WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.520 --> 00:00:08.279 This is the baseline discussing the hot button topics of the NBA. Welcome everybody, 2 00:00:08.279 --> 00:00:12.080 your tune to the baseline Calie Warrenshaw discussing the hot button topics of the 3 00:00:12.199 --> 00:00:17.760 NBA. Moving forward. As we're recording our podcast, Man, we are 4 00:00:18.440 --> 00:00:24.199 down to the final four of the illustrious twenty twenty three to twenty four NBA 5 00:00:24.359 --> 00:00:30.280 season. And while there are still four teams remaining, there were four teams 6 00:00:30.679 --> 00:00:39.280 that we must once again put on the white jackets and thoroughly bodium. May 7 00:00:39.320 --> 00:00:46.000 they rest in peace. Our coveted autopsy report series continues forward and as always, 8 00:00:46.000 --> 00:00:48.320 Man, we're gonna roll out the red carpet to my right hand man 9 00:00:48.640 --> 00:00:51.920 www. Dot Shaw Sports dot Netwick on UPNC, my man, mister Shaw, 10 00:00:52.159 --> 00:00:54.039 repping out of Fort Lada to Florida. It was good, brother, 11 00:00:55.000 --> 00:00:57.759 good to be back man, back in the saddle as you lived to four 12 00:00:57.799 --> 00:01:02.159 games, four teams, rather team's gone. Four teams still playing kicking and 13 00:01:02.399 --> 00:01:04.760 kicking and screaming here in the Eastern and Western Conference, respectively, in the 14 00:01:04.760 --> 00:01:08.159 middle of those series as we record. But we got to pay our respect, 15 00:01:08.239 --> 00:01:11.400 as you alluded to, our homage to the dead, the forgotten of 16 00:01:11.480 --> 00:01:17.680 the four teams from the semi finals. And I think the one way that 17 00:01:17.719 --> 00:01:21.079 you can kind of sum this up is that it's the parody of death. 18 00:01:22.599 --> 00:01:30.640 You have the reigning defending champions, who have you know, suffered an untimely 19 00:01:30.680 --> 00:01:38.640 demise. You have the team who many didn't feel with confidence was the best 20 00:01:38.680 --> 00:01:44.760 team out of the Western Conference, who suffered an untimely demise. You have 21 00:01:44.799 --> 00:01:49.079 a team that a lot of people felt, if fully healthy, are arguably 22 00:01:49.519 --> 00:01:55.480 as equal to if not, you know, the Boss and Celtics out of 23 00:01:55.519 --> 00:02:00.319 the East, and they're untimely demise. And you have a team which by 24 00:02:00.319 --> 00:02:01.920 all accounts, man, I don't know if it just stays with you know, 25 00:02:01.920 --> 00:02:05.680 a team that down have n rolls with. It's like no one buys 26 00:02:05.719 --> 00:02:09.439 into whether or not the team is actually legit. And we'll talk more about 27 00:02:09.439 --> 00:02:14.199 this Calves team, which you know now has become you know, the Utah 28 00:02:14.319 --> 00:02:17.400 Jazz of the Eastern Conference and stuff like that. So it's just parody with 29 00:02:17.479 --> 00:02:21.960 the way that we're going to have to autop see these four teams, respectively, 30 00:02:22.000 --> 00:02:24.840 show with the Nuggets, thunder Knicks, and Calves. And I think 31 00:02:24.840 --> 00:02:28.560 that's what to me makes it ironic, Like we can sit here and go 32 00:02:28.639 --> 00:02:30.840 into all of the details about you know, the teams remaining and why they 33 00:02:31.080 --> 00:02:36.080 you know, arguably are the best teams remaining, you know what I'm saying, 34 00:02:36.080 --> 00:02:38.680 given what they've done. But you know, these four teams there were 35 00:02:38.800 --> 00:02:40.800 nothing to sniff at given their body of work through the course of the regular 36 00:02:40.879 --> 00:02:44.759 season, and it just didn't come together for them when it needed to when 37 00:02:44.759 --> 00:02:46.960 it mattered the most, or to speak, which was you know, in 38 00:02:47.000 --> 00:02:53.400 the semi finals. The only team that I'm legitimately surprised is here is Denver 39 00:02:53.319 --> 00:02:58.000 just because of their championship pedigree and the way they came back in their series. 40 00:02:58.039 --> 00:03:00.120 Would have thought they might have had it, you know, especially with 41 00:03:00.159 --> 00:03:04.120 the Game seven on their own floor. And I think the second team closest 42 00:03:04.120 --> 00:03:07.360 to that would be the Knicks by virtue of what they were playing throughout the 43 00:03:07.400 --> 00:03:09.400 playoffs. But they just run out of bodies so obviously, which we'll talk 44 00:03:09.400 --> 00:03:12.560 about when we get to them, you know, more and depthly, But 45 00:03:13.560 --> 00:03:17.400 that's my quick assessment of it. You know, the OKC situation you figure 46 00:03:19.000 --> 00:03:22.599 first year really in you know and experiencing this to get to the second round 47 00:03:22.680 --> 00:03:25.919 is is nothing to be embarrassed about in any capacity and losing to a Luka 48 00:03:27.000 --> 00:03:30.319 Dachs and Kyrie Irving led team. Nothing wrong there. Sure they wish they 49 00:03:30.360 --> 00:03:34.240 could have did more, but again I think there's nothing to hold their head 50 00:03:34.240 --> 00:03:37.039 down about. And then I think in the case of the Cleveland Cavaliers, 51 00:03:37.199 --> 00:03:42.280 it's interesting, you know, analogy with the Utah because of the Donovan Mitchell 52 00:03:42.439 --> 00:03:46.400 led aspect of that, and will donnav and Mitchell even being Cleveland, you 53 00:03:46.400 --> 00:03:49.159 know coming into the summer going into next season, we don't know, but 54 00:03:49.479 --> 00:03:52.840 we're to come on that cast team as news has broken since we decided to 55 00:03:52.879 --> 00:03:55.560 do our autopsy report about Cleveland specifically, so we'll kind of save that for 56 00:03:55.599 --> 00:03:58.960 the last part of our show here because it's a little bit juicy as well. 57 00:03:59.039 --> 00:04:00.639 Yeah. Absolutely, and as always, be sure to get on my 58 00:04:00.639 --> 00:04:03.719 Manshaw as Sports NBA Get at Me a Gay Face Leader shows, Twitter and 59 00:04:03.840 --> 00:04:06.360 on NBA. 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And for those of you on 95 00:06:17.519 --> 00:06:21.120 the YouTube channel, you'll see that we have the promo code listed down the 96 00:06:21.160 --> 00:06:24.920 right hand corner. Say at any time during the show, we ask you 97 00:06:25.040 --> 00:06:29.319 feel free to take advantage of all of the great sports happening with its NHL, 98 00:06:29.519 --> 00:06:34.279 NBA, WNBA that's going on right now, all of it. Prize 99 00:06:34.279 --> 00:06:40.000 Picks is the way to go. More Baseline Cali Warnts y'all Coveted Autopsy report, 100 00:06:40.120 --> 00:06:46.199 don't go away. Time now for our coveted autopsy report. First on 101 00:06:46.319 --> 00:06:51.160 the slab, we're going to talk about the no longer defending champions because by 102 00:06:51.199 --> 00:06:56.920 the time that the NBA season is done, there will be a new NBA 103 00:06:57.079 --> 00:07:00.600 champion. So the one time Denver Nuggets, who all a lot of people 104 00:07:00.680 --> 00:07:05.759 thought that they were expected to repeat, given they may have lost a couple 105 00:07:05.839 --> 00:07:11.519 of ancillary pieces, but maybe they weren't so ancillary, given you know, 106 00:07:11.720 --> 00:07:16.480 just the way that you know they had to struggle just to get themselves in 107 00:07:16.560 --> 00:07:20.720 a position to probably win this series. But it's you know, it's amazing 108 00:07:20.720 --> 00:07:25.759 to me Shaw because as much as we put this on the fact that a 109 00:07:25.800 --> 00:07:29.399 lot of people think that it's because of the core players, I think it's 110 00:07:29.480 --> 00:07:35.160 more so of the step down from the starters, and it's not Jokic. 111 00:07:35.639 --> 00:07:39.839 I think Jamal Murray may get a pass because he has never been one hundred 112 00:07:39.839 --> 00:07:44.439 percent going into the playoffs. But when you look at KCP, you look 113 00:07:44.480 --> 00:07:47.800 at Aaron Gordon, and you look at Michael Porter Junior, which I know 114 00:07:47.839 --> 00:07:51.360 there's gonna be a focal point in our conversation with these guys, I think 115 00:07:51.399 --> 00:07:56.199 you hone in on that, and you say to yourself, the inconsistencies of 116 00:07:56.279 --> 00:08:00.519 getting that type of dominant play that they showed last year in the play layoffs 117 00:08:00.600 --> 00:08:05.800 kind of ridest ugly head when they played against a really good, consistently defensive 118 00:08:05.839 --> 00:08:11.879 minded basketball team like the Minnesota Timberwolves, who up and down the roster all 119 00:08:11.920 --> 00:08:16.399 displayed something and exposed some kind of weakness, you know that Unfortunately, Mike 120 00:08:16.439 --> 00:08:22.240 Malone just couldn't surpass x's and O's out of it just kind of you know, 121 00:08:22.279 --> 00:08:26.879 and there's no there weren't enough yokches on the basketball court for him to 122 00:08:26.959 --> 00:08:31.199 utilize for them to get past you know, his Timberwolves team to probably participate 123 00:08:31.240 --> 00:08:33.639 in this year's Western Conference Finals. Yeah, the depth seemed to really be 124 00:08:33.679 --> 00:08:37.879 an issue, you know, for them, And much was made about the 125 00:08:37.919 --> 00:08:43.320 Minnesota Timberls specifically being built constructed to beat the Denver Nuggets, you know, 126 00:08:43.360 --> 00:08:48.679 and the way Tim Poney assessed that former Nuggets team as a former president general 127 00:08:48.720 --> 00:08:52.279 man over there are now moving over to Minnesota, And again what a difference 128 00:08:52.279 --> 00:08:54.000 of the year makes from the ru to Gobert trade, right, But the 129 00:08:54.000 --> 00:08:58.919 Minnesota, the way Minnesota came in there and stole that game from Denver is 130 00:08:58.000 --> 00:09:03.480 really an interesting I think lesson in terms of the being the hunted and the 131 00:09:03.559 --> 00:09:05.240 hunter if you will, and I think that was, you know, the 132 00:09:05.360 --> 00:09:11.360 Jamal Murray pseudo cop out if you will. Minnesota was just better and ultimately 133 00:09:11.399 --> 00:09:16.399 Denver in some ways, I think to for granted the importance of bench depth, 134 00:09:18.159 --> 00:09:20.039 you would think they still had enough, and I think we all thought 135 00:09:20.080 --> 00:09:24.360 they would probably still have enough, but ultimately they came up short and Yo 136 00:09:24.440 --> 00:09:28.639 Kich and Jamal Murray and like they were gassed, you know, that timber 137 00:09:28.679 --> 00:09:33.000 Wolves team, you know, like they ran them out of random, out 138 00:09:33.000 --> 00:09:35.000 of gas by the time Game seven came. It took so much for Denver 139 00:09:35.080 --> 00:09:39.039 to come back into that series after falling down oh two and credit the championship 140 00:09:39.039 --> 00:09:43.960 grip to actually take control of the series, you know, winning three straight 141 00:09:43.000 --> 00:09:48.399 games, but then ultimately not being able to close it out and hence now 142 00:09:48.679 --> 00:09:50.559 a new champion in the NBA for the six straight year, which is almost 143 00:09:50.600 --> 00:09:54.919 unprecedented for the dynasties that we've seen in the NBA first for such a long 144 00:09:54.960 --> 00:10:00.240 time. I think Denver will be back. I know this is obviously a 145 00:10:00.240 --> 00:10:03.720 really good basketball team, but what can they do now in essence to improve 146 00:10:03.759 --> 00:10:07.360 the depth that they will clearly