You're listening to the Mind Over Murder podcast. My name is Bill Thomas.
I'm a writer, consulting, producer, and now podcaster. I am now
trying to use my experience as the brother of a murder victim to help other
victims of violent crime. I'm working on a book on the unsolved Colonial Parkway
murders and I'm the co administrator of the Colonial Parkway Murders Facebook group together with
Kristin Dilly. My name is Kristin Dilly. I'm a writer, a researcher,
a teacher, and a victim's advocate, as well as the social media
manager and co administrator for the Colonial Parkway Murders Facebook page with my partner in
crime, Bill Thomas. Welcome to Mind Ever Murder. I'm Kristin Dilly and
I'm Bill Thomas. Welcome to another episode of Mind Over Murder. And we
would like to start by thanking you all so very much for your enthusiastic response
to the fact that we have a live show. Come. Hey, this
is a first. We've never done this before. Now, to be fair,
we kind of started in the middle of a pandemic, so it's never
really been possible tell the people all about it Kristin Dilly. On April fifteenth,
which does happen to be tax Day for anybody who has not yet filed
their taxes, we are going to be at the Yorktown Public Library and we
will be offering a live Mind Over Murder true crime podcasting event from six to
eight. We will be in their wonderful facility and we will be talking about
the Colonial Parkway murders Alan Wade Wilmer Senior, all of the recent developments in
that case over the last couple of months. You'll get to see the two
of us live and in person. You also get to meet Joyce Call Canada,
sister of Keith Call and a wonderful advocate in her own right, and
ask us questions live which will end up on the air for anybody who is
not able to make it to the York Anny Public Library. We are as
a matter of fact, to be recording this just like we would any other
podcasting event, and we will be able to send that to you as a
weekly pod, So if you cannot make it, never fear you will be
able to hear all of the information that we are presenting on that evening once
it comes to you on your podcast app of choice. You sound more excited
about this than almost anything. I'm really looking forward to a night of public
speaking after I do a whole day's worth of public speaking with high schoolers.
We're going to have a great it's gonna be a lot of fun. We're
going to have a great time. We were asked on one of our social
media pages, mind Over Murder on Facebook or Colonial Parkway Murders on Facebook.
Someone asked us if they needed to provide their questions in advance, which we
do when we're recording, and ask me anything. In this example, I
think we're going to just go for it and take questions right there in the
room. Yeah. I believe that your prior descriptor of it last episode was
free wheeling discussion. Be careful what you ask for. That's probably exactly what
you're going to get. Let's go with free wheeling. That's going to be
great. We're very much appreciative of all the support. People have been very
excited about it. If you don't make it to April fifteenth, then you
have a second shot, different content on May thirteenth, which is four weeks
later, which is Kristin Dilly's forty third birthday and more of a celebration than
text day exactly, and I expect not only a rousing round of applause,
but possibly even a rousing chorus of Happy birthday. Yeah, we could make
plans for that excellent. Oh can I request like a cake also, and
maybe a mariachi band and some sparklers and things like that. Since we're fulfilling
all of my requests now, this means we need a sheet cake that's big
enough for ninety people or more. I don't know where you would find such
a thing, although Publix comes to mind. You no needs that much cake.
That's a disaster in the making, Okay, But I would like it
noted that after a long day of teaching high schoolers, I'm going to spend
the evening with you lovely people. And then the very next day I have
to get up and get breakfast for my AP students will be taking their AP
exam that day. It's going to be a busy forty eight hours. There
is getting breakfast for the AP students tradition. It's something that I do for
my kids, yes, so that they can come down to my room and
grab a muffin or a banana or something before they head upstairs. My colleagues
who also teach AP, we all make goodie bags for our kids where we
give them pens and pencils and little sweet treats and we throw in stickers and
stuff like that. And so they take their goodie bag and they take their
breakfast, and they go upstairs, and then they write essays for four hours
and do good work. We hope, and we surely hope and make their
teachers proud. Oh, I hope that too, very much. This idea,
the sheet cake is looking bad and better because then we could give leftover
cake to the AP students the next day. I should absolutely bring in half
a sheet cake for my AP kids and stay come downstairs and grab cake for
breakfast so you can be as sugared and caffeinated as possible before you sit down
for a four hour test session to answer multiple choice questions and write for essays.
