WEBVTT

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Hey guys, it's Jack. I
just wanted to talk to you today about

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at patreon dot com slash the Teamhouse. You're like probably fifteen to twenty minutes,

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but if it's Pekee traffic, three
hours ye whatever. So not kind

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of you know, normal like middle
class childhood. Uh you know, played

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sports, Uh you know, no, but my parents weren't the military.

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I was delost of four, really
had zero you know, designs or any

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idea would actually be in the military, and so was playing playing pretty somewhat

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competitive soccer. Got looked up by
a few colleges. So then you know,

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I settled on Manhattan College, up
in the Bronx of all places,

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even though it's coll Manhattan. But
uh, you know, I thought I'd

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be playing D one soccer up there. Uh ended up red shirting my freshman

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year. Wasn't really a huge fan
of the coach. It's kind of like

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everything in the movies you see when
the coach is recruiting you, he's like

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Mother Teresa. Then you actually go
play for the guy and he's you know,

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Satan himself reincarnated. So uh so
what ended up happening was I looked

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at some other options to get some
money to transfer to schools, because you

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know, the little money that I
did get from this guy was you know,

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was not going to cut it at
another school. So I looked at

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some things like the Marine PLC.
I had a buddy playing for a school

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in Philly, and you know,
basically they didn't have the money to put

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me on until I was a junior, and so we started looking at different

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ways of how I could pay for
it, you know, grants, scholarships,

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you know. They asked me if
I was part Native American or part

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something. Said nope, no,
dice. So and then the one guy

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goes, well, hey, you
know, one of my assistant coaches said,

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our school here has this thing called
road Sea or rot something. Yeah,

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I think it's called road Sea.
And I'm like, oh, okay,

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it turns out your school does too. And so the thought process was

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to apply for a scholarship at my
school and then basically transfer over my junior

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year and play there. And again
all this is literally just like could play

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soccer at some like low level D
one school. So it's crazy the way

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things worked out. Like I had
zero thoughts of what it really meant to

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become a commissioned officer and enroll,
and I thought like, you know,

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hey, I'll do my four years
and get out. And then, you

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know, sophomore year was playing a
little bit soccer, but slowly I started

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realizing like the Air Force thing was
kind of become a more important to me.

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Soccer really wasn't, uh, but
generally playing soccer, I was kind

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of in decent shape. So then
I decided to get real brave and think,

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hey, ill you know, I'll
go try and be a PJ or

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a crow and God bless Uh Lieutenant
Colonel Russell was his name, was the

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colonel at my school. I think
he kind of looked at me and kind

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of knew better and said, yeah, I don't really see you as a

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PG type, Brian, Uh,
you probably could do it. It was

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basically a nice way of telling me, dude, you're soft. Is not

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your thing, Dude, like,
just be greatful. Just you have gifts,

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but it's not in that realm.
So again I was looking at other

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things to do, and uh,
you know, it was pretty fun.

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I come to now I've gone through
boot camp, I come home. You

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know, it's definitely changed my life. At this point, I'm still figuring

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out what I think I'm going to
do in the Air Force, and uh,

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funny story is, uh, you
know, it's probably the fall of

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my journey year. And you know, for you guys, for the background,

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if you go to if you want
to become any sort of aircrew position

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in the Air Force, you go
through a board as a cadet. You

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you apply generally the higher scores if
you will, between grades, pilot aptitude,

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all that kind of stuff, you
get a pilot slot. The guys

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that are sort of like your second
and third tier grades wise, you'll get

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a navigator spot or like a Wizow
spot, which is what I got,

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and then sometimes intermixing that the guys
who fly a wax So those guys,

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the guys that you see in the
movies sort of doing the air battle management

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piece abm ors. That's another sort
of another rated air crew position. So

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I had no designs on doing it, mostly because a it meant extra time

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in the in the service. You
know, I was gonna do whatever you

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kid in New York wanted to do. Come right back, go work on

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Wall Street, be a you know
downtown dude, live live, you know,

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live my best court, and get
go life. And then you know,

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come in one day during the year, my commander's like, hey,

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I just put you in for a
flight school spot. I go, weg

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what and I find out is apparently
some kid at UMass because they were literally

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in the same region as us.
I'd gotten caught skiing. So yeah,

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he got dis enrolled and now he
had this like flight school spot that already

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been advocated to him my colonel just
again. You know, you get lucky.

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There's a few people in your life
over your career that kind of like

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really shape and kind of mentor you. And this guy was definitely my first

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one. But so he signed me
up for it, and I kind of

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initially was like, sir, I
don't think this is for me. Goes

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dude, you were going to love
this. You're literally gonna either fly a

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B one or Inn fifteen E.
And if you don't like it, you

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just it's fine, you drop out
and they'll find something else for you.

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Yeah. So that's my junior year
and then senior year, you know,

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I'm starting to kind of wind down, and you know, this was like,

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you know, late two thousand,
mid two thousand and one, economy

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is starting to kind of slow down
in New York. A lot of my

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friends were freaking out about like what
jobs were going to get everything else,

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And I kind of had it made
because I already had a guarantee job now

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at this point and then you know, but being in New York on nine

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to eleven obviously removed any doubt that
I'm going where I need to be.

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If anything, I was a little
pissed off because I started doing the math

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and probably what a lot of us
thought was, you know, I'm a

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cadet at this point, at the
best scenario, at least three years away

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from you know, A getting my
wings and b being certified to flying aircraft.

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So we're thinking, like, this
fight's gonna be well over by mom.

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Commission, You're right, sick joke, right, little to be no,

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So yeah, commission. In Mayo
two, I hung around in New

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York a little bit as an ad
lieutenant waiting for my flight school to pop

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up. From there, I went
down to Pensacola Naval Air Station. So

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this is back when the Air Force, I think smartly, we the two

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strike school slots, which were basically
at fifteen he's and b ones. They

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let those gut. Basically, they
kind of offloaded that train to the Navy.

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So it was kind of a really
cool experience where I'm an Air Force

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officer, but I'm in a Navy
squadron and it's all Marines and Navy guys

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with me with some other Air Force
guys. So that was actually a really

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you know, the Navy and the
Air Force are definitely different. You know,

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the Air Force is very anal like
you will be at work at seven

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am, you will leave it four
and if you start flight school in this

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date, you will get your wings
on this date. And there is no

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like middle ground. The Air Force
is very regimented it that way, which

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is sometimes good and bad. Navy
God Bless him is like, yeah,

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dude, fucking serfs up. Bro, Yeah you're in this class and you're

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supposed to graduate around this month,
but you know whatever weather and you know

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whatever, and yeah, yeah around
you know they'd give you like a two

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or three month waiver. Yeah then
Ady was very like, you know,

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they would throw three hundred kid debts
at a training pipeline and in their mind

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like if we get one hundred and
fifty pilots or nabs ORF NFO is equivalent

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to wizzow Naval flight officer, so
like goosen top gun right, Like yeah,

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dude, we get a if half
you guys wash out, but we

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actually get one hundred and fifty guys
like cool success, We don't really give

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a shit like it's it was definitely
like a big boy program. Uh,

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if you guys are the kind of
guys that can go out and get blasted

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on Pensacola Beach. But you come
in and get your work done and you

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pass your flights. Cool, and
if you don't, you'll fail. Yeah,

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and like it was very so definitely
it was definitely a very big boy

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from day one. And so so
as a as a wizzow or like an

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NFL. Yeah you said, NFL, right, do you is there a

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pilot training in that for you?
Do they want you to understand? How?

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Yeah? So I'd probably missed this
part. So before even going down,

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So, the Air Force had a
program where if you were going to

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pilot training, you were not going
to go to pilot training until you've got

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your civilian license, okay. So
they called it if T Intermediate or Introductory

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Flight Training. And then for guys
that were gonna be go that, guys

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that had a pilot school slot,
you got your PPL your private pilot license

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before you even went okay. For
the Wizzos or nabs that were going it

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was called NIFT, you know,
Navigator Introductory Flight Training. And really all

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they gave you was about twenty hours
okay, And so you know at that

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point, I wasn't really thinking that
far ahead, and I'm kind of kicking

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I kicked myself later on down the
road because for a discounted price, I

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probably could have continued on and got
my PPL. Sure, but once the

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twenty was over, my twenty hours
I did it up in Connecticut, I

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was like, I'm done. I'm
gonna enjoy my last few months in New

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York before leave for good. Right, So probably a little bit short side

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of my part, But yeah,
to answer your point, at least from

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the Air Force perspective, you went
in with at least a good twenty to

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fifty civillion hours, okay, Yeah, And then as far as the part

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of your initial curriculum, so for
us, it was about three to four

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months of ground school, And what
was cool about it was everyone did the

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same ground school Marines pilots, Navy
pilots, Navy, NFOs, air Force

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pilots that were down there, like, everyone went through the exact same course.

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So once you did that, you
transition over the flight line. And

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then for us, they these things
have been since retired, but not the

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World War Two era T thirty four, but the modern I say modern seventies

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eighties T thirty four, That's what
I started out in. And so your

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first six to eight flights. Other
than basic navigation, there is some flying

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that was going on there as well. But then after that it starts ramping

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up to you fairly complicated navigation,
a lot of land nav a lot of

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stuff where there's a hood over you, and you got to sort of do

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just timing, heading that kind of
stuff, see what the winds are doing

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to you, you're looking back on
it. It ended up none of it

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really ended up ever translating into like
what I did in the real world,

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because there's obviously a jet, there's
a GPS, there's so much else going

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on in a combat aircraft where like
you don't have time to you know,

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clock, chart, ground or whatever
that terminology was that I forget. But

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but yeah, that was sort of
the beginning days of it. Yeah,

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so about three to four months of
a prop plane then switched over to the

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T one for intermediate that's kind of
like a business leer jet, and it's

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the same thing the Air Force uses
to train up all their heavy pilots.

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And then from there you went to
an advanced squadron called VT eighty six,

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and you started off in a T
thirty nine saber line, which is like

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a Vietnam era. It was probably
it was actually really crazy. You flew

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with active duty guys, mostly Navy
Marines, but a few Rando Air Force

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guys. In the T thirty four, the T one, and the T

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thirty nine was all being flown by
retiree contract pilots and I think literally every

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single one of them. It was
like a Vietnam era like Navy fighter pilot.

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Yeah, like I number one crazy
story where it was one of the

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few Air Force guys still remember.
His named Lynn Coleman. So he was

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the retired Eggland Air Force Base wing
commander and ended up doing a cross country

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flight with him. So we were
just kind of sitting there bs and he's

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asking us where he got commissioned.
He was an academy guy, wasn't And

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this guy really was had some crazy
history. I don't know if you guys

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are aware who Lance side John was. Lance side John was the first ever

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Air Force Academy graduate to see the
Medal of Honor and he was a pow,

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tried to escape multiple times, ended
up unfortunately dying of captivity. So

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Lance Saide John is a big deal
in the Air Force. Lynn Coleman was

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one of his roommates at the academy. So there's that story, and then

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I'm making small talk with him and
he goes, yeah, I'm retired as

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the wing king at Egglin and my
vice was Bud Day. So like we're

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just kind of sitting there in awe. Another medal of honor. You know,

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Bud Day who was a marine first
and became an Air Force colonel and

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you know, got the Medal of
Honor poet and he lived him and became

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were pretty tight from what I remember, So it was cool we had these

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We had these like legends of like
Vietnam era naval and Air Force aviation teaching

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00:12:05.799 --> 00:12:07.360
us. Yeah, but it was
also crazy because part of your safety beep

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before taking off was it's you in
this seventy eighth year old pilot in the

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left seat. You're in the right
seat. Uh, there's a chance you

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might get a bird in the face, and what are your actions? And

206
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it's like, shit, I've been
flying this plane since before you were a

207
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niche and your daddy's crops. Oh
yeah, I mean some of the stories

208
00:12:22.960 --> 00:12:26.159
these guys have, Like one guy
with Connie Hoffman, I still remember his

209
00:12:26.240 --> 00:12:31.360
name, was a C one thirty
pilot I think was a spooky pilot for

210
00:12:31.399 --> 00:12:35.240
a little bit before they were gunships
or AC forty sevens. I believe we

211
00:12:35.320 --> 00:12:37.600
just telling a story about you know, they'd open up the back. He

212
00:12:37.799 --> 00:12:41.000
Hey, dude, co pilot,
you got the jet, I'm gonna go

213
00:12:41.000 --> 00:12:41.840
in the back and see what the
little bets up there. He's fucking,

214
00:12:43.120 --> 00:12:45.919
you know, blazing weed. Yeah, casters Like, I mean, you

215
00:12:45.960 --> 00:12:48.639
know, really, I thought I
had done some cowboy shit in my career,

216
00:12:48.639 --> 00:12:50.919
but some of the Vietnam War stories
were just out of control. But

217
00:12:50.919 --> 00:12:54.240
but yeah, kind of in the
middle of that pro like towards the end

218
00:12:54.240 --> 00:12:56.480
of that program, Yeah, you
track select, you gotta go fighter or

219
00:12:56.519 --> 00:13:00.240
bombers. Uh, Like everyone else, I wanted fighters. That's and I

220
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got very intimately familiar with the whole
fiscal year concert of the military. Got

221
00:13:03.240 --> 00:13:05.519
called in and it's like, yeah, dude, it's early September, and

222
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I'm like, yeah, it sure
is still nice out. Yeah you're not

223
00:13:09.960 --> 00:13:13.639
hearing me. I guess I'm not, because, yeah, dude, you're

224
00:13:13.679 --> 00:13:16.320
not killing it. You're really doing
good, but you're not like blowing away

225
00:13:16.360 --> 00:13:18.279
the grade curve. And unfortunately,
like we just don't have any more B

226
00:13:18.360 --> 00:13:22.399
school slots for strike Eagles and I
was I was pretty devastated. Yeah,

227
00:13:22.480 --> 00:13:24.279
you know, life's not fair.
Whate was me kind of shit? But

228
00:13:24.320 --> 00:13:28.759
again, looking back on it,
like had I gone strike Eagles, not

229
00:13:28.799 --> 00:13:31.600
to be self deprecating, but like
I probably would have maybe been like above

230
00:13:31.639 --> 00:13:33.799
average, maybe middle of the road. I really would. I do have

231
00:13:33.799 --> 00:13:39.200
broken my ass to sort of like
maintain because it's a high performing type of

232
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environment being a fighter guy backseat or
a pilot. Yeah, and the b

233
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one. You know, I definitely
think I found my niche like, I

234
00:13:48.159 --> 00:13:52.320
so correct me if I'm wrong,
because it seems as though, like on

235
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a strike on a fighter, the
wisdow actually has It would seemed to me

236
00:13:56.879 --> 00:14:00.320
in my mind, the wisdom has
less to do than they would on a

237
00:14:00.360 --> 00:14:03.919
bomber. It's like it almost seems
like they control the show on a bomber.

238
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We do control the show on a
bomber. I would say for the

239
00:14:05.440 --> 00:14:09.679
fighter guys, at least I've talked
to and having sat in one, Generally,

240
00:14:09.720 --> 00:14:13.919
if you're a wizzo on a fighter, you're not just doing air to

241
00:14:13.960 --> 00:14:16.279
air, and obviously in today's environment
you're mostly doing air to ground, right,

242
00:14:16.320 --> 00:14:20.559
so you're kind of running that show. I believe, you know,

243
00:14:20.600 --> 00:14:24.879
those guys could literally do everything that
the pilots could do, I think other

244
00:14:24.919 --> 00:14:26.360
than fire and air to air missile. I could be wrong, but like

245
00:14:26.399 --> 00:14:30.840
you, you were still pretty test
saturating. Again, if you're a fighter,

246
00:14:31.559 --> 00:14:35.080
things are coming a little faster.
I mean the Bone we were pretty

247
00:14:35.080 --> 00:14:39.360
maneuverable for a bomber, but we
were still a three G jet limited in

248
00:14:39.440 --> 00:14:43.240
combat and most times to save gas
when we're doing casts, which we'll get

249
00:14:43.240 --> 00:14:48.919
into, you know, we were
our wings forward to be as gas economical

250
00:14:48.960 --> 00:14:52.720
as possible, So I mean we
were Those are some rough days where we

251
00:14:52.759 --> 00:14:54.799
went off dry on a nine line
and it was a putt. It was

252
00:14:54.840 --> 00:14:58.559
a good sold Yeah, sometimes three
and a half four minutes to get back

253
00:14:58.720 --> 00:15:03.840
over target. So those are those
were pretty hectic times. So you know,

254
00:15:03.200 --> 00:15:07.399
for us, it was the key
on going off hot successfully on the

255
00:15:07.399 --> 00:15:09.840
first drop. Was like it was
like life or death in a lot of

256
00:15:09.840 --> 00:15:13.120
cases. Yeah, but yea yeah, I mean I would say definitely ran

257
00:15:13.159 --> 00:15:16.720
the show a lot more on the
Bone, and it was just like a

258
00:15:16.759 --> 00:15:18.720
trade off, you know. I
mean, those guys at less play time

259
00:15:18.799 --> 00:15:22.879
did cooler shit. We definitely in
certain parts of Afghanistan could hang around for

260
00:15:22.879 --> 00:15:26.639
three four hours at a time not
leave. You know, initially our loadouts

261
00:15:26.639 --> 00:15:33.840
in OEF and OIF were fourteen weapons, yeah, eight and six or fourteen.

262
00:15:35.360 --> 00:15:39.279
Eventually we removed the bait tank and
started going up to twenty and so

263
00:15:39.360 --> 00:15:41.240
I mean we would, you know, there were times where we'd be the

264
00:15:41.279 --> 00:15:45.039
only jet in country because of weather, and we would you know, I

265
00:15:45.039 --> 00:15:48.559
think my record was four separate ticks
that all went hot, like we were

266
00:15:48.559 --> 00:15:52.879
the only guys in country. Wow. You know, Vipers couldn't take off

267
00:15:52.879 --> 00:15:56.159
from calf strike, Eagles and hogs
were like grounded for whether at Bath.

268
00:15:56.240 --> 00:15:58.720
So like, you know, being
the only game in town was huge for

269
00:15:58.799 --> 00:16:03.399
us. Sure tell us about you
know, moving from this one track fighter

270
00:16:03.440 --> 00:16:06.720
track to a bomber track. What's
that look like? Yeah, so once

271
00:16:06.759 --> 00:16:10.519
that happens, this has all changed. The air Force has kind of redesigned

272
00:16:10.519 --> 00:16:12.080
how they do their their their pipeline. But basically happens after that is so

273
00:16:12.080 --> 00:16:15.080
the B one. The B one
is a four person aircraft. It's an

274
00:16:15.080 --> 00:16:22.080
aircraft commander, a co pilot and
then uh you've got two wizzows but and

275
00:16:22.159 --> 00:16:25.480
you're dual qualify to sit either seat. There's an OsO seat, which is

276
00:16:25.519 --> 00:16:29.559
the offensive Offensive System officer, and
then there's the DSO seat, which is

277
00:16:29.559 --> 00:16:33.399
the defensive system officer. So if
you guys remember Doctor Strangelove, think of

278
00:16:33.440 --> 00:16:36.159
the EWO who's watching the bomb come
up? You know, range gate pull

279
00:16:36.200 --> 00:16:38.799
off, range gate pull off working, We actually were qualified to sit bold

280
00:16:38.840 --> 00:16:42.440
seats and the reason for that was
once you got your wings in Pensacola,

281
00:16:44.159 --> 00:16:47.960
you then went to Randolph Air Force
Base for four months of Electronic Warfare Officer

282
00:16:47.960 --> 00:16:52.360
school. Okay, okay, So
once that happens, now you're basically legally

283
00:16:52.360 --> 00:16:55.480
allowed to go attend the B one
school at Dias Air Force Base in Texas.

284
00:16:56.399 --> 00:16:59.919
Before we did that, you did
water survival and then full of SURVI

285
00:17:00.000 --> 00:17:03.200
I a school up in Fairchild Air
Force Base in Washington. So I'd say,

286
00:17:03.400 --> 00:17:07.480
on all, it's probably about a
year and a half process before even

287
00:17:07.480 --> 00:17:11.480
allowed to go at ten Dias Air
Force Base to start learning. Now the

288
00:17:11.559 --> 00:17:15.359
specific that a fly your jet,
and so what that looks like is you

289
00:17:15.400 --> 00:17:18.480
show up similar to like flight school, where it's it's a few months of

290
00:17:18.519 --> 00:17:22.279
ground school, a lot of sims, and then eventually you get kicked over

291
00:17:22.279 --> 00:17:26.480
to the flight line and you start
flying, you know, the line with

292
00:17:26.519 --> 00:17:30.839
the schoolhouse, and it's the FTU, which is the Flight Training Unit.

293
00:17:30.160 --> 00:17:34.519
And so the way I describe it
is IQC Initial qual the initial qualification course

294
00:17:36.160 --> 00:17:41.559
that's teaching you how to just safely
operate the jet and then once that happens.

295
00:17:41.920 --> 00:17:45.160
There's three combats B one squadrons in
the world. There's one at Dias

296
00:17:45.200 --> 00:17:47.839
Air Force Base, which is the
ninth down the road from the schoolhouse,

297
00:17:48.519 --> 00:17:51.720
and then there's two up north at
Ellsworth Air Force Base and it's the thirty

298
00:17:51.759 --> 00:17:55.799
seventh and the thirty fourth. What
was cool about that was the thirty seventh

299
00:17:55.880 --> 00:17:57.519
and thirty fourth. We're part of
the Do Little Raiders. So like Jimmy,

300
00:17:57.839 --> 00:18:02.359
like me. We called the twenty
eighth Operations Group up at Elsworth.

301
00:18:02.400 --> 00:18:06.000
It's called the Do Little Raiders because
we direct lineage from Jimmy Doolittle. Yeah,

302
00:18:06.079 --> 00:18:07.920
if you guys go back and look
at some of the pictures and I'll

303
00:18:07.920 --> 00:18:11.359
show you. You know, there's
pictures of Jimmy Doolittle sitting there in the

304
00:18:11.400 --> 00:18:14.119
carrier and the guys sitting next to
him. We're all war And the thirty

305
00:18:14.119 --> 00:18:15.599
fourth Bomb Squadron Patch, which is
the same one that I wore. Yeah,

306
00:18:15.599 --> 00:18:18.200
so that was really cool, like, you know, for being the

307
00:18:18.240 --> 00:18:21.279
youngest service, right, only been
around since forty seven, to be in

308
00:18:22.240 --> 00:18:23.440
to be in a squadron, I
had like a direct reach back to like

309
00:18:23.440 --> 00:18:26.880
the World War two hour. It
was was actually really cool. Yeah,

310
00:18:26.039 --> 00:18:30.039
So did that again about a year
and a half or so, I'd say,

311
00:18:30.079 --> 00:18:33.279
to learn the jet and a lot
of it was mainteninstitute to be one

312
00:18:33.400 --> 00:18:37.839
historically was definitely a maintenance problem child. So we got up there and I

313
00:18:37.880 --> 00:18:41.400
got up to Ellsworth and Lado five
to join the thirty fourth bomb Squadron.

314
00:18:41.480 --> 00:18:44.160
And kind of similar to what we
I'd said before at nine to eleven.

315
00:18:44.680 --> 00:18:47.640
You know, at this point now
we probably know better than I do,

316
00:18:47.759 --> 00:18:52.279
but I'd say, oh, four
ish five, Iraq was still a mess,

317
00:18:52.319 --> 00:18:56.079
but Afghanistan was kind of quiet.
You didn't really see a lot of

318
00:18:56.119 --> 00:18:59.759
the insurgent tactics make their way,
like you know, IED's I think we're

319
00:18:59.799 --> 00:19:02.839
pretty much unheard of Fastan, you
know in the early days. Yeah,

320
00:19:02.880 --> 00:19:04.799
like it just did We're not heard
of. Uh, but you know,

321
00:19:04.880 --> 00:19:10.440
we obviously shifted resources to deal with
Iraq, and so obviously the Taliban were

322
00:19:10.440 --> 00:19:11.160
allowed to sort of you know,
we're kind of allowed to regroup, re

323
00:19:11.279 --> 00:19:15.880
armed, if you will. So
when our sister squadroned in Texas went back

324
00:19:17.200 --> 00:19:19.960
to start servicing targets from Davo Garcia, you know, we we started hearing

325
00:19:21.000 --> 00:19:22.039
like, hey man, it's starting
to pick up again, like it's getting

326
00:19:22.079 --> 00:19:26.200
busy. Uh. And the problem
is though, back then, bones were

327
00:19:26.240 --> 00:19:30.599
launching off a dgar so do U
Arcia. And I think if this was

328
00:19:30.720 --> 00:19:33.799
nuts. You take off with a
tanker in tow, essentially in tandem.

329
00:19:34.119 --> 00:19:38.200
They get you out to about three
hours post launch, they would give you

330
00:19:38.240 --> 00:19:41.319
every single bit of guest they had, they'd go home. So that was

331
00:19:41.359 --> 00:19:45.039
another two hours. And so it
was taking guys about five hours just to

332
00:19:45.039 --> 00:19:51.119
get to Afghanistan. Wo yes,
and that's about if you look at a

333
00:19:51.119 --> 00:19:55.599
map, that's about including about forty
five to an hour transit of what we

334
00:19:55.640 --> 00:19:57.400
call it was called the Beach Road, and it's Haid southern. If you

335
00:19:57.400 --> 00:20:00.759
look at the map, you know, Pakistan kind of does that reverse l

336
00:20:00.799 --> 00:20:06.279
thing to touch Afghanistan, touch i
Ran, and Afghanistan is just sort of

337
00:20:06.359 --> 00:20:10.119
north of this thing called the Beach
Road, and it's a desolate, unpopulated

338
00:20:10.160 --> 00:20:12.279
part of Pakistan, and that was
the one area they let us flying because

339
00:20:12.319 --> 00:20:15.359
no one really cared. And it's
like, you know, pay us,

340
00:20:15.440 --> 00:20:18.319
give us our aid, you leave
us aloan and leave you alone. So

341
00:20:18.359 --> 00:20:21.920
that was yeah. I mean,
i'd like you never had to experience this,

342
00:20:22.000 --> 00:20:23.559
but yeah, it was. Guys
were already airborne for five hours before

343
00:20:23.559 --> 00:20:27.480
we can start in their rowle.
That that's wild. And just to clarify

344
00:20:27.519 --> 00:20:33.440
for people listening, so they're they're
not landing at like calf Or or or

345
00:20:33.480 --> 00:20:41.839
whatever or bogram, they are actually
like flying from Diego, Garcia five hours

346
00:20:42.279 --> 00:20:48.000
to then prosecute targets, yeah,
and then flying back. Yeah. And

347
00:20:48.039 --> 00:20:49.640
you're so you're doing one pre we
call it a pre bowl tank. You're

348
00:20:49.640 --> 00:20:53.200
doing one pre Bowl tank nine times
out of ten. Those guys were doing

349
00:20:53.240 --> 00:20:56.160
another in country tank, and then
on their way home doing a third.

350
00:20:56.400 --> 00:21:00.440
So you're hitting a tank or three
times. And I think somebody only started

351
00:21:00.440 --> 00:21:03.279
to kind of do the math and
go doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

352
00:21:04.359 --> 00:21:07.799
The bone is not runway limited to
at aluded like the B fifty two

353
00:21:08.000 --> 00:21:12.359
was. And I think at this
point now the Asian Games were either happening

354
00:21:12.400 --> 00:21:17.039
in six oh seven. So at
the time the CEA fact, the three

355
00:21:17.079 --> 00:21:19.680
star Air Force airman that was,
you know, under the samecom commander.

356
00:21:21.559 --> 00:21:23.240
At that point, he experimented with, hey, what let's see what two

357
00:21:23.319 --> 00:21:26.480
jets, let's split the squadron up
a little bit. And at this time

358
00:21:26.480 --> 00:21:30.240
it was the Texas Squadron, the
ninth and so they had sent I believe

359
00:21:30.279 --> 00:21:33.119
two to three jets to the deed
to see what the feasibility was. And

360
00:21:33.160 --> 00:21:36.680
once they realized like, hey,
we can actually operate out of here,

361
00:21:37.359 --> 00:21:41.000
at that point the decision was made. Digar is gone. Bones will now

362
00:21:41.000 --> 00:21:44.480
be operating at a AU deed.
And you're al you did Cutter? Yeah,

363
00:21:44.519 --> 00:21:48.000
Cutter? Sorry? Yeah? And
and so how far was that flight

364
00:21:48.039 --> 00:21:51.240
then from Cutter to target? Yeah? So this was I'd say, to

365
00:21:51.240 --> 00:21:56.079
get to Afghanistan, it was probably
a solid hour to go directly east.

366
00:21:56.440 --> 00:22:00.359
You'd fly over UAE, you'd check
in with Muscat Control, which was Oman.

367
00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:03.440
Once you did that, maybe five
to ten more minutes you checked in

368
00:22:03.480 --> 00:22:07.240
with Karachi and then Karachi really just
didn't give a shit about You're like,

369
00:22:07.240 --> 00:22:08.119
oh, yeah, cool, boring
whatever, like you don't care. We

370
00:22:08.160 --> 00:22:11.799
hope you die, yeah, we
know, you hope we die, you

371
00:22:11.799 --> 00:22:14.680
don't fuck with us, won't fuck
with you, and then we'd basically we'd

372
00:22:14.680 --> 00:22:18.559
basically go tactical where we'd put our
tactical squawk on. At that point we'd

373
00:22:18.559 --> 00:22:22.920
switch everything off of Victor into uniform
and we were basically talking to other military

374
00:22:22.920 --> 00:22:26.039
aircraft for deconfliction. And once you
got within range, you were really starting

375
00:22:26.039 --> 00:22:29.160
to listen in on j tech freaks
to figure out what was going on in

376
00:22:29.160 --> 00:22:32.240
the country, right, and then
you know, you every now and then

377
00:22:32.279 --> 00:22:34.359
you'd pass one of the other b
ones going in and you get like a

378
00:22:34.359 --> 00:22:41.119
set rep where the action was if
they had done anything, and then yeah,

379
00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:44.079
I mean that was That's kind of
how Afghanistan went, I think for

380
00:22:44.119 --> 00:22:48.200
most of my deployment. So so
when when units were doing like ground force

381
00:22:48.279 --> 00:22:52.720
planning, when you like operational planning, would they know that you guys would

382
00:22:52.759 --> 00:22:56.640
be on station or would you guys? Would they just plan their op with

383
00:22:56.680 --> 00:23:00.880
whatever was in theater, and then
you guys would kind of in and say,

384
00:23:00.000 --> 00:23:04.119
hey, like we're here, does
does anybody anybody needed any bombs?

385
00:23:04.119 --> 00:23:07.559
No? I mean the most I
mean, I think some of that happened

386
00:23:07.599 --> 00:23:08.559
in the early days, like some
of the Cowboy days. Yeah, the

387
00:23:08.720 --> 00:23:12.440
uh, the it's killing me a
carnt of the name of this now,

388
00:23:12.440 --> 00:23:18.720
but the there was a process where
uh, the J tax and the the

389
00:23:18.759 --> 00:23:22.240
asoce guys, whether it was Big
Army, whether it was you know,

390
00:23:22.920 --> 00:23:25.839
the combat controllers with the ODA teams. And I think at this point too,

391
00:23:25.880 --> 00:23:30.000
my first deployment, OD eight CCTs
were still supporting the White Seal teams.

