WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.960 --> 00:00:05.799 Hello, and welcome to you. Out of this world. I'm coming to 2 00:00:05.799 --> 00:00:14.679 you from some undisclosed tropical location and I'm so excited tonight because b LA based 3 00:00:14.800 --> 00:00:19.640 lit analyzer is joining me for the first time. He's classing up the place. 4 00:00:20.280 --> 00:00:27.039 We are getting better and better guests and personalities for you. And he 5 00:00:27.199 --> 00:00:32.600 has been doing so many great shows with David Patrick, Henry Hotel, and 6 00:00:32.960 --> 00:00:36.679 Rachel Wilson, and he is part of the squad and this is our first 7 00:00:37.399 --> 00:00:42.560 dance together tonight. So how are you tonight. I'm awesome. I'm so 8 00:00:42.600 --> 00:00:45.759 glad to be here, can't you know. I'm very excited to talk about 9 00:00:45.799 --> 00:00:49.399 this as a great topic. We're doing Peter Pan tonight and yeah, shouts 10 00:00:49.439 --> 00:00:53.119 out to David Patrick, Carrey Jersey, Turnal Logos, all of our friends 11 00:00:53.159 --> 00:00:56.679 out there. You know it's it's been fun and I think we're gonna do 12 00:00:56.920 --> 00:00:59.600 a nice deep dive into this one. I can't wait. You know your 13 00:00:59.600 --> 00:01:04.040 shows have been you kill it every time. Yes, especially with my friend 14 00:01:04.120 --> 00:01:07.239 Rachel. Rachel Wilson based on school mom, so shouts out to her, 15 00:01:07.760 --> 00:01:12.040 looking forward to it totally. So we're just getting this cool. Like network 16 00:01:14.519 --> 00:01:19.239 podcasters and content shares and creators and friends, and tonight we're going to talk 17 00:01:19.280 --> 00:01:23.040 about something crazy, because I know I've been promising you this, but we've 18 00:01:23.079 --> 00:01:27.799 been in transition. But I have one more chapter to go in this crazy 19 00:01:27.840 --> 00:01:33.840 thing, and that's gonna be on Rock Fin But it's all about Panis. 20 00:01:33.920 --> 00:01:36.799 So before we get to Peter Pan, we're going to talk a little bit 21 00:01:36.840 --> 00:01:41.879 about who Pan is, the hidden god, and I'm going to read you 22 00:01:42.200 --> 00:01:47.760 the description of Pan in the glossary from the most probably the most evilest book 23 00:01:47.799 --> 00:01:52.400 I own. I had to one time I moved. I had to split 24 00:01:52.439 --> 00:01:55.480 my library and I didn't have room for everything, and so a lot of 25 00:01:55.519 --> 00:01:59.799 the evil books didn't make it. You know, they got cut, but 26 00:02:00.359 --> 00:02:05.200 made the cut because it had a story behind it. But so Pan from 27 00:02:05.239 --> 00:02:14.360 this book uh is Greek literally means all Latin ome Sanskrit ome. So this 28 00:02:14.439 --> 00:02:17.960 is gonna go places that you don't think because whenever you're doing yoga and you're 29 00:02:17.960 --> 00:02:23.080 saying ome money, pop me ome, this is the mantra or the god 30 00:02:23.159 --> 00:02:29.039 Pan, right, yes, what's the There's a Beatles song also where George 31 00:02:29.039 --> 00:02:38.000 Harrison incorporates it. He says ja ja guru devela om Guru day. Yeah, 32 00:02:39.759 --> 00:02:46.000 nothing gonna change that one, that's right, Yes, okay. And 33 00:02:45.759 --> 00:02:49.639 and actually you know you losing that book of or the box of you know, 34 00:02:49.800 --> 00:02:53.879 esoteric evil books is funny. I had the same thing I moved and 35 00:02:53.919 --> 00:02:59.080 I lost a huge It was a box of all the like novels, all 36 00:02:59.120 --> 00:03:01.360 the pros. So every time I think of a novel, I can't find 37 00:03:01.360 --> 00:03:05.000 it. So I understand what it's like, but I still, you know, 38 00:03:05.080 --> 00:03:08.319 I guess, unfortunately, I guess I've got my Alister Crowley Books made 39 00:03:08.360 --> 00:03:13.919 it. Well, it's so valuable, I mean just that alone. It's 40 00:03:13.960 --> 00:03:16.360 a lot of money if you ever want to replace this one. So, 41 00:03:16.680 --> 00:03:20.599 but you will hear all about that on the Rock Fin Show, probably out 42 00:03:20.639 --> 00:03:25.319 this week. But so Pan Home, Egyptian, Amun, Hebrew, Amen, 43 00:03:27.800 --> 00:03:30.439 all designations of the Hidden God of the forest, the abyss, the 44 00:03:30.560 --> 00:03:36.240 deep, the underworld, any region would drawn and without the range of waking 45 00:03:36.479 --> 00:03:43.960 consciousness. So we're already getting into the dream world, the subconscious world where 46 00:03:43.960 --> 00:03:50.120 Pan operates. Right, So for the folks at home, Jamie, we've 47 00:03:50.159 --> 00:03:53.639 already gone, you know, very deep literally and figuratively with this name and 48 00:03:53.759 --> 00:03:57.520 like this is just from the title itself. Right, this is just Peter 49 00:03:57.599 --> 00:04:00.479 Pan, and I think it's interesting that, you know, I'm sure people 50 00:04:00.520 --> 00:04:05.319 will look at this and say, no, this has nothing to do with 51 00:04:05.360 --> 00:04:08.240 it. Right, It's just Peter Pan, you know, it's just a 52 00:04:08.319 --> 00:04:13.360 literation or just as a nice sounding title. But it's in the title, 53 00:04:13.719 --> 00:04:15.639 and it's an obvious name. It's an obvious name, So of course I 54 00:04:15.639 --> 00:04:21.680 think it it's apt to go into the symbolism and into the archetypes and the 55 00:04:21.680 --> 00:04:28.040 mythology of that well, as we're going to find out his cult was really 56 00:04:28.079 --> 00:04:32.120 popping off in the Victorian era, in the Gothic era, when these are 57 00:04:33.600 --> 00:04:41.160 plays, books, stories, all of these things were becoming popular. And 58 00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:47.720 Pan is related to Nodens, and now we're going even deeper into the Abyss 59 00:04:47.839 --> 00:04:53.680 because he would be like a Lovecraftian type, like an elder god, like 60 00:04:53.680 --> 00:04:57.920 a Cthulhu. So Nodens the god of the deep or Abyss, and according 61 00:04:57.920 --> 00:05:01.120 to Lovecraft, the only name elder god Steed. He survived into Roman times 62 00:05:01.480 --> 00:05:05.720 and was worshiped in the Islands at the Earthly Power Zone or Chakras, situated 63 00:05:05.759 --> 00:05:14.879 at Lydney and Gloucestershire sows. Yeah, Gloucestershire, Gloucestershire. Okay, so 64 00:05:15.639 --> 00:05:20.360 Notens is gonna pop back up. Pan is gonna like the psyche in Peter 65 00:05:20.439 --> 00:05:28.279 Pan when we talk about Jan Barry and Peter Pan, and then we're going 66 00:05:28.360 --> 00:05:32.959 to talk about next week the Great God Pan of Victorian novella by Arthur Makin, 67 00:05:33.079 --> 00:05:42.480 who is admired by occultist HP Lovecraft in Kanneth Grant and other occult writers. 68 00:05:44.000 --> 00:05:46.399 So Pan, I mean that's literally chaos, right. It was where 69 00:05:46.439 --> 00:05:54.000 we get the word pandemic. We get the word panic, panic, pandemonium. 70 00:05:54.279 --> 00:05:59.680 You know, So what have we been going through the last three years? 71 00:06:00.079 --> 00:06:09.959 But a ritual a pandemic? Right, pander pander, Yeah, Yeah. 72 00:06:10.000 --> 00:06:15.519 The pandemonium is the most interesting one to me because when I think of 73 00:06:15.920 --> 00:06:21.600 pandemonium, it's a word that occurs in in Paradise Lost. It's in Milton's 74 00:06:21.639 --> 00:06:27.279 Paradise Lost, right, because all the devils are there. They're all there. 75 00:06:27.360 --> 00:06:31.120 They when they gather together in book book one of Paradise Lost, they 76 00:06:31.160 --> 00:06:35.560 find themselves like on the shore of you know, a darkness and it's so 77 00:06:35.680 --> 00:06:40.639 dark that the darkness is visible, and they call it pandemonium because they look 78 00:06:40.639 --> 00:06:44.560 out and it's strange because immediately they look out and they see that like they're 79 00:06:44.560 --> 00:06:50.160 in company. But I never put together the Pan, the Pan part of 80 00:06:50.199 --> 00:06:57.040 Pandemonium, including the reference to Pan the god, the you know, the 81 00:06:57.160 --> 00:07:02.040 Roman or the pagan, the pagan image. So it's interesting, all right. 82 00:07:02.120 --> 00:07:06.399 Yeah, So Pan is the bringer of violence. He's disruptive, he's 83 00:07:06.439 --> 00:07:13.519 beasts like, he's sexually aggressive, He's known for overturning the prevailing order of 84 00:07:13.560 --> 00:07:17.120 things. So he is the chaos part of Ordo ab chaop. Right, 85 00:07:18.199 --> 00:07:25.480 And so let's go back in time a little bit, because Pan he wasn't 86 00:07:25.519 --> 00:07:32.199 really a huge thing. He was sort of like an attendant to Dionysus, 87 00:07:32.240 --> 00:07:42.240 which Dionysus and Bacchus were very popular in Greek mythology, and the mystery plays 88 00:07:42.240 --> 00:07:47.439 where we get the idea of theater and acting and invocating gods into actors that 89 00:07:47.879 --> 00:07:53.319 influence crowds. So let's talk about mystery schools for a minute. So let's 90 00:07:53.319 --> 00:08:00.360 go back to each of Crease. So I don't know if you want to 91 00:08:00.480 --> 00:08:03.839 when you want me to bring this up, but the one play, one 92 00:08:03.879 --> 00:08:09.079 of the ancient plays that deals with this specifically is the play by Euripides, 93 00:08:09.120 --> 00:08:15.839 which is called the Bacai and and the it's you know, Bacchus is the 94 00:08:15.920 --> 00:08:20.519 Roman name for Dionysus. And I've I learned about this because when I was 95 00:08:20.560 --> 00:08:26.680 a child, we had a dog named Bacchus. And and uh. And 96 00:08:26.720 --> 00:08:28.959 then later, you know, when when listening to the Doors, when I 97 00:08:30.040 --> 00:08:31.840 was like, you know, ten years old, is when I first started 98 00:08:31.840 --> 00:08:35.000 listening to the Doors. And I learned a lot of literature from reading about 99 00:08:35.519 --> 00:08:39.159 Jim Morrison and you know, people that's how people learn, you know, 100 00:08:39.200 --> 00:08:43.480 get into their heroes and stuff and then go on from there. But he 101 00:08:43.480 --> 00:08:48.840 would constantly bring up Dionysus. And there's a story about when uh. And 102 00:08:48.879 --> 00:08:52.480 it kind of illustrates the beginnings of this because when the Doors first formed, 103 00:08:52.559 --> 00:08:58.360 Jim and Raymond z Eric like met on a beach and they decided to form 104 00:08:58.399 --> 00:09:00.840 it. I mean, this is kind of mythology, but they decided to 105 00:09:00.879 --> 00:09:03.159 form a band. And Raymond Zeri's like, yeah, we'll play concerts and 106 00:09:03.200 --> 00:09:07.559 you know, and we'll like get girls and make money or whatever, and 107 00:09:07.559 --> 00:09:09.440 and Jim said, and this isn't the film. Also he said, it's 108 00:09:09.440 --> 00:09:16.200 like when Dionysus arrived on the shores of Greece, making all the women crazy, 109 00:09:16.399 --> 00:09:18.879 and he saw himself as kind of, you know it modeled himself as 110 00:09:18.919 --> 00:09:22.600 like a neo sort of Dionysus. But one of the interesting elements of this 111 00:09:22.759 --> 00:09:26.360 that is inherent in it you were talking about the you know, the god 112 00:09:26.399 --> 00:09:31.159 of chaos, is that this is like a twofold god because and it ties 113 00:09:31.200 --> 00:09:35.039 in with like the nature of alcohol, because you know, Bacchus is the 114 00:09:35.200 --> 00:09:43.120 and Dionysus the god of wine. So for half the year we'll say Bacchus 115 00:09:43.440 --> 00:09:50.399 is a party god, right wine, and and you know, yes, 116 00:09:50.480 --> 00:09:54.519 yes, yeah, exactly a great time, you know, so you know, 117 00:09:54.559 --> 00:09:58.200 the big the big out in the open, great you know, greco 118 00:09:58.320 --> 00:10:01.799 eyswatch party or whatever, and they're being you know, Greek and then Roman. 119 00:10:03.480 --> 00:10:07.559 But then for the other half of the year, it's the other side 120 00:10:07.600 --> 00:10:11.720 of drinking, or the other side of alcoholism, which is anger and lust 121 00:10:13.360 --> 00:10:18.519 and they've had too much. And for that half the women roam the countryside 122 00:10:18.720 --> 00:10:24.559 insane and tearing apart the men. And part of the ritual for the one 123 00:10:24.559 --> 00:10:31.679 of the cults of focus was tearing, you know, like biting men men's 124 00:10:31.759 --> 00:10:35.159 flesh, and they often did this, uh, you know, symbolically like 125 00:10:35.240 --> 00:10:39.519 with a beast, you know, or a pig, usually like a dead 126 00:10:39.559 --> 00:10:45.080 animal that they'd sacrifice, but sometimes it was a you know, a man 127 00:10:45.279 --> 00:10:50.720 or a live person, which I think is interesting to say the least, 128 00:10:50.799 --> 00:10:54.840 and probably probably ties into the book we're about to read in it, Like 129 00:10:54.879 --> 00:10:58.679 that's kind of a stretch. But some some very dark and weird things to 130 00:11:00.039 --> 00:11:03.000 happen and are mentioned in the text in jam Barry's text. But we'll see 131 00:11:03.000 --> 00:11:07.759 where that goes, I suppose. So I don't know if you have come 132 00:11:07.799 --> 00:11:13.840 across this, but I'm trying to recall my Pan and Mystery School initiation, 133 00:11:15.080 --> 00:11:18.960 and I think I remember it's like going into the underworld and meeting Pan as 134 00:11:20.080 --> 00:11:24.320 the bride starts with the Arion d or something like that, and you have 135 00:11:24.399 --> 00:11:31.600 to have some kind of marriage in the underworld. Are you talking about Ariadney? 136 00:11:31.200 --> 00:11:43.679 Yes, Yeah, so that's that's mentioned in there's like a huge text, 137 00:11:43.679 --> 00:11:50.360 and that's mentioned in in Edith Hamilton's Mythology. I'll find it, okay, 138 00:11:50.399 --> 00:11:54.559 I'm sorry. Yeah, So we're talking about secret initiations. We're talking 139 00:11:54.600 --> 00:12:03.759 about people assuming God forms and having rituals and sometimes you know, sexual rituals, 140 00:12:03.799 --> 00:12:07.799 because that is a component to all of these initiations that we're gonna talk 141 00:12:07.840 --> 00:12:11.639 about, especially with Pan. He's you know, got of lust and secundity 142 00:12:11.799 --> 00:12:20.120 and descending from Dionysus Bacchus, who was the vegetation you know, fertility dying 143 00:12:20.200 --> 00:12:24.039 god. Like you just explained half the year, he was one thing in 144 00:12:24.080 --> 00:12:30.840 the other half. So he was an example of the you know, phallic 145 00:12:31.039 --> 00:12:35.200 current, if you will, because it dies and rises again and dies again. 146 00:12:35.320 --> 00:12:45.600 So just like vegetation. So Pan is a satyr. He's half you 147 00:12:45.639 --> 00:12:52.039 know, man, half beast. So he is this archetype of the baphome 148 00:12:52.399 --> 00:12:58.159 and the alchemical man beast things. And also he's real and not real, 149 00:12:58.200 --> 00:13:01.159 and he's alive and dead at the same time, so he really embodies a 150 00:13:01.159 --> 00:13:09.080 lot of the alchemy. Right, Yes, I can't find Davith Hamilton's somewhere, 151 00:13:11.240 --> 00:13:13.639 right, it was right here, but I've got like forty books right 152 00:13:13.679 --> 00:13:16.320 here and it's I can't find it. I did a whole stream on it 153 00:13:16.320 --> 00:13:18.600 the other night, talking about Gemini, but it's a short passage and she 154 00:13:18.759 --> 00:13:24.360 basically mentions what you said, and it's about Pan, you know, related 155 00:13:24.399 --> 00:13:28.200 to nature, and the symbolism of like the goat, the goat feet. 156 00:13:28.919 --> 00:13:31.279 Oftentimes mytho, you know, mythological creatures are like this. They're like a 157 00:13:31.320 --> 00:13:35.879 combination of three different creatures, right, like the griffin, the griffin or 158 00:13:35.960 --> 00:13:41.639 the I don't know whatever, but but or the cerberus, right having three 159 00:13:41.639 --> 00:13:43.960 heads. But pan is a you know, has goat feet, and it 160 00:13:45.080 --> 00:13:50.679 like is is obviously sexual just right away looking at the at at him because 161 00:13:50.679 --> 00:13:56.440 of one particular thing. And that's also part of the theatrical nature of like 162 00:13:56.480 --> 00:14:01.960 the rituals and the bacchanal. What the horns are interesting, I mean that 163 00:14:03.000 --> 00:14:09.720 seems to be you know, obvious. But what about like what about his 164 00:14:09.759 --> 00:14:15.960 human his human form, his human parts? What you know, what is 165 00:14:15.960 --> 00:14:24.840 the your immediate take about his humanity? Yeah, I mean, is it 166 00:14:24.879 --> 00:14:26.960 just so that we can recognize that there is a human there and that's supposed 167 00:14:28.000 --> 00:14:31.000 to be something like there's a part of this god that is we recognize as 168 00:14:31.080 --> 00:14:37.279 like having some sort of human form, Yeah, or maybe the intelligence part. 169 00:14:39.600 --> 00:14:50.360 Maybe it could represent that because he he was getting popular as things were 170 00:14:50.399 --> 00:14:58.440 becoming more modern, so they were shifting into more like scientism instead of church 171 00:14:58.480 --> 00:15:05.879 in this time, I'm in the West, So I wonder if that's why 172 00:15:05.919 --> 00:15:11.559 he you know, the humanity part of him maybe because be like rationality intelligence. 