WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.360 --> 00:00:03.560
This holiday season, you might be
looking for nutritious, convenient meals to keep

2
00:00:03.600 --> 00:00:08.640
you energized on jam pack days.
Factor America's number one ready to eat meal

3
00:00:08.679 --> 00:00:11.519
delivery service, can help you feel
up fast for breakfast, lunch, and

4
00:00:11.599 --> 00:00:17.000
dinner with chef prepared, dietician approved
ready to eat meals delivered straight to your

5
00:00:17.000 --> 00:00:19.960
door. Do you want to cleanse
after eating too much Halloween candy? Do

6
00:00:20.000 --> 00:00:23.679
you want to have energy to deal
with your relatives and all the travel.

7
00:00:24.039 --> 00:00:30.120
Eat nutrient dense food that's quick and
easy with Factor Meals. That's what I

8
00:00:30.160 --> 00:00:33.240
do. Sometimes I'm just too busy
to cook on my busy schedule, and

9
00:00:33.280 --> 00:00:35.359
I want to make sure I'm eating
while and with Factor, I don't have

10
00:00:35.399 --> 00:00:37.679
to run at the grocery store.
I don't have to chop, prep and

11
00:00:37.679 --> 00:00:41.119
clean up either, and I get
flavor and nutritional quality that I look for

12
00:00:41.159 --> 00:00:44.320
to give me the energy to keep
doing what I do. It is cold

13
00:00:44.320 --> 00:00:47.240
and flu season, and I've thought
over time that when I've been eating while

14
00:00:47.520 --> 00:00:51.640
I recover quicker from cold and flu
symptoms, and during this time of year,

15
00:00:51.679 --> 00:00:54.320
you want to be able to get
out and do things without feeling like

16
00:00:54.359 --> 00:00:57.679
you're going to be sick for two
weeks afterwards. The clean eating and nutrient

17
00:00:57.679 --> 00:01:00.520
density and Factor meals makes me more
confident that I'm going to fight back against

18
00:01:00.520 --> 00:01:03.719
all the germs that are out there
circulating during this time of year. Factor

19
00:01:03.760 --> 00:01:07.920
provides over thirty five weekly flavor packed, fresh, never frozen meals that does

20
00:01:07.959 --> 00:01:12.239
support a healthy lifestyle and will meet
your meal preferences with their variety, all

21
00:01:12.280 --> 00:01:15.439
delivered right to your door and ready
to pull out of the refrigerator and heat

22
00:01:15.480 --> 00:01:19.400
up and eat in two minutes.
You don't have to wait forty five minutes

23
00:01:19.400 --> 00:01:22.040
for delivery, worry if the food's
going to be cold, worry about how

24
00:01:22.120 --> 00:01:25.120
much to tip, and mess around
with the delivery app. Every week,

25
00:01:25.159 --> 00:01:26.439
you get a box of meals and
they're in your fridge, ready to go.

26
00:01:26.560 --> 00:01:30.840
They also have an assortment of forty
five plus add ons to suit various

27
00:01:30.879 --> 00:01:36.079
preferences and tastes, including breakfast items
like apple cinnamon, pancakes and smoothies.

28
00:01:36.560 --> 00:01:38.359
With Factor, you can rest assured
you're making a sustainable choice too. They

29
00:01:38.319 --> 00:01:42.959
offset one hundred percent of their delivery
emissions and source one hundred percent renewable electricity

30
00:01:44.079 --> 00:01:48.319
at their production and site offices,
so this November. Get Factor and enjoy

31
00:01:48.359 --> 00:01:52.840
eating well without the hassle. Simply
choose your meals and enjoy fresh, flavor

32
00:01:52.879 --> 00:01:56.640
packed meals delivered to your door,
ready in just two minutes, no prep,

33
00:01:56.680 --> 00:02:00.359
no mess. Head to Factor Meals
dot com, slash Wade fifty and

34
00:02:00.480 --> 00:02:07.280
use code Wade fifty to get fifty
percent off. That's Codewade fifty at Factor

35
00:02:07.319 --> 00:02:23.159
Meals dot Com. Slash Wade fifty
to get fifty percent off. Now,

36
00:02:23.360 --> 00:02:28.439
pw Torch and Spreaker bring you the
Wade Killer Pro Wrestling Podcast. It's time

37
00:02:28.479 --> 00:02:34.199
for this week's Interview Classic where Wade
Killer Interview is one of Pro Wrestling's newsmakers.

38
00:02:37.479 --> 00:02:39.520
Five years ago this month, John
Piermarini joined me. He is a

39
00:02:39.560 --> 00:02:44.639
former WWE creative team member of frequent
guest on the show, providing a lot

40
00:02:44.680 --> 00:02:49.120
of insight into how WWE works behind
the scenes, and in this episode,

41
00:02:49.360 --> 00:02:53.199
we focused one hundred percent on women's
wrestling in WWE. First, He provided

42
00:02:53.199 --> 00:02:59.479
behind the scenes insights on the time
he worked for WWE, including working alongside

43
00:02:59.479 --> 00:03:02.039
Mickey James, Alicia Fox, The
Bellas, Beth Phoenix, Eve Kelly Kelly,

44
00:03:02.080 --> 00:03:06.800
Gail Kim, and others. He
talks about the attitude towards women's wrestling

45
00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:10.520
then and how women felt about how
they were utilized. Then we review each

46
00:03:10.599 --> 00:03:14.599
match at Evolution, look at the
match order, what's next for ron A

47
00:03:14.680 --> 00:03:19.080
Rousei, his take on the booking
of Becky Lynch, and more. This

48
00:03:19.159 --> 00:03:23.360
is a Wade Caller Pro Wrestling podcast
for Saturday, November eleventh, twenty twenty

49
00:03:23.360 --> 00:03:27.159
three, and it is our Interview
Classic edition from five years ago this month.

50
00:03:27.159 --> 00:03:30.719
The show originally dropped on November two, twenty eighteen. Here we go,

51
00:03:32.599 --> 00:03:38.560
All right, John, For someone
who worked in WWE creative almost ten

52
00:03:38.599 --> 00:03:42.319
years ago, can you believe I'm
saying that? How shocked are you,

53
00:03:43.159 --> 00:03:47.840
if at all, that we just
finished up earlier this week women's only WWE

54
00:03:47.879 --> 00:03:54.439
pay per view, not a novelty
ww network special, but an actual replacement

55
00:03:54.439 --> 00:04:00.599
for what would have been the October
regularly scheduled pay per view. I'm not

56
00:04:00.919 --> 00:04:03.879
shocked that they did it, but
it's not because I felt like that was

57
00:04:03.960 --> 00:04:11.360
the natural progression of the division.
I think that when you started seeing the

58
00:04:11.560 --> 00:04:15.959
press that Ronda Rousey was getting in
USC at the time when she was sort

59
00:04:15.959 --> 00:04:19.920
of taking over that company and almost
really become in the face of that company

60
00:04:19.959 --> 00:04:24.079
at the time, because I think
that's when they were losing like GSP and

61
00:04:24.079 --> 00:04:29.879
a couple other people, and you
could see that ww was starting to want

62
00:04:29.879 --> 00:04:34.279
to piggyback on that. So not
surprised at all, knowing that the way

63
00:04:34.360 --> 00:04:43.839
that this country at least is moving
towards women empowerment and you know, focusing

64
00:04:44.000 --> 00:04:49.000
on what they're able to do.
Then I honestly it was like you knew

65
00:04:49.040 --> 00:04:50.920
they were going to get in on
that. So no, no, no

66
00:04:51.000 --> 00:04:55.439
surprise, but still happy that they
did it. However they can get it

67
00:04:55.480 --> 00:05:00.399
done, I'm happy with for them. The culture of WWE, what do

68
00:05:00.480 --> 00:05:04.000
we at eight I guess about eight
years ago when you were there. When

69
00:05:04.000 --> 00:05:13.439
it comes to women wrestlers and women
in general, what describe it like?

70
00:05:13.839 --> 00:05:18.879
I think people have an impression that
maybe women were looked at hired based on

71
00:05:19.959 --> 00:05:27.040
looks, but on a different criteria
than men, and that they were in

72
00:05:27.120 --> 00:05:32.000
a largely historically men's business where women
were a novelty described kind of the culture

73
00:05:32.199 --> 00:05:38.439
both for on air talent and off
air talent or off air workers in WWE

74
00:05:38.759 --> 00:05:41.879
compared to what you've experienced with where
you are now and where you've been before,

75
00:05:43.680 --> 00:05:46.759
just as a WW culture or just
in general. Yeah, the culture

76
00:05:46.839 --> 00:05:51.680
in WWE eight years ago towards women
in predominantly men's business or the man of

77
00:05:51.680 --> 00:05:54.800
the stars, the men make the
money, the met of the promoters.

78
00:05:55.079 --> 00:05:58.879
You know, there's Stephanan and some
executives, but like it's the culture towards

79
00:05:58.920 --> 00:06:02.000
women in WWE and when you were
there different than you found in other corporate

80
00:06:02.160 --> 00:06:10.000
or life environments. Yeah, I
think that all just kind of really comes

81
00:06:10.040 --> 00:06:14.120
down to who who's creating the culture
and what their thoughts are on it.

82
00:06:14.360 --> 00:06:18.120
You know, being in Los Angeles
and in the television industry pretty much since

83
00:06:18.160 --> 00:06:27.079
I was eighteen nineteen years old,
I didn't see a lot of the same

84
00:06:27.160 --> 00:06:31.600
that I saw in WWE. But
that's also because the person or person's running

85
00:06:31.639 --> 00:06:38.519
it thought very differently. And I
think that, you know, it's hard

86
00:06:38.519 --> 00:06:41.360
to kind of answer that because I
don't know how it is now, and

87
00:06:41.399 --> 00:06:46.000
I don't know if they are if
the culture has changed there in the way

88
00:06:46.040 --> 00:06:49.279
that they're treating people or how they
see the women, or if it's just

89
00:06:49.360 --> 00:06:57.360
something where you know, much like
Crown Jewel, it's forget if whatever they

90
00:06:57.399 --> 00:07:00.399
may be, forget our values and
folks. More on where the money's at.

91
00:07:00.439 --> 00:07:03.279
So it's a hard question to answer, but it very very different,

92
00:07:03.680 --> 00:07:05.959
is the only way that I could
put it. When I was there,

93
00:07:06.519 --> 00:07:10.759
it was like you were saying,
it was like higher them on their looks.

94
00:07:10.879 --> 00:07:18.839
If they didn't fit into that mold, then it was, you know,

95
00:07:19.000 --> 00:07:24.000
like a bully mentality, and I
think that they were looked down upon.

96
00:07:24.160 --> 00:07:28.839
I was actually very shocked when it
was not too long after I left,

97
00:07:28.839 --> 00:07:32.759
because I remember even hitching her to
be part of Lake Cool when I

98
00:07:32.800 --> 00:07:36.319
was working with them, when they
brought in Awesome Kong, and I actually

99
00:07:36.360 --> 00:07:40.319
was pretty surprised that they brought her
in and did what they did with her

100
00:07:40.399 --> 00:07:46.800
because it just was so different than
what I would expect Vince or that company

101
00:07:46.800 --> 00:07:50.040
to get behind. But yeah,
I hope that answers your question somewhat.

102
00:07:50.160 --> 00:07:54.480
Yeah, so far as far as
Auntio talent goes, there's a premium in

103
00:07:54.560 --> 00:08:00.480
WWWW placed on diversity of body type
with men. The idea is, obviously

104
00:08:00.519 --> 00:08:05.040
the leading men have a certain consistency
to their look over the years, from

105
00:08:05.120 --> 00:08:09.920
Hulk Hogan, Steve Austin, and
Rock a little bit different during a different

106
00:08:09.920 --> 00:08:13.439
time, but not that different.
John Cena, Roman reigns. You can

107
00:08:13.480 --> 00:08:18.040
put some people in between attempts they
made with Sid and Batista, but they

108
00:08:18.160 --> 00:08:20.279
still valued on the roster different body
types. But you had a whole roster,

109
00:08:22.399 --> 00:08:24.920
a large male roster of dozens of
men, where there was room for

110
00:08:26.000 --> 00:08:33.120
diversity with the women. It was
and historically has been to the average viewer

111
00:08:33.200 --> 00:08:37.679
much less. Somebody worked behind the
scenes. A premium placed on well we

112
00:08:37.799 --> 00:08:39.840
have, and they've tried to move
away from this and incorporate women into the

113
00:08:39.840 --> 00:08:48.279
demographics. But young male fan base
who want eye candy and fantasies and sex

114
00:08:48.279 --> 00:08:54.559
appeal for the one or two slots
for the women on a TV show compared

115
00:08:54.600 --> 00:08:58.039
to the fifteen spots for men on
a two R TV show. So part

116
00:08:58.080 --> 00:09:01.519
of it was they're just if you're
gonna have women on the show, it's

117
00:09:01.600 --> 00:09:09.240
unabashedly for looks and sex appeal,
and there's not enough spots for quote diversity

118
00:09:09.240 --> 00:09:11.399
of body type. And I don't
think that's I don't think that's unfair.

119
00:09:11.440 --> 00:09:13.480
I'm not even trying to be critical. I'm just trying to be like,

120
00:09:13.639 --> 00:09:18.159
state the obvious. Does that seem
sort of fair? Why there wasn't room

121
00:09:18.200 --> 00:09:20.080
for a lot of different body types, even if you look back at it

122
00:09:20.240 --> 00:09:24.399
and somewhat shamefully and say, hey, they should have worked harder to make

123
00:09:24.480 --> 00:09:28.000
room for other body types. Yeah, sure, I mean yes to both.

124
00:09:28.039 --> 00:09:30.399
I mean yes, that's the reason, but yes, they should have

125
00:09:30.399 --> 00:09:33.159
worked harder. And I think that, you know, the problem is is

126
00:09:33.279 --> 00:09:37.519
that when you have essentially one person
making the decisions, and that one person

127
00:09:37.600 --> 00:09:41.279
treats it like you know, it's
his own personal action figures that he can

128
00:09:41.320 --> 00:09:43.919
play with, and those are the
ones that he wants to play with,

129
00:09:45.000 --> 00:09:46.159
and you know, then you got
to tell them, all right, well,

130
00:09:46.159 --> 00:09:50.120
look, you can only do this
once and you have five minutes.

131
00:09:50.159 --> 00:09:52.039
How are you going to use that
five minutes? Then that's what he's going

132
00:09:52.120 --> 00:09:58.000
to go for. It's it's you
know, look again, it's like we

133
00:09:58.039 --> 00:10:03.600
can look back on how it was. Whatever the reason is, it's it's

134
00:10:03.799 --> 00:10:11.360
good that somebody was the culture as
a whole, was able to change the

135
00:10:11.399 --> 00:10:13.399
way that they thought about it,
even if it's them being forced to do

136
00:10:13.480 --> 00:10:16.799
it and probably going in like you, look, you look at some of

137
00:10:16.840 --> 00:10:22.960
those female wrestlers that are there.
Now, I can guarantee you that there's

138
00:10:22.000 --> 00:10:26.039
no way that Vince is a fan
of them, but you know, maybe

139
00:10:26.080 --> 00:10:31.000
he feels like he's just stepped away
from it and said, hey, look,

140
00:10:31.039 --> 00:10:33.360
if this is what you guys are
going to do, it's your thing.

141
00:10:33.440 --> 00:10:35.519
You do it, and you know
when you bring up a guy,

142
00:10:37.360 --> 00:10:39.759
I'm trying to think of a specific
example that was, you know, maybe

143
00:10:39.840 --> 00:10:46.519
seen as a big star in NXT
or elsewhere, and then when he was

144
00:10:46.600 --> 00:10:48.720
in charge of him, it kind
of wasn't the same thing, maybe like

145
00:10:48.720 --> 00:10:52.759
a Finn Balord or even on the
opposite end with like an Elias where he

146
00:10:52.799 --> 00:10:54.759
goes, well, that's the kind
of guy I want to get behind,

147
00:10:54.799 --> 00:10:58.039
where someone like Triple H didn't.
I think that he's just kind of stepping

148
00:10:58.080 --> 00:11:01.759
away from it. Is my guests
and saying, hey, you know,

149
00:11:01.240 --> 00:11:05.480
do what you want and I may
not like it, but you seem to

150
00:11:05.519 --> 00:11:07.279
be you know, you're in charge
of it. You make it work.

151
00:11:09.679 --> 00:11:11.840
Let's set the table here, introduce
ourselves. I got to follow up on

152
00:11:11.840 --> 00:11:13.600
a couple of things you just said
too after this. But this is the

153
00:11:13.600 --> 00:11:20.159
Wade Keller Pro Wrestling Podcast Interview Friday
for November two, twenty eighteen, and

154
00:11:20.279 --> 00:11:24.440
my guest on today's program is John
pier Marini. He is a former WWE

155
00:11:24.440 --> 00:11:31.399
creative team member and as he mentioned, still active in Hollywood and Los Angeles

156
00:11:31.440 --> 00:11:37.720
and entertainment. He's been a guest
on my shows my podcast over the years.

157
00:11:37.679 --> 00:11:41.919
Many times we ran a multi hour
interview and transcript for VP members.

158
00:11:43.120 --> 00:11:46.840
In our initial interview, which that
must have been like twenty eleven or twenty

159
00:11:46.840 --> 00:11:52.720
twelve, John kind of reintroduce our
newer listeners to to your background at WWE,

160
00:11:52.799 --> 00:11:56.000
what you're doing now, and yeah, anything else you want them to

161
00:11:56.080 --> 00:12:03.159
know. What I want them to
know what I worked at. Yeah,

162
00:12:03.279 --> 00:12:07.879
I worked at WW from two thousand
and early two thousand and nine to basically

163
00:12:07.919 --> 00:12:13.240
the end of twenty ten. Lifelong
wrestling fan. Kind of like my dream

164
00:12:13.320 --> 00:12:16.639
was to become a professional wrestler.
I never grew into that, and it

165
00:12:16.720 --> 00:12:20.679
was much different back then in you
know, how you would find a way

166
00:12:20.720 --> 00:12:24.600
to get into the business, And
I started. I worked at MTV and

167
00:12:24.639 --> 00:12:31.559
then found that WW was hiring writers
and made my way into into their world

168
00:12:31.919 --> 00:12:37.440
with that and stayed there for a
couple of years. Found that there.

169
00:12:37.600 --> 00:12:41.639
I mean, look, they can
just go back and listen to our talks

170
00:12:41.679 --> 00:12:45.080
that we've done for the hours that
we've put into it and they can learn

171
00:12:45.240 --> 00:12:50.360
all about why I left. But
yeah, that's that's that's really it as

172
00:12:50.399 --> 00:12:54.799
far as wrestling goes. And what
have you been doing since I? When

173
00:12:54.840 --> 00:13:01.639
I left WWE, I moved back
to LA and have been on America's Got

174
00:13:01.639 --> 00:13:05.679
Talent really since then, kind of
NonStop. It's usually in television you you

175
00:13:05.759 --> 00:13:09.720
work, you know, project to
project to project. But I've been lucky

176
00:13:09.799 --> 00:13:13.919
enough that this show has been so
successful that I've been able to stay on

177
00:13:13.960 --> 00:13:18.919
this NonStop pretty much since that time. I think there was there was a

178
00:13:18.960 --> 00:13:22.080
break in which I wasn't doing it
before I I there was a break where

179
00:13:22.120 --> 00:13:26.799
I was I was not doing much
in television, and then came back to

180
00:13:26.840 --> 00:13:31.080
do this show. So it's been
I've been fortunate, and it's always fun

181
00:13:31.120 --> 00:13:37.399
when we get our reports of when
we like our social media report where we're

182
00:13:37.440 --> 00:13:39.559
going head to head with I think
at the time, no it is still

183
00:13:39.600 --> 00:13:45.039
now like with SmackDown, and they
compare our numbers to them, So I'm

184
00:13:45.080 --> 00:13:48.840
sure WWC is that as well,
and they're probably it's probably a subject of

185
00:13:48.840 --> 00:13:52.639
conversation there now. Are you still
creating characters, writing storylines and helping decide

186
00:13:52.679 --> 00:14:00.720
on outcomes? Definitely not deciding the
outcomes now, but definitely it's been fun

187
00:14:00.919 --> 00:14:05.600
to have a creative hand in,
you know, meeting some very talented people

188
00:14:05.639 --> 00:14:07.720
and helping them established. I mean, if you've seen the show, you

189
00:14:07.759 --> 00:14:13.480
see it's it's kind of very similar
to w W, where we establish who

190
00:14:13.480 --> 00:14:18.360
they are as a person, sometimes
as a character, get you to want

191
00:14:18.399 --> 00:14:22.399
to root for them and then or
not, and then see them perform and

192
00:14:22.440 --> 00:14:26.840
then it's up to you to decide
if they move forward or not. It's

193
00:14:26.879 --> 00:14:33.080
a lot like how WW claims that
they decide who gets a push, but

194
00:14:33.159 --> 00:14:35.279
we're actually doing it. Yeah,
no, that's I thought I was almost

195
00:14:35.279 --> 00:14:39.000
getting a big scoop player, but
I almost tricked you into it. No,

196
00:14:39.039 --> 00:14:41.879
yeah, no, no, no, it's one legit. Yes,

197
00:14:41.960 --> 00:14:48.600
yes, that's what promoters said for
decades to John, Someday you're gonna no

198
00:14:48.639 --> 00:14:50.799
never mind, No, no,
there's definitely nothing to say there, I

199
00:14:50.799 --> 00:14:54.120
promise, No, I don't you
you've heard me on your show before.

