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Well off of the final weekend of
June. We have seen world title fights

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and wins for Lamont, Roach for
Ta Femo Lopez, for Mam Rodriguez,

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and we're ready to recap all of
it. And speaking of champions, Shakur

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Stevenson, the newly crowned lightweight champion
of the world right here on this very

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podcast, and a conversation with Dan
Rayfield coming up. Welcome in. It's

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the Fight Freaktion Night recap. I'm
the somewhat competent host TJ. Reeves.

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He is our insider. Hello,
Dan Rayfield. Fight Freaktion Night is his

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substack, bigfight Weekend dot Com.
How we feelings? We head into July

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now July fourth later this week,
Baseball, apple Pie fireworks, and a

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hot dog eating contest on July fourth
minus Joey chest disgusting. Disgusting. I

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don't understand why human beings pay attention
to people gorging themselves with sixteen hot dogs

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in their mouth on national television.
But I digress. By the way,

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thank you for finding us. I
come your way. The peeps always love

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this Rayfield. I come your way
from the east coast of Florida, about

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three hours from my home near Coco
Beach, Florida. I am out on

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the patio as we speak, trying
not to get the side eye from the

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twins, et cetera. On vacation
while we record the podcast real quick here

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recap the fights here from Shakur,
et cetera. I don't want to I

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don't want to leave the peeps at
the altar. I don't want to leave

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them jilted. So even on a
mini vacate for a few days, we

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are here, Petes, we come
off the weekend with the recap. You

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just want to brag that you're overlooking
the ocean from the beach. Yeah,

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they have that. They have to
visualize that. I'm condo they have they

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have a We have a condo that
we paid slightly less than an oldsmobile for.

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I'm gonna have to do the podcast
apparently until I'm ninety to pay all

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this stuff off. But we are
here for a few days and I'm doing

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the pod with Rayfield here to recap
the fights. Thank you for finding us.

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Rate us in review us a new
month. Ratings and reviews help,

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five star reviews help. Thank you
for doing that. Leave us a nice

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review, follow, Subscribe apples,
Spotify. Let's get into it. Let's

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roll the sleeves up. We're gonna
go chronologically. When we left this podcast,

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you were discussing world title fights.
But why don't we begin first of

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all with the most noteworthy one,
and that is the match Room Saturday night

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show in Phoenix where Bam Rodriguez,
who they heard from on the preview podcast

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last week in advance of this fight, wiped out Jan Fancisco Strata. Yes,

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he got dropped in a flash knockdown, laid in the fight, but

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he got right back up, wasn't
hurt, and then blasted Estrata to the

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body and laid him out. That's
gonna lead our recap mode here. Tell

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me what you saw from Bam,
who has really solidified himself as one of

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the top I think it's fair to
say one of the top US world champions

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right now in any division. That's
obvious with the resume that he has.

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Dan go ahead, Oh, no
question about it. I mean I love

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the fight. Number one. It
was a fight that everybody figured was going

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to provide excitement, entertainment value,
fireworks, and it was gonna be a

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heck of a fight, and it
was all that tremendous fight. I mean,

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we haven't had the run of like
tremendous Fight of the Year candidates so

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far through the first half of twenty
twenty four like we did last year.

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So I think this fight again through
the first six months, I don't think

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know if it's the fight of the
year, but it's on the short list

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for the first six months. Even
though it was somewhat at least to myself

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and basically everybody else except for the
two of the dopey judges, who was

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a pretty one sided fight in the
cards, but it was a really good

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fight. And dam Rodriguez, as
you said, is not just one of

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the best American champions in the sport
whatever the way last he's one of the

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best pound for pound fighters in the
world. I don't agree with Eddie hearn

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All that often, but I listened
to his commentary when he was interviewed after

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the fight by our buddy Chris Mannix
on his own broadcast, and you know,

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he made a valid point. He
says, Look, you can talk

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about Terrence Crawford as a pound for
pound guy. He talked about Alexander Usak,

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who was the heavyweight champion. He
talked ABOUTI in a way, who

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was the undisputed champ at one hundred
and twenty two pounds. But if you're

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going to talk about those three guys, you know you need to throw the

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three letters bam, bam into that
conversation. I don't. I mean,

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he's not ahead of those three guys. But if you wanted to make an

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argument and tell me that you feel
like he's number four, I mean I

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might fight you a little bit because
I still have high regard for people like

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Bivol and Canelo and others, but
I can't argue too strongly against him.

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He's a really outstanding fighter. He's
got a full arsenal offensively, defensively,

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he can go back, go forward, both hands, speed, youth,

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really smart, great corner. You
know, with Robert Garcia running the show,

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he's just a real he's a very
cerebral fighter. Also, he really

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gets it. There's nothing not to
like about the young man he's putting together.

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I said it before the fight DJ, he's laying the groundwork for a

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Hall of Fame residume. Yes,
and so now he's coming into this fight.

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He was already a junior bandonweight champion
that he had vacated the WBC title

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to drop down in Wait at flyweight, he won a title, and then

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he beat up on Sonny Edwards to
unify two titles. Then he went back

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up in Wait to fight Estrada,
who had won the vacant WBC belt in

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when he vacant although he had been
the lineal champion. And he goes in

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and he flows through a Strada in
a terrific performance to capture the lineal and

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the WBC title. And now you
look at the resume that he's had.

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You know, belts are one thing. If it was all about belts,

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and you know, Adrian Broner would
be a first bout Hall of Famer.

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But it's not just about the belts. You know, Berner won titles in

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four weight classes, but never beat
a top, top guy. If you

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take a look at what this what
this guy has done in terms of Damn

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Rodriguez. He beats Carlos Squadros,
He knocks out Swissa katsar Rung beside.

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Granted they were in the toilet of
their careers, but no one ever did

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them the way he did them.
Number One, Now he goes into the

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flyweight division, he beats up he
doesn't just beats Sony Edwards. He dismantles

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him, He batters him, he
breaks his face, he pummels him,

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he takes away his undefeated record to
unify. Then he goes back up and

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he takes out the guy Estrada,
who was the king of that division,

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who never been stopped before, whose
losses were against the best buys in the

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world, against you know, Roman
Gonzales and Uh and Uh and others in

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that you know, Sir rungby Side, I mean, those types of opponents.

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And he didn't just win. He
fucking blew him away in a in

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a great action battle, knocked him
down in the fourth round, knocked him

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out with a devastating body shot in
the seventh round, and as you mentioned,

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he did take a flash knockdown in
round six, but that sort of

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added to the to the drama and
the excitement of the event. Although I

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never for one moment had the impression
that he was truly hurt in the sixth

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round with thin so I mean he
popped up smiling sometimes smiles or to feign

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that you're actually hurt. He wasn't
hurt, he wasn't stumbling around it.

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But it was it was a fight
you got, you got your money's worth

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from that, and what a great
crowd. Again. Phoenix continues to show

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itself as a big time fight town
and fight area, whether David Benavitez is

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fighting there and some of the other
recent times. You remember Jake Paul fought

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there and sold out what was it
Anderson Silva for that fight. So they

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had a loud, roaring crowd there. And again, we're not gonna make

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this guy out to be invincible.
Obviously, I'm not saying you're not.

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He also thought when he thought on
the Edwards in December, it was in

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Glendale, which is right next door
to Phoenix Base right there, so you

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know, it is an excellent uh
fight region. So the fight itself was

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terrific, The performance was outstanding.
Uh. You know one thing that that

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that was pretty clear in the post
fight commentary is that Wan Francisco Astrada had

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the right to an immediate rematch.
He said he's going to exercise them multiple

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times. Eddie Hearn said that he
had that right. Bam said he had

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that right. They're all willing and
ready to do that fight again in the

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fall. Uh Strata, in his
comments that were translated, said that he

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he made a mistake. He knows
what the mistake was. He should have

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boxed a little bit more earlier instead
of going right into the battle. So

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we're gonna probably see the rematch in
the fall. I mean, I guess

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it can't be too mad about it. It does irritate me though that it

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has to happen. I feel like
rematches should be uh sort of more where

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it's the type of thing where the
fans want it. That said, it's

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a popular fight, people really want
to see it again, not because it's

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mandate. It should be more organic, I guess if it comes about.

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But if there's gonna be the rematch, so be it. Obviously, if

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you listen to what Rodriguez said,
he would he would prefer to unify in

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the next fight against the winner of
the July seventh fight in Tokyo. That's

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going to be for two of the
belts in the way class between Kazuto Aoka

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and Martinez. So there's that possibility
if if the rematch doesn't take place.

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Because BAM's gonna bring money also,
and there's that's why he's gonna be able

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to get fights because at this stage
of the game with his popularity, his

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performances, the zones backing, Mattroom
is backing He's gonna be able to draw

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the guys to fight him who don't
otherwise make big money in this one hundred

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and fifteen pou Way class. Now
let's get chowy. Now that's the fight,

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That's what the future lies. They
also talked about a fantasy fight in

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the long distant future of Noya in
a way, which is maybe something a

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couple of years down the road,
but at the moment that ain't happening.

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So we have to discuss TJ my
least favorite topic to discuss on the on

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the Recap podcast, And what do
you think that let's see, is it

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having to go to dental surgery?
No, having to do your taxes?

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We don't normally discuss that on the
podcast. No having to sit through another

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Trump Biden debate. No, how
about bad judging dot com, dot next

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dot org Rayphaiel, what is this
card from the Mexican judge? I,

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honest to god, well, but
the one the one that gave estrata like

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the first four rounds. I legitimately
thought when I saw that card, he's

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marking them in the wrong column.
But the wrong fighter. All Right,

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I'm gonna say it before you say
it. At what point are we gonna

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publicly fire one of these guys.
We don't have to flog them. We

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don't have the time to an ant
heel and pour kool aid on them.

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At what point are you gonna say
you're never working another title fight? I

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mean, I don't know. If
you say you're never working a fight again,

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you never working a fight again.
No, never say another title fight

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again. That's not to me the
same thing. The point is, if

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the person has shown a reasonable career
thus far, you at least put him

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into some training, You go over
it, you try to rehabilitate them.

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I do believe people deserve a second
chance, But it's getting to the point

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where it's just fucking comedy at this
point, because you know, no matter

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whether it's a decision or not.
Got almost every big time fight there's some

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fucked up score that you just can't
wrap your mind around. Now, let's

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go through this in order. Yep. So Steve Morrow is the United States

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judge that was on the panel.
He had to fight normal. I'm looking

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at the scorecard. He gave the
first four rounds to uh Bam Rodriguez,

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including a round four where he scored
the first knockdown of the fight, and

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then he gave him the fifth round
of the fight, and he gave us

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ten to eight round appropriately because as
Trada dropped Bam in round six, that

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seemed to be the proper way of
scoring the fight. That's how I scored

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the fight. That's how lots of
people I saw online score the fight.

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That's to be the right score.
Fifty eight fifty four. Let me let

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me interject, there's no planet where
Bam Rodriguez is not winning the fight entering

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the seventh round. Period continue on. Okay, now, let's go to

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our good pal, mister Robert Tapper, from the greats, their great country

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of Canada, our our dear friends
north of the border. I got nothing

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but love for Canada, right,
been there many times. We love,

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we love the hockey. Been been
up there for vacations, Toronto and Montreal,

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Niagara Falls. I grew up a
few hours from the Canadian border.

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I love Canada. You know,
I'm almost ready to break into Oh Canada.

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Oh you just did it, you
just went there. But they should

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fucking deport Robert Tapper. Okay,
wait, wait, wait, I want

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people, I want people fired as
judges. You want him deport it?

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Okay, continue, all right,
So Robert Tapper, we haven't even gone

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to the third judge yet, but
he's got cover because he as fucked up

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and stupid and shitty. As his
scorecard is, it's actually not even nearly

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as bad as the one we're about
to talk about. But on Taper's card,

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he's got the fight going into to
the knockout round. He's got it

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fifty six to fifty six. That
makes absolutely no fucking sense. Did I

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mention to you there's no planet where
Bam Rodriguez is not winning the fight in

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entering the seventh round. I believe
I mentioned. I'm still looking at the

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card. Here he gives Estrada rounds
one and two. Now, you might

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be able to make the argument that
he won the first round. If there

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was any other round other than the
knockdown round that you could probably give him,

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maybe it's the first round. He
gave him the first rounds, then

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he gave Bam three, four,
and five, which were totally dominating rounds,

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and then obviously the ten eight round
in the knockdown round. After that,

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Now to fifty six to fifty six
is fucked up. That's bad,

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Yes, but it's me. It's
like his shit's like just that's like an

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annoyance based on what we're about to
talk about. So we're leave my friend

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from Canada alone for a minute.
Right now, Let's go to our our

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man, Javier Camacho from the wonderful
nation of Mexico. I love Mexico.

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Loved the food, right, been
there many times on vacation, covered fights

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in the bull ring in Cancun.
Yes, love love my my uh my

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father in law with the time share
in Cabo San Lucas. Been there many

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times, nothing but love for my
my Mexican brothers. One of the port

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cities on the Love Boat, I
believe it was. It's outstanding Mexico.

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I love Mexico. Now nation fucking
the port Camacho? Is this? This

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is the most unconsionable card I can
read. This is like fucking This is

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CJ. Ross level horribleness. Okay, this is just pathetic. He gave

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the first three rounds to a strata. He almost got knocked down and got

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badly hurt in round three, and
he gave him that round. That's fucked

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up. He at least got the
fourth round, right, because Bam had

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to get a knockdown actually win the
round, so he got that. He

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did give him the fifth round ten
to nine. And then this is another

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crazy thing. In the sixth round, which was the round in which Astrada

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dropped Dam Rodriguez, he did something
that's not against the rules but highly unusual

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is he only scored a ten to
nine in favor of Estrata. I guess

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in his opinion it was so dominant, but I didn't think it was dominant.

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It was only the knockdown, because
even after the knockdown, you know

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it was competitive, but it wasn't
like Bam came back and soup. So

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the math again through sixth round,
so headed to the seventh round is what

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he has a Strata I had fifty
seven to fifty six, which is one

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of the most fucked up things I've
ever seen. I felt like I'm doing

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like an acid trip when I look
at this squorecard. Now again, you

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gotta fire somebody accountability. You got
to say you're no longer working championship fights.

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And when you start just doing this, then you're going to put people

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on notice that if you're there for
whatever incompetiti corrupt or whatever reason. Just

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you know, Christmas treeing is what
we called it on scantron tests and multiple

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choice tests. If you're just Christmas
treeing your scorecard, you're not gonna rep

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championship fights. And it's incumbent on
the Arizona Commission, the organizations, everybody.

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They won't do anything about it.
They won't, they won't give I

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want to hear I'd be willing to
give heavier Camacho the floor to explain,

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like in round three, four and
five, we're so overwhelmingly dominant for Bam

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that you're like, the fight's fucking
over. I mean, he did come

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back and get the knockdown on six, but he was beating the living shit

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out of Estrada in those three rounds
and he actually gave one of them.

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It just is it's such an unconsortable
I mean, I don't really get where

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that worked up about that shit much
anymore, but this one just really pissed

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me off because the fucking draw score
card was terrible and the one that had

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him winning is even worse. But
what do we say Estrada brought who his

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two judges, his right and his
left, particularly the body shot with the

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left and it didn't matter. It
didn't matter, and so congrats to him

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and we'll see what he does next. So it's gonna be the rematch.

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And how soon will that rematch happen? Is it like a September October thing?

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Is it a November December thing?
It'll be this fault. That's the

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bottom line. We shall see,
all right. The cold feature fight is

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the fighter who BAM had beaten in
his most immediate title win, and that

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was Sonny Edwards of England. As
you and I discussed on the bet US

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show back on Friday, we foresaw
that this would be a distance fight,

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with Edwards winning two guys that don't
have huge punching power Adrian Curiel's one punch

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knockout a side of Nat Shinga to
win the title. Not Shinga regained the

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title knocking him out, and so
Edwards was cruising along, was winning some

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rounds and then we had a gnarly
nasty flash of heads that basically renders the

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fight over. Unlike the tim Zus
situation, Edwards is like, look,

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I'm good, I can't see,
I'm believe everywhere and we go to the

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cars, right, yeah, I
mean, look, we talked about ahead

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of time. This was the fight
where you have Sonny Edwards coming off getting

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battered by Bam and losing the Flyway
title in December. He needed a win.

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Yet Adrian Curie all who had come
out of nowhere to upset on Shinga

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by knockout, but then lost by
knockout in the immediate rematch, and so

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he moves up in wait, he
needs to win. You don't want to

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lose two in a row. But
it seemed evident to me that Sonny Edwards

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as the bigger fighter, as the
way way slicker, more experienced fighter,

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the better boxer by you know,
by multiples, that this was the type

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of fight that Sonny Edwards is going
to probably dominate, and when by decision,

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that's exactly what happened. The only
thing that was sort of the the

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monkey wrench in the whole situation was
that terrible head clash that caused the fight

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to be stopped. It was it
was a really really really terrible cut.

