WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.720 --> 00:00:12.919 Love Talk Radio. Welcome to us a think Tank with your host Alejandro Roh. 2 00:01:23.959 --> 00:01:30.560 Alright, there's the theme music, and I know how excited you all 3 00:01:30.640 --> 00:01:37.879 get when you hear it, because it means it's another episode of UFO Think 4 00:01:38.000 --> 00:01:42.120 Tank. Hello people, this is your host, Alejandro t Rojas, and 5 00:01:42.200 --> 00:01:46.159 we've got a great guest. Of course, we always have great guests, 6 00:01:46.519 --> 00:01:52.040 and this is another guest who's going to be a speaker at the Roswell Festival 7 00:01:52.120 --> 00:02:01.079 next weekend. The crowds go wild because I've had just about everybody who's gonna 8 00:02:01.120 --> 00:02:06.959 be speaking at the Roswell Festival on my show. I am coordinating this speaker's 9 00:02:07.000 --> 00:02:10.199 conference, and I'm very proud of that. I've done a heck of a 10 00:02:10.319 --> 00:02:15.560 job people putting this together. Manhem, I've been busy. I just hope 11 00:02:15.599 --> 00:02:17.479 it goes smooth. Hopefully, you know, you can put it all together 12 00:02:17.560 --> 00:02:22.400 and everything can go smooth and then it's a disaster when you get there. 13 00:02:23.840 --> 00:02:27.000 Hopefully that won't be the case. Not gone. Hell, My desk is 14 00:02:27.039 --> 00:02:30.560 made out glass, unfortunately, but hopefully it's gonna go well. It's gonna 15 00:02:30.599 --> 00:02:34.319 be a lot of fun. You know, these are great people, so 16 00:02:34.520 --> 00:02:38.039 even if a dozen things get screwed up per hour. That's a lot. 17 00:02:38.599 --> 00:02:43.960 I think these are friends who will put up with it. They're they're good 18 00:02:44.039 --> 00:02:47.560 sports and they're just here they get the information out. But I'm sure my 19 00:02:47.639 --> 00:02:53.840 good buddies, Freeward, Amy, Ward Renee, all of these wonderful people 20 00:02:54.319 --> 00:03:00.199 that all work for the city of Roswell, they are absolutely wonderful. They've 21 00:03:00.240 --> 00:03:04.439 been doing a great job putting at things together. Free and Amy have been 22 00:03:04.479 --> 00:03:07.639 working so hard. Peter Robbins, who I've had on the show, he's 23 00:03:07.680 --> 00:03:13.080 been working real hard to get all this together. We're gonna be partying with 24 00:03:13.159 --> 00:03:16.400 Jefferson Starship, all right, So we're gonna have a good time out there. 25 00:03:16.439 --> 00:03:19.719 It's gonna be a lot of fun. And I know some of you 26 00:03:19.800 --> 00:03:23.159 listeners are gonna make it, and maybe some of you have not decided to 27 00:03:23.199 --> 00:03:29.520 go next weekend, and you know what, now's the time to just say, 28 00:03:30.000 --> 00:03:34.840 I gotta do this. Get out there, grab a tent, come 29 00:03:34.879 --> 00:03:38.280 on out. There is campground out there. You know, if you need 30 00:03:38.319 --> 00:03:43.000 to just kind of park on the side of the road and sleep in your 31 00:03:43.080 --> 00:03:46.000 car, you're gonna want to be there because it's gonna be a lot of 32 00:03:46.000 --> 00:03:49.680 fun, and we're gonna have a lot of great speakers, including our guests 33 00:03:49.680 --> 00:03:58.319 this evening. Mister doctor, excuse me, Donald Burlson. What history this 34 00:03:58.400 --> 00:04:04.439 guy has? He is a mathematician, obviously, he's also interested in the 35 00:04:04.479 --> 00:04:13.199 paranormal. He's moved on State director actually for New Mexico, but he's also 36 00:04:13.280 --> 00:04:18.000 at English. His PhD is an English. He's done mathematics. He's worked 37 00:04:18.040 --> 00:04:24.480 at the University of New Mexico. He held the top secret clearance with USO 38 00:04:24.680 --> 00:04:30.639 Air Force Intelligence for it as a Chinese language specialist. He's also fluent in 39 00:04:30.839 --> 00:04:35.600 Spanish and a reading knowledge of French. I mean, this guy sounds like 40 00:04:35.720 --> 00:04:43.439 a super genius, really intelligent guy, done a lot of stuff, and 41 00:04:43.519 --> 00:04:46.040 he's got a couple of books out there, so he's an accomplished author as 42 00:04:46.040 --> 00:04:51.160 well. He has a book on Marilyn Monroe and her death related to UFOs. 43 00:04:51.360 --> 00:04:55.879 Hmmm, we'll talk a lot about that. And then he's also got 44 00:04:55.920 --> 00:04:59.600 another book and that's what he's going to be talking about in Roswell, which 45 00:04:59.639 --> 00:05:04.839 is Oppenheimer and his connection with UFOs, And specifically he will be talking in 46 00:05:04.959 --> 00:05:14.040 Roswell about Oppenheimer's connection to Roswell so Oppenheimer Saudi's Roswell beans or this crash or 47 00:05:14.079 --> 00:05:17.040 something. I don't know. I haven't seen his hock yet, so we 48 00:05:17.120 --> 00:05:19.519 will find out. And you know what, I'm gonna be honest with you 49 00:05:19.560 --> 00:05:23.639 people. Right now, I'm not gonna get into the Oppenheimer's stuff much. 50 00:05:24.000 --> 00:05:27.680 You're gonna have to come to Roswell to hear it. So is that so 51 00:05:27.839 --> 00:05:30.920 much to ask? Come on, if you hop in the car right now, 52 00:05:30.959 --> 00:05:33.240 you can make it, even if you're on the other side of the 53 00:05:33.279 --> 00:05:39.000 country. Grant Cameron, one of our speakers from Canada, has decided to 54 00:05:39.199 --> 00:05:45.079 drive. He's just leaving today. He if he can get there from Canada, 55 00:05:45.560 --> 00:05:47.879 you can get there from wherever you are. Take the Greyhound. For 56 00:05:48.040 --> 00:05:51.680 God's sakes, people, that's only a few bucks. But come on out 57 00:05:51.680 --> 00:05:55.000 to Roswell and check it out. It's gonna be a lot of fun. 58 00:05:55.319 --> 00:06:00.079 And in fact, I've got a little homage to Roswell and just a minute. 59 00:06:00.240 --> 00:06:05.519 But first, the UFOs in the news segment, there's been a lot 60 00:06:05.560 --> 00:06:11.879 of as usual, there's a lot of UFO stuff in the news. I 61 00:06:11.879 --> 00:06:15.519 don't think I covered this with you all last weekend because I just found out 62 00:06:15.560 --> 00:06:19.680 it. I just posted it on Sunday, and that is a new movie 63 00:06:20.079 --> 00:06:26.399 starring George Clooney called Men Hysteric Goats, and it's kind of out. It's 64 00:06:26.439 --> 00:06:30.920 about psychic research that the military did. And the reason I bring it up 65 00:06:30.920 --> 00:06:35.839 here is because it is loosely based on George Clooney's character, and it's going 66 00:06:35.920 --> 00:06:39.600 to be a dark comedy. I said, unfortunately, a dark comedy. 67 00:06:39.600 --> 00:06:42.639 And someone jumped my case, just kidding. He didn't jump my case. 68 00:06:42.680 --> 00:06:46.000 He just had a great question. He said, well, you know, 69 00:06:46.079 --> 00:06:49.240 can't we be funny in uphology And I said, no, this is serious 70 00:06:49.279 --> 00:06:53.959 business. If you're not going to be serious, hit the road, hit 71 00:06:54.000 --> 00:06:58.279 the skids. Just kidding. Obviously I'm being silly because I try to add 72 00:06:58.360 --> 00:07:00.240 humor into my show here. I do my best. Some of you may 73 00:07:00.319 --> 00:07:04.319 find it annoying, and I apologize if that's the case, but hopefully some 74 00:07:04.360 --> 00:07:09.360 of you do find me at least a little bit amusing and adds to my 75 00:07:09.560 --> 00:07:13.639 charm. I like to think, but yeah, I certainly think that. 76 00:07:14.399 --> 00:07:17.199 You know, I think of Ghostbusters, which was a movie about paranormal now 77 00:07:17.199 --> 00:07:23.279 it's hilarious. I think some of the real funny X Files like I told 78 00:07:23.319 --> 00:07:26.879 them, I think your protagonist just needs to probably be you know, like 79 00:07:26.920 --> 00:07:30.720 a researcher or someone into it. Especially. The reason I said unfortunately about 80 00:07:30.759 --> 00:07:34.879 this movie is because it's going to be a dark comedy and the title men 81 00:07:34.920 --> 00:07:39.399 who Stare at Goats, it gives me the sense they're going to make fun 82 00:07:39.439 --> 00:07:44.759 of this because the reason they I think they really had some projects where they 83 00:07:44.759 --> 00:07:47.319 had guys staring at goats is they were trying to kill them with their mind, 84 00:07:47.480 --> 00:07:51.680 which is unfortunate. And it's certainly for any of you people with psychic 85 00:07:51.720 --> 00:07:57.920 abilities or you're discovering your psychic abilities, use it for good. Please don't 86 00:07:57.920 --> 00:08:03.000 go kill goats or other innos and almost used to make people feel better, 87 00:08:03.279 --> 00:08:05.240 you know, that would be the right way to use it, I think. 88 00:08:05.759 --> 00:08:11.680 But this guy, John Alexander, unfortunately works for the military. He's 89 00:08:11.680 --> 00:08:16.279 been in intelligence, and I don't think he uses his powers for good. 90 00:08:16.360 --> 00:08:20.600 He may feel differently, so just the difference of opinion. He is actually 91 00:08:20.639 --> 00:08:28.160 into non lethal weapons. He is into psychic They had him look into the 92 00:08:28.199 --> 00:08:35.759 psychic stuff. He's into UFOs as well, but he says that the government 93 00:08:35.759 --> 00:08:39.480 doesn't know anything about UFOs. Roswell didn't happen. We're all just as curious 94 00:08:39.519 --> 00:08:45.000 as you all, but I do believe they exist. So he also, 95 00:08:46.639 --> 00:08:52.039 along with his non lethal weapons stuff. Oh excuse me, people, my 96 00:08:52.080 --> 00:08:58.399 goodness, he is into the brain stuff, you know, manipulating people by 97 00:09:00.279 --> 00:09:03.720 influence and stuff like that. So some shady stuff kind of you know, 98 00:09:03.919 --> 00:09:09.200 so, but he is into UFOs. He goes to UFO conferences and talks 99 00:09:09.200 --> 00:09:13.639 about how the military is innocent and doesn't know anything about all this stuff. 100 00:09:13.639 --> 00:09:18.840 Who knows other people feel that way as well. I don't, but I 101 00:09:20.200 --> 00:09:24.039 would be really surprised. I think they know a lot. More news. 102 00:09:24.159 --> 00:09:28.960 Multiple witnesses watch UFO dropping lights on the ground right here in Colorado. I 103 00:09:30.039 --> 00:09:35.960 didn't see it, but I'm gonna keep my eyes open. Triangular shaped UFOs 104 00:09:35.039 --> 00:09:39.600 over Arizona have been being seen, and all the rest of these stories I 105 00:09:39.679 --> 00:09:46.279 think were brought to us by Roger Marsh, the UFO examiner at Examiner dot 106 00:09:46.320 --> 00:09:50.879 com does a great job. Some more stories you brought UFOs being seen over 107 00:09:50.960 --> 00:09:56.159 airports, jets possibly chasing UFOs in New Mexico. Will keep my eyes out 108 00:09:56.240 --> 00:10:00.840 for that next weekend, and an exeter UFO festival up here, so that 109 00:10:00.960 --> 00:10:03.440 ought to be a lot of fun. That's going to be late June. 110 00:10:03.480 --> 00:10:09.279 June twenty fourth, Also a couple of other stories that weren't from him. 111 00:10:09.720 --> 00:10:15.279 I got a message from Robert Hastings. Robert Hastings is the author of UFOs 112 00:10:15.320 --> 00:10:20.480 and Nukes. He's been on Larry King. He actually wrote a book about 113 00:10:20.679 --> 00:10:24.960 UFOs seeming to visit nuclear facilities, including if you've heard of the mauls from 114 00:10:26.000 --> 00:10:31.240 Air Force Base where people claim that they turned off the nukes for a period 115 00:10:31.240 --> 00:10:35.480 of time. He's going to be on Larry King along with James Fox, 116 00:10:35.879 --> 00:10:39.159 another researcher. He's going to have a couple other people on. Unfortunately, 117 00:10:39.200 --> 00:10:43.799 he's going to have his skeptics. He's going to have Phil what's his face? 118 00:10:43.919 --> 00:10:48.320 And Bill Nye and Blood. I think they get ridiculous. If they 119 00:10:48.360 --> 00:10:52.120 would at least look into this stuff and argue exact points, that would be 120 00:10:52.159 --> 00:10:56.759 helpful. But they just make these blanket statements, which is unfortunate. But 121 00:10:58.080 --> 00:11:01.679 yeah, July third, Larry King, I'll have UFOs on again, So 122 00:11:01.840 --> 00:11:05.120 keep an eye out for that. If you're in Rodswell, like most of 123 00:11:05.159 --> 00:11:07.279 you are, you know, let's get together. We'll go somewhere and watch 124 00:11:07.320 --> 00:11:13.840 this together. Huh, let's make it a date and let's see one more 125 00:11:13.960 --> 00:11:18.799 story that I had here with NASA and UFO. It's just an interesting story 126 00:11:18.799 --> 00:11:22.480 in American Chronicle where he felt that some of the research and opening up that 127 00:11:22.639 --> 00:11:26.879 NASA is doing in their research is going to force them to look into UFOs. 128 00:11:26.919 --> 00:11:31.879 I hope he's right. We'll see check out his story on American Chronicle. 129 00:11:31.919 --> 00:11:37.360 Remember, you can see all of these stories at UFO think tank dot 130 00:11:37.399 --> 00:11:41.720 com. Scroll down on the very front page you will see these news links. 