need. And I don't know that it's so 147 00:10:07.440 --> 00:10:11.960 much of taking the ball out of Jokich's hands, but I think it's taking 148 00:10:11.000 --> 00:10:15.720 the pressure out of Joki should do so much every single night, especially when 149 00:10:15.759 --> 00:10:18.320 the playoffs come to come to town. Hey, he delivered, but I 150 00:10:18.360 --> 00:10:22.879 think you know it was it was kind of tough to watch him not, 151 00:10:22.440 --> 00:10:26.279 you know, shoot over fifty percent, which were very much used to him 152 00:10:26.279 --> 00:10:28.440 doing that, and Jamal Murray being hobbled yet again. They need some more 153 00:10:28.480 --> 00:10:33.919 depth behind Murray that's electric in a way that can take some pressure off of 154 00:10:33.919 --> 00:10:35.600 the offensive load that the bench doesn't seem to have. Right now, you 155 00:10:35.720 --> 00:10:41.240 got you bring up so many different points, I'm going to start a little 156 00:10:41.240 --> 00:10:46.240 controversy, Shaw, Okay, let's go. Do you remember how I talked 157 00:10:46.240 --> 00:10:52.440 about one of the things that concerned me about the beginning of that series between 158 00:10:52.480 --> 00:10:56.320 the Timberwolves and the Nuggets, And I think I saw some glimpses of it 159 00:10:56.360 --> 00:10:58.840 as well too in the series before against you know, the Los Angeles Lakers, 160 00:11:00.480 --> 00:11:03.399 that I think with Jokic, it comes so easy to be as talented 161 00:11:03.440 --> 00:11:09.279 and as good as he is, and I think a lot of his leadership 162 00:11:09.519 --> 00:11:11.320 is manifested in just the way that he goes out in the court and he 163 00:11:11.399 --> 00:11:16.480 just does his thing. And I think it makes it easy for Mike Malone 164 00:11:16.480 --> 00:11:18.639 to get away with the things that he says because he knows that when it's 165 00:11:18.679 --> 00:11:22.519 all said and done, he has to ride the shoulders of Nikola Jokic. 166 00:11:24.559 --> 00:11:31.440 What really struck me, Shaw, was the lack of urgency that I just 167 00:11:31.559 --> 00:11:35.759 saw permeate through the rest of the team. In other words, when I 168 00:11:35.799 --> 00:11:43.679 see a determined Jamal Murray, right, you see it and maybe the injuries 169 00:11:43.919 --> 00:11:50.080 really you know, hampered him, bothered him. It really kind of you 170 00:11:50.080 --> 00:11:54.240 know, took a hold mentally of how much work it was going to take 171 00:11:54.279 --> 00:11:56.600 for him to be able to exert against a team as talented as a Minnesota 172 00:11:56.639 --> 00:12:01.840 Timberwolves, given what his responsibility are, especially in this type of offense, 173 00:12:03.120 --> 00:12:07.240 because it's really predicated on how him and Yokic feed off of each other, 174 00:12:07.399 --> 00:12:11.080 move off of each other. You can clearly see Jamal Murray was being suffocated 175 00:12:11.120 --> 00:12:18.240 everywhere he went. So Aaron Gordon just I just wasn't seeing that hunger. 176 00:12:18.399 --> 00:12:22.120 You see glimpses in the way that he played great, right, but I 177 00:12:22.200 --> 00:12:24.559 just didn't see it throughout the course of the series. And that look, 178 00:12:24.919 --> 00:12:26.519 I'm not gonna say what I know, I'm gonna get to the point about 179 00:12:26.559 --> 00:12:33.480 MPJ. But what I'm getting at seaw with this first point is you're gonna 180 00:12:33.519 --> 00:12:39.440 have to find somebody who is going to help offset the demeanor of what a 181 00:12:39.519 --> 00:12:45.919 Yokic brings for the rest of the guys to understand the moment and to find 182 00:12:45.960 --> 00:12:50.919 another gear. Then leaning on what Jokic shows you and manifests in what he 183 00:12:50.000 --> 00:12:52.799 does, I think it just comes too easy. He can make it work 184 00:12:52.879 --> 00:12:56.120 for him, because you saw how the look on his face in that Game 185 00:12:56.279 --> 00:13:01.080 six getting blown out by forty five. Knew he was going to come in 186 00:13:01.279 --> 00:13:03.360 and you knew he was going to put on a damn good performance. But 187 00:13:03.480 --> 00:13:07.919 for everybody else, that switch doesn't come on right, and it looked like 188 00:13:09.000 --> 00:13:11.879 those guys are just like, damn, this may have been the best opportunity 189 00:13:11.879 --> 00:13:16.759 for us to actually get this done because we don't have the legs, or 190 00:13:16.759 --> 00:13:20.600 we don't have that other gear, or they rested on their laurels knowing that 191 00:13:20.639 --> 00:13:24.279 they had home field advantage for Game seven, and to still not find it 192 00:13:24.320 --> 00:13:30.720 within themselves to do what was necessary. I think spoke loudly about the disconnect 193 00:13:30.919 --> 00:13:35.360 where guys understand not just collectively as a team to what they need to do, 194 00:13:35.720 --> 00:13:39.799 but also more so about the lean the dependency that they have on Jokic. 195 00:13:39.919 --> 00:13:43.639 Well. I think in some ways, the way I'm interpreting that is 196 00:13:43.639 --> 00:13:46.840 that the rest of the team may feel like, hey, that's our lead 197 00:13:46.879 --> 00:13:50.360 horse. He can he can kind of get us through all things. But 198 00:13:50.519 --> 00:13:52.679 you all have a have a proverbial part to play, and you know, 199 00:13:52.679 --> 00:13:56.919 when you run up against a team like Minnesota, and there's obviously not too 200 00:13:56.919 --> 00:14:01.000 many teams like Minnesota, but a hungry team like they or it's going to 201 00:14:01.080 --> 00:14:05.200 require you digging down and figuring out another way to take some of that pressure 202 00:14:05.240 --> 00:14:07.080 off. And what it was in that game seven, right, they scored 203 00:14:07.120 --> 00:14:11.759 like eighty or seventy something points of like the ninety seven points they scored or 204 00:14:11.799 --> 00:14:16.120 whatever, you know, between he and Murray. That that that's problematic. 205 00:14:16.279 --> 00:14:20.000 The other thing that it's interesting because it doesn't get talked about a lot from 206 00:14:20.000 --> 00:14:24.960 from the Denver side because they shoot a decent percentage from three. I think 207 00:14:24.000 --> 00:14:28.639 there were tenth overall in the regular season, but that dropped down. You 208 00:14:28.639 --> 00:14:31.200 know, they shot thirty seven percent from three in the regular season down to 209 00:14:31.240 --> 00:14:33.799 thirty one percent, you know in the playoffs. So the three ball wasn't 210 00:14:33.799 --> 00:14:37.919 falling. And you know, Michael Porter Junior had a very good first race 211 00:14:39.000 --> 00:14:43.960 with Lakers an average or to blow average one against the Timber Bowls KCP. 212 00:14:43.200 --> 00:14:46.960 Also, you know, didn't shoot the ball well in this series. And 213 00:14:46.000 --> 00:14:50.960 then you add that to an ailing Jamal Murray and it's the recipe for disaster, 214 00:14:50.120 --> 00:14:54.399 especially when you need to score points against a staunch defense like Minnesota, 215 00:14:54.440 --> 00:14:58.960 and that's something I think they need to address a couple of other quick points 216 00:15:00.159 --> 00:15:03.240 because when it goes back to the bench, you know, Christian Brown, 217 00:15:03.759 --> 00:15:07.879 he wasn't even looking at the rim. He was like, I think there's 218 00:15:07.879 --> 00:15:09.480 a lot of people who like this young man and feel like he's got a 219 00:15:09.480 --> 00:15:13.320 great future and it could be a good role player. But he's gott at 220 00:15:13.399 --> 00:15:16.519 least look at the rim and then eventually has to be able to stretch the 221 00:15:16.519 --> 00:15:18.679 floor. I think at some point, I think he's more of a you 222 00:15:18.720 --> 00:15:20.480 know, a garbage guy at this point, or you know, kind of 223 00:15:20.519 --> 00:15:24.279 slashing and driving to the garbage, I mean around the rim. You know, 224 00:15:24.360 --> 00:15:28.039 you know put backs and you know back cut back, back cut. 225 00:15:28.080 --> 00:15:31.240 Dunsan. He was supposed to be. He's supposed to be an energy bunny, 226 00:15:31.440 --> 00:15:33.320 right like, I mean, he's supposed to come in and give you 227 00:15:33.399 --> 00:15:37.159 like energy hustle. And even that he was, he was relegated or steimied, 228 00:15:37.440 --> 00:15:41.320 you know, by when you think about their bench, it was the 229 00:15:41.320 --> 00:15:43.600 first person you think of. And some people might say Reggie Jackson, some 230 00:15:43.679 --> 00:15:46.759 might say Brown or whatever the case would be. Kyt Watson didn't really get 231 00:15:46.759 --> 00:15:50.120 a whole lot of minutes in this but he's still more of a defender at 232 00:15:50.120 --> 00:15:56.480 the stage. My point in saying all that Holliday got more run, Yeah, 233 00:15:56.039 --> 00:15:58.159 I don't know. I don't know if that's really the answer. But 234 00:15:58.200 --> 00:16:00.639 at the end of the day, they need to figure out a way to 235 00:16:00.679 --> 00:16:07.080 get more offensive punch off that bench and more consistent three point shooting, whatever 236 00:16:07.120 --> 00:16:08.960 that looks like in the future. And it's interesting because I don't think Bruce 237 00:16:10.000 --> 00:16:14.879 Brown and Jeff Green were you know, three point specialists in any capacity, 238 00:16:14.919 --> 00:16:18.720 but they provided other intangibles that got Denver over the hump in some other ways 239 00:16:18.759 --> 00:16:22.000 last year. Yeah. So look, this to me is the bottom line 240 00:16:22.000 --> 00:16:26.320 of why now I want to focus my attention on Michael Porter Junior for a 241 00:16:26.399 --> 00:16:32.960 second or maybe Michael Porter Junior to me is the greatest anomaly right now in 242 00:16:33.080 --> 00:16:37.799 sports basket in the NBA. I don't understand how a guy with his skill 243 00:16:37.879 --> 00:16:45.639 set, his height, length and advantage can't figure out a way to elevate 244 00:16:45.679 --> 00:16:52.679 his game to a point where I have to question whether or not And remember 245 00:16:52.720 --> 00:16:56.120 Sean I was kind of doing this even last year on whether or not the 246 00:16:56.159 --> 00:17:03.159 combination of him, Murray and Yokic is considered the three, right, like 247 00:17:03.200 --> 00:17:08.759 the trifecta of the team, or it's really Gordon and this performance again, 248 00:17:08.920 --> 00:17:15.839 this inconsistency again rears his ugly head. And part of it is it just 249 00:17:15.880 --> 00:17:22.680 seems like Porter's purpose right now is to shoot the three. It's like he 250 00:17:22.839 --> 00:17:29.839 has totally forgotten that his length could have caused mismatched problems in the paint, 251 00:17:30.799 --> 00:17:34.519 especially if Yokic is getting the ball. It's like, I didn't see Porter 252 00:17:34.599 --> 00:17:40.559 cut. I didn't see him do anything relegated to the basket more than just 253 00:17:40.599 --> 00:17:45.079 the fact that he's just flanking out and just jacking up shots. And to 254 00:17:45.119 --> 00:17:48.599 me, that's the part that just disturbs me more than anything, because that's 255 00:17:48.640 --> 00:17:52.720 exactly what the Nuggets needed. They didn't need more three pointers, they didn't 256 00:17:52.720 --> 00:17:55.880 need more three points shooting. They needed someone to get to the cup. 257 00:17:56.079 --> 00:17:57.640 They needed to get to the free throw line. And it shouldn't have only 258 00:17:57.680 --> 00:18:03.079 been Yokic and Murray, right, and especially with Gordon, who doesn't shoot 259 00:18:03.079 --> 00:18:06.359 a high percentage from the free throw line anyway, this would have been a 260 00:18:06.400 --> 00:18:12.039 great opportunity to really display your versatility by getting to the basket. And I 261 00:18:12.039 --> 00:18:15.079 don't know how many times, Mike. I mean, it was so bad 262 00:18:15.079 --> 00:18:18.160 that even the Minnesota Timbers were confident putting a smaller guy on Porter because they 263 00:18:18.200 --> 00:18:21.799 know he's just gonna sit out there and flank around a three point line. 264 00:18:21.920 --> 00:18:23.519 And if you're Mike Malone, I don't know what you got to do in 265 00:18:23.599 --> 00:18:26.200 order to get this guy to you know. I understand he had a whole 266 00:18:26.200 --> 00:18:30.119 lot of stuff that's going on, especially off the court or whatever, but 267 00:18:30.200 --> 00:18:36.160 this, to me is indicative of the lack of maturation in Michael Porter junior. 