173 00:15:13.480 --> 00:15:16.600 Well so, okay, so when you say, you know during this 174 00:15:16.639 --> 00:15:20.159 time, I mean are you are you saying like, is this specifically the 175 00:15:20.600 --> 00:15:26.200 you know, the eighteen hundreds into the twentieth century. Yeah. The earliest 176 00:15:26.519 --> 00:15:33.480 thing that I read this time it was about eighteen ninety. What is this 177 00:15:33.519 --> 00:15:43.399 one, Yeah, eighteen ninety So yeah, well, I was gonna say, 178 00:15:43.440 --> 00:15:48.799 I wonder that probably has something to do at least in Britain, like 179 00:15:48.960 --> 00:15:54.159 with the you know, the Enlightenment in the neoclassical era is you know, 180 00:15:54.240 --> 00:16:00.960 the strict reason strict it's an intellectual move and we get the you know, 181 00:16:00.039 --> 00:16:04.759 we get the French Revolution in continental Europe out of that, and then there 182 00:16:04.759 --> 00:16:10.639 are huge changes in Britain. But then we get the Romantic movement, like 183 00:16:10.879 --> 00:16:15.200 seventeen ninety eight to the beginning of the nineteenth century is a brief movement, 184 00:16:15.240 --> 00:16:18.799 but it's a you know, it's explosive and it's like a return to nature 185 00:16:18.960 --> 00:16:22.720 and this idea of like a utopia. There are a bunch of writers, 186 00:16:22.759 --> 00:16:30.600 even Samuel Taylor Coleridge went off and tried to form like these communes and and 187 00:16:30.759 --> 00:16:34.200 you know he called it a utopia. They wanted to form these these places 188 00:16:34.200 --> 00:16:40.720 away from society where they thought man could live in harmony with nature. Have 189 00:16:40.840 --> 00:16:45.000 you heard of the finn Torn people, the Fine Horn cult? No, 190 00:16:45.240 --> 00:16:52.240 what's like environmental nature call in Britain in the seventies and they have a lot 191 00:16:52.240 --> 00:17:00.559 of ties with like the u N and theosophy and the unders of that. 192 00:17:00.639 --> 00:17:07.160 Said that they made this place because of one talking vegetables there. There are 193 00:17:07.240 --> 00:17:11.200 vegetables in their garden. Talk to them and they had an encounter in the 194 00:17:11.200 --> 00:17:18.400 forest with pan. The tomatoes were crying man literally. So that's I talk 195 00:17:18.480 --> 00:17:22.400 about that in that a rock fan show I did about the Hidden Dangers, 196 00:17:22.440 --> 00:17:27.519 the Rainbow, the New Age movement. They're doing big things over there in 197 00:17:29.279 --> 00:17:32.880 America. Is this god? Chase Manson? And he said that the grass 198 00:17:33.039 --> 00:17:37.279 is crying, so you can't walk on the grass. Yeah, what was 199 00:17:37.039 --> 00:17:40.920 what was the name of the of the cult? Again, I don't know 200 00:17:40.920 --> 00:17:44.359 if it's finn Torn or Fine Torn, because I always thought it was Fine 201 00:17:44.400 --> 00:17:47.839 Torn, but some people have said it's f I N d h O R 202 00:17:47.920 --> 00:17:52.839 and Fine Horn. It's really a weird thing. We're gonna kill ourselves, 203 00:17:52.119 --> 00:17:59.440 fine Horn, because we lived for pangs Horn exactly. Yeah, I wouldn't 204 00:17:59.440 --> 00:18:03.480 be surprised. So not only that you have like Percy Shelley writing him of 205 00:18:03.599 --> 00:18:07.680 Pan Keats writing him Tupan, and these are written within a year of each 206 00:18:07.720 --> 00:18:17.960 other, so Pan really had his like peak in Victorian. And so it 207 00:18:18.119 --> 00:18:22.480 also goes along with orphans that we're gonna find, and that ties in with 208 00:18:22.519 --> 00:18:30.759 Peter Pan and Pans Labyrinth, so that we've got all of the street urchins 209 00:18:30.759 --> 00:18:33.519 you could ever want coming up in this in this show about Pans. So 210 00:18:34.319 --> 00:18:41.319 do you want to dive in start talking about old Jan Barry, the author 211 00:18:41.480 --> 00:18:45.599 of Peter Pan. Yes, what you first? You just mentioned Shelley and 212 00:18:45.680 --> 00:18:52.039 Keats and fine editions of Shelley and Keats here you know, both for the 213 00:18:52.039 --> 00:18:56.119 folks at home, as they say, if you know anything about Percy Shelley 214 00:18:56.640 --> 00:19:00.799 or John Keats, John Keats is a thing of beauty as a joy forever 215 00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:07.039 right. Keats died at twenty six of tuberculosis, and he lived with Shelley 216 00:19:07.160 --> 00:19:15.200 in Rome. Shelley died at thirty something. He drowned. Shelley was notable. 217 00:19:15.559 --> 00:19:22.839 His poems include Ozzi Mandius, which is the great poem about like humanity, 218 00:19:23.039 --> 00:19:26.680 the things that humans build pass away, right, they go into the 219 00:19:26.119 --> 00:19:33.160 sands of time. But he was he was notable because he was a outlandish 220 00:19:33.160 --> 00:19:37.640 sort of rebel figure at Cambridge and he wrote a treatise on atheism. He 221 00:19:37.119 --> 00:19:41.160 like was a proponent of atheism, and people kind of argue whether you know, 222 00:19:41.319 --> 00:19:47.039 this was a symbol of something else, but he was. I read 223 00:19:47.079 --> 00:19:49.279 a new biography of him, and like, everything that he writes is it's 224 00:19:49.319 --> 00:19:52.880 funny because he's one of these guys who like sees this sort of spirituality and 225 00:19:52.920 --> 00:19:57.799 then like as a proponent of societal atheism, which just says to me that 226 00:19:59.079 --> 00:20:03.480 he's into the accout Bolton, the esoteric, and he's against organized religion. 227 00:20:03.519 --> 00:20:07.200 Man. And he was, you know, of course he was in this 228 00:20:07.240 --> 00:20:12.920 privileged class and they they also were the people that like Shelley especially, he 229 00:20:12.960 --> 00:20:18.200 was hanging out with Byron and that's how they came up with Frankenstein, the 230 00:20:18.240 --> 00:20:22.519 idea of Frankenstein at that house in Switzerland. Anyway, moving on to Barry, 231 00:20:22.599 --> 00:20:26.519 What's interesting is that Barry comes at the tail end of the Victorian era. 232 00:20:26.559 --> 00:20:30.319 The Victorian era ends in nineteen o one with the death of Queen Victoria, 233 00:20:30.519 --> 00:20:37.279 and Victoria like dominated the nineteenth century in terms of her reign, her 234 00:20:37.279 --> 00:20:45.359 monarchy, colonialism. Even the monarchs of the other European nations were nephews of 235 00:20:45.799 --> 00:20:51.200 Queen Victoria. They all looked exactly the same. And when she died, 236 00:20:51.319 --> 00:20:55.519 and then we went into the you know, the Edwardian and then the modern 237 00:20:55.559 --> 00:21:00.599 era, the world sort of especially artistically, like really into it hard l 238 00:21:02.039 --> 00:21:07.440 the you know, industrialism just picked up in a huge way. And people 239 00:21:07.559 --> 00:21:11.799 like Barry who was friends with H. G. Wells, Robert Lewis Stevenson, 240 00:21:12.000 --> 00:21:15.880 a bunch of you know, known writers. He was in these sort 241 00:21:15.880 --> 00:21:22.079 of writers groups. What's interesting is that while he had correspondence with these guys 242 00:21:22.079 --> 00:21:22.799 and he hung out with him, and you know, H. G. 243 00:21:22.880 --> 00:21:30.079 Wells obviously did what he did and was prolific, Berry didn't really, you 244 00:21:30.119 --> 00:21:33.839 know, he didn't go into He wasn't a hugely well known prolific writer of 245 00:21:34.400 --> 00:21:41.160 a variety of different styles, and he wasn't a celebrity like Robert Lewis Stevenson 246 00:21:41.200 --> 00:21:48.359 became. Instead, you know, he wrote this play Peter Pan and then 247 00:21:48.720 --> 00:21:51.400 I don't think he serialized as he made it into a you know, into 248 00:21:51.400 --> 00:21:53.599 a novel, but it was hugely popular. You know, he wrote this 249 00:21:53.680 --> 00:21:57.599 one work and it was so big, it was so popular, and he 250 00:21:57.680 --> 00:22:03.920 was later he wasn't just night. I think he became a baronet. He 251 00:22:04.119 --> 00:22:07.680 played with when he was an adult. He hung out. He was hanging 252 00:22:07.680 --> 00:22:14.160 out somewhere and he played with the young future Elizabeth the second and her sister. 253 00:22:15.000 --> 00:22:22.839 Huh. He adopted this this family. They were called Llewellen, not 254 00:22:22.920 --> 00:22:26.440 Llewellyn Davis, Llewellyn Davies. I think the Davis family, you know, 255 00:22:26.519 --> 00:22:30.880 Welsh family, and he was very close to them. And obviously the correlation 256 00:22:30.920 --> 00:22:36.559 between Barry and the activities of Lewis Carroll is like they did almost the same 257 00:22:36.559 --> 00:22:41.920 thing, which is which is very weird and very you know, it's sucks, 258 00:22:42.319 --> 00:22:48.119 let's just say it. I mean, care behavior is like okay, 259 00:22:48.240 --> 00:22:55.079 like that's past whimsical into creepy, do you know what I mean? Yes, 260 00:22:55.200 --> 00:23:00.440 they're so so there's there's no like there's no you know, hardcore or 261 00:23:00.519 --> 00:23:06.480 in print evidence of anything, right, but I mean the context of the 262 00:23:07.559 --> 00:23:11.599 like hanging out is very weird. It's just very weird. I wonder what 263 00:23:11.680 --> 00:23:15.960 it like an FBI person would think of these writers or these profiles, or 264 00:23:17.039 --> 00:23:22.759 you know what I mean, Like our guy. They probably say, our 265 00:23:22.759 --> 00:23:26.319 guys doing really well. He's doing exactly what he's supposed to. It's like 266 00:23:26.440 --> 00:23:30.559 how many red flags is Lewis Carroll have and Jan Barry happened together? As 267 00:23:30.559 --> 00:23:40.440 so many? So yeah, he it does act like a grooming story. 268 00:23:40.680 --> 00:23:45.359 I mean the first book that Peter Pan, the character appeared in, was 269 00:23:47.599 --> 00:23:59.200 called what was it called the A Little White Bird? Right, So in 270 00:23:59.279 --> 00:24:03.920 A Little White Bird there's this character called Peter Pan who is a seven day 271 00:24:03.920 --> 00:24:07.039 old baby who flies around a park and comes out when people have gone home, 272 00:24:07.039 --> 00:24:11.640 and the magic takes over and the gates closed. So there's already this 273 00:24:17.160 --> 00:24:25.319 transition from daytime activities to night time activities in the park. And I'll in 274 00:24:25.480 --> 00:24:30.160 London, Kensington Gardens is where a lot of this stuff takes place, right, 275 00:24:30.359 --> 00:24:33.799 Yeah, do you know much about Kensington Garden? Oh, I've been 276 00:24:33.839 --> 00:24:37.279 in the air a couple of times, looked at the swans and looked around 277 00:24:41.359 --> 00:24:42.759 it. I mean, it's it's important in the life of London. It's 278 00:24:42.880 --> 00:24:51.160 you know, central London and there's a there's a there's an Ezra Pound poem 279 00:24:51.160 --> 00:24:56.680 about it. He says, uh, like a skein of loose silk blown 280 00:24:56.680 --> 00:24:59.960 against the wall. She walks beside the railing of a path in Kensington Gardens, 281 00:25:00.000 --> 00:25:03.160 and she's dying piece meal of a sort of emotional anemia. It's a 282 00:25:03.279 --> 00:25:06.960 it goes on, but it's a lyric poem about you know, a woman. 283 00:25:07.359 --> 00:25:11.880 There's it also mentions children. It says around about there's a rabble of 284 00:25:11.880 --> 00:25:15.000 the filthy, sturdy, unkillable infants, of the very poor. They shall 285 00:25:15.039 --> 00:25:21.599 inherit the earth. So I suppose even you know, later, there was 286 00:25:21.640 --> 00:25:25.839 the presence of like a you know, there was a clear dichotomy between rich 287 00:25:25.880 --> 00:25:30.519 and poor around there, which is which is interesting. I wonder if his 288 00:25:30.599 --> 00:25:36.720 story arose out of like the rate of infanticide, you know at the time. 289 00:25:38.480 --> 00:25:45.400 It must have. Well, we're talking about a time of the like 290 00:25:45.519 --> 00:25:51.559 industrial revolution, so there's a lot of orphans. There's a lot of early 291 00:25:51.720 --> 00:25:56.839 deaths, and some of these footage that you can see like on YouTube and 292 00:25:56.880 --> 00:26:00.839 TikTok, like the earliest cameras that they like turn the camera on and it's 293 00:26:00.880 --> 00:26:07.759 like recording the street Some of these they did in England are of the children 294 00:26:07.839 --> 00:26:12.559 and the children coming out of the factories that they were working at and they're 295 00:26:12.599 --> 00:26:17.559 just look like they're forty and they're you know, ten years old, but 296 00:26:17.720 --> 00:26:22.759 they're smoking cigarettes, they're brawling, they're dressed exactly like a mini adult wood 297 00:26:22.799 --> 00:26:26.359 with you know, they're not they don't look like children at all, and 298 00:26:26.440 --> 00:26:30.039 you can just see like the life was sucked out of them at this time 299 00:26:30.720 --> 00:26:40.079 in this place. That's what Blake's William Blake at that punt of Jerusalem. 300 00:26:40.079 --> 00:26:44.200 It's really famous. I think they read it at the Olympics. I mean 301 00:26:44.200 --> 00:26:47.759 they made the song about it. It's but it has that verse England's dark 302 00:26:47.839 --> 00:26:52.880 Satanic millsm So this is what's producing a lot of lost boys, right, 303 00:26:53.039 --> 00:26:59.799 lost boys and girls. But in Peter Pan it's a little bit different because 304 00:27:00.200 --> 00:27:06.599 Pan is the one that lures lost boys away from parents. So he doesn't 305 00:27:06.640 --> 00:27:11.880 go around collecting orphans. He snatches kids from homes. Yeah, he makes 306 00:27:11.880 --> 00:27:18.200 them. He makes them orphans, right I suppose. Yeah, or as 307 00:27:18.200 --> 00:27:22.400 you're gonna see, he'll betrays them and kills them. So but we'll get 308 00:27:22.440 --> 00:27:26.720 there in a second. So the Little White Bird the baby goes out the 309 00:27:26.720 --> 00:27:30.039 window and flies around Kensington Park and tries to come home, but notices that 310 00:27:30.079 --> 00:27:36.839 mom has locked the window and he can't get back in, and there's a 311 00:27:36.880 --> 00:27:41.960 new baby, so he's been replaced and so this, yeah, this is 312 00:27:41.960 --> 00:27:49.200 crazy. So this that's the last time you go flying cha. Yeah. 313 00:27:49.400 --> 00:27:55.680 So he wanted to call it the Boy who Hated Mothers, but they talked 314 00:27:55.720 --> 00:28:00.359 him out of it. And so this because this flying baby was cured to 315 00:28:00.440 --> 00:28:03.839 be orphan flying around Kensington Garden for the rest of his life. Right, 316 00:28:03.880 --> 00:28:08.519 who's gonna buy that one? You know? I mean, these Victorian things 317 00:28:08.519 --> 00:28:12.400 are so dark and it's funny because I have like Gallows sense of humor. 318 00:28:15.279 --> 00:28:19.079 It's too wordy. It needs to be a mother, mother hater or something, 319 00:28:19.200 --> 00:28:23.799 just one word, right, So they're like, no, hault, 320 00:28:25.559 --> 00:28:30.079 little white bird or whatever. So the Peter Pan gets taken out of that 321 00:28:30.160 --> 00:28:33.160 and made into kind of a different character, like grown up a little bit, 322 00:28:36.000 --> 00:28:38.119 and in the nineteen eleven comes out as Peter and Wendy, which is 323 00:28:38.119 --> 00:28:44.720 the book that you read, right, yes, yes, well well this 324 00:28:44.839 --> 00:28:48.000 one, I mean it's it's just titled Peter Pan, but it's about you 325 00:28:48.039 --> 00:28:52.799 know, it's it is about Peter and Wendy, and Wendy is as a 326 00:28:52.920 --> 00:28:55.799 nuanced character. Well, I know, we'll get to her, but she's 327 00:28:55.839 --> 00:28:59.400 an interesting The family is interesting, and it just you know, right away 328 00:28:59.440 --> 00:29:03.559 from the star Yeah, yeah, yeah, they're interesting because you know, 329 00:29:03.640 --> 00:29:07.640 different analyzes will will sort of, I think, misrepresent what the family is 330 00:29:07.680 --> 00:29:11.359 supposed to be at the beginning. People kind of confuse the status of the 331 00:29:11.440 --> 00:29:15.400 family at the start of the book, like, well, you know, 332 00:29:15.519 --> 00:29:18.000 some people will say, oh, this is a you know, they're not 333 00:29:18.079 --> 00:29:22.119 a well off family. In fact, they're dirt poor. They're very poor. 334 00:29:22.200 --> 00:29:25.839 And it's like, what, they're very poor. The mom and dad 335 00:29:25.839 --> 00:29:30.519 are together and they're going to a cocktail party, right right. I guess 336 00:29:30.559 --> 00:29:36.640 they get that because of Nana. Nana's a dog. Oh okay, right, 337 00:29:36.720 --> 00:29:37.359 so they're like, oh, well they're you know, they don't have 338 00:29:37.359 --> 00:29:41.519 a real nana. They got to use their dog as the nurse. So 339 00:29:41.559 --> 00:29:45.960 they're obviously very poor. But I think that's just a like a whimsical element 340 00:29:45.039 --> 00:29:48.680 that well, they were portrayed as poor in the Disney movie, were they 341 00:29:49.000 --> 00:29:56.720 No, they're they're they're well off. Yeah, this is so funny. 342 00:29:56.720 --> 00:29:59.880 I'm gonna tell you guys, like a cringe secret of my childhood, so 343 00:30:00.039 --> 00:30:04.359 like Peter Pan. If I ever had a crush or like, you know, 344 00:30:04.759 --> 00:30:10.920 an attraction to a fictional character as a child, it was Peter Pan. 345 00:30:11.039 --> 00:30:17.720 And especially that cartoon on Fox, Peter and Wendy. Do you remember 346 00:30:17.759 --> 00:30:19.440 that where he was a little more masculine, a little more grown up, 347 00:30:19.440 --> 00:30:22.480 a little more human. I was like, Okay, I like this kid. 348 00:30:23.039 --> 00:30:29.640 And I actually, when I was young, I remember sitting in church 349 00:30:29.680 --> 00:30:33.960 and like dozing off and imagining like Peter Pan would come in the window and 350 00:30:34.000 --> 00:30:37.720 like whisk me off on adventure and save me from like boring church or whatever. 