Really true. Welcome back to truth seekers from around the world. It is
time for another edition of the Flat Earth Files. We have a very special
guest tonight. He is one of the legendary pioneers of the modern flat Earth
movement. His video series Flat Earth Clues from twenty fifteen went viral and has
played a significant role in many people's journey to the truth. Oh. By
the way, that video series has millions of views and continues to grow every
single day. And you can catch Mark at flatober Fest twenty twenty three on
October twenty feet and twenty second at Sam'stown Hotel in Las Vegas, Nevada.
Conference hours are noon to ten pm both days. Ladies and gentlemen, the
one and only Mark, Sergeant Mark. Good evening. How are you,
sir, Hey, I'm good, Thank you very much. And by the
way, I am opening the conference on the first day, which means no
one's gonna remember anything that I do. Because the flatter the community likes to
drink and partake of all sorts of things, and what they don't realize and
we're trying to tell people now, and I'll mention on this show is like,
look, drink responsibly because as you know, Vegas is different from other
places. The bars don't close, so beforehand, you know, you know,
it's like last call, and then eventually you'd go home. Well,
you want to order six beers at three in the morning, you can do
that. I highly encourage you not to do that. Yeah, And the
other thing I want to mention was, yeah, the Clues are still getting
millions hits however the channel, but most of those hits are not even coming
from my channel. One of the reasons it went viral is because I made
the Clues Creative Commons license, you know, I made it free to everybody,
and three three just average run of the mill channels that look for the
Creative Commons licenses, you know, because if you say it's like, oh
great, I can put it on, I can get the nickels on my
channel. And they named it. They didn't put Flight Earth in the title.
One of them is called They're Hiding God or the Greatest Lie Ever.
One is called They're Hiding God with the Biggest Lie Ever with somebody stole from
somebody else that was stealing, and somebody called it Under the Dome full documentary.
Each one of them have millions of hits. And I don't know any
of these people at all, and I didn't know until probably five months later
after they first put their channel out because people saying, oh, I loved
your two hour movie. I was like, what what to hour movie?
You know? Because I only made like these little ten minute videos and someone
you know, of course, the Internet just mashed them all together released them
as a thing. It's like, hey, great, you made thousands of
dollars of it. I'm happy for you. So and but I get it
got the word out, so I'm not gonna complain. Yeah, And I
think that's the one cool thing about the truth community. Sometimes plagiarism is a
pat on the back, as they say, right, it's what I forget
the phrase, So imitation is the Yeah, imitation is the most sincere form
of flattery. And you're absolutely right. It happens to us all the time.
I like, it's part of my speech which I'm doing in the in
Vegas. The speech is going to be called flat earth is the real pandemic.
And I try to tell people as I look the top channels and flat
earth barely crack six figures, right, And those are the these guys have
been around like me. You know, I crack barely crack six figures.
I've been doing this for eight years, and yet every major channel on YouTube,
if you can think of them, I don't care who they are unless
they're movie reviewers. They've done a flat Earth video and and and with the
best and it gets millions of hits, millions of millions of hits. I
mean the number one I think was Shane Dawson with like forty forty million hits,
which is amazing. And what was amazing is all these channels did flatter
videos. Nobody talked to us. So these guys are getting huge amounts of
hits of our content and doing all this stuff, and it's you know,
and once one of them did it, they all did it, and yet
nobody subscribes toward channel. We are the and I don't know if you're old
enough to remember, we would be the Spice Girls of the conspiracy world.
Yeah, you're probably going, why what are you talking about? I go,
Spice Girls is the was the number one female pop band in the world.
I'm fifty four, without doubt with them. Oh you you do not
look it well, thank you very much. Seriously, you look a lot
younger than me and I'm fifty five. So, uh, it's number one
female pop band in the in the world. I have yet to meet anyone
that owns the album, so what happened? Point a lot of people bought
it. None he's going to admit to it, that's yeah, come on,
I mean they made two two blockbuster movies. They were so huge,
right, and like, yeah, that's that's what we are. Lots of
people are into flat Earth. Very few people will admit it in public.
Ninety percent of our our membership is still in the closet, which I love
that I hate simultaneously the we're that secret army that's out there. Yeah.
So just a little backstory about myself. I've had a podcast called The Fact
Hunner for four years and probably within the first four or five months into the
podcast, David Weiss sent me an email and I'm like, what kind of
nutcases emailed me about the flat Earth? I deleted it, but the curiosity
got the best of me. I pulled him back. I contacted him and
I brought him on, and actually I think he had a video from Triple
seven. So by the time I brought him on, I was wide awake
to flat Earth and It changed my life. And I had David Weiss on
the podcast, and I was like so excited because I'm sharing this new found
information to my audience. Guys, guess what this Heliocentian thing is a lie?
And I wake up the next morning and check my email and I'm like,
you're a moron. I'm never listening to your podcast again. I had
no clue how divisive Flat Earth was in the truth community. Was that something
that you knew going in? Yeah, well I did because I was one
of the early people that got into it. I was into it when nobody
was into it. In fact, David was lucky enough he got into it
just as the documentary, the Netflix documentary was wrapping up, so he didn't
get to be part of it. And I think secretly, behind the scenes,
he's like, oh, thank god kidding it there because everyone that was
in on it just got nailed to the wall. Yeah. However, had
you had me on, I would have talked to you out of it,
because it's one of the things that I tell people every holiday season. I
say, Okay, here's what's gonna happen. Everybody. It's Thanks Gavin's coming
up, and you're gonna want to go home. You're gonna want to sit
down everyone at the table or your carving turkey or whatever. You're gonna want
to say, Hey, what's new in your life, Bob, And you're
gonna want to say, oh, let me tell you what I'm into a
flat Earth. Right, you've got to understand your context. You've got to
understand the room, which it looks. You might as well tell people you've
changed your religion, your sexuality, and you're a heroin addict simultaneously. Right.
In fact, it would be easier for them to understand because I've had
horror stories come back. Because again that one of the drawbacks of flat earth
is once you once you flip, once it's in your head, it's in
there forever. However, simultaneously you've forgot the journey that got you there.
You know, it may have taken you four weeks, it may have taken
you five weeks. And then it's kind of like a like a children's puzzle,
and it's like, you think, so simple, I should have known
this in the beginning. You know what, I can convince a family member
over a coffee. It's like, in fact, I'm gonna try to do
that because it's in my head. I see all the pieces into when you're
talking to a family member, Yeah, they're gonna look at you like you've
got a bug on your face. Yeah, and they do. So.
