What is krack alacin fellow thermonuclear a Efforts. I am Dan fa Valley coming
at you with my certified fantabulous co host, mister Grant Hughes, coming to
talk the opening of NBA training camps and all the news rumors, takeaways,
observation questions that we deem pertinent as we bounce around before we get started,
the usual reminder that you don't hear all the time now as we plow through
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I haven't done this in a while, so it's very just just subscribe.
That's the best way to to support the show at this point, Grant,
how the heck are you doing? I'm doing very well. I would also
add that, like, if enough people finally listen to the our constant requests
for subscriptions and follows and validation really is what we're talking about, maybe we
won't have to start and end every podcast with this. Maybe we did it.
What's the threshold at which we stop asking for validation? Do you think
once we get to five thousand YouTube subscribers, if that could happen in the
next couple months, Like I will stop pumping at the beginning. It has
to come at the end. It doesn't have to say it at the end.
So I don't know. I don't know how to transition into the Frank
Mila, Keena, Jared Allen stuff without first talking about rating, reviewing,
and subscribing. It's just like my brain goes on a track that has to
start with that stuff. So that'll always be at the end. But you
know, I'm doing well. I'm excited to current events. The other thing
I will push I always talk about juicing the algo on the full video is
go to our shorts and put comments on those things. They get views and
they generate subscribers, but very few of them get like comments. And I'll
see all these other shorts that have all these comments. I understand that.
Whatever, but go go juice the algorithm on the shorts and comments on those.
Yeah, and your comment can be this is dumb. If you want,
you know, it doesn't really matter what it is. Just away,
go ahead, right whatever you want. We just want interaction current events,
right, Like we've got media days and training camps and we're recording this on
on Wednesday. Stuff is like actually happening, which is fun because now it's
no more. I mean, we're still going to do some of this when
we do wind totals and stuff next week, but uh, we have new
developments as opposed to let's look at this team on paper and try to guess
how it's going to be like that. This is this is a little bit
of a pivot, and it's also a signal that it's getting real. We're
starting, we're getting close to the real thing. Now. Whenever our podcast
schedule has become less formulaic, like the content coverage of it, it's oh,
it's go time. Until that we are we are reaching reaching that point.
Do you wanna what do you want to talk about first? How about
you start us off? We'll go back do you I don't know if I
want to talk about it, but we really have to the James Harden stuff.
You know, he misses media day. Uh, this is all coming
on the heels of just it being telegraphed over the off season that like this
is gonna be a mess. Uh, he's going The word uncomfortable was used
then and now in quotes as as far as how he was going to make
things go for the Sixers. He wasn't at media day, not a surprise.
He wasn't at the first day of training camp. Uh. The sixtions
are now at Colorado State having completed I think today's second day of training camp,
and James Harden was there. H. So you know in conjunction with
all that we've got, you know, reports and various sourced quotations from everyone
you know. Woj has stuff. Sam Amy had some stuff today. I
just like. And it kind of runs the gamut because in Woge's piece he
talks about the Sixers express hope the situation can be resolved, and it's just
like, what really like this is salvageable? It just doesn't seem possible.
And then you get things like he wants to make things uncomfortable, and then
Amic says the hardness just as incensed as before at Maury, which I love
the word. The use of incensed is really it tickles the right, tickles
the right. Good choice by him, Good job, Sam. I guess
I don't really have I do. I guess I do have a question.
What should this is gonna be a mess, It's not going away. Harden
has the withholding services thing hanging over his head where if he you know it
is really really not careful about how he handled this, he could cost himself
free agency. Essentially, what do you think the sixers should want? Like,
they can't really want him back, right, and then what do you
think is likely to happen? Here? Is this gonna drag on. I
just am curious about sort of where you stand holistically on the hardened situation,
because I'll let you talk and then I'll give you my take. But I'm
just like the cynic in me is just like this is never gonna get fixed
and the Sixers are done forever. Like that's that's where I've gone with it.
Or are you there too? Or do you have a more nuanced take
on it? No, I don't. I don't think it's more nuanced.
I will say, despite all these reports, I just don't feel like the
inevitable outcome has changed and that this is more likely going to regardless of whose
sides you're taking, and we're never gonna know the whole story. I'm sure
this is similar to the Damian Lillard stuff. I'm sure all parties involved could
have handled things a lot better, and that they've They've messed up to some
degree, But the most likely outcome is James Harden will probably get what he
wants to some extent, and I end up on a different team. Maybe
it's the Clippers, and that this is going to set back the Sixers more
than anything. I know it worked out with the Ben Simmons situation. This
is just different because there wasn't like a free agent market for Harden this year,
and it's it's very clear. It's such as he wants to go to
one team. When we were going through the Damian Lillard stuff, when we're
going through even Drew Holiday stuff, you can come up with multiple teams,
even if they're not on Damian Lillard's list, who should roll the dice on
that star. I can't come up with that team for Harden, which I
really do think is going to screw over the Sixers in terms of asset management
and what they're able to get back for him, What that does to their
window with Joel Embiid, what it does to their chances of keeping Joel Embiid
beyond this season. I would say, because I don't think a trade request
is coming imminently but from him, But I would say next summer, like
the on how this James Harden situation shakes out, and there's also is there
a possibility where he just doesn't get moved, plays out the season in Philly
and then then what happens? What are his options? When you're looking at
the cap space teams next summer, they're not gonna be necessarily any more attractive
than they were this past season for him, unless he just cares about getting
the bag and maybe there's a team that's, hey, we will give you
a max contract for two or three years or whatever it ends up being.
I just I can't predict the outcome here, but it just kind of seems
like there were more outs and more twists and turns and unpredictability in the Damian
Lillard situation when looking at how it would ultimately turn out, then there is
with this because I feel like it all ends with I think in the end,
the Sixers are gonna be the ones that come out looking worse for where
when you're gauging their future and their outlook, I think, I think ultimately
it's gonna cost them EMBIID. And it's been a series of moves that have
led to this. You know, the Ben Simmons thing is very much related.
But you know, and be to his credit, has been loyal and
is not making this as nasty of a situation as I think he's within his
rights to make it because he just won MVP and now like the idea of
a gap year is on the table, even if no one's talking about it,
like where we take a step back as the Sixers and just hoard cap
space for free agents like Tobias Harris, And I don't know what the point
of that is. I want to ask you a hypothetical. You're one of
the other twenty nine gms in the league outside of Philly, do you want
James Harden on your team? And obviously, and now because you have to
trade for him, the answer is if you have to give up a significant
number of assets, is clearly no, because the trade would be done by
now if that offer were on the table. Like, just do you want
him? Because I think the number of teams that he makes sense on is
really low, and I think if you acquire him, you're you know,
we're people were talking about, Well, Drew Holliday may not be as great
an acquisition. I don't think this, but is kind of not the easiest
acquisition in the world because he's got the ability to hit free agency. We've
got to figure out what this thirty three year old is worth. We're gonna
have maybe have to overpay him, or maybe we lose him. That all
applies to James Harden, except like the concern factor is one hundred x because
of all the various times he's quit on his teams and made things difficult.
Like, so, do you want James Harden? That like just end of
question. No, Now, I don't want to be in the James Harden
business if it's gonna like the money is one thing that you're gonna have to
pay him, but the fact that you can't extend him once you acquire him,
and so what are his salary de Man's gonna be this summer? Is
there a chance that he just leaves right anyway? Because you knew that's not
that's not gonna happen with Damian Lowd in Milwaukee. Worst case scenario, he
requests out again, they're still gonna get stuff for him. Maybe you could
figure out a way to sign and trade hard in that scenario. I don't
know, but if you're gonna have to give up real stuff to get him,
yeah, you know, if you're the Clippers is a good example.
That's the team he wants to go to. And I think if Russell Westbrook
wasn't on the team, I could probably talk myself and do, Yeah,
put your two firsts on the table, throw the expiring contracts in there,
No, Terrence Man shouldn't be a breaking point because I get the theory of
what is playmaking shot creation does for that team. They can insulate him defensively,
but he also just we want that team to play with more pace.
Russell Westbrook helps them do that. Terrence Mann helps them do that. You're
gonna get rid of Terrence Mann maybe in that trade, and then you're gonna
pair James Harden with Russell Westbrook again. And that didn't turn out so well
in Houston. So that is the team that can talk themselves into probably giving
up the most right now, unless this is does this all kind of end?
Like could the Lakers do something ridiculous once Austin Reeves and Ruy Hachimora or
once Danzelo Russell and Austin Reaves become trade eligible, and like they talked themselves
into paring James Harden with Anthony Davis and Lebron James and step Ladder their way
there. I just can't you know, you're asking me if I want James
Harden, what is the I just I struggle. James Harnden is still very
good basketball player, which is why is so wild? I mean, sometimes
not not necessarily when you really need him to be though, right, but
like right, And I think the big issue here is he had some big
playoff games last year, but he's never shown a willingness to be like the
even the second guy. Really he was that last year and I guess he
wasn't happy, and so what is he gonna be like if he's the third
guy? Right, so you could probably talk yourself into certain teams, but
if he is knocked down a peg or two in the hierarchy, I could
see that being beneficial. But like I'm thinking of teams, you know,
the two teams that kind of stand out as like I would kind of love
to just not like sort of a fuck it, let's try it. And
I don't know what the package would be. So Miami is won just Harden
and heat culture, like does he get in the best shape of his life
or something? What happens there the other one? And I don't think people
are gonna like this, like what if he was justin Minnesota and it's like
you James Harden and Anthony Edwards and like that you're having that much shot creation
from those two players, And so I don't know. Again, I don't
know what the past looks like I wouldn't give up Jade McDaniels from at this
point, do the Sixers they're not gonna want Towns or go bare. Maybe
they'd want Commonly because he's he's fired in contract, but like they don't have
picks to give up. Like those are just two teams where it's like if
they're just trying to shake things up or get better. I know some people
have floated in Toronto, but I just can't see that going over well,
and Toronto is another team we have to get to we will, Yeah,
And so I just like, is there even I'll throw this question to you.