That's a great idea. We should roll with that. Okay, all
right, we'll work on that perfect. Bill. You brought a really interesting
topic to the table today. And as sometimes happens when Bill and I are
choosing topics to talk about, it starts with one or the other of us
sending a link to an article, for example, and saying, oh,
have you read this? And so Bill sent this to me a couple of
days ago, and there wasn't even an ooh have you read this? It
was just a link and I clicked on it. I'm reading through it,
and I'm reading through it and I'm like, this is interesting. I'm not
sure why I care about this until about that last paragraph and it said Bill
Thomas and it was a quote from my partner, and I was like,
oh, this is why I care about this. Okay. So I had
to go read it a second time and then figure out, Okay, this
is why Bill sent this. Jimmy, these are the issues we're getting into.
So Bill tell us the article that kind of kicked this off for you
and introduce what we're talking about today. The article that I sent, which
will include in the show notes here, is from the Boston Globe. It's
written by a reporter named Aiden Ryan. The headline is how blogger Aiden Carney
first name same as the author Carney is the last name, aka turtle Boy,
turned the Karen Reid case into a true crime spectacle. And so we'll
get into the details of the Karen Reid case, which is currently pending up
in Massachusetts. The reporter had reached out to me and asked me if I
was following the case, and I said yes to some extent, and this
blogger and podcaster who sees himself as an advocate named Aiden Carney has really inserted
himself into this Karen Reid case to a level like I've never seen before.
They wanted me to comment on it, and then, interestingly, they also
asked Julie Murray, our friend and fellow sibling advocate Moramari's sister. She also
commented, and interestingly, the comments from us were at the end of the
article, so they gave us the last word, which I thought was nice.
Yeah, I thought so too. I've been following this Karen Reid case
and I have been completely baffled by the extent to which this blogger and podcaster
Aidan Carney turtle boy. One of the things I did say to the reporter,
which didn't end up in the Boston Globe, was what grown man calls
himself turtleboy. Yeah, yeah, that was definitely my very first thought.
There is an origin story there which we can get into a bit. It's
a very string situation. This is a murder case and Karen Reid is charged
with murdering her boyfriend, so it's quite a serious situation. But then this
guy, Turtle Boy, gets involved and is such a bizarre, kind of
obnoxious, self serving presence who claims to be an advocate for Karen Reid.
He's just stirring up all of this. I'm trying to come up with a
non obscene way of putting this soup muck muck. Yeah, let's go with
Mike muckraker. Yeah, he's a muckraker for sure. It's a very strange
story. So I thought it was worth us perhaps spending some time talking about
it. This case is getting a lot of play in Boston and in New
England. It'll be fascinating to see where this all goes, because, as
you just said, this case is much more of a Northeast case than anything
else. Is not familiar with the name Karen Reid, and I have a
feeling there are going to be some of our listeners who are not either.
So let's go ahead and start at the top here with the very basic question
who is Karen Reid and what is she charged with? Again, will include
some articles in our show notes that'll help our listeners come up to speed.
Here are the basics. Karen Reid is a forty three year old woman.
She lives in Mansfield, Massachusetts, which is outside Boston, and she is
currently charged with the murder and it could be dropped down to lesser charges,
but she's charged with the second degree murder and manslaughter while operating under the influence.
And we're talking about seriously under the influence and leaving the scene of an
accident resulting in personal injury or death. And the person that was killed in
this accident, i'll call it is a Boston police officer. His name is
John O'Keefe and he lives in a town outside of Boston. That town is
called Canton, Massachusetts. And so ms Reid is charged with striking Officer O'Keefe
with her SUV while the two of them were really on a bender. This
was a night of bar hopping back in January twenty twenty two. The two
of them were both seriously impaired. I've seen articles about just how much alcohol
was consumed. The two of them are drunk out of their minds and should
not have been operating motor vehicles. Obvious, and she's charged with accidentally they
believe, striking O'Keefe with her SUV and leaving him for dead outside the home
of mutual friends of theirs driving home and again, these people are blind drunk,
so they shouldn't be operating motor vehicles at all. He ends up dying
in a snowbank, and he's not discuss until the following morning, sometime around
six am. He has died as a result of his injuries and freezing to
death on this January night in the middle of a blizzard. What do we
know about Karen Reid's boyfriend, John O'Keeffe, other than the fact that he
is a Boston police officer. What else do we know about their relationship?