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I mean it was deep and it
was long, and it was wide,

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and it was in a bad spot
right by like between his eye, ye

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hear his nose, Like it was
a vertical cut like they were showing it

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on the on the on the replay, it was like they were making it

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talk that so wide almost go up, so discussed horrific. So, you

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know, so Sonny gets the decision. It was maybe a little more gruesome

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than to expect that. I figured
he would just cruise to the twelve round

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decision. He won going away,
and uh it was in ninety to eighty

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two, eighty eight, eighty four, and then of course there was one

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outlier card which actually had it eighty
seven eighty five, which seemed dizarre to

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me because Sonny Edwards, who was
way faster, way more technical, way

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longer with his jab and uh,
just much more. There's an unconfirmed before

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that Camacho scored the fight one oh
six eighty nine for career out go ahead.

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So Sonny Edward's look, he gets
to win. It wasn't maybe,

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uh, you know, the the
most exciting fight in the world. But

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unfortunately for Sonny, uh you know, he's gonna be off for a bit.

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That was a rugged, rutal,
brutal, terrible cut. I mean,

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honestly, it's going to be months
before that stuff's ready to go.

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He may be sitting down plastic surgeon, plastic stenergy. That's probably a four

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or five month cut at least based
on the how Definitely gotta let it,

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heal it. He's a good talker, they've used him on commentary before,

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so he gets the victory. We'll
see what his future is at Flood.

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Anything else from the de Zone show
or shall we move on? We shall

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move on. Let's move on to
the ESPN Top rank boxing card in Miami,

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a late night Saturday night where Teja
Fimo Lopez, as expected, dominated

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Steve Claggett, who did not offer
a lot retaining his WBO Junior welterweight title.

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Lopez busier Lopez landing consistently with the
lead right hand. The only question

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mark, and we addressed this leading
in on our preview and on the vet

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Us show, is is the punching
power going to translate at some point for

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him at one and now the man
after the fight fact is talking about after

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the fight's over with about wanting to
move up to one forty seven. I

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was a little again disappointed is the
wrong word, but I'm just questioning what

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the punching power is that he couldn't
get Claggett out of there. Couldn't knock

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him down, couldn't stop him.
He was clearly dominating the fight. What

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are your thoughts in the recap?
Well, I've said this before about other

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fights. I've never been one to
hold it against a guy if he can't

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score a knockout. Now, to
me, the knockouts the bonus. I

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mean, you'd like to see it, especially when you do all the talking

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and the bragging that certain fighters do
about it. But to me, it's

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not like a disqualifying thing. Just
because he didn't score a knocket against Clagg,

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it doesn't mean he couldn't compete in
heavier weight classes. I mean,

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I'll give you I'm not making a
comparison between the two of them in terms

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of their abilities. But like I
look at like a Parnel Whitaker. You

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know, a brilliant fighter won world
titles in a bunch of weight classes undisputed

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at lightweight. You know, walterweight
champion, moved up and you know briefly

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held the Jermim Midlewhight Talle because he
couldn't get any competition in the lower weight

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division one forty champion. The point
is he never knocked anybody out, and

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nobody held it against him, So
I'm not gonna hold it against him because

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Teve Fimo Lopez didn't stop Steve Kagge
at a guy who had going into the

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fight seven losses, but only didn't
stopped one time. So he'd already shown

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over the course of his career,
a long fifteen year career, sixteen year

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career, that he can take a
punch even if he wasn't fighting the elite

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fighter. So you know he did. Lopez did win basically every single round

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there wasn't That was one, thank
god, where there wasn't any kind of

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00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:59,160
nonsense with the cards. Two of
the judges had a clean sweep one eight

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one judge one round to give the
school Steve Claggy, which I can see.

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He was very active and busy and
this pressure, pressure, pressure.

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But here's the thing. The reason
why it is understandable if you're gonna be

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disappointed in the performance is because when
the fight was me Remember, he's coming

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off of an absolutely terrible performance against
Jermaine Ortiz in February, where a lot

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of people question whether he should have
gotten the win. I thought Ortiz won

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the fight. I was not alone, but it was a horrible fight,

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00:21:26,279 --> 00:21:30,880
and Ortiz moved and and you know, he ran around and try to just

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00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:33,039
try to frustrate him throughout the fight, and you know, touch and move

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00:21:33,079 --> 00:21:37,079
and that kind of thing. So
the antidote to that, if you're the

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00:21:37,799 --> 00:21:41,799
folks that are running Ti Femo's career
and matchmaking and all that, is,

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00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:45,640
let's get him as far away from
that negativity as possible. Let's give him

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00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:49,279
an opponent who's going to be right
in front of him, who's gonna do

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00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:53,920
nothing about moving, dancing side to
side. He doesn't even know as what

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00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:57,920
the word lateral means. I mean, he's just gonna stand right in front

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00:21:57,960 --> 00:22:00,960
of you and come at you like
a bull, and you can punch him

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00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:04,240
like an open target. And that's
what they gave him, Steve Claggan.

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That's the reason, Steve. They
didn't pick Steve clagg because he's some great

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contender, And there was the reason
they picked him and didn't pick the other

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opponents that were brought to the table. They didn't pick Kenneth Simms for a

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00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:19,680
reason, right, They didn't pick
Raymond Morettaia for a reason. They picked

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Steve Klaggett because he is going to
offer the best possible chance for two things.

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To make it an exciting fight because
of the amount of punches that are

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gonna be thrown and landed, and
that TFMO is gonna have so many clear

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00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:34,559
openings he's gonna stop the guy.
Well, that didn't happen, So that's

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00:22:34,559 --> 00:22:37,200
why you have to question it.
It was made to order for him to

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00:22:37,279 --> 00:22:41,680
do a knockout victory, and he
was not able to not only not get

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00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:44,960
it, but as you mentioned,
never came close to hurting him or knocking

353
00:22:45,039 --> 00:22:47,240
him down or anything like that.
Now, part of that you got to

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00:22:47,279 --> 00:22:48,519
give Steve Klaggett, the old man
thirty five years old, you know,

355
00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:52,279
nine years older than TV Molopez.
You got to give him some credit.

356
00:22:52,319 --> 00:22:56,720
He had a motor, he had
stamina. There was not a lot left

357
00:22:56,720 --> 00:23:00,160
on his punches by the later rounds
because he was obviously expending a tremendous out

358
00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:02,240
of energy with that. You know, go get your kind of style.

359
00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:04,000
So I do tip my hat to
clack it. I'm gonna tell you right

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00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:07,480
now, if you're a promoter out
there or a manager and you've got a

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young, up and coming one hundred
and forty pound fighter and you want to

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00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:14,920
give him a test, Steve Klaggett's
the guy to give him the rounds and

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00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,880
give him the test because he's gonna
he's gonna give anybody a tough fight even

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if he doesn't win. So he
didn't. He didn't disgrace himself at all,

365
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:23,240
not to say Ta Femo disgrace himself, but so from the standpoint of

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00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:26,200
not getting the knockout, which was
the whole concept of making the match first,

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00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:29,960
that was a little bit disappointing.
But I did think that t Fmo

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fought a good fight. He fought
under control, He threw and landed the

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00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:37,279
most punches in his entire career according
to copybox, and he won every single

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round. He didn't get injured.
So I'm a little bit I read some

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of the post fight things that people
said on social media. I read some

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of the other journalists that wrote stories
about the fight, and I don't think

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I'm getting soft in my old age
as as a heavier comat show and might

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00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:56,640
might let you know, but uh, you know, I thought, I

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didn't think it was a terrible performance
or anything like out that fought a good

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fight and did did what he could
do. And even if you don't get

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the knock it if you went every
single round. You've done your job,

378
00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:08,519
and it wasn't like it was a
boring fight. Now it did sort of

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00:24:08,519 --> 00:24:11,880
in the last handful of rounds,
kind of degenerate in my mind where I'm

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00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:15,720
watching the same round after un I
felt like and he didn't and he didn't

381
00:24:15,759 --> 00:24:18,640
stop on the accelerator, He didn't
get him trapped in a corner and brutalize

382
00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:22,640
him. He didn't do any of
that. He just did enough to score

383
00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:25,119
points, score not get hit some. Now he did get hit some.

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00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:27,839
I mean he had both both eyebrows
were a little puffy at the end of

385
00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:33,000
the fight. But Againe for the
sizzle, for how good he looked against

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00:24:33,079 --> 00:24:37,559
Josh Taylor. Uh, this is
easy for me to say. We talk

387
00:24:37,599 --> 00:24:40,640
about all the time, go flatten
somebody, Go flatten somebody like this guy

388
00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:42,440
and get everybody's rated. Isn't easier
said than done. I mean, he's

389
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:47,480
now five he's got five fights as
a junior Welterwait, he's won all five

390
00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:49,440
of them. He did, let
me say it. Let me he did

391
00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:53,119
stop Pedro Camp in his debut.
But he's gone the route against good fighter

392
00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:56,680
Sander Martin, Josh Taylor, Jamaine
Ortizan. Now, uh, you're gonna

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00:24:56,680 --> 00:25:00,200
be in a sentence with good fighters. Let me just let me finish.

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00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:03,519
He's a little bit less than those
guys. Okay, but let me say

395
00:25:03,519 --> 00:25:06,319
one more thing. You're gonna blab
after the fight about one forty seven,

396
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:08,079
Well to wait this, wanting to
fight that, wanting to fight this.

397
00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:11,240
Where have you demonstrated that you can
punch at one forty seven? If you

398
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:15,000
can't punch at one forty well again, I'm gonna say it again. You

399
00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:19,079
just because you can't punch doesn't mean
you can't compete and win in the division.

400
00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:22,039
I just used the example of Paronel
Whitaker. You did you? Okay,

401
00:25:22,039 --> 00:25:25,559
So now I'm gonna swatch you that
you are using one of the all

402
00:25:25,599 --> 00:25:29,640
time great fights. I'm using the
exhausts to exaggerate my point. I understand.

403
00:25:29,759 --> 00:25:33,079
He was an elusive, tremendous boxer. That's the style in which he

404
00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:37,400
thought. This guy style is not
that. This guy style is he lands

405
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:41,279
he's in front of you. He
got knocked down by George Cambosis because of

406
00:25:41,319 --> 00:25:45,119
it and got brutalized, and a
lot of that fight cut up and beat

407
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,680
up. Because that's the way you're
you're not being fair. You're not being

408
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:49,519
fair in that way. We all
know, and I'm not defending theme all

409
00:25:49,519 --> 00:25:55,440
of us. He had an obvious
and clear provable major physical ailment that he

410
00:25:55,480 --> 00:25:57,000
went into the fight with. So, yes, all the things you said

411
00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:02,440
are true, but there has to
be so type of context to the situation.

412
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:06,680
So all I'm making the point your
TJ is the following. Just because

413
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:11,920
you cannot be a big puncher at
one does not mean you cannot compete a

414
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:15,599
hang at one forty seven. Now
that said, he's talking about Terrence Crawford.

415
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:19,759
While I appreciate the uh, the
the you know, the desire and

416
00:26:19,799 --> 00:26:23,400
the and the mariage, Crawford destroys
him in four or five rounds. I

417
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:29,279
totally agree with that. Okay,
but we don't agree on a lot sometimes.

418
00:26:29,279 --> 00:26:32,160
But that's that's true. That's true
enough. But that fight's not happening

419
00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:34,359
because he Themo Lopez. If he
goes to welterweight, he's gonna get to

420
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:38,400
a welterweight division where Terrence Crawford has
moved on to the junior middleweight division.

421
00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:41,960
He's never gonna see one forty seven
again. He's gonna fight Israel Magemov for

422
00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:45,079
the WBA belt in the August,
and presumably he's gonna have a you know

423
00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:48,799
a little bit of a run in
that weight class win or lose against Maduev.

424
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:55,200
So the Crawford fight is highly unlikely. The more likely possibility if he

425
00:26:55,279 --> 00:26:57,359
decides to move up, and this
is from what Top Rank has told me

426
00:26:57,799 --> 00:27:03,119
since the fight, they're probably going
to try to make. Okay, well,

427
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:06,640
let's back up. When Terrence Crawford
gets to junior middleweight, the belts

428
00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:10,039
that he still holds in the welterweight
division are going to become vacant. You

429
00:27:10,079 --> 00:27:12,160
know, he's been stripped away of
the IBF and he was made champion in

430
00:27:12,240 --> 00:27:17,880
recess by the WBC, but the
WBA and the WBO eventually, you know,

431
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:22,599
they'll do something similar day whatever.
So when the WBO belt becomes vacant,

432
00:27:22,599 --> 00:27:27,480
which it will, Brian Norman,
who's the young undefeated fighter that's with

433
00:27:27,519 --> 00:27:33,160
Top Rank that won that interim title
back a few weeks ago, is going

434
00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:36,039
to become the full champion. He's
with Top Rank. That's the fight the

435
00:27:36,079 --> 00:27:40,000
Top Rank is talking about making for
this fall. Ste Fimo Lopez against Brian

436
00:27:40,039 --> 00:27:45,359
Norman for the WBO welterweight title,
So that's a more likely scenario. Now.

437
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,279
Brian Norman does not have a big
name, but he's certainly put on

438
00:27:48,319 --> 00:27:51,839
a tremendous performance when he won that
belt. Yeah, and you know,

439
00:27:51,839 --> 00:27:55,559
knowing his team, it seems like
they would be willing to make that kind

440
00:27:55,559 --> 00:27:56,599
of match, you know, as
long as obviously they're paid. He's twenty

441
00:27:56,640 --> 00:28:00,920
six and oh he's only twenty three
years old. He looked at so fantastic

442
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:04,519
knocking out Giovanni Santition to win that
belt back in May, a shocking win

443
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:10,519
because Santiago had looked so good in
the previous fight with what with roacha with

444
00:28:10,559 --> 00:28:14,480
Alexis Rocha, and then Norman put
it on him. So yes, listen,

445
00:28:14,559 --> 00:28:18,400
santwin was undefeated, and that's and
I know what you're saying, that's

446
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:21,359
a winnable fight for Tayo Fima Lopez. If that's the fight, and a

447
00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:22,839
winnable fight for Brian Norman, it
seems to me. I mean, so

448
00:28:23,319 --> 00:28:26,039
you know, you know, even
before he stops Santio, he was ahead

449
00:28:26,039 --> 00:28:29,759
on all the cards by pretty wide
margins. Well, there was one close

450
00:28:29,839 --> 00:28:30,920
card, two of them were pretty
wide. Because there's always a fucked up

451
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:34,920
score. But the point is,
uh, I'm not saying that's a mega

452
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:38,680
fight, but that seems like a
very makeable, reasonable logical fight. If

453
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,440
tia Fima Lopez is insistent upon wanting
to leave the one forty pound way class,

454
00:28:42,559 --> 00:28:45,799
here's the thing, TJ. Let's
say he decides he wants to stay

455
00:28:45,799 --> 00:28:48,839
at one hundred and forty. You
tell me what's the big fight for him?

456
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:52,240
I just don't see now he mentioned
Pitbull Cruise. He said, I

457
00:28:52,319 --> 00:28:56,279
you know, this was him talking
to Mark Kriegel in an interview on the

458
00:28:56,319 --> 00:29:00,000
broadcast, talking about how if he
could get a fight with Pitbull Cruise,

459
00:29:00,279 --> 00:29:03,480
that he would even be willing to
take less money just to get the opportunity.

460
00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:07,079
Pitbull obviously has a big fan base. But again, Pitbull's fighting on

461
00:29:07,119 --> 00:29:10,839
the August third card that Crawford is
on. If he wins, I guess

462
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:14,079
you never say never, that would
be I'd listen. That's of the guys

463
00:29:14,079 --> 00:29:18,119
who have the belts at one forty, that's probably the most interesting fight.

464
00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:21,519
He's not going to get a Liam
Paro. It's not a fight that anybody

465
00:29:21,519 --> 00:29:23,960
here would care about. Alberto Pueo, you know, he just was elevated

466
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:26,039
he's got other things he's got to
deal with. We're going to talk about

467
00:29:26,079 --> 00:29:30,359
that a little bit later. So
Ti Fimo in a unification against Pitbull Cruise,

468
00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:33,759
I'd be down for that. If
other than that, I'm not sure

469
00:29:33,799 --> 00:29:37,000
what else here is at one forty. Devin Haney is going to be out

470
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:38,519
for a little while. I wouldn't
mind seeing that, but he doesn't have

471
00:29:38,559 --> 00:29:41,759
any interest. It seems like he's
going to take a break understandably. You

472
00:29:41,759 --> 00:29:45,799
know, Ryan Garcia has left the
Way class and he's suspended anyway for the

473
00:29:45,799 --> 00:29:48,440
next number of months. So I'm
not sure what else is out there at

474
00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:52,799
one forty that would be of a
serious note. So I think we're going

475
00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:56,920
to see him in Brian Norman in
the Fall. Interesting all right. On

476
00:29:56,000 --> 00:30:02,440
the undercard, as expected, Roba
c Ramirez did get his knockout when he

477
00:30:02,519 --> 00:30:07,920
delivered a vicious uppercut and finished off
Brandon Leon Benitez, and so that now

478
00:30:07,079 --> 00:30:14,279
sets up firmly the rematch with Rafael
Espinosa to come late this year. Tell

479
00:30:14,319 --> 00:30:17,559
me what you saw out of Robas
Ramirez. He had a huge partisan crowd

480
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:21,279
in Miami, as we expected,
big Cuban population. Heck, Miami's about

481
00:30:21,279 --> 00:30:25,079
thirty minutes to the south of where
I'm sitting right now, and they were

482
00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:30,200
roaring for him throughout that cold feature
and that win. He did what he

483
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:33,000
was supposed to do. Absolutely,
I thought Robas Heirom has looked absolutely sensational.

