Hi, This is mari Ansorge from blake Forest, Illinois and I play at
Conway Farms golf Course. This is Golf's order number nine fifty seven. I
firmly believe in bifurcation. I think they are playing a different game than we
play. That's very obvious on any given day, in any given moment,
any given t shot, any given pot, any given ship. Those guys
are elite and play the game in such a different way swing speed, length
ability, it's not even close, right, And even people who think they're
close are not close. So I do not believe that, in the midst
of golf's greatest growth phase for men, women, and children and every other
person on the planet, to throw in the concept of a rollback for amateurs,
for people who pay to play the game, do whatever you want to
the people who get paid to play the game, But for the people who
are actually coming to the game to pay money to rock up and utilize a
facility for eighteen holes, the idea of throwing in the concept of a roll
back to pieces of the equipment, especially the golf ball, to me,
just doesn't make sense. The power and future of storytelling in golf media with
writer and producer Matt Genella. This is Golf Smarter, sharing stories, tips
and insights from great golf minds to help you lower your score and raise your
golf IQ. Here's your host, Fred Green. Welcome back to the Golf
Smarter podcast. Matt, thanks for having me, Fred, always a pleasure.
Thank you for agreeing to do this. Ever since our last conversation,
I'm like, how do I get mad on again? And I've got some
ideas and we'll talk about that in the future tonight. For today, let's
uh, let's talk about what's going on in the golf world. I I
just did a road trip up to Eugene, Oregon to go visit samh On
at Lab Golf, and uh, it was way beyond my expectations. Sam
and I have a very kindred spirit. There's something about Sam and I together
that is really awesome. I really like this guy, this kid, and
got the full tour. Got a tutorial from from Sam on how to use
my new DF three broomstick. I'm very excited about it. And those are
gonna be videos that we're gonna do. Those they'll be ready for next week's
episode and there'll be videos separate videos. One on the tutorial and one on
the whole tour as well, So we got of the factory I got.
I mean, you know what I think of Sam. I I think he's
a fantastic character, and I've enjoyed getting to know him and obviously enjoyed getting
to know his story as it relates to lab golf and Bill Pressey and all
the different tentacles that I sort of explored in reporting out that podcast series,
and then got a chance to actually go by and meet him in his work
environment at that golf course in Eugene that they call home, and they were
cranking. I mean they were breaking record their new daily records, monthly record,
weekly records. This goes back in May. They were just shattering.
Every day was a new day of you know, unmeasured success. So happy
for them that everybody I met just couldn't be more passionate about what they do
and how they do it, and they were they were just you know,
seem to be enjoying the fruits of their labor. Well, we did a
road trip. I went with a buddy of mine who is he works for
a consulting firm, a large consulting firm, and he was blown away by
the culture up there about how everybody is so tight and so wonderful and loves
what they do so much and are so behind the mission that Sam is leading.
He is, He is really quite the character. I think he's well,
I can go on and on about him. And we got to play
eighteen holes with him as well, along with Liam Bedford and those two can
play golf. No, it's Sam. I played with Sam here in San
Diego. Liam was in the group I think ahead of us, and I
was, Yeah, Sam is real deal. I mean, I you know,
I think he's a scratch. I think and play and kind of plays
to it is what I call. And I know Liam is legiti former baseball
player right Philly's organization, but an Australian legit athlete. And do you realize
that he's thirty one and he didn't start playing golf until he was twenty five.
Yeah, he was part of the podcast and he was scratch in six
months. Yeah, No, he's athletes are athletes, you know something you
just can't coach or teach, and and he's definitely falls into that category of
just pure athlete. Yep. You know, hand eye coordination, you know
all that stuff. Well, on the drive up north. It's about,
you know, five hundred miles from where I live. We listened to the
entire series again the second time. For me, I was like, Okay,
now now it's research. Now I've got to study this thing. And
there was one thing that Sam said in there that I had to get right.
And I didn't remember which episode it was, and it was early on
in episode one. But when he said, yeah, people think of me
a weird hippie stoner, I'm like, That's what it was about him that
I felt like, It's like, oh, we're the same guy. We
came from the music business and we're you know, out of San Francisco and
blah blah blah, and yeah, it was right as soon as we saw
each other, it was like, oh yeah, yeah, No. He
loved listening to it again. It was worth a second listen. Congratulations,
it's such a phenomenal series. I thank you. I again. I didn't
know what I was getting myself into. It's actually been you know, I
don't even know really where to go from here in terms of where, you
know, I'm sitting on several stories that I've reported. It's going to take
some time to put them all together. I'm in transition mode myself in terms
of what I'm doing and how I'm doing it, and so I'm kind of,
you know, I'm dug in on a couple of clients and people that
I'm working with in order to make sure that I'm serving them, and then
also kind of trying to figure out where we go next. We're also moving
literally physically moving. I've got some family stuff I'm dealing with, so a
lot of things going on. I think as far as the Lab series goes,
I continue to get comments DMS messages. I had a lab. I
didn't know how to use it. I listen. Now I know how to
use it. I understand the technology better. I bought a lab. You
know. I get a lot of really very thoughtful, positive, encouraging feedback
from people who not only like their putter. I think they liked the story
behind the putter and how it became what it is and the brand it is
so and the way you just really get as you know, as a storyteller,
when you tell a story, when you share someone or another brand story
and it moves people, that obviously moves you. I mean that feels good.