392
00:23:30.200 --> 00:23:33.519
That eventually changed because either they're their
own j tax but no, you

393
00:23:33.519 --> 00:23:37.640
you would put in ASR. That's
what it was called Air service request,

394
00:23:37.960 --> 00:23:41.279
and you would submit an ASR prior
to the ATO cycle. And you know,

395
00:23:41.319 --> 00:23:44.920
like everything else, the a SoC
would rack and stack what's a high

396
00:23:44.920 --> 00:23:47.880
priority mission, what's general? You
know, they had their own sort of

397
00:23:47.920 --> 00:23:49.440
algorithm, for lack of a better
term one determining who would get what.

398
00:23:49.599 --> 00:23:53.240
Uh huh. Obviously, distance and
geography played a part. You know,

399
00:23:53.279 --> 00:23:56.319
we had the legs to get in
some fairly remote parts of the country,

400
00:23:56.640 --> 00:24:00.599
so that would play a part as
well. But now I really was I

401
00:24:00.599 --> 00:24:04.119
mean, there was always a plan. Okay, very rarely would we take

402
00:24:04.200 --> 00:24:08.400
off without a like basically a JTAC
and a kill box to check into.

403
00:24:08.599 --> 00:24:11.920
Right, every now and then there
was nothing really the service, so you'd

404
00:24:11.960 --> 00:24:15.400
do what's called X casts. Yeah, you know, the joke was it

405
00:24:15.440 --> 00:24:18.640
was extreme casts, like you know, they give us cansa mountain dukes.

406
00:24:18.640 --> 00:24:22.680
It was so extreme flame joke.
But at that point, really it was

407
00:24:22.799 --> 00:24:25.519
just just be in country. God
forbid, something happens, right, and

408
00:24:25.559 --> 00:24:29.440
they would position you. You had
to be careful when they positioned you,

409
00:24:29.480 --> 00:24:32.079
because like you didn't want to like
intrude on somebody else's airspace, but you

410
00:24:32.160 --> 00:24:33.359
kind of wanted to be like at
a jumping off point where like hey,

411
00:24:34.119 --> 00:24:38.480
you know, uh, Kundu's has
been pretty hot lately, like be somewhat

412
00:24:38.519 --> 00:24:41.960
around there. Yeah, uh,
you know for a long time. On

413
00:24:41.000 --> 00:24:45.279
one of my deployments, unfortunately after
seven and oh eight with uh you know

414
00:24:45.359 --> 00:24:51.359
cop keating and uh the other copy
could overrun, you know, we had

415
00:24:51.359 --> 00:24:53.920
this thing called we had one hundred
percent armed overwatch where those guys in the

416
00:24:53.960 --> 00:24:57.720
corn gall would have a jet overhead
twenty four to seven period dot. Yeah,

417
00:24:57.799 --> 00:25:02.559
and then we actually did a lot
of that stuff overnight because uh,

418
00:25:02.720 --> 00:25:03.359
we just we had the legs to
do it, we had the gas to

419
00:25:03.400 --> 00:25:07.960
do it, and so you know, some of those missions were really kind

420
00:25:07.960 --> 00:25:11.359
of tedious and tough. But the
cool thing about those things was, uh,

421
00:25:11.599 --> 00:25:14.599
you know. We talked to j
Tax afterwards and say, dude,

422
00:25:14.599 --> 00:25:18.079
I know it sucks. I know
you've keyed the mic six times total in

423
00:25:18.160 --> 00:25:22.960
six hours, literally like checking in
okay, cool, two hours of nothing,

424
00:25:22.480 --> 00:25:26.440
checking off to go get gas,
okay cool, See you come back

425
00:25:26.440 --> 00:25:29.440
in and forgetting gas, checking out
a guess again. So there we was.

426
00:25:29.480 --> 00:25:33.720
There was there was a few stories
where over corn Gal we'd literally key

427
00:25:33.759 --> 00:25:37.400
the mic six times over seven hours
and it was like I just described checking

428
00:25:37.440 --> 00:25:40.359
in, checking out, check and
check it out. But from what we

429
00:25:40.359 --> 00:25:42.000
heard from those guys at all,
like the fobs like that was the only

430
00:25:42.039 --> 00:25:47.599
time those guys could actually get some
sleep because us us just making noise generally

431
00:25:47.759 --> 00:25:49.279
was at least enough of the turrent. Yeah a lot, yeah, guys

432
00:25:49.319 --> 00:25:52.200
for ship heads, not to like
trying to pop something. Yeah, so

433
00:25:52.240 --> 00:25:55.880
that that actually made us feel good. Let me take a quick segue here.

434
00:25:56.000 --> 00:26:00.480
I need to pimp out the podcast
and remind people that we have a

435
00:26:00.480 --> 00:26:03.640
Patreon and there's a link down the
description. If you guys go and subscribe,

436
00:26:03.680 --> 00:26:07.160
you'll get access to all these episodes. Ad free. Really appreciate you

437
00:26:07.200 --> 00:26:12.519
guys supporting the channel. We do
some bonus episodes on there, and YouTube

438
00:26:12.599 --> 00:26:18.799
doesn't like YouTubers for some reason recently, so we're trying to transition to the

439
00:26:18.799 --> 00:26:22.559
Patreon a bit. And thank you
everyone who already subscribes, We appreciate it.

440
00:26:22.559 --> 00:26:26.839
And if you haven't, it's also
free just to subscribe to the YouTube

441
00:26:26.039 --> 00:26:30.680
and hit the bell icons so you
get notified when we go live. Oh

442
00:26:30.720 --> 00:26:36.079
yeah, The eyes On is our
secondary podcast, which is national security current

443
00:26:36.079 --> 00:26:38.880
events with Jason Lyons and Andy Milburn. So that's on the same channel.

444
00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:44.039
So thank you guys. So,
Brian, just to back up a little

445
00:26:44.039 --> 00:26:48.759
bit, I want to ask you
about the quote unquote traditional or the doctrinal

446
00:26:48.839 --> 00:26:51.480
role of the B one bomber.
I mean that is I believe it's our

447
00:26:51.480 --> 00:26:56.039
only supersonic bomber. Yes, it's
a very unique aircraft. Tell us about

448
00:26:56.079 --> 00:26:59.759
like what that thing's designed for,
what it's designed to do. And then

449
00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:04.920
now you guys obviously had to change
modalities there to fight a counter insurgency or

450
00:27:04.920 --> 00:27:07.920
counter terrorism miss yeah, absolutely,
so yeah, the B one, you

451
00:27:07.920 --> 00:27:11.200
know, originally was a program in
the late seventies. You know, heigh

452
00:27:11.200 --> 00:27:15.000
of the Cold War, and you
know, the original design of it was,

453
00:27:15.160 --> 00:27:18.799
you know, this thing, you
know had a terrain following radar still

454
00:27:18.799 --> 00:27:22.000
does. We just can't execute anymore
unfortunately, to try to extend a life

455
00:27:22.000 --> 00:27:26.440
of the aircraft. But you know, terrain following radar, you know,

456
00:27:26.519 --> 00:27:30.519
so basically hands off the jet could
fly at two hundred feet flying curvature of

457
00:27:30.519 --> 00:27:33.839
the earth type thing. And the
thought process was it was nuclear cable when

458
00:27:33.880 --> 00:27:38.119
it was first you know, designed, and really the mission was two hundred

459
00:27:38.160 --> 00:27:42.279
feet under early warning radars in the
mother Russia, pop up to a safe

460
00:27:42.319 --> 00:27:48.000
release altitude, you know release you
know the shrams or you know the nuclear

461
00:27:48.039 --> 00:27:51.000
weapons at the time, and you
know, basically pray for the best so

462
00:27:51.079 --> 00:27:53.000
you can sort of do an out
maneuver, not get blinded, right and

463
00:27:53.039 --> 00:27:56.160
basically make it home safe. That
was the original mission. You know,

464
00:27:56.240 --> 00:28:02.160
President Carter killed it based on budgets
concerns and some other reasons, and then

465
00:28:02.200 --> 00:28:07.160
you know, Reagan reignited it.
So the jet was only produced in two

466
00:28:07.279 --> 00:28:11.039
years eighty five and eighty six.
So whenever you stepped to a jet,

467
00:28:11.359 --> 00:28:12.720
the tail number is either going to
start with eight five or eight six.

468
00:28:12.839 --> 00:28:15.960
That was the only two years it
was built. It was early, originally

469
00:28:15.960 --> 00:28:19.319
designed to have two hundred that of
course got cut down to one hundred and

470
00:28:19.319 --> 00:28:22.319
then I think at its height,
I want to say, there was maybe

471
00:28:22.400 --> 00:28:27.319
seventy five to eighty something jets,
so it was kind of a maintenance pig

472
00:28:27.359 --> 00:28:32.440
initially. It actually did not play
at all in Desert Storm one, and

473
00:28:32.519 --> 00:28:37.079
so yeah, you had a lot
of a lot of angry sort of you

474
00:28:37.079 --> 00:28:40.480
know Cold War warrior types that pretty
much felt like they got shut out of

475
00:28:40.480 --> 00:28:45.240
it. You know, Go War
one was a really big, you know,

476
00:28:45.400 --> 00:28:48.279
B fifty two fight from a bomber
perspective in the one seventeen I think

477
00:28:48.279 --> 00:28:52.319
also minutes to view then too,
So really, you know, the Bone

478
00:28:52.319 --> 00:28:55.480
really had to kind of search around
for a mission for a lot of years.

479
00:28:56.359 --> 00:28:59.799
I might be screwing the years up
here, but an old wing commander

480
00:28:59.839 --> 00:29:03.839
of he retires a two star general
Tolliver. He luckily was deployed, I

481
00:29:03.839 --> 00:29:07.279
want to say, were deployed to
England when Northern Watch and Southern Watch were

482
00:29:07.319 --> 00:29:11.599
a thing in ninety six, we
decided to respond I think to some incursions

483
00:29:11.599 --> 00:29:15.599
by Saddam and so the first ever
use of the B one I believe was

484
00:29:15.599 --> 00:29:18.960
for Southern Watch in ninety six and
it's a cool video. This is also

485
00:29:19.079 --> 00:29:23.319
back when we had no GPS weapons. Everything was unguided, so we were

486
00:29:23.319 --> 00:29:29.119
literally releasing you know, at its
height unguided the B one could carry eighty

487
00:29:29.160 --> 00:29:34.039
four marke eighty two's so eighty four
five hundred pound unguided weapons. So that

488
00:29:34.160 --> 00:29:37.240
was cool, kind of like showed
that like, hey, we actually have

489
00:29:37.599 --> 00:29:42.559
a place here and we actually have
a role. Once the jet finally got

490
00:29:42.680 --> 00:29:47.240
GPS guided weapons available to it.
This is right around the time of Kosovo,

491
00:29:47.319 --> 00:29:51.400
so ninety nine. It also played
in Kosovo with some with some pretty

492
00:29:51.440 --> 00:29:56.839
good success. And so when nine
to eleven happened, the B onees were

493
00:29:56.839 --> 00:30:00.559
one of the first jets to respond. We sent jets out to Digar to

494
00:30:00.720 --> 00:30:04.559
some other areas too, which either
can't remember them or mile to talk about

495
00:30:04.599 --> 00:30:07.880
them, but I mean they're probably
places we've heard of, right, Yeah,

496
00:30:07.039 --> 00:30:10.359
So you know, they were one
of the early jets to respond.

497
00:30:10.720 --> 00:30:12.599
You know, I want to say
nine to eleven happened that I've talked to

498
00:30:12.640 --> 00:30:15.799
guys that you know, basically,
by mid November we're we're dropping weapons in

499
00:30:15.839 --> 00:30:21.799
country support and fifth Group and the
guys up north. So yeah, basically

500
00:30:21.839 --> 00:30:25.480
they just you know, we adapted
to the role that was required. You

501
00:30:25.480 --> 00:30:29.640
know, you could argue that there
really is no perfect cast platform other than

502
00:30:29.640 --> 00:30:33.480
the A ten and even the A
ten and you know most A ten weapons

503
00:30:33.480 --> 00:30:34.720
school, where I will tell you, like that thing was designed to kill

504
00:30:34.720 --> 00:30:37.240
tanks and the fold the gap during
the Cold War, but it's turned.

505
00:30:37.279 --> 00:30:41.279
It's basically it's made itself essentially the
King of Cash. From a doctoral standpoint,

506
00:30:41.400 --> 00:30:44.559
the fact that it can do Type
one I can see the target,

507
00:30:44.599 --> 00:30:45.839
I can see the friendlies, like
that thing is amazing. Yeah, but

508
00:30:45.960 --> 00:30:49.079
you know not this sort of paraphrase, you know, Rumsfeld, but you

509
00:30:49.079 --> 00:30:52.759
know, you go to war with
the Air Force, you had so basically

510
00:30:52.640 --> 00:30:56.240
our frontline stuff, which was designed
for near peer we all had to sort

511
00:30:56.279 --> 00:31:00.960
of figure out how we're going to
be an optimal CARES platform, right,

512
00:31:00.960 --> 00:31:03.680
And like I said, you know
before, like we had some pros and

513
00:31:03.720 --> 00:31:07.319
cons. You know, we had
shiploads of gas, shiploads of weapons,

514
00:31:07.359 --> 00:31:11.319
and then really just the issue with
us sometimes is we're high really can only

515
00:31:11.359 --> 00:31:15.599
do type two control casts, right, I'm never going to see the friendlies.

516
00:31:15.920 --> 00:31:18.119
Maybe if I'm lucky going to see
the bad guys. Yeah, but

517
00:31:18.200 --> 00:31:22.279
a lot of times I'm really kind
of releasing on cordinates only. But we

518
00:31:22.440 --> 00:31:25.880
definitely had persistence and gas to you
know, stay over ahead for three four

519
00:31:25.920 --> 00:31:27.599
hours at a time and you know, beat it overwatch for guys. So

520
00:31:27.680 --> 00:31:32.279
yeah, I would say our role
definitely evolved over time to where you know,

521
00:31:32.359 --> 00:31:36.200
we were happy that guys could just
execute basic cast in the beginning to

522
00:31:36.400 --> 00:31:38.000
like three four years later, like
you know, we're getting into the nuances

523
00:31:38.039 --> 00:31:41.519
of like you know, you know
this is you know, do I do

524
00:31:41.559 --> 00:31:45.720
this sort of a maneuver after cast
for optimal placement? Like we started trying

525
00:31:45.720 --> 00:31:48.759
to get into the finer points of
conducting casts like the fighters and and you

526
00:31:48.759 --> 00:31:52.079
know, and the rotary guys would
could could you take us a little bit

527
00:31:52.079 --> 00:31:53.799
through like what it's like, you
know, sitting there in the hot seat

528
00:31:53.799 --> 00:31:57.599
as a weapon sky and how you're
putting those presumably you're the guy that has

529
00:31:57.599 --> 00:32:01.400
to put the weapons on target.
So funny story. So O seven,

530
00:32:01.880 --> 00:32:06.839
Uh, you know we were still
radar only. We had no targeting pod.

531
00:32:07.240 --> 00:32:09.279
Oh wow, so O seven,
which was my first apployment, like

532
00:32:09.359 --> 00:32:14.400
LADO six oh seven. Uh,
we were literally a rate our only platform.

533
00:32:14.799 --> 00:32:16.759
Yeah, it was scary. So
which was funny was being at the

534
00:32:16.839 --> 00:32:21.640
deed. So being at the deed, even though I rack at this point

535
00:32:21.680 --> 00:32:24.720
was an effing mess. Like the
early parts of seven like eventually led into

536
00:32:24.839 --> 00:32:29.680
Petraeus coming in, uh, you
know for this for the reawakening and him

537
00:32:29.759 --> 00:32:32.480
kind of turning the tide against this, you know, with with the the

538
00:32:32.720 --> 00:32:37.119
tribal leader piece that he advocated for. But you know, if you went

539
00:32:37.160 --> 00:32:39.200
to Iraq, you knew you weren't
dropping unless it was pre planned because we

540
00:32:39.240 --> 00:32:44.799
had no targeting pod and everything that
was urban. Afghanistan was a different story

541
00:32:44.880 --> 00:32:49.079
obviously, a lot more spread out, not as much focus as there as

542
00:32:49.079 --> 00:32:52.160
we've talked about, Like the fight
was Iraq Afghanistan, I had to say

543
00:32:52.160 --> 00:32:54.240
it at that point, was you
know, was really more of an afterthought

544
00:32:54.480 --> 00:32:57.960
like, hey, it's we went
there for good and yeah, can we

545
00:32:58.000 --> 00:32:59.839
kind of took out off the ball
a little bit? Like that's just my

546
00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:04.519
opinion. So I'll give you one
story where it's my first combat sortady.

547
00:33:04.559 --> 00:33:07.759
Ever, I'm a little nervous,
hadn't really slept that great. Uh so

548
00:33:07.799 --> 00:33:10.720
we check in, we go all
the way towards Jalalabad, and I'm sitting

549
00:33:10.720 --> 00:33:14.480
in the left seat, which is
not the weapon seat, and uh,

550
00:33:15.519 --> 00:33:19.759
you know, I kind of tell
the other wizzo to my right sky auto.

551
00:33:20.400 --> 00:33:22.000
Uh. And he had been on
his third deployment, but because his

552
00:33:22.079 --> 00:33:24.720
previous two deployments were de guard appointments, he never d have to single weapon

553
00:33:24.799 --> 00:33:29.279
either. So we're both like two
neophytes in the back. So we're checking

554
00:33:29.319 --> 00:33:31.559
in with the j tack. Uh. He's not answering, not keying the

555
00:33:31.599 --> 00:33:34.359
mic. So we figured like,
okay, it's a no show, no

556
00:33:34.359 --> 00:33:36.680
big deal, will hang out here. So I kind of go to aut

557
00:33:36.680 --> 00:33:37.480
I'm like, hey, dude,
I really didn't sleep ah a lot.

558
00:33:37.519 --> 00:33:40.240
Man, Like I'm gonna like wedge
my checklist, you know, and like

559
00:33:40.279 --> 00:33:43.640
in my ejection seat and kind of
like try to like you know, homeless

560
00:33:44.119 --> 00:33:45.839
sleep it off a little bit.
He goes, h Ude, all good.

561
00:33:45.480 --> 00:33:49.200
I want to say I got about
maybe fifteen minute power nap and he

562
00:33:49.240 --> 00:33:51.079
cracks me in the arm, like, dude, we got a tick.

563
00:33:51.359 --> 00:33:54.920
Yeah. And you know, back
then, before mc crystal came in and

564
00:33:54.960 --> 00:33:59.759
before we really started kind of really
tying up, how we went kinetic.

565
00:34:00.400 --> 00:34:04.200
I mean six oh seven you said
the word tick. It was like the

566
00:34:04.240 --> 00:34:07.079
three star, like legally letting you
drop weapons. Yeah, we we had

567
00:34:07.119 --> 00:34:10.199
some situation. I mean, there
were definitely some of my thinking since is

568
00:34:10.239 --> 00:34:15.079
where we probably abuse that authority where
guys just drop the magic word tick.

569
00:34:15.239 --> 00:34:16.400
I think I'm threatened, And that
was all the excuse you need to go

570
00:34:16.400 --> 00:34:21.320
connectic. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, we had. I'll tell

571
00:34:21.320 --> 00:34:23.280
you some some I'll take one or
two stories in that. But so we

572
00:34:23.320 --> 00:34:25.920
get I get punched in the arm, all right, shit, okay,

573
00:34:25.960 --> 00:34:29.760
cool, all right, where are
we going? And I'm like all jazzed

574
00:34:29.840 --> 00:34:31.360
up and then I realized it,
you know, and at this point now

575
00:34:31.719 --> 00:34:34.800
we're running the math in the back. We're figuring out okay, if we

576
00:34:34.800 --> 00:34:37.639
go point nine down to this tick
in Helmet Province, uh, we'll show

577
00:34:37.679 --> 00:34:40.239
up there in about forty minutes and
we'll still about two hours of playtime.

578
00:34:40.559 --> 00:34:44.000
So you get it amped up,
and then it's like a fuck, like,

579
00:34:44.119 --> 00:34:46.000
you know, I'm going from jbad
down to helmet right, it's still

580
00:34:46.039 --> 00:34:49.719
forty minutes, right, but you
know, you get you know, get

581
00:34:49.760 --> 00:34:52.519
your time to get your act together, get checked in. And I want

582
00:34:52.519 --> 00:34:55.400
to say generally on a uniform freak. We could generally start reaching ja tax

583
00:34:55.400 --> 00:34:59.119
set about if you were lucky spending, if they especially if they had an

584
00:34:59.159 --> 00:35:01.119
extender on the UH. I think
it was the one seventy twos they were

585
00:35:01.159 --> 00:35:05.880
running around with. But around forty
to fifty miles you can start getting camps

586
00:35:05.880 --> 00:35:07.800
with the j A tack. And
so I first took ever, I'll never

587
00:35:07.840 --> 00:35:13.039
forget it, Widows seven eight,
and it was a British j tech assigned

588
00:35:13.039 --> 00:35:16.400
to the Royal Fusiliers. And I
love working with the Brits because you know,

589
00:35:16.559 --> 00:35:20.719
I'd work later on with Americans and
it's hectic and its cast. The

590
00:35:20.719 --> 00:35:23.239
Brits were the most they could be
in a life threatening situation. It's like

591
00:35:23.920 --> 00:35:27.719
there in three four it's Widow seven
eight. I saw to be a ball

592
00:35:27.719 --> 00:35:30.679
the sub but we are taking a
heavy fire from these. I stand by

593
00:35:30.719 --> 00:35:35.199
grid alright ready four one Sierra papod
Remia and then like boo, yeah,

594
00:35:35.519 --> 00:35:37.039
and this is back in the days
where like you know, sang in Province,

595
00:35:37.599 --> 00:35:40.679
this is you know, And obviously
Helmand and Kandahar were like the spiritual

596
00:35:40.719 --> 00:35:44.760
home metal band. That's kind of
where they made their reawakening. And so

597
00:35:44.840 --> 00:35:47.119
the Brits that were there really got
into it big time. So those guys

598
00:35:47.119 --> 00:35:52.519
were constantly getting into contact and it
flew by. But I kid you not.

599
00:35:52.679 --> 00:35:55.000
We stayed with these dudes for about
eight hours. Yeah, and at

600
00:35:55.000 --> 00:35:59.719
the time, we were carrying a
bay tank six GBU thirty eights in the

601
00:35:59.760 --> 00:36:02.000
interner media bay, which was a
five hundred pound GPS skided weapon, and

602
00:36:02.000 --> 00:36:06.280
we had eight thirty ons and we
know, shit, we we released all

603
00:36:06.320 --> 00:36:09.119
eight two thousand pound weapons. Wowcame
this effing close to go in Winchester,

604
00:36:10.000 --> 00:36:13.079
and I could tell the j tech
was really trying to make it work.

605
00:36:13.320 --> 00:36:15.400
Man, I'm really trying here.
We think we you're all dead. You've

606
00:36:15.400 --> 00:36:17.679
done too good of a Joel,
but I didn't think we can get connected

607
00:36:17.679 --> 00:36:20.960
with your loss. Thank you so
much, gents, appreciate it, you

608
00:36:21.000 --> 00:36:22.079
know, Like then I blink,
I'm like, oh, fuck, do

609
00:36:22.119 --> 00:36:23.840
you We've been airborn for like seven
hours. Wow, We've been in this

610
00:36:23.880 --> 00:36:28.079
tick for seven hours. Yeah,
So that was like story that was like

611
00:36:28.079 --> 00:36:30.880
my first ever drop, and you
know all that like regret of like not

612
00:36:30.960 --> 00:36:32.000
going fighters, not going eagles.
I'm like, you know what, this

613
00:36:32.039 --> 00:36:35.880
is where I was meant to be
for you. Guys, do you recall

614
00:36:36.280 --> 00:36:38.679
what the danger close was for the
five hundred pounders and then for they know

615
00:36:38.760 --> 00:36:45.719
it's yeah, it's it changed the
initial days and seven uh. An impact

616
00:36:46.119 --> 00:36:52.639
GBU thirty eight was three hundred and
five meters, a impact GBU thirty one

617
00:36:52.719 --> 00:36:57.719
was three sixty five. Uh.
And then I'll be honest with you,

618
00:36:58.599 --> 00:37:00.800
some of my old students, if
they listen, that's gonna be giving me

619
00:37:00.880 --> 00:37:05.239
shift not remembering if I went airburst
on the thirty eight, it bumped it

620
00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:07.400
up by thirty meters, okay,
And if I went airburst thirty one,

621
00:37:07.599 --> 00:37:12.000
it bumped it out to like four
oh five okay. Now after that for

622
00:37:12.079 --> 00:37:14.679
almost almost one hundred extra meters,
yeah, pretty much. Yeah. So

623
00:37:14.760 --> 00:37:17.159
after that though, they did a
lot more research, they sort of dial

624
00:37:17.239 --> 00:37:21.519
on them down. And I want
to say, my last deployment, the

625
00:37:21.519 --> 00:37:25.119
thirty eight's I remember being two sixty
five for impact, three zero five for

626
00:37:25.199 --> 00:37:30.199
airburst, And I want to say, for some weird reason, three fifteen

627
00:37:30.239 --> 00:37:32.400
and three eighty five or three fifteen
and three sixty five for thirty one says

628
00:37:32.440 --> 00:37:36.880
that's how I kind of like obviously
the the air burst because the spread would

629
00:37:36.880 --> 00:37:39.079
go out right on the nose cone
that would generally put it out for about

630
00:37:39.079 --> 00:37:43.079
forty fifty meters on top. What
was the standard height for an airburst when

631
00:37:43.079 --> 00:37:45.239
you guys would drop, So the
DSU thirty three was twenty feet plus or

632
00:37:45.280 --> 00:37:49.840
minus this plus or minus six feet. Okay, so it would go anywhere

633
00:37:49.880 --> 00:37:52.880
from fourteen feet all the way up
to twenty six feet with the impact point.

634
00:37:52.960 --> 00:37:55.639
That's quite a that's quite a shit. Yeah, we had one about

635
00:37:55.679 --> 00:37:59.440
it. Well, we had a
couple of sorties where a number one fucker,

636
00:38:00.480 --> 00:38:04.840
this was eight, and the call
was, uh, we dropped the

637
00:38:04.880 --> 00:38:07.000
g W thirty to air bursts on
this guy and this guy I really hope

638
00:38:07.000 --> 00:38:09.440
this guy lived in whet to go
cure cancer or something. But it was

639
00:38:10.119 --> 00:38:15.239
not too far from Kandahar. They
had caught him plant an I D and

640
00:38:15.320 --> 00:38:19.199
we literally watched this My our targeting
pod screen went poof, like we hit

641
00:38:19.280 --> 00:38:21.960
him. But this guy literally must
have served. They called it like the

642
00:38:22.000 --> 00:38:24.920
Coner Survival, right. The guy
literally was underneath and all the frag went

643
00:38:24.960 --> 00:38:28.599
out. Yeah, this guy actually
did one of these in the pod and

644
00:38:28.639 --> 00:38:30.320
like sprinted off. Yeah, and
we couldn't get cleared for a reattack.

645
00:38:30.679 --> 00:38:34.800
Uh. So Yeah, there was. There's a few times there were we

646
00:38:34.840 --> 00:38:37.800
really advocated for unless the guy is
offset or unless you won't be hitting guys

647
00:38:37.800 --> 00:38:40.320
in trees. Yeah, you know. We'd actually tell the j Tax over

648
00:38:40.320 --> 00:38:44.639
the radio like, hey, copy
all recommend me go impact and we'll and

649
00:38:44.639 --> 00:38:46.800
we'll connect. If we'll, we'll
readjust from there for and you're saying,

650
00:38:46.840 --> 00:38:50.920
because with an impact, it hits
and it goes out with the air bursts,

651
00:38:50.920 --> 00:38:52.320
it goes out, which gives you
a wider spread. It does,

652
00:38:52.599 --> 00:38:57.840
but but there's actually like underdirectly underneath
the cone. It's the weird you wouldn't

653
00:38:57.840 --> 00:39:01.320
think it. Yeah. Now,
granted there was a few times where talking

654
00:39:01.320 --> 00:39:05.199
to guys afterwards or like that guy
probably is gonna die the next day,

655
00:39:05.679 --> 00:39:08.840
just based on the the uh the
compression, Yeah, that he's getting off

656
00:39:08.840 --> 00:39:12.119
the BOTMB. Yeah. Yeah,
I'll send you guys the video. There's

657
00:39:12.119 --> 00:39:15.440
one video. Uh, the British
Jay Tax and O seven would like this

658
00:39:15.519 --> 00:39:19.480
is this is before iPhones? He's
like the Sony digital cams. Yeah,

659
00:39:19.559 --> 00:39:22.480
they call in strikes from us.
They'd like, you know, overcover And

660
00:39:22.519 --> 00:39:25.599
there was one where we dropped to
thirty one and they were well outside of

661
00:39:25.679 --> 00:39:30.079
danger close but you can hear the
guy coughing and hacking because he's talking as

662
00:39:30.079 --> 00:39:34.639
the shockwave goes. Yah, he's
like you know, yeah, the guy

663
00:39:35.039 --> 00:39:37.960
like he's hacking up. He's hacking
up along. So yeah, yeah,

664
00:39:38.000 --> 00:39:42.760
that overpressure must must have been immense
even if he didn't catch Yeah, there

665
00:39:42.840 --> 00:39:45.119
was a few guys where it's like
you didn't want to get into like an

666
00:39:45.159 --> 00:39:47.079
argument the groundcourse commander, but it's
like, dude, yeah he's walking with

667
00:39:47.159 --> 00:39:51.880
like that guy's not surviving. That
guy's bleeding from every orifice he has and

668
00:39:51.880 --> 00:39:53.480
probably something that we just created,
like this guy's not gonna live. Yeah,

669
00:39:53.760 --> 00:39:59.119
no, he's moving like if we'll
drop another seventy K for they or

670
00:39:59.159 --> 00:40:01.599
like why not? Yeah, it
reminds of your major pain. It's like

671
00:40:01.639 --> 00:40:05.480
if he's in there, he ain't
happy. Yeah, that was a big

672
00:40:05.519 --> 00:40:09.679
part of it for Jesus. Yeah, that was yeah, but yeah,

673
00:40:09.679 --> 00:40:14.599
that was so ill. I'm kind
of getting off on tangency, but yeah,

674
00:40:14.840 --> 00:40:21.039
right, so seven was crazy because
uh you know right when uh,

675
00:40:21.519 --> 00:40:23.800
right before I'd say about a month
before we transitioned out. That's when Portrayus

676
00:40:23.880 --> 00:40:29.559
came in and like the floodgates of
Iraq just opened like I think betrays gave

677
00:40:29.599 --> 00:40:32.239
a lot of the ground force commanders
sort of uh like license like hey dudes,

678
00:40:32.880 --> 00:40:36.199
uh, there's been something you've been
meaning to shwack, Like now's your

679
00:40:36.239 --> 00:40:39.159
time. Yeah, So we had
we had one sorty where uh you could

680
00:40:39.199 --> 00:40:43.840
usually hit Basra in about forty five
minutes, the southernmost point. The Britz

681
00:40:43.880 --> 00:40:46.280
were control of that. Remember taking
off, We took off to the north

682
00:40:46.800 --> 00:40:51.679
and so like basically hit Iraq and
like record time, And if you look

683
00:40:51.719 --> 00:40:54.760
on a map, it was a
killbox south of Bagad. I forget the

684
00:40:54.800 --> 00:41:00.639
specific town, but we literally was
lined up. We were hitting Olive Grove

685
00:41:00.719 --> 00:41:04.480
that was historically like you know,
insurgent staging area. And I think I

686
00:41:04.519 --> 00:41:07.920
don't think we changed our heading more
than five degrees. We just flew straight

687
00:41:07.960 --> 00:41:10.519
for forty five minutes, opened the
bay doors. We had all twenty weapons

688
00:41:10.559 --> 00:41:15.559
off on one pass, all three
fours Winchester Missigon complete. And then you

689
00:41:15.599 --> 00:41:17.360
know somebody at the talk is looking
at their like all right, your Winchester

690
00:41:17.480 --> 00:41:22.960
go home. So yeah, I
went Winchester in like under four hours after

691
00:41:22.079 --> 00:41:25.320
dropping twenty weapons. And that that
was just like the portrayal, Like the

692
00:41:25.880 --> 00:41:30.880
that like month I think our bomb
total like we were on track. Maybe

693
00:41:30.880 --> 00:41:34.519
they dropped like five hundred over the
course of six months, and I think

694
00:41:34.519 --> 00:41:36.719
by the time we left in July
oh seven, we were up to like

695
00:41:36.760 --> 00:41:39.280
seven and change. Wow, And
that was just Afghanistan was still hot.

