Ladies and gentlemen. Welcome back to another night at the Roundtable. Gentlemen,
please introduce yourselves. Hi. I'm David Flora. I'm the host of the
Blurry Photos podcast. Oh hi, I also co host Hysteri fifty one in
Quiz Quiz Bang Bang. I also have five minute frights and that's me.
So it's any zinger from the zing this podcast. I think I can officially
say I have the best hair on this episode. You're the only one with
hair on Hey, Hey, I win things by default. Okay, yeah,
I'm visiting this podcast, and yeah, we talked about pop culture and
stuff. And I don't have a laundry list like David does, so yeah,
oh wait, no wait I do. I also do a Star Wars
podcast called Nights of Vader. There I got to I got too, And
of course I am Derek Kay's of Monsters among Us podcast. And we've assembled
here tonight's to review yet to another film. Now we've flipped the lights in
the theater on, we've dusted off the seats and pop some popcorn and sat
down to watch the Unbinding the new Kirk's brand new documentary. Gentlemen, let's
start off with initial thoughts, Uh, justin, David, you go first,
We'll see. We'll see what David has to say. I just wanted
to sea, Yeah, I just want to keep just on his toes.
Tonight, David hit us first and in justin, Just what did you guys
think? Initially watching this thing? I thought this was a very compelling story.
They told about an object that me or may not have been cursed it.
It kept my attention throughout. I thought it was beautifully shot, well
done, so I I enjoyed it. So for me going into this cursed
object stuff like that, it's not something I really put a lot of stock
in. As the episode, I mean sorry, As the documentary film continued,
I became more invested. Much like their Hell Your documentary, it kind
of draws you in and keeps drawing you in a little bit more with you
kind of figuring out more of what's going on with it. So, I
mean, I enjoyed it by the end of it. The start was where
it was like, oh, it's a possessed item. I'm like, okay,
because that's not high on my list of paranormal stuff, but I know
other people's are, so, Like I said, it drew me in and
kept me captivated. So they really dangle that that lead out there in front
of you, don't they Every Every time you're okay, what's going on?
Now, there's another piece of information that seems to drop that's like okay,
Well it moves you forward in the story, and that's exactly how that's supposed
to work. I guess my thought was, I'm familiar with this story.
I remember hearing them talk about it. Man, I don't know, four
or five years ago on I want to say Bigfoot Collectors Club, that guys
over there have them on on occasion. Anyway, I remember hearing the story,
so for me, it was fun to actually get to see this idol
or what they ended up calling it. They called it the Krone. We'll
get into that here in a second. But what is that epigy idol?
Yeah, it's a little carved wooden carved goddess figure. There you go.
That nails it, And I guess we should segue this into some sort of
we should segue into some sort of synopsis, and I guess I'll try to
deliver it best I can without any spoilers, of course. So initially the
film begins with a group of hikers that in the Catskill Mountains and they uncover
this strange carving in a cave and they reach out to well, they reach
out to Reddit, I believe, and that's where the New Kirks kind of
find this information. And somehow, one way or another, the gentleman ends
up sending the effigy off to the New Kirks that they have it in their
possession. So the film essentially is kind of following the research of what this
thing might be, trying to recreate the item to save it, because ultimately
they want to take it back and put it back in the cave where they
found it or where it was found I suppose. So the whole thing is
just kind of the journey of this carving and you know what it's about and
where it ends up, and fair enough snops Us. They get around to
some Slavic folklore and mythology, and my ears kind of perked up at that
the name Baba Yaga came up. I don't know that it was necessarily necessary
to the figure itself, but it opened the door for them to find out
more about where this could have come from, or at least the idea of
and what the figure represented so I really appreciated the Slavic mythology, folklore and
stuff that they But you know that old mythology folklore, the mythology and the
folklore that they brought up in it, I thought that was really cool to
draw from. So I appreciated that. You know, Another thing I like
about it, and I'm a very visual guy. Just the area where this
takes place, the Catskill Mountains or like, I've never been there, but
it looks spooky as hell, and all this footage that they shot. And
of course they shot in like October or something, so it was like the
perfect time of year to shoot in a place like that. But frankly,
I might have to go visit, you know, Central New York or the
Finger Lakes or wherever the region is the cat Skills, I guess, because
it just looked amazing to me. Reminded me of Ohio beck Home. I
was about to say. The other thing that got me was the timeline of
this was interesting because if I'm correct, all this took place before they did
Hellyer. I think, because I had that question as well. I think
that Hellier started a little earlier with the emails and stuff. But this was
either right, on top of it or right with it when they because helier
came out and I think twenty nineteen you are correct, and they had mentioned
something maybe about receiving emails and stuff in twenty twelve even maybe Well it seems
like both stories were going on, you know, at the same time.