If anything, the relationship does not sound like a good one. There is
a lot of conflict between the two and there's accusations of infidelity. Social media
plays a significant part, as do cell phone records, texts and other exchanges
of messages. For whatever reason, likely involving him being involved with another woman,
there is significant friction between the two people, Karen Reid and John O'Keeffe.
They have located texts and other messages that indicate that she is extremely unhappy
be with him. She accuses him of sleeping with another woman. There's a
history going on there that is ugly and personal. It does not sound like
an ideal relationship or a very good situation either way. Does the contentious nature
of their relationship have anything to do with the fact that she has been charged
with murder as opposed to like reckless endangerment or something like that. Because it
could be an accident, As you said, they were both probably pretty drunk.
How do we know that it wasn't just an accident that she accidentally ran
him over when she should not have been driving. What are the mitigating factors
here? There's a couple of things going on. The case has not actually
gone to trial yet, although it's expected to go to trial in April,
so we don't know exactly what the prosecutors are going to allege. It appears
this is being presented as an accident. There are some mitigating actors in that
friends of theirs have indicated that the defendant, Karen Reid, had phone conversations
with, for example, a woman named Carrie Roberts and her husband. Carrie
Roberts' husband was a friend of Officer O'Keeffe's she supposedly had a phone call with
Karen Reid. Karen was described as hysterical and she screamed John's dead and then
hung up the phone, And this would have been about an hour before they
discovered O'Keeffe's body frozen to death in this snowbank. It appears that the defendant
was really upset at the same time, she appears to also have knowledge of
the fact that John O'Keeffe had been killed, and she hung up the phone.
Later on, another witness, Jennifer McCabe, went to the house in
Canton, Massachusetts, to search for O'Keeffe, and Karen Reid supposedly said out
loud she quote wondered out loud whether she could have hit O'Keefe with her car,
and she mentioned that she had a crack in her tail light, and
this ends up being important as well from an evidence perspective. Around six o'clock
in the morning, Reads spots O'Keeffe's body in the snow bank in front of
this residence, and then supposedly she told paramedics who arrived on scene a short
while later, I hit him. I hit him in a way that indicated
that she was upset about this, but you can see how she's saying things
that would appear to confirm the fact that she struck him while driving her SUV
in a highly impaired state. So it sounds though, from reading the stories,
and there have been so many of them, that it is a little
hard to keep track of all of this for somebody who's coming in to this
blind. I have no real cognizance of this story. I was trying frantically
to play a little bit of catch up on this case, and it is
just it is twisty and turning, and there's a lot going on. It
sounds like Karen Reid's legal team has an alternative theory for how Officer O'Keeffe died
that does not involve the accidental striking of Officer O'Keeffe with Karen Reid's car.
Can you get into that alternative theory? I can, and this guy,
Turtle Boy Aiden Carney is one of the biggest proponents of these alternative theories.
The lawyers for Karen Reid are claiming that she's been framed and that O'Keefe was
actually beaten to death inside the home in Canton where his body was found this
is not his home, but the home of a friend of his, a
man named Brian Albert, who's also a Boston Police officer. So there's a
lot of cops in the mix here. They're saying that this is all a
vast conspiracy among a group of law enforcement officers, including Boston Police, and
then they feel that there's a cover up involving the State police as well.