696
00:41:39.360 --> 00:41:44.840
Obviously the spring fighting season was in
full force at that point, and then

697
00:41:44.840 --> 00:41:47.760
the Iraq just being there for the
beginning of the of the Awakening. I

698
00:41:47.760 --> 00:41:51.360
feet what the terminology was when Portray
showed up, that was Yeah, that

699
00:41:51.400 --> 00:41:55.199
was a huge game changer. So
got home, went back out the next

700
00:41:55.280 --> 00:42:00.000
year. I actually went a little
bit late because I went to instructor school.

701
00:42:00.519 --> 00:42:02.880
But that second deployment we actually had
the the sniper targeting pod. And

702
00:42:02.920 --> 00:42:06.480
everyone had warned us like, dudes, you're gonna drop less of this thing,

703
00:42:06.559 --> 00:42:07.199
marked by words like no, no, no way, man, Like

704
00:42:07.199 --> 00:42:09.079
do you know many targets I could
have found to fight a poly gull?

705
00:42:09.159 --> 00:42:12.880
Right? Shit? Had? Okay, fine, you know better? They

706
00:42:12.880 --> 00:42:15.079
were right, you know, we
had the targeting pod. That's like an

707
00:42:15.079 --> 00:42:17.039
appointment. I think we dropped our
drop went down to like three eighty five.

708
00:42:17.599 --> 00:42:21.880
For why is that? I mean
a lot of that point now it's

709
00:42:22.079 --> 00:42:25.480
the onus is really on the air
crew and for them, you know,

710
00:42:25.880 --> 00:42:29.519
whatever possible, like it probably should
be, right, Like you're a tool

711
00:42:29.559 --> 00:42:32.119
for the guy on the ground.
You know. The biggest thing, at

712
00:42:32.199 --> 00:42:37.239
least I would say from the b
Ones perspective, was most guys got it

713
00:42:37.320 --> 00:42:38.280
that, Like, dude, I
don't care if we fly a three hundred

714
00:42:38.280 --> 00:42:40.760
million dollar jet, like the mission
is the guy on the ground. Sure,

715
00:42:42.199 --> 00:42:45.599
Like is there like a quantity over
quality kind of aspect or vice versa

716
00:42:45.719 --> 00:42:49.639
that the sniper pod made you more
accurate? I mean that was definitely a

717
00:42:49.679 --> 00:42:53.079
part of it. It was also
I think, uh, I don't want

718
00:42:53.119 --> 00:42:55.360
to go back and look and say, maybe some of the bombs we dropped

719
00:42:55.360 --> 00:43:00.760
in O seven maybe were maybe overkill
or there was really nothing there, or

720
00:43:00.800 --> 00:43:02.039
you're also working with what you had
it. Yeah, but yeah, the

721
00:43:02.039 --> 00:43:08.599
sniper pod definitely like you could not
some guys got into trouble because you could

722
00:43:08.599 --> 00:43:12.360
not definitely tell like what a dot
was, right. Sure, And if

723
00:43:12.360 --> 00:43:15.440
you looked at the you know,
the John Chapman Medal of Honor MQ one

724
00:43:15.519 --> 00:43:19.159
video right like that that that is
about as graining as it effing gets.

725
00:43:19.280 --> 00:43:23.199
Yeah, the Lockheed Sniper Pod was
ten times better but I still couldn't discern,

726
00:43:23.719 --> 00:43:28.880
you know, child from man right, woman from man. All I

727
00:43:28.920 --> 00:43:31.599
could basically tell is I've got movement, And if I really was starting to

728
00:43:31.679 --> 00:43:36.239
stretch the limits here, I have
a possible Like there were certain cases where

729
00:43:36.239 --> 00:43:39.360
if your clarity was good enough,
I could see like a shorter blip and

730
00:43:39.400 --> 00:43:44.519
an adult sized blip right, and
you'd get Dude, I'm not saying definitely,

731
00:43:44.559 --> 00:43:46.440
but I've got some half size returns
with some full size returns. I

732
00:43:46.480 --> 00:43:49.360
really was up to the guy on
the ground to sort of make that judgment

733
00:43:49.360 --> 00:43:53.000
call, right. But you know
the uh pretty much that we were there

734
00:43:53.039 --> 00:43:55.239
as a censor and we were there
as a tool for them, but for

735
00:43:55.320 --> 00:44:00.800
a tick, I mean with this
sniper pod, especially if if you know

736
00:44:00.880 --> 00:44:04.039
the enemies were and for people who
might not know tick. When we say

737
00:44:04.039 --> 00:44:07.599
tick, we're talking about troops in
contact, uh so ground force you know,

738
00:44:07.800 --> 00:44:10.239
engagement and usually like when they call
in a tick, it's more than

739
00:44:10.320 --> 00:44:14.960
just like a squirter or like somebody
shooting pop shots. It's like you're you're

740
00:44:15.000 --> 00:44:21.599
you're effectively engaged by enemy. Yeah
right, so what what like what not

741
00:44:21.639 --> 00:44:24.199
only from your level but also from
the air force level with these sniper pods

742
00:44:24.239 --> 00:44:30.920
coming online, what would happen if
there were discrepancy between what the jatach was

743
00:44:30.960 --> 00:44:34.400
saying and what you were seeing on
the sniper pod. I mean really,

744
00:44:34.400 --> 00:44:38.039
you just you know, you know, guys got into trouble when they sort

745
00:44:38.039 --> 00:44:40.719
of thought they were they were doing
leading calm, you know, almost like

746
00:44:40.760 --> 00:44:45.239
being like a jailhouse lawyer. You
really. And that's the thing too,

747
00:44:45.239 --> 00:44:47.079
like everything's getting recorded, right,
So we would tell our young guys like,

748
00:44:47.159 --> 00:44:51.280
dude, like, you're not there
on the ground, I know that,

749
00:44:51.800 --> 00:44:53.679
you think you can discern that.
So some lied underne of your crosshairs,

750
00:44:53.679 --> 00:44:57.400
but it's probably not right. So
just just effing tell the guy what

751
00:44:57.440 --> 00:45:00.199
you see, right, and don't
bullshit, don't, you know, because

752
00:45:00.199 --> 00:45:02.639
listen. The other thing too,
is like there were times where you know,

753
00:45:04.000 --> 00:45:07.440
guys were using ROVER and you know, I forgive me for forgetting the

754
00:45:07.480 --> 00:45:09.679
acronym, but you know, ROVER
was the link I think it was remote

755
00:45:09.760 --> 00:45:14.880
operated video enhancement something radio, that's
what it was. And ROVER was the

756
00:45:14.960 --> 00:45:17.360
j tax ability to see what my
snipper was saying. Remember that. And

757
00:45:17.360 --> 00:45:21.159
there were times where they used it
with drones too. Yeah, they drones,

758
00:45:21.639 --> 00:45:23.880
if you had like the raid cams
on a base where and some of

759
00:45:23.880 --> 00:45:27.400
the pictures from those things were like
it was like HD, it was amazing.

760
00:45:27.800 --> 00:45:30.679
But there were times where like guys
were convinced that they were staring at

761
00:45:30.679 --> 00:45:32.000
the same thing and they weren't because
I mean, let's be honest, like

762
00:45:32.079 --> 00:45:37.360
every mud hud looks pretty ef and
similar. Most guys are wearing the same

763
00:45:37.400 --> 00:45:39.639
style of Man Jammy. Right,
there's like two Man Jammy producers in Afghanistan,

764
00:45:39.719 --> 00:45:43.320
you know, like it's either Calvin
Klein or this other guy. So,

765
00:45:43.400 --> 00:45:45.199
yeah, there are a lot of
times where you really got yourself into

766
00:45:45.239 --> 00:45:51.440
trouble if you talk to yourself.
I mean I get it. Like you're

767
00:45:51.440 --> 00:45:53.239
sitting in a jet, you're moving
in a mile a minute. You want

768
00:45:53.280 --> 00:45:57.199
to keep the guys safe because you'll
hear incoming, you'll hear contact on the

769
00:45:57.280 --> 00:46:00.079
radio. But when you're on the
ground and you're the instructor and you're reading,

770
00:46:00.079 --> 00:46:02.280
you're watching their sniper pod, you're
like, ah shit, I know

771
00:46:02.280 --> 00:46:07.480
where at ground speed zero you could
see where guys from a comms perspective would

772
00:46:07.480 --> 00:46:08.840
talk themselves onto like the wrong targets. Yeah, so the thing we would

773
00:46:08.840 --> 00:46:13.000
tell guys is just dude. It
doesn't have to be sexy. I don't

774
00:46:13.039 --> 00:46:15.519
care if the comm sounds like garbage. Just tell the guy what you see.

775
00:46:15.599 --> 00:46:17.159
Yeah, and then you know,
and it sucks in a lot of

776
00:46:17.199 --> 00:46:21.079
ways. But if there's any doubt, there is no doubt, right because

777
00:46:21.079 --> 00:46:23.079
I mean, this is kind of
hard for us, but you know,

778
00:46:23.159 --> 00:46:29.000
like so twenty fourteen is a perfect
example of I can't come into a lot

779
00:46:29.000 --> 00:46:30.039
of it, obviously because a lot
of it's still I think classified, But

780
00:46:30.039 --> 00:46:32.239
you know that the frat we had
unfortunately to be one of the on the

781
00:46:32.239 --> 00:46:36.920
fifth group guys. You know,
I've listened to some of those tapes and

782
00:46:36.960 --> 00:46:40.760
it was I'll just say that there
was. There was definitely I'll kind of

783
00:46:40.840 --> 00:46:44.679
dance around a little bit. There
were a few comments to the tune of

784
00:46:44.760 --> 00:46:46.639
like I'm either gonna get a fucking
weapon out of you guys, or I'll

785
00:46:46.639 --> 00:46:49.920
find somebody who will give me.
It was kind of like, dude,

786
00:46:49.920 --> 00:46:52.559
we're taking fire, and I think, you know, unfortunately we sort of

787
00:46:52.639 --> 00:46:58.679
let and I know personally some of
the guys in that jet, So I

788
00:46:58.719 --> 00:47:00.440
don't want to say much more of
it, but that's an example I think

789
00:47:00.519 --> 00:47:04.639
of kind of getting browbeating and doing
something normally you wouldn't do. Actually it's

790
00:47:04.679 --> 00:47:07.400
Bean zero. Yeah, so really
that's how we would try to keep Which

791
00:47:07.400 --> 00:47:12.760
incident are we talking about? So
twenty fourteen? Uh, and actually conn

792
00:47:13.039 --> 00:47:15.800
it might have been, but it
was the one where they interviewed the Uh

793
00:47:15.960 --> 00:47:20.760
he ended up going to Georgetown Law
School. The captain of the Fifth Group

794
00:47:20.880 --> 00:47:23.920
ended up they did a CBS report. I mean, but you're saying twenty

795
00:47:24.039 --> 00:47:28.599
fourteen, Yeah, I'm thinking the
fifth Group. I'm thinking Jason and Green

796
00:47:28.800 --> 00:47:30.599
and the You're you're thinking like the
Bee fifty two, so early on in

797
00:47:30.639 --> 00:47:34.239
the you're thinking, you're thinking,
oh, to where the guy reset his

798
00:47:34.320 --> 00:47:37.559
radio. Yeah, twenty fourteen,
there was a twenty four two was okay,

799
00:47:37.679 --> 00:47:45.719
yeah, if you go back and
look my bad like this, you're

800
00:47:45.760 --> 00:47:49.880
all good. Okay, I'll put
it up higher. Is that is that

801
00:47:49.920 --> 00:47:52.119
better? All right? Cool?
Yeah? Twenty summer of twenty fourteen,

802
00:47:52.159 --> 00:47:55.800
unfortunately, we had a blue on
blue and it was you know, basically,

803
00:47:55.920 --> 00:48:01.360
uh, you know, Dismounts guy
got separated and you know, essentially

804
00:48:01.400 --> 00:48:04.440
we're firing our each other. Didn't
know it, and then a bone showed

805
00:48:04.519 --> 00:48:07.440
up and responded and unfortunately, we
think we lost four guys. That's just

806
00:48:07.480 --> 00:48:10.920
like one example. I think of
what country was this in Afghanistan? Okay,

807
00:48:13.760 --> 00:48:15.360
but what sucked up? I mean, again my personal opinion, not

808
00:48:15.440 --> 00:48:22.960
you know, official air force position, but when that's happening was CBS did

809
00:48:22.960 --> 00:48:27.280
a special on it, and if
you read the CBS special, it's b

810
00:48:27.440 --> 00:48:32.519
ones with targeting pods are unsafe,
and it's like, it's like, dude,

811
00:48:32.679 --> 00:48:35.320
there were some fuck ups, don't
get me wrong, but like there

812
00:48:35.360 --> 00:48:37.880
were a fuck up whole around.
And that's kind of one of those things

813
00:48:37.880 --> 00:48:43.000
where as an aircrew guy, you
don't feel right sometimes passing judgment on a

814
00:48:43.000 --> 00:48:45.719
guy getting shot out on the ground. But it's also like, dude,

815
00:48:45.719 --> 00:48:49.320
like similar to everywhere. Sure,
you know when I when I was thinking

816
00:48:49.360 --> 00:48:52.519
about Kundus, I mean that's where
the Doctors Without Borders Hospital was. Oh,

817
00:48:52.599 --> 00:48:57.639
that's another one. There was a
number of different things that like led

818
00:48:57.760 --> 00:49:00.559
up to that, and it becomes
like the perfect storm. So it's funny.

819
00:49:00.679 --> 00:49:04.519
Yeah, And that's that's the comment
for guys who've listened to that tape

820
00:49:04.519 --> 00:49:07.800
that I do the after action report. You know, obviously, uh,

821
00:49:07.960 --> 00:49:10.280
I remember talking to a couple of
fifth Group guys because for a while,

822
00:49:10.320 --> 00:49:15.519
they're like a lot of B one
guys, Like if you were around you

823
00:49:15.599 --> 00:49:17.199
kind of didn't let Fifth Group dudes
know that you were a bone dude,

824
00:49:17.239 --> 00:49:21.639
because it was definitely a touchy subject. But I met one or two Fifth

825
00:49:21.679 --> 00:49:23.079
Group guys that just kind of like, hey, dude, listen you guys.

826
00:49:23.679 --> 00:49:27.079
The one guy actually kind of made
us feel really feel a little better.

827
00:49:27.119 --> 00:49:29.719
He goes, I've got two personal
stories where you guys have saved my

828
00:49:29.719 --> 00:49:32.000
ass, and he goes, it
just it sucks. It wasn't just you,

829
00:49:32.960 --> 00:49:35.800
if you know, CBS kind of
threw us out of the bus a

830
00:49:35.840 --> 00:49:38.519
little bit. Yeah, it was
literally, like you said, cascading events

831
00:49:39.239 --> 00:49:44.079
and it's happened in the past,
where like that was kind of one of

832
00:49:44.119 --> 00:49:45.480
the benefits for a long time of
us being a four person jet. Like

833
00:49:45.480 --> 00:49:49.360
one guy could cry uncle and go, well, dude, something's not sounding

834
00:49:49.440 --> 00:49:52.559
right here right, and you'd reassess, go fuck dude, like I miscarried

835
00:49:52.599 --> 00:49:55.320
the one yeah, the wrong great
identify or whatever. That was just unfortunately

836
00:49:55.320 --> 00:49:59.559
one of those stories where like the
moon's all aligned in the wrong spot.

837
00:49:59.639 --> 00:50:02.320
Yeah, it's horrible, you know, I feel terrible about it. It

838
00:50:02.400 --> 00:50:07.639
was the nature of the war.
But it's unfortunate because that sort of fog

839
00:50:07.719 --> 00:50:13.199
war like it happens on the ground
between blue on blue also, so it's

840
00:50:13.599 --> 00:50:17.639
it's not you know, it's not
as if it's something that is solely limited

841
00:50:17.840 --> 00:50:22.400
to be ones with sniper pods.
And that was the funniest thing about it,

842
00:50:22.440 --> 00:50:25.119
was like, dude, it's the
exact same sniper pod on every other

843
00:50:25.599 --> 00:50:29.199
calf platform, right, So like
the fact that they were trying to tie

844
00:50:29.199 --> 00:50:32.159
it to us, it's like the
micron like the physics of the pod don't

845
00:50:32.239 --> 00:50:37.079
change on a fighter. It's still
the same micron range in IR Like that

846
00:50:37.159 --> 00:50:39.320
was kind of where a lot of
us cried bs. But it kind of

847
00:50:39.320 --> 00:50:42.400
gave us a black guy for a
little bit unfortunately, and you know,

848
00:50:42.440 --> 00:50:45.480
for a lot of us. Again
it's my personal opinion. I think it

849
00:50:45.519 --> 00:50:49.559
felt like the Air Force is doing
everything their power to justify getting rid of

850
00:50:49.599 --> 00:50:53.360
the bone because we're not nuke anymore. You know, it really had no

851
00:50:53.400 --> 00:50:58.400
problem I think running us into the
ground simply to make you know, slides

852
00:50:58.400 --> 00:51:02.360
of green for cast coverage, right, But uh yeah, and it's it's

853
00:51:02.400 --> 00:51:06.519
wild because you know, you're talking
about the Air Force trying to get rid

854
00:51:06.519 --> 00:51:09.280
of the B one. Meanwhile,
we know that, you know, they've

855
00:51:09.280 --> 00:51:13.280
tried since Vietnam to get rid of
the A ten. They've tried since Vietnam

856
00:51:13.360 --> 00:51:17.079
to get rid of the AC one
thirty like and and these these platforms come

857
00:51:17.119 --> 00:51:22.440
out and proved to be incredibly viable
and important platforms in these wars. And

858
00:51:22.599 --> 00:51:27.559
yet even after these wars, the
Air Force is still determined to get rid

859
00:51:27.559 --> 00:51:30.320
of us, like they have the
next great, greatest and best thing.

860
00:51:30.639 --> 00:51:34.079
I think, luckily, at least
the rumor that I've heard is again this

861
00:51:34.159 --> 00:51:36.239
is just open source. But you
know, I think the B one's gonna

862
00:51:36.239 --> 00:51:39.079
probably get a little of a stay
of execution. If you guys saw I'll

863
00:51:39.079 --> 00:51:42.719
get a shot out. But my
old squadron, uh, you know,

864
00:51:42.760 --> 00:51:45.559
unfortunately we lost the uh we lost
our three with the drone and a taff

865
00:51:45.559 --> 00:51:51.199
garrison. Well the bone is what
responded again. And one of my old

866
00:51:51.199 --> 00:51:52.559
students texted me to give me grief, like, hey, I broke your

867
00:51:52.599 --> 00:51:57.679
record like you you the libyas the
Libya crew had the record for combat sorty

868
00:51:57.679 --> 00:52:00.679
from Konis yea. We just we
just killed it like eat, thank you

869
00:52:00.719 --> 00:52:04.920
all, young wise when I've touched
you well, but yeah, we continue

870
00:52:04.920 --> 00:52:07.280
to prove that. Like right when
you think like the old way of doing

871
00:52:07.320 --> 00:52:09.800
war is done, it's like the
old golf other thing. Just when I

872
00:52:09.840 --> 00:52:12.519
thought I was out, they pulled
me back in. Yeah, we just

873
00:52:12.559 --> 00:52:15.519
cannot extricate ourselves from at effing theater. It seems like. Yeah, and

874
00:52:15.559 --> 00:52:21.079
I also think too, like just
from a sheer number standpoint, you know,

875
00:52:22.320 --> 00:52:23.719
you know, God forbid something kicks
off the Pacific, like it just

876
00:52:23.760 --> 00:52:27.800
becomes a number. It literally becomes
just basic math. I e. R.

877
00:52:28.079 --> 00:52:30.960
I've got x number of combat B
fifty two's, they've got X number

878
00:52:30.000 --> 00:52:32.679
of weapons station. I've got x
number of bones, x number of B

879
00:52:32.760 --> 00:52:37.199
twos, And then you literally just
start doing the math of available weapon station

880
00:52:37.280 --> 00:52:40.360
per bomber, how many platforms with
the fuel range that can actually reach out

881
00:52:40.440 --> 00:52:44.880
exactly? You know, I want
to get back to sort of your story,

882
00:52:44.960 --> 00:52:46.719
man, but since you brought it
up, you know, can you

883
00:52:46.760 --> 00:52:52.480
tell us can we talk about the
other sort of bomber platforms and what they're

884
00:52:52.719 --> 00:52:58.719
like, what advantages they have and
why the B one you know, was

885
00:52:58.760 --> 00:53:02.039
thought to be outdated but then yeah, to be so obviously the BFT two,

886
00:53:02.199 --> 00:53:06.199
which again, you know, there's
sort of like a you know,

887
00:53:06.400 --> 00:53:09.519
bomber rivalry syndrome if you will,
And I know I just missaid that word,

888
00:53:09.519 --> 00:53:14.880
but you know, the thing,
the thing is a marvel of of

889
00:53:14.920 --> 00:53:19.519
aircraft engineering. That thing possibly will
fly for one hundred years. I'd say

890
00:53:19.519 --> 00:53:23.000
the edge it has over us right
now is it can fly higher. It's

891
00:53:23.199 --> 00:53:25.599
I don't know this is an advantage
per se, because I want no part

892
00:53:25.599 --> 00:53:29.199
of the nuke mission ever, but
it is. It is nuclear capable.

893
00:53:30.679 --> 00:53:34.159
It has the ability to carry heavier
weapons than we do. As of right

894
00:53:34.239 --> 00:53:37.880
now. The heaviest weapon that B
one can carry is in the two thousand

895
00:53:37.920 --> 00:53:42.599
pound class. Bf T twos can
carry five thousand pound class weapons. You

896
00:53:42.599 --> 00:53:45.159
know, the problem right now is
in a near peer fight, they'll probably

897
00:53:45.199 --> 00:53:49.440
never get close enough to actually drop
a five thousand pound weapon. But it

898
00:53:49.480 --> 00:53:54.960
has that ability. So the BF
two is is definitely very highly versatile and

899
00:53:54.960 --> 00:54:00.360
capable. It's just really really old, and it's also speed limited. Like

900
00:54:00.440 --> 00:54:05.920
our standard employment speed generally is pointy
five mock, which roughly translates into about

901
00:54:05.960 --> 00:54:08.679
five ten true. I want to
say the BFT two's are pointy eighty three

902
00:54:09.679 --> 00:54:14.199
and I mean the pointy three is
like they're no shit limit. Like I've

903
00:54:14.239 --> 00:54:17.960
employed the jet in combat up to
point nine because our door we could go

904
00:54:19.000 --> 00:54:21.960
faster. The only each from the
B one is past point nine. Mock

905
00:54:22.039 --> 00:54:24.159
the Betaors. It's a speeders regal
the Betors. But I mean, you

906
00:54:24.199 --> 00:54:27.039
know, we have the ability to
drop weapons to get the f out of

907
00:54:27.079 --> 00:54:30.639
dodge quick buffs kind of short of
not so much. They have some speed

908
00:54:30.719 --> 00:54:35.320
limitations, but they can fly higher, so they definitely can release all their

909
00:54:35.320 --> 00:54:38.400
weapons instantaneously. There's some limitations with
us doing that. So that's kind of

910
00:54:38.440 --> 00:54:42.480
like i'd say modern day stuff with
the B fifty two in a nutshell,

911
00:54:43.239 --> 00:54:45.519
the B two think of it right
now until the B twenty one comes online.

912
00:54:46.199 --> 00:54:49.440
The B two is literally like our
nine to one to one, like

913
00:54:49.639 --> 00:54:54.239
you know, there's under twenty now. Unfortunately it's stealth. Obviously it's still

914
00:54:54.320 --> 00:54:58.400
it's stealth, but like we're talking
late eighties nineties technology, right, it's

915
00:54:58.440 --> 00:55:02.559
starting to become less and less sealth. And fortunately it's not modular in the

916
00:55:02.639 --> 00:55:07.559
sense of I can update LRUs and
update parts of the aircraft quickly because it's

917
00:55:07.639 --> 00:55:12.119
again where things designed in the eighties
and the nineties. But again, you

918
00:55:12.159 --> 00:55:14.920
know that that thing was built to
be able to be launched from the States,

919
00:55:15.599 --> 00:55:20.360
hit a target anywhere in the world
and come back safely. So and

920
00:55:20.400 --> 00:55:22.800
it's also nuclear capable. Yeah,
I've had a few friends of mine that

921
00:55:22.840 --> 00:55:25.519
have transitioned from the B one to
the B two, So that that's I

922
00:55:25.559 --> 00:55:30.360
think sort of like the probably like
the the Macro thirty thousand foot view on

923
00:55:30.360 --> 00:55:32.960
the big difference between us, you
know, and I'd say, if you're

924
00:55:32.960 --> 00:55:38.519
gonna compare us to them, depending
on the weapon type, if it's a

925
00:55:38.559 --> 00:55:42.559
five hundred pounds smart weapon, the
B two has got us killed. We

926
00:55:42.599 --> 00:55:46.159
can only drop about fifteen of those. But from some weird bay limitations,

927
00:55:46.199 --> 00:55:50.840
some raclimentations, we can somehow drop
twenty four two thousand pounders, which makes

928
00:55:50.840 --> 00:55:52.679
no sense. You can drop more
heavier than less, it makes no sense.

929
00:55:53.679 --> 00:56:00.719
And obviously we at least in my
personal opinion, we can integrate with

930
00:56:00.760 --> 00:56:02.800
a package and fighters a lot more
easily because they're a little bit more dynamic.

931
00:56:02.880 --> 00:56:06.159
We're a little bit more maneuverable.
And again the speed piece is not

932
00:56:06.199 --> 00:56:07.199
there as well. Yeah, we
don't have to speed the mattention to be

933
00:56:07.280 --> 00:56:12.559
the two does so, Yeah,
and yeah, I mean right now you've

934
00:56:12.559 --> 00:56:15.119
got to keep a certain number of
B twos on the line that they're ready

935
00:56:15.159 --> 00:56:17.000
for anything U B for the q'es. Right now, we're going through a

936
00:56:17.039 --> 00:56:22.039
major upgrade, of major overhaul,
So i'd say b ones right now are

937
00:56:22.079 --> 00:56:23.400
kind of back to being like that, like you know that that nine one

938
00:56:23.440 --> 00:56:25.840
to one response force. We got
to respond to something within you know,

939
00:56:25.960 --> 00:56:29.679
pick a time frame, Kayak will
we just saw with Syrian Iraq like about

940
00:56:29.679 --> 00:56:31.599
a month ago. Yeah, what
do you think the or I mean a

941
00:56:31.639 --> 00:56:34.800
lot of it's probably public, I
imagine, I mean, but what do

942
00:56:34.840 --> 00:56:37.519
you what do you think the future
is of bombers in the US Air Force?

943
00:56:37.559 --> 00:56:39.679
What what is the you know,
like right now we're transitioning to the

944
00:56:39.760 --> 00:56:43.800
F thirty five for fighters, and
there's going to be another like joint fighter

945
00:56:43.840 --> 00:56:45.880
that comes at What do you see
the future looking like for bombers? I

946
00:56:45.880 --> 00:56:47.760
mean, I think right now it's
pretty open source. But I mean,

947
00:56:50.159 --> 00:56:52.360
and now this keeps changing, but
probably up until a few months ago,

948
00:56:52.400 --> 00:56:57.280
the game plan was, you know, we were going to start sunsetting b

949
00:56:57.400 --> 00:57:00.199
ones to then start making room for
B twenty ones and then the B two

950
00:57:00.239 --> 00:57:05.639
is next to go. So in
a crazy turn of events, literally our

951
00:57:05.679 --> 00:57:09.280
bomber force on paper, by the
year twenty thirty five to twenty forty is

952
00:57:09.320 --> 00:57:14.679
gonna literally be B twenty ones and
B fifty two's like our oldest bomber and

953
00:57:14.719 --> 00:57:17.239
our newest bomber. Yeah, and
the two little middle children, if you

954
00:57:17.280 --> 00:57:21.480
will. The B two and the
B one are pretty much getting sunseted now

955
00:57:21.559 --> 00:57:25.440
I think. Now in an amazing
accomplishment, the B twenty one actually flew

956
00:57:25.480 --> 00:57:29.599
on timel on scheduled it looks a
lot. The B twenty one looks very,

957
00:57:29.679 --> 00:57:30.679
very similar to the B two,
but it's on YouTube. Like the

958
00:57:30.719 --> 00:57:35.360
B twenty one actually flew. It
won't be mission capable I think until the

959
00:57:35.480 --> 00:57:37.440
end of the decade or so.
Don't want to put an exact date on

960
00:57:37.480 --> 00:57:42.000
it. But but yeah, as
of right now, per the Air Force,

961
00:57:42.039 --> 00:57:45.119
I mean, your future bomber force
is literally the B fifty two and

962
00:57:45.119 --> 00:57:47.760
the B twenty one. But like
I said, I think, you know,

963
00:57:49.000 --> 00:57:51.000
the B one might be around for
the ten years now, okay,

964
00:57:51.039 --> 00:57:54.480
based on recent events, but right
now there's no scheduled like intermediate step between

965
00:57:54.519 --> 00:57:57.880
the two. Now that's it.
You know, like that we went all

966
00:57:57.920 --> 00:58:01.039
into the B twenty one. I
think the difference with the B twenty one

967
00:58:01.159 --> 00:58:05.800
versus everything else and even the F
thirty five is it's designed to be modular,

968
00:58:06.360 --> 00:58:10.760
Like it's designed to sort of be
a lot more software and digital capabilities,

969
00:58:12.280 --> 00:58:15.960
so as threats update, as things
update, like the thought processes,

970
00:58:15.039 --> 00:58:19.000
I can pull something out, swap
it back in. You know, no,

971
00:58:19.000 --> 00:58:21.960
no, no worries. Yeah,
that's really a challenge for some of

972
00:58:22.000 --> 00:58:23.440
the jets we have now just because
based on their you know, when they

973
00:58:23.440 --> 00:58:27.119
were built in some of the parts
and stuff. So but as of right

974
00:58:27.159 --> 00:58:30.320
now, that that that is,
that is your future bomber Force. Yeah.