They were dealing with both at the same time. Well, the thing that
got me is Greg looked really young in a lot of the like a lot
of the footage. That's why I was like, is this just weird?
Does he look way younger? And I kept having to remind myself, this
is before a lot of stuff that we see like now from them and everything.
So that was just something that I just had to keep reminding myself that
this takes place before, like a lot of events take place before, and
I guess a lot of the filming they did took place before the events of
Hell Here, which, like, I'm not super familiar with the New Kirks
prior to hell Youer per Se. So like I said, it's just Hellure
was my introduction to them for the most part and from then on, so
I didn't know that they were this involved in the paranormal scene. And I
guess the convention scene too, with their little setting up the at the what
was it the Michigan, Michigan, Michigan. We should probably work our way
into talking about their museum a little bit. It's called the Traveling Museum of
the Paranormal and the Occult. Is that a Cincinnati, But it's a traveling
museum. I guess they have it all over the place. I've never seen
it, you know, I've never experienced it, but just looking at some
of the stuff that they had in the footage incredible. I mean I was
pretty jealous of some of the pieces that they had. Yeah, they've collected
a lot of a lot of cool stuff. Yeah, is it? Zach
Baggins is the other guy that does like the collection of like haunted items.
Yeah. Okay, he has a museum in Vegas. Okay, Derek,
you've been there, right there, you go wearing the shirt we have the
T shirt on synchronicity. Guys, synchronicity, What a great thing to have
in a complete audio medium. I mean, I'm wearing micir then no one
can see. Well, they've seen you too, so they so they know
I automatically win on the pet hair facial hair. I think I will never
beat Flora. So but but getting back to this, like, like I
said, it was just like something that was interesting with all that. And
I'm wondering because you guys are more clued into this, that that whole event
of when they like took it out at the convention and like everything went,
Hey, why that's when you guys had heard about before, because you guys
have your fingers vaguely closer to the polls of this stuff that I do.
I don't know, you mean this exact event or or something like it.
Well, no, no, no, the event of like the guy having
like a seizure, bleeding from the mouth, all this that that whole crazy
thing on once they drink was spilled. Now to let people that aren't going
to watch the film or whatever in on what we're talking about this effigy,
they put it in a box, and I guess that's their way of,
well, we'll get to why, we'll get to why they put in a
box on a second problem. Oh yeah, we probably should do that too.
But anyway, they put it in a box, lock it up,
and they took it with them in the museum, and I guess some guy
kept asking, Hey, I want to see it. I want to see
it. I want to see it. Finally they gave in, They're like,
okay, fine. They opened the box and I guess there was some
sort of energy that just went through the room. There was drinks that were
spilled, and then a guy down the end of the hallway had some sort
of seizure and just started vomity. Blood or something. I can't re there
was blood involved somehow, So that's that's what Justin's talking about there. I
was not familiar with it. I've never been to Michigan Pericon. They've yet
to invite me. I don't I don't go to Michigan very often for personal
reasons, for special sorts reasons, especially this time, especially this time of
year. Anyhow, I did hear other people talk about it online though,
that it did happen. So there are why they didn't have those those witnesses
in the film. I think that would have been powerful. Maybe they couldn't
get them or whatever. I know how that is. But I did hear
other people talking about being there and just how weird it was, that there
was something strange going on, So that is backed up a little bit there.
Yeah, so I guess we should get into like what this effigy that
they found or that was sent to them was doing or allegedly doing to the
people who came into possession of it, much like a divic box. Also
at Zach Beggins. Yeah, yeah, very true. Wait doesn't he have
the doll too? No? No, I don't think so. That's the
Warren's Museum. Okay, sorry, and he's got island or something. Yeah,
he does have dolls. I mean there are hundreds of them in that
building, but not the not Robert or Annabelle I think of the two famous
ones. But as far as the activity is concerned, once they had the
creature sent to them, the creature, once they hud the carving scent to
them, they would hear like strange sounds and I guess water was associated with
it. They would find wet footprints and like water dripping in different surfaces.
You know. They did some digging and it found out that there was some
David, you should take over here because this is definitely in your territory.
But it was. It was a little confusing because they brought up a goddess
by the name of Mokash and they they said at one point she was goddess
of witches, I think, or something something paranormal like that of women who
practice magic. And I looked at that a little bit, and I couldn't
find a solid connection between this goddess and witchcraft, except for maybe divination.