200
00:14:54.159 --> 00:14:56.679
If there is something to say,
i'd say it. Yes, definitely.

201
00:14:58.440 --> 00:15:01.759
Thanks, So let's to our podcast. Did you know? We also have

202
00:15:01.799 --> 00:15:05.639
a website, pw toorch dot com
daily news updates, editorials, and my

203
00:15:05.679 --> 00:15:09.960
live TV coverage covering Raw, Dynamite
and SmackDown, and my live pay per

204
00:15:11.039 --> 00:15:15.279
view coverage for WWE and AEW.
Create a tab or bookmark make it a

205
00:15:15.360 --> 00:15:18.720
daily stop. Visit us throughout the
day every day to keep up on breaking

206
00:15:18.759 --> 00:15:28.559
news and more. That's pw torch
dot com talk about the women's division and

207
00:15:28.600 --> 00:15:33.240
how different it was then versus now
in the evolution era. The culture of

208
00:15:33.360 --> 00:15:37.639
WWE at the time, and you
know, it's it's sort of eye candy,

209
00:15:37.639 --> 00:15:43.600
it's what Vince wants. How we're
did it seem even just back then,

210
00:15:43.639 --> 00:15:46.440
which isn't that long ago unless you're
twelve, then it seems like forever

211
00:15:46.440 --> 00:15:50.879
ago, but it's not that long
ago. We're we're Was it just open

212
00:15:52.320 --> 00:15:58.200
objectification of women on almost an official
level, not having drinks afterwards, but

213
00:15:58.360 --> 00:16:02.919
like, uh, you know,
the promoters or executives, like when a

214
00:16:02.960 --> 00:16:06.000
woman would go out to the ring
or walk by and her her ring outfit,

215
00:16:06.120 --> 00:16:10.279
Like was it just sort of like
the culture was from on air all

216
00:16:10.320 --> 00:16:12.799
the way to behind the scenes objectifying
or was there a level of hey,

217
00:16:12.879 --> 00:16:17.840
we know why we're here, but
we're growing ups and there are and everybody

218
00:16:17.840 --> 00:16:23.159
here are equal professionals. M I
mean, I guess it depends where those

219
00:16:23.200 --> 00:16:30.600
conversations were happening. I know in
the creative room that you know, I

220
00:16:30.639 --> 00:16:33.799
remember having conversations. I think he's
still there, right, Ryan Ward,

221
00:16:34.759 --> 00:16:41.159
I believe he worked on NXT and
yeah, he was the raw what was

222
00:16:41.200 --> 00:16:48.720
it like the assistant for raws me
Brian Gowurtz, Dave Kapoor and Ryan writing

223
00:16:48.799 --> 00:16:52.799
Raw And you know we used to
have conversations all the time. We were

224
00:16:52.799 --> 00:16:57.919
big MMA fans. And I remember
Gina Carano was doing something for I can't

225
00:16:57.960 --> 00:17:03.679
remember if it was Strike Force was
the organization, but they had she was

226
00:17:03.759 --> 00:17:10.799
the headline act against maybe cyborg in
and again I'm totally trying to remember this

227
00:17:10.880 --> 00:17:15.559
right now, like San Jose and
they sold out the arena and they were

228
00:17:15.559 --> 00:17:18.359
the main event, And I remember
having a conversation with Ryan and being like,

229
00:17:18.640 --> 00:17:22.440
I just I mean, it just
proves that if the right person is

230
00:17:22.480 --> 00:17:25.519
there, and if the right story
is there, and if you get interest,

231
00:17:25.559 --> 00:17:27.720
there's no reason why we can't have
our women doing the same thing.

232
00:17:29.839 --> 00:17:32.480
And you know a lot of people
agreed with that, but you know,

233
00:17:32.559 --> 00:17:38.759
it's it's with anything when you hit
that certain part of the road where a

234
00:17:38.839 --> 00:17:42.440
decision has to be made and there
is someone that can that can stop that,

235
00:17:42.640 --> 00:17:48.119
then that's kind of where it ended. I honestly, I don't if

236
00:17:48.119 --> 00:17:55.240
there was. I don't recall any
specific comments made about objectifying women, so

237
00:17:55.559 --> 00:18:00.200
I can't really I can't really speak
on that per se. But the the

238
00:18:00.960 --> 00:18:03.839
philosophy and the culture definitely was that
it was about sex appeal. But I

239
00:18:03.880 --> 00:18:07.640
don't think that anybody really hid that. I don't think Vinci Mann was ever

240
00:18:08.119 --> 00:18:11.519
hiding that at the time, but
also that it was a time when you

241
00:18:11.519 --> 00:18:15.119
could say that and it's not like
too many people were gonna get on you

242
00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:18.839
for it, not saying it was
right, But I don't think it was

243
00:18:18.920 --> 00:18:22.920
hidden that that's the way he saw
the women. Yeah. Yeah, so

244
00:18:23.319 --> 00:18:30.920
that Vince McMahon back then versus what's
happening now. Does this seem like with

245
00:18:30.000 --> 00:18:34.960
Evolution on Sunday and what's going on
with Ron Rolsey, that it's purely economic,

246
00:18:36.720 --> 00:18:40.079
Hey there's an opportunity here, or
is there some semblance of hey,

247
00:18:40.119 --> 00:18:47.359
we're a maturing corporation and okay,
yeah, I mean, I'm not there

248
00:18:47.400 --> 00:18:49.480
to tell you if that's the case, but I think sometimes you just have

249
00:18:49.559 --> 00:18:52.400
to look at the writing on the
wall, and you have to look at

250
00:18:52.400 --> 00:18:55.640
the timing. I mean, it's
they want to say that, you know,

251
00:18:56.839 --> 00:18:59.720
whatever the promo was at Stephanie Cutt, it's all about timing, or

252
00:18:59.759 --> 00:19:03.000
it's about kicking down doors in this
that It's like WW did none of that.

253
00:19:03.240 --> 00:19:08.200
This was all happening outside of their
world and then they saw a way

254
00:19:08.240 --> 00:19:12.000
to capitalize on it. It's it's
how they do all of their business.

255
00:19:12.279 --> 00:19:18.640
So for them to take any credit
for it is them lying to themselves.

256
00:19:18.680 --> 00:19:23.160
And maybe they do feel like they
should get credit for it, and maybe

257
00:19:23.160 --> 00:19:27.480
because they're the ones that are out
there trying as hard as they can to

258
00:19:27.480 --> 00:19:32.720
to be you know, out there
and pushing that like they do with everything

259
00:19:32.759 --> 00:19:34.640
else that, you know, charity
and all that. It's there's there's probably

260
00:19:34.680 --> 00:19:38.359
people that do a lot more for
some of the things that they're involved with,

261
00:19:38.920 --> 00:19:41.920
but they are not pushing it.
But WW will get credit for it

262
00:19:41.960 --> 00:19:45.799
because they're the ones every week that
are saying, hey, look what we're

263
00:19:45.839 --> 00:19:52.000
doing. And so I think that, yeah, I mean it's it's all

264
00:19:52.039 --> 00:19:55.799
because of they They saw an opportunity
and they're capitalizing on it. I don't

265
00:19:55.799 --> 00:19:57.559
think there was ever a conversation.
Don't get me wrong, I'm sure that

266
00:19:57.640 --> 00:20:03.079
someone like Stephanie or maybe even Triple
H. It's no different than when we

267
00:20:03.079 --> 00:20:06.759
were there and some of us were
pushing for the women there. You just

268
00:20:06.839 --> 00:20:10.480
had to get that right person there
to do it. But you know,

269
00:20:10.559 --> 00:20:14.440
I think that even if Stephanie was
a big proponent for it all this time,

270
00:20:14.599 --> 00:20:18.279
or Triple H was, they weren't. They weren't. They were giving

271
00:20:18.359 --> 00:20:22.559
up the fight against Vince. And
I think at some point Vince saw it

272
00:20:22.599 --> 00:20:25.599
as, hey, look at all
these things happening. I'm sure he had

273
00:20:25.680 --> 00:20:29.000
no idea who Ronda Rousey even was
at the time she was doing all that,

274
00:20:30.519 --> 00:20:33.880
and I think that he finally saw
that as a way too, and

275
00:20:33.920 --> 00:20:36.160
maybe it was the way they convinced
him, but a way for us to

276
00:20:36.200 --> 00:20:37.440
make money, and he finally said, okay, let's go with it.

277
00:20:38.119 --> 00:20:41.279
And and to be honest, it
was sort of slow. It's not like

278
00:20:41.359 --> 00:20:47.440
they just went all in and said, hey, we're we're giving them,

279
00:20:47.839 --> 00:20:49.319
you know, a pay per view
and we're going to have them headline.

280
00:20:49.359 --> 00:20:52.799
I mean, it was all very
very slow. It was like they definitely

281
00:20:52.839 --> 00:20:56.759
tested it before they went all in
on it. So let's go to your

282
00:20:56.759 --> 00:21:03.640
time there with some of the women
who were around and being featured on television

283
00:21:03.680 --> 00:21:07.359
at that time, and if there's
any anecdotes about storylines and how they were

284
00:21:07.359 --> 00:21:11.839
presented or how you remember them being
framed behind the scenes, and what the

285
00:21:11.839 --> 00:21:17.160
goal was because we had the Bellas
Kelly, Kelly, Maurice was active back

286
00:21:17.160 --> 00:21:19.799
then, Beth Phoenix, Jillian Hall, who else comes to mind as kind

287
00:21:19.839 --> 00:21:25.839
of the priorities for Vincient Man at
that time, about eight or so years

288
00:21:25.880 --> 00:21:32.000
ago. Gosh, I don't really
think there was a priority as far as

289
00:21:32.839 --> 00:21:34.680
a female wrestler. I think it
was just, you know, whoever had

290
00:21:34.720 --> 00:21:40.359
the title had a very small storyline, and I do remember working a lot

291
00:21:41.079 --> 00:21:45.119
with the girls and pushing to not
just have them go out there and have

292
00:21:45.200 --> 00:21:48.279
a match, but you know,
build a little bit of a story there

293
00:21:48.440 --> 00:21:52.599
was. There wasn't like a long
leash on what we were given. I

294
00:21:52.640 --> 00:21:56.839
do remember working with like Maurice,
I can't remember. I think Eve was

295
00:21:56.920 --> 00:22:00.480
the Divas Champion at the time,
and we got to do like a little

296
00:22:00.720 --> 00:22:07.319
storyline with them. I remember,
let's see who else was there. I'm

297
00:22:07.319 --> 00:22:11.680
trying to remember who the Champions were. When I started working that with them,

298
00:22:11.680 --> 00:22:15.119
it was like Eve Maurice. I
remember then we started doing the thing

299
00:22:15.200 --> 00:22:22.839
with Daniel Brian and the Bella Twins, and then Michelle McCool and Layla were

300
00:22:22.839 --> 00:22:26.240
on SmackDown. But I started to
work with them quite a bit and then

301
00:22:29.119 --> 00:22:36.480
started to write there their storylines,
and then that became I wouldn't necessarily call

302
00:22:36.480 --> 00:22:40.920
it like a priority, but it
was definitely like the infamous you know,

303
00:22:41.000 --> 00:22:42.680
Vincric Mann lines is like, you
know, what is John Cena doing this

304
00:22:42.759 --> 00:22:47.160
show? And it got to you
know, what what are they doing?

305
00:22:47.200 --> 00:22:51.759
Because I think he was highly entertained
by those girls. So I wouldn't call

306
00:22:51.839 --> 00:22:55.039
them a priority, but I would
say that that was someone that he did.

307
00:22:56.000 --> 00:23:00.480
It's tough because I want to say
focus on but he kind of let

308
00:23:00.599 --> 00:23:03.839
us just do what we wanted to
do. And you know, I don't

309
00:23:03.880 --> 00:23:07.440
know if it was because he liked
what we were doing or if it was

310
00:23:07.480 --> 00:23:11.519
because he felt like, you know, that's Undertaker's wife and you know,

311
00:23:11.559 --> 00:23:15.200
I want to make him happy.
But that was never said or implied.

312
00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:18.799
Like I was never pulled aside by
Vincric Mann and saying like, hey,

313
00:23:18.839 --> 00:23:22.279
that's Undertaker's wife, so we've got
to do stuff. But I mean,

314
00:23:22.319 --> 00:23:26.920
like a similar thing happened with working
with Miz, where we used to have

315
00:23:26.960 --> 00:23:30.000
to go in and get promos approved, and one day we walked in he

316
00:23:30.000 --> 00:23:33.839
said, I trust him, So
let's you don't have to come to me

317
00:23:33.960 --> 00:23:41.519
with miss promos anymore. So it's
tough because like I don't I feel like

318
00:23:41.559 --> 00:23:44.920
sometimes I can't answer your question because
there isn't an answer. But it's it.

319
00:23:45.079 --> 00:23:48.440
That's the closest thing I can think
of to you know, being a

320
00:23:48.480 --> 00:23:52.440
priority or or kind of giving them
the time. I think again, slowly,

321
00:23:52.480 --> 00:23:56.359
it was you would. It was
almost like he gave like it was

322
00:23:56.400 --> 00:23:57.160
a handout to you. You know, it's like, hey, well we

323
00:23:57.200 --> 00:24:00.960
want Maurice came to me and she
had this idea for you know, doing

324
00:24:02.000 --> 00:24:04.519
something backstage with Eve, and it's
like it's like, yeah, okay,

325
00:24:04.680 --> 00:24:07.039
go ahead do it. It's not
like we were able to do it every

326
00:24:07.039 --> 00:24:11.279
single week and build to this like
epic storyline between them. It's like you

327
00:24:11.319 --> 00:24:12.640
take what you can get, you
make the most out of it in those

328
00:24:12.720 --> 00:24:15.880
like two minutes, and then you
hope that it's enough to draw interest.

329
00:24:17.640 --> 00:24:19.160
But a lot of times it was
like we had to work the girls into,

330
00:24:19.200 --> 00:24:26.720
like working Maurice into the Ted Dbass
storyline. There was someone else.

331
00:24:26.799 --> 00:24:29.200
I can't remember, it's so far. I mean, if I had a

332
00:24:29.279 --> 00:24:30.960
roster in front of me from that
time, I could probably be better at

333
00:24:30.960 --> 00:24:33.839
it. But you know, it
was like you had to find you found

334
00:24:33.880 --> 00:24:37.319
ways for them to get in.
But it wasn't always the way that you're

335
00:24:37.359 --> 00:24:40.160
seeing it now, where it's just
like, hey, they're great, let's

336
00:24:40.160 --> 00:24:42.680
put them in the ring, give
them ten minutes and they'll be happier.

337
00:24:42.759 --> 00:24:49.480
Let's create a compelling storyline to build
too, you know Ronda in Nikki Bella

338
00:24:49.599 --> 00:24:55.359
in six weeks. Yeah, there's
a thing where it's like we always had.

339
00:24:56.359 --> 00:25:00.039
I'm sure you've heard other writers talk
about it. We had like grids

340
00:25:00.079 --> 00:25:03.039
where you would lay out you'd have
a storyline that you would build to each

341
00:25:03.039 --> 00:25:04.160
pay per view, and it was
done on a grid, so you'd have

342
00:25:04.240 --> 00:25:07.759
like four sections for the four weeks
to get to that pay per view.

343
00:25:08.759 --> 00:25:12.720
While some of us were writing our
own for people that would it would never

344
00:25:12.759 --> 00:25:19.000
actually be seen by Vincricman. Like
there was never like the Vincric Man saying

345
00:25:19.039 --> 00:25:22.920
like I need you guys to or
Brian gowert saying like I need you to

346
00:25:22.960 --> 00:25:26.319
work on a grid for Eve Torres
Like no, that didn't happen, or

347
00:25:26.359 --> 00:25:30.839
Kelly, Kelly, but you know, it doesn't mean that there weren't people

348
00:25:30.960 --> 00:25:34.119
there trying to make something like that
for them and the girls too. The

349
00:25:34.160 --> 00:25:37.359
girls were very like the girls were
very creative. They had a lot of

350
00:25:37.359 --> 00:25:48.000
great ideas. It's just a lot
of times the time wasn't dedicated to them.

351
00:25:48.240 --> 00:25:52.599
In twenty twelve, NXT transitioned into
the developmental system and ultimately the brand

352
00:25:52.640 --> 00:25:59.000
you see today. On the Torch
VIP podcast NXT Eight Years Back, we'll

353
00:25:59.039 --> 00:26:03.160
be taking a week look at this
page in NXT's early history. Join Kelly

354
00:26:03.160 --> 00:26:07.599
Wells and me Tom Stout from p
WT Talks NXT every Saturday as we go

355
00:26:07.720 --> 00:26:11.559
eight years back to the day to
track NXT's rising talents and why they did

356
00:26:11.720 --> 00:26:22.160
or didn't work out exclusively for PW
Torch VIP members. Did you sense the

357
00:26:22.519 --> 00:26:27.559
women at that point were resigned to
what their role was or fighting for more

358
00:26:29.400 --> 00:26:36.400
or motivated to push for more and
take little steps forward? Like what was

359
00:26:36.480 --> 00:26:40.440
kind of the demeanor in the attitude
I think it's I think it's the same

360
00:26:40.480 --> 00:26:44.319
with men. It's like there's certain
people who pushed, and then there certain

361
00:26:44.319 --> 00:26:48.799
people who accepted, and then there
were certain people who like were ridiculous with

362
00:26:48.880 --> 00:26:52.039
some of the things that they weren't
on TV. So then they'd pitch a

363
00:26:52.079 --> 00:26:55.519
story, but the story would be
like them going over triple H or something,

364
00:26:55.519 --> 00:26:57.720
and it's like you got to be
realistic. I think it was the

365
00:26:57.759 --> 00:27:02.400
same with the girls. You had
the girls that were fighting. Those people

366
00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:08.839
were like Maurice, Eve, Michelle, Layla, Natalia, Beth Phoenix.