484
00:30:33,039 --> 00:30:36,000
I mean, granted, you have
to take into account the level of

485
00:30:36,039 --> 00:30:40,400
the opponent that he was fighting.
Maybe he's refocused and remotivated after the upset

486
00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:45,039
loss to Espinosa that took place in
December, but Robusirimirez when he's on his

487
00:30:45,079 --> 00:30:48,920
game, is as dangerous and as
sharp and as talented as anybody in the

488
00:30:48,039 --> 00:30:52,839
entire sport. But you know,
you look at the record and you're like,

489
00:30:52,839 --> 00:30:55,400
Okay, he lost to pro debut. We've litigated that, we know

490
00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:57,680
what happened against Espinosa, and now
I mean, he's got a chance to,

491
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:02,640
you know, to show us that
that it's that he is the real

492
00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:04,000
deal if he goes in there and
he and he takes care of Espinosa in

493
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:07,000
the rematch, which is gonna be
tough based on what we saw the first

494
00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:10,279
time around and what we've seen from
Espinola since in his victory last week.

495
00:31:10,839 --> 00:31:15,640
With that size he has but against
Brandon Benitez Robes Heerman has looked absolutely sensational.

496
00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:18,000
I mean the knockout, that's a
knockout of the ear candidate. By

497
00:31:18,039 --> 00:31:22,799
the way, it was a massive
uppercut, and he rocked his head back

498
00:31:22,839 --> 00:31:26,519
and forth so much he made him
like the human pez Dispenser. I mean,

499
00:31:26,599 --> 00:31:32,160
that was a vicious, vicious,
vicious knockout. He landed the uppercut

500
00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:34,359
and then a little right hand behind
it, and you know, he never

501
00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:37,920
know what was coming, and it
was the way he went down, and

502
00:31:37,839 --> 00:31:41,759
that was a sensational knockout. So
he gets the rematch, and so he

503
00:31:41,839 --> 00:31:45,440
did his part. Espinosa did his
part in the previous week, and we'll

504
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:47,640
see them fight this fall. I
don't know the date, they'll probably do

505
00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:52,400
it in like November ish, and
uh, hopefully we'll see another good fight

506
00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:56,400
because the first one was spectacular.
And again credit Espinoza for a lot of

507
00:31:56,440 --> 00:32:00,400
reasons. But that knockdown that he
suffered early in the fight with Ramirez from

508
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:02,359
that uppercut, I believe that's that
are similar type punch, and he was

509
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:07,119
staggering all over the ring, recovered
and then out fought Ramirez the rest of

510
00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:09,960
the way, dropping weight and won. So there's a lot of intrigue.

511
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:16,559
Hey, let's hear it for two
guys being active in between both getting impressive

512
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:20,160
knockout wins, and now they'll fight
each other. We like that. It's

513
00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:22,960
compelling. I know it's two it's
a Mexican against a Cuban, it's two

514
00:32:22,039 --> 00:32:24,839
non Americans, But I'm intrigued by
this. If you're a fighter fan,

515
00:32:25,079 --> 00:32:29,720
how are you not intrigued by this? But I've never cared what the nationalities.

516
00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:31,839
You're talking to a guy, by
the way, that used to back

517
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:36,799
in the in the pre YouTube days, and even before there were DVDs,

518
00:32:36,799 --> 00:32:40,880
I was getting VHS tapes of freaking
World Island and you're self described as the

519
00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:45,720
Far East sicco. That would have
all the fights sent to you on VHS

520
00:32:45,759 --> 00:32:47,440
back in the day. But I'm
just saying to you, they could have

521
00:32:47,559 --> 00:32:51,759
that fight in Miami, they could
have that fight in Phoenix, they could

522
00:32:51,799 --> 00:32:52,839
have that fight wherever they want to
have it, have it in Las Vegas,

523
00:32:52,839 --> 00:32:57,160
and it's going to be interesting and
intriguing. So good on both of

524
00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:01,000
those guys. All right again,
Shakur Stevenson conversation with Dan coming up shortly.

525
00:33:01,079 --> 00:33:06,759
Let's wrap up with a couple of
more recaps that includes have you heard

526
00:33:06,799 --> 00:33:09,680
that Nico Ali Walsh is the grandson
of Muhammad Ali? Can I just say

527
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:14,559
this? We have a lot to
cover with his win, his revenge win,

528
00:33:15,119 --> 00:33:20,839
his sixth round decision win over sona
Akali. But my god, I

529
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:24,319
counted from the beginning of the build
up with the fight, when the fighters

530
00:33:24,319 --> 00:33:28,480
were walking into the ring, all
the way up until the fourth round.

531
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:35,039
Joe Tessitour mentioned nine different times the
grandson of Muhammad Ali, Muhammad Ali's grandson,

532
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:37,599
Muhammed Ali's grandson, the grandson of
Mhammad Ali. Joe, we get

533
00:33:37,599 --> 00:33:40,799
it, ESPN, we get it, top rank, we get it.

534
00:33:40,839 --> 00:33:45,640
You don't have to say it nine
times in four rounds. We get it.

535
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:50,200
I love Joe. Joe's a friend
of the pod. Joe listens to

536
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:53,799
the pods. Thank you, so
I think you he just got a little

537
00:33:53,799 --> 00:33:58,119
excited about that. But look,
he is the grandson Mohamma Ali. That's

538
00:33:58,119 --> 00:34:00,000
the reason why anybody would give a
guest. I was not aware of that.

539
00:34:00,440 --> 00:34:02,799
I'm thanking you for. So let's
discussed the fight for a minute.

540
00:34:02,799 --> 00:34:07,640
I mean the pressure up first of
all. I I first, if you

541
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:10,280
ever meet Nico aliwash wife met and
talked to several times. I saw him

542
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:14,519
a couple of weeks ago when I
was out in Vegas at the at the

543
00:34:14,639 --> 00:34:19,000
Tank Davis fight. He was at
that celebration for the MGM's one hundredth championship

544
00:34:19,039 --> 00:34:23,559
event. He's a very very nice
kid. He's very approachable. He understands

545
00:34:23,639 --> 00:34:27,760
the hoopla. He gets it about
his grandfather. He's not trying to be

546
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,599
his grandfather. I respect him a
lot for what he's trying to do in

547
00:34:30,639 --> 00:34:36,079
this business because it's not easy.
Because you have that gigantic target on your

548
00:34:36,119 --> 00:34:43,079
back. You're not just any old
offspringer grandkid of a You're the grandson of

549
00:34:43,119 --> 00:34:46,920
Muhammad Ali. That's the biggest name. Five times that we've said it.

550
00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:51,920
So but but again, he has
such a good nature about it. He

551
00:34:51,920 --> 00:34:54,159
he embraces it. And why shouldn't
he. That's uh, that's grandpa.

552
00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:58,119
Okay. So he's trying to do
his own thing. He just so happens

553
00:34:58,119 --> 00:35:01,360
that because of his bloodlines, he
gets more attend then your average fighter.

554
00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:05,440
That was nine and one or ten
and one going into the fight. Now

555
00:35:05,559 --> 00:35:10,400
he lost a very close decision majority
a sixth round or two SONA CALLI back

556
00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:14,599
in August of last year. He's
won a couple of fights since, and

557
00:35:14,679 --> 00:35:19,000
so they finally made this rematch,
and it was close. But I thought

558
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:21,719
that Nico did a hell of a
job in that fight. He punched,

559
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:25,079
he boxed again, it's at a
certain level, but he got a knock

560
00:35:25,199 --> 00:35:30,280
down. The knockdown was vital for
the Actually knockdown was the difference in terms

561
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:32,440
of winning or a draw if he
had not. If he didn't get that

562
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:37,840
extra point for the knockdown, it
would have been a draw. More impressively,

563
00:35:37,159 --> 00:35:42,599
the balls that he showed by dislocating
his shoulder in the final round and

564
00:35:42,599 --> 00:35:45,360
then jumping up and down and hitting
himself on the shoulder to try to put

565
00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:47,519
it back. Let me ask you, now, he didn't know that it

566
00:35:47,519 --> 00:35:52,360
was hurt because he didn't ever win
after him. Meanwhile, his left arm

567
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:55,199
is dangling by his side. You
have done this for so long. Have

568
00:35:55,400 --> 00:36:00,360
you ever seen a fighter trying to
hit his own older to knock it back

569
00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:06,079
in place, because that's what he
was clearly doing. He said it after

570
00:36:06,159 --> 00:36:08,360
the fight. I was trying to
knock it. He's never had that before.

571
00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:13,239
By the way, he knew it
was dislocated and he was literally trying

572
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:16,880
to punch it back into place while
keeping the distance from his opponent. I

573
00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:21,800
don't know in the forty five years
that I can coherently remember watching boxing that

574
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:27,800
I've ever seen that it was a
sixth round that sona Calli has got terrible

575
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:32,719
ring IQ because he did not notice
that his opponent had a not thrown a

576
00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:37,199
single left hand in round six and
b not only hadn't thrown, hadn't fainted

577
00:36:37,239 --> 00:36:42,119
with it, and basically had it
dangling by his side for virtually the entire

578
00:36:42,199 --> 00:36:45,559
round. If that's the case and
your man has your left hand and down,

579
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:49,159
why are you not attacking with your
right hand which was his punch anyway?

580
00:36:49,519 --> 00:36:52,360
And so I credit to Nico.
He fought that fight smart. He

581
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:57,800
just kept working on the other hand, his right hand, and he got

582
00:36:57,840 --> 00:37:00,079
the and I think he won the
last round even with the injury, to

583
00:37:00,159 --> 00:37:02,960
win the fight. So you know, I don't I don't seen the actual

584
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:06,639
scorecard, but the bottom line was
he pulled it out. I mean he

585
00:37:06,679 --> 00:37:08,639
was. It was close and it
was competitive, but he got to win,

586
00:37:08,679 --> 00:37:10,880
and you know, we move on
again. I don't know how far

587
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:15,320
he's going to go, but I
respect his work ethic. I like his

588
00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:19,960
commentary afterwards talking about how you know
that Jake Paul into that. You know,

589
00:37:20,039 --> 00:37:22,960
let's get into that, because that
was interesting. He said that he

590
00:37:22,119 --> 00:37:27,320
was offered and I assume he means
this July twentieth date that's coming in about

591
00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:30,519
three weeks for Tampa, for Jake
Paul to be the opponent, and he

592
00:37:30,519 --> 00:37:35,400
said he was offered a billion dollars
and he said, I'm not doing that.

593
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:37,079
I'm not being part of it.
I think he called it a circus.

594
00:37:37,079 --> 00:37:39,280
I'm not being part of the boxing
circus. So I found that works

595
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:44,039
though, because I found that interesting. Nico is one hundred and sixty pounder.

596
00:37:44,159 --> 00:37:45,840
Jake, you know, on the
low end as a one ninety pounder,

597
00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:50,559
so there's a big spread in weight. Horse Jake's coming down, maybe

598
00:37:50,559 --> 00:37:52,039
he gets down to one to eighty
five or something like that, but the

599
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:55,480
spread in the weight was a lot. But it wasn't He wasn't knocking Jake

600
00:37:55,559 --> 00:38:00,760
Paul in that sense. What he
was knocking was the comments that that t

601
00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:05,800
Fima Lopez apparently had made regarding him, and he did he took exception about

602
00:38:05,800 --> 00:38:07,119
that and said, I'm a real
fighter, you know. And I'm trying

603
00:38:07,119 --> 00:38:10,760
to do things the right way,
you know whatever. My grandfather's name is

604
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:15,199
UH and and so you got to
respect that. So again, I don't

605
00:38:15,199 --> 00:38:17,199
know how far Nico Ali Walsh is
gonna go, but I'm gonna root for

606
00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:21,559
him guts, big time guts with
the busted shoulder. Now, if he

607
00:38:21,599 --> 00:38:24,599
had to fight on multiple more rounds
with that shoulder, who knows what happens.

608
00:38:24,639 --> 00:38:28,039
But and Joe Tessitur was on it. And by the way, bravo

609
00:38:28,119 --> 00:38:30,320
to Chris al Jerry, who I
know. You know, I don't know

610
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:34,000
him. I know he's working with
our buddy Dan Canobio, and I love

611
00:38:34,079 --> 00:38:36,280
his commentary on and all this stuff
they're doing. But he was right on

612
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:39,719
it throughout the night. And he
was right on something is wrong with Walsh

613
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:43,679
because look at his left arm dangling, and he's not he's not raising the

614
00:38:43,719 --> 00:38:45,239
left arm, he's not using the
left arm anymore. He picked it up

615
00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:49,239
right away, So go to him
in there. Yeah. The good news

616
00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:52,639
about that and this was I got
the note from UH from a top rank

617
00:38:52,679 --> 00:38:55,519
after the fight that UH that the
doctor at the Inn had reset the arm

618
00:38:55,519 --> 00:38:59,159
and that they had sent Nico off
to the hospital just to get checked out.

619
00:38:59,159 --> 00:39:00,800
For you ever, have you ever
seen that done, Because I've been

620
00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:05,320
around in the NFL a bun with
the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, and it is

621
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:09,159
a painful thing in the moment.
But I have seen it where you leverage

622
00:39:09,280 --> 00:39:14,480
and stand in front of somebody and
wah pow, pop it back into place

623
00:39:14,519 --> 00:39:17,159
by drinking it back into place.
No fun for the person. When I

624
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:21,840
was when I was a kid in
summer camp one year, I was probably

625
00:39:22,199 --> 00:39:27,639
thirteen fourteen something like that, I
dislocated my shoulder and no, I know

626
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:29,960
exactly what it's like. So they
had to come over, and it's a

627
00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:32,079
doctor or somebody and they said,
Dan, look the other way, take

628
00:39:32,119 --> 00:39:35,800
a deep breath and whah hoow,
and they put it back in. I

629
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:38,079
was in and then I was in
like a sling for about That was like

630
00:39:38,119 --> 00:39:42,599
towards the end of the summer camp
and the last week of our camp it

631
00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:45,320
was a day camp, but the
last week we would go on a camping

632
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:47,559
trip for like the five days and
you know, up in the mountains and

633
00:39:49,079 --> 00:39:50,760
you know, on a lake and
the whole thing it was. It was

634
00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:53,239
always a great you know, great
fun and a thing we already looked forward

635
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:57,320
to for the end of the end
of the summer camp year. And I

636
00:39:57,360 --> 00:40:00,800
remember being there with the fucking sling
on my shoulder. I could do anything.

637
00:40:00,199 --> 00:40:02,199
But what it did help was I
because I had to sling on,

638
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:06,320
I could get out of having to
like go pick up the firewood and help,

639
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:07,960
you know, do all the manual
labor everybody else was doing. Because

640
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:10,639
I was all fucked up with my
arm. I would have rather done the

641
00:40:10,679 --> 00:40:14,880
manual labor and had my arm work
that week. But what you can identify

642
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:19,159
with the grandson of Muhammad Ailey,
you can you can identify with the grants

643
00:40:19,159 --> 00:40:22,159
of Muhammed Aley. We've made that
point. One more fight to go over

644
00:40:22,199 --> 00:40:25,559
and then here Shakur Stevenson in a
moment on the Recap podcast that is the

645
00:40:25,639 --> 00:40:30,119
Friday night win in Washington, d
C of Lamont Roach. He did what

646
00:40:30,599 --> 00:40:35,360
everybody really thought here he won,
and he won impressively multiple knock nowns tko

647
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:39,960
stoppage of Farodol McCrory of Ireland to
retain his WBA Junior lightweight title. What

648
00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:44,000
else here do we need to know
coming out of that, including what might

649
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:45,639
be next? Well, I think
that when you say that he did what

650
00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:49,320
everybody expect him to do, I
think you're only half right about that.

651
00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:51,880
And the reason I say this is
because, of course, when you bring

652
00:40:51,920 --> 00:40:55,519
an opponent like McCrory to your hometown
of Washington, d C. An opponent

653
00:40:55,559 --> 00:40:59,280
that, while he had a very
good record at sixteen and oh coming into

654
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:01,719
the fight, had never really been
tested, hadn't really fought a top opponent.

