You're listening to the Paranormal UK Radio Network, the best in paranormal talk radio
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Network. Hello, is that the famous Astronova, Sir Patrick Wall It is
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The new normally dis comentitiously astronomosis a huge black hole. Welcome to Twin Souls.
Twin Souls has brought to you an association with a poun m, the
UK Radio Network. Your host Philip can sella. Now, ladies and gentlemen,
we have an amazing guest on our show to day, none other than
Chris Evers. And Chris Evers is the creator OFLM Outer Limits Magazine, a
wonderful online magazine which pulls to and brings together all researchers authors within the UFO
Department of Study. Not only that, but Chris also organizes conferences, amazing
conferences and he's actually written a book. His first book called The Shape of
Things to Come from Elsewhere, and I thought that title really was very catchy.
And the book also has a forward by Peter Robbins, eupologist from the
United States of America. And I've got to say before we get into finding
all about Chris and what got him involved in UFOs, and you know the
conferences in his magazine and as well as the book, but reading this book,
it's really very different because one of the things I found was that it's
very black and white. It's very to the point and deals with the actual
shapes of UFOs, which is very interesting and poses many questions that I'm sure
we'll get to within interviews. So Hello, Chris, how are you,
Hi? Phil thank you very much for the invitation to come on you Sure
twin Souls. It's nice once again to be on the Paranormal UK Radio network.
As you know, I used Robert Sure along with Philip Mantle a couple
of years ago now, and it's nice to be to be on the show
with you and to speak to your face to face as it were. Yeah,
well, from this end of the recording, it certainly is lovely but
it's so fascinating. I mean, your whole involvement within the subject of UFO
research and also the dedication that you've put within that field of research, and
also bringing together other key elements to this, not just on a theoretical level,
but also reaching out to you know, amazing minds from across the world
who is all looking into this subject. So tell us, Chris, what
was it that got you involved in UFO's in the first place, Because everyone
has a story or an experience that they can recount with regards to what got
them there. Absolutely, I think everybody that has come into this subject or
should we say maybe and this is complete guests Off the top of my head,
I do not have actual figures, but I would say at least ninety
nine percent of people that'm involved with UFO investigations, research studies, whatever you
want to tell them, it as I've had some kind of experience where they've
seen a strange event or an incident, or a strange light or even a
craft of some description. You know, they've seen those and it's dragged them
down the rabbit hole as we now call it, you know, into youuthology.
Well, I'm very much the same man began in February nineteen seventy four,
so I'm just over fifty years now of looking at this subject. I
haven't always been up front, you know, a well known face within the
subject. But I think that has actually helped me just to study what I
want to study, to look at what I want to look at, and
it's helped me to keep balanced view hopefully, you know, I believe I've
got a balance for you anyway. But you know, and my involvement in
the subject is explained, you know, in the book, which I'm sure
you know I got involved. I'm sure we'll discuss that in a few minutes.
M. Yes, And you know, I do agree with you.
I think, you know, I wouldn't say that you're you know, unassuming.
I think the work that you've done has been phenomenal. And it's normally
those individuals who in the background that get very little credit. But actually without
those people, none of this will work. So you know, you have
to be credited for the huge amount of work and the effort that you've pulled
into this and of course supplemented to a large degree a lot of your time
and resources. And you know, so you know, a lot of people
out there have to thank you very much for what you've brought to the table
and also the creation of O. L. M. Outer Limits magazine,
which also fuels into the conference that you organize. But I will also say
here, Chris, which is interesting. I know that there's a lot of
youupologists researchers out there who don't always see eye to I, who are not
always on the same page with regards to what they think the phenomena may represent.
But what's truly intriguing is that your approach is very grounded. I think
you've taken this to a level that should have been taken to because we all
hear about these different UFOs that are seen reported now UAPs, the acronym of
which has changed. You know. They come in varied sizes, very dimensions,
shapes, EPHN, triangular, circular, doughnut shaped, you name it,
we've had them. So I think that your book here actually has taken
a stance that no other research has really looked into. So you know,
how did this all come about for you? Well, as I mentioned a
moment ago, I was involved really nineteen seventy four after my own siting here
in Hull in East Yorkshire, and again that is described in the book How
I got involved in that, So I'm not going to dwell on that for
too long. But I started reading the publications that were around at that time,
books by Major Donald Keyhole. Everything seemed to come from America unless it
was something to do with the warm inster thing, Arthur sugar Wood, etc.
So I read his books. I read Donald Keyhoe's books, and I
read read whatever I could from wherever I could. Now, being a fourteen
year old lad, I didn't have the money to go out and buy brand
new publications. So thankfully I joined the local library, the local lending library
here in Hull, and I think I went through about every single book on
the unexplained and you know, the phenomena that they had, you know,
and they knew what I was coming for as soon as I went in really,
to be quite honest with you. Yeah, So it went from that.
I had an avid interest. I was. I got married young sixteen,
actually my first marriage, and I was together with that lady for about
thirteen fourteen years, and I left that one and I got back involved in
the subject again, you know, and basically I ended up setting up the
whole UFO Society back in the mid nineteen nineties, and so my interest was
always there. I always had actually quite an avid interest in the subject,
and people come in to meet just to talk to me, people like Paul
Sinclair when he first started, you know, having mysterious events in Bridlington,
when he moved from West Yorkshire to Bridlington. He rang me up and I
would spend hours talking on the phone with him. I sent him some publications
that I'd done at the time, which are paper based publications, very similar
to what Limitsed magazine, just getting information out to people who were interested.
