Understand the thinking atheist. It's not a person, it's a symbol, an
idea. The population of atheist in this country is going through the rule,
rejecting faith, pursuing knowledge, challenging the sacred. If I tell the truth,
it's because I tell the truth, not because I put my hand on
a book and made a wish and working together for a more rational world.
Take the risk of thinking. Feel so much more happiness, truth, beauty,
and wisdom will come to you that way. Assume nothing, question everything,
and start thinking. This is the Thinking Atheist podcast hosted by Seth Andrews.
Fast Approaching on my speaking roster Dallas, Houston, in Tulsa, Kansas
City. I'll be in dressed in New York and then Sarnia, Ontario,
Canada. Details on dates, times, addresses, locations, tickets, whatever
at Seth andrews dot com slash Events. I have a confession to make.
I have to be careful because I don't want this to sound arrogant like I'll
be honest. I'm confident in what I do. I'm thirty three year broadcaster.
I wouldn't do this if I didn't think I had something to offer.
And I've developed a style and a perspective and opinions over those three plus decades.
Okay, and I'm sure some are going to hear what I'm about to
say and say, well, Seth's just full of himself and he's you know,
he's total ego. This is what's going If you know me, please
accept this in the spirit in which I offer it up. Okay, And
people ask me what podcasts do you listen to? And I don't usually listen
to podcast I do a lot of wondering of material you've heard me talk about
them, and I love those guys, and long form audiobooks. I do
enjoy audiobooks. I listen to a lot of true crime and some biography stuff,
you know. And there is a podcast I do listen to, smart
Less. I think that's kind of a fun show. And it's a nice
balance between conversational levity and interviewing. I mean, the questions are really softballs,
and I get it right. It's not like you're watching a deep,
probing interview. This is friendly territory as celebrities come on and talk about their
careers. But I follow a lot of those celebrities on the big screen and
I enjoy their work, so that's fun for me. But it's very rare
that I listen to somebody else's material or want somebody else's material, especially in
the atheist movement, because I am busy producing atheist content. The last thing
I want to do is listen to another show debunking the Book of Genesis.
That's what we do. Oh look, we're going to go after the New
Testament and deconstruct the Gospels. You know, We've got a show on that.
Or we're going to do a cult show about scientology or whatever. And
we've done that, and so it's not of great interest to me. Not
that it's not valid, but it's it's just I do it already. So
I'm looking for other stuff. So I decided I'm going to sort of scroll
the podcast verse. My car's got a little interface, a little media interface,
and it's got streaming media. I click that podcast search, and I
just typed in comedy podcast and true crime, and I think I did one
horror movie podcast, like a fan podcast, because I love horror movies.
Those who know me listen to ghost Stories. You know, I've produced a
ghost Stories audio book. So I'm gonna dip my toe into the waters and
within five minutes, I wanted to shove my face through the windshield. I
mean, it's a mine field when you're producing a broadcast, a difference between
sharing interesting anecdotes and parts of your personal life that other people can relate to.
In fact, in radio we call them a relate as a little behind
the scene stuff going on here, I'll pull back the curtain. But you
know, if you're talking about something other people can relate to, even if
it's a personal anecdote, or if it's fun or interesting, there goes in
a bizarre, entertaining direction, that's a journey worth taking. And it's okay
if it's a digression from the subject at hand. Hell, you've listened to
me before I've started the theme of a show. I'll go off on a
bunny trail, you know. In twelve fifteen minutes later, I have to
pull myself back back to the topic that we were supposed to do the theme
of the show. I'm guilty of that. But this is the stuff I
was hearing. And it literally screamed, we want to make you drive off
of the bridge just to end this. That's what I was hearing. Stuff
like this, Hey, Bob's in the studio today, Hi Bob, Hi
Steve. Bob's wearing his favorite green shirt today. You love that shirt.
I love this shirt. You love the color green, don't you. Oh
yeah, I have green shirts, and I've got green shoes and some green
socks, even green socks. Wow. You know it's nine months till Saint
Patrick's Day. You don't have to wear green. It's okay for every day
it's Saint Patrick's Day. For me. You love the color red. Oh
yeah, stop shut up. Nobody cares like if you're going to tell me
the green shirt story, that shit better go somewhere you can tell. I'll
take the green shirt journey with you. If you have a destination that I
can relate to that's entertaining, compelling, funny, whatever, But I love
my green shirt. It just went on and on and oh it's another trap
that some broadcasters fall into. This was huge in FM radio, and I
was guilty myself when I first started. We call them the pukers, and
that is when you're not talking to an audience, you're talking at them.
So you go on and you are trying to sound like what you think or
radio announcer sounds like. And I was guilty for about two or three years.
You punctuate the consonants in these weird ways, like, hey, Q,
what oh seven? Thanks so much for listening today, Gonna be a
great day, chance of showers by the weekend, could be stormy on Sunday.
Done forget to be listening tomorrow morning to the secret song of the day
at seven twenty you could win a brand new car. You hear that you're
punching the syllables because that's what radio disc jockeys are supposed to sound like.
You know, we try to emulate that Scott Shannon counting down the top forty
songs of the nation. Yes, that's what DJ sound like. And you
become this homogenized, vanilla, instantly replaceable, robotic kind of puker. And
I tried that for a while until I finally came to my senses and realized
that I need to be speaking to people instead of talking at them. It's
okay to have a personality of your own. You can be professional without being
some sort of a like a puker. Right, And a lot of these
podcasts I'm scrolling through and the role kind of sounded like this, and they've
all got that canned laughter. They're laughing much too hard at stuff that's not
that funny. Shut the hell up, Shut the hellop stop it. I'm
just saying the comedy podcasts. I've come to the point in my life when
one of the most terrifying things I hear from someone is, hey, they've
scheduled a great comedian. Somebody asked me if I want to go out on
a double day with Natalie and we're gonna go to the comedy club. I
usually just weasel my way out sticky stand up comedy. Everybody's like so and
so, they're so funny, such and such, they're hysterical. I have
this comedian and I'll go, you know, look him up on Amazon,
Primer, Netflix, and I stare at the screen like I'm reading stereo instructions.