351 00:30:37.759 --> 00:30:41.599 But I was like when I was really look young, right, So 352 00:30:41.960 --> 00:30:49.400 it's weird that this character has like a a draw on young girls. Especially 353 00:30:52.880 --> 00:30:56.920 I don't remember the show who played him in the show. It was a 354 00:30:56.000 --> 00:31:03.920 cartoon, so it was like an after school cartoon on Fox, and he 355 00:31:03.920 --> 00:31:07.799 he wore brown and he had brown hair. But I really love that show, 356 00:31:07.839 --> 00:31:11.000 and I always had, you know, an affinity for the character Peter 357 00:31:11.079 --> 00:31:14.559 Pan. And now as I'm growing up, I'm like, oh, this 358 00:31:14.640 --> 00:31:22.119 is on purpose, right. I don't think that's unusual. I think that's 359 00:31:22.160 --> 00:31:26.079 I think that's intentional as part of the story because for me, it's, 360 00:31:26.160 --> 00:31:33.160 you know, like the descriptions of Tinkerbell are are obviously I'm gonna read one 361 00:31:33.160 --> 00:31:37.240 when we get to it, but it's obviously like it's it's a sexualized description 362 00:31:37.319 --> 00:31:41.839 of her. Did you have you ever seen uh, you have seen Jordan 363 00:31:41.880 --> 00:31:48.279 Peterson's take on on Peter Pan. No, it's a it's a short uh 364 00:31:48.400 --> 00:31:52.039 you know, they called an essay. It's like seven minutes long, though, 365 00:31:52.079 --> 00:31:56.640 and it's funny because he's, you know, he's really vehement, and 366 00:31:56.720 --> 00:32:00.000 I wish I could do a good Jordan Peterson. But also the whole time 367 00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:01.559 he was talking, I kept thinking, Okay, his name should be Jordan 368 00:32:02.000 --> 00:32:12.240 Peter Panson or Jordan Peterson Pan, Jordan Peter Pan, Yeah, Jordan Jordan 369 00:32:12.519 --> 00:32:15.920 Peter Pan's son. Yeah, But he's like, why, you know, 370 00:32:16.880 --> 00:32:21.519 why would why would Peter Pan want to be a captain hook? I mean, 371 00:32:21.559 --> 00:32:27.200 look, he's he's got a hook, He's like, but he's really 372 00:32:27.240 --> 00:32:30.200 angry about it. And when he gets to talking about tinker Bell, he's 373 00:32:30.960 --> 00:32:35.200 he says some terms that are pretty spicy, but obviously this is the thing. 374 00:32:35.640 --> 00:32:38.039 And then also then you go further and you get into Tiger Lily, 375 00:32:39.200 --> 00:32:44.319 and Tiger Lily is even more so in the story. But I think that's 376 00:32:44.799 --> 00:32:46.000 the characters, for one, are at an age where I mean, like 377 00:32:46.039 --> 00:32:50.839 the kiss is you know, very innocent at the beginning, but you know, 378 00:32:50.960 --> 00:32:53.160 then there's a you know, one of the things is obviously that like 379 00:32:53.839 --> 00:32:59.839 Peter Pan won't grow up to have Wendy as his you know, romantic partner, 380 00:33:00.440 --> 00:33:02.119 because they can't grow up enough for that. And that's you have to 381 00:33:02.400 --> 00:33:08.000 understand that reading it probably not you know, very young readers, but that 382 00:33:08.119 --> 00:33:12.240 is that has to be a part of it. So that's not unusual that 383 00:33:12.319 --> 00:33:16.119 you pete Pan was sexy, Yeah, if that's the word for it. 384 00:33:16.160 --> 00:33:21.039 When you're that young to be watching cartoons. You know, I didn't like 385 00:33:21.160 --> 00:33:27.880 have weird fantasies, but I did want to go on adventures and like be 386 00:33:28.079 --> 00:33:32.039 his partner, right, and will come and we'll fly fallow far away. 387 00:33:34.079 --> 00:33:40.759 Yep, exactly. So that's super embarrassing. But he is described as being 388 00:33:40.799 --> 00:33:45.400 between a bird and a boy and an outfit mede of skeleton leads. So 389 00:33:45.519 --> 00:33:52.079 he's not human and he's not quite animal. He's something else, right, 390 00:33:52.240 --> 00:33:57.720 Yeah, Yeah, the shadow. The whole thing with the shadow, the 391 00:33:57.759 --> 00:34:00.759 reason, you know, the way that he enters the nursery in the first 392 00:34:00.759 --> 00:34:07.079 place, like chasing his shadow is is like it's it's I want to say 393 00:34:07.079 --> 00:34:10.199 original, but it's not original really because it's just the story of Psyche, 394 00:34:10.320 --> 00:34:15.280 right, it's the math of Psyche, which is the hidden God. Like, 395 00:34:15.320 --> 00:34:20.960 Okay, so I'm gonna tell you guys something esoteric. The ancients, 396 00:34:21.239 --> 00:34:28.360 uh saw. What they're trying to do is see through the veil of reality. 397 00:34:28.440 --> 00:34:31.480 It's like that would cut what's it called the Flammarion wood cut where he 398 00:34:32.039 --> 00:34:36.840 pierces the veil of reality and he sees the galaxy, the mundane world, 399 00:34:36.880 --> 00:34:39.760 and the stars. You know I'm talking about. I just know they want 400 00:34:39.760 --> 00:34:43.800 to break on through the other side. Yeah, exactly, That's what I'm 401 00:34:43.800 --> 00:34:52.679 talking about. So they called that seeing the god Pan. Really, yeah, 402 00:34:52.960 --> 00:34:54.639 that's a terrible first thing to see when you get to the other side. 403 00:34:54.679 --> 00:35:00.679 That's awful exactly. So he is a archetype also of the shadow of 404 00:35:00.719 --> 00:35:07.719 the unseen, of the subconscious, of the you know, spirit realm. 405 00:35:07.719 --> 00:35:15.199 So yeah, Peter Pan's shadow is a really esoteric element to this story. 406 00:35:15.800 --> 00:35:21.840 All right, good question in Egyptian lore when you you know, when they 407 00:35:22.599 --> 00:35:25.119 did that book American Gods, and there's a scene part of it is taken 408 00:35:25.119 --> 00:35:32.119 from mythology and when they die they confront. It's not said they first confront. 409 00:35:32.119 --> 00:35:35.679 Who do they first confront? Like when they're about to go, you 410 00:35:35.719 --> 00:35:37.960 know, they have to make the choice of like the three doors they go 411 00:35:37.000 --> 00:35:43.559 into, and there's so who would be down there? Neptees, Osyrus, 412 00:35:43.639 --> 00:35:47.000 and Nubis are in the underworld. Who else is it? Someone with horns? 413 00:35:47.760 --> 00:35:54.559 A Nubis has like pointy ears. Okay, okay, I don't know. 414 00:35:55.199 --> 00:36:00.519 I'm not an expert, but I have I do you know what these 415 00:36:00.800 --> 00:36:06.599 people are doing? Oh yeah, oh with the horns? Is that what 416 00:36:06.639 --> 00:36:08.679 you want to talk about? Yeah? I just you know, it's just 417 00:36:08.800 --> 00:36:14.119 interesting that in both of those they could front you know, this horned this 418 00:36:14.239 --> 00:36:20.360 horned the horned God. Yeah, the god of the witches also witches Sabbath, 419 00:36:20.400 --> 00:36:23.320 they worship the horned God. And that's the forest and pan all. 420 00:36:23.760 --> 00:36:31.320 He's all the universe. Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah, that's 421 00:36:31.559 --> 00:36:37.880 uh, he's home in esoteric philosophies. I don't know, folks. That 422 00:36:37.920 --> 00:36:40.880 gives me the creepy, crawling. It is creepy. It's so creepy and 423 00:36:40.960 --> 00:36:45.360 like the statues. I don't have my book at hand, but I have 424 00:36:45.440 --> 00:36:50.480 a picture in one of my books of a sculpture like a pan given it 425 00:36:50.519 --> 00:36:59.480 to a goat. It's super graphic, Like, yeah, interest to see 426 00:36:59.519 --> 00:37:07.400 it all. I saw a statue of him in I went to Pompeii on 427 00:37:07.480 --> 00:37:13.440 a on a school trip when I was fourteen, and I didn't know that. 428 00:37:13.480 --> 00:37:16.119 You know, Pompeii is you think it's just the you know, this 429 00:37:16.320 --> 00:37:22.039 this citty in ruins that they excavated. But it's it's just a giant you 430 00:37:22.079 --> 00:37:24.760 know, it's just a giant brothel. All the all the frescoes are like, 431 00:37:24.840 --> 00:37:29.440 you know, sex sexual stuff, which is interesting. We thought it 432 00:37:29.480 --> 00:37:32.679 was awesome when we were fourteen. But there's a but there's a there's a 433 00:37:32.719 --> 00:37:37.719 statue of pan Uh playing the pan pipe. But that's you know, I 434 00:37:37.719 --> 00:37:40.159 think most people when they think of pan they just think of this, you 435 00:37:40.199 --> 00:37:45.199 know, myth, like an innocent satier myth creature playing a pan pipe, 436 00:37:45.400 --> 00:37:50.199 you know, playing about in nature. But you just like Stafrolic, what 437 00:37:50.320 --> 00:37:59.079 is your problems? He just like it's cool and plays his flute, plays 438 00:37:59.119 --> 00:38:05.679 with mermaids and side. So there's some more esoteric clues. Uh, Capricorn, 439 00:38:05.760 --> 00:38:12.440 the goat is actually a seagoat and this is connected to Pan a sea 440 00:38:12.519 --> 00:38:17.079 goat. Yeah, he's like he's got like goatie fish legs. Oh man, 441 00:38:17.239 --> 00:38:27.679 that's even worse. Are sure? So you've got the mermaids in Peter 442 00:38:27.760 --> 00:38:37.760 Pan, right, and he is described as being innocent at the same time 443 00:38:37.800 --> 00:38:46.840 and cruel so because he he doesn't have a very good memory. And right. 444 00:38:46.880 --> 00:38:50.639 I know that when they did the they have the statue of Peter Pan 445 00:38:50.840 --> 00:38:53.960 in maybe some Kensingti gardens in London. There's a statue of Peter Pan. 446 00:38:54.119 --> 00:38:57.960 Yes, I bet you, yeah, I bet there is. Yeah, 447 00:38:58.000 --> 00:39:02.280 And and I know that Barry didn't like the statue because they wanted the statue 448 00:39:02.320 --> 00:39:08.199 to be made modeled on the child that he modeled Peter Pan on. That 449 00:39:08.320 --> 00:39:12.079 child grew up and became a dude who fought in World War One and he 450 00:39:12.159 --> 00:39:16.719 later jumped off a bridge. Yeah, it's a lot of sad like reality 451 00:39:16.760 --> 00:39:22.840 stories around this. You just imagined that that guy's whole life. People are 452 00:39:22.880 --> 00:39:27.840 like, yeah, peade Pan whatever whatever, Peadie Pan. Because you have 453 00:39:27.920 --> 00:39:31.960 to remember if these things were wildly popular, like everyone had read Charles Dickens, 454 00:39:32.079 --> 00:39:37.000 everyone had every child in England almost you know, had seen these plays. 455 00:39:40.400 --> 00:39:45.400 Well, speaking just one thing about Dickens, because I was you know, 456 00:39:45.920 --> 00:39:49.800 he kind of comes to mind with all this. And one of the 457 00:39:49.840 --> 00:39:53.480 differences between Dickens and this all of this you know, section of work, 458 00:39:53.519 --> 00:39:59.519 which is after Victoria, is that we have these sorts of characters in like 459 00:39:59.639 --> 00:40:04.079 especially Great Expectations, where you have a you know, a kid who's poor 460 00:40:04.320 --> 00:40:07.599 and then he has a benefactor who's a prisoner that he helped, but it's 461 00:40:07.599 --> 00:40:14.280 anonymous. So that's like a stark difference between Barry's life and this. You 462 00:40:14.320 --> 00:40:16.519 have a benefactor, he gives all this money, the kids educated, he 463 00:40:16.519 --> 00:40:19.679 goes off, you know, he becomes a gentleman, but the guy doesn't 464 00:40:19.719 --> 00:40:24.360 reveal himself, whereas this is like Barry's like, I love this family of 465 00:40:24.400 --> 00:40:28.119 fifteen kids. I'm going to take them. I'm gonna be with them all 466 00:40:28.199 --> 00:40:34.480 the time. Twenty four seven. Yeah, and the parents died of i 467 00:40:34.519 --> 00:40:37.400 mean young. It was just a weird story. And what we're talking about. 468 00:40:37.400 --> 00:40:42.079 They made a movie with Johnny Depp finding Numberland, and they like whitewashed 469 00:40:42.159 --> 00:40:46.880 the whole story and took all the creep out of it and put Johnny Depp 470 00:40:46.880 --> 00:40:50.280 in the roll. So now everyone loves Jan Barry and he's just a good 471 00:40:50.280 --> 00:40:53.440 philanthropist who took a shining on a family one day. But he had been 472 00:40:53.480 --> 00:40:58.679 stalking this little five year old in the park for a long time and like 473 00:40:58.719 --> 00:41:02.079 writing about him. But yeah, okay, so here's Capricorn. He goat 474 00:41:02.320 --> 00:41:13.800 can you see that? So we're talking about okay. So in his original 475 00:41:13.880 --> 00:41:17.039 notes. In Jan Berry's original notes, Peter Pian was the villain and he 476 00:41:17.119 --> 00:41:28.920 described him as a demon boy. So he's he's getting a kinder as he 477 00:41:29.000 --> 00:41:35.519 goes along. But in the beginning he was like a weird animal hybrid who's 478 00:41:35.559 --> 00:41:39.960 kind of a demon. And he took boys who wandered away from their parents 479 00:41:40.000 --> 00:41:44.719 and Kennington Park can convince them to come to Neverland where kids can do whatever 480 00:41:44.760 --> 00:41:52.559 they want. So he's a trickster, he's a he's a pagan asque, 481 00:41:52.599 --> 00:41:58.639 low key, you know, just playing little innocent tricks until the tricks become 482 00:41:58.920 --> 00:42:04.400 you know. He the pied piper right, yes, with the pan food. 483 00:42:05.039 --> 00:42:08.119 Good call, Yeah, a good call learning kids away and saying, 484 00:42:08.159 --> 00:42:12.519 hey, if we go to this place, like you know, there's no 485 00:42:12.679 --> 00:42:16.679 grown ups there, there's only enemies, pirates, you know, we can 486 00:42:16.679 --> 00:42:20.239 do whatever we want. It's pleasure Island. It's never Land. And it's 487 00:42:20.320 --> 00:42:25.920 like remember Michael Jackson, Yes, he was obsessed with Peter Pan and being 488 00:42:27.079 --> 00:42:32.920 never growing up, which is a philemic idea, the aon of Horace, 489 00:42:34.000 --> 00:42:39.239 the child, the immaturity, materialism, all of that. So and never 490 00:42:39.320 --> 00:42:45.440 landed all. It's also the spirit world, the dream world, the other 491 00:42:45.480 --> 00:42:52.960 world, never Land, like the nether the right, I guess, like 492 00:42:52.079 --> 00:42:57.559 crossing the river what leafy, the river of forgetfulness. I mean they do 493 00:42:57.639 --> 00:43:01.679 forget as soon as they fly. Yes, it's like they're flying. It's 494 00:43:01.719 --> 00:43:07.480 like this Crowley and you know, crossing the Abyss. They're actually projecting all 495 00:43:07.599 --> 00:43:20.119 right. Yeah, so you know, and he had been visiting Wendy before 496 00:43:20.320 --> 00:43:24.840 he lost his shadow there because he liked to hear the bedtime stories. So 497 00:43:25.360 --> 00:43:30.920 he's been creeping on her before she ever met him. She's a t I 498 00:43:30.920 --> 00:43:37.159 don't know, what's that? A target? Oh yeah, targeah yeah yeah, 499 00:43:37.039 --> 00:43:45.719 yep. And so he finally like hat they have their meeting, and 500 00:43:45.760 --> 00:43:51.320 he decides that he wants Wendy to come be his mother. Right, So 501 00:43:51.360 --> 00:43:55.559 he's already we've got some issues floating around, some very Freudian things going on 502 00:43:55.639 --> 00:44:00.760 in this. You think, oh, for sure, Yeah, psychology of 503 00:44:01.559 --> 00:44:06.440 Jane Barry. So she's a TI. And then by extension, the other 504 00:44:06.519 --> 00:44:13.039 kids become those they ask for project out the window, they cross the Abyss. 505 00:44:13.079 --> 00:44:15.639 They go flying with the boy, the boy who could fly, who's 506 00:44:15.719 --> 00:44:22.280 a shadow self psyche and skeleton clothes. Yeah, they go find They go 507 00:44:22.360 --> 00:44:30.119 to Neverland Ranch slash jeff Stein, every island right where the it's the place 508 00:44:30.159 --> 00:44:32.079 where you know, it's all kids and they don't grow up except for these 509 00:44:32.320 --> 00:44:37.480 like this whole horde of adults, which is weird, right, they're all 510 00:44:37.840 --> 00:44:47.760 Jimmy Buffett pirates. They're there's the there's the key for Sutherland Lost boys that 511 00:44:47.800 --> 00:44:52.440 are there. Yes, they're all in animal skins, shouting, bangering. 512 00:44:53.239 --> 00:44:57.880 That's right. And then and they talk about how you know, when it 513 00:44:57.880 --> 00:45:00.320 gets to be too many people. First of all, Peter will depop the 514 00:45:00.760 --> 00:45:05.880 you know, the island, and then that turns into every time he breathes, 515 00:45:06.679 --> 00:45:09.760 they say, a grown up will die in the real world, which 516 00:45:09.840 --> 00:45:15.719 is he starts breathing, how he starts panting when that happens, odd, 517 00:45:16.239 --> 00:45:22.360 right, Sometimes he even kills off his own guys. He does because it's 518 00:45:22.440 --> 00:45:28.400 all a it's all a dream to him. It's all a game to him, 519 00:45:29.400 --> 00:45:34.360 right, Peter Pan, Like, the psychology of this hero is pretty 520 00:45:34.440 --> 00:45:39.960 dark. Actually, he's what we're He's forgetful. He's cruel to the boys. 521 00:45:40.039 --> 00:45:45.239 He you know, like teases them with fake food when they're actually hungry. 