But as I say, back in those days it was paper based. The
Internet or the computers weren't powerful enough to actually make them as PDFs, which
I do now, and I just send them out to people, you know,
to subscribe. So anyway, people like Paul Sinclaire came, you know,
came and spoke with me a little bit, and people like Graham Batel,
who were many British uthologists will know and remember Russ Callahan, people like
Tony Dodd, you know, Malcolm Robinson. I've first spoke with Malcolm back
in the nineteen nineties. So I've always kind of been there within the subject,
but just slightly in the background. Now, back in the early naughties,
the early two thousand I dropped out of the subject once again, really
because my mum was here and she actually eventually passed away with cancer. So
kept myself to myself, just carried on reading information and eventually got up to
the point where back again in twenty fourteen, I believe it was, I
got interested in the subject once again and I started reading up on the reports
I'd missed out of over the last ten or so previous years, and I
just found really that the subject had changed, the rabbit hole had got a
bit deeper and a bit wider, you know. And anyway, that is
part of what I did, and part of that I saw there was a
little corner for perhaps another PDF based UFO publication or anything. Really, the
idea behind our Limits magazine was that it would be anything to do with the
paranormal ghosts UFOs, you know who parts which some people do forget about sometimes,
you know, out of place artifact, that kind of thing. And
you know, the one thing I set out to do with OLM was not
to put my opinion across. I do have opinions on subjects, but I
don't put them across and I don't share them, you know, as perhaps
as much as I should do, you know. So yeah, that was
the reasoning behind OLM. And along with that, I thought, well,
perhaps I can do a conference in the whole area and bring people across the
hole, such as yourself and your brother, you know, and it just
keep the interest going locally, because my idea is well, one of the
taglines that I use in OLM is being formed, and that is what I
tried to do, and that is what I tried to do with the publication,
and that's what I tried to do with the book. And you know,
it's interesting because you've connected with a lot of the top names within yourthology.
I mean, you're good friends with UFO Royalty, Philip Mental, Oh
yes, yes, And I did recall Philip telling me once when he was
with Graham bird Sel and you know, they were setting up this magazine and
it was all to do with this printing of this magazine and the problems they
had with it. So going back into the eighties most definitely. I mean
I remembered when I was a kid and I would go to the library because
we didn't have much money. Then I don't think any kid really had much
money. You were lucky if you've got fifty p a week, you know.
But that's where I would look across the shelves to see what UFO titles
they had, and to be honest with you, there weren't that many of
them. I remember the one on Roswell, UFO Crash and a few others.
But I would sit in the library every Saturday doing a project on them.
And that was when I was, you know, round about the age
of thirteen going on to fourteen, and my grandmother bought me my very first
book, The Heinechqufo Reporter. I remembered I didn't understand a word of the
paperback, but I was drawn to the cover with a flying saucer on the
front with clouds behind it. So going back to your creation of the Outer
Limits magazine, you know, that's very interesting because now everything is computer based,
and you know, within publications now it is all PDF files and you
download information, which is the way that things are going. And I know
that author and film writer David Sapastin of Cocoon, he is a dear friend.
He said to us that we would become basically content providers. So you
tell us a little bit about you know, with regards to going back all
those years, I mean you had you were connected with beufora as well too,
and with the likes of Gary Anthony, and of course the interest of
the magazines came your way because you were thinking to yourself, well, you
know I can do that, not so much paper based because that was much
more expensive back in the day. But you know, your your magazine is
really very informative, and I know that I've been graced by having a number
of articles published in there where time permits. But you know it has got
a growing base, hasn't it with regards to your magazine and pushing it out
there to be informed is what it's all about. So you know that's very
interesting, and I always wondered whether or not you actually with all the knowledge,
all the information that you have, that you would set about bringing a
book out. You've also had, you know, big names coming to the
conference. You've also connected with all those big names in the past as well.
But you know, although you've got the idea for this, your book,
the shape of things to come from that little bit of a niche also
with regards to the shape of them. You know, I wanted to ask
you, and as we're getting into the subject of yourphology here with your ideas,
your opinions, which are important. I mean, do you believe that
we are dealing with a multitude of intelligences or do you believe that, perhaps
Chris, that we're dealing with one single phenomena that's operating with different vigors like
us as human beings have different shaped crafts, you know, aircraft with vehicles,
cars, by set happen thing. What's your opinion on that? What
do you think? Well, I actually believe that we are being visited by
many, many different species, I'll put it that way, of extraterrestrial visitors
lifeever you want to call them. Now, the reason I say that is
somebody wants estimating and I forget the gentleman's name now, it could have been
Enrico Fermi, But I believe somebody estimated that the galaxy, the full galaxy,
the universe, whatever you want to call everything that's out there. They
were estimated that there was something like three hundred billion I think it was stars
out there. Yeah. Now when we take those the same individual estimated that
each one of those stars will have at least one planet circling around it.
Now, if we take that, that's a hell of a lot of planets
in the galaxy or the universe, whatever you want to call it, you
know. So my answer is, if we can have life on one planet,
surely we can have life on other many other planets. We're not something
odd, you know, although when you look at how we treat each other,
you know, you'd think that we are quite odd, you know,
as a species. To be honest with you, anyway, So that is
what my belief is. Somebody once called me, I think it was last
October actually, and it was actually an interview with Paul Sinclair, and he
actually called me an old school uthologist. Now I actually sat, I actually
sat and thought, what does he mean by your school youthologists? Now I
view that as me being a little bit and bolts about the subject. I
believe that whatever they these visitors are using to travel to UDS must have some
kind of fantastic advanced technology which enables them to travel the distances that they do.