Sometimes she was because she was a goddess of several things, fertility, something
like water right, well, they say moisture, but I get the sense
that it was like rains for crops. I don't know, it could just
be straight up wet or you know, moisture and but whatever. And so
they talked about that and the fate aspect of this goddess who was like the
main mother goddess of Slavic mythology. Uh, there was this connection to knowing
the future a little bit because she spun the threat of fate, and the
divination aspect came from that angle of it. So I didn't see much else
in terms of witchcraft or you know, being kind of a patron of that.
She was a protector goddess protected women in particular and especially during childbirth.
So I think they tied the story of Mokosh into this by saying it was
Mocosh who was bound in this effigy and it could have been by Vellus.
I think the there's an underworld god who in one story captures Mokash takes her
up a mountain, and then the god Perun, the thunder god, who
was kind of the main who was like the Zeus figure, was the husband
of Mokash, and had to cut open the stomach of Vellas to get her
out because she had been kidnapped. Right, yeah, just like you do.
Who hasn't cut open a god's stomach before? So they then they brought
up this other creature called a kiki mora, which is kind of like a
There are a couple types, but their household spirits, from my understanding,
and one of them in particular, comes from swamps. And that's where you
get this dripping wet type of entity that leaves footprints and wears moss and grass
and stuff, and sometimes can kidnap children if as I as I read up
on it, if the household is kind of in disarray, if the woman
doesn't do her duties, if the man cautionary, it's abusive, Yeah,
I think so, And it can still children. So that's the thing that
they they eventually, I think, got around to saying, was coming out
of this thing when people experienced stuff. So it was a little confusing in
there, but I don't know, I appreciate the mythology of it. Yeah,
no, I was. I was pretty confused myself. I was unsure
if they were trying to say that Mokosh is that is that right, okay,
if if the carving was containing or possessed by Mokosh, or if it
was something similar, you know, or also if the carving itself was of
Mokash. So there was a I feel like I should have watched it twice,
honestly, but I didn't have the time for that. But I was
a little confused as to where that tie in was. So that's that's certainly
helpful that you re explained that. Yeah, I think it was of her,
Yeah, but it also contained her. But then there was this other
creature sorry, yeah, got involved was thrown in there at some point.
Well again, that was the gateway to kind of got them, you know,
to find this really because they didn't know what to look for. And
I'll give a little bit away that when they go to take it back,
they realized that it's a Ukrainian settlement there. Ukrainian Americans kind of live in
this area, so then that kind of like, oh, well, maybe
we should look in Ukrainian folklore, and that's sort of they backtracked into what
they did find. It's all very fascinating and like justin out of my wheelhouse
as well, like I'm not much into the mythology or cursed objects or anything
like that either, but it's certainly interesting. I want to ask go ahead,
justin no, no, go ahead, to go ahead. You might
be asking my question, but I'll say it if you don't, well,
I just wanted to ask what you guys thought of the Esta's method session that
they did. Now, for people that don't know the estas method is,
I can't remember who came up with it, one of the guys from the
film here, but basically, you put headphones in a blindfold on and you
do the radio scan what do they call a spirit box or whatever they call
those things. So you're just listening to a radio scan channel to channel like
every half a second or something, and then you shout out what you hear,
but you can't communicate with everybody else in the room and they're talking to
this. So anyway, they do this in a hotel trying to communicate with
the carving or what's held within, And I'll be honest with you, I
think the Estes method and the spirit Box, both of them are kind of
BS in my opinion. That said, that session was pretty impressive. The
way things lined up to me was pretty impressive. So I wanted to get
you guys's input on there, your thoughts. Like I've witnessed people doing the
spirit box before, ironically at Mothman and one of the bunkers, and it
was one of those things. I was sitting at a distance from it cause
I was like sitting like right near the door they were inside, and they
had it going and it was echoing all around in one of the bunkers,
and there was people that that would yell out periodically, Oh I heard this.
I heard that. I'm like, I heard nothing. So it's not
high on my list of like believability when it's just like just thrown out there
and having everyone interpreting. I think having one person focus on it is probably
a little bit more in line with something I think that isn't as BS as
just having it just to where anyone can hear what they want from it.
And I know, if I remember correctly, I think they used this in
hell here as well, this method, and it was kind of compelling.