I know how you feel whether you want James Harmen, But there's a
team that is not the Clippers that you think maybe it's not even right now,
Maybe it's a month, two months down the line that can talk themselves
into, hey, we're gonna go after James. Like, does any team
spring to mind? Like it was very easy to start listing off teams for
Damian Lillard. It's not even close too difficult. It's worse than difficult to
do that with Harden. Yeah, I think the Clippers are the obvious one.
I mean, in so far as any of these teams are obvious.
The heater there too. I mean, like, I mean, you would
still say Houston. And I think Houston actually was a decent threat before there
was a report. I think I just saw it today. I don't know
how old it is. That basically Hardened and communicating with the Rockets made it
clear that he wanted to he wanted a scoring title, and that was what
Immiodoka said, like, well, that's a red flag, we're not interested.
Houston would have made sense because they've shown they showed a willingness to court
veterans on short deals to just try to you know, be half decent for
a little while and not compromise long term. Uh you know, cap flexibility
or whatever. Hard And ticks some of those boxes. I don't have a
team. I just don't like it doesn't this is this is the thing too.
In addition to that, Darryl Morey has been pretty adamant in saying we're
not going to trade him unless we get pieces back that up our championship equity.
And I'm paraphrasing, but it's like, the idea is we want to
stay where we are or get better by trading James Harden, and that to
me, seems just beyond unrealistic at this point. So that would suggest that
they won't trade him, which also seems unrealistic at this point. And that's
why the situation is so fascinating. It's such a weird impasse where like every
factor on every side just run. It just works in contradictory ways are working
across purposes. One of the most interesting things to me about all this is
Tyrese, MAXI, PJ. Tucker and to some extent EMBIID have all kind
of and Maxie and and and uh and Patrick Beverley to throw him in there
have said things like we'd love to have him back, like we I hope
he shows up, you know, which is part of It's like, well,
what are they really going to say? And from a microphone, you
know where I'm done with him? I can't you can't probably say what you
really think. But one of the strangest elements in all this to me is
that the players don't seem teammates, don't seem to turn on Harden in situations
like this, or at least not as much as like I would with them,
you know, So that that's so it really does seem like there are
probably a lot of players on teams out there that are like, yeah,
get us James Harden. That'd be awesome. But I don't think there's a
single executive in the league that feels the same way. It's just an interesting
divide and and I can't kind of like reconcile it in my mind. Do
you know what would be I think the funniest random destinations. And these are
not teams that I'm endorsing to go after James Harden. I got a few
of them. Shit go sideways, and we'll get to this team in Golden
State and they just decide, like Chris Paul's not working out, we're gonna
step light our away with his salary to get James Harden and see if that
works. Because we know, you know, maybe James Harden kind of falls
in line when Steph Curry and Draymond Green. Sure, yeah, like he
fell in line with Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving and fell in line with Joe.
Let me like you to come off the bench. I don't think that
would go. Brooklyn might be the biggest what if team in NBA history,
Like if Kyrie just gets the jab, are we talking about a team that
win, they have at least one title, right, maybe maybe, I
mean the Harden narrative would be really different, but it isn't. I don't
want to spoil that. That's part of my garbage time though, so I
don't want to spoil that, all right, spoiler half spoiler alert. Could
they like if it's if the cost ends up being and this doesn't jibe with
what the Sixers want to do entering free agency, maybe there's a third team
here where they get expiring contracts if the cost is CJ. McCollum and stuff
that is not Trey Murphy and it's the Pelicans. Yeah, that's just a
team where it's okay, we have Zion. There's a lot of overlap then
with Brandon Ingram and Harden. At the same time, my Carn's a much
better passer than anyone else on this team, including CG. Mccoms. So
does it get a little bit like, is there some is there an element
of similarities there with Harden? Or is it worse because you can't count them
in the locker room. But then you're also getting out of CG. McCollum's
extension, and maybe you're worried about that. As your team gets more expensive,
Brandon Ingram start thinking about his new contract. Trey Murphy is going to
be extension now Herb Jones's deals like it's a footnote. But like Jonas found
Chewess in the final year of his deal, So I'm not looking at is
oh, you need to get off to CJ McCollum deal. But this is
a team in the Pelicans that, while they are in the tax right now,
and while David Griffin has maintained that they would be willing to pay the
tax if they're good enough, they're not going to pay the tax. Yeah,
like it's not gonna happen it, So that would be Again, I'm
not endorsing any of these, but that is a team that is just like
okay, like if they're playing kind of well, but they want to duck
the tax and they're still kind of worried about Zion's like I'm just wondering,
and then I have another one, but good, I don't want to because
I've already like made my position clear of like I don't want James Harden,
so all I would do is like, well, Dan, I mean,
like the whole point of the Pelicans is so Zion can be on the ball.
James Harden's not gonna be like no shit, Like, of course,
it's easy to shoot down all these ideas and I don't want to do that.
It's hard. What about Orlando before you give me another one? Is
that what you're You're gonna just want Magic fans to hate us, Like every
journey we have is the antithesis of what Orlando was looking for. It doesn't
matter. Ah, look that I actually think that would not be a terrible
fit. But they're just not a team that's gonna do it. No,
they're not because they should. The next team and I'm gonna mention wouldn't do
it either, But it's just like what if? What if? Just OKC
is really good? But like the offense isn't there yet, and you're looking
at you know, Philly wants picks and salaries that they can reroute like to
keep their books clean. You have damas Burton's is expiring there maybe they would
would you give up lou Dort and Breton's and picks for a flyer on Harden
like you're not? But then like Giddy's already there. I again, I
wouldn't do it. I'm just you know, maybe there's good vibes. He
was in OKC once before. Is he's still mad about the way things unfolded
there. He probably never becomes the megastar he is if he stays in the
shadow of Russ and KD. I look, this is how I'm grasping for
straws. I mean, you know what's funny is some of the teams I
already mentioned Houston and you mentioned OKC, like Brooklyn actually needs a James Harden
type, you know, like someone to you know, someone that so dinwitty
and and isn't your main ball handler. And Ben Simmons isn't being relied upon
to be the point guard, and Michail Bridges can scale back a little,
like all these teams that he's been on, like they're they're the ones that
actually kind of need him if if anyone does, I don't know, like
you could just nay Is leaving Brooklyn and Teckning more about Kyrie right than anything
else, And so maybe you could mend those fences. I just have no
idea. Wouldn't it be How wild would it be for Simmons and Harden to
end up team Well, Simmons isn't expiring so whether it'd have to be a
third team and the Philly's like obsessed with cap space for some reason. No,
No, I'm not sending Simmons back to the Sixers. I'm saying Harden
and Simmons now play together. Oh, I thought you meant that would be
hysterical, it'd be so bizarre. The final thing on this because we and
we'll get to I was gonna I was thinking about asking you about there's been
shade has been thrown at Doc Rivers left and left and right in trading camp.
We're gonna do Sixers look at too, and we'll talk to Brian toa
Porik about that stuff. The last thing on the hard in front though,
is were we not saying similar things about the Ben Simmons situation in Philly?
So is there a chance that we're wrong here or was it? Well,
even when Ben Simmons was on the block and they weren't moving him, you
at least there was the idea that, oh, the Sixers might have turned
down Tyre's Halliburton, whereas with James Harden it's the Clippers won't even give up
Tern's man for him, right right, No, they're the situations are analogous.
I mean just because of the team's involved, but they're so different.
Like I just I I am as much as anything, I am fascinated to
see because I do assume he'll get traded. It just I can't imagine that
this is a salvageable situation in Philly. I cannot wait to see what the
trade package is because because it might because if it's a decent package, it's
gonna seem like I'll be just blown away. How do the Sixers get anything
for him? And then if it's a really like unbelievably low ball package,
it'll just be it'll just solidify what I'm like starting to kind of think,
which is that we are now in the like late stage Russell Westbrook portion of
the James Harden experience, where you know, if you give up anything to
get him talking about the Lakers straight a couple off seasons ago, it's just
a mistake by definition. So I'm I cannot wait to see how this resolves,
because the trade package will just be fascinating and I wanted to resolve.
I know we just spent twenty mills year about talking about it, but I
want it to end. This is not because because it seems so unlikely that
there's gonna be a curveball thrown, Like I don't enjoy talking about it.
Like the Damian Lillard stuff, there was always the prospect of, like,
we think it's gonna be Miami, but I could see it not. And
this is just I don't have that same inkling here. I can't wait,
by the way, to talk to Brian about uh, just because I feel
like I'm being alarmist with the Embiid stuff and I'm, you know, looking
too many steps ahead. But it's just like every super starts loyal till they're
not. Dame Muller just got traded like it just and it's if if Embid
were to make a trade request, nobody on planet Earth would say no,
are you kidding? Like I couldn't have seen you know it, Just it
seems like it's imminent. I don't know what the timeline is, but I'm
curious about someone who really has followed that team super closely where he is on
the whole Embiid side of this, because that's more than anything I don't want
to ruin the episode we've yet to record yet, but speaking with him fairly
frequently on the side you're not being an alarmist. Good, but let's go
to the Golden State Warriors, because I feel like this is more positivity than
if we were to shift directly to Toronto. What have you kind of made?
