Hello world. You're listening to Eleanor Wagner's Strange and Scary World here on the
Paranormal UK Radio Network, where we'll always creeping it real. I'm your host,
Eleanor Wagner. Welcome all to my paranormal Closet, where the stories in
magic take place. Rulyie's guest is a former principle of the Martin Agency.
Over the years, the firm has created well known advertising for such clients as
Geico, Virginia Tourism, Virginia Is for Lovers, Mercedes Benz Ups, Colonial
Williamsburg, and King's Dominion, among others. Today, he's the editor and
publisher of the Oakleia Press. Did I say that correctly? It's Oakley Oakley
Press Press, a traditional book publisher. He's also the author of more than
three dozen books, including six business titles under his own name in five novels
listed in Who's Who in America. He is the only three time winner of
Theriter's Digest Book Award, having won twice for fiction and once for nonfiction.
He has also won First Prize for Visionary Fiction from Independent Publisher Magazine, First
Prize for Nonfiction from USA Book News, and to Bronze Medal for Visionary Fiction
from Reader's Favorite Book Reviews. Writing is Steve's passion. Join me and welcome
Steven Hawley Martin. Well, thank you so much, Helen. I'm so
happy to be here. I'm looking forward to I'm thrilled to have you back
on the show for the second time now to introduce the public to your new
release, how you can help create the shift in consciousness needed to save the
world. That's some long title you got there. I thought I had a
long title for my book. It's really long. A shift in consciousness is
a shift in perspective. As we change our beliefs about life, the life
we see and experience then changes Accordingly. People have been predicting this shift in
a direction of peace, love, harmony, and understanding among the people of
our planet for quite some time now. Globally, this ship has already started,
and as I understand it, you are all for it. I am
all for it. I think that once people reach this level of higher consciousness
understand what life is really all about, why they're here on earth. You
know that they are eternal spiritual beings that are having a temporary physical experience.
When people realize that it's going to make the world a much better place,
because you know, we're all part of it, and we're all one in
a way, and so maybe we'll start being nice to each other for a
change. That would be nice. Sometimes I find it hard to believe because
there are constantly those who are trying to divide us, media being the number
one culprit in my opinion. But you've teamed up with a television production company
called Good all Over TV to produce the series for public television where you intend
to get the facts out about the true nature of reality. How did this
all come about? Well, I'm on the board of a nonprofit called Bell
Tower Pictures, and Bell Tower Pictures is in business to make uplifting films and
they've made a number for PBS, and they've also made some that were released
in movie theaters that were you know, regular movies, not just documentaries.
And the president of that is a guy named Craig Martin no relation, who
is a partner in a film production company, Good All Over TV, that
makes films for PBS. So he and I got to be friends through that,
and he is very interested in AI automated intelligence, you know, and
I'm of course a metaphysician, been studying reality and trying to figure it all
out for fifty years. And he was the son of a missionary who he
grew up in Thailand. But he's not strictly a Christian anymore. He's had
a man of faith, but you know, his faith is more spiritual religious,
and he got very interest in this. We started talking and decided this
would be a great thing. We can do a series. He can get
information out about his ai interests, and I can get the facts out about
the true nature of reality, which is what I've been trying to do with
my books now for about twenty five years. So that's how it all came
about. Eleanor then do you hope for it to air? We're hoping that
it'll be this fall. We're working on it. We've had a number of
meetings. We're trying to work out the format and now you know exactly the
logistics of the whole thing. We're also in the process of raising some money
to fund it, which anybody wants to help with that, we'd be have
you set up have you set up a GoFundMe page for that. You can
go to my website Shmartin dot com and there is a button there that says
donate you can use that. We may do the go fund. Mean,
we haven't decided yet, we may. We're looking for, you know,
donors that are interested in these topics, and I want to get the public
to learn about the interest. Yeah. So what kind of episodes are you
going to have? Well, I think probably we'll start out with with Craig
and me in a conversation, but I see us moving to conversations with other
experts. For example, there's a unit of the University of Virginia Medical School
which is not far from me. I'm in Richmond. We're both in Richmond,
Virginia. Up in Charlottesville about fifty sixty miles away is the University of
Virginia School of Medicine, and they have a division called the Division of Perceptual
Studies. There has been studying consciousness for about sixty years. They started in
the mid nineteen sixties. They study children's memories of past lives. They have
over twenty five hundred cases that they've studied. They say they've solved about seventeen
hundred of them where they found the individual that the child said he was in
a previous life based on love that. Yeah, it's amazing because this well,
and they're also studying near death experiences. The first book about that,
Life After Life by Raymond Moody, was while he was at the University Virginia
and the medical school there. They're studying all kinds of things about consciousness,
and basically what they've determined is that the brain does not create consciousness. It
is more like a receiver of consciousness. It certainly affects your consciousness, you
know, when you get have too much to drink or take drugs or whatever.