975
00:58:30.519 --> 00:58:34.159
So yeah, back to your personal
experience, absout worries, Yeah,

976
00:58:34.360 --> 00:58:37.000
out of curious say, as a
Wizzo and you know you said it on

977
00:58:37.039 --> 00:58:40.360
the B one, you've got to
you know, it's one thing when you're

978
00:58:40.360 --> 00:58:44.480
the only game in town, but
when you're on a really hot op and

979
00:58:44.519 --> 00:58:47.880
there are multiple stacks of there,
yeah, how how are you managing that?

980
00:58:49.400 --> 00:58:52.000
I mean so funny story is generally
in a lot of those instances,

981
00:58:52.639 --> 00:58:57.639
the jet that's got the most weapons
and essentially is prosecuting the targets is the

982
00:58:57.639 --> 00:59:00.280
mission commander. Okay, so the
b want actually in a lot of ops

983
00:59:01.639 --> 00:59:05.960
on multiple strike ops is actually the
mission commander. So it's really his job

984
00:59:06.000 --> 00:59:08.679
to actually run the show, which
is kind of funny because and a lot

985
00:59:08.719 --> 00:59:13.960
of times, based on our lack
of link connectivity or you know, sort

986
00:59:14.000 --> 00:59:15.760
of where we are in the stack, you could argue we had the least

987
00:59:15.880 --> 00:59:20.239
essay sometimes and everything else, but
it's still you know, don't care,

988
00:59:20.320 --> 00:59:22.519
fix it per doctrine, like that's
your job, right. Really, at

989
00:59:22.519 --> 00:59:27.679
that point it ends up you know
the jokes sometimes when you have things like

990
00:59:27.679 --> 00:59:30.400
weapons school events and red flag events, it's really called deconfliction flag because you

991
00:59:30.400 --> 00:59:37.360
know, like prosecuting the targets and
surviving is almost second to just safely managing

992
00:59:37.360 --> 00:59:42.880
your stack of it, don't d
yeah, Like yeah, don't drop through

993
00:59:42.920 --> 00:59:45.360
something someone's altitude, Yeah, don't
you know, don't get out of your

994
00:59:45.360 --> 00:59:49.880
block, like you know that's that. Yeah, Really, it becomes like

995
00:59:49.960 --> 00:59:53.280
honestly, at that point, it's
literally the mission is either going to be

996
00:59:53.280 --> 00:59:57.719
accessed or not before even stept to
the jet. Like if you mission planned

997
00:59:58.280 --> 01:00:00.840
good, yeah, and you mission
plans safe, and you know, the

998
01:00:00.920 --> 01:00:05.119
challenge sometimes at bones was you know, worth the deed and we're having a

999
01:00:05.119 --> 01:00:07.599
emission plan, say with you know
F twenty two's and strike Gules at al

1000
01:00:07.679 --> 01:00:12.800
Dafra, you know F sixteen's up
north. Uh. You know, it

1001
01:00:12.840 --> 01:00:16.199
wasn't really a huge istrom Afghanistan.
That thing you just described really became an

1002
01:00:16.239 --> 01:00:22.039
issue I would say during ISIS because
there were multiple times where you know,

1003
01:00:22.159 --> 01:00:24.360
ISIS went back to feeling like,
Okay, now we're actually training like it's

1004
01:00:24.519 --> 01:00:28.840
now I wouldn't say near peer,
but we're doing things that we have never

1005
01:00:28.880 --> 01:00:31.199
done in the last ten fifteen years. Yeah, you know, so I

1006
01:00:31.239 --> 01:00:37.960
guess i'll kind of I'll kind of
skip through some of the next eight deployed.

1007
01:00:37.159 --> 01:00:42.760
You know, first Targeting Pod one
great, uh did not deploy weirdly

1008
01:00:42.880 --> 01:00:45.559
enough, because that was our full
year off in between appointments and nine.

1009
01:00:45.800 --> 01:00:49.000
And then when we were I got
in twenty ten, that was the birth

1010
01:00:49.079 --> 01:00:54.280
of the whole quote unquote TACITLE directive
And that was when McCrystal was COMMISAFF and

1011
01:00:54.360 --> 01:01:00.079
basically Commandable Force Afghanistan. And that
was, uh, you know, we

1012
01:01:00.119 --> 01:01:04.199
went from like if guys were under
fire, taking taken taken rounds. It's

1013
01:01:04.199 --> 01:01:06.679
like Okay, dude, just tell
me where and you're getting around. Yeah,

1014
01:01:06.719 --> 01:01:09.719
you know, the tactical directive was
literally, you you will not go

1015
01:01:09.800 --> 01:01:15.480
kinetic unless you know we're gonna lose. Dudes. You can guarantee that there

1016
01:01:15.480 --> 01:01:20.159
are no civilians anywhere in the vicinity
and or you cannot disengage. Yeah.

1017
01:01:20.159 --> 01:01:24.079
So it was the first time ever
in my life where you're watching indirect you're

1018
01:01:24.079 --> 01:01:28.800
seeing the dude shoot. Yeah.
But because they were near a structure and

1019
01:01:28.840 --> 01:01:30.920
we could not verify whether out that
structure was completely clear civilians, which we

1020
01:01:30.960 --> 01:01:34.599
know in a lot of cases they
were filled with civilians on purpose. Yeah,

1021
01:01:34.639 --> 01:01:37.639
like chained up. Yeah, I
mean it was. It was eerie,

1022
01:01:37.880 --> 01:01:42.679
like there was like our dropping,
our weapons released like grind into a

1023
01:01:42.719 --> 01:01:47.880
halt. That's deployment. I did
drop once in twenty ten before I actually

1024
01:01:47.920 --> 01:01:50.599
I got lucky. I got seleck
to go to like you know, the

1025
01:01:50.599 --> 01:01:52.559
Air Force version of Top Gun.
It's cooled Air Force Weapons school, and

1026
01:01:52.639 --> 01:01:55.280
I found out half with through my
twenty tenth diplointment, I got selected to

1027
01:01:55.280 --> 01:02:00.960
go. But it was really cool
was we would you know, Baltimore God

1028
01:02:00.039 --> 01:02:05.719
became really really hot, like oh
nine, twenty ten time frame I remember

1029
01:02:05.840 --> 01:02:08.840
there was a few ticks where we'd
go up there. I'll never forget this

1030
01:02:08.880 --> 01:02:14.320
Prankster was the eighty second Airborne j
Tack. We check him with him,

1031
01:02:14.800 --> 01:02:15.559
you know, we try to get
clearance to drop, and it's like,

1032
01:02:15.639 --> 01:02:20.599
yeah, Bone, ground commander,
we're not meeting in tent then, And

1033
01:02:20.639 --> 01:02:22.320
this is all in the same killbox, the kid you not. So it's

1034
01:02:22.320 --> 01:02:25.199
like a you know, our killbox. You guys would sort of usually operate

1035
01:02:25.239 --> 01:02:30.199
by, you know, district centers, villages, provinces. Aircrew for a

1036
01:02:30.239 --> 01:02:32.280
lot of time just thought killboxes.
Yeah, So Baltimore gob was way up

1037
01:02:32.280 --> 01:02:36.280
in the northwest. I think it
was the Turkmenistan border, and there was

1038
01:02:36.320 --> 01:02:38.000
one sort where like you know,
Prankster, the Jay you know, Prankster

1039
01:02:38.079 --> 01:02:42.920
was essentially like the large division force
on the ground is saying no dice,

1040
01:02:43.000 --> 01:02:45.400
dude, Like ground force commander is
not approving. We had a Jaguar call

1041
01:02:45.440 --> 01:02:49.880
signed get on who's combat controller is
attached to Nodier. He's like, yeah,

1042
01:02:49.920 --> 01:02:52.760
Bone, stand by, we're working
it. But I think at this

1043
01:02:52.840 --> 01:02:57.719
point, now going kinetic was such
a freakin like. I think at that

1044
01:02:57.800 --> 01:03:00.639
point it went all we have to
like the O six sodaf dude for that

1045
01:03:00.719 --> 01:03:04.920
for that region, right, I'll
never forget it. Like as this as

1046
01:03:05.000 --> 01:03:07.719
Jaguar is off on vozipper, you
know, murk chat trying to find somebody.

1047
01:03:08.159 --> 01:03:12.880
Literally the Marsk dude hops on like
bone yeah we're good, saying we'll

1048
01:03:12.880 --> 01:03:15.960
fucking kill it. So Halo was
the Marsak call sign, and uh yeah,

1049
01:03:16.000 --> 01:03:19.199
that was that was crazy. It
was like, you know, my

1050
01:03:19.280 --> 01:03:21.480
dad says no, My dad says
no, my dad's cool as shit.

1051
01:03:21.519 --> 01:03:23.599
My dad says yes, so go
go, go ahead, and uh I

1052
01:03:23.679 --> 01:03:27.280
ended up only being a warning shop, but at least it stopped the indirect.

1053
01:03:27.960 --> 01:03:30.960
So that was one. Actually I
lot, I dropped twice and then

1054
01:03:31.079 --> 01:03:36.079
my last sortie before I went home
again, it was Halo, who was

1055
01:03:36.119 --> 01:03:42.559
a Marsk team. Uh So they
were taking an indirect and we basically we

1056
01:03:42.599 --> 01:03:45.599
had pretty shitty cloud cover, but
uh we recommended we dropped three by g

1057
01:03:45.679 --> 01:03:50.000
W thirty one's in a triangle pattern
we called the Triangle of Death but basically

1058
01:03:50.000 --> 01:03:53.119
we would basically look like a triangle. But they were coming down and so

1059
01:03:53.719 --> 01:03:59.159
unfortunately one of them ended up dutting. But you know, to four thousand

1060
01:03:59.159 --> 01:04:01.679
pounds of Organs going off essentially did
the trick. And what was really cool

1061
01:04:01.800 --> 01:04:05.719
was, uh, you know,
so I leave, I go through Air

1062
01:04:05.760 --> 01:04:12.039
Force Weapons School, I come home, and uh, it's March of twenty

1063
01:04:12.079 --> 01:04:15.559
eleven now, and we were setting
up for uh because our biggest problem of

1064
01:04:15.639 --> 01:04:20.360
times was a lot of these you
know some mostly was the soft guys,

1065
01:04:20.599 --> 01:04:24.079
and you know, working with Jaysck
was almost foreign to us because we just

1066
01:04:24.119 --> 01:04:27.280
never got called to those things.
But we really started trying to lean into

1067
01:04:27.280 --> 01:04:29.719
getting guys up to South Dakota to
like work hand in hand with us,

1068
01:04:29.719 --> 01:04:32.920
to like know how we operate weird
way of doing things. And so we

1069
01:04:32.960 --> 01:04:40.239
spent like a month organizing an East
Coast MST teeny comf to Ellsworth. So

1070
01:04:40.280 --> 01:04:43.480
it's the week before they're supposed to
come up, and then Libya kicks off,

1071
01:04:43.880 --> 01:04:45.119
and so we're thinking, like,
all right, the beat. We

1072
01:04:45.159 --> 01:04:47.840
had no idea we were going to
play in Libya. And so at the

1073
01:04:47.880 --> 01:04:53.800
time, uh, he's he was
the wing he was the wing commander about

1074
01:04:53.800 --> 01:04:56.000
a year ago. I think he's
probably he'll probably be a general some day.

1075
01:04:56.039 --> 01:04:59.440
But this guy scab. They decided
here we're gonna play a joke on

1076
01:04:59.480 --> 01:05:02.360
Sloth who's me. So it's Patty's
Day. I'm obviously Irish, and I'm

1077
01:05:02.360 --> 01:05:04.880
inviting in the you know, in
the holiday of my people. And uh

1078
01:05:05.360 --> 01:05:10.320
so I'm at a party and uh, you know, I guess the game

1079
01:05:10.360 --> 01:05:12.880
plan while everyone's in on it.
But they're like, hey, do you

1080
01:05:12.880 --> 01:05:16.159
when Sloth is really like effing like
like housed, I want you to text

1081
01:05:16.159 --> 01:05:19.440
me. So I'm like, you
know, ship faced, I'm playing you

1082
01:05:19.480 --> 01:05:21.960
know, the Pogue and I'm trying
to like run the DJ set. Nobody

1083
01:05:23.000 --> 01:05:25.599
wants to listen to Irish music,
but like I'm I'm fortunate too, and

1084
01:05:25.679 --> 01:05:27.159
actually, you know, like,
hey, dude, Sloth, you got

1085
01:05:27.159 --> 01:05:28.400
a call. Dude. I'm like, oh, yeah, what's up?

1086
01:05:28.440 --> 01:05:30.760
You know, Okay, who's this? And it's you know, at the

1087
01:05:30.800 --> 01:05:32.400
time, he was our wing weapons
off, so you know, it was

1088
01:05:32.400 --> 01:05:34.079
like, hey dude, it's go
time. Bro, Like we're going to

1089
01:05:34.079 --> 01:05:36.440
Libya. I'm like fuck, and
I'm like, you know, and the

1090
01:05:36.440 --> 01:05:39.400
whole crowd is like, you know, oh really, Oh We're going to

1091
01:05:39.559 --> 01:05:42.679
Yeah, that's it, that's all
right. I decided to turn my buddys

1092
01:05:42.719 --> 01:05:44.639
bedroom in like a mobile skiff,
like all right, you're allowed in,

1093
01:05:44.679 --> 01:05:47.000
You're not a letter I give.
We're on Olivia. I need somebody driving

1094
01:05:47.000 --> 01:05:50.199
the bay and they'll let me ramble
on for like fifteen minutes, and then

1095
01:05:50.280 --> 01:05:54.199
you know, finally when goes aha, asshole, you're not going to Libya.

1096
01:05:55.039 --> 01:05:58.239
That's a Saturday. Okay, Well, you know, joke's on me.

1097
01:05:58.360 --> 01:06:01.280
I'll have the laugh and then no
ship that next Friday. The jokes

1098
01:06:01.280 --> 01:06:04.880
on him because sure enough we get
called to the skiff and we're going to

1099
01:06:04.920 --> 01:06:08.159
Libya, where you like, stop
fucking with me, dude, like,

1100
01:06:08.159 --> 01:06:10.360
get the fuck out of it.
Well we kind of thought that, but

1101
01:06:10.400 --> 01:06:12.079
then when they're like, no,
d you gotta go up to the skiff

1102
01:06:12.239 --> 01:06:14.679
up at Wing Wing headquarters, like, oh, I guess this is happening.

1103
01:06:14.760 --> 01:06:17.599
Yeah, so we walk in it
like yeah, dude, uh the

1104
01:06:17.719 --> 01:06:23.719
requesting we've got a weapons bunker.
Air Force is saying no more, be

1105
01:06:23.840 --> 01:06:28.440
two sort He's like we got to
go. So you know, that was

1106
01:06:28.440 --> 01:06:30.639
a pretty wild I'll send you guys
the pictures of it. But you know,

1107
01:06:31.239 --> 01:06:34.719
and I've done interviews on this thing, and you know, literally our

1108
01:06:34.760 --> 01:06:41.400
maintenance dudes in like sub freezing weather, gend up five green jets and like

1109
01:06:41.719 --> 01:06:45.280
got four airborne and we basically took
off in like zero zero weather out of

1110
01:06:45.320 --> 01:06:48.559
South Dakota. Yeah, and so
the way that works is basically what happens

1111
01:06:48.679 --> 01:06:51.960
is you take off every green jet
available takes off and then the game plan

1112
01:06:53.119 --> 01:06:55.559
is the two greenish jets. By
the time you get off the coast of

1113
01:06:55.599 --> 01:06:59.400
New Finland, those guys take gas
from a tankers and those guys the ones

1114
01:06:59.400 --> 01:07:01.920
who crossed the park and you're going
to execute the mission. So we got

1115
01:07:01.960 --> 01:07:06.639
four jets to the coast. This
could be an entire separate podcast this this

1116
01:07:06.679 --> 01:07:11.199
sefent thing, but like so we
you know, my jet and a Buddies

1117
01:07:11.280 --> 01:07:15.840
jet. We luckily all our weapons
were green. Both sniperpods worked good to

1118
01:07:15.880 --> 01:07:18.719
go, so we take on all
our gas and at that point, now

1119
01:07:18.719 --> 01:07:23.440
it's about other four or five hours
over to off the coast to England and

1120
01:07:23.480 --> 01:07:26.119
then at Milden Hall they've got Casey
Win thirty fives. Those guys come out

1121
01:07:26.119 --> 01:07:29.960
and meet us. So now we're
coming down, we're going through Gibraltar.

1122
01:07:30.000 --> 01:07:32.280
We're hanging out in the med and
this is like when Odyssey Dawn's in full

1123
01:07:32.280 --> 01:07:36.239
bloom, Like there's a carrier strike
group there. Guys are launching from Aviano,

1124
01:07:36.320 --> 01:07:40.039
Like, it's pretty busy, you
know, in every NATO country is

1125
01:07:40.039 --> 01:07:43.679
playing. So we find out let
me check in. Hey dude, there's

1126
01:07:43.679 --> 01:07:46.960
a change to your targets. You're
going to hit new targets in that same

1127
01:07:47.000 --> 01:07:49.480
area. Oh but by the way, the Brits have already lunched weapons at

1128
01:07:49.559 --> 01:07:51.199
them, so they're kind of aware. Now I'm like, oh, this

1129
01:07:51.239 --> 01:07:55.440
is really tactically fucking brilliant. Yeah, all right, we'll say we're ready

1130
01:07:55.440 --> 01:07:58.920
for your targets and then we figure
out we have the wrong crypto. Oh,

1131
01:08:00.000 --> 01:08:03.239
I'm telling you guys offline. We
got eighteen dimpies right off to us

1132
01:08:03.239 --> 01:08:06.000
in the red and I was I
said, to this day, I said,

1133
01:08:06.039 --> 01:08:11.119
like, had anyone been listening in, anyone somewhat competent, Like,

1134
01:08:11.119 --> 01:08:14.360
we probably won't be here. Yeah. So anyway, we get our new

1135
01:08:14.400 --> 01:08:18.800
dimpies, we go feet dry,
and we actually have two growlurs to E

1136
01:08:18.920 --> 01:08:23.479
eighteen's which were so you know the
as a backstory, you know, the

1137
01:08:23.479 --> 01:08:27.359
Marines and the Navy both through Prowlers. The Navy retired prowers and now fly

1138
01:08:27.399 --> 01:08:30.680
basically electronic warfare version of the Super
Hornet. Yeah, badass aircraft. It's

1139
01:08:30.720 --> 01:08:34.880
basically a hornet that jams. It's
awesome and it's the first time they've ever

1140
01:08:34.960 --> 01:08:39.840
done embedded combat with a bomber platform. And so we're you know, it's

1141
01:08:39.880 --> 01:08:43.840
basically a four ship going line abreast
into the southernmost part of Libya. And

1142
01:08:43.920 --> 01:08:46.560
what was crazy was we thought we
had planned everything correctly, and right as

1143
01:08:46.560 --> 01:08:50.800
we're about to basically go execute,
you know, these dudes launched their harms

1144
01:08:51.239 --> 01:08:54.880
and it's like, hey, bone, sorry dude, we're bingo. Later

1145
01:08:55.680 --> 01:08:59.920
we're like what, So we end
up going down into Sebha. We're hit

1146
01:09:00.039 --> 01:09:02.479
and AMMO dump and uh, I
mean we looked outside and Triple A's coming

1147
01:09:02.520 --> 01:09:04.840
up. But luckily it was pretty
low millimeters so it's only topping out it

1148
01:09:04.880 --> 01:09:09.880
like fifteen sixteen thousand. We were
above that, but they did launch just

1149
01:09:09.920 --> 01:09:13.680
based on noise and activity. They
did launch a three blistically at us because

1150
01:09:13.680 --> 01:09:16.319
one of the pilots saw it.
So we do all that, you know,

1151
01:09:16.560 --> 01:09:20.000
pretty successful. We reach both just
go off Winchester and no big deal.

1152
01:09:21.000 --> 01:09:25.319
We land heroes, welcome with the
deed. It's awesome and I'm thinking

1153
01:09:25.359 --> 01:09:27.359
like, oh, this is cool, man, Like it's like late March

1154
01:09:28.039 --> 01:09:30.039
chill here we'll get my three beers
a day, rolling to April, get

1155
01:09:30.039 --> 01:09:31.760
other both of the tax free and
like yeah, no, no dude,

1156
01:09:31.800 --> 01:09:34.840
you're you're going back tomorrow. You
know, basically no, you're going back

1157
01:09:34.840 --> 01:09:39.119
to Libya again. Okay're basically gonna
do a drive by. We think we

1158
01:09:39.119 --> 01:09:43.399
know where get off his sun is. So it was that sorty in the

1159
01:09:43.399 --> 01:09:45.920
way back was a little hairy because
uh did not go as planned. We

1160
01:09:46.000 --> 01:09:49.520
thought a five was launching at us. We had weapons faults like that that

1161
01:09:49.640 --> 01:09:53.239
we had to actually earn our paycheck
that sorty. But yeah, that one

1162
01:09:53.319 --> 01:09:58.439
was pretty crazy as well. So
we get back uh and I basically left

1163
01:09:58.439 --> 01:10:00.359
the guy who pointed up with a
joke on me, like know, hey,

1164
01:10:00.439 --> 01:10:01.319
you know he dude like jokes on
you. I actually did go to

1165
01:10:01.359 --> 01:10:06.840
Libya. Yeah, so then we
end up going to uh a normal Afghani

1166
01:10:06.880 --> 01:10:13.399
sort of that summer. That one
again was fairly I'd say the one two

1167
01:10:13.399 --> 01:10:15.600
things out of the ordinary, and
that's on that deployment happened to me.

1168
01:10:15.840 --> 01:10:21.000
Uh one was, uh, you
know, they had told us for years

1169
01:10:21.000 --> 01:10:24.880
like hey dude, be ready man, like you know, Somalia can happen

1170
01:10:24.920 --> 01:10:26.680
anytime, and like when you're a
young guy, You're like, oh,

1171
01:10:26.720 --> 01:10:29.239
yeah, dude, you're you're you're
amped up, you're studying the airspace.

1172
01:10:29.840 --> 01:10:31.359
By the third or fourth time,
you're like, dude, I'm done getting

1173
01:10:31.359 --> 01:10:34.920
cock teas about Somalia. I'm not
going quit teasing me or Yemen or whatever.

1174
01:10:34.960 --> 01:10:41.560
Right. Yeah, So I'd done
a pretty late night and I'm in

1175
01:10:41.600 --> 01:10:43.479
bed and we're getting a pounding on
the door and it's like, no,

1176
01:10:43.560 --> 01:10:45.239
dude, we have to go.
It's we actually think this is happening now.

1177
01:10:45.600 --> 01:10:49.000
So we walk into the mission room
and uh, if you guys remember

1178
01:10:49.039 --> 01:10:54.399
you know once Bin Laden got killed, uh Anwar Alwaukie, who was the

1179
01:10:54.439 --> 01:10:57.000
Yemeny was American born, but he
was the Yemeny cleric. He's the guy

1180
01:10:57.000 --> 01:11:00.720
that actually uh radicalized the underwear bomber
of the Chris bomber Row nine. Well,

1181
01:11:00.720 --> 01:11:03.680
they had a beat on them,
and what was crazy was they had

1182
01:11:03.680 --> 01:11:08.720
actually parked the Marine LCS off the
coast of Yemen simply for the purposes of

1183
01:11:08.800 --> 01:11:13.880
killing this dude. And weird you
know, whatever agency was tracking them,

1184
01:11:13.960 --> 01:11:16.319
just the moons aligned the day that
they had a beat on him. This

1185
01:11:16.439 --> 01:11:20.359
Marine LCS squadron was down for maintenance. So we got launch out of the

1186
01:11:20.399 --> 01:11:25.800
deed and it was a huge cock
t's because they could never get a beat

1187
01:11:25.840 --> 01:11:27.680
on them. But like the fact
that I got woke up out of bed

1188
01:11:27.720 --> 01:11:30.840
to it at that point to go
target the potus is number one objected with

1189
01:11:30.880 --> 01:11:34.039
the f and cool. You know, they have us sextra go pills that

1190
01:11:34.119 --> 01:11:36.159
day because we might be eirborn for
thirty hours, so that it was kind

1191
01:11:36.159 --> 01:11:41.039
of fun. But so that was
that happened on that deployment and then unfortunately

1192
01:11:41.119 --> 01:11:46.800
also this was really eerie. You
know, we're on a mission north of

1193
01:11:46.880 --> 01:11:53.279
Bath, pretty quiet, nothing's happening, but it's August and I don't want

1194
01:11:53.279 --> 01:11:56.279
to get the date wrong because it's
a pretty bad date. But uh so,

1195
01:11:56.880 --> 01:11:58.760
usually what happens is, you know, you'll check out with the j

1196
01:11:58.920 --> 01:12:00.000
tach. Hey, dude, sorry
it was tonight, but no workman,

1197
01:12:00.079 --> 01:12:02.840
Thanks for the help. Appreciate yep
bone three four you guys stay safe,

1198
01:12:02.880 --> 01:12:08.520
switching freaks cool. So you check
in with essentially like the you know,

1199
01:12:08.600 --> 01:12:12.600
the combat version of the FAA or
ATC. Really, so it's a you

1200
01:12:12.640 --> 01:12:15.560
know, it's either at the time
it was either an Air Force or a

1201
01:12:15.600 --> 01:12:20.600
marine ground control unit. But so
we're clear two three five back south and

1202
01:12:20.840 --> 01:12:24.279
you know, at that point,
now like the sorties over, even though

1203
01:12:24.279 --> 01:12:27.880
you're still in country, practically you're
done. So you start kind of doing

1204
01:12:27.920 --> 01:12:30.239
admin work. We're typing up our
Missrup on the laptop. You know,

1205
01:12:30.279 --> 01:12:32.600
guys are stretching, figuring out which
movie we're gonna play in the way home.

1206
01:12:33.399 --> 01:12:36.720
Guys are breaking out like you know, food whatever, and next you

1207
01:12:36.720 --> 01:12:39.960
know, we start getting screamed out
over guard like you know, Bone three

1208
01:12:39.960 --> 01:12:42.279
four, avert, avert avert,
you know, like like so we know,

1209
01:12:42.399 --> 01:12:44.239
we get the fuck out of Dodge
and like, what's what's happening?

1210
01:12:45.119 --> 01:12:46.479
And you know, we find out
like you guys just flew through a hot

1211
01:12:46.560 --> 01:12:49.159
rose. We're streaking operating zone and
we're like, yeah, dude, Bone

1212
01:12:49.159 --> 01:12:53.199
three four, we'll check the tapes
on landing, but like we got cleared

1213
01:12:53.199 --> 01:12:54.920
here, dude, Like, yeah, know, my bad, no harm,

1214
01:12:54.960 --> 01:12:59.680
no foul. So when we land
unfortunately find out that it's Extortion one

1215
01:12:59.720 --> 01:13:05.159
seven that we just blew. Yeah, And I remember at the time the

1216
01:13:04.720 --> 01:13:10.720
the guy it was a team based
in the East, so I won't say

1217
01:13:10.720 --> 01:13:15.560
which base was at, but when
I landed that the team one of the

1218
01:13:15.600 --> 01:13:20.119
team leaders called me screaming at me, like how basically like the gist of

1219
01:13:20.119 --> 01:13:25.520
it I got was that they either
had a beat on the RPG team or

1220
01:13:26.520 --> 01:13:29.640
they thought they had a beat on
either way, like in his mind us

1221
01:13:29.640 --> 01:13:31.399
blowing through his ras and really fucked
something up. And so I'm sitting there,

1222
01:13:31.439 --> 01:13:34.920
you know, he's a FOURM and
O three and I'm like, sorry,

1223
01:13:34.920 --> 01:13:38.640
I'm so sorry. I don't know
what's happened, but like we'll look

1224
01:13:38.640 --> 01:13:41.479
at our tapes. I swear to
God, like we were cleared, and

1225
01:13:41.520 --> 01:13:44.199
I you know, not to knock
the JASOT guys, but those guys were

1226
01:13:44.319 --> 01:13:47.000
those guys were not tories for doing
pop up roses and not telling the rest

1227
01:13:47.039 --> 01:13:50.079
of the big fight. If you
and I get why. You know,

1228
01:13:50.159 --> 01:13:56.199
they were generally taking down HBI's objective
names. So but they're they're kind of

1229
01:13:56.279 --> 01:14:00.560
I bequeath you respected restricted airspace,
but not telling any of that. That

1230
01:14:00.600 --> 01:14:02.239
was. Yeah, some units were
different than others. Yeah, this one

1231
01:14:02.239 --> 01:14:04.960
in particular, I guess I'd never
had an issue with before, but it

1232
01:14:05.079 --> 01:14:09.359
just pretty So it's kind of one
of those historical things. I did not

1233
01:14:09.399 --> 01:14:13.760
want to be like Airborne four,
but I was sure so that deployment wrapped

1234
01:14:13.840 --> 01:14:17.039
up. You know, at that
point, I was actually selected to go

1235
01:14:17.079 --> 01:14:21.199
back and teach it weapon school.
Sequestration is remember happened in twenty thirteen,

1236
01:14:21.239 --> 01:14:25.880
they shut down weapons School. I
went into the ground job up in Kabul,

1237
01:14:26.239 --> 01:14:28.800
up at the airport, which was
kind of eerie. You know,

1238
01:14:29.079 --> 01:14:31.479
we saw the pull out. I'm
seeing videos of like the Thai restaurant on

1239
01:14:31.520 --> 01:14:33.600
Twitter and the airport like, oh
shit, you know we ate there.