One? We haven't talked about the Draymond Green ankle sprain, which I
think Jason Dumas reported he's going to be out three to four weeks or something.
And aren't the Warriors timelines. They're always kind of like reevaluate and then
you attack on another week or two to that. So there's that factor in.
But the stuff coming out of so Chris Paul when he was asked about
starting because he had to be that might be a non issue to begin the
season if Draymond misses some time, but it will invariably be a question he
brought up like the two thousand and eight Olympics, which was almost twenty years
ago at this point. His coming off the bench. Yeah, but again
positive response. And then there was the video that was posted by Anthony Slater
where it seemed like Chris was really trying to immerse himself in Pet Warrior sets
rather than Oh, he's arguing that he wants the Warriors to run like more
double drag with him or something. So what have you kind of made of
It's? Look, it's the start of training camp. Everyone's in the best
shape of their lives. They game fifteen pounds of muscle while losing five percent
of their body fat. But like, what if are you? Are you
like more optimistic that you tended to be, by the way, relative to
Warriors, like people more optimistic about this fit to begin with? Were you
like even more hopeful now after going through the early offts of training camp?
Well, I got to say that the Draymond Green injury really it hit me
a little harder than I think. It's a sprained ankle in September at the
time normally would But it's because I was gonna and we may still need to
do this. I was gonna have like, Dan, please talk me down,
because I kind of think the Warriors belong in the like top flight contender
class, just with literally anyone. And and then when that injury gets reported,
it's like, oh, right, these guys are old, and a
sprained ankle is a long time and there's no guarantee that it doesn't affect almost
all of the season, like and this is just the first and what might
be because of these guys' ages, just a series of this kind of thing,
and we never really we're gonna it'll be January and it's like the starting
five finally gets to play together, you know, like that kind of thing.
So I get with or without Chris Paul, Well that's the thing.
So so that was I just wanted to, like, you know, start
with that aspect of it is. I'm ready to kind of like just like
back off the enthusiasm a touch because this was a reminder of how fragile this
whole thing is. Like everyone's subject to injuries derailing a season, but when
you're dealing with guys that are all in there, you know, early to
mid and Chris Paul's case, late thirties, like this is this is how
it goes bad, I think, which is to say like I never so
to get back to Chris Paul, everyone has kind of said the right things
throughout, you know, Steve Kerr said we're gonna use camp to look at
it. Chris Paul aside from some like you know, maybe misinterpreted facial expressions,
and like, let me answer your question with the question about me.
Starting type of stuff has at least been measured and let's do a wait and
see kind of approach, which makes sense, right, Like even if even
if Steve Kerr really already knows what he wants to do and is just hoping
everyone gets on board, don't you don't say that right away? The reason
I was high on the Chris Paul signing is if and this is the caveat
for the whole thing, if he's willing to come off the bench and probably
not close fairly off, and if everybody's healthy, he addresses their main weaknesses,
which is like just the turnover bonanza and the second unit sucking basically non
curry units not being able to score, like those have been a plague for
years, and they really reared their heads last year. And I just think
he solves those problems. So I think it's really it is encouraging that so
far, and the latest comments do seem to suggest that Paul is like it's
may it may go smoothly, like he might come off the bench. I
think that's the right decision. By the way, I think he should be
the sixth man. Yeah, because you can make a case for him substituting
in for like I don't know, Looney or Klay Thompson or even Draymond.
I guess that just never made like didn't seem like the way to get the
Warriors to you know, their optimal state to me, So it is encouraging.
I think that he's kind of the things are moving in the direction of
the direction they should, which is where he is the sixth man, and
he starts, you know, he might start twenty five games just because of
injuries and because of whatever else, rest days and things like that. So
I'm other than the Draymond injury, I think I'm mostly encouraged by by how
things are looking. And it is interesting that at least interesting to think about
Paul, who has been you know, probably doesn't get in as much credit
as he should for having to adjust playing styles like say in Houston for example,
but just the quintessential pick and roll point guard kind of learning. I
think him and Steph Curry work talking about like you know, pitch and go
actions and things like that, like that's that's interesting. I'd like to see
what Chris Paul could do and stuff like that in sets like that. So,
by the way, as to say, I'm mostly encouraged other than the
Draymond injury. I would love to see if they could get Steph CP three
And like on Draymond's podcast, I would listen to that episode of Raymond's podcast.
Yeah, just talking tactics and what do you think? I mean,
I assume you agree that like the hit you over the head logical moves,
that Chris Paul is the six man for this team, right, like there's
no other way to do it. We've kind of talked about it and we
were just more optimistic on the fin I do think people under sell everyone's talking
about, well, when it matters, most Steph Curry's gonna be on the
floor. So a lot of the non Steph minutes matter. They matter because
the Warriors lose them all the fucking time, and they're like a lot of
them. And yeah, and they were. There's at least, let's say,
thirteen minutes a game where Steph Curry's not on the floor. If you
can be a net neutral to net positive during those minutes on a consistent basis,
that's huge. And look, frankly, Jordan Poole wasn't cutting it.
And I know he came in and was he played very well as a starter
last year. When you look at his statistics, but like he's still insulated
there because you're gonna spend a lot of time with Draymond Green, like you
need someone who and they even kind of got away. They like to pair
Steph and Drey together, and they do that as much as possible. Like
last year they even tried to like use Draymond with the second unit more to
cushion that, and it just wasn't yet. It worked a little bit,
but then you're removing what you want is your best duo or like those are
the players you want, you know, sort of the Yokich and Jamal Murray
connection where it's you don't want to play those guys together less because they're so
damn good together. I think Chris Paul can really at least address those pockets
of time, if nothing else. What I'm most fascinated to see is,
never mind the starting how does he react if he's not closing games, because
that's a very real prospect. And then what does it even look like if
he is closing games or if that is your five man unit that you lean
on, that's gonna put a lot of pressure. I think on Andrew Wiggins
and lay Thompson would be the two, and we're already talking about Klay Thompson.
They've already talked about Kay Thompson defending more power forwards this year, and
that's probably better for his Like I know people will make jokes like power forwards
are bigger, but they also tend to be slower, and that might be
beneficial to Clay, Like, you know, if Andrew Wiggins has to defend
the point of attack, like, then you're gonna need Klay Thompson to kind
of check your opposing wings that you can stash Curry and CP three here and
there. Maybe see three ends up being better defensively. Like I feel like
people talked about like he was just absolutely cooked, and he definitely looked at
at points when we saw him in games against certain opponents and in the playoffs.
But he also aged thirty eight and is nowhere near the worst defensive guard
in the league. Yeah, which matters. I'm curious to see how they
navigate that. And I'm also before I throw it back to you and I
don't know this random, I just like kind of want to see is he
someone that can really help streamline the development and the play of Jonathan Kaminga and
maybe help Jonathan Kamena increase his opportunity on this team. I know the Warriors
are singing the praises of Dario Sharz right now. Like Kaminga, he's in
year three, Like this is a big year for him and the Warriors if
they still want to be invested in him as this long term cornerstone. Because
if they're not, it's kind of time to like shit or get off the
pot and then look at actually moving him into trade. Yeah. No,
I think sometimes I misjudge, like is this too obvious of a storyline to
discuss, because I'm very much in the like the Warriors silo, but the
Kaminga aspect of it, I don't think can be overstated because and it's represented.
Paul's potential impact on Kaminga is representative of like the knock on effects he
can have on lots of guys. But to start with Kaminga, one of
the hugest issues with him is, like I think, and it's been reported
like Kaminga really wants to be in on the ball twenty point a game scorer
like that is how that has kind of been his intention from the jump,
and it's just like he like raining him in and limiting the things he does
has been a challenge all along, and I think the most positive reports you
hear about him tend to be focused from the coaching staff and teammates on him
embracing a role which is basically like do three things really well like be an
athlete, roll to the basket, rebound, run, and transition. Everything
else is gravy if they just want him to do that, And I think
Chris Paul is someone that should just stream like you said it, streamline everything
for KAMINGA and make it easier. So maybe you don't get a better sense
of can he actually be like a first option on the ball like big Wing.
I don't think so, but I don't think we need to know that
yet. I think we need to see how good of a like superstar role
player he can be before we start talking about any of that. And I
think he's better positioned now with Paul to give us that information than he's ever
been. And it is kind of a make or break which is crazy to
say because he's twenty one, you know, it is kind of it feels
like a make or break season in some respects. But I think Paul also,
like if you're Klay Thompson, and you've a lot of times had to
be on a second unit without Steph and or Draymond, like that's where he
was he took you know, it was not focused on enough. Thompson's shot
selection last year was really bad in stretches, and it's because there wasn't a
lot else the Warriors could do and he was pressing. I think if he
just gets like one or two clean looks a game because Chris Paul finds him
spotting up as he runs a pick and roll, that could mean a lot
for the second unit and for the Warriors. And I think like someone like
Gary Payton who's super limited offensively, Paul is never going to miss him cutting
for a lob from the corner, Like it's just never gonna happen. And
so I think the impact Paul can have on guys beyond and Moses Moody is
another one. Just get him a couple of easy looks so he doesn't have
to do more than he can. That is, you know, that's really
just kind of parsing out the different ways that Paul can make the second unit
look better. But I think every single guy that he's gonna play with stands
to benefit and they stand to benefit because he's going to do all the thinking
and all the strategic hard work, and they're just going to get to finish.