Things are very different, but it's not where consciousness come from. Consciousness
is basically the ground of being, of reality, and it's something we all
share. We think we're separate because you know, we have an ego,
we have subconscious minds been built up over many many incarnations. But anyway,
for example, then there are several experts there who have been studying reincarnation,
who've been studying past lives, who've been studying psychic phenomena, and they would
be people that we would want to have in this show and interview and let
them tell about what they've learned. That would certainly be something that I'd be
interested in for sure, yeah, when this may be out of the scope
of what you're talking about with consciousness, and you tell me if it is.
But because I just finished reading this book called Second Sight by David Williams
and actually came out in the seventies, and there was a movie based on
his book with Lindsay Wagner in It was called The Other Lives of Jenny Logan.
I don't know if you're familiar with it, but with one of my
all time favorites as a young girl, and I said, I want to
see if there's the book that matches the movie, because I saw the movie
before I read the book. I actually found it online and I said,
I've got to get it, and I've got to read it and compare it
to the movie. You know how you do that Usually read the book and
then you see the movie, and then you're usually upset because they've ruined the
whole story, like they did with Stephen King's The Shining Right. Yeah.
So I read the book and I was just really happy with the way they
did it because they presented it just as it should be. And it's a
book that has to do with time travel and how this woman is able to
bring herself back into this time frame that she wanted to be in, and
somewhere in time is what Christopher Breeve is pretty similar to that too, that
he's able to bring himself back to a time. Do you think that is
that's a reality. Is it just fantasy or are there other dimensions? Can
people time travel? What's your thoughts on that? I'm really curious. Yeah,
I haven't read the book you're talking about, but I did read Somewhere
in Time a while ago. What I'll say about that is that time only
exists in this reality, this three D actually I call it a four D
reality because it's hight depth with and time. When you go beyond this reality
into the dimensions of mind I call them of consciousness, there is no time.
It's all one time. And the reason I am pretty sure about that
is that you these remote viewers, and I've interviewed two remote viewers that are
very adept at it. One is Stephen Schwartz, who does this for to
find to locate archaeological digs and things like that. The other is a guy
named Skip at water HEA's was the gentleman who set up Stargate for the army
back in the seventies and eighties and to spy on to spy on the Eastern
Bloc countries in the Soviet Union using psychics, and which was a very effective
apparently. But anyway, what they tell me is that you can when you
go into the dimension beyond this dimension it's all one time, and they can
if you want to go back in time or to the future, you can
do it, but that's the way. You have to do it through the
mind. For example, they they can tell they can view through their technique
something that happened in the past, and they can view through their techniques the
probable future. And I'll give you a quick example of that if I can.
Steven Schwartz was teaching a class at Atlantic University down in Virginia Beach about
teaching his students how to do this remote viewing, and he had forty seven
students. This particular story took place in two thousand and three during the Rock
War, when before Saddam hu Sin had been captured. So at the end
of the session into the class after the last few days, he had his
students remote view the capture of Suddam Hussein which had not yet taken place,
and he took the forty seven answers that he got and compared them and took
any of the ones that agree seemed to agree, and made a list.