After all, let's be honest, you know, serious. The nearest
star towards I believe it is, is four light years away, So you
know, that's a hell of a distance. So if we have been visited
by and I've heard numbers, some suggesting as many as different as as fifty
seven different species or sixty seven different species, excuse me, I've aid those
kind of numbers. So you know, if they are visiting as those kind
of numbers or more or less, it doesn't I'm not really bothered. They
must have some kind of device which they're using to travel that distance. Now
this begs the question, you know, do they all come from the same
into galactic you know, a motor plant? Surely no, Surely if these
creatures, these visitors were technically in advance of us, which let's be honest,
they must be. If they're traveling those kind of distances in craft that
we can only dream about, you know, then they must be far,
far, far far more technically advanced than we are. You know, UFO
Royalty. You know that the Prince Philip uses a bit of Philip Mantle.
If you're listening, I hope you enjoyed that. Yeah, I Philip uses
a bit of an analogy that you know, if you took a modern TV,
smart TV and he dropped it in an ant's nest, the ants would
crawl all over it in this case where the ants human race are the ants
in this part, so they would climb. I'm all over that TV.
That could do so for a million years, but they never get to know
exactly what it does, how it works, and what you can actually,
you know, achieve about using that TV. So I feel that right now
where we are with technology, we are kind of in the ants nest situation.
Yes, And I agree with you there because we think like humans,
and yet these extraterrestrials as they know, may be far in advance and think
very differently from us on an evolutionary scale. And I did smile because I
do agree with you that as a species, you know, we haven't got
anything right, and this is why we've really made no way forward in terms
of progression technologically. It is interesting, I think also with regards to the
amount of star systems that are able to support habitable life for intelligences far beyond
our dreams, perhaps some of them in the early stages of development. And
I've always found that fast within its symmetry. So I agree with you.
I believe that this planet is home or perhaps a kind of like a passing
mark for these intelligences that may be operating in different systems of reality. And
it's interesting. I think, you know when you say nuts and bolts,
well, you know, we hear stories of crushed UFOs now UAPs, and
I have no doubt whatsoever that this secret military and industrial complex have access to
that material, along with biological bodies that are probably stored on ice. So
that's very interesting. So I agree with you that they you know, we
always consider that they may have done it this way, but we're looking at
in terms of our propulsion, in terms of our resources, our technology,
which may be very very different from where they have come from and how they
have evolved. And I think that's very fascinating, and I want to ask
a question. I really want to ask this question of you. I mean,
I know that you know Prince Philip UFO Royalty as you as you labeled
him. We know he's UFO Royalty and he's always stated that this issue within
the Pentagon, with David Grush and also the others that are trying very hard
to bring about disclosure, you have to give it to them because they're not
there just for a tea party. They are dedicated within their convictions of what
they believe that we have these crashed objects with these biological entities, and that
you know this fastened. Philip has always said, no, it'll end up
in tears, and I agree with him because there never seems to be any
point of disclosure because of the enormous complications and secrecy. What's your thoughts on
that, Chris, Well, my thoughts on disclosure. Well, let's talk
about David Grusfairs. Yes, I'm not disputing anything that the gentleman has done,
are what you said or anything. What I am disputing is the fact
that he personally has not witnessed what he's claiming understood, so that you know,
if people have come to him. I mean I could come to you,
phil and I could say, oh, I've just come up on the
lottery of one a million pound, but I would have to show you that.
I would have to give you the evidence that I've done that. Now,
one of the problems we've got with disclosure. I mean, let's just
go back a minute first, just to twenty seventeen. Seventeenth of December twenty
seventeen, the New York Times article by I've got a name Keen anyway,
Leslie Kean, Yeah, Ralph Bloomington tal and Leslie Kean. What a fantastic
article. It's in so many ways. The Pentagon have admitted that admitted right
that we have lied to you that in the article they point out there is
something beyond yous that we do not understand. That for me was disclosure.
That was disclosure. Now I'll bring it forward now to the to the recent
release of the information in the Arrow Report, which came out about week or
so ago. We do not need the United States to tell us, yes,
we admitted, we admitted that we've lied. We know the plaid,
you know, we don't need them to come forward and admit anything. There
is more than enough evidence around the world that something strange is going on,
and these different shapes of crafts, these different vehicles you know, that have
been seen in the skies of the planet and underwater. You know for millennire
I'm talking thousands of years. We know that these things have gone on.
We don't need the USA to take the lead. Why your people are waiting
for America to do that? You know the problem with the Arrow Report is
that it's the police in this case, the Pentagon, etc. Police in
themselves. They would really expect they would come out after nearly eighty years and
say, oh, I'm sorry, guys, we've lied. You know,
all they've done is another Project Saucer, another Project Sign, another Project Grudge,
and another Project blue Book. Nothing has changed. They're still trying to
control the narrative because there are still people there in you know, in the
United States, in the Pentagon who believe that that the people of the planet
cannot accept the truth. Well, come on, we're not We're not all
backwards. You know this isn't you know, you know, it's not three
sets. If over ad you know what I'm saying, We'll live in twenty
twenty four. Ad Man can't has advanced enough to understand that there must be
some kind of intelligent life out there. Yes, and that's some kind of
intelligent life is visiting the planet. Yes, yep, and absolutely I agree
with you wholeheartedly there because I remembered as a kid, you know, I
you know, we always used to go off down to the cinema uster Costa
or but about fifty p I think to get into the cinema then, and
I remember there was a film, not just et but one called Hangar eighteen,
and I remembered you you know the film. I think we all we
all know the film, and that kind of scared me, you know,
thinking that the government had this secret UFO and a hangar and obviously, you
know, relaying the film off of actual events and facts that could well have
happened. And I agree also with you that we don't need to be told
by the Americans that you are a reality, because we have had our own
British Ministry of Defense that have had a keen interest in it, as well
as other areas around the globe. Now what's interesting is this with regards to
all of these varied factions of intelligence, they all seem to generate and connect
with the United States, which you know most people see as a very supreme
culture in terms of acceleration. So I believe that there is a faction or
an organization that reports directly to the States in certain areas of the country when
these things come into force. And I do also know, as you will
well do, that there are these other secret corporate organizations that go in very
quickly if a UFO or UP has been grounded. And it's interesting I've always
thought about this in my brother as well, thought very long and hard about
this about why these crafts seem to crash in and in the majority of cases
is in remote areas, which is very interesting, now, you know,
what's your theory on that. Do you believe or think that perhaps these intelligences
are in some way wanting for us to try and father them out and work
their technology out to escalate our species. What's your thoughts about that, because
a lot of the crashes do appear to have occurred in remote you know areas
well. We've had a report which I've seen today, which will be going
in the next issue of or Limits magazine, which is available from first of
April, about an alleged crash recovery in the north of England in the late
nineteen eighties. Now, obviously the mod have come out and said, now
nothing beyond this, you know, But there's actually an iranking paratrooper who actually
said, oh, hang on a minute, yes there is something behind this.