I know comedy is subjective, right, everybody's comedy frequency is going to
be different. But I think as I'm getting older, shit is becoming less
and less funny. Terry Gilliam of Money Python Fame has said the same.
He said, as you age, you find yourself laughing less about jokey type
stuff because there are much fewer surprises. You've heard the punchlines before, you've
heard the stick before. And the secret to humor really is surprise, right,
If you see it coming, it's one thing. But if you're surprised
and it's comical, you laugh. The secret to humor is surprised. And
more and more I find myself less surprised. And as I'm listening to the
comedy podcast, you know who's laughing the host and co host at each other
over the dumbest, laziest shit you have ever heard? Yeah, yeah,
ah, stop it, stop talking, stop it. So here I am.
And if I have an opinion about this, people think, oh,
Seth thinks he's all that, thinks he's better than everybody else when it comes
to podcasting. Hell no, I think you can be pretty good at what
you do, but also know there's a ton of people better than you who
could do it better than you. Some people talk about and I'm so grateful
they enjoy listening to the narrated audible version of my books, and I will
shamelessly shill for those audio books any chance I get. Look for Seth Andrews
narrator audible dot com. I've narrated ten books over the past twelve years.
Somebody was saying that d converted my autobiography kind of mirrored their own experience,
and as they were driving, they were listening to the audio book and it
was a companion for them, and it was an encouragement to them, and
they appreciated the polish of it. And I can receive that and say thank
you, knowing that there are many many superior audiobook narrators out there, but
I know how to do it. And i'd like to think I know how
to podcast. I don't know. And by going off on this random I
guilty of the same thing that I've been accusing other people of doing on their
own podcast. People are screaming, right now, get to the point,
sath, get to the point. Who wants to hear about your personal opinions
and private life? Blah blah blah'd somebody complained the other day I was telling
stories about my dogs, Linus and Gracie. An unless I do an atheist
podcast to hear about your dogs, Okay, that's valid. I see them
as personal anecdotes that connect us host an audience, friend to friends, and
it's interesting when I go out on the road and we get a chance to
actually stand next to each other and talk to each other that people have taken
my family into theirs in that amazing way. Hey tell Natalie we missed her.
I wish you'd be able to bring her with you. How are Linus
and Gracie and cats? How is Linus's foot healing up? I mean,
I don't know. It's it's a connective thing. It's an intangible it's hard
to really qualify. It's different than man I should like wearing my green shirt.
This is my lucky shirt. I don't know. I'm sorry, I'm
sorry. Is that arrogant? Am I being an egomaniac? Or is it
confidence? The confidence that comes with years of experience. I don't think you
should do something unless you feel like, let me say it this way.
I don't think you should attempt to do something in a professional way or a
formal way unless you feel like you can pull it off. Like if there
is a comedian who was genuinely funny, there's going to be a time when
they take the stage for the first time, it's amateur night or whatever,
and they want to go out and they have something to offer. You never
want to kill the dream. You never want to kill the dream of someone
who may be learning by doing just tipping their foot in the water. But
there are some people who have new business opening the microphone and attempting to communicate
with other people in this format. This is not their gift. Their gifts
are over here, over there there. Look, you're much better at that
than I am than anybody else in your region. Is that's what you should
be doing this? No? No, no, no, is that arrogant?
I hope not. Anyway, I was listening to I tried listening to
podcasts, and you know, there's like, I forgot how many podcasts.
Aren't there like nine hundred thousand plus podcasts in the world, So I know
there's a ton of great ones, and I only tried out five and a
ram dam search. Do you have a podcast beside this one that you like?
Leave it in the common section, let me know what it is.
I'm most interested in real stuff. I do like true crime. I do
enjoy a good horror story, although most of them that are told. I
don't know why. Everybody feels like they have to sound like John Houseman at
the beginning of the fog when they's sitting over the campfire, you know,
and all they found was an iron hook. No, it's not it's not
interested in that, And who chooses the music for those? Why the theremin?
It's the year twenty twenty three. Somebody's telling a story and all you
hear is that's not scary to me? Not scary. Sometimes less is more.
Sometimes just the voice of a storyteller is a and then your brain connects
the dots and paints the picture and fills in the blanks. Good storytelling actually
in age as you you're not just a spectator. You become a participant in
that way. Is there a podcast that does that when it tells fictional horror
stories? I welcome your opinions, your contributions and suggestions in the comments box,
and I welcome your calls. Nine one nine Roger, thanks for calling.
What's on your mind? Hey? Hey, I just wanted to tell
you. First off, I really appreciate everything you do. I've read all
your books, listen to your podcasts. Thank you, really love your Paul
Harvey stuff. Thank you. But no, my question to you is is
just what do you think of Christopher Hristians would think what we live in today?
People being so easily offended and as much as he came back with his
read retorts and such I just wonder how the reception he would get nowadays.
Well, he would be as horrified by the insanity of the world as you
and I are. You know, he was a free speech absolutist. I
remember one speech he gave where he said, you know, you go into
a crowded theater and screaming fire, and that is protected. I'm not quite
there. I'm not quite the free speech absolutist. I think there is a
social contract, and there are issues of safety, etc. And it's messy.
But he was such a reasonable voice and an encyclopedic rolodex of knowledge about
history and religion that you know, if he saw the rise the resurgence of
the theocrats and the bigots, etc. You know, I think he would.
