WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.159 --> 00:00:04.120 Welcome to Backing your Leadership. I'm Chris and I'm Lorenzo, and welcome to 2 00:00:04.120 --> 00:00:07.480 this week's Thoughtful Thursday. Don't forget to follow us on YouTube at Hacking your 3 00:00:07.519 --> 00:00:10.439 Leadership and leave us a review on iTunes. On this Thoughtful Thursday, I 4 00:00:10.480 --> 00:00:13.320 want to talk about interview questions. Oh, I like this. Are you 5 00:00:13.320 --> 00:00:17.039 gonna interview me? I'm an interview yes. Now. The reason I want 6 00:00:17.079 --> 00:00:21.359 to bring this up is because I've seen a lot of kind of guides online 7 00:00:21.399 --> 00:00:24.399 about, you know, interview questions to ask, and a lot of them 8 00:00:24.440 --> 00:00:28.800 are good, but some of them are seriously lacking. I think with the 9 00:00:28.839 --> 00:00:33.280 amount of interviewing that a lot of people are doing, people have gotten better 10 00:00:33.759 --> 00:00:39.560 at answering questions in a way that satisfies whatever that interview question is, but 11 00:00:39.600 --> 00:00:45.119 that doesn't necessarily allow the interviewer to truly assess the kind of person that they 12 00:00:45.200 --> 00:00:48.280 are hiring. And I think what that leads to is a lot of organizations 13 00:00:48.560 --> 00:00:53.240 having people who interview very well and they end up not being able to execute 14 00:00:53.240 --> 00:00:56.840 in the moment on the on the things that you need them to execute. 15 00:00:56.880 --> 00:00:59.640 And obviously, you know, no one will argue with you that there's that 16 00:00:59.679 --> 00:01:03.159 there's a better way to figure this out than to actually see a person in 17 00:01:03.200 --> 00:01:06.719 action. But how do you see a person in action when they haven't been 18 00:01:06.760 --> 00:01:10.120 hired yet? Right, So it's this age old kind of problem of you 19 00:01:10.120 --> 00:01:11.879 want to know how they're going to do the job before they do it, 20 00:01:11.920 --> 00:01:15.439 but you can't hire them before you hire them. An example I can just 21 00:01:15.480 --> 00:01:18.519 think of off the top of my head is in on my recent interview with 22 00:01:18.519 --> 00:01:23.799 Stephen shad Letsky. He talks about in his book Speak Up Culture about how 23 00:01:23.799 --> 00:01:26.920 his sister went to go interview to be a doctor at a hospital that prided 24 00:01:26.959 --> 00:01:32.760 themselves on doctors with great bedside manner, and one of the questions that she 25 00:01:32.879 --> 00:01:37.799 was asked in the interview was to teach the interviewers how to do something that 26 00:01:38.120 --> 00:01:41.120 she was passionate about. And she shows dance because she had had years of 27 00:01:41.200 --> 00:01:44.120 kind of dance practice, and they didn't care about knowing how to dance, 28 00:01:44.159 --> 00:01:47.640 and they were terrible dancers. But what they wanted to see is how would 29 00:01:47.680 --> 00:01:52.280 she respond when they inevitably didn't dance well, or follow instructions well, or 30 00:01:52.319 --> 00:01:55.760 do what they were supposed to do. Did she react with positivity? And 31 00:01:55.840 --> 00:01:57.719 encouragement and know, Okay, you're getting it and you're moving through this, 32 00:01:59.519 --> 00:02:01.079 or did she roll her eyes and be like, no, I told you 33 00:02:01.079 --> 00:02:05.280 to put your arm here, you know, like is how how did she 34 00:02:05.400 --> 00:02:07.959 react in the moment? I thought it was a brilliant interview question, and 35 00:02:07.199 --> 00:02:13.280 it's made me think about other interview questions that allow that kind of disarm the 36 00:02:13.319 --> 00:02:17.560 process and allow leaders to really get a sense of who they're interviewing as opposed 37 00:02:17.560 --> 00:02:23.120 to just going by the book of these are the