You know that. That's the That's why the theory of Paul and the
Warriors always had so much appeal for me. Where do you want to go
next? We got to talk. I mean, we can take this a
million different ways, because it's the biggest kind of like combo story of the
last you know, well of the off season. So you got Damian Lillard
in Milwaukee, you have Drew Holliday in Boston, and I think it's fair
to say, like when the Lillard trade happened, all the title odds,
you know, bumped Milwaukee to the top. The Boston trade happens, Boston
kind of moves back to the top. There's a very clear one two in
the East. We can talk about that, and we probably should. I
just it's hard to know, like, you know, how much we're belaboring
kind of pretty well covered talking points about Boston's depth issues, injury issues and
Milwaukee's like what are we gonna do with Dame on defense stuff? We can
circle back to that. Have we entirely forgotten about the Calves. I know
you love the Calves. I know that the you know, record they put
together last year when they had the second best net rating in the league,
suggests that we should love the Calves. I know the fact that they addressed
the weakness we harped on all last year by getting Max Struce suggests they should
be better. I know the fact that everyone that matters on that team shouldn't
be at least as good this year as last, with the exception of Darius
Garland and Evan Mobley, who should be way better and are already really good.
I'm not saying the Calves belong necessarily in the Milwaukee or in the Milwaukee
Boston tier, but like people are talking about Miami before getting to Cleveland when
you're thinking of like, who's gonna give these top two teams a hard time?
And that seems just so totally backwards to me. I get it,
the Heat made the finals and the Calves lost in the first round, But
I just don't know how you can look at the Eastern Conference landscape. Maybe
this is the way to put it and Philly's falling apart and not put Cleveland
as number three with a bullet with a really good chance to give either of
those top two teams trouble, Like is that over? Like, who else
are you even considering as the third best team in the East? Is I
think it's Cleveland, like in a absolute runaway. And when we talk,
when you hear the discourse on these top two teams, Cleveland just isn't like
isn't in the conversation And I don't understand it. That's not a question.
I just want you to validate my Uh how upset I am about that?
Well, it's validation. And I think, look, because of the uncertainty
that Boston and Milwaukee, which they they had to begin with, there was
different there's different versions of uncertainty. But now that they've caked in a lot
of these depth questions on their team, like are we just sure? Like
yeah, I want to see those two teams meet in the playoffs for sure.
And I think that based off the top end of their town in Boston's
top six is just beyond compare. Yeah, But like if we're looking at
the regular season specifically, the Cavs are in the mix for the one seed,
Like you can't tell you can't guarantee me right now? Based on some
of the death concerns, some of the injury concerns that both those teams have
that like, I would not I don't know what if you forced me to
bet on like an X amount of dollars on both Boston and Milwaukee having a
better regular season record than Cleveland. I'm not betting more than like one hundred
bucks because I don't want to lose it. There's a chance that they're going
to be that good, and I'll shout out. I'll shout out and then
drag him through the mud. Justin Rowan from the Chase Down podcast pointed out
to me that Darius Garland was more of an emotion shooter last year than I
had credited. And I looked at the volume. I didn't I knew he
was could be a good shooter. I did not realize the volume when he
was in motion. That is monstrous for this team to have him and Max
Strews on the court at the same damn time. Now, I will drag
him through the mud for this. I was flirting with picking the cass to
come out of the East and then the Bucks make the Damian Lillard trade.
But Justin Rowan kind of talked me out of it, just saying like they're
not ready to the experience is there. He is super high on this team.
He acknowledged me that there is an outcome where they could come out of
the East. He's just not ready to go there yet. And I understand.
But why, honestly, honestly, why is it? Because if the
reasoning is because Giannis and Dame exist or because Boston's top six exists, I
am more than willing to be Yeah, that's fair. But like you hit
it on the head, Darius Garland and even more so Evan Mobley or at
the beginning of their prime arcs. Evan Mobley is still in his developmental arcs
and if he adds any sort of layer to his game where it's he can
deal with being more physical on the offensive end. He does a better job
of being more physical on the glass, although again the Caves need to improve
their rebounding, especially in the playoffs. But like Evan Mobley's spends so much
time away from the basket. It's the thing. Yeah, he's just not
around the basket. And when you let's go through the defenses of like the
Eastern Conference and how all these different teams match up with Milwaukee and Boston,
is there a tougher matchup for either of those teams than what Cleveland poses,
Like maybe I would say maybe Milwaukee's toughest matchup. Well I'm can no,
You're right, Milwaukee's toughest matchup. I mean exclude Boston is Cleveland, because
now Damian ask you, is it more Cleveland than Boston? Now that you've
gotten rid of Grant Williams time Lord, and people were complaining because I was
calling time Lord r W three or r dub. I prefer that the time
Lord, but I we'll call him time Lord. Now it's like you get
rid of those two, you got rid of Marcus Smart, who was also
another and there's no like defending Giannis, but like you can't expect a Horfard's
been one of the best Giannis defenders since Johannis entered the league. Al Horford
is pretty freaking old. Yeah at this point, so just please go ahea.
No, I that that that is a huge factor to me. Now
the Celtics, like I have a harder time saying, oh, Cleveland's really
gonna give Drew Holliday and Derek White, like like there's not gonna be a
better backcourt defensive tannem in the league. But you're I take your point of
like the Celtics did lose. I mean, when healthy RW three was transformative
defender when used the right way. Grant Williams was good on Giannis, al
Horford is older, Porzingis may be hurt, may have played really well in
a contract year, may not be as good of a rim protector as they
need. Like you know, we can have a conversation about that. But
the Milwaukee side of it, where now it's Damian Lillard and not Drew Holliday.
That's the point of attack defender when Donovan Mitchell is running a pick and
roll and Brook Lopez is in a drop or flip it and make it Darius
Garland, like you can all just that's like item one on Milwaukee's what the
fuck do we do? You know, series set of priorities against the against
the Calves because Cleveland just has the guards now a lot well again, a
lot will depend on Struce being able to pull a defender out to the corner
or wherever he is, which the Celtic of the Calves just didn't have.
But they're better positioned to really make their guard duo who can hit threes off
the dribble when a screen is set for them, or pop into mid rangers
or get into you know, the upper paint and move the ball. Like
Milwaukee is going to have trouble with that, I think, or at least
at least the Bucks are going to have to make concessions against those two defensively,
like give them something that I think very few other teams are going to
put the Bucks in that position as as like obviously as the Calves can and
like, yeah, I mean the just the idea. Sometimes the analysis probably
needs to stop at Milwaukee has Giannis and Dame and Brook Lopez could win Defensive
Player of the Year and no one would bat and I and so like,
yeah, they're just gonna beat the Calves. But the matchup things are at
least like worth discussing, I think in a real way between those two teams.
And like you said, you know, the Celtics have six guys and
then after that, I don't know, like there it's not like you got
world beaters and they're they're old. Some of the guys like Horford or older
that there are injury risks, like just just to say, like no,
Cleveland should not probably have better odds to win a title or to make the
finals, but it's like they're not. I put it this way, Cleveland
is closer to Milwaukee and Boston than I think anyone else in the East is
to Cleveland from like the underside of that of those like standings, Does that
make sense, Like there's more likely to be a top three than there is
to be a top two, and like six other teams we view kind of
equally. No, I'm with you there, and even I feel like Boston
poses probably more matchup problems for them still than Milwaukee at this point with that
kind I mean maybe even not because who's there, Damian Lillard defender, that's
the that's an issue. But it's also like with Boston, and I know
Kevin O'Connor had this tweet where and I was never trying to because I have
I was skeptical more so before the Drew trade about Christops is fit. He
was excellent last season. He has been one of the best straight up room
protectors in the league for a while now. But if you're Cleveland and you
already laid this out, like if you're gonna have more shooters moving around,
Jared Allen and Evan Mobley are good enough passers to find them if they have
to pass out of Christops's room protection. And if Mobley is actually a point
where he can sort of punish guys down low, if he can get sort
of the like we've seen him take these shots, these fallaways or these flip
shots, like if those start going in at a higher clip, like what
christophs Porzingis is doing on the back line is much less of a concern to
me than what's happening up top. Because you have Derek White and Drew Holliday.
So, and I would even frame it this way. You said there's
a top three in the East. If we were trying to name the top
five most likely championship winners in the league this year, I think you have
Boston, I think you have Milwaukee. I would have Denver, and I
would have Phoenix. There is there. I'm not asking you to name the
fifth. Do you agree with those four? You know, honestly, I'm
good with the three, And then I think there's like three or four or
even five others you could throw in there. I don't put Phoenix in the
like absolute no brainer side of it. The so, but like so let's
even say, like Cleveland, is is there any team aside from those those
three or those four that you would guarantee belongs in that most likely one of
the title spot and then Cleveland that is there any other team that you would
even guarantee well bias alert, I think I'd say the Warriors, but I
think I think they belong I think Cleveland and Golden State and Phoenix are kind
of I view them as pretty close as like your second tier of contenders behind
the two Boston, Milwaukee and Denver. I think there's a little bit of
a cut off there. But yeah, to your point, you can't you
you know, so I would not guarantee that there's another team that clearly has
it belongs in like a cut above other than those three relative to Cleveland.
Yeah, No, Calves are good. Caves are really good. We got
to talk about well, apparently nobody knows, so only us. We're the
only one talking about the Cabs. The can we talk about the Spurs?
Oh, I'd love to. They gave Devin. I would drink his bath
water of a sell a five year, one hundred and thirty five million dollars
guaranteed extension. Some people are still flipping out about the numbers. Can I
in the first of all, there's no player options. It can get up
to one hundred and I think forty seven if he reaches certain incentives which are
not public just yet. No player options. Do you know as of right
now what the highest percentage of the salary cap that deal is projected to be
worth? Oh man, I don't. I would love for you to tell
me. Can I guess the most celebri be worth is like twenty four percent?