And I do want to point out though we haven't described what this effigy looks
like, by the way, which I think should be noted. On what
this thing looks like. If you don't mind it, I'll describe it real
quick to the best of my abilities. It is this I want to say,
like about eight inch tall eight inch to a foot tall wooden carving of
a female. And it has a little noose around its neck as well as
multiple nails driven into its eyes. So it looks very it doesn't. Yeah,
I was I was gonna say, it's not something super complex, it's
very simple. It's very I want to say, not trying to bury the
lead here, but it's something that would be of its like as David was
describing, I would believe like if you found something like this in a Slavic
you know, I don't want to say like burial mound or something, but
something to where like archaeologists would discover this in like an old settlement or something.
It's it's enough in line with that that it's believable in that point once
you find that out later. But like I said it's creepy too, because
it's not something i'd want to just have hanging out around my house. The
noose and the nails are separate. They were added to it. We should
say they weren't carved up, but that was the But that was something that
could have been what was it if I got it correctly, that was them,
not them as in the New Kirks. But whoever did was binding,
yeah, something into this effigy, into this object. So I just wanted
to give a quick description for people who might not watch this or or wanted
to see how accurate we could describe it. And we'll put a picture up
in the show notes where I will at least I can't speak for these jabrons,
but I'll put one up. I'll copy and paste from Derek, so
I will have it up as well. Share the link there you get,
David, I want to know what you thought about the ESDA method. I
agree with you guys how it was. It's compelling to watch. I can't
get there personally with believing that it works or you know, does anything.
I think I would be more impressed by it if the questioners and the person
doing it were in two separate rooms where they couldn't hear. And I know
that the people who use it on that we've seen have soundproofing headphones and all
that stuff, But personally, I would put more stock in it if they
were separate. Now I don't know the rules of ghostdom where if you're in
a different room with the object, will it even work if the spirit box
is in a different room. But it's like spectrum Wi Fi. It only
goes through one wall and that's it. But drywall just eats up the Esti's
method. So yeah, I I But I will say that in this and
in Hellure, to be honest, the narrative and the storytelling of it is
very compelling and gets creepy real fast. Yeah yeah, I'll tell you what
my issue is with it, and it's the the manipulation of it by the
spirits, I guess. So the thing is, it's just a regular radio
and it's programmed to skip every station. I don't know how many stations are.
It goes from eighty nine to one oh five or something like that on
the FM scale, and just at every quarter of a second, half of
a second, it'll hit that channel and whatever's there just goes. So for
me in the back of my head, they're just hearing or we're all just
hearing, you know, radio DJ saying half a phrase and then somebody else
is another half a phrase and you put it together. Now I see why
people pull words out of this. Where I'm having an issue is where how
does the ghost manipulate what's going to be on the radio? Because we already
know it skips in order. It doesn't just skip around randomly. It skips
in order eighty nine, nine, ninety point one, ninety point two.
It just skips all the way through and then loops back around. So there's
no manipulation to be had unless they can go to the radio station and force
a DJ to say a certain phrase. It just doesn't pan out for me.
And I understand people's enthusiasm because you get the results. There's actually something
there for you to hear. But I just have a hard time getting around
that. I haven't spent enough time around it or done enough research you know
about it. But for me, that was one of the least believable parts
of the film. But like I said, that session, there were so
many things that lined up. It was in my head. It almost has
to me. Two things like they know what's going on. It's scripted out,
which it didn't seem like that's what it was, or there was some
sort of strange communication going on there. That's literally what it seemed like.
And I again, I'm still skeptical, so in the back of my head
like there's no way this works, but that's how it seemed. I highly
encourage people to check that scene out, because I mean it was just back
and forth, just like a regular conversation, and to the point where I
forgot that Dana had headphones on and couldn't hear what was going on, and
it was just it was so fluid and so quick back and forth. I'm
like, oh, this is it caught my attention. I guess the best
way to say that I would be very interested to try that for myself,
to try that method. Yeah. Now, I I think that they would
say there might be a component to it of sensitivity, that it works better
with people who might be sensitive to other worldly things, and I don't think
I would fall into that category, but I would be willing to try it
and see how it goes. Sounds like another special episode for us coming up.
Yay, just radio static for a whole hour. So my question to
you two is this is what I was going to ask. So Derek did
not hit my question. But I guess at the at the base of this
whole thing is how much stocked you two? Not from this instance. I
mean, if you want to take this instance, sure put in cursed objects
or possessed objects. Hmm, Well I'll start. I actually have a quick
little story I used to go because I want to go with David. First,
David, let me know what. I used to work in an office
down in LA and there was like forty people in that office or something,
and it was we made films, and we made some pretty big films.