131 00:11:43.120 --> 00:11:46.759 Also, if you're at the blog talk site on the right hand side 132 00:11:46.759 --> 00:11:50.840 of my homepage, you'll see a link to my Yahoo news. You can 133 00:11:50.879 --> 00:11:56.080 also go to Yahoo groups and look for a UFO think tank there and join 134 00:11:56.200 --> 00:12:00.559 my email list. And that's the best thing to do because you will get 135 00:12:00.559 --> 00:12:03.720 these stories boom boom right on the spot, and you will be up to 136 00:12:03.799 --> 00:12:09.080 date on everything happening. You don't want to read about your neighbors getting sucked 137 00:12:09.080 --> 00:12:15.639 out of their house by a UFO from me on Saturday when you kuld have 138 00:12:15.679 --> 00:12:18.919 heard about it when it happened, and you know, batten down the hatches 139 00:12:18.960 --> 00:12:24.960 and watched out for that, so check it out. That's the news. 140 00:12:24.039 --> 00:12:28.639 Also, this is big news for UFO Think Tank and I'm very happy about 141 00:12:28.679 --> 00:12:37.279 this. I was on Joe Montaldo's show recently. Joe Montaldo runs the UFO 142 00:12:37.559 --> 00:12:43.440 Paranormal Radio Network and this guy, holy moly, gets hundreds of thousands of 143 00:12:43.519 --> 00:12:48.360 listeners. He's on satellite radio in Australia and other countries, so there are 144 00:12:48.519 --> 00:12:52.440 lots of people in other countries you've got they've got a stay sean all day 145 00:12:52.440 --> 00:12:58.159 long. Well, he's going to syndicate my show, so UFO Paranormal Radio 146 00:12:58.240 --> 00:13:03.039 he's going to be playing me on his station. I think he's gonna play 147 00:13:03.080 --> 00:13:07.320 Saturday nights after this show, so if you miss it, you can go 148 00:13:07.399 --> 00:13:11.480 listen to it there. He also loops archives all the time, so they're 149 00:13:11.480 --> 00:13:15.080 gonna hear me over there a lot. So Luckily, I don't like to 150 00:13:15.120 --> 00:13:16.919 brag about this, and you guys know, if you're a regular listener, 151 00:13:16.919 --> 00:13:22.799 I've never bragged about this, but I am the number one paranormal show on 152 00:13:24.120 --> 00:13:28.720 blog talk radio. Believe it or not, that's the truth. I'm typically 153 00:13:28.840 --> 00:13:35.159 always in the top ten most popular radio shows on blog talk radio. So 154 00:13:35.399 --> 00:13:41.000 pretty cool stuff. I've got a lot of people podcasting me, so hopefully 155 00:13:41.000 --> 00:13:45.759 I'm gonna get hundreds and thousands of more listeners on Joe's network. There so 156 00:13:46.360 --> 00:13:50.000 really exciting news. I'm excited about that, people. I hope you are 157 00:13:50.120 --> 00:13:54.480 too, And thank you for everybody in the chat. I'm gonna type thanks 158 00:13:54.559 --> 00:13:58.960 right here to the chat people. Thank you for all of your congratulations and 159 00:13:58.039 --> 00:14:03.360 stuff. I couldn't have it without you, guys, good old buddies in 160 00:14:03.399 --> 00:14:07.639 the chat room. Chat's a lot of fun. So all right, well, 161 00:14:07.759 --> 00:14:11.240 let's move on to the guest. I do have a little bit of 162 00:14:11.440 --> 00:14:16.240 a Roswell special type of thing to do. However, I want to bring 163 00:14:16.320 --> 00:14:24.320 Don on to share this experience with him, and hopefully he doesn't mind, 164 00:14:24.480 --> 00:14:28.080 because I'd like to hear his comments on this little thing. I'm gonna do. 165 00:14:28.159 --> 00:14:31.440 Well, but guess what, I am gonna have to dial down, 166 00:14:31.480 --> 00:14:35.879 and every time I dial, I think you guys know what that means. 167 00:14:35.399 --> 00:14:39.879 There's some dial music. And I know you've probably heard enough about Michael Jackson. 168 00:14:39.879 --> 00:14:43.120 A lot of people are like, I heard enough about that. I'm 169 00:14:43.120 --> 00:14:46.120 Michael Jackson, and you know he was good. His music was extraordinary. 170 00:14:48.159 --> 00:14:52.000 So here's my rendition, which Mama say ma masama, ma Gusa, i'ma 171 00:14:52.039 --> 00:14:54.360 say ma masama, Markusa. I'm gonna say ma masama, mak gusa, 172 00:14:54.519 --> 00:14:58.480 I'm say a massama Masha. I was like, oh, gotta get old 173 00:15:00.080 --> 00:15:05.399 right yet stuck in the may though, and then they pay me. Well, 174 00:15:05.399 --> 00:15:13.440 you got to be stopping something, dude, dude, Hello, Hello, 175 00:15:15.080 --> 00:15:18.919 Yeah, hey don it's Alejandro. Hi. How are you doing. 176 00:15:20.799 --> 00:15:24.840 How are you great? Well, I'm really excited to have you on the 177 00:15:24.879 --> 00:15:28.759 show, and thank you very much for coming on. I'm just really hyped 178 00:15:28.840 --> 00:15:33.799 up. If people can't tell, I'm I'm kind of being a little silly 179 00:15:33.840 --> 00:15:39.559 because I'm so excited for next week. But I'm also yeah, it's gonna 180 00:15:39.559 --> 00:15:43.320 be And you live in Roswell, right you have to do Yeah, so 181 00:15:43.559 --> 00:15:48.840 you've got to not much of a commute, not like Grant Cameron who's driving 182 00:15:48.879 --> 00:15:52.840 all the way from Canada. Yeah. We told him we're not good. 183 00:15:54.879 --> 00:16:00.960 We told him we would pay for a Greyhound, just kidding. We've offered 184 00:16:00.960 --> 00:16:03.200 to playing me. He said, I'm driving. I want to see America. 185 00:16:03.759 --> 00:16:06.679 Oh, well that's a good way to do it. Yeah. Well, 186 00:16:06.759 --> 00:16:15.080 you have quite an interesting background. Your PhD is in English or mathematics. 187 00:16:15.080 --> 00:16:22.360 Okay, an English, but I'm a mathematician by profession, so okay, 188 00:16:23.000 --> 00:16:26.559 nothing but able to decide between the left bling and the right bray and 189 00:16:26.559 --> 00:16:30.200 I suppose yeah, well that's perfect. I mean, the super geniuses are 190 00:16:30.320 --> 00:16:33.519 using both sides, right. Well, I don't know, I don't know 191 00:16:33.559 --> 00:16:40.759 that I've ever been accused particularly well balanced. But you also were in the 192 00:16:40.799 --> 00:16:45.159 Air Force, has had top secret clearance there, and you what for Chinese 193 00:16:45.240 --> 00:16:49.519 language, but you also know Spanish and French. Yeah, you know, 194 00:16:49.559 --> 00:16:55.279 I'm embarrassed to say with my name Alejandra Rojas, I don't even know Spanish. 195 00:16:55.480 --> 00:16:57.440 I've always been kind of a kind of a language fruit. Cool. 196 00:16:57.559 --> 00:17:02.159 Well, that is really cool. And of course you're our state director for 197 00:17:02.279 --> 00:17:06.880 move Fund, which is great. Yeah. Well, I want to get 198 00:17:06.960 --> 00:17:10.720 uh huh cool. I'm glad. Well, I want to get into a 199 00:17:10.720 --> 00:17:12.720 lot of this stuff. However, if you don't mind, I wanted to 200 00:17:12.720 --> 00:17:18.000 bring you on first, just to get into the mood of Roswell. I 201 00:17:18.039 --> 00:17:26.200 want to play the original Roswell radio cast on the incident. I hope you 202 00:17:26.240 --> 00:17:30.799 don't mind. No, of course, there's some people have probably heard this, 203 00:17:30.880 --> 00:17:33.920 but there's probably a lot of people who didn't hear this, so it's 204 00:17:33.960 --> 00:17:36.839 a lot of fun. So let's listen to that real quick and then I'd 205 00:17:36.839 --> 00:17:45.839 like to hear your comments on it. Sure headline of this. In July 206 00:17:47.000 --> 00:17:51.240 eighth, nineteen forty seven, the Army Air Forces has announced that a flying 207 00:17:51.319 --> 00:17:55.160 disc has been found and there's now in the possession of the Army. Army 208 00:17:55.200 --> 00:17:59.519 officers say the missile, found sometime last week has been inspected at Wilswell, 209 00:17:59.519 --> 00:18:03.480 New Mexican and sent to right Field, Ohio for further infections. Russia has 210 00:18:03.480 --> 00:18:08.039 demanded un action to get all foreign military person now out of Greece. Southern 211 00:18:08.160 --> 00:18:11.319 soft co operators have not yet reached agreement with John L. Lewis, but 212 00:18:11.440 --> 00:18:15.519 the rest of the soft coal industry has resumed production. The House of Representatives 213 00:18:15.519 --> 00:18:19.200 has passed the tax reduction Bill by more than the two thirds which would be 214 00:18:19.240 --> 00:18:23.640 required toward the ride of veto Headline edition of englishpecial reports and interviews in a 215 00:18:23.680 --> 00:18:33.119 moment. The American Broadcasting Company A affiliated stations present Headline Edition with Taylor Grant 216 00:18:33.240 --> 00:18:37.440 from all over the world wherever the day's headlines are made. Headline Edition brings 217 00:18:37.480 --> 00:18:42.440 you accurate primary reports on the news behind those headlines, but informity then person 218 00:18:42.480 --> 00:18:48.160 interviews with the men and women who made the headlines today. Today's edition presents 219 00:18:48.440 --> 00:18:52.279 around us of the latest developments in the finding of a flying disc, an 220 00:18:52.319 --> 00:18:57.359 eye witness report of today's significant action in the un Security Council, Ohio Congressman 221 00:18:57.440 --> 00:19:03.960 Thomas A. Genton commenting on today's House action on text legislation, a special 222 00:19:03.000 --> 00:19:07.079 report of the state of the soft coal negotiations, and the details of today's 223 00:19:07.079 --> 00:19:11.160 All Star Baseball game. Reported from Chicago's Stay in step with history of the 224 00:19:11.160 --> 00:19:17.759 making state tuned to headline editions now Here's Taylor Grants. Late this afternoon, 225 00:19:17.799 --> 00:19:22.400 a bulletin from New Mexico suggested that the widely publicized mystery of the flying Sauters 226 00:19:22.440 --> 00:19:26.279 may soon be solved. Army Air Force officers reported that one of the strange 227 00:19:26.319 --> 00:19:30.039 discs had been found and inspected sometime last week. Our correspondents in Los Angeles, 228 00:19:30.119 --> 00:19:33.759 San Chicago have been in contact with Army officials, endevoring to obtain all 229 00:19:33.799 --> 00:19:41.039 possible late information. Jill Wilson reports with Now from Chicago, the Army may 230 00:19:41.079 --> 00:19:44.759 be getting to the bottom of all this talk about the so called flying saucers. 231 00:19:45.200 --> 00:19:48.119 As a matter of fact, the five hundred and nine Atomic Bombs Group 232 00:19:48.200 --> 00:19:52.400 headquarters at Roswell, New Mexico, reports that it has received one of the 233 00:19:52.440 --> 00:19:56.680 discs, which landed on a rant outside Roswell. The this landed at a 234 00:19:56.799 --> 00:20:00.400 rant at Corona, New Mexico, when a rancher turned it o to the 235 00:20:00.440 --> 00:20:04.519 Air Force ranch or WW Brazil was the man who discovered the soffer. Colonel 236 00:20:04.559 --> 00:20:08.599 William Blanchard of the Rothwell Air Base refuses to give the tails of what the 237 00:20:08.640 --> 00:20:12.440 flying disc looked like. In Fort Worth, Texas, where the object was 238 00:20:12.519 --> 00:20:17.920 first sent, Rigadier General Roger Ramie says that it is being shipped by air 239 00:20:18.000 --> 00:20:22.279 to the AAF Research Center at Wrightfield, Ohio. A few moments ago, 240 00:20:22.319 --> 00:20:25.839 I talked to officials at right Field, and they declared that they expect the 241 00:20:25.920 --> 00:20:30.000 so called flying soffer to be delivered there, but that it hasn't arrived as 242 00:20:30.039 --> 00:20:33.279 yet. In the meantime. General Ramie describes the object as being of flimsy 243 00:20:33.319 --> 00:20:37.319 construction, almost like a box type. He says that it was so batter 244 00:20:37.400 --> 00:20:41.000 that he was unable to determine whether it had a disc form, and he 245 00:20:41.039 --> 00:20:45.640 does not indicate its size. Raymie says that, so far as can be 246 00:20:45.680 --> 00:20:48.559 determined, no one saw the object in the air, and he describes it 247 00:20:48.640 --> 00:20:53.200 as being made of some sort of tinfoil. Other Army officials say that further 248 00:20:53.240 --> 00:20:57.920 information indicates that the object had a diameter of about twenty to twenty five feet, 249 00:20:59.200 --> 00:21:03.519 and that nothing in the apparent construction indicated any capacity for speed, and 250 00:21:03.559 --> 00:21:07.279 that there was no evidence of a power plant. But this also appeared Jill 251 00:21:07.359 --> 00:21:11.640 Flimsey to carry a man. Now back to Taylor Grant in New York, 252 00:21:11.720 --> 00:21:18.839 there was important activity within the UN Security Council today. All right, Well 253 00:21:18.880 --> 00:21:21.839 there it is. It's a lot of fun to hear it. And it's 254 00:21:21.920 --> 00:21:27.519 interesting that they mentioned that the Air Force may be close to having more answers 255 00:21:27.599 --> 00:21:33.880 on this UFO issue, I mean, sounding like the flying sauce issue. 256 00:21:33.920 --> 00:21:37.000 It was a big deal during that time. Well, you know the thing 257 00:21:37.000 --> 00:21:44.079 it's really amusing about that the reference to you, you know, the statement 258 00:21:44.160 --> 00:21:48.960 to the effect now that now that you know we've recovered of this object, 259 00:21:48.440 --> 00:21:52.960 we'll be able to solve the ministery right Well, you know, I mean 260 00:21:52.000 --> 00:21:56.920 the Listery still isn't solve. He had odd years later, you know, 261 00:21:57.160 --> 00:22:03.480 there was still glappily. But I think if there ever was a misplaced optimism, 262 00:22:03.559 --> 00:22:07.680 you know that, I mean in the level they can think the distory 263 00:22:07.680 --> 00:22:12.640 would be solved just because they had one. Yeah, well that whoever recovered 264 00:22:12.680 --> 00:22:18.440 that craft definitely has more answers than the rest of us. Yeah, but 265 00:22:18.559 --> 00:22:23.559 I'm inpring to agree with those those investigators who say that the cover up, 266 00:22:23.640 --> 00:22:30.359 you know, very likely is a cover up of ignorance, because it's quite 267 00:22:30.359 --> 00:22:34.480 possible that the people who have the wreckage and so forth, you are still 268 00:22:34.480 --> 00:22:38.039 scratching our heads trying to figure out what makes it all work. Yeah, 269 00:22:38.240 --> 00:22:41.880 you know, I mean it couldn't be. I mean we're probably talking about 270 00:22:41.960 --> 00:22:45.240 technology. It's so different from ours that you know, it would be like 271 00:22:48.039 --> 00:22:51.319 dropping a swift watch in the middle of a of a of a of a 272 00:22:51.359 --> 00:22:53.359 settlement of them, you know, in the in the Dawn Stone Age. 273 00:22:53.599 --> 00:22:57.559 Yeah. I like the analogy that Stanton Friedman uses where he talked about if 274 00:22:57.559 --> 00:23:04.640 you were to give Columbus a nuclear submarine, you know, yeah, what 275 00:23:04.720 --> 00:23:07.079 were to deal with that? Yeah? Yeah, So what do you think 276 00:23:07.119 --> 00:23:15.319 about Colonel Corso's claims then that he helped distribute some of the pieces. Well, 277 00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:23.519 certainly the notion that pieces were distributed around and and and various companies and 278 00:23:23.839 --> 00:23:29.839 various entities were were asked to uh, you know, study them and perhaps 279 00:23:29.920 --> 00:23:37.680 back engineer them. That's that's quite feasible. And given that, actually, 280 00:23:37.720 --> 00:23:41.680 if you look at the at the technological curve, so to speak, you 281 00:23:41.720 --> 00:23:45.519 know, when did the thing start getting developed and so forth? Uh? 282 00:23:45.920 --> 00:23:52.359 I mean ciniconductors as an impable patented in late nineteen forty seven, and you 283 00:23:52.400 --> 00:23:56.039 know, it's as if the whole technological curve just put this turn upward, 284 00:23:56.119 --> 00:24:00.279 you know about that point, and so definitely doesn't stretch my imagination. May 285 00:24:02.160 --> 00:24:04.119 right, who do you suppose that there was a glaby little back engineer. 