Yeah, I'm sorry you had to go through that, because for me it
wasn't that bad. Because what I did was when I made the clues,
I put the challenge out there to anybody. I said, look the internet,
hive mind, here's all my contact information, which is such a great
idea. Put all your contact information online, docks yourself. It's a great
idea. No, I don't recommend that. I definitely, even women should
never ever do that regardless. And I said, okay, I can't prove
the globe in a court of law anymore. Tell me where I went wrong.
Somebody come back at me and hit me. You know, I just
basically stuck my chin out there. And the people that came at me weren't
the trolls, not right away. It was the subject matter experts, people
in the military and structural engineers and air traffic controllers and pilots and stuff like
that, and then of course the media, weird media stuff. I didn't
know what the hell media was. I never worked with a field producer before
or anything like That's so when I'll give you a Rob Skip a story,
you may have heard this one or maybe not, because you know, Rob
was one of the first people to interview me, and you know, because
I ruined his life and I was his excuse. So when he would bring
when he would do the public public presentations, I was his insurance policy.
He would bring up one slide he was. He would always say, I'm
ninety eight percent sure has this all goes south? It's this guy's fault over
here, right, put a picture up of my clothes. I was the
fault guy. And so I remember one of the producers from Coast to Coast
contacted me almost immediately and said, oh, hey, okay, you know,
tell me what about flat earth blah blah blah, and and they I
go, oh, they go, what's your name of your book? Can
I go, I don't have a book right, this is twenty fifteen.
And they go, okay, what's the name of your DVD? And I
go, I DVD don't don't have one of those either, and and and
she and she's like you could hear getting frustrated on the other end. She
said, okay, what's name of your freaking website? And I go,
look, I've been doing this for maybe five weeks, right, And and
she's gone, why am I talking to you? How can you called me
go out of the blue only only because my docs myself. So we worked
it out and she goes, okay, give me the Nickel tour. She
goes, go I go, okay, here's flatter song and dance blah blah,
and she goes, all right, you're on right, And then I
remember I knew there was something going on because Rob asked me shortly after I
got on TFR. He uh, because TFR after me a show, like
after the second interview I did with Rob. They just called me up and
they said I would like to be on TFR. Go okay, and Rob
asked me, he goes, He goes, how many times you have to
solicit to coast to coast before they let you on? And I go,
solicit? What are you talking about? He goes, Well, he goes,
I've been trying to submit to them for like two or three years.
I can't. I can't get on the freaking shell. And I go,
uh, yeah, he do anything, Which is why again, if I
ever lived long enough to write an autobiography. And I'm still and my options
on that one. It's gonna be called unsolicited because for whatever reason, I
never had to pick up a phone. It just it just That's how I
knew something was going on, because it just happened. People were just calling
you right and left. It's like, hey, how would you like to
do this? Hey, how would you like to publish a book? Hey?
You know? And then the Netflix thing went in a completely never and
even when we were shooting Netflix for the thing for seven months, but none
of the producers had any faith in it at all, to the point where
it's like, well, we're never gonna get film festivals and we're definitely not
gonna be able to sell it right as and like every film festival they applied
to, they got in instantly to the point where they were sending me out
to film festivals, which is a terrible idea. They actually had me on
people webcaving me, live streaming me live to watch me to make sure I
can say the wrong thing and go completely off on the weeds. They want
to know exactly what I was saying. And then when and then all of
a sudden, you know, Amazon bought it immediately, and iTunes and then
finally Netflix. And yet kind of like you when Netflix bought my email low
doubled in a weekend and I was already getting a lot of emails and then
all of a sudden, you know, my email was just flooded with stuff
and I'm writing people. It's like something happened I don't know about. It's
like, dude, that Netflix picked up the movie. It's like, oh
God, anyway, Sorry, I ramble, so please put me out of
the weeds from time to time. That's awesome. Hey. One thing that
resonates with a lot of people in the big part of our podcast is we
asked our guests to explain your journey to the truth, like it, were
you into conspiracies beforehand? What was your life coming up? And what were
your influences? Yeah, and then of course the step how did you come
upon flat Earth? Okay, so my life was fairly I don't want to
steal this speech from Austin Powers, you know, you know, lose lessons
summers in Rangoon where I was beaten with reads when I was tied up in
a burlap sack. No, I grew up in uh the Seattle on a
rural island in the middle of nowhere. I didn't know anything about. It's
very naive, very sheltered. Didn't even know there was more than one religion
until the laughter. I left and kicked out of university in my junior year
for manufacturing explosives on campus. It's absolutely true, which was basically, look,
I was running a legal fireworks company on on campus and I got hit
for it by the it's it's it's a slap in the rest. The first
time you get hit. You don't want to get hit twice. It's basically
a fireworks charge because I legal fireworks have only been illegal since really the sixties.
And then during my community service because I knew a lot of teachers because
I grow up and basically a teacher's lounge because my family was teachers. I
was teaching kids computers early computers back in the early nineties, okay, And
and then entered a video game World Pinball tournament Digital Pinball from a little company
out in Tokyo called Little Wing. Won the tournament. It was a year
long tournament. I'm not going to tell you how I want it. It
takes a little while, but I did bend the rules a bit. I
got the scores, but I bent the rules to where I basically finished the
tournament six months before it was even over, and then kind of slipped in
scores because again we'll talk after and and then part of my prize was to
review one of their next games. I didn't like it very much at all,
and I wrote this scathing review. Who knew that I that I could
do I could review video games, And the developer from Tokyo says, yeah,
he's absolutely right, because we gotta make all these changes. It's like,
you should hire this guy. And they did wow, and they were
out. They were out in Boulder, Colorado. So I went out and
interviewed for the job and they hired me on the spot. Went out to
Boulder, Colorado on my own and did my own thing out there for twenty
years to where I was playing video games for this company. I was a
ringer for the company, so I would go out to the conferences like World
Boston, a mac World, sad fran and E three and stuff like that
and make the games look better than they were. I was, you know,
a game gamer ringer, but this was I was one of the early
people to ever get hired to play video games for a living. But this
wasn't your you know, the tournament kids that you have now, this was
a desk job, right. I was working. I was a working man,
you know, if you can call it that, I sure, but
I had I had all gamer friends. And then when that that finally ended,
I taught proprietary software in Boulder, Colorado for the rest of those twenty
years. And during that time, I never got married, had kids,
So I had huge amounts that you're old enough to remember this, you know,
back when you could finish the internet, right, the internet was you
know, we had dial up and there're only so many sites that were out
there. Yeah, right, and so and if you don't have you get
married or have kids, you have huge amounts of free time on your hands.