And apparently the crash was taken away, but apparent some I'll call them
individuals left the crash crash scene, and apparently the set of paratroopers, this
special unit actually went off to try to capture them or track them down anyway.
What the outcome of all that is, I don't know because I've not
read the full report yet. I will read that when I put it in
the magazine. But yeah, so stay tuned for that one. But if
my, if these individuals, these visitors are using I'll call them man made
devices for the sake of a better word. If they are using man made
devices, it doesn't matter what you make. You know, you can make
a TV. It can feel. You can make a typewriter it can feel.
So these devices if they have traveled many, many many miles, you
know, across the universe, the galaxy, or you know, even if
the boneages come from a serious or Zeta reticular, you know they've actually come
still come quite a distance. Things and parts can wear out. I mean,
man knee joints are wearing out. So you know, please help me,
I understand. You know. It's interesting because and there is also the
hypothesis that they are tracked, and that is absolutely confirmed that the military know
when these UFOs UAPs come into our Earth orbit, they can track them.
This is what makes me laugh about. You know, they've got these amazing
telescopes that can just actually take clear pictures of other star systems but when it
comes to our very own moon, we don't get very clear images there,
and that's another story entirely. So we can see that there are some kind
of cover up absolutely totally there to not inform the public of what's really going
on. And I believe that it's possible that the huge complexity of this will
be really hard for a lot of the public to digest because we have ostensibly
been programmed by a system that's told us UFOs don't exist, and other areas
of the paranormal are just all here, so it's all a over bowld rubbish.
Now, what's really incredible and bizarre is that we have an admittance by
the system, almost like a drip feed way, to say, well,
we may not have been honest there. Now, this is huge within its
symmetry, Chris, because this opens up a can off worms with regards to
the reality of the phenomena. And you know, think about all those people
who have themselves had these experiences, been mocked and jeered at in the streets
and especially in the media cartel. Can you imagine how many of these organizations
will be sued by these individuals for perhaps definition of character or that you know,
that they've been live to. I think this opens up huge can what's
your thoughts on that. I completely agree with that statement, to be quite
honest with you, Yes, you know this is why I have an interest
to some extent in the older reports, some of which I mentioned in the
book. I mean, for example, in the book, I put a
story in I think it's from twelve to fifteen AD where there's an execution about
to take place in Japan, when I'm presuming this was a daytime execution,
because I can't see the point of you know, this execution taking place when
the sugun or the emperor or whoever was behind it wants to put his authority
across to the individuals in the area that he controlled. So I'm presuming it
was a daytime execution. Where Upon this priest who was about to lose his
life and the many others that were there, actually witnessed a silver, round
object in the sky. They said it was unlike So imagine the size of
the moon. You know, I know we see it at different distances,
but just imagine the size of the moon flying in the sky above your head
in twelve fifteen What was that? Where did it come from? Was it
something that you know, the physicists of use to get here, or was
it something that was natural? Well, it can't be natural, and certainly
not a balloon, because the Mongolfier brothers didn't actually perfect or air balloon until
the seventeen seventies, So you know, what the hell was it? But
the outcome of this was that this priest was spared his life because they viewed
this as a message from the gods. This thing was flying in the sky.
What we tend to do We look at this problem, this subject,
or we look at it through the eyes of the technology that we have at
the time. So today we'll look at it, you know, a little
bit more advanced than perhaps they did in twelve fifteen. We can go back
to again. I mentioned it in the book and the Battle of I think
it was something called Malvan Bridge in Rome where Emperor Constantine, who had had
a vision of the previous night of he claims he had a vision of Christ
claiming that if he went to battle under the cross or a psalm, that
he was given anyway that he would win the battle, had become the emperor
and during the battle something was seen in the sky. Now, whether or
not it's just completely all that is myth, you know. But again people
will have witnessed that. We can come forward to nineteen fifty two, I
think it was. We have a football game taking place in Florence, in
Italy between two local teams who were quite you know, quite what's the word.
All he was contentious with each other anyway, doing this particular game,
normal game of football soccer, and these two teams. Nothing, nothing was
really going on in the game. It was a normal football game up until
our time. Teams went off, had a bit of refreshment, come back
on more or less. Right from the very beginning, devices were seen over
the stadium. Now these devices were witnessed by ten thousand people. Again,
we don't need America to tell us these things are going on. We have
witnesses globally who see these things on a regular basis, you know. So
we are being visited by some kind of unknowns, and I mean, basically,
that's that's where what I feel about that. You know, it's interesting
because your book The Shape of Things to Come from Elsewhere does specify a lot
of really very interesting cases that some of which I didn't even hear about.