So there was a lot of money coming in and out. Didn't come to
me, but it went to somebody. So there were a lot of gifts
that were given out, especially this time of year, I mean box after
box. And when I first started working, there was a pa in.
My job was to deliver all these boxes and one of them came from a
foreign client. We did foreign sales there. I don't even know what country
it came from, somewhere in Asia and they sent I'm going to show you
guys, and I'll post pictures of this as well, but they sent this
little guy and it's just like this ah hack, no sculpting wizard looking guy
with a huge hat on. Now when you pull his hat, it's a
knife. There's a knife his hat. So anyway, this thing passed around
twenty different offices. Nobody went. They were terrified of this thing. Everybody
was trying to get rid of it. And I found it in the trash
and I'm like, this is going home with me. So I took the
oat of the mailroom trash and I still have it, like ten years later
or whatever. I don't have a clue where this thing came from. It.
There's nothing written on it. It's just this weird looking little wizard with
like some fake hair. It's probably real hair, but hair sticking out.
And then when you pull on his head, he becomes a knife, like
a letter opener or something. So anyway, that's my brush with a cursed
object that has n't well. I've had really bad luck to pass five or
six years, so maybe it does bring bad luck, but uh, that's
my brush with cursed objects. And I have a handful of listeners that say
they're gonna send me something, but I've yet to receive it, And Sarah's
real happy about that because she got mad that I was willing to accept any
haunted objects. She's like, not in my house, but put out in
the recording shed. Well, I'm in the bay, but I can do
whatever I want down here. This is my layer. That's why he's doing
here and not upstairs. David, what about you. I don't put much
stock in cursed objects. I I the closest I think I could come to
that is people that are cursed just people that have bad luck. They're they're
clumsy, they break stuff or stuff breaks around them, stuff doesn't work.
They they find things missing a lot, like there are people that I've observed
that have had because you just described, I don't know, how's your microwave
doing. That's everything else is broken the microwave, your computer, Uh,
you have issues with so yeah, so it's almost late to this recording because
it would not start up. And that's you know, something that that has
been happening lately. But you know, the the objects and stuff I you'd
have to to reproduce a lot in front of me to to get stuff to
to get me to believe this stuff. So for example, if you if
you have a voodoo doll something like that, or or a like some an
object from like ben In or West Africa. They they would often drive nails
into stuff for a variety of reasons. I don't think it was always negative,
but because it looked scary, right, that's what it looks. It
looks crazy, but it's but it's a way I'm I'm trying to remember exactly
what, because I've done a couple of episodes on that, and it was
it was a way too oh boy, try to make something manifest in a
way. And and I'm not talking like summoning a demon or something like that.
I'm just like a thought or if you want something to happen, almost
like a like the secret, like hanging it on your refrigerator or something.
In a way, it's sympathetic magic. It's it's a way to for you
to put your thoughts and once onto an object and hope that that object then
transfers to whatever real thing you want it to represent. And that's why you
would get, you know, a piece of hair or fingernail or something to
put in that object to make it be sympathized with the real thing. So
if it's a person, you know, you put that stuff in there,
and then it and and then if you try to hurt it, it's supposed
to hurt the person. Blah blah blah. That's a sympathetic magic, which
I just I don't put any stock. What about something like that. Are
you familiar with Otsy the ice Man? Yeah? Does that sound familiar for
well, for listeners that don't know and justin OTSI was just I mean,
he's a ten thousand year old human that was walking to French Alps or the
Italian Alps or I don't know, the Alps somewhere and he was in the
Alps and all the ice is melting. So he was found fifteen twenty years
ago. They chiseled him out. And every person that's come in contact with
this mummy, this freeze dried guy has died or had something really bad happened
to them. And there's several deaths, I mean, like a dozen I
think associated with him. The guy that found him, the guy that dug
him out, the guy that drove the truck, the guy at the museum.
I'm making these up. I don't know what it actually is. I
can't I'm not that good. But there was a lot of people associated with
it. So I'm curious, like, what do you think of that where
there's there is like a track record if you believe what's being told at least
well in the same vein. That sounds a lot like the tut and Common.
Yeah, I was gonna say, I was like the Mummy, Yeah,
Diamond, James Dean's little bastard. But there's a bunch of them.