655
00:41:02,079 --> 00:41:05,639
And now you're you know, he's
getting this opportunity to fight for the

656
00:41:05,639 --> 00:41:07,480
world title, so you know you're
the hand pick guy and you're going to

657
00:41:07,519 --> 00:41:12,159
the enemy turf. But the thing
about it is, I've watched Lamont Roach

658
00:41:12,199 --> 00:41:15,519
for his entire career from day one. I've got to know Lama and his

659
00:41:15,599 --> 00:41:17,559
father. We you know, we
joke around because for many years, for

660
00:41:17,599 --> 00:41:21,199
most of his careers on all the
Golden Boys shows because they had signed him,

661
00:41:21,199 --> 00:41:23,440
and since we're both from the region, inevitably we're always on the same

662
00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:27,039
airplanes going to Vegas and coming back, so we would hang out in the

663
00:41:27,079 --> 00:41:30,719
airports together before and after his fights. They're very nice people. But the

664
00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:35,599
one thing about Lamont Roach has been
missing in his game. As talented as

665
00:41:35,639 --> 00:41:38,559
a as a boxer as he is
in terms of his amateur background, his

666
00:41:38,639 --> 00:41:43,960
skills, his tenacity, you know
that, that desire, you know,

667
00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:45,280
you know, you have to have
that. He just never was a big

668
00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:47,960
puncher, and that's that's been the
case. He doesn't have a ton of

669
00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:53,760
knockouts, but in this particular fight, he looked as good offensively. And

670
00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:58,519
I think I've probably seen literally every
single LaMotte Roach fight of his entire career,

671
00:41:58,679 --> 00:42:02,320
and Ben ringside for a number them. I was supposed to go to

672
00:42:02,360 --> 00:42:06,280
this fight and something ended up happening
on Friday, I got to cancel my

673
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:07,960
trip out to to into DC to
go to the fight, so I did

674
00:42:07,960 --> 00:42:10,599
watch it on the It was it
was the main event of the Probox TV

675
00:42:10,679 --> 00:42:15,719
card. They did a nice job
with their presentation. He scored three knockdowns

676
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:19,920
and knocked him out and looked absolutely
devastating with his with his h with his

677
00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:22,599
offensive arsenal he's he dropped him two
times with the body punches. The left

678
00:42:22,639 --> 00:42:28,159
hooks were spectacular. He just totally
dominated basically with the left hook, and

679
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:31,000
he took him out of there,
uh you know, in in largely with

680
00:42:31,079 --> 00:42:34,599
the left hook. I mean,
he just totally systematically beat him down and

681
00:42:34,639 --> 00:42:37,800
stopped him in round number eight when
the corner threw in the towel. I

682
00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:42,000
think it's the best performance Lamont Roach
has had his entire career, because even

683
00:42:42,039 --> 00:42:44,920
when he won the title, could
go back in his previous fight. That

684
00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:47,360
was last fall, that was on
one of the Showtime pay per view undercards,

685
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:52,159
back when it was David Benavite's against
Dimitri's Andre. He won the belt

686
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:57,559
from Hector Luis Garcia, but it
was not a particularly good fight, and

687
00:42:57,599 --> 00:43:00,119
it was kind of close, and
some people thought that Garcia wan. I

688
00:43:00,119 --> 00:43:02,280
believe it was a split decision.
If I'm not mistaken correct, that was

689
00:43:02,320 --> 00:43:07,400
his big win. But this was
a sensational performance. I mean, he

690
00:43:07,519 --> 00:43:12,039
had the confidence and he fulfilled the
dream we talked about in the preview.

691
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:14,920
Back in twenty seventeen, which was
the last time he had fought in his

692
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:17,159
home region. He'd fought out at
the MGM National Harbor, which is in

693
00:43:17,639 --> 00:43:21,480
Maryland, right over the river into
you know, from where he lives in

694
00:43:21,599 --> 00:43:24,480
Washington, close to where I live. I've been to many fights there and

695
00:43:24,519 --> 00:43:29,840
he headlined as a prospect on an
old ESPN two card when Golden Boy was

696
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:31,480
doing some show was on ESPN two
and said, you know what, someday

697
00:43:31,519 --> 00:43:36,000
I'm bringing a world championship I back
to my town. And it's taken until

698
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:39,719
twenty twenty four. But he fulfilled
the promise and the goal, and he

699
00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:43,360
looked really, really good. And
I'm going to tell you what I love

700
00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:45,039
about him. Also, he's not
looking at Duck and Dodge. He wants

701
00:43:45,079 --> 00:43:47,760
the best names. He was asked
afterwards about who he wants. He talked

702
00:43:47,760 --> 00:43:51,320
about, you know, bring on, I'd love to fight Emmanuel Navarette.

703
00:43:51,639 --> 00:43:54,559
And here's your thing. kJ.
This is a guy who is a promotional

704
00:43:54,559 --> 00:43:59,920
free agent. His father has this
promotion company. No excuse promotions. There

705
00:44:00,039 --> 00:44:01,840
the ones to put the event on. But he is open for business.

706
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:05,360
If Top Rank wants to sign with
him, or sign him, if if

707
00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:07,280
Golden Boy wants to bring him back, of Mattrum, who wants to work

708
00:44:07,320 --> 00:44:10,320
with him? You know, whoever
you name it, I mean, PBC

709
00:44:10,840 --> 00:44:15,119
whatever. He is open for any
of those types of fights. I think

710
00:44:15,159 --> 00:44:19,599
anybody that's got like good fighters at
one hundred and thirty pounds or say twenty

711
00:44:19,599 --> 00:44:23,719
six pounders that might move up,
why wouldn't you want to have LaMonte roach

712
00:44:23,760 --> 00:44:27,480
on your roster not to mention.
In fact, you know he's not going

713
00:44:27,559 --> 00:44:29,239
to break the bank. I mean
you got to pay him obviously. He

714
00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:30,800
his Royal Championship. He's not the
kind of guy that's going to be commanding

715
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:35,039
crazy, stupid money. The dollars
are going up. He gets a title

716
00:44:35,079 --> 00:44:37,360
defense win and now whatever that next
move is, you would think, by

717
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:42,280
the way, that was his first
knockout, going back five fights to a

718
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:45,639
knockout of someone named Daniel Ross in
July of twenty twenty one, so it

719
00:44:45,719 --> 00:44:50,599
had been three years and five fights
since he had gotten a knockout. But

720
00:44:50,639 --> 00:44:53,239
good on, good on Lamont Roach
to get the win on Really, listen,

721
00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:58,119
he's a really he's a really easy
guy to root for. You know,

722
00:44:58,199 --> 00:45:00,320
no no one gave him anything.
He worked for what he's got.

723
00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:04,480
The first World Championship opportunity that he
had a few years ago. He was

724
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:07,159
the mandatory in the WBO. He
lost a decision competitive, but he lost

725
00:45:07,199 --> 00:45:10,440
against Jamel Herring. You know what, he didn't sulk, He didn't,

726
00:45:10,559 --> 00:45:14,440
you know, retire, He just
went back to work it, worked hard

727
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:16,000
and got himself in position, won
a bunch of fights in a row.

728
00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:20,800
And even if he talked to Golden
Boy. They're they're they're split. Was

729
00:45:20,840 --> 00:45:22,880
not in any way at least from
my understanding talking to both sides, it

730
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:25,679
was very amicable. They just you
know, Golden Boy was interested to resign

731
00:45:25,760 --> 00:45:29,840
him. They just couldn't work it
out. They decided to stay free agents

732
00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:31,039
and do their thing. And you
know, they were able to put this

733
00:45:31,079 --> 00:45:35,320
event on on their own, and
it drew a nice crowd there at the

734
00:45:35,599 --> 00:45:37,840
at the arena where they held it, about a forty five hundred seed arena

735
00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:42,000
called the Entertainment and Sports Arena in
Washington, d C. And you know,

736
00:45:42,039 --> 00:45:44,000
good for them. They put on
a good event. And uh,

737
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:46,199
you know he you know, he
loves to fight for his Washington people,

738
00:45:46,199 --> 00:45:50,639
and uh, you know we Uh
maybe I'm a little biased because I've lived

739
00:45:50,639 --> 00:45:54,960
in the Washington area for twenty five
years. We have a very underrated boxing

740
00:45:55,639 --> 00:46:00,119
tradition and rich history here in this
region, and I've always said for a

741
00:46:00,199 --> 00:46:04,840
long time it's underrated. It's underutilized
as a region of bring fights, even

742
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:07,519
if the guy's not from the city, because they've got knowledgeable fight fans,

743
00:46:07,559 --> 00:46:12,599
particularly if you have a top African
American fan. Washington, DC. Obviously

744
00:46:12,679 --> 00:46:15,039
is one of the most heavily black
cities in the country. Every time I've

745
00:46:15,079 --> 00:46:17,840
ever been to a fight in the
district, which is numerous, they always

746
00:46:17,840 --> 00:46:22,800
bring out a good crowd, black
and white. I wish there was more

747
00:46:22,840 --> 00:46:25,239
fights here in this in this region. All right, very good. Now

748
00:46:25,320 --> 00:46:30,119
watch and listen to my segue work. You're talking about a promotional free agent,

749
00:46:30,199 --> 00:46:32,239
LaMonte roach is Shaquur Stevens said,
about to be a promotional free agent

750
00:46:32,320 --> 00:46:36,199
or not? Well, we do
know this. He's about to defend his

751
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:42,440
newly one WBC lightweight title against Artam
Hartytuonian. You don't have to wait though,

752
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:45,639
for later this week, for all
the press coverage and all the comments,

753
00:46:45,679 --> 00:46:49,920
et cetera. Here is Shakur Stevenson
with my man Dan Raphael right now

754
00:46:50,280 --> 00:46:54,159
as part of the podcast in advance
of that title defense. It's my great

755
00:46:54,199 --> 00:46:58,320
pleasure to be joined on our podcast
this week by none other than the WBC

756
00:46:58,440 --> 00:47:01,239
lightweight champ of the world, sha
course Steve Chicourt. Thank you very much

757
00:47:01,280 --> 00:47:05,239
for doing this. How you doing, bro, I'm good, I'm good.

758
00:47:05,280 --> 00:47:08,119
I'm good on sitting back chilling in. It's my birthday, so I'm

759
00:47:08,199 --> 00:47:12,719
just sitting back waiting for the fight. Now, I know you got you

760
00:47:12,719 --> 00:47:15,039
got ahead of me. I was
gonna say, first off, happy twenty

761
00:47:15,079 --> 00:47:19,719
seventh birthday as we tape this on
June twenty eighth. I'm sure obviously you've

762
00:47:19,719 --> 00:47:22,519
always wanted to spend a part of
your birthday being interviewed by me. I

763
00:47:22,559 --> 00:47:25,760
know that's a dream come true for
you. Probably not, but we're here

764
00:47:25,760 --> 00:47:30,519
to talk about your first lightweight title
defense. You'll be taking on Ardam Hartytuny

765
00:47:30,559 --> 00:47:36,119
in July sixth in the top rank
ESPN main event at Prudential Center in your

766
00:47:36,119 --> 00:47:39,159
hometown of Newark, New Jersey.
How does a young man spend his twenty

767
00:47:39,159 --> 00:47:45,199
seventh birthday while also in training camp
a week before their fight. Uh,

768
00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:52,280
just chill out, just relaxing.
Honestly, birthdays is cool, but it's

769
00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:57,639
like I probably wouldn't even be doing
nothing for my birthday anyway. So I

770
00:47:57,840 --> 00:48:01,400
just sit back, watch spots saying
and patiently wait for my moment. I

771
00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:06,079
got you. So this this is, like I mentioned, this is going

772
00:48:06,159 --> 00:48:07,880
to take place at the Prudential Center. It's your hometown. I know it

773
00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:09,800
means a lot to you. You
know, you wear it on your sleeve.

774
00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:13,480
You're always talking about Newark, and
you've done a lot of community work

775
00:48:13,480 --> 00:48:15,880
in the city and brought a lot
of big time boxing matches back there.

776
00:48:16,039 --> 00:48:19,760
It's going to be your third fight
there in your last four fights, your

777
00:48:19,800 --> 00:48:23,079
fourth overall in that building, Prudential
Center. You fought in Las Vegas,

778
00:48:23,079 --> 00:48:25,760
New York, Atlanta, Atlantic City. Well, what does it mean to

779
00:48:25,760 --> 00:48:30,239
you to have fights in front of
your people, in front of your hometown

780
00:48:30,280 --> 00:48:35,320
in that kind of arena? Amaze
everything to me. Own. I hope

781
00:48:35,320 --> 00:48:39,960
that everybody comes out to support.
I know that my promotional company is not

782
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:45,800
trying to promote the fight properly,
because I'm not. I had to resign

783
00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:50,719
with them, So I just pray
that the same people that have been coming

784
00:48:50,760 --> 00:48:54,320
out for me keep coming out for
me and just show up and enjoyed the

785
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:59,840
show. Well, you touched on
it when you say they're not promoting the

786
00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:01,559
all right. I mean from my
way of looking at as a media person,

787
00:49:01,599 --> 00:49:05,000
which is sort of one of the
things they promote towards to get media

788
00:49:05,039 --> 00:49:08,840
attention. It seems like they have
because they've helped set up this interview between

789
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:12,440
you and me to help promote your
fights. So can you tell me what

790
00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:16,079
you mean by that, I mean
usually it's just more. You know,

791
00:49:16,599 --> 00:49:20,679
I've been working with them for years, so you know, it's not just

792
00:49:20,719 --> 00:49:25,440
about the interviews that I'm doing,
which I feel as though we've been working

793
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:30,199
for a long time, and it's
just more. I ain't gonna get into

794
00:49:30,239 --> 00:49:32,719
detail. I ain't. It is
what it is. I ain't chipping on

795
00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:37,159
it. I just got to show
up and do my job. So I

796
00:49:37,199 --> 00:49:38,119
was gonna get to this a little
bit later in the interview, but since

797
00:49:38,119 --> 00:49:40,519
you brought up the whole free agency, we'll get to the fight in a

798
00:49:40,519 --> 00:49:44,800
minute for sure. But like you
said, it is your last fight with

799
00:49:44,840 --> 00:49:46,920
your promotion contract with Top Rank.
You've been with him your entire career.

800
00:49:47,559 --> 00:49:51,360
Seems to me from the outside looking
in, you've done good business together.

801
00:49:51,400 --> 00:49:54,280
You've won world championships in three different
weight classes. You've unified titles in one

802
00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:59,079
of those weight classes. You've made
millions of dollars. They've put on some

803
00:49:59,119 --> 00:50:02,239
big fights for you. But now
that the free agency is upon you following

804
00:50:02,280 --> 00:50:07,199
this matchup, is it all a
distraction to you? Nah? I don't

805
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:14,199
really care for uh, honestly,
the free agency and everything where that matters

806
00:50:14,239 --> 00:50:17,159
after the fight, right, now
we got to stay focused on what's what's

807
00:50:17,199 --> 00:50:22,119
the ahead of us, and the
main thing is come in and they are

808
00:50:22,159 --> 00:50:28,440
prepared and ready to put on the
performance. So nah, I don't care

809
00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:30,800
for it. It is what it
is, not a dishttion at all.

810
00:50:30,079 --> 00:50:32,480
Okay, glad to hear that.
As I mentioned, you have won the

811
00:50:32,480 --> 00:50:37,480
titles in the three whel with three
weight classes. You have beaten some notable

812
00:50:37,519 --> 00:50:43,480
opponents Oscar Valdez, Concasyle, Jamel
Herring. There are many people shakor you

813
00:50:43,519 --> 00:50:45,719
know this, you see it.
They talk about you as being one of

814
00:50:45,719 --> 00:50:47,719
the most talented boxers in the whole
sport, a guy that's gonna be on

815
00:50:47,760 --> 00:50:52,039
that talent for poundless for many years
to come. But we got to go

816
00:50:52,119 --> 00:50:54,440
back for just a quick minute and
look at your last fight. That's when

817
00:50:54,440 --> 00:50:59,519
you won this WBC vacant lightweight title
against Edwin de los Santos in November.

818
00:50:59,519 --> 00:51:02,679
You won a decision, but you'd
be the first to admit this. I

819
00:51:02,679 --> 00:51:07,599
think that was not a good fight
from for anybody to watch. He barely

820
00:51:07,639 --> 00:51:09,800
threw any punch as he turned one
of the most dismal performances I've ever seen

821
00:51:10,079 --> 00:51:14,280
in almost twenty five years of covering
boxing. I know you did not seem

822
00:51:14,320 --> 00:51:17,519
happy after that fight, even though
you got the win. Were you disappointed?

823
00:51:17,559 --> 00:51:21,079
How disappointed were you in the way
that fight went, the fan reaction

824
00:51:21,159 --> 00:51:22,599
to the fight. I know,
I'm sure you're happy you won the title,

825
00:51:23,039 --> 00:51:27,719
but uh, what about that other
part of it? The other part

826
00:51:27,760 --> 00:51:29,679
of it. It is what it
is. At the end of the day.