367
00:27:08.960 --> 00:27:11.920
They fought, you know, so
like when you see them on there,

368
00:27:12.160 --> 00:27:15.240
like on Evolution and Beth talking about
how much that means to her, like,

369
00:27:15.519 --> 00:27:18.319
yeah, she fought for that,
Like I can see why that means

370
00:27:18.359 --> 00:27:22.480
so much to her. There were
girls that never said anything to you,

371
00:27:22.559 --> 00:27:26.200
and it was just they're not on
the show, and they're just not on

372
00:27:26.240 --> 00:27:30.720
the show, and you see them
in catering and they're just they've accepted that

373
00:27:30.720 --> 00:27:36.759
that's what it is. But yeah, it's there. There was There was

374
00:27:36.799 --> 00:27:38.200
a lot of everything. I wouldn't
necessarily say, and I don't know what

375
00:27:38.240 --> 00:27:41.720
happened inside the girl's locker room,
but it wasn't like all of them banded

376
00:27:41.759 --> 00:27:45.319
together to say we're gonna make this
work and we're fighting for this. There

377
00:27:45.359 --> 00:27:49.640
were the girls that fought for and
the ones that did. To the extent

378
00:27:49.720 --> 00:27:53.640
that they were able to what they
were able to be given, they did

379
00:27:53.759 --> 00:28:00.839
fight and earn those spots. There
was some comments on Evolution about men being

380
00:28:00.920 --> 00:28:03.519
advocates for this also. I can't
remember if it was Beth Phoenix who said

381
00:28:03.519 --> 00:28:07.640
it on commentary or or who,
but the idea that hey, there were

382
00:28:07.680 --> 00:28:11.359
men fighting for this too. I
know if that Finley's name was brought up

383
00:28:11.359 --> 00:28:17.519
and others, what can you pinpoint
instances were men who had some powersome influence

384
00:28:17.559 --> 00:28:23.759
at least a voice also advocated for
more with the women. It depends on

385
00:28:23.839 --> 00:28:27.599
if they had an idea. I
don't remember anyone ever like standing up and

386
00:28:27.640 --> 00:28:32.640
going, we need to give these
women more. You know, if someone

387
00:28:32.799 --> 00:28:37.920
Brian or another writer or myself or
anyone had an agent even too, like

388
00:28:37.000 --> 00:28:41.240
yeah, like fit he worked with
the girls, so you know there were

389
00:28:41.279 --> 00:28:42.799
times where he'd go like, man, you know, these these girls can

390
00:28:42.839 --> 00:28:45.559
go. Let's give them. Let's
give them ten minutes, Let's give them

391
00:28:45.599 --> 00:28:51.519
fifteen minutes, and or you know, Brian having an idea or a writer

392
00:28:51.640 --> 00:28:53.559
having ideas speaking up and going like, hey, I think this would be

393
00:28:55.119 --> 00:29:00.240
you know, great for them,
like exhaustedly we there were people there that

394
00:29:00.559 --> 00:29:07.799
pitched good stories for those girls that
were ignored. So yeah, I mean

395
00:29:07.839 --> 00:29:11.839
it's individually, Yes, I don't
think that I ever heard anyone knock on

396
00:29:11.960 --> 00:29:15.920
Vince's door, walk in and go
we're not doing this right. You know,

397
00:29:15.960 --> 00:29:18.880
we need to we need to give
them more and we need to focus

398
00:29:18.920 --> 00:29:22.000
more on them. It might have
happened, but I don't think it was

399
00:29:22.039 --> 00:29:23.359
done on that large of a scale. I think it was just more like,

400
00:29:23.680 --> 00:29:26.920
hey, these girls were tearing it
up at the house show, like

401
00:29:26.000 --> 00:29:30.160
let's give them fifteen minutes on Monday
night. Raw. Gail Kim was around

402
00:29:30.200 --> 00:29:36.799
when you were there. Is she
somebody who didn't fit Vince's or Kevin Dunn

403
00:29:37.000 --> 00:29:41.240
or Michael Hay whoever, you know, like the Maurice Kelly Kelly type.

404
00:29:41.680 --> 00:29:45.440
Did you, if you have any
memory of it, did you sense that

405
00:29:45.680 --> 00:29:48.680
here's Gail came coming in with a
claim from TNA. Her matches with Awesome

406
00:29:48.680 --> 00:29:52.160
Calm were heralded and deservedly so,
and then she came in and people were

407
00:29:52.200 --> 00:29:59.000
shocked that Vince didn't quite seem to
get behind her and market her in the

408
00:29:59.000 --> 00:30:03.960
way that TNA sixty at on their
platform, which was smaller. I think

409
00:30:03.079 --> 00:30:07.920
I remember the way I remember it
is that there was already she was there

410
00:30:08.000 --> 00:30:11.400
prior to she she was there and
then went to TNA and then came back

411
00:30:11.480 --> 00:30:14.640
right and then she came back when
I was there. Is that the right

412
00:30:14.680 --> 00:30:21.039
timetable? I actually don't remember what
I think, So, yeah, I

413
00:30:21.079 --> 00:30:22.839
know she did go back to TNA. If I'm wrong, I apologize,

414
00:30:22.839 --> 00:30:26.599
But this is the way I remember
it in my head now, is that

415
00:30:26.079 --> 00:30:30.559
I already remembered going into WW that
they that Vince had soured on her in

416
00:30:30.640 --> 00:30:36.279
her first run there, and I
remember it being something about they didn't,

417
00:30:37.240 --> 00:30:41.799
uh, he didn't like the character, the vignettes or something. And then,

418
00:30:41.799 --> 00:30:45.599
like I think you've heard so many
times from people that like that,

419
00:30:45.680 --> 00:30:48.640
you can lose him. It could
be the smallest thing, the way someone

420
00:30:48.680 --> 00:30:52.119
looks at him, the way you
know, someone throws a punch, And

421
00:30:52.160 --> 00:30:55.640
in her case, it could have
just been those vignettes and that's it.

422
00:30:55.680 --> 00:30:59.119
I'm done. I'm sour on that
person. So when she came back.

423
00:30:59.200 --> 00:31:03.200
I don't think I have really expected
him to be fully behind her. But

424
00:31:03.279 --> 00:31:07.160
also what she brought to the table
wasn't something that Vince was looking for in

425
00:31:07.200 --> 00:31:10.680
a female at the time. I'm
not saying she wasn't attractive. She was

426
00:31:10.759 --> 00:31:15.440
extremely attractive, and I'm not even
saying she wasn't as attractive as the other

427
00:31:15.480 --> 00:31:18.759
girls there. I'm just saying that
what she what I think that the fans

428
00:31:18.799 --> 00:31:22.559
were really into, and like even
what you brought up was that the matches

429
00:31:22.599 --> 00:31:25.640
she had with Awesome Kong and how
good she was in the ring. I

430
00:31:25.680 --> 00:31:29.039
don't think that was of value to
Vince. So I don't think that he

431
00:31:29.079 --> 00:31:30.920
saw her and said, man,
I got to put her on TV and

432
00:31:30.960 --> 00:31:33.920
have these great matches. I think
it would have worked better if she was

433
00:31:33.920 --> 00:31:40.359
there now. Oh yeah, can
you imagine if instead of in I think

434
00:31:40.400 --> 00:31:41.880
she first went there in the mid
two thousands and then yeah, she had

435
00:31:41.880 --> 00:31:47.279
to break and then she came back
for quite a while, but never kind

436
00:31:47.279 --> 00:31:51.720
of was that centerpiece. But people
don't look back at her and say,

437
00:31:51.720 --> 00:31:55.400
well, she was a trailblazer in
WWE. But I think people look at

438
00:31:55.440 --> 00:31:59.079
Kim and Kong and what they did
in TNA and say that infancy people's eyes

439
00:31:59.119 --> 00:32:01.200
to how a crowd can act,
how a feud with the women can seem

440
00:32:01.240 --> 00:32:06.319
like a comain event and not a
side show or a warm up or just

441
00:32:06.359 --> 00:32:12.119
there for sex appeal and her.
But also I think the frustration that people

442
00:32:12.160 --> 00:32:16.920
felt with what she could have been
and what she wasn't might have ignited some

443
00:32:17.039 --> 00:32:22.720
frustration that led to action being taken
that manifested years later in things going being

444
00:32:22.799 --> 00:32:25.759
better, because it was such a
shame that Gail Kim could have meant so

445
00:32:25.839 --> 00:32:30.359
much more if the attitude towards her
wasn't, like you said, Vince McMahon

446
00:32:30.400 --> 00:32:31.519
looks at her and then sees him
and yet and boom, I'm done.

447
00:32:31.519 --> 00:32:36.480
I got to move on other things. Yeah, it's unfortunate, but you

448
00:32:36.519 --> 00:32:39.599
know, I guess it's kind of
like you hear, you know, like

449
00:32:39.839 --> 00:32:46.400
whether it was the guys the Trailblazers
of USC or any the wrestlers even like

450
00:32:46.440 --> 00:32:50.240
before the attitude or it's like man
if I was just around now, But

451
00:32:50.480 --> 00:32:52.359
I mean, it's just it's the
way that it is. I think the

452
00:32:52.400 --> 00:32:55.559
good thing is that maybe she didn't
make the money that she could have made,

453
00:32:55.640 --> 00:33:00.559
but she's looked at fondly by arrest
Link community. That you know,

454
00:33:00.680 --> 00:33:07.079
sometimes depending on what's important to you
down the line will mean more than you

455
00:33:07.079 --> 00:33:09.920
know, cashing a big check,
but also you have to survive, so

456
00:33:10.079 --> 00:33:15.759
that might ultimately be more important to
these people than some. We invite you

457
00:33:15.759 --> 00:33:19.440
to email the show with feedback or
questions or comments. That email address is

458
00:33:19.519 --> 00:33:24.359
Wade Keller Podcast at ptwtorch dot com. That's Wade Keller Podcast at PW torch

459
00:33:24.400 --> 00:33:28.759
dot com. Also welcome your feedback
on Twitter. You can follow us on

460
00:33:28.799 --> 00:33:32.799
Twitter at PW Torch and follow me
at the Wade Keller. That's at PW

461
00:33:32.839 --> 00:33:43.160
Torch and at the Wade Keller.
Let's you mentioned something earlier about Vince McMahon

462
00:33:43.240 --> 00:33:45.759
looking at the Evolution lineup now in
the women's roster, and there's some women

463
00:33:45.759 --> 00:33:50.880
there who you'd he'd even be surprised
eight, nine, ten years ago that

464
00:33:51.000 --> 00:33:53.920
they were featured today, Like,
elaborate on that. Who do you think

465
00:33:53.960 --> 00:33:59.240
of some of the current women are
that he if it were completely his decision

466
00:33:59.240 --> 00:34:01.160
and his inclination, probably wouldn't be
in the spot that they're in. So

467
00:34:01.279 --> 00:34:05.000
I mean, just in looking at
the roster, I mean, even like

468
00:34:05.519 --> 00:34:09.840
if you had, if you had
Ronda Rousei come into WW with zero background,

469
00:34:10.559 --> 00:34:15.000
that's someone that definitely he would not
get behind. I think I'm actually

470
00:34:15.039 --> 00:34:22.679
surprised, you know that he didn't
see a lot more in Becky Lynch prior

471
00:34:22.760 --> 00:34:27.960
to her sort of forcing her way, and especially with this new character really

472
00:34:28.000 --> 00:34:34.800
showing what she has Shana Basler.
But I know he's not necessarily involved with

473
00:34:34.800 --> 00:34:37.280
with her. Let me see,
can you? I guess you can't make

474
00:34:37.320 --> 00:34:42.800
this just the females. What's her
name, Ruby Riot? That's definitely one

475
00:34:42.920 --> 00:34:46.360
that I definitely, I mean,
Osca is still fighting that, I think

476
00:34:46.480 --> 00:34:50.599
right now. I don't know if
it's if it's her look he doesn't get

477
00:34:50.679 --> 00:34:53.000
the English, but that's one I
mean, I mean, I can almost

478
00:34:53.079 --> 00:34:55.400
I'm just looking at him, and
I can give you an argument for all

479
00:34:55.400 --> 00:35:00.360
of them. Bailey. I think
someone like like a Billy Kay as someone

480
00:35:00.400 --> 00:35:07.440
that he's probably would be very,
very into. But that also leads me

481
00:35:07.519 --> 00:35:12.639
to believe that he's sort of not
his hands on with that division as other

482
00:35:12.679 --> 00:35:17.559
people might. Bella as I always
know that he's liked and wanted to find

483
00:35:17.599 --> 00:35:23.639
things for Charlotte fits that mold let
me just try to find ones that would

484
00:35:23.679 --> 00:35:30.159
be different ember Moon. But again, I think as I'm saying some of

485
00:35:30.159 --> 00:35:32.599
these, I do see some of
the influence of him kind of you know,

486
00:35:32.679 --> 00:35:36.800
maybe them going all right, so
we're going to bring in ember Moon

487
00:35:36.880 --> 00:35:39.920
and we'll have her work this with, you know, Ronda, and you

488
00:35:39.960 --> 00:35:44.280
just kind of hear that, you
know, and then Okay, well,

489
00:35:44.320 --> 00:35:49.039
I mean we want to get what
we want to be able to have the

490
00:35:49.039 --> 00:35:53.360
proper time for them, or be
able to give them a storyliner multiple segments,

491
00:35:53.400 --> 00:35:58.039
and so maybe they pull back knowing
that he's not super into someone,

492
00:35:58.079 --> 00:36:01.199
so then they put in the people. Because if I remember correctly, I

493
00:36:01.199 --> 00:36:04.480
remember when they brought in and kind
of said like, hey, we're going

494
00:36:04.559 --> 00:36:07.719
to push this, and it was
like the Four horse Women came up and

495
00:36:07.840 --> 00:36:10.000
it was those four girls, and
it was about like the work rate.

496
00:36:10.079 --> 00:36:15.000
And then slowly I think that like
you started to work in some of that

497
00:36:15.119 --> 00:36:21.360
like Vince McMahon influence, you know, And I think now you're balancing that

498
00:36:21.559 --> 00:36:24.559
as far as when it comes to
what's presented on Raw and SmackDown, And

499
00:36:24.639 --> 00:36:28.599
I think evolution was a different story, but for Raw and SmackDown, I

500
00:36:28.599 --> 00:36:30.480
think you're seeing a little bit of
both. I think you're seeing I'm going

501
00:36:30.559 --> 00:36:35.280
to give you what you want,
you know, bring to me the storylines

502
00:36:35.360 --> 00:36:37.639
or whatever it is that you want
to bring to me. But I think

503
00:36:37.679 --> 00:36:40.679
he still has an influence on who's
getting that push now that I look at

504
00:36:43.039 --> 00:36:49.280
some of the names that are and
aren't. But like Amandy Rose, I

505
00:36:49.280 --> 00:36:52.960
mean she would be. She would
have been a superstar when I was there,

506
00:36:53.159 --> 00:36:55.719
and there's no reason to believe that
she can't. Now. I'm not

507
00:36:55.800 --> 00:37:00.199
taking anything away from her. I
just think that she's definitely not on the

508
00:37:00.280 --> 00:37:05.280
level with in ring style as some
of these other girls that are above her.

509
00:37:05.519 --> 00:37:08.320
But Anaya Jacks even, I mean
I think Anaya Jacks could be.

510
00:37:08.840 --> 00:37:13.320
You hear sometimes when you when you
what was it? It was that girl

511
00:37:13.440 --> 00:37:16.159
Tony Storm, I think, and
everyone was after her match she's a star,

512
00:37:16.800 --> 00:37:19.719
and I mean, hey, maybe
she could be. I don't think

513
00:37:19.760 --> 00:37:25.360
you look at that person you immediately
go superstar. I can see why WWE

514
00:37:25.519 --> 00:37:29.880
is saying that, but I think
I look at like a Naya Jacks and

515
00:37:30.239 --> 00:37:37.199
I say superstar because I think that
if WWE were pushing female empowerment and you

516
00:37:37.239 --> 00:37:39.440
know, don't be a bully.
I mean, there's so much you could

517
00:37:39.519 --> 00:37:45.360
do with her. Number One,
she's a beautiful person, but there was

518
00:37:45.400 --> 00:37:50.320
no reason that she shouldn't have been
the champion and going on Good Morning America

519
00:37:50.360 --> 00:37:52.400
and all of these shows, being
an advocate for some of the things that

520
00:37:53.079 --> 00:37:58.199
she had gone through and to say, hey, look if you go through

521
00:37:58.199 --> 00:38:00.599
that, look at me. I
made it. Ignore those people. I

522
00:38:00.679 --> 00:38:02.679
know they kind of did it with
like her promos and all that, but

523
00:38:02.679 --> 00:38:07.519
that's something that's forgotten. A minute
later, I look at her and I

524
00:38:07.519 --> 00:38:14.280
think she is a star. I
think Natalia has probably been fighting what we're

525
00:38:14.280 --> 00:38:17.800
talking about since before I was there. I feel like we can go through

526
00:38:17.800 --> 00:38:21.719
everyone, but it would take not
one minutes. Yeah, no, no,

527
00:38:21.760 --> 00:38:24.519
it's fat, it's it's it is
I think part of as you kind

528
00:38:24.519 --> 00:38:28.079
of run down those names and the
different things that they could do with them

529
00:38:28.880 --> 00:38:30.119
and what they are doing with them, but were the potential list for other

530
00:38:30.159 --> 00:38:37.519
things. It does illustrate that having
a full women's division, not six or

531
00:38:37.559 --> 00:38:42.800
eight, but a full division of
women, that there is room for diversity

532
00:38:42.840 --> 00:38:46.719
now and there's so many different stories
that can be told. You know,

533
00:38:46.840 --> 00:38:50.840
Nya Jacks and they are telling the
stories, you know, Rona RAUSEI the

534
00:38:51.519 --> 00:38:54.320
what the story that they're telling with
Becky Lynch, even if it seems like

535
00:38:54.320 --> 00:38:58.440
they're going up against a headwind trying
to try really hard to get you know,

536
00:38:58.480 --> 00:39:00.440
with the machinery to get fans to
boo Becky and the fans keep cheering

537
00:39:00.519 --> 00:39:06.760
or they're there. That's a fully
invested storyline. So they are doing a

538
00:39:06.800 --> 00:39:08.480
lot of storylines with different women.
They did a lot with Sasha and Bailey

539
00:39:08.559 --> 00:39:13.480
for a while and on and on. You do you kind of look at

540
00:39:13.480 --> 00:39:19.559
what's happening now and the diversity of
personalities, body types, looks, talent,

541
00:39:19.679 --> 00:39:22.679
experience everything and kind of think that
would have been fun to write for

542
00:39:24.159 --> 00:39:29.119
Absolutely, yeah, I mean I
think that just seeing the talent. I

543
00:39:29.119 --> 00:39:31.360
mean, look, in the end, this is sort of like a tired

544
00:39:31.400 --> 00:39:35.119
statement. But in the end,
you have to build to a wrestling match,

545
00:39:35.559 --> 00:39:38.679
So you look at what to use
women. That's not that that should

546
00:39:38.679 --> 00:39:43.880
be the sense of like yeah,
right, but it's tired and that that's

547
00:39:43.880 --> 00:39:45.280
sort of what like everyone goes to. It's like, look, in the

548
00:39:45.360 --> 00:39:49.280
end, you've got to get to
a wrestling match. I'm not saying anything

549
00:39:49.320 --> 00:39:52.800
that hasn't been said a million times, but you look at what these women

550
00:39:52.920 --> 00:39:58.280
can provide in that payoff, and
you could write so many good things.

551
00:39:58.360 --> 00:40:01.239
I mean, you know, some
of the things that bug me a little

552
00:40:01.239 --> 00:40:06.960
bit is like when you watch Tony
Storm, like those facial expressions. I

553
00:40:06.960 --> 00:40:09.400
mean, maybe I'm in the minority, but it takes away from what I'm

554
00:40:09.440 --> 00:40:15.159
watching because it does look like someone
is overdoing it or overacting, and it's

555
00:40:15.199 --> 00:40:19.199
like, just pull that back a
little bit. But she has she had

556
00:40:19.280 --> 00:40:22.000
a great match. I haven't seen
too many of hers, but that one

557
00:40:22.079 --> 00:40:23.679
was great. But yeah, I
just think and also too, like the

558
00:40:23.719 --> 00:40:30.480
diversity of what they have on the
roster makes for telling good stories. You

559
00:40:30.519 --> 00:40:35.519
know. It's like you shouldn't have
all the same thing because you can't create

560
00:40:35.559 --> 00:40:39.039
different personalities out of the same person, the same guy, the same girl.