So I went down just about every rabbit hole you think of. I
have an opinion on just about every conspiracy there was, and I went through
and I only did I finish the Internet, finished all the conspiracies by the
time I was I don't know, forty five, and to where I was
starting looking to stuff that I never would have looked into before, you know,
you know, like you know, are is the Royal family, lizard
people, you know it did? Did Elvis have Bigfoot's baby and crap like
that, you know, the stuff that I haven't opened. Serious, I
haven't opined on every conspiracy you could think of, but I would not look
at flat earth. Flat earth was just stupid, Yeah, because everyone it's
the only thing we debunked to children, which should be a flag in itself.
It's like, why is it the only thing that's like, Oh,
hey, kids, I know you're just old enough to form a conscious thought,
but you used to be flat Now it's a globe. Globe is gonna
sit in the corner of your classroom forever, right right below the American flag
usually and again a wonderful reinforcement. The CIA pays top dollar for that sort
of conditioning. And that's so I didn't look at it. I didn't look
at it. And then finally, in summer of twenty fourteen, I gave
up. I was like, all right, I'm not getting any younger,
I might as well freaking look at it, right so so, but but
I was on and the only reason I even looked at it at all was
I was looking at hollow earth theory with Admiral Bird and he came up and
Admiral Bird's like, oh, hollow Earth three. I like the whole Journey
at the Center of the Earth thing I already watched. No, I mean
everybody's watched Journey to the Center of the Earth movies has been those things have
been around forever. And that led me to Antarctica. And when as I
was looking more, I kept seeing this whole flatter thirty flatter three and there
were not a lot of people talking about it. And then and I was
going, well, I can knock this thing out, this piece of kick
and ever again everybody starts out in the negative. Everybody hates flatterer. David
Weiss would ban people. He probably told you that one. But you would
ban people from chat if they even brought it up. It's like lifelong band
and gone, you bring up flatter. Alex Jones did this day. You
know, doesn't want people to talk about flat Earth. I mean he's just
dragged, kicking and screaming into some of the interviews we did with him.
So finally, after nine months of looking at this thing, you know,
the days turned into weeks, which started into months, and the beginning of
twenty fifteen, again I had that Jerry McGuire moment. People think, oh,
it's just a movie. It's not just a movie. It happens where
I woke up in the middle of the night and I had the narrative in
my head. I was wrestling with it. It's like, wait a minute,
you know, if I could go with the other way on this,
maybe I can get my answers if I say, if I if I make
a series of videos, well we'll just start out with one video. I'm
gonna put it out there to the internet hive mind and say, hey,
Internet hive mind, tell me where I'm wrong. And so I got up
at literally three o'clock in the morning, and it was weird. And some
people call it and what prophetic or touched or whatever. But I could hear
all the dialogue in my head, in my own voice, you know,
the whole the whole thing, paragraphs, just and I've never had such clear
writing before. Where I sat down type and then the whole Forrest Gump thing
kicked in its Well, I'm done writing, it might as well narrated.
So I grabbed a stupid you know, twenty dollars mic, you know,
gaming mic, because that's all I had, and recorded it and then I'm
like, wow, I recorded him as let some images to it. It
took me all day. I didn't know anything about video editing. If you
guys watched the original you can probably tell the way I cobbled it together.
I mean, it's amazing, you know. It took me all day to
make a freaking ten minute video, and that happened every day for a week.
I made the first seven clues in eight days, and it was cathartic,
meaning I could go to sleep, but I wake up, you know,
pretty early five six am, and I was like, oh no,
I've got another idea, and I would I would write some more and then
put it out there. And by the time it was done, I had
a couple hours worth of videos called the Flat Earth Clues, and as I
was releasing them, things started to happen. People again, people you know
who you know, Well, you may or may not remember who this guy
is. You know, the first guy who contacted me was that Matt Boyland,
the guy from the really Loud Canadian artist from the Netflix documentary You can't.
A lot of people don't noise because he didn't make a lot of content,
but he was this really loud, really eccentric guy who tried his luck
with acting. He was a comedian. He was an actor out of Los
Angeles, but he's from Montreal, Canada. Bo Y l a n Boiland
Boiland boiling. And he contacted me after like clue two. Talk about good
instincts and he's like, yeah, you know, I like what you're doing,
blah blah blah, and he had some ideas about collaboration, but his
head was all over the place, so it never really happened. But yeah,
he was literally the first guy that contacted me. And then they just
kind of started snowbawling. So there you go. That's my my little journey,
how I How I got here? And that was eight years ago.
There we are three books, documentary, I don't know how many conferences,
I don't know how many meetups and again another conference coming up. So I
mean this was one of the events. I mean, this is one of
the biggest events that changed your life. Oh yeah, without without question.
That's saying something coming from where I was. I mean, you know,
I was, you know, from running a legal fireworks operation and count on
campus to becoming a professional video game player. This is octaves above that right.
I mean this this because this, because this affected other people. No
one cares about wont a video game tournament, right, trophy, show trophy
and all sorts of people. No one cares the fireworks thing. It's an
interesting story, good at parties, but that's about it. But if you
go out and say, hey, you know what flat earth? If you
say that seriously, like and like not ironically to people, you'd be amazed
the ripples it creates. I mean, the pullarizing two words I've ever seen
in my life. To the point again, where were you and I were
talking to the show every It was so polarizing that the rumors got around the
social media world and everybody. It's like, dude, you want to get
a bunch of quick hits and amazing amount of comments, you know, polarizing
comments, ten times the comments you would normally get due to a freaking flat
earth video, don't take a stand, or if you're gonna take a stand,
go against it and watch what happens. And that word spread around to
where I mean getting you name it. I mean I knew when Beauty Pie
did two of them that I was in trouble, or the fact that Logan
Paul and I was one of the only guys even knew who he was at
the time, showed it, you know, tried to punk one of our
conferences, and then the very next confidence in Dallas, we were punked by
Jimmy Kimmel and it's like, okay, now we're we're going into territory.
We were, we were going flying without a net most of the time.
So but again it was that's that's the sort of thing that degenerates. And
I do love it, but yes, it has changed my life forever.
But at the same time, all I really did was say yes, where
a lot of people didn't. And I get criticized a lot at least,
you know, when he came on, it's like, aren't you an agent?
Do you work for the government? Which people have accused me up for
so often, and I try to remind them. I go, you know
why I get the interviews, you know why people get a hold of me
because I put my name in my phone number out there. It's not hard.