The whole thing gets very complicated and convoluted. They're claiming that this whole thing
is a cover up, that O'Keefe was actually beaten by fellow officers and people
that would supposedly be friends of his, and then the body is dumped outside
Brian Albert's home, which is where he's found the following morning. The whole
thing seems like a real stretch. Yeah, My first question when anybody mentions
a conspiracy is, okay, why it sounds very convoluted, very much a
stretch. Why would these people, some of them his colleagues and arms,
why would they beat Officer O'Keefe to death? And then why make it look
like Karen is the person responsible. I don't understand. Is there any of
that, you know, come up at all? Or well again, I've
not seen any kind of adequate explanation for why they're claiming that Officer Albert and
these other officers killed O'Keefe. The whole thing seems like a real bizarre claim,
and they are going on at some length. This is the defense team
claiming that this conspiracy just extends further and further out, involving Massachusetts State Police
and other law enforcement agencies. The whole thing is just crazy. And of
course in the middle of all this guy Turtle Boy Aiden Carney. He's blogging
about this case. He is issuing podcasts. He has been charged with and
even jailed for witness intimidation in this case. He has gone after people who
are probably going to be called as witnesses for the prosecution. He's made attempts
to discredit them. He's shown up at people's kids' sports events. He's made
threatening remarks. He does these highly profane, really unhinged podcasts and other public
pronouncements. The whole thing is as bizarre as anything I've ever heard of,
which is why the Boston Globe wanted Julie Murray and I to both comment about
this case independently. This seems to fit as a great example of where true
crime podcasting and advocacy and journalism, and I'll put air quotes around both of
those words, as you should. People are saying. This is a classic
example of advocates who are completely out of control, who feel that they can
do or say anything in defense of the person they feel is innocent. That
is Karen read So this whole Turtle Boy debacle, he's been dragged before the
courts several times times and ended up actually incarcerated. He's currently in jail at
the moment. Let's go back just one step further, because again, I'm
behind all of this, whereas you're right on top of it. How does
this guy even learn about Karen Reid's case? Why does he have a vested
interest in her? Did he have such a flaming sense of injustice that he
immediately decided to leap to her rescue? I really would like to know the
backstory here on how Aiden Kearney decided, you know what, that's my case,
the one that I'm going to hang my hat on. How did that
even come about? He's done this several times before. He gets involved in
cases and he issues these very strongly worded pronouncements. He's very big on being
a provocateur on his podcast and in his blogs. I don't know that I'm
really clear at the moment on how they met. The two of them,
Karen Reid and Aiden Carney have had extensive and really pretty unusual levels of communication.
He's now being charged with speaking to her over two hundred times for at
least a forty hour period. They have spoken over and over again. There
are now court documents that have been produced that allege that Karen Reid sent all
sorts of what the court claims would be confidential information about the case to him.
So he's gone all in for her. He says he'll stake his reputation,
which is not very good to start with, on the fact that Karen
Reid is innocent. It's got a lot of very strange twists and turns.
He's got thousands of people following his blog and his podcast. They've actually had
protests outside the court room. There's a freak Karen Reid movement, which he
is of course right there in the middle of. And he has created all
sorts of freak Karen Reid merchandise with of course the Turtle Boy logo on it,
available for sale on his website claims that the proceeds from the sale of
these items are going to go to a fund for Karen Reid's legal defense,
So it's quite something. The whole thing is incredibly odd and off putting.
There's some effort on the part of Reid and Carnie to keep their relationship private,
but it has now come out that they've had this extensive amount of contact,
and they also used private messaging apps including Signal and others, almost like
they were trying to keep their communication a secret, but they've been much less
than successful in that regard. So I'll play devil's advocate for a second,
because I think that they're probably going to be people who have the same question.
She does have the right to speak to just about anybody that she wants
to. Why is it problematic that she's talking to him? Is it the
nature of what she's saying, is it the frequency, or is it all
of the above. Let's just break it down for our listeners to better understand
why it's such a problem that she and he are communicating as often as they
are. The court is now claiming that she has been provided with documents by
the prosecution in order to prepare her defense, and that she has then taken
these documents which should have remained confidential. These would include things that you and
I are very familiar with from the Colonial Parkway murders, crime scene photos,
autopsy photos, other things. And remember there's a victim here, Officer O'Keefe.
These are often featuring him, for instance, pictures of his autopsy or
pictures of his body lying in the snow bank. The prosecution says that,
of course Karen Reid is entitled to the documents and files and photographs, as
are her defense team. But how is this blogger guy with a history of
harassing people and inappropriate behavior, how is he able to access these documents.