That's you know, I don't know where we are in the media industry
now, in golf media and as it relates to storytelling, whether people actually
still care, I don't know if they do or not. But that's why
it's nice to hear certain people actually saying, oh, I really enjoyed that.
I you know, I listened, or I listened twice. I didn't
expect to listen, and I started listening. I couldn't stop. That to
me, is is that's good? That's good stuff? Yeah? So do
you think I mean the way we see it right now? But is lab
Golf the hottest putter company in the world right now? I mean they seem
to be showing up in a lot of places. Yeah. I don't know
anything about anything. I don't look at business analytics and I don't know,
you know, but I will say that there's there can't be any other putter
company that's had this kind of growth like this, you know, No,
no putter companies growing exponentially like lab Is right now. I mean, Scottie
Cameron Is is an iconic putting company and brand. And I don't know the
numbers that they do and you know, but I but I know that lab
Is has its own individual thing and Company. I mean, how can you
be hotter than lab? I mean, it just seems to be firing on
all cylinders. And you know, it doesn't mean I didn't miss a four
and a half footer in this week's Herdsman at goat Hill Park, you know,
in the hall of the horse race that costs my partner and I.
But it made a bunch of putts to get us there, you know what
I mean. You still got you still got to have to hit, but
you got to hit your right line. You got to have the right speed.
So it doesn't do everything for you, and but it it has made
putting fun for me again. I use a DF three. If I had
to do all over again, I would probably go with the broomstick. Knowing
what I know now and having heard everything I've heard and then experimented with both,
I've just can't a can't go away from what I'm using, which is
the shorter DF three, And because that's been really good to me, But
be it's just hard to stick a broomstick in your bag and travel with it
and put it in your trunk like it's just a really long thing. Isn't
it the same length as your driver? I don't know. I think it
is. I mean, unless you have something longer than forty four inches.
I've never actually put it in my bag. It's whatever it is, it's
it's just a big giant thing. And I'm just not sure that I'm ready
to actually put with a broomstick. Yeah. Again, I see the technology.
I think the technology is best served as you know, as pendulum as
you can be, and I think broomstick is as pendulum as you can be.
But I just can't. I just can't get myself to do that yet.
Well, you know, that's really contrary to what you were saying on
your series, because if it works, I mean, let it speak for
itself. What Kelly Slater said, I didn't say that, but you know,
and what Adam Scott said, and what Lucas Glover said. I mean,
they're, you know, and they're they're just better at this than me.
But I just there might be a day where I'd go to it.
But right now, again, I'm putting so well with the shorter DF three
And like I said, if I were to start all over again and do
the first version of lab as my you know, it would be a broomstick.
But once now that I got this in my hand, and I'm putting
so well with it. I just I don't change stuff, like if it's
working for me, I stay with it. And that's why it took me
so long to even go to LAB. They you know, they had sent
me my putter. I didn't start using it for a couple of months because
I'd been putting so good with my previous putter, so I don't, Yeah,
I stay with I dance with the one that brung me, you know
what I mean. And but now it's the DF three short one and I'm
loving it. And people, I mean people are noticing at my club.
They're like, Okay, that's it. I'm getting a LAB. I see
how it's changed the way you put It's interesting because on the video, when
Sam is giving me a tutorial on how to use the broomstick, I mentioned
to him, and I really believe it's true. For me. I was
using the DF three and it is a huge leap from the two point one,
the DF two point one, the direct force directed force, direct force.
But what I noticed about my putting with a regular size putter is that
my left hand is what gets me in trouble. I'm right handed, but
it's my left hand. If I push it or I pull it, it's
because of what's going on with my left hand. And so by using a
broomstick, getting my left hand out of the equation and just using that classic
perfect pendulum with the right arm, I'm like my line, it's all about
speed. At that point, the line is exactly where I wanted to go.
Well, I think again the whole gist of in the essence of why
it's working and catching on as you're eliminating that whole concept of you know,
managing torque. Right, what is either the toe balance or the face balance
the toe hang of the face bounce putter. So if you're just taking that
out of the equation, now you're just focused knowing that, knowing that that
face is going to be square coming square to that ball, and it's going
to be starting online or something very close to it. Now you're just worried
about speed and line. That eliminating that factor certainly makes sense to me.