286 00:24:04.720 --> 00:24:11.319 Yeah, and you know we're gonna have in Roswell Paula Harris talking about Colonel 287 00:24:11.359 --> 00:24:15.720 Corso and from what all I've seen, she seems to be, uh, 288 00:24:15.799 --> 00:24:19.720 the person who was closest to him while he was talking about all this stuff. 289 00:24:21.200 --> 00:24:25.200 Right, Yeah, So she'll be showing some interviews that she did with 290 00:24:25.319 --> 00:24:27.279 him and talking a lot about that. That ought to be great. Well, 291 00:24:27.319 --> 00:24:32.279 I think it will be you know mm hmm, so uh being living 292 00:24:32.319 --> 00:24:37.720 in Roswell We had Jesse Marcel on last week and I asked Jesse about edgar 293 00:24:37.799 --> 00:24:45.839 Mitchell because edgar Mitchell who lived in Roswell as a kid. He said that 294 00:24:45.960 --> 00:24:49.480 he knew a lot of people coming forward talking about what they saw and what 295 00:24:49.559 --> 00:24:55.400 the experienced people who lived in Roswell. Do you see have that sort of 296 00:24:55.400 --> 00:24:59.880 thing happening to you? Well, because you know, as far as it's 297 00:25:00.079 --> 00:25:04.759 our primary original witnesses though, you know it was it was a lot easier. 298 00:25:04.799 --> 00:25:07.519 They were a lot easier to come by, you know, years and 299 00:25:07.559 --> 00:25:10.319 years ago than they are now. You know, we're playing in a game 300 00:25:10.359 --> 00:25:14.000 of I'm sorry to put it like this, they're racing the undertaker pretty much. 301 00:25:14.039 --> 00:25:17.599 You know, it's still being able to talk to original witnesses now, 302 00:25:18.720 --> 00:25:21.039 but there's a one time, you know, there must have been a lot 303 00:25:21.079 --> 00:25:26.720 of people around here really new firsthand you know what has happened here. Yeah, 304 00:25:27.160 --> 00:25:30.759 do you do you still? Do you have people come to you occasionally 305 00:25:30.799 --> 00:25:41.079 that hey, well the only I did have one new witness who had handled 306 00:25:41.240 --> 00:25:47.160 degree and he didn't want to be identified. I wrote about him in the 307 00:25:47.200 --> 00:25:52.599 Mussan Journal, giving him an assumed name, you know, and he actually 308 00:25:52.680 --> 00:25:56.920 told me the story of handling some degree when he was out on a hunting 309 00:25:56.079 --> 00:26:02.920 exhibition with with mac Brasel and the glass will pull the metal stuff out of 310 00:26:03.000 --> 00:26:04.319 it. So let's pluff this up against you know, the bottom of the 311 00:26:04.400 --> 00:26:10.640 the ski tree and shoot at and they they were hitting it with a with 312 00:26:10.799 --> 00:26:14.039 a thirty off fifth beer rifle you know, and then flipping it up in 313 00:26:14.079 --> 00:26:17.200 the air and everything, and it wasn't even bitting it. Wow, and 314 00:26:18.359 --> 00:26:22.880 the what as I said, you know, I had a very very memory 315 00:26:22.880 --> 00:26:26.400 of that and didn't want to be identified. Yeah, Jesse had an interesting 316 00:26:26.400 --> 00:26:30.759 story where he was like at a bar or something and some guy was talking 317 00:26:30.759 --> 00:26:33.599 about how he was at the bar and someone he was talking with, some 318 00:26:33.759 --> 00:26:38.640 researcher, and he said, you know what, I I put a couple 319 00:26:38.680 --> 00:26:42.200 of those pieces in my saddle bag. I'll have to show you one day. 320 00:26:42.240 --> 00:26:45.559 And then the next day he said, people showed up at his door 321 00:26:45.599 --> 00:26:48.759 and said you need to give us that material, and he gave it to 322 00:26:48.839 --> 00:26:53.400 him and and but yeah, the very next day someone showed up. And 323 00:26:53.440 --> 00:26:56.640 the scary thing about that, I know what, I've been into the bar 324 00:26:56.799 --> 00:27:03.960 in Colonna. It's a kind of a landmark. And also the Roswell case 325 00:27:03.000 --> 00:27:08.000 because as we sometimes put up, that's where that's where he lost at loop. 326 00:27:10.680 --> 00:27:12.160 He hadn't been picking up pieces of a Bill Brazel, you know. 327 00:27:14.000 --> 00:27:18.240 And the puery thing is that that that there would be somebody in that bar 328 00:27:18.440 --> 00:27:22.559 that that much way, you know, fits into all of that and reporting 329 00:27:22.559 --> 00:27:26.720 it and reporting it so promptly that it all got confiscated in this morning. 330 00:27:26.279 --> 00:27:30.440 Yeah, you know, that's pretty pretty scary when you think about it. 331 00:27:30.799 --> 00:27:36.519 Yeah, how far back does your family go in ros Wand Oh my life? 332 00:27:36.559 --> 00:27:40.200 And I just moved here in nineteen ninety six. We okay from New 333 00:27:40.240 --> 00:27:44.319 Hampshire. I grew up in West Texas. That we lived in New England 334 00:27:44.319 --> 00:27:48.480 for many years. Did you move out there to work at that un m 335 00:27:48.759 --> 00:27:52.599 and now rest? Well, I actually we moved back here, as I 336 00:27:52.599 --> 00:27:56.759 said that, mostly because we just love New Mexico and of course specifically Roswell, 337 00:27:56.759 --> 00:28:03.200 because of our interest in your Yeah. I taught at the Eastern Mexican 338 00:28:03.319 --> 00:28:07.079 University, the Rove will Brea here until I was tired a couple of years 339 00:28:07.079 --> 00:28:10.480 ago. That's actually I still teach there, but I only wanted two cords 340 00:28:10.519 --> 00:28:14.880 with part time cool. Well, we do have someone who was in the 341 00:28:14.960 --> 00:28:17.640 chat who wanted to call in and ask a question? And that looks like 342 00:28:17.720 --> 00:28:22.240 he's here, so let me bring him on the air. And he goes 343 00:28:22.279 --> 00:28:26.279 by man in black, so hopefully he's not really well, we'll hand him 344 00:28:26.279 --> 00:28:30.319 back. Yeah, we'll find out real quick. Here if this works, 345 00:28:30.480 --> 00:28:34.680 come on here it goes is man in black on the air. All right, 346 00:28:36.519 --> 00:28:40.000 Hello, hey there, how you doing? Oh not too bad? 347 00:28:40.079 --> 00:28:44.119 Thanks for having me. Yeah, thanks for calling. So you got a 348 00:28:44.200 --> 00:28:48.839 question? I do. I have a few questions if I can ask a 349 00:28:48.880 --> 00:28:56.000 few questions here. My first question is, uh is for you and your 350 00:28:56.039 --> 00:29:00.839 guest, And thanks to your guest for doing in the show, and thanks 351 00:29:00.920 --> 00:29:04.319 for you for putting it on. Have you guys heard of a gentleman by 352 00:29:04.319 --> 00:29:07.839 the name of Ed Grimsley? And if so, what do you think of 353 00:29:07.880 --> 00:29:17.559 his research? Do you want to know Ed Grimsley? He doesn't ring any 354 00:29:17.599 --> 00:29:22.680 bells that I have heard of him. And yeah, he's the guy who 355 00:29:22.559 --> 00:29:29.400 takes night scope binoculars and looks up in this guy and often see stuff, 356 00:29:29.680 --> 00:29:36.000 And yeah, I think that's worth doing. I mean, I've seen satellites. 357 00:29:36.039 --> 00:29:38.680 I couldn't see what the naked eye with these things, and I think 358 00:29:38.720 --> 00:29:41.519 it's great that people are doing that. And I've seen some of his stuff 359 00:29:41.559 --> 00:29:48.319 which is so is unexplainable. So yeah, I think that's interesting. Now 360 00:29:48.799 --> 00:29:52.759 what do you think of that sort of thing? I think really good thing 361 00:29:52.839 --> 00:30:00.599 to do. Yeah, yeah, there's there's video of it on the website. 362 00:30:00.079 --> 00:30:03.200 Yeah, you've got video on his website. So it's really interesting. 363 00:30:03.759 --> 00:30:07.200 Yeah. So did you have another question? Yeah, just one more question. 364 00:30:10.119 --> 00:30:18.400 If there's a few things that I believe we without a lot of speculation, 365 00:30:18.480 --> 00:30:25.039 that we know about the UFO phenomenon. Obviously I haven't done as much 366 00:30:25.079 --> 00:30:30.440 research as your guest, but as I take it, there's only really two 367 00:30:30.559 --> 00:30:34.880 things besides abductions and these other things, that we really know. One is 368 00:30:34.920 --> 00:30:40.359 that they don't want to formally introduce themselves to us. They don't want to 369 00:30:40.359 --> 00:30:44.359 come down and shake our hand or park on the White House lawn. And 370 00:30:45.079 --> 00:30:48.920 number two is that they have seem to have a higher technology than us. 371 00:30:51.119 --> 00:30:55.640 By these crafts moving around the way they're moving, it seems that they have 372 00:30:55.880 --> 00:31:00.519 a higher intellect and a higher technology than us. So keeping in mind that 373 00:31:00.640 --> 00:31:07.960 we only really know those two factors or just just for speculation, purposes if 374 00:31:07.200 --> 00:31:11.000 you could entertain me. What do you think is that that? What do 375 00:31:11.000 --> 00:31:15.680 you think that that means? Knowing that they don't want to introduce themselves, 376 00:31:15.680 --> 00:31:22.799 they'd rather just watch us and not show us their world, and number two 377 00:31:22.920 --> 00:31:27.160 that they have a higher technology they don't seem to want to share with us. 378 00:31:27.680 --> 00:31:30.519 All right, Yeah, don well, I'm not planned to think that 379 00:31:30.640 --> 00:31:38.640 the whole business not wanting to be kind of you know, cause buddies, 380 00:31:38.640 --> 00:31:41.880 if not so to speak, you know, is in fact just part of 381 00:31:41.920 --> 00:31:48.000 the fact that they do probably have, you know, a very advanced standing 382 00:31:48.079 --> 00:31:53.319 technological compared a lot. It's kind of like if you work against study a 383 00:31:53.319 --> 00:31:56.799 lower animal of some sort, you know, if you if you if you're 384 00:31:56.799 --> 00:31:59.960 actually standing there, you know, the magnifying life looking at an ant column, 385 00:32:00.079 --> 00:32:02.839 you know, you don't say that the f O I'm mister Jones. 386 00:32:04.519 --> 00:32:07.599 Uh hello, mister you know, basically you stand there and studies that you 387 00:32:07.640 --> 00:32:12.799 know, because you have no reason to, you know, to even even 388 00:32:13.240 --> 00:32:16.720 even think about communicating with them in a variable maybe the same relationship with us. 389 00:32:17.000 --> 00:32:21.559 Yeah, I guess you could say something similar with uh, a lion 390 00:32:21.680 --> 00:32:23.519 in the in the field, will we'll take them down, you know, 391 00:32:23.599 --> 00:32:29.160 tranquilize them, work on them, uh medical experiments, and then put them 392 00:32:29.200 --> 00:32:31.920 back in the field. But we don't we don't even have the ability to 393 00:32:31.960 --> 00:32:37.839 really converse with them. Yeah, some some abduction with the people who you 394 00:32:38.039 --> 00:32:45.960 claim to have been that have said that it's shocked them that they're interviewers so 395 00:32:45.079 --> 00:32:49.680 to speak of the captor or whatever you want to call them. Did it 396 00:32:49.759 --> 00:32:52.759 eas to be too impressed with the fact that you could even communicate, that 397 00:32:52.839 --> 00:32:55.200 we could even talk, you know, that we even have a language. 