827
00:51:29,719 --> 00:51:31,840
I can't do nothing about it.
But at the end of the day,

828
00:51:31,880 --> 00:51:40,280
we got to also take recognition and
understand that Delasanto's is not an easy

829
00:51:40,320 --> 00:51:52,679
fight, and hopefully I'm hoping that
somebody gives home an opportunity, because now

830
00:51:52,559 --> 00:51:57,800
the world can see that that's not
a guy that that you just go in

831
00:51:57,920 --> 00:52:01,960
there and annihilate, and especially like
somebody with me that I got one hand

832
00:52:02,199 --> 00:52:08,039
in the fight. So now I'm
fighting this good fighter that has good defensive

833
00:52:08,119 --> 00:52:15,440
abilities and got power, and it's
a tricky fighter with good skills. I'm

834
00:52:15,480 --> 00:52:22,199
fighting home with one hand. Yeah, I was mad at myself, but

835
00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:27,400
now that I went back and like
rewatched it and understand like everything that was

836
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:30,000
going on, I'm not mad at
I'm happy that I can go pull that

837
00:52:30,119 --> 00:52:35,639
off on a bad night, and
I don't think that there's a lot of

838
00:52:35,639 --> 00:52:39,679
fighters that y'all put at the top
level that will fight him. We already

839
00:52:39,679 --> 00:52:45,559
seen Pitbull CRUs turned him down in
a fight. You wonder why he would

840
00:52:45,599 --> 00:52:51,079
turn him down. But take a
fight with writ somebody that Edwin Della Santos

841
00:52:51,159 --> 00:52:55,199
knocked out. I think that is
just a game that's not really being played.

842
00:52:55,280 --> 00:53:00,079
Fear because I think like the outsiders, they don't understand everything that goes

843
00:53:00,119 --> 00:53:06,119
on into like the sport of boxing. But when y'all sit there and y'all

844
00:53:06,119 --> 00:53:08,679
say, oh, y'all didn't like
to fight, Okay, cool, y'all

845
00:53:08,800 --> 00:53:15,320
probably didn't. But it's some people
that understand boxing that did like the fighter,

846
00:53:15,320 --> 00:53:19,880
and the people that understand boxing that
did like to fight. They like

847
00:53:20,039 --> 00:53:23,519
chests. It was more and so
a chess match with two boxers that's more

848
00:53:23,599 --> 00:53:30,679
defensively and one got one hand in
there. So now I'm handicapped and making

849
00:53:30,719 --> 00:53:35,119
it work. So honestly, I
feel the stuff. I'm going back on

850
00:53:35,199 --> 00:53:37,480
it. I'm not even mad at
the performance, no more, I'm mad

851
00:53:37,519 --> 00:53:43,320
at the public. I'm more so
mad at the public whole. Oho.

852
00:53:45,039 --> 00:53:49,840
I go out there and I'll go
perform night after night, years and years

853
00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:52,519
of me putting hands on people and
beating people up, and then you have

854
00:53:52,719 --> 00:53:58,360
one off night and then everybody just
say fucking And if that's how they feel

855
00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:00,880
about me, if it's fuck you
to me, it's fuck you to them

856
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:05,360
too. And people may say,
oh, well, these are people who

857
00:54:05,559 --> 00:54:09,000
pay money to see you fight and
they do this, and okay, understood.

858
00:54:09,039 --> 00:54:12,480
But at the end of the day, I'm a man, and if

859
00:54:12,519 --> 00:54:15,679
anybody anybody, I don't give a
fuck who it is, whether it's money

860
00:54:15,719 --> 00:54:21,519
involved or money and not involved.
If anybody say fuck me, I'm gonna

861
00:54:21,519 --> 00:54:24,039
say fuck the too. So well
is what it is. Then that's I

862
00:54:24,079 --> 00:54:27,800
understand where you're coming from. I
just uh for the point though, I

863
00:54:27,800 --> 00:54:30,199
don't think people are holding it against
you for the rest of your career.

864
00:54:30,199 --> 00:54:32,360
I think it's understandable they may have
been upset that one particular night, but

865
00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:36,039
it's not that they don't have any
interest in seeing a talent like your self

866
00:54:36,039 --> 00:54:38,880
perform in the future. But you
mentioned about being honeycop. The logic,

867
00:54:39,039 --> 00:54:43,000
the logic that they've runned me.
Oh now, now I'm a runner.

868
00:54:43,360 --> 00:54:45,760
But how many fights have I stood
in the pocket? No? I get

869
00:54:45,760 --> 00:54:49,400
it. I get it. You
mentioned this, I'm a hockey fighter.

870
00:54:49,519 --> 00:54:52,360
If we're being real, I want
to just clarify. You said you were

871
00:54:52,360 --> 00:54:53,559
a handicap because you had one hand. What was the you had? Was

872
00:54:53,559 --> 00:54:58,239
it a shoulder injury? If I'm
not mistaken, No, the shoulder was

873
00:54:58,400 --> 00:55:01,679
my right shoulder went fucking. The
one hand that I got, I still

874
00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:06,000
was using, but it was the
hand was my left hand got you?

875
00:55:06,119 --> 00:55:09,400
Okay, all right, So that
that's in the past. I just wanted

876
00:55:09,400 --> 00:55:13,000
to get your reaction to that.
But now you obviously have this fight coming

877
00:55:13,079 --> 00:55:16,639
up against Hartitunian. Look, you
were a twenty sixteen silver medalist in the

878
00:55:16,679 --> 00:55:22,199
Olympics. He was a twenty sixteen
UH bronze and bronze medalist in the Olympics

879
00:55:22,199 --> 00:55:25,360
for Germany. You fought in different
weight classes. He fought at light welterweight

880
00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:29,000
about one hundred and forty pounds.
You were fighting obviously down in about one

881
00:55:29,039 --> 00:55:31,800
hundred and twenty three pounds, so
you're in you're in a different division.

882
00:55:31,800 --> 00:55:35,679
But were you familiar with him from
the amateurs at that time or do you

883
00:55:35,719 --> 00:55:37,960
remember seeing him perhaps in the Olympics. Yeah, I seen him, I

884
00:55:38,039 --> 00:55:44,760
seen I've seen a fight this tall
Cuban kid from Ajubbajan. No, he's

885
00:55:44,800 --> 00:55:47,679
really from Cuba, but he was
training. He went to Ajibbajan scene and

886
00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:52,320
I wouldn't say he lost, but
yeah, I seen him. I seen

887
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:54,960
him, I'll do. So,
what is your sort of assessment of his

888
00:55:55,039 --> 00:55:59,239
abilities and what he brings? Uh, obviously you were separated by a lot

889
00:55:59,239 --> 00:56:00,760
of weight back then. How you're
obviously you know, at the same weight

890
00:56:00,800 --> 00:56:04,840
class. But what did you What
is your sort of scattering report on Hartitunian.

891
00:56:05,719 --> 00:56:08,800
I think he's a real good,
solid fighter. I think that he

892
00:56:08,880 --> 00:56:15,480
tried to press you, pressure you
with his legs, got real good feet,

893
00:56:15,480 --> 00:56:17,760
where know how to like bag out, got a nice little hot guard.

894
00:56:21,239 --> 00:56:23,920
Honestly, I just don't think he
sings anything like me. So the

895
00:56:23,960 --> 00:56:28,840
one time he did step up and
fight a more recognizable kind of name was

896
00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:30,360
a pretty good fight. He had
the fight with Frank Martin, who just

897
00:56:30,400 --> 00:56:36,599
recently challenged Tank Davis for the WBA
LIGHTWEIGHTE belt and did get knocked out in

898
00:56:36,599 --> 00:56:39,639
that fight. But Frank Martin was
able to win a decision against Hartitunian.

899
00:56:39,880 --> 00:56:43,400
He did score a knockdown against him
in the in the final round in the

900
00:56:43,400 --> 00:56:45,519
twelfth round of their fight. Did
you see that fight and what did you

901
00:56:45,719 --> 00:56:50,480
What was your impressions of Hertitunian's performance
in that one time he did step up

902
00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:53,360
against a name opponent. Honestly,
I thought he was winning the fight.

903
00:56:53,440 --> 00:57:01,440
I thought it was a pickup fight. I still think it was a case

904
00:57:01,480 --> 00:57:06,519
where it should have either been a
drawer or I ain't gonna I ain't gonna

905
00:57:06,519 --> 00:57:09,280
say or it could have went either. I think that the problem was he

906
00:57:09,400 --> 00:57:12,840
took a knee, because I ain't
even gonna say, you got knocked down.

907
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:16,559
Let's like we're gonna really I analyzed, like the actual fights. It

908
00:57:16,599 --> 00:57:21,639
wasn't like a punch that Frank Martin
hit him with that heard him. Or

909
00:57:22,320 --> 00:57:25,440
he took a knee I want to
say from fatigue. Okay, that's that's

910
00:57:25,519 --> 00:57:30,480
kind of what I saw from watching
the fight. And when he took that

911
00:57:30,559 --> 00:57:35,320
knee from fatigue, I think that
kind of gave the the decision away.

912
00:57:35,559 --> 00:57:38,280
On being that he's fighting in Dallas, I want or was it Veggies.

913
00:57:38,800 --> 00:57:43,119
I believe it was in certainly was
not in his home area. Let's put

914
00:57:43,159 --> 00:57:45,880
it like that. I forget what
it was the B side he was let's

915
00:57:45,920 --> 00:57:49,679
just say he was the B side
right from being the B side taking the

916
00:57:49,760 --> 00:57:53,280
knee in what the twelfth round.
Uh, it's the worst thing that you

917
00:57:53,320 --> 00:57:59,119
can do, especially in a fight
where it seems like you're ahead, but

918
00:57:59,239 --> 00:58:05,519
it's like you give some moments where
Frank is doing anything too. So honestly

919
00:58:05,639 --> 00:58:09,280
a good fighter. I don't take
nothing away from Home but his lovels.

920
00:58:09,599 --> 00:58:12,800
Yeah, I understand that. I
mean, I think if you looked at

921
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:15,559
it and you analyzed your boxing ability
compared to his, I would think that

922
00:58:15,599 --> 00:58:17,920
you think that. I'm not gonna
say you think this is an easy fight

923
00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:21,599
because he does have that amateur background. He did have a good performance against

924
00:58:21,639 --> 00:58:24,960
Frank despite the loss, But you
figure that you are just a far superior

925
00:58:25,000 --> 00:58:29,119
boxer to him overall in terms of
the way you'll be able to handle and

926
00:58:29,159 --> 00:58:32,760
get the win. Yeah, I
think that I'm just levels above Home.

927
00:58:32,800 --> 00:58:38,079
Man. Still got to go out
there improve it. So on July sixth

928
00:58:38,159 --> 00:58:42,280
is the date. That's the day
we go out there and show who I

929
00:58:42,320 --> 00:58:45,360
am. I wanted to go back
real quickly to your discussion about your your

930
00:58:45,400 --> 00:58:49,559
potent, you know, your impending
free agency. I've seen some videos or

931
00:58:49,599 --> 00:58:53,079
saw some of the commentary from Mattroom
boxing promoter Eddie Hearn. He's talked you

932
00:58:53,199 --> 00:58:57,239
up, talked about how great of
a young fighter you are, thinks he

933
00:58:57,320 --> 00:59:00,400
said, he thought you're not being
promoted the best, and so I'm sure

934
00:59:00,440 --> 00:59:04,639
he'll be a shuitor among others.
When when you do hit the free agency,

935
00:59:04,920 --> 00:59:07,199
when you when you do decide where
you're going to sign whatever offers are

936
00:59:07,239 --> 00:59:10,760
presented to you, what are you
looking for in your next deal in terms

937
00:59:10,760 --> 00:59:14,719
of a promoter. Is it just
strictly the money. Is it about the

938
00:59:14,719 --> 00:59:17,880
opportunities and who they have that you
can make a match for you against.

939
00:59:19,079 --> 00:59:22,199
What are you what are you thinking
about in that sense? Or is it

940
00:59:22,239 --> 00:59:25,679
something else I didn't mention. I
think big fights is mainly the thing that

941
00:59:25,719 --> 00:59:30,000
I'm looking for. I want to
be in big fights, be could I

942
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:32,639
want a chance to pose it the
work, to show who I am as

943
00:59:32,639 --> 00:59:37,079
a fighter. But honestly, it's
hard to even think about that kind of

944
00:59:37,119 --> 00:59:40,079
stuff with what's going on right now, and I'm trying to like stay within

945
00:59:40,159 --> 00:59:46,320
the moment and focus on arm So
we could talk about it, but it

946
00:59:46,320 --> 00:59:50,760
ain't here yet. I mean,
you know, it'll be better interview me

947
00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:54,280
after the Artam fight, and they're
not gonna, you know, strategically tell

948
00:59:54,320 --> 00:59:57,639
you, well, we can do
that. We can definitely get together after

949
00:59:57,639 --> 01:00:00,840
this. We can get together after
the fight, all right. So I

950
01:00:00,840 --> 01:00:01,440
just want to ask you this then. I mean, you know, I

951
01:00:01,440 --> 01:00:06,760
know you're very confident in beating Artem
in the fight on July sixth, uh

952
01:00:06,800 --> 01:00:08,159
And so I know, look,
this is an important fight because it's a

953
01:00:08,159 --> 01:00:10,800
title defense, and obviously your perfect
record is on the line, and anytime

954
01:00:10,800 --> 01:00:14,760
you go into a match, it's
important. But I don't think anybody looking

955
01:00:14,760 --> 01:00:16,840
at this considers that a so called
big fight. So I wonder, from

956
01:00:16,880 --> 01:00:21,480
your perspective, what is the big
fight? Like I think you tell me

957
01:00:21,519 --> 01:00:24,239
if I'm wrong. A lot of
fans would love to see chakhor Stevenson lockhorns

958
01:00:24,280 --> 01:00:30,400
with Tank Davis, see you lockhorns
with Lomachenko. Also would be a unification

959
01:00:30,440 --> 01:00:32,920
fight. Obviously, there's a lot
of conversations right now that Tank and Lomachenko,

960
01:00:34,360 --> 01:00:37,320
their teams are negotiating with each other
for a fight later this year.

961
01:00:37,360 --> 01:00:44,480
Well, what what what is your
big fight is? Yes, sir,

962
01:00:44,679 --> 01:00:51,239
he is, to my knowledge,
they're making the Tank Davis Limachenko fight.

963
01:00:52,320 --> 01:00:54,400
That's what I've reported about. I
take it you think that I see you

964
01:00:54,480 --> 01:00:58,119
laughing about that. What's uh?
You tell me what you think about that.

965
01:00:59,480 --> 01:01:02,719
Uh. I mean it's business at
the end of the day. So

966
01:01:02,800 --> 01:01:08,079
I understand it and I get it. But my issue is when you know,

967
01:01:08,239 --> 01:01:14,239
guys like Tank go and do interviews
and say, oh, I'm on

968
01:01:14,280 --> 01:01:19,559
this side, and I'm basically saying
that I'm on a certain side and that's

969
01:01:19,559 --> 01:01:24,400
why the fight with me can't get
done right now, or he says things

970
01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:30,039
like that and then doing business with
somebody with Top Ring after saying like they

971
01:01:30,119 --> 01:01:35,599
wouldn't do business with Bob Aaron,
and Bob Aaron is the guy holding the

972
01:01:35,639 --> 01:01:38,960
fight back. But I mean,
clearly they ready to get in business with

973
01:01:39,440 --> 01:01:43,360
let me Chenko. So I think
it's just a lot of camp that's been

974
01:01:43,400 --> 01:01:45,400
putting out there. Well, it
seems to me that you certainly with your

975
01:01:45,400 --> 01:01:49,480
fight that you have coming up right
now, that you would be in if

976
01:01:49,480 --> 01:01:52,000
you win, be in great position
to fight the winner of a potential fight

977
01:01:52,039 --> 01:01:58,000
between Tank and Lomachenko. I assume
it would interest you know, come on

978
01:01:58,079 --> 01:02:02,960
now for sure, But like I
said, we never know until it gets

979
01:02:04,000 --> 01:02:07,079
here. So I'm taking things one
step at a time. But I think

980
01:02:07,119 --> 01:02:12,480
that people just contradict themselves a lot
when they start talking about at the size

981
01:02:12,480 --> 01:02:16,960
of the streets and street signs and
all the these kind of things that prevent

982
01:02:17,039 --> 01:02:23,159
fights from happening. But clearly a
lot of people is willing to make bread

983
01:02:23,519 --> 01:02:27,679
and get in business with each other
when the time is right. Well,

984
01:02:27,679 --> 01:02:30,719
you're right about that because taking Lomar
with different companies, so they are going

985
01:02:30,800 --> 01:02:34,320
to work together if they're able to
make the fight. So hopefully that that's

986
01:02:34,360 --> 01:02:37,480
good for everybody in boxing. You
know yourself and all the other fighters that

987
01:02:37,559 --> 01:02:42,320
want to fight other top guys from
different companies. But first you got to

988
01:02:42,360 --> 01:02:46,400
take on your your challenger and artem
Hardtunian Chakur. I wish you the best

989
01:02:46,480 --> 01:02:49,639
luck in the fight, and I'd
like to say happy birthday, my friend.