1240
01:14:33.640 --> 01:14:36.560
Yeah, shit, we took a
rocket attack there. So I'm kind of

1241
01:14:36.560 --> 01:14:41.159
fast forwarding. And uh so this
point, now, like I'm in New

1242
01:14:41.199 --> 01:14:43.439
Yorker, I'm living in West Texas, and I'm kind of like starting to

1243
01:14:43.479 --> 01:14:45.199
like, okay, you know what, the the cool factor of flying the

1244
01:14:45.279 --> 01:14:49.479
B one is not really compensating for
me not being happy socially, right,

1245
01:14:49.760 --> 01:14:53.279
And so I was kind of ready
to like, you know, jump ship,

1246
01:14:53.359 --> 01:14:55.439
go to the guard. You know
there's there's a rescue unit in Long

1247
01:14:55.479 --> 01:14:57.720
Island, the one oh six,
Yeah, the PJ unit in the eighth

1248
01:14:57.800 --> 01:15:00.039
one thirty unit. I was pretty
con so I was gonna jump ship to

1249
01:15:00.039 --> 01:15:02.640
that unit. And they basically said, dude, just give a one more

1250
01:15:02.640 --> 01:15:05.199
shot. We're to try and get
you back to the East coast. Just

1251
01:15:05.199 --> 01:15:10.760
just stick with us too. We're
working for you. And so luckily we

1252
01:15:10.800 --> 01:15:15.239
did. Okay, I did.
And then I ended up volunteering off cycle

1253
01:15:15.279 --> 01:15:20.039
for deployment right after the ground one. And you know, this was like

1254
01:15:20.159 --> 01:15:26.680
early twenty fourteen, and so the
news wasn't really picking up a lot of

1255
01:15:26.720 --> 01:15:30.479
the activity of the Middle East.
Jet like Afghanistan was cured, right,

1256
01:15:30.520 --> 01:15:33.560
that's on my downslope. I rack
was Iraq, And so I'm thinking,

1257
01:15:33.600 --> 01:15:35.960
like, you know, I'll get
out to the DEED. I'll fly once

1258
01:15:36.039 --> 01:15:39.520
a week. I'll be a wing
weapons officer. I'll study from my geam

1259
01:15:39.560 --> 01:15:42.680
out of my gre and if I
don't have an assignment waiting for me when

1260
01:15:42.680 --> 01:15:45.760
I come home, I'll come here. I'll try to get into a grad

1261
01:15:45.800 --> 01:15:47.000
school here, I'll work part time, I'll do the guard thing whatever.

1262
01:15:48.000 --> 01:15:51.439
I'll never forget. It's the summer, and my buddy is like, uh,

1263
01:15:51.479 --> 01:15:55.359
yeah, dude, you might be
a little busier than planned. Things

1264
01:15:55.359 --> 01:15:59.199
are starting to ramp up here,
and I said okay, And then that's

1265
01:15:59.239 --> 01:16:01.840
when finally a new started picking it
up, you know. Uh, unfortunately,

1266
01:16:01.840 --> 01:16:05.720
you know, and the journalist James
fully got aheaded uh Sinjar Mattin happened

1267
01:16:05.960 --> 01:16:12.960
uh with the aziddies, and so
you know, I got out there two

1268
01:16:13.079 --> 01:16:16.720
weeks after OYR and hew it resolved
officially kicked off and so you know,

1269
01:16:17.920 --> 01:16:20.640
kind of back that whole thing,
like things happened for a reason. I'm

1270
01:16:20.680 --> 01:16:24.119
getting ready to launch on my first
SORTI, and I go and check my

1271
01:16:24.159 --> 01:16:26.720
email and it's like, hey,
congrats, you've been seking for an airstaff's

1272
01:16:26.720 --> 01:16:28.920
side of the Pentagon. And I'm
like, oh dude, like, guys

1273
01:16:28.960 --> 01:16:30.840
are high five of me, Like
this is great. So then now it's

1274
01:16:30.840 --> 01:16:36.720
my first isis SORTI. So the
way this one works is uh forty again

1275
01:16:36.760 --> 01:16:42.079
forty five minutes ont to Basra,
about another maybe hour to get like northwest

1276
01:16:42.079 --> 01:16:45.760
of missoul And at this time we
had a tanker track literally right outside the

1277
01:16:45.800 --> 01:16:48.800
Iraqi border. You do a pre
bowl tank and then you pretty much press

1278
01:16:48.840 --> 01:16:53.960
in. And I'd say for the
first three months all we were doing was

1279
01:16:54.000 --> 01:16:58.319
Kabani because Gabani, if your remember, was Syria, yep, and the

1280
01:16:58.600 --> 01:17:00.199
and this is why you have the
Curds to this day are the bravest,

1281
01:17:00.760 --> 01:17:04.119
most amazing people we've ever supported.
Why we keep finem Over is beyond me.

1282
01:17:04.199 --> 01:17:08.319
But uh so, Cabani was at
one area where it's like, you

1283
01:17:08.359 --> 01:17:11.960
know, everyone is fleeing Syria,
everyone's fleeing Isis is weak. And the

1284
01:17:12.079 --> 01:17:14.159
Kurds were like, come at me, bro, like we're not leaving,

1285
01:17:14.560 --> 01:17:16.000
Like you know, they got the
women and kids out, but like the

1286
01:17:16.079 --> 01:17:18.760
Caabat, you know, the Curds
that that were a fighting age and even

1287
01:17:18.760 --> 01:17:23.319
their women they stayed and it was
essentially like trench warfare, like they were

1288
01:17:23.359 --> 01:17:27.479
fighting block to block to block.
So my first sorty there I remember actually,

1289
01:17:27.560 --> 01:17:30.960
now that you mentioned this, I've
actually seen footage shot by some of

1290
01:17:30.000 --> 01:17:33.720
the fighters in Cobani, the Kurds
and some of the foreigners somefing there with

1291
01:17:33.800 --> 01:17:38.920
them, not not military like people
who volunteered crazy enough to go and do

1292
01:17:39.000 --> 01:17:43.159
that. Yeah, but I mean
it is fucking insane to see like airstrikes

1293
01:17:43.239 --> 01:17:45.640
like five hundred feet in front of
them, buildings just being demolished. I'll

1294
01:17:45.680 --> 01:17:48.399
do. I'll give you a comparison
story real quick after this one. But

1295
01:17:48.520 --> 01:17:51.439
like so, and as I described
before, right, I'm used to like

1296
01:17:51.520 --> 01:17:58.199
Afghan casts bone three four contact on
two by movers, you know in this

1297
01:17:58.279 --> 01:18:00.279
vicinity kby wing through four monitor and
you'd track a guy for a while,

1298
01:18:00.319 --> 01:18:03.079
seev the nefarious right that could.
That could sometimes turn into an hour,

1299
01:18:03.159 --> 01:18:08.520
sometimes two. Happy to do it. I will never forget. We rip

1300
01:18:08.560 --> 01:18:12.279
out a two ship of vipers,
we do a swap, they do a

1301
01:18:12.319 --> 01:18:15.239
target handoff into like this area,
and it's like, hey, we saw

1302
01:18:15.239 --> 01:18:18.760
activity in this block, so we're
you know, we're searching. And then

1303
01:18:18.880 --> 01:18:21.119
I was the new guy, so
I sat the left seat, not the

1304
01:18:21.159 --> 01:18:26.760
bomb seat, but I'm running the
radio. And you know this, Syria

1305
01:18:26.920 --> 01:18:30.800
was actually back to the defensive guy. There is no longer there just to

1306
01:18:30.840 --> 01:18:33.239
support the O, Like, dude, we're actually you know, Syrian Air

1307
01:18:33.239 --> 01:18:36.840
Force is still active. The Turks
are friends. Every now and then the

1308
01:18:36.920 --> 01:18:41.159
fuck with us would light us up
just just just because they could, because

1309
01:18:41.359 --> 01:18:44.760
you know, we're helping the people
they hate. So and they still had

1310
01:18:44.800 --> 01:18:46.720
an active three. Every now and
then the five, the SA five would

1311
01:18:46.720 --> 01:18:49.960
go on. So like you actually
to be a dso because Syria could pop

1312
01:18:49.960 --> 01:18:55.680
off at any moment. But and
apparently it was even completely different. The

1313
01:18:55.760 --> 01:18:59.479
Russian showed up even worse. But
so it's funny like I'm being the d

1314
01:18:59.640 --> 01:19:02.199
and I and I'm taking the radio
for the guy because it was weapons heavy.

1315
01:19:03.079 --> 01:19:08.680
I'll never forget it, you know, talking to the JTAC and it's

1316
01:19:08.720 --> 01:19:11.199
like, you know, hey,
Bone three four contact two by packs and

1317
01:19:11.239 --> 01:19:15.079
fcinity thirty seven year dot alpha and
I And before I even got the ending

1318
01:19:15.119 --> 01:19:17.199
grid out Bone three four, they're
there, cool stand by nine line and

1319
01:19:17.239 --> 01:19:21.199
I'm just like what what Like,
We're not gonna fow these guys for four

1320
01:19:21.239 --> 01:19:24.600
hours? And everyone else in the
jets, dude, shut up, it's

1321
01:19:24.840 --> 01:19:29.720
go time. Like it was literally
like at that point, Phase Line Broadway

1322
01:19:29.720 --> 01:19:30.720
I think was the name of the
road. If you got a map aa

1323
01:19:30.720 --> 01:19:35.319
Bannie, there was like this northeast
of southwith running like major Highway slash major

1324
01:19:35.399 --> 01:19:39.479
road, and it was called Phase
Line Broadway. And for a while,

1325
01:19:40.079 --> 01:19:43.800
if you were southeast of Phase Line
Broadway, you were bad, right because

1326
01:19:43.800 --> 01:19:46.359
you were most likely coming off the
main road leading from Raka because that was

1327
01:19:46.359 --> 01:19:48.560
like there were Saint Petersburg for isis
like, oh, you're a new guy,

1328
01:19:48.600 --> 01:19:51.399
welcome to the you know, welcome
to our new heavenly state. Get

1329
01:19:51.439 --> 01:19:54.800
the fuck up to Gabani and you
know, do your job, yea and

1330
01:19:54.840 --> 01:20:00.239
please come die, Yeah, thank
you and yeah that was that shift of

1331
01:20:00.439 --> 01:20:02.920
no, dude, this is like
no questions asked, like there was no

1332
01:20:03.119 --> 01:20:06.560
tactical directive. There's no coin here, like if they are on this grid,

1333
01:20:06.760 --> 01:20:12.079
right, they e fing die.
And for context, you asked before

1334
01:20:12.119 --> 01:20:16.399
right about the danger close Now.
Granted, a lot of this is also

1335
01:20:16.439 --> 01:20:20.960
because every building in Cabani just seemed
to be created with reinforced concrete. Because

1336
01:20:21.239 --> 01:20:25.880
sure enough I found out on another
deployment, a future deppointment, there was

1337
01:20:25.920 --> 01:20:30.439
literally a cement factory in the town
south of Cabani, Lafront Cement LCF.

1338
01:20:30.760 --> 01:20:31.720
So there was the two landing zones
right. There was KLZ, which was

1339
01:20:31.760 --> 01:20:34.239
Cabani land Zone after we you know, cleared it, and then l CF.

1340
01:20:34.479 --> 01:20:36.840
LCF became one of our big bases
in there. Yeah, exactly,

1341
01:20:36.920 --> 01:20:39.960
I was at. I never made
to LCF. I made the KELZ once,

1342
01:20:40.439 --> 01:20:44.479
but uh so. Yeah. But
the craziest nine line I ever got

1343
01:20:44.720 --> 01:20:48.039
was, uh it was like watching
a street fight. It was two small

1344
01:20:48.039 --> 01:20:51.079
buildings with thatched root not that route
but like you know, short roofs,

1345
01:20:51.600 --> 01:20:56.119
and we were watching the YPG,
the People's Protection Unit, the CURD organization.

1346
01:20:56.199 --> 01:20:59.840
You're watching the YPG, and isis
trade shots and the nine line comes

1347
01:20:59.880 --> 01:21:02.279
in and it's literally you know,
uh, you know line one through three

1348
01:21:02.319 --> 01:21:06.720
and a line four elevation was pretty
low in that area. You know,

1349
01:21:06.800 --> 01:21:11.279
line six the gridline started with thirty
seven zero to the alpha. No shit,

1350
01:21:11.359 --> 01:21:16.640
line eight west four zero meters and
they wanted to thirty eight wow,

1351
01:21:16.760 --> 01:21:19.279
And I'm like, dude, And
we found that afterwards, like dude,

1352
01:21:19.319 --> 01:21:24.760
don't ask questions. Yeah, the
minute you call inbound, we we somehow

1353
01:21:24.800 --> 01:21:28.439
get word to them and they seek
shelter and like basically like if you don't

1354
01:21:28.479 --> 01:21:30.880
drop, they're going to die.
Yeah, So I mean that went on.

1355
01:21:30.439 --> 01:21:36.479
I mean, Cabani was insane,
and Cabani was a challenge because you

1356
01:21:36.560 --> 01:21:39.960
know we're going up there. Originally, we're going up there with a cast

1357
01:21:40.000 --> 01:21:43.199
load out, so like you know, we're all doing like air burst on

1358
01:21:43.239 --> 01:21:46.520
the nose cones, which are great, but like if you're doing buildings with

1359
01:21:46.640 --> 01:21:50.840
any sort of like structural integrity,
those things are eating our bombs alive because

1360
01:21:50.840 --> 01:21:55.239
they're moving the hard cone of them. So we finally figured out that like

1361
01:21:55.560 --> 01:21:59.600
you change that on the bird,
do you got dial I can change from

1362
01:21:59.640 --> 01:22:02.800
impact air burst, but like the
physical cone that's on the ground. So

1363
01:22:02.800 --> 01:22:06.199
the problem is, like, even
if I'm dropping something impact, if it's

1364
01:22:06.239 --> 01:22:10.319
got a quote unquote flangible nose cone, because you've seen those things, Yeah,

1365
01:22:10.319 --> 01:22:14.800
they look like a like it's a
black little sensor. If you're dropping

1366
01:22:14.840 --> 01:22:16.720
those things on there, like it's
essentially were moving, like I hate to

1367
01:22:16.720 --> 01:22:18.960
say it, like part of the
structural insecrity the weapon on the nose of

1368
01:22:19.000 --> 01:22:23.479
it, so that there were times
where like their buildings were like eating our

1369
01:22:23.520 --> 01:22:27.880
weapons alive. And you know,
it's interesting that, you know, I've

1370
01:22:27.920 --> 01:22:31.359
talked to quite a few military warriors
in the past about like rules of engagement,

1371
01:22:31.439 --> 01:22:35.680
and they've explained that in American the
American military, there's basically no such

1372
01:22:35.760 --> 01:22:39.640
thing as a free fire zone.
Yeah, but there always has to be

1373
01:22:39.680 --> 01:22:44.439
some sort of intel that directs you
that there's suspected enemy activity here. Good

1374
01:22:44.439 --> 01:22:47.000
intel or bad, that's debatable,
but it sounds like this is a case

1375
01:22:47.000 --> 01:22:50.600
where actually this this I don't want
to use the term free fire, but

1376
01:22:50.720 --> 01:22:54.399
I mean, this was the cleared
bad guy land. It was. It

1377
01:22:54.479 --> 01:22:58.800
was funny, it was it was
probably the closest thing to type three casts

1378
01:22:58.920 --> 01:23:01.359
that I've ever like World War II
to basically leveling this place. Yeah,

1379
01:23:01.439 --> 01:23:04.760
like you know, if I go
back and read and hopefully some of my

1380
01:23:04.880 --> 01:23:09.000
CCT budies aren't listening. But you
know, Type one cast is you can

1381
01:23:09.039 --> 01:23:12.840
see both the friendly and the enemy. Type two is you got to see

1382
01:23:12.840 --> 01:23:15.439
one or the other. Type three
was literally like that whole area is bad

1383
01:23:15.760 --> 01:23:19.960
and it's it's Type three is the
one engagement where they don't clear you hot,

1384
01:23:20.279 --> 01:23:24.760
they go call and engagement complete.
Yeah, Like go engage and you

1385
01:23:24.800 --> 01:23:28.199
tell me when you're done moppingh up. Right. Yeah, so you're winchestering

1386
01:23:28.239 --> 01:23:31.039
every road pretty close. Yeah,
and I still had to get eyes on

1387
01:23:31.079 --> 01:23:33.640
because there were still Curds running around. But I mean, what I think

1388
01:23:33.760 --> 01:23:39.000
was happening was so here's the craziest
part about it, too, is I'm

1389
01:23:39.000 --> 01:23:42.960
getting cleared hot over Sackcom by a
guy on the East coast. I'll just

1390
01:23:43.000 --> 01:23:46.760
say that. So we think we
pieced together what was happening. It was

1391
01:23:46.800 --> 01:23:53.840
either uniform or non uniform guys on
our side running around the Kurds passing intel

1392
01:23:53.920 --> 01:23:58.279
to guys across the border that was
getting back to again a certain area on

1393
01:23:58.319 --> 01:24:01.439
the East coast, probably via sat
phone, and those guys were literally clearing

1394
01:24:01.479 --> 01:24:04.600
us hot from some desks somewhere.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, there were

1395
01:24:04.640 --> 01:24:11.640
like fire direction centers in Iraq.
Yeah, but still a very gnarly convoluted

1396
01:24:11.680 --> 01:24:14.760
process. And then it got to
the point where like we were giving like

1397
01:24:14.800 --> 01:24:16.800
iPads to the Kurts, right,
oh yeah, like yeah, you know,

1398
01:24:17.079 --> 01:24:21.199
basically we started doing a matching buildings
to numbers. So the entire and

1399
01:24:21.279 --> 01:24:25.920
we did is a lot Afghanistan too, but we were creating grid systems based

1400
01:24:25.960 --> 01:24:28.680
on the buildings. Yeah, like
bad guys are in building fifty five in

1401
01:24:28.760 --> 01:24:31.239
this grid. Yeah. And then
the worst was you know there's times where

1402
01:24:31.279 --> 01:24:34.119
like the cloud cover was just I
couldn't see shit. Yeah, and I'm

1403
01:24:34.159 --> 01:24:40.560
basically having a release on magers grids
or he doesn't e the term piss off.

1404
01:24:40.840 --> 01:24:45.920
The Precision Strike Suite for Special Operations
Forces, it was basically mansarrated grit.

1405
01:24:46.000 --> 01:24:49.039
It was mensarted graphics that I could
actually derive CAT one cord it's for

1406
01:24:49.199 --> 01:24:54.439
to drop. Oh like it sounds
like what we would have called GRG's back

1407
01:24:54.479 --> 01:24:56.880
in the old days. It was. It was basically a GRG. There's

1408
01:24:56.960 --> 01:25:00.279
computer program you could you could actually
drive a Cat one cor off using that.

1409
01:25:01.520 --> 01:25:04.399
But yeah, it was it was
insane because I think the comment that

1410
01:25:04.439 --> 01:25:10.399
I made one time was those days
in Cabani, it was it was inner.

1411
01:25:10.680 --> 01:25:13.359
We were we were basically doing air
and addiction, but we were calling

1412
01:25:13.359 --> 01:25:17.359
it casts either for simplicity, because
all the aircrew in that time were just

1413
01:25:17.399 --> 01:25:21.279
trained to do casts. So I
was getting like, you know, doctrinally

1414
01:25:21.319 --> 01:25:26.960
speaking, getting cleared hot from a
guy four thousand miles away for a guy

1415
01:25:27.000 --> 01:25:29.760
that I can't see, Like that's
not cass right, uh. And a

1416
01:25:29.840 --> 01:25:32.319
lot of cases too, like on
objectives. Because the cool thing about this

1417
01:25:32.359 --> 01:25:36.159
too was as we're supporting the Kurds, you know, every now and then,

1418
01:25:36.199 --> 01:25:39.920
like you get a guy jumping on
your radio from that same organization like,

1419
01:25:39.960 --> 01:25:43.479
hey dude, you're being redirected.
We have objectives so and so in

1420
01:25:43.479 --> 01:25:47.520
sight. So that same organization was
both doing the support for the Kurds,

1421
01:25:48.079 --> 01:25:51.840
but they were also doing their HBI
targeting like and that was it was that

1422
01:25:53.039 --> 01:25:56.359
unit that owned that portion of the
world, right. Yeah, So like

1423
01:25:56.399 --> 01:25:59.159
those guys were like and they're all
coming from the same op center. I

1424
01:25:59.159 --> 01:26:01.000
mean, they had some forward guys
obviously in certain areas, right, but

1425
01:26:01.920 --> 01:26:04.640
it was a few stories were like
I mean, Beck just to like take

1426
01:26:04.720 --> 01:26:08.600
us back in time. This is
like the twenty forte. This is literally

1427
01:26:08.720 --> 01:26:11.840
this is this is literally like months
two and three of issis. Yeah,

1428
01:26:11.840 --> 01:26:15.439
this is so there's there's really no
American uniform service members in serious There's no

1429
01:26:15.439 --> 01:26:18.079
one wearing I'll just say this,
there's no one wearing flags on the uniforms,

1430
01:26:18.159 --> 01:26:20.359
right for sure. Yeah. I
mean if we had anyone over there

1431
01:26:20.439 --> 01:26:25.520
was very very minimal. Yeah,
I mean that. That's I said that.

1432
01:26:25.560 --> 01:26:29.439
The we'd call the j tax too
when we land on a Vosa phone

1433
01:26:29.439 --> 01:26:32.640
and they were back in the States
and you know, and you know how

1434
01:26:32.640 --> 01:26:35.399
those guys are, like if you
call one of those fires as you know,

1435
01:26:35.520 --> 01:26:39.000
fires, this is Chris. Actually, no fires, is Joe.

1436
01:26:39.199 --> 01:26:41.800
I think the French were over there
before us. They probably, Oh,

1437
01:26:41.840 --> 01:26:46.119
I remember for a while we got
better intel, especially in Iraq because you

1438
01:26:46.159 --> 01:26:51.199
probably do remember this. Even our
Tier one units were restricted from that.

1439
01:26:51.359 --> 01:26:54.800
They could not get within one click
of an act of his own. So

1440
01:26:54.840 --> 01:26:59.720
literally the Canadians, the French,
some other countries I think maybe the Brits.

1441
01:26:59.760 --> 01:27:01.399
I think so they were the ones
so we were seeing, well the

1442
01:27:01.399 --> 01:27:06.359
crazy things they saw was I think
he's now the I know he's the one

1443
01:27:06.359 --> 01:27:10.600
start at the time. But Gorilla, I remember the name. I think

1444
01:27:10.600 --> 01:27:14.479
he's a four star now journal Gorilla. He was the one star in the

1445
01:27:14.520 --> 01:27:17.319
North and he wanted to be one
for a strike. And it was some

1446
01:27:17.560 --> 01:27:23.399
entrenched thing near Missoul And I'll never
forget. We're in the chaok and we

1447
01:27:23.439 --> 01:27:28.119
see pictures and it looked like polaroids
but it was literally the cansoft dudes low

1448
01:27:28.199 --> 01:27:31.520
crawling it digital camera shit. And
there's one point where like you see like

1449
01:27:31.560 --> 01:27:34.319
the dirt flying over the guy's shoulder
in the photo and it's an icis dude

1450
01:27:34.319 --> 01:27:39.239
digging a trench? Like those guys
got that close shit? Talk about close

1451
01:27:39.319 --> 01:27:42.479
RECKI yeah, so like and I
think I think legally we were restricted,

1452
01:27:42.720 --> 01:27:45.000
like our guys couldn't go do that. That sounds right about that time frame.

1453
01:27:45.239 --> 01:27:48.560
Yeah, Like the like I said, the the the fall of fourteen

1454
01:27:48.760 --> 01:27:50.920
was like, I mean, Kabani
was just like a free for all.

1455
01:27:50.960 --> 01:27:55.239
Like it was kind of one of
those things where like if you supported Kamani

1456
01:27:55.319 --> 01:27:58.279
and came home and only released six
weapons, you were like kicking yourself with

1457
01:27:58.399 --> 01:28:02.680
just saw as me what. Like
it was that insane, right, Cobani

1458
01:28:02.760 --> 01:28:05.479
was out of control and then wee
the coolest thing. I wish I would

1459
01:28:05.479 --> 01:28:10.439
have caught this on iPod. You
know. This was actually because if you

1460
01:28:10.479 --> 01:28:13.600
guys remember, like I think,
like I Kirby was still active duty.

1461
01:28:13.920 --> 01:28:16.279
Uh Kerry was the Sect Secretary of
State. We had said right at the

1462
01:28:16.319 --> 01:28:18.479
beginning, like, hey, there's
we really can't help these people. Like

1463
01:28:18.520 --> 01:28:23.680
they're like we we can't get involved. It sucks, but like we can't

1464
01:28:23.760 --> 01:28:28.520
keep coming involved this area. And
I think not to presume to know the

1465
01:28:28.520 --> 01:28:30.239
inner workings of the government, but
like I want to feel like between the

1466
01:28:30.279 --> 01:28:34.279
Cinjar Mountain thing and James fully getting
beheaded, that seemed to sort of turn

1467
01:28:34.359 --> 01:28:39.800
public opinion. That's when we got
involved. And so like Cabani went from

1468
01:28:39.800 --> 01:28:44.600
being like this lost cause to like
through like again probably thousands of weapons over

1469
01:28:44.600 --> 01:28:46.279
the course afforded you know, three
or four months. Like those guys,

1470
01:28:46.319 --> 01:28:49.760
the Kurds beat those dudes back,
blocked by block by block. And one

1471
01:28:49.760 --> 01:28:56.119
of the coolest things I ever saw
was the high ground southeast of Cabani was

1472
01:28:56.119 --> 01:28:59.600
this area called Mischion or Hill,
and the strike Egal guys got it on

1473
01:28:59.600 --> 01:29:02.600
camera, which I would have,
but there's this cool video of it's a

1474
01:29:02.640 --> 01:29:06.199
sniperpod footage where the strike he was
doing like a loop around the you know,

1475
01:29:06.239 --> 01:29:10.439
the village, just for like Reki, and you literally see the YPG

1476
01:29:11.159 --> 01:29:14.039
storm up the hill, toss the
ice it's almost like eu GM, but

1477
01:29:14.079 --> 01:29:16.119
they throw the iceis flag off and
they plant like the yellow YPT flags.

1478
01:29:16.560 --> 01:29:18.680
Yeah, I wish I would have
flown. It was really jealous. I

1479
01:29:18.680 --> 01:29:23.399
wish I would have seen that.
Yeah, but that was that seven months.

1480
01:29:23.439 --> 01:29:26.119
I would say, like doing that
mission was probably like the coolest seven

1481
01:29:26.119 --> 01:29:30.479
months of my life. Yeah,
because that happened. You were just pounding

1482
01:29:30.520 --> 01:29:31.760
the shit out of some assle.
Yeah, it was. It was you

1483
01:29:31.800 --> 01:29:35.680
know, Afghanistan. You'd still go
over there just to make them, let

1484
01:29:35.720 --> 01:29:40.359
them know you're still there. But
this is fourteen. I don't think anyone

1485
01:29:40.720 --> 01:29:45.199
thought Afghanistan would devolve into what it
evolving into. Like uh and then that

1486
01:29:45.319 --> 01:29:49.640
was the focus. But then also
the Jasak guys really started to you know,

1487
01:29:49.760 --> 01:29:53.439
that was the big rumor for a
while was hey, save all your

1488
01:29:53.439 --> 01:29:57.319
low collateral weapons because like Missolo's gonna
be hot and heavy. The Missolo offensive

1489
01:29:57.319 --> 01:30:00.800
eventually took what happened like six months
after it was planned, But like you

1490
01:30:00.800 --> 01:30:02.000
know, we'd do some reki work
in Missoul, and it was like,

1491
01:30:02.760 --> 01:30:06.760
you know, I dropped twice in
Missoul. But like you talk to like

1492
01:30:08.640 --> 01:30:11.000
some of the soft birds, like
the U twenty eight's and some of the

1493
01:30:11.000 --> 01:30:14.279
other things, like and those guys
were dropping like the really really really low

1494
01:30:14.319 --> 01:30:17.119
collateral precision weapons. I mean,
those guys were doing like assassination missions,

1495
01:30:17.159 --> 01:30:23.439
you meaning like health fires. Not
even I'm talking like things called like you

1496
01:30:23.439 --> 01:30:26.079
can google them, but like I'll
just say google the word griffin. I

1497
01:30:26.119 --> 01:30:29.760
mean, these are essentially like little
pneumatic things pop out of a tube and

1498
01:30:29.800 --> 01:30:33.000
it's essentially like a fifteen or twenty
pound warhead. The point where like you

1499
01:30:33.039 --> 01:30:36.119
could be HBI number one, I'm
Matrid number two. We're having a conversation.

1500
01:30:36.279 --> 01:30:39.479
Next thing, you know, like
I black out and I look up

1501
01:30:39.520 --> 01:30:43.600
and you're dead because just like Shotgun
Show on Royds just went up over your

1502
01:30:43.640 --> 01:30:46.479
head. Like, yeah, it
was sexy to watch. It was a

1503
01:30:46.520 --> 01:30:49.399
few times I wish I had low
collateral weapons, but I was happy with

1504
01:30:49.439 --> 01:30:55.079
my five hundred pounders. So but
yeah, I mean that was like I

1505
01:30:55.079 --> 01:30:58.439
said that deployment alone could probably go
into a separate, complete hour long story

1506
01:30:58.439 --> 01:31:00.359
about some of the stuff we saw
there, but like, yeah, it

1507
01:31:00.399 --> 01:31:03.319
was. It was amazing because we
were generally the only platform that could get

1508
01:31:03.319 --> 01:31:06.479
there, hang out for three or
four hours at a time and just effing

1509
01:31:06.600 --> 01:31:13.079
work. The one or two close
calls I had was this is pretty funny.

1510
01:31:14.159 --> 01:31:17.039
So we're we're doing work and if
you look at a map Assyria daris

1511
01:31:17.079 --> 01:31:21.479
Are, which now was the side
of that that does or south? Yeah,

1512
01:31:21.520 --> 01:31:26.079
so it was right. It was
near the Iraq border. It was

1513
01:31:26.079 --> 01:31:29.600
like maybe a killbox two wealthy Iraq
border, so like sixty miles if that.

1514
01:31:30.560 --> 01:31:33.000
But uh, that was one of
the last places aside still at a

1515
01:31:33.000 --> 01:31:35.560
presence there and he still had an
Air Force bace there. So there was

1516
01:31:35.560 --> 01:31:42.800
one night where we're working, We're
going connetic a lot and we're getting ready

1517
01:31:42.800 --> 01:31:45.119
to get ripped out by a two
ship of vipers. And this would happen

1518
01:31:45.119 --> 01:31:47.720
every now and then we're like they
show up on station or like bone we

1519
01:31:47.760 --> 01:31:50.039
actually blew out of gas getting through
somewhere to get up here, dude,

1520
01:31:50.039 --> 01:31:53.520
like would you mind hang would you
mind covering the first part of our role.

1521
01:31:53.920 --> 01:31:55.880
We're going to go tank Like yeah, of course, we'll stay and

1522
01:31:55.960 --> 01:32:00.640
drop more weapons of course. So
this one night, you know, they

1523
01:32:00.640 --> 01:32:03.199
go off, think a gas and
then next thing you know, we start

1524
01:32:03.239 --> 01:32:06.680
hearing a bogie call. And so
if you know geographic on the map,

1525
01:32:06.760 --> 01:32:11.560
like Cabani, we would always fly
solo. The roots skis weren't there yet.