398 00:32:55.720 --> 00:32:59.440 Yeah, it's a well, you know, you should be impressed with it, 399 00:32:59.519 --> 00:33:04.000 but they will. That's buddy, all right, Well, thank you 400 00:33:04.039 --> 00:33:07.559 man in black, thank you for taking my calling. Then thank you. 401 00:33:08.160 --> 00:33:12.880 There's also someone else in the call cue, but their hand isn't up, 402 00:33:12.880 --> 00:33:15.279 so I'm not sure if you're if you're calling trying to call in, I 403 00:33:15.440 --> 00:33:20.160 push a one if you want to ask a question, and that lets me 404 00:33:20.200 --> 00:33:22.559 know, because sometimes people call in just to listen, which is fine too 405 00:33:22.599 --> 00:33:29.240 because you can listen on your phone. Interesting to that UFO paranormal network I 406 00:33:29.319 --> 00:33:32.000 was talking to, they say a lot of their listeners are streaming over their 407 00:33:32.000 --> 00:33:37.960 telephones and listening that way. These days where it's the techno phone technology gets 408 00:33:37.000 --> 00:33:45.160 better. But what other sort of you know, interesting cases or interesting stories 409 00:33:45.200 --> 00:33:50.960 do you have out there in New Mexico since you've been UH State director out 410 00:33:50.960 --> 00:33:57.720 there. Oh well, we get a lot of citing reports. I've got 411 00:33:57.720 --> 00:34:00.720 it. In fact, just I think the three weeks that I had got 412 00:34:00.799 --> 00:34:05.440 eight reports in one league, which is something of a record for US. 413 00:34:05.480 --> 00:34:08.719 I think that as usual, a lot of them don't really end up being 414 00:34:09.280 --> 00:34:15.599 anything very very definitive. But we have had some interesting things happened. I 415 00:34:15.679 --> 00:34:22.000 did my wife and I actually interviewed a couple of Woodmanses a few years ago 416 00:34:22.039 --> 00:34:30.039 about one hundred miles north of here, where they had had this experience kind 417 00:34:30.039 --> 00:34:37.679 of experience and they didn't know what to make of them. So they called 418 00:34:37.679 --> 00:34:42.719 at the time John Shutwer, you know, who was international director, and 419 00:34:42.800 --> 00:34:46.360 he called me and we went up an interviewed, and they had been driving 420 00:34:46.360 --> 00:34:52.760 at night and had a lost time experience that involved an impression of driving in 421 00:34:52.800 --> 00:34:54.440 a spiral, you know, in a place where the road was straight, 422 00:34:55.159 --> 00:34:59.119 and of having white spinning and so forth and so on, and we had 423 00:34:59.199 --> 00:35:02.440 quite a time interview. And then one of the witnesses was very reluctant to 424 00:35:02.599 --> 00:35:06.679 actually come along with two sisters. Actually, one of the sisters didn't want 425 00:35:06.679 --> 00:35:10.480 to come in. I like to see that, actually, I would love 426 00:35:10.480 --> 00:35:15.599 to see that then than see witnesses overly eager to be interviewed, because you 427 00:35:15.639 --> 00:35:20.360 know, there's certainly no chance that that the shy sister, you know, 428 00:35:21.360 --> 00:35:24.519 was just trying to you know, be a wannabe, you know, just 429 00:35:25.000 --> 00:35:28.480 get a name in the journal or something, you know, because because she 430 00:35:28.559 --> 00:35:31.440 was reluctant to even to even talk to us, that's actually a good sign 431 00:35:31.599 --> 00:35:37.079 a lot. Yeah, yeah, when the people want to remain anonymous or 432 00:35:37.159 --> 00:35:43.119 reluctant, I know, I read recently, I think and Roger Marshall posted 433 00:35:43.119 --> 00:35:49.280 something about a signing out there where people acting jets chasing UFOs possibly. Yeah, 434 00:35:49.679 --> 00:35:52.280 of course there was a big hoop of are in Texas too, you 435 00:35:52.320 --> 00:35:58.760 know in January seventh with the jets chasing the object. I actually signed a 436 00:35:58.800 --> 00:36:01.599 new witness to that oneman. Even though it's not my state, you know, 437 00:36:01.719 --> 00:36:07.320 I gave it one. I can't go kent Cherry to call and but 438 00:36:07.400 --> 00:36:08.559 hey, you know, you want to talk to the lady about you know, 439 00:36:08.840 --> 00:36:14.119 Northeast of dollars if she had seen them out and I'll just huggling over 440 00:36:14.159 --> 00:36:16.800 the like or where they live. Oh wow, that doesn't have any strange 441 00:36:16.800 --> 00:36:21.599 stuff in the sky. You just have to come and look more. Yeah, 442 00:36:22.239 --> 00:36:27.719 one interesting and New Mexico so full of It's my second favorite state, 443 00:36:27.800 --> 00:36:31.480 second of my home state of Colorado. I love New Mexico. But uh, 444 00:36:31.599 --> 00:36:35.159 and I've spent some time. My mom lived out there for about ten 445 00:36:35.239 --> 00:36:39.000 years actually, and I have family roots out there. And while she was 446 00:36:39.039 --> 00:36:43.599 out there, there was a guy who told a story about he delivered furniture. 447 00:36:43.679 --> 00:36:46.159 My sister worked with him for a little while, and he would go 448 00:36:46.239 --> 00:36:51.480 out to the middle of the of the desert once in a while and they 449 00:36:51.519 --> 00:36:53.800 would he would only he wouldn't see anything until you get real close. You 450 00:36:53.840 --> 00:37:00.199 see a covered hillside with a big door there, and he dropped off furnitures 451 00:37:00.239 --> 00:37:05.159 at these doors. And one time he got to go in and he went 452 00:37:05.239 --> 00:37:08.079 on this you know, hydraulic thing that took him down a few levels in 453 00:37:08.159 --> 00:37:13.159 these huge hallways. They had him drive the truck up and then dropped the 454 00:37:13.159 --> 00:37:21.599 furniture off in one of these huge hallways. Really. Yeah, so you 455 00:37:21.679 --> 00:37:24.679 hear a lot of things about about you know, underground structures and so forth. 456 00:37:24.760 --> 00:37:29.639 I had somebody, actually a military person, tell me one time that 457 00:37:29.800 --> 00:37:35.159 you can drive from from the Army base and Fort Fort Bluffs, you know 458 00:37:35.239 --> 00:37:43.599 in El Paso up to the White Fence Missile Range cow really the ground. 459 00:37:43.760 --> 00:37:45.559 Yeah, yeah, there's actually supposed to be a tunnel with you to do 460 00:37:45.599 --> 00:37:49.280 that. He said, Yeah, I know about it, and I've seen 461 00:37:49.320 --> 00:37:52.519 it. You know, Wow, I'm sure it's sake nice and cool that 462 00:37:52.559 --> 00:37:57.199 would say, you know that, It adds me, I think more as 463 00:37:57.239 --> 00:38:00.880 a story coming from a military guy who probably had reason to know, you 464 00:38:00.920 --> 00:38:06.960 know, and so you know, there are a lot of stories about above 465 00:38:07.559 --> 00:38:13.239 and underground structures and tunnels and bases. And the thing about in Mexico is 466 00:38:13.360 --> 00:38:20.480 we have one of the highest concentrations of places where there's classified work going on 467 00:38:20.599 --> 00:38:22.440 or has been going on. You know, have almost been around the plant. 468 00:38:22.480 --> 00:38:25.800 I mean, you know, you said, listening things like Los Alamos 469 00:38:25.880 --> 00:38:31.840 and Holomand Air Force Base and Sandia Labs and Kirkland Air Force Base, and 470 00:38:31.920 --> 00:38:40.679 you know, all those places, and one can kind of understand why another 471 00:38:40.800 --> 00:38:45.960 race might be interested in having a look around here. Yeah. I love 472 00:38:46.079 --> 00:38:51.519 looking at Google Maps, especially at Kirkland Air Force Base and the stuff in 473 00:38:51.559 --> 00:38:53.719 the mountains there, because like you said, there's San Dia Labs. There's 474 00:38:53.760 --> 00:38:59.559 also Monsanto Mountain which used to hold the nukes and now you can see tanks 475 00:38:59.599 --> 00:39:04.039 and all these openings that go into the mountains and then you see where they 476 00:39:04.039 --> 00:39:08.079 hold the nukes now in that big underground facility. And you see the most 477 00:39:08.119 --> 00:39:14.559 interesting things on the Currentland Air Force Base when you looked on Google Maps. 478 00:39:14.599 --> 00:39:20.079 And it's fun because I remember flying into Albuquerque once and there is a jet 479 00:39:21.239 --> 00:39:27.280 fighter jet that was landing right with us there. Well, so yeah, 480 00:39:27.320 --> 00:39:31.440 I have reason to think of that. Actually, the Roswell wreckage was some 481 00:39:31.559 --> 00:39:37.880 of the perhaps temporarily taken to Carlsbad Caverns MHM for the storage until kind of 482 00:39:37.920 --> 00:39:42.000 the heat was off with us who could be moved without some troop lot and 483 00:39:42.039 --> 00:39:47.800 attention because Molly and I went down to a cause that's two years ago and 484 00:39:47.880 --> 00:39:52.199 such an old newspaper file and we found out for about a week or a 485 00:39:52.239 --> 00:39:57.360 week and a half or so after the Roswell incident, they were all kinds 486 00:39:57.360 --> 00:40:00.239 of strange. I think military groups coming in out of town all the time, 487 00:40:00.960 --> 00:40:05.719 these little foods, you know, would show up and they would have 488 00:40:05.800 --> 00:40:07.880 lunch somewhere and then they'll all get them a bus and go somewhere, you 489 00:40:07.920 --> 00:40:10.239 know, and then it's come back like in an hour and get an airplane 490 00:40:10.239 --> 00:40:15.360 and leave. And if if you know, the waiters or whoever the hotel 491 00:40:15.360 --> 00:40:17.119 people ask them where you guys from, you know, they would say things 492 00:40:17.199 --> 00:40:22.679 like California, you know, and you would say, well, we're in 493 00:40:22.679 --> 00:40:27.559 California, and they would say California, you know. And they seemed to 494 00:40:27.639 --> 00:40:31.639 him to be a sort of a little flurry of military activity there just about 495 00:40:31.639 --> 00:40:37.360 a week and a half or so after Oswald. Wow, that was I'm 496 00:40:37.360 --> 00:40:40.920 inclined. Well, you know, Kyle's Big Caverns has something in the order 497 00:40:40.960 --> 00:40:45.719 of between fifty and sixty entrances that are not available to the public right. 498 00:40:46.679 --> 00:40:52.199 It also has controlled temperatures, a certain temperature a year round at fifty seven 499 00:40:52.280 --> 00:40:55.719 fifty eight degrees all the time. And if you wanted to get that stuff 500 00:40:55.760 --> 00:40:59.559 out of side and have a look at it in any kind of way till 501 00:41:00.199 --> 00:41:02.679 all the hoop while you know, died down and then put a carple it 502 00:41:02.880 --> 00:41:07.480 and move it up. You know, some of the way that that would 503 00:41:07.480 --> 00:41:13.760 be the Tinkleari storage points and examination plays I would have, Yeah, lots 504 00:41:13.800 --> 00:41:17.480 of I know, even though the caverns that you can walk in are humongous. 505 00:41:19.519 --> 00:41:22.480 I know, it's only a certain fraction that are available to the public 506 00:41:22.519 --> 00:41:27.920 even yeah, yeah, yeah, and that was even more true, and 507 00:41:28.599 --> 00:41:32.199 that is forty seven you know, lots of it opens in. But now 508 00:41:32.280 --> 00:41:37.000 I think, yeah, well, and you know, that's another great reason 509 00:41:37.039 --> 00:41:39.480 to go down to Roswall because Carl's back Caverns is some amazing stuff. I 510 00:41:39.559 --> 00:41:45.960 love going there and and it's nice when you're there's one hundred and fifteen degrees 511 00:41:45.079 --> 00:41:50.000 out I think when we went, but you get down into that sixty degree 512 00:41:50.039 --> 00:41:53.519 cavern and that's thanks. Yeah, that's pretty nice. So let's get into 513 00:41:54.320 --> 00:41:58.920 the Marilyn Monroe research that you've done. How did you get into that? 514 00:42:00.719 --> 00:42:07.000 Well, there had been that cia in memo you know about Mallan that came 515 00:42:07.039 --> 00:42:09.559 out in August third, nineteen sixty two, the nineteen sixty two, just 516 00:42:09.599 --> 00:42:15.639 a day before the death, and that had been sticulating for quite a while. 517 00:42:16.639 --> 00:42:24.880 I had a hand and I was helping i'llthdicate that document. And so 518 00:42:25.039 --> 00:42:30.639 how did it come out. Well, you mean, how did the authentication 519 00:42:30.719 --> 00:42:32.840 come out? Ah? Now where did the where was the document found? 520 00:42:32.960 --> 00:42:37.679 Was it under freedom of information or was it was it was a Floyer release. 521 00:42:39.239 --> 00:42:46.320 And I actually at one point put in a Floyer request of the CIA 522 00:42:47.599 --> 00:42:57.400 for the wiretaff transports of Malin's telephone and for a copy of her diary, 523 00:42:58.400 --> 00:43:00.000 which disappeared from the kind of us, you know, a couple of days 524 00:43:00.000 --> 00:43:06.719 after she died. And naturally, you know, I didn't know none of 525 00:43:06.719 --> 00:43:08.440 the STIPs was released to me. But the interesting thing is, in the 526 00:43:08.480 --> 00:43:14.280 case of the of the y tap transcripts, they said, you know, 527 00:43:14.400 --> 00:43:16.920 we aren't. You know, we don't. We don't find anything responsible to 528 00:43:16.960 --> 00:43:21.559 your request and we're not releasing anything. So of course I filed an appeal. 529 00:43:22.360 --> 00:43:25.280 And when I filed the appeal, I used the appeal on the CIA 530 00:43:25.400 --> 00:43:30.960 memo, the CIA Mariland memo of August third, nineteen sixty two, which 531 00:43:30.320 --> 00:43:32.480 cashed the copy of ITIM thing, you know, it's because of this that 532 00:43:32.559 --> 00:43:38.920 I think you know you do in fact have you know the memo actually said 533 00:43:39.079 --> 00:43:43.199 she you know, her phone wasn't being tapped, so you must have those 534 00:43:43.199 --> 00:43:47.880 transcripts. And they accepted the appeal, they sent it to the Agency release 535 00:43:47.960 --> 00:43:52.320 panel. At the time, George Tennant was running the KIA and he and 536 00:43:52.599 --> 00:43:57.840 you know what happened, was going to go to the Agency release Chanel Senate 537 00:43:57.880 --> 00:44:00.519 and whoever is running you know, the agency at the time, and the 538 00:44:00.559 --> 00:44:06.000 top people basically meet and they decide whether or not to release something. But 539 00:44:06.079 --> 00:44:07.400 they think if it doesn't even make sense to send it to the panel, 540 00:44:07.400 --> 00:44:14.960 it was not it to believe. The point is really that the memo or 541 00:44:14.960 --> 00:44:22.840 whether the appeal wouldn't have been accepted unless the agency regarded the document as legitimate, 542 00:44:22.360 --> 00:44:25.199 and it was unless they were willing to actually not that it was their 543 00:44:27.519 --> 00:44:30.800 right. They don't accept appeal, you know, based on both it's documents, 544 00:44:30.000 --> 00:44:36.719 right, so that that authenticates the document right there. And I got 545 00:44:36.719 --> 00:44:39.840 interested in it through that and I started really looking into it and looking into 546 00:44:39.880 --> 00:44:46.239 things like Marilynd's boyfriend at the time she died with Fella that uful Belong was 547 00:44:46.280 --> 00:44:52.719 a Mexican screenwriter who lived in la actually at the time, and the fact 548 00:44:52.719 --> 00:44:57.679 that he had called her just minutes before she died. And then later when 549 00:44:57.719 --> 00:45:02.400 Anthony Summers interviewed in the nineteen nineteen eighty three, twenty one years later, 550 00:45:04.119 --> 00:45:07.519 he said, Marylyn told me something that not on the phone that will one 551 00:45:07.599 --> 00:45:12.760 day shock the whole world. Hmm, that's an interesting thing, because, 552 00:45:13.400 --> 00:45:16.800 yeah, I mean will one day it still hadn't you know? It was 553 00:45:16.840 --> 00:45:21.039 the point make the the third fence. And they sadly, I mean, 554 00:45:21.039 --> 00:45:22.599 the whole world wouldn't be shocked by things like the fact that she was having 555 00:45:22.639 --> 00:45:28.920 affairs with Bobby Kennedy and Jack Kennedy and other people. Nobody would be shocked 556 00:45:28.920 --> 00:45:31.440 by that. They'd be shocked if they weren't. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 557 00:45:31.440 --> 00:45:36.559 exactly. And the CIA memo actually said that one of the one of 558 00:45:36.599 --> 00:45:43.719 the agencies concerned was that Marilyn was aware that Jack Kennedy had gone to a 559 00:45:43.760 --> 00:45:47.519 secret air base for the purpose of looking at of inspecting things from outer space. 560 00:45:50.280 --> 00:45:52.480 I mean, the memoi actually says that, yeah, maybe you could 561 00:45:52.519 --> 00:45:57.239 go over some of the other things the memo for people who aren't familiar with 562 00:45:57.760 --> 00:46:04.119 the memo said, well, picarly talked about wire taps on her phone and 563 00:46:04.159 --> 00:46:09.440 some other phones, the people that she knew, and the fact that they 564 00:46:09.440 --> 00:46:13.559 were they were nervous about the fact that she was keeping a diary in which 565 00:46:13.639 --> 00:46:17.000 she apparently he's writing down a lot of things that the Kennedy's were telling her. 566 00:46:17.719 --> 00:46:22.400 And then it does make that very very telling remark, you know that 567 00:46:22.760 --> 00:46:30.159 about being as an airbase and so forth. It's uh the reason why, 568 00:46:30.199 --> 00:46:34.239 of course I turned in that foyer request, and I knew that I wouldn't 569 00:46:34.280 --> 00:46:37.440 get. You know, there's the wire time transcription. You know, you're 570 00:46:37.480 --> 00:46:39.679 not going to get things like that, but they wouldn't be spectacular. They 571 00:46:39.679 --> 00:46:45.960 would have to be because it's, in fact, Melan told Clothe Belongos what 572 00:46:46.079 --> 00:46:49.880 I'm pretty sure she did tell him. You know, that's the last thing 573 00:46:49.880 --> 00:46:52.760 in the world they want to see on the front pages of the New York 574 00:46:52.800 --> 00:46:57.800 Times and you know the La Times, which is exactly where I would have 575 00:46:57.800 --> 00:47:04.079 put it. Yeah, yeah, So what more did you discover with that? 576 00:47:04.440 --> 00:47:08.559 So what is your belief about how and why she died? Well, 577 00:47:08.639 --> 00:47:14.679 I I think that that the afternoon that she uh of the union, she 578 00:47:14.760 --> 00:47:21.960 died such a few hours before the fable event, Bobby Kennedy went over to 579 00:47:22.000 --> 00:47:25.719 her house. He was in town for a for a legal convention, and 580 00:47:25.960 --> 00:47:31.719 uh he uh he and Allen had a big sight because because he asked her 581 00:47:31.760 --> 00:47:35.840 for the diary. He was getting a diary. You know, my family 582 00:47:35.880 --> 00:47:39.320 will pay you for it. There were there were there were surveillance tapes at 583 00:47:39.360 --> 00:47:43.039 her house. Could actually you could actually he was them yelling at her and 584 00:47:43.119 --> 00:47:45.280 saying, I mean I want that diary and I want it now, you 585 00:47:45.320 --> 00:47:49.719 know, wow, where the black blank is it? You know? And 586 00:47:49.719 --> 00:47:53.199 and my family will pay you for and so forth, she threw him out 587 00:47:53.199 --> 00:48:00.119 of the house. To her credit. U and uh, I think Zobby 588 00:48:00.239 --> 00:48:04.800 said. What happened was when he when he he went back over to Peter 589 00:48:04.920 --> 00:48:07.519 Lawford's beach house in Santa Monica, and they kind of sat and licked their 590 00:48:07.559 --> 00:48:12.519 wounds because actually Peter Lawford had been along too at her house at the same 591 00:48:12.559 --> 00:48:15.639 time, and he could be hurt on the tape trying to calm Bobby down, 592 00:48:15.719 --> 00:48:20.679 you know. And I think Bobby figured at that point she had been 593 00:48:20.679 --> 00:48:23.360 talking about having a news conference, and in fact, on one of the 594 00:48:23.360 --> 00:48:25.559 wire taps, she had been heard to say She's going to have a news 595 00:48:25.599 --> 00:48:30.679 conference un quote, tell all unquote. And I think Bobby taught you, 596 00:48:30.679 --> 00:48:36.960 you know what if she tells the big one, you know that Jack actually 597 00:48:37.119 --> 00:48:42.719 gave her classified information. I mean, he could be impeached for guess it's 598 00:48:42.760 --> 00:48:46.840 like he could be actually indicted for treason. You know, the whole house 599 00:48:46.880 --> 00:48:50.320 of cards are going to come down, and she has a news conference on 600 00:48:50.480 --> 00:48:53.360 that, and I think he decided right then that they had to take her 601 00:48:53.400 --> 00:49:00.519 off. But I think you tend to take her out. And that's what 602 00:49:00.559 --> 00:49:04.639 happened. I mean, basically, Bobby and two guys carrying medical bags showed 603 00:49:04.679 --> 00:49:07.320 up at the house and at ten thirty in the evening and they ordered the 604 00:49:07.760 --> 00:49:14.880 Jinnie to murray the housekeeper and her her son in law who was the groundskeeper 605 00:49:14.920 --> 00:49:16.480 out there's a get out of the house, go somewhere, you know. 606 00:49:16.519 --> 00:49:21.639 They went next door and watched through the through the neighbor's window, and then 607 00:49:21.719 --> 00:49:23.000 they said, these guys came out a little later, and they went back 608 00:49:23.039 --> 00:49:30.159 over to the house and Maryland was lying or die and her toxicality report later 609 00:49:30.239 --> 00:49:35.239 showed that she her blood at the time of death had a toxicity density of 610 00:49:35.679 --> 00:49:40.760 four point five milligrams percent tint of barbitall and eight point zero milligrams percent chlorohydrate, 611 00:49:40.840 --> 00:49:45.599 which actually would kill about fifteen to twenty people. Wow, and there's 612 00:49:45.599 --> 00:49:47.920 no way in the world. She'd got that stuff in her, in her 613 00:49:47.920 --> 00:49:52.280 blood, taking mendiutall tablets. I mean, you know she just didn't you 614 00:49:52.280 --> 00:49:55.159 know, it wasn't that. You can't be that it was not that it 615 00:49:55.199 --> 00:50:00.000 was murdered. Yeah. I had read a story in the La Times. 616 00:50:00.039 --> 00:50:06.119 They did a couple of stories, one of those being how also how it's 617 00:50:06.199 --> 00:50:10.960 hurt. The first person who had done an autopsy was concerned, and he 618 00:50:12.079 --> 00:50:19.079 sat there spelled play because some of the stuff went missing, some of her 619 00:50:19.079 --> 00:50:22.920 body parts and stuff went missing. Well, and there's a lot of paperwork 620 00:50:22.960 --> 00:50:30.199 missing too. The Clutters report started off being seven hundred and fifty odd pages 621 00:50:30.280 --> 00:50:35.440 long. Wow, and about seven hundred pages of that stuff disappeared. Wow. 622 00:50:35.719 --> 00:50:40.280 It was brought to Lionel Grandis on his sign. He looked at it 623 00:50:40.360 --> 00:50:44.199 and said, well, you know, this is not the style I saw. 624 00:50:44.360 --> 00:50:47.719 You know, this is not the paperwork I saw. And I don't 625 00:50:49.039 --> 00:50:54.679 anyway, I don't think it was suicide. And he was told just sign 626 00:50:54.719 --> 00:51:00.719 it, or things are going to happen to you, he told. He 627 00:51:00.800 --> 00:51:04.519 told someone in an interview years later that that was how he was told this. 628 00:51:05.480 --> 00:51:08.480 Yeah. I think his story covered that that he had believed it was 629 00:51:08.639 --> 00:51:13.599 murdered. He didn't believe that it was yea, and because of the things 630 00:51:13.639 --> 00:51:17.760 you cited, and I think they said they couldn't find out how it was 631 00:51:17.880 --> 00:51:22.239 done that you know, he found out it wasn't pills, and I think 632 00:51:22.280 --> 00:51:25.920 it said he believed it was a suppository. No, it was an injection, 633 00:51:27.679 --> 00:51:30.159 an injection. Yeah, it's feeling way that the biochemically, it's the 634 00:51:30.199 --> 00:51:36.679 only way it makes sense. And it's fairly easy to uh, to conceal 635 00:51:36.719 --> 00:51:38.400 that. For example, if you did the injection and a hair follicle, 636 00:51:38.440 --> 00:51:43.679 it's very hard to find it, very easy for for an autopsis the minister 637 00:51:43.920 --> 00:51:47.079 an injection and a hair follicle. Yeah, oh, I've never heard of 638 00:51:47.079 --> 00:51:50.559 that. It's just the point. I mean, you know, it's just 639 00:51:50.679 --> 00:51:53.840 evile, you know, I see what you're saying. Follicle was about a 640 00:51:53.880 --> 00:51:59.119 knight be that. Yeah, but somebody outel peopill miss it. Hmmm makes 641 00:51:59.159 --> 00:52:07.760 sense. Interesting. So you believe then that explosive information she had was regarding 642 00:52:07.880 --> 00:52:12.679 UFOs. Yeah, that's that's that's what the CIA thought because they said so 643 00:52:13.199 --> 00:52:20.280 mm hmm oh, because it talked about where Jack Kennedy had gone. Yeah, 644 00:52:20.360 --> 00:52:22.559 and then the fact that that was one of the big secrets, you 645 00:52:22.599 --> 00:52:27.519 know, that they were nervous about. And the fact that they actually more 646 00:52:27.679 --> 00:52:31.960 was unwittingly authenticated the document for me by accepting my appeal, you know, 647 00:52:32.079 --> 00:52:37.920 and the fact they have said, the fact that UFOs were the problem mm 648 00:52:38.000 --> 00:52:45.360 hmm. Who originally submitted the original Foyer request to get and receive that I 649 00:52:45.400 --> 00:52:50.679 haven't been able to find out. I know that Timothy Cooper had the had 650 00:52:50.760 --> 00:52:55.199 the document early on, and I think he may have been the original Flower 651 00:52:55.280 --> 00:53:00.960 recused. The document was originally in the hands in his hands and in the 652 00:53:00.039 --> 00:53:09.760 hands of the Milo Spiriglio Detective Agency in Los Angeles very early on. And 653 00:53:09.920 --> 00:53:14.079 were they involved. Were they hired by someone to look into her death? 654 00:53:15.719 --> 00:53:19.199 Not that I know of, but they were involved. I think I think 655 00:53:19.280 --> 00:53:22.559 that either Tim Cooper or someone close to him, you know, I actually 656 00:53:22.639 --> 00:53:28.840 got the documents ushuaia uh huh yeah, wow, really interesting stuff. So 657 00:53:29.800 --> 00:53:32.119 yeah, it seems I seem to be kind of fated, you know, 658 00:53:32.320 --> 00:53:38.320 to to write books about well, to those books that that attempt to rescue 659 00:53:38.360 --> 00:53:44.760 people from the clutches of of of a secrecy obsessed government, you know, 660 00:53:45.199 --> 00:53:50.159 kind of like too late to do the many good firstly with Malo and Mack 661 00:53:50.320 --> 00:53:52.960 was one of those recent books about Robert Oppenheimer, who also got shafted over 662 00:53:53.079 --> 00:53:59.360 UFOs. Yeah, that's the that's gonna be the subjective of my talk at 663 00:53:59.400 --> 00:54:02.480 the FT over years. Yeah. Yeah, because they didn't they didn't kill 664 00:54:02.519 --> 00:54:07.440 Appy, you know, but they did the Yankees' cornas, and they almost 665 00:54:07.480 --> 00:54:13.119 might as well have murdered him because because he was out of basically he never 666 00:54:13.159 --> 00:54:16.199 worked in his field again and after they did that. Yeah, I don't 667 00:54:16.239 --> 00:54:21.960 want to get too into that because I'm trying to get our listeners to come 668 00:54:22.039 --> 00:54:27.039 down and hear you talk about it live. Yeah, as well starting thing 669 00:54:27.119 --> 00:54:30.079 to work on. Yeah, and maybe you can review who for some people 670 00:54:31.280 --> 00:54:36.800 who Oppenheimer was. Yeah, he was. He was basically in charge of 671 00:54:37.679 --> 00:54:44.480 developing the atomic bomb at the at the was almost during the Manhattan Project and 672 00:54:45.320 --> 00:54:52.320 from late nineteen forty two to mid nineteen forty five he was actually a general. 673 00:54:52.400 --> 00:54:58.199 Leslie Gloves was in charge of the projects, but he had to have 674 00:54:58.280 --> 00:55:05.000 a course of scientific you know, chief over the whole thing, and he 675 00:55:05.559 --> 00:55:09.719 chose Oppenheimer. And Oppenheimer of course did developed a bomb as you know it 676 00:55:09.800 --> 00:55:15.119 was tested on July sixteen, nineteen forty five, successfully, and the similar 677 00:55:15.159 --> 00:55:22.239 one was dropped a few days later on on Hiroshima. And basically at the 678 00:55:22.320 --> 00:55:24.480 end of World War Two, he was a national viewer of the type I 679 00:55:24.519 --> 00:55:29.960 don't think we've seen since or before, you know, or ever any other 680 00:55:30.079 --> 00:55:37.880 time. And yet he was portrayed by his own government really sad well. 681 00:55:37.000 --> 00:55:44.840 And what's the official story about how he fell from grace Well, the official 682 00:55:45.079 --> 00:55:51.079 reasons that the Temach Energy Commissions Security Board gave for refusing to run state of 683 00:55:51.159 --> 00:55:57.760 clinics was question bild his loyalty. Basically, you know, the people in 684 00:55:57.840 --> 00:56:01.360 his family had been Communists back in the thirties. We didn't see the bother 685 00:56:01.360 --> 00:56:04.840 of them when they hired him in nineteen forty two, you know. But 686 00:56:07.400 --> 00:56:15.039 also they were concerned about the fact that he had kind of dragged his seat 687 00:56:15.079 --> 00:56:20.000 of the development of the age bomb, and he had explained all of that 688 00:56:20.199 --> 00:56:24.119 during the hearings. He said, I'm not disloyal because because I have doubts 689 00:56:24.159 --> 00:56:27.119 about the age bomb. It's just but I don't think, you know, 690 00:56:27.159 --> 00:56:30.199 I think what we need is tactical weapons, and that's not a tactical weapon. 