questions you answer and ask, 38 00:02:23.199 --> 00:02:25.719 and these are the points you score, and here's how you objectively move 39 00:02:25.759 --> 00:02:28.840 through people. There has to be a better way. Yeah, No, 40 00:02:28.879 --> 00:02:31.520 I think it's a great conversation. And I remember there were books written about 41 00:02:31.560 --> 00:02:37.400 this, what fifteen maybe twenty years ago, some of the big like crazy 42 00:02:37.479 --> 00:02:39.719 questions that they would ask in some of the really big like at the like 43 00:02:40.080 --> 00:02:44.360 I think it was about like Microsoft or Google or something like that. Yeah, 44 00:02:44.439 --> 00:02:46.599 Yeah, they had these crazy questions they would ask, and that was 45 00:02:46.639 --> 00:02:49.840 the intention was to like how do you problem solve, how do you work 46 00:02:49.919 --> 00:02:53.639 under pressure? How do you imagine? How how do you kind of like 47 00:02:53.759 --> 00:02:57.199 step out of the kind of the box of the norm and come up with 48 00:02:57.240 --> 00:03:00.759 creative solutions. And they were trying to assess for a lot of those types 49 00:03:00.800 --> 00:03:02.000 of things, and I really like that. I think I think that there 50 00:03:02.120 --> 00:03:10.479 is there is value in having a consistent kind of interview experience that allows you 51 00:03:10.560 --> 00:03:15.840 to assess people against specific you know, skills or competence or maybe even some 52 00:03:15.960 --> 00:03:21.280 value aspects to get their opinion on an interview process. But to what you're 53 00:03:21.319 --> 00:03:23.639 sharing, I'm a huge fan of, like what are the different types of 54 00:03:23.719 --> 00:03:28.000 questions or things that you can do. They give you a greater look into 55 00:03:28.000 --> 00:03:30.159 who the person is, yeah, you know, and and what are their 56 00:03:30.199 --> 00:03:36.520 passions and what do they do and like how do they think about whether it's 57 00:03:36.560 --> 00:03:40.039 the work or or the perspective of the work. Like, there's a lot 58 00:03:40.080 --> 00:03:43.719 of things that can be done and questions that can be asked that allow you 59 00:03:43.800 --> 00:03:46.039 to really get a better sense of like who are you hiring, not just 60 00:03:46.120 --> 00:03:49.639 the skills maybe that they bring to the job. Yeah, we can all 61 00:03:49.680 --> 00:03:53.280 agree that attributes are more important than skills. You can teach the skills, 62 00:03:53.520 --> 00:03:57.199 the attributes of what makes a person who they are are things that are are 63 00:03:57.199 --> 00:04:01.039 a lot harder to teach them they're impossible, but people largely are who they 64 00:04:01.080 --> 00:04:04.719 are from an attribute standpoint, is a person creative, does a person think 65 00:04:04.719 --> 00:04:08.840 outside the box? Do they like people? Do they have empathy? You 66 00:04:08.879 --> 00:04:12.199 know? These kind of attributes are things that people bring with them and that 67 00:04:12.319 --> 00:04:15.079 allow them to learn the skills. So give me somebody who has all these 68 00:04:15.120 --> 00:04:18.519 positive attributes who doesn't know anything, and you can teach them anything. But 69 00:04:18.560 --> 00:04:23.000 give me somebody who has a ton of skills and doesn't have these attributes. 