And it's a list, you know, about ten or fifteen observations, and
every one of them was right on how he was captured, what he was
wearing, the fact that he had a pistol with him, the fact that
he had a lot of money with him, seven hundred and fifty thousand dollars
in cash, All of that checked out. And so I mean that's the
case of traveling to the probable future. It was only six weeks between the
time that was done and when it happened, So you know, things can
change. We do have free will. But as long as they keep going
the way they're going, that's what the future is going to be unless something
happens. And what I'm trying to do with my TV show and books is
is get the information out that will shift people's consciousness, so they'll so they
we'll all start getting along a whole lot better. That does one shift their
state of consciousness? Well, by knowing and reviewing the facts of what you
know. You're taught in school. We're all taught in school. The scientific
materialist viewpoint. A doctrine I would say that came about in the nineteenth century,
eighteenth and nineteenth century. Back one of the books I've written. One
of my ancestors was one of the Salem witches, and I've written a book
about her. Yes, love that book. Yeah, it's called a Witch
in the Family. And go to my website and I find it in my
list of books and click on it. Interesting, so interesting. Yeah,
it is well. And I've written that book from the standpoint of my understanding
now of the true nature reality that when most books are written, like you
know about the Witch Trials, they assume there's no such thing as the paranormal,
because that's the scientific position that's been ever since Darwin, actually before Darwin.
Let me quickly explain that a English philosopher named Thomas Hobbes who's fairly famous
and wrote the Levethian I think is this famous book. It's about politics.
But he said, and I think sixteen something it was around the Witch Trials,
that if God made it, then that's all that exists. In other
words, our physical reality is all that exists. Now people intellectuals picked up
on that, people like Thomas Jefferson, and you know, our founding fathers,
many of them believed they became what's called deists. Just the clockmaker theory,
the idea that God created it all wounded up and let it go and
it is no longer involved, and that the physical realm is all that exists
because that God made it, you know, and let it go. Well,
along comes Darwin in the mid nineteenth century, eighteen fifty nine, I
believe is when he published that book Origin of Species, and they were intellectuals
were able to get rid of God altogether. So based on Darwin's theory of
survival of the fittest and how organisms came about, Well, that is still
taught in school, even though there's the quantum mechanics came along in the earth.
Early twentieth century, Max Plank created quantum theory and actually won the Nobel
Prize for it. And Max Plank said, clearly the ground of reality we
cannot get past consciousness. Consciousness is the in so many words, ground of
reality from which everything comes. It's it's not that matter the brain creates consciousness,
it's that consciousness creates matter. Well, he's been saying that another quantum
physicists, you know, Einstein's basic theory was that equals mc squared. Energy
equals mass times is speed of light squared. Well that what all that means
is there's really no such thing as matter the way those nineteenth and eighteenth century
people perceived it. It's all energy, and it's energy that's conscious. Max
Plank also said that there's an intelligent mind behind it all. Yet we're taught
today in school that everything came from a big bang, which started with nothing.
So from nothing, which doesn't exist, came all the laws of the
universe, all the matter and energy of the universe. I mean, it's
ridiculous. You need to go you need to listen to what the founder of
quantum physics said, Max Plank. There's an intelligent mind, consciousness behind it
all. Now they do. They definitely have a theory that the field is
the ground of reality, the unified field, and that is basically what Max
Plank was talking about. But still we're taught in school that all that exists
this matter. So if you buy into that, when you die, that's
it. It's like we pull the plug on a vacuum cleaner. It's a
shame. It's a shame. It's they're being taught whatever is being selected to
teach them, and then they come out only knowing this and have no perspective
on the reality, which is a shame. Well it is. And you
know, thousands of people have had and I think I read somewhere that it's
something like fourteen percent of the public has had a near death experience. I
had one when I was twenty five, and that's what really started me on
all this. But I when they have this, most people who have the
near death experience experience a life review. Now you're not judged. There's no
god with a long white beard who's standing there and pointing his finger at you
the mistakes you made or thing that you shouldn't have done. But you see
what you're fact what efect you had on others, both good and bad,
base lesson, base lesson, Yeah, based on your actions and your thoughts.