Now again, women can't do it because men are idiots. But it's
amazing how many guys again still use no offense to you or any people you
know, still use complete aliasis and don't put it. You want people to
get a hold of you. The media would I try to explain, is
media is lazy. Not necessarily you, but I mean mainstream. If mainstream
was like, hey, we needed to do a story on a flat earther,
if that whatever, intern or low level producer, if they can't,
they're all they're gonna do is do a quick search. If they can't find
anybody in the first ten minutes, you know, they're going for the top
of the list, whatever's there. They'll literally type in flat Earth interview and
see what shows up, which is again, I'm happy that Dave is doing
as many as he does. He's of course killing it. My gosh,
he's doing like twenty week Yeah, yeah, he's why. I mean,
I only think he even knows how many he's done. I definitely know he's
into four figures, you know, over a thousand interviews. But the difference
was, again, I wouldn't trade places with them when when it comes to
this is that he would contact people, or he would have people contact people,
you know, right, contact just about every podcast you could think of.
The problem with that is, you know, so when when people contact
me, they want to talk to me they're generally curious, and they don't
want to They don't want to attack me most of the time. I'll see
how tomorrow's goes, we'll say, but most of them they don't want to
attack me because they again, they're they're worried. It's like, oh crap,
we attack him. Who else are we gonna get when David goes.
When David exlicits people, you run into occasionally podcasts that will they'll be in
a in one of those moods. You can't still be in the wrong mood,
right. It's like, hey, hey, Frank, you want to
talk to some flat earth. They say, oh, yeah, I want
to talk to some flatter I'm gonna give him a piece of my mind.
And he they do. They come after him and he has developed a very
very thick skin, to the point where his interviews style has has changed.
He has become what I call like a gypsy science teacher. What he does,
it's it's really clever in a way. But I know, I know
it wasn't planned. It just it was just a survival instinct, which was
he figured out that the best, you know, the best defense is a
good offense. So he will remind people very quickly on how much they don't
know about science, right, And it's a it's a great line to where
I'm stealing some of that stuff even now, which is you know, I'll
you know, I'll go to I won't do it as abrasive as he does.
It's like, you know, do you know how fast the Earth is
you know, you know, spinning, and how fast is going around the
Sun, how fast the Solar system is flying sideways? You know how fast
that you know the galaxy is going through the universe. And and the point
he gets to, you know, eventually it's you know, after her reminds
me, it's like, hey, you don't know all of these things,
right, so why are you defending it blindly defending heliocentrism blend, Why why
are you defending a model that you don't know right? You are making a
massive assumptions just based on you know, all you're saying is the model,
right, And it's like, well, you can't just say the model.
You can't just say science, and you definitely can't just say gravity. So
but but again, that's what I love is he puts them on their heels
enough to where, yeah, he's still gonna get pushed back, but but
they will. That kind of is humbling in a way because it's like,
oh, crap, I didn't know all these things. I'm really surprised that
more people. Again, media is lazy that they don't listen to at least
one or two. Sometimes they do. Sometimes they're ready for him memorize some
of the factoids that we had to memorize to where if you because you knowing
that at least you can come back and but while sorry, let me let
me back up just a second. If you, as you're knowing these things,
as you're relearning all these little science factoids, you all of a sudden
realize, hey, wait a minute, as you're doing your own math yourself,
you know you're or you're working out the system, You're like, hey,
that doesn't make sense. How how is this happening? If if again,
we make massive assumptions, let me end with this the Truman Show line
is so very very true, which is, we believe the world that is
presented to us. If somebody in a higher authority that you think is smarter
than you, which you should never make that assumption immediately, if if they
say, oh, yeah, the world is something we're not talking to me
about a mechanic telling you it's like there's something wrong or your radiator. Right,
you probably believe he's been working on radiators a long time. But do
you have you have somebody that says, oh, hey, by the way,
the sun is ninety three million miles away, and it's and it's so
many thousands of miles. Why it's it's this massive thing even though they've never
been there, we've never had probe sent there or anything. And you know,
they're basing it off of books which are based off of other books,
the Tesla line. You know, the flaw with science is everything is stacked
on top of each other, and everybody that goes one more rung up.
They never checked the base. They never checked the core foundation that it was
based off of. He goes. By the time you get up like five
or six, it's like it's meaningless because nobody checks anything below it. They
just make the assumptions like, well, the science that I am working that
I am climbing on top of, that's got to be right. Okay,
really it's sure about that. It's like just lazy anyway, Sorry, No,
that's that's great. I want to ask you a question. I have
noticed just within the last three or four years that the term flat earth has
not been quite as divisive within the truth community, and I was shocked to
see that when I started this podcast, the amount of numbers that we were
getting and the responses. So do you think I've said for a long time,
I do think that they And I'll ask you that question later who was
they? But do you think they overplayed their hand with the COVID narrative to
the point where they accidentally woke a lot of people up? Because I have
seen I get emails all the time, and one of the common emails I
get mark is COVID woke me up. I saw the lies that they continuously
lied. They tried to brought me with the cheeseburger to take a vaccine and
you know, the joint for jabs, and just the three years of ridiculousness
to where I think people started to understand that maybe they are lying to us.
Do you see the connection between the lives of COVID and people waking up?
Yes, yes, they do the COVID thing unfortunately. And I don't
want to get you into too much trouble. Whatever you want, as simple
as I can here. Well, no, I mean because if this,
if the audio goes up on YouTube, I don't want to flip the sensors.
So I'll say shots and I won't use the word, you know,
I'll just stay vax or vax or whatever it is. It won't people up.
From our standpoint, it stunted us in one sense because we couldn't do
conferences anymore, because we couldn't find venues that would that would go without a
mass for the most part, we couldn't do a national conference. We definitely
couldn't do anything international. Twenty nineteen, for example, we were freaking golden
twenty nineteen. We could do no raw and I did conferences in seven different
countries and you know, did an endorsement. I did a mobile commercial in
freaking Australia. Really it was. It was awesome. Oh yeah, we
were doing I mean there, let me let me tell you how quickly,
how harshly things can get closed down. I had gone to London to do
a conference right in the UK, and then came back. A producer from
a morning television show called me and said, hey, we need you to
fly back out to London working at you do a show. It's like really
from the Seattle he just got back. It's like, oh wait, wait,
we'll pay for It'll be fine. So I, you know, bounce
off of Iceland and go over there again and then come back. And as
I'm back and somebody else calls me up and they say, hey, we'd
like you to do a McDonald's commercial in London. I go, really,
I go, how's that going to work? And they go, oh,
because we had pancake Day here and you know, it's routed, it's flat.