And if you see it, if you see what happens on the revealer,
of what happens when putters are whipping around and going in and that one is
just staying steady, and then you go into down the Brett Rumford hole of
let go of control to gain control and kind of that epiphany moment that he
had, or that a lot of people have, and which as light as
I try, I try to hold that putter literally as light as possible.
I try to like swing it as smooth and as steady as possible and let
the technology actually do what it's supposed to do, what it was designed to
do, what I think a lot of marketing had told you other putters in
theory were going to do. But Bill Pressey actually figured out how to do
it. So you just get you get out of the way. And you
know, I got hot with it early. Then I went through a cold
phase. Then I realized I needed to move closer to the putter. People
were noticing that I was too far. My eyes were back away from the
ball. So I got a little more close again, getting more into that
upright position, more into like almost a pendulum position. And then slin,
you know, just letting that sway, And now I'm hot again. And
now I agree in my mind, I feel like I can make every part.
I look at the green is you know, a meeting place of hope.
That's what And that's what I think putters and putter companies sell, right.
I mean, they're selling you on the hope that you can, you
know, get good at putting and make the ones that matter right. And
I think Lab's done a very effective job of doing all of that well.
In your nine part series. You you know, you learn so much and
you get to the point of, like you just mentioned, you got to
let go of control to gain control. But if you just say that to
someone, it's not as effective as when you hear the whole story and get
to that point. But it really is true about let go of control of
your putter, untrque yourself, is what they say it Lab, right,
But let go of it to gain control too, to then become a better
putter. Get out of the way, you know, get out of the
way and just let the let the let the putter do the work. So
you know, I mean, and and not and as it's mentioned in this
series, not bad life advice either, right, let go of control control
and you know, so there's a lot, there's some you know, golf
is life and life is golf, and all the parallels keep going on and
on and on, and here's yet more to chew on it and I think
it was my first episode with that we did in two thousand and five with
doctor Joe Parent who says, I help people get out of their own way,
and I think this putter does that a lot as well. If you
let it, if you let it, you let it. Yeah. Absolutely,
Okay, enough about lab for now. We may n't back there.
But there's other things like when you just mentioned about storytelling in in golf and
media, it made me think of Bryce to Shambo and how effective he's become
through his YouTube channel and how he talked about you know, his YouTube channel
helped him to realize that it's all entertainment and it's all storytelling, and that
he's an entertainer and he I was kind of blown away after he won the
major at the PGA Championship and it just seemed like he was a different kid.
I want to make sure that I'm understanding the question in there just before
I started answering, which is you know, in other words, is Bryceon
evolving in a way that makes him more likable? Is that kind of what
I'm hearing for me? Yes? Yeah, for me as well. I
the let's see, I think there's a few things here. I think he
has evolved as a human being, Okay, which is you know, you'd
like to think we all do we all are? I know some of us
don't, or some of us. He's still a young person, he's still
twenties earlier. Again, and I think the way and I again, I
don't know anything about anything. He's quirky, okay, so whatever that is.
You know, Tom Doak is quirky. By Bryson d. Chambeau is
quirky. There's a lot of very very successful people in this industry who are
you know, what would be deemed quirky or odd or socially wonky or you
know, a lot of a lot of But it doesn't make them bad people.
It doesn't mean they're you know, it just means that they're kind of
they're they're unique, they're different. They look at life, you know,
through a different set of glasses. I don't know. Bryson is definitely different,
and we've seen a lot of different sides of him over the years.
Some of the sides made it really hard to like him. I mean,
the tantrums and some of the meltdowns and some of the things that he says.
But you know, I give. I give people passes on that knowing
that they're young, or they're immature, or they've been coddled, or they're
surrounded by yes men, or they they they came up with a different guys.
I don't know, there's a there's a lot of things that go into
whoever we are as individuals. I do think that as he's gotten older and
found his you know, get he's he seems to be a little more comfortable
in his own skin. He seems to be a little less agitated in his
you know, personal and professional life. I think, you know, I
think Live was kind of the was a was It's it's been good for for
some people, have not been good for some people. Who's benefited more from
Live than Bryson Dschambau right, like out from underneath this kind of structured PGA
tour that's very controlling and very like trying to manifest a lot of different little
brand narratives the way they see it or want to see it, and controlling
and it's like this lily white PGA tour that we're going to, you know,
project and you know, manage in a way. Well, Bryson got
out, you know that wasn't that that wasn't good for him for a guy
who's so unique and kind of wanting to do his own thing and bring it.