I would love to hear what he had to say. I think I'd
like to hear how he strung the words together. He had that gift for
elocution, didn't he. Man, he's really did it. Just can listen
to it over and over again and always walk away with feeling a little less
than than you did before. Right, I always felt dumber because he was
so freaking smart, you know. I always felt it like I'm an idiot
and he's got this, And I think the recall was one of the things
that struck me the most because I can't remember why I walked in this room.
Oh where did I put my wallet? Where are my keys? What
was I saying? I can't remember? And yet he would be able to
draw upon the history of the world and do so immediately without notes, And
it's just it was remarkable, perfect recall. Yeah, after having much to
drink. Right on many accounts, right, I think he found many things
in this world offensive. He was offended by Islam's assault on women, he
was offended by Christianity's assault on science, reason, human rights, common sense,
good sense. But I get what you're saying. I think he didn't
want to live in a world where people used, i'm offended to insulate themselves
from analysis and criticism. And I totally agree. And I do find there
are people in tribes of all shapes and stripes, including the atheist movement,
who do like to play the offense card. Is a kind of conversation stopper.
Right, I'm offended. I think that infantilizes some people, not all,
certainly, I think there are things we can be offended about, but
there are some people they broadcast their buttons, and then when other people they
allow other people to push them, they blame everybody else. There's a level
of individual responsibility. I think that must be at least a part of that
equation. And some don't want to talk about that, but I think Christopher
Hitchens certainly would. Absolutely, absolutely, But I just wanted to thank you
for having you're doing them. Keep up at what you work, you're doing
them. You are appreciated. Thanks so much. Take care, we'll see
a have a doing. I never got a chance to meet Christopher Hitchens,
shake his hand and tell them about the time I was watching that debate video
on YouTube and how it propelled me into this journey. I wish I could
have rita at three five two high. What's going on? I'm a philosopher
myself, and I have my own YouTube channel, and I've recently been like
promoting and talking about two philosophies I think you may know about them, anti
natalism and ethylism. Aren't familiar with these? I really am not familiar.
Can you explain? Anti natalism is the philosophical position where it's immoral and unethical
and theological for anyone to have children for multiple different reasons, and there's different
philosophers with different arguments, but the asymmetry argument is there is guaranteed pain coming
into existence and no pain by not being born. Also, there's the consent
arguments, where you can't ask the unborn for consent to being born, so
it's in a position an agolis to rape. So every one of us is
a victim of being born without consents. And this is what unifies all mankind
under one banner. And it's in line with Buddhism, where life is suffering
and it's promoting utility by continuing the human projects. That's anti nuedalism and ethylism
is the same thing, but just including the animals. Have we spoken before,
No, we have not. I have never called before, and I
only recently discovered your podcast because of one of my viewers told me about it.
I had a conversation like that, a little bit like this years ago.
I'm getting a flash of it now. I don't see reproduction as rape.
I don't see it as a consent issue. I think you know it's
explained evolutionarily. You're right that people don't choose to be born, but framing
it as a kind of violation to me, I don't buy that. What
you position if you're unable to ask the girl who's drunk in the alley for
consent and you proceed to have sex with her body. If you cannot ask
consent, it's an imposition. Since the unborn are not able to be asked,
it falls under the imposition of not getting consent. An evolution squanders suffering
only so the advancement of the intelligence can be used as a better scheming tool.
There is no need to make need, and that's all a human being
does when they're alive. Hang on, So the scheming of the advancement of
the intelligence or what was I hearing? I just want to make sure I
understand the human being is using their intelligence to get the heroine instead of asking
how to stop wanting the heroine. If you don't make a person, they
can't be an addict. And so all human life, in all organic life
is is just consumption and reproduction for no end and no purpose. Okay,
well, so we're just figuring out new what. I just disagree with your
premise. First of all, the idea that the cost benefit of the suffering,
even though it sucks, the pain of childbirth, etc. Is horrible,
and I would like to remove that from the reproductive process. The cost
benefit of that is not just net suffering. The person who is born then
has many opportunities to be alive, to breathe the air, to fall in
love, to set and achieve goals, to fulfill dreams. There are so
many positives they wouldn't be deprived. You. I know you've accessed through a
computer right now, right like you've a monitor right next to you. Yeah,
can you pull up David Bennettar's asymmetry arguments. It's on Google Images,
and that will help me its pain. I will after the show. I'll
read the argument after the show. What I'm interested in though, is this,
I mean, would you rather that you would not have been born because
you were not given consent to be born? Book? That's the title of
Benetar's book, It's better never to have been. And I am one of
the people who wish I had been aborted or swallowed by my mom. I
wish I was aborted. I hate my life and I hate the human race.
Well, that grieves me because I think there is much. I can't
tell you nothing. I'm going to finish this, Okay, I can't tell
you what your position or opinion on humanity should be. This is your journey
to take on your terms, and so your opinion certainly belongs to you.
But I'm really convinced that your perspective on being alive, on humanity, on
the opportunity to breathe the air, and love and all those things that are
part of our experience, you know, they're worth having and worth knowing.
And I'm thankful I was born, and I think there were so many millions,
if not billions, who feel the same. I understand your point of
view, and I understand what you're saying, But this right here, I'm
gonna make. I guess I'll make one more point because I know you have
more callers. But the difference between what go ahead? No, No,
go ahead, Okay, I just go rush, and I know you know
no, I can take some time here, go ahead, okay. These
are important. So anti natalism and ethalism are about stopping birth, preventing new
people from coming here. Me and you seth We're already here, so we
can make the best of it. The difference between anti natalism and etholism is
the third step, which is called the promortalism, and it's the human right
to die, which no one is talking about, where it's like there's no
euthanasia censors, where it's like I can't just go and check out because suicide
is taboo. And I have a friend who is fellow philosopher and had his
own channel and he took his own life because the philosophy there was no arguments
against it. So it's like only the good die young. It's better to
live a shorter life than a longer life. In the argument logic is this,
the longer one exists, the more suffering they will continue to experience and
cause others. They will cause others to suffer, and they will experience more
themselves. So the shorter life is the better life because of the pain they'll
experience and the negatives. One hammer to the jaw is more detrimentally a bad
thing than one makeout session. The negatives always as the good. All right,
So I'm a fifty five year old man. I'm guessing I'm older than
you are. Let's say I make it just seventy. Are you saying that
I am I'm cheating goodness by existing for a longer period of time. The
longer I am a live the more damage I'm doing, it's a bad thing.