70 00:04:23.120 --> 00:04:25.439 And they might work well for the moment, but as soon as the business 71 00:04:25.519 --> 00:04:28.240 changes or new skills are required, they're gonna be a lot harder to bring 72 00:04:28.240 --> 00:04:30.519 along for the ride because they kind of want to say things the way they 73 00:04:30.519 --> 00:04:33.720 are. Another question I can think of that gets asked in a lot of 74 00:04:33.720 --> 00:04:36.439 interviews is you know the old you know, tell me your biggest weakness, 75 00:04:36.560 --> 00:04:41.240 right, And then I hear that, and I think the cliche answer is, 76 00:04:41.439 --> 00:04:44.360 well, I'm I'm too honest, or I'm a perfectionist, or you 77 00:04:44.360 --> 00:04:47.759 know whatever that is. And it's like you have to watch these interviewees do 78 00:04:48.079 --> 00:04:53.199 mental gymnastics on how how do I say something that's a negative but really have 79 00:04:53.240 --> 00:04:56.639 it be a positive? And reframe it in a way that doesn't make me 80 00:04:57.000 --> 00:05:00.399 make them decide not to hire me. And you know what I like to 81 00:05:00.439 --> 00:05:03.639 ask instead in a question besides or instead of what's your biggest weakness? Is? 82 00:05:04.040 --> 00:05:06.879 You know, when things get stressful, tell me what kind of support 83 00:05:06.920 --> 00:05:11.079 you need from me? So, if I'm your leader and you're having an 84 00:05:11.120 --> 00:05:13.800 issue, what kind of support are you looking for? And what I'm looking 85 00:05:13.800 --> 00:05:15.839 for is for a person to say to me how they're going to respond or 86 00:05:15.879 --> 00:05:19.800 how they're going to react in a situation that is stressful, because that's when 87 00:05:19.800 --> 00:05:24.720 a person's weaknesses come out, is when they're under stress and pressure versus when 88 00:05:24.720 --> 00:05:27.399 things are you know, hunky dory. And so what I'm going to ask 89 00:05:27.399 --> 00:05:30.480 you, Lorenzo, is what's a question that you have gone to in your 90 00:05:30.560 --> 00:05:34.800 interview process that you think has reliably been a good predictor of how a person 91 00:05:34.839 --> 00:05:38.519 will actually perform in the job they are being hired for. And so I 92 00:05:38.519 --> 00:05:40.240 want to ask you that, but first I want to give up toward one 93 00:05:40.240 --> 00:05:43.639 of our sponsors. All Right, Lorenzo, what's a go to question you 94 00:05:43.720 --> 00:05:47.519 have that has not been You've found people can't haven't figured out how to fake 95 00:05:47.560 --> 00:05:51.879 it yet they actually have to. It's actually a key determining factor in how 96 00:05:51.879 --> 00:05:55.560 a person's actually going to do their job. There's a couple of them that 97 00:05:55.600 --> 00:05:59.600 I like that give me kind of a good kind of look into who the 98 00:05:59.600 --> 00:06:01.120 person is. Is the one that I would probably say sticks out the most 99 00:06:01.199 --> 00:06:03.360 is I like to ask people, like, tell me about a time in 100 00:06:03.399 --> 00:06:06.680 your life where you really exceeded your own expectations where maybe you set a goal 101 00:06:06.720 --> 00:06:11.240 to do something and you didn't only achieve the goal, but you were just 102 00:06:11.279 --> 00:06:15.240 blown away by how well you did and kind of how that shocked you. 103 00:06:15.319 --> 00:06:17.480 Why do you like that question? Because I think it allows me to understand, 104 00:06:17.560 --> 00:06:20.680 like, what what are people's intrinsic motivations? What bar do they set 105 00:06:20.680 --> 00:06:25.319 for themselves? You know, what are the goals that they have not just 106 00:06:25.360 --> 00:06:28.160 to work, but in life. How do they measure those types of things? 107 00:06:28.959 --> 00:06:30.839 What is that We talk a lot about perseverance and grit, but I 108 00:06:30.879 --> 00:06:33.600 think a lot of times you kind of hear those factors come out in a 109 00:06:33.680 --> 00:06:41.600 question like that, because many times that will spark an answer where it's something 110 00:06:41.759 --> 00:06:45.120 really big, you know, in life, and sometimes it's not, And 111 00:06:45.199 --> 00:06:48.720 that's okay. Because even if maybe you haven't had you know, maybe life 112 00:06:48.879 --> 00:06:53.480 or work experience where you've had these really big things that have happened, but 113 00:06:53.519 --> 00:06:58.319 there's still