It'd be awesome. We'll work the graphics and it'll be solid. And
it's like, oh, this is great. I mean, seriously, it
was gonna be if you thought that I caught crap before. If I would
have actually done McDonald's commercial, people would have crucified. It's yeah, and
uh no, I've told people. I go, look, you, if
you tie me to a chair and throw pies at me, right and I
get to say flat earth on camera, I don't care what you do as
long as it's still flat earth based. In fact, in fact, the
mobile commercial, they even tried to do a take with me where I was
renouncing flatter earth and I said, sorry, I can't even do it as
an outake, I can't not do it. So but when I got back,
right, you know, and I knew because as I was flying back,
as I was getting on the plane back from the the London thing from
the Morning Show, there was a lady with a clipboard walked up to me.
Again talk about your foreshadowing movie moment where she looks, she goes,
She goes, so have you been to China in the last two weeks?
I go, I go, I go. You know, I didn't know
anything. He's like, no, why and she goes, never in check
she walks away, and then of course, you know, but then the
borders closed, so I mean, so everything was ready to go, and
then all of a sudden, yeah, sorry, you're not going to London
because nobody's going to London. And that was it. And then you know,
three years later, now did it stunt is yes, But at the
same time, because again human nature, you know, people ran out of
things to watch, you know, literally, I mean, how many people
never would have thought I would have run out of things to watch on Netflix?
Right, It's okay to the point where I like today, I think
I've got a season and a half left of Supernatural, which I had never
watched. People don't understand. That's fifteen season kids, right, that's all.
And that's twenty two episodes of season. That is a huge catalog.
And I'm going through it because why the hell not? I got nothing else
to watch? So what else? What else were people doing? Well,
unch up YouTube on your television and start going down in rabbit holes, and
so people were getting woken up to a whole bunch of things. Why not
because you know it's different now because everybody else's home, so you're recommending to
other rabbit holes to people. So flat Earth came into it, and so
they slowed us down in one sense, but they give it brought us broader
exposure in another, to where now everybody knows that the flat earth is a
thing. Beforehand, they knew the term, but they didn't know what it
meant. Now it's a thing. To where I was telling somebody recently that,
you know, I've done a lot of school interviews, which David doesn't
get to do. I talked classrooms. They call me up, really and
I go, and I It's like, how I go, How exactly am
I talking to a classroom? Right? And they say, well, because
we watched the documentary, and I go what, It's like, oh yeah,
it's it's required. It's on the syllabus. Wow, It's like what.
And and the reason is is because once it's on Netflix, and Netflix
is generally you know safe, you know, unless it's got an Our rating.
It's like no, that's mainstream media approved. And so it's like,
no, no, we're just anything fringe on YouTube. We're having them watching
Netflix documentary. And and so I talked to so many classes that would I
mean so many classes that would say the same thing. It's like, oh,
yeah, we were required to watch the documentary. I mean, David
and I just did. There was a girl two weeks ago from Sweden.
She's doing her dissertation on it, not the documentary, but the flat Earth
in general. And she's not the first one. So now yeah, so
it's it's it's permeated everything. So the pushback, Yes, of course,
there's still good people. The average person going into it's still going to go
into the five stages of acceptance and denial and anger. You know, it's
still out there, and we've got some dedicated trolls. But I think some
of the trolls are just trolling us because they can't flip, you know,
once you're dedicated troll, and once you have your established viewer base, you
can't flip because you'll lose the base. So now they have to be a
troll forever. That's right. And I still think Joe Rogan to an Stent
is one of those guys. He was a truther and then he was given
a big payout to get away from the truth or community just before we came
into play, and Flatters would have been so fun for him. And so
I feel bad, you know, because he'll he'll bring it off and off
comments, He'll he'll throw it a guess, he'll try to be the the
antagonist. But I know full well that back behind closed doors, there's all
sorts of people that are again closet flat earthers that just can't say it because
they don't want to for either sponsorship reasons or they're base or both. They
don't want to they don't want to deal with the hassle. Yeah, you
mentioned Netflix. It's funny. I don't know if you're aware of it or
not, but one of the CEO's the guy's name is Mark Randolph. He
is directly related to Sigmund Freud. And even funny enough, Edward Burns,
who I don't know if you know who Edward Burnes is, but he was
the king of propaganda. Oh no, I watched that documentary that that multipart
series about him. Yeah, yeah, and he was one. You know
what what I remember about that series is he had such the deeper he got
in the more he learned about how to market to human psychology, the more
heat found humans contemptible. Yeah, you know the lines like they're all idiots.
It's like, just tap into that idiot, you know, part of
it, and you can make them basically do anything. And sorry he would.
Yeah, the father of modern marketings. Yeah, yeah, and he
wasn't he wasn't he the one that that helped God was it getting women into
smoking yea torches for freedom or something like that. Yeah, they really busted
out their cigarettes and let them up. Yeah. And he was the dude
behind putting fluoride and water and of course the again who would have known that
the again, one twenty percent of people smoke anyway, But the one of
the biggest pushes was just in implementing a pack of cigs into military rations for
world yea boxhol You're hot jacked up. You've got nothing better to better smoke
up, Jenny, Yeah, trustman, I smoked a lot of heaters when
I was in the military. You're else and yeah, you're trying to kill
a lot of time. They actually had. They kept them in their MRIs
through Vietnam, and I think the mid seventies they cut them out. You
know it's well they had to after that. Oh yeah, for sure,
for sure. Oh which, well, sorry, let me throw one more
thing ahead before before he gets there. It's a little quick story. It's
tied to the whole shot thing. Cigarettes reminds me of this because you know,
people say, oh, you know, you don't take the whole pandemic
very seriously. I go, no, I don't. And the biggest reason
for me, believe it or not, was something silly, which was I
go, you know what it was, I go, smoking on airplanes and
then they go, what do you mean. I go, well, you
know they banned it, right, they banned smoking on airplanes. And they
go why, I go, well, because second hand smoke nothing stops it.
You know, even your lungs don't stop it. Hence secondhand smoke,
right, you know, you breathe and smoke you breathe on your spouse.
Hey, your spouse Scott cancer who not Yeah, not picking on smokers.
But the point was is that planes just use furnace filters, you know,
as filters to circulate the air. And and pilots tell me it's like,
yeah, they make coffee in the back, we'll smell it in the in
the cabin, in the cockpit in less than ninety seconds. It's really fast.
You know, they have to keep the air, you know, circuling
in the can. And they go, what's your point? I go,
My point is is that if the furnace filled, if the filters in the
airplanes can't stop smoke, and virus particles are way way smaller. Why didn't
the airplanes shut down? The airport's never closed. I mean, yeah,
the borders closed, but that was an international border. Thing. Didn't fly
domestic all day long at no point at lax Close or New York or any
of these I flew in these planes and they all said the same thing.