You can guess, but you would be way wrong. It's in the
first year and it's sixteen point nine percent of the salary cap. By the
end of that deal, he's projected to be making under fifteen percent of the
salary cap. It's a I'm you don't need to call it a steal.
But like I saw a lot of people like, oh man, his agent
deserves like a rent. No. No, Denzelle's absolutely worth seventy percent of
the salary cap. I am fascinated though, by the type of player that
you think he could become because, and I don't know if this is a
hot take, here's the Victor wemen Yama discussions right there. I want to
know how good offensively, he's gonna be right off the bat. Who is
the best shot creator on the Spurs right now? And if it's Wemby,
then after Wemby, well, I don't think it's Wemby. I think it's
Vacille. Like I mean, like unless you're just counting Trey Jones, because
he's a point guard and he actually does create shots. But that's the difference.
You're just like not as for others, probably like when he's gonna make
plays in the pocket, but like he wants to get to like very specific
spots. Where's Den Bissell. There's gonna be more variance to how his buckets
are coming on the ball or off the ball, for sure. No,
I don't even know who's in the conversation. Besides, I like, you
know who's actually should be in the conversation. That's this is the only other
name I think of. Malachi Brandham. Oh wow, it's just like that
dude. He shot like ninety percent on flip shots last year. I'm exaggerating,
but it really was like in the sixties, I believe. And he's
just very comfortable at probably the bottom two levels as opposed to the three point
level. I still think it's Devin Vessel. This is like, this is
a player we need to be z and I know that he just averaged was
it like eighteen points or nineteen points per game? This is still someone you
need to circle on your list when looking at what he could do defensively,
as a passer, as a scorer, Like he's in the most improved player
just like early season. Mostly I might pick him. We haven't done our
awards yet, I haven't even thought about them, to be honest with you,
but like this, like I'm just I'm so high on the future of
the Spurge, just having Wemby, Jeremy Sohen and Devin Vassell and I know,
so you want to some people want to throw Keldon Johnson in there.
I think he's a very useful player. I don't know if he's a core
core member of this team. Same with Trey Jones, Malachi Branham. This
team is just I don't know how many minutes they're gonna play Wemby right off
the bat. I just I look at having Wemby, se In Visell,
Zach Collins. I'm just I'm kind of sad that they got rid of Reggie
Bullock, who shout out to him. I'm assuming. I don't know if
we have the final details on his deal. I'm guessing because the Rockets had
the room exception, that's why he went to Houston. Because playing time doesn't
seem to be like I thought he could help them. There's like a chance.
I know they're really young, but that the Spurs are a lot better
defensively than we think. And I am so in on Devin Vesel that we
didn't talk about it yet on this podcast about his extension. I was just
surprised. No one. I don't think I saw anyone like lampoon it and
say that he's a shitty player and that deal was terrible. But I saw
a lot of like oh man, like his agent moves up a few notches
every like no, no, he doesn't, this is a deal. We
threw out the number. I think when we were talking in a podcast,
or maybe it was when I was talking to Noah mcgaro George, there was
like, would you bat Andy if it was one hundred and thirty? And
I think we were in agreement. I think it was you and I we
were in agreement. No, there are some people on YouTube like WHOA WHOA
you can't do that. No, you absolutely can, and you should and
you did, right. I think part of it is I mean it was
in San Antonio last year. That was a massive mail in job, and
I think he only played like forty something to get forty two I want to
say games last year. I may be wrong. It's in the neighborhood,
and it's like it's just hard to get noticed as a third year guy that
is basically off the radar after what like December or January that just is not
you know, is could not be more on the periphery of like broader NBA
attention because of where he is and like the fact that he's not playing.
But yeah, eighteen and a half points a game. I think the other
thing, he's a good defender and I think he could get a lot better.
And he also did WAE more ball handling and shot creation. He like
I think he almost doubled or maybe more than that assists per game, and
it's not assist per game or whatever, but like the types of things he
was asked to do with the ball. I think for a minute there we
were kind of like Devin Vessel awesome three and d prospect. Right, He's
just more than that. It's kind of the same way everybody was like,
oh, Desmond Baying good three and d prospect, Oh no, wait,
he can run ten pick and rolls a game, no problem. Vacell is
kind of the next in that line of guys where we pigeonholed him a little
early, and I think has just way more that he can do. And
if he can, if he does excel as as more of a Desmond Bane
like Jack of all offensive trades type, he'll be I mean, he might
be underpaid now, but he'll be dramatically underpaid at this rate if he becomes
like what I think you and I both kind of see as being possible.
Yeah, look, the turn came there was last year, like the turn
came after Dee Jonte Murray trade where they got him involved as the primary handler
in ball screens. And like he trade, Jones was the only one who
ran more pick and rolls per game on the Spurs last year. Like this
is someone who I think that the Spurs they paid like he could be the
second best player on the on a core of a team that is contending for
a title, a roude around the outskirts of it. And I think that's
absolutely what he can be. I mean, there's like real, you know,
Bradley Beal type type of you know, upside I think, or maybe
it's not even upside. I think he might just be like a Bradley Beal
type player, you know, before too long. That's not that we need
to readily builds contract as a measuring stick for what guys like that are worth,
but like it's you know, more than would you say, sixteen percent
of the cap. That's that's ridiculous. Where you want to go next?
I think we got to talk about Toronto. I don't know how much there
is to really say. We've kind of crushed them every time we've talked about
them. This just it piques my interest, you know, masaiu Jiri in
the context of talking about you know, it's an extension for Pascal Siakam and
just sort of general like what's the plan stuff. I don't think it's overstating
it to say, like guys, he said, guys played selfishly and we're
kind of taking a wait and see approach before we start handing out money.
That's how I took his comments, and that may be a little unfair.
It makes me wonder, like do we need to reevaluate Ujiri as and maybe
we've passed that point as someone you know, I think for a long time
people would have said this guy might be the best executive in the league.
And I think even after that more recently he was sort of unassailable. Like
how now you can kind of question Greg Popovich as a head coach, like
is it thing passed? Has things passed him by a little bit? Where
for they would be blasphemous to suggest that, like three four years ago.
Maybe a bad analogy because Papovich might be the best coach ever. But like
so, just to summarize, Jery doesn't do anything with Fred van Vliet,
Fred VanVleet Walks seems to have been caught off guard by Gary trans Junior opting
in in the midst of all. Before that you make the Yaka Purl trade
for a first rounder and then you re sign him to a contract I think
we both agree is pretty as above market. And this is all happening in
the context of like Scottie Barnes stalled developmentally in year two, and the broad
direction of the team is basically indecipherable, Like we joke about it all the
time, but like picket direction raptors, Are you tanking? Are you trying
to build around this group? Who's integral, who's not? What is the
long term plan? At some point all of that just has to fall at
the feet of the decision makers. And now how said decision maker is kind
of like knocking down the trade value of someone like Siakam by intimating that he
played selfishly and is and has og in andobi and I guess you're lumping him
in there too, is someone that you probably need to try to trade and
have rebuffed ridiculous apparently trade offers for him over the years. And you're gonna
look at you know, van Fleet got away. Is that gonna happen with
two more guys because you're you're killing their trade value and it's gonna be harder
to I just like it's all going. It was already bad for me looking
at Toronto from Afar, it just feels worse now. And I'm what,
this is maybe impossible? Like what logic is there in him saying the things
he said? And like what logic has there been in how they've conducted business
with all their guys who are nearing the ends of their contracts. I just
like make it make sense for me. There are two other things that stand
out. I wanted to tack onto what you said is his comments about Van
Fleet. That he said something about could we have moved him at the deadline?
Maybe, but sometimes it comes down to a level of respect for the
player shows that me. What does that? What does that mean? And
first of so, I want to this point, I don't think I've seen
some people start to relitigate what missile Eujery has done, and a mom Amon
Aiden had a stat on Twitter I think was the Raptors have like the highest
winning percentage in the NBA over the last half decade or whatever it is.
We can't religate what he's done, and we can't dismiss him as still being
a threat. It's fair to question what is going on here. I think
Missayujeri can be a top executive. Something seems to skew in Toronto those fredman
Fleet comments. I don't understand you haven't. This is not circa Kyle Lowry
at the end of his career, where maybe you punt it on like a
bottom five first round pick, like you could have gotten real stuff for Fred
VanVleet. That is that is something we all know for a fact off the
record. On the record, we know for a fact your obligation as the
executive is still to the franchise, and you weren't talking about how you were
doing this to give him the opportunity to explore free agency, and like no,
like no, you probably just misread the market on it. And I
still think you should have just paid him and figured out the rest. It's
the short term deal. Who cares. The other thing that stood out was
did you see Bobby Webster? There was MESSI saying that our interest in Damian
lill was overblown, and then Bobby Webster said, we offered more than we've
ever offered for another player in a trade for Jamian Lillard. The house does
not seem completely in order. And I saw a lot of and look,
there were raptors, media members with their boots on the ground. They're gonna
understand the abbiance of what was happening better than you or I saying that all
these comments were sort of being overblown. That wasn't the tenor right, but
the fact it doesn't. You could say all this shit with a smile on
your face, like that's not We're in a calm dialect. I'm it's something
is still off here and to not this is the biggest one for me.
Pascal Siakam is an All NBA player. He's better than fred Van Fleet.