522 00:45:45.519 --> 00:45:51.079 He's a very like, uh, he treats them more like captives really 523 00:45:51.360 --> 00:45:53.119 right, right, like a drill sergeant. You know, this is my 524 00:45:53.400 --> 00:46:00.760 regiment. And he brings Wendy to be their mother hungry from I'm hungry for 525 00:46:00.920 --> 00:46:06.960 Mashy Pease, just use your imagination. Pretend there's food. Well, you 526 00:46:06.960 --> 00:46:10.840 remember in that scene in Hook where they brought the food. They manifested all 527 00:46:10.880 --> 00:46:15.920 of the slop and the food. We'll get to that. That's one of 528 00:46:15.960 --> 00:46:20.039 my favorite scene is the food fighting Hook. I don't want to I want 529 00:46:20.039 --> 00:46:23.880 some. I'm hungry for meat cubes and slave slope and it's like, you 530 00:46:23.920 --> 00:46:31.039 know, multicolored ice cream slop. Yeah, like if whipped cream and plato 531 00:46:31.280 --> 00:46:37.800 were food. Okay, So now we're talking still about the book, The 532 00:46:37.920 --> 00:46:43.360 jam Berry Book that was a short story about a weird baby that became a 533 00:46:43.400 --> 00:46:46.199 play that now it's one of the most beloved children's stories of all time, 534 00:46:46.239 --> 00:46:57.360 recreated at nauseam and a classic of Walt Disney. Peter Pan my elementary school 535 00:46:57.519 --> 00:47:06.719 boyfriend. So he uh turns on the Lost Boys when they figure out that 536 00:47:07.280 --> 00:47:10.280 they actually do have a family. Right, So, when the Lost Boys 537 00:47:10.440 --> 00:47:14.320 get their consciousness back and they say, hey, what's been going on? 538 00:47:14.400 --> 00:47:25.079 I remember that you know I don't belong here, that it's over for them. 539 00:47:25.159 --> 00:47:30.559 Yeah. Meanwhile, well, when that happens, what about Michael, 540 00:47:31.320 --> 00:47:36.960 Alvin, Theodore and Wendy or whatever what? I don't remember what they think 541 00:47:37.079 --> 00:47:40.000 when that's going on with the Lost Boys. Oh, you know what it 542 00:47:40.039 --> 00:47:44.920 is. It's that Wendy keeps saying that, you know, our mother's gonna 543 00:47:45.000 --> 00:47:46.880 leave the window open, right, She's not going to forget us. The 544 00:47:46.920 --> 00:47:50.599 family will not forget us. They'll leave the window open. We'll be able 545 00:47:50.639 --> 00:47:52.239 to just return anytime. And then finally Peter's like, no, they won't. 546 00:47:53.800 --> 00:47:57.440 They'll forget about you. In fact, they've probably already forgotten about you, 547 00:47:57.480 --> 00:47:59.719 that's what happened to me. I laughed. And then a day later 548 00:47:59.800 --> 00:48:01.519 they shut the window and they said, you know, and they forgot about 549 00:48:01.559 --> 00:48:07.559 me. So I said something. A t R A F F I C 550 00:48:07.800 --> 00:48:14.119 q R would say, mm hm, isn't it? Yeah? It it 551 00:48:14.199 --> 00:48:17.239 reminds kept the end of that guy. I don't want to say his name 552 00:48:17.320 --> 00:48:23.920 on here. Ghanni Josh. Remember whatever happened to Ghanni Josh, the kid 553 00:48:23.960 --> 00:48:29.320 on the on the milk crate. I kept thinking of that during this thing, 554 00:48:29.400 --> 00:48:32.800 because it's essentially like, in fact, what's it he taking out a 555 00:48:32.800 --> 00:48:37.079 window? I think he was gone out a window and and one of those 556 00:48:37.079 --> 00:48:40.960 girls in the Caribbean went out the window, didn't she too? One of 557 00:48:40.960 --> 00:48:50.360 those There was a window file kidnappings. There was a window involved with what's 558 00:48:50.360 --> 00:48:52.559 her name? Made No, not Matt, that's it, that's it. 559 00:48:52.000 --> 00:48:55.239 Yeah, yeah, so there's a window with that. And then the the 560 00:48:55.679 --> 00:49:00.599 what's the beauty pageant? The girl, the little girl she wasn't taken, 561 00:49:00.639 --> 00:49:05.119 but she you know, they found her in the house, the little what's 562 00:49:05.159 --> 00:49:09.119 her name? O R M z se y. Yeah, yes, so 563 00:49:09.199 --> 00:49:12.760 they yeah, there was a window involved with that. They tried to say 564 00:49:12.760 --> 00:49:15.639 they tried to take her out the window. The movie Prisoners, I did 565 00:49:15.679 --> 00:49:22.639 that movie not too long ago and involved this, and like yeah movie, 566 00:49:22.840 --> 00:49:29.320 yeah, oh yeah dark. Yeah. So now we're getting somewhere with Peter 567 00:49:29.440 --> 00:49:37.320 plan and the epidemic of missing four on one children, because if you think 568 00:49:37.320 --> 00:49:44.840 about the numbers of missing children, it's kind of black pill to think about 569 00:49:45.119 --> 00:49:51.800 just hundreds of thousands with what in the heck? Yeah, I think I 570 00:49:51.800 --> 00:49:54.800 think the numbers are I mean, just the numbers that they you know, 571 00:49:54.840 --> 00:50:00.440 they estimate talking about Atlanta, a number that you know, end up either 572 00:50:00.519 --> 00:50:06.400 in Atlanta as uh street kids or they go through Atlanta is like it's like 573 00:50:06.440 --> 00:50:13.679 an unbelievable number. Actually, I knew one of my friends, uh was 574 00:50:13.840 --> 00:50:16.920 kind of you know, but when I was a kid, one of my 575 00:50:17.000 --> 00:50:22.159 friends, his mom, uh, someone tried to do this at their house 576 00:50:22.159 --> 00:50:25.400 and my best friend's house. And they had a two story house. You 577 00:50:25.400 --> 00:50:28.679 know, he had four brothers. They were all on the bottom floor, 578 00:50:28.719 --> 00:50:34.079 but his mom was upstairs and woke up like there was a dude like in 579 00:50:34.079 --> 00:50:37.599 in the room, and she jumped out the window, like second story. 580 00:50:37.679 --> 00:50:42.079 She just jumped right out the window and ran and ran into the neighbor's house 581 00:50:42.920 --> 00:50:45.360 and then you know, the cops got there or whatever, and he wasn't 582 00:50:45.360 --> 00:50:50.199 this dude one there? And then the next week, uh, their house 583 00:50:50.280 --> 00:50:53.760 burned down. Dude came back and burned the house down. Yeah, and 584 00:50:54.320 --> 00:51:00.559 they did catch the dude and he was you know whatever, it was on 585 00:51:00.639 --> 00:51:05.039 them, But don't be summoning pan. You can get all these hands out 586 00:51:05.039 --> 00:51:09.119 of your house, right and locked the damn windows. Jeers. So he 587 00:51:09.159 --> 00:51:16.840 takes them to a place that promises like a utopia of children, but it's 588 00:51:16.880 --> 00:51:24.719 actually a war zone, right, perpetual war zone between lost boys and pirates 589 00:51:24.760 --> 00:51:32.400 and other like beasts that are hostile. And you come to find out Peter 590 00:51:32.519 --> 00:51:38.400 started the war when he cut off Hook's hand, and he recruits child soldiers 591 00:51:38.480 --> 00:51:46.960 to fight these adult pirates. So he's like the best of Yeah, the 592 00:51:47.000 --> 00:51:50.960 beasts of no name, he recruits them. It is odd, I'm doing 593 00:51:50.960 --> 00:51:58.159 a Cony twenty twelve on them, right, And now they have to fight 594 00:51:58.199 --> 00:52:01.840 these pirates and if they were remember where they came from. Then Peter turns 595 00:52:01.880 --> 00:52:07.519 on them and kills them. And then yeah, which is very like monarch. 596 00:52:08.159 --> 00:52:13.880 Yeah, and there's this hypothesis that the pirates were the previous Lost Boys 597 00:52:14.360 --> 00:52:20.760 who grew up and escaped Peter. Right, Yeah, and so he tricked 598 00:52:20.760 --> 00:52:24.480 all these kids because he hates mothers because he was shut out in the beginning 599 00:52:27.280 --> 00:52:32.400 at seven days old, and when he grew up, he steals kids away 600 00:52:32.480 --> 00:52:39.199 from their family. This is really deep psychologically, Like I feel like I 601 00:52:39.280 --> 00:52:44.920 know what happened to jan Berry. Now in a way, what do you 602 00:52:44.920 --> 00:52:52.239 think? Well, I think that part of the reason it works is because 603 00:52:52.159 --> 00:52:57.039 it's complex and it's nuanced like this, and we can, you know, 604 00:52:57.079 --> 00:53:00.400 we can sort of try and parse out the symbolism in the book, and 605 00:53:00.440 --> 00:53:04.280 I think that I think it's valid all, you know, the interpretations of 606 00:53:04.320 --> 00:53:07.199 the book are valid's. But even the hook thing, you know, the 607 00:53:07.239 --> 00:53:10.519 thing about the pirates being the ex Lost Boys, you know, in a 608 00:53:10.559 --> 00:53:15.039 way it makes sense. I'm not sure in the end it makes sense or 609 00:53:15.079 --> 00:53:23.239 that they are the good guys because they also are trying to take the kids, 610 00:53:24.679 --> 00:53:30.280 so they're not trying to take them home. So right, that to 611 00:53:30.400 --> 00:53:32.760 come up in Oh no, we watched Pan We'll get to that, the 612 00:53:32.800 --> 00:53:42.920 one with huge as Man. So when Peter convinces Wendy to complain mother for 613 00:53:42.960 --> 00:53:47.280 all the lost boys, And I really also liked the character Wendy. When 614 00:53:47.360 --> 00:53:53.360 I was young, I wanted my name to be Wendy. And I believe 615 00:53:53.480 --> 00:53:58.880 this was the first that was a made up name for this story. Was 616 00:53:58.920 --> 00:54:01.079 it a name before that? I don't know. I heard that summer. 617 00:54:01.480 --> 00:54:08.719 Yeah, I haven't thought about that. So the character Wendy's interesting and her 618 00:54:08.800 --> 00:54:15.679 rivalry between herself and tinker Bell. So when she arrives to Neverland, she's 619 00:54:15.800 --> 00:54:22.400 almost shot down because tinker Bell gave a false command. Do you remember that, 620 00:54:22.960 --> 00:54:28.079 Yes, yes, tinker Belle immediately, Yeah, Tinkerbelle immediately does not 621 00:54:28.159 --> 00:54:32.159 like her. Yeah, And it's made obvious why you know, she's a 622 00:54:32.280 --> 00:54:40.559 she's a rival tink tinker Bell obviously loves Peter Pan. She's uh, you 623 00:54:40.559 --> 00:54:44.159 know, he goes into the nature of the Pixies, you know, in 624 00:54:44.199 --> 00:54:50.239 the sprites and how they come about, which is interesting. But also that 625 00:54:50.360 --> 00:54:53.519 she's called tinker Bell because she's a tinkerer, right, she she like fixes 626 00:54:53.519 --> 00:54:59.079 all the little things. And what do you think about her, I mean 627 00:54:59.119 --> 00:55:01.519 in terms of not skip like towards the end of it, you know what 628 00:55:01.639 --> 00:55:06.559 she does in the end, she knows she the idea of sacrifice or self 629 00:55:06.599 --> 00:55:12.679 sacrifice is obviously important in the book, and it's really the only way they're 630 00:55:12.679 --> 00:55:15.440 going to get out of the predicament they're in, whether it's out of the 631 00:55:15.519 --> 00:55:20.719 dream world or out of Neverland or what or whether Peter Pan will will you 632 00:55:20.760 --> 00:55:23.599 know, do something selfless, But Tinkerbell is the one who does that. 633 00:55:24.159 --> 00:55:32.480 M hm. So she's kind of a selfless one, the conscience of Peter 634 00:55:32.559 --> 00:55:39.800 Pan maybe the she's definitely his feminine counterpart. Yeah, and you know, 635 00:55:39.960 --> 00:55:45.880 she's physically small. She's like she's a light being. She's all light. 636 00:55:46.679 --> 00:55:51.519 And in fact, they discuss and there's a part in the book where they 637 00:55:51.679 --> 00:55:54.559 are they're flying and they are going to be spotted, i think by the 638 00:55:54.599 --> 00:56:01.000 pirates and they can sort of camouflage themselves, but they've got Tinkerbell and so 639 00:56:02.000 --> 00:56:06.280 they're like, just you know, just tell her to like damp in her 640 00:56:06.360 --> 00:56:08.079 light, and she can't do that, so she hides like in John's you 641 00:56:08.119 --> 00:56:12.559 know, top hat. But it's interesting, you know, she's a she's 642 00:56:12.559 --> 00:56:19.880 a being light man, but she you know, she's from this like other 643 00:56:20.039 --> 00:56:24.280 world kind of like Peter is. How would she have like a free will 644 00:56:24.400 --> 00:56:30.880 in terms of the like the paradigm within the story, right, But she 645 00:56:30.079 --> 00:56:35.920 ends up, you know, she ends up being the character who you know, 646 00:56:35.960 --> 00:56:38.440 it's as true love, right, she sacrifices herself for her love, 647 00:56:40.119 --> 00:56:44.480 whereas Wendy's love is totally different. Wendy's love is like a you know, 648 00:56:44.960 --> 00:56:47.440 a motherly love. She's a whole you know, she's and that's great. 649 00:56:47.440 --> 00:56:51.760 She's a wholesome character. She wants to sort of remain even keeled throughout the 650 00:56:51.800 --> 00:56:58.719 thing. The boy, the brothers don't really they don't really like change. 651 00:56:58.800 --> 00:57:00.880 They don't really like you know, their characters aren't really elevated. They don't 652 00:57:00.920 --> 00:57:07.440 really like learn anything over the passage of time. When you mentioned top Hat, 653 00:57:07.519 --> 00:57:10.920 I was like, I just remembered one of those was he wore that 654 00:57:12.079 --> 00:57:20.239 the entire time? That's Masonic? Yeah, that's remember the picture of Crowley 655 00:57:20.280 --> 00:57:30.880 as Winston Churchill top Yeah. So more esoteric elements in this. And then 656 00:57:31.599 --> 00:57:40.280 when they get home, Wendy has a generational pact with Peter. Right, 657 00:57:43.840 --> 00:57:49.360 you know, did she say she's that that's in the That's they used that 658 00:57:49.400 --> 00:57:52.360 in Hook in the in the film Hook, which is confusing, by the 659 00:57:52.360 --> 00:57:58.360 way, in that film because first of all, Robin Williams is Peter Pan, 660 00:57:58.679 --> 00:58:01.039 which is like, that's confus using right away. That's the reason I 661 00:58:01.199 --> 00:58:05.079 that's the reason I never liked the film. I just can't. I just 662 00:58:05.079 --> 00:58:12.039 did little shorts that did it for me. His little tattered shorts. That's 663 00:58:12.079 --> 00:58:16.480 so stupid. And then oh and then so then he's got a wife, 664 00:58:17.320 --> 00:58:22.719 and you're like, is this Wendy, right, But Wendy is the like 665 00:58:22.760 --> 00:58:25.760 the old lady who's Maggie Smith by the way, And it's like nineteen ninety 666 00:58:25.840 --> 00:58:30.559 one and she's been old for like seven hundred years in the middle, right, 667 00:58:30.159 --> 00:58:34.760 I know, like she looked exactly the same in Downtown Abbey as she 668 00:58:34.840 --> 00:58:37.760 did in Hook, which was like thirty years later. Like what the heck 669 00:58:39.000 --> 00:58:51.480 she was born? Like, Okay, So Peter comes back to snatch Wendy's 670 00:58:51.559 --> 00:58:53.840 daughter, and then when Wendy's daughter grows up, he comes back to snatch 671 00:58:54.920 --> 00:59:00.960 daughter daughter. So there's some generational messing around here, some curses. You 672 00:59:01.079 --> 00:59:06.159 got your Peter Pan demon on your family. You need to break those soul 673 00:59:06.239 --> 00:59:10.119 tithes. Right, We'll miss you, Pee Japan. Oh, I'll be 674 00:59:10.159 --> 00:59:15.079 back forever for all the generations of your family. Chasing my shadow it's like 675 00:59:15.360 --> 00:59:19.320 start DiCaprio, like, when they get too old, he has to go 676 00:59:19.360 --> 00:59:29.079 to the younger, right, she's aged out of Peter pan Adventure. Well, 677 00:59:29.119 --> 00:59:32.840 okay, I want to get to the movie, but we're having fun 678 00:59:32.880 --> 00:59:37.800 on the book still. Let's see. Well, so you want to hear 679 00:59:37.800 --> 00:59:43.039 a couple of things from the text. Yeah, well, I realized. 680 00:59:43.079 --> 00:59:47.239 First of all, I realized that where the character of Peter Pan you know, 681 00:59:47.320 --> 00:59:52.000 comes from, at least in a literary sense. And to me, 682 00:59:52.119 --> 00:59:59.599 he's an you know, he's a Barry takes cues from prior you know, 683 01:00:00.079 --> 01:00:02.840 right, characters in literature, and a couple of these that are big are 684 01:00:05.119 --> 01:00:09.480 Ariel in the Tempest and Shakespeare's Tempest. And Ariel is you know, if 685 01:00:09.480 --> 01:00:14.280 we're talking Disney, we think Ariel the Mermaid, but Ariel in the Temper 686 01:00:14.320 --> 01:00:22.519 I did a Tempest analysis. Ariel is a kind of androgynous sprite who Prospero 687 01:00:22.639 --> 01:00:28.440 the Wizard uses to you know, to drive the plot along. And he's 688 01:00:28.480 --> 01:00:31.280 a he's a spirit of the air. So he's just like Peter Pan. 689 01:00:32.920 --> 01:00:37.159 He's also kind of a trickster character. He you know, he does good 690 01:00:37.199 --> 01:00:44.079 and bad things within the context of the of the play. Also another one 691 01:00:44.360 --> 01:00:49.920 is, uh, there's the famous monologue by Marcucio in Romeo and Juliet, 692 01:00:50.079 --> 01:00:57.519 which I have, uh okay somewhere around here anyway, And it's the Queen 693 01:00:57.599 --> 01:01:01.760 Mab speech that Marcucio gives. He's talking to Romeo and he's he's before they 694 01:01:01.760 --> 01:01:07.039 go to the party, and he talks about Queen Mab who is rides her 695 01:01:07.719 --> 01:01:14.840 you know, her chariot, and in this he's Queen Mab has mentioned in 696 01:01:14.920 --> 01:01:21.360 the text see page seventy of this book. It says, this is the 697 01:01:21.360 --> 01:01:25.679 Peter Pan book. It says, no woman, however large, could have 698 01:01:25.719 --> 01:01:31.320 had a more exquisite boudoir and bed chamber combined. He's talking about he's talking 699 01:01:31.360 --> 01:01:37.639 about tinker Bells where tinker Bell lives in Netherland. It says. The couch, 700 01:01:37.719 --> 01:01:43.159 as she always called it, was a genuine Queen Mab with club legs, 701 01:01:43.320 --> 01:01:46.559 and she buried the bedspreads according to what fruit blossom was in season. 