268 00:18:36.200 --> 00:18:37.920 And I think a lot of people were talking about when he got drafted 269 00:18:38.000 --> 00:18:41.920 like this is why they say that it's a project, because you should be 270 00:18:41.960 --> 00:18:45.039 able to see this from a mile away. You knew that the Timber was 271 00:18:45.160 --> 00:18:48.960 gonna put you in that position, and the fact that you didn't even attempt, 272 00:18:49.079 --> 00:18:53.839 You didn't even try in one of the most important situations, which was 273 00:18:53.880 --> 00:18:59.440 the last two games of that series, just speaks about whether or not he 274 00:18:59.599 --> 00:19:02.839 really fits in this system. And I think that you have to question that 275 00:19:03.240 --> 00:19:04.720 moving forward, y'all. More than anything else. You can get all the 276 00:19:04.799 --> 00:19:07.799 role players you want, but if you got a guy eating up minutes because 277 00:19:07.799 --> 00:19:11.000 you assume that he's just he should be gelling with the rest of your core 278 00:19:11.079 --> 00:19:15.319 guys. He's got to figure out a way to score points other than just 279 00:19:15.400 --> 00:19:18.319 jacking up shots, because you can see when his shot failed him, he 280 00:19:18.400 --> 00:19:22.000 completely dissipated and disappeared for you know, for the Nuggets throughout most of those 281 00:19:22.000 --> 00:19:26.480 games, and those are wasted minutes. Yeah, I mean, you know, 282 00:19:26.640 --> 00:19:29.559 ten and six, you know, after you know, almost twenty points 283 00:19:29.680 --> 00:19:32.920 or twenty something points per game in the in the Lakers series. You know, 284 00:19:33.119 --> 00:19:34.960 it says a lot. Again, you think you still got a credit 285 00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:38.440 Minnesota's defense here, Right, I think I'm not disagreding in what I'm saying 286 00:19:38.519 --> 00:19:41.680 is that so they had a game plan, but right, I think when 287 00:19:42.119 --> 00:19:45.720 when you see that stuff needs to change, you know, do you actually 288 00:19:45.759 --> 00:19:48.839 adjust or do you continue to kind of, you know, do the same 289 00:19:48.920 --> 00:19:52.599 thing and just say, all right, well, this is what I'm supposed 290 00:19:52.599 --> 00:19:55.480 to be good at, even if it's not working over the course of a 291 00:19:55.480 --> 00:19:56.920 seven game series. And I think, you know, once you get the 292 00:19:56.960 --> 00:20:00.319 game, once you go down on two, I think to be obviously adjusting, 293 00:20:00.559 --> 00:20:03.279 adjusting your play, you know, and then you know, as the 294 00:20:03.279 --> 00:20:07.880 series continues to rest like it really should be about anything to win, so 295 00:20:07.960 --> 00:20:12.599 I would agree I'm disappointed in his inability I think to rise to the proverbial 296 00:20:14.039 --> 00:20:18.039 moment here, especially with Murray being you know, maybe not his his his 297 00:20:18.160 --> 00:20:21.720 normal self, and then it does bring into question, but I don't think 298 00:20:21.759 --> 00:20:25.599 Denver is as asking themselves that question honestly. You know, if they've committed 299 00:20:25.640 --> 00:20:27.359 a crap ton of money to Michael Porter Junior over the next next amount of 300 00:20:27.440 --> 00:20:30.079 years, you know, and this is a core, you know, with 301 00:20:30.599 --> 00:20:33.480 that four of Gordon, Porter, obviously, Jokich and Murray, I think 302 00:20:33.480 --> 00:20:38.640 those guys are are pretty much locked in and all the pieces around it are 303 00:20:38.720 --> 00:20:44.599 probably subject to some semblance of change. But they have a pretty high salary 304 00:20:44.680 --> 00:20:47.920 right now, and they're gonna be scratching, you know, getting into repeaters 305 00:20:48.000 --> 00:20:51.119 centrom here in a little bit. Don't know what they'll be able to do. 306 00:20:51.319 --> 00:20:55.640 You'd figure playing with Yokich is hey should be everyone's dream, But how 307 00:20:55.640 --> 00:20:59.640 many other guys like Aaron Gordon are out there like what roles can Can they 308 00:20:59.680 --> 00:21:04.039 really feel around what this team has and needs and then pay somebody here properly? 309 00:21:04.079 --> 00:21:07.240 I think guys are gonna have to want to take less money, and 310 00:21:07.279 --> 00:21:11.359 now that they're not the defending champions anymore, that might be a little bit 311 00:21:11.400 --> 00:21:14.680 harder to come by than it was going into this past summer. All right, 312 00:21:14.720 --> 00:21:18.480 So you so you stay, you know, Malone and guys, they're 313 00:21:18.480 --> 00:21:23.440 gonna figure this out with with MPJ, and they're gonna probably ride on the 314 00:21:23.480 --> 00:21:27.799 idea that they're really gonna do some searching, you know, to help bulk 315 00:21:27.880 --> 00:21:33.119 up and beef up that that bench. I mean, listen, Eventually something's 316 00:21:33.119 --> 00:21:36.039 gonna have to give as well, too, especially from the center position. 317 00:21:36.160 --> 00:21:38.759 Also, because you can't keep running your kitch out there like that. There's 318 00:21:38.759 --> 00:21:42.559 only gonna be so much before you leave them susceptible to injuries and stuff. 319 00:21:42.559 --> 00:21:47.440 So I get that part of it, but ultimately to the fact that you 320 00:21:47.519 --> 00:21:49.039 have to address like the other thing as well too, is that it would 321 00:21:49.079 --> 00:21:55.039 be nice to see Jamal Murray get back to being more the two guard than 322 00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:57.920 just only the primary point guard. I think to your point that that in 323 00:21:57.960 --> 00:22:00.839 and of itself was part of the tangibles and why Bruce Brown was so important 324 00:22:00.839 --> 00:22:06.720 because he played a hybrid point guard play and was able to run him out 325 00:22:06.720 --> 00:22:08.279 there. I don't think you can continue to do that with Reggie Jackson, 326 00:22:08.319 --> 00:22:11.880 and clearly Malone didn't have the confidence enough to do that to run Jackson out 327 00:22:11.880 --> 00:22:15.000 there, because you could have basically switched it up and had Jackson murray On 328 00:22:15.319 --> 00:22:19.200 playing off the two. But you can only do that for so long. 329 00:22:19.279 --> 00:22:23.319 So clearly they're gonna probably have to upgrade that point guard position, whether it 330 00:22:23.359 --> 00:22:27.039 be via starter or via through somebody that you're gonna come in is gonna be 331 00:22:27.079 --> 00:22:30.119 the true six man coming off the bench to take up those minutes and move 332 00:22:30.200 --> 00:22:36.319 Jamal back over to the two old player options for both KCP and Reggie Jackson 333 00:22:36.359 --> 00:22:40.920 next year, and imagine both of those guys takes that options and so that 334 00:22:41.039 --> 00:22:44.359 you know, puts Denver at roughly one hundred and ninety million in change. 335 00:22:44.599 --> 00:22:47.640 So it's it's gonna be It's gonna be tough. DeAndre Jordan comes off the 336 00:22:47.680 --> 00:22:49.759 books, Justin Holliday comes off the books. You can resign those guys at 337 00:22:49.759 --> 00:22:52.680 better, more minimums if you if you just need the bench depth. But 338 00:22:53.000 --> 00:22:57.319 I will be intrigued by the aspect of who they go after. As we 339 00:22:57.359 --> 00:23:00.440 said, the free agent class is an amazing but it's not amazing from in 340 00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:03.839 terms of stars. They don't need stars, you know, they need competency, 341 00:23:03.920 --> 00:23:07.720 if you will, and guys who are going to be able to stay 342 00:23:07.720 --> 00:23:08.680 on the floor. And I think they will be able to find that in 343 00:23:08.720 --> 00:23:12.039 this just phrasia class. But those guys have to take a pay cut to 344 00:23:12.039 --> 00:23:17.680 play with the Great Yo Kitchen the number Nuggets. All right, well let 345 00:23:17.720 --> 00:23:18.839 it be said, man, the Denver Nuggets got to do a little bit 346 00:23:18.880 --> 00:23:22.960 of soul searching, man, because the Minnesota Temple will snatch that right out 347 00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:26.960 they chest. You know what I'm saying, your terms of the baseline. 348 00:23:26.960 --> 00:23:30.920 Cali warrns y'all discussing the hot button topics of the NBA. Coming up, 349 00:23:30.960 --> 00:23:36.039 we'll talk about the number one seeded Oklahoma City Thunder and their demise. But 350 00:23:36.160 --> 00:23:40.519 was it really a demis or was it just more so us kind of recognizing 351 00:23:40.640 --> 00:23:45.279 that, hey, they have arrived and we may have to take notice come 352 00:23:45.319 --> 00:23:48.680 next year just how damn good they can possibly be. You find out here 353 00:23:48.680 --> 00:23:52.440 on the other side. Don't go away. We're back. Cali Warrnshaw based 354 00:23:52.440 --> 00:23:57.079 on NBA podcast, continuing our covet At autopsy report, and now we're going 355 00:23:57.119 --> 00:24:00.000 to focus our attention on Oklahoma City Thunder team that came out as the number 356 00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:03.440 one seed in the Western Conference. A lot of chirping from a lot of 357 00:24:03.480 --> 00:24:10.400 analysts who believed that the Yoklahoma City Thunder weren't deserving to be a number one 358 00:24:10.440 --> 00:24:14.920 seeded team. Some of even said that they were the weakest number one seeded 359 00:24:14.920 --> 00:24:18.000 team in the Western Conference in NBA history, which, you know, that's 360 00:24:18.039 --> 00:24:22.880 just fodder for clicks in my opinion. But obviously this team fell short of 361 00:24:22.920 --> 00:24:26.960 the expectations that as a number one seed you should at least be in the 362 00:24:26.960 --> 00:24:32.640 Western Conference finals. But listen, man, they played against a really, 363 00:24:32.720 --> 00:24:40.160 really difficult, you know, Dallas Mavericks team that was on another level when 364 00:24:40.160 --> 00:24:42.799 it made its trades after the trade deadline. Clearly was not the same Dallas 365 00:24:42.799 --> 00:24:47.359 Mavericks team that we would have made our predictions off of, and I think 366 00:24:47.400 --> 00:24:53.400 because of that, it really had us taking a second look on whether or 367 00:24:53.440 --> 00:24:59.640 not this young team could overcome its circumstances, which is young and has never 368 00:24:59.720 --> 00:25:04.480 really been in that situation against you know, one, an NBA