I wouldn't say cheating. That wouldn't be has to be the right term.
But I think there is a term. I'm not sure what it is,
but it's some mood or emotion that people feel where it's like they've already
they think or they've felt that they've already experienced every emotion that life has to
offer, and it's just a repeat of the other ones. So an orgasm,
a cheeseburger, a soda on a hot day, or a handshake or
a high five, it's the same things repeating themselves cyclically over and over,
and humanity goes to these cycles of times and extinctions where they forget And right
now we're on this cusp of flirting within artificial intelligence, and we're going to
wipe ourselves out. And the trick for humanity to figure out how to stop
this is to leave records that survived the cataclysm, and so far the only
things that survive are like the pyramids or like the Eastern Islands, and no
one knows how they were made. It's like, obviously it was advanced technology,
and it's like we're trying to figure out how to stop this endless cardinal
fucking flesh prison of suffering. Well, I mean they're fact look and I
am. I think I'm going to draw this. What I don't want to
do is is dry the listeners crazy, as they're probably clawing at the at
the speakers at the podcast. But yeah, that's like the thing is the
free speech, Like, like Christopher Inshon said, free speech. I'm a
free speech absolutist, and the human right to die is something that our lawmakers
need to fucking acknowledge that we need to taboo suicide. We treat suicide people
like they're mentally ill. And I'm mentally ill. I have schizophrenia, but
I'm still coherent and logical and competent to have these conversations, okay, And
I'm not saying that we all need to kill ourselves, but I would press
the red button to blow up the earth if I could, because all right,
right, the fact that you've been very transparent about your on struggles with
mental illness, and I don't want to in any way betray that or minimize
that. I just think you and I definitely I'm going to I'd like to
finish this sentence. I think you and I simply disagree that we are merely
processing on the hamster wheel of emotion, and once we have experienced those emotions,
repeating them becomes this banal exercise, this redundant thing that renders everything meaningless.
I don't think joy felt yesterday disqualifies the joy I feel today or seek
tomorrow. I don't think the love that I had enjoyed yesterday will negate or
nullify or diminish the love I feel today or tomorrow. And I think life
is a wonderful, beautiful thing for a great many people, and so many
of us would like to extend that as long as we can. It doesn't
mean we seek eternal life through AI, Heaven, etc. Which would render
everything meaningless. We know we're on the close. There's a sense of urgency,
but you know, this idea that's being born against our will is kind
of a form of rape, and it's all suffering, and I wish I
could blow up the world. That to me is a tragic position. It's
an unfortunate point of view. And it's my hope that you will be able
to see an extract real joy and meaning out of being alive, because this
is the only ploth we have Okay, Rita, are you closing off now
or that I don't want to have another point? Is our goodbye? I'll
think of bye if you're saying godby too, I don't want to have another
point. If you hear that was it? If you would, I feel
like this is probably a good closing chapter point for the call. Okay,
respectfully, No, respectfully, I appreciate your position. We stand apart on
this, but it's something that you've given our listeners to chew on and we'll
see what happens. Okay, Okay, thank you for having my call.
Yeah, I appreciate it. I mean, there are some things I hear
in that call that you know, I hate people or I hate humanity.
To make sure I'm remembering that correctly, I hate being alive. And of
course, when he references his own struggles with schizophrenia, etc. You've got
to be very careful. I'm going to make sure that I'm not at all,
I don't know, building an argument on or unnecessarily highlighting or exposing someone
who may be at a place where cognitively we are not in a healthy place.
You know. I mean, that's very that's touchy. But his sentences
were coherent. His point was made certainly with passion and conviction. What do
you think I think life's beautiful or can be beautiful. I'd rather be alive
than not. I'm thankful I was born. I think connecting and living and
loving and dreaming are amazing, wonderful things, and I'm every day grateful to
be able to experience them. And it's my wish that other people would feel
the same as well. You know, and I certainly hope Rita finds that
fulfillment, love and joy in his own life. Your perspective on some of
this and whatever else is on your mind, we'll talk more next. We
get a chance to tell a lot of stories on this show, and I'm
thankful for that. But I have a second podcast which really feeds the storyteller
in me. I get a chance to tell five minutes stories, true stories
about stuff. Something may have happened last month or hundreds of years ago.
It could be true crime or celebrity trivia or weird news to something bizarre,
interesting stuff that occasionally might blow your mind. So subscribe on all major podcast
apps. True Stories with Seth Andrews Bryce at six one a tie. Thanks
for calling. What's On your mind. Hi, So I've been dealing with
my fiance's grandmother for some time will both of us have, obviously, and
she posts some very boring on disturbing things on Facebook. Here's a prime example.
Here's a post from back in December, Santa Claus not welcome here that
includes his eight reindeer, Rudolph two and his elves. They are a big
lie themselves. Christmas is to honor Jesus and that alone is what should please
us. Only Jesus had to die, but not to spread the Santelli.
Jesus said, he is the truth. That is what to teach our youth.
It sounds a lot like what I've heard in fundamentalist Christian cultures that Santa,
the story of Santa, cheats the Jesus narrative that they believe is the
core of Christmas. So there's nothing really surprising there. What is it that
you want to accomplish? Are you asking that? If you should respond or
intervene somehow more or less. We've tried to disengage a lot lately, but
she just really lashes out over Facebook, because that's really else she has at
this point. But it's not just the direct correlation with Fanta and the Christmas
season. It's anything that could possibly be used as an idol to draw attention
away from Jesus. So she posts about the tooth Fairy, the Easter Bunny.