1526
01:32:11.600 --> 01:32:14.079
They weren't there yet. No,
so this is still like late fourteen,

1527
01:32:14.079 --> 01:32:16.720
early fifteen, but occasionally you'd randomly
get like a mid twenty three,

1528
01:32:16.800 --> 01:32:23.319
a mid twenty nine Alissade, Yeah, a side bird. So what happens

1529
01:32:23.399 --> 01:32:26.640
is it's kind of tough to describe
geographically, but like you know, Kabani's

1530
01:32:26.680 --> 01:32:29.880
in like the north almost like northwest
part of the country. I imagine the

1531
01:32:29.960 --> 01:32:32.239
viper pilots jagging themselves off over this
opportunity. Yeah, it was a few

1532
01:32:32.279 --> 01:32:35.640
of them that were like just itching
for something. The spin said, like,

1533
01:32:35.720 --> 01:32:38.760
unless you're getting threatened, dude,
let them fly, like real,

1534
01:32:38.920 --> 01:32:42.279
Yeah, oh dude, it was
very There was definitely some behind the scenes

1535
01:32:42.760 --> 01:32:45.439
like cabinet level conversation probably happening,
but like from our standpoint, it's like,

1536
01:32:45.479 --> 01:32:47.960
dude, unless you are getting engaged, you leave them alone. Yeah,

1537
01:32:47.960 --> 01:32:49.920
Like, I don't care if it's
a mid twenty nine, I don't

1538
01:32:49.920 --> 01:32:54.159
care if it's like, you know, they're version of one thirty, you

1539
01:32:54.840 --> 01:32:58.279
stay outside of this certain range for
the spins like you were here by ordered,

1540
01:32:58.319 --> 01:33:01.680
right. Yeah. So like so
we're flying, we hear a bogie

1541
01:33:01.720 --> 01:33:03.920
call and like, yeah, bone, we got a bogie. You might

1542
01:33:03.960 --> 01:33:08.600
want to not be in Syria anymore. Like all right, so like your

1543
01:33:08.680 --> 01:33:12.359
Darzar is here, We're in Cabani
and it's kind of setting up one of

1544
01:33:12.359 --> 01:33:15.560
these things where it's like, uh, you know both before says had us

1545
01:33:15.560 --> 01:33:18.720
a bogie, you know, bogey
bra you guys talk to them and the

1546
01:33:18.760 --> 01:33:21.880
clear uh though this is in the
green, but we're talking not those guys.

1547
01:33:21.880 --> 01:33:25.279
No, And I don't think this
syeriones even listening to guard right,

1548
01:33:25.319 --> 01:33:29.159
Okay. So it's like but I'll
never forget. Like we're going and I'm

1549
01:33:29.239 --> 01:33:30.560
like enough of this ship. I'm
like, yo, blah blah blah,

1550
01:33:30.560 --> 01:33:33.760
say status a viper flight, VIPRA
flight. We aggress into Iraq as the

1551
01:33:33.760 --> 01:33:38.359
bogue. I'm like and I'm like, so we at this straight. You

1552
01:33:38.479 --> 01:33:42.039
egress the two ship of fighters right
because there's a bogie, right, and

1553
01:33:42.079 --> 01:33:45.119
we're here and you're there and I
and I felt bad because I found out

1554
01:33:45.119 --> 01:33:46.399
way that I think it was a
lieutenant on the bird and you and you

1555
01:33:46.439 --> 01:33:51.359
hear like the ship and so we
had a decoy on our We had the

1556
01:33:51.359 --> 01:33:55.600
ability to watch decoys on our jet, and so I tell the young guys

1557
01:33:55.600 --> 01:33:58.359
sitting next to me, go do
decoy out. And at this point now

1558
01:33:58.479 --> 01:34:03.199
like I might necessarily the angle cut
off. I think we would have probably

1559
01:34:03.520 --> 01:34:08.119
beaten him into Iraq Himan, Okay, but he started to inching up this

1560
01:34:08.199 --> 01:34:10.560
way, and it's like does this
guy know where we are? Like now

1561
01:34:11.000 --> 01:34:12.760
and at this point now it's like, dude, we might have this.

1562
01:34:12.920 --> 01:34:15.760
We might have to basically run at
this turkey crying like please don't shoot us,

1563
01:34:15.760 --> 01:34:19.119
but like you're a you're a NATO
ally here ques. That was like

1564
01:34:19.159 --> 01:34:21.479
in my head, like as the
mission commander, like I'm we might have

1565
01:34:21.479 --> 01:34:27.760
to literally squawk like emergency and go
like beg for forgiveness in Turkey. Yeah,

1566
01:34:27.800 --> 01:34:30.960
and we're luckily have gone over well
it probably like a fucking fart in

1567
01:34:30.039 --> 01:34:33.520
church. But like luckily it didn't
happen because at some point now, like

1568
01:34:33.560 --> 01:34:36.319
the guy eventually just turned away and
then we found out later like it was

1569
01:34:36.319 --> 01:34:40.600
an L thirty nine, like just
doing a night flight like the night Reki,

1570
01:34:40.680 --> 01:34:42.720
Like, I don't think you even
realized we were there. Oh okay,

1571
01:34:42.800 --> 01:34:45.159
so that was a pretty funny like
close call. Do you I mean

1572
01:34:46.359 --> 01:34:51.720
and you can tell like I don't
want to ask you something that is restricted

1573
01:34:51.800 --> 01:34:58.319
classified, But do you guys have
any kind of countermass? Are you completely

1574
01:34:58.399 --> 01:35:02.760
reliant on fighters? No? We
so they're on paper, yes, but

1575
01:35:02.800 --> 01:35:05.920
there's also just some realities of like, dude, if it's a certain threat

1576
01:35:05.920 --> 01:35:11.359
with a certain missile, like where
you know, speed, speed of running

1577
01:35:11.359 --> 01:35:13.279
away. Now, the one thing
we do have on a lot of fighters

1578
01:35:13.359 --> 01:35:16.239
is like we have we have gas
to blow and uh like you know,

1579
01:35:16.840 --> 01:35:20.439
like those guys trying to chase me
down, they're gonna go bingo. I've

1580
01:35:20.479 --> 01:35:26.640
survived more red flag and weapons school
events just by simply running away now,

1581
01:35:26.720 --> 01:35:29.640
like generally had an exercise, I
would run away and go low to get

1582
01:35:29.640 --> 01:35:33.520
lost in the clutter. We could
not do that in Syria because you know,

1583
01:35:33.880 --> 01:35:39.079
they had surface to air. The
surface to air wasn't really the worry.

1584
01:35:39.119 --> 01:35:43.039
It was the like we ended up
getting visual conference. I actually we

1585
01:35:43.079 --> 01:35:46.479
wasn't me personally, but we ended
up getting visual confirmation of an actual man

1586
01:35:46.600 --> 01:35:51.359
pad of Cabani and it was misidentified
initially as an RPG. And then I

1587
01:35:51.399 --> 01:35:54.239
go back and look at the table. I'm like, whoa, stop,

1588
01:35:54.479 --> 01:35:58.600
dude, that's this is the problem
is. You know, we had hogs

1589
01:35:58.600 --> 01:36:00.840
doing shows of force. We had
done a show a force and we're like,

1590
01:36:00.920 --> 01:36:03.920
dude, there's an effing like s
A fourteen equivalent thing out there,

1591
01:36:03.920 --> 01:36:08.119
Like this is a problem. Right, So we after we found that out,

1592
01:36:08.119 --> 01:36:12.960
we stopped doing that. But you
know, yeah, like I said,

1593
01:36:13.159 --> 01:36:15.600
the cool thing about it was,
you know, we were integral.

1594
01:36:15.600 --> 01:36:18.239
I think in you know, Kabani
went from being sort of like a lost

1595
01:36:18.279 --> 01:36:21.079
cause to like, no, we
actually beat these guys down and liberated it.

1596
01:36:21.159 --> 01:36:24.239
Yeah. And then you know the
next few months after that that I

1597
01:36:24.279 --> 01:36:25.920
was there was it was like,
okay, now it's the war in the

1598
01:36:25.960 --> 01:36:29.520
Kabani suburbs. Like every little feeder
town that I was using to feed in,

1599
01:36:29.760 --> 01:36:32.760
yeah, we would target those at
some point too. This is this

1600
01:36:32.880 --> 01:36:38.119
was crazy and I didn't so the
whole time this is happening. Right just

1601
01:36:38.239 --> 01:36:43.760
west of Kabani was the tomb of
Suliman. So it's it's the tomb of

1602
01:36:43.760 --> 01:36:46.880
one of their ancient Sultans, the
Turks. It just happens to now being

1603
01:36:46.920 --> 01:36:50.720
what was called you know, Syria, and this is this is insane.

1604
01:36:51.199 --> 01:36:56.600
That thing was guarded by a contingent
of Turk special forces, and at some

1605
01:36:56.720 --> 01:37:00.039
point when we were there, they
had caught intel or whatever like Iis was

1606
01:37:00.079 --> 01:37:03.600
threading to like basically invade it and
desecrate his body and all this. So,

1607
01:37:03.840 --> 01:37:06.960
uh, I didn't get to fly
this night, but uh, the

1608
01:37:06.960 --> 01:37:13.159
Turks ended up launching like a sixty
or forty vehicle convoy into Syria to take

1609
01:37:13.199 --> 01:37:15.680
the remains of sue him on the
great is that The third of the I

1610
01:37:15.720 --> 01:37:17.359
forget, I think, go google
is that when they went in the Drobiless.

1611
01:37:17.720 --> 01:37:20.479
I don't know if that was a
specific town, but you can it's

1612
01:37:20.520 --> 01:37:24.720
on Wikipedia. Like, and I
remember seeing this thing in the pod.

1613
01:37:25.159 --> 01:37:28.439
It looks pretty cool. It's like
this. It's a bridge that leads into

1614
01:37:28.479 --> 01:37:31.479
like this little like miniature peninsula.
There's like a gatehouse for like where the

1615
01:37:31.479 --> 01:37:34.760
soft dudes live, and then literally
the tomb of like this dude from like

1616
01:37:34.840 --> 01:37:39.359
centuries ago. Yeah you know,
but Iis was claiming to like they were

1617
01:37:39.359 --> 01:37:42.399
gonna come in and like invade it
and kill all the guards and you know,

1618
01:37:42.479 --> 01:37:45.720
so I think we did a diversion
every strike south there and uh and

1619
01:37:45.800 --> 01:37:48.319
one my buddies' was airborne for it, and that we stayed away, so

1620
01:37:48.359 --> 01:37:50.520
I think their bipers came in to
provide air cover. Yeah. He just

1621
01:37:50.560 --> 01:37:53.640
kind of like, you guys,
do what you want. Yeah, we'll

1622
01:37:53.640 --> 01:37:55.600
be over here actually, like you
know, helping the courage. You guys

1623
01:37:55.600 --> 01:37:59.720
can you know, uh take like
your George Washington and Brigham homes there.

1624
01:38:00.680 --> 01:38:02.319
Yeah, just the fact that it
was just like a weird little cool historical

1625
01:38:02.359 --> 01:38:05.560
thing, like there's this weird little
like it's almost like the Vatican, Like

1626
01:38:05.560 --> 01:38:10.560
there's this weird piece of quote unquote
Turkish land in the middle of Syria that

1627
01:38:10.680 --> 01:38:14.840
like you guys like protect with like
this like contingent of soft dudes living in

1628
01:38:14.920 --> 01:38:17.279
like Indian countries. So yeah,
So that was like I would say,

1629
01:38:17.319 --> 01:38:20.159
the first three or four months of
that deployment, and then a lot of

1630
01:38:20.159 --> 01:38:25.359
stuff started shifting back into Iraq.
Like that point, I think we had

1631
01:38:25.359 --> 01:38:28.399
a bigger presence. Uh, you
know, we had a lot more white

1632
01:38:28.399 --> 01:38:31.279
soft dudes running around with like Iraqi
Soft and Iraqi you know national police.

1633
01:38:31.319 --> 01:38:35.880
Some of those dudes I got a
little dicey at times because you guys remember

1634
01:38:35.880 --> 01:38:40.359
seeing some of those YouTube clips of
like, you know, the Shia militia

1635
01:38:40.359 --> 01:38:43.319
guys that were like, you know, the butchers of ISIS. They hate

1636
01:38:43.399 --> 01:38:46.600
us just as much, probably,
but I definitely I can't confirm or deny,

1637
01:38:46.640 --> 01:38:50.239
but there were definitely a few strikes
we took part in that I think

1638
01:38:50.279 --> 01:38:54.119
inadvertently helped those dudes. Yeah,
but like you know enemy and my enemy

1639
01:38:54.159 --> 01:38:56.279
is my friend for the time being
type shit. So well, I mean

1640
01:38:56.279 --> 01:38:59.359
in Iran was the same deal,
right, Yan was very much against ISIS,

1641
01:38:59.359 --> 01:39:01.199
but Iran it's never on our side
now. And that was It was

1642
01:39:01.239 --> 01:39:03.920
funny because there was that one guy
I remember what his name was, Isaiah.

1643
01:39:03.920 --> 01:39:05.760
It was the one guy that had
like you know, it was a

1644
01:39:05.760 --> 01:39:10.560
six two bodybuilder. He carried an
axe with him. He had some huge,

1645
01:39:10.600 --> 01:39:12.680
bushy black beard. He was like, you know, I feel what

1646
01:39:12.720 --> 01:39:15.960
his name was, but he was
like I guess the per the Farsie way

1647
01:39:16.000 --> 01:39:18.159
they described he was the Angel of
Death. I think it was what his

1648
01:39:18.239 --> 01:39:20.640
nickname was. But you know,
nice guy. Now, Yeah, like

1649
01:39:20.319 --> 01:39:26.159
I arrooided up due with a black
beard pirate field, which militia he was

1650
01:39:26.159 --> 01:39:29.359
a part of but uh it was
it jshl shoppy. It might it might

1651
01:39:29.359 --> 01:39:31.279
have been, but I lost track
of all, you know, the jam

1652
01:39:31.319 --> 01:39:34.520
because the jam came back when I
was there. The Mahdi Army came back

1653
01:39:34.520 --> 01:39:39.359
when we were there. But yeah, that it was actually crazy too.

1654
01:39:39.359 --> 01:39:45.119
Because you were a fifth Group guy, you can probably appreciate this, you

1655
01:39:45.199 --> 01:39:49.279
number in seven. Unfortunately, the
uh, the three guys got kidnapped and

1656
01:39:49.359 --> 01:39:53.520
eventually got you know, uh,
there we one hundred and first guys.

1657
01:39:53.520 --> 01:39:55.279
They weren't Fifth Group guys, but
they were. There were there were four

1658
01:39:55.279 --> 01:39:59.039
Campbell guys. This was O seven
in Iraq. Yeah, it was.

1659
01:39:59.079 --> 01:40:00.479
It was in that we were.
They called it the Sunni Triangle. Yeah,

1660
01:40:00.479 --> 01:40:03.359
it was one of those areas.
But the first time I really got

1661
01:40:03.359 --> 01:40:10.079
shot at was the unit out looking
for those guys got hit by an ID

1662
01:40:10.359 --> 01:40:14.199
and I guess the EOD troop whoever
it was, was pretty sharp. You

1663
01:40:14.239 --> 01:40:16.319
could tell was a command wire.
So the guys were around, So we

1664
01:40:16.359 --> 01:40:20.800
did one show of force icon chatter
got generated and then this was really dumb

1665
01:40:20.800 --> 01:40:24.760
on our part. We did a
reattack show of force, but we came

1666
01:40:24.800 --> 01:40:28.039
back to the same heading and as
we're coming back for the second go around,

1667
01:40:28.079 --> 01:40:30.000
Like we look over and like you
know, and thankfully it was an

1668
01:40:30.039 --> 01:40:31.760
RPG, but like that was the
first time, like oh shit, like

1669
01:40:32.039 --> 01:40:34.479
yeah, and then every time we
would do shows a fourth night area like

1670
01:40:34.520 --> 01:40:38.640
the jam would shoot at us,
you know, the but you know,

1671
01:40:38.680 --> 01:40:41.800
it was kind of funny, like
we joked at like every show of force

1672
01:40:41.800 --> 01:40:43.960
we did, we made him pissed
through the AK. But let's because we

1673
01:40:44.000 --> 01:40:46.720
were literally just shooting up with an
AK hope for a golden BB just following

1674
01:40:46.760 --> 01:40:49.920
our jet noise ye. Meanwhile,
the things were like you know, hopefully

1675
01:40:49.920 --> 01:40:51.960
falling out of the sky and hitting
him back on the rebounds. So we'll

1676
01:40:53.000 --> 01:40:56.800
see. But yeah, that was
but yeah, that was. I came

1677
01:40:56.880 --> 01:41:01.199
home June of fifteen, so I
did I missed the Russians, and then

1678
01:41:01.239 --> 01:41:04.319
I did two more weapons School stories
as an instructor and then you know,

1679
01:41:05.000 --> 01:41:08.159
basically became a dirty staff when he
after that, you know, went to

1680
01:41:08.199 --> 01:41:13.119
the Pentagon did weapons requirements, which
is actually a really cool job. It

1681
01:41:13.199 --> 01:41:16.119
was actually able to uh, I
guess one of my cool stories if you

1682
01:41:16.159 --> 01:41:19.439
need to really have a cool story
in the Pentagon was a you know,

1683
01:41:19.640 --> 01:41:25.079
we realized after too many years that
uh, you know, having a hell

1684
01:41:25.199 --> 01:41:29.560
fire or having a a two hundred
and fifty pound SDB is not really quote

1685
01:41:29.600 --> 01:41:32.239
unquote loc collateral. We really needed
some sort of a forward firing ordinance,

1686
01:41:33.039 --> 01:41:39.600
and so BAE had actually built this
thing called APKWS Advanced Precision Kill Weapon.

1687
01:41:39.680 --> 01:41:43.199
And what it is is it's a
laser guided rocket on the front of a

1688
01:41:43.199 --> 01:41:45.680
two seven five. I'm sorry,
it's a laser guidance kit on the front

1689
01:41:45.720 --> 01:41:48.039
of a two seven five rocket.
It's actually pretty genius because apparently we have

1690
01:41:48.079 --> 01:41:51.520
like hundreds of thousands of two seven
five rockets at our arsenal, and so

1691
01:41:53.600 --> 01:41:56.279
the Marines were the first to acquire
them. We were kind of trying to

1692
01:41:56.279 --> 01:41:58.720
like beg, borrow and steal from
them. And I'll never forget. For

1693
01:41:58.800 --> 01:42:01.000
anything to happen in the Air Force, I would probably need to go one

1694
01:42:01.079 --> 01:42:04.520
or two stars approval right right.
The guy in the Marines that was controlling

1695
01:42:04.720 --> 01:42:09.800
this stockpile, he was operating on
standing orders from his three star like I

1696
01:42:09.840 --> 01:42:12.720
can't go below a certain number,
but anything after that, dude, you

1697
01:42:12.720 --> 01:42:15.319
want to hop in front of our
production line, feel free, that's awesome.

1698
01:42:15.439 --> 01:42:17.239
So I never going down the bar
because I actually was lucky enough to

1699
01:42:17.239 --> 01:42:21.640
work in the fighter bar. We
got him down to the bar and Thriller

1700
01:42:21.720 --> 01:42:26.239
was his call sign. Ryan Shill, I just want to say, Yah,

1701
01:42:26.239 --> 01:42:29.800
Thriller was his call sign. He
was a Cobra guy. I'll never

1702
01:42:29.840 --> 01:42:31.079
forget, like we actually got the
deal done just when he give him a

1703
01:42:31.119 --> 01:42:38.600
six pack and we're able to get
uh thirty rockets to bath for the vipers

1704
01:42:38.600 --> 01:42:41.479
to use on some Jaysock targets.
So that was actually a pretty cool,

1705
01:42:41.479 --> 01:42:45.359
like depending on war story. And
then the next seven years, you know,

1706
01:42:45.560 --> 01:42:47.119
just just I just punched the clock
and you know, did weapons stuff.

1707
01:42:47.159 --> 01:42:55.239
So do you guys like, what
what's the nature of like electronic warfare?

1708
01:42:55.279 --> 01:42:58.199
Because you talk about the icon chatter? Yeah, did you guys have

1709
01:42:58.760 --> 01:43:02.279
and we're used to like the EW
birds. But as EW becomes more advanced

1710
01:43:02.279 --> 01:43:06.520
and the suites become more compact,
are they able to squeeze like an EW

1711
01:43:06.680 --> 01:43:11.640
suite on bird psych yours? That's
what we're well, i'd say for the

1712
01:43:11.720 --> 01:43:15.359
legacy stuff in theory, yes,
but the problem is, as you can

1713
01:43:15.439 --> 01:43:20.600
imagine, there is like zero appetite
to upgrade legacy systems that are not going

1714
01:43:20.680 --> 01:43:25.920
to play in the Pacific. Sure, so I would say right now,

1715
01:43:26.640 --> 01:43:29.920
the one thing that they're going to
work on for the super Hornet is going

1716
01:43:30.000 --> 01:43:32.560
to be a digitized version of something
that could be upgraded modually. Uh,

1717
01:43:33.079 --> 01:43:36.720
you know, there is there like, there is, there is the ability.

1718
01:43:36.840 --> 01:43:41.680
The problem is there's just no appetite
to spend a few hundred million in

1719
01:43:41.800 --> 01:43:46.520
NRA non recurring engineering to refurbish basically
what is a legacy system, right because

1720
01:43:47.640 --> 01:43:51.239
at some point, even if you
gave it unlimited power, and even if

1721
01:43:51.279 --> 01:43:56.239
you gave it like the greatest electronic
attack techniques, at the end of the

1722
01:43:56.319 --> 01:43:59.880
day, if it's not stealth,
it's a honking huge platform. And and

1723
01:44:00.239 --> 01:44:02.279
the threats that are getting developed right
now are just to the point where,

1724
01:44:02.279 --> 01:44:05.479
like I don't even think you have
a chance, like if you're a fourth

1725
01:44:05.560 --> 01:44:12.239
generation platform getting within a certain range
of something like you're like the PK of

1726
01:44:12.279 --> 01:44:15.079
them getting a hit on you is
pretty high. Yeah, now that being

1727
01:44:15.119 --> 01:44:19.359
said, that's what we sort of
train to. Yet I think you look,

1728
01:44:19.840 --> 01:44:21.159
I mean, I hate to say
it, but you know, even

1729
01:44:21.239 --> 01:44:27.800
before what's happening right now in Gaza, I think these Raelies routinely prove that

1730
01:44:28.119 --> 01:44:30.079
there is a way I've ran that
these rallies are flying f thirty fives and

1731
01:44:30.479 --> 01:44:34.520
doing some amazing stuff. But it's
like, you know, it's there's beyond

1732
01:44:34.640 --> 01:44:39.319
paper capes and then I guess there's
like you know, the push to test,

1733
01:44:39.399 --> 01:44:42.920
right, Like you know, you're
talking about all these drones that they

1734
01:44:42.960 --> 01:44:45.880
shot down the other day. It's
that I'm even talking about like waking up

1735
01:44:45.880 --> 01:44:50.319
and finding out like they got into
like downtown Damascus, in downtown here that

1736
01:44:50.359 --> 01:44:57.079
are protected by fairly advanced Russian stuff, most likely with some Russian merch operating

1737
01:44:57.079 --> 01:45:00.439
it. Possibly, Yeah, and
somehow they're still getting through. I don't

1738
01:45:00.760 --> 01:45:02.159
I'm not reading any more of that
stuff, but it's like I'm wondering how

1739
01:45:02.199 --> 01:45:06.600
much of it is a combination of
the aircraft the weapon types. But like

1740
01:45:08.159 --> 01:45:10.560
you know, on paper, that
really shouldn't be happening, but somehow they're

1741
01:45:10.560 --> 01:45:12.760
proving it to happen. I mean, look at Ukraine, you know,

1742
01:45:12.840 --> 01:45:16.760
like they worried us for a long
time on you know, but the Ukrainians

1743
01:45:16.760 --> 01:45:21.359
are literally with like spitt and glue
and elbow grease and ingenuity like you like,

1744
01:45:21.359 --> 01:45:25.239
for instance, I don't know the
specifics of it, it was open

1745
01:45:25.279 --> 01:45:28.000
source though, but like you know, we gave a bunch of a GM

1746
01:45:28.039 --> 01:45:30.880
eighty eights harms that we were at
a decommission anyway, they literally Jerry riggim

1747
01:45:30.880 --> 01:45:33.720
to work on their MiGs, which
is an American weapon on a Russian fighter

1748
01:45:34.039 --> 01:45:39.960
and made it work. So you
know, there's the capability piece, and

1749
01:45:40.000 --> 01:45:42.800
then I think, honestly, just
the application piece. So you know,

1750
01:45:42.880 --> 01:45:47.680
you could you mentioned like the chance
of ag or generation for like you know,

1751
01:45:48.199 --> 01:45:57.319
platform getting to target. Do you
think that even with Gen five or

1752
01:45:57.359 --> 01:46:00.399
moving forward? You know, when
we look at like hypersonics, when we

1753
01:46:00.439 --> 01:46:03.399
look at things like that, do
you think that there's a point where if

1754
01:46:03.439 --> 01:46:10.720
it's not like an orbital platform or
a or an atmospheric platform, that that

1755
01:46:10.800 --> 01:46:14.279
we're gonna move past the idea of
bomber. I think, I think,

1756
01:46:15.359 --> 01:46:16.279
and I'm not smart at the cond
of this up, but like at some

1757
01:46:16.359 --> 01:46:19.079
point right, like everything that we're
doing right now, let's be honest,

1758
01:46:19.159 --> 01:46:24.039
it's evolutionary, it's not revolutionary.
So we're we're adding a few more extra

1759
01:46:24.079 --> 01:46:28.199
miles on a weapon, We're adding
a few more layers of quote unquote low

1760
01:46:28.319 --> 01:46:31.199
rcs, right, but we're very
rapidly maybe not very rapidly, but at

1761
01:46:31.239 --> 01:46:35.319
some point we're gonna we're gonna basically
get to like the cost curve where like

1762
01:46:36.159 --> 01:46:42.560
it's gonna take me in the billions
to get you like a degree maybe two

1763
01:46:42.640 --> 01:46:45.960
of better rcs. It's gonna take
me in the billions to get you know,

1764
01:46:46.039 --> 01:46:49.000
a few hundred more miles on this
missile. Like at some point,

1765
01:46:49.119 --> 01:46:54.439
like like we're just gonna get to
like this standoff of you know, a

1766
01:46:54.520 --> 01:46:58.720
near pier in the Pacific with tyranny
of distance is building systems that are gonna

1767
01:46:58.760 --> 01:47:01.119
keep us out like base to Hawaii, right, and then we're gonna spend

1768
01:47:01.119 --> 01:47:03.640
in the billions to like fight away. So at some point it's gonna be

1769
01:47:03.680 --> 01:47:08.039
like, I like, what do
you do here? And that's when I

1770
01:47:08.079 --> 01:47:13.159
think what gets worrisome is that's when
you start seeing the shift to let's just

1771
01:47:13.199 --> 01:47:17.800
say other like other other planes,
you know, LEO, this that the

1772
01:47:17.840 --> 01:47:21.279
other thing. Like that's that's truly
like you know, I think a lot

1773
01:47:21.279 --> 01:47:25.800
of people sort of scoffed, maybe
me included when the whole space force was

1774
01:47:25.800 --> 01:47:30.239
created, but like, I mean
you really, I think the world is

1775
01:47:30.279 --> 01:47:34.640
evolving to a level where space you
can no longer have space sort of be

1776
01:47:34.640 --> 01:47:39.880
a subcomponent of a service, like
and maybe the first few years until like

1777
01:47:39.920 --> 01:47:43.039
that, Like I don't think and
even some people in the military probably don't

1778
01:47:43.039 --> 01:47:45.600
realize like what a problem that area
is going to be and how contested it's

1779
01:47:45.600 --> 01:47:49.439
going to be. So maybe some
guys like why do we need a space

1780
01:47:49.479 --> 01:47:53.119
force, Like it's kind of one
of those things where like it will probably

1781
01:47:53.119 --> 01:47:55.119
it will more than it will more
than prove it's worth I think in the

1782
01:47:55.119 --> 01:47:59.079
future, because you really can't afford
to have like why have the air force

1783
01:47:59.119 --> 01:48:02.039
in the army and the Navy and
we have a space expertise or a space

1784
01:48:02.039 --> 01:48:04.720
command of that, Like that's just
not going to cut it. Like you

1785
01:48:05.159 --> 01:48:09.640
essentially need a dedicated service, sure, kind of the same way like the

1786
01:48:09.680 --> 01:48:13.039
Marines, right, Like you know, I can't just have like a specialty

1787
01:48:13.079 --> 01:48:17.359
part of the army do the amphibious
small unit self contained new meth concept,

1788
01:48:17.439 --> 01:48:20.359
Like you actually need a service to
do that, right, So the difference

1789
01:48:20.359 --> 01:48:26.359
between like from a counterinsurgency or counter
terrorism mission to fighting you know, if

1790
01:48:26.399 --> 01:48:30.600
another global war happens and our stuff
that's in space gets shot down, all

1791
01:48:30.720 --> 01:48:33.159
those modern capabilities we've been describing for
the last few hours, who are like

1792
01:48:33.239 --> 01:48:35.119
kind of off the table, they
go away. Yeah, I mean,

1793
01:48:35.119 --> 01:48:38.079
and that's the thing, Like,
no matter how many times we try to

1794
01:48:38.119 --> 01:48:41.880
train to it, it's going to
be a rough go of it. When

1795
01:48:42.000 --> 01:48:44.159
if we are truly GPS out,
like we you know, part of our

1796
01:48:44.199 --> 01:48:46.840
training syllabus is we would train GPS
out and you know we had an I

1797
01:48:46.920 --> 01:48:51.159
and S inertional navigation system. We
would train how to actually keep that thing

1798
01:48:51.239 --> 01:48:56.439
working without GPS crack hits going to
it every six seconds. But I mean

1799
01:48:56.479 --> 01:48:59.960
there's a difference between doing it on
a training mission to check off a training

1800
01:49:00.359 --> 01:49:02.600
versus like doing it for real,
right right, I mean, and I

1801
01:49:02.600 --> 01:49:06.239
mean you guys are probably will not
remember like the Thomas guys, like who,

1802
01:49:06.520 --> 01:49:10.359
like who knows how to use the
Thomas guy? Now I don't Yeah,

1803
01:49:10.399 --> 01:49:13.000
yeah, like that, I don't
even know how to like do like

1804
01:49:13.000 --> 01:49:15.640
like you think about too, Like
it's one thing doing it like overland or

1805
01:49:15.640 --> 01:49:17.119
in vicinity of land, right,
but you look at the guys that have

1806
01:49:17.159 --> 01:49:20.479
to do like celestial navigation. Yeah, because you're like your your feet wet

1807
01:49:20.520 --> 01:49:24.319
for six seven hours. Yeah,
that's gonna happen. Yeah, And that's

1808
01:49:24.359 --> 01:49:27.800
the thing. Sometimes when you describe
the current like the next fight possible,

1809
01:49:27.840 --> 01:49:30.359
you hope it doesn't happen. But
you know, when you try to put

1810
01:49:30.359 --> 01:49:32.279
it for scale, it's like,
dude, imagine trying to go from New

1811
01:49:32.359 --> 01:49:36.920
York to California over nothing but water
with no frame of reference, right,

1812
01:49:38.000 --> 01:49:41.239
And that's like the distances we're talking
about when we think we're going to quote

1813
01:49:41.279 --> 01:49:44.039
unquote operate in that area, right, Like, you know, it's,

1814
01:49:45.560 --> 01:49:47.520
yeah, it's gonna be an interesting
you know, from what I've seen,

1815
01:49:47.560 --> 01:49:51.039
at least from when I left the
service. You know, when I got

1816
01:49:51.079 --> 01:49:54.920
back from my deployment in nineteen,
it was twenty thirty five, twenty thirty

1817
01:49:54.960 --> 01:49:57.600
five, right, and then it
slowly started to shift to like, dude,

1818
01:49:58.479 --> 01:50:00.439
we're not going to get to thirty
five if we can't fix today in

1819
01:50:00.479 --> 01:50:04.520
twenty seven and thirty and then at
least now from the Air Force perspective,

1820
01:50:04.560 --> 01:50:08.239
now, like I walk around all
these trade shows and it's like a lot

1821
01:50:08.239 --> 01:50:11.600
of the young airmen and a lot
of the young operators now are all wearing

1822
01:50:11.640 --> 01:50:15.399
like on their flights to the uniform
they're wearing twenty twenty seven pen tabs is

1823
01:50:15.399 --> 01:50:17.359
like a constant reminder like yeah,
dude, this is like around the corner.