He's better than og An Andobi. He's better than Kyle Lowry was when Kyle
Lowry was coming up on free agency. He is more important to you both
now and moving forward than Scotty Barnes based off what disampl size you have from
Scotty Barnes. How have there not been extension talks? And even if that's
being overblown, U Jerry didn't like he had an opportunity to say no like
that, that's not true, and he didn't. What are you doing here?
And so I don't understand. I have nothing else to offer. I
just wanted to tack on to you know this onslaught of dumping on the Raptors.
Is I think it's fair. I'm not gonna if the if the cost
of Damian Lillard was too high, it otienately seems like they didn't want to
give up og Siakam or Barnes. I get that in the sense of you
want to pair Damian Lollard with them to maximize your chances of contention. I
might have considered trading Barns for Damian Lillard just because Og Siam and Damian Lillard
is a Capslock Italics Boldtex contender to me. But that's that's a real debate
to be had, And it seems, at least according to Webster, they
were they were in on Lillard. Ask Jerry, he says something different.
They got to get on the same page. I have zero confidence in the
Raptors handling this properly, because who's to just say that if you don't like
I know, you can offer Siakam the most money and he wants to qualify
for the Supermax. Everything that this team has done one screams even if Siakam
qualifies for Supermax, they're not gonna give it too. And then two,
if you've rubbed him the wrong way by not engaging in extension talks and then
you don't move him, is he just gonna leave? And so it's Og
feels a little bit more workable, I think because he hasn't been paid like
Siakam yet, and so even if the vibes aren't great in Toronto and they
don't move him by the deadline, they might just be willing, he's kind
of young. He's an archetype that everyone will like. You look at the
Jeremy Grant deal. If ojiannaob got something similar, that deal can be moved
for probably positive value. I would say, Yeah, So that situation feels
less It's critical, but it feels less mission critical than this. Siakam right
now is the future of your franchise because he's that good. He's the only
All NBA level player right now on your roster. And just what have you
done to maximize your chances of winning with him this season? And what have
you done to optimize your chances of building around him for the future. And
if you don't want him, this comes back to I don't mean to talk
us in circles. We said it on the grades, I said it when
I was talking to him, like pick a direction, right, And this
team just feels like it's going through deliberately an existential crisis that it doesn't care
to address or acknowledge. It just feels like is there a level of denial
here or is there just a lack of a vision? Is it? Are
we at a point where's massaiyu jiy kind of operating with a level of bravado
or ignorance because of how good he's been in there. I honestly don't know.
I'm not even casting these you know, dispersions his way to say like
like he sucks. I'm just genuinely, morbidly, uncomfortably curious as to what
the hell is going on in Toronto as I think about it now, And
like I'll admit, and I've said it before, I'm always more worried about
the lose the guy for nothing side of things than probably I should be,
and certainly you are. And I you know, that applies to Seacam,
and that applies to Anonobe, it applied to Van Fleet. What I'm thinking
about now is is how much worse or or how much higher the likelihood of
losing guys for nothing could go just if things don't start very well this season.
And looking at the team who had a hell of a time trying to
create good half court offense triggered in charge of that now as opposed to Fred
van Vliet, and there's not really any reason to believe that like maybe Perdle
as like a hub you know, can help you know, he's underrated in
that regard on offense. I just could see this looking a lot like the
last couple of years on offense and maybe with worse transition offense to offset it.
Scotty Barnes is going to go a long way towards determining like a lot
of what the Raptors you know, do the rest of the this year.
But like, if things don't go well at the beginning, then you're just
then it's then it's just like, well, why would Siakam want to come?
I mean, the money's gonna talk, But like what the odds of
really losing guys for nothing? I think increase And I think I think the
chance we should expect things to not go great in Toronto because they didn't really
get any better in the off season, they're probably worse. So I just
I don't know where to think about this. Is there a chance though,
that that's incorrect? Where it's if they're kind of hovering around like six to
ninth or tenth is the bigger problems where if things don't go well, might
it not coax them into finally making those decisions that they've neglected to make now?
Because I'm looking at it as if if things are going that poorly,
you're absolutely gonna look at are you gonna? I guess you paid pertle,
so you could be a little resistant. But I would think that what benefits
them the most is to have a definitive feel for this team. So if
they come out like Gangbusters from the gate, that'll show them, Hey,
we need to go double down. Sure now, because we have these guys
entering free agency, now's the time to do it. If it's so poor,
then it's okay, Well we need to look at resetting. Whereas if
they're just hovering around the middle again and it could go either way, it
makes it harder. Yeah, almost in theory. I guess maybe you know,
I don't know what logic they're using. What's the protection on the pick
they owe to San Antonio because that's the twenty four first top. Yeah,
so you can't really tank. I mean, I guess you have to tank
really hard, like I just oh, man, I okay, we've we've
bagged on the raptors enough. Do you have anything else? We've exhausted my
my talking points. I have a couple of quick hitters before we get into
the I guess the everyone loves the name of the segment, but we need
to change the name of Yeah, can we call it that? Is it
different if we call it that? I don't see why not. So some
quick hitters for you, Minnesota. Still they're polarizing for both of us.
We still, on some level believe our confidence has been I would say shaken,
rattled to its very core. Maybe there was a lot of talk about
just and it made me feel better about my lack of fuel for the tim
Wolves because I don't understand what this team is on defense or offense at this
point, because we didn't see them at full strength enough last year. They
talked a lot on media Day about like kind of establishing their identity, and
Chris Finch was talking about being more or innovative on the offensive end. I'm
just my expectations for this team are gradually crescendoing again, and can you talk
can you talk me down off the Minnesota Timberwolves. First of all, I'm
delighted this was unexpected because now I have to evaluate, like, are my
expectations higher now? Too? I think I think so much of the logic
that made us bullish on the Timberwolves last offseason, incorrectly bullish by a huge
degree, by the way, should still apply because we can use the excuse
of we didn't see enough of the two bigs together to really get a feel
Anthony Edwards is gonna be better. Maybe maybe Jade McDaniels will be playing for
a contract at this rate. I don't know. They still haven't extended him.
I think the calmly over del Idala was pretty good for them, though
I'm not gonna talk you down unless you're like, they're gonna be the fourth
seed in the West or something like that. I think think I understand the
confusion because the fit was always going to be tricky and just the push and
pull of like, is this just gonna be the Anthony Edwards show now?
And that marginalizes cat? And if Kat is marginalized, what's the point of
having him? Do we talk about trading him? There's a bunch of uncertainties,
but I think there's still just the element of, like, you could
build a really good defense with Rudy Gobert. You've got one of the best
stretch bigs of all time. You've got a guy that everyone agrees is already
an all star lead guard that is only going to get better. There's just
still like a lot to like. It's very much is a question of the
talent exists, how's it going to be deployed? Like can it be optimally
deployed? Is that possible given the mix of players. So I'm not going
to talk you down too much other than to say, like if there's anything
that needs to be like flagged as a like let's pump the brakes type of
thing, it's just that, like this is an inherently difficult mix of players
to make work. But if you can get it to function, all the
pieces of the machine like are are good. Like, It's just it's a
real challenge. So I don't know if that it talks you down or makes
you more concerned, but I guess I don't really disagree that, Like,
if the point is the Timberwolves might actually still be really good, at least
in the regular season, I'm not going to talk you down off that.
I think a lot. I think everything actually comes down to I'm not as
worried about the dual big setup. I think everything just comes down to is
Anthey, Edward's gonna make the playmaking leap. We saw hints of it last
year. I don't think he had like the best time with Team USA when
you were looking at him as he had some moments of the primary facilitator.
That's gonna be the biggest thing for them. And if he does make that
kind of jump, you say top four of the East is too spicy.
There's a top two in the Western me and it's wide open after that.
Yeah, speaking of wide open in the West, the Timberwolves talked a lot
or the Timberwolves the Pelicans talked a lot about playing Zion at center this season.
How seriously he's taken his health. How do you feel about this team
and the idea of Zion at center, which, in case you're wondering,
happened for ninety two possessions last season. They had a one to twenty three
offensive rating and a one to eleven defensive rating, which is in the eighty
fifth percentile. But like they can't figure out a way to rebound during that
stretch, they give up a thirty seven pointy five offensive rebounding rate. Do
you think that's a just because they talked about it more than I sp It's
always been among you and I like the people that are from for like Zion
it center. It could be a cheat code for the team to kind of
focus on. It could you see that becoming a staple for the Pelicans.
Do you think they have the requisite rebounding in defense around Zion Williamson to have
that be Let's not even say, you know you're not going to begin games
like that. You have Yonus Valentunis, he's good, he should play,
but if you're looking to kind of surround him with as much higher volume shooting
as possible, where Valentunas space is the floor but not in incredible sky high
volume. Is that something that if you're them, you would lean on more
of this or do they just still not have the personnel to make it happen.