691 00:56:30.800 --> 00:56:35.440 Yeah. Yeah, he was very hesitant about its usage, and I 692 00:56:35.599 --> 00:56:42.920 know there was a little bit of almost that mutiny where scientists on the project 693 00:56:43.079 --> 00:56:45.880 were really concerned about its usage. Ye, he was the pact, not 694 00:56:45.920 --> 00:56:49.519 a law of being the lots to do it. I mean, you know, 695 00:56:49.639 --> 00:56:52.199 there were people who said we absolutely should not, you know, build 696 00:56:52.199 --> 00:56:57.920 a weapon like that, but there were people out to get him. Hoppy 697 00:56:58.079 --> 00:57:01.280 actually made a lot of enemies. He took a lot of his own problems. 698 00:57:01.280 --> 00:57:07.679 You know, he essentially just made enemies to people that he shouldn't have 699 00:57:07.800 --> 00:57:10.679 made enemy the other times, you know, and they didn't forgive him for 700 00:57:10.800 --> 00:57:15.840 it. And when it came time for a vendetta, you know, they 701 00:57:15.920 --> 00:57:21.400 didn't hesitate to have to play take anyone m hm. Yeah, it's unfortunately, 702 00:57:21.400 --> 00:57:24.639 I'm sure projects like that, it's difficult not to make enemies, especially 703 00:57:25.159 --> 00:57:30.760 with the military when you're during the war, when you're trying to advocate peace. 704 00:57:31.400 --> 00:57:37.119 And Einstein even wrote a letter, didn't he to the president and eventually 705 00:57:37.199 --> 00:57:40.800 about yes he did usage of the bomb, Yes he did. And in 706 00:57:40.920 --> 00:57:45.760 fact, it's funny when when they told OPI that they were pulling it, 707 00:57:45.800 --> 00:57:49.960 they were suspending his clent at hiding house has spent at as client in December 708 00:57:50.000 --> 00:57:53.039 nineteen fifty three, and they told him a few days letter. You're traveling 709 00:57:53.079 --> 00:57:54.880 in Europe at the time. When he got back, they told him, 710 00:57:54.920 --> 00:57:59.159 and they gave him one day to decide whether to decide it or not, 711 00:57:59.400 --> 00:58:05.239 just just to come forget that. Those were these these security board hearings, 712 00:58:05.280 --> 00:58:07.639 you know, putting no board hearings to see if he could get this current 713 00:58:07.800 --> 00:58:14.119 back. He decided to fight. And when somebody told Einstein that but APPI 714 00:58:14.280 --> 00:58:16.519 was gonna side it, Einstein said, well, you know what Oppenheimer's problem 715 00:58:16.679 --> 00:58:22.840 is, he's in love with a woman who does not love him the United 716 00:58:22.960 --> 00:58:30.320 States government. That's a great anta, what a great line. Einstein's got 717 00:58:30.360 --> 00:58:34.719 a lot of them. I'd love using his quotes you So, Yeah, 718 00:58:34.960 --> 00:58:40.000 his wit and his wisdom are just incredible, amazing, amazing guy. And 719 00:58:40.159 --> 00:58:46.480 speaking about Einstein and Oppenheimer's relationship, they wrote a document to the president about 720 00:58:46.559 --> 00:58:52.480 how to deal with extraterrestrials. Isn't that true? That's true? Yeah, 721 00:58:52.519 --> 00:58:54.440 you know they did, which is just another reason that you know, the 722 00:58:54.559 --> 00:59:00.000 Melvin Oppenheim was involved in all this and what was that sure? That document 723 00:59:00.079 --> 00:59:06.559 and what were they telling the president. Well, basically it was just you 724 00:59:06.639 --> 00:59:10.039 know, a document discribing of you know, the probable nature of why elseware 725 00:59:10.159 --> 00:59:15.599 and the fact that one has to has to approach you know, studying it 726 00:59:15.679 --> 00:59:19.280 a certain way and so forth and so on, you know, or rather 727 00:59:19.519 --> 00:59:22.440 rather telling kind of documents. There are other documents, the documents that show 728 00:59:22.519 --> 00:59:30.280 up Inheimers as a an advisor to Majestic twelve mm hm. You know, 729 00:59:30.440 --> 00:59:34.360 And that's sort of thing, you know what, I think that's funny about 730 00:59:34.400 --> 00:59:40.400 the Einstein Oppenheimer letter. But they went over a lot. They talked about 731 00:59:42.559 --> 00:59:50.880 the legal ramifications and and that national law and the creation of interstellar law and 732 00:59:51.679 --> 00:59:55.599 all of this stuff getting caught up in courts. And it's really I've never 733 00:59:55.760 --> 01:00:02.320 heard it since anybody talked thinking about you know, possible with the exception of 734 01:00:02.400 --> 01:00:07.480 that time, you know, President of Riggan told the United Nations that it 735 01:00:07.639 --> 01:00:12.480 might take all to unite, all of the fullness might have it might take 736 01:00:12.519 --> 01:00:15.440 an admissary from space. Yeah, you know, I remember the Middle remark 737 01:00:15.559 --> 01:00:20.360 like that the United Nations one time. Yeah, But and that doesn't really 738 01:00:20.400 --> 01:00:22.000 get into that politics as a law, which is funny, you know, 739 01:00:22.480 --> 01:00:28.159 we'll me that not even that what's called exopolitics, you know, gets into 740 01:00:28.239 --> 01:00:34.519 that sort of thing, right, which is what that implies, you know, 741 01:00:35.719 --> 01:00:37.119 a line. It seems like, you know, that's something you would 742 01:00:37.159 --> 01:00:44.920 need to address in some way. But it's kind of funny where the legal 743 01:00:45.119 --> 01:00:47.400 side of the whole business is fascinating. Fact, I devote a chapter in 744 01:00:47.480 --> 01:00:52.360 my Open Have a book to the fact that there's really no legal basis for 745 01:00:52.519 --> 01:01:01.039 government secrecy except executive orders. Funny president supposed to like law, Yeah, 746 01:01:01.320 --> 01:01:07.159 but they do well. And all those so many of those executive orders, 747 01:01:07.400 --> 01:01:10.960 especially with the Bushes, both of them are secret and you still don't know 748 01:01:12.079 --> 01:01:15.960 what they were. Yeah, yeah, and they're really There is nothing in 749 01:01:15.039 --> 01:01:21.920 constitutional law and nothing in statutory or repellent law but says anything about the government's 750 01:01:21.960 --> 01:01:24.719 willy to keep it within secrets. Not the world no matter thinks of this, 751 01:01:24.880 --> 01:01:29.760 it does not well. And that was a great thing about the Disclosure 752 01:01:29.880 --> 01:01:36.760 Project and their lawyer, Danny Dang. I cannot remember his last name right 753 01:01:36.800 --> 01:01:39.000 now, which is a bummers. It's great. That was his premise. 754 01:01:39.079 --> 01:01:46.920 He worked on the presidential files, the Pentagon files and other things, but 755 01:01:51.719 --> 01:01:55.840 that was their premise. That those secrets, those oaths that they took in 756 01:01:57.199 --> 01:02:01.079 the military to keep those secrets were illegal because of projects were legal, so 757 01:02:01.440 --> 01:02:08.119 they didn't have any lacking a legal basis, if not illegal, if not 758 01:02:08.519 --> 01:02:15.559 legal, even know is right not legal? You know, but you know, 759 01:02:15.119 --> 01:02:20.000 speaking of that as well as space law. You know, people in 760 01:02:20.079 --> 01:02:24.039 the chat here were talking about the moon and crashing that satellite into the Moon 761 01:02:24.159 --> 01:02:29.679 like they want to do, and they were talking about legal law or the 762 01:02:29.840 --> 01:02:32.679 law around space, and someone was like, there's such a thing as space 763 01:02:32.800 --> 01:02:37.159 law, and a lot of people don't know that there is international space law, 764 01:02:37.679 --> 01:02:45.000 and especially just like any international laws lately, the US just ignores that 765 01:02:45.119 --> 01:02:50.320 they exist whatsoever, such as I know, part of space laws, you're 766 01:02:50.360 --> 01:02:53.960 not supposed to fly satellites over other countries and take pictures, and if you 767 01:02:54.039 --> 01:02:59.119 do, you have to share those with that country, exactly, sure, 768 01:02:59.159 --> 01:03:02.440 everybody really of that one. And no weapons, there's supposed to be no 769 01:03:02.559 --> 01:03:07.920 weapons at all in space, yeah, which she's never seen the movie Meteor. 770 01:03:08.079 --> 01:03:14.800 You know, you meant probably about how thats so there is international space 771 01:03:14.960 --> 01:03:19.400 law. Yeah, do you think Oppenheimer or Einstein had anything to do with 772 01:03:19.480 --> 01:03:25.440 those laws? It's conceivable. It's conceivable. Let's they may maybe precipitated some 773 01:03:25.599 --> 01:03:30.159 of that, you know, wouldn't with that memo, Like say, Einstein 774 01:03:30.320 --> 01:03:36.280 was taken fairly seriously in government circles. Yeah, more than Oppenheimer was. 775 01:03:36.360 --> 01:03:39.480 I think Oppenhewer is kind of a hothead. You know. People tended to 776 01:03:39.519 --> 01:03:43.360 be a little afraid of him, you know during that whole business of his 777 01:03:45.840 --> 01:03:49.159 being questioned about you know, loyalty and so forth. But Eisenhower and his 778 01:03:49.599 --> 01:03:52.880 friends kept him away. That's the same time the army and the contact areas 779 01:03:52.920 --> 01:03:59.719 were going on, and Eisenhower and his cronies kept them, kept Oppaphenheimer and 780 01:04:00.280 --> 01:04:05.480 uh Senator McCarthy apart deliberately. They didn't what they didn't let McCarthy go after 781 01:04:05.599 --> 01:04:12.840 him because they moved as McCarthy and Oppenheimer will ever in a room together with 782 01:04:13.000 --> 01:04:16.239 cameras. Uh, it was just going to be a blood letting. I 783 01:04:16.280 --> 01:04:20.159 mean, you know, would just cut them to pieces with a big audience. 784 01:04:20.159 --> 01:04:23.159 You know. They didn't want that to happen, so they kept them 785 01:04:23.159 --> 01:04:27.119 apart. That's too bad. Yeah, Yeah, it would have been funny 786 01:04:27.159 --> 01:04:30.920 to see. Yeah, he's had it coming to that. McCarthy yeah, 787 01:04:30.000 --> 01:04:38.800 for sure. So with Eisenhower, what is your belief about what Eisenhower knew 788 01:04:39.320 --> 01:04:44.480 and if you really did you know, handle these events Roswell and all of 789 01:04:44.559 --> 01:04:46.400 these Oh, I think yeah, I think that most of these things, 790 01:04:46.440 --> 01:04:48.719 you know. You know, we've had the stories of Eisenhower going to a 791 01:04:49.280 --> 01:04:54.800 place in looking at wreckage and whatnot. I think I think the the stories 792 01:04:54.880 --> 01:05:01.599 of his family pronounced involvement in the beautiful question are almost certainly true or valid 793 01:05:01.679 --> 01:05:06.000 because for the simple reason he was the next military man. He made lots 794 01:05:06.039 --> 01:05:10.960 of connections. I mean, actually, the fact that he was a left 795 01:05:11.079 --> 01:05:15.760 end in nineteen fifty three and Harry Truman wasn't president anymore made a big difference, 796 01:05:15.800 --> 01:05:18.519 because if if Truman had had stayed president, I think it could have 797 01:05:18.599 --> 01:05:25.719 been different. But when Eisenhower came in, all the military guys had to 798 01:05:25.760 --> 01:05:28.760 say to him though about you know, it was, hey, I remembered 799 01:05:28.760 --> 01:05:32.519 that favor you all made, remember when we served together, you know, 800 01:05:32.639 --> 01:05:34.800 and so forth, and we needed to kind of fit him this thanks for 801 01:05:34.840 --> 01:05:39.480 a while longer, and I'm sure that the secrecy things much easier to keep 802 01:05:39.519 --> 01:05:44.159 going with him than it would have been with Truman. You know, yeah, 803 01:05:44.239 --> 01:05:49.480 and you know that I think being a military man, his speech when 804 01:05:49.480 --> 01:05:56.119 he left office is really, I think pretty incredible and a lot of wisdom 805 01:05:56.679 --> 01:06:00.800 which we're suffering from not listening to his way of them. When he talked 806 01:06:00.800 --> 01:06:09.440 about watching out for the dangers of misplaced power in the defense industry. Yeah, 807 01:06:09.639 --> 01:06:13.239 yeah, yeah, exactly. But you know heinsight, well you know 808 01:06:13.280 --> 01:06:18.599 what they say about hindsight had always been twenty twenty right, exactly so, 809 01:06:18.840 --> 01:06:25.400 and then uh, Majestic twelve you mentioned with Oppenheimer. Of course that was 810 01:06:25.519 --> 01:06:30.039 supposed to have started during the Eisenhower years, right, well, yeah, 811 01:06:30.079 --> 01:06:36.599 Actually, actually the common understanding I think is that is the Truman first appointed 812 01:06:38.760 --> 01:06:43.079 these people, and actually Appenhammer never was, it was according to the list 813 01:06:43.199 --> 01:06:45.400 we see and everything, was never a member. But he I have seen 814 01:06:45.480 --> 01:06:49.679 one memotive defense. He was a He was a an advisor to them. 815 01:06:51.480 --> 01:06:56.639 But these were people that just Trence just went across the lines, you know, 816 01:06:56.760 --> 01:06:59.440 when when when one president was re closed by another, you know, 817 01:07:00.559 --> 01:07:04.840 the public still is something like you're just like twelve new people on other nethersent. 