And one wonders whether or not these intelligences, you know, if they're actually
on our planet they're not actually coming from another star system, or if they
have they've been here for a very long time, because as you said,
with regards to these cases that happened, you know, centuries ago, it
tells us that they're they're very much interested in us as human beings, but
don't want to be a part of our culture or connect in with us.
They've always remained separate from us, and this overall mystery. I love the
way that you quite rightfully put very very important and very very much well said
in terms of like the priests that were spared because of the UFO that had
been seen as a sign from God, and now going forward to all this
time, people are now confusing the issue of UFOs UAPs with back engineer technology
because we have reached a level where we're able to, you know, become
airborne with new technology, and this is what creates this Merkin and I feel
that it's possible that the intelligence behind all of this knows this and knows that
it's able to cover itself in some kind of smoke screen, so it will
never be revealed as such. So I think that's very important, you know,
I never really thought about it that way in terms of the past.
But it's really just concerting to know that the intelligence has been here for a
very long time, isn't it. But I also feel that if we are
being visited by many different species, it's not you call it an intelligence.
Yes, it must be an intelligence, but there must be many different intelligences
who were sending these different devices to us. I mean, when we compare
the shape of things to come from elsewhere, they appeared different now to what
they were like in eighteen nineties. So they have advanced, you know,
I think they actually made a specific craft for a specific job. I think
the device which was used to abduct Calvin Parker and Charlie Dixon was specific for
that job. I think, you know, other devices which they've used are
specific for that for the jobs at the time. We do know that in
the eighteen nineties, excuse me, they were quite large cigar shaped objects,
devices, vehicles, whatever you want to call them, flying in the skies
of New Zealand. They then advanced and went to Australia, They came up
through Europe, then across to America. But these were all before these kind
of devices became popular with mankind and when mankind started to create them himself.
You know, it reminds me of the food Fighters, and of course the
experience that me and Ronnie as twins had thirteen with our maternal grandmother with the
sphere, the football shaped silver sphere that came over to the garden and over
our grandmother's head in broad daylight. And you know, although at that time
we didn't know what it was, we knew it was not from here,
but from elsewhere, if I can use that heading there. But our grandmother
just told us that the fairies had come to take a closer look at us.
She was covering it, I think, so that we won't be alarmed,
and she didn't seem at all fas. But I do think back to
the World War two when the Foo fighters were seen. I mean, this
object wasn't glowing, it was just silver, but I'm sure that they perhaps
glow in the dark, and that my brother always assumed was some kind of
eye. So when you talk about some kind of reconnaissance craft or some kind
of exploratory craft that's not that doesn't have any biological form in it. That
certainly comes across and you know what's really strange here. I remembered I used
to watch The six Million Dollar Man. I mean, we're all used to
watch, you know, Wonder Woman six months on. And one of the
things that used to say is my mum told me about that film. Yeah,
sorry, mate. It was one of the programs I would never watch
when I was a kid. I apologize you no, but there was one.
There were several series is where they had the people and they weren't people.
They took the mask off and it was a robot. And I remembered
thinking to myself, my goodness, that's not real. That's some kind of
machine. So was that kind of feeling the only way I could explain it,
that kind of feel that you get that when you're viewing some think of
this kind that it is simply not from here. But it seemed weighty.
But how could it float? How could it levitate the way that it did?
So I understand when you talk about these reconnaissance crafts are going back to
when you're saying that they can malfunction, they can crash absolutely. I mean,
you know, we have our own issues and problems with our own technology
here that sometimes can go a roll. But what is your thoughts, Chris
about what is it that you think that they want from us? They've they've
kept themselves hidden for so long and so well removed from our society other than
and I'm sure those cases where crash retrievals have been implemented and biological specimens stored
away in cryogenic freeze or whichever way they store the bodies are able to preserve
the bodies. What is it? What do you think that they want from
us? Why are they here? We've had many, many, many people
trying to answer this question. Now, if I knew that, I would
be a rich man Philip, you know, because obviously I'd have the answer
for the question. But you know, I don't think that they're here to
armors in any way because we don't have the technology to stop them. If
they were armors in any way, shape or form, they would have done
so. They're not here to conquer the planet because they would have already done.
So. You know, if I here to help us, then why
not come out of where ever they're riding? And I've had various points put
on that as well. You know, why don't they come out from wherever
they're hiding and try and do that for us, try and help us in
some way, shape or form or form. Should I say, you know,
I'm not. I don't do what I call the space brothers, you
know, because I don't think that that is the right answer to the question.
Now, where are the hiding You've mentioned the moon. You know a
lot of people who mentioned the moon. We don't get a lot of info
from the far side of the moon. So we've had that that's one suggestion.
We've also had other suggestions, for example, under the waves of the
oceans of the world, we know far far. We know only about five
percent of what is under the waves of the oceans. That's all we've investigated.
We know about the moon, more about the Moon than we do in
the Atlantic Ocean or the Pacific or whatever. You know. And there isn't
a new thing though. That isn't something that has just come out. I
know. Gary Zeltown had an article in the American online version of The Sun
where he discussed the possibility that they did come from under the ocean. But
all he's doing is reflecting what Tony Dodd was talking about back in the nineteen
nineties. I've got an issue of UFO magazine. I think it's from nineteen
ninety seven. I don't remember the month off the top of my head.
Where he talks. Tony talks about strange vehicles again I'll call them my vehicles
flying in the air around the island of Iceland, you know, and fishermen
reporting them to him, and these devices were apparently intercepted, according to Tony.