champion, 369 00:25:04.839 --> 00:25:11.599 right, two some guys who have already gotten quite a bit of playoff experience, 370 00:25:11.039 --> 00:25:15.880 and three, arguably you know one of the more well respected head coaches 371 00:25:17.400 --> 00:25:22.799 in the NBA who is able to coach up and utilize a very well rounded 372 00:25:22.839 --> 00:25:26.839 and dangerous Dallas Mavericks team. But let it not be said, y'all, 373 00:25:26.880 --> 00:25:30.200 it's okay. See thunder team put the world on notice that this wasn't fake 374 00:25:30.880 --> 00:25:34.160 and that them getting that number one seed mere bag of shells. Now it's 375 00:25:34.160 --> 00:25:38.519 a question of how many wins come next year can this team amass and really 376 00:25:38.559 --> 00:25:41.839 what room of improvement it can be done. Is it more of the roster 377 00:25:41.960 --> 00:25:45.480 or just more about these guys taking that next step, all of them elevating 378 00:25:45.519 --> 00:25:52.279 themselves to that next level. I think there's some roster construction, not issues, 379 00:25:52.359 --> 00:25:56.799 but things they can tweak to be more competitive. The physicality seem to 380 00:25:56.799 --> 00:26:00.559 be a little bit of an issue. So do they find some more size 381 00:26:00.640 --> 00:26:04.279 behind Chet who's obviously slighter frame, you know, playing that five position, 382 00:26:04.519 --> 00:26:08.240 and whether you think he's truly a four or whether he can man the middle 383 00:26:08.240 --> 00:26:11.200 if you will, as a five man is not even enough for debate for 384 00:26:11.279 --> 00:26:15.480 me. The aspect is like he's still gonna need somebody takes some pressure off 385 00:26:15.519 --> 00:26:18.279 of him in these years. Okay, see what they did a lot of 386 00:26:18.279 --> 00:26:22.359 people said they should have did more at the deadline addressing that specific need, 387 00:26:22.400 --> 00:26:25.720 like, hey, you need more size, you need more rebounding, more 388 00:26:25.720 --> 00:26:30.400 physicality. And the MAVs, unbeknownst to us, when and got guys who 389 00:26:30.400 --> 00:26:33.880 were more physical and Gafford and PJ. Washington really bolster their lineup. But 390 00:26:33.960 --> 00:26:37.279 they thought, well, let's see how it goes. And I can't necessarily 391 00:26:37.319 --> 00:26:41.279 fault them for that. They make one small move a getting Gordon Hayward or 392 00:26:41.319 --> 00:26:44.200 whatever the case, that doesn't really pan out. Don't think he'll be back 393 00:26:44.279 --> 00:26:47.759 next year, and he's already complaining about the role that he had or didn't 394 00:26:47.759 --> 00:26:49.440 have, I guess with this team. But to me, that's where Okaysee 395 00:26:49.559 --> 00:26:52.359 is going to try to focus on. And they still have draft equity. 396 00:26:52.599 --> 00:26:56.279 Remember Sam Presty is, you know, is the draft king in terms of 397 00:26:56.319 --> 00:27:00.799 being able to just hobble picks together and then and actually doing something with him 398 00:27:00.799 --> 00:27:03.519 wherever he's picking, whether he's in the top five, whether there's in a 399 00:27:03.519 --> 00:27:07.119 lot of room in the back half or the second round. He seems to 400 00:27:07.119 --> 00:27:11.440 be able to mind guys who are good basketball players. So that's why there's 401 00:27:11.440 --> 00:27:14.039 a lot of optimism for this team, and yeah, they felt like they 402 00:27:14.079 --> 00:27:17.440 should have moved on to the conference finals. Sure, some people said they 403 00:27:17.440 --> 00:27:19.359 were pay per number one, you know seeds in the Western Conference. But 404 00:27:19.480 --> 00:27:22.799 this team is here to stay. Sga is a legitimate and the perennial MVP 405 00:27:23.000 --> 00:27:26.519 candidate. You know my guy, you know j Dubb that's that's one of 406 00:27:26.519 --> 00:27:30.880 my dudes. And we're also hearing as we're recording today that Josh Getty might 407 00:27:30.920 --> 00:27:36.839 be on the move, so you know, they Guddy is not a bad 408 00:27:37.000 --> 00:27:40.720 basketball player. He obviously has some off the court issues as well and then 409 00:27:40.880 --> 00:27:42.799 seem to be maybe a little bit unplayable because of his lack of shooting. 410 00:27:42.799 --> 00:27:47.680 But there's there's teams who will take a not say take a chance, would 411 00:27:47.680 --> 00:27:49.839 be willing to you know, pick him up and maybe even give something for 412 00:27:49.920 --> 00:27:53.200 okay see, to continue bollstering the rest of their lineup. So all is 413 00:27:53.359 --> 00:27:56.640 really rosy and okay see, despite a disappointing loss in six games starts, 414 00:27:56.680 --> 00:28:00.839 I guarantee you the Denver Nuggets would have loved to Vowegiohn on their roster. 415 00:28:02.559 --> 00:28:07.599 Right, all great points. The one thing that I disagree with with people's 416 00:28:07.599 --> 00:28:15.039 perception about what the Oklahoma City Thunder, you know, having to do something 417 00:28:15.039 --> 00:28:18.559 that the trade deadline is. Look at where the Oklahoma City Thunder was at 418 00:28:18.559 --> 00:28:23.680 the time of the trade deadline to what they had gotten themselves or positioned themselves 419 00:28:23.720 --> 00:28:27.200 to do. You know, the question wasn't about whether or not this Oklahoma 420 00:28:27.240 --> 00:28:33.200 City Thunder team was competing against the Dallas Mavericks. By all accounts, while 421 00:28:33.240 --> 00:28:37.680 the Dallas Mavericks made some really solid moves, Dallas Mavericks were in a you 422 00:28:37.680 --> 00:28:42.200 know, quandary themselves. They had to make sure that they played themselves out 423 00:28:42.240 --> 00:28:47.119 of the play in situation. Right, So it wasn't like, you know, 424 00:28:47.200 --> 00:28:52.000 those particular pieces were just going to sell catapult them to the top seeded. 425 00:28:52.039 --> 00:28:56.799 The Oklahoma City Thunder had been hanging around the top three primarily for most 426 00:28:56.839 --> 00:29:00.920 of this season, you know what I'm saying. It wasn't until the Denver 427 00:29:00.039 --> 00:29:03.799 Nuggets made a surge, right. It was really the Oklahoma City Thunder and 428 00:29:03.839 --> 00:29:08.359 the Minnesota Timberwolves jockeying for that number one seed, Okay, and all of 429 00:29:08.400 --> 00:29:11.200 them had little hiccups here and there through the course of the year. So 430 00:29:11.359 --> 00:29:17.160 if I'm pressty, if I'm Dagonol. I'm saying to myself, look at 431 00:29:17.240 --> 00:29:21.200 how my guys are growing through the season. Look at how they're elevating through 432 00:29:21.240 --> 00:29:22.799 the season. You go in and you try to just get some guy, 433 00:29:22.839 --> 00:29:26.200 and you're gonna assume, you know, you know, get a guy that's 434 00:29:26.200 --> 00:29:30.240 gonna come in and what be a sudden rebounder you want check Holmgren getting those 435 00:29:30.240 --> 00:29:33.160 minutes. You want to see can he match himself up against the bigger front 436 00:29:33.200 --> 00:29:37.279 courts that are out there? Right so they knew this going in. If 437 00:29:37.319 --> 00:29:41.720 you go in, you start throwing out capital. Not to say that you 438 00:29:41.720 --> 00:29:45.160 don't have confidence in them getting it, but it's the wrong fit. Right. 439 00:29:45.960 --> 00:29:48.759 Then you put yourself in a position where you're now hampered with a guy 440 00:29:48.759 --> 00:29:49.799 that you don't know if you're gonna be able to get rid of them. 441 00:29:49.920 --> 00:29:53.359 You can't offload the contract. And then now you got to figure out you 442 00:29:53.400 --> 00:29:56.119 got to put something more on Dagonolf's plate to figure out how to use him 443 00:29:56.160 --> 00:30:00.480 for the upcoming season. Doesn't make any sense. I understand they went and 444 00:30:00.559 --> 00:30:03.799 got Gordon because even we said, it's a pretty good move by them, 445 00:30:03.000 --> 00:30:07.599 nothing splashy, but well needed and necessary for what they were lacking at the 446 00:30:07.640 --> 00:30:14.640 time. Okay, now we fast forward and we see how teams based on 447 00:30:14.680 --> 00:30:18.440 the moves that they have made. What that meant. I would challenge you 448 00:30:18.480 --> 00:30:22.319 to say, Shaw, while the idea is to get a big, my 449 00:30:22.480 --> 00:30:26.599 thing is get you some physicality from the front court side of it. Doesn't 450 00:30:26.640 --> 00:30:30.680 necessarily have to be a center. Could have been a wing player, you 451 00:30:30.720 --> 00:30:33.839 know what I'm saying, Because it's obvious that the MAVs were able to use 452 00:30:34.000 --> 00:30:40.799 their bigs in a way just as undersized Lively is just as undersized as home 453 00:30:40.799 --> 00:30:45.240 Grin, but he played much more physical and much stronger because he understood what 454 00:30:45.359 --> 00:30:48.880 was required for this MAVs team given the type of players he had around them. 455 00:30:49.279 --> 00:30:52.799 So all I'm saying is is that I think this comes down to what's 456 00:30:52.839 --> 00:31:00.720 the next step for j Dubb, for Isaiah, Joe, for Loot Door 457 00:31:00.160 --> 00:31:04.160 for you know, each of these guys are all gonna take another step forward 458 00:31:04.240 --> 00:31:08.240 in what made them so great for this season, and will it equate to 459 00:31:08.319 --> 00:31:12.799 the level of greatness that we're seeing from the remaining teams now, which is 460 00:31:12.799 --> 00:31:17.799 the MAVs and the Timberwolves in kind that they're going to be able to match 461 00:31:17.880 --> 00:31:21.359 up with them, and then when you tell me homegrown can't hang with these 462 00:31:21.440 --> 00:31:23.279 dudes, homegren can't. All right, now, you got to really look 463 00:31:23.319 --> 00:31:27.960 at how do you offset that in order to balance out what the roster is 464 00:31:29.039 --> 00:31:32.519 giving you in order to make them as effective as they are. It's a 465 00:31:32.519 --> 00:31:36.319 tricky situation. We've seen where the thunder Of attempted to do things like this 466 00:31:36.599 --> 00:31:40.359 and they failed miserably at it. So I like the idea that they held 467 00:31:40.440 --> 00:31:44.440 pat because now this comes down to our guys are gonna take that next step, 468 00:31:44.440 --> 00:31:47.839 and if they take that next step, you're just feeling down the roster 469 00:31:47.920 --> 00:31:51.640 to be as deep and as dangerous as ever. Yeah, I mean real 470 00:31:51.720 --> 00:31:53.720 talk. And you know, if they were to move off of Giddy, 471 00:31:53.799 --> 00:31:56.519 that freeze up now eight million, but they're already well below. They're only 472 00:31:56.720 --> 00:32:00.440 one hundred and two million dollars level. All the teams we've talked about, 473 00:32:00.039 --> 00:32:05.359 no team this deep that got this, even the playoff, has a salary 474 00:32:05.559 --> 00:32:09.559 that low because they have all pretty much young players commanding that shit. Obviously, 475 00:32:09.720 --> 00:32:13.400 she is on his on his second deal here, so he's in the 476 00:32:13.400 --> 00:32:16.200 thirty to forty million dollar range now, but everybody else is ten million or 477 00:32:16.279 --> 00:32:21.279 under like that. That is a wild and then it's an amazing place to 478 00:32:21.279 --> 00:32:23.319 be from an organizational structure. So it backs up everything you just said. 479 00:32:23.319 --> 00:32:28.359 It's like, listen, why they had the money that they could have thrown 480 00:32:28.400 --> 00:32:30.359 to kind of maybe do something while if they wanted to. But does that 481 00:32:30.480 --> 00:32:35.119 upset the team chemistry? Why not play it out see how this team does. 482 00:32:35.200 --> 00:32:37.599 Let them not knowing, they take their lumps, but learn and experience 483 00:32:38.200 --> 00:32:42.400 and then see where you need to adjust. And now it allows them to 484 00:32:42.440 --> 00:32:45.839 be major players. And again not necessarily from the free agent side, but 485 00:32:45.920 --> 00:32:49.880 in the trade market if they want to, because Prescy's done such a great 486 00:32:49.920 --> 00:32:53.200 job in acquiring draft capital, they could move a guy like Giddy if they 487 00:32:53.240 --> 00:32:55.720 so wanted to. They could move a guy like Door if they were so 488 00:32:55.839 --> 00:32:59.680 inclined. I don't think they would, but I think those are the pieces 489 00:32:59.720 --> 00:33:04.119 that are available to them. And then I think, if I'm not mistaken, 490 00:33:04.240 --> 00:33:07.759 Isaiah, Joe has as a as a team option. I don't think 491 00:33:07.759 --> 00:33:10.160 they picked it up. If they didn't, I can see Pressey doing the 492 00:33:10.519 --> 00:33:15.119 right thing here in declining the option with the wink wink agreement, Like, 493 00:33:15.160 --> 00:33:16.440 hey, Joe, we need to pay you more than like two point seven 494 00:33:16.440 --> 00:33:20.799 million dollars, like you're valuable to us, So go ahead and knocked out 495 00:33:20.799 --> 00:33:23.039 of that, or we'll decline that option and then he can resign for something 496 00:33:23.079 --> 00:33:27.039 that's more in the you know, to twelve to fourteen million dollars range as 497 00:33:27.039 --> 00:33:29.599 well too, because remember there's also a salary floor. Okay, so he 498 00:33:29.599 --> 00:33:31.599 needs to be going into the start of next season. So there's a lot 499 00:33:31.640 --> 00:33:37.400 of machinations that are happening here with the thunder, but all of it is 500 00:33:37.680 --> 00:33:42.160 good. Home Grid really will be and essentially his second year playing, third 501 00:33:42.200 --> 00:33:44.880 year in the league next year, so all the things that he learned from 502 00:33:44.880 --> 00:33:47.799 this playoff run he'll be able to take into so health health provided. This 503 00:33:47.880 --> 00:33:51.920 is a team that should be in the think of the Western Conference conversation for 504 00:33:51.960 --> 00:33:55.160 a very long time. And one last point seaw before we transition, you 505 00:33:55.200 --> 00:34:00.960 know, the conversation, you know to the next thing that we're gonna autopsy. 506 00:34:01.839 --> 00:34:08.559 What we also saw as well, too, is a young team that 507 00:34:08.559 --> 00:34:15.480 that didn't understand where they needed to be to be as good as they got, 508 00:34:15.880 --> 00:34:19.039 right, Like it just finally kind of came out. It just kind 509 00:34:19.039 --> 00:34:21.880 of just just showed itself so to speak. You know what I mean, 510 00:34:21.920 --> 00:34:24.679 Like, I don't know why everybody is making this big deal if you really 511 00:34:24.679 --> 00:34:30.119 think about it, outside of the Denver nugget Shaw, nobody has truly dominated 512 00:34:30.159 --> 00:34:32.519 the Western Conference. So when people keep talking about, oh, you know, 513 00:34:35.199 --> 00:34:37.119 they weren't deserving to be the number one seeded team, I'm sorry, 514 00:34:38.679 --> 00:34:44.960 I argue. When was there ever outside of the Denver Nuggets, a true 515 00:34:45.400 --> 00:34:49.039 dominant number one seed. That's the whole point. This is why everyone kept 516 00:34:49.039 --> 00:34:52.760 saying the Western Conference is the most challenging. It is a gauntlet from one 517 00:34:52.800 --> 00:34:58.199 to ten. And the Oklahoma City Thunder won the games that they need to 518 00:34:58.239 --> 00:35:01.320 win to best position themselves to make as deep a run with the type of 519 00:35:01.440 --> 00:35:07.639 roster that they had to get to the semi finals. I do not fall 520 00:35:07.199 --> 00:35:09.840 you know what I'm saying. You talking about playing the game. They played 521 00:35:09.840 --> 00:35:15.280 the game not just intelligently, they've played it smartly, and they even realized 522 00:35:15.519 --> 00:35:20.840 that they probably could have been playing in the Western Conference finals a few you 523 00:35:20.880 --> 00:35:25.039 know, ball bounces their way a couple of times here and there, they 524 00:35:25.079 --> 00:35:30.400 probably are going to be representing the Western Conference finalists other than the Dallas Mavericks 525 00:35:30.519 --> 00:35:34.440 you know what I'm saying. And let's not forget the Dallas Mavericks were in 526 00:35:34.440 --> 00:35:37.559 this position with Luka Doncic a few years ago, back in twenty nineteen, 527 00:35:37.800 --> 00:35:42.760 so it isn't as like again, I just want people to truly understand that 528 00:35:42.840 --> 00:35:46.400 when we're talking about the Oklahoma City Thunder and what they've shown us, they've 529 00:35:46.440 --> 00:35:51.440 shown us that they can easily be a legit number one seeded team, no 530 00:35:51.519 --> 00:35:53.639 different than you could have easily put the Timberwolves, no different than you could 531 00:35:53.639 --> 00:35:57.360 have put the Denver Nuggets, no different than you could have put the Dallas 532 00:35:57.400 --> 00:36:00.360 Mavericks. If this is Dallas Mavericks team that people are watching right now, 533 00:36:00.440 --> 00:36:02.519 was at the beginning of the season, they probably would have as many wins 534 00:36:02.519 --> 00:36:06.840 as the other three teams that were there and not be a four to five 535 00:36:06.920 --> 00:36:09.039 seed, a five seeded team, you know what I'm saying. So again 536 00:36:09.159 --> 00:36:14.920 people need to slow their role and with the disrespect about what you saw from 537 00:36:14.920 --> 00:36:19.800 this team, because they showed you how dangerous and versatile they are, and 538 00:36:19.880 --> 00:36:23.920 Presty still got pieces to play with before he actually has what is now being 539 00:36:24.039 --> 00:36:31.199 dubbed as probably a dynastic run for the Oklahoma City Thunder team of successful winning 540 00:36:31.280 --> 00:36:35.599 seasons, which was something that you couldn't count going all the way back to 541 00:36:35.639 --> 00:36:39.400 when it was the Big Three with Durant, Harden and Westbrook. Yeah, 542 00:36:39.760 --> 00:36:46.119 they still have clips in and it's about to be unleashed. So this is 543 00:36:46.159 --> 00:36:50.000 going to be in their league. There's not a younger team in the NBA, 544 00:36:50.039 --> 00:36:52.840 and there's not a team I think I'd rather be moving forward than Okay 545 00:36:52.840 --> 00:36:57.679 see right now, especially with that cost control that they have over two of 546 00:36:57.679 --> 00:37:00.960 their main pieces, especially with Jay Dubb and chenhol Then amazing, amazing, 547 00:37:01.000 --> 00:37:05.639 amazing job by Presty crazy in organization. You're tuned to the baseline, Cali 548 00:37:05.639 --> 00:37:08.719 warns y'all discussing the hot button topics of the NBA coming out. We're going 549 00:37:08.760 --> 00:37:12.679 to focus our attention on the New York Knicks team that was hampered so much 550 00:37:12.719 --> 00:37:15.960 by injuries. But damn were they ever so close from putting themselves back into 551 00:37:16.000 --> 00:37:20.559 the Eastern Conference finals, something that they haven't done in over a decade. 552 00:37:20.800 --> 00:37:24.159 You'll hear more about that on the other side. Don't go away, We're 553 00:37:24.280 --> 00:37:30.320 back. Cali Warrnshaw basedline NBA podcast, continuing our autopsy report and now we'll 554 00:37:30.320 --> 00:37:35.599 focus our attention on the New York Knicks, and look what more can be 555 00:37:35.679 --> 00:37:40.000 said? Man, this team you talk about going all out, like throwing 556 00:37:40.039 --> 00:37:46.719 it all in. You know this team, And it's ironic because I think 557 00:37:46.840 --> 00:37:51.679 while a lot of people want to hate on the New York Knicks because of 558 00:37:51.679 --> 00:37:53.480 the New York Knicks fan base and the way that they kind of operate, 559 00:37:53.519 --> 00:37:58.519 at times, you can't help but feel like, damn, you feel bad 560 00:37:58.559 --> 00:38:00.480 for the fan base, and you feel bad for the players, you know, 561 00:38:02.039 --> 00:38:08.039 to fall short and to not be able to kind of see themselves in 562 00:38:08.079 --> 00:38:14.280 this Cinderella situation sort of speak shaw I think speaks a lot more to like, 563 00:38:14.840 --> 00:38:17.599 Man, don't we wish that this script was rewritten just a little bit 564 00:38:17.760 --> 00:38:24.559 for us to properly assess whether or not this was hyperbole or this is the 565 00:38:24.639 --> 00:38:30.239 truth about what the Knicks showed us and the way that they played not just 566 00:38:30.280 --> 00:38:32.679 through the course of the season, but all the way leading up to that 567 00:38:32.719 --> 00:38:37.880 Game seven against the Indiana Pacers. I mean, there is a lot to 568 00:38:37.000 --> 00:38:42.840 cheer about. Me personally, I am so ecstatic for this Knicks team, 569 00:38:42.880 --> 00:38:47.840 just simply because the organization finally got it right with the way that they constructed 570 00:38:47.920 --> 00:38:52.559 this roster, and I hope that they take this, they bottle it up, 571 00:38:52.960 --> 00:38:57.760 they leave it on their desk right, walk away from it for a 572 00:38:57.800 --> 00:39:00.920 couple of weeks, you know whatever. Come back after draft and whatever, 573 00:39:01.639 --> 00:39:06.760 and look at that that that that that bottle again. Before you open that 574 00:39:06.840 --> 00:39:12.320 nonsense up, you you clear out everybody that's gonna be talking some craziness about 575 00:39:12.559 --> 00:39:15.480 you know, gotta go big free agency, this, that, and the 576 00:39:15.559 --> 00:39:20.480 third stay keep your eye on the prize. That is what I'm hoping for 577 00:39:20.480 --> 00:39:23.320 for this New York Knicks, the organization and team. Well, before we 578 00:39:23.360 --> 00:39:27.239 get into the basketball side of it, I'm gonna say something that's a little 579 00:39:27.239 --> 00:39:30.559 tongue in cheek here. While I agree with you, I don't think they 580 00:39:30.599 --> 00:39:35.000 need to go, you know, big game hunting into whatever free agent or 581 00:39:35.320 --> 00:39:38.559 player says that are unhappy and becomes available. What I think they ultimately need 582 00:39:38.599 --> 00:39:43.079 to do, and I'm not disparaging their their current staff here now, but 583 00:39:43.159 --> 00:39:45.920 they need to is as long as this as the coach, they need to 584 00:39:45.079 --> 00:39:52.239 invest in UH an elite level training staff and an elite level recovery team. 585 00:39:52.400 --> 00:39:55.360 And and I say that with the utmost respect because I think at this point 586 00:39:55.440 --> 00:40:01.519 it's it's foolish to combat what this is gonna do, Like he's he's gonna 587 00:40:01.519 --> 00:40:06.599 Thibodaux was gonna Thibodeaux, and at this stage we understand that. So I 588 00:40:06.639 --> 00:40:09.039 think, if this is who you've hit your wagon to as as a lead 589 00:40:09.199 --> 00:40:15.800 coach, understanding that players are going to play heavy minutes, you might as 590 00:40:15.800 --> 00:40:19.360 well invest in the supplemental and auxiliary staff that helped those players when