702 01:01:46.639 --> 01:01:51.440 Her mirror was a puss in boots, of which they are now only three 703 01:01:52.360 --> 01:01:57.760 unchipped known to the fairy dealers. The washstand was a piecrust and reversible. 704 01:01:57.800 --> 01:02:02.840 The chest of drawers and authentic Charming the sixth and the Carpet and the Rugs 705 01:02:02.920 --> 01:02:07.320 of the Best the early period of Marjorie and Robin. There was a chandelier 706 01:02:07.639 --> 01:02:12.360 from Tidally Winks for the look of the thing, but of course she lit 707 01:02:12.360 --> 01:02:15.440 the residence herself. In other words, they're sort of he's he's planning like 708 01:02:15.559 --> 01:02:22.039 famous names of you know, furniture like chippendales and stuff with kind of whimsical, 709 01:02:22.280 --> 01:02:29.199 mystical fairy names, and saying that like she's engaged in the in the 710 01:02:29.239 --> 01:02:32.079 commerce of like you know, fitting her apartment out kind of like a Marie 711 01:02:32.119 --> 01:02:36.840 Antoinette would do, right, But she's a little fairy. And of course 712 01:02:37.000 --> 01:02:40.360 the what was the other reference to Shakespeare in there, Oh, no, 713 01:02:40.559 --> 01:02:45.559 one Shakespeare. It was, uh, Cinderella. There's kind of Cinderella imagery 714 01:02:45.559 --> 01:02:51.280 in there, because of you know, the fairy godmothers who in you know, 715 01:02:51.360 --> 01:02:54.400 in the film, like turn into little sort of like beings, pixie 716 01:02:54.599 --> 01:03:02.480 pixie beings right when they're hovering around her. There's also when I'll read the 717 01:03:02.480 --> 01:03:06.360 description of Hook because this is interesting. He's kind of a he's like a 718 01:03:06.360 --> 01:03:12.239 byronic hero in this. He you know, he's dark and he's a well 719 01:03:12.320 --> 01:03:16.880 spoken, like handsome devil, and it says he's described as a dark jewel, 720 01:03:19.760 --> 01:03:22.360 which like is something left out of like films. It's only in the 721 01:03:22.400 --> 01:03:25.360 text that you get this, which is interesting. Do you want me to 722 01:03:25.400 --> 01:03:30.280 read it real quick? Just something? Yeah, it's I've wrote all over 723 01:03:30.320 --> 01:03:31.719 the text, so it's hard I'm going to get this. We were laughing 724 01:03:31.760 --> 01:03:37.320 about Dustin Hoffman as Hook and how like gross his close ups were of his 725 01:03:37.480 --> 01:03:39.400 like mustache and stuff. It kind of like gross me on when as a 726 01:03:39.480 --> 01:03:45.440 kid. So yeah, yeah, yeah, they shows Dusty moth Man right 727 01:03:45.519 --> 01:03:49.320 as Captain Hook, and he's not He's not byronic or you know, a 728 01:03:49.360 --> 01:03:53.679 handsome devil at all. You know, the Pan movie gets huge Jasmin, 729 01:03:53.760 --> 01:03:59.679 which is still not really accurate. They like take some sort of I don't 730 01:03:59.679 --> 01:04:01.800 know what, I don't know what they're doing with that. That was weird. 731 01:04:01.920 --> 01:04:04.480 Yeah, we'll get to it. Yeah, but he's you know, 732 01:04:04.519 --> 01:04:09.280 I kept thinking like he's modeled on Charles the Second and then sure enough I 733 01:04:09.320 --> 01:04:12.239 went back and I was reading the book and then he mentions him. He 734 01:04:12.280 --> 01:04:17.000 says, let's see, he was named James Hook, or as he wrote 735 01:04:17.119 --> 01:04:21.239 himself, Jazz Hook, of which it has said he was the only sing 736 01:04:23.000 --> 01:04:27.360 He was the only man that the seek the sea, the sea Cook feared. 737 01:04:27.400 --> 01:04:30.719 So I think he's kind of like Captain Cook, but he's Captain Hook, 738 01:04:30.800 --> 01:04:34.920 so he takes it from that. He laid ease in a rough chariot, 739 01:04:35.000 --> 01:04:38.840 drawn and propelled by his men, and instead of a right hand he 740 01:04:38.920 --> 01:04:43.480 had the iron hook, with which ever and anon he encouraged them to increase 741 01:04:43.519 --> 01:04:47.400 their pace. As dogs, this terrible man treated and addressed them, and 742 01:04:47.440 --> 01:04:51.320 as dogs they obeyed him. It's a person. He was a cadaverous and 743 01:04:51.760 --> 01:04:56.760 black of vice. That his hair was dressed in long curls, which at 744 01:04:56.760 --> 01:05:00.280 a little distance looked like black candles, and gave a singularly threatening expression to 745 01:05:00.400 --> 01:05:06.760 his handsome countenance. His eyes were of the blue of the forget me not, 746 01:05:06.960 --> 01:05:14.519 and of a profound melancholy. An interesting detail save when he was plunging 747 01:05:14.599 --> 01:05:18.480 his hook into you, at which time two red spots appeared in them, 748 01:05:18.519 --> 01:05:23.400 and lift them horribly. Skipping a little bit, it says he was a 749 01:05:23.519 --> 01:05:28.480 raconteur of repute. He was never more sinister than when he was most polite, 750 01:05:29.039 --> 01:05:31.360 which is probably the truest test of breeding. And the elegance of his 751 01:05:31.400 --> 01:05:35.079 addiction, even when he was swearing, no less than the distinction of his 752 01:05:35.119 --> 01:05:42.119 demeanor showed him one of a different cast from his crew. And then finally, 753 01:05:43.840 --> 01:05:47.159 let's see the name of Charles the Second, having heard it said in 754 01:05:47.199 --> 01:05:50.400 summer earlier period of his career that he bore a strange resemblance to the ill 755 01:05:50.519 --> 01:05:56.960 fated Stuarts. So he's a handsome devil. He looks like Charles the Second. 756 01:05:57.480 --> 01:06:00.440 You know Charles the Second for the folks at home. Charles the Second 757 01:06:00.559 --> 01:06:08.880 was the monarch who in the sixteen sixties returned to England to restore the monarchy 758 01:06:08.960 --> 01:06:14.280 after the protect the period of the Protectorate which was the Puritans and and Cromwell 759 01:06:14.320 --> 01:06:18.800 and was known as the Restoration. He was a foppish character of these what 760 01:06:18.880 --> 01:06:24.519 is that? Yes, so there's John Depp as the Earl of Woman and 761 01:06:24.519 --> 01:06:29.800 then John Malcatraz as Charles the Second. And that's from the film The Libertine, 762 01:06:29.800 --> 01:06:32.400 which is a pretty oh right, because that's what Pan is about. 763 01:06:32.719 --> 01:06:39.519 Liberty, right, that's his thing. So okay, yeah, you've got 764 01:06:39.599 --> 01:06:48.079 the age of would you foppish dandies, the rufflies and the curl wigs, 765 01:06:48.480 --> 01:06:56.719 and what else they got sleeves little like ruffle sleeves, buttons sleeves, you 766 01:06:56.760 --> 01:07:03.559 know, have a French influence. I don't mind, like three Musketeers look 767 01:07:03.639 --> 01:07:12.400 on guys. It can be okay, it can be masculine and artistic at 768 01:07:12.400 --> 01:07:15.239 the same time. Like I don't hate it. But the curly wigs, 769 01:07:15.239 --> 01:07:26.039 I think that's going a little far weird costume to have. Why do you 770 01:07:26.119 --> 01:07:30.079 want to grow up? I'm gonna hook for a I mean, he's gotta 771 01:07:30.639 --> 01:07:32.760 right so he's got his left hand, he's got the left hand path, 772 01:07:32.800 --> 01:07:41.039 but he's got his right hook hand. Yeah, okay. And also the 773 01:07:41.159 --> 01:07:45.960 black the blue eyes which get red dots in them, like when he's hooking 774 01:07:46.000 --> 01:07:49.960 someone, the red dots of blood. That's a weird, yeah, weird 775 01:07:50.039 --> 01:07:56.760 detail. But yeah, you know, he's a he's surrounded by you know, 776 01:07:56.760 --> 01:07:59.480 he's surrounded by decadence that you know, they continuually talk about, like 777 01:07:59.519 --> 01:08:02.360 the pearl and the jewels and the diamonds that the that the pirates have. 778 01:08:02.519 --> 01:08:06.719 But of course the pirates are all like straight up pirates. And he's a 779 01:08:08.559 --> 01:08:13.760 Oh one other thing is he he was blackbeards like right hand man, but 780 01:08:13.800 --> 01:08:17.720 then he ends up worse than black Beard. Oh okay, and black Peard 781 01:08:17.760 --> 01:08:21.760 will come up later in pant the pan the movie, right, the live 782 01:08:21.800 --> 01:08:30.560 action movie. So this book, all right, I heard that Jan Barry 783 01:08:32.520 --> 01:08:38.479 had this obsession with boyhood and okay, put that on pause because am I 784 01:08:38.520 --> 01:08:43.039 going crazy? Or were you wearing a white hat before? Like did you 785 01:08:43.079 --> 01:08:51.000 switch hat? Oh? Okay, all right? I was like, well 786 01:08:51.000 --> 01:08:55.319 wait till I put on my Charles the second wig. Then you're really how 787 01:08:55.319 --> 01:08:58.800 many hats is you switching? And because sometimes you have glasses on and sometimes 788 01:08:58.840 --> 01:09:01.520 you don't, and I like, I thought you have a different I know, 789 01:09:01.600 --> 01:09:05.199 I'm not. I'm not trying to drive anybody's like schizophrenia crazy. That's 790 01:09:05.359 --> 01:09:10.159 gonna watch this later. I'm just trying to I try and change my look 791 01:09:10.199 --> 01:09:15.479 every five seconds on perfect No, I'm just it's funny. Like the next 792 01:09:15.479 --> 01:09:20.239 time I was okay, what was I saying? Oh? Yeah, my 793 01:09:20.800 --> 01:09:27.880 odd, I just can't stay still. He well, he had a tragedy 794 01:09:28.359 --> 01:09:34.239 that his brother died at age thirteen, and that brother was his mom's favorite, 795 01:09:34.439 --> 01:09:40.119 and her like comfort she would say was that the boy would remain a 796 01:09:40.159 --> 01:09:44.319 boy forever. So he kind of got that stuck in his psyche somehow, 797 01:09:45.800 --> 01:09:49.000 And then when he grew up he became this like we were saying before Uncle 798 01:09:49.279 --> 01:09:56.800 Jim. They called him to the Daidis family and he would write these weird, 799 01:09:57.000 --> 01:10:00.640 crushed, questionable letters to the kids, like I really fancy you, 800 01:10:00.720 --> 01:10:05.479 but don't tell anyone, like straight up, you know that's not appropriate. 801 01:10:05.560 --> 01:10:12.800 What do you think? I think that's total creeper material the letter, the 802 01:10:12.880 --> 01:10:16.640 letters in the first places. You know, the letters should be like, 803 01:10:17.880 --> 01:10:21.560 you know, I went on an adventure and it was great, and you 804 01:10:21.600 --> 01:10:28.119 know, here's a postcard. Well why why is a grown man writing letters 805 01:10:28.159 --> 01:10:31.039 to young kids? Don't even try and tell me it was a different time, 806 01:10:31.279 --> 01:10:38.479 because no, no, that's not so. Then there was also questions 807 01:10:38.520 --> 01:10:44.760 about the custody when both the parents died, so you had an intact family 808 01:10:45.000 --> 01:10:51.359 until this guy came along and suddenly he inherits like five kids, right is 809 01:10:51.399 --> 01:10:56.880 that or how many? It was a bunch of them, yeah, and 810 01:10:57.159 --> 01:11:02.399 the five year old George was the one that he liked the most. And 811 01:11:02.479 --> 01:11:12.239 there's this whole like controversy did he change the will to make him be the 812 01:11:12.279 --> 01:11:15.560 one who had custody of the kids because he was like the proprietor of the 813 01:11:15.560 --> 01:11:20.319 will. But it could have said something like to a girl's name, and 814 01:11:20.359 --> 01:11:24.399 he could have changed it. I don't know. I just watched this like 815 01:11:24.439 --> 01:11:29.079 documentary on YouTube about jam Barry, So there's a lot of questions that keep 816 01:11:29.119 --> 01:11:36.239 popping up about his like character and after the fact, and like after how 817 01:11:36.319 --> 01:11:41.319 you see how our lives turned out. You could see that they're very troubled 818 01:11:41.399 --> 01:11:46.239 people. I mean, did you have any familial, you know, ties 819 01:11:46.279 --> 01:11:49.239 with this family at all, like any blood ties. No. I think 820 01:11:49.279 --> 01:11:53.319 the story was he just met them in the park one day or something like 821 01:11:53.359 --> 01:11:57.000 that. I don't. Oh, boy, that's even worse. So and 822 01:11:57.520 --> 01:12:00.920 we were talking about the park and what happens in the parks at night. 823 01:12:01.880 --> 01:12:09.199 And then this book comes out, which is about a guy trying to get 824 01:12:09.279 --> 01:12:13.239 favor of a young kid by telling them stories. And this is just like 825 01:12:13.680 --> 01:12:19.039 the more you hear about it, the worst it gets. Yeah, it's 826 01:12:21.920 --> 01:12:27.359 I don't know what I've always I can't ever read about Carol because of this, 827 01:12:27.399 --> 01:12:30.680 because you know, his thing was like photographs or whatever, right, 828 01:12:30.079 --> 01:12:35.399 And I've never I've never liked als in Wonderland and they would put anybody in 829 01:12:35.560 --> 01:12:41.359 jail over that today, Like just because it's in Sepia and it was way 830 01:12:41.359 --> 01:12:46.199 back when, it doesn't make it not what it was. Yeah, I 831 01:12:46.199 --> 01:12:51.520 mean, I've never liked Jabberwalukee. I've never liked als in Wonderland of it. 832 01:12:51.640 --> 01:12:56.520 You know. The nonsensical nature of like Carol stuff is is just like 833 01:12:56.600 --> 01:13:02.520 outright weird, and I've never liked it. Honestly, I've never paid I've 834 01:13:02.560 --> 01:13:06.119 never paid attention to Jane Barry's life before. I've never looked, you know, 835 01:13:06.239 --> 01:13:15.199 looked into his life. But it's it's definitely oh and then it's good. 836 01:13:15.720 --> 01:13:19.720 So the boy that played Peter Pan in the Walt Disney cartoon, Bobby 837 01:13:19.720 --> 01:13:26.399 Triscoll, he had a very tragic time too, and there was some scandals 838 01:13:26.439 --> 01:13:30.520 that you can read about in that book Hollywood Babylon by Kenneth Inger. Yeah, 839 01:13:30.520 --> 01:13:32.279 I've got that. So there's it's either I don't know if it's in 840 01:13:32.319 --> 01:13:36.000 part one or two, but there's a chapter about Bobby Triscoll in Walt Disney 841 01:13:36.119 --> 01:13:41.920 and lots of rumors about that. And he was like, you know, 842 01:13:41.960 --> 01:13:47.600 the first child, uh star in the first cautionary tale of like how the 843 01:13:47.680 --> 01:13:51.600 industry treats children and choose him up and spits them out, and you know 844 01:13:51.640 --> 01:14:00.399 he like died Penny Listen unclaimed after a lot of tragedies in his life. 845 01:14:00.439 --> 01:14:04.680 So this Pan character, in this Peter Pan especially has a lot of dark 846 01:14:04.720 --> 01:14:13.279 stuff around it. The kid who played Heartful Dodger in The Oliver Twist nineteen 847 01:14:14.079 --> 01:14:16.640 one, it was it was best picture of think nineteen sixty eight. The 848 01:14:16.760 --> 01:14:21.800 kid played artful Dodger. He also had a it was bad for him as 849 01:14:21.800 --> 01:14:26.640 well. Kenneth Anger was he went a child's star, but didn't he start 850 01:14:26.640 --> 01:14:32.760 off as a child actor himself? He was in I think he was in 851 01:14:32.800 --> 01:14:36.960 Midsummer Night's Dream or was he? Well, well, the Fairy King and 852 01:14:38.039 --> 01:14:43.840 the staters and stuff in that Oberon And uh yeah, that's the other one 853 01:14:43.880 --> 01:14:47.720 that that that's a good call that Peter Pan is similar to the Puck Puck 854 01:14:47.840 --> 01:14:55.800 exactly. He was also a trickster. So before we move on to movies, 855 01:14:55.880 --> 01:15:00.319 I like this combination of like books and movies and movies that were books. 856 01:15:00.439 --> 01:15:04.600 So is there anything else you want to say about the actual book Peter 857 01:15:04.680 --> 01:15:08.760 Pan. Well, I'm gonna go back into it like as we go, 858 01:15:08.840 --> 01:15:11.640 because there's some more. There's some more interesting things that are you know, 859 01:15:11.680 --> 01:15:15.439 revelatory as we go, just some some of the passages and the language of 860 01:15:15.479 --> 01:15:18.720 them. Uh, but you know that they'll they'll, I'm sure they'll come 861 01:15:18.760 --> 01:15:24.520 up organically. Okay, as we do this, let's talk about the twenty 862 01:15:24.520 --> 01:15:28.840 fifteen movie Pan first, and then what do hook And then we're gonna have 863 01:15:28.960 --> 01:15:33.000 to do part two next week where we cover the god Pan and Pan's Labyrinth 864 01:15:33.039 --> 01:15:38.399 and like more Pan, more Peter Pinion probably too. There's so much there's 865 01:15:38.680 --> 01:15:42.399 there's so much material with this, Yeah, I mean, it's such a 866 01:15:42.560 --> 01:15:47.319 it's it's interesting that you know, Jay and I did Wizard of Oz and 867 01:15:47.359 --> 01:15:55.119 it sort of fits into the same milieu, but there's they're both super famous, 868 01:15:55.159 --> 01:15:58.640 and this one is like the there's so many very i mean just the 869 01:15:58.720 --> 01:16:01.159 movies alone. The number of remakes of the movie that you know, you 870 01:16:01.159 --> 01:16:06.239 mentioned that earlier. It's crazy and you were like, do you remember the 871 01:16:06.279 --> 01:16:11.119 live action play? And I was laughing because it was androgynous. It was 872 01:16:11.479 --> 01:16:15.560 a woman playing a little boy, right, yes, And I always thought, 873 01:16:15.600 --> 01:16:18.479 I'm like, that's a little too fruity even for like a girl. 874 01:16:18.800 --> 01:16:23.159 That's just I don't know, it's over the top silly. What do you 875 01:16:23.199 --> 01:16:29.520 think? Yeah, I mean I thought that. I thought that in kindergarten 876 01:16:29.560 --> 01:16:32.239 when they made it, was like a badass adventurer that fought pirate's not a 877 01:16:32.399 --> 01:16:34.560 woman, right. I was like, dude, I mean, you know, 878 01:16:34.560 --> 01:16:38.119 I want to be Peter Pan in this play because I'm gonna get to 879 01:16:38.159 --> 01:16:41.239 fly, you know, when I get a sword and I get like this 880 01:16:41.359 --> 01:16:44.399 cool hat and stuff. And then they showed us the movie and I'm like, 881 01:16:44.600 --> 01:16:45.600 why are they show of all them? Why did they just show us 882 01:16:45.640 --> 01:16:51.439 the animated movie instead of this this lady. It's like grown lady playing Peter 883 01:16:51.479 --> 01:16:55.119 but she's clearly a lady, which is weird. Yeah, I know. 884 01:16:56.199 --> 01:16:59.960 And then and then in Hook, you know, Julia Roberts says Tinker Belle, 885 01:17:00.079 --> 01:17:05.479 It's like, what, even that's kind of weird. Yeah. I 886 01:17:05.520 --> 01:17:11.640 always thought like, why are they using a grown lady to be But okay, 887 01:17:11.640 --> 01:17:14.119 so that movie was just so weird anyway, But I guess if they 888 01:17:14.119 --> 01:17:16.119 did the opposite it would also be weird. So no matter how they do 889 01:17:16.159 --> 01:17:20.119 it, you know, just keep in a book. Just maybe don't creep 890 01:17:20.119 --> 01:17:25.439 on kids and write it in books. Right at this off at the root, 891 01:17:25.640 --> 01:17:30.000 all right, let's talk about Pan twenty fifteen. Probably not a lot 892 01:17:30.000 --> 01:17:31.640 of you have seen this because it was kind of a flop. I think 893 01:17:32.079 --> 01:17:40.640 it was a Warner Brothers. It was not awesome overall as a movie. 