These are lies. We shouldn't lie again, the irony. But no,
she's apparently I don't know if she'd been diagnosed with schizophrenia, but there
is a point long time ago bipolar when they attempted to medicate her for that
and apparently didn't go as well as she had helped, and she's been long
unmedicated. She doesn't think she has a problem. So we're talking about someone
who is expressing a fundamentalist faith and her own opinions about Santa on her own
page. She also may be suffering from some kind of a mental illness of
some kind and it bothers you, and you would like to see her rescued.
Yeah, I'd say that's certainly a good way of putting in. My
opinion is probably for some might be controversial, But I've got fundamentalist religious relatives
that post this kind of screed on their own pages. Doesn't affect my life
one bit. In fact, the mute or unfriend button has actually served me
quite well, this is their space, whether it's wacky or not. It's
their Facebook page, and I can decide to follow or not. The odd
are pretty long that you're going to be able to go and create a complete
mind position change in this person, especially if this delusion is linked to some
kind of mental illness, schizophrenia or otherwise. I get that it bothers you,
but I think trying attempting to change this person, I think that's probably
one step forward and about ten steps back for your own peace of mind,
I just consider unfollowing and getting on with your life. That's my two cents.
Yeah, I think that's some solid vice stuff and definitely take it into
consideration at the very least. I don't want to sound cruel in this sense,
but it's bordering on amusing some of the things she posts. I get
it myself, have you know. I think we all have the fantasy of
rescue, and there are some who can be rescued, but it's situational.
I think you look at her age capacities and on what form or format would
you be successful. It ain't going to be by commenting on Facebook. I
guarantee you that. So you know, if you see a window of opportunity
for a meaningful discussion. I certainly would never discourage that, but committing yourself
to changing her, you know, that's a place where madness lies. Okay,
all right, I really appreciate the advice up and will definitely take it.
Take it or leave it one guy's perspective, hang in there. Thanks
for Colin. Appreciate you, Appreciate you. Take care. I see you.
I got a relative and it's all conspiracy. I mean it's the typical
one world government and the Jews and George Sorrows and COVID conspiracy and satellite tracking
and just the wankiest shit. I swear someone passed away on Natalie's family tree,
a woman of eighty who had lived a wonderful life, who had heart
attack and died suddenly, and someone else in the family. Their first question
when they called had they gotten the vaccine? Meaning they believed that COVID vaccine
had killed her. Now, I will counter that publicly, But will I
commit myself to attempting to change this person's mind? No, No, it's
rare. I'm working on a speech that talks about identity beliefs and how so
often when you and I try to bring data points and they don't work,
and people not only don't change their minds or they're not curious, but they
actually doubled down and get pissed off. Why does that happen? We get
into in grouping, social identities, communities, group think, and how there
is an emotional bond that is created two ideas and two others of like ideas,
people who validate us and all humans can be guilty of it. We
get into the COVID communities and the anti mask communities, and the flat earth
communities and the wellness communities, you know. And so anyway, I've been
kind of nibbling away at that something I'm probably going to launch when I travel
in the fall. I've got so it looks like an international area code of
forty four. Alexis, Are you there? Yes, I'm here as thanks
for calling. Where are you calling from? I'm calling from Glasgow, Scotland.
Wonderful, It's so great to have you. What's on your mind?
Alexis anti vaccination movement and how how can somebody be anti vax and this day
and age, it just flab augusts me, don't understand it, And also
flab augusts me is se on newspools are entertainment programs, say daytime television,
if they're talking about health and specifically vaccinations, and then they'll bring on doctor
and then they'll have some celebrity. I've got an example to tell you.
Years ago, on a brit daytime TV program called This Morning, they were
talking about the vaccination for young teenage girls against the human papaloma virus, which
causes sur vical cancer. So they had on two doctors to practicing medical doctors,
and then they had odd to counteract these doctors arguments an ex glamor model
who just happened to have teenage daughters, and I just couldn't believe it that
it dis astounded me. I understand your concern. It's hard. There seems
to be a pride in resisting science. One of the arguments I've heard is
well, science is always changing. Science used to say this was true,
and then it changed and now it says that is true. Or it's anecdotal
I knew someone who got vaccinated and the next day they were sick as a
dog. Or it's a correlation causation argument. We get into social in grouping.
Look at all the people who agree with me they don't trust vaccines either.
There's a personal freedom angle where they've decided, you know, you're not
going to tell me, you're not going to require me to get a vaccine.
No, no, no, My freedom expression will be one of resistance.
There's a hundred gears in the machine, all of them frustrated. And
I remember talking to Karasena Marie about this, and she had a great point
about the absence of collectivist values, this idea of social responsibility. What can
I do to keep other people safe, even potentially to minimize harm and the
loss of life? How can I help? That? Attitude seems to be
missing And a lot of these people. Have you seen that in Scotland,
These people who say you're not going to tell me what to do whatever,
not under guards to anti vaccination, or at least I haven't knowingly come across
any people who are anti vax but I have come across people who were against
social distancing and against wearing their mask. And about two jobs ago, there
was one one of my colleagues who I got on stone very well, but
he was so getting social distancing and at that job, at the place where
I worked, then you weren't allowed to go into the elevator by yourself,
and so I wouldn't go in if anyone else was in the elevator. But
one day Finns going in for my shift, met my colleague whether we chat
outside and we went in to go to our shift, and he went in
the lift and he said, don't worry, let's just coming here with me.