561
00:40:39.400 --> 00:40:44.119
So God, it's like, there's
so much you could do with these

562
00:40:44.199 --> 00:40:45.480
with these women, I think it
would be great. I think the one

563
00:40:45.480 --> 00:40:50.639
thing that they're missing on Ronda,
to kind of just give an example,

564
00:40:50.800 --> 00:40:55.280
is you know, I know it's
I know it's different in ww and with

565
00:40:55.280 --> 00:41:00.000
with wrestling, but it's like,
to me, what made her and what

566
00:41:00.679 --> 00:41:05.960
you know you can use Brock both
in WW and UFC. You can use

567
00:41:06.039 --> 00:41:10.639
Chuck Liddell in UFC WWE with you
know, for a while braun Stroman,

568
00:41:10.800 --> 00:41:15.679
it was you tuned in to see
what they were going to do because they

569
00:41:15.719 --> 00:41:20.519
were doing something different, whether that's
for you for Ronda Rousey and UFC,

570
00:41:20.800 --> 00:41:23.559
they tuned in because they wanted to
see her knock someone out and how quick

571
00:41:23.599 --> 00:41:29.159
it would be, or not so
much for her knocking someone out but winning

572
00:41:29.199 --> 00:41:30.880
a match, or is this finally
the girl that's going to be here.

573
00:41:30.920 --> 00:41:35.360
For braunz Stroman, it was like
that was the guy, who what is

574
00:41:35.400 --> 00:41:37.880
he going to do this week?
Same with stone Cold. You know,

575
00:41:37.920 --> 00:41:42.760
I don't think too many people tuned
in to see how great of a match

576
00:41:42.800 --> 00:41:45.039
he was going to have, but
it was what is he going to do?

577
00:41:45.079 --> 00:41:47.119
Brock Lesner and WW, I think
they're missing that with her where it's

578
00:41:47.159 --> 00:41:52.639
like the appeal for her is that
she should be coming in and not so

579
00:41:52.760 --> 00:41:59.400
much being so much better than some
of their top women, but I think

580
00:41:59.440 --> 00:42:01.960
she should be running through some of
these people and and and bring in some

581
00:42:02.039 --> 00:42:07.119
of that appeal that she had in
UFC, and then when you finally have

582
00:42:07.280 --> 00:42:09.440
someone who can hold their own.
You're building other people now, I mean

583
00:42:09.440 --> 00:42:15.480
if you would have had Nicki have
that match with her. But prior to

584
00:42:15.519 --> 00:42:20.159
that, Ronda was, you know, running through some of these other girls

585
00:42:20.199 --> 00:42:24.559
that you could easily tell the story
I'm looking here and Sonya Deville isn't on

586
00:42:24.599 --> 00:42:28.519
her level yet, so she gets
smashed, you know, But then you

587
00:42:28.599 --> 00:42:31.320
show your you're building Nicki at that
point because Nicki held her own and did

588
00:42:31.320 --> 00:42:36.719
well against her, and now you
have a possible contender. When when Ronda

589
00:42:36.880 --> 00:42:38.920
does get beat I think it means
a lot more. It's going to mean

590
00:42:38.920 --> 00:42:43.639
a lot anyways, but I think
it could mean a lot more if she

591
00:42:43.840 --> 00:42:46.760
was someone that you tuned in to
see. Either is she going to run

592
00:42:46.800 --> 00:42:52.199
through this person and you're excited if
she does. If she doesn't, you're

593
00:42:52.239 --> 00:42:54.800
going, wow, Okay, you
know Nicki Bella is better than I thought,

594
00:42:54.880 --> 00:42:58.239
or a contender and you get a
little bit more invested in her,

595
00:42:58.639 --> 00:43:01.239
or you ever lose and you've made
someone. I think otherwise you're tuning in

596
00:43:01.320 --> 00:43:06.199
to see her while she's been great
and doing a lot of things different than

597
00:43:06.239 --> 00:43:08.639
the other girls, like you're trying
to say, hey, she came from

598
00:43:08.679 --> 00:43:13.800
this other world she's a celebrity,
but she's doing everything everyone else is doing

599
00:43:13.840 --> 00:43:16.519
in the ring. So I think
that's one small thing. The other thing

600
00:43:16.519 --> 00:43:20.280
you brought up to, and I'm
probably going off the question you said,

601
00:43:20.320 --> 00:43:27.400
is that they're trying to steer people
away from doing Becky Lynch. If fans

602
00:43:27.400 --> 00:43:30.559
are complaining about what they're doing with
her, I think that's a huge mistake

603
00:43:30.639 --> 00:43:36.199
because she is turning into a superstar
right now, and I think that you

604
00:43:36.400 --> 00:43:40.079
needed to have the heel turn to
get what you're getting out of her.

605
00:43:40.440 --> 00:43:45.360
To me, I always thought she
was great and I enjoyed watching her,

606
00:43:45.400 --> 00:43:50.039
but she wasn't providing much outside of
like good matches for me as a fan

607
00:43:50.760 --> 00:43:52.599
prior to this happening, and now
it's like you want to tune in to

608
00:43:52.599 --> 00:43:58.920
hear what she's going to say.
What I think the problem is isn't that

609
00:43:58.960 --> 00:44:01.599
she's a heel and that Charlotte's the
babyface. I think the problem is that

610
00:44:01.920 --> 00:44:07.679
WW looks stupid in not addressing that. I mean, why not just say,

611
00:44:07.719 --> 00:44:12.639
as commentators, hey, there are
people who agree with her, you

612
00:44:12.679 --> 00:44:15.000
know, and there are people who
agree with Charlotte, and just leave it

613
00:44:15.039 --> 00:44:20.320
at that and just let it play
out and not have to say, you

614
00:44:20.360 --> 00:44:22.159
know, if she does something that
turns her into a heel, it's like,

615
00:44:22.199 --> 00:44:28.039
God, I can't believe she has
gone to that point now where she

616
00:44:28.239 --> 00:44:31.519
wasn't that before. She doesn't need
to do that as a but it's it's

617
00:44:31.679 --> 00:44:35.559
it's it's just a very weird thing. But I don't know. I wouldn't

618
00:44:35.599 --> 00:44:37.719
be one of the people that are
going like, I'm going to fight that

619
00:44:37.800 --> 00:44:42.800
she's a heel and you need to
turn her into a babyface and change Charlotte

620
00:44:42.840 --> 00:44:45.920
like how people kind of have done
with Roman. It's like, just let

621
00:44:45.920 --> 00:44:50.039
it be because she's doing so great. Why do you need why do you

622
00:44:50.079 --> 00:44:53.000
need anything to change it? Boo
her or cheer her? Just we need

623
00:44:53.119 --> 00:45:00.280
WW to acknowledge that it's happening instead
of ignoring it. A Are you a

624
00:45:00.320 --> 00:45:04.000
nostalgic wrestling fan? Do you want
to hear about shows you haven't seen in

625
00:45:04.039 --> 00:45:07.079
ten, twenty, maybe even thirty
years. Well, I have the show

626
00:45:07.159 --> 00:45:10.800
for you. I'm pwtortch dot com
contributor Frank petty Ani, and since December

627
00:45:10.840 --> 00:45:15.159
of twenty twenty, I've hosted Pro
Wrestling Then and Now together with a rotating

628
00:45:15.239 --> 00:45:19.800
chair of co hosts, We go
back and review old shows from top to

629
00:45:19.840 --> 00:45:23.119
bottom, talk about where the wrestlers
were at the time and compare what's taking

630
00:45:23.119 --> 00:45:27.679
place now to what took place.
Then you can hear this so along with

631
00:45:27.760 --> 00:45:31.800
other shows as part of your PW
Torts VIP membership with exclusive podcasts just for

632
00:45:31.880 --> 00:45:37.480
members compatible with the Apple Podcasts app. Visit pwtorch dot com slash go vip

633
00:45:37.639 --> 00:45:47.960
for details and sign up form.
Yeah. I think with Becky's fascinated because

634
00:45:47.960 --> 00:45:53.519
I mean she's showing a different tide
of personality and in this fire and this

635
00:45:53.639 --> 00:45:59.280
attitude and this edge that was I
think she had in a different way before

636
00:45:59.639 --> 00:46:02.760
that. I think WWE creative and
so man looked at as same old Becky.

637
00:46:02.800 --> 00:46:07.679
She's quirky and fans like her,
but she's more in Italia than she

638
00:46:07.800 --> 00:46:12.360
is Charlotte Ronda. And now she's
been given the freedom to emote and show

639
00:46:12.400 --> 00:46:15.199
her range. The problem is,
and there's no question she seems like a

640
00:46:15.199 --> 00:46:21.960
bigger star now. I think the
argument. Counter to the argument is had

641
00:46:22.000 --> 00:46:24.559
they just pushed her as a star
and featured her in let her let loose,

642
00:46:24.559 --> 00:46:29.119
but not had the machinery and the
narrative frame her as a heel,

643
00:46:29.159 --> 00:46:32.320
which Renee Young. The baby face
commentator talks negatively about Ronda. Michael Cole

644
00:46:32.400 --> 00:46:37.840
baby face commentator generally advocates her faces, says negative things about Becky. They

645
00:46:37.880 --> 00:46:40.039
book her to grab her title belt
and try to run from the match and

646
00:46:40.039 --> 00:46:44.960
not stay to fight. So you
have these things that go completely against how

647
00:46:45.000 --> 00:46:47.800
fans feel about her. And now
you have another instance where the fans feel

648
00:46:47.840 --> 00:46:51.920
like they're at war with the booking
vision. And they had that with Sina,

649
00:46:51.960 --> 00:46:53.679
they had that with Roman, they
had it with Daniel Bryan, and

650
00:46:53.760 --> 00:46:58.119
now they're in punked to a degree
and they're seeing it now with Becky.

651
00:46:58.239 --> 00:47:01.400
And I think the Becky Becky is
taflon like, she's just so good,

652
00:47:01.440 --> 00:47:07.280
she's gonna be fine. The question
is are you damaging if you're wwe are

653
00:47:07.320 --> 00:47:10.480
you damaging that bond with fans who
feel like, once again it's what they

654
00:47:10.559 --> 00:47:15.719
care about more than what we're expressing, and they're fighting it, and it

655
00:47:15.760 --> 00:47:20.239
does make the commentators look bad.
And a side of a collateral damages Charlotte

656
00:47:20.320 --> 00:47:23.159
or any baby Face who faces Becky. There's some collateral damage because fans who

657
00:47:23.239 --> 00:47:29.119
like Charlotte up until the Becky feud
are now booing Charlotte because there's an incongruency

658
00:47:29.119 --> 00:47:34.480
between what the machinery is saying and
booking Becky to do versus how fans feel

659
00:47:34.480 --> 00:47:37.920
about her. That's what's I agree, Becky's a star and she's gonna come

660
00:47:37.920 --> 00:47:40.719
out of this just fine, But
what about the damage done along the periphery?

661
00:47:42.760 --> 00:47:46.280
Well, I think you know you
are right. You know she had

662
00:47:46.360 --> 00:47:49.760
this in her, whether she's a
babyface or a heel, but the way

663
00:47:49.800 --> 00:47:52.000
that she was booked both in now
but also I think you know, in

664
00:47:52.079 --> 00:48:01.119
working with talent both inside ww and
out, it's sometimes using heel and babyface

665
00:48:01.239 --> 00:48:07.719
is that you could be great at
both, but sometimes you're missing on that

666
00:48:07.920 --> 00:48:12.880
little something that takes you over the
edge to be where it be a superstar

667
00:48:13.000 --> 00:48:15.760
and be like, yeah, you
know she's good, she cuts good promos

668
00:48:15.800 --> 00:48:19.559
and I enjoy her work, to
then going like, oh my god,

669
00:48:19.679 --> 00:48:23.480
she's taken that next step. I
think for Becky maybe she need and maybe

670
00:48:23.480 --> 00:48:28.280
she knew it, maybe she didn't, but she needed to be this character

671
00:48:28.559 --> 00:48:32.239
for at least the way I look
at it is that she's a much better

672
00:48:32.360 --> 00:48:36.480
character now and she's a bigger star
now, And I get what you're saying

673
00:48:36.480 --> 00:48:39.559
about the collateral damage for others,
but that's also to me, it's not

674
00:48:39.679 --> 00:48:46.320
so much about that she's a heel. I think that it's just saying,

675
00:48:47.039 --> 00:48:52.840
look, if you agree with her, you agree with her. If you

676
00:48:53.000 --> 00:48:58.440
don't, you don't, and leave
it at that. Let the audience decide.

677
00:48:58.960 --> 00:49:01.960
And instead of I'm even okay if
she wants to grab her title and

678
00:49:02.039 --> 00:49:07.800
run, I mean if she sometimes
you could you could play that up as

679
00:49:07.199 --> 00:49:14.280
psychological. Sometimes you know, she
can just say I was put in this

680
00:49:14.360 --> 00:49:17.599
situation and you know this person doesn't
deserve it, and they're kind of getting

681
00:49:17.639 --> 00:49:20.920
one up on me. I'm walking
out. I don't need to be here.

682
00:49:21.320 --> 00:49:25.599
Like that plays into it without you
know, necessarily having to say she's

683
00:49:25.639 --> 00:49:30.280
a cowardly heel. Now, I
just think let her be if you if

684
00:49:30.320 --> 00:49:34.119
you want to cheer her, go
for it. We're not going to tell

685
00:49:34.159 --> 00:49:37.599
you as commentators, we're not going
to lead you one way or the other.

686
00:49:37.679 --> 00:49:40.400
And then that way when she goes
up against a babyface like you know

687
00:49:42.280 --> 00:49:45.000
Bailey, it's not gonna hurt Bailey
because they feel like, no, okay,

688
00:49:45.000 --> 00:49:47.599
we're going to get behind our girl, get behind whoever you want.

689
00:49:47.679 --> 00:49:52.840
I mean, I don't know why
WW hasn't seen too. I don't know

690
00:49:52.880 --> 00:49:55.480
if like in their office, Vince
is going. I can't seem to get

691
00:49:55.519 --> 00:50:00.960
this right. I think that Charlotte
should be the babyface or Roman should be

692
00:50:01.000 --> 00:50:05.800
the babyface, and he should be
the star. I don't it's if that's

693
00:50:05.800 --> 00:50:07.920
the case, like still have a
babyface and have a heel, But it's

694
00:50:07.960 --> 00:50:13.679
okay to let the audience pick what
they want. And I think that it's

695
00:50:13.719 --> 00:50:16.519
a culture now in WWE where that's
just going to happen. I don't think

696
00:50:16.519 --> 00:50:23.960
you could. Their booking is never
going to solve the problem. So book

697
00:50:23.960 --> 00:50:28.519
how you want a book, and
then let the audience determine who they're going

698
00:50:28.559 --> 00:50:34.079
to get behind, and I think
that you're going to see. I just,

699
00:50:34.159 --> 00:50:37.400
I honestly just don't get The only
thing that I kind of keep up

700
00:50:37.400 --> 00:50:39.159
on is like the news sites,
and sometimes I see that, you know,

701
00:50:39.239 --> 00:50:44.119
fans are complaining that she shouldn't be
the heel. I just in watching

702
00:50:44.159 --> 00:50:46.719
what I've seen from her, can't
seem to fathom why anyone should say she

703
00:50:46.760 --> 00:50:52.079
shouldn't be doing what she's doing right
now. Thanks for downloading Today's show.

704
00:50:52.159 --> 00:50:54.119
Take it to the next level with
a VIP membership, get shows like this

705
00:50:54.440 --> 00:50:59.199
the Way Keller Prossing Podcast, Weaightkeller
Prosing post show, and the pw Torch

706
00:50:59.320 --> 00:51:04.760
daily casts on our pw Torch VIP
podcast feed with ads and plugs removed from

707
00:51:04.800 --> 00:51:08.280
the shows for a streamlined listening experience. And also hear the VIP exclusive shows

708
00:51:08.280 --> 00:51:12.480
that I host with Rich Fan and
Todd Martin, Everything with Rich Fan and

709
00:51:12.480 --> 00:51:15.880
The Fix with Todd Martin's signature VIP
series. That you're missing out without a

710
00:51:15.000 --> 00:51:19.960
VIP membership, So go VIP here
in twenty twenty two and enjoy all the

711
00:51:19.960 --> 00:51:23.800
benefits, all the bonus content and
the ad free listening experience. Pw torch

712
00:51:23.840 --> 00:51:35.000
dot com slash go VIP. Let's
talk about Ronda Roussi and what you're seeing

713
00:51:35.880 --> 00:51:43.320
with her and how WWE is pushing
and framing and presenting this. She might

714
00:51:43.360 --> 00:51:47.480
be the top paid star on the
roster right now across the entire board on

715
00:51:47.559 --> 00:51:52.559
per match basis brock us higher,
but overall right now, among full time

716
00:51:52.599 --> 00:51:57.599
talent, Ronda is probably the highest. What do you think about how they

717
00:51:57.599 --> 00:52:00.800
are now that Roman's gone too?
How do you feel that, how do

718
00:52:00.840 --> 00:52:05.920
you feel about what you're seeing with
Ron and how she's adapting from the UFC

719
00:52:05.960 --> 00:52:09.800
personality and what you maybe saw in
her as a potential pro wrestler or how

720
00:52:09.880 --> 00:52:15.119
she's presenting herself in WWE as at
this point. I think when you're a

721
00:52:15.119 --> 00:52:17.559
wrestling fan and you kind of always
get it, you know, and I

722
00:52:17.559 --> 00:52:22.559
think it's easier to sort of become
that character and play that character when when

723
00:52:22.599 --> 00:52:24.719
you're a fan, and I think
that she kind of always was trying to

724
00:52:24.719 --> 00:52:32.400
be a little WWE in UFC,
So I think she's transitioned well. I

725
00:52:32.440 --> 00:52:37.920
mean she's kind of growing at a
rapid rate. I mean even just with

726
00:52:38.920 --> 00:52:43.519
the first promo that she cut,
I can't remember when that was. Didn't

727
00:52:43.519 --> 00:52:45.800
they do like a pay per view
where they had her come out and do

728
00:52:45.000 --> 00:52:51.639
a signing or something and that promo
was god awful. And then to seeing

729
00:52:51.679 --> 00:52:54.880
her cut the promo on Nikki Bella, and like, I mean, it's

730
00:52:55.440 --> 00:53:00.679
happening so quick, like she will
end up being great at everything. I

731
00:53:00.679 --> 00:53:06.559
think. I think that her entering
work is growing fast. I think she's

732
00:53:06.599 --> 00:53:09.800
going to be great there. I
think that she's going to be a great

733
00:53:09.840 --> 00:53:15.239
talker, I think that there's no
reason why they can't just say, hey,

734
00:53:15.280 --> 00:53:20.440
if it happens, she could be
the face of the company. I

735
00:53:20.519 --> 00:53:24.280
know that's going to be something that
they probably are going to be hesitant to

736
00:53:24.320 --> 00:53:32.880
do because she's a woman. But
I also think that WWE follows the headlines,

737
00:53:32.880 --> 00:53:37.559
and I think that if she ends
up being the one that people are

738
00:53:37.719 --> 00:53:42.159
talking about or getting behind, and
I'm not talking about fans, I'm talking

739
00:53:42.159 --> 00:53:46.519
about she pulls the headlines in media, then I think that they'll they'll go

740
00:53:46.639 --> 00:53:51.639
that route. But I also think
part Events is never really gonna fully I

741
00:53:51.639 --> 00:53:54.320
think he'll always put if she becomes
that, I think he'll put her on

742
00:53:54.519 --> 00:54:00.239
the shows. But I think he'll
always say what was it that. I

743
00:54:00.280 --> 00:54:02.199
don't know if it was you that
said it, or if like listening to

744
00:54:05.159 --> 00:54:07.880
Bruce Pritchard, but it's like you
sprinkle that Hogan dust. And I feel

745
00:54:07.880 --> 00:54:12.760
like with her, if she becomes
that, they're going to put her on

746
00:54:12.800 --> 00:54:15.760
the shows, and then they're always
going to attach a male superstar to her.