1824
01:50:18.279 --> 01:50:23.239
And then to your point about the
fourth gen piece, like, I

1825
01:50:23.279 --> 01:50:28.680
think there's probably sometimes a miss.
There's probably a mischaracterization of what we think

1826
01:50:28.720 --> 01:50:30.239
our four structure are gonna look like. Like, dude, even if it's

1827
01:50:30.279 --> 01:50:33.520
twenty thirty twenty thirty five, like, AB, we don't have the money

1828
01:50:33.560 --> 01:50:35.920
to do it, and b we're
not gonna have the range to just have

1829
01:50:35.960 --> 01:50:40.119
an entire fifth gen force, Like
the buff is still gonna be here,

1830
01:50:40.279 --> 01:50:43.319
it sound like to be one might
still be here like a large chunk.

1831
01:50:44.159 --> 01:50:46.399
I think of our aircraft, our
combat air force is still going to be

1832
01:50:47.000 --> 01:50:50.199
fourth gen. Yeah, I mean
the Navy. I mean you know what

1833
01:50:50.239 --> 01:50:53.920
like the super hornets like that things
you saw top gun too, like that,

1834
01:50:54.119 --> 01:50:56.479
I mean that thing will probably fly
to the twenty thirties and beyond.

1835
01:50:56.560 --> 01:51:00.520
Yeah, Like just because we A, I would say the third five is

1836
01:51:00.520 --> 01:51:03.079
a little range limited. It's one
engine. Uh, the load out is

1837
01:51:03.119 --> 01:51:06.239
not what we need it to be. So like you, even again,

1838
01:51:06.279 --> 01:51:10.640
if money was no object and and
you gave Lockey Martin a blank check,

1839
01:51:10.760 --> 01:51:14.680
like we ate an entire all thirty
five force is not the right answer.

1840
01:51:14.760 --> 01:51:18.279
Right, So that's kind of like
the that's sort of like the science.

1841
01:51:18.279 --> 01:51:20.159
You know, it's like an art
and a science. They say about like

1842
01:51:20.199 --> 01:51:24.479
you know, force design planning is
like what is the right high low mix

1843
01:51:24.520 --> 01:51:28.159
of like fourth to fifth gen stuff? And that's been like that debate is

1844
01:51:28.239 --> 01:51:30.560
raged off like the last decade.
I would say at least well, and

1845
01:51:30.800 --> 01:51:34.319
I mean would you, and not
being an expert in this field, I

1846
01:51:34.319 --> 01:51:38.439
would say that things like A tens
and AC one thirties are are are you

1847
01:51:38.760 --> 01:51:42.760
like third gen? But but you
still have function? And so many times

1848
01:51:42.800 --> 01:51:46.479
the Services or Congress like they outrun
their headlights, yeah, by trying to

1849
01:51:46.479 --> 01:51:50.359
mock all these things when they still
have even see SOCOM getting their little crop

1850
01:51:50.439 --> 01:51:54.039
duster. Oh that yeah, that
that thing's actually be pretty cool to watch.

1851
01:51:54.119 --> 01:51:57.359
It's and it has it does have
a use in it in a counterinsurgency

1852
01:51:57.359 --> 01:51:59.880
conflict. It does. And that's
the thing. Well, it's funny bring

1853
01:51:59.920 --> 01:52:02.279
that because uh, you know,
for years I was a little bitter towards

1854
01:52:02.279 --> 01:52:05.359
big big Air Force, you know, big Blues. It's like, you

1855
01:52:05.399 --> 01:52:09.039
know, we we ran our b
one into the ground, right, like

1856
01:52:09.079 --> 01:52:11.560
we just we beat the piss out
of it. It's we had to get

1857
01:52:11.640 --> 01:52:13.920
rid of a bunch of jets,
you know when I joined, when I

1858
01:52:14.000 --> 01:52:15.960
when I went at the duty and
sort of flying I want to say we

1859
01:52:16.000 --> 01:52:18.960
had sixty two or sixty three A
b ones. We're down like forty five

1860
01:52:19.000 --> 01:52:21.319
now because we've had a mothball a
lot of them. We had to like

1861
01:52:21.439 --> 01:52:27.239
get rid of the hangar queens to
redirect assets of the flying ones. And

1862
01:52:27.239 --> 01:52:29.199
one of my really good friends,
I won't knock them out here, but

1863
01:52:29.279 --> 01:52:32.199
uh, pretty brilliant dude. And
on one of our deployments, just because

1864
01:52:32.199 --> 01:52:36.319
he was bored, he ran the
numbers on you know, a cost for

1865
01:52:36.399 --> 01:52:42.520
flight hour, the maintenance call like
and he goes the cost in six months

1866
01:52:42.560 --> 01:52:46.039
that it took to have a bone
squadron and an F fifteen squadron. That

1867
01:52:46.159 --> 01:52:51.319
money, you literally could have outfitted
let's say Harat and mez up in the

1868
01:52:51.319 --> 01:52:56.880
north with like eighteen or twelve either
eighty sixes or super Dacanos, right,

1869
01:52:57.479 --> 01:53:00.159
and you could have had fighter pie. I was doing a six month tour

1870
01:53:00.319 --> 01:53:02.920
doing those things we did with other
aircraft. Yeah, and sure enough we'll

1871
01:53:03.000 --> 01:53:05.680
end up doing ten years later,
we bought the Afghans a twenty nine.

1872
01:53:05.880 --> 01:53:13.720
Yeah, so it's like we yeah, I don't. It's like we you

1873
01:53:13.760 --> 01:53:15.840
know, the US Air Force and
like you know any you know in the

1874
01:53:15.920 --> 01:53:18.840
Navy, Like they were not designed
to do coin, right, They're designed

1875
01:53:18.840 --> 01:53:23.199
to fight a near peer, right. And but unfortunately think for US is

1876
01:53:23.199 --> 01:53:25.359
you know, I don't think any
of us thought it would be twenty years

1877
01:53:25.399 --> 01:53:29.760
of coin right, and it just
really bled down these things that we're gonna

1878
01:53:29.760 --> 01:53:33.600
need night one. Yeah, so
hit questions, yeah yeah, yeah please.

1879
01:53:33.880 --> 01:53:40.640
So you definitely know about like the
next generation air dominance Yeah yeah,

1880
01:53:41.279 --> 01:53:45.359
I mean that's supposed to replace F
twenty two, F fifteens for the most

1881
01:53:45.359 --> 01:53:46.760
part, right in a way.
Yeah, I think it's going to be

1882
01:53:46.760 --> 01:53:50.640
a comp like I think A and
I have to kind of unremember something I

1883
01:53:50.800 --> 01:53:55.880
got men in blacked, you know
when I left that. But I would

1884
01:53:55.960 --> 01:53:59.000
just say, and YAD is going
to be this the fancy buzz term is

1885
01:53:59.000 --> 01:54:00.960
this thing called family of sistan.
I think en goad is going to be

1886
01:54:01.000 --> 01:54:05.239
the initial transch in a family of
capabilities, if you will. Like,

1887
01:54:05.279 --> 01:54:09.840
I don't think it's gonna flat out
replace anything in all honesty, like I

1888
01:54:09.840 --> 01:54:12.520
think when the f when the twenty
two goes away. Unfortunately. I think

1889
01:54:12.520 --> 01:54:15.119
it's gonna be more because of money
and manning and funding. I think the

1890
01:54:16.279 --> 01:54:18.800
I would kind of equate End God
in a little This is my opinion that

1891
01:54:18.840 --> 01:54:21.800
could be wrong, but kind of
in the way that hypersonics are not gonna

1892
01:54:21.800 --> 01:54:25.880
replace all weapons, right, They're
gonna be complimentary because a we can't afford

1893
01:54:26.239 --> 01:54:30.399
to be an all hypersonic force.
It's gonna compliment in existing force structure,

1894
01:54:30.399 --> 01:54:31.760
if that makes sense. So I
think End God is gonna kind of come

1895
01:54:31.800 --> 01:54:38.239
on in small batches and end Goad. I think B twenty one maybe won't

1896
01:54:38.279 --> 01:54:41.439
be this that exquisite, but like, those are the things you're gonna see,

1897
01:54:41.479 --> 01:54:44.760
Like I don't even mean like night
one that's gonna be like minute one,

1898
01:54:44.840 --> 01:54:46.399
hour one. Like those are gonna
be the things that like literally do

1899
01:54:46.520 --> 01:54:51.640
like break Like they're gonna be like
the safe breaker for like the first few

1900
01:54:51.640 --> 01:54:56.239
hours. Yeah, and it's like, Okay, God's gonna be manned and

1901
01:54:56.359 --> 01:54:59.239
unmanned, right, Like that's the
thought process. They kind of keep going

1902
01:54:59.239 --> 01:55:02.239
back and forth on that, but
yes, that that's at least the initial

1903
01:55:02.239 --> 01:55:05.479
thought, uh, the production line
on whatever they're going to use for endgad

1904
01:55:05.520 --> 01:55:10.920
in theory could eventually be a souped
up version of this thing called the c

1905
01:55:11.000 --> 01:55:15.720
CIA, the collaborative combat autonomous thing. That's the thought process with CIAS is

1906
01:55:16.439 --> 01:55:21.680
I could have one F thirty five
force multiplying itself by controlling five or six

1907
01:55:21.680 --> 01:55:25.560
of these unmanned ccas to sort of
do its bidding, if you will.

1908
01:55:25.560 --> 01:55:29.199
It's carrying weapons, it's going forward, it's doing forward launch, and it's

1909
01:55:29.239 --> 01:55:31.399
sort of being like a loyal wingman
to a fighter, right slaved off to

1910
01:55:31.439 --> 01:55:33.399
the human offen. Yeah, pretty
much. You know, one thing we

1911
01:55:33.479 --> 01:55:38.760
talked about, like we talked about
sort of the policy, you know,

1912
01:55:38.840 --> 01:55:43.119
the how the close to our support
and things like that, but you can

1913
01:55:43.920 --> 01:55:47.039
hill rucks time became a lot more
restrictive. And we've talked on the on

1914
01:55:47.359 --> 01:55:50.680
you know, to guys like j
tax before and people who are like,

1915
01:55:50.760 --> 01:55:54.800
yeah, I had to have like
a free page, like a three page

1916
01:55:54.800 --> 01:55:58.439
thing prepared to justify a call for
fire. Yeah, we've talked about that.

1917
01:55:58.479 --> 01:56:00.920
But one of the things that we
didn't talk that I'd love to hear

1918
01:56:00.119 --> 01:56:04.359
from you is like one of the
things that frustrated a lot of ground troops

1919
01:56:04.359 --> 01:56:08.920
and I think a lot of pilots
and air crews with at least the Air

1920
01:56:08.960 --> 01:56:14.399
Force in the latter parts of the
war was like AC one thirty couldn't fly

1921
01:56:14.520 --> 01:56:18.279
during the day that there were people
in high level positions that were placing the

1922
01:56:18.279 --> 01:56:24.920
the the airframe above the troops on
the ground. Yeah, did you guys

1923
01:56:24.960 --> 01:56:30.359
have any experience with that? We
did so, Like here here's like a

1924
01:56:30.439 --> 01:56:36.359
B one nuanced example. The first
two or three deployments when I did shows

1925
01:56:36.399 --> 01:56:41.199
of force, we were restricted to
five thousand feet over the ground. And

1926
01:56:41.920 --> 01:56:45.359
it took us like a deployment or
two to convince the leadership like you're actually

1927
01:56:45.359 --> 01:56:48.479
making me a bigger target at five
thousand feet, like simply from like a

1928
01:56:48.479 --> 01:56:54.399
Trigg standpoint, Like I mean actually
eventually we eventually got the goos to get

1929
01:56:54.399 --> 01:56:57.560
it down to a thousand feet in
combat. But you think about it,

1930
01:56:57.600 --> 01:57:01.239
like if I'm you know, I'm
the best guy, and you know we

1931
01:57:01.279 --> 01:57:04.319
want to you know, scare him
generated ICM chatter on trying to fix on

1932
01:57:04.399 --> 01:57:08.079
him, Like if I'm flying at
five thousand feet, it's like the equivalent

1933
01:57:08.119 --> 01:57:11.000
of seeing like the team house thing. That fucker could beat me all day,

1934
01:57:11.520 --> 01:57:15.319
and I think we just assumed that
all the capable you know, SA

1935
01:57:15.479 --> 01:57:18.560
seven equivalents like I R Man pads
were gone by that point. But it's

1936
01:57:18.600 --> 01:57:21.760
like you're actually giving that you to
a better chance to kill me higher than

1937
01:57:21.800 --> 01:57:25.720
if you let me literally scream up
on him at five hundred one thousand feet

1938
01:57:25.880 --> 01:57:29.159
right. So there that was.
That's like no joke, a b one

1939
01:57:29.199 --> 01:57:34.239
specific jample. That was real.
That's one, you know, trying to

1940
01:57:34.239 --> 01:57:39.640
think of some other ones, like
you know, for a while, if

1941
01:57:39.640 --> 01:57:45.000
it was in defense of a guy
on the ground, like you know,

1942
01:57:45.159 --> 01:57:47.840
if my wing happened to clip Pakistan, like okay, whatever should happens,

1943
01:57:48.079 --> 01:57:54.319
like my third and fourth deployment,
you encroached on Pakistan like by a millimeter

1944
01:57:54.399 --> 01:57:56.960
you were going home? Wow,
Like it was Yeah, And I think,

1945
01:57:57.000 --> 01:57:59.960
I mean, I think some of
that's politics that some of that sort

1946
01:58:00.079 --> 01:58:03.560
on the time of like the Torqum
Gate incident, where I mean, again,

1947
01:58:03.640 --> 01:58:06.239
I've talked to some guys that were
involved in that, and I think

1948
01:58:06.279 --> 01:58:12.680
when you're doing body searches afterwards and
you're finding pack mill IDs on bad guys,

1949
01:58:13.279 --> 01:58:15.439
you might have had a reason to
engage, right, but you had

1950
01:58:15.439 --> 01:58:19.039
to kind of eat it because it's
a political thing and you guys remember like

1951
01:58:19.079 --> 01:58:21.880
that that actually fucked a lot of
the guys in country for a while because

1952
01:58:21.920 --> 01:58:26.640
like they did not I mean,
you can only get so much inbound to

1953
01:58:26.640 --> 01:58:30.600
Afghanistan via the air, Like most
of that stuff was like the trucks,

1954
01:58:30.600 --> 01:58:32.159
so that stuff was colded. That
was a problem. Yeah, when they

1955
01:58:32.159 --> 01:58:34.840
would close the when they would close
the betro do us, like that was

1956
01:58:34.880 --> 01:58:39.920
a problem because like at that point, now like the guys in country are

1957
01:58:39.960 --> 01:58:43.720
restricted to like like anyone that was
in country, Like that's all you're getting,

1958
01:58:43.720 --> 01:58:46.199
Like bones aren't coming, yeah,
fifteen. At that point it moved

1959
01:58:46.239 --> 01:58:49.079
to dafferd like they're not coming.
Yeah, the boat guys aren't coming like

1960
01:58:49.119 --> 01:58:53.479
so that like that's sort of a
different argument. I apologize, but like

1961
01:58:53.520 --> 01:58:58.119
yeah, but it leads into like
you'd almost have to like people want to

1962
01:58:58.119 --> 01:59:00.359
put your wings on the table,
going like yep, cool me home,

1963
01:59:00.399 --> 01:59:01.920
take my wings. But like that
guy was gonna get a weapon whether you

1964
01:59:02.039 --> 01:59:06.600
like it or not. Yeah,
I mean one story was you guys remember

1965
01:59:06.640 --> 01:59:11.199
Marja twenty ten, and that was
in a crystal thing too. But like

1966
01:59:11.319 --> 01:59:14.279
they told us for three months leading
up to it, like you will not

1967
01:59:14.359 --> 01:59:17.279
drop on that like you bones,
you're there to like prevent Somalia from happening,

1968
01:59:17.279 --> 01:59:20.920
but like the whole basically it's like
we don't even want you here because

1969
01:59:20.920 --> 01:59:25.000
you're ruining our whole message of like
people outreach everything else. But it's like

1970
01:59:25.039 --> 01:59:27.640
the war's over, bro. Yeah
yeah, and then no shit, sure

1971
01:59:27.720 --> 01:59:31.119
enough night one Marja Marines took a
tick and like my buddy was flying God

1972
01:59:31.119 --> 01:59:33.520
bless him. Yeah, like no, no, you're getting a weapon and

1973
01:59:33.520 --> 01:59:35.159
I don't care if I have to
give my f and wings up, Like

1974
01:59:35.199 --> 01:59:38.800
this guy's getting a weapon. Yeah. And what was nuts about that was

1975
01:59:38.840 --> 01:59:42.800
like because it was such a high
profile op. It was literally a single

1976
01:59:42.840 --> 01:59:45.039
thirty eight and I think when the
time, by the time he landed,

1977
01:59:45.079 --> 01:59:49.039
there was at least two gos hanging
around trying to get in his shit.

1978
01:59:49.159 --> 01:59:54.560
It's the debrief for a single weapon
was like three four hours, whereas like

1979
01:59:54.600 --> 01:59:57.960
I've gotten Winchester and been in and
out in like forty five. I mean,

1980
01:59:58.000 --> 02:00:00.880
so that was that was I mean, I think to your point what

1981
02:00:00.920 --> 02:00:05.239
you asked was about like arbitrary restrictions
on the aircraft. I think the two

1982
02:00:05.279 --> 02:00:10.680
like that I can think of really
as like the the border incursion shit,

1983
02:00:10.760 --> 02:00:13.279
and then again the show of force
thing blew us away for a while.

1984
02:00:13.319 --> 02:00:16.520
It's like, dude, you're painting, you're basically screaming at like I'm making

1985
02:00:16.520 --> 02:00:18.640
it easier for you. Yeah,
because now I'm at a twenty thousand,

1986
02:00:18.840 --> 02:00:21.000
I'm at five thousand, I'm like, please come kill me, like yease

1987
02:00:21.119 --> 02:00:25.479
fucking take a shot. When they
finally smartened up and let us go down

1988
02:00:25.479 --> 02:00:28.399
to one thousand, that's when we
actually started getting better effects. So I

1989
02:00:28.439 --> 02:00:30.319
think for years we had desensitized the
enemy to like, okay, cool,

1990
02:00:30.359 --> 02:00:33.760
the infails are flying, they'll put
on an air show, then they'll leave,

1991
02:00:33.800 --> 02:00:35.640
and then we can go back to
doing what we do. And we

1992
02:00:35.680 --> 02:00:40.439
started doing that tactic like that's when
like they like everything else that they adapted

1993
02:00:40.479 --> 02:00:44.279
to that. But there was actually
a cool six month period where like the

1994
02:00:44.520 --> 02:00:46.119
icon got scary again, like,
oh, show they're that fucking around,

1995
02:00:46.119 --> 02:00:48.960
Like, yeah, they're letting the
infidels come down. And because they thought

1996
02:00:49.039 --> 02:00:51.520
for a while like we were like
a hog, like I could shoot you

1997
02:00:51.520 --> 02:00:54.720
with a yeah. Yeah, So
we let them think that obviously, but

1998
02:00:55.319 --> 02:00:58.520
you know there were times where like
we would change and yeah to give Hi

1999
02:00:58.520 --> 02:01:00.600
credit, like those guys could adapt
like like sure and we would take you

2000
02:01:00.640 --> 02:01:03.199
know, they figured everything out pretty
quickly. It took it. You know,

2001
02:01:03.239 --> 02:01:05.439
I never Gates is quote when he
was the sec deaf. You know,

2002
02:01:05.640 --> 02:01:10.920
we're being out propaganda by a guy
in a cave and we have an

2003
02:01:11.039 --> 02:01:15.680
entire you know, billion dollar public
affairs machine and messaging and synops and stuff.

2004
02:01:15.720 --> 02:01:17.520
So which I don't think was the
fault of our guys. It was

2005
02:01:18.399 --> 02:01:21.600
it took the first six your train
to come in to approve something. Meanwhile,

2006
02:01:21.640 --> 02:01:25.920
the local Taliban you know, fucking
platoon sergeant equivalent was like, yeah,

2007
02:01:25.920 --> 02:01:30.319
cool, get it out there.
Yeah yeah. So questions from viewers,

2008
02:01:30.479 --> 02:01:33.680
what's the story behind Brian's called sign
of slot Oh shit, wow,

2009
02:01:33.680 --> 02:01:40.199
okay, So so the way like
at least in our squad, you know,

2010
02:01:40.199 --> 02:01:42.600
so when naming ceremonies like what you
see like in the movies, like,

2011
02:01:42.920 --> 02:01:45.560
it's not like cool call signs,
it's usually something dumb and stupid.

2012
02:01:45.560 --> 02:01:49.439
You did so in my early days
ball duster, yeah, you know,

2013
02:01:49.720 --> 02:01:54.479
or you know fucker yeah or Murkin
or something. You So what happened was,

2014
02:01:54.600 --> 02:02:00.399
uh, I would I had a
habit for in South Dakota. Obviously

2015
02:02:00.399 --> 02:02:02.000
the elements are not really in your
favor if you want to get smashed and

2016
02:02:02.039 --> 02:02:08.079
make it home safely. Sometimes so
I would find some ingenious places to sleep.

2017
02:02:08.479 --> 02:02:13.680
Mostly it was atm dwellings and bank. But I had a gift.

2018
02:02:13.720 --> 02:02:18.840
I could nap anywhere anytime, So
between exhibiting sloth like behavior when they did

2019
02:02:18.840 --> 02:02:24.800
our ceremony uh at the time,
I was the deputy mayor of our bar

2020
02:02:25.319 --> 02:02:29.760
and the mayor was Chunks. So
then somebody decided to super impose my face

2021
02:02:29.760 --> 02:02:32.800
on the sloth from the Goonies.
So the combination of like slothy animal because

2022
02:02:32.800 --> 02:02:35.760
I was napping and moving slow all
the time, that was, you know,

2023
02:02:35.840 --> 02:02:41.000
being a lush and then Chunk you
know, uh, sloth from the

2024
02:02:41.039 --> 02:02:45.119
Goonies baby rooth. For like about
a month under that name, I was

2025
02:02:45.159 --> 02:02:48.359
finding fucking baby roots and like my
flight bag, my helmet. I would

2026
02:02:48.439 --> 02:02:54.239
love that personally, it was but
it was like get on the net.

2027
02:02:54.600 --> 02:02:58.079
Here you goes like like your an
deployment. You're in meat head mode,

2028
02:02:58.159 --> 02:03:00.039
right, you getting shape. You're
not boozing as much os as indeed,

2029
02:03:00.119 --> 02:03:01.600
but it's like, you know,
I'm like, dude, get this fact

2030
02:03:01.600 --> 02:03:04.199
boy katy away from me. Yeah, I gotta I have a girl.

2031
02:03:04.199 --> 02:03:06.079
That's the point when I come home. Yeah, I like have like a

2032
02:03:06.119 --> 02:03:09.239
three pack, if you know,
for the deppointment. So yeah, but

2033
02:03:09.279 --> 02:03:13.319
that's yeah. Like like like most
aircrew things, it's generally like either something

2034
02:03:13.399 --> 02:03:19.399
you did stupid once or just like
the repeated demonstrational behavior between the And this

2035
02:03:19.439 --> 02:03:23.039
is back before the days of like
really good this is like six o seven

2036
02:03:23.239 --> 02:03:26.439
now it was actually it was six
So I never the guy who did the

2037
02:03:26.479 --> 02:03:30.640
photoshop. It was like Rembrandt,
like how he did this photoshopping, Like

2038
02:03:30.720 --> 02:03:32.960
it didn't look like it was fake, Like the guy made all the creases

2039
02:03:33.039 --> 02:03:39.039
work in the coloring. So it's
like the guy misses calling. Yeah,

2040
02:03:39.079 --> 02:03:41.159
but yeah, sorry was I was. There was a better story behind it.

2041
02:03:42.720 --> 02:03:45.840
Alex, Thank you very much.
Do you think non self bomber platforms

2042
02:03:45.880 --> 02:03:49.720
will have a future in near peerer
symmetrical conflicts in the future or will everything

2043
02:03:49.760 --> 02:03:56.520
be uh uh like uh durak uh
drones and stealth aircraft. No. I

2044
02:03:56.560 --> 02:04:00.600
definitely think at least for the next
decade or more. I think for two

2045
02:04:00.680 --> 02:04:03.199
reasons. A, we just we
don't have the number of jets to do.

2046
02:04:04.279 --> 02:04:10.319
I think right now, drones based
from aircraft capability, We're pretty limited

2047
02:04:10.319 --> 02:04:13.119
to what we could do with those
things. Like I mentioned before, I

2048
02:04:13.119 --> 02:04:16.159
think the CCA cop concept is still
a few years away. But I would

2049
02:04:16.239 --> 02:04:21.760
argue from a well A, it's
going to think about two like the cost

2050
02:04:21.840 --> 02:04:28.760
of just retiring everything but then regenerating
a new platform from scratch is going to

2051
02:04:28.760 --> 02:04:30.840
be pretty impossible. That's going to
create at least a multi year gap.

2052
02:04:31.680 --> 02:04:35.640
So yes, but I would say
obviously, as the threats increase and push

2053
02:04:35.680 --> 02:04:39.479
you out further, it's going to
demand. So the role I see for

2054
02:04:39.560 --> 02:04:44.159
fourth generation aircraft, especially bombers,
is in the initial phases of a conflict

2055
02:04:44.760 --> 02:04:46.960
in a near peer it's probably going
to be your cruise, missile and hypersonic

2056
02:04:47.000 --> 02:04:50.479
carrier. That'll probably be the first
couple of days of the war or whenever

2057
02:04:50.479 --> 02:04:55.479
they're able to get in. And
then, like most things, I don't

2058
02:04:55.479 --> 02:04:58.680
really know if we have a good
example in recent history of what we can

2059
02:04:58.680 --> 02:05:00.479
compare what we think the next one
would be be. But like everything else,

2060
02:05:00.560 --> 02:05:04.399
right, like you know Iraq was
you know, Iraq was hot and

2061
02:05:04.439 --> 02:05:09.600
heavy with a traditional eye ADS takedown, and then within a few weeks or

2062
02:05:09.600 --> 02:05:13.680
so, like it transitioned into we
pretty much own the air. Their fighters

2063
02:05:13.720 --> 02:05:15.199
are gone, their SAMs are gone. Now we're just sort of doing like

2064
02:05:15.920 --> 02:05:21.880
you know, uh, air superiority, sort of complete dominance of the air

2065
02:05:21.920 --> 02:05:24.680
where I can, I can kind
of come and go as I please and

2066
02:05:24.720 --> 02:05:29.279
just do either HBI takedowns, systems
takedowns like you know, kind of what

2067
02:05:29.399 --> 02:05:30.640
you know, the old scud hunts
and deserts from one. Yeah, but

2068
02:05:30.680 --> 02:05:33.920
that that comes after the initial sort
of like door kick phase right where we

2069
02:05:33.960 --> 02:05:36.520
have to kick down their eye ads, make make air. You know,

2070
02:05:36.840 --> 02:05:41.359
we have to basically have air supremacy. I don't. I think the days

2071
02:05:41.399 --> 02:05:44.199
of us ever having air supremacy ever
again are probably over. Yeah. I

2072
02:05:44.199 --> 02:05:49.359
think we will probably have momentary time
slices of air superiority for a little bit,

2073
02:05:49.399 --> 02:05:54.600
but dominance and supremacy probably never gonna
happen again. Contested Yeah, yeah,

2074
02:05:54.840 --> 02:05:57.680
And I think we'll have fleeting moments
of it. But then they're going

2075
02:05:57.720 --> 02:06:00.000
to regroup, regen, and we
hope that we've accomplished what we wanted to

2076
02:06:00.000 --> 02:06:06.159
target and we get out of dodge. Yeah, Bear Holmes, thank you

2077
02:06:06.199 --> 02:06:12.880
very much. Say China invaded Taiwan
tomorrow, what aircraft in the current inventory

2078
02:06:13.039 --> 02:06:19.279
would be the most important. I
want to say it's a loaded question.

2079
02:06:19.359 --> 02:06:30.079
It's it's probably because we don't I
would say it's a really good question.