And as I said, nobody judges you, and you don't go to
hell because of it. But if people knew that they were going to have
that life review, it might change their you know what they do a little
bit. You know what I come from the people that I've interviewed from near
death experiences. It's changed them forever. They really they really learned something from
it and came back a totally different person. Do you mind sharing with us
what happened to you when you were twenty five and how that went. Yeah,
that was a very brief out of body experience, but it was enough
to wake me up. What happened is I I had a terrible case of
the flu. I was a bachelor living in Baltimore, worked at an ad
agency, and I had two roommates, both bachelors, who were you know,
we were having a good time living there in an old townhouse in Bolton
Hill and Baltimore. And I was up in my bedroom on a Saturday night
with terrible case of the flu, felt awful, and I heard people come
in downstairs and you know, sort of chatter starting, and I said,
oh, my gosh, there's a party going on down there. And so
I decided, at the age of twenty five, you know, well I
get up, I'll be all right. And I went down and I had
some drinks and things, and I just started feeling horrible. I managed to
make it back upstairs, flopped down in the bed, and the next thing
I knew, I was looking down at my body and it looked like roadkill
down there, and I was looking around. I saw the ceiling and I
was looking at the little cracks and see it and I thought, you know,
I don't feel bad anymore. I feel pretty good. And wait a
minute, that's my body down there and I'm up here. Revelation. I'm
not my body. I'm like consciousness. So that didn't last very long.
It didn't go through the tunnel. I didn't have a life review. It's
really was very brief. But I woke up the next morning. I was,
you know, not okay, but I was better than I was when
I flopped out on the bed. But anyway, that started me on.
I grew up in that situation. We we talked about where I was in.
My family were secular, you know, materialists type people. I mean,
we went to church on Christmas and Eastern but I was not brought up
into a religious family. And I learned in school, as everybody else did
and still does, that batter is all that exists. And you know,
the brain creates consciousness and when you're dead, you're dead, and that's it.
And so I realized from that experience, that's not right. Something's different.
First thing I did was join the Rosie Cruise in Society Order, which
is a society of mystics who study metaphysical laws. And I went through all
their courses and went from novice to adept and I read everything I could about
metaphysics. When Raymond Moody's book came out, Life After Life, I read
it in one sitting. And I've studied this for it's been fifty years.
I've had a what back then was called an internet talk show called The Truth
about Life for about three years, interviewed over one hundred authorities on things like
quantum mechanics and paranormal research, near death survivors, etc. Etc. Over
one hundred individuals, and that's where a lot of the material in my book
comes from. I interviewed a couple of people from the Division to Perceptual Studies
at the University of Virginia, Jim B. Tucker, for example, who's
head of that, Who's written two books on memories of past lives. And
so, Yeah, that's a long answer to your question, but it was
a very short out of body experience. But it woke me up. Do
you feel like we constantly go into a new the past life regression? I've
had that myself because I was curious, because I felt like I had pass
lives. The question I want to ask is do you think that we keep
on moving into different lives to learn different lessons or do we actually go somewhere?
Is there a place for us to go to? I know that I
totally don't believe that there's nothing. I don't believe that it ends when we
die, that's for sure. But where do you feel that we actually go?
Do we move on to another life? Do we have choices to make?
Can we go or not go? Yeah? I believe that we when
we die, when our body dies, we don't die. But when our
body dies, we go into another of mind. I think of it as
mind, so you could call it a spiritual realm if you want. And
that Jesus said, then my father's house there are many rooms, and so
I think he was talking about the fact that there are a lot of places
you go. I think you go where you feel comfortable, and that you
probably have a group of souls that are your soulmates who are evolving with you.
And this is certainly not my idea, it's one that I've heard from
a number of people who are into all this, that you incarnate off,
not every time, but often with different souls from that group that you're part
of. You might want life. They might be your father or your mother,
or your sister, your brother. But it switches around, and that
the whole purpose of life is evolution. If you look around at the world,
you can see that everything is evolving. All the life is evolving.
That's what it does. I wrote a book called The Secret of Life.
In a spoiler alert, the secret of life is the urge to become.