I'm not saying he's right. I'm not saying he's wrong. These devices
was witnessed going into the sea, and apparently at this time a NATO force
was sent up there to investigate. But at that time, and now this
is when the world was a bit more quieter place. If the Russians actually
got involved and apparently a couple of ships disappeared. Now again I'm not saying
it's right. I'm not saying it's wrong. But I'm saying if that is
true, then they could possibly some kind of subterranean species. But when you
look at the technology that they've got, which is fir in advance of our
own, then where did they get it from? How have they got this
technology these materials to make flying devices that can travel underwater and in the air
at the same time, and they can switch and convet. It's a click
of a finger, you know, you click your fingers and it goes from
water to airborne. And also it's claimed that these same device ices can fly
out in space. Well, I suppose when we look at you know,
the the control would need of these craft, there is not much different really
with flying underwater to flying in space. That's right. And you know what's
also disconcerting is that these UFOs or known as and identified submergible objects usos,
are one of the same. I've never doubted that, and it's interesting.
I think that perhaps it's in it could be conceivable to assume that these intelligencers
have with some of their vehicles used our materials, the Earth materials in composition
of what you know with the heart of their materials, and that their spaceborne
crafts are of different materials entirely. So I believe I do agree with you
that these objects are one of the same, And again absolutely correct about the
ocean because we know very little about what's under there, and what better form
of camouflage of a hiding place, and on the Moon, because they know
that we probably would have great difficulty getting there or right beneath our nose and
under the under pressures that we would never be able to survive in. So
that's that kind of has always disconcerted me. Yeah, you know, I
mentioned a few moments ago about those in control in inverted commas like to keep
the subjects under their umbrella. Now I've heard it said that the term USO
in reports is no longer used. I heard it described as as being I
think it's you ups unidentified underwater phenomena. So not only is it u AP
now, you know, unidentified aerial phenomena. They're trying to alter how they
record information. And I think they're doing that because it's moving the goalpost slightly.
So somebody sends in a quest a freedom of information request, you know,
they can, oh, well, no, I'm sorry, we don't
have anything on us host. It's u UPS now, you see. So
you know, you know, I think that they like to control it all
and move the goalpost, you know. But the Britain you mentioned the British
investigation earlier, I actually think that Britain. You know, I'm not being
funny, And America has been great to us over the years, you know,
with as allies and so on and so forth. But I think it's
time the British government got off its own backs Haarde and started investigating these events
seriously once again. Because there is talk around Europe, Germany, France.
We know France is quite open anyway, Spain I think is quite open,
and in other countries like Italy, you know, they're all opening their files
up for people to look at these. You know, yes, there'll be
some rubbish in there, but you know there's going to be some quite interesting
things in there as well. And you know, what's really disconcerting that for
all these decades of denial and we're still you know, only scratching the surface
of it. And I believe that my understanding, Chris, I'd like your
opinion here is that the major corporate companies are in possession of these objects,
and what right do they feel that they have to deem it as theirs when
actually it belongs to all of us. I mean, you know, the
planet belongs to all of us. You would think that we have division and
difficulties in terms of getting on with one another in certain countries, but you
know, with regards to U Fou phenomen it's just absolutely ludicrous. I can't
get my head round the fact and here it comes. What is the big
deal about stating to all of us that, yes, there is intelligent life
out there. All the scientific establishments will admit that is fact. But to
a planet that we can't even reach, it's a possibility. But what is
the problem in stating to the people why the reality is real when they keep
telling us that it's not. They're going around in circles. What's your what's
your opinion about that? Why do you think that they won't tell us?
They're trying to control the narrative. The excuse a few decades ago would be
oh, mankind will fail, you know, if fall won't be able to
understand it, religion will fail, religion will collapse. Sorry, it's all
poppy coot. As I mentioned earlier, you know, we're intelligent enough and
to accept I think in a recent survey, I think it was in America
about seventy six percent of people accepted the notion of extraterrestrial intelligence. Whether or
not again, I'll say this, you know, whether or not that intelligence
is visiting the planet is a different question. But they actually believe in the
existence of extraterrestrial life that is somewhere out there. We could still find it
within our own solar system, it won't be intelligent as we would call intelligent,
because you know, they're not in the Goldilock zone, you know,
which is that certain distance from the Sun which basically allows life to exist.
You know, if you look at some of the the far out planets for
the moons around them, you know, at places like that that there is
also that question that they could have life out there. Now, you know,
it's again, I can't see it being intelligent at all, filed to
be honest, But it all comes down too. You know, we only
have to find it intelligent life on one planet, but that will come from
far away. But all we have to find is life and then it's not
unique to the Earth. So another question here, Chris, that I'd like
to ask you, and I'm sure your listeners would be interested. Do you
believe that there is more behind this? When I say more, okay,
So if the system that we served actually tells the general public that yes,
we do have crashed UFOs UAPs, we are in possession of certain bodies,
you know what. Okay, we can accept that, a lot of people
accept that, but we're told that there's a lot more behind this. The
public will not be able to accept or understand. So you know that is
kind of like and I know that it came out from certain sources, and
I'm kind of in agreeance with that. What do you think this is?
I mean, it's quite unsettling, isn't it? Is it the appearance of
the visitors? Is it what technology that they have? You know? And
I believe that perhaps it's possible that their technology perhaps runs on free energy.
We've had We've had about zero point energy and all that type of thing about
using the energy from the universe as free energy. We know that Nikola Tesla
was kind of like bordering along those lines with regards to as research and was
shut down. And I know that a lot of corporate companies will be very
you know, you know, absolutely totally against the idea of free energy coming
in because you know, how would you charge people with something that's free?