818 01:07:05.679 --> 01:07:11.679 So you do believe that Majestic twelve did, and possibly I think I 819 01:07:11.719 --> 01:07:15.920 think the work that Stan Friedman has done on that you know well stands pretty 820 01:07:15.920 --> 01:07:18.920 well that Yeah, yeah, really, you know, I've got his book 821 01:07:18.960 --> 01:07:25.000 and if Stanton says something, of course he's skeptical of a lot of stuff, 822 01:07:25.760 --> 01:07:30.480 but if he puts his stamp of approval on it, you know that 823 01:07:30.800 --> 01:07:34.679 he has done a lot of research. Yeah, it has overcome his own 824 01:07:34.760 --> 01:07:39.719 skepticism to do so, you know, right, which is a skepticism being 825 01:07:39.760 --> 01:07:42.880 of course, the healthy attitude about everything. You know, if you've start 826 01:07:42.880 --> 01:07:45.159 off saying, well I'm not going to believe it until I'm convinced, then 827 01:07:45.320 --> 01:07:48.559 if you are in those they really means something. Yeah, well that's science. 828 01:07:48.639 --> 01:07:53.760 I mean he comes from a skeptical perspective. That's what you do in 829 01:07:53.880 --> 01:07:59.920 science exactly. So JFK. Then do you what do you believe about here 830 01:08:00.159 --> 01:08:04.480 knowledge in uh on this subject of UFOs. Well, if we you know, 831 01:08:05.800 --> 01:08:10.159 I can can believe that that c I a memo of which I think 832 01:08:10.199 --> 01:08:12.360 we can because, as I said, I kind of get the CIA to 833 01:08:12.480 --> 01:08:16.760 authenticate it. He knew about it, I mean, you know, he 834 01:08:16.920 --> 01:08:25.079 had seen probably debris and bodies and you know he was either then there have 835 01:08:25.199 --> 01:08:29.960 been rumors that Coach for years, but that the thing that gottn assassinate had 836 01:08:30.039 --> 01:08:33.479 might it might have been that he was going to be classify everything. Yeah, 837 01:08:33.640 --> 01:08:36.279 he was the type of person you know if she said to him, 838 01:08:36.279 --> 01:08:39.399 well you can't do that, he would say, yes, I can, 839 01:08:40.159 --> 01:08:43.680 mm hmm, you know, and that may have been what, you know, 840 01:08:43.760 --> 01:08:46.520 what did him in on the end. So there were rumors immediately after 841 01:08:46.600 --> 01:08:51.399 his assassination if the CIA is involved in I used to wonder why to do 842 01:08:51.600 --> 01:08:56.600 that, you know, but they are actually pretty defensible reasons for the right. 843 01:08:58.399 --> 01:09:01.520 Yeah, I know that part of you right from that point of view 844 01:09:01.680 --> 01:09:10.399 exactly with uh JFK. You know, there's been uh I think it's been 845 01:09:10.439 --> 01:09:15.920 Michael Sala and or Alfred Lambert who have been writing about speaking of extrapolitics, 846 01:09:15.720 --> 01:09:24.560 about JFK opening up our space exploration with Russia to work together on that, 847 01:09:25.199 --> 01:09:29.800 and that there were suspicions that he was also then going to open up UFO 848 01:09:30.000 --> 01:09:32.279 files with Russia. Have you heard much about that? Yeah, yeah, 849 01:09:32.359 --> 01:09:36.960 I've seen of course the famous Mama who he talks about just a safety you 850 01:09:38.039 --> 01:09:43.159 know, the Soviet Union in the United States and other countries have to know 851 01:09:43.319 --> 01:09:49.600 about them. Identified flying objects because say, along to identify one could start 852 01:09:49.640 --> 01:09:54.199 a nuclear war. Uh huh, but what if what if something a novel 853 01:09:54.239 --> 01:10:00.199 of shows up in the sky and country anythinks that it's country be firing blue 854 01:10:00.279 --> 01:10:02.600 nipple couple A. You know, you have to know the different and the 855 01:10:02.760 --> 01:10:09.159 difference. No, no, fairly detail nimble about that that I was saying, 856 01:10:09.600 --> 01:10:14.239 Yeah, it reminds me. I think I mentioned this last time because 857 01:10:14.279 --> 01:10:17.439 so much of that era and that stuff reminds me of Doctor Strangeland I just 858 01:10:17.520 --> 01:10:20.680 thought, oh, yeah, yeah exactly. I mean it's a it's just 859 01:10:21.640 --> 01:10:26.720 to have lived through that time is quite an interesting figure. I mean there's 860 01:10:26.720 --> 01:10:32.800 a lot of tension. You know, there's a lot of tonio h very 861 01:10:32.960 --> 01:10:41.920 very strange time. Yeah, I know, there's a gentleman ken Storch. 862 01:10:43.880 --> 01:10:46.319 No, no, he's a move on investigator and a police officer out here. 863 01:10:47.159 --> 01:10:53.159 And actually before this Discovery Channel television show, did you catch the UFOs 864 01:10:53.159 --> 01:10:59.199 over Earth's shows? Oh no, oh, that's too bad. I've got 865 01:10:59.359 --> 01:11:00.720 him, and I think I copy them, and I think since they're not 866 01:11:00.840 --> 01:11:04.680 being distributed, we can probably I'll see if we can distribute those. But 867 01:11:06.279 --> 01:11:11.119 because that was it was focused on Mouf on the Discovery Channel shows. But 868 01:11:11.199 --> 01:11:16.479 before that, there was actually another pilot shot of move On Investigations and this 869 01:11:16.640 --> 01:11:20.319 guy Ken Short's police officer, mouf On Investigator was the host of those. 870 01:11:21.199 --> 01:11:27.920 But he was in the military and he says he was part of an incident 871 01:11:28.159 --> 01:11:34.840 where they did catch UFO on radar and they were really scared and they were 872 01:11:35.319 --> 01:11:41.199 ready to push the button and they were watching these things and it changed course 873 01:11:43.039 --> 01:11:47.399 and yeah, it changed course and went towards Canada, and he was thinking, 874 01:11:47.439 --> 01:11:54.359 well, let them New Canada as long as it's but they were happy 875 01:11:54.520 --> 01:11:57.800 that, you know. He said. It was a real tense moment. 876 01:11:58.640 --> 01:12:01.039 But that's that's called development. But I mean, you know, the governments 877 01:12:01.239 --> 01:12:10.439 can't afford not to study UFOs. They have to. I mean, we've 878 01:12:10.479 --> 01:12:12.960 got admit a couple of countries in the world right now, you know, 879 01:12:13.159 --> 01:12:16.920 threatening nuclear war, and you know, a country just has to know what's 880 01:12:16.960 --> 01:12:19.239 in the air. You know, they got to know the difference between something 881 01:12:19.239 --> 01:12:24.720 that's supposed to be there and something you're not supposed to be, something that's 882 01:12:24.800 --> 01:12:28.680 man maybe something that isn't. Yeah, well, with all those tensions in 883 01:12:28.720 --> 01:12:33.159 the Middle East and with that exactly North Korea, you know, like UFO, 884 01:12:33.680 --> 01:12:40.840 what would they do and that launch on Japan or another ally, So 885 01:12:41.039 --> 01:12:45.840 anytime anytime a government says to you we're not interested in UFOs, you know 886 01:12:46.000 --> 01:12:49.720 you're correct response to it. You can't be that stupid. Of course, 887 01:12:49.800 --> 01:12:55.600 you have to be well. And the beautiful thing is is that a lot 888 01:12:55.720 --> 01:13:00.239 of countries do admit that they're interested in UFOs. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 889 01:13:00.399 --> 01:13:05.560 yeah, the Brazil, Mexico, Belgium and uh, you know what 890 01:13:05.840 --> 01:13:10.960 the that's what's great about you know I Nick Pope, Yeah, he'll be 891 01:13:11.079 --> 01:13:15.199 there with us in Roswell and he'll be talking about Britain opening up the files, 892 01:13:15.239 --> 01:13:18.680 which is great because Nick did a lot of conferences this year because of 893 01:13:19.159 --> 01:13:23.960 all the British news. But the British news is died down and Nick hasn't 894 01:13:24.000 --> 01:13:26.479 talked in a few months, and I know there's more that's gone. So 895 01:13:27.000 --> 01:13:30.279 we're going to be able to hear to catch up on some of that stuff. 896 01:13:30.920 --> 01:13:34.399 But yeah, exciting, mm hmm. It should be great. And 897 01:13:34.520 --> 01:13:42.680 then of course we sprung something on you that I haven't talked to you about 898 01:13:42.760 --> 01:13:46.520 yet. I know Free did so and another thing that hopefully you're open for 899 01:13:46.640 --> 01:13:53.680 doing and if not, that's flying too. All those little the work. 900 01:13:54.520 --> 01:13:57.239 Yeah, so yeah, yeah, I signed up to the two of those 901 01:13:57.279 --> 01:14:00.159 and I'm looking forward to them. Cool. Great because I'm going to write 902 01:14:00.199 --> 01:14:03.479 up an agenda, but you can do what you want and also bring a 903 01:14:03.560 --> 01:14:09.640 disc of pictures so we can go over a lot of pictures with people. 904 01:14:09.720 --> 01:14:14.960 I think people love UFO pictures and I downloaded a bunch of them from a 905 01:14:15.119 --> 01:14:21.159 British paper that put up like twenty five great UFO photos. Well yeah, 906 01:14:21.279 --> 01:14:27.159 I actually had planted too with my sessions to talk a little about the about 907 01:14:27.239 --> 01:14:31.399 like clapsification system for cool, I can see how we tell them what kind 908 01:14:31.439 --> 01:14:34.399 of siding and you know, exciting news. Yeah, that's a great idea 909 01:14:34.920 --> 01:14:39.880 if you need it. I've got a clip of Alan j Heinek and close 910 01:14:40.000 --> 01:14:45.960 Encounters like yeah, because I have actually done a number of sessions on the 911 01:14:45.239 --> 01:14:48.239 l AT system, you know, really like let's say what move from reading 912 01:14:48.359 --> 01:14:53.000 and oh cool, just to be sure everybody understands how it will works. 913 01:14:53.079 --> 01:14:58.079 That's it's it's a new system mm hmm. Yeah yeah, And I mean 914 01:14:58.159 --> 01:15:03.760 somebody had to put something together, but so out of uh, I guess 915 01:15:03.840 --> 01:15:09.399 getting into some of the speakers and stuff out there. Well, actually I 916 01:15:09.439 --> 01:15:13.720 wanted to Oh, I was going to ask something about m J twelve, 917 01:15:14.319 --> 01:15:23.079 but more about that. It was John Alexander. Do you know of him? 918 01:15:24.199 --> 01:15:29.680 Oh? I can't. Yeah, well I was going to ask you 919 01:15:29.760 --> 01:15:32.159 about that, but it already sounds like John Alexander worked for the military. 920 01:15:32.239 --> 01:15:39.760 And the news I gave Earliers are creating a movie loosely based on him. 921 01:15:40.119 --> 01:15:43.119 George Clooney's going to play him, actually, and it's going to be a 922 01:15:43.279 --> 01:15:47.720 dark comedy. And they asked him to look into different paranormal subjects and he 923 01:15:47.920 --> 01:15:54.560 did, and his thing is mostly psych warfare and non lethal weapons, which 924 01:15:54.600 --> 01:16:00.279 is kind of scary stuff of course. But he goes to people by him 925 01:16:00.279 --> 01:16:03.800 to UFO conferences and he talks about how the government doesn't know anything about UFOs 926 01:16:04.960 --> 01:16:10.520 well, but like they better know about it. Yeah, they better know 927 01:16:10.800 --> 01:16:15.800 something, uh exactly. So, but you know you had mentioned m J 928 01:16:15.920 --> 01:16:19.319 twelve and stuff, so you certainly don't seem to agree with that perspective. 929 01:16:21.079 --> 01:16:27.520 Interesting. Yeah, so some of the other speakers that are going to be 930 01:16:27.560 --> 01:16:30.840 out there in roswell, so we can get some people excited about that. 931 01:16:32.319 --> 01:16:36.520 Yeah, it's good. It's quite an interesting whip. I know, International 932 01:16:38.520 --> 01:16:43.439 Director James Carrying is going to be speaking, and also Cliff withs Gong with 933 01:16:44.399 --> 01:16:48.239 of the documents expert, and he lives there locally, right, Yeah, 934 01:16:49.359 --> 01:16:55.600 known for you a little fun uh huh oh cool, great, Yeah, 935 01:16:56.119 --> 01:17:02.439 he's got some fascinating information. Yeah, I've seen I think actually that's what 936 01:17:02.520 --> 01:17:06.000 had Cliffer do. I thought that at Statewide moved on a meeting on time. 937 01:17:06.039 --> 01:17:12.920 And of course this guy had got hundreds of thousands of pages of documents. 938 01:17:12.960 --> 01:17:15.800 You know that he's probe out of one government agency or another over the 939 01:17:15.920 --> 01:17:18.840 years. M hm, he's really into it. Yeah. Well, and 940 01:17:18.880 --> 01:17:23.479 because he's a local, because he's a nice guy, and I have all 941 01:17:23.520 --> 01:17:28.199 of that information I knew. I Luckily nobody has made an issue of it. 942 01:17:28.319 --> 01:17:30.239 I thought people were going to give me a little bit of trouble over 943 01:17:30.960 --> 01:17:38.399 uh, inviting Cliffs for our talk because he's so highly controversial. Well but 944 01:17:38.560 --> 01:17:41.560 you want that, I mean, you know, without any controversy, what 945 01:17:41.680 --> 01:17:46.159 would this field do? You know? Yeah? Boring? Yeah, pretty 946 01:17:46.239 --> 01:17:50.159 much. We might as well just be a knitting club. Oh yeah, 947 01:17:51.880 --> 01:17:56.840 yeah, So I was really excited to bring him on. He's definitely probably 948 01:17:57.279 --> 01:18:00.960 one of our most controversial guys there. And then Travis Walton. Have you 949 01:18:00.000 --> 01:18:01.960 ever got to see him? Oh yeah, yeah, I've actually never met 950 01:18:02.000 --> 01:18:06.479 Travis Walton, but yeah, I'm hopefully coming weekend. I think we're glad 951 01:18:06.479 --> 01:18:12.199 to have him coming out. Oh yeah, definitely. He is so down 952 01:18:12.279 --> 01:18:16.000 to earth, such a nice guy, and that is one of the things 953 01:18:16.079 --> 01:18:23.079 that's great about meeting Travis Walton. He you know, he doesn't have some 954 01:18:23.279 --> 01:18:28.800 kind of polished talk. He's still up until very recently, I don't he 955 01:18:28.920 --> 01:18:30.840 was talking about stopping, but I don't think he has. But up until 956 01:18:30.880 --> 01:18:35.319 recently, he's still a lumberjack, you know, working ten twelve hour days 957 01:18:35.359 --> 01:18:43.479 out there Allen Moggs cutting down logs and stuff. So yeah, so and 958 01:18:43.960 --> 01:18:45.000 you know, know, you meet him and you know how old he is, 959 01:18:45.119 --> 01:18:49.960 but he's that doesn't look at he's still really fitting. But just a 960 01:18:50.720 --> 01:18:56.159 it's great to see him talk about his experience and see what kind of person 961 01:18:56.279 --> 01:19:00.560 he is and just how down to earth he really is. Yeah, mot 962 01:19:00.560 --> 01:19:04.359 of just his his account, you know, all the more all the more 963 01:19:04.399 --> 01:19:10.199 crotability for another, it is not even feak about him not not not believing 964 01:19:10.279 --> 01:19:14.520 that they all really happened him that they had to. Yeah, it's kind 965 01:19:14.520 --> 01:19:16.199 of like Betty and Barnie Hill, you know, I mean they have they 966 01:19:16.399 --> 01:19:20.399 fake that, you know, they couldn't count mm hmm. What do you 967 01:19:20.439 --> 01:19:24.319 think about this? There? You know, the caller called in and talked 968 01:19:24.319 --> 01:19:31.239 about abductions I've heard lately from some abduction or a I should say abduction researcher. 