We all have the urge to become more than we are, and that is
what we're doing each time we incarnate. Now. I believe also that we
have a some choices to make when it's when we decide that we're going to
go back to the physical realm, and it's usually to either complete some sort
of mission. We have something that we want to get done and or there
are things that we need to learn to improve ourselves to for our soul to
evolve. And we're setting ourselves up to have the lessons and the problems and
things that we have to overcome during our lifetime. In order for us to
learn that and ford to become part of us, we go through a veil
of forgetting when we enter this reality, because if we knew all that we
knew when we were before we incarnated, and what we were trying to do
and so on and so forth, that it would be like cheating. It'd
be like having the answer to the test before you sat down to take it.
And so it wouldn't be something that you internalize. You have to go
through these struggles and face difficulties and overcome them in order to internalize it and
to grow. Now, it doesn't mean that we're always successful in every life
and accomplishing what we set out to do or learn. In fact, it
is possible to regress, to go backwards. But I think that's what it's
about. I think we're on a path toward reunification with the Source, and
we've got a long, long, long way to go before we get there.
I tell you quick story about regressing if you if you let me do
it. It's your listeners probably know about Edgar Casey, who was back in
the twentieth century known as the Sleeping Prophet. He was a psychic who went
into a self induced tranch twice a day, once in the morning, one
st afternoon and answered people's questions mostly had to do with health issues that they
were suffering. He's also known as the father of verbal medicine or you know,
a kind of natural medicine. He was born in eighteen seventy seven and
died in nineteen forty five. But Edgar Casey did a past life review of
himself. He studied his own past life, and apparently in the previous life
he had regressed. He had been at way way back a priest in Egypt
and had attained a very high level of spirituality and psychic ability, and he
when he used it in his current life between eighteen seventy seven nineteen forty five,
he had to go into a trance to do it. Prior to that,
he did not have to go into a trance, and he misused that
ability to enrich himself. He was a riverboat gambler. He seduced women,
you know, he was a real rogue, using psychic abilities in a way
that apparently he shouldn't. And so that was why he said that he had
to go into a trance in the current life in order to in order to
access that ability. So there you go. Did he know how he died
in the previous life, he probably did, but I don't remember remember that
part. I have been down to. There's place in Virginia Beach, which
not far from me. It's a couple hour drive called the Association for Research
and Enlightenment, and that is the nonprofit that Edgar Casey established during his time
back in the nineteen thirties, and it's still there, still going strong.
It's right at the corner of sixty eighth and Atlantic Avenue, a big building
and it houses all his readings. They were all taken down by a stenographer
and typed up, and they're now available. I believe you can get a
CD with all of them on at fourteen thousand readings. But I've interviewed people
who work there, including Kevin Titeski, who's the executive director of the Association
for Research and Enlightenment, and that's really from him. Then from a guy
named Peter Woodberry, and also I interviewed in two thousand and seven. I
think it was Edgar Casey's son, who at the time was ninety five years
old, whose name was Edgar Evans Casey. He was still very sharp.
But anyway, that's how I know most of these anecdotes about Edgar Casey I've
read books about him. There's a wonderful book on reincarnation called Many Mansions by
a woman I can't think of her name right now, but it explains all
this thing about evolution and why we come back and how we can be affected
by something that happened in a past life can be still troubling us. Now.