But what do you think is behind this? This more that they're they're covering
up with regards to this. And I know you probably don't know like I
do, but what is it? This is disconcerting part to this The interesting
point here is that you mentioned Nikola Tesla, Yes, we know passed away
in poverty. But isn't it quite interesting that the US authority when he passed
away, I think it was in the nineteen forties if I remember correctly.
Isn't it quite interesting that they rushed in there and kind of you know,
cleaned his room out for him. They took all his papers and hid them
away. They've got them in their file. You know. It could be
many things. It could be we live in a system that relies on oil
a hell of a lot, you know, So it could be that they
want to carry on controlling that more than anything. Oh yes, you know,
because and the damage that is doing to the planet. We know,
you know, global warming comes because of oil, et cetera. You know.
So yeah, they could they could be trying to control what we know
and what we laim that way. But I want to mention again because I
think it's kind of tied in with the bodies and crashed vehicles and so on.
The Arrow report that came out just a week ago was only part one.
We knew what they were going to say, as I mentioned at the
beginning, we knew they were going to cover it all up. And the
vast majority of yourthologists globally, you know, I've said it's a crap report.
Basically, it's rubbish. But that report only goes if I may get
the date wrong, it only goes up to the early two thousands. Part
two covers up to twenty twenty three, I believe. So let's see what
they put in part two with what they admit in part two off the report,
which is you to come out a little bit later this year as far
as I'm aware, So you know, let's wait for that before we truly
condemn them. Yes, And you know, the other interesting thing is that
with regards to this so called disclosure, it was very strange, was it
not? When the media was ablaze and the first time ever on the news
channels with regards to saying that they've had some UFO crashes. Do you remember
that Chris coming out and everyone was like, you know, wondering whether or
not they were these vehicles from another world. And it was very strange.
How and this concerting, I think, especially for the media because they have
never ever entertained the thought of reporting a UFO crash on primetime television, especially
the news. That was very strange, wasn't it. That was very weird?
I mean, you know what do you think was going on there?
Well, let's look, you know, as I mentioned about witnesses a few
moments ago, you know, the witnesses that have come forward like Frever you
know and is associated, they saw and recorded on video or film whatever they
use, digital cameras, whatever they use, they recorded something that was unusual,
you know. But the biggest thing for me was the fact that the
New York Hams, which for decades and decades and decades, you know,
there's called as all tinfoil at wearing lunatics. You know, they add on
their front page the report you know again with Leslie Keane, Ralph Blumertil and
I forget the third lady, the third individual's name who was involved, but
you know that is a big, big step, and you are completely right.
They actually had a lot of this. It was all over the news
for weeks and weeks. Well it would be, you know, because the
news, you know, perhaps they know different, perhaps they really do want
to bring out the truth, you know. You know, I've seen a
recent bit of film where major Jesse Marcel Rosswell, it talks about what happened
at the Rosswell event. Now let's remember that they ushed it up, but
this thing that came down covered twelve Americans football field. It covered twelve American
football fields, according to what was said in the report with Jesse Marcel.
Now, if that's a balloon, it's a bloody big balloon, you know,
if it's a weather balloon whatever, or Project Mogul going up there to
you know, but it's still a massive device. And when we look at
ken the final's report back in you know, nineteen forty seven to twenty fourth
of June, he saw and I'm going to bring this back to the book,
now, he saw two different shapes of craft. One was convex and
the other one, I mean it described them variously as paipon like convex.
You know, it moved like a dishwood if you skimmed it across water.
Flying sauces came up. But the one that he said was different was the
second of the nan. There was nine of them. The second from the
end of the nan as it was flying along, actually had a whole it's
in the craft. So it was kind of like bat wing shaped if you
can imagine that, you know, with a tail coming out and going round
to the wings, and then obviously you get the front Airofoil going forward or
whatever it was that it, you know, but it had a hoole in
the in the craft. Now not many people mentioned that, so the shape
of those were completely different. Now the news people, if you why do
the BBC and the RTV all have even Sky they all have the same reports
daily because there's a panel which they have to go to get permission to show
their reports. So again it comes back down to the government of controlling this.
You know, very slowly, we're coming to the end of the show
and I have to say that it's been an absolutely amazing talk with you,
Chris. I mean what I love about your thoughts on the matter. They
are fact as they stand. They are not theoretical. Their fact. We
know that UFOs and ups exist and the history of them that you've acknowledged within
your book, the shape of things to come from elsewhere is absolutely amazing.