something there. And if there's not, if it's a tough answer, 114 00:06:58.360 --> 00:07:00.959 if they're not able to kind of speak to some thing where they've set 115 00:07:00.000 --> 00:07:03.360 a goal for themselves and they've overachieved it, that's also a little bit of 116 00:07:03.399 --> 00:07:06.839 a peek into maybe where they are in regards to how they would show up. 117 00:07:06.959 --> 00:07:13.000 Right. So I'm thinking about this specifically in like the leadership context, 118 00:07:13.399 --> 00:07:15.879 because if I'm looking for somebody who is going to be a leader, that 119 00:07:16.000 --> 00:07:21.519 element of lifelong learning and setting the bar and evolving is really going to grow 120 00:07:21.879 --> 00:07:26.680 from that kind of approach to life into thinking about, like, there, 121 00:07:27.120 --> 00:07:29.959 I know that when I apply myself and I put my mind to something, 122 00:07:30.279 --> 00:07:32.000 not only can I achieve it, but I can exceed it, And like 123 00:07:32.040 --> 00:07:38.839 that's a very powerful element of kind of focus and confidence that's needed to be 124 00:07:38.920 --> 00:07:41.759 able to then kind of feed into that as you're helping them with their growth 125 00:07:41.759 --> 00:07:44.480 and development. So what's something that you could hear from an answer to that? 126 00:07:45.000 --> 00:07:47.040 In an answer to that question that would set up a red flag that 127 00:07:47.079 --> 00:07:50.399 would make you think, oh, this might be might be the right candidate 128 00:07:50.439 --> 00:07:57.839 from a leadership standpoint, if it does not have an element of maybe leading 129 00:07:57.879 --> 00:08:03.800 people or leading themselves, if it does not have a really clear, kind 130 00:08:03.800 --> 00:08:07.360 of like self motivated goal. If I hear something that's like, well, 131 00:08:07.920 --> 00:08:11.360 like at my last job, my boss asked me to achieve this, and 132 00:08:11.399 --> 00:08:15.240 then I achieved it, and then some again like this is kind of what 133 00:08:15.279 --> 00:08:16.800 I'm listening for. It's like, Okay, I want to dig a little 134 00:08:16.800 --> 00:08:20.240 bit deeper then, because again, like does it have to be an assigned 135 00:08:20.319 --> 00:08:24.079 goal or is this something that you're kind of pushing for yourself if the goal 136 00:08:26.639 --> 00:08:33.039 or I'm sorry if the example is very kind of like me based and like 137 00:08:33.159 --> 00:08:37.840 I over the team type of a thing, Like that's something that I would 138 00:08:37.879 --> 00:08:43.399 kind of listen into where it's kind of like I achieve this type of goal, 139 00:08:43.759 --> 00:08:46.559 you know, in spite of other people or other people that are on 140 00:08:46.600 --> 00:08:48.960 my team. Like those are types of things that I would say, like, 141 00:08:48.039 --> 00:08:50.480 let me dig a little bit deeper to understand this type of an example. 142 00:08:50.519 --> 00:08:54.320 Yeah, I like that a lot. So it's not really about what 143 00:08:54.360 --> 00:08:58.279 they accomplished, it's about the mindset going into it, and did they set 144 00:08:58.279 --> 00:09:01.759 the goal on their own or is something that was assigned to them, Like 145 00:09:01.480 --> 00:09:05.879 a person says, yeah, my goal was to make sure I attended all 146 00:09:05.919 --> 00:09:09.919 of the anger management classes the judge assigned me to go to, and I 147 00:09:09.000 --> 00:09:11.480 managed to get to all of them. Right, That's not necessarily the same 148 00:09:11.480 --> 00:09:16.600 thing as someone who their goal was to you know, get you know, 149 00:09:16.720 --> 00:09:20.399 three people promoted from underneath them over a period of a year and they managed 150 00:09:20.440 --> 00:09:22.279 to get four absolutely, or they were able to say, hey, you 151 00:09:22.279 --> 00:09:28.039 know, I wanted