And what I try to get to people I go to look, I go,
you can wear a masks all you want, but here's here's the kicker.
If you can, if you're wearing your mask and you can smell something.
That's it, right, I go, I go. Odor particles are
way bigger than virus particles. There's a reason why firefighters, when they go
into major blazes they have full blown oxygen tanks. They might as well they're
well be wearing scuobattacks because that's the only thing that stops smoke. So if
the masks makes you feel better, hey great. Does it stop people spitting
on you? Yeah? Sure, but that's it, that's all, that's
all it does. So again, when they requirement planes, that was a
tough year. Yeah. One thing I'll take to my grave, I'll never
forget is seeing somebody and I think every now and then you'll still see one
or two people in their cars by themselves wearing masks. Man, that was
just oh well, yeah, you don't want me to get started on that.
But yeah, there's there's two things that happen. They're one. You
know, you've got the comfort zone people that even when the administration changed,
no one want to buy them and they rolled back to mandates. They didn't
care. They don't trust anyone. At this point, it's like, no,
no, this is my comfort zone, this is my wheelhouse. That's
right, And you can tell those people are gonna be wearing masks outside for
the rest of their lives, which isn't really that much different if you ever,
I mean, you're in the military people. I was used to it
kind of because it was people always coming from Japan. Yeah, they always
when japan people got the plane, it's like, what's with the masks,
And people told me, oh, it's Japanese people. They wear masks.
You know, there's a percentage of Japanese people that do it. The other
part, which is I don't want to pick, but it's it's unattracted people,
which is unattracted people that realized, you know, they got more compliments
when they were wearing the mask because it only shows their eyes. I mean,
how many people have ugly eyes, Let's be honest. Uh, They're
like, oh no, I'm actually better with you know, with a with
a mask, kind of like me, but I'm better with a hat.
Whenever producer tells you it's like oh, dad, dude, you should wear
more hats, It's like, yeah, I get it, I'm wearing more
hats. Yeah. My mom said I have a face for radio. That's
why I do podcasts. No, no, no, no, you've got
it. You've got a very wholesome I like your face, and you got
and you got a bright smile. Oh thank you. I want to get
into a few questions for me, and it sounds like for you now listen.
We're always constantly learning. But uh, flat Earth was one of the
last rabbit holes where I went down, and obviously you told the same story.
I'm I'm really shocked. I've interviewed tons of people on this program.
We bring just the listeners on and they tell their stories. There's a lot
of them mark that this was their first rabbit hole. They don't know anything
about nine to eleven or Klahoma City, and I'm every time I hear their
story like that, I am shocked. It's just amazing for me. I
think I had to take that you know stairway, you know with JFK,
the moon landing, the baby steps in order to lower my guard. But
that is something I'm seeing more and more often, is flat Earth is their
first rabbit hole. That is shocking to me. Well, that's good and
bad. I mean, I was worried back in the day. I was
kind of jogging with some of the early people. It's like I was worthy
there would be a percentage of people that would freak out right if this happened,
you know, I mean like lose it. It's like it's like,
are we gonna see like some people like put on full blown suicide vest It
starts like flat Earth click, you know, stuff like that. But but
it never happened, which was great. Apparently simultaneously, when you shrink the
universe down to a big studio apartment, you also create this comfortable sense of
oh wow, but it's got purpose, so I don't really have to freak
out after all. But the process, when it shrinks down, you panic,
right, and it's like it's getting smaller. It's getting smaller. It's
like, oh, it's not that bad, but getting there is a scary,
scary situation. If you learn about flat earth first, boy, that's
gotta be a hell of a roller coaster because at that point you understand that
you because yeah, if you learn about flat Earth at first, then you
realize that anything can be lied about. Yeah, anything, so anything below
that, I mean, come on, everything. And I feel bad for
the nine to eleven people that would give me crap because it's like you're taking
away from the ultimate conspiracy, which is nine to eleven. I'm going,
dude, that was two buildings three if you count building seven, which I
do. Right of course, this is a whole other thing, but it's
just it's one country. It's a tiny part of one country. I go
flatter, it's the whole world I got. Nothing can compared to that.
It's always going to be second tier to flat Earth. However, once again,
once you realize that flatter is a possibility, then everything that anyone ever
tells you you can't discount. Right, you know again, I people I
would just throw out of the room before again, the lizard people right right
there, you or somebody would come up to me. It's like, dude,
I'm pretty sure that Elvis and Bigfoot were like an item, right we're
Hannah be like, dude, just cut back on whatever you're smoking. But
now I'd be like, you know what, I got a few minutes,
what do you have? What do you got? Bring it? Hit me
with that. So, I mean, I'm kind of envious in a way
for people to get into flatters first, because then everything is a possibility.
That being said, their trust probably of authority figures probably goes out the window
really quickly to where you jump to to you know, the term the auto
hoax thing, yea, which you get into that. I mean David Weiss,
isn't that's every once in a while, which is I don't blame him,
which is everything on the news is a lie, right, everything,
and and that shouldn't be your default stance. But at the same time,
if you're play of the percentages, it's probably the safer bet because again,
people forget kind of like the line which I'll jump back and forth real quick,
which is because I asked people outside of this country, I go,
why do you think the Americans went to the moon? Why do you believe
the Americans went to the moon? Right? I know? You know our
Americans. You watch Fox News every once in a while. I haven't years,
but I used to, and I'm one of the commentators on their.
Dana Perino, she's still on there now. She used to be are preseector
for the Bushes. One of her lines was really, really scary. She
goes, I believe in the moon landings because I'm a patriot. She said
that absolutely in that I know, and she said that straight to the camera.
I knew exactly what she was saying, meaning whatever the government tells you
that's what you go with. I mean, you're from the military, you
know that line. We have a saying on this podcast that patriotism is a
hell of a drug. Yeah yeah, And it's like, no, we're
we're looking out for you. Therefore whatever the government says is for your own
good. That's right and so and I get it right. And inside this
country it's like America waved little flags and we're great. However, you know,
I ask people in other countries, it's like, why do you think
the Americans went to the moon? And they always said the same thing they
said because it was on television, and the American media wouldn't lie. And
I'd look at him, I go, you don't know us at all.
We lie about everything. Yeah, in fact, we have layers of lies.
America is the greatest show on earth, the operative word there being show.
We're pretend, we're make believe. I mean, we're a fantastic empire.
Were we're the what was the line I used in one of my things,
like we're the Michael Jordan of empires, very showy, very flashy.
Are we the greatest, you know empire that ever lived? No, it's
the Roman Empire. They crushed people and the big difference in I was kind
of irritated the America didn't go down this line, but I know why they
didn't. You once you start down the path, you can't with the Romans.