747
00:54:16.199 --> 00:54:19.920
At the time, it could have
been Roman Reigns, but hey,

748
00:54:19.920 --> 00:54:23.679
we're going to have Ronda ROWSI on
Good Morning America. Okay, Well,

749
00:54:23.880 --> 00:54:29.679
joining us is Ronda Rausi and the
ww champion Roman Reigns. I think that

750
00:54:29.840 --> 00:54:31.800
Vince will always want to do that. I don't think she'll ever stand alone

751
00:54:31.880 --> 00:54:39.400
as the face. But I also
think that she's going to lose the appeal

752
00:54:39.760 --> 00:54:47.559
of the non wrestling fans if they
continue to just book her as another wrestler

753
00:54:47.559 --> 00:54:51.360
on the roster, which goes back
to that point that I was making earlier.

754
00:54:51.360 --> 00:54:57.280
I think you need to keep her
in that have the people kind of

755
00:54:57.280 --> 00:55:00.719
tune in because she's doing something different
and you're entertained by that. If she

756
00:55:00.920 --> 00:55:05.280
just becomes another wrestler on the roster, I think you're just gonna eventually just

757
00:55:05.320 --> 00:55:07.480
have your wrestling fans tuning in to
watch her. What did you think of

758
00:55:07.719 --> 00:55:13.719
Nikki Bella and Breen her corner as
opponents for rond and how they made that

759
00:55:14.119 --> 00:55:19.000
turn into Did it feel to you
like a worthy main event match on the

760
00:55:19.039 --> 00:55:24.440
first ever all women WWB pay per
view? Hmm? Well after the match

761
00:55:24.480 --> 00:55:30.679
that came on before it no,
but no to be look, I feel

762
00:55:30.679 --> 00:55:34.079
like if I say no, it's
taking away from both of them, and

763
00:55:34.119 --> 00:55:37.679
I don't want to do that.
I think it was it was good for

764
00:55:37.719 --> 00:55:39.440
what it was. I don't think
it was. I mean, look,

765
00:55:39.440 --> 00:55:42.880
when you're gonna do a pay per
view like that, I feel like this

766
00:55:43.159 --> 00:55:46.199
is it's almost like ECW's first pay
per view. You had a lot to

767
00:55:46.320 --> 00:55:52.360
prove. And I guess I won't
kind of sidetrack this conversation, but what

768
00:55:52.400 --> 00:55:53.320
I was going to do is say, like, what did you think of

769
00:55:53.360 --> 00:55:58.719
it at the time? But I
would have rather seen it, you know,

770
00:55:58.760 --> 00:56:02.199
if you're going to show an the
Charlotte Becky match should have went on

771
00:56:02.320 --> 00:56:06.679
last. I think that at that
point you're kind of saying, look where

772
00:56:06.679 --> 00:56:13.480
we've come. Not because there was
tables getting broken or chairs being stacked on

773
00:56:13.480 --> 00:56:17.280
someone, but how great that match
was the story that you told to get

774
00:56:17.280 --> 00:56:22.800
there, And I think it kind
of shows a difference in what we used

775
00:56:22.840 --> 00:56:27.719
to do to where we are now. And I think that the Nicky Ronda

776
00:56:27.760 --> 00:56:31.719
match was good, and I think
that Ronda was really good in it.

777
00:56:31.880 --> 00:56:38.199
I think that Nicki was able to
take people that would have gone she has

778
00:56:38.280 --> 00:56:44.000
no chance, this is not a
great matchup or worthy of a Ronda opponent

779
00:56:44.280 --> 00:56:47.039
and change their minds a little bit. But I don't think that that was

780
00:56:47.159 --> 00:56:51.519
like here we are we've made it. And then I also think they should

781
00:56:51.519 --> 00:56:54.440
have ended that show with some sort
of storyline as well to kind of anyone

782
00:56:54.480 --> 00:56:58.840
who might tune in just out of
curiosity, just to kind of say like,

783
00:56:59.000 --> 00:57:04.480
hey, what is this to give
them something to instead of showing more

784
00:57:04.480 --> 00:57:07.719
of like a conclusion at the end, like here we are, we did

785
00:57:07.760 --> 00:57:09.039
it. Let's pat ourselves on the
back. I'm not talking about the women,

786
00:57:09.039 --> 00:57:15.239
I'm talking about WWE. They should
have ran a cool angle with Naya

787
00:57:15.360 --> 00:57:19.360
Jacks to and the show with her
coming out and attacking Ron that or doing

788
00:57:19.440 --> 00:57:21.719
something. I think that would have
been cool. But as far as that

789
00:57:21.760 --> 00:57:24.760
match, don't want to take anything
away from it. I don't think that

790
00:57:24.760 --> 00:57:35.920
that was a main event Changing of
the Guard evolution. This is where you

791
00:57:35.920 --> 00:57:38.679
know women's wrestling is today. I
think the match before it was more that

792
00:57:40.360 --> 00:57:45.960
And look, Wade, I think
no one will argue that the reason that

793
00:57:45.960 --> 00:57:49.679
that was the main event is because
of the name that was attached to that

794
00:57:49.800 --> 00:57:52.920
match. I don't think anyone would
say that match deserved to be a main

795
00:57:52.960 --> 00:57:57.239
event. That match stands for where
we are right now with women's wrestling,

796
00:57:57.679 --> 00:58:01.079
other than we've brought in a celebrity
to be part of it. Are you

797
00:58:01.119 --> 00:58:06.599
surprised at the Bellas are where they
are? How were they perceived when you

798
00:58:06.639 --> 00:58:08.960
were there? How did you perceive
them? And how do you feel about

799
00:58:08.960 --> 00:58:14.559
the fact that here Nicky is headlining. You know, she's John Cena's ex,

800
00:58:14.639 --> 00:58:17.800
Brie as Daniel Bryan's wife. They
are stars of a reality show where

801
00:58:17.800 --> 00:58:22.480
that has been a storyline that they
push forward. They're very well known because

802
00:58:22.559 --> 00:58:28.719
of that, in addition to other
things. What are are you surprised or

803
00:58:29.400 --> 00:58:31.719
how do you feel about where Nicki
and Brie are at this point? Vince

804
00:58:31.800 --> 00:58:35.320
was always intrigued by them. When
I was there, they weren't doing much,

805
00:58:35.320 --> 00:58:37.360
and I remember I would sit with
them and we try to come up

806
00:58:37.360 --> 00:58:42.800
with stuff because Vince would always say
like, hey, there's something with them,

807
00:58:43.280 --> 00:58:45.800
you know, let's do something with
them. And I don't know if

808
00:58:46.239 --> 00:58:50.519
I mean, look, when you're
that behind someone, you know, it

809
00:58:50.880 --> 00:58:53.719
shouldn't take an earth shattering idea to
finally say, cool, let's do something

810
00:58:53.760 --> 00:58:59.239
with it. But you know we
did. Finally we were able to get

811
00:58:59.280 --> 00:59:05.079
the Daniel Brian Bella twins story.
Not to say again that that was progressing

812
00:59:05.079 --> 00:59:10.599
women's wrestling but you know, he
did always see something and I think also

813
00:59:10.760 --> 00:59:15.360
too. You bring up a good
point because I don't necessarily I don't watch

814
00:59:15.440 --> 00:59:17.159
the show, so I never think
of like the Bella Twins as like reality

815
00:59:17.159 --> 00:59:27.440
TV stars. But that was probably
the main reason why she was put in

816
00:59:27.480 --> 00:59:30.280
that match. And again I haven't
followed the show, so if I'm missing

817
00:59:30.320 --> 00:59:35.000
something and she was tearing the house
down every night prior to that, so

818
00:59:35.039 --> 00:59:37.519
they gave her that opportunity, then
I stand corrected. But I think it

819
00:59:37.599 --> 00:59:43.800
was Vince and WWE, because no
matter who's pushing for what they're they're always

820
00:59:43.840 --> 00:59:46.280
looking at how are we being presented? And I think that was their way

821
00:59:46.280 --> 00:59:52.000
of going, Hey, casual fans, they're going to see this as we

822
00:59:52.079 --> 00:59:58.800
have Ronda Rousey the celebrity versus Nicky
Bella the celebrity. Look how big we

823
00:59:58.880 --> 01:00:00.760
are and then this is big match. I think that's the way that they

824
01:00:00.760 --> 01:00:02.920
were looking at it, and I
think that wrestling fans were looking at it

825
01:00:02.960 --> 01:00:07.760
from a different way. So not
surprised she was in the match. Again,

826
01:00:07.840 --> 01:00:10.559
not taking anything away from her.
I love those girls. I think

827
01:00:10.599 --> 01:00:15.440
that they're great. I think they're
talented, but I don't think that they

828
01:00:15.440 --> 01:00:21.199
were put in that match because that
was the two best wrestlers to have in

829
01:00:21.239 --> 01:00:24.639
it. Ronda perhaps, yes,
but no not. I don't think the

830
01:00:24.679 --> 01:00:30.559
Bela Twins and anyone was writing into
WWE or tweeting them, going win,

831
01:00:30.599 --> 01:00:36.960
are we getting that match? I
think they do for other females. I

832
01:00:37.000 --> 01:00:39.639
think that they clont when that was
first rumored to be the match. I

833
01:00:39.639 --> 01:00:43.559
think people rolled their eyes and groaned
and felt like, well, this is

834
01:00:43.559 --> 01:00:45.000
an evolution. I mean, you
know when you're thinking, I mean,

835
01:00:45.079 --> 01:00:49.920
Nikki's better than Breeing the ring widely
regarded as such, and I think fairly

836
01:00:50.000 --> 01:00:53.559
so, but it came across as
this is, you know, WW style

837
01:00:53.599 --> 01:00:58.119
booking the reality star who's gotten in
with certain people and have been around a

838
01:00:58.119 --> 01:01:00.960
long time against Ronda, and you
know they probably user influence. All that

839
01:01:00.199 --> 01:01:06.360
is so, But I think they
actually won most people over with the match

840
01:01:06.440 --> 01:01:09.199
quality. Now, like you said, in contrast to the match before it,

841
01:01:09.199 --> 01:01:12.559
it was a hard act to follow, no question, but I don't

842
01:01:12.599 --> 01:01:15.599
think people looked at that. In
fact, I'm sure I don't remember.

843
01:01:15.639 --> 01:01:19.039
I can't recall anybody saying after Revolution
on Sunday, well boy, that that

844
01:01:19.159 --> 01:01:22.320
flopped. We were proven right,
or people who were critical this match proven

845
01:01:22.400 --> 01:01:27.199
right. I think it passed.
And I think for oh, especially if

846
01:01:27.239 --> 01:01:29.159
it turns out to be kind of
a one off and now run and moves

847
01:01:29.159 --> 01:01:32.039
on to other things, given the
history of the Bellas and given their their

848
01:01:32.840 --> 01:01:37.360
wrecking, the recognition that they have
with a wide base of fans over a

849
01:01:37.400 --> 01:01:42.039
long span of time, newer fans
or reality TV and w B going all

850
01:01:42.039 --> 01:01:45.960
the way back then to you know, ten years ago. I think in

851
01:01:45.000 --> 01:01:49.679
retrospect it turned out good in part
because I think the writing was good,

852
01:01:49.840 --> 01:01:52.079
Ron and Nikki and Brie were really
really good in their segments on TV,

853
01:01:52.760 --> 01:01:57.800
and the match turned out good too. Like I think that turned out to

854
01:01:57.800 --> 01:02:01.239
be a very fitting end and appropriate
made event. Now, could they have

855
01:02:01.480 --> 01:02:08.440
put all their effort and resources into
OSCA undefeated against Ronda and had their eye

856
01:02:08.480 --> 01:02:15.199
on this nine months ago and made
that feel relatively similar in terms of yeah,

857
01:02:15.239 --> 01:02:16.960
that that belonged on that show and
that was a kick ass made event.

858
01:02:17.000 --> 01:02:19.719
Sure, Yeah, I think they
probably could have. It would have

859
01:02:19.760 --> 01:02:24.079
been very different. But but I
give credit to Nikki for stepping up in

860
01:02:24.159 --> 01:02:27.719
Ronda for improving as quickly as she
has, like you said, and so

861
01:02:27.760 --> 01:02:30.559
it was good. Yeah, but
you're you're saying that you're looking at it.

862
01:02:30.599 --> 01:02:34.320
I think from you know, a
you're not looking at it from the

863
01:02:34.400 --> 01:02:38.400
ww lens of going like, could
they have built Osca to Ronda in WWE's

864
01:02:38.960 --> 01:02:43.920
maybe Triple H, I don't know, but in Vince McMahon and his vision

865
01:02:44.280 --> 01:02:47.119
and maybe even Triple H now because
he's whether he agrees with it or not,

866
01:02:47.239 --> 01:02:52.400
feels like she's Oscar's been watered down. But you're looking at it in

867
01:02:52.440 --> 01:02:53.880
a way of like, man,
those are the two best, and they

868
01:02:53.880 --> 01:02:58.079
could have built this, and WWE's
looking at it is like, what is

869
01:02:58.159 --> 01:03:02.880
the biggest we can do that has
nothing to do necessarily with ring work?

870
01:03:04.199 --> 01:03:07.599
You know, It's like they're looking
at it's like, let's put our two

871
01:03:07.599 --> 01:03:12.840
biggest stars outside the company in the
main event. So I don't think that

872
01:03:13.079 --> 01:03:15.159
them ever going, even if we
were going to do Evolution in nine months,

873
01:03:15.159 --> 01:03:19.360
that they ever even considered the fact
of like, well do we keep

874
01:03:19.400 --> 01:03:22.599
Oscar undefeated to do that? It's
like that's telling a wrestling storyline as opposed

875
01:03:22.639 --> 01:03:29.239
to them trying to grab eyeballs and
say look at r two. In a

876
01:03:29.320 --> 01:03:32.519
sense, Top women right now because
if you're tuning into this pay per view

877
01:03:32.599 --> 01:03:36.599
and you don't watch, you are
thinking those are your two top women,

878
01:03:36.719 --> 01:03:38.960
and you're going wow, and they're
two stars. Yeah, no, no

879
01:03:39.039 --> 01:03:50.039
output. Every Sunday night, catch
Wrestling Night in America on PW Torchdailycast dot

880
01:03:50.039 --> 01:03:53.000
Com, hosted by me PW Torch
calumnist Greg Parks. Each week, I'll

881
01:03:53.000 --> 01:03:55.960
welcome a co host from the Torch
family to discuss the big shows and pro

882
01:03:57.000 --> 01:04:00.840
wrestling, taking your calls and emails. You can listen live most week's beginning

883
01:04:00.880 --> 01:04:03.679
at eight pm Eastern. On Sunday
nights with a WWE or Impact pay per

884
01:04:03.800 --> 01:04:06.159
view, we go on the air. At the conclusion of that pay per

885
01:04:06.239 --> 01:04:09.519
view. You can listen live,
but of course, the full show is

886
01:04:09.559 --> 01:04:14.599
available for download on demand anytime shortly
after it airs. Visit PW Torchdailycast dot

887
01:04:14.639 --> 01:04:16.960
com and click the live stream link
to find the next scheduled live show link.

888
01:04:17.039 --> 01:04:21.440
Search PW Torch and Apple Podcasts or
your podcast app to subscribe Wrestling Night

889
01:04:21.440 --> 01:04:39.719
in America every Sunday, PW Torchdailycast
dot Com. Charlotte and Becky, you

890
01:04:39.719 --> 01:04:43.719
mentioned that that's a hard act to
follow. That was just I mean you

891
01:04:43.760 --> 01:04:46.079
want an evolution to have a real
standout match that got lots of time,

892
01:04:46.119 --> 01:04:50.880
that went almost a half hour am
a woman's match on a WWE pay per

893
01:04:50.960 --> 01:04:55.039
view, regardless of the context,
or on TV going a half hour that

894
01:04:55.199 --> 01:05:00.320
in and of itself is like headline
material based on past eras. And then

895
01:05:00.320 --> 01:05:02.800
they just delivered. You know,
they had Yes, the fan you know,

896
01:05:02.800 --> 01:05:05.920
a lot of fans were behind Becky
and the machinery. The narrative was

897
01:05:05.920 --> 01:05:10.239
trying to push fans the other direction. That's the only like asterisk in terms

898
01:05:10.280 --> 01:05:14.119
of anything on this, and it
actually maybe fueled a lot of enthusiasm for

899
01:05:14.199 --> 01:05:16.559
Becky that added heat to the match. Your thoughts on what you saw there

900
01:05:16.599 --> 01:05:20.400
in terms of the presentation and the
execution, Yeah, I mean it was

901
01:05:20.480 --> 01:05:27.719
great. I just I love I
like I like when it's more than just

902
01:05:28.400 --> 01:05:32.199
you know, I love good wrestling, but I love that when you can

903
01:05:32.360 --> 01:05:35.760
when you can add other elements,
you know, And I feel like sometimes

904
01:05:35.760 --> 01:05:41.519
there's no reason why their match couldn't
have been like a scene in a movie.

905
01:05:41.880 --> 01:05:44.119
You know, it's like, well, it's last man standing. Whether

906
01:05:44.199 --> 01:05:46.800
you like that stipulation or not,
those are the types of things that you

907
01:05:46.800 --> 01:05:50.599
should probably be doing. And I
think that it showed that they are capable

908
01:05:50.599 --> 01:05:55.719
of doing those types of things.
I think it's good to have things like

909
01:05:55.840 --> 01:06:00.880
that every now and then. And
man, I mean it is just it

910
01:06:00.920 --> 01:06:04.679
was so good. And to be
honest, like what was great about it

911
01:06:04.840 --> 01:06:12.519
was that the fans got behind Becky, right, And it's almost like in

912
01:06:12.559 --> 01:06:15.480
a sense, I don't think WW
meant to do this, but it worked

913
01:06:15.480 --> 01:06:18.679
out well where it was like they
took you on a journey where you're going,

914
01:06:18.760 --> 01:06:24.800
oh god, they're going to like
turn Charlotte into superwoman here and she

915
01:06:24.800 --> 01:06:28.920
she breaks away from the stack of
chairs on her and then you think,

916
01:06:29.039 --> 01:06:31.360
Okay, they're definitely going to shove
her down our throat now and they're going

917
01:06:31.400 --> 01:06:33.960
to have her win and we don't
like this and we are ready for it,

918
01:06:34.360 --> 01:06:36.559
and then and then they give you
what you want at the end.

919
01:06:36.639 --> 01:06:45.159
I thought it was great. I
thought that it's that to me, showcased

920
01:06:45.360 --> 01:06:47.639
where women's wrestling is for some of
the reasons you said, and for some

921
01:06:47.679 --> 01:06:50.239
of the reasons I said, and
which is why I think that should have

922
01:06:50.239 --> 01:06:54.639
went on last. And I think
that is you, you being able to

923
01:06:54.679 --> 01:07:01.239
tell the proper story of we are
a revolution or an evolution or whatever tagline

924
01:07:01.280 --> 01:07:04.960
you put onto it, But that
showed where women's wrestling is capable of being

925
01:07:05.039 --> 01:07:11.239
today. Absolutely so right now?
Is there anything you look at with Charlotte

926
01:07:11.280 --> 01:07:13.920
and you think I'd be doing something
different if I were her, I were

927
01:07:14.079 --> 01:07:16.159
WWE, she should be a heel
or if she's going to be a face,

928
01:07:16.159 --> 01:07:19.920
she should do this different. What
do you if you're in a creative

929
01:07:20.039 --> 01:07:24.079
meeting and that comes up with what
you've seen of her? What do you

930
01:07:24.079 --> 01:07:26.639
see about her progress and what do
you think she should do going for different?