990
01:02:50,519 --> 01:02:55,119
Thank you man again. That battle
is coming in Newark, Shakur's hometown

991
01:02:55,159 --> 01:03:00,679
as you covered with him. All
right, thoughts, here we head into

992
01:03:00,679 --> 01:03:04,199
Shaquur. Stevenson titled Defense fight Week
off of the fourth of July. Midweek

993
01:03:04,239 --> 01:03:07,960
had a weird fourth of July being
on Thursday. Anytime it's midweek coming off

994
01:03:07,960 --> 01:03:10,000
a fourth of July. Though maybe
I'm working the puns. I'm working the

995
01:03:10,800 --> 01:03:16,280
metaphors. Maybe fireworks from Shakour coming
on Saturday. Final thoughts there. On

996
01:03:16,320 --> 01:03:20,519
the interview Dan Well, we did
talk about how bad the last tia Fimo

997
01:03:20,559 --> 01:03:24,679
Lopez fight was when he fought in
his recent fight against Jamaine Ortiz. If

998
01:03:24,719 --> 01:03:28,480
there was anything worse than that fight, it was the last, unfortunately sucort

999
01:03:28,519 --> 01:03:30,800
fight, when he fought Edwin deel
Loos Santos. He went in, there

1000
01:03:30,840 --> 01:03:32,159
were some injuries, but it was
just one of the most miserable fights he

1001
01:03:32,159 --> 01:03:36,719
could ever see. So he's kind
of got to make up for that a

1002
01:03:36,719 --> 01:03:39,280
little bit. He's I got the
distinct impression, and I've always enjoyed talking

1003
01:03:39,280 --> 01:03:43,000
to Shakur. I've known him since
he was an amateur. I've interviewed him

1004
01:03:43,039 --> 01:03:45,639
numerous times, been ringside for many
of his fights. I feel like in

1005
01:03:45,679 --> 01:03:47,760
going into this fight, he's got
even a little bit more of a chip

1006
01:03:47,760 --> 01:03:52,039
on his shoulder than usual, partly
because of that performance and the grief he

1007
01:03:52,079 --> 01:03:54,760
took about it. Even though you
know it does take two to tango.

1008
01:03:54,840 --> 01:03:59,599
It's not all his fault, but
more so because of the fact that his

1009
01:03:59,639 --> 01:04:01,039
contract with Toppring is coming up,
and you heard him talk about it.

1010
01:04:01,199 --> 01:04:03,639
You know, I had in my
prepared questions that I wanted to talk to

1011
01:04:03,719 --> 01:04:06,199
him about when I did the interview
with him. Of course, I was

1012
01:04:06,199 --> 01:04:10,559
going to ask him about his impending
free agency and all the things that Eddie

1013
01:04:10,559 --> 01:04:14,039
Hern had been saying very nicely about
his interest in signing him and what a

1014
01:04:14,039 --> 01:04:16,199
great fighter he was, and now
he wasn't being promoted the right way in

1015
01:04:16,239 --> 01:04:20,039
his opinion, which I disagree with, but that's a different story. But

1016
01:04:20,119 --> 01:04:24,519
I was surprised when Chakor brought that
up, like what thirty seconds into our

1017
01:04:24,559 --> 01:04:28,159
interview and he started ragging on top
rank and they're not fighting the right way.

1018
01:04:28,199 --> 01:04:31,119
So I was a little surprised by
that. But you know, look

1019
01:04:31,159 --> 01:04:32,679
at the end of the day,
it's in his hands. You know,

1020
01:04:32,840 --> 01:04:36,079
what kind of offers he's going to
get gets up to him to go out

1021
01:04:36,079 --> 01:04:42,320
there and perform and remind those who
have those checkbooks of what he really can

1022
01:04:42,360 --> 01:04:45,280
do and put on a great performance. It's Hardtunian. Now, I'm pretty

1023
01:04:45,280 --> 01:04:49,119
sure he's gonna beat Hardtunian. But
again, if you're looking for that big

1024
01:04:49,239 --> 01:04:55,639
mega contract and those opportunities. You
know, it's on you to make us,

1025
01:04:55,679 --> 01:04:59,199
the viewer and the promoter who's going
to be spending the money, to

1026
01:04:59,719 --> 01:05:02,159
give them a real reason to want
to roll out the red carpet. Because

1027
01:05:02,159 --> 01:05:04,280
the way I look at it,
TJ is the following. You know,

1028
01:05:04,320 --> 01:05:08,599
there's not that many big promotion companies
in boxing. It's a very splintered industry,

1029
01:05:08,639 --> 01:05:12,199
but in the days of like there's
a whole bunch of promoters that are

1030
01:05:12,239 --> 01:05:15,559
that are making their way. It's
obviously been much more consolidated in recent years,

1031
01:05:15,559 --> 01:05:19,960
partly because of the broadcasting situation.
So when you examine what's out there,

1032
01:05:20,320 --> 01:05:23,840
there's Top Ranked obviously where he's been
with his whole career, who have

1033
01:05:23,960 --> 01:05:27,880
a very row best television agreement with
ESPN. There is Mattroom Boxing and Golden

1034
01:05:27,840 --> 01:05:30,840
Boy. You've got deals with the
Zone. You have obviously PBC, who's

1035
01:05:30,840 --> 01:05:33,480
struggled little bit lately because of their
lack of dates, even though they do

1036
01:05:33,559 --> 01:05:38,360
have this agreement with a Prime Video
which they're going to start doing non pay

1037
01:05:38,360 --> 01:05:42,800
per view fights come August. And
then there's the overseas promoters that don't do

1038
01:05:42,840 --> 01:05:45,119
fights here in America, like a
Frank Warren who's obviously got a huge amount

1039
01:05:45,159 --> 01:05:48,000
of talent in this table, but
does the most of his events in the

1040
01:05:48,079 --> 01:05:53,320
UK and now obviously Saudi Arabia.
Question is, so, who's really a

1041
01:05:53,360 --> 01:05:57,800
candidate to me? The only real
candidates I think that would even be in

1042
01:05:57,840 --> 01:06:01,559
the conversation are either to stay with
Top Rank and come to a new agreement

1043
01:06:01,559 --> 01:06:05,039
even though Top Rank has offered him
something and been turned down, or Mattroom

1044
01:06:05,079 --> 01:06:10,639
boxing because I don't see PBC going
forward and that type of thing, because

1045
01:06:10,679 --> 01:06:14,840
they're having enough troubles keeping their own
guys going uh, and you're not going

1046
01:06:14,880 --> 01:06:17,119
to take on a high ticket item
like that without even having like some mega

1047
01:06:17,119 --> 01:06:19,960
fight for the guy. Although the
Tank Davis fight would be there, that's

1048
01:06:19,960 --> 01:06:25,159
obviously the biggest fight they can make, right and so and so you're talking

1049
01:06:25,199 --> 01:06:28,880
about Mattroom as the other possibility.
You know, he doesn't really Not to

1050
01:06:28,880 --> 01:06:30,079
say that Golden Boy couldn't do a
good job promoting it, but he doesn't

1051
01:06:30,079 --> 01:06:33,079
seem to fit with the profile of
the fighters that they have in their stable

1052
01:06:33,159 --> 01:06:39,559
other than William Zapeta, who's man
just going there. Yeah, williams Zapeta,

1053
01:06:39,760 --> 01:06:42,199
I'd love that fight, but I
don't know on the realism mean or

1054
01:06:42,239 --> 01:06:44,840
how realistic it is. I mean, only because he's gonna be He's you

1055
01:06:44,880 --> 01:06:46,360
know, Zepaida is in an interesting
situation. We'll talk about him more next

1056
01:06:46,360 --> 01:06:49,320
week when he comes back into the
rink. But he's that rare fighter.

1057
01:06:49,599 --> 01:06:51,719
It's highly I mean, I'd have
to go back and look, but it's

1058
01:06:51,880 --> 01:06:56,119
can has happened very often at all. He's literally number one in all four

1059
01:06:56,159 --> 01:06:58,920
organizations across the bord at one hundred
and thirty five. So he's gonna have

1060
01:06:58,960 --> 01:07:01,840
his options of where he wants to
be the mandatory. But I just don't

1061
01:07:01,840 --> 01:07:04,000
I don't think that that him.
I don't. I just don't feel like

1062
01:07:04,039 --> 01:07:09,239
Golden Boy and Shakur are are the
right. It just doesn't doesn't seem.

1063
01:07:09,440 --> 01:07:12,280
But maybe maybe he does. What
kind of Canelo has been doing as a

1064
01:07:12,280 --> 01:07:15,079
blueprint Devin Haynes recently, you just
do a one off, do a one

1065
01:07:15,119 --> 01:07:17,480
off somewhere and then try to figure
it out. Who knows. But the

1066
01:07:17,760 --> 01:07:27,320
difference is Canelo is a big star
and Haney had big time attractive fights that

1067
01:07:27,360 --> 01:07:29,960
they did. And now you see
what happened. He was a free agent

1068
01:07:30,239 --> 01:07:33,280
and no one bid on his next
fight. Uh is more. Wait,

1069
01:07:33,360 --> 01:07:38,400
but wait, there's detail that we're
leaving out there. He got clocked by

1070
01:07:38,480 --> 01:07:42,679
Ryan Garcia in the ring with whatever
happened after that, and there's question marks

1071
01:07:43,039 --> 01:07:45,639
in this case this guy, there
are some question marks, but his trajectory's

1072
01:07:45,679 --> 01:07:49,519
going up. I don't know.
We'll see and here's the bottom of here.

1073
01:07:49,559 --> 01:07:53,119
We go back to how good does
he look Saturday night? To help,

1074
01:07:53,159 --> 01:07:57,840
I was just yeah, he his
next situation is going to be a

1075
01:07:57,880 --> 01:08:01,960
lot of It's going to depend on
what he shows Saturday against Tartitunian and we'll

1076
01:08:01,960 --> 01:08:04,320
see. But I suspect he'll win
the fight. And like I said,

1077
01:08:04,320 --> 01:08:06,639
I feel like he's got a little
bit of a chip on his shoulder because

1078
01:08:06,639 --> 01:08:10,480
of all the things we've discussed,
and that may motivate him and bring out

1079
01:08:10,519 --> 01:08:13,079
the beasts in Shaquar, because trust
me, he can be a beast.

1080
01:08:13,159 --> 01:08:15,479
He is a phenomenal fighter and a
great talent. All right, speaking of

1081
01:08:15,520 --> 01:08:18,680
beasts, we've been here for a
little while, we've heard from Shakur and

1082
01:08:18,720 --> 01:08:23,640
I've got women, all of them, including my sixteen year old twins,

1083
01:08:23,960 --> 01:08:26,439
who are ready to go eat dinner
soon. At the time that we're taping

1084
01:08:26,520 --> 01:08:29,199
the podcast. So let's get to
some news, and we've got some more

1085
01:08:29,199 --> 01:08:33,520
Mike Tyson nostalgia because it's Mike's birthday
on the night that we're doing the podcast

1086
01:08:33,560 --> 01:08:38,279
here on Sunday, his fifty eighth
birthday. All right, News, First,

1087
01:08:38,279 --> 01:08:42,319
you've made reference to Devin Hainey vacating
the one hundred and forty pound title

1088
01:08:42,359 --> 01:08:46,520
in Albert Poyo being elevated. We
talked on the preview podcast going in that

1089
01:08:46,520 --> 01:08:51,079
that had happened, and now the
latest is it looks like we're gonna have

1090
01:08:51,119 --> 01:08:55,880
a purse bid here for his next
opponent. Explain what's going on at one

1091
01:08:55,920 --> 01:08:59,479
hundred show for the WBC. So
we know that there had been a purse

1092
01:08:59,520 --> 01:09:01,800
bid for Haney when he was still
the WBC champion at one hundred and forty

1093
01:09:02,079 --> 01:09:04,800
that the purse bid was ordered between
him and Sander Martin, who was the

1094
01:09:04,840 --> 01:09:08,680
mandatory challenger. They did not make
a deal. Top Rank, which was

1095
01:09:09,000 --> 01:09:13,640
the co promoter of Sander Martin,
was the only promotion company to bid on

1096
01:09:13,680 --> 01:09:16,479
the fight. There was a number
that was not particularly big in terms of

1097
01:09:16,520 --> 01:09:20,159
what Haney would get, so he
was clearly upset about that. And then

1098
01:09:20,520 --> 01:09:24,520
partly because of that partly because of
the fallout from what happened with the Ryan

1099
01:09:24,600 --> 01:09:28,439
Garcia fighting him losing even though he
now has no contest blah blah blah.

1100
01:09:28,479 --> 01:09:31,159
Anyway, he became champion in recess. He asked for that, and so

1101
01:09:31,239 --> 01:09:36,640
by that happening, the WBC then
elevated Alberta Pueo from the interim champion to

1102
01:09:36,720 --> 01:09:40,600
the full champion. He didn't have
to wait long because he only won the

1103
01:09:40,600 --> 01:09:45,640
interim belt that was on the undercart
of Tank Davis against Frank Martin just a

1104
01:09:45,680 --> 01:09:46,960
couple of weeks ago. I don't
think he had any expectation that he would

1105
01:09:46,960 --> 01:09:53,119
be elevated that quickly. He beat
Gary Antoine Russell via split decision, and

1106
01:09:53,159 --> 01:09:57,279
now he's suddenly he's now the full
champion. But the thing is he now

1107
01:09:57,319 --> 01:10:00,800
takes over that Sander Martin mandatory challenge, which is a fight on paper that

1108
01:10:00,840 --> 01:10:02,439
I don't think is going to be
appealing to a lot of people, frankly,

1109
01:10:03,239 --> 01:10:06,279
but they ordered the fight and so
that's going to probably be next if

1110
01:10:06,319 --> 01:10:09,880
he wants to keep the title.
So they gave him a month to negotiate

1111
01:10:09,920 --> 01:10:12,479
the deal, and if they are
not able to make an agreement, then

1112
01:10:12,479 --> 01:10:14,680
the purse, but it will take
place July twenty third. I wrote about

1113
01:10:14,720 --> 01:10:17,199
the details in my notebook from a
couple days on my substack on my Fight

1114
01:10:17,239 --> 01:10:21,239
Freaks Night newsletter. The interesting thing
about this, and this is within the

1115
01:10:21,319 --> 01:10:24,880
rights of the WBC to do this, but it is a little bit unusual.

1116
01:10:25,359 --> 01:10:28,199
Is normally, when you have a
champion and a challenger, there's a

1117
01:10:28,239 --> 01:10:30,600
division of the purse that's going to
give the advantage to the champion. Now

1118
01:10:30,840 --> 01:10:33,520
it's on a sliding scale. They
have every right to change it here and

1119
01:10:33,560 --> 01:10:36,880
there, but very, very rarely
do you see it be split fifty to

1120
01:10:36,920 --> 01:10:41,520
fifty. They're actually giving sanderd Martin
a fifty to fifty split on this particular

1121
01:10:41,520 --> 01:10:44,920
fight. I'm not entirely sure what
the reasons are for that, but it's

1122
01:10:44,920 --> 01:10:47,279
a fifty to fifty split, So
that makes it a little bit of an

1123
01:10:47,319 --> 01:10:51,640
unusual situation. But we'll see that
fight happen. I'll tell you one thing,

1124
01:10:51,960 --> 01:10:56,319
if they end up making a top
rank in PBC, if they're able

1125
01:10:56,319 --> 01:11:01,159
to finalize the fight that they've been
discussing between Tank Davis and Vasilio Lomachenko,

1126
01:11:01,159 --> 01:11:06,079
which by all accounts is moving along
very nicely because this would be Pueo against

1127
01:11:06,279 --> 01:11:11,279
Martin, which is also a PBC
versus top rank, and the timing seems

1128
01:11:11,319 --> 01:11:14,600
to be logical. It seems like
maybe that's a fight that could potentially wind

1129
01:11:14,680 --> 01:11:17,199
up on that undercard when they end
up, if they end up making the

1130
01:11:17,239 --> 01:11:21,520
match between Tank and Lomachenko. I'm
just, you know, spitballing that.

1131
01:11:21,600 --> 01:11:25,319
But that's you're making a lot of
sense. You're making a lot of sense

1132
01:11:25,319 --> 01:11:27,960
if that is well, that's that's
the news there that that that Pueo takes

1133
01:11:27,960 --> 01:11:30,720
over that mandatory and they have ordered
the fight. All right. Speaking of

1134
01:11:30,760 --> 01:11:34,119
the WBC, I can I tell
you that when I saw this, even

1135
01:11:34,159 --> 01:11:38,479
while I'm at the beach vacation,
I literally loled. I laughed out loud.

1136
01:11:38,680 --> 01:11:43,039
The WBC has given David Benavitez a
two week extension to decide if he's

1137
01:11:43,079 --> 01:11:47,159
going to remain the interim titleist at
light heavyweight or it's super middleweight. Can

1138
01:11:47,199 --> 01:11:50,239
I just say to you, at
what point does the fighter and his management

1139
01:11:50,319 --> 01:11:56,600
get to give the WBC a two
week extension on are you going to order

1140
01:11:56,680 --> 01:12:00,239
Canelo Alvarez to fight me? Or
are you going to strip him of his

1141
01:12:00,359 --> 01:12:06,640
title? Because I've been the interim
champion since since Abraham Lincoln was the president.