The public demanded it. It's like, who have you conquered today for
the empire? Are you doing your part for the empire? I mean that
was their thing. They waited for you, and it's like, what are
your broadest today? Oh? You you took out half a Europe. That's
fantastic. Who are you gonna, you know, hang in the coliseum with
America. We try to do it and still pretend to be the good guys.
And I get it's it's a good good thing and it works. You
know, our propaganda machine is is top notch. So what was the initial
question on that? I don't even remember now, I'm so hooked on your
your story one point? All right, but but that's but that's sorry.
Oh the patriotism thing so uh and the moon landing crap. No, I
think it was just patriotism in general. We were talking about. The first
frabbit hole was the flat earth? Yeah yeah, yeah, and again if
yeah one yeah, Once people get into it, then again, the authority
can't be necessary. Oh yeah, it's the auto hooks anything, which is
everything on the news. You that's sorry thinking not back to where I was,
which was the people forget that the news isn't objective objective journalism. I
don't know if it's ever truly existed. You guys, want to watch a
wonderful movie that you know that stands the test of time. It's Citizen Kane
going all the way back to where And this was based on a true story
which was American like like we reinvented it or something, which is, if
a very wealthy person is getting accosted by a newspaper, what's the answer,
Well, you just buy the freaking newspaper and you can do whatever you want.
They're never going to write a bad story about you. Again, Transition
that to radio, Transition that to television, Transition that to the internet,
and you can do anything you want. So the corporations that are out there
again, we tried to take the naive nature of people away, which is
the news. You know, the whether it's Fox or NBC or ABC.
They are owned by a parent company which is owned by a parent company which
has different interests, and those interests. They will dictate policy all day long.
That's what they do, and they pit they don't in this country.
They've done a wonderful job of pitting people against each other. Last thing before
whatever question you have next, which is the question I have for people?
It's like, oh no, there's no such thing. It's fake news.
It's like, okay, I go resolve these two statements. Everything on CNN
is absolutely true, and everything on Fox News is absolutely true. The end,
you can't you can't depend on which side you vote, and most people
don't or most people do. I don't. The you know, both sides
accuse each other of line all the time. We know full well. Last
part, which is we know full well or you know full well whoever's listening,
that there are conspiracies out there right in business and politics and sports and
entertainment and yes, even journalism and science. Right. The difference is is
that there's media sanctioned conspiracies which aren't conspiracies at all. They're either scandals or
their tragedies if somebody dies, right, Anything that isn't one of those two,
anything that they don't want to dig in more about, that's a conspiracy.
And that's fringe. But come on, I could spend all day on
any one of those topics. Business and politics, I mean, come on,
there's corporate espionage. We know about the politics. They lie for a
living, for God's sakes. Sports because there's nothing ever weird happens in sports.
You know, no one's there's no scandals in sports ever, ever.
Ever. The other thing, entertainment, come on all day long, all
day long. At Harvey Weinstein. That was a nice laid incident. That's
just one guy, right. And then journalism and politics, well you want
to talk about, Oh, who is the journalist that said he was getting
shot in the helicopter over the Middle East? Remember him? And he had
to do it? A pause? Tom Broke? Off? Was that his
name? Tom Broke? And I think it was Tom crap go off to
remind me later. And then and and science come on, happens all the
time. And by that I mean every scientific version of anything. I mean
con they just look at all the scientists going all the way back. Most
of the scientists have cut corners over the years, right, lead paint,
lead, gasoline, asbestos, by the way, which is a great product
unless you work in the factory. Then is that some grade, or how
about all the scientists again nut to pick on smokers, that that that took
the money and said, oh yeah, cigarettes absolutely fine, right lie under
oath. Things like that happen all and don't give me started on the pharma
industry. You know science, science has conspiracies. So anyway, sorry,
I go off. And it's interesting when actually, when I did that episode
on Edward Burney's I actually played a lot of those commercials from the fifties.
You know, my doctor chooses camel shows, the doctor letting up a lung
dart. Money is money is such it's I shouldn't say it's the root of
all evil, but it allows bad people to do bad things. That's a
line from a movie, perfectly saying and but but it's so true. I
mean, if there's enough money in hell. There was a movie I just
watched recently called pain Killer. It was it was a multi part series about
the the OxyContin thing, which was people forget that back in that Look,
if there's money in it, we will be people will find a way to
make it keep going all the way back to again, back in the days
when they sold cocaine in the drug stores, or the fact that Coca cola
is called coca cola, right, And and here's a quick story most people
don't know, and that is I remember doing tech support for a company that
they made the high fructose corn syrup for coke. They were one of the
companies that did this. And I go, yeah, I go remember when
they used to do you know, coca leaves, you know, and the
he goes, and the guy the other in phonic goes, what do you
mean used to? And I go, oh, you're talking about it,
he goes. He goes, dude, he goes, Once it's below the
FDA's minimum threshold, you can do whatever you want. We still put coca
leaves in it. In fact, he goes, during the process, we
have so much cocaine paste that we have to put it in a vault and
the FEDS have to come and get it to destroy it. What on like
a bi monthly basis. Wow, I go what and he goes, yeah,
he goes, It's always been in there. It's never going away.
I mean, he goes, because but it's below the FDA's minimum, so
it doesn't count technically, right if it's below that. Whatever it is you
know you've seen or whatever. Yeah, yeah, parts per million. It's
like, but it's still in there, and and he goes, yeah,
it is great, that's that's awesome. Or again the movie Painkiller so well,
I thought was interesting was they figured out a way. You know,
once Heroin and Cooke you know, became controlled substances, it became illegal.