969 01:19:31.800 --> 01:19:36.760 He believes that Betty and Barney Hill was not an extraterrestrial abduction, but 970 01:19:38.000 --> 01:19:46.960 uh, military abduction. Well, anything is possible. Yeah, the it 971 01:19:47.239 --> 01:19:51.640 doesn't really that's a hypothesis. It doesn't really account for everything. Mm hmm. 972 01:19:53.159 --> 01:19:57.760 It doesn't account for Betty's done that for one thing. Yeah. Uh. 973 01:19:57.920 --> 01:20:00.760 This is Joe Montealdo and I hope to have him the show to talk 974 01:20:00.840 --> 01:20:04.199 more about that because yeah, yeah, he says, I know you're probably 975 01:20:04.239 --> 01:20:08.960 skeptical, and yes I am, but uh no, but you know the 976 01:20:09.039 --> 01:20:12.239 thing you think of business, how science were science was but a like computing 977 01:20:12.319 --> 01:20:15.359 hypothesies, you know, right, and looking at which ones account for everything 978 01:20:15.479 --> 01:20:18.800 best. Yeah, and that's what I love, and that's why you know, 979 01:20:18.880 --> 01:20:23.039 I'm certainly I love the openness and why we should listen to Clifford Stone 980 01:20:23.079 --> 01:20:27.560 and all these guys, because exactly like you said, science doesn't start with 981 01:20:28.239 --> 01:20:33.359 listening to witness testimony and saying, oh, that's not possible and blowing it 982 01:20:33.439 --> 01:20:38.960 off. That's not science. And those scientists who do that are not good 983 01:20:39.000 --> 01:20:46.479 scientists. That's right. Science is taking that witness testimony they observed phenomena and 984 01:20:47.600 --> 01:20:51.159 trying to put a hypothesis to it and test it and trying to figure it 985 01:20:51.239 --> 01:20:58.359 out exactly. And that's why, you know, it's really a good way. 986 01:20:58.479 --> 01:21:01.000 Let's see, let's see moving in that diruption. You know, for 987 01:21:01.279 --> 01:21:09.079 seven years the field of uposed studies was considered kind of suspect by a lot 988 01:21:09.119 --> 01:21:13.279 of people. You know, it was considered like not really valid or not 989 01:21:13.439 --> 01:21:15.800 reallyal science or something. And now we're actually not going to beginning to make 990 01:21:15.840 --> 01:21:20.680 it clear that it is scient mm hmm. It has to be, Yeah, 991 01:21:21.359 --> 01:21:25.359 that's what it has to be. Yeah, I know. It moved 992 01:21:25.399 --> 01:21:30.399 on there some of us working on a science conference with a typical you know, 993 01:21:30.600 --> 01:21:36.960 scientific symposium. We've they've written up to call for papers and trying to 994 01:21:38.079 --> 01:21:45.960 have it kind of like a SETI conference, but beyond because we're gonna entertain 995 01:21:45.079 --> 01:21:50.640 of course more hypotheses than SETI would, right, Yeah, And I don't 996 01:21:50.680 --> 01:21:56.520 know, yeah, and I don't know if you saw this, but the 997 01:21:56.640 --> 01:22:02.159 only place I saw was in a blog where this guy uh does news on 998 01:22:02.279 --> 01:22:08.000 SETI and stuff like that, and he blogs on UFOs and things. He 999 01:22:08.159 --> 01:22:14.279 went to the SETI conference last year in France and there were two scientists, 1000 01:22:14.399 --> 01:22:17.560 one from France and I think one from Italy, and they both talked about 1001 01:22:17.720 --> 01:22:26.239 UFOs in their SETI talk, which SETI I'm sure didn't appreciate. One of 1002 01:22:26.279 --> 01:22:30.239 them talking about how they're here and he was talking about how it's probably this 1003 01:22:31.359 --> 01:22:38.079 he was hypothesizing on why they don't interact with us, and he was kind 1004 01:22:38.119 --> 01:22:42.800 of the same as what Stanton freedom and talks about, they're probably containing us 1005 01:22:42.880 --> 01:22:49.279 because we're wild animals observing us at the same time. So that was interesting. 1006 01:22:49.319 --> 01:22:55.000 And then another one who was talking about how we really need to look 1007 01:22:55.039 --> 01:22:59.720 at UFOs because they're here and people are seeing them, and you know that's 1008 01:22:59.840 --> 01:23:04.840 for we're going to find some more information exactly. So yeah, the only 1009 01:23:04.880 --> 01:23:12.279 way anybody can plain that there are most that there are no UFOs is to 1010 01:23:13.920 --> 01:23:19.880 demonstrate that every single object ever seen anytime, but anyone anywhere in the sky 1011 01:23:20.439 --> 01:23:25.960 has been positively or identified as something familiar mm hmm. And that is simply 1012 01:23:26.039 --> 01:23:30.199 not possible. M h I mean, the definition of the UFO is simple 1013 01:23:30.199 --> 01:23:32.079 as something in the air and we don't know what it is, you know, 1014 01:23:32.239 --> 01:23:38.479 and Heaven knows a lot of that, a lot of it. Yeah, 1015 01:23:38.800 --> 01:23:42.960 And I can't imagine anybody's saying, you know, denying that those things 1016 01:23:43.000 --> 01:23:46.960 in the sky we can't identify. Yeah. Well, and that's what's great, 1017 01:23:47.039 --> 01:23:51.880 you know. I remember when Dan Ackroyd came out with his video talking 1018 01:23:51.920 --> 01:23:56.880 about UFOs, which is a great video. People, Oh gotta get that. 1019 01:23:58.039 --> 01:24:00.520 He's done a lot of research. And some ufologists are like, oh, 1020 01:24:00.680 --> 01:24:06.359 that's basic stuff. Well maybe, but uh you know it, yeah 1021 01:24:06.439 --> 01:24:12.279 exactly. To the public, it's probably not basic exactly. So he does 1022 01:24:12.319 --> 01:24:16.000 a great job getting out some information. He sounds like a seasoned upologist. 1023 01:24:16.760 --> 01:24:19.520 Yeah. Yeah, well, I think that was the reason the noble of 1024 01:24:19.640 --> 01:24:24.279 the speak. Yeah. So when he came out with that, they were 1025 01:24:24.399 --> 01:24:29.199 talking on CNN or they interviewed him, and they they asked him about it, 1026 01:24:29.760 --> 01:24:33.399 and I think they had Bruce mcabeyond and the lady was like and you 1027 01:24:33.479 --> 01:24:38.079 know, there were something like three or four sightings in the United States last 1028 01:24:38.159 --> 01:24:44.479 year, weren't they? And you know, and I think I'm pretty sure 1029 01:24:44.479 --> 01:24:45.880 it was Bruce mcavee. They had on and talked about, well, actually 1030 01:24:45.920 --> 01:24:49.720 there's a lot more and you can go to moufon dot com and see more. 1031 01:24:50.159 --> 01:24:55.399 And he didn't see how many, but you know, there are thousands. 1032 01:24:55.479 --> 01:24:59.039 I mean, we're getting thousands of reports. And I know when I 1033 01:24:59.159 --> 01:25:04.000 became that's the gator I was. I was surprised and delighted by the credibility 1034 01:25:04.039 --> 01:25:09.279 of some of these people. I went out to go investigate. Yeah. 1035 01:25:09.319 --> 01:25:11.279 Yeah, I have been too. I have been too. I've worked on 1036 01:25:11.359 --> 01:25:15.880 a number of cases where I was just really gratified to see but it was 1037 01:25:15.159 --> 01:25:19.000 something of substance, you know, and I was working on something that was 1038 01:25:19.359 --> 01:25:26.279 obviously real. You know, it's well, it's a privilege. It's a 1039 01:25:26.319 --> 01:25:30.159 privilege to able to work on these things. Yeah, you know, listen 1040 01:25:30.159 --> 01:25:31.880 to I don't have to. I'm going to have to sign off. Okay, 1041 01:25:34.159 --> 01:25:39.680 I've got to get up early tomorrow morning and decent things. But I 1042 01:25:39.840 --> 01:25:45.000 just want to tell everybody that this year's bash. I don't know what else 1043 01:25:45.359 --> 01:25:47.800 I mean it's going to be a really nice, nice festival. I think 1044 01:25:47.840 --> 01:25:53.239 we have a big lineup of speakers and lots of events. We have these 1045 01:25:53.439 --> 01:25:57.119 these orientation sessions I think are going to be a lot of fun. Mm 1046 01:25:57.199 --> 01:26:00.840 hm and uh, well, well, you know, like somebody said, 1047 01:26:00.920 --> 01:26:04.439 be here or be noble with Yeah, I can ask one last question real 1048 01:26:04.520 --> 01:26:09.520 quick. Sure you know a lot of investigators and actually we're out of time 1049 01:26:09.560 --> 01:26:13.439 anyway, but a lot of investigators talk about, you know, what percentage 1050 01:26:13.560 --> 01:26:19.960 of UFO's reports are actually unknowns rather than something saying that's identified. What's your 1051 01:26:20.079 --> 01:26:25.520 num. Well, I don't have I don't have hard data on that, 1052 01:26:25.920 --> 01:26:30.119 and over the years, I've gathered the impression that something on the order of 1053 01:26:30.239 --> 01:26:39.439 maybe three percent of cases are truly anomalous. And that's stupendous because because I 1054 01:26:39.520 --> 01:26:42.920 mean, even if let's say there were only a thousand fat of replies in 1055 01:26:43.000 --> 01:26:45.720 a given year, and many many more than that, right, but if 1056 01:26:45.720 --> 01:26:48.359 they're only three thoting a thousand sinding replies in a given years, that's thirty 1057 01:26:48.600 --> 01:26:55.800 real UFOs, exactly thirty really anomalous projects. Yeah, I heard its three 1058 01:26:55.840 --> 01:27:00.239 percent or whatever. That little percentage is that really knows life interesting. Yeah, 1059 01:27:00.319 --> 01:27:03.920 that's pretty much what Mitchiakaku has been saying lately. Yeah, well great, 1060 01:27:04.000 --> 01:27:06.560 thank you so much for being on the show. I can't wait. 1061 01:27:06.920 --> 01:27:11.319 Yea, in just a couple of days here, we'll have a lot of 1062 01:27:11.399 --> 01:27:15.199 fun. Oh yeah, yeah, it's it's coming and it's gonna be fun. 1063 01:27:15.600 --> 01:27:20.079 Yeah. And I'm sure it's hot out there. Huh, Holy moly. 1064 01:27:20.319 --> 01:27:25.039 So short, sir, I'm not going to be able. I'm not 1065 01:27:25.119 --> 01:27:32.279 going to be fancied next week. So wow, all right, yeah, 1066 01:27:33.000 --> 01:27:38.760 okay, well, thank you very much. Everybody. You can go check 1067 01:27:38.800 --> 01:27:45.600 out the website black Mesa oh yeah, black Mesa Press dot com, black 1068 01:27:45.680 --> 01:27:49.239 Mesa Press dot com and you can get his books and check it out and 1069 01:27:49.359 --> 01:27:53.880 come hear them talk in Roswell. So thank you, yeah, thank you. 1070 01:27:54.039 --> 01:27:59.479 Look forward to seeing it. So just to do the rundown real quick 1071 01:27:59.640 --> 01:28:04.960 on the other speakers that will be out there in Roswell for the listeners here. 1072 01:28:06.359 --> 01:28:12.159 Like we've talked about James Carrion, Director of MUFON, Travis Walton, 1073 01:28:13.119 --> 01:28:19.359 Don Burrows, We've just talked to Paula Harris. We'll be out there talking 1074 01:28:19.399 --> 01:28:27.479 about Colonel Corso. Like we just talked about Clifford Stone, who we just 1075 01:28:27.600 --> 01:28:30.600 talked about. Nick Pope. I think we covered everybody all I cover, 1076 01:28:31.439 --> 01:28:36.680 Chuck Zukowski, who I had on Roswell, researcher who will be talking with 1077 01:28:36.800 --> 01:28:41.279 his sister. That'll be Ziggelemeyer, and they're going to be doing our Roswell 1078 01:28:41.399 --> 01:28:45.319 one oh one coming the basics for our visitors who aren't up to speed on 1079 01:28:45.439 --> 01:28:50.439 all of that. Grant Cameron talking about presidents, Claude Swanson, a physicists 1080 01:28:50.520 --> 01:28:58.800 talking about equations that were downloaded by Stan Romaneck somehow, and Richard Dolan, 1081 01:28:58.840 --> 01:29:02.760 he's got a brand new book out calling both to cover up past, present 1082 01:29:02.920 --> 01:29:08.199 and future. I'm gonna be in Roswell next weekend and I'm gonna be so 1083 01:29:08.399 --> 01:29:11.840 busy. Unfortunately, I'm not gonna be able to do a show. I 1084 01:29:12.039 --> 01:29:15.840 apologize, ladies and gentlemen, but I'll be back in two weeks. And 1085 01:29:16.000 --> 01:29:20.159 I'm already gonna be up on the UFO and Paranormal Network in the next couple 1086 01:29:20.239 --> 01:29:25.800 of days, so they'll be playing some of them on my archives on there. 1087 01:29:25.960 --> 01:29:30.680 So the Australians are gonna be getting a dose a UFO Think Tank Radio. 1088 01:29:30.800 --> 01:29:33.840 I hope they like it anyway, You guys have a wonderful weekend. 1089 01:29:34.399 --> 01:29:38.920 Come say hi if you're in Roswell. I'm gonna be at to move on 1090 01:29:39.079 --> 01:29:44.319 talks and I'd love to say hi and meet some of you. But thanks 1091 01:29:44.399 --> 01:30:26.720 again. Talk to yous guys, Laters. H dav Il Matop with a 1092 01:30:26.880 --> 01:30:35.199 bad Day made Preciate with a daily that I have the mad Preciate with bad 1093 01:30:35.960 --> 01:30:45.880 day. The band who gave