But the thing I was going to follow up with this after I said my
piece, which actually he's into Derek's thing is it's is do you feel like
this is something if you're investing in the mythology of it, it makes it
stronger. Then it makes you kind of put the pieces together for it to
make it real. If if you get what I'm saying, you guys get
what I'm saying with this is that you're making it real by putting emphasis on
it. Yes, Yeah, Tulpa essentially is yeah, the philosophy you're talking
about or or for you know, psychology, it's kind of a placebo.
It would be. It would be kind of a real time confirmation bias type
of thing. Yeah, goodenough for you. Yeah, Like I said,
that's kind of some elements I got from this, because I would have loved
to have seen them bring somebody in they had nothing to do with this,
no clue what was going on, and see how they reacted to it,
like giving them nothing to go off of, because, like I said,
I'm somebody that doesn't super believe in stuff like this. So if you handed
me this dog, be like, yeah, that's a weird sorry this FGMYA,
that's weird. But I wouldn't have like because the guy when he was
like pulling the nails out at the end, was like physically being affected by
it to where he was like getting exhausted from it and getting like I think
he was crying at one point. But I'm like, I wonder what happened
if you just grab some random person off the street and told him to do
it, if it affected them who has no clue, I'd put a huge
emphasis on. Okay, I'm starting to believe this now because that person has
no parameter for it. Yeah. So but if you're somebody who believes in
it and feeds into it, maybe energy you give it gives that energy back.
Just something I kind of thought of while watching this. To go back
real quick to Derek's question about otsy and stuff, the Curse of the Mummy
from Howard Carter opening the tomb for twot in Common in twenty two. There
was a legend about nineteen twenty two. We buy that now, Yeah,
there was a legend that grew out of that about a bunch of people involved
or secondarily or tertiarily involved with this opening of this tomb that met an untimely
end after that happened, and well, I did an episode on it back
in the day, and it turns out that everybody. It sounds crazy when
you're like, yeah, five people died after the tomb was open, but
it was like five people over over like a decade or more, and they
were all like there was like, oh, somebody died in their sleep,
Oh, somebody contracted malaria, some you know, oh a bird you know
got sick and died or something. It was like, there's nothing actually to
this that isn't straight up coincidence. Yeah, but when you say five people
died after this tomb was opened, I mean we could now say like billions
of people have died, you know, or whatever. I don't feel it's
sort of the Bermuda triangle effect, where you know, it sounds crazy when
you list all the things, but if you list the things just outside the
triangle's the exact same. I mean, it's it's just how the ocean is.
So yeah, that's that's the parallel I'm drawing. Huh. I said,
just just just something I pulled from this on the whole, Like like
if you brought me in, didn't set me up for any of this stuff,
didn't prime me for it, sat me in a room with it,
if I get the same responses from it, see, that's you're you're thinking
correctly, justin because that's a double blind test. That's scientific method. That's
what needs to happen with with that kind of stuff. Yeah, but that
I said that, that's just the thing I said. I find it interesting
seeing all these but I said I would just I'd love to see somebody who's
not primed for it. Like we can do this with a lot of other
examples like the Martha lights or different and things that are supposed to just occur,
to see if someone who's not primed for or just just going into a
haunted house, Like if you don't prime somebody for it and they start responding
like someone prime for it, that gives me the intention of I'm believing this,
But I said, it's nothing against the New Kirks, because everybody in
this was primed to think of this thing as some cursed object, and the
whole like water smell, the whole like water appearing places. That is weird.
Yeah, but I said, it's kind of one of those things to
where I would want to experience that myself. Like if I got handed this
thing and then all of a sudden I got water footprints around my house,
I'd be like, Huh, that's new. That's how you do, that's
how you drink. Huh, that's new. Normally they're flaming footsteps. Well,
you know, it's a piggyback on what you're saying a little bit here,
justin every person's different, And as David touched on earlier, some people
claim to have sensitivities. And I'm not going to sit here and say I
believe, but I've seen some stuff that really makes me question, and I've
heard some things that really make me question. If I was there in the
room and saw this unfold, I'd probably believe. But because it came secondhand
or came off the Internet or whatever, there's that separation that gives me a
hard time. The point being that you could show this thing to one hundred
people and fifty of them could be affected by the other fifty just they're not
open to that sort of thing, So you could David's right, double blinded.
It means the perfect test to take. But if you start getting complicated
and digging into the fine details of the human psyche, do some people have
the abilities? And those are the people that connect to these things. So
I guess you then have to ask have you ever had like a psychic experience?
Have you ever guessed the lottery numbers or anything weird like that? I
could see it getting complicated pretty quick. I wouldn't even go that far.