931
01:07:27.880 --> 01:07:31.480
Always loved her as a heel,
never really was a big Charlotte babyface

932
01:07:31.559 --> 01:07:35.519
fan. I think she's great.
I love Charlotte, I love her entering

933
01:07:35.559 --> 01:07:40.159
work, I love her character.
I think she works best as a heel.

934
01:07:40.239 --> 01:07:44.559
I would probably have been an advocate
for making her the heel in the

935
01:07:44.719 --> 01:07:48.360
in the Becky storyline, but then
again I would have been wrong because I

936
01:07:48.440 --> 01:07:51.039
love what Becky's doing and who knows. You know, here's the other thing

937
01:07:51.079 --> 01:07:57.880
we don't see as well, is
that backstage when you are spending time with

938
01:07:57.960 --> 01:08:01.440
Becky lunch and you're running prom with
her, or you're hearing storyline ideas from

939
01:08:01.440 --> 01:08:05.119
her, or she's just giving you
opinions on things. Maybe you just even

940
01:08:05.159 --> 01:08:10.920
know her as a person. They
someone there could have seen what we're seeing

941
01:08:10.960 --> 01:08:15.679
now and go they're not gonna get
it, but as soon as they see

942
01:08:15.719 --> 01:08:19.479
her, they're gonna know why we
did it, and that could be the

943
01:08:19.520 --> 01:08:24.159
reason why it was her. I
think Charlotte should end up being a heel.

944
01:08:24.560 --> 01:08:29.920
I think that, to me,
a great match would be Ronda versus

945
01:08:30.000 --> 01:08:32.239
Charlotte. I think last time we
did the show, we were talking about

946
01:08:32.239 --> 01:08:35.079
like Roman reigns at the time or
something, and I think you asked me,

947
01:08:35.159 --> 01:08:39.199
like, what do you see one
year from now, like being the

948
01:08:39.279 --> 01:08:42.920
top act or something. I think
I had said they should do Ronda versus

949
01:08:43.000 --> 01:08:46.439
Charlotte to headline WrestleMania, and I
think that that could still be something,

950
01:08:46.479 --> 01:08:50.039
but I don't think it will work
as well if it's Babyface versus baby Face.

951
01:08:50.079 --> 01:08:54.880
I think Charlotte is the best possible
character as a heel, and she

952
01:08:55.000 --> 01:08:58.199
needs to be that. To say, like, what is a storyline for

953
01:08:58.279 --> 01:09:02.640
her? I haven't watched enough or
given enough thought to it to just give

954
01:09:02.680 --> 01:09:06.079
something off the top of my head. But man, there's no reason why

955
01:09:06.119 --> 01:09:11.399
she shouldn't be one of I mean, I think you'd probably have to move

956
01:09:11.439 --> 01:09:18.159
her away from SmackDown. I think
with Becky there. But yeah, I

957
01:09:18.159 --> 01:09:23.920
mean there's no reason why she shouldn't
be one of the headlining acts of Raw

958
01:09:24.000 --> 01:09:27.119
or SmackDown every week. I don't
think it has to be. I don't

959
01:09:27.119 --> 01:09:30.840
think you always have to do every
show going okay, you know what,

960
01:09:31.119 --> 01:09:34.720
we have to revolve everything around what
aj Styles is doing. I mean,

961
01:09:35.119 --> 01:09:39.880
yeah, you're building to something great, but it doesn't just need to be

962
01:09:39.880 --> 01:09:44.319
because he's the champion or because Roman
is our guy. It has to always

963
01:09:44.399 --> 01:09:46.680
every single Monday be about what he's
doing, especially now. It would be

964
01:09:46.720 --> 01:09:50.680
different if this was, you know, the days of Stone Cold was always

965
01:09:50.800 --> 01:09:56.560
doing something exciting. You know,
he's going to come out in a beer

966
01:09:56.600 --> 01:10:00.520
truck or he's going to hunt Vincement
Man all night. You know, and

967
01:10:00.560 --> 01:10:04.399
there's a payoff at Dan Fine.
I get that you're telling the lead story

968
01:10:04.439 --> 01:10:10.199
every week, but there's no reason
where WW doesn't do that anymore. Like

969
01:10:10.199 --> 01:10:15.840
there's there's really no storytelling or anything
that Sometimes I won't watch for months or

970
01:10:16.000 --> 01:10:20.239
weeks and then I tune in and
I'm going the same thing is happening.

971
01:10:20.319 --> 01:10:24.119
There's no there's no difference. It
may be a different opponent, but the

972
01:10:24.119 --> 01:10:28.079
same thing is happening. Where As
back in the day, you tune in

973
01:10:28.119 --> 01:10:30.279
and you go, wait, hold
on, Triple H is in the corporation

974
01:10:30.439 --> 01:10:33.680
and this person's doing this, and
that was kind of like a reason why

975
01:10:33.720 --> 01:10:36.399
you never wanted to tune out,
because you didn't want to miss something.

976
01:10:38.079 --> 01:10:40.840
I'm going so far off track.
I don't even remember what the question was,

977
01:10:41.000 --> 01:10:45.000
but I think that, Oh,
it's it's Charlotte being the Yeah,

978
01:10:45.079 --> 01:10:47.800
so it's like, why not if
there's something great that you have for Charlotte,

979
01:10:48.039 --> 01:10:51.520
make her the focal point of that
episode. It also kind of takes

980
01:10:51.560 --> 01:10:58.119
away from the fatigue of where there's
weekly television plus a monthly pay per view,

981
01:10:58.359 --> 01:11:01.119
of the fatigue of that one person
you're pushing every week, especially when

982
01:11:01.119 --> 01:11:06.760
you're not really doing anything with them, like story wise, or that story

983
01:11:06.880 --> 01:11:13.159
sort of is being told for one
week or for that four week period to

984
01:11:13.199 --> 01:11:15.520
get to the pay per view,
and then it's just kind of doesn't mean

985
01:11:15.560 --> 01:11:18.000
anything anymore. So Yeah, I
mean, yeah, I see Charlotte as

986
01:11:18.039 --> 01:11:23.000
like a top a top performer on
any brand that she's on, but I

987
01:11:23.000 --> 01:11:25.640
do think she should be a heel. I think she's always worked best as

988
01:11:25.640 --> 01:11:28.520
a heel. Especially it's like,
I mean, gosh, play up the

989
01:11:28.600 --> 01:11:33.760
Queen Charlotte thing. I mean it's
look, I get the reality based programming

990
01:11:33.880 --> 01:11:38.800
that they have, but I mean, come on, like you have WW

991
01:11:38.960 --> 01:11:43.119
has the opportunity to be the only
WWE instead of being like everyone else.

992
01:11:43.880 --> 01:11:46.760
Play up characters. I mean,
like, I could be wrong, I

993
01:11:46.800 --> 01:11:50.560
really could be, but I truly
I would be more invested if these people

994
01:11:50.560 --> 01:11:54.479
were over the top characters. Have
her be Queen Charlotte, have her b

995
01:11:54.600 --> 01:11:57.239
where, like you know, she
doesn't walk to the ring, she needs

996
01:11:57.239 --> 01:12:00.399
to be carried or she needs to
do like the mancho king thing, like

997
01:12:00.720 --> 01:12:04.479
I don't know, man make her
feel like she's above everyone else. And

998
01:12:04.520 --> 01:12:08.840
it could be because of that reality
based of like I'm Rick Flair's daughter.

999
01:12:08.880 --> 01:12:12.880
I don't know if you can necessarily
like go too far with it now because

1000
01:12:13.159 --> 01:12:15.640
you've kind of established who she is. But I mean, you can have

1001
01:12:15.680 --> 01:12:20.960
so much fun with making these people
into characters and then playing off those characters

1002
01:12:20.960 --> 01:12:29.600
on a weekly basis and creating storylines
for them where you don't have to say,

1003
01:12:29.680 --> 01:12:31.399
well, you know, we got
to find something for AJ because then

1004
01:12:31.560 --> 01:12:35.159
sometimes it just looks forced or there's
just nothing to do. So you put

1005
01:12:35.199 --> 01:12:38.600
them in, you then have to
do well. The only thing we have

1006
01:12:38.720 --> 01:12:42.239
is we got to do. I
think they ran like a series of matches

1007
01:12:42.239 --> 01:12:46.000
where like AJ face like every great
dream opponent you can think of, because

1008
01:12:46.039 --> 01:12:49.399
like Daniel Brian, then it was
someone else, and then it's like Samoa

1009
01:12:49.479 --> 01:12:53.159
Jon. It's like geez, you're
throwing all of this at me at once,

1010
01:12:53.640 --> 01:12:57.800
Like let's let's tell some stories on
here, and then we can build

1011
01:12:57.840 --> 01:13:02.840
to not having to throw out things
because you have nothing else. Yeah,

1012
01:13:02.840 --> 01:13:05.800
So we ended up talking about AJ
styles for five minutes there when the question

1013
01:13:05.880 --> 01:13:09.520
was about Charlotte, I apologize,
no, no, but it does all

1014
01:13:09.880 --> 01:13:12.600
it does, all tie in.
It's it's good examples. See when you're

1015
01:13:12.600 --> 01:13:15.239
not on for a while, then
you know you can it builds up.

1016
01:13:15.279 --> 01:13:19.960
You know, you got to get
gotta get your ideas. And I have

1017
01:13:20.039 --> 01:13:23.720
not had the chance to talk about
Harry's Razors in a while, but they're

1018
01:13:23.720 --> 01:13:30.840
back as a sponsor of the program. You don't have to wait for the

1019
01:13:30.840 --> 01:13:34.159
way Keller Progrestling post show to find
out what I thought of Monday Night Raw

1020
01:13:34.199 --> 01:13:38.359
and SmackDown. Each week, you
can check out my reports that are updated

1021
01:13:38.680 --> 01:13:43.960
live throughout Raw and SmackDown at pwtorch
dot com. My written report will tell

1022
01:13:43.960 --> 01:13:46.039
you what's happening in detail in case
you missed the show, and it will

1023
01:13:46.079 --> 01:13:51.119
also analyze key segments and give my
random thoughts quips on what I am watching

1024
01:13:51.479 --> 01:13:55.680
as it airs. So check it
out every Monday night and Tuesday Night at

1025
01:13:55.720 --> 01:14:00.680
pewtorch dot com. That also applies
to WWE. I cover those live at

1026
01:14:00.680 --> 01:14:04.359
pw torch dot com with a detailed
written report with star ratings, and of

1027
01:14:04.359 --> 01:14:09.079
course you can find other TV reports
from other contributors to PW torch such as

1028
01:14:09.239 --> 01:14:13.560
nxt R, oh, Impact Wrestling
and more. Check it out pw torch

1029
01:14:13.640 --> 01:14:28.960
dot com your first stop for TV
and pay per view written reports. Kyrie

1030
01:14:29.000 --> 01:14:30.720
Saying and Shana Basler. What jumps
out to you about both of them as

1031
01:14:31.119 --> 01:14:36.560
as marketable acts on how WWE presented
them and what they delivered? So see

1032
01:14:36.560 --> 01:14:44.840
this is the thing where the what's
what's the girl's name? Not? Let

1033
01:14:44.920 --> 01:14:46.159
me look her up? What's what? Give me the girl's names? Again?

1034
01:14:46.159 --> 01:14:49.560
Both of them? Oh sure,
Kyrie San and Shana Basler. Yeah,

1035
01:14:49.720 --> 01:14:54.079
yeah, okay, not not Shana, the other girl. It's like,

1036
01:14:54.119 --> 01:14:58.840
that's an example of I remember watching
a takeover and she came out and

1037
01:14:58.880 --> 01:15:00.479
it was like they were like,
and here she is in her like a

1038
01:15:00.600 --> 01:15:05.720
yacht persona. It's like, okay, no, but they said yacht they

1039
01:15:05.760 --> 01:15:10.479
said persona, yeah, and it
was whoever the commentator was, And I

1040
01:15:10.520 --> 01:15:13.399
just remember I was watching with a
friend. I'm like, they don't even

1041
01:15:13.479 --> 01:15:15.560
know they have a character, and
they don't even know what it is.

1042
01:15:15.920 --> 01:15:20.439
They don't even know how to present
it. It's like, that's the case

1043
01:15:20.479 --> 01:15:28.399
of going like she's playing something because
of the laziness of your staff to either

1044
01:15:28.520 --> 01:15:30.359
not find out what it is and
play off of that or build off of

1045
01:15:30.399 --> 01:15:32.960
that, it's just going. I
mean, I don't know. She goes

1046
01:15:32.960 --> 01:15:35.359
out there and she acts like she's
a pirate, so I guess, let

1047
01:15:35.399 --> 01:15:39.640
her be a pirate. But it
means nothing. It plays nothing into her

1048
01:15:39.720 --> 01:15:44.319
character, nothing into the storylines that
they're doing. So I don't get that,

1049
01:15:44.399 --> 01:15:45.840
and it's hard for me to get
behind something like that. She's a

1050
01:15:45.880 --> 01:15:50.960
great worker. Shana Basler is like, that's that's a good character in the

1051
01:15:51.039 --> 01:15:57.760
sense that you watch her and you
just don't like her. Sometimes it could

1052
01:15:57.760 --> 01:16:00.920
be because you think she's doesn't have
personality, or she doesn't have a character

1053
01:16:01.000 --> 01:16:05.800
or you whatever, or she's in
that spot because of Ronda Rowsei. But

1054
01:16:08.079 --> 01:16:11.680
that's good. You need to have
someone on there for people to say,

1055
01:16:11.720 --> 01:16:14.920
I don't like that person who cares
about the reason you have something there.

1056
01:16:15.039 --> 01:16:16.439
So I think she's great and I
think she should be used that way.

1057
01:16:16.479 --> 01:16:20.640
I think that you know what's probably
gonna happen is she's going to come up

1058
01:16:20.680 --> 01:16:26.399
and probably work Rhonda and they tell
that story of like the friend betraying her,

1059
01:16:26.479 --> 01:16:29.600
which you know, I guess it's
a layup and it's easy, and

1060
01:16:29.640 --> 01:16:32.640
that seems to be like what they
go with. But I like her.

1061
01:16:32.640 --> 01:16:36.439
I didn't see I gotta be honest. I stepped away during that match,

1062
01:16:36.479 --> 01:16:43.760
so I can't even remember if I
saw any of it. But nothing jumps

1063
01:16:43.760 --> 01:16:47.079
to my head about either of them
as far as evolution goes, So sorry,

1064
01:16:47.920 --> 01:16:51.039
sure, no no problem. What
I'm talking about the Battle Royal and

1065
01:16:51.119 --> 01:16:57.039
how that was handled with names from
the past mixed with current names, and

1066
01:16:57.560 --> 01:17:02.520
it seemed like it was a very
intricately bulk booked match. I assume you

1067
01:17:02.560 --> 01:17:06.159
were probably around for some throwaway Battle
Royals and a couple of row rumbles.

1068
01:17:06.239 --> 01:17:10.720
What jump out to you about how
how that to your eye played out for

1069
01:17:10.800 --> 01:17:13.680
the time that it lasted. Yeah, I liked it. I mean,

1070
01:17:13.800 --> 01:17:18.199
I the that that dance thing was
just it's embarrassing. Honestly to me,

1071
01:17:18.319 --> 01:17:23.560
that's embarrassing, but maybe it works
and maybe some people enjoyed it. I

1072
01:17:23.680 --> 01:17:27.760
was like, why am I watching
this? I liked the booking of it.

1073
01:17:27.840 --> 01:17:31.800
I thought that what was great about
it is that it's always fun in

1074
01:17:31.840 --> 01:17:35.520
those types of matches where you don't
know who's gonna win and you can kind

1075
01:17:35.520 --> 01:17:40.439
of give a case for you know, maybe at the time there's probably like

1076
01:17:40.560 --> 01:17:43.119
four or five left and you're kind
of like, oh, okay, well,

1077
01:17:43.199 --> 01:17:45.560
I mean I can kind of see
them going here and kind of see

1078
01:17:45.560 --> 01:17:48.560
them going there, which is always
good. We're usually in these in these

1079
01:17:48.600 --> 01:17:53.279
battle royals typically like not so much
with Royal Rumboy. I know they've done

1080
01:17:53.279 --> 01:17:55.520
it a couple of times, but
you kind of always end up with like

1081
01:17:55.560 --> 01:17:58.359
the whole like two heels versus one, and you're like, okay, I

1082
01:17:58.399 --> 01:18:00.680
kind of get where this is going. And one of them one of the

1083
01:18:00.720 --> 01:18:03.159
heels is one that you know for
sure isn't gonna win. Where in this

1084
01:18:03.199 --> 01:18:06.359
one, I thought it was great. It was odd. I mean,

1085
01:18:06.359 --> 01:18:12.439
I don't know if it's just that
they've had the other legends before so they

1086
01:18:12.439 --> 01:18:14.600
felt like, well, we haven't
had Ivory, so like, let's give

1087
01:18:14.640 --> 01:18:16.439
her that little moment. And maybe
they just kind of passed that around,

1088
01:18:16.600 --> 01:18:19.359
as you know, next time there'll
be a new one and that person kind

1089
01:18:19.359 --> 01:18:23.359
of gets a moment. But I
don't know. I would have liked to

1090
01:18:23.359 --> 01:18:25.760
have seen. If I have to
complain about something is I would have loved

1091
01:18:25.800 --> 01:18:31.520
to have seen. Look if Trish
or Leita or who else was in there

1092
01:18:31.560 --> 01:18:34.960
that was kind of a big name. Let's just use those two as an

1093
01:18:34.960 --> 01:18:39.600
example. Look, if those two
can go, why not set something up?

1094
01:18:39.880 --> 01:18:43.680
You know, like, why not
set something up between or Trish wasn't

1095
01:18:43.680 --> 01:18:45.760
in there. I'm sorry, right, No, they did a tag team

1096
01:18:45.760 --> 01:18:49.800
match. I apologize. You have
Michelle McCool right, who obviously seems eager

1097
01:18:49.840 --> 01:18:54.079
to want to kind of stay involved
a little bit. You can't commit full

1098
01:18:54.119 --> 01:18:57.239
time, but you have someone like
that who can go, who has name

1099
01:18:57.279 --> 01:19:01.319
recognition, or pick anyone and set
something up because again, if like you're

1100
01:19:01.319 --> 01:19:05.560
talking about evolution, it would have
also been like a great night to have

1101
01:19:08.119 --> 01:19:13.319
a Sasha Banks go over a Trish
or a Michelle McCool or Alita and just

1102
01:19:13.399 --> 01:19:16.680
kind of have a great match but
kind of show that you know it's it's

1103
01:19:16.760 --> 01:19:19.960
their time now, or build to
something. But I thought I thought it

1104
01:19:20.000 --> 01:19:25.079
was good. I think again nia
Jacks. I think was the only disappointment

1105
01:19:25.520 --> 01:19:30.039
that I had in her winning was
that we've seen that match before, and

1106
01:19:30.640 --> 01:19:35.359
I feel like it's one I don't
mind seeing a match again. I always

1107
01:19:35.399 --> 01:19:42.000
hate when you build up to something
and you're excited about you know, you

1108
01:19:42.039 --> 01:19:45.319
don't know where it's gonna go,
and then it ends up being something you've

1109
01:19:45.359 --> 01:19:49.399
seen before. Like so Nia Jacks
winning about Royal where two things. One

1110
01:19:49.479 --> 01:19:54.399
you could have built someone, which
I guess, fine, you give it

1111
01:19:54.399 --> 01:19:57.279
to Nia Jacks. But there was
there's no reason for me to a go

1112
01:19:57.439 --> 01:20:00.960
uh oh, look out Rohnda or
go oh, finally I'm gonna get this

1113
01:20:01.039 --> 01:20:04.960
again, because there was nothing from
that first match that really made you go,

1114
01:20:05.439 --> 01:20:09.640
I definitely need to see this again, or they didn't build anything for

1115
01:20:09.720 --> 01:20:14.520
me to go she's a threat or
that you know, there's a compelling story

1116
01:20:14.560 --> 01:20:16.600
already in place. So that part
to me was kind of like, ah,

1117
01:20:16.640 --> 01:20:19.359
okay, well you should have just
built someone new there, or get

1118
01:20:19.399 --> 01:20:24.760
someone excited for like a brand new
match, because it's not like they're building

1119
01:20:24.800 --> 01:20:28.800
that battle Royal as like a Royal
Rumble that will go down in history.