You know, maybe we drowned in a past life and so we're afraid
of water. Water, yeah, yeah, yeah, very interesting. So
there are four modes of consciousness, correct, four modes of well you have
I'm not sure what you're asking. There's there's the ego supegouin d yes yes,
yeah, yeah, yeah, the adult in the modern partans it's adult,
parent and child and that that was a book that was gosh, it's
probably written fifty in the seventies, which I read. It's a great book
called I'm Okay, You're Okay, And basically it's how we interact with one
another and most and most people go around thinking that others are okay and they're
not okay, and so they have to win approval from others and so they're
operating out of their child, whereas others walk around, you know, thinking
they know it all and you want to tell people what to do, They're
operating from their adult and the way to have a happy life is to stay
not not your adult, your parent. They're operating from the parent. The
way to have a happy life life has to stay in your adult, which
is the rational reasoning part of you that can consider all kinds of things without
getting upset about it. And when you're triggered by something happening and you want
to react, you need to step back and say, I'm not going to
react. Now. Why did I feel that way when so and so said
that or when such a such happened, and kind of analyze yourself and bring
whatever it is to the surface that you learned as a child or from a
past life, wherever it comes from. It made you feel that way,
and that's the way to get to improve yourself. I guess what do you
think about? All? That? Confusing? To me? I don't have
a metaphysical mind like you do. For me, it has to be in
very simple terms. That's the way my brain works, and I find it
very confusing. I don't know if I would be able to even tell if
I've reached a higher consciousness. To be honest, with you. I would
I would love to have an out of body experience like you did. In
fact, I think I've had dreams in the past which people say weren't actually
dreams. I may refer to it as dream, but people that I've interviewed
have said to me, no, you actually had an out of body experience,
because what had happened was I didn't feel myself going through the roof,
but I was already above my house, and I was in the sky,
and I could see the stars around me, and I could feel the wind
blowing in my ear my hair, and I knew I was out of my
body. Is that a different consciousness? Yeah, well that's what you had
there. Most people would call that elucid dream, but you were out of
your body. I mean, this reminds me. I think I mentioned Skip
Atwater, who was the guy who started the Stargate unit of the Army Intelligence.
It's Russians with psychics. He that's so interesting. As a child,
I interviewed him, and he is a child would go out of his body
at night all the time, and sometimes he would he would think he was
he was going to the bathroom, but he would wet his bed. Oh,
out of his body. I mean, his consciousness was out of his
body, but his the rest of me was still in bed the body.
And so his mother apparently was into all this sort of thing and explained to
him why that happened, that he was really he had he'd left his body,
but he left his body, he need to to take his body with
him when he went to the bathroom. So yeah, especially children, I
think I have that experience very receptive. Yeah, they're very receptive children.
And when they reach a certain age, well that's what they even say with
past life, past lives. Children up to I think it's the age five
or six can remember things clearly, and then as they grow older, it
tends to they lose that memory. As you said earlier, because if we
knew about everything that we learned in our previous life, it would be like
cheating on a test. So that's probably the reason for these children forgetting as
they get older. But I do appreciate the fact that that man's mother,
who was into that sort of thing, was able to nurture him in that
experience so that he would understand what was happening to him, because a lot
of children don't grow up with that kind of support, and some of it's
intentional because they think they're crazy. Don't tell the world because they're going to
put you away that sort of thing. Others are just ignorance, They don't
understand it or know it, and they say it was a dream, it's
not anything. But those people who actually understand and support this sort of thing
and recognize it in their children and then are able to nurture it and help
them grow. I work with people in the field that are so much,
so experienced and so learned, and I'm learning from them because they had parents
that help them in their journey when they were younger to learn and understand their
gifts and use them for the betterment of paranormal world. Well, yes,
and that's absolutely true. And the thing of it is, we've all been
taught in school that it's impossible to leave our bodies and go out into you
know, for any of this sort of stuff we've been talking about to happen.
And so by the time we are told that enough times, we believe
it. And that's one of the reasons I want to get this information out
through my books and through hopefully this TV show that we're doing, so that
people will understand what is true and real and what the true nature of reality
is, and that we are the spiritual beings who were not meet robots,
which is what we're taught in school. We're taught that we're like, you
know, a robot made of meat with a brain, that it's like a
computer that creates our content business. And that's not at all the truth.
So there you go. I understand that anxiety has a way of working its
way into the mix of these shifts. Have you heard anything like that before
that? The Yeah, I think we're going through a time that's very chaotic.
And I think whenever whenever you have a shift, that's what happens.
There's there's chaos for a while. And that's the stage I believe that we're
in. We're in the chaotic stage where where we've got political parties that can't
you know, compromise anymore. We're either all one way or all the other
way, and you know, it's it's a mess. The world is kind
of a mess. We've got wars going on, two big wars, you
know, Iran, who knows what's going to happen with that, China and
Taiwan. I mean, this is about us you know, since World War
Two, I can't remember it being any words, And yeah, we're going
through chaos, but I think we're going to come out on the other side.