894 01:17:40.680 --> 01:17:45.800 I had fun watching it for this show. But it starts off in Kensington 895 01:17:45.840 --> 01:17:51.359 Gardens, right, and at the Lambeth Home for Boys where Peter is dropped 896 01:17:51.359 --> 01:17:57.720 off. And what is the axiom of orphans is that they still have parents 897 01:17:57.720 --> 01:18:00.840 that love them out there somewhere, and for some splitical reason they are there 898 01:18:00.880 --> 01:18:08.960 at the orphanage. And so it's very formulaic. The it's also awful like 899 01:18:09.159 --> 01:18:16.680 it it is, absolutely it's hellish. It's so bad. The auction teams 900 01:18:16.720 --> 01:18:24.479 were very drawn out. And yeah, so they drop off baby Peter and 901 01:18:24.479 --> 01:18:29.039 they given him his little pan pipes as his totem that he's you know, 902 01:18:29.359 --> 01:18:38.640 somebody loves him, right, And here you have the Victorians and their orphans, 903 01:18:38.920 --> 01:18:41.680 And did you did you have anything like that when you were a kid, 904 01:18:41.800 --> 01:18:45.319 like a little an instrument? What do you mean, like, like, 905 01:18:45.359 --> 01:18:49.000 I feel like little kids sometimes get like a little like you were saying 906 01:18:49.079 --> 01:18:53.920 that the totum, like they get like a little there's something that they play 907 01:18:53.960 --> 01:18:58.720 with. It's unusual. Like I had a harmonica. I still remember it. 908 01:18:58.760 --> 01:19:00.279 I was like two and I had like a giant harmonica and I would 909 01:19:00.319 --> 01:19:04.520 just play it, like play the harmonica all day long, like drooling out 910 01:19:04.520 --> 01:19:08.439 of this harmonica. And he's got a pan pipe. You didn't have a 911 01:19:09.560 --> 01:19:14.199 I did have. Okay. So those little plastic recorders that just have like 912 01:19:14.359 --> 01:19:16.359 one octave on them, I play on that all the time, you know 913 01:19:16.359 --> 01:19:23.239 what I'm talking about. And those bells that they they're just like a box 914 01:19:23.279 --> 01:19:27.640 of metal with a rubber being, but they're toned like different sizes and you're 915 01:19:27.640 --> 01:19:30.560 like, yeah, pong and you pick up the others bong bong. Remember 916 01:19:30.600 --> 01:19:32.399 those. This was a very young kid. Yeah, I had a little 917 01:19:32.399 --> 01:19:36.479 recorder and I had those bells. I think the recorder is like the most 918 01:19:36.520 --> 01:19:41.840 torturous instrument to like teach little kids to play, because you know, the 919 01:19:41.880 --> 01:19:44.920 parents every like for generations, the parents are like, oh, it's so 920 01:19:44.960 --> 01:19:47.039 wonderful, it's beautiful. You learn how to play hot cross buns on it, 921 01:19:47.079 --> 01:19:50.279 and it's always terrible, but I know, but it's so fun for 922 01:19:50.319 --> 01:19:54.399 a kid, and you feel like literally like I'm Beethoven. With this, 923 01:19:54.520 --> 01:19:59.319 like you like, I am a classical Uh. When you got a recorder 924 01:19:59.359 --> 01:20:03.119 in your backpack, man, that's like you're a renaissance kid, right, 925 01:20:03.239 --> 01:20:06.560 Yeah, and you're learning tones, you know you're learning. I'm sure there's 926 01:20:06.720 --> 01:20:13.880 there's something about it. I don't know, Okay. So, yeah, 927 01:20:13.960 --> 01:20:19.600 I was not an orphan, so I didn't have any like gifts bestowed upon 928 01:20:19.680 --> 01:20:26.000 me. I had good parents because I did not grow up in London in 929 01:20:26.000 --> 01:20:31.079 World War two. So this actually is taking place in what nineteen forty five 930 01:20:31.359 --> 01:20:36.800 or forty four, But it looks like Victorian England, it does. It 931 01:20:36.800 --> 01:20:40.399 looks like Victorian England, but it is. I think you're right. It's 932 01:20:40.479 --> 01:20:48.119 during the Blitz. Yeah, and the nuns are over the top, mean, 933 01:20:48.760 --> 01:20:56.000 abusive, fat, greedy, all of the things religion is, you 934 01:20:56.039 --> 01:21:01.920 know, always portrayed as hypocrites. Yeah, the nuns. It reminded me 935 01:21:01.960 --> 01:21:08.960 of the story that came out a few years ago about the what's the the 936 01:21:09.439 --> 01:21:14.439 Irish Orphanage. I don't forget the name of it. There's an Irish orphanage 937 01:21:14.439 --> 01:21:23.760 where they found like tons of they found a lot of evidence of disappeared people 938 01:21:24.439 --> 01:21:27.840 on the grounds of the orphanage and that there are all these stories about the 939 01:21:27.880 --> 01:21:30.760 nuns that were exactly like this in the movie. So that's one thing is 940 01:21:30.760 --> 01:21:33.680 that you're watching the movie and you're like, these these nuns are absolutely terrible. 941 01:21:33.680 --> 01:21:38.279 This is awful. But then you're like, oh, no, it's 942 01:21:38.319 --> 01:21:42.359 probably true to life. Now. If that's the case, then what happens 943 01:21:42.399 --> 01:21:47.079 to them is it takes on a different it's a different element because it's like 944 01:21:47.199 --> 01:21:54.279 thenms like this monarch ye, psychic mind split that happens. Yeah, and 945 01:21:54.399 --> 01:22:00.880 that's why Wizard of Oz, h Alison Wonderland and Peter pan I would say, 946 01:22:00.960 --> 01:22:08.000 are like the top three, you know, programming scripts, four kids, 947 01:22:08.680 --> 01:22:13.279 and so yeah, you definitely have this like monarch element because it's World 948 01:22:13.319 --> 01:22:18.000 War two and they even call her a dirty old nun and she's hiding food. 949 01:22:18.039 --> 01:22:24.159 Remember she's a dead de old nun. And because she's hiding food from 950 01:22:24.159 --> 01:22:32.600 the kids, she's hoarding, she is beating them. And then they fly 951 01:22:32.800 --> 01:22:39.560 the Jolly Roger flag late at night and the pirates come and kidnapped the kids. 952 01:22:39.800 --> 01:22:45.319 So this is getting weird. So they fly the Yale flag at night 953 01:22:45.439 --> 01:22:50.199 and they fly the skull Bones and summon the pirates and the pirates come and 954 01:22:50.239 --> 01:22:54.840 kidnapped the kids, so there's less Moustafie. It's you know, I also 955 01:22:54.920 --> 01:22:59.920 thought of it's the same story at the beginning of this film as what happens 956 01:23:00.079 --> 01:23:04.079 the beginning of The Saint with val killing it. Remember Simon Templar with the 957 01:23:04.119 --> 01:23:08.319 food and everything. They lock up all the food and Simon Temple it's a 958 01:23:08.399 --> 01:23:11.239 kid, you know, the child version of Simon Templar. And he puts 959 01:23:11.239 --> 01:23:15.439 on the Templar flag, picks the lock, liberates the food, feeds the 960 01:23:15.479 --> 01:23:19.199 children, and then the girl. I think that's when the girl like falls 961 01:23:19.279 --> 01:23:24.279 and dies. Yeah, And so he's a liberator like you just said, 962 01:23:24.359 --> 01:23:26.960 and we'll see at the end of the movie. He comes back and he 963 01:23:27.039 --> 01:23:33.760 liberates the orphans from there and takes him to Neverland. So the pirates come 964 01:23:33.800 --> 01:23:39.920 and they kidnapped the boys, and they have this like scene where the fighter 965 01:23:40.000 --> 01:23:44.880 planes during the air raid of London in nineteen forty four something are fighting the 966 01:23:44.960 --> 01:23:50.359 stupid pirate ship in the air remember that. Yeah, they're doing they're doing 967 01:23:50.359 --> 01:23:58.319 the dog fighting against the the n ot see pirate ships. Yeah, so 968 01:23:58.600 --> 01:24:05.800 the food fighters were actually pirate ships going to and from Netherland space Pirates. 969 01:24:05.840 --> 01:24:17.079 Hotler's Space Pirates, Pirates in Space that's actually a Disney movie Treasure something, 970 01:24:19.000 --> 01:24:28.159 Treasure Planet. Remember that Disney cartoon Treasure Planet. Yea space Pirates. I 971 01:24:28.199 --> 01:24:38.479 remember the movie Ice Pirates was Robert Yurick. That's a terrible So when he's 972 01:24:38.520 --> 01:24:45.039 floating in space, he touches Saturn, remember that. So we're back to 973 01:24:45.119 --> 01:24:51.840 Capricorn. So so he goes to the hexagonal storms on the poles of Saturn. 974 01:24:53.439 --> 01:24:59.239 H learns from set. Yes, oh, what was the he comes 975 01:24:59.239 --> 01:25:02.199 out with the model from two thousand and one? What was the Jude Law 976 01:25:02.359 --> 01:25:08.479 movie? You guys covered it was Jude Law uh Sky Captain Sky Captain in 977 01:25:08.520 --> 01:25:13.319 the World of Tomorrow. Remember that that has like they're not pirates but floating. 978 01:25:15.239 --> 01:25:17.159 I mean they're there. It's like World War two but it's the future. 979 01:25:17.520 --> 01:25:24.279 Remember that one. Yeah? Oh? J. G. Ballard's Empire 980 01:25:24.319 --> 01:25:28.479 of the Sun, which is which is also a Spielberg movie, right with 981 01:25:28.560 --> 01:25:33.520 Christian Bale. Me. Yeah, he's a he's a privileged kid living in 982 01:25:33.520 --> 01:25:40.199 Shanghai with his colonialist governor dad, but then becomes an orphan in a prisoner 983 01:25:40.239 --> 01:25:43.600 or war camp and the ship that the you know, planes play a big 984 01:25:43.920 --> 01:25:45.640 role in that film too, So in other words, it's a motif, 985 01:25:45.720 --> 01:25:49.439 you know, with with these with this kind of story. H Okay, 986 01:25:50.119 --> 01:25:56.520 you've got the pirates. They're not Peter Pan's not learning kids never Land anymore. 987 01:25:56.560 --> 01:26:00.039 They're just straight up grabbing them. Now they're natural. And when they 988 01:26:00.079 --> 01:26:05.439 get there, never Land is like mad Max Thunderdome. Yes, yeah, 989 01:26:05.479 --> 01:26:09.720 they yes, no they they yeah it is. They go to Bartertown, 990 01:26:10.119 --> 01:26:13.359 yeah, and all the feral kids are there, like in the canyon, 991 01:26:14.199 --> 01:26:18.840 and then they then they they somehow change that to to what's the last one? 992 01:26:18.840 --> 01:26:23.720 A Fury Road? Right with the dude with the mask on, like 993 01:26:23.800 --> 01:26:26.800 standing at the you know, on the top of the rock when he like 994 01:26:26.880 --> 01:26:30.520 he like does the thing and like the water comes out and they the same 995 01:26:30.560 --> 01:26:33.920 thing happened in this. It was interesting because they're you know, he's standing 996 01:26:33.920 --> 01:26:36.479 at the top of the abyss. I guess where all the feral kids are. 997 01:26:36.880 --> 01:26:41.600 Right. But then but then it got it went into uh, here 998 01:26:41.600 --> 01:26:44.920 we are now and to tay you know, I was like, oh my 999 01:26:45.039 --> 01:26:50.039 god, what is this. They're singing Nirvana, which I don't know if 1000 01:26:50.079 --> 01:26:59.039 I'm crazy making these connections, but that is also going along with the yogic 1001 01:26:59.159 --> 01:27:03.079 version of Pan parly version of Pan. You know, Nirvana and Tantra and 1002 01:27:03.359 --> 01:27:11.800 Indian gods and stuff like that, which we'll talk about when we talk about 1003 01:27:11.840 --> 01:27:15.319 this one. Hey, oh real quick, can you hold up the book 1004 01:27:15.319 --> 01:27:20.359 Pan our Peter Pan, because I noticed you had a really good picture on 1005 01:27:20.439 --> 01:27:27.560 the copy. Yeah, okay, and Berry very good? Okay, oh 1006 01:27:28.039 --> 01:27:33.279 shadow right, it's just his outline, his shadows. I first read this. 1007 01:27:34.720 --> 01:27:40.640 I got this one in England Christmas Day two thousand hmm. Cool, 1008 01:27:42.840 --> 01:27:48.079 sure, so fing edition. They arrived to Neverland huge ass man is like 1009 01:27:48.239 --> 01:27:56.039 some kind of rock star Warlord the Pirate Blackbeard, right, What was that? 1010 01:27:56.159 --> 01:27:59.199 I mean, like, what was the deal with the music? Because 1011 01:28:00.079 --> 01:28:05.000 they were singing other pop songs. I didn't write them down, but they 1012 01:28:05.079 --> 01:28:11.640 did break into song a couple more times, but they but the songs that 1013 01:28:11.680 --> 01:28:16.399 they chose. It was an odd selection. It was like the movie came 1014 01:28:16.399 --> 01:28:20.560 out what you said, twenty fifteen something like that, I mean, and 1015 01:28:20.600 --> 01:28:27.359 they sing in Nirvana song like, you know, if kids want to see 1016 01:28:27.359 --> 01:28:30.359 this, like they wouldn't get the reference, right, I guess. I 1017 01:28:30.359 --> 01:28:34.159 don't know if they chose it just for the lyrics or I don't know why, 1018 01:28:34.279 --> 01:28:43.319 but never mind, they're singing Nirvana and what they're doing is capturing children 1019 01:28:43.359 --> 01:28:48.159 to work in a mind. So you've got the Temple of Doom themes. 1020 01:28:48.239 --> 01:28:57.439 Yeah, yes, very dust from here. So it's like the Victorian era 1021 01:28:57.720 --> 01:29:03.399 of child's workers in factory. You've got these themes of children in the minds 1022 01:29:03.760 --> 01:29:11.680 and children's soldiers. Right, they took these stones from here. Yeah, 1023 01:29:11.720 --> 01:29:15.079 it took the storms from shore. Okay, no, yeah, they were, 1024 01:29:15.159 --> 01:29:18.039 they were they were working in a mine. I guess they're working in 1025 01:29:18.079 --> 01:29:23.000 a lithium mine, right, and they're but this but this on they're mining 1026 01:29:23.000 --> 01:29:27.840 for seriously, like this is like blood diamond stuff. This is mining, 1027 01:29:27.920 --> 01:29:32.119 like you just said for like things that power the cell phones and right, 1028 01:29:32.159 --> 01:29:38.039 so it's child slavery. But but in this one they're mining for like a 1029 01:29:39.000 --> 01:29:43.439 I can't really say it, you know, Dren No, oh yeah, 1030 01:29:43.640 --> 01:29:46.560 that's what I thought. Okay, So in the movie they call it pixie 1031 01:29:46.600 --> 01:29:49.960 dust or pixel or something like that. So what why do you think that, 1032 01:29:51.840 --> 01:30:00.199 Well, because the I mean I see that that ties in with with 1033 01:30:00.239 --> 01:30:06.520 Peter Pan as a theme. Right, it's remaining forever young, they remain 1034 01:30:06.680 --> 01:30:14.159 young because of the you know, the boys there there's an island. There's 1035 01:30:14.159 --> 01:30:20.920 always an island. There's older never like the island. Yeah, there's there 1036 01:30:20.960 --> 01:30:26.319 are older guys there who are older, but they're going to remain in that 1037 01:30:26.399 --> 01:30:30.960 place. So in a way, they're remaining younger. But also they are 1038 01:30:30.119 --> 01:30:39.239 doing sea traffic like place to place. Uh. There's psychic split, there's 1039 01:30:39.279 --> 01:30:43.239 the searching for your shadow. There's the gas lighting of talent, you know, 1040 01:30:43.279 --> 01:30:53.960 the the imaginary food and keeping them there. What else they're they're in 1041 01:30:54.000 --> 01:30:57.520 the like they're in the abyss, like the bout you know, the bottom 1042 01:30:57.560 --> 01:31:04.520 of their psyche mining this like light illuminated stuff. Right. Did you notice 1043 01:31:04.720 --> 01:31:11.840 that he says that when they're in the mind, they're free from life's dungeon 1044 01:31:12.600 --> 01:31:19.159 and he grants them liberty and opportunity. So are they're not dead but they 1045 01:31:19.279 --> 01:31:28.279 are in like on a live world. Yeah, they they're granted liberty, 1046 01:31:28.439 --> 01:31:31.159 you know, the freedom to do whatever. Like in the book, they're 1047 01:31:31.159 --> 01:31:33.840 granted the freedom to do whatever they want. They can play these games, 1048 01:31:33.880 --> 01:31:39.560 they can play war, they can you know. But the question is like, 1049 01:31:39.600 --> 01:31:42.319 what what does that mean? What is what is freedom and liberty? 