That's like another company stepped in. It's like, how can we repackage heroin
into a pill, right and then push it past the FDA? Can we
do it? And can we get away with it without people fit? You
know, how long can we do it before people you know, figure out
what we're doing? And they did it for years, years, and you
know, on the nineties and the early two thousands, it's it's a fantastic
looking you don't want to do the whole history of oxy conton. There you
go, one family figured it out, They figure out, you know,
and again what did it takes? All they had to do is bribe the
right FDA person's right, that's it, and then then you're you're good until
cities start collapsing, you know, until the crime rates started jacking up,
and then then America has always been notorious for taking things too far. Always
you wonder why if you ever look at British media, why they run so
so many stories in America? You know, because we're the ultimate British spinoff,
you know America. We they look at us over there and they go
what they've been up to? Now? They don't want stories in Canada like
this. It's always America. I mean, people forget we used to sell
This is too old for most people. We used to sell machine guns in
the hardware stores back in the thirties, literally sold. But you could buy
a hammer and a machine gun at the same time. And why not Why
wouldn't you. Yeah, you could order guns on through your comic books or
I don't know what your comic books, but you can through catalogs. Yeah,
yeah, absolutely, and yeah fully automatic weapons. And you know,
the Roaring twenties, there was no joke. The shootouts were amazing, you
know, and the cops had them and the and the and so when like
the later guns stuff happened, you know on the eighties, you know,
the big assault weapon thing, it's like, we've already done this. At
one point. This was just on a on a slightly different than what had
happened was all the cops had switched back to revolvers, and then the drug
dealers started picking up. You know, there were places and it's like,
well, the cops were like, hey, we're we're not doing well in
these shootouts and so, and we're not gonna let Basically, what they figured
out was, we're not going to give cops the your beat cop machine guns
anymore. They're not going to keep machine guns into the trunk. So we're
gonna we have to ramp down the the the assault weapons. And I got
it. I mean, come on, I was year old enough to remember
what was happening in the eighties. It was nuts. It was absolutely freaking
nutty. What was going on. Did you do you ever go to the
gun shows in the early nineties, Uh? Yeah, sure, occasionally,
Yeah, absolutely, Yeah. I went to one up in near Seattle,
and I was there when like six at F agents decided to just remember this
was before any of the legislation was going down, so they showed up just
to kind of walk around and see what was going on. And the horror
in their faces when they were walking through, you know, because we're talking
about a fair ground's barn or two just jammed the freaking bristling with weapons and
they were you know, gang members and bikers and merchant marines and you know
off duty cops and everyone's just buying stuff. You know, within seconds,
there's no paperwork, there's nothing. It's like the system we built is completely
useless. This is this is happening everywhere. It's like yep pretty much.
And that's why they were like scrambling, just freaking I got it. I
mean, I remember, you know, picking up a I think I picked
up a Ruger pistol once brand new in the box. Uh in like under
thirty seconds. Who's that fast? Guy had a cardboard sign, you know
on his back. It's like a three hundred book book book done there you
go, yeah, yeah, America, God bless her. We do stuff.
By the way, fail fail Army. The channel I recommended from people.
It's like, look, you don't want to see Americans on a regular
basis is growing up there you go hold my beer? Yeah, sorry,
go ahead. I watched that a couple of times a week. Just when
I'm feeling bad about myself, I turn on exactly me too, and I'm
good and and by the way, and I don't want to do racial profiling,
but you know what I see when I watch a lot of that,
and I bet you, I bet you this happens out there. It's white
people problems like white the people of really dumb things. I am sure there
are other demographics out there watching and tail army going wow, why why would
you do this? That is hilarious. I want to get to cut to
some of these questions. Okay, what do you got? All right?
So first one, I got a couple from me and a couple from listeners,
and a couple of audio questions. This one is so flat Earth Clues,
which delves into the possibility of our human civilization actually being inside a Truman
show like an enclose a Truman show like enclosed system, and how it's been
hidden from the public since nineteen fifty six. So and that's in you.
I think your YouTube about in your show why nineteen fifty six. Nineteen fifty
six would have been the when the last major Navy operation was happening down in
Antarctica, which is also known as was its fifty five fifty six Operation Deep
Freeze, which was by Admiral Bird his last mission, by the way,
before he died of whatever cause. And honestly, you know, watching him
on television, he was a problem because he was too casual on camera,
he was too good on camera, and he let things slide that even nowadays
would make people, you know, producers wins. Which was you know,
I knew when he in that line where he was talking, it's like,
oh, yeah, there's coal and there's there's oil and uranium and he stops,
he goes, I probably shouldn't have said that. It's like, oh
god, do you imagine the handlers scatching? You know, It's like,
oh dudelet come on, you can't you know. And then it's like,
well, you know, worried, worried we could be fighting about this.
So yeah, so an Operation fifty five fifty six. What I what I
believe was they were still looking, you know, for the better part of
thirty years, for any sort of evidence that there was an outer barrier,
which would make sense, which would mean that you put the outer barrier,
you take the coast of Antarctica, and then you go inland thousands of miles,
right, because they'd have to be thousands of miles because it took you
thirty years planes and refueling stations and flying the ice and flying and flying and
flying, and then you give up I think at one point they're like,
well, maybe either we won't find it, or maybe it's just not there.
And of course Murphy's law. During Operation Deep Freeze, they found something,
but they weren't going to talk about it. All we knew was when
they were done with Operation Deep Freeze, they immediately started working up the paperwork
for the Enter Treaty, the only unbroken treaty in the history of treaties that
said, yeah, everybody off the ice, no one's going down there.
We're basically militarizing it. No one, no country can own it. And
again, the big red flag for me was that not only are you not
allowed to go down there set up company, you know, no matter how
much money you have, which you tread flag which, But the other one
is you're not even allowed to talk about it. That's the big one,
which is you have a big oil and gas company. They are notorious for
running like full page ads and newspapers back in the day. You know,
it's like, how great you want to, you know, influence public opinion.
You run page ads because they can't miss it. And he's like,
how great would it be for British petroleum to be down an antarctical. It's
jobs, it's security, it's Britain, right, you know, fly the
Union jazz. So but they weren't even allowed to do that, and I
knew exactly why, which was like, oh yeah, that would be standard
protocol. You know. You you go to these companies, you say,
okay, so you're even thinking you're just the top guys, right, whatever
it is the top guys, and say national security, don't even think about
it, don't even talk about it. And when you retire, give them
this card and have them call us, and then we will come in and
we'll do this over again. We'll repeat this. And that's what happened.
I mean, every country that came online as an economic power had to sign
this treaty. No one's allowed to question, no one's even tried. You
know, if you think it's like China, why didn't they storm the ice?
In fact, one of the big flags also was the only people the
only country that was down there during World War two, which was Nazi Germany's
right, everybody was gone and they were down there. They were working hard
again because Indiana Jones was not just a movie. There are some countries and
I will hand it to Germany. In this sense, there's an old saying
called All's fair in love and war Geneva convention. Yeah, it's a nice
idea, but the truth is whatever wins the war period, right, if
you're if you are ruthless enough that you've heard the military saying, which is
the difference, all sides being equal? It usually comes down to the what
the person's willing to do something the other guy is not right? You know,
who's willing to take steps that who may even be unethical the then and
we're talking about flexible ethics here. So if Germany all of a sudden,
you know, Germany's looking for the Holy Grail, if they're looking for you
know, Froto's Ring, if they're looking for Harry Potter's wand if that will
turn the course of the war, Oh yeah, they're gonna find it.
Right again, people thought it was a great movie. It's it's