I think there's such a strange like push and pull with the supplementary pieces
you put around a Zion at center lineup that you get some of what you
need, but almost never all of it, Which is to say, like,
I think you get some really interesting like length defensively. You know,
you play Herb Jones, Trey Murphy's hurt, but let's put him in there
for when he's healthy. Brandon Ingram Dyson Daniels I think would be a real
key potentially if you're really trying to like get some interesting defensive switching coverages and
just get length, get smarts, get like ballhawks out there surrounding Zion at
the five. You could see your way to defending there. I don't know
that there's enough shooting to make that offense really work, because the whole thing
with Zion at center or at least and certainly Zion on the ball is if
you can you know, dot the perimeter with guys that can make open shots,
you're just gonna you're gonna have that one twenty offensive rating. I just
I struggle to see how they get everything they need out of Zion at the
five looks and the rebounding, like you mentioned, is an issue. I
still want them to try it because for short stretches against you know, if
you can do it not necessarily as like a closing group or as a starting
group, but against the right matchups and you can get away with you know,
some iffy shooting or some rebounding, you know, like substandard rebounding,
it could really just be the type of setup that you know, other teams
just can't stay with in transition and in a space flour on offense. So
like, absolutely I want to see more of it. I do think,
like I don't know if I'd go so far as to say, like,
well, this is just clearly the way to do it, and it's a
cheat code, but they should try it for sure, right because the alternative,
we know what the other things look like we have you know, valance
unis is kind of in the way a little bit if you're trying to get
Zion really cooking, and then nance just one isn't healthy often enough and doesn't
give you the rim protector. You know, there's there's nothing perfect. So
since the Pelicans don't have a perfect way to go at it, just be
the most awesome imperfect lineup you can, right, which would be Zion the
five. I will say based on the other stuff they said about the luxury
taxism, now they should be a team. Then if they're actually committed the
way that they seem to intimate, they should be heavily involved on trying to
upgrade the roster, which also means that they probably should have been involved on
the Damian Lillard sweepstakes, which they weren't. So I have questions about not
the direction, but I'm just wondering if they're sitting on this core a little
bit too long, or sitting on their assets a little bit if they actually
believe in this there's a lot of information we still don't have, right,
but they said some things that made athing like they really do believe in this
core. But it's also kind of if you believe in it, it's a
make or break season for it. So I'm very interested to monitor that end
of the spectrum from them. Yeah, I agree. I think they're interesting.
They're a little bit like the Timberwolves, except like the relatively small amount
of information we have about them is like really kind of like exciting because when
Zion was healthy and they gave them the ball, like that worked. The
Pelicans were very good when they did that, So I can understand them wanting
to kind of having a little bit more of an attachment to this core just
for that reason. I just a couple more we'll frame it this way will
make them super quick hitters. Talk me it's either talked me down or am
I too excited about X? And the first one will be The Detroit Pistons
are not married to the dual big model, and I am ecstatic. Monty
Williams talked about how Marvin Bagley and James Wiseman are both competing for the backup
big spot, which means we will see Isaiah Stewart and Jaellen Duran. That's
fine, But if only one of them is going to be in the rotation
Wiseman or Badley, that means we are going to get boing on Bodonovich at
the four. We're going to see Arsar Thompson and Kate Cunningham play wing minutes
rather than be you specifically as guards. I'm very happy about it. On
a scale of one to ten, How happy should I be about it?
Oh? Man? Well one, I'm going to talk you up and wherever
you're at, move up to like an eight or nine, just because that's
what this team needs. I think if you want to make life easier on
Cad and on Jade and Ivy, more shooting, more spacing, we don't
need two guys in there whose range is like Dunk or you know, guys
like Bagley that just you know, are are kind of in the way no
matter what they're doing. So I think you should be as happy as possible
about a downsized Piston's future. On a scale of one to ten, how
happy excited should we be about the Clippers making it very clear Kuhi and PG
you're gonna play more four, they're gonna get man more minutes in those types
of units to kind of I'm assuming throw some nitrous oxide into their pace in
addition to having Russell Westbrook scale of one to ten, How excited should we
be? I'd go like an eight there. I think it's the right move,
just because it's not like you're losing toughness or physicality or even really rebounding.
If Kawhi and PG or four is at a huge wings which are basically
fours now anyway, it's not like they're gonna get smashed on the glass.
So the upside offensively and getting man on the flour more that's a huge plus
final two on a scale of one to ten, How excited should we be
that the New York Knicks are patently boring right now? I'm gonna go like
a five, which is just about right for this topic, because I can
understand why the Knicks wan essentially run it back and sum in Devincenzo for top
end and just assume get better at rebounding in the process. By the way,
Uh yeah, it's okay to be boring. I think the Knicks have
a good core, and I think there is likely to be, you know,
right in the mix for a top four spots last year. I'm gonna
say I should be on a ten because until we see them, they haven't
done anything that. Yeah, some people want to move Julius Randall. Some
of them wanted to be more aggressive the trademarket this year. They didn't do
anything. Disillusioned though, to like they're going to see that they prioritize continuity,
which is a big deal for this franchise. When you this has to
be like when you look at the rollover, I should go look at the
Basketball Reference minutes of the minutes from last season coming back to this season,
and you have someone like Obi Toppin, who's the biggest departure and barely played
last year. That's huge. And now we evaluate them. Okay, we
know this front office and this team acts logistically. We've kind of seen them
adjust cater to some certain strengths. Now it's how do they develop some of
the youngsters within this context of being competitive? How do they get creative with
Dante DiVincenzo. How do they react if they art, if they're better than
expected, if they're worse than expected, how do they adjust from here?
I'm actually super excited that they prioritize continuity, knowing that there were no opportunities
to really shake up the roster there. So I'm gonna say, I'm on
an eleven. What was the stat It wasn't there a fact? I guess
that like Barrett was the first guy they'd signed to a rookie scale extension since
like I don't know, like Charlie Ward or something ridiculous like that. So
the continuity is has been a pleasant change of pace for this team. On
a scale of one to ten? How excited are you to watch? And
I'm borrowing this race from someone in discord? I apologize, I can't remember
who said it the New This wasn't what they were talking about when they coined
it. To watch the holy affinity of Usman Jang, Chet Holmgrin, and
Alexey Pokashevski once he's held only affinity, Oh my god, one to ten
only because Chet and and your your favorite human on planet Earth Uzman Jang are
involved. Pokashevski is he? You know what? I'm gonna give that a
ten. That's fun? Ill are you high enough on Ushman Jang? I
just would you understand that we're talking about like an MVP level player here,
the name alone Holy Affinity is does it for me? That's that's that's perfect.
I'm weigh in on that. I will say, I, I don't
know if you saw Sam Presty's comments about some of the trade stuff, and
I think that's going to be the narrative that I talked about this on the
Uncontested, which shout out to them for shouting me out on their most recent
podcast in the In the Vein of a Blank one eighty two reference. So
if anyone thinks that I don't listen to people before that, even when they're
not coming on the pod, I still listen. Uh. We're talking about
how it has to be the right superstar, the right time, the right
trade acquisition for them to go in on. I actually appreciate those comments.
It could have been sort of GM's peak, but I got the feeling that
this team is ready once it kind of understands what it has to go in
and make that move the right opportunity. It needs to be a mixture of
opportunity and timing, but like they understand that they are good enough to where
the timing might be right soon right well, and and they also can't know
yet what they have really other than other than SGA, like that's the known
commodity. But you need to know more about Chet, you need to know
more about Jalen Williams, you need it more about Jang. I mean you
might even need to know more about like Giddy for that matter. So you
absolutely need to know more about Giddy. Yeah, there's plenty. So yeah.
I think normally we're kind of like, let's go, let's catch these
picks in or or let's be super patient. But they're kind of right in
the middle, and I think they've actually played it correctly. All Right,
it is garbage time that we're gonna Is that? Where're with? For now?
We need a names grant. I actually brainstormed them very quickly. I
don't like any of the things I came up with. I didn't even send
them to you. One of them was like half court heaves had flopping around
a little bit, but I feel like that could be taken is yeah,
flopping around has some connotations. Yeah, the garbage time's fine, Okay,
can I start? I have one for you that I I hope hurts your
brain. Let's do it. Dan, who's getting traded first? Very simple.
Joel Embiid, Karl Anthony Towns or Luka doncic Oh, Joe all Embiid
who's getting traded last? Yeah, that's probably right. Can I give you
a career three pointers made? Either? Or's let's roll all right? Dan?
Who has made more career three pointers? Lebron James or Kyle Lowry Lebron
James. That is correct, and it's close. Dan, who's made more
threes? Jj Reddick or Jamal Crawford. Oh, Jamal Crawford was in the
league forever. Let's go with him. You're on fire. It's not close.
Twenty two to twenty one for Crawford, nineteen fifty for Reddick. Oh
my god, yeah, big gap? Right? More threes? Baron Davis
or Alan Houston? Oh my god, I'm gonna say Alan Houston incorrect.
Baron Davis noted three point sniper? Baron Davis, Klay Thompson or Damian Lillard.
I'm assuming you're trying. Damian Lillard, You're trying to trick me here.
I'm always trying to trick you, but you were not tricked on that
one. You're correct, Damian Lillard, Derek Devinsky or Jason Kidd Oh,
I don't like this. Jason Kidd. You're right, You're doing so well,
Dan, Kevin Durant or Eric Gordon, Eric Gordon, unbelievable. Well
done, Chris Paul or Mike Conley. Last one. Oh, Mike Conley,
I'm sorry it is Chris Paul. Really good effort, though, I
think you got six out of eight there. Good job, you have any
more? I have more, but if you have some, all take and
we can alternate. Yeah, so let's keep a theme with the three pointer
one. Which of these NBA players has never hit nine or more threes in
a single regular season or playoff game. Bradley Beal, Kobe Bryant, Kevin
Durant or Tyre's Halliburton Kevin Durant. Wow, nice, I was afraid you
were gonna know that because you had Kevin Durant and yours, which is why
I ended up not picking him, because I knew that he was the answer
to this question. For me. That's tough though I had to hesitate on
Bradley Beal of all people. I don't know why. Okay, that's a
good question. All right, I have another one for you here. This
is just about all Star games. Who's made more okay in their careers.