1050 01:31:42.520 --> 01:31:45.880 Like with no belief. They believe in Peter Pan. But Peter Pan is 1051 01:31:45.920 --> 01:31:55.520 always tricking them. He's capricious and yeah, right in hook when Who's a 1052 01:31:55.640 --> 01:31:59.920 Ruffio? When Ruffio dies, remember the last thing he says. He says, 1053 01:32:00.359 --> 01:32:04.800 I just wish that I could have a father. Yeah, oh yeah, 1054 01:32:05.039 --> 01:32:13.119 even death is too right. They say that they're lucky because you know, 1055 01:32:13.159 --> 01:32:16.159 they have a mother. They don't have a mother. They want, 1056 01:32:16.239 --> 01:32:20.520 you know, they want. I guess that's what the whole thing you know 1057 01:32:20.640 --> 01:32:25.039 is about, at least just the big thing on the surface, which is 1058 01:32:25.079 --> 01:32:28.520 that there's a trade off you make. Right, you want to be forever 1059 01:32:28.600 --> 01:32:30.359 young. You want to be a kid, and you want to be free 1060 01:32:30.359 --> 01:32:33.840 from responsibility and to have adventures and have an imagination. But if that happens, 1061 01:32:33.840 --> 01:32:41.359 then you won't have you won't be able to grow up to have experience 1062 01:32:41.479 --> 01:32:46.119 love and you take care of other people and the fullness of life. And 1063 01:32:46.159 --> 01:32:49.279 there's always something missing when you're a kid, because even though they're free, 1064 01:32:49.319 --> 01:32:56.239 when their kids, they still depend on their parents to take care of them 1065 01:32:56.279 --> 01:33:00.560 well, and they don't they don't have that. This is like at the 1066 01:33:00.640 --> 01:33:05.760 Peter Pan boy, he doesn't want to grow up failure to launch neat Proleian 1067 01:33:08.479 --> 01:33:16.159 child. And I saw this tweet by a like a red pilled person let 1068 01:33:16.239 --> 01:33:20.720 me see and just described everything you just said, because he was like describing 1069 01:33:20.760 --> 01:33:25.199 a high value mail. But it was like Peter Pan stuff. Let me 1070 01:33:25.239 --> 01:33:29.600 see if I can find it. Okay, a bachelor in his forties or 1071 01:33:29.640 --> 01:33:35.439 fifties, a vasectomy child, free by choice, travels extensively, reads voraciously, 1072 01:33:35.600 --> 01:33:40.560 nothing wrong meeting, but swims in the sea every morning in the sunshine, 1073 01:33:40.680 --> 01:33:44.319 enjoys the very best of life, unfettered by the concerns and responsibilities of 1074 01:33:44.399 --> 01:33:47.960 our others have. So this is the kind of like checklist that's going around 1075 01:33:48.279 --> 01:33:53.520 the red pill dudes for like what is a high value man and is totally 1076 01:33:53.560 --> 01:34:00.279 like Peter Pan. Yeah, all that stuff is great, but you know 1077 01:34:01.239 --> 01:34:05.560 you have all that and then eventually the things fade and then you're older and 1078 01:34:05.560 --> 01:34:10.079 then you can't even do those things and then you die alone. I mean 1079 01:34:10.119 --> 01:34:13.239 at least when you're born, like there's people in the hospital room and you 1080 01:34:13.279 --> 01:34:17.119 know you're being you know, they're helping you be born. Right. But 1081 01:34:17.960 --> 01:34:23.560 the whole point of this is that obviously Peter Pan is a is a he's 1082 01:34:23.600 --> 01:34:26.039 a sad I don't know if he's a tragic figure, but he's a sad 1083 01:34:26.079 --> 01:34:31.079 figure. I guess Hook is probably a tragic figure in a way, not 1084 01:34:31.079 --> 01:34:34.039 not like a truly tragic figure, because he's he is the villain, but 1085 01:34:34.680 --> 01:34:40.479 in at least in the text. But but he remarks on this, right 1086 01:34:40.600 --> 01:34:44.199 he you know? Okay? Oh, the other element that you know we 1087 01:34:44.239 --> 01:34:47.159 haven't mentioned yet is that the one thing that that the villain is afraid of, 1088 01:34:47.319 --> 01:34:54.199 which is the Is it a crocodile or an alligator? I guess it's 1089 01:34:54.199 --> 01:35:00.880 a So the crocodile, you know, took his hand, and the crocodile, 1090 01:35:01.560 --> 01:35:05.000 you can he knows the crocodile is always approaching when he hears the TikTok, 1091 01:35:05.159 --> 01:35:10.279 the sound of the clock. So the one thing that Hook is afraid 1092 01:35:10.319 --> 01:35:15.239 of is also time. Yes, he's afraid of the passage of time because 1093 01:35:15.279 --> 01:35:21.960 he know it's it's his impending doom. And yet he wants the boys to 1094 01:35:23.239 --> 01:35:27.760 share in that, Like does that mean that he wants them to grow up, 1095 01:35:27.880 --> 01:35:30.560 like to be with them so that they can also die in a way, 1096 01:35:33.920 --> 01:35:40.479 The Lost Boys and Peter Pan they use they use that against Captain hook 1097 01:35:40.600 --> 01:35:43.000 like they you know, they hold up the clocks and they mimic the sound 1098 01:35:43.000 --> 01:35:45.640 of the clock, but they don't understand what it means because they're too young 1099 01:35:45.680 --> 01:35:49.039 to understand, right, Like when you get it's like when you go to 1100 01:35:49.079 --> 01:35:51.800 the funeral of like a family member and you're five years old and you have 1101 01:35:51.840 --> 01:35:57.520 no you don't understand. Yeah, time is on your side still, and 1102 01:35:57.560 --> 01:36:02.640 time is not on hook site right right and there that connects it to Saturn 1103 01:36:02.680 --> 01:36:15.840 again with time element, so yeah, yeah. Uh So they're down in 1104 01:36:15.880 --> 01:36:20.079 the mine slaving away for uranium or whatever. They're trying to get fairy dust. 1105 01:36:24.520 --> 01:36:28.640 The kid Pan, he has to walk the plank, but discovers he 1106 01:36:28.680 --> 01:36:31.960 can fly because apparently he is the son of the moon and of a fairy 1107 01:36:32.079 --> 01:36:41.600 king. So when we talk about Pan's labyrinth, this is gonna come up 1108 01:36:41.600 --> 01:36:48.680 again. How she's actually a princess or the demon tells her that she's not 1109 01:36:48.760 --> 01:36:56.399 a human in the underworld, She's actually princess of the underworld. So Pan 1110 01:36:56.560 --> 01:37:01.800 is a prince of the Neverland in this movie Pan twenty ten, Right, 1111 01:37:02.359 --> 01:37:09.960 Yeah, I just I just did analysis of something where where one of the 1112 01:37:10.000 --> 01:37:16.439 women was a I found out she was a demi goddess. What was it? 1113 01:37:18.319 --> 01:37:24.279 Something not? Or it was something to do with Orpheus, who's the 1114 01:37:24.279 --> 01:37:30.000 one who goes down into the underworld. It's is it Persephone? And she 1115 01:37:30.079 --> 01:37:36.600 a demigod, she's a half goddess. Mhmm. Okay, so I guess, 1116 01:37:38.000 --> 01:37:44.279 okay, so I guess she's a persephone character. Yes, exactly, 1117 01:37:44.800 --> 01:37:48.000 son of a fairy kings. I mean that's Oberon in Midsummer Night's Dream, 1118 01:37:48.079 --> 01:37:55.640 right, And then they said that we're Blackbeard. He comes out and he 1119 01:37:55.680 --> 01:38:00.520 says, Neverland is a dream from which you never wake. So now we're 1120 01:38:00.520 --> 01:38:03.760 talking about dreams again. We're talking about subconscious and it's gonna get even deeper 1121 01:38:04.079 --> 01:38:10.680 next week when we talk about Great God Pan and the subconscious and when I 1122 01:38:10.760 --> 01:38:16.840 do the rock Fin show about this and dream state and the subconscious. And 1123 01:38:17.760 --> 01:38:24.720 Peter in this movie is a messiah to Neverland. So he is a prince 1124 01:38:25.640 --> 01:38:30.319 demi god, a messiah. He is the one who is going to balance 1125 01:38:30.399 --> 01:38:34.279 the force again in Neverland, right when they get rid of old huge ass 1126 01:38:34.319 --> 01:38:43.079 man Blackbeard. Right, And this movie is so goofy, like it could 1127 01:38:43.079 --> 01:38:47.920 have been okay as a kids movie, but the dubbing was really lame. 1128 01:38:48.439 --> 01:38:51.560 And I don't know that actor. He's not a bad actor, but his 1129 01:38:53.159 --> 01:38:58.399 lines and his dubbing, they did him dirty. I think I like the 1130 01:38:58.560 --> 01:39:03.560 older guy. What's his name, Garrett, Garrett Headland, Yeah, the 1131 01:39:03.600 --> 01:39:06.359 guy, remember the guy that he finds in the mind and the guys. 1132 01:39:06.640 --> 01:39:10.479 What's what's funny about that is he's like, here's how you get out of 1133 01:39:10.520 --> 01:39:13.439 your chains. I'll show you how. And then the next thing he goes, 1134 01:39:13.479 --> 01:39:15.479 I'm not your friend. I'm not here to show you how to do 1135 01:39:15.520 --> 01:39:17.119 anything, and I'm not here to give you any you know, in any 1136 01:39:17.239 --> 01:39:21.760 I'm not here to be your friend. You want to be friends. Right, 1137 01:39:23.560 --> 01:39:29.279 That's like okay, but like in the movie, right right, So 1138 01:39:29.359 --> 01:39:34.960 now Hook is this sort of mentor, like this, who's the Oh my 1139 01:39:35.000 --> 01:39:40.880 gosh, who's Harrison Ford in Star Wars Han Solo. He's like that, 1140 01:39:41.640 --> 01:39:46.239 he's the Han solo of the movie. He's the cooler older person that Pan 1141 01:39:46.600 --> 01:39:53.319 is mentored by. He kind of he kind of talks like Harrison Ford too, 1142 01:39:53.600 --> 01:39:57.760 Yeah, kind of the samples gem me bragmar family, Yeah, get 1143 01:39:57.840 --> 01:40:05.840 off my point. Yeah. So when they escape from Blackbeard mines, and 1144 01:40:06.000 --> 01:40:11.640 it also has like a wild West element to it, so it's Pirates in 1145 01:40:11.720 --> 01:40:19.279 Space and also Cowboys. How did that happen? Probably they got a seven 1146 01:40:19.359 --> 01:40:26.600 year old to give them an idea for a movie, yeah, because it's 1147 01:40:26.720 --> 01:40:31.840 kind of like a Cowboy Han solo. Yeah, and it turns into this 1148 01:40:32.520 --> 01:40:39.000 journey to the Center of the Earth adventure where they're now in Neverland is like 1149 01:40:39.079 --> 01:40:43.920 some kind of prehistoric jungle, right, and they're looking for the natives. 1150 01:40:44.039 --> 01:40:49.720 So you've got like Avatar meets Harry Potter meets Wild West, Pirates in Space 1151 01:40:50.920 --> 01:41:00.039 is that meets lay Manz. There was obviously you know there singing, and 1152 01:41:00.079 --> 01:41:05.439 that was probably huge Jasmine's idea. They probably and the natives are just like 1153 01:41:05.520 --> 01:41:15.640 over the top multicultural amalgam of like every Mayan native like, well, it's 1154 01:41:15.760 --> 01:41:19.319 very Avatar, right. It was the Burger King Kids Club. Oh totally, 1155 01:41:21.359 --> 01:41:31.399 it was the Burger King Kiss Club. And then there their hero of 1156 01:41:31.640 --> 01:41:38.920 their culture is called a pant right. Pan is not the name of a 1157 01:41:38.960 --> 01:41:43.000 person, it's the title like lord or you know, our savior, pant 1158 01:41:43.439 --> 01:41:47.760 these are our warrior. That was That was the producer's idea to make it 1159 01:41:47.880 --> 01:41:55.800 different than the other movies. And also there's a weird like West World to 1160 01:41:55.880 --> 01:42:01.039 this. I mean, there's the cowboy thing, but because is huge Hugh 1161 01:42:01.119 --> 01:42:06.399 Jasmine is like, he's not the foppish King Charles the second. Instead, 1162 01:42:06.399 --> 01:42:12.359 he's got like a weird like it's almost like a Samurai haircut. It's like 1163 01:42:12.720 --> 01:42:21.760 Stingapore pirates. Yeah, very Japanese looking hairstyle and uh, not handsome at 1164 01:42:21.760 --> 01:42:29.399 all, gruesome almost like yeah, heath and scary eyes, right, yeah, 1165 01:42:29.479 --> 01:42:30.520 yeah, that was the thing. You know, we were talking about 1166 01:42:30.560 --> 01:42:34.000 that about his eyes, and that was the one thing that was like the 1167 01:42:34.039 --> 01:42:40.720 one thing I took away from this movie was that that just in terms of 1168 01:42:40.760 --> 01:42:45.439 like, in terms of film in general, the the the one thing that 1169 01:42:45.479 --> 01:42:48.760 every actor wants is the close up. That's like what they demand in their 1170 01:42:49.520 --> 01:42:53.239 you know, in their contracts, you know a certain number of close ups 1171 01:42:53.760 --> 01:42:56.720 because their whole face is the screen. So they're you know, they're not 1172 01:42:56.720 --> 01:43:00.680 only larger than life, but now they're larger than even that. And but 1173 01:43:00.720 --> 01:43:05.279 it's the eyes that sell the role. So that's why you get a lot 1174 01:43:05.359 --> 01:43:11.560 of bad actors in film who just looked the part. Because people are willing 1175 01:43:11.600 --> 01:43:16.399 to like willing suspension of disbelief. People are willing to overlook the flaws as 1176 01:43:16.439 --> 01:43:20.520 long as they can believe what the persons saying in their eyes. So like 1177 01:43:20.600 --> 01:43:26.199 one thing is like you know when you can tell when you're looking at at 1178 01:43:26.239 --> 01:43:30.439 an actor and they're trying to remember their lines, they're like seeing the script 1179 01:43:30.560 --> 01:43:33.760 in their eyes. And I thought, you know, Hugh Jackman is good 1180 01:43:33.760 --> 01:43:39.439 in this because it did bring out a subtle thing with his character, which 1181 01:43:39.479 --> 01:43:43.840 is that you know that there there has to be something driving the bad guy. 1182 01:43:43.760 --> 01:43:45.640 It can't just be the bad guy and he's there and he's doing these 1183 01:43:45.680 --> 01:43:49.960 things. You have to you have to like not only hear him say the 1184 01:43:50.000 --> 01:43:53.000 words, but you have to look in his eyes and believe that, like 1185 01:43:53.039 --> 01:43:59.279 there's there's something about him that where he like he knows what Peter is going 1186 01:43:59.319 --> 01:44:01.760 through, he knows the orphans are going through. And I thought that was 1187 01:44:01.800 --> 01:44:04.600 good. It was kind of like, you know, show instead of tell, 1188 01:44:04.720 --> 01:44:09.279 we can see that he is one of If he's not one of these 1189 01:44:09.279 --> 01:44:13.560 guys from his former life, then then there's some sort of pain that he's 1190 01:44:13.640 --> 01:44:20.239 carrying. Yeah. I thought he did the best acting in that movie. 1191 01:44:20.359 --> 01:44:29.800 For sure. He's in prisoners also forgot about that, Oh yeah, so 1192 01:44:30.439 --> 01:44:39.560 they find this Disney tribe of natives and who worship their hero Pan and what 1193 01:44:39.720 --> 01:44:44.720 they are protecting is the Fairy Kingdom, where Peter thinks that his mother lives 1194 01:44:44.720 --> 01:44:49.720 now. And so here is another dimension within a dimension. So now we're 1195 01:44:49.760 --> 01:44:55.279 getting like you know, five to six D realms, right, So you 1196 01:44:55.399 --> 01:45:00.279 have to pass through the mundane world into Neverland and the Neverland and is there's 1197 01:45:00.279 --> 01:45:04.800 a door to the Fairy Kingdom, right, So you have these veils of 1198 01:45:04.880 --> 01:45:11.520 reality being lifted and the different beings that live on these planes of existence, 1199 01:45:12.239 --> 01:45:20.760 and in this movie, the highest beings are the fairies right right, So 1200 01:45:23.239 --> 01:45:31.880 is this like is this just another multiverse? Yeah? Maybe? Yeah? 1201 01:45:32.239 --> 01:45:39.159 Yeah, dimensions, angelic realms, fairy realms. This is what magic is 1202 01:45:39.199 --> 01:45:47.199 all based on contacting beings from these different places, right or incarnating them. 1203 01:45:47.239 --> 01:45:59.039 And Peter is a well this movie, I'm gonna give you a confession, 1204 01:45:59.119 --> 01:46:02.159 Like I was like Joe's off three quarters of the way and like woke up 1205 01:46:02.199 --> 01:46:06.199 at the very end. So you have to tell me what happened after he 1206 01:46:06.279 --> 01:46:10.760 made it through the Fairy Kingdom and they were like blasting the fairies with the 1207 01:46:11.119 --> 01:46:15.840 fire. You have to forgive me we're moving. So I was like really 1208 01:46:15.880 --> 01:46:17.159 tired, and I tried to put this on and watch it, but it 1209 01:46:17.239 --> 01:46:26.760 was not that good. Look did anybody watch this movie and not do that? 1210 01:46:26.760 --> 01:46:30.680 That's known as the naptime of the movie because you probably did it too. 1211 01:46:30.760 --> 01:46:39.039 Huh's I totally did. Totally. Yeah. No. But the just 1212 01:46:39.319 --> 01:46:43.640 the point, the point, I guess is that, especially with the multiverse 1213 01:46:43.680 --> 01:46:49.239 thing, I guess it's different than that because the multiverse always, like in 1214 01:46:49.319 --> 01:46:55.600 Marvel movies, always functions as like a resolution. Oh the bad thing happened 1215 01:46:55.600 --> 01:46:57.600 in the world, we can just go to the multiverse and then we'll sort 1216 01:46:57.640 --> 01:47:00.760 it out by doing it there and like having some sort of synthesis of the 1217 01:47:00.800 --> 01:47:08.720 worlds. But in this the multiverse dream dream world is what they have to 1218 01:47:08.760 --> 01:47:12.720 make their way through. Like it's it's it's surrealistic. There's also a lot 1219 01:47:12.720 --> 01:47:16.600 of like inversion and like upside down walking and you know, sort of nonsense 1220 01:47:16.680 --> 01:47:24.760 world. In this it's like Alison Wonderland's who is falling and finding equilibrium and 1221 01:47:24.800 --> 01:47:28.600 then the other direction is up and stuff like that. Right. Yeah. 1222 01:47:28.680 --> 01:47:32.840 In fact, one of the big things in Alison Wonderland is the you know, 1223 01:47:32.880 --> 01:47:38.560 the hookah sm smoking caterpillar sitting on the mushroom, right whoa tripping man? 1224 01:47:40.439 --> 01:47:45.000 That is