1120
01:20:28.920 --> 01:20:31.000
Is like, I'm gonna say this
person was a Royal Rumble winner, and

1121
01:20:31.039 --> 01:20:36.000
you want to put that on somebody, have a surprise when it that gets

1122
01:20:36.000 --> 01:20:42.000
people excited for that person to face
Rhonda, or have it set up so

1123
01:20:42.039 --> 01:20:45.960
that when you're going to give them
something they've seen before, that there's a

1124
01:20:45.039 --> 01:20:48.520
reason for me to care that I'm
getting it again. So it felt a

1125
01:20:48.520 --> 01:20:55.960
little like a lost opportunity. Yeah. I mean, if she would have

1126
01:20:56.000 --> 01:20:59.359
done something to end the show,
I think it wouldn't have been. But

1127
01:20:59.640 --> 01:21:01.680
to me at least, it did
feel like a lost opportunity. And I'm

1128
01:21:01.680 --> 01:21:05.680
not to say that you just give
it to anybody just to surprise people,

1129
01:21:05.720 --> 01:21:10.720
but you know, there had to
be someone in that match that could have

1130
01:21:10.840 --> 01:21:15.840
felt like, ooh, I really
want to see that now. Maybe you

1131
01:21:15.840 --> 01:21:17.800
know, I know a lot of
people are high on Ember Moon that could

1132
01:21:17.800 --> 01:21:23.720
have been. It hard for me
to remember everyone else in that battle Royal.

1133
01:21:23.840 --> 01:21:27.159
But as long as it makes sense, I'm not saying just have Ivory

1134
01:21:27.199 --> 01:21:30.560
win because no one would see it
coming. And I feel like they've done

1135
01:21:30.560 --> 01:21:33.640
that a lot like these past WrestleManias. Just give them a surprise where no,

1136
01:21:33.840 --> 01:21:36.880
if it makes sense, great,
but also give me a reason to

1137
01:21:36.920 --> 01:21:41.600
care that Naya Jacks won, or
give me a reason to look forward to

1138
01:21:41.640 --> 01:21:46.279
that, because in their first match, I think there was Alexa bliss Er

1139
01:21:46.359 --> 01:21:49.399
feared right, but I don't think
you really watched that and was like,

1140
01:21:49.720 --> 01:21:54.840
oh, okay, Naya is a
threat just because the way that she looks,

1141
01:21:55.039 --> 01:21:57.960
you know, I feel like WW
takes a lazy route sometimes like oh

1142
01:21:57.960 --> 01:22:00.880
my god, she's so big,
or she's so powerful, or she's so

1143
01:22:00.439 --> 01:22:04.520
this, Like that's enough for us
to make you care. It's it's not

1144
01:22:04.920 --> 01:22:09.319
like give me something, give me, give me something a little bit deeper

1145
01:22:09.359 --> 01:22:14.119
than that. So yeah, I
guess lost opportunity for me, but not

1146
01:22:14.159 --> 01:22:18.720
to necessarily say it was like the
wrong decision. And then finally tris Stratus

1147
01:22:18.720 --> 01:22:24.600
Alita Alicia Fox Mickey, James Mickey
was around when you were there, talk

1148
01:22:24.640 --> 01:22:30.720
about her a little bit and and
your thoughts on how they incorporated the return

1149
01:22:30.760 --> 01:22:33.000
of Trish and Leada is sort of
a feel good nostalgia moment from another era.

1150
01:22:35.079 --> 01:22:40.760
Yeah, I think that was one
of those where it's like, we're

1151
01:22:40.800 --> 01:22:43.760
going to give them to you so
that you can pop because they're here and

1152
01:22:43.800 --> 01:22:45.479
you grew up with them, and
but that's all it is. You know.

1153
01:22:45.520 --> 01:22:50.359
It wasn't like there was Trish was
going to put someone over or Lda

1154
01:22:50.479 --> 01:22:54.800
was going to put someone over.
It was just a fun here we are,

1155
01:22:54.960 --> 01:22:58.439
let's all be excited that we're here
and have a match. I think

1156
01:22:58.439 --> 01:23:03.159
that pre match proo was horrendous.
I think that the the acting of playing

1157
01:23:03.159 --> 01:23:06.239
it off was horrendous. I think
that the match was, you know,

1158
01:23:06.399 --> 01:23:11.039
it was cool. There was some
good spots in there. I think the

1159
01:23:11.279 --> 01:23:15.000
the Trish doing the or Mickey's up
on the top rope and she does the

1160
01:23:15.119 --> 01:23:17.960
hurrican Ron and then you block that. I thought that was a good spot.

1161
01:23:19.199 --> 01:23:21.640
But you know, it is what
it is. It was just you

1162
01:23:21.720 --> 01:23:25.640
got to see Tris Stratus and Leada
again. But I thought that it could

1163
01:23:25.640 --> 01:23:30.159
have been done in a more meaningful
way because I think there's money, and

1164
01:23:30.640 --> 01:23:32.680
you know, I think maybe this
is wrong with me sometimes, but I

1165
01:23:32.960 --> 01:23:38.359
do go back to like real life
sports sometimes, like if you have boxing

1166
01:23:38.479 --> 01:23:44.279
or you have UFC or MMA just
in general, but you can you had

1167
01:23:44.359 --> 01:23:47.640
someone from the past who was great
and you can bring them back to you

1168
01:23:47.680 --> 01:23:51.640
know, gsp I guess is kind
of an example now where you can have

1169
01:23:51.800 --> 01:23:59.960
those like dream matchups between those two. Why not use Trish to in either

1170
01:24:00.079 --> 01:24:03.119
in that situation or for the future, you know, mania or something where

1171
01:24:03.800 --> 01:24:06.720
those are the spots where you can
say, hey, look, we have

1172
01:24:06.800 --> 01:24:12.439
to fill fifty two weeks of television
plus however many pay per views that they

1173
01:24:12.439 --> 01:24:15.039
do twelve or even more. It's
it's tough for us to be able to

1174
01:24:15.119 --> 01:24:18.319
do what we did back in the
day and save things like you kind of

1175
01:24:18.359 --> 01:24:23.600
have to get to things or else
things start losing their appeal. Well,

1176
01:24:24.119 --> 01:24:27.640
then you have someone like Trish that
you could use in those spots. You

1177
01:24:27.640 --> 01:24:30.960
know, you can say, hey, as opposed to us getting to Ronda

1178
01:24:31.039 --> 01:24:35.479
versus Charlotte, now let's put Tricia
in that spot and we sell it as

1179
01:24:35.560 --> 01:24:41.319
like this was you know what many
consider to be the girl who kind of

1180
01:24:41.640 --> 01:24:45.279
was the first to break a barrier
or however, you tell the story,

1181
01:24:45.720 --> 01:24:50.479
and now she's facing the girl that's
on top now leading the revolution. Give

1182
01:24:50.520 --> 01:24:54.319
me something like that that's interesting.
I mean just to say, like,

1183
01:24:54.399 --> 01:24:57.560
let's get a pop out of them
appearing and then having just you know,

1184
01:24:57.600 --> 01:25:00.399
a fun match and them hugging at
the end. I don't really get what

1185
01:25:00.439 --> 01:25:02.840
that accomplishes. I think Mickey James
is great. I haven't seen a lot

1186
01:25:02.920 --> 01:25:08.600
of her lately. You know,
again, I preferred her more in like

1187
01:25:08.720 --> 01:25:14.840
the psychopath stalker of Trish Stratus kind
of character, because she played that so

1188
01:25:15.000 --> 01:25:19.640
well. Again, why can't Why
can't the characters be diverse? What makes

1189
01:25:19.640 --> 01:25:25.720
her any different than Alicia Fox or
Alexa Bliss or anybody else? There's nothing,

1190
01:25:26.159 --> 01:25:29.479
you know, create a character for
her and have her be something,

1191
01:25:30.199 --> 01:25:35.319
because I feel like people are sort
of maybe tired of her. I don't

1192
01:25:35.359 --> 01:25:40.319
know if it is the right word, but there's no reason to care about

1193
01:25:40.359 --> 01:25:44.560
her. So now you have two
people, you have a match that doesn't

1194
01:25:44.560 --> 01:25:46.920
mean anything with people in it that
no one cares about, and you're going

1195
01:25:47.000 --> 01:25:50.319
nowhere with it. It's just there
to fill time or to get you to

1196
01:25:50.359 --> 01:25:54.359
say, like I saw Trish on
television ten years ago, and now I

1197
01:25:54.399 --> 01:25:57.600
get to see her in person.
Okay, great, let's finish that up

1198
01:25:57.640 --> 01:26:01.039
and move on then, when you
can actually lie those people in the ring

1199
01:26:01.159 --> 01:26:11.520
to do something. Longing for some
nostalgia or maybe you want to learn some

1200
01:26:11.600 --> 01:26:15.680
wrestling history, don't miss the Nineties
Past Cast Every Friday on the PW Torch

1201
01:26:15.800 --> 01:26:20.439
Daily Cast Feed. Alex and Patrick
will transport you thirty years into the past

1202
01:26:20.840 --> 01:26:26.199
by taking you through the Torch issue
from that very week. Follow news from

1203
01:26:26.199 --> 01:26:30.079
the WWF and WCW and all the
happenings from across the wrestling industry in real

1204
01:26:30.119 --> 01:26:34.840
time as The Torch reported it thirty
years ago. That's the nineties Past Cast

1205
01:26:34.920 --> 01:26:50.279
every Friday on the PW Torch Daily
Cast Feed. Do you remember have any

1206
01:26:50.319 --> 01:26:55.479
memories of Alicia Fox back when you
were in WWF? She just yeah,

1207
01:26:55.920 --> 01:27:00.279
she seems like they've finally taken her
real self and decid I had to exaggerate

1208
01:27:00.319 --> 01:27:03.359
it, maybe slightly for television.
What what what do you think about her

1209
01:27:03.439 --> 01:27:06.159
upside then? And what do you
remember about how what she was like behind

1210
01:27:06.199 --> 01:27:10.880
the scenes and how she approached her
career? Yeah? Great girl, I

1211
01:27:10.920 --> 01:27:15.399
love her. She's great. We
I don't think I can't say like we

1212
01:27:15.520 --> 01:27:18.000
worked together a lot because there wasn't
a lot to do. But yeah,

1213
01:27:18.039 --> 01:27:24.880
I was there when she we did
the the Was it fatal four Way?

1214
01:27:25.000 --> 01:27:28.079
Was that the name of the pay
per view? Remember when everything was themed?

1215
01:27:28.239 --> 01:27:30.199
I can't remember if it was called
Fatal four Way, but that's where

1216
01:27:30.600 --> 01:27:38.880
uh yeah, whoever the champion was
at the time at Oh wow, that's

1217
01:27:38.880 --> 01:27:43.760
crazy, where like they legit put
the title on her because Vince said,

1218
01:27:44.079 --> 01:27:46.039
we're calling this fatal four way.
We have to make people think that,

1219
01:27:46.279 --> 01:27:48.760
you know, you shouldn't be able
to win a match in this, so

1220
01:27:48.960 --> 01:27:51.199
just give her the title. It's
like, wow, that's why we're handing

1221
01:27:51.239 --> 01:27:56.920
out titles now. But I don't
be honest, I don't understand what that.

1222
01:27:58.600 --> 01:28:00.279
Okay, So it's a fatal four
way, so the odds are against

1223
01:28:00.359 --> 01:28:03.359
the champion to win. So if
we're going to start branding this pay per

1224
01:28:03.439 --> 01:28:05.680
view, and I'm sure Vince thought
of it as like we're going to do

1225
01:28:05.720 --> 01:28:10.479
this every year for the next twenty
years, that you know, we need

1226
01:28:10.520 --> 01:28:14.560
people to go, oh wow,
I need to watch that because a champion

1227
01:28:14.560 --> 01:28:16.079
shouldn't win that kind of match.
And there you go. See it didn't

1228
01:28:16.119 --> 01:28:19.800
happen. The champion, and I
want to even say almost if we look

1229
01:28:19.880 --> 01:28:24.960
back at the results, maybe minus
like if there was an important champion working

1230
01:28:24.960 --> 01:28:28.119
on a different story, it didn't
happen. But I think they changed titles

1231
01:28:28.119 --> 01:28:31.279
in every match of a fatal four
way match. But even if they didn't,

1232
01:28:31.319 --> 01:28:35.119
the concept was we just have to
have a title changed hand so that

1233
01:28:35.279 --> 01:28:39.319
next year people go, I have
to watch that because the title change hands.

1234
01:28:39.479 --> 01:28:42.039
And I guess I'm not against that
as long as, like, Okay,

1235
01:28:42.199 --> 01:28:44.319
if that's what we're doing, we
shouldn't say it the day of the

1236
01:28:44.399 --> 01:28:46.720
event. Let's build towards that,
you know, Let's have a reason for

1237
01:28:47.199 --> 01:28:50.520
someone to be a champion, not
just say it because it is what it

1238
01:28:50.560 --> 01:28:54.680
is, and we're going to do
it that night with no explanation or reason

1239
01:28:54.720 --> 01:29:00.279
why this person is deserving of a
championship, but to be hones honest.

1240
01:29:00.359 --> 01:29:03.079
From what I've seen of her,
and again, I don't watch the weekly

1241
01:29:03.159 --> 01:29:09.239
shows that much. I don't see
a difference in what we presented her as

1242
01:29:10.319 --> 01:29:14.039
and what when she was champion,
where she got her you know, three

1243
01:29:14.079 --> 01:29:16.039
minutes every week, so you know, keep keep that in mind, but

1244
01:29:16.239 --> 01:29:19.199
I don't see her as being much
different than what I remember us presenting her

1245
01:29:19.239 --> 01:29:23.760
as at the time, and maybe
I'm missing something. Yeah, they just

1246
01:29:23.800 --> 01:29:29.479
they portrayed her as a little out
there and crazy and temperamental, and I

1247
01:29:29.720 --> 01:29:34.159
don't even know what what kind of
the adjectives to describe her. Very they're

1248
01:29:34.199 --> 01:29:42.199
treating her as very unconventional, unpredictable, and maybe a little flighty. I

1249
01:29:42.199 --> 01:29:45.880
don't know. Sure flighty's prbably the
wrong rote sure of herself, but very

1250
01:29:45.960 --> 01:29:50.079
unpredictable. And yeah, it's just
quirky and in a way that I don't

1251
01:29:50.119 --> 01:29:55.439
I think is amplified more than it
was five and ten years ago. Uh

1252
01:29:55.880 --> 01:29:59.359
yeah, I mean is it comedy
though, Yeah, it's played for comedy.

1253
01:29:59.479 --> 01:30:01.079
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's
not really like you're not building to

1254
01:30:01.119 --> 01:30:03.279
anything with their right with it?
No, No, I mean she was

1255
01:30:03.279 --> 01:30:06.560
a substitute for Alexa because Alexa got
hurt. So I mean she's more she's

1256
01:30:06.560 --> 01:30:13.800
more traded as an an oddity and
a sidekick than a serious fighter who is

1257
01:30:13.840 --> 01:30:16.239
a contender or even hopes to be
a contender. But you know, they

1258
01:30:16.279 --> 01:30:18.920
love having one of those on the
show. Oh totally always have to have

1259
01:30:18.960 --> 01:30:23.560
that. Yes, yeah, well, any anything else from Evolution stand out

1260
01:30:23.560 --> 01:30:27.039
that you want to comment about as
a as a production or individual performances,

1261
01:30:27.079 --> 01:30:30.800
commentary, anything that that you kind
of watch it, I'll do it.

1262
01:30:30.560 --> 01:30:34.000
I'll do it by asking you some
questions. When you see Tony Storm,

1263
01:30:34.039 --> 01:30:38.079
do you see a star? Yeah? Yeah, I think I think that

1264
01:30:38.119 --> 01:30:40.760
potential is. But just you look
at her, like the way it's presented

1265
01:30:40.800 --> 01:30:43.880
is you just look at her and
she's a star. Do you see that?

1266
01:30:44.680 --> 01:30:47.079
Yeah? I get it. Yeah, okay, yeah, okay,

1267
01:30:47.359 --> 01:30:50.000
I won't argue it. Yeah.
I mean, it's not saying she's not.

1268
01:30:50.279 --> 01:30:53.920
It's subjective. I yeah, I
think I think the way she cares

1269
01:30:53.920 --> 01:30:57.279
herself and the way she looks,
I think I understand that they want that

1270
01:30:57.359 --> 01:31:00.640
they want to see what they can
get out of her. And and and

1271
01:31:00.279 --> 01:31:04.000
she answered that match pretty banged up, and so she was good, don't

1272
01:31:04.000 --> 01:31:08.479
get me wrong, oh right,
but she adjusted her she adjusted her style

1273
01:31:09.079 --> 01:31:11.840
of match that she might have wanted
to have instead. Yeah. And again,

1274
01:31:11.880 --> 01:31:14.039
I don't want to take away from
saying that she can't be I just

1275
01:31:14.119 --> 01:31:16.680
because that was the first time I
had seen her from start to finish in

1276
01:31:16.800 --> 01:31:20.439
like an entire segment. And it's
like when they were pumping that I'm like,

1277
01:31:20.479 --> 01:31:24.760
I get why you're saying that,
but it's not translating to me.

1278
01:31:24.840 --> 01:31:28.479
Seeing her for the first time.
It's like I'm Whitney seeing this huge star

1279
01:31:28.560 --> 01:31:30.640
when it's like, they don't just
say that about everybody. So I just

1280
01:31:30.760 --> 01:31:35.800
was seeing yeah, And then I'll
ask the other one is Tamina Snuka,

1281
01:31:36.039 --> 01:31:40.159
Like do you at all fall for
it anymore? I mean, how many

1282
01:31:40.159 --> 01:31:44.039
times are they going to give her
five minutes to say, oh, oh,

1283
01:31:44.199 --> 01:31:46.439
this is a threat, and then
you never see her again, and

1284
01:31:46.479 --> 01:31:49.600
then when you do, she's losing
or whatever. And then she comes back

1285
01:31:49.640 --> 01:31:53.119
again six months later and they go, oh my god, here she is.

1286
01:31:53.119 --> 01:31:55.439
She's a threat, Like, is
it working with you? Well,

1287
01:31:55.600 --> 01:31:58.039
I think it's too early to tell
at this point. I think what she

1288
01:31:58.199 --> 01:32:00.560
was gone for a while and then
she came back. And what I applaud

1289
01:32:00.600 --> 01:32:04.600
them for is making it her.
If you're gonna have around television and she's

1290
01:32:04.640 --> 01:32:08.720
been around a while and there's some
recognition there, make her seem relevant.

1291
01:32:08.920 --> 01:32:12.239
There's something going on with your nia
Jackster telling a story. I do not

1292
01:32:12.359 --> 01:32:15.039
expect Temina to be a top star
nine months from now, or even a

1293
01:32:15.079 --> 01:32:19.640
particularly relevant top tier star nine months
from now. But what I like the

1294
01:32:19.680 --> 01:32:24.680
idea of is bring her back because
she's been defined down and defined as something

1295
01:32:24.680 --> 01:32:28.800
other than a central character in the
division. She's been gone a while.

1296
01:32:28.840 --> 01:32:31.119
That gives you that you can hit
the reset button then, And so I'm

1297
01:32:31.119 --> 01:32:34.840
an advocate for it's kind of what
you talked about earlier with Ronda. Have

1298
01:32:34.960 --> 01:32:39.239
to Mina look like she's got a
new attitude, a new determination. There's

1299
01:32:39.279 --> 01:32:42.720
some momentum there. She's got a
new attitude or fresh out, whatever you

1300
01:32:42.720 --> 01:32:45.199
tell the story why we should look
at her differently after she's been away.