2080
02:06:30.119 --> 02:06:33.720
It's tough because you know, I'm
not saying, is the aircraft work in

2081
02:06:33.720 --> 02:06:38.760
conjunction with one another? Yeah?
Yeah, I really probably can't pin it

2082
02:06:38.800 --> 02:06:42.399
down to one aircraft, right,
Believe it or not. And this doesn't

2083
02:06:42.399 --> 02:06:45.399
sound it's not a sexy answer,
but like some of the most crucial aircraft

2084
02:06:45.439 --> 02:06:49.199
in this fight are gonna be your
tankers, your early warning, all your

2085
02:06:49.279 --> 02:06:54.520
what we call have A and have
it is h VAA high value how that

2086
02:06:54.840 --> 02:06:59.680
high value air assets is what HAS
stands for. So really it's tough to

2087
02:06:59.680 --> 02:07:01.960
pin it down to one because unfortunately
f thirty fives are not gonna have the

2088
02:07:02.039 --> 02:07:09.720
legs to get there bones without any
sort of protection. I would say right

2089
02:07:09.720 --> 02:07:12.600
now, it's not necessarily the aircraft
that's gonna determine it. I would say,

2090
02:07:12.640 --> 02:07:17.760
it's gonna be the weapons. And
because there's nothing in that fight,

2091
02:07:17.840 --> 02:07:21.239
there's no aircraft that we have that
is just untouchable. Right, So really,

2092
02:07:21.359 --> 02:07:24.720
and we're kind of learning this the
hard way, and I'm kind of

2093
02:07:24.760 --> 02:07:29.600
dancing around hurt. The question but
we learned way too late, a long

2094
02:07:29.640 --> 02:07:35.199
time ago, that we've been building
amazing fifth and with n YAD and BE

2095
02:07:35.279 --> 02:07:40.479
twenty one six gen aircraft, but
we've we've been doing it without a thought

2096
02:07:40.479 --> 02:07:43.119
that the weapons are gonna carry.
So case in point, you know,

2097
02:07:43.119 --> 02:07:45.520
I had an old general one time
we said that if you guys are not

2098
02:07:45.640 --> 02:07:49.600
irate over the fact that a big
part of the F thirty five's load out

2099
02:07:49.720 --> 02:07:54.800
is a seventy technology weapon g WU
thirty eight, like, you're not angry

2100
02:07:54.920 --> 02:07:58.439
enough. And that's been our problem
is we've been so heavily focused, I

2101
02:07:58.439 --> 02:08:01.319
would say on aircraft development over the
last two decades that we missed the boat

2102
02:08:01.319 --> 02:08:03.399
in a lot of ways. On
weapons, we let a lot of the

2103
02:08:03.399 --> 02:08:07.880
weapons industry atrophy, in my personal
opinion, and we didn't really learn the

2104
02:08:07.960 --> 02:08:13.640
lessons of, like what other adversaries, knowing they can't compete with us,

2105
02:08:13.640 --> 02:08:16.760
what they're going to do the whole
term. Third offset, you know,

2106
02:08:18.600 --> 02:08:22.239
you could argue that Russia realized that
they were going to lose that war again,

2107
02:08:22.279 --> 02:08:26.000
so what they start doing They started
investing in the really non sexy stuff

2108
02:08:26.039 --> 02:08:31.319
electronic warfare, jamming, comms,
dispersion, psyops, rotting us from within

2109
02:08:31.399 --> 02:08:35.119
with propaganda, like you know,
we're probably the we're probably in the midst

2110
02:08:35.119 --> 02:08:39.000
of the largest counterintelligence campaign in history. Every day with just like Chinese water

2111
02:08:39.079 --> 02:08:41.640
torture, drip drip, drip,
drip, A little lie here, a

2112
02:08:41.640 --> 02:08:43.960
little eye there, right, because
they don't operate like us. They don't

2113
02:08:43.960 --> 02:08:50.640
operate in four yeatly making us hate
our fellow bro and the Chinese is the

2114
02:08:50.680 --> 02:08:54.039
same way they operate generationally, not
like every four years. Yeah, we

2115
02:08:54.079 --> 02:08:56.479
operate in four year chunks and hate
your chunks. And anyone that can think

2116
02:08:56.520 --> 02:09:00.840
out to the thirties things, he's
like some sort of master Tratigigno dude,

2117
02:09:00.840 --> 02:09:03.760
Like China's plan is the one hundred
year plan. Yeah, Russia just operates

2118
02:09:03.800 --> 02:09:07.279
like it'll be the same guy in
charge forever, which he probably will be

2119
02:09:07.279 --> 02:09:11.760
to you know, dies, but
that's unfortunately, like we're the greatest country

2120
02:09:11.720 --> 02:09:13.920
in the world, but like it's
also one of our downfalls is, yeah,

2121
02:09:13.960 --> 02:09:16.920
we have a democratic system that let's
be honest, it's scary how lately

2122
02:09:18.000 --> 02:09:20.760
how easily exploiled it is. It
feels like I don't know how we go

2123
02:09:20.800 --> 02:09:24.199
off on that topic, but uh, but it's kind of sort of related,

2124
02:09:24.239 --> 02:09:28.960
I would say in the sense of
yeah, I think we we we

2125
02:09:28.000 --> 02:09:31.960
thought we could get away with uh
just focused on aircraft for a long time

2126
02:09:31.960 --> 02:09:35.439
and not really doing the weapons piece. We're starting to catch up a little

2127
02:09:35.439 --> 02:09:37.760
bit, but we were I think
we're a ways behind. Yeah, so

2128
02:09:37.840 --> 02:09:41.439
that's so. I don't know if
I can necessarily say an aircraft. I

2129
02:09:41.439 --> 02:09:43.880
would argue if you put a gun
in my head, it would probably be

2130
02:09:43.920 --> 02:09:46.239
one of the bombers, assuming that
we could get a hypersonic capability with the

2131
02:09:46.319 --> 02:09:50.319
next two years, Yeah, that
would be That would be my best guess.

2132
02:09:52.119 --> 02:09:54.840
JK, thank you very much.
Thoughts on the bird scene on Alphabet

2133
02:09:54.880 --> 02:10:01.439
Soup's compound calf definitely not an are
I don't wait, what was the question?

2134
02:10:03.119 --> 02:10:05.800
I think they called it like the
Beast of candle Horn or something.

2135
02:10:05.960 --> 02:10:09.680
Oh that thing? What are my
thoughts on it? That happened? This

2136
02:10:09.720 --> 02:10:13.119
only happened in twenty ten, right, I think it was a drone that

2137
02:10:13.159 --> 02:10:15.760
they were flying off of candle horror. Oh, yeah, you know the

2138
02:10:15.760 --> 02:10:18.079
Beast of Canada. Yeah, so
the RQ one seventy. Like, what

2139
02:10:18.079 --> 02:10:22.239
do I think happened there? I
guess he's just what do you think about

2140
02:10:22.279 --> 02:10:26.039
what do you think about, uh, thoughts thoughts on the bird? He

2141
02:10:26.079 --> 02:10:28.880
says, definitely not a RQ one
seventy. I think the guy is probably

2142
02:10:28.880 --> 02:10:35.880
referencing like some black Side drone,
which I that I I'm not even being

2143
02:10:35.960 --> 02:10:39.920
koy like I'm actually not I know, I have no answer for his question.

2144
02:10:39.079 --> 02:10:41.640
Yeah. The only thing I will
tell him is my personal opinion.

2145
02:10:41.840 --> 02:10:46.359
It's kind of so related. Is
how I rank got their hands on the

2146
02:10:46.359 --> 02:10:50.960
one seventy? Is I think they
outside help? Yeah? I think I

2147
02:10:50.039 --> 02:10:56.000
think unfortunately, Uh, there was
a back door, there was there was

2148
02:10:56.000 --> 02:11:00.439
a there was a vulnerability there that
they probably did not put off on their

2149
02:11:00.439 --> 02:11:03.359
own. And with what I've found
cute about that whole thing is over the

2150
02:11:03.439 --> 02:11:05.159
last because that happened. It happened
like fifteen years ago now, I think,

2151
02:11:05.239 --> 02:11:07.439
right, Yeah, what's cute about
it is when they put the thing

2152
02:11:07.479 --> 02:11:13.119
on display, they had this almost
like banquet curtain underneath. If you guys

2153
02:11:13.159 --> 02:11:16.119
by to look at pictures on the
Iranians displayed it, it add this like

2154
02:11:16.279 --> 02:11:18.039
banquet curtain like underneath it, like
like it was like a you know,

2155
02:11:18.159 --> 02:11:22.439
kinseigner or something, which leads me
to believe is I think that thing eight

2156
02:11:22.600 --> 02:11:26.880
dirt big time when landed and the
undercarriage of that aircraft is fucked. Yeah,

2157
02:11:26.920 --> 02:11:28.760
so sorry, it's not answering his
question. Yeah, I would just

2158
02:11:28.880 --> 02:11:35.640
point out there are black side drones
that are flying operationally and not my area

2159
02:11:35.680 --> 02:11:37.880
of expertise. But yeah, that
stuff is out there. It's pretty Oh

2160
02:11:37.920 --> 02:11:41.359
no, it's stuff we out there. Yeah, I mean I'll say that.

2161
02:11:43.199 --> 02:11:46.199
Yeah, they're like stuff that has
never been revealed to the public.

2162
02:11:46.359 --> 02:11:48.399
Oh yeah. And I so when
people say, like you think there's aliens

2163
02:11:48.439 --> 02:11:52.520
at fifty one, like, no, that that's where our shit gets built.

2164
02:11:52.600 --> 02:11:54.680
Yeah, like you know there's I'm
not the first got to say this,

2165
02:11:54.760 --> 02:12:00.560
but uh, you know, the
quickest way they go to jail as

2166
02:12:00.560 --> 02:12:03.920
an ACTI Duty Air Force officers is
clip the container at a red flag or

2167
02:12:03.920 --> 02:12:07.560
a weapon school like that thing was, Like you got anywhere remotely near that

2168
02:12:07.600 --> 02:12:11.239
thing, Like you're you're done.
So, I mean, and I don't

2169
02:12:11.239 --> 02:12:16.199
think it's for the reasons that people
think it is right. It's not because

2170
02:12:16.199 --> 02:12:18.239
they don't want you to see e
T. Yeah. Like I'm not saying

2171
02:12:18.279 --> 02:12:20.279
there's not ET. I just don't
think ET's there. Yeah. I think

2172
02:12:20.279 --> 02:12:26.520
if there is an et, he's
somewhere else. Yeah, you know council

2173
02:12:28.359 --> 02:12:37.319
exactly sure. Yeah from Danny.
Has any of Brian's fellow aviators ever confide

2174
02:12:37.359 --> 02:12:43.159
it to him about experiencing a UFO
encounter during a flight or mission? Wow?

2175
02:12:43.560 --> 02:12:46.000
Uh, the answer is no.
And the only reason I would say

2176
02:12:46.000 --> 02:12:52.960
that is because when you when you
read all the reports, and I think

2177
02:12:52.960 --> 02:12:54.640
there's a common theme when you read
the reports, right, it's all navy

2178
02:12:54.640 --> 02:12:58.439
piles to see it, and it's
generally all navy pile to doing it off

2179
02:12:58.439 --> 02:13:03.000
the water, so and again,
and some of these guys are pretty credible

2180
02:13:03.159 --> 02:13:05.720
and they say, like, you
know, I'm an arrow major from the

2181
02:13:05.760 --> 02:13:09.439
Naval Academy, like, things are
not supposed to do that at that g

2182
02:13:09.600 --> 02:13:13.680
limit at that speed. So it
really could be something. Again I'm not

2183
02:13:13.880 --> 02:13:16.439
playing koy former government worker, like, it really could be something that cannot

2184
02:13:16.439 --> 02:13:22.880
be explained. My theory also is
is that you know, you guys right

2185
02:13:22.880 --> 02:13:24.960
now, if you want it to, could go online and look up pictures

2186
02:13:24.960 --> 02:13:28.399
of like stuff we have out in
the desert. Because there's aircraft watchers with

2187
02:13:28.439 --> 02:13:33.199
better cameras than we have that see
these things take off. There's only so

2188
02:13:33.319 --> 02:13:37.159
much secrecy. I think you can
do with some of our really high level

2189
02:13:37.199 --> 02:13:41.279
PID covered programs over land. So
I would not be shocked if we are

2190
02:13:41.279 --> 02:13:45.960
doing some next level weapons development out
of the water and it just happens to

2191
02:13:46.000 --> 02:13:50.079
be at a time where like there's
a four ship of hornets taken off from

2192
02:13:50.079 --> 02:13:56.760
you know, that's that's just my
personal PAGs because it always happens to be.

2193
02:13:56.880 --> 02:14:00.479
It always just seems to be the
Navy, and it always the ones

2194
02:14:00.479 --> 02:14:03.720
I've heard about. It seems to
be over the water, So that that's

2195
02:14:03.760 --> 02:14:09.359
just my And I'm also if some
credible whistle blover comes forward someday and says

2196
02:14:09.359 --> 02:14:13.159
like no, no, they're actually
okay cool, I guess I'm I don't

2197
02:14:13.199 --> 02:14:16.039
one percent say like there's not out
there, right. I just I think

2198
02:14:16.119 --> 02:14:20.720
the the the more realistic near term
explanation is is that that's probably where we've

2199
02:14:20.760 --> 02:14:24.760
moved a lot of our advanced development
and stuff. It's I know that a

2200
02:14:24.760 --> 02:14:30.199
lot of like credible pilots have reported
like seeing things that they couldn't explain.

2201
02:14:31.079 --> 02:14:33.880
I didn't know that it was like
they were prevalent, like it was Navy

2202
02:14:33.920 --> 02:14:37.199
primarily Navy, And that does make
sense. Yeah, And if I go

2203
02:14:37.239 --> 02:14:41.119
back and I don't want to make
a general statement because somebody will probably tell

2204
02:14:41.159 --> 02:14:43.720
me like, no, no,
you've missed this specific case on this day,

2205
02:14:43.800 --> 02:14:46.119
Like you're probably right. I Actually
it's kind of like almost being in

2206
02:14:46.119 --> 02:14:50.239
an air show when I get guys
come up to me going like, why

2207
02:14:50.279 --> 02:14:52.439
don't you know more about what?
Do I know mark your aircraft and I

2208
02:14:52.560 --> 02:14:54.840
than you do. I'm like,
I don't know, dude, because I

2209
02:14:54.880 --> 02:15:01.039
like to go and party and yeah, I like, yeah, I don't

2210
02:15:01.039 --> 02:15:03.840
want to denigrate people who really take
an interest in aviation. Yah, yeah,

2211
02:15:03.840 --> 02:15:07.680
that's awesome. But it's like like
I've definitely been stumped at air shows

2212
02:15:07.039 --> 02:15:11.479
about ship about my own aircraft.
Dude, that's thanks for telling me.

2213
02:15:11.520 --> 02:15:13.279
I'll use it as a trivia nugget
now for a young guy. But like

2214
02:15:13.399 --> 02:15:20.159
I that nerds come out and challenge
the same way as like like Star Trek

2215
02:15:20.239 --> 02:15:24.279
fans than the actors ride like Q
like is a former Green Bray guy,

2216
02:15:24.319 --> 02:15:26.159
Like I mean, you know,
did you know about this mission in ninety

2217
02:15:26.920 --> 02:15:30.520
I didn't, But thanks for telling
them, Like yeah, you things all

2218
02:15:30.520 --> 02:15:31.680
the time. Yeah, that's kind
of part of it, So I don't

2219
02:15:31.680 --> 02:15:37.319
need to denigrate make fun of anyone
like I just the e T you know,

2220
02:15:37.600 --> 02:15:41.800
unexplained vehicle thing like I just don't
maybe I should, I just don't

2221
02:15:41.800 --> 02:15:43.239
take a huge interest in it.
Yeah. So it's like the ones that

2222
02:15:43.279 --> 02:15:46.319
I can remember from the top of
my head. It just always seems to

2223
02:15:46.319 --> 02:15:48.760
be a Navy guy over the water. That's why. That's why I say

2224
02:15:48.760 --> 02:15:52.079
that. Yeah, all right,
one way of saying, I don't know,

2225
02:15:52.119 --> 02:15:56.319
sorry, we have one more.
What are some of the what are

2226
02:15:56.359 --> 02:16:00.000
some of the interesting ways the crew
would pass time on a long sortie.

2227
02:16:00.119 --> 02:16:05.600
That's a really good one. So
kind of like Candy Crush Bubbles was a

2228
02:16:05.600 --> 02:16:09.560
great one. We play that game
tanks with each other because we get Jerry

2229
02:16:09.600 --> 02:16:13.079
rig Our laptops to see each other. Mostly to be honest with you,

2230
02:16:13.199 --> 02:16:15.760
it was a lot of iPod,
a lot of music, a lot of

2231
02:16:15.800 --> 02:16:22.880
iPod playing. And it's crazy because
like an average OEF combat sort he was

2232
02:16:22.920 --> 02:16:28.039
anywhere from about twelve to thirteen hours. Wow, the full time, you

2233
02:16:28.079 --> 02:16:31.680
know, the whole time of you
being in country was anywhere from six to

2234
02:16:31.720 --> 02:16:35.159
eight So I mean really you had
about a rough wag of it would be

2235
02:16:35.239 --> 02:16:39.399
like I had two and a half
hours to actually get on station about another

2236
02:16:39.440 --> 02:16:41.360
two and a half to get home, and you mix in some decks,

2237
02:16:41.360 --> 02:16:45.920
some go pills there to be alert. Yeah, I mean we had one

2238
02:16:45.959 --> 02:16:52.079
guy, one guy literally completed like
his masters just on drone time for a

2239
02:16:52.120 --> 02:16:52.719
lot of years. You guys will
probably get a kick out of this.

2240
02:16:54.000 --> 02:16:56.680
Do you guys remember, like again, it's the Air Force, because you

2241
02:16:56.680 --> 02:16:58.840
know we're we have we have to
be the Air Force. We have to

2242
02:16:58.879 --> 02:17:03.360
be those guys. Reflect the belts
were like if you don't basically, if

2243
02:17:03.399 --> 02:17:05.399
you don't wear a reflective belt,
it's the equivalents of like letting an insurgent

2244
02:17:05.399 --> 02:17:13.319
in the base. Yeah, it's
almost you scum, you filth bag.

2245
02:17:13.399 --> 02:17:16.719
So it's like we had one of
my buddies. I'll think the link to

2246
02:17:16.719 --> 02:17:20.399
this because I'm shooting. I'm shot
the out right now with like it's like

2247
02:17:20.440 --> 02:17:26.920
the biggest fuck you to leadership.
Uh. He literally by hand, he

2248
02:17:26.959 --> 02:17:28.920
took a reflective belt on a jet
one time. So this is actually over

2249
02:17:28.959 --> 02:17:33.000
the course of a few sorties,
and he was cutting out parts. He

2250
02:17:33.079 --> 02:17:37.479
was cutting off pieces of the reflective
belt and by hand sewing in velcrow to

2251
02:17:37.559 --> 02:17:39.440
the reflective belt, and so for
a while he was like, young,

2252
02:17:39.440 --> 02:17:45.639
we're my reflective belt. He was
making like pencil patch tab reflective belts.

2253
02:17:45.959 --> 02:17:46.920
But it's like I looked at one
time and I'm like, dude, can

2254
02:17:46.920 --> 02:17:50.600
you imagine if you just used your
powers for good, you could fucking cure

2255
02:17:50.639 --> 02:17:56.360
cancer or like or like like like
you can invent the next but you're hands

2256
02:17:56.399 --> 02:18:01.280
sewing reflective belt patches just to piss
off like the local wing commander. Honestly,

2257
02:18:01.399 --> 02:18:07.520
I reflective belts, if I remember, like started to really become a

2258
02:18:07.520 --> 02:18:15.280
thing, like a bogrum, maybe
around like two thousand, was it two

2259
02:18:15.479 --> 02:18:18.000
two thousand it was, And at
that point I was like, all right,

2260
02:18:18.079 --> 02:18:20.719
we've already lost this war. Like
when that becomes the thing, when

2261
02:18:20.719 --> 02:18:26.479
that becomes everybody has to Like I
remember Fort Benning there, like your first

2262
02:18:26.479 --> 02:18:30.719
line supervisor gets fired if you're not
wearing a reflector. Yeah, and Ranger

2263
02:18:30.719 --> 02:18:33.000
of Btown, there's a lot of
angry privates angry at their team leader.

2264
02:18:33.200 --> 02:18:37.879
And so there's a mat in the
middle of a run old gond of Jettison.

2265
02:18:39.000 --> 02:18:41.159
I wasn't a huge fan of the
Guys comedy, but you remember there

2266
02:18:41.200 --> 02:18:45.200
was a video of a Carlo Smancia
and he's at one of like he's at

2267
02:18:45.200 --> 02:18:50.040
a USO show and it was either
it was either au ded or it wasn't

2268
02:18:50.079 --> 02:18:52.559
like an Afghan or iraqy base.
But he just went off on this tangent

2269
02:18:52.879 --> 02:18:56.319
and he was basically like pointing out
like the six that was in charge the

2270
02:18:56.319 --> 02:19:00.200
policy, like calling him a loot, like you fucking like an whole I

2271
02:19:00.200 --> 02:19:03.280
was like cheering these guys just kind
of sitting there like and eat it because

2272
02:19:03.319 --> 02:19:05.120
it's like, all right, yeah, I'm the I'm the asshole put this

2273
02:19:05.159 --> 02:19:07.959
policy in place. Yeah, you
know, Big Blue wants me to uh

2274
02:19:09.559 --> 02:19:11.680
we wrap up tonight. Do you
want to talk about what you're doing today?

2275
02:19:11.920 --> 02:19:15.399
Uh, what you're up to nowadays? Yeah, so yeah, yeah,

2276
02:19:15.399 --> 02:19:20.079
you know, uh retired active duty
from the Pentagon as an airstaff officer,

2277
02:19:20.319 --> 02:19:22.559
took a job of the defense company. It's probably one of the last

2278
02:19:22.559 --> 02:19:24.280
few remaining ones in the Northeast area, which is really awesome because it gets

2279
02:19:24.280 --> 02:19:28.959
me go closer to home. But
yeah, just trying to learn the you

2280
02:19:28.000 --> 02:19:31.920
know, trying to not be your
your classic sleazy business development or bed guy.

2281
02:19:33.120 --> 02:19:35.399
But in my space, I'm primarily
focused. You're not a VC guy.

2282
02:19:35.399 --> 02:19:39.440
It's yeah, primarily focused on the
electronic warfare aspect, even though my

2283
02:19:39.440 --> 02:19:43.719
background's more sort of weapons. But
uh now, honestly, you guys probably

2284
02:19:43.719 --> 02:19:46.719
want through the same thing, right, Like I'm I'll be about a year

2285
02:19:46.760 --> 02:19:50.280
in June of sort of being out
of uniform, and you know it just

2286
02:19:50.360 --> 02:19:52.760
it still feels not real. Yeah, I'm really just trying to, you

2287
02:19:52.760 --> 02:19:54.920
know, find my way and yeah, you know, still kind of like,

2288
02:19:56.920 --> 02:20:01.200
you know, learn the ways of
uh you know what what Boots Allen

2289
02:20:01.239 --> 02:20:03.440
Hamilton. Yeah, not that bad, well any one who knows. But

2290
02:20:03.719 --> 02:20:05.840
no, honestly, really just you
know, just just trying to get settled

2291
02:20:05.840 --> 02:20:09.600
back in the area and kind of
learn the new language of And it's really

2292
02:20:09.600 --> 02:20:13.040
weird at times, like it's it's
big boy in a really weird way.

2293
02:20:13.440 --> 02:20:16.959
It's like there's been a few times
where I've just been like I really kind

2294
02:20:16.959 --> 02:20:20.239
of wish I had like a a
reg or an Afi to go back to

2295
02:20:20.319 --> 02:20:24.159
right now, because like I craved
that like structure, ycause some of the

2296
02:20:24.159 --> 02:20:26.239
ship today is like ah, yeah, you had a meeting with so and

2297
02:20:26.280 --> 02:20:31.239
so, and uh, I just
show up wear a suit and like anything

2298
02:20:31.280 --> 02:20:33.200
else, like naw, you'll figure
it out. I'm like I will,

2299
02:20:33.319 --> 02:20:37.120
ye there's like money apparently being discussed, like I I don't feel ready,

2300
02:20:35.959 --> 02:20:39.799
I just just do it. So
that that part's a little weird, but

2301
02:20:39.040 --> 02:20:43.440
uh now yeah, so just just
back in the area doing defense contracting and

2302
02:20:43.520 --> 02:20:46.799
uh, you know, trying to
be trying to do it for the right

2303
02:20:46.799 --> 02:20:48.079
reasons, you know, like if
my company has the solution for something,

2304
02:20:48.120 --> 02:20:50.520
we can help great. If not, then you know, still trying to

2305
02:20:50.600 --> 02:20:54.319
keep like the guys and gals and
and bros That are out doing the job,

2306
02:20:54.479 --> 02:20:58.319
like trying to keep them in mind
repitch stuff. So yeah, pretty

2307
02:20:58.360 --> 02:21:01.520
much that that's awesome. Two quick
things. Yeah, Barret Holmes, which

2308
02:21:01.520 --> 02:21:07.079
fifth Gen looks the coolest? I
got to say the F twenty two.

2309
02:21:07.360 --> 02:21:11.920
I think that thing is I've seen
that thing up close. We I actually

2310
02:21:13.239 --> 02:21:16.920
and little known story like the F
twenty two is active in Syria, like

2311
02:21:16.360 --> 02:21:20.639
helping me target isis Like that fucking
thing is the greatest thing I've ever seen.

2312
02:21:20.799 --> 02:21:24.040
Yeah, I don't and it's a
shame we cut it and we probably

2313
02:21:24.079 --> 02:21:28.079
the wrong call at the time,
but like that that is the sexiest,

2314
02:21:28.159 --> 02:21:30.479
most capable thing I've ever seen in
my life. Yeah, it is amazing.

2315
02:21:30.600 --> 02:21:33.239
Yeah, I think some of the
like the belt, like some of

2316
02:21:33.280 --> 02:21:35.799
the concept helicopters look really really badass. Yeah, but of courtunate, we

2317
02:21:35.799 --> 02:21:39.399
just canceled the one, right,
Yeah, being out in was it Nevada

2318
02:21:39.520 --> 02:21:45.479
or Arizona and being out on the
flight line and just watching like, dude,

2319
02:21:45.559 --> 02:21:48.120
a dozen f twenty two's just screaming
down and taking off and I was

2320
02:21:48.159 --> 02:21:50.920
like, they are that is gangster. They are. They are the greatest,

2321
02:21:52.239 --> 02:21:56.120
And yeah, I follow what's his
face the OAF on Instagram? Operators

2322
02:21:56.120 --> 02:22:01.159
fucked that guy. He's a former
marine. But uh, that's it's weird.

2323
02:22:01.159 --> 02:22:03.559
It's like it's it's it's mostly about
like you know, soft guys and

2324
02:22:03.600 --> 02:22:05.920
operators. But he he he.
Just occasionally I think, like once a

2325
02:22:05.920 --> 02:22:09.559
month or once a quarters happens to
get the twenty two demo guy in there,

2326
02:22:09.559 --> 02:22:11.079
because like, yeah, you know, what's what's cool? Is cool?

2327
02:22:11.079 --> 02:22:16.879
Like that think is amazing? Yeah
and then uh oh in corporate think

2328
02:22:16.879 --> 02:22:20.799
you match, hit the like button
and subscribe. We agree and thanks fellows.

2329
02:22:20.920 --> 02:22:26.040
Interesting conversation. Ok, okay,
and uh next Friday, we will

2330
02:22:26.079 --> 02:22:31.920
be back with a gentleman who served
as an FBI agent. He was actually

2331
02:22:31.959 --> 02:22:35.680
an assistant director, not once but
twice. All right, we'll have him

2332
02:22:35.719 --> 02:22:37.360
in studio. Really excited to talk
to him. It's going to be a

2333
02:22:37.399 --> 02:22:43.120
fun conversation. Brian, thanks for
joining us. Anything else you want to

2334
02:22:43.120 --> 02:22:46.760
put out this is this is awesome, Anything you want to promote or I'm

2335
02:22:46.840 --> 02:22:50.280
just a boring suit wearing bad guy
like this is Uh, We're all just

2336
02:22:50.360 --> 02:22:54.239
working slobs out on the streets.
I'm just happy. I'm just happy to

2337
02:22:54.280 --> 02:22:56.079
be one now. But no,
honestly, like I said, you know,

2338
02:22:56.239 --> 02:22:58.239
the biggest thing I probably didn't mention
was, you know, you know,

2339
02:22:58.280 --> 02:23:01.680
for years doing the cast mission,
right like for us, like the

2340
02:23:01.680 --> 02:23:05.399
guys in the ground were our heroes, and you know, so it was

2341
02:23:05.520 --> 02:23:09.440
it was cool as like the years
went on and you got to meet a

2342
02:23:09.440 --> 02:23:11.760
lot of those guys like one on
one, like to get their perspective.

2343
02:23:11.799 --> 02:23:15.440
Like now, dude, let's you
know, you know, it's cool that

2344
02:23:15.479 --> 02:23:16.280
you're a fanboy at times, but
it's like, no, like you you

2345
02:23:16.360 --> 02:23:20.000
really pulled this out of some really
shitty spots right now, so it's it's

2346
02:23:20.079 --> 02:23:22.159
cool to like it all comes full
circle and uh, I really appreciate you

2347
02:23:22.159 --> 02:23:24.479
guys sort of bringing on a different
perspective. I'm just happy to provide my

2348
02:23:24.520 --> 02:23:28.120
part, So thanks for having me, yea man, And absolutely this was

2349
02:23:28.159 --> 02:23:33.280
exactly like stepping outside of the soft
infantry sort of space that we're off and

2350
02:23:33.360 --> 02:23:37.079
in and talk about some more of
the strategic level stuff that goes on.

2351
02:23:37.440 --> 02:23:41.479
And yeah, and I think and
we, like I've talked about it before,

2352
02:23:41.520 --> 02:23:45.159
like having Cast come on station when
when you feel like you're fucked,

2353
02:23:45.399 --> 02:23:50.479
like when you feel like, man
like this is it and having Cast come

2354
02:23:50.520 --> 02:23:54.520
on station, it's it's it's like
it's a spiritual experience. It really is.

2355
02:23:56.079 --> 02:23:58.360
I only I'm only mentioning it now
because I just saw him recently,

2356
02:23:58.399 --> 02:24:03.079
But Ski going Bestkie who wrote Level
zero here. Yeah, I hung out

2357
02:24:03.120 --> 02:24:07.440
with him a little bit at a
conference not too long ago. It's funny

2358
02:24:07.319 --> 02:24:11.440
Ski actually works at the Air Force
Academy now, like doing something with one

2359
02:24:11.479 --> 02:24:15.000
of my buddies. But we always
love Ski because like when he wrote that

2360
02:24:15.040 --> 02:24:18.879
book that was all about b MG
Balimore gob when we were there and he

2361
02:24:18.000 --> 02:24:22.360
was the first guy ever to really
like we got more the b one got

2362
02:24:22.360 --> 02:24:26.399
more love from like another service,
another perspective than our own f and Air

2363
02:24:26.399 --> 02:24:28.760
Force. And it's like, yeah, it's been a few times where we've

2364
02:24:28.760 --> 02:24:31.120
seen our name mentioned in books and
whatnot, and like it feels good that,

2365
02:24:31.200 --> 02:24:33.360
like, you know, guys,
even if our own service didn't really

2366
02:24:33.440 --> 02:24:37.319
like us appreciate us, like the
guys in the ground like in us,

2367
02:24:37.319 --> 02:24:39.959
that's all it mattered for you.
So I wish I could have done it

2368
02:24:39.959 --> 02:24:43.079
more and definitely the highlight of my
life. I bet eight ten guys probably

2369
02:24:43.879 --> 02:24:46.760
yeah, oh yeah, absolutely yeah, and those guys you know today,

2370
02:24:46.799 --> 02:24:48.920
I will say it to anyone who
asks, like those guys are the kings

2371
02:24:48.920 --> 02:24:52.799
of cast period died like they owned
the doctrine, the right way of doing

2372
02:24:52.799 --> 02:24:58.399
it everything, Like we take our
cues from them. So thank you Brian

2373
02:24:58.440 --> 02:25:01.559
again for com on the show,
coming in studio Mane. We appreciate him.

2374
02:25:01.600 --> 02:25:07.079
Yeah we so we met Brian at
our Christmas part actually and uh yeah,

2375
02:25:07.120 --> 02:25:11.959
you came in with Josh right yeah, yeah, our friend Josh Lee's

2376
02:25:11.079 --> 02:25:18.079
you will have to dig deep,
deep into the teamhouse archives cannon, right,

2377
02:25:18.200 --> 02:25:24.840
yeah, yeah, that's more.
Josh was on with Zach Dude.

2378
02:25:24.959 --> 02:25:31.440
Yeah, okay, yeah, And
Josh's story about building a water canner is

2379
02:25:31.799 --> 02:25:35.639
honestly one of the best stories we've
ever had on this show. The world

2380
02:25:35.760 --> 02:25:41.319
was interesting. Man, he's fascinating, so much fun, but it's actually

2381
02:25:41.319 --> 02:25:46.760
awesome. Yeah, so thank you
everybody, thanks for joining us, and

2382
02:25:46.040 --> 02:25:48.959
we'll see all of you next Friday. Of your night