I do agree with your point, kristin that Karen Reid has every right to
talk to anybody that she wants to in preparing a vigorous defense for herself.
But is she crossing a line when she's allowing people who are not partied to
this lawsuit access to crime scene photos and autopsy photos and all sorts of additional
information, which is really peeling back the layers into John O'Keefe's life in a
way that might not really be fair to him. As a crime victim.
You're listening to Mind over Murder. We'll be right back after this word from
our sponsors, We're back here at Mind over Murder. My biggest concern,
as it relates to all of us podcasters' advocates, ethics and true crime,
is when you have someone like Aiden Carney. I'm sorry, I just cannot
call him turtle boy. That is patently ridiculous. He makes the rest of
us look bad. He is the sort of person that I'm picturing when the
FBI is sitting there bringing their hands about the fact that you and I have
a podcast, I think that they're worried we're going to do the same thing
he is. I think they're worried that we're going to insert ourselves in appropriately,
that we're going to contaminate jury pools, that we are going to be
sharing information that should not be shared. I picture them looking at us and
seeing us doing the same thing that this guy is doing. I get that
that's a I think that's a concern, But I think when the FBI is
getting its blood pressure up about the fact that Bill Thomas has a podcast,
oh no, I pictured them thinking that you're going to go is off the
rails. As this guy has gone, which isn't true. Of course,
you're not going to go off the rails like this guy. I bet that's
one of the concerns that they have. Do you feel like that's a fair
assessment or am I maybe not being polite enough to the FBI on this point.
Heaven forbid for me to ever defend the FBI, so I probably won't.
But Aiden Carney has no role here except the one he inserted himself into.
I guess at my own defense, I haven't threatened witnesses. I haven't
attended potential witnesses sporting events and yelled at them. I haven't made threats.
I haven't been jailed for witness intimidation and other unsafe reactivities. So I get
the fact that the FBI. And Hello to our friends at FBI headquarters to
listen to our podcast. Hello, good afternoon, good evening. I think
you're joining us. Thank you. We appreciate your support. Challenge the FBI.
If they think I've said something that's incorrect, tell me what it is
and I'll correct it. But they don't so far, they haven't. Yeah,
they're not happy about the fact that we have a podcast called mind over
murder, and we talk about the Colonial Parkway murders in other cases, but
I don't think we've approached the level of vitriol and bad behavior that we're seeing
here with Aiden Carney. For what it's worth, by the way, speaking
of just a character or lack thereof, Carney's currently in jail actually for being
charged with assault and battery by a woman that he was dating. So he's
got a bit of a history here as being a hot head and someone that
is often extremely abusive towards people with whom he disagrees. I don't think anything
like that is happening here in the Colonial Parkway murders. Some of his behavior
is quite disturbing, and I think that law enforcement and the prosecutors are standing
on pretty firm ground in terms of the things that he's done and said are
crossing a line. I'm really curious why he thinks that's actually going to get
him answers in what universe is that behavior going to get you anything other than
what it is currently getting you, which is jail time and potential legal trouble.
I've never understood people who behave that erratically with that much. I like
your word of vitriol from a couple of minutes ago. I don't understand people
who behave in that way. That is not going to get you anything.
Unless he thinks that having dozens and dozens of people outside the courtroom wearing free
Karen Reid shirts and holding up signs to show support for her is somehow when
from his lie, I guess from a pr standpoint, if you're him,
maybe it is. This is very interesting, So why ultimately did the Boston
Globe end up reaching out to you and Julie Murray. A number of experts
that they interview. These are college professors and other people that study social media,
have pointed out that they think that this Aiden Carney example in the Karen
Reid trial is a classic example of when true crime media goes off the rails.