So I think Live gave him that kind of freedom, content freedom,
you know, uh, platform freedom. Uh you know the way he plays
that, you know, no one's no one's gonna outwork Bryson Dschambau. So
it didn't didn't matter that he was going to be playing three rounds or playing
less golf or shotgun didn't. You know, Like he he's a hard worker,
he's a golf fanatic, he's a junkie. He's going to work as
hard as he needs to to try to keep improving. Mad scientist, he's
a mad scientist. Part of the quirk I was referring to it. He's
just really that's his thing. So I think he's just a guy who,
you know, whereas Dustin Johnson probably needed this structure and needed the guard rails
and needed the control, you know, like am you saying of the PGA
tour, of the guys who left the tour to go to Live. I
think some of these guys aren't aren't succeeding. You know, john Rom probably
needed the structure, the legacy, the you know, the four rounds and
the play, you know, like, I don't think he's gotten better since
he left. I don't think DJ has gotten better since he left. I
think Brooks is still a mixed bag. And we'll see what happened. I
know he kind of partly left because he had a bunch of injuries. And
you know, whether he's hell Fear or not, I don't really know.
But but Bryson is one of those guys who left and is actually you know,
has been very successful in his departure from the the institution of the PGA
Tour. Right or wrong, good or bad? Like it or don't like
it. That's that Those are all different conversations. I'm just saying he's one
of the few who's really thrived in this kind of fences, you know,
gates open kind of mentality of live golf, and more power to him.
And you know, he's one another the US Open and h and he did
it in a really really stylish, you know, convincing way, and uh
and he's played well in in you know, most of the majors, and
you know he's succeeding and he's now found this other platform and and outlet for
all of again, more quirkiness, you know, politics aside, and whether
we agree or don't agree like with all that that again, more different conversations.
I just think it's nice to see I think he's good for golf generally.
I think it's nice to see him be happy and be successful. I
don't begrudge people, you know, success and happiness. So good for him.
So I'm gonna throw this one out to you. I hope that you
can step I have no doubt you'll step up to this challenge. I just
got word that you were made the commissioner of the USGA and you're in charge
of the PGA Tour. What's your first move? Well, in terms of
oh man, that's a lot. So I'm in charge of the USGA and
the PGA Tour. Oh no, let's talk about everyday golfer. Let's talk
about with the restrictions that everyday golfers have to do. Whether you believe in
bifurcation or not, you know that there's a set of rules. It should
be for the tour and a set of rules for everybody else who plays.
Let's just say in the USGA, you are now in charge and you get
to say, you know this rule, we really need that, Larry David
here, but you know, where would you go with that? I would,
you know, I think they're generally kind of going there. Certainly were
going in the right direction. I definitely like Mike Waan. I I think
he I think he's a good leader, and I think he did really incredible
things for the LPGA. Whether that is going to ultimately translate into being good
for the USGA, I think to be determined. I think he's he's he's
really into this marketing and these taglines and these catchphrases of you know, unify
and go whatever, you know, all these different things. I firmly believe
in bifurcation. I think they are playing a different game than we play.
That's very obvious. On any given day, in any given moment, any
given t shot, any given putt, any given ship. Those guys are
elite and play the game in such a different way swing speed, length,
ability, it's not even close, right, And even people who think they're
close are not close. So I do not believe that it's necessary to in
the midst of golf's greatest growth phase for men, women, and children and
every other person on the planet, to throw in the concept of a rollback
for amateurs, for people who pay to play the game, do whatever you
want to the people who get paid to play the game, but for the
people who are actually coming to the game to pay money to rock up and
you know, utilize a facility for eighteen holes. The idea of throwing in
the concept of a roll back to pieces of the equipment, especially the golf
ball individually, and singling out the golf ball is to me just as doesn't
make sense. It's unnecessary. Bucket of water on what is this beautiful,
warm, you know, life giving flame. That is the growth that's happening
in the game. So that seemed odd and unnecessary to me. I do
think that the longest hitters in the game. If you want to do a
tournament ball, or if you want to shrink the driver size, or if
you want to lengthen fairways, if you want to, you know, limit
the loft on what would be a driver. You know, you can do
any number of things. I really honestly could care less. When I go
play softball, I use a metal bat. When they go play professional baseball,
they use a would bat. I know it's not exactly the same But
my point is is that I know that I'm not playing the same game that
they play, and they know they're not playing the same game that I play.