it comes 591 00:40:19.400 --> 00:40:22.920 to recovery and injury management to some degree. So I would have loved to 592 00:40:22.960 --> 00:40:28.719 see this next team healthy. And there's a lot because we won't know that 593 00:40:28.840 --> 00:40:30.360 said, hey, this team could have made a finals run, and they 594 00:40:30.719 --> 00:40:37.400 could have. They very well could have had everybody been there. But with 595 00:40:37.519 --> 00:40:39.960 Randall being lost for you know, a large chunk of the year, and 596 00:40:39.960 --> 00:40:45.760 Annobe being in and out after his acquisition from Toronto, it just it just 597 00:40:46.000 --> 00:40:52.159 was too much to overcome, even Bogdanovich going down that, Mitchell Robinson going 598 00:40:52.199 --> 00:40:54.760 down. Hartenstein missed parts of the regular season as well too, you know, 599 00:40:54.920 --> 00:40:59.800 think the Achilles situation, it was it was a rough year, you 600 00:40:59.840 --> 00:41:02.400 know, when it comes to battling injuries. But this the team the heart 601 00:41:02.960 --> 00:41:07.400 that this team showed is something that is really great for the NBA and great 602 00:41:07.400 --> 00:41:13.280 for the hustlers in the league. If you will, like not everybody's going 603 00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:16.000 to be elite. When we talk about elite guys, you better mention mister 604 00:41:16.079 --> 00:41:21.079 Jalen Brunson, whatever the hell Bicky Hammon have to say about him not being 605 00:41:21.119 --> 00:41:24.159 a guy, whatever people said about him signing the contract. You know, 606 00:41:24.199 --> 00:41:29.239 I wouldn't pay Yellant rushing twenty five million dollars or whatever it was. He's 607 00:41:29.280 --> 00:41:32.599 all that and then some and so the next half, didn't we say, 608 00:41:34.000 --> 00:41:36.280 on my hands, you know what that guy? Didn't we say this though? 609 00:41:36.639 --> 00:41:43.360 Didn't didn't we say this right? And and and I said the way 610 00:41:43.400 --> 00:41:49.440 I described this was, if the Knicks don't do this right, if they 611 00:41:49.440 --> 00:41:54.159 don't do this right, they will do more damage to the person that they're 612 00:41:54.239 --> 00:42:00.320 signing than they even imagine or realize. Because if the talk is still about 613 00:42:00.719 --> 00:42:05.199 Donovan Mitchell, if the talk is still about them missing again on signing who 614 00:42:05.239 --> 00:42:08.079 they were coveting and talking about, I mean to the damn point where like 615 00:42:08.159 --> 00:42:12.480 even the NBA had to be like, are you guys tampering? Is that 616 00:42:12.519 --> 00:42:14.519 what's going on here. You know what I'm saying, I mean, you're 617 00:42:14.519 --> 00:42:16.880 we tampering with this notion that he had to be You know what I'm saying, 618 00:42:16.880 --> 00:42:21.480 we gotta go after Donovan, but give credit. And this is what 619 00:42:21.559 --> 00:42:27.360 I'm saying, give credit to Jalen Brunson because I wasn't sure what kind of 620 00:42:27.400 --> 00:42:31.440 mentality he was going to have coming into this situation. Let's not sugarcoat this, 621 00:42:32.079 --> 00:42:36.840 okay. And this is the reason why I'm saying New York Knicks fans 622 00:42:36.920 --> 00:42:42.280 are funny, right, they are hilarious. They didn't want Jalen Brunson in 623 00:42:42.320 --> 00:42:45.480 the beginning. They didn't want it to be giving up this kind of money 624 00:42:45.480 --> 00:42:47.880 for him because they were so sour on the fact that the Knicks missed out 625 00:42:47.880 --> 00:42:52.760 on Donovan Mitchell. You know what I'm saying, Now you love the guy 626 00:42:52.199 --> 00:42:57.880 now, my god, hey, own it, Okay, own it. 627 00:42:58.440 --> 00:43:00.840 And at the same time you can say thank you as well too. You 628 00:43:00.920 --> 00:43:07.920 can say thank you Jalen Brunson, because you showed us that our temperament needs 629 00:43:07.960 --> 00:43:13.239 to be better about our expectation for our star players or players who are going 630 00:43:13.320 --> 00:43:17.079 to be stars for this jersey. Right, he earned that. You know 631 00:43:17.079 --> 00:43:20.920 what, I'm saying, and Knicks fans can never take that away, even 632 00:43:20.960 --> 00:43:23.039 if they're you know, they'll be all He'll forever be a Nick and things 633 00:43:23.079 --> 00:43:27.960 of that nature. That's great, that's awesome. But guess what, you 634 00:43:27.960 --> 00:43:30.800 could have had that so many times over. You could have demanded that so 635 00:43:31.000 --> 00:43:37.559 many times over, and this roster could have been constructed exactly in that way. 636 00:43:37.280 --> 00:43:40.920 You had that with Julius Randall at times, right, you had that. 637 00:43:42.559 --> 00:43:45.000 And yet and this is the reason why I'm saying people have to pay 638 00:43:45.039 --> 00:43:50.760 attention to what we're seeing here and why it's important that Tom Thibodeau stays as 639 00:43:50.800 --> 00:43:52.960 the coach because of the fact that, to your point, Shaw, this 640 00:43:53.000 --> 00:43:55.519 is the give and take with him, and you know, yeah, he's 641 00:43:55.519 --> 00:43:59.960 gonna run players down to the ground, but there is a hustle and respect 642 00:44:00.119 --> 00:44:05.440 factor that just was just never there prior to Tips, and no matter how 643 00:44:05.440 --> 00:44:07.880 many coaches you put out there. And this is why it made it impossible 644 00:44:08.000 --> 00:44:13.039 for Rose to get rid of Tips, because you can clearly see that with 645 00:44:13.159 --> 00:44:19.320 the right guys on that roster and they stay healthy, they can all practically 646 00:44:19.320 --> 00:44:22.440 be championship caliber. But to your point, y'all, you brought up such 647 00:44:22.440 --> 00:44:27.800 an excellent point at the beginning. This is where the organization needs to quote 648 00:44:27.880 --> 00:44:34.760 unquote recalibrate on where its investments really need to be in right, it shouldn't 649 00:44:34.800 --> 00:44:37.280 be in the splash of the players that you bring. It should be on 650 00:44:37.480 --> 00:44:42.519 all of the other things to accommodate the intent that the run is real for 651 00:44:42.599 --> 00:44:46.000 these guys and that you want it to be everlasting. And it requires these 652 00:44:46.039 --> 00:44:51.760 guys to be fully healthy, fully on board, and fully discipline in whatever 653 00:44:51.840 --> 00:44:55.239 regiment is required to maintain them being on the court for as long as possible. 654 00:44:57.000 --> 00:45:00.199 Yeah, it really is, Like it sounds corny and cheesy, guess 655 00:45:00.239 --> 00:45:02.239 from us say, but no, it's really the sports science of it now 656 00:45:02.880 --> 00:45:07.320 is could I think you have a You have players that are bought into this 657 00:45:07.480 --> 00:45:12.639 system. These guys want to play these minutes extended minutes and give their effort 658 00:45:12.639 --> 00:45:15.599 and run through a wall. You know, for their coach, you can't 659 00:45:15.760 --> 00:45:21.760 teach that. You literally cannot buy that. So now that you've cultivated it, 660 00:45:22.119 --> 00:45:25.079 how do you maintain it in a way that can be conducive to an 661 00:45:25.119 --> 00:45:30.400 extended run? Because they they should have beat the Anama Pacers like they should 662 00:45:30.480 --> 00:45:34.960 have and would have had they been able to stay healthy, and who knows 663 00:45:35.000 --> 00:45:37.639 what have happened, you know, because the Celtics are shaky, and so 664 00:45:37.920 --> 00:45:40.679 going up against that type of force and that type of energy and grit, 665 00:45:40.719 --> 00:45:45.079 that relentlessness might have Ultimately the Knicks could have fumbled their way if you will, 666 00:45:45.480 --> 00:45:49.000 you know, and to the NBA Finals, and then once you're there, 667 00:45:49.039 --> 00:45:52.039 anything can happen. So I know there's a lot of optimism about this 668 00:45:52.079 --> 00:45:55.039 team. They have two draft sticks in this year's draft, late in the 669 00:45:55.039 --> 00:45:59.119 first round. They can do some stuff with that they want to or bring 670 00:45:59.159 --> 00:46:01.559 it in for the depth. I'll be interested to see if they bring Boganovan 671 00:46:01.679 --> 00:46:06.400 back or Boganovic or they decline. Not Declient he doesn't have an option, 672 00:46:06.480 --> 00:46:08.440 but he has a non guaranteed deal. Brooks is up, so they can 673 00:46:08.480 --> 00:46:12.039 do some stuff on the edges there. But they got to obviously make sure 674 00:46:12.119 --> 00:46:15.119 their main horses are healthy. But one quick point before we move on, 675 00:46:15.079 --> 00:46:19.599 and the irony, and I don't know if it was brought up, you 676 00:46:19.599 --> 00:46:22.559 know, in New York radio because obviously I'm not there, but remember the 677 00:46:22.639 --> 00:46:27.400 Knicks should have drafted Tyres Haliburton and then obviously they wouldn't have Jalen Brunson right 678 00:46:27.440 --> 00:46:30.119 now. So I don't know which player most people will take, you know, 679 00:46:30.239 --> 00:46:34.679 especially now or moving forward. I think it's close. I think the 680 00:46:34.719 --> 00:46:37.280 Knicks are happy where they're at, and I think Indiana's happy where they're at 681 00:46:37.320 --> 00:46:39.280 and now as well too. But by all intentsive purpose of tality should be 682 00:46:39.320 --> 00:46:43.679 a New York Nick anyway, So I know that was way sweet? Are 683 00:46:43.679 --> 00:46:46.400 sweet? Very sweet for him to beat that team, especially going down two 684 00:46:46.440 --> 00:46:49.920 and they're coming back and beating them in the games up. Yeah, listen, 685 00:46:50.000 --> 00:46:52.039 we all we all said that, right. Remember we had our pre 686 00:46:52.159 --> 00:46:58.280 draft, we had our draft uh uhraft draft review, and you know we 687 00:46:58.440 --> 00:47:01.159 commentated on the fact that, like, what the hell of the Knicks thinking 688 00:47:01.360 --> 00:47:05.960 right like you needed a point guard? Tylery's Haliburton was available. By all 689 00:47:05.960 --> 00:47:12.280 accounts, everybody praises how quality of player Tyrese Haliburton was coming out of college. 690 00:47:13.280 --> 00:47:15.159 You know, some things made and needed to be polished. And listen, 691 00:47:16.360 --> 00:47:21.000 give credit where credit is due. The Indiana Pacers figured out a way. 692 00:47:21.559 --> 00:47:24.199 Rick Carlisle figured out a way to open this kid up. I don't 693 00:47:24.239 --> 00:47:30.079 know if something you know was a miss when he was in Sacramento whatever, 694 00:47:30.599 --> 00:47:37.559 but minus you know, the little you know shade with him wearing that hoodie. 