1142
01:12:06,800 --> 01:12:11,279
How much longer do I have to
wait for you to order him to

1143
01:12:11,399 --> 01:12:15,600
fight me. I'm not upset with
your logic, but you do not know

1144
01:12:15,680 --> 01:12:19,079
the rules. So I'm gonna explain
to them a little bit to you when

1145
01:12:19,119 --> 01:12:21,840
and again I don't I'm not saying
I support these rules. I've had my

1146
01:12:21,960 --> 01:12:26,239
conversations with my friends at the WBC
a battle. I don't like this rule.

1147
01:12:26,560 --> 01:12:28,399
I don't agree with it. I
think they need to make it more

1148
01:12:28,399 --> 01:12:31,079
clear and make it logical. But
that being said, when you be and

1149
01:12:31,119 --> 01:12:33,720
I didn't actually know this for a
while, and then I actually read that

1150
01:12:33,800 --> 01:12:38,960
section of the rules, and it's
accurate. When you become a WBC interim

1151
01:12:39,039 --> 01:12:45,000
champion, you are not the mandatory. Now in other organizations you are in

1152
01:12:45,079 --> 01:12:47,520
the WBC, just because you have
the interim title does not make you the

1153
01:12:47,520 --> 01:12:51,520
mandatory. They have to confer that
position on you. So just his status

1154
01:12:51,560 --> 01:12:57,960
as the WBC's interim champion in either
way class does not make him mandatory for

1155
01:12:58,000 --> 01:13:00,039
a champion. And I'm going to
stop. Let me stop about for I

1156
01:13:00,640 --> 01:13:03,199
need to finish this. They did
make him the mandatory for Canelo. Okay,

1157
01:13:03,199 --> 01:13:08,000
they just haven't ordered the fight.
There's there's the rubb on that the

1158
01:13:08,279 --> 01:13:13,399
i'll use big words. The convoluted
stupidity of what you just said is the

1159
01:13:13,680 --> 01:13:17,960
problem with rankings in boxing right now. The guy won an interim title fight

1160
01:13:18,079 --> 01:13:23,960
and has even since defended it,
and to say that he shouldn't be the

1161
01:13:24,000 --> 01:13:28,359
guy to fight for the full championship
for over a year is just stupidity at

1162
01:13:28,359 --> 01:13:30,880
this point defended it multiple times.
So no, no, no, to

1163
01:13:30,039 --> 01:13:34,920
fight the guy Canello. And the
fact that it hasn't been ordered. The

1164
01:13:34,960 --> 01:13:39,439
word the word you use, the
word that I used before you. Where

1165
01:13:39,520 --> 01:13:43,960
is the ordering? You have to
fight him or we're going to strip you?

1166
01:13:44,520 --> 01:13:46,800
And they won't. I know why
they won't do it. I know

1167
01:13:46,840 --> 01:13:49,640
why they won't do it. But
still this whole thing of you got to

1168
01:13:49,640 --> 01:13:51,760
give us, you got to give
us an answer. Why don't I have

1169
01:13:51,760 --> 01:13:55,479
to give you answered? I actually
don't know what David David is going to

1170
01:13:55,520 --> 01:13:59,600
do because if he stays as the
super middleweight mandatory, it's not like Canelo

1171
01:13:59,680 --> 01:14:01,880
is gonna suddenly fight him. And
I know he has, you know,

1172
01:14:01,920 --> 01:14:03,920
some troubles with the weight He's going
to be out of the ring for a

1173
01:14:03,960 --> 01:14:08,159
bit anyway, because his hands are
all messed up from what happened in the

1174
01:14:08,520 --> 01:14:12,079
training camp going into the fight against
Bodzick that took place a couple of weeks

1175
01:14:12,079 --> 01:14:15,159
ago, and then he exacerbated those
injuries in the ring, plus he got

1176
01:14:15,199 --> 01:14:17,119
cut. So David is out of
the ring probably until the late fall,

1177
01:14:17,159 --> 01:14:21,279
I would think. And if he
stays in the light heavyweight position with the

1178
01:14:21,319 --> 01:14:26,199
interim title, it's not like he's
getting an immediate shot for that belt either

1179
01:14:26,239 --> 01:14:30,840
because Alexander, I mean, because
Arthur better Biev is the champion, but

1180
01:14:30,920 --> 01:14:33,399
he is going to be coming back
from his injury to take on Dmitri Bibol

1181
01:14:33,399 --> 01:14:38,239
in October for the undisputed title,
so he's not going to get that fight

1182
01:14:38,279 --> 01:14:41,640
either. So he just has to
decide where do I feel more comfortable in

1183
01:14:41,720 --> 01:14:45,840
terms of my conditioning and my weight
and my training. What kinds of fights

1184
01:14:46,159 --> 01:14:50,840
are available to me if I stay
at supermittlewight if it's not Canelo, And

1185
01:14:50,840 --> 01:14:54,720
what kind of fights can I have
at light heavyweight if it's not going to

1186
01:14:54,800 --> 01:14:58,680
be next against the winner of the
undisputed fight. So you know, he

1187
01:14:58,720 --> 01:15:01,119
has a good team behind him,
Ampson Lucawitz, who's this promoter as a

1188
01:15:01,199 --> 01:15:05,199
very smart boxing person. Obviously,
he works closely with the folks at PBC

1189
01:15:05,319 --> 01:15:09,960
and TGB promotions, so they know
their shit too. Don't have to figure

1190
01:15:10,000 --> 01:15:15,359
it out, all right. Don't
hold your breath on anything coming his way

1191
01:15:15,359 --> 01:15:17,560
though, for right now. No
matter what he decides, however, he's

1192
01:15:17,600 --> 01:15:23,199
one of the he's one of the
intriguing fighters that's out there right now,

1193
01:15:23,199 --> 01:15:27,159
whether it's at one sixty eight or
one seventy five. And we'll see what

1194
01:15:27,159 --> 01:15:30,159
happens with David Benavitez, all right. Before we are gone, we've talked

1195
01:15:30,159 --> 01:15:33,079
a ton about Mike Tyson when we
left on the preview pod, we did

1196
01:15:33,159 --> 01:15:38,840
nostalgia on his one round destruction of
Michael Spinks. Also that not only that

1197
01:15:38,880 --> 01:15:43,079
anniversary from this past weekend, but
the anniversary of Byte night in the rematch

1198
01:15:43,319 --> 01:15:46,800
with Evander Holyfield, and Mike now
has turned fifty eight years old, which

1199
01:15:46,840 --> 01:15:50,399
we knew it was looming that,
you know, in advance of fighting Jake

1200
01:15:50,439 --> 01:15:55,119
Paul, he was going to turn
fifty eight years old. So happy birthday

1201
01:15:55,279 --> 01:15:59,239
to Iron Mike here at this stage
and what else, what else in the

1202
01:15:59,279 --> 01:16:02,319
nostalgia here about Mike Tyson, because
we covered a bunch obviously back on Friday.

1203
01:16:02,600 --> 01:16:04,680
Well, it wasn't so much about
one particular fight. It's just the

1204
01:16:04,720 --> 01:16:09,840
fact that here you have one of
the if not the most iconic fighter in

1205
01:16:09,880 --> 01:16:14,319
the history of the sport other than
Muhammad Ali turns another chapter, turns another

1206
01:16:14,359 --> 01:16:16,239
age. And the fact that we
could even sit here at age fifty eight

1207
01:16:16,319 --> 01:16:19,760
saying well, by the way he
scheduled for an official boxing match, you

1208
01:16:19,800 --> 01:16:25,199
know, in November, still mind
boggling to me. It may be an

1209
01:16:25,199 --> 01:16:28,079
official fight, but obviously to me, his career ended back in two thousand

1210
01:16:28,079 --> 01:16:31,960
and five after he thought Kevin McBride. But the fact that all this is

1211
01:16:32,000 --> 01:16:34,239
the thing that is amazing about.
First of all, I think he's the

1212
01:16:34,279 --> 01:16:38,000
first to tell you the fact that
he's still alive at fifty eight is like

1213
01:16:38,039 --> 01:16:41,159
a miracle, Like I don't think
he ever thought that with all the terrible

1214
01:16:41,199 --> 01:16:44,279
things that he's gone through in his
life, and all the issues he's had

1215
01:16:44,279 --> 01:16:47,960
and going to prison, and just
the upbringing he had and just the crazy

1216
01:16:48,000 --> 01:16:51,960
lifestyle that he lived, the drugs, the whole thing. Well, part

1217
01:16:51,960 --> 01:16:56,359
of what you mean, and this
gets lost on the newer generation is that

1218
01:16:56,479 --> 01:17:04,199
he grew up in a very rough, poor area of New York and he

1219
01:17:04,359 --> 01:17:11,760
was basically rescued because of his boxing
ability by Custom Motto and Custom Otto's people

1220
01:17:12,239 --> 01:17:15,960
to train him as an amateur fighter
and give him a way out of that

1221
01:17:15,079 --> 01:17:20,039
rough life or he probably would have
been in prison or dead. And he's

1222
01:17:20,079 --> 01:17:25,600
admitted that and talked about that.
Look, the prophecy, Yeah, the

1223
01:17:25,640 --> 01:17:29,840
prophecy from Custom Otto was that Mike
Tyson, this is after he started working

1224
01:17:29,840 --> 01:17:31,279
with him, that he would become
the youngest heavyweight champion of all time.

1225
01:17:31,640 --> 01:17:34,640
And Cuss had passed away at that
point, but he fulfilled the prophecy of

1226
01:17:34,680 --> 01:17:39,239
the old man and he knocked out
Trevor Burbick and when he was twenty years

1227
01:17:39,239 --> 01:17:42,399
old when he became the heavyweight champion
of the world. I mean, it's

1228
01:17:42,439 --> 01:17:45,319
still one of the more impressive feats
in the history of boxing. You look

1229
01:17:45,359 --> 01:17:51,000
at statistics and milestones and important accomplishments. The thing that still amazes me is

1230
01:17:51,439 --> 01:17:54,600
like you and I were kids.
You know. I was like in high

1231
01:17:54,640 --> 01:17:58,600
school at that time, and I
was more in tune with Tyson than the

1232
01:17:58,680 --> 01:18:01,359
average boxing fan because back in those
days. I was not the die hard

1233
01:18:01,439 --> 01:18:04,760
boxing fan that I became, But
because I grew up in that upstate New

1234
01:18:04,840 --> 01:18:10,119
York Albany, Schenectady, Troy,
Glenn's Falls area, not that far,

1235
01:18:10,319 --> 01:18:14,800
like you know, less than like
an hour drive maybe from Catskill. He

1236
01:18:15,000 --> 01:18:17,199
was a local celebrity. He was
in the local newspapers, he was on

1237
01:18:17,279 --> 01:18:23,239
the local TV news programs. They
covered his boxing matches that took place in

1238
01:18:23,439 --> 01:18:25,920
all the New York ins connected in
New York, in Glens Falls, New

1239
01:18:26,000 --> 01:18:29,399
York, in Troy, places like
that. So he was well known to

1240
01:18:29,520 --> 01:18:32,199
our community. And then when he
burst on the scene and he started fighting

1241
01:18:32,199 --> 01:18:36,279
on ESPN and then those early fights, and he had then went to HBO

1242
01:18:36,359 --> 01:18:40,079
and had some you know, pre
title fights. He was already made.

1243
01:18:40,079 --> 01:18:44,159
They let me tell you a little
nostalgia here from TJ. Reeves in the

1244
01:18:44,239 --> 01:18:47,079
youth. So while you were in
tune with Tyson at that time period when

1245
01:18:47,119 --> 01:18:50,720
you're talking about nineteen eighty five primarily
and a little bit into nineteen eighty six,

1246
01:18:51,199 --> 01:18:54,560
you and I are contemporaries. Were
the same age. I'm in high

1247
01:18:54,600 --> 01:18:59,039
school in Tampa, Florida, where
I live. We actually physically moved to

1248
01:18:59,119 --> 01:19:01,079
a new area of Tampa. And
this is how crazy it can get kids,

1249
01:19:01,079 --> 01:19:05,399
because there was no internet different times
where we moved, it was not

1250
01:19:05,720 --> 01:19:11,600
wired for cable yet, Dan Rayphiel, so we went, oh my cave

1251
01:19:11,720 --> 01:19:15,199
or something. We went. We
went to an area of Tampa where it

1252
01:19:15,279 --> 01:19:20,600
was not yet wired and ready to
go for cable. I understand that.

1253
01:19:20,800 --> 01:19:25,119
But the area where we had been
had it. The area where we moved

1254
01:19:25,159 --> 01:19:29,800
did not have it yet. So
when Tyson was fighting several times on ESPN

1255
01:19:29,880 --> 01:19:33,800
in the early part of him destroying
everybody in late nineteen eighty five early nineteen

1256
01:19:33,840 --> 01:19:38,680
eighty six, young tj ain't seeing
that because we don't have ESPN and there

1257
01:19:38,760 --> 01:19:42,239
is no internet. This is in
a day when you didn't see it that

1258
01:19:42,439 --> 01:19:45,039
night you missed it where you missed
the highlights of it on ESPN after the

1259
01:19:45,079 --> 01:19:49,520
fact. It was not until he
began to fight and we eventually got cable

1260
01:19:49,560 --> 01:19:54,600
later eighty six. But when he
fought those fights on ABC's wide Willdess Sports

1261
01:19:54,680 --> 01:19:57,399
Quick Tillis was one of them.
And who was the other one, Jesse

1262
01:19:57,560 --> 01:20:00,800
Marguson, No, the big one, the one, Yeah, those are

1263
01:20:00,840 --> 01:20:02,479
two for sure, but the one
that's the memorable one is the one where

1264
01:20:02,479 --> 01:20:05,800
he blew out Marvius Fraser. He
destroyed all three of them. When we

1265
01:20:05,840 --> 01:20:13,680
started seeing we started seeing those fights
on over the air ABC now called called

1266
01:20:13,680 --> 01:20:17,399
by Jim Lampley pre HBO. That's
correct, the Marvius Fraser destruction and quick

1267
01:20:17,439 --> 01:20:24,399
Till Listen and maybe even Ferguson.
We finally were introduced to who this was.

1268
01:20:24,840 --> 01:20:28,479
I remember reading in Sports Illustrated about
him because they had they had him

1269
01:20:28,520 --> 01:20:31,039
on the cover like Kid Dynamite or
whatever, with all the knockouts before he

1270
01:20:31,119 --> 01:20:34,960
became the champ. Would you be
surprised? I told you? Would you

1271
01:20:34,960 --> 01:20:39,840
be surprised if I told you TJ. Reeves that In my extensive boxing collection,

1272
01:20:40,359 --> 01:20:43,560
I have that Kid Dynamite issue of
Sports Illustrating. That doesn't surprise me

1273
01:20:43,600 --> 01:20:47,159
at all. I expect that of
you. But what I'm saying is once

1274
01:20:47,239 --> 01:20:51,079
he got introduced, not just to
me, but to millions of fight fans

1275
01:20:51,079 --> 01:20:56,800
because boxing was so much more mainstream
by it being on Saturday, ABC's wide

1276
01:20:56,800 --> 01:21:00,840
wall to Sports free to see network
TV, the legend grew at that time.

1277
01:21:00,319 --> 01:21:05,439
Just being nostalgic here on top of
your nostalgia on how the ledging grew

1278
01:21:05,479 --> 01:21:10,199
into what we eventually saw, which
is him winning these title fights that were

1279
01:21:10,199 --> 01:21:14,399
all on HBO or closed circuit or
pay per view later on. The thing

1280
01:21:14,439 --> 01:21:17,560
that still amazes me, though,
is that twenty years post his boxing career,

1281
01:21:18,479 --> 01:21:24,880
that he's still in many ways within
the sports world and ubiquitous figure because

1282
01:21:24,880 --> 01:21:29,319
of the Jake Paul thing, and
you know, the Roy Jones exhibition that

1283
01:21:29,399 --> 01:21:32,600
did you a million, like,
well over a million paper views, maybe

1284
01:21:32,600 --> 01:21:36,079
close to two million pay per view
bys. Granted there was extenuating the circumstances

1285
01:21:36,119 --> 01:21:40,520
given and we're all trapped at home
during the throes of the pandemic, but

1286
01:21:40,640 --> 01:21:45,159
even still, he's so he's gone
through so many like layers of his career

1287
01:21:45,239 --> 01:21:49,079
because for a long time he was
the feared, baddest man on the planet.

1288
01:21:49,319 --> 01:21:53,199
Then he was a reviled figure because
he was in jail for a rate.