It doesn't bother me. And I went, no, no, I'm
not going to do that. Well, if they don't think he would have
been bothered, any of the supervisors managers would have told him off. I
don't want to get told off for that, and I don't want to put
someone's health at risk. It's funny, Ale sister. In the high to
the pandemic, we had some people who they would purposefully go and cough on
other people in public just to show off, like, not only am I
not going to wear a mask because hashtag freedom, but I'm going to go
and force my you know, my particles on other people And thought and I
just think, how how do we get there? And it's frustrating to live
in an anti science culture where everybody in their dog can come up with the
wackiest conspiracy theory and find validation for it on the internet. I don't know
what the solution is. Just no, I feel you. I sympathize with
you of them. I'm glad you're there, you know, masking and vaccinating
and standing up for a good science. That's encouraging to me. Yeah,
well, I'm just one test. No no, no, You're not just
one person. You are one person and that matters. So Alexis you keep
kicking Okay, okay, well thanks, all right, take care, bye
bye bye. A lovely accent, Oklahomans have an accent. We have an
accent, and it's people just start deducting IQ points. I can get my
y'alls on, you know, I start saying euan's and y'alls when I get
real tired. But if you're from Scotland, didn't you've got an accent?
It's just lovely. It's lovely. Australia, what a lovely accent? Anybody
from the UK? What a lovely accent? South Africa? What a great
accent? Oklahoma? Not so much. I've got Michael at seven seven zero.
Are you there? Hey, I'm right here. Thanks for calling.
What's on your mind? Oh? I was just wanting to talk about Christian
metal since you like to go on about Christian rock. I was just seeing
there. Do you have any experience in that genre Christian heavy metal? My
experience is going to be decades old. Brother, This was back in the
nineteen eighties and nineteen nineties, right, Stryper and such. I'm talking more
along line like bands becoming the archetype, Eternal Decision and the Second Sea.
Yeah. Sorry, I think we had I don't know if raz band would
be considered metal. It was just hard rock. There was a band called
Deliverance, you know, and we had some other The problem is I'm not
familiar enough to speak with authority about genres. So was it death metal or
thrash metal or whatever? Wherever you log on and it's just double base riffs,
you know, some gaiging certains, you know that kind of thing.
There is a whole genre of Christian music where people do that. You know.
My experience is pretty honestly, So do you listen to it? I
mean, why why bring it up? Why is it on your money?
Absolutely? Well, it's like I've been I've been wanted to talk to you
about these particular bands because one of the things we talk about Striper, we
talk about Skillet and how cringe their performances are, and how they try too
hard to try to get on the mainstream and whatnot, which they really are
mainstream, and it's just that Christian metal itself isn't really mainstream. Like Eternal
Decision actually had an album Aware they have an extraordinarily similar sound to Metallica,
which I think is absolutely hilarious. Well, I did a whole speech called
the Copycats, or we talked about Christian culture and it's radar up to see
what was happening in secular culture, and it says, oh, that's popular,
let's do a Christian version of that. Music is certainly a great example,
and we would just wait. An artist has a hit song, a
band has a great album, and about six months later, there would be
a Christian version of it, usually much weaker, much lamer of pale imitation,
very generic, but at least we had it, and there was a
charm to that because we're like, now we've got a Christian version, man,
we don't have to participate in the world. I'm gonna rock for the
rock man, I'm gonna rock for the King. And that's how we felt
in the eighties when these big hair bands came out like Baron Cross. You
know, we well right for the King, you know, that's how those
albums went all right, right, I think I heard a little bit of
that talk you did about the coffeecat. Yeah, that's awesome. You know
it's awesome. And if you really want to have fun, google search Christian
heavy metal album covers. It is the greatest thing in the universe to see
these album covers. It's just a gift to all human kind. So if
your board Christian heavy metal album covers, just go google it. Okay,
Oh, I've done that. In fact, actually had a CD of becoming
the archetypes of their album Dichotomy. More hairspray was used in a fifteen year
period. I think it's probably the reason that we have holes in the ozone
right now is the metal hair bands of the eighties and nineties, and so
they oh, an apology to the species. Gotta run, Michael, thanks
for colin brother, and we'll see you later. Yes, sure, not
a problem, all right, to see you later. Oh my gosh,
that takes me back. I was second row It's striper for the to Hell
with the Devil tour. I was there. I took this poor girl.
It was a date I was on with. Tina was her name. She'd
never been to a concert of any kind in her life. So I said,
hey, why don't we go to Stryper. They're awesome. They rock
for the rockman. So I got us second row at the Brady Theater,
which was a place that we called the Old Lady on Brady. It was
this charming theater still here in town. And we were right that, we
were right up front, and it was ear splitting. The speakers were just
right there, pointed at us and ah, I mean they were screaming.
You could feel your ear drum actually sort of flutter from the vibration of the
sound. I'm sure I've got permanent hearing loss. At one point, the
opening band, their name was Hurricane. The guy pulls out it's very spinal
tap. He pulls out a guitar, an electric guitar and a gem studded
cello bow and he just screeches it across the strings, just yeah, and
we're all like, yeah, man, awesome rocking for the King. Oh
I'm so embarrassed. I'm so embarrassed. I was there. I lived it.
I was heavy meddling for Jesus Man. Let's take a look a here.
Wow, if you could meet the young your seth, you would just
shake your head and wonder what happened. Let's take a look here at nine
four zero Cody, Hi, thanks for calling. Hi. I was just
kind of sort of wondering. He's like, I've been watching a lot of
atheist content for like a while now, and sometimes they'll talk about like this
certain college that does gives people the fake degrees and stuff, and turns out,
I'm pretty sure that's actually my grandpa. Hang on, miss, I
missed the first part of that. They hand out what degrees, just not
credited to degrees. Oh like gray Mill where you just go and they yeah
they degree farm. Yes, Pice, Okay, go ahead, yes,
sir. Well, I've watched a lot of videos like that, and I'm
pretty positive that it's my grandpa that runs that. And I honestly didn't know
that he did that until I heard a bunch of people into the internet talking
about it. And I'm honestly not sure if I should, you know,
like asking him about that, because I don't know what he thinks he's doing.