695 00:47:37.039 --> 00:47:40.239 You know, I don't mind the brash talking in the Bravado because he's 696 00:47:40.239 --> 00:47:43.599 gonna come and he's gonna bring it, you know what I'm saying. He's 697 00:47:43.639 --> 00:47:45.760 gonna bring it, and I respect that. And I think because of that, 698 00:47:46.199 --> 00:47:50.760 it is renewed the rivalry of the Knicks and the Pacers, and I 699 00:47:50.800 --> 00:47:54.599 think now more than ever, we're gonna see a much fiery, you know, 700 00:47:55.079 --> 00:48:00.159 battle between these two teams. While everyone's focusing attention will still it will 701 00:48:00.199 --> 00:48:02.119 be about the Boston Celtics and things of that nature. I really think people 702 00:48:02.159 --> 00:48:07.039 need to pay attention to this Knicks Pacers situation as well too, because they 703 00:48:07.079 --> 00:48:09.320 are on a collision course and whether or not it's them as the two top 704 00:48:09.360 --> 00:48:14.920 teams in the Eastern Conference, or even if the bosson Celtics want to upset 705 00:48:14.920 --> 00:48:16.719 the apple cart and make sure that they hold ground and tell people, hey, 706 00:48:16.719 --> 00:48:21.599 we still run things in the East. Either way, both of these 707 00:48:21.639 --> 00:48:27.480 teams bring very different styles to their fight, and I think that in and 708 00:48:27.519 --> 00:48:31.440 of itself is the reason why the Eastern Conference is very quickly becoming one of 709 00:48:31.480 --> 00:48:36.960 the more watchable of the two conferences, so to speak, because of what 710 00:48:37.119 --> 00:48:43.280 Tyre's Halliburton, Jalen Brunson, and arguably what Tatum and Brown are doing respectively 711 00:48:43.440 --> 00:48:47.400 at their young ages in the primes of their career. Well, it's not 712 00:48:47.480 --> 00:48:51.760 as destitute as I think some would think. I think most people would still 713 00:48:51.760 --> 00:48:57.639 a grate the West is deeper in just better overall. But I say the 714 00:48:57.679 --> 00:49:00.519 East is not as far behind as people would say because of that, because 715 00:49:00.519 --> 00:49:05.000 of this young talent, and and even if you don't like the aesthetics of 716 00:49:05.039 --> 00:49:07.519 the play, you have to respect the hustle of the play, the relentless 717 00:49:07.599 --> 00:49:10.880 of relentlessness of both of these teams that I think are going to have a 718 00:49:10.920 --> 00:49:15.360 lot to say. The uninvited guests into the conference finals are the Pacers, 719 00:49:15.400 --> 00:49:16.920 but the Knicks are gonna have a lot to say about this, especially if 720 00:49:16.920 --> 00:49:20.639 they can stay healthy going into next season. Oh yeah, I love it, 721 00:49:20.679 --> 00:49:22.719 man. Oh yeah. By the way, the Miami Heater are still 722 00:49:22.760 --> 00:49:29.039 around in some way, shape or form. Right, you're too to the 723 00:49:29.039 --> 00:49:34.159 baseline. Cali warren Shaw coming up, gotta talk about the Cleveland Cavaliers and 724 00:49:34.199 --> 00:49:38.320 Man, the news that just hit while we're recording this podcast. Got to 725 00:49:38.360 --> 00:49:42.199 give it up to the Cavs. Man. They're making themselves. They're they're 726 00:49:42.239 --> 00:49:45.360 they're playing up into the play, into the storyline. So well, you 727 00:49:45.360 --> 00:49:50.320 gotta love it more. Baseline, don't go away. We're bat Cali warrens 728 00:49:50.320 --> 00:49:54.119 Shaw based on NBA podcast Last Team. We're putting on a slab Cleveland Cavaliers. 729 00:49:55.360 --> 00:50:05.599 All right, So Cleveland Cavaliers got dismissed, And not only did the 730 00:50:05.599 --> 00:50:09.239 team get dismissed, the team itself also decided to put a little extra work 731 00:50:09.239 --> 00:50:12.559 on our plate. He said, we just can't body the team. We 732 00:50:12.599 --> 00:50:15.679 got a body to coach with the team as well too, So of course, 733 00:50:15.039 --> 00:50:21.559 the Cleveland Cavaliers decide to part ways with JB Bickerstaff. I don't know 734 00:50:21.559 --> 00:50:28.559 you're surprised by this. Not surprised because it was looming literally seconds after they 735 00:50:28.639 --> 00:50:32.800 lost Game five in the semi finals. You know, Sham had tweets ready 736 00:50:32.920 --> 00:50:38.119 locked and loaded as if as like this this wasn't even this was some someone 737 00:50:38.239 --> 00:50:45.000 of an inside job there players ready just telling the whole story about Donovan Mitchell 738 00:50:45.119 --> 00:50:50.000 and his discontentment and the JB lose the locker room and all this stuff, 739 00:50:50.039 --> 00:50:54.039 and at no time during the Cavaliers run here in the last two years. 740 00:50:54.360 --> 00:50:58.599 Now look at that and say, yeah, JB is the problem, and 741 00:50:58.880 --> 00:51:02.360 all coaches have their issues and growing pains, but the roster was what the 742 00:51:02.440 --> 00:51:05.679 roster was, and a lot of people said, hey, they shouldn't have 743 00:51:05.679 --> 00:51:07.039 played the double Biggs, And then they were saying, well, you can't 744 00:51:07.039 --> 00:51:10.800 play the two backcourt players together in Donovan and Garland, And then you saw 745 00:51:10.880 --> 00:51:15.960 success when one or some of those guys were out because it didn't allow for 746 00:51:16.000 --> 00:51:22.679 that duplicity in those same areas. That's not JB's fault. So I mean 747 00:51:22.719 --> 00:51:25.400 you can say, well JB needed to put Jared Jared Allen on the bench, 748 00:51:25.400 --> 00:51:28.559 Maybe need to put Mobile on the bench, or Garland on the bench 749 00:51:28.599 --> 00:51:31.079 or Donovan Mitchell. Not gonna happen, like when you have that level of 750 00:51:31.119 --> 00:51:37.000 talent, like you're trying to make it work. But it's an unfortunate situation. 751 00:51:37.119 --> 00:51:39.159 As we all know, coaches are always the first to go whether it's 752 00:51:39.199 --> 00:51:44.639 really their fault or not. I think injuries did the Cleveland Cavaliers in especially 753 00:51:44.719 --> 00:51:46.800 at the tail part of this season. You know, Mitchell was out karrisl 754 00:51:47.199 --> 00:51:50.800 was out, Jared Allen was out, Like what were they really supposed to 755 00:51:50.880 --> 00:51:52.920 do, you know, against the team that was the best in the use 756 00:51:52.000 --> 00:51:55.639 and conference at least record wise. So I think it's a little bit of 757 00:51:55.679 --> 00:51:59.920 a cop out to let JB go. But somebody's got a fall. And 758 00:52:00.159 --> 00:52:04.159 if that's if that means JB needed to go so that Donovan Mitchell could stay, 759 00:52:04.360 --> 00:52:07.199 well then that would be the political the politics of star players in the 760 00:52:07.280 --> 00:52:09.039 NBA here, but that still remains to be seen. So I don't want 761 00:52:09.039 --> 00:52:12.880 to put that Donovan Mitchell's you know, plate right now and say, Okay, 762 00:52:13.119 --> 00:52:15.280 here's the reason JB is gone, but JB's not gone. Let's not 763 00:52:15.320 --> 00:52:21.920 of in Mitchell okays it? I think, to correct me if I'm wrong. 764 00:52:22.000 --> 00:52:27.559 Kobe Altman is still the GM right yep. And the hiring of JB. 765 00:52:27.639 --> 00:52:32.440 Bickerstaff was on whose watch he hired JB. JB's been there four years, 766 00:52:34.280 --> 00:52:37.679 okay, So don't you find it kind of interesting Shaw that this was 767 00:52:37.719 --> 00:52:42.199 the call that had to be made by Kobe Alman. But when you look 768 00:52:42.239 --> 00:52:47.320 at the roster construction, there's no accountability for the moves that were made by 769 00:52:47.400 --> 00:52:53.159 Kobe Altman on his behalf to supplement the type of team that JB. Bickerstaff 770 00:52:53.199 --> 00:52:57.800 has had to work with over the last couple of years. And you and 771 00:52:57.840 --> 00:53:01.400 I had said this, we question whether or not Donovan Mitchell was the right 772 00:53:01.559 --> 00:53:06.920 move, like because we were gobsmacked by the fact that it was the Cleveland 773 00:53:07.000 --> 00:53:12.639 Cavaliers that came in and swooped up and decided to take Donovan Mitchell right because 774 00:53:12.679 --> 00:53:15.320 remember they were still trying to figure out what they were gonna do with Colin 775 00:53:15.360 --> 00:53:20.119 Sexton. Now, I'm not saying that they should have kept Sexton. I 776 00:53:20.159 --> 00:53:22.280 mean, look, if you're gonna you're gonna tell me that you legit, 777 00:53:23.360 --> 00:53:28.320 you know, want to go for it. Of course you go after Donovan 778 00:53:28.320 --> 00:53:31.079 Mitchell, no doubt. But I probably would have told you maybe not at 779 00:53:31.119 --> 00:53:37.960 the expense of keeping Darius Garland, because I didn't see where that combination worked 780 00:53:37.960 --> 00:53:43.239 more so than I probably saw Colin Sexton and Donovan Mitchell working. But all 781 00:53:43.320 --> 00:53:47.039 that being said, what did we say about Evan Mobley. What did we 782 00:53:47.039 --> 00:53:52.159 say about this dude? Shaw? He frustrates you the most because on any 783 00:53:52.239 --> 00:53:58.559 given night, that guy can probably look like freaking Victor Wimbanyama. You know, 784 00:53:59.519 --> 00:54:07.119 and then at nights he looks like Michael Porter Jr. And that inconsistency 785 00:54:08.800 --> 00:54:12.320 is it a Is it a bad straight? Oh? It is a bad 786 00:54:12.480 --> 00:54:15.239 Is it? Is it a bad straight? No? Because what I'm basically 787 00:54:15.320 --> 00:54:19.719 saying when I'm talking about Evan Mobley is it's all there. He has the 788 00:54:19.800 --> 00:54:22.280 package. It ain't like it's just high like you know what I'm saying, 789 00:54:22.280 --> 00:54:25.280 you gotta drag it. The problem is is that it's not consistent. The 790 00:54:25.360 --> 00:54:29.119 problem is is that it's not out there on a night in, night out 791 00:54:29.119 --> 00:54:31.360 basis. So that kind of stray is the same kind of straight we spent 792 00:54:31.400 --> 00:54:35.599 all that time talking about Michael Porter Jr. That was the case, the 793 00:54:35.639 --> 00:54:37.800 Nuggets would still be playing in this in in in in the playoffs. You 794 00:54:37.840 --> 00:54:39.760 know what I'm saying. I'm not saying he's the only reason, but I'm 795 00:54:39.760 --> 00:54:45.719 saying he is a big reason why hard for teams to make moves when you're 796 00:54:45.840 --> 00:54:50.280 vested on the potential of someone who should be giving this to you on a 797 00:54:50.320 --> 00:54:53.719 consistent basis, or it needs to happen in the in the most critical times, 798 00:54:53.760 --> 00:54:58.840 which is the freaking playoffs. You know what I'm saying, Like I 799 00:54:58.920 --> 00:55:01.760 understand Jared Allen was there, but that's exactly why Evan Mobley should This is 800 00:55:01.800 --> 00:55:06.199 his time, is his time to shine. Now did he play awful? 