Aiden Carney's behavior troubles these experts because they say that this is an example
of when true crime media begins to be counterproductive and actually ends up damaging the
presentation of information that would allow for a fair and impartial jury to arrive at
a decision in this Karen Reid trial, which is upcoming next month, and
they see this as an example of true crime media gone bad. And of
course we know this is very much of interest and of moment, because there
have been so many examples recently of times when colleagues, ones that we know
and ones that we are only just peripherally aware of, have gone off the
rails in their own way and has led to some irresponsible reporting and some very
upsetting moments for all of us in the true crime space. I'm glad that
they were able to reach out to you when, ultimately, because I had
no idea that you had done this article until you sent it to me and
it was in print, when did this person reach out to you? And
what was your conversation with them? We actually talk quite a bit on background
the reporter aiden Ryan, and I explain what that means for anybody who doesn't
know. On background is when you are discussing something with a media person and
you want to speak plainly but not be quoted as saying such. You might
also hear off the record or something like that. But that's what background is
on now. One of the things that a number of reporters have said to
me over the years in writing about the Colonial Parkway murders and covering the case
is that I've been doing this a long time, and I did this professionally
before I got involved in the advocacy role that you and I have hopefully fulfilled
in the Colonial Parkway murders, specifically for my sister Kathy. I tend to
be pretty message disciplined. Now. I will speak plainly with reporters because I
think it's important that they have a good understanding of what's happened, for example,
on the Colonial Parkway murders. At the same time, I want to
think carefully and craft my words so that when I do go on the record,
that is, they may use quotes and they may say what so and
so actually said, I want to be careful that what I'm saying is accurate
and thoughtful and non distracting. We ended up talking several weeks before this article
ran, and I actually started to think that maybe they aren't going with the
story because I never heard anything from the reporter. But then one day the
reporters sent me a note with a link, and this story was contained and
Julie Murray and I were given the last word in the article. I'll actually
read you what I said. Yes, please let me just set this up
A little bit previous paragraph some other families who've had brushes with viral true crime
said they are watching the read case closely, deeply aware of the effect that
the scrutiny can have on people who are still mourning a loved one. Quote.
There should be a serious, fact based investigation into the circumstances of how
this man died, said Bill Thomas, whose sister Kathy Thomas, was killed
in the Colonial Parkway murders in Virginia nearly forty years ago. The case has
been widely covered by news organizations, on TV and in true crime podcasts.
And then back to a quote quote, I'm not big on censorship at all,
but I can't help but think, man, the world would be a
better place if this guy would put a sock in it. Thomas added,
I'm still shocked that people buy this crap. Nice. I'm actually very interested
before you get to Julia's quote, and I do want you to get to
it. Did you tell him that you yourself were a true crime podcast.
Yeah, he knew that. He knew that, Okay. No, I
was just curious why he didn't put no, that's that's his choice. Okay.
I was curious why he didn't acknowledge that you yourself are one. It's
interesting because Julie Murray comes up next. And remember Julie is also doing a
true crime podcast. Now, yes, Now, he and I had spent
a good deal of time on background. He had listened to Mind Over Murder,
which is how they found out about us, You and me. Oh
okay, and so he knew I was a true crime podcaster with you,
and that we did a true crime podcast together. And by the time I
spoke with him, he had definitely listened to Mind Over Murders, so he
knows all about us. But in their descriptor they didn't end up going with
that. Now, Julie Murray, who's recently added a true crime podcast to
her to do list. She's calling her new podcast, which I think she's
done about eight episodes, called Media Pressure, which is quite well done,
and she's offering a lot of insight for her followers. So she wears the
podcast hat now too. The story continues. Julie Murray, whose sister Maura
Marty disappeared in New Hampshire twenty years ago, said true crime writers should be
more empathetic when covering cases. Quote, it's not like I can type some
stuff on the internet like turtle Boy, closed my laptop and go get dinner.
Murray said, I carry this with me everywhere I go. And that's
actually the end of the story. So Aiden, Ryan from the Globe kind
of gave us the last word. So it's interesting that advocates like you and
me and like Julie Murray have actually found that podcasting can be a very good
mechanism for us to be able to talk about the case and talk about these
issues in the true crime space. I think it's actually a good platform for
us to have these discussions. At the same time, I can't help but
look at what this guy, Aiden Carney has done, and I think to
myself, I don't think this is really helpful. No, definitely not.