I know that they're getting paid to play. We're going out and trying
to utilize our You know, most people only play six to ten rounds a
year. FRED like, six to ten rounds a year. Do you know
what I'm saying. Like, if you think about a golf season in the
Midwest of being five months and you play twice a month, you're playing ten
times. That's why we don't really need to get like, it doesn't matter
how far they hit. Like, if that person that plays ten times a
month is hitting it over a bunker, I normally shouldn't be hitting it over,
cutting it at a corner or whatever it's going to. It's just it
doesn't seem to make a lot of sense to me. So I say,
let a real good thing alone. And if I was in charge of the
USGA, I would be working with the other governing bodies of golf to create
a set of standards or equipment or rules that that made sense to the elites
so that we can, you know, so that we can still utilize some
of the best venues in golf, for you know, some of the best
tournaments in golf. And if guys are hitting at three forty to three sixty
to three seventy, or if they're getting it, they're carrying at three thirty
and it's rolling another fifty yards, I get. The optics are that you
know that some of these cherished venues are becoming irrelevant or obsolete. And if
you do want to do that, if you want to, if you want
to keep those in and keep them relevant, then roll some stuff back.
But don't don't mess with us. Don't mess with the paying consumer, because
it doesn't It doesn't make any sense to me, because the reality is we
the people who pay to play, actually don't hit it too far. And
if you know what, if I got a group of twenty eight guys who
go to banded dunes every year and we play sixty two hundred yards and we
get a little wind and a little conditions, trust me, there's very few
of us that are playing to our handicaper better. It just from sixty two
hundred yards. So the point is it's just not going too far, you
know what I mean. You throw in a few little elements, you've thrown
that type of style of golf. It's just start asking, Start pulling caddies
at some of these best courses in America and ask them if the ball's going
too far for the bags that they carry. Trust me, ninety four percent
of the caddies pulled would tell you they wish the ball went further. And
there's a natural rollback that happens by virtue of age and and and you know,
and and physical restrictions. That's already happening to us, whether we like
it or not. It's called getting older and not being able to rotate as
much. And you know a lot of the twenty somethings or thirty something younger
thirty something there going oh you know, you know we need to roll it
back. Okay, just give it, give it ten years, and tell
me if you think it still should be rolled back, right right, come
back to me in a in a decade. We come on. You get
one or two gray hairs in your head, then let's talk about Paul is
actually going too far for you? Congratulations, Enjoy it well, lasts because
a year or two or five years from now, it's not going to be
the case. Yep, yep, I don't know what made me think about
this this past weekend watching the Open Championship. But you talk about using a
metal bat for you know, when you play softball. But I guess this
is really obvious, but it occurred to me, like the finally occurred to
me that the people who go to see professional sports. Now we're talking about
football, baseball, basketball, hockey, right, not golf. How many
of those people you think play the sport. But when you go when you
watch a major or any golf tournament on television, what ninety nine percent of
the people who are attending that event, they're golfers to some degree whatever that
is again, whether that's you know, a couple of rounds or they you
know that, whatever that is. And the good news is they participate in
the sport as opposed to being just a voyer. And the good news is
there's so many different entry points of what is the sport. Now again going
back to the basketball analogy, and that you know, if you went out
and play horse, you played basketball that day. If you played seven up,
or if you played two on two or you played one on one,
you played basketball that day. You didn't play five on five full court.
You know, you know, basketball in order to play basketball. And I
think now we have all these different variations of what is golf, from top
golf to putting courses to you know, simulator experiences now that are becoming super
social. And again, if you go to Korea, you know, there's
a there's a simulator on every corner, like there is a Starbucks in New
York. It's it's like they're there. That's the way people consume the game
is simulator experiences or driving range experiences and and so uh, you know,
I love that this game that especially in this country, has evolved fairly quickly
considering you know, twenty five years ago was doom and gloom. It was
takes too long, it's too expensive, it's too hard, and now apparently
the issue is the ball goes too far. Like I don't that we we've
you know, like I think I think, you know, I'm on the
board of youth on course. Kids can get cards and play for five dollars
or less at now almost two thousand golf courses in America. It's now spread
across the country subsidized green fees for juniors. So so the affordability, accessibility
I think has has evolved. A lot of women and girls are getting into
the game. That's amazing for the true health of the sport in general.
A LPGA seems to be, you know, in a really good place thanks
to a lot of a lot of you know, very likable, watchable,
enjoyable, you know leaders in that sport and Nelly Corda being you know,
the Scottie Shuffler of the LPGA, and I don't know the game, the
game is in a great place. I would get rid of ob white steaks
and just I'd make everything red steaks. I mean there's you know, just
little fun tweaks, little things that kind of that just pass the sensibility test.
I would continue to massage those and make them make sense to you know,
I I think you know, I played Goat Hill Park. Everybody knows
this. I'm wearing a Winter Park nine hat it because that's where you know,
we you know, a big group of people helped transform that community asset
that was underachieving into something that's now overachieving. Great goat Hill Park. There's
no dress code. It's dogs, it's kids, it's music, it's fun,
it's you know, it's it's it's a community. It feels like a
family. You know, I go there and I don't even play golf and
have a stop in to see my friends or my son knows more people there
than I do. I mean, it's like, you know, like the
game isn't a really good place. So if I were a part of some
of this golf leadership, I would be making sure that I would be doing
things that continued the path of growth and not things that like felt like they
were having it go two steps back. Is that a crazy concept? I
don't think so. Recently, I've been coaching at First T. There's a
new First T program here up in Marin and Sonoma County, and I've been
working with six to ten year olds. That's got to be rewarding and amazing,
and it's adorable. It's adorable. It's a lot easier than trying to
teach my three year old grandson to but he keeps hitting himself in the head
with his butter. But there's so many opportunities to be part of the community.
What have you been up to recently? Well, I mean we you
know, what was the fire pit collective is what I mean? The collective
was what I pivoted out of you know, again I've told this story multiple
times, but I leave Golf Channel twenty twenty start what was going to be
my you know, a production company. It was called Dawn Patrol Productions.
It was going to be travel lifestyle architecture events. A month later, COVID
hit, so then you know, travel lifestyle events that didn't you know,
that was going to be like uh, that was just bad, really bad
timing. So then it was like, well, maybe maybe we create you
know this talking to Alan Chipnuk was like, let's create a collective, you
know, a team of not unlike what was happening at Barstool or No Laying
Up some of these other you know, boutique media outlets kind of joining forces
and creating a team of storytellers. And you know, I think we were.
I think we were surrounding ourselves with very talented people. I think there
was a there was a ton of opportunity to try to you know, form
one of those one of those additional you know, storytelling outlets. And I
think we told some really cool stories with people like Ryan French or Michael Bamberger,
Coltneddler, Las Versaillas or Jordan Perez or you know, we we had
a we had an incredible team of people that we were working with, but
we just got too big, too fast. I brought everybody in. You
know, salaries were too high, and we I thought it was gonna be
a little easier to sell content, sell stories, you know. There turns
out that takes time. You need audience to sell. Yeah, we weren't
in our twenties, you know, as Alan and I were saying, here
we are in our late forties feeling like we got to go, got to
go, gotta go. And we kind of got drunk on the success of
the phil book and the excerpt and that kind of going globally viral, and
it was like, oh wow, here we go. This is We got
all these analytics and all this feedback, but we didn't have a field book
every week, right, I mean, you got you know, you don't
get that. So a lot of hard lessons learned, a lot of time,
energy expense put into that, and then not only to try to make
it work at the start, but to try to make it work at the
end. It's very hard to admit you're wrong, or it's very hard to
admit a loss. It's very hard to like, actually, you know,
come to terms with you know, I had worked at Sports Illustrated Golf Die
Just Golf Channel, I had, you know, I had only worked for
a big, you know, big company. I had had you know,
whatever is deemed success and sort of telling stories and sharing experiences, and thought
I could roll right in, and I got to kind of you know,
got speed bumped by COVID, and then and then it turns out maybe I'm
actually not that great at managing a large group of people. While also trying
to tell I mean, I don't know, I've learned, you know,
learned a lot about myself. I've learned a lot of people about the people
in my life. I've learned a lot about my family, who have been
incredible and super supportive and amazing. So here we are now at what I'm
you know, in theory referring to as Firepit Productions. So the production I'm
sort of back to the beginning, that original concept of a production company in
which I tell stories about you know, places and people and things, architects,
architecture, restoration, renovation, new developments, getting into the event's business.
With what we're calling Bonfirebonfire two man dot com. We're gonna have events
at you know, Pasa Tiempo in December. We're going to going to Gamble
Sands in October. David we're documenting the David mcclay's second build at Gamble Sands.
We're documenting Jim Orbina's restoration and you know of all Alistair McKenzie Greens.
So they did the front nine the first year and now they're doing the back
nine and we're in We're called in the dirt there. We did the Golden
Gate Park restoration renovation by Jay BLASEI which is a huge success and an amazing
story. I've never played there, you know, I've known there was a
little nine hole at the park, and I played the Olympic Club recently which
was awesome, and I love Harding Park, but I've never played in Golden
Parting Yeahgate Park and it's a nine hole part three course and again WP nine
Golden Gate Park, I mean Goat Hill Park. This Golden Gate Park is
another you know, it was an underutilized, underachieving community asset. Dan Burke
and Jay Blasi and Josh Lewis and some of these guys have gone in there
and absolutely made you know, with some private investment in funding made this into
what is going to be an absolute gem and impact the community in such a
positive way, far beyond golf right, far beyond people having the occasional home
one and having a great experience. It's just going to be an incredible community
assets already having you know, wild is it open now? Are they working
on it? No? It's open? No? And is it run by
the city? The city essentially you know, it's but Dan Burke, who
knows the game of golf. You know, it is a first tea hub,
it's a first tea facility. It's a extension of Harding Park as a
first tea hub. So they've got golf people in there that know what they're
doing. So yes, from an agronomy standpoint, the city is still managing
it, and I think there's some education that's been happening from the time of
the restoration until now. That's the same thing. Nine. I mean,
John Ashra has the lease and has control over Goat Hill Park, and that's
a huge advantage for him because he is a golf guy. But he's still
using the same superintendent that's been there for thirty plus years because that guy,
you know, knew what he was doing and and just needed some resources to
make it better. And now you got some of the best greens in southern
California go toill Park. So it's not just you know, I know what
you mean, and it's you know, it's cringey when you hear that.
You know the city is managing anything as it relates to golf, and I
wish that was happening less and maybe more cities would actually realize that the real
answer is turning it over to golf people and they can lease it or rent
it, you know what I mean? Right? But I played Lincoln Park
in San Francisco a couple of weeks ago, and fun track terrible condition.
Needs it needs it needs what Golden Gate Park got and hopefully Jay Blonsie gets
that kind of chance Sharp Park, Lincoln Park. I think there's other opportunities
that could come. And again if you keep using if these if these turnarounds
and investments into these community assets keep having success, why wouldn't There's plenty of
blueprints out there to show cities like this is how it works, right,
get golf people in there to do really good golf things and then sit back
and reap the benefits of Now what will be a renaissance of a community asset.
That would be amazing. I would absolutely love that And I cannot wait
to go to Golden Gate Park and play nine holes. Yeah, that's gonna
be phenomenal. Yeah. And the next time you're anywhere near there, and
you're gonna want to go around twenty miles from Yeah, you're gonna love it.
You're gonna love it. Yeah. So Tempo is amazing too. And
what Jim Arbina has done, and justin Mandon and and and earth Sculptures and
these this team of people that have been been tasked by the club to restore
these Mackenzie Greens has been amazing. To be able to sort of help them
tell this story and the next part of that series because we did the Front
nine and that air during the Western Intercollegiate in April, and there's you know
it's there's a five and a half minute version and a three minute version of
what happened on the Front nine. You can see the before and afters,
but we are the Part two is a deep dive into the sixteenth Green,
this sort of feigned multi tiered green that it might be one of the most
famous greens in American golf. And certainly as it relates to Mackenzie's portfolio of
greens, and we are going to show you exactly what they're doing to every
one of these greens in their effort to try to bring them back to what
was intended by Mary Allens and Aliston McKenzie through the lens of the sixteenth Green.
So we have fascinating eight week time lapse that's been running out there.
We have all aspects of everything they've done and the pictures they used as reference
points. And Brett Hochstein, who also worked at Golden Gate Park as a
young great shaper that's helped sort of be part of this group. That's that's
that's you know, putting this putting this gem back together again, and it's
really cool. It's it's a very successful story. And we're we're following Core
and Crenshaw Crazy Mountain Ranches. They build a very high end private experience for
Sam Byrne at the base of the Crazy Mountains outside of Bozeman, Montana,
which is just spectacular. So we got David Kidd, Core Crenshaw, Jay
Blasi, and Jim Orbina that were kind of really intimately involved in sort of
you know, documenting what they're doing, you know, again, from new
builds to restorations to renovations and uh and and it's with four very talented architects
who you know, have very distinctly different styles and I love all of it.
Wow, I have to get back to Pasa Tampa because the one time
that I played there was right in the worst part of the drought that we
were having, and they hadn't watered in a long time, and it was
just really difficult to play there. Everything was rock hard, the greens were
not in great shape. It was really kind of sad. Well. I
did that story for Golf Channel and what was called Water Week at that time.
They were in the middle of a five year drought, right and they
didn't have water. They didn't have access to water reclaimed water, so it
was all potable water and those water costs were outrageous and they were drilling and
trying to find well water. And meanwhile, next door it's Scott's Valley.
Scott's Valley has one of the biggest water treatment plants in the country. Don't
quote me on that, but I know they have a massive water treatment facility
and they were making so much reclaimed water a big chunk of it was going
back out into the ocean. And meanwhile, past Teampo is their next door
neighbor, and they're going, we are dying on the vine over here in
one of our community assets at this Alixe McKenzie, Marion Hollins, you know,
gem of of sort of piece of what's happening in American golf and your
water's going out there. And the smart people and sends me people got in
the right room. Scott quite, the former GM of Postuma, deserves a
lot of credit. Justin Mannon again, who's still currently the superintendent, deserves
a lot of credit. Deals were made and essentially they got some of that
reclaimed water to Passe Tiempo and made it all make sense and they essentially has
set that place back up for a sustainable next one hundred years with diversifying the
water portfolio. And that's when they started feeling like, now we can start
focusing on our green Once they had the water is Shoe resolved, which took
you know, a lot of a lot of a lot of phone calls and
meetings and conversations and again sense of people making sensible decisions. Now they now
that the membership and leadership of Pastia got to focus on the greens. They
knew they needed to do something to try to, you know, enhance the
sustainability of those greens, and it run out of pinnable locations. I mean
with you know, with top dressing and sand splash in almost one hundred years
of washouts and mother nature. You know, you're you're looking at almost twelve
to eighteen inches of sort of time being put on top of these of these
putting surfaces. And what what you do is if you're top dressing only the
putting surfaces and nothing in the surrounds, well, what happens is you can
you can take like what would be considered a punch bowl green and it almost
becomes a Donald you know, upside down bold green by virtue of just time
or sand splash around the bunkers that are coming. So learning all about all
this then also what was happening under the ground there from an agronomy standpoint was
just archaic, and you had things like thatch and lack of drainage. So
they needed to pull all that apart. And again we've watched them do this.
It's been a bit of an archaeological essentially dig back into time and trying
to understand what Mackenzie and Hollins's intent were. And then now with Urbina's you
know, references of images and slight interpretation and understanding of what, you know,
what could have been or should have been. And again given today's modern
day green speeds, the eighteenth green, for example, you went from one,
maybe two, two and a half pinnable locations. If the greens are
running at nine, if they're running at eleven, you really just had almost
no pin location. Now you have upwards of eight the fifth green, eighth
green, you know what's going to be, the sixteenth green, seventeen like
it, just you've got these now this shelving pattern within these greens, you
got greens within the green. That gives Justin Mannon in the club a lot
more options and opportunities to create a variety of where you're playing and where you're
attacking these greens. And it's it's amazing, it's really really incredible, incredibly
successful project that I think everyone's going to get, whoever deserves credit's going to
get it. Great. Great, all right, last question, we'll wrap
this up. I'm just where what are you putting out these days? Do
you have any content, new content that we can hear is fire Pit podcast
happening or Yeah, I'm going to get back to it again. Where my
wife is the most recent addition to Real Housewives of Orange County. So that
was six months of shooting really for her and us as a family. Now
I needed to kind of work on sort of pulling apart fire Pit collective while
also trying to give her the give her the driver's seat of whatever it is
that is this family business. We have a company called te Shots We're working
on which is flavored shots and golf ball dispensers and a sleeve of four so
we have that you don't be seeing more of. I will get back to
storytelling and again again these are we are a production company. I have clients
that I'm working with and try to tell their stories. I will ultimately get
back to my personal storytelling in which I do more podcasting. Like I said,
I'm sitting on at least five or six reported out timeless podcasts, including
Nancy Lopez and Jack Nicholas, is thirteen hundred Pound Marlin and some of these
things that I've got a variety of voices talking about. But for now I'm
focused on on my family, and again we have some My father's not doing
well. My wife's on Orange County housewife that's coming with a lot of uh,
you know, responsibilities and pressures and time time commitments, t shots,
and then you know, other than that, we don't have much going on.
So ain't nothing happening. Matt, Thanks so much, man, it
was so great to talk to you. I I know, all I have
to do is write down one or two things and it's going to be an
easy conversation. Yeah, well, let's play. We got a bonfire at
Pasa Tempa December nineteenth, where everybody's welcome to come join us. We're going
to have an outing there. Jim Orbina will be there. We'll have a
we'll have lunches and dinners and around the golf where we maybe we teat at
Golden Gate Park when I'm in town. We'll we'll find a way to play
some golf and use our lab putt. What happens when two people use lab
putters and they're really good at it's going to come down to the final fut
Obviously, it's hope. So it's a it's a big it's the meeting place
of hope. Never loose hope. Great talking to you, Matt. Thanks
thanks as always friend to keep care well. Now that we talked a little
more about Lab Golf with another fan of the company, next week we'll get
to go inside the walls of the Lab Golf factory and get a tour from
CEO Sam Han. In addition, Sam will provide me with a tutorial on
how to best utilize my new DF three broomstick putter. But it's not just
the podcast next week, the tour and the tutorial, which will be one
podcast episode, will also be available as two separate videos on our YouTube channel
at golf Smarter. I want to thank this week's Golf Smarter Ambassador, Maryanne
Zurich from Lake Forest, Illinois. Now, Marianna has received the free link
to Tony Manzoni's video of the loss Fundamental for opening today's episode. You know,
it's free to become a Golf Smarter Ambassador, and the only barrier to
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