801 00:55:06.599 --> 00:55:09.519 No, but he definitely did not play like I didn't see that same kind 802 00:55:09.519 --> 00:55:12.920 of performance. He did that kind of performance. It was it thirty three 803 00:55:12.960 --> 00:55:15.960 points and some twelve fourths. He did it on al halford Man. Come 804 00:55:15.000 --> 00:55:17.639 on, you know what I'm saying. He wasn't gonna do that against Kris 805 00:55:17.679 --> 00:55:22.719 STAPs Porzingis and Kristaph Porzingis is not the best defender, but he's definitely a 806 00:55:22.760 --> 00:55:28.599 step up for the Celtics. You know, MOBILEI wasn't doing that against Howser 807 00:55:28.679 --> 00:55:31.960 and Cornett all throughout the series, so you know that was more him than 808 00:55:31.960 --> 00:55:37.280 it was about the Celtics also as well too. You know what I'm saying, 809 00:55:37.320 --> 00:55:38.880 Like, what I'm saying is the way that this roster was constructed, 810 00:55:38.920 --> 00:55:43.599 Shaw, it's gonna have his EBB and flows. And I don't know if 811 00:55:43.599 --> 00:55:45.480 you were lied more on the fact that JB was supposed to pull you know, 812 00:55:45.639 --> 00:55:49.800 magic out of a hat with this team, but you could clearly tell 813 00:55:49.840 --> 00:55:52.440 this team the way that they were constructed was not suited for what I think 814 00:55:52.519 --> 00:55:55.639 JB really wanted to do. And if you're Donovan Mitchell, I guess you'd 815 00:55:55.679 --> 00:56:00.880 be upset about that, But I think it speaks more to what is necessary 816 00:56:00.880 --> 00:56:04.840 for Donovan Mitchell. It's obvious that Donovan Mitchell wasn't who he thought he was 817 00:56:04.880 --> 00:56:07.239 when he was out there in Utah and he was shouldering basically a team that 818 00:56:07.400 --> 00:56:12.119 was less talented than the team he had access to with the Cleveland Cavaliers, 819 00:56:12.320 --> 00:56:16.280 because by all accounts, the Cleveland Cavaliers talent wise looked a lot like what 820 00:56:16.320 --> 00:56:20.559 we're talking about with the Oklahoma City Thunder. But I guarantee you we're talking 821 00:56:20.559 --> 00:56:23.400 about the Oklahoma City Thunder with more longevity than we'll be talking about the Cleveland 822 00:56:23.400 --> 00:56:27.199 Cavaliers. So let me ask you this. I mean, what do you 823 00:56:27.239 --> 00:56:30.719 think ultimately happens here? And just you know, I think, as succinctly 824 00:56:30.760 --> 00:56:36.239 as you can, do they run this back with tweaks. Isaaca Ocurrow is 825 00:56:36.280 --> 00:56:38.000 a guess as a free agent who they'll need to resign. I don't think 826 00:56:38.039 --> 00:56:43.239 they he got a deal done by the deadline. Do they run this back 827 00:56:43.320 --> 00:56:45.400 and just say, Hey, a new coach put in a new system, 828 00:56:45.440 --> 00:56:47.960 and figure it out, do they? And that could mean they bring some 829 00:56:49.039 --> 00:56:51.400 of those guys off the bench, if you will, so that there's not 830 00:56:51.400 --> 00:56:54.920 the dad duplicity in the starting lineup. Strews wasn't the total answer for them, 831 00:56:55.039 --> 00:56:59.000 but the verse on the contract. Mobiy's on the contract, Allen's on 832 00:56:59.039 --> 00:57:01.320 the contract, Mitchell is on contract. You know it's his last year, 833 00:57:01.360 --> 00:57:04.880 so that's why there's like, oh, he's extension eligible, so blah blah 834 00:57:04.880 --> 00:57:07.199 blah blah. But do you just bring it to coach and say, cool, 835 00:57:07.280 --> 00:57:10.559 let's run it back, or do you make changes with one Garland, 836 00:57:10.559 --> 00:57:14.840 one Mitchell, Jared Allen and I don't think they're gonna move motely, but 837 00:57:14.960 --> 00:57:19.360 you know one of those three guys you make changes And honestly, well, 838 00:57:19.400 --> 00:57:22.079 let's put it like this, It all depends on the coach, right, 839 00:57:22.400 --> 00:57:25.800 This is what Kobe is hitching his wagon on. And obviously Donovan Mitchell I 840 00:57:25.840 --> 00:57:30.599 think has gotten in the ear of the organization, like if you want to 841 00:57:30.639 --> 00:57:32.079 keep me, you're gonna have to the next person you're putting in here is 842 00:57:32.119 --> 00:57:37.360 gonna have to be someone that is that I think is suitable, which now 843 00:57:37.400 --> 00:57:43.800 also usurps Darius Garland right, so, and and it to me, the 844 00:57:43.920 --> 00:57:47.559 dynamics of this is very interesting because if you flake out and get it and 845 00:57:47.559 --> 00:57:51.920 get a coach that's better for for Donovan but not better for for Garland. 846 00:57:51.920 --> 00:57:53.519 What are we talking about here, you know? And how many coaches are 847 00:57:53.519 --> 00:57:58.880 out there that are really as innovative to accommodate the style of play that you 848 00:57:58.960 --> 00:58:02.800 both see from from from Donovan and from from Garland. Listen, their styles 849 00:58:02.840 --> 00:58:07.679 are very different. Shaw Garland to me, is much better when he operates 850 00:58:07.960 --> 00:58:12.559 at a fast pace. Donovan is more deliberate. He plays he acts like 851 00:58:12.599 --> 00:58:15.440 he plays fast, but he really does not play fast. He plays better 852 00:58:15.480 --> 00:58:19.639 half court and I think he slow walks the ball a lot. He his 853 00:58:19.639 --> 00:58:22.360 his usage rate is way high. Taking the ball out of Darius Garland's hands, 854 00:58:22.360 --> 00:58:27.000 to me, I think goes against the rest of the roster because the 855 00:58:27.039 --> 00:58:30.360 rest of those guys eat off of the way Garland facilitates and gets the ball. 856 00:58:30.880 --> 00:58:34.280 So I don't I don't know what you do here with this? Yeah, 857 00:58:34.320 --> 00:58:37.960 well, I do think Garland, even by some of the reports you 858 00:58:37.000 --> 00:58:42.360 know his his agency, I think he's a lebron guy, so clutch guy. 859 00:58:43.320 --> 00:58:45.119 If Mitchell stays. They've already said that that Garland is going to look 860 00:58:45.159 --> 00:58:50.199 into peace out, so we'll see what ends up happening. But I don't 861 00:58:50.199 --> 00:58:52.840 see Mitchell staying though either, Shaw, I really don't. He's still on 862 00:58:52.920 --> 00:58:55.440 the contract, so they would have to find the deal to make that work. 863 00:58:55.480 --> 00:59:00.079 But I don't know, Pil. I just think that we're in this 864 00:59:00.239 --> 00:59:05.800 day in age Shaw where I think the the enticement of the super Max and 865 00:59:05.840 --> 00:59:08.280 things of that nature, I think it's losing a lot of its teeth, 866 00:59:08.719 --> 00:59:15.360 not because of the situation, not not because what's what's one of what is 867 00:59:15.360 --> 00:59:22.119 it that I'm thinking of? It's not because of per se the team as 868 00:59:22.199 --> 00:59:25.440 much as it is the environment of the team, you know what I mean. 869 00:59:25.719 --> 00:59:31.719 I think a lot of that now is being factored so heavily that a 870 00:59:31.719 --> 00:59:35.519 guy like Donovan Mitchell might be the first dude to be like, yeah, 871 00:59:35.760 --> 00:59:37.559 you can offer it to me, but I'm just gonna go elsewhere, you 872 00:59:37.599 --> 00:59:43.079 know, because listen the circumstances by what he got there, I don't think 873 00:59:43.119 --> 00:59:46.159 in like made him feel like you know, I think he was happy he 874 00:59:46.159 --> 00:59:50.039 got out of Utah, But I don't know I whether or not he was 875 00:59:50.239 --> 00:59:52.519 a static that it wound up being Cleveland. And I'm not trying to be 876 00:59:52.559 --> 00:59:57.239 disrespectful to the Cleveland Cavaliers. I think if you're Donovan Mitchell, you look 877 00:59:57.280 --> 01:00:00.760 at this, this is a prime situation with the talented had access to. 878 01:00:00.599 --> 01:00:04.440 I don't know, man, do you go anywhere else? If you're intent 879 01:00:04.559 --> 01:00:07.079 is that you're really wanting to be competitive in any of the conferences. Who 880 01:00:07.079 --> 01:00:09.840 knows where you might land up, and you may not be the featured player 881 01:00:09.880 --> 01:00:14.920 by the time it's all said and done. I agree there, And I 882 01:00:15.000 --> 01:00:20.039 know the old adages are again. Be Hold, the old teams are snipping 883 01:00:20.079 --> 01:00:22.920 around again. So New York is not one of them. And in the 884 01:00:22.960 --> 01:00:25.679 situation, but here comes Miami, Here come the Lakers. You know, 885 01:00:25.760 --> 01:00:29.800 hey, if Donovan Mitchell is available, and that's that's a way all that 886 01:00:29.960 --> 01:00:35.880 those those two franchises will seek and go after. And maybe that will entice 887 01:00:35.920 --> 01:00:37.400 him. You know, maybe he does want to go somewhere in Miami. 888 01:00:37.440 --> 01:00:42.559 He could be the lead guy offensively and maybe could compliment Jimmy Butler, who 889 01:00:42.639 --> 01:00:45.159 takes his annual see us to anyway, So maybe that works itself out. 890 01:00:45.239 --> 01:00:52.599 But I think Cleveland is primed to retain him. You know, he did 891 01:00:52.639 --> 01:00:55.480 not make an All NBA team if I if I'm remembering quickly, so you 892 01:00:55.519 --> 01:00:59.480 know, his extension. He might need to play this one out anyway and 893 01:00:59.519 --> 01:01:01.599 then see that he can get that that that extension at a higher or higher 894 01:01:01.679 --> 01:01:06.639 mount Ley and r on. So Cleveland's in an interesting situation. Uh. 895 01:01:06.760 --> 01:01:09.039 JB is the guy who's been on our podcast. So you know we always 896 01:01:09.079 --> 01:01:12.719 have you know, love for that people showing us love. So we know 897 01:01:12.840 --> 01:01:15.840 he'll be back, you know, in the NBA and whatever capacity that he 898 01:01:15.880 --> 01:01:19.320 wants to or a job in basketball and whatever he wants to do, you 899 01:01:19.320 --> 01:01:22.159 know, sometime soon. Here So shouts to JB Man, good individual, 900 01:01:22.440 --> 01:01:23.840 you know, just a bad situation there in Cleveland for him. Yeah, 901 01:01:23.840 --> 01:01:27.599 he got a raw deal on this one. You know, fortunately you got 902 01:01:27.599 --> 01:01:30.360 you got a raw deal. It's one of those few situations where, you 903 01:01:30.400 --> 01:01:34.559 know, what do you do when you don't have your full pieces healthy? 904 01:01:35.000 --> 01:01:38.960 Competing arguably in a gauntlet of you know, what was going on in the 905 01:01:38.960 --> 01:01:45.599 Eastern Conference And I say that respectfully because you know that's exactly what it was. 906 01:01:45.880 --> 01:01:49.920 You know, you're playing against arguably the best team in the Eastern Conference. 907 01:01:50.400 --> 01:01:53.559 Right in in that in that round, and you don't have your starters 908 01:01:53.559 --> 01:01:58.280 for you to really assess was it you? You know, we always question 909 01:01:58.360 --> 01:02:01.119 too whether or not JB does make those of adjustments. But I think there 910 01:02:01.159 --> 01:02:05.239 wasn't too many adjustments that could be made. Man, it was a monoy 911 01:02:05.280 --> 01:02:10.639 mono circumstances situation, and the Celtics just have more mono than than than the 912 01:02:10.639 --> 01:02:15.400 Cavaliers. And I think part of that, to me, I think speaks 913 01:02:15.440 --> 01:02:19.880 more about the players and what they have to do to get themselves in a 914 01:02:19.880 --> 01:02:23.800 position to put the onus on being either coached up better or stepping up to 915 01:02:23.920 --> 01:02:28.840 just be better. And I think that what's I think because of this, 916 01:02:28.840 --> 01:02:31.880 this circumstance, in this situation, Shaw, now the eyes are really on 917 01:02:31.960 --> 01:02:37.039 Donovan Mitchell right now. The eyes are really on Darius Garland, you know, 918 01:02:37.119 --> 01:02:42.840 are they are they paper superstars? Are they gonna legit be superstars? 919 01:02:43.519 --> 01:02:46.760 You know? And I think you know that's where we are with them, 920 01:02:47.000 --> 01:02:52.000 Yes, sir, I love to hear what our fans listeners have to say 921 01:02:52.000 --> 01:02:57.320 about it, how they feel, you know, the Nuggets, thunder Nicks 922 01:02:57.320 --> 01:03:00.280 and Calves should go into the offseason. Which team would you most rather be 923 01:03:00.320 --> 01:03:05.880 moving forward and you know this, This is a lot more to come. 924 01:03:05.960 --> 01:03:08.440 Did Jamie get get a raw deal? We think so? But do you 925 01:03:08.480 --> 01:03:12.800 agree? So let us know if you're on the baseline and the underscore basedline 926 01:03:12.920 --> 01:03:16.880 you know on Instagram and NBA Baseline on X. Now forward to absolutely Man. 927 01:03:17.239 --> 01:03:20.760 Once again, you'd like to thank you and yours for hopping on board 928 01:03:20.760 --> 01:03:23.760 with us this week for the baseline. Cali warren Shaw. We appreciate you, 929 01:03:23.800 --> 01:03:27.599 guys, you know we do. We'll catch up with you next time.