I believe, I'm optimistic that we will have the shift that will go
in the right way. The other thing is AI artificial intelligence. You know,
how's that going to affect the world. It can only draw upon stuff
that's already in the in the system, and so much of it is false
because it's based on scientific materialism, on physicalism, which is an incorrect doctrine
that's based on a false premise, the premise being that only matter exists,
and it's not true. Wonderful will ever change the minds of people, you
know, try But I heard I heard a quote recently that Carl Young,
who theorized that there's a universal consciousness that we're all part of, which is
the same idea macrl. Young said, progress is made one funeral at a
time. So the old guys that are holding on to this old fashioned scientific
materialism for the nineteenth century, they got to die off before we It's so
funny that you should say that, because I don't know if you know,
but I'm a paranormal investigator. I do investigations in old people's residences and business
and I write about them in my books. And I'm really into historical preservation
in trying to preserve these older buildings that get torn down to build enormous apartments.
And I like to approach the historical societies in the areas that I write
about to try and help them, because most of them are nonprofit and they're
trying to raise funds to keep these buildings up and preserved. And I try
to use the paranormal because that's what I do. I tell them, look,
we can we can have a fundraising event where we have a paranormal investigation
in the building and the funds that come in will help you to preserve the
building. And there are so many older people there that are unbending and oh
no, we don't believe in ghosts. We don't, we don't believe in
the paranormal. And I'm thinking, think outside of the box. You may
not believe it, but there are so many people that do. And why
don't you just be you know, optimistic about it and say, okay,
well, let's let this happen. Even though I don't believe in it.
It's going to bring in money to help us keep this beautiful building in it
the form that we want it to be. But no, they're not.
And that thought has been in my mind constantly that we just have to wait
for these people to die unfortunately, for things to actually happen while they were
allowed. So you do have groups that ures like, yeah, let's do
it, and they're the ones that are benefiting from it, while these other
ones are just sitting back waiting for the money to roll in, and it's
not going to happen because they're not looking outside box. Plus, when they
die, when that person who doesn't believe in ghost dies, they may not
know they're dead and they may be the one that ends up haunting that building.
I have a question, but let me just quickly tell you a story
that popped into my mind because of what you said, and that is my
first wife was French. We used to go to France every summer and I'd
go for two or three weeks. She'd stayed all you've told me this story.
I love this story, the head tells again. So anyway, her
good friend Katherine married Alrie whose account and they lived in Paris. But he
inherited this house. It's really they cult of a chateau in the Big House
in Lorraine, and we went to visit there one time, and already knew
I was interested in this sort of thing, so he told me the story
about when they were renovating the house. He would at night, when he
was drifting off to sleep, he would hear what sounded like something someone screaming
for help, or if he woke up in the middle of the night,
you know, and he was kind of half sleepy to hear it again.
After a while, he had all these workmen around who were renovating the house.
After a while, he went down into the cellar and he saw this
wall that looked like it might be newer than the other ones, and he
got the workman to tear down that wall, and behind the wall was a
skeleton, and al Rey said, apparently, you know, they popped this
guy in the head, bricked him up behind the wall, and he must
have come to it he was trying to get out anyway. They gave him
a Christian burial and then never heard the night noises again. So you know,
there was a who died who didn't realize they were trying to get out.
Ever since, and because there is no time in the other dimension.
He didn't realize it had probably been fifty sixty seventy years since he'd been behind
there. Did they ever find out who he was? Who that person?
Now? It's he? He thinks it probably happened before World War Two because
the house hadn't been lived in a quite quite some time. So anyway,
Yeah, I think that often people die and they don't realize. There's a
there's a Twilight Zone episode that I saw many years ago where this woman's in
an automobile accident which keeps on going and of course at the end, again
spoiler report, she's dead. It doesn't know, you know, she just
keeps on doing what she's doing. So my daughter and I were just talking
about the Bruce Willis movie sixth Sense just start I spoiler alert out there.