1301
01:32:45.560 --> 01:32:47.760
Feed her to Ronda, build her
up as a threat, but have her

1302
01:32:47.760 --> 01:32:51.520
on a beat her And so now
you have a two month span where you

1303
01:32:51.520 --> 01:32:56.000
don't have to feed Ronda, Charlotte
or Becky or somebody you know, once

1304
01:32:56.039 --> 01:32:59.159
you get past Survivor series. To
me, just build up to Mina and

1305
01:32:59.239 --> 01:33:02.520
have Ron create a storyline where there's
a sense of jeopardy. People know better

1306
01:33:02.560 --> 01:33:04.960
if you know how the business works. But you get into the story and

1307
01:33:04.960 --> 01:33:06.520
you go, wow, this is
going to be interesting. This is a

1308
01:33:08.720 --> 01:33:11.479
challenger that we didn't expect that came
out of the blue, and she's on

1309
01:33:11.520 --> 01:33:14.720
a hot streak. Boom. Then
you have r on a beater beater decisively.

1310
01:33:15.199 --> 01:33:16.439
I don't feel like that was fooling
me. I feel like that was

1311
01:33:16.479 --> 01:33:20.039
telling a short story to bridge to
a more important story next year. Hey,

1312
01:33:20.119 --> 01:33:23.560
I'm fine with it. If that's
what they're doing. It's just funny

1313
01:33:23.600 --> 01:33:26.840
that it's always heard that, Like
I watch that, I don't think you're

1314
01:33:27.079 --> 01:33:31.159
laugh I will understand I'm saying that
like that, so I'm sorry, I

1315
01:33:31.159 --> 01:33:33.359
remember, but like I want to
be clear, I don't think that's what

1316
01:33:33.399 --> 01:33:35.279
I don't know. They're not doing
that. I think they're gonna do something

1317
01:33:35.279 --> 01:33:39.880
with Nya and Timina and maybe a
tag team. Not at that level.

1318
01:33:40.039 --> 01:33:43.279
Cool and if so, that's fine, But more it was more example wise.

1319
01:33:43.359 --> 01:33:45.840
I'm okay with bringing her back,
but it was sort of almost like

1320
01:33:45.880 --> 01:33:48.479
a dare or a challenge in a
way to say, to offset what your

1321
01:33:48.479 --> 01:33:53.520
criticism is, I think they should
push her hard, but not expect fans

1322
01:33:54.039 --> 01:33:58.680
to expect that to last a long
time. No no, no, yeah,

1323
01:33:58.920 --> 01:34:00.920
and then listen. I completely agree
with you that they if you're going

1324
01:34:01.000 --> 01:34:03.279
to use her and you have her, do something with her. But I

1325
01:34:03.319 --> 01:34:06.119
just think it's funny that this has
to be like the six or seven times

1326
01:34:06.119 --> 01:34:09.960
that they've tried to do that and
they just go nowhere. It's like,

1327
01:34:10.159 --> 01:34:15.439
let's use that for this one segment
or this or these few minutes, but

1328
01:34:15.039 --> 01:34:18.000
we don't really mean that we're going
to do anything with her. I find

1329
01:34:18.039 --> 01:34:21.520
it hilarious that they use her for
that. Yeah. The only other thing

1330
01:34:21.560 --> 01:34:26.199
is I think, honestly, after
watching Evolution and kind of seeing the roster

1331
01:34:26.279 --> 01:34:29.880
of girls that they have, they
should have their own show. Like,

1332
01:34:29.920 --> 01:34:33.239
I think that there's no reason with
the WW network why they as opposed to

1333
01:34:33.319 --> 01:34:36.520
like saying, hey, the girls
are at a point where they should have

1334
01:34:36.680 --> 01:34:43.079
a meaningful segment or you know,
two meaningful segments on the show. I

1335
01:34:43.119 --> 01:34:47.600
think they're I think they're at the
point where they have the draws to have

1336
01:34:47.640 --> 01:34:49.520
their own show, and I think
it should be one show. I think

1337
01:34:49.520 --> 01:34:51.840
it should be one champion. You
can have a tag team champion, like

1338
01:34:51.840 --> 01:34:55.720
you're even saying with you know,
you put together a Nyeana to Meena,

1339
01:34:55.760 --> 01:35:00.199
and there's so many other different clicks
that you see on air that you can

1340
01:35:00.199 --> 01:35:02.600
easily do that you could have a
secondary title. I think you do like

1341
01:35:02.680 --> 01:35:06.560
quarterly pay per views with them.
I think I think it would be a

1342
01:35:06.600 --> 01:35:12.680
great show. There's no reason why
it couldn't be successful, and then you

1343
01:35:12.680 --> 01:35:16.199
know, really showcase them. I
think that if like Fox or USA say

1344
01:35:16.199 --> 01:35:19.880
well we don't want you to take
Ronda or Charlotte or whoever it may be

1345
01:35:20.199 --> 01:35:24.560
off the show, there's no reason
why you can't have them, you know,

1346
01:35:24.720 --> 01:35:27.560
still be part of that and kind
of go like, hey, you

1347
01:35:27.600 --> 01:35:32.479
know, we are one company,
so you know, we can utilize talent

1348
01:35:32.640 --> 01:35:39.760
however we choose to. But this
girl comes from you know, whatever show

1349
01:35:39.840 --> 01:35:42.159
you call it. You know,
let's just say it's called Evolution. Well

1350
01:35:42.279 --> 01:35:45.159
this is this. You can see
her every week on the WW networker on

1351
01:35:45.279 --> 01:35:49.800
USA or wherever you do it on
Evolution. But you still are able to

1352
01:35:49.880 --> 01:35:54.399
use Ronda in whatever way to progress. Why not use raw to progress the

1353
01:35:54.439 --> 01:35:58.439
storylines that then you can tune into
Evolution to see I don't think there's anything

1354
01:35:58.479 --> 01:36:00.039
wrong with that, you know,
like almost like a cross promotion thing where

1355
01:36:01.199 --> 01:36:04.039
you know, like you have it
built in there with page where she can

1356
01:36:04.119 --> 01:36:08.640
just go, hey, you know, I wanted to book a segment on

1357
01:36:09.079 --> 01:36:14.399
the show tonight to showcase two great
women that were on Evolution last week,

1358
01:36:14.399 --> 01:36:15.880
and I wanted them to come here
on SmackDown, So I worked it out

1359
01:36:16.199 --> 01:36:20.159
and we have, you know,
a cross promotional thing here. I wouldn't

1360
01:36:20.199 --> 01:36:24.159
do it like how they used to
do it with like Ron SmackDown, where

1361
01:36:24.600 --> 01:36:27.199
they were brand splits, but they
weren't. But I also don't think that

1362
01:36:27.239 --> 01:36:30.640
this necessarily has to be considered like
a brand split. Just give them their

1363
01:36:30.640 --> 01:36:33.840
own show and then utilize them if
you need to on your other shows.

1364
01:36:34.159 --> 01:36:38.560
Yeah no, and I don't.
I don't think that's far fetched. Whether

1365
01:36:38.680 --> 01:36:43.840
it's on you know, f S
one or WWW Network Exclusive or some combination

1366
01:36:43.920 --> 01:36:48.119
of both. I think that fits
the way wwb's building their portfolio of hours

1367
01:36:48.159 --> 01:36:53.199
of original programming to use their corporate
speak. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

1368
01:36:53.840 --> 01:36:56.359
Jonas is great. Cool, Thank
you, Yeah, great, real good

1369
01:36:56.359 --> 01:36:58.119
discussion. I appreciate it. All
right, man, I'll talk to you

1370
01:36:58.159 --> 01:37:00.039
soon, all right, great,
John. You can hear a lot more

1371
01:37:00.039 --> 01:37:04.159
of John Pimerini in the archives on
the PW Torch VP website. If you're

1372
01:37:04.199 --> 01:37:11.000
not a VIP member, get full
information at PW torch vipinfo dot com.

1373
01:37:11.039 --> 01:37:15.640
So PW torch are prosing Torch and
subscribe Thanks to John Pimerini. Always pleasure

1374
01:37:15.680 --> 01:37:18.680
talking to him and getting his insight. I thought real good timing, having

1375
01:37:18.880 --> 01:37:23.680
since he watched Evolution this week and
was around during a very different era of

1376
01:37:23.680 --> 01:37:29.079
women's wrestling to convey his thoughts on
how things are similar and how things have

1377
01:37:29.199 --> 01:37:32.279
changed a lot since he worked for
that company for nearly two years, just

1378
01:37:32.319 --> 01:37:35.520
a half full of years ago.
All right, thanks everybody, until next

1379
01:37:35.520 --> 01:37:58.880
time. Wade Tellers signing off.
Invite you to email the show with feedback

1380
01:37:58.960 --> 01:38:03.800
or questions or comment. That email
address is Wadekeller Podcast at ptwtorch dot com.

1381
01:38:03.800 --> 01:38:09.319
That's Wadkeller Podcast at pwtorch dot com. Also welcome your feedback on Twitter.

1382
01:38:09.439 --> 01:38:14.239
Even follow us on Twitter at PW
torch and follow me at the Wadekeller.

1383
01:38:14.520 --> 01:38:19.880
That's at PW Torch and at the
Wadekeller. Searching for more great pro

1384
01:38:19.960 --> 01:38:24.840
wrestling talk, then join me Jason
Powell, host of the three weekly Pro

1385
01:38:24.880 --> 01:38:29.119
Wrestling Boom podcast. Each week you'll
hear the latest news and analysis from me

1386
01:38:29.199 --> 01:38:31.840
and my team at pro Wrestling dot
Net along with other pro wrestling media members.

1387
01:38:32.159 --> 01:38:36.439
Plus the Pro Wrestling Boom podcast features
long form interviews with notable names in

1388
01:38:36.479 --> 01:38:41.399
the pro wrestling industry. Subscribe and
iTunes, Stitcher, Downcast, and all

1389
01:38:41.439 --> 01:38:45.199
your favorite secondary apps, or visit
us directly at PW boom dot com.

1390
01:38:45.239 --> 01:38:51.000
Once again, that's PW boom dot
com. Thanks for listening to our podcast.

1391
01:38:51.039 --> 01:38:56.319
Did you know we also have a
website pwtorch dot com daily news updates,

1392
01:38:56.439 --> 01:39:00.720
editorials, and my live TV coverage
covering Raw Dynamite and and my live

1393
01:39:00.800 --> 01:39:05.199
pay per view coverage for WWE and
AEW. Create a tab or bookmark make

1394
01:39:05.239 --> 01:39:09.359
it a daily stop. Visit us
throughout the day every day to keep up

1395
01:39:09.359 --> 01:39:15.079
on breaking news and more. That's
PW torch dot com. Need an extra

1396
01:39:15.119 --> 01:39:19.079
dose of positivity in your wrestling podcasts, will come join me Alan fourrel Over

1397
01:39:19.119 --> 01:39:25.159
in the Progress Paradise at pterwboo Torch
VIP as we mask on the bright side

1398
01:39:25.199 --> 01:39:29.239
of wrestling and focus on some of
the great matches and shows from around the

1399
01:39:29.239 --> 01:39:33.399
world, be it US, Japan, Europe or Mexico. There's always a

1400
01:39:33.439 --> 01:39:38.640
place for wrestlings past in the Paradise
too, and we've done fun historical shows

1401
01:39:38.720 --> 01:39:44.359
such as the We Love Liger series
celebrating the glorious career of Jusian Thunderliger and

1402
01:39:44.399 --> 01:39:46.840
Our Eye was there when shows where
our guests will join me to talk about

1403
01:39:46.840 --> 01:39:51.079
a classic bout that they were in
attendance for. We love variety and you

1404
01:39:51.119 --> 01:39:57.520
can expect lots of it at the
Prorest Paradise. Detailed pw Torch VIP subscription

1405
01:39:57.600 --> 01:40:02.279
information and a list of all the
VIP the benefits is available at pwewtorch vipinfo

1406
01:40:02.399 --> 01:40:08.800
dot com. And yes, all
VIP podcasts are compatible with popular podcast apps

1407
01:40:08.800 --> 01:40:13.199
on iPhone and Android devices, or
you can stream them directly from our ad

1408
01:40:13.239 --> 01:40:17.319
free VIP mobile site. See you
in the Paradise. One way that you

1409
01:40:17.359 --> 01:40:21.199
can help us sustain our schedule of
putting out podcasts throughout the week is by

1410
01:40:21.199 --> 01:40:26.119
giving us a five star rating on
Apple Podcasts. Just go to Apple Podcasts

1411
01:40:26.159 --> 01:40:29.920
and look for our Weightkeller Pressing podcast
and Weight Keller Processing post show and give

1412
01:40:30.000 --> 01:40:32.439
us a five star rating. We
hope you think we've earned that score with

1413
01:40:32.479 --> 01:40:38.439
our fast turnaround times and our quantity
and quality of wrestling analysis throughout the week.

1414
01:40:38.600 --> 01:40:41.760
So take a moment out for us
and do us favor and give us

1415
01:40:41.760 --> 01:40:45.359
a five star rating and Apple Podcasts. That helps us on search returns and

1416
01:40:45.439 --> 01:40:47.479
helps us grow. And if you
want You can add a few comments about

1417
01:40:47.520 --> 01:40:50.520
what you like about the programs in
the comments section. Thank you so much.

1418
01:40:55.039 --> 01:41:00.560
In twenty twelve, NXT transitioned into
the developmental system and ultimately brand you

1419
01:41:00.600 --> 01:41:04.960
see today. On the Torch VIP
podcast NXT Eight Years Back, we'll be

1420
01:41:05.119 --> 01:41:11.319
taking a weekly look at this page
in NXT's early history. Join Kelly Wells

1421
01:41:11.359 --> 01:41:15.039
and me Tom Stout from PWT talks
NXT every Saturday as we go eight years

1422
01:41:15.079 --> 01:41:19.000
back to the day to track NXT's
rising talents and why they did or didn't

1423
01:41:19.039 --> 01:41:26.000
work out, exclusively for PW Torch
VIP members. PW Torch VIP membership doesn't

1424
01:41:26.039 --> 01:41:28.600
just give you ad free access to
these shows and a ton of other VIP

1425
01:41:28.720 --> 01:41:31.880
exclusive podcasts throughout the week, but
you also gain access to our unmatched vast

1426
01:41:31.960 --> 01:41:36.239
library of wrestling history, our contemporaneous
week to week coverage through our progressing Torch

1427
01:41:36.279 --> 01:41:41.239
Weekly newsletters dating back to the late
nineteen eighties, along with streaming and download

1428
01:41:41.279 --> 01:41:45.520
access to hundreds of retro radio shows
from the nineteen nineties, including some of

1429
01:41:45.560 --> 01:41:50.039
my interviews with wrestling's top newsmakers in
the nineties, and also our podcast library

1430
01:41:50.119 --> 01:41:54.520
dating back to the year two thousand
and three. There's no larger, longer

1431
01:41:54.560 --> 01:41:59.920
spanning pro wrestling podcast library than that
that comes with a pw Torch VIP membership.

1432
01:42:00.079 --> 01:42:03.159
Now we're approaching twenty years of podcasting. Go VIP and dive into our

1433
01:42:03.159 --> 01:42:06.840
post pay per view roundtables are covered
with some of your favorite eras of wrestling,

1434
01:42:08.279 --> 01:42:13.279
top name, long form interviews and
special format podcasts that we've done throughout

1435
01:42:13.319 --> 01:42:17.039
the years. Pw torch dot com
slash go vip. We have a streamline

1436
01:42:17.039 --> 01:42:19.880
sign up for me and you can
pay with PayPal or directly with your credit

1437
01:42:19.880 --> 01:42:23.920
card or debit card. In one
or two minutes from right now, you

1438
01:42:23.920 --> 01:42:27.520
can be a VIP member and diving
into our library. Pw torch dot com

1439
01:42:27.560 --> 01:42:31.279
slash go vip. This holiday season, you might be looking for nutritious,

1440
01:42:31.279 --> 01:42:36.000
convenient meals to keep you energized on
jam pack days. Factor, America's number

1441
01:42:36.000 --> 01:42:40.239
one ready to eat meal delivery service, can help you feel up fast for

1442
01:42:40.279 --> 01:42:44.640
breakfast, lunch, and dinner with
chef prepared, dietician approved, ready to

1443
01:42:44.680 --> 01:42:47.239
eat meals delivered straight to your door. Do you want to cleanse after eating

1444
01:42:47.239 --> 01:42:50.960
too much Halloween candy? Do you
want to have energy to deal with your

1445
01:42:51.039 --> 01:42:57.279
relatives and all the travel. Eat
nutrient dense food that's quick and easy.

1446
01:42:57.640 --> 01:43:00.239
With Factor meals, That's what I
do. Sometimes I'm just too busy to

1447
01:43:00.279 --> 01:43:03.039
cook on my busy schedule, and
I want to make sure I'm eating while

1448
01:43:03.039 --> 01:43:05.279
and with Factor, I don't have
to run at the grocery store. I

1449
01:43:05.279 --> 01:43:09.119
don't have to chop, prep and
clean up either, and I get flavor

1450
01:43:09.159 --> 01:43:12.399
and nutritional quality that I look for
to give me the energy to keep doing

1451
01:43:12.600 --> 01:43:15.239
what I do. It is cold
and flu season, and I thought over

1452
01:43:15.279 --> 01:43:19.000
time that when I've been eating while
I recover quicker from cold and flu symptoms,

1453
01:43:19.159 --> 01:43:21.119
and during this time of year,
you want to be able to get

1454
01:43:21.119 --> 01:43:25.279
out and do things without feeling like
you're going to be sick for two weeks

1455
01:43:25.319 --> 01:43:29.880
afterwards. The clean eating and nutrient
density and factory meals makes me more confident

1456
01:43:29.920 --> 01:43:32.079
that I'm going to fight back against
all the germs that are out there circulating

1457
01:43:32.159 --> 01:43:35.840
during this time of year. Factor
provides over thirty five weekly flavor packed,

1458
01:43:35.880 --> 01:43:40.720
fresh, never frozen meals that does
support a healthy lifestyle and will meet your

1459
01:43:40.720 --> 01:43:44.800
meal preferences with their variety, all
delivered right to your door and ready to

1460
01:43:44.800 --> 01:43:46.840
pull out of the refrigerator and heat
up and eat in two minutes. You

1461
01:43:46.840 --> 01:43:49.560
don't have to wait forty five minutes
for delivery, worry if the food's going

1462
01:43:49.560 --> 01:43:53.239
to be cold, worry about how
much to tip, and mess around with

1463
01:43:53.359 --> 01:43:56.039
the delivery app. Every week,
you get a box of meals and they're

1464
01:43:56.079 --> 01:43:58.520
in your fridge, ready to go. They also have an assortment of forty

1465
01:43:58.520 --> 01:44:02.199
five plus add ons to suit various
preferences and tastes, including breakfast items like

1466
01:44:02.199 --> 01:44:06.560
apple cinnamon, pancakes and smoothies.
With Factor, you can rest assured you're

1467
01:44:06.560 --> 01:44:10.960
making a sustainable choice too. They
offset one hundred percent of their delivery emissions

1468
01:44:11.079 --> 01:44:15.720
and source one hundred percent renewable electricity
at their production and site offices. So

1469
01:44:15.960 --> 01:44:19.680
this November, get Factor and enjoy
eating well without the hassle. Simply choose

1470
01:44:19.680 --> 01:44:24.880
your meals and enjoy fresh, flavor
packed meals delivered to your door, ready

1471
01:44:24.880 --> 01:44:28.720
in just two minutes, no prep, no mess. Head to Factor meals

1472
01:44:28.840 --> 01:44:32.680
dot com, slash weigh fifty and
use code weigh fifty to get fifty percent

1473
01:44:32.720 --> 01:44:39.119
off. That's code weighed fifty At
Factor meals dot com. Slash weigh fifty

1474
01:44:39.279 --> 01:44:40.640
to get fifty percent off