If you go to a place like Crime Con or the True Crime Podcast Fest
or any other true crime forward event, you're going to need a lot of
podcasters. And there are more of us who are attempting to do good,
solid, ethical work than there are people like Aiden Carney. Turn Boys such
a ridiculous name. I'm so sorry, and I'm glad that there are more
of us than there are of him. But it is the ones like him,
the bad apples that sort of spoil the whole entire barrel. And that
is why it is so important for people like us and Julie to speak out
and say, hey, this is not ourmo this is not what we do
because this is not appropriate and we know it's not appropriate. Totally agreed.
And at the same time, when experts, like a number of the academics
that were quoted in some of these articles, they've highlighted the fact that what
this guy is doing, Aiden Carney, is actually a classic example of what
not to do, and that this, in their opinion, is not helping
Karen read It isn't helping move justice forward either. As we were saying,
there's a tragedy here, which is a terrible thing happened that night and John
O'Keefe ended up deadness Snowbank as a result. Now he's shown exceptionally poor judgment
by drinking to great excess, as has his girlfriend Karen Reid. I think
this case needs to be treated very seriously. As I said in the Globe,
the way that Aden Carney is going about this, with this self centered,
sensationalistic, profane, endlessly self promotional approach, I don't think that's a
way to advocate on someone's behalf. He might feel that all's fair if this
gets Karen Reid found innocent or gets her to a reduced sentence or whatever,
maybe that's a win from his perspective. But it sure doesn't seem that way
to me. No, it does not seem that way to me either.
It is going to be very interesting to see how this shakes out. Karen
Reid is due to go to trial when April sixteenth, I believe, is
the latest state, and as we hear more about that case, we will
share more of it with our listeners. Yeah, we'll keep you posted.
It'll be very interesting to see where this all goes. Boy, they've thrown
up a lot of dust in this case and discredited a lot of people are
tried to So it'll be very interesting to see whether the prosecution can move forward
with a clean presentation of what they see as the facts, and the defense
team has just gone hog wilde claiming all sorts of bizarre conspiracy theories. I
don't know if those things are going to hold up in court or not.
Yeah, I was reading some of the articles that you sent me earlier,
and I my head was just spinning at how much they are throwing against the
wall to see if it will stick. There is so much to unpack,
but we will include links to all of those in our show notes, and
as more information becomes available on the Karen Reid trial, we will keep you
all updated as well. Any final thoughts from you, mister Thomas, I
think I'm not going to buy a free care and read t shirt. I
don't think I will either, mainly because I do not want to give my
money to turtle Boy. Now you find yourself calling him by his chosen name,
I can't bring myself to be snarky about it, although I really want
to be, Oh, feel free, I don't want. I don't want
our listeners to think that I have anything less than a sweet Southern lady's disposition.
But yeah, the snark is right there under the surface. It's bubbling
up. I think they've already figured that out. Although you've gotten off a
couple of bless your hearts on different episodes of Mind of a Murder, I
think so. And I know I've been salty at the FBI the last couple
of episodes, but it's we're all just out here trying to make it.
It's hard enough without having the FBI decide that they're going to blacklist you.
We're all just trying to make it through twenty twenty four and it's been a
humdinger of a year so far. I don't know about you, Bill,
but I don't feel like I've slept proper rely since January eighth. Conversation for
another time. Absolutely, we very much look forward to seeing all of you
at our live show on April fifteenth. Please do make sure that you put
that on your calendar. It's the same day as Tax Day. Was that
on purpose? Pill or was that just what they had available to us?
Was what they had available? And then don't forget May thirteenth, which is
also Kristin Dilly's birthday. And then of course you will be able to see
us at Crime Con and we have more interesting information coming out about that here
in the next couple of weeks, So stay tuned, exciting news, stay
tuned as they say that is going to do it for this episode of Mind
Over Murder. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next time.
Mind Over Murder is a production of Absolute Zero and Another Dog Productions.
Our executive producers are Bill Thomas and Kristin Dilley. Our logo art is by
Pamela Arnois. Our theme music is by Kevin McLeod. Mind Over Murder is
distributed in partnership with cral Space Media. You can follow us on Facebook,
Twitter, or Instagram. You can also follow our page on the Colonial Parkway
Murders on Facebook, and finally, you can follow Bill Thomas on Twitter at
Bill Thomas. Five six. Thank you for listening to mind Over Murder.