You find out at the end that he's actually dead. But that movie,
when that first came out, I remember, just floored me at the end
because you had no idea throughout this whole meeting. You really just thought that
he was a psychologist helping this young child, which he was, but you
didn't realize that the child who sees ghosts was really seeing the ghost. It
was just a great, great movie. But that's similar to I love movies
that are like, there's another one the others with Nicole Kidman, that's very
similar in nature to that as well. Yeah, but I love those kind
of those kind of movies with endings like that, right, yeah, yeah,
but apparently can't have it. So my advice to anybody is, you
know, eventually we're all gonna, you know, pass, So when you
do, look for the light and go for it exactly, especially since you
mentioned that they don't some people don't know that they've died. It happens a
lot with sudden tragic deaths or like accidents that happened and they don't even realize
it. And as a paranormal investigator, our testimonial is that our first and
foremost thing of importance is the spirit and helping that spirit get acknowledged and telling
the world what it is that they want to say, and if we are
able to help that spirit move on, we try to do that. Sometimes
they don't want to go, and then we have to try and help the
residences in that building to live in harmony with this spirit because we are actually
in that spirit space. They were there before we were but most of the
time we were able to help them move on, which is a great thing.
You know what I mean to do this. You've got an old building
with a spirit living there, living there, Is that the right word.
Yeah? And when they tear the building down and put up the apartment building,
what does the spirit They're still there? They're still there. You're in
the old building. Yeah, yeah, they're still in the old building,
and in their mindset they are. So even though it's changed into an apartment
building and it might be somebody's bathroom that was maybe part of their bedroom at
one time, they are still there haunting it. So you do end up
having I actually wrote about something similar to that years ago. There was a
beautiful old house on a property and it was haunted and the people that lived
there, the elderly woman that lived there, she rented a portion of it
to a young woman, and so they were experiencing all this stuff. And
then when the woman died and the house was sold by her children, it
was torn down and an apartment building was put up, and then the people
in the apartment building were experiencing what they had experienced. And now the woman
who owned the home was part of the haunting. She was haunting the building.
Yeah, I'm not surprised that that's the way it works. Yeah,
yeah, because we build this world around us with our minds, both when
we're in the physical form still here a lot, as well as when we're
on the other side. I did an investigation a couple of years ago in
an old diner. It actually gives you the appearance of an old fifties dining,
you know how they had them looking that way back then and it still
is that way, and they were having experiences in the building. So we
did an investigation and I had mediums with me who could actually physically see,
because sometimes you can anybody can see them if they're powerful enough to let you
do that, but then if not, the mediums are able to see.
And one of them was seeing a man half of his body, just the
upper portion of his body, and he looked to be like a chef,
where he had like the kind of chef hat on. And so when we
asked the owner of the building, they said, well, that makes sense
because the floor used to be lower and we've now heightened it. So the
only reason why you're seeing half of them is probably because he was on the
original floor plan, which I found really interesting. Yeah, that is that's
great, very interesting. Wow. Okay, well it's really fun. I'm
so thankful for you coming back on and reaching out to me. Thank you
so much. It's been my pleasure. I'm so glad you invited me,
and I really appreciate your your your time, and just want to tell everybody
visit my website Shmartin dot com at s H M A R T I N
dot com and find out your books there too. Your books available there are
on Amazon. Well, uh, there are my books are there? There
are some that are on the home page. You can actually download the new
book for free from the homepage of pdf of it. But if you look
up in the menu, you'll see fiction and non fiction books. Click on
that and most of my books are on that page. If you click on
a cover you can find out more about it. It'll take you to the
page on Amazon where there'll be reviews and you can read the first few chapters
and so forth. So, yes, you can do all that through my
website Schmartin dot com. Right, so, listeners out there, you hear
free free. The new book is free. Everybody likes free. So if
you really want to learn more about this sort of thing. Check it out.
If you will like listening to this week's episode and you're into all things
paranormal, check out my other show, Eleanor Rector's Creeping at Real podcast out
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author Eleanor Wagner at gmail dot com. I write about the history of the
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I hope you'll come back again. Remember to tap into your own gifts.
Everyone has them, and in the meantime, make sure you're creeping it
real when piety beginning point of anything