I love your your the way that you describe the events. I love the
way that you also bring about these different shapes of UFOs. And you know,
it's all very well for an ardent europologist or someone you know remotely interested
in UFOs to oh, look, there's the triangles, there's the circles,
but no one's ever like yourself thought about Well, hang on a minute,
you know, you know, where are we dealing with one of the same
look at the structures of these crafts and look how important they are, and
also analyzing them against our own technology. But also you're bringing the past into
this to show well, it couldn't be our stuff because this was happening way
back in the day, centies before. So I think, you know,
the way that you've conducted your research and shaped your book, excuse the punt
the shape of things to come from elsewhere is really very fascinating. And you
had a eupologist, Peter Robbins right the forward, and he's very much in
the know with a lot of people. He's had a lot of connections,
isn't he, Not just with some of the astronauts, but also with many
other key figures, Bud Hopkins most notably, and many others. So I
think that the way that your book comes about is really beautiful because it's just
it's literally about the crafts themselves, which is wonderful. So tell us a
little bit about that. Okay, Well, the book I really started it
as a kind of refresher for myself because as I mentioned right at the beginning,
I've missed a few years here and there, so I wanted to increased
my knowledge, my head knowledge a little bit more. And as I got
writing it, and I think all in all, this is something like sixty
five to seventy different cases mentioned in there, some going back to the you
know, two thousand years ago, but some only going back to the end
of twenty twenty two, because I actually finished writing the publication of the book
in March about a year ago actually, and you know, that's as far
as I went. But I quote one particular group in the United States,
which is NEWFOK, the National UFO Reporting Center, which is only one organization
in the US, one organization globally, and I can't remember the exact number,
but it's well of one hundred and forty thousand different cases reported to them
over there up to November twenty twenty two existence. So that was that was
forty seven years of existence. Now the book itself, I didn't I didn't
want to go country by country because I just thought that, you know,
I just wanted to set out, for example, at the beginning, the
flying crosses that were saying the different shapes. Some of it like plus sand
shaped crosses. Others are like the flying cross in the Cross of Lorraine,
which is a standard across that Jesus was said to have died on with an
extra beam across the top, so it's got two beams and one damwaruld be
you know. So all those are mentioned. I talk about the adventure on
Iceland, which I mentioned a few moments ago. I talked about, you
know what the future could possibly hold. But the one thing that they have
to do globally is they have to get off the backsides. They have to
tell the truth, and they have to admit that something is visiting the planet.
Whether or not they will do that phil is a completely different question altogether.
But I think we know as investigators, as researchers, there is more
than enough evidence to prove that there is NATA. Made me laugh last year
when they said, sorry, we cannot put a point out about this because
we do not have the evidence. You know, they have the evidence at
least going back to nineteen forty seven, so you know, get off the
backside, look at the evidence, talk to people, Talk to the real
people that are on the ground level who see these things. Perhaps we'll get
the answer to what really is coming, you know, the shape of Things
to Come and where they're coming from. And I totally agree with you.
I think that you know, all of us are passionate for our truths,
although we have our different ideas about them. They can actually bring about this
evidence and clear this all up once and for all, and I think all
of us will be, you know, absolutely incredulous and not surprised because I
think most of us know what really is is going on. Now. I
have to say to your listeners out there, you have to go out and
buy a copy of the Shape of Things to Come from Elsewhere by Chris Evers
and The Ford by the wonderful Peter Robbins, published by Philip Mantle's Flying Disc
Press. And the book is beautiful. It's a really big book, you
know, got wonderful illustrations in it, photographs in it. It's wonderful.
I love it, so, you know, just go out and get it.
It's available on kindle, as paperback, as hardback and audio. Is
it on audio? It's not on audio as yet. No, we haven't
actually had it done as audio. They can if they want to go along
to www dot l M hyphen mag mag dot co dot UK. All the
details are on there of how to get the book, and there's I think
there's a link on there as well which takes you straight to Amazon. If
they want to go straight to Amazon, the can do just putting Chris Evers'
book and it'll bring it up for you. Yes, and you have a
conference coming up? Do you want to tell them about your conference? Oh?
Yes, the fourteenth of September twenty twenty four. We've got a major
conference coming up in the whole area and we have Peter Robbins coming over once
again from the United States. We have Steve Aspin talking, who's a generational
abductee, and also we have Jason Gleaves, who's well known XT hour ref
as a photo analyst. We have Grahem Rendall coming along, and we have
myself maybe doing a little bit, and I can't remember. There's another person
who's name, that's it Paul Askoff. He'll be coming along and talking as
well. All very well received at previous events. And again, if you
want to look on the website which I mentioned a few moments ago, you
can find out op to purchase tickets there. Tickets are priced at fifteen pounds
for a magazine subscriber and twenty pound for a non magazine subscriber. So a
full day's event does open at nine and we're finished at six thirty pm on
that particular day, fourteenth of September twenty twenty four here at the whole university.
Well, that's wonderful under all success with that, I know we've been
to yours before. They've been wonderful, and it's just the atmosphere of being
among like minded individuals. It's so wonderful. And I think you bringing all
these people together, you have to be credited for the work and dedication and
research that you've put into your creation OLM out of limits magazine and of the
conferences and of for you know, your your magazine with all the wonderful articles
in there. And I always say you always remember those who started you off,
and you were one of the good souls that took some of my work
and had started publishing it within your wonderful magazine. So the shape, well,
i'd like just before we finished, Phil, I'd like to make you
an offer now in that the next coming out I have from LM on June
the first will be the fiftieth issue. I'm inviting you now to get an
article into me to go out on that issue. So you need to get
it to me by the twenty first of me twenty twenty four. I'm sure
that can be achieved. Chris. Thank you so much. And that's enough
for you. Can't refuse, isn't it. So thank you. I'll send
the lad round. But thank you so much. Chris on board. Really
wonderful and a really in depth, you know, conversation about this subject matter,
really you know, getting in your teeth into it, which is what
this is all about. And I love the rawness. I love the whole
nature of just looking at the nuts and bolt syndrome with regards to the phenomena
which you have been doing. So the shape of things to come from elsewhere.
Chris evis the author Forward by Peter Robbins, published by Flying Dispress,
available on Amazon and go and get your tickets and also look at Chris's website
get your tickets also for the OLM event and also for his wonderful magazine,
and of course of which the fiftieth anniversary is coming up very soon. So
thank you very much, indeed, Chris for coming on board. My pleasure,
Philip, thank you very very much for the invite, and no doubt
we'll speak again very soon. We will, indeed, sir, and you've
been listening to Twin Souls, your host Philip Kinsella in association with the pow
Normal UK Radio network and our esteemed guest Chris Evers, author and organizer and
researcher within the subject matter of yourpology. Stay safe,