to further my education outside of work and you know and 152 00:09:28.080 --> 00:09:31.799 that type of thing, and so I took some additional classes, or I 153 00:09:31.840 --> 00:09:35.639 did this, or you know, I have a really big passion or hobby 154 00:09:35.679 --> 00:09:41.360 and it's something that like I challenged myself to go do and spend time doing, 155 00:09:41.720 --> 00:09:43.519 and then I was able to kind of like make that into you know, 156 00:09:43.559 --> 00:09:48.480 something that was either an additional source of income or just get accolades for 157 00:09:48.519 --> 00:09:50.399 something that they put out like these are things that I'm kind of looking for. 158 00:09:50.440 --> 00:09:54.840 Again, it's it's more around the are you setting goals for yourself and 159 00:09:54.879 --> 00:09:58.480 then are you able to see yourself through the work that has to be done 160 00:09:58.559 --> 00:10:03.360 and then are you you then able to understand how do you apply that continual 161 00:10:03.879 --> 00:10:05.919 mentality of getting work done into the work that you have. Sure, because 162 00:10:05.919 --> 00:10:09.879 if you know how to do that and you like doing it, a person 163 00:10:09.919 --> 00:10:15.279 who has experienced doing that and who likes doing it, that gets applied everywhere. 164 00:10:15.399 --> 00:10:18.799 Right, Yeah, you can apply that to anything. And yeah, 165 00:10:18.840 --> 00:10:22.639 for sure if a because eventually they're going to be asked to set to they're 166 00:10:22.639 --> 00:10:26.600 going to be given goals and ask to achieve things that aren't necessarily self driven, 167 00:10:26.399 --> 00:10:31.759 and they have to be able to have the kind of the storyboarding process 168 00:10:31.840 --> 00:10:35.840 in place that gets them through it when it isn't necessarily self motivated, when 169 00:10:35.840 --> 00:10:37.480 it's when it's because it's the goal of a team, or and it's because 170 00:10:37.480 --> 00:10:39.879 it's the job they've been assigned to do. Yeah, so all of these 171 00:10:39.919 --> 00:10:45.600 things, just the ability to get through it is necessary because sometimes it's going 172 00:10:45.679 --> 00:10:46.759 to be self motivated and sometimes it's not. I like that a lot. 173 00:10:46.799 --> 00:10:50.639 I think. I think if you're an interviewer and you're asking questions, the 174 00:10:52.159 --> 00:10:56.000 goal is you almost have to work backwards. You have to start with what 175 00:10:56.080 --> 00:10:58.799 is it that you're hoping to see out of this person? And then how 176 00:10:58.840 --> 00:11:01.519 do I figure out if that person is going to be able to do that 177 00:11:03.039 --> 00:11:07.080 in advance, but in a way that they can't just say what's appropriate in 178 00:11:07.120 --> 00:11:09.720 the moment where you know that they've been through it, you know that they've 179 00:11:09.759 --> 00:11:13.559 actually experienced. They're not speaking in hypotheticals. They're not talking about, you 180 00:11:13.600 --> 00:11:16.679 know, what they would do if something happened. They're talking about what they 181 00:11:16.720 --> 00:11:22.720 did do when this happened. And if you have people that can show that 182 00:11:22.240 --> 00:11:26.960 in a way that says these are the attributes I'm looking for in a new 183 00:11:26.039 --> 00:11:31.480 hire or in a promotion, I think that's a great way forward, because 184 00:11:31.519 --> 00:11:33.840 again, skills can be taught. These are the types of things that you 185 00:11:33.840 --> 00:11:37.320 know, it takes a lot more effort to teach these things if they're even 186 00:11:37.320 --> 00:11:39.840 teachable at all. Absolutely, and with that it brings us at the end 187 00:11:39.840 --> 00:11:41.960 of this episode, this is how your leadership. I'm Lorenzo and I'm Chris, 188 00:11:43.000 --> 00:11:43.639 and have a great day.