It's like ant Hovend the Apologist. Have you seen the place where he
got his degree. It looks like a double wide mobile home. It is
a degree B that is actually my grandpa. Like I think that is the
one that gave him the diforma. These places exist, and so then you
become doctor. So and so. I remember I worked in a building with
a traveling evangelist and he was given an honorary doctorate by his home church.
Tell me that's not a rigged game. And from then on his office manager
required everyone on staff to refer to him as doctor. And he didn't receive
a doctorate. He didn't have a PhD. He didn't actually have enough life's
work to qualify for an honorary doctorate. He was just a preacher whose own
church decided he deserved a PhD or to be called doctor, and he played
that card for freaking decades. I wouldn't say anything to your grandfather, but
I think it's a it's certainly fertile ground for conversation among you and your friends,
you know, And if it comes up, I would lead with questions,
what were their course studies, what were their requirements? Are they accredited?
Were they vetted? You can ask questions and kind of see what happens.
Hell, I might be curious about that, but I don't think i'd
walk in with, Hey, I heard you were the dean of bullshit University.
I don't think i'd lead with that. I mean you can, And
just like also, I guess talking to him about general because honestly, like
he kind of knows I don't really believe in a god anymore, and like
we haven't had the greatest conversation since then. I've kind of been avoiding talking
to him in general. He's kind of trying to like guilt me into him.
He's like he's kind of sickly and about to die. Probably he's playing
the I may die at any moment card. He's just like, did I
really waste my entire life? Do you want this to be the last conversation
we have together? That sort of thing. That's just bullshit. First of
all, he's asserting falsely, and I don't think he believes that his sole
purpose in life was to have a Christian grandson. There were many purposes in
his life, self generated and otherwise. Secondly, this is emotional blackmail,
and I don't think you have to put up with it from anybody, including
a dying grandfather. That's a boundary violation. And I would respond if it
was me with actually, I'm in a good place. I'm happy with my
life. And just as no one could tell you how to live yours and
how to take your journey, I'm going to take mine on my own terms.
Now, I'm here for you if you need anything. But this part
of our conversation really is a personal thing, and we need to move on.
And if he refuses to move on, I think you physically move on.
Have a nice day. Thank you for letting me talk to you.
Karty, is nice talking to you, and we'll see you later. Look
at me counseling people, relational advice as if I had a PhD and family
therapy, counseling psychology. Who knows, Maybe I do. Maybe maybe I
went to one of those little shacks out in the weeds. Yeah, walked
into the lobby and filled out a form, dropped a few hundred bucks cash
only, cash only, and they gave me my degree. Congratulations, PhD
Doctor Seth Andrews. And then whenever I spoke in public, when I'm traveling
and touring and speaking, I would be introduced from the stage ladies and gentlemen,
Doctor Seth Andrews, how many people would actually go and check out my
degree, find out where I had graduated. I think in this community a
lot of people. I think the news would break pretty soon. This is
skeptical audience. You know. I always think about Saul Goodman from the show
Breaking Bad and Better Call Saul, especially when he was really in his sort
of slimy bus bench ambulance chasing billboard shill of a lawyer. He got his
degree by mail from the University of American Samoa Law School. Now, I'm
not knocking anybody who does correspondence courses, because I think those can be extremely
valid, But University of American Samoa does not exist in real life. This
is not an actual college, but it was sort of sold in the series
as kind of a pretender. You know, it's college light. It's sort
of the fast track to a law degree. And I just picture one of
those double wides out in the wilderness. You drive the dirt road, you
go in, you get your degree. That's kind of what I picture in
my mind, Doctor Andrews. Oh, if I wanted to, could I
get away with its? Probably not with this audience. I think your bullshit
meter would be going off pretty much right away. The prestigious, highly esteemed
doctor Andrews will continue hosting and taking your calls next. Thanks so much for
including me in your day. I appreciate your listening so much. Kind of
a random show. We're talking to you about the stuff that's on your mind.
I've got Ruth at seven zero seven. Hello Ruth, Hi, this
is the second time I get to talk to you. I'm so excited.
How long has it been. It's been about a year and a half.
I'm working with the homeless now, I'm feeding the hungry and the nunsheltered in
bushes. And when it comes to schizophrenia, the young man that wanted to
blow up the planet and hate his life, You're right, it's very sensitive
and most of my clients have schizophrenia on top of mess at it. So
sometimes when they get that way, it's best to let him spew sometimes to
get it out of their brains. And he was very distraught. How would
you critique my approach? How might I have like? I wanted to make
sure I gave plenty of room at the same time, while respecting the audience
and the limited time we have together. Do you have any critique for me
how I might improve my approach with something like that. Well, I thought
you did a really good job. I know you've probably been doing this for
a really long time. When it comes to when he wants to starts getting
really going on, you just kind of bring them back down to where they
started. You know, he started he hates life, you know, apparently
he didn't have the choice of being born. None of us do. And
it's hard when I don't know if he was on his medication, Seth was
not. I think he said he had been off his medication. Maybe that
was the next scholar was talking about his grandma. And I think we have
to be fair and say that it's very possible that his position on life and
death, existence, etc. May exist legitimately apart from schizophrenia or any other
condition. I mean, he might just hold that opinion. I've heard it
expressed elsewhere that nobody chooses to be born. It'd be better off if we
had not been born, or we all went extinct. I mean, I
know that this position does exist not there. It does, and it does
with the unsheltered when they're living in a berry bush and they have literally nothing.
But I have to give credit to the outreach program I work with.