I just have somebody just come in and just experience like because then if you're
like I said, I mean, I don't want to go back to the
example of me with with the spirit box. But I said, sitting there
overhearing like the jumbled stuff and having hearing people y'all, oh man, it
just said this, and I'm sitting there like it just sounds like you're flying
through radio stations. Like. Like I said, it wasn't something I was
willing to put belief in, so maybe I wasn't going to get belief out
of it. Now speaking of like cursed objects and stuff, I will point
out this, and I will one hundred percent not deny this. I will
point I'm pointing this out free of everything I said. I'm skeptical on some
stuff. But there was a timeframe when we had our old me me and
my wife had our old car, and it was having issues one of the
computers in the house, like there was like a ton of mechanical issues going
going on it like one time in the house and for some reason not trying
to plug plug. But I was listening to the end of the fray and
they were talking about gremlins and someone said like their their mother said like or
it was something talking about gremlins and like putting out a bowl of milk out
I've heard that. And I sat there and I was like, you know,
what, what's the harm in doing this? Like, what is the
harm in me taking a bit of milk, putting it outside on the porch
bybe where all this stuff is happening and seeing if it goes away, you're
going to attract the dunes, is what's going to happen. That's what I
was gonna say, you just had the raccoons. I have a raccoon problem
right now, so you don't want it. They're here all. Oh no,
this this this was years ago. And like I said, I did
it. Did it? Raccoons did exactly before they were a threat, back
before the raccoon invasion of six. But but no, it's it's just something
to where it's like, did I believe that that's what was causing all this
stuff? No? But I was like, what's the harm in trying this?
Sure? Like if I'm wrong, eh, if I'm right, maybe
I get rid of these weird things that are bothering me. Like I said,
didn't work out. No, that that that van abandoned dustin Pennsylvania like
a few months later. So but it worked fine up until that point.
So maybe it was just I had to keep it in the right state.
But like I said, this this whole thing is interesting, and I think
and I said, the biggest thing I took away from this is belief in
the object, belief in its causing this or it's doing this. And I
said, that's the thing is I feel like everyone in this was prime for
which is great. But I said, as someone skeptical. I'm very like,
eh when I've had the same response with this. So so another thing
I wanted to ask you guys was, you know, we talk about directors
and that kind of thing, and this one was director directed by Kyle Jeez
and this one was directed by Carl Pfeiffer, who did the Heller serieses because
there were two of them. What did you guys think of that? You
know, the aesthetics of the film, like the way it was composed,
you know all that, the the technical details of filmmaking. I thought it
was well done. Yeah, I mean he took the green filter off from
Hellier, so I said, I thought it was shot very well. It
was something to where like I said, Derek said that going to the Catskills
looks beautiful and everything. So it definitely emphasized like the atmosphere of a lot
of areas they were in. So it does set set an atmosphere, I
would I'll say that for sure, Like it definitely has a vibe to it.
Or you're you're going on this ride with them, and it's not hard
to put yourself in their shoes when you're experiencing all this stuff. They did
a really good job of conveying all that. There's a lot of slow motion.
But what I what I loved about there were there were quite a few
moments that were kind of hair standing up on your neck inducing. Yeah.
I had to look behind me a couple of times just to be like,
I'm not sure nobody's here with me. Like they they did a great job
of telling stories about how this thing was affecting people, and how it was
affecting them in their houses and what was going on, and it got so
creepy in a couple of parts. I really appreciated that. This doesn't have
anything to do with the directing. But something they did in the film that
I did appreciate was they were trying to replicate the carving. I touched on
this a little bit earlier, but they they did a three D scan and
tried to three D print it, and then eventually they end up just doing
a silicon silicon mold of the effigy itself. I love that, you know,
I love that preservation. Whether it's cursed or not, this is part
of paranormal history now. So I love the fact that even though it's gone
and I don't want to give away where it went, but it's gone,
it still exists in a way, you know, they still have for the
most part, it's still here so people can lay eyes on it. That
kind of thing, because a lot of times we lose these pieces and once
they're gone, they're gone. And you hear old timers talk about all this
big Foot cast print that I had was the perfect print, could have proved
big Foot existed. But it's broken and gone now. So with with this
preservation method, that stuff can can continue on. So I do appreciate that.