First up, Kevin Durant here he is again versus Chris Paul. Chris Paul
incorrect. Durant has thirteen. CP three has twelve. Chauncey billups or Jimmy
Butler more All Star Games? Ooh, Jimmy Butler correct, Good job avoiding
the overthink there. Six to five for Butler? Who's made more All Star
Games? Al Horford or Jason Tatum? Al Horford, you're correct, You're
doing very well, Dan uh More All Star Games? LaMarcus Aldridge or Joel
embiid Oh, LaMarcus Aldridge, you got it? Seven to six? Last
one, Damian Lillard or Bradley Bill and Devin Booker combined. Damian Lillard or
Bradley Beal and Devin Booker combined. Damian Lillard, You're right, seven to
six. Really good run by you. Well done? Okay. Which NBA
player averaged the most points per game as a rookie? Luka, Doncic,
Alan Iverson, Shaquille O'Neal or Zion Williamson. Oh man, that's such a
good question. I'm gonna go. I'm gonna go. Alan Iverson, that
is the correct answer. Nice job, he had shock zero point one points.
Yeah, Shaq was. Shaq was second, uh Luka, Dancic was
third, Zion was fourth. Do you have the averages? I'm just kidding.
I believe Alan Ivers was twenty three point four. Okay, Shaq was
tough, he was tempting. All right, good question. Okay, We're
gonna pivot a little bit and now I'm asking you now about career earnings.
Okay, this is according to spotrack, and it does not include money that
is like coming in the future. It's just how much money have these guys
made to dates in their careers? Okay, hit me starting with Dan who's
made more money in his career? Gordon Hayward or Anthony Davis. Gordon Hayward
correct two hundred thirty six million. I'm rounding to two twenty six. Davis
is gonna pass him here with this big extension he just signed. Goran Dragicic
or Harrison Barnes, oh Man, Harrison Barnes had been the king of signing
good contracts. Is to him? It is He's made one hundred and sixty
six million. Do you want to guess where Draga is one eight? That's
an unfair question. They're all pretty close. One fifty four. Gordon Dragic
has made one hundred and fifty four million dollars. Good for him. Hey,
Devin Bisselle is gonna make almost as much as that over his next contract.
He's gonna deserve every penny. Who's made more money. Andre Drummond or
Kristaps porzingis ooh, I mean Drummond only had the one big deal. I'm
gonna say, Chris Tops, it's actually Drummond, but it's super close.
One for Drummond, one thirty nine for KP Damn. This is the special
one for you. Higher career earnings. Reggie Jackson or Auto Porter Junior auto
Porter Junior incorrect, Reggie Jackson has made one hundred and forty four million dollars
in his career. I guess he signed that second the Big One director with
the clip. Yeah, the Big One Porter Junior is doing just fine.
One thirty two so far for man I hope, I'm glad he's that's basically
poverty level though. So that's that's Reggie's gonna get him ten more, right
because he signed that deal that we love so much for the Nuggets, Okay,
which NBA Hall of Famer made exactly one three pointer for their entire career.
Patrick Ewing, Shaquille O'Neal, Yao Ming or Ben Wallace. Oh great
question one, and that's it. I'm gonna say, Patrick Ewing, No,
that's not even close. He made He made the most threes of anyone
on this list. I believe it was Shack made exactly one. Oh.
I thought Shack had it like three? How many Yao? Must so Ewing
made more than Yao. I think I was in the NBA for like ten
minutes. I think ye Ewing had nineteen. I don't even remember what Yao
had. I was just going with the era, assuming that nobody was shooting
threes during most of Ewing's career. But that kind of should have applied to
Shaq too. He Uh yeah, yeah, Actually you're never gonna believe Yao
made two? So you were oh man, Okay, good question? Uh
are you out? I have a couple more? I'm out. I'm out.
Ok So, which team is the bigger what if? An NBA history?
The Kyrie KD James Harden era Nets or the Kyrie Harden Russell Westbrook era
Oklahoma City thunder Waity hold on Kyrie was not on the I've spotted your trick,
Dan, and I don't appreciate it. Which team is the bigger What
if an NBA history, the KD Russ Harden era OKC Thunder or KD Harden,
Kyrie era Brooklyn nets Man. The recency makes me want to say the
Nets and they were their net rating in their record was super good with those
guys. But I still gotta go with the OKC group just because I mean,
they were good enough. They probably should have made another finals like post
Harden, and so I think if they could have just kept those guys together,
it's hard to get past that team as like a generational team. Potentially,
although this is a too long of an answer, but I don't think
Harden could have been hardened with Russ and KD, Like that's just not possible.
Yeah, I would pick the Nets, And I guess there could be
recency buyas here, but it is because I don't know that heart Harden was
already hardened on the Nets. Yeah, KD was KD by the time,
Like KD wasn't even KD really but by the time Harden left sure and OKCE
and so yeah, there's the element. Also if they were younger at the
time, so could they have won more championships, but they were never a
title formality, and like the Nets, if they were healthy, felt like
a title formality in the in the very small sample that we watched them all
play. That's a yeah, the huge what if? That is? Like
it feels like a you know, I mean, it was only a couple
of years ago that could have really happened. Okay, a couple I have,
oh, actually have three more. So I apologize this one's all right.
So I'm gonna go in order of what I think is the most fun
voter will increase. Hot or not? Got five for you here, So
hot or not? Devin Booker will finish higher in MVP voting than Kevin Durant.
I don't think that's a hot take. I think you just the number
of games played is gonna get in Kd's way more than Bookers. Hot or
not. Og Anenobi will finish this season on the Kings, Knicks or Warriors.
That's hot. That is that is a hot take. Okay, don't.
I don't think I think he's gonna finish on the Raptors. They haven't
traded him yet. Why start now? Hot or not a rookie will make
the All Star team. That's not a hot take. I think Wemby's gonna
I mean, can you imagine the international vote? Hot or not? At
least eight players will average thirty points per game? Ooh, last year six
averaged over thirty and the year before that too. I'm gonna say that's a
hot take, too hot, because I think some of the guys like Dame,
for example, are gonna see their scoring average go down because they're just
on better teams. Now, funny you mentioned Dame. Hot or not,
the Milwaukee Bucks will finish the regular season with a top three offense. Hmm,
that is not a hot take. I think I think that is.
That is a there's a great chance of that happening if this pick and roll
stuff between him and the honest works out. Okay, this one. I'm
happy about this one. I cribbed it from a br project that is being
worked on which NBA team should have their own version of the NFL's Hard Knock
series for the twenty twenty three twenty twenty four regular season and playoffs if you
will. There's so many good choices. Don't we have to pick the sixers?
Just be Okay? If you're not gonna let me pick the Sixers,
I'm gonna pick the MAVs because I just I think we need to see the
Kyrie Luca dynamic happen. I think I'm gonna go with the Raptors because the
dysfunction and the discord is just so rampant right now. And the other pick
feels like Golden State just having Chris Paul in that locker room with Raymond Green
and what if things don't work out right away? Those were I mean,
the Sixers are obvious, but like and you're another team just to make it
an an even but odd five. I'd like to follow the OKC thunder.
Oh yeah, year, that's fun. I do like that we both went
with teams that look like the biggest tire fires right now, or at least
the most controversial. If I go Sixers and you go Raptors, just disaster
potential all over the place. Uh. And so this is my final one
Nervous, which NBA player joined Paramore on stage to sing the hit single Misery
Business. Jimmy Butler, Stephan Curry, Paul George or Klay Thompson. It
just has to It won't be. It's too obvious, but I'm gonna say,
Jimmy Butler, it is to Curry. It was Steph Curry. Yeah,
amazing. How did you come upon this information? Someone in our discord
dropped a picture of Steph singing on stage with Haley Williams, and I asked
if that was artificial intelligence? That basically that that's a that's a never skip
song, by the way, in my life, never skipping it great song.
I tried to pick the age groups of players too. I was like,
okay, they would have been like Paramore would be a thing. I
was. I knew you were gonna I thought you would pick Jimmy because the
emo stuff. Yeah, that was bait. That was bait by you.
Listen, Jimmy Wassens the hot mull again. He's officially the one of the
top two players in the NBA. He's yeah, he's he's for real.
This is not a put on, that's really who he is. I had
a lot of fun with this segment. I would reiterate that if you have
any it can be harder to quiz us, obviously, but like, if
you want to drop ideas in our discord on the YouTube comments about what you
want to see, we can do that, Like, these segments are just
they're fun. It's garbage time, so we're out there. If you have
any ideas for us, yep, And eventually we're gonna get this. Uh,
you'll never guess game off the ground. We're gonna tweak the format because
I just can't pass up opportunities to try to make Dan figure out who Grievous
Fasquez is with I killed that one. I can't figuret who Stephan Marbury was.
People in the comments were like, I was yelling at the screen.
I wanted to yell at the screen you play for the Knicks. I just
feel like if you're not gonna I mean, you're a young man, maybe
a little before your time, but you know still, I feel like you
should have got it. Yeah, Graves, you're If you ever top that
one, I've I might have to retire from making you guess what I think
are hard questions? You got anything else? Or shall I take us out
of here? No? Please take us out of here? This was This
was fun. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed it. Yeah, give us
more ideas because we're gonna run out of like who made more threes pretty soon
or least I will everybody. Thank you for listening, Thank you for commenting
if you have already done so, thank you for subscribing, following, rating,
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any of those things one why not? And two how dare you? And
three, please do them. They're very helpful to us. Help grow the
podcast, help us create more content. Check out our merch too, Dan
Tease the new merch drop coming out. That's exciting. He's wearing the shirt.
I blew it over the coffee cups behind my head. If you're watching
as usual? Yeah, and what else? I think that's it. Follow
on all the socials. All the information you need to do, all the
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so check all that out. And as always, we will close with
a shout out to the one and only Frank Milakina in an apology to Jardine,