And I'm I'm an atheist. I'm not out there to get into heaven and
I tell everyone that. But sometimes these people who have zero, nothing,
and they're schizophrenic and they're going off the deep end, some of the religious
people do bring them in and it helps them. It gives them only one
thing to have hope for. And I know they're all going to be disappointed
when they die. It just gives them that one little bit of hope.
That and cigarettes. I don't think they're going to be anything what they die,
but I understand what you're trying to get the spirit of what you're saying.
It's not like they'll be conscious to be able to acknowledge there was no
heaven. They're just going to fall asleep. That's my position, right.
Who was it Twain who said mine? I hadn't existed for billions of years
before now, and I hadn't been inconvenienced really at all by it, So
I take that right. That's just a saying I say when I'm talking to
my mother about my born again Christian brother, I just make light of it,
like ge mom, he's going to be so disappointed. I get well,
you know, it's interesting. We talk a lot about how we construct
the mechanisms for coping or navigating, and if you are hopeless, if you
have nothing but suffering around you, it's going to certainly color how you see
the world. Some people will, I think, want to see the world
destroyed because you know, the world's been so cruel to you, why continue?
And others will build a happy ending to their story. One day I
will have a mansion and be rich and be whole and be loved and all
those things. And it's understandable. And I think this construction of this afterlife,
this wonderful next chapter. I think we have to approach that with empathy.
Instead of saying, well, how stupid is that? We say,
you know, I understand these people are hurting, and we get it.
Yeah, not everyone gets it. It takes a real I don't know,
a real special person not to argue with them. The last thing I would
ever say to one of my homies, I'm sorry, but there is no
God. They would literally od and die. And they're humans. I look
at them as human beings. They have a heart, they bleed, they
suffered. You know, we've all suffered these people need us, and no
one preaches to them. There's an open church when they want to go,
they don't have to pray to get a meal. We feed them what we
feed ourselves. So there is the place here in Santa Rosa were you have
to give yourself to the Lord to get a meal, and no one wants
to go there. They want to make that choice for themselves. Let me
ask you a personal philosophical question, Ruth, are you glad you were born?
Do you look forward to the future or do you feel like you're just
on the hamster wheel and it's all meaningless. I have never felt meaningless.
My life is and such a joy I love every day. I wake up
early. I'm happy. You know I hear God fearing people say that if
you're an atheist, you have no morals, you can't be happy, or
you have nothing to look forward to. Coming from a nonbeliever, here's how
most of us probably wake up. Everything we do, every choice we make,
every time we make someone happy sad. We do it because it's our
free well to do it. No God tells me what I can and cannot
do. I was taught critical thinking, and the problem with they take their
kids and really really young, and they get them hooked on it and it's
a drug. But you are a happy person, glad to be alive,
looking forward to tomorrow. Yes I am. I can hear it in your
voice, Ruth, and I appreciate your perspective on ours call and thank you
so much for calling me. A thank you fair you can't care. I
see you later, Bye bye. I've got Bruce at two five four.
Bruce are you there? Hey, Seth, Hey have voices? Thanks for
calling? Man, what's going on? Yeah? You are the voice though
joy. Listening to your show brings me joy. Walking outside brings me joy.
We live in a world where I think we're easily manipulated, and as
an atheist, when I speak to Christians, they say, how are you
so happy? How do you know everyone? I've never met a stranger,
but I've met a lot of strange people, but I've never met a stranger.
Hey, it's good to see you. I'm just glad to be part
of this existence. Call live. You know. I was kicked out of
the Catholic school in the first grade because I asked too many questions they couldn't
answer, and my grandmother said, you're gonna be just fine. Search and
keep asking questions is your cup half full or half empty? And I said,
I'm just glad I have a cup. Yeah. And my grandfathers they
both said, you're gonna be just fine. And my parents let me choose
my own path. Even though I was raised in the Catholic family, I
wasn't considered different and I was always a pretty happy kid. The simplest things
make me happy. And people don't understand how that can be. You're an
atheist, you should be full of hate, and they just don't get it.
And part of it, I laughed, insided them for being so narrow
minded. You know, there's a few that I speak to, a few
of these young Christians that I work with, and I talk about how easily
humans are manipulated with the social media and the thumbox, the phone. You're
buying shoes because you saw somebody else wearing them. Do you not think that
religion easily manip let you that easily? And they're thinking a little bit,
they're thinking, you know, and that's all I wish people would do is
think a little bit more about others and quit being so selfish. I remember
that great is it a Jatteruski quote birds born in a cage think flying is
an illness, and you and I are like open the cage, baby,
just spread your wings. There is no feeling like that liberation that comes with
breaking out and breaking free. You feel it, I feel it. I
think we want other people to feel it as well. Right, Yeah,
I don't force anybody, but I'm the guy that always jumped in the deep
end. Come on, we can swim, Come on, you know.
And something my grandmother said that always stuck with me. And she was raised
canceolate, but she had a very open mind, and I think of her
time she had to put on that face. But she said, along your
journey to the mountaintop of nirvana, you might meet the Buddha along the way
and reach up, meet Jesus and reach up and he'll give you a hand.
Reach down and help somebody else. But find your own way, find
your own path to nirvana, your inner happiness, and don't let anybody tell
you their way is the only way. Those are the ones that are scary,
the ones that run around the bottom of the mountain with a book and
a gun or a weapon and say my way is the only way, because
it's not. We're all individuals, we all have a different path, we
all have different ideas. Your enthusiasm is contagious, and I think it's a
great way to sort of cap the show. You know, there's no one
way to be happy. Find what fits for you, be kind, find
the joy, get the goodness. I love it, Bruce, thanks for
calling our slowman. Have a great day, all right, We'll see you
later. I like that. Let's end on a high note. Man,
That's what we'll leave each other with as we call it a day, and
I'll see you back here for the next show next time. Follow on Facebook
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