1289
01:21:53,560 --> 01:21:58,720
He was then you know, discarded
and hated by everybody when he bit

1290
01:21:58,800 --> 01:22:01,079
holy Field's ear, that he he
could come back from those two things,

1291
01:22:01,119 --> 01:22:06,199
specifically to be a love beloved figure
because he's in the you know, he's

1292
01:22:06,199 --> 01:22:11,880
in the Hangover movie. He gets
the tattoo, you know, the chip

1293
01:22:12,000 --> 01:22:14,800
still got it after the pick,
right, hand. I mean, he

1294
01:22:15,600 --> 01:22:18,319
and listen and the tragedy that he's
encountered also in his life because of the

1295
01:22:18,359 --> 01:22:21,239
things he's been through, the death
of one of his daughters at a very

1296
01:22:21,239 --> 01:22:26,319
young age a few years ago.
Was extremely, extremely sad that he's still

1297
01:22:26,520 --> 01:22:30,760
standing and still ticking and still doing
his thing. You know, it's pretty

1298
01:22:30,760 --> 01:22:31,840
remarkable. And I mean, I
know he's done bad things, but I

1299
01:22:31,880 --> 01:22:34,199
will say this, I mean,
I get it, I know it.

1300
01:22:34,720 --> 01:22:38,920
I don't excuse it. And not
that say Mike and I are like best

1301
01:22:38,920 --> 01:22:42,880
buddies, but I've known Mike for
twenty something years, not that we're close,

1302
01:22:42,920 --> 01:22:45,439
but we you know what deceived me. It's it's a beautiful thing.

1303
01:22:45,479 --> 01:22:48,000
We hug it out, it's it's
it's a pleasant you know. I've told

1304
01:22:48,039 --> 01:22:50,079
the story of the first interview we
had with him, which was a fucking

1305
01:22:50,119 --> 01:22:56,079
train wreck, But my interactions with
him post that in two thousand, right

1306
01:22:56,159 --> 01:23:00,880
and two thousand, I guess it
was, Yeah, have all been outstanding.

1307
01:23:00,279 --> 01:23:03,319
So I'm glad that he's due a
point in his life as he turns

1308
01:23:03,319 --> 01:23:08,319
fifty eight years old today as we
record this, that at least on the

1309
01:23:08,359 --> 01:23:11,960
outside, he's in a good place. He's you know, he doesn't have

1310
01:23:12,000 --> 01:23:15,159
the hundreds of millions of dollars he
should have had from his boxing career.

1311
01:23:15,840 --> 01:23:17,600
We don't have to litigate all the
issues he had with Don King, who

1312
01:23:17,920 --> 01:23:21,840
you know, he accused of taking
money that was not rightfully his. Obviously,

1313
01:23:21,880 --> 01:23:27,039
you know, they've had their litigations, they've settled all that. He's

1314
01:23:27,039 --> 01:23:30,680
been in bankruptcy, he's been married, in divorce multiple times, as I

1315
01:23:30,680 --> 01:23:34,600
said, death of a child,
all kinds of issues, prison, jail

1316
01:23:34,680 --> 01:23:39,359
for the road rage incident, a
drug problem, and he's come out the

1317
01:23:39,359 --> 01:23:41,800
other end, and you know what, he's a stronger person because of it.

1318
01:23:41,840 --> 01:23:45,159
And now he seems like he's living
his best life. He's making money,

1319
01:23:45,159 --> 01:23:46,920
he's having fun, he's you know, he's eating his edibles. He's

1320
01:23:46,920 --> 01:23:51,680
gonna fight Jake Paul. I mean, it's just the arc of his career

1321
01:23:53,319 --> 01:23:56,760
is just so remarkable. We got
to know him as like a We started

1322
01:23:56,760 --> 01:23:59,479
to know him as about a nineteen
year old, and now as a fifty

1323
01:23:59,520 --> 01:24:02,279
eight year old. Some you know
what all these years later we did still

1324
01:24:02,279 --> 01:24:05,640
in our life is amazing to me. We did the whole what if thing?

1325
01:24:05,760 --> 01:24:08,920
You did some what if this happened. What if that happened? And

1326
01:24:09,000 --> 01:24:11,159
one of the things I brought up
right away when we did that on one

1327
01:24:11,159 --> 01:24:15,319
of these pods many months ago,
was what if don King did not drive

1328
01:24:15,359 --> 01:24:21,479
the wedge in between what was left
of Cus Domatto's lineage cust To Motto had

1329
01:24:21,560 --> 01:24:27,399
died, Jim Jacobs had died,
and if Kevin Rooney had still been the

1330
01:24:27,439 --> 01:24:30,800
trainer, and if if, if, if, if he had still stayed

1331
01:24:30,840 --> 01:24:34,600
on track and stayed focused, the
Buster Douglas thing never happens. I firmly

1332
01:24:34,600 --> 01:24:38,840
believe it was. It was just
February of nineteen ninety. Yeah, honestly,

1333
01:24:38,920 --> 01:24:41,359
I think if he had stayed with
those folks, if if, for

1334
01:24:41,399 --> 01:24:45,159
example, Jimmy hadn't passed, or
he had stayed with with uh Rooney and

1335
01:24:45,000 --> 01:24:48,560
not with King, whatever, maybe
they would have kept the train on the

1336
01:24:48,560 --> 01:24:50,960
track a little bit longer. But
it was inevitable that it was going to

1337
01:24:51,000 --> 01:24:55,520
go off the track at some point, So I don't maybe, I mean,

1338
01:24:55,560 --> 01:24:57,800
maybe maybe somebody was going to beat
him, and maybe it was going

1339
01:24:57,880 --> 01:25:01,079
to go off the track, but
certainly not as downward as spiral as what

1340
01:25:01,199 --> 01:25:05,359
happened within about a year where he
was beaten by a fighter that had a

1341
01:25:05,399 --> 01:25:10,239
great night but had no business beating
him, and uh, and then the

1342
01:25:10,520 --> 01:25:14,920
rest leads to prison in his mid
twenties. After that, the fleet during

1343
01:25:14,960 --> 01:25:18,319
that lead to I could have foreseen
that Mike Tyson defended the title another eight

1344
01:25:18,479 --> 01:25:24,880
or ten times, possibly in the
early in the early nineteen nineties. None

1345
01:25:24,880 --> 01:25:27,239
of that ever happened. Buster Douglas
beading him and he went to prison.

1346
01:25:27,800 --> 01:25:31,920
I just wonder is it possible.
Is it possible today for there to be

1347
01:25:32,079 --> 01:25:39,319
another boxer as famous as him?
Because as famous as Manny Pacyao became,

1348
01:25:39,520 --> 01:25:45,800
or Floyd Mayweather became, Oscar de
la Hoya, Cayson Fury's fame is a

1349
01:25:45,840 --> 01:25:48,039
pittance compared to Mike Tyson. The
only thing that he's got compared to Mike

1350
01:25:48,119 --> 01:25:53,359
is the fact that he's named after
Mike. So I'm just making the point

1351
01:25:53,359 --> 01:25:59,079
that I don't I think he's the
last one to achieve that level of justice

1352
01:25:59,079 --> 01:26:02,399
because all but like he can go
anywhere in the world, that's right,

1353
01:26:02,479 --> 01:26:04,680
and they know who you were.
And it's like Ali, you could have

1354
01:26:04,680 --> 01:26:09,199
plopped anywhere anywhere in the planet and
he would have been recognized absolutely, But

1355
01:26:09,239 --> 01:26:12,920
today you can PLoP Mike Tyson anywhere. I don't care if it's Africa,

1356
01:26:13,000 --> 01:26:15,159
Asia, Europe, the United States. I need street corner. People are

1357
01:26:15,159 --> 01:26:21,800
going to recognize Mike Tyson. And
the reason and the reason because we keep

1358
01:26:21,800 --> 01:26:27,960
emphasizing this that he became so well
known is boxing was in the past ten

1359
01:26:28,119 --> 01:26:33,119
so much more mainstream. The heavyweight
title was such a big deal worldwide,

1360
01:26:33,239 --> 01:26:39,479
and he was destroying everybody leading to
it, destroying them It was laughable,

1361
01:26:39,520 --> 01:26:42,520
destroying them in a round or two
in a lot of cases. And these

1362
01:26:42,720 --> 01:26:45,960
biggest fights, especially the Sphinx fight, when everybody thought that was going to

1363
01:26:45,039 --> 01:26:48,800
be such a big test. After
he had wiped out an age Larry Holmes

1364
01:26:48,800 --> 01:26:51,880
and had wiped out two or three
others in titled defenses, and then he

1365
01:26:51,920 --> 01:26:57,239
destroys Sphinx in around You're looking at
this going this guy's invincible, and worldwide

1366
01:26:57,279 --> 01:27:00,840
they do know who he is.
But the end result is nothing ever lasts

1367
01:27:00,880 --> 01:27:03,920
forever. That run didn't last forever, but Mike has lasted to age fifty

1368
01:27:03,960 --> 01:27:06,479
eight, which is what your point
is. The bottom mine is thety birthday

1369
01:27:06,479 --> 01:27:10,199
to Iron Mike. Yeah, if
you spent if he's fifty years old today,

1370
01:27:10,199 --> 01:27:14,520
he spent literally about forty years in
the public Spoway, Yes, and

1371
01:27:14,560 --> 01:27:17,520
he's still in it and he's fighting
coming up. It's crazy happy Brandon,

1372
01:27:17,600 --> 01:27:21,840
Mike and uh and one more little
footnote here. Really I believe it was

1373
01:27:21,880 --> 01:27:27,000
his last amateur fight. We got
the Olympic boxing that we always know about.

1374
01:27:27,039 --> 01:27:29,319
In the Olympic boxing, it's controversially
is it going to be in the

1375
01:27:29,319 --> 01:27:31,399
Olympics, Not in the Olympics anymore, et cetera. Mike lost to Henry

1376
01:27:31,479 --> 01:27:36,720
Tillman in the Olympic Boxing trials,
and Tilman went on to the LA Summer

1377
01:27:36,760 --> 01:27:41,239
Games in nineteen eighty four and won
the gold medal. How much different or

1378
01:27:41,239 --> 01:27:44,680
what more would we have known if
Mike Tyson the amateur ends up in the

1379
01:27:44,800 --> 01:27:46,479
LA Summer Olympics and wins a gold
medal. Who knows if he would have

1380
01:27:46,479 --> 01:27:49,720
won the gold medal? I don't
know. But that's how about when Tyson

1381
01:27:49,760 --> 01:27:53,439
fought Henry Tillman in the pros and
destroyed him. He got his hands on

1382
01:27:53,479 --> 01:27:56,800
Tilman in nineteen ninety after the bug
Buster Douglas loss, and again it was

1383
01:27:56,920 --> 01:28:00,960
quicker than the Burger King drive through. It was over card. That was

1384
01:28:00,000 --> 01:28:03,199
the card that he fought in the
main event on where George Foreman fought in

1385
01:28:03,199 --> 01:28:08,279
the co feature, and Bob aarm
and Don King co promoted that because George

1386
01:28:08,319 --> 01:28:11,439
was with Bob, and they did
this big show at Caesar's Palace, a

1387
01:28:11,479 --> 01:28:15,079
double header on HBO where George fought
Addison Rodriguez, and there was a lot

1388
01:28:15,119 --> 01:28:18,279
of conversation that that was the prelude
to what I think would have been easily

1389
01:28:18,279 --> 01:28:21,439
the biggest fight in heavyweight history in
terms of the money, at least at

1390
01:28:21,439 --> 01:28:25,439
that time, was George Foreman against
Mike Tyson. I would have been big

1391
01:28:25,439 --> 01:28:28,439
even if it wasn't for a world
title, and for a variety of reasons,

1392
01:28:28,439 --> 01:28:30,039
it never happened. But that night
when they fought on the same card,

1393
01:28:30,079 --> 01:28:34,159
it was Tyson exacting the amateur avenge
against Henry Tillman, who we absolutely

1394
01:28:34,159 --> 01:28:36,680
destroyed it in the pros. Are
you gonna tell me now that you have

1395
01:28:36,720 --> 01:28:42,800
a program or a poster from Henry
Tillman beating Mike in the Amateurs? I

1396
01:28:42,800 --> 01:28:45,600
wish I did. I do.
I do have the program of the poster

1397
01:28:45,640 --> 01:28:48,800
from that doubleheader with Foreman absolutely about
that. I count on you for that.

1398
01:28:48,840 --> 01:28:51,199
In the Rayfield collection, I don't
even know. I've never seen.

1399
01:28:51,239 --> 01:28:55,239
I'm sure there's a I'm sure there's
something to the to the trials, but

1400
01:28:55,279 --> 01:29:00,479
it wouldn't necessarily mention Tillman or or
Tyson on the cover in the there is

1401
01:29:00,720 --> 01:29:04,079
there is video out there. I
want to say, ABC showed it,

1402
01:29:04,439 --> 01:29:08,920
even in clip form, not the
whole fight of Henry Tillman beating Mike Tyson

1403
01:29:08,960 --> 01:29:12,840
in the Olympic Trials, and then
ABC televised the Summer Olympics a couple months

1404
01:29:12,920 --> 01:29:16,880
later. That think as much as
much boxing is as ABC did in their

1405
01:29:16,960 --> 01:29:20,600
day, especially with wide world of
sports, one thing that people sometimes forget

1406
01:29:20,640 --> 01:29:25,319
is for all the big professional fights
that they put on ABC, they also

1407
01:29:25,640 --> 01:29:29,960
very very regularly covered amateur boxing.
That's right, all the all the trials,

1408
01:29:30,039 --> 01:29:33,600
and and not only the trials,
but but things that were, you

1409
01:29:33,640 --> 01:29:39,000
know, national Golden Gloves, National
Golden Gloves. They would also cover just

1410
01:29:39,039 --> 01:29:41,439
like a random due meet, the
United States versus Cuba, or the United

1411
01:29:41,479 --> 01:29:45,239
States versus Poland or whatever it was. And and that was the way that

1412
01:29:45,279 --> 01:29:47,720
a lot of those amateur fighters got
It's kind of like if you're watching,

1413
01:29:48,039 --> 01:29:50,399
you know, back before it was
one and done. In college basketball,

1414
01:29:50,600 --> 01:29:55,720
when players would stay in in the
big schools and play for three or four

1415
01:29:55,800 --> 01:29:59,760
years. Those players when it came
time for the NBA draft were household names.

1416
01:29:59,760 --> 01:30:01,760
You know, sit there and you
you know, watch where Shaquille O'Neal

1417
01:30:01,800 --> 01:30:04,760
going. He had been playing college
ball for a few years. He was

1418
01:30:04,800 --> 01:30:09,000
known. Or you know, Christian
Latoner, everybody knew a lot was people

1419
01:30:09,039 --> 01:30:12,960
would watch that. Now it's not
the same, but amateur boxing that was

1420
01:30:13,000 --> 01:30:15,479
sort of the same thing. Those
guys became big names. That's how Ray

1421
01:30:15,560 --> 01:30:18,359
Leonard and all those great fighters on
the seventy six Olympic team became known at

1422
01:30:18,359 --> 01:30:23,159
the time. Same thing with the
eighty four Olympians, Whittaker and Evander Holyfield,

1423
01:30:23,199 --> 01:30:26,359
and they were all known because they
had been seen on the weekend shows

1424
01:30:26,399 --> 01:30:29,000
for years. Tyson didn't get to
that level because he didn't fight in the

1425
01:30:29,039 --> 01:30:31,640
Olympics. But uh, you know, we digress. But that's the point

1426
01:30:31,640 --> 01:30:36,319
though Tyson got that early TV exposure, combined with the massive knockouts, became

1427
01:30:36,359 --> 01:30:41,039
a fucking legend. And uh,
we're still talking about him forty years later.

1428
01:30:41,039 --> 01:30:45,079
Interims Hay Birthday, iron mind and
with that, it's been a busy

1429
01:30:45,159 --> 01:30:48,239
recap pod. I am getting the
stink guy right now about going and grabbing

1430
01:30:48,279 --> 01:30:53,439
some dinner with the twins. So
thank you for finding us here on the

1431
01:30:53,439 --> 01:30:57,359
pod. We're ready for fourth of
July week, Shakur Stevenson Title Fight week.

1432
01:30:57,359 --> 01:31:00,560
Hopefully you enjoyed hearing Shakur. Make
sure you're follow subscribing on this podcast

1433
01:31:00,600 --> 01:31:04,920
feed, follow and subscribe to the
email newsletter and the Dan Rayfield substack as

1434
01:31:04,960 --> 01:31:09,119
well. With that, my friend, we come off the weekend. We're

1435
01:31:09,119 --> 01:31:11,319
ready to have a good week,
a holiday week. The independence of the

1436
01:31:11,439 --> 01:31:15,520
United States of America coming up this
week. Have a good week, Dan,

1437
01:31:15,520 --> 01:31:17,960
anything else will be good. I
think we're good. I hope you

1438
01:31:18,760 --> 01:31:26,239
enjoy the rest of your Foco Beach
excribe agains, and yes, we're having

1439
01:31:26,239 --> 01:31:29,159
fun over here. We'll be back
in due time with a preview pot off

1440
01:31:29,199 --> 01:31:31,159
the fourth of July holiday. Thank
you, Dan Rayphaield, have a good

1441
01:31:31,159 --> 01:31:34,880
week you too, sir. There
we go fight for e ch Night substack.

1442
01:31:34,960 --> 01:31:38,640
Make sure you're following subscribing. I'm
merely TJ Reach. Thank you for

1443
01:31:38,680 --> 01:31:40,880
being with us.