I'm not going to talk about how they did that because I think the
three D printing also had its own little interesting twist with it too. Yeah
that that that was a moment that made an eyebrow on my head to shoot
up real quick. So I was like, that's weird. Yeah, that
was a fun part. So yeah, well, like I said, it's
definitely interesting. Oh I was about to do my final thoughts, I was
like, nope, saving it, Well, we can do that. I
mean I think we could probably you guys, cool, if you're wrapping it
up, do you want to segue into that? Justin sure? After watching
I feel like, hell, youer more pulled me in quicker on the premise
of what it was. This had I think a lot more interesting stuff with
developments they came across as the as it progressed, Like like I said,
you tell me there's a haunted object, and you don't have me pulled in
yet you build on that with certain aspects later and I get interested. Much
like David, I am someone who is a connoisseur of ancient mythology and stuff
like that. So it definitely rang a bell with me at when they got
to that point with it. Like I said, it pulled me in then
kept me in. Hell, you're what I said. It had me from
the get go of wait, weird gobbling things out in the world. It's
oh man. So, like I said, it's definitely something that I would
recommend if you're well, hey, if you're listening to any of the three
podcasts that we mainly host are the other twenty that David host, definitely check
it out. I mean, it's it's definitely worth I mean a rent,
and I mean if you enjoyed Hellier this, this definitely has a lot of
that same weirdness in it. I cut the Hellier theme in there a few
times. Oh this song, someone I had a good ear. I do
enjoy the hell your theme. That is something I did enjoy a lot.
I guess, I'll guess, I'll jump in here. It's very digestible.
It's an hour and thirty six minutes or something like that, so it's not
like Hellier where it's going to take up a day's worth of your time to
get through all this. This is very quick and clean, and there's resolution,
or somewhat of a resolution. I highly recommend it. Keep your skeptical
glasses on, of course, but it's an entertaining ride, so I had
a good time watching it. Yeah, I agree with you guys. It's
I appreciate that they did this in a film as opposed to like six episodes
or something. I think it's cleaner that way. They get to the point
you go on the journey with them. There's a resolution, there's a little
bit of an epilogue. I think it's again shot really well. I never
was bothered by any of the cinematography, any of the editing. Everything worked
well for it. So I think kudos to Greg and Dana for putting this
together. It was a very smooth, very smooth film. Well, gentlemen,
thank you both for assembling here this evening to go over this film.
A lot of people right in saying we had to do this, so I
kind of dust it off the old round table mic and it's the same mic
I use every week, but I dusted it off anyway, and here we
are. So thank you guys for stopping by, and thank everyone for listening,
and of course go check out this film. I don't know where you
guys found that. I found it on Apple, the Apple app. I
don't know what they think it's on Prime, So I found it on Prime.
Okay, well there you go. I think it was like four bucks
to rent or something, and it was definitely worth worth the money. Justin
you start for real this time. Tell everybody where they can find you and
anything you got going on. You can of course find Zignas podcasts or ever
you find Grace podcast. That's ce ng this. We do pop culture stuff
every week and sometimes the pair of Normal slips in there into that pop culture
because well it's part of that everything. So definitely check out the Zingnis podcast.
You can check out a Blurry photos wherever you get podcasts. I'll be
coming back with some episodes. I'm just finishing the writing of one right now,
got a couple in the bag, so I'll be not long absent much
more that that all made sense grammatically. You can also check out Hysteria fifty
one if you'd like a little comedy with your paranormal Quiz Quiz Bang Bang Trivia
and Five Minute Frights is a narrative story podcast. That's where all the animatronics
come to life and take you out right. It's it's the it's exactly that.
There's a several games. They just made a movie of it. There
was a better movie that was made a couple of years ago with a different
name, but that might be our next movie. We do five nights of
Ready. Well. You can find Monsters among us every Thursday. Wherever you
get fined podcasts and you get bad podcasts, we're all in the same place.
I got nothing else going on. David Denies film. We don't have
a date yet, but we're working our asses off trying to find the date.
We think it's gonna be March, So stay tuned and we'll try to
get that date. Now that we've said that, it'll be'll yeah, because
they tell here's what happens. They tell us a date, we tell you
guys, and then next time we talk to him like, oh, we
didn't say that it's this date, and then they just keep pushing it forward,
so eventually it will come out, and you know, there's there's a
lot of processing and stuff, so there's actually a lot of work going on
behind the scenes, so they're not just twiddling their thumbs anyhow, enough of
that. If you want to see my little creature, my little carving that
I have, be sure to check out the show notes. Be sure to
check out the unbinding from Greg and Dana Newkirk and thanks again, guys,
had a good time. Also, stay tuned for my new I will not
stay tuned to this, but check out my new show Five Minutes with Flora.
It's like five Nights at Friday's, but more terrifying always and he's also
an animatronic, right, I can. I every but