in the book, there's a scene where like Hook, Captain 1225 01:47:45.000 --> 01:47:47.880 Hook is talking to Sme or whatever is you know, he's writing man and 1226 01:47:47.880 --> 01:47:51.319 he's sitting on a mushroom and then the mushroom starts to heat up and he's 1227 01:47:51.439 --> 01:47:54.800 like, well, what is this? And then it's like, well, 1228 01:47:54.800 --> 01:47:59.479 obviously lost boys use mushrooms as caps for their chimneys, so they live in 1229 01:47:59.520 --> 01:48:04.239 the under have an underground world, and so so then we have to like 1230 01:48:04.279 --> 01:48:08.199 go from the dream, you know, the dream world of the island world 1231 01:48:08.319 --> 01:48:15.479 outside of reality even further into the underground world, and the mushroom hides the 1232 01:48:15.840 --> 01:48:23.720 smoke reality from Hook. And then there's a whole sequence where Peter has to 1233 01:48:23.840 --> 01:48:28.239 fit the kids to the trees, which is really weird, Like most people 1234 01:48:28.239 --> 01:48:30.079 forget about this then, which is that it says like, okay, you 1235 01:48:30.119 --> 01:48:32.479 know when you go to a tailor and you gotta like fit the clothes to 1236 01:48:32.560 --> 01:48:39.520 you, what's the opposite, Like every kid fits a tree, so you 1237 01:48:39.560 --> 01:48:43.319 have to find exactly the right sized tree and then when the kid like gets 1238 01:48:43.359 --> 01:48:45.840 in the tree and then they can like wriggle down. That's how they get 1239 01:48:45.880 --> 01:48:50.239 in the tunnel down into the underworld. So like when they come up, 1240 01:48:50.279 --> 01:48:55.960 they like wriggle up on the inside of a tree, which is very It 1241 01:48:56.119 --> 01:49:02.760 was just very very odd. Does this sound like programming talk psychology like deeper 1242 01:49:02.760 --> 01:49:12.079 and deeper hypnotism stuff or not? Yeah? I mean yes, yes, 1243 01:49:12.239 --> 01:49:16.479 and and the like. When you were describing Pan, I was thinking like, 1244 01:49:16.880 --> 01:49:20.079 this is a like, if this is a dream state, it's hellish, 1245 01:49:20.159 --> 01:49:25.199 Like this is a this is awful. Yeah, to get to get 1246 01:49:25.199 --> 01:49:27.840 lost in this world and then you have in that world and then you have 1247 01:49:27.880 --> 01:49:30.560 to make your way back in your reality. Yeah, children are your parents 1248 01:49:30.600 --> 01:49:34.039 and the only adults are like a horrible pirates trying to kill you. And 1249 01:49:34.279 --> 01:49:40.760 it sounds like a nightmare, definitely. It also starts to be the you 1250 01:49:40.800 --> 01:49:44.680 know, monarch always turns into like the most dangerous game, right, So 1251 01:49:44.720 --> 01:49:46.199 it's the Manchurian candidate. You have to go and you're going to be one 1252 01:49:46.239 --> 01:49:48.560 of the lost boys, and you have to you know, take out so 1253 01:49:48.720 --> 01:49:55.319 and so in order to not be disappeared, and then you can find your 1254 01:49:55.359 --> 01:49:58.279 home and then you can make your way back. And then when you get 1255 01:49:58.319 --> 01:50:00.800 here, by the way, you won't remember anything that happened, right, 1256 01:50:02.079 --> 01:50:11.319 yep. I think we're pretty much nailing it tonight on these analyzes. They're 1257 01:50:11.359 --> 01:50:19.000 both based and lit like this is this honestly, this is the type of 1258 01:50:19.000 --> 01:50:26.920 of you know text where just with the MK ultra stuff, you know reading 1259 01:50:27.000 --> 01:50:30.000 like I don't know John markin just all these people that talk about, you 1260 01:50:30.039 --> 01:50:34.680 know, programming, and like when you listen to people like Kathy O'Brien and 1261 01:50:34.720 --> 01:50:39.159 stuff talk about this, there are elements of it where you go, you 1262 01:50:39.159 --> 01:50:42.159 know, or Montague project like this. This is one of the key things 1263 01:50:42.279 --> 01:50:47.000 in it is the programming. And I did that with uh catching the rye. 1264 01:50:47.039 --> 01:50:49.640 Catching the rye is so odd to me that it strikes me as just 1265 01:50:49.720 --> 01:50:56.079 like a there's another language encoded in the language. And it's the same thing 1266 01:50:56.119 --> 01:50:58.279 with Wizard of Oz and it's the same thing with this. What was the 1267 01:50:58.279 --> 01:51:03.399 trifecta that you pointed out Wizard of p Yeah, right, because they go 1268 01:51:03.520 --> 01:51:08.720 beyond just the kids to I mean, on the surface, this is a 1269 01:51:08.760 --> 01:51:11.920 great story for kids. Like if I'm a little boy and I, you 1270 01:51:11.960 --> 01:51:14.039 know, read this book or I hear the story, it's cool for me 1271 01:51:14.079 --> 01:51:16.199 because it's like, oh, I can fly, I get to I have 1272 01:51:16.239 --> 01:51:18.479 a tribe, I get to do whatever I want to, get to play 1273 01:51:18.479 --> 01:51:23.279 war. Even the stuff about like oh you can die in the fights with 1274 01:51:23.279 --> 01:51:25.319 the other people, it's like, well, you know, little kids play 1275 01:51:25.359 --> 01:51:31.680 war all the time and they die, you know. Uh. I remember 1276 01:51:32.039 --> 01:51:39.000 outside one story in preschool we had like our little war gangs, and there 1277 01:51:39.079 --> 01:51:42.439 was this kid and he said can I play? And my friend Brad from 1278 01:51:42.479 --> 01:51:45.279 Brad said you can't, you can't play, and the kids said let me 1279 01:51:45.279 --> 01:51:48.039 play and said okay, you can be mister nobody. Yeah. It was 1280 01:51:48.119 --> 01:51:51.000 terrible. So anyway, this kid ended up being the first like person who 1281 01:51:51.039 --> 01:51:54.600 got you know, got killed in the war, like on the place set. 1282 01:51:55.279 --> 01:51:57.840 And I remember going over to him and going like, nope, you 1283 01:51:57.880 --> 01:52:00.560 know, he's not breathing. And my friend Brad goes, let's check and 1284 01:52:00.560 --> 01:52:02.840 see if he's really dead and grabbed this kid's tongue and pulled it like this 1285 01:52:02.920 --> 01:52:09.760 far out of He was like, yeah, he's definitely gone. All right, 1286 01:52:09.760 --> 01:52:12.199 we gotta go kill the bad guys in the woods. But like that's 1287 01:52:12.199 --> 01:52:15.399 what little kids do, you know. And so Peter Pan is cool like 1288 01:52:15.439 --> 01:52:18.720 that, but when you get beyond that, because it's a complex book. 1289 01:52:18.760 --> 01:52:24.640 The addiction in the book is far beyond little kids reading. They you know, 1290 01:52:24.640 --> 01:52:30.279 they even mentioned O r G y in the book a number of times. 1291 01:52:30.800 --> 01:52:34.920 What, yes, that word is. See if I can find the 1292 01:52:35.000 --> 01:52:45.880 reference here. It's mentioned specifically that you know, I'm not gonna be able 1293 01:52:45.920 --> 01:52:48.199 to find it now. Oh, here it is. Here's one. Uh. 1294 01:52:48.319 --> 01:52:55.720 This is page sixty seven in the book. It says after time he 1295 01:52:55.800 --> 01:53:00.000 fell asleep and some unsteady fairies had to climb over him on their way home 1296 01:53:00.079 --> 01:53:04.119 from an O R g y. Uh. Any of the other boys obstructing 1297 01:53:04.119 --> 01:53:09.319 the fairy path at night, they would have mischiefed, but they just tweet 1298 01:53:09.359 --> 01:53:14.159 Peter's nose and passed on. What a weird paragraph. So he's talking about 1299 01:53:14.239 --> 01:53:19.439 fair or gys in a kid's book, And you just said something that made 1300 01:53:19.439 --> 01:53:24.840 me think, like, so this is something that an adult has to read 1301 01:53:24.880 --> 01:53:28.760 to a child, not that they could just pick up in absorb on their 1302 01:53:28.760 --> 01:53:30.840 own, right, I mean, yeah, for sure, Oh for sure. 1303 01:53:31.960 --> 01:53:36.359 So it's just like g R O O M I N G script. 1304 01:53:39.840 --> 01:53:45.159 I mean, even the look on the page of the pros there's there's too 1305 01:53:45.239 --> 01:53:48.800 much there's too much like there's too much verbiage on the page. For kids. 1306 01:53:49.039 --> 01:53:55.439 It's a one hundred and fifty page book. I mean now probably teenagers 1307 01:53:55.439 --> 01:53:58.720 couldn't even read this. The kind of things that come out of this time 1308 01:53:58.960 --> 01:54:05.319 period. People like their their wholesome just because they were from the old times. 1309 01:54:05.840 --> 01:54:12.800 You know, they can't have any type of nefarious stuff going on back 1310 01:54:12.800 --> 01:54:20.119 then because everybody was wearing frilly wigs in right right. In a way, 1311 01:54:20.159 --> 01:54:26.119 I guess it's kind of like, you know, when when boomers love the 1312 01:54:26.159 --> 01:54:33.560 boomers, we love the boomers. Victorians were so like chaste and uh so 1313 01:54:33.600 --> 01:54:40.840 it has this veneer but so the creepers had to go underground, have their 1314 01:54:40.880 --> 01:54:47.119 creep clubs and their codes and their stories and their predatory techniques. And what 1315 01:54:47.279 --> 01:54:54.439 better way than through you know, media plays, books and fairy tales or 1316 01:54:54.479 --> 01:54:59.359 they're just straight up adoptions, like a random you could, yeah, just 1317 01:55:00.159 --> 01:55:04.279 pick one from the park and lure him away with your fairy stories. But 1318 01:55:04.359 --> 01:55:08.640 it's it's like when boomers are like, you know, the the music now 1319 01:55:08.800 --> 01:55:11.319 is so bad. It is so you know, all they talk about is 1320 01:55:11.399 --> 01:55:14.439 you know, sex and you know all this stuff, and it's like yeah, 1321 01:55:14.520 --> 01:55:18.680 but you're on film like for three days getting naked in a mud pit 1322 01:55:19.920 --> 01:55:25.399 like on acid. Oh from stock. Yeah, that's like that's like that's 1323 01:55:25.399 --> 01:55:28.079 what they sell. But I mean that's their thing. So in a way, 1324 01:55:28.119 --> 01:55:30.359 it's we always look at the past with these kind of you know, 1325 01:55:31.399 --> 01:55:36.039 uh, rose colored glasses, I guess, but like you said, it's 1326 01:55:38.920 --> 01:55:40.880 it's I mean, it's right there, it's right there in the book. 1327 01:55:42.600 --> 01:55:46.760 So in the movie Pan, the twenty fifteen huge ass Man movie, he 1328 01:55:46.800 --> 01:55:53.359 gets the key to Fairyland. He saves Neverland. He's the messiah Pan and 1329 01:55:53.399 --> 01:56:01.000 the crystals have to do with immortality and his mother. Even though he finds 1330 01:56:01.000 --> 01:56:08.000 out she is dead, she's still alive through the collective unconscious, I would 1331 01:56:08.039 --> 01:56:13.720 say, of the berries merging together and piecing together so he can talk to 1332 01:56:13.760 --> 01:56:20.720 his mom again. Yeah, for data is saved in the Fairyland, which 1333 01:56:20.800 --> 01:56:27.439 is like a which is kind of like that's Stranger Things sort of event. 1334 01:56:27.600 --> 01:56:30.720 Right, Remember, eleven is looking for her mom and her mom is lost 1335 01:56:30.760 --> 01:56:34.720 in the like she's catatonic in the real world, but she's alive in the 1336 01:56:35.399 --> 01:56:41.800 you know, the blackened psychic world or whatever, and she's sort of she's 1337 01:56:41.880 --> 01:56:46.640 kept alive because remember in season two she meets with the other you know numbers 1338 01:56:46.720 --> 01:56:49.399 or whatever, and they like are able to help her, you know, 1339 01:56:49.479 --> 01:56:54.600 reach her mother. So it's different than in the other versions of Peter Pan 1340 01:56:54.760 --> 01:56:57.359 because like in that one, just the parents are just doing their normal thing 1341 01:56:57.399 --> 01:56:59.760 and they're you know, they're gonna keep the window open. And this one 1342 01:56:59.760 --> 01:57:03.079 he's is literally an orphan and they, like you said, they just like 1343 01:57:03.159 --> 01:57:10.560 lift him straight out of the orphanage scene. Yeah, and then after he 1344 01:57:10.640 --> 01:57:17.119 has crowned the prince of this place, the Crystal Kingdom really, so then 1345 01:57:17.159 --> 01:57:23.199 I was like, what does this have to do with high technology, because 1346 01:57:23.239 --> 01:57:28.479 that's what crystals are used for, like warts and holding memory and powering you 1347 01:57:28.520 --> 01:57:34.079 know, chips, and so you've got your mining for technology in the beginning, 1348 01:57:34.760 --> 01:57:40.600 and then you're using your crystal underground technology at the end. He's the 1349 01:57:40.640 --> 01:57:46.960 prince and the hook character gets the tribal girl. I can't remember, I 1350 01:57:47.000 --> 01:57:51.359 think that no, And then he comes back and he saves the orphans from 1351 01:57:51.520 --> 01:57:58.840 the mundane world and he is instead of being kidnapped, the orphans go willingly 1352 01:57:58.920 --> 01:58:09.159 to serve him right there of course, to be being taken away to a 1353 01:58:09.159 --> 01:58:13.880 place where they're neither dead or alive. Yeah, so oh that part I 1354 01:58:14.000 --> 01:58:17.399 forgot. That part reminded me of Brave New World, right where they go 1355 01:58:17.399 --> 01:58:23.000 and meet John is it John Savage when they go into the outer world and 1356 01:58:23.159 --> 01:58:30.600 it's everyone is free from the system, right, But then when they go 1357 01:58:30.680 --> 01:58:33.840 back, you know, everyone walks willingly into their slavery. I suppose probably 1358 01:58:33.880 --> 01:58:40.399 a stretch, but in spirit, it's kind of the same. It's just 1359 01:58:40.600 --> 01:58:45.560 it's this peculiar movie, but it fits right in the theme of what we're 1360 01:58:45.600 --> 01:58:49.520 talking about. And now we are going on two hours, so I think 1361 01:58:49.600 --> 01:58:55.159 maybe we should talk about Hook next time. Hook, because I know that's 1362 01:58:55.159 --> 01:58:57.640 gonna be so funny, and I think I want to watch it again before 1363 01:58:57.880 --> 01:59:00.960 next time, because that's one of those that I've seen million times. Like 1364 01:59:00.079 --> 01:59:08.239 we had a collection of movies that you can record, like pirated movies, 1365 01:59:08.319 --> 01:59:12.560 you know, like the vhs is that have three movies each on them, 1366 01:59:12.600 --> 01:59:16.920 and we had about ten of those. So I've seen like Hook so many 1367 01:59:17.000 --> 01:59:23.920 times that I could probably quote it still. But I want to rewatch it 1368 01:59:24.520 --> 01:59:28.399 because I know you're gonna have some funny takes on it, and I think 1369 01:59:28.520 --> 01:59:33.680 you might want to read this before next time. Ye crazy stuff. Look, 1370 01:59:33.720 --> 01:59:39.680 I mean, look at all of these like it's it's just a little 1371 01:59:39.840 --> 01:59:43.359 novella, maybe like two hours you could read it, not very long, 1372 01:59:43.479 --> 01:59:47.840 but it's super packed with esoteric crap in it. And so we're gonna do 1373 01:59:47.880 --> 01:59:54.319 that, and we're gonna do pants Labyrinth, which is pretty much on theme 1374 01:59:54.520 --> 01:59:59.800 for all of the child abuse and stuff we've been talking about tonight. So 1375 02:00:00.000 --> 02:00:04.039 I want to thank you. We had so much fun, and tell everybody 1376 02:00:04.039 --> 02:00:09.600 where you can be found. Yes, everybody watching this, please go to 1377 02:00:09.680 --> 02:00:14.439 my channel, A based lit Analyzer over on YouTube. Please hit that sub 1378 02:00:14.439 --> 02:00:16.640 button. This has been a lot of fun. We did a for sure 1379 02:00:16.680 --> 02:00:19.560 a part one deep dive, and I don't know anyone who's done a better 1380 02:00:19.560 --> 02:00:24.520 Peter Pan analysis than this one. What do you think I think we you 1381 02:00:24.560 --> 02:00:27.279 know, and we're not even finished because there's a lot more, because I 1382 02:00:27.279 --> 02:00:30.640 didn't even get to you know, We're gonna get to the mac and book. 1383 02:00:30.640 --> 02:00:33.680 I'm gonna talk about Euripides in a little more detail. With the Bakai, 1384 02:00:34.600 --> 02:00:39.640 we're gonna talk about the Bakic rituals. And I didn't even get to 1385 02:00:39.840 --> 02:00:45.479 some of the other weird literary elements like the Sylvia Plath, Ted Hughes Uigi 1386 02:00:45.600 --> 02:00:53.560 board contact of this demon entity called Pan, the Baffamet stuff with Pan's labyrinth, 1387 02:00:54.600 --> 02:00:57.119 So look forward to that one now. It's gonna be a good one, 1388 02:00:57.159 --> 02:01:00.319 folks. Please. And also one more thing, let me do a 1389 02:01:00.359 --> 02:01:03.439 shameless plug here. Check me out. Tomorrow, I'll be on Jim Bob's 1390 02:01:03.479 --> 02:01:08.640 channel. We're gonna be doing a deep, deep dive into Donnie Darko and 1391 02:01:08.800 --> 02:01:15.359 actually the Donnie Darko is this is how I discovered Jay and like twenty ten. 1392 02:01:15.560 --> 02:01:19.880 The essay was twenty ten and the analysis, the you know YouTube annalysis 1393 02:01:19.880 --> 02:01:24.960 was like twenty ten, twenty twelve or something like that. So it's it's, 1394 02:01:25.079 --> 02:01:27.680 you know, one of y'all's in your arena, one of your first. 1395 02:01:27.680 --> 02:01:30.880 So we're gonna be going back into Donnie Darko and doing some deep discussion 1396 02:01:31.199 --> 02:01:33.319 of that over on Jim Bob's channel. So this has been a lot of 1397 02:01:33.319 --> 02:01:36.520 fun. Thank you, Jamie. Yeah nice, Everyone go check out his 1398 02:01:36.640 --> 02:01:42.119 channel. He's definitely part of our squad now and we're gonna have fun next 1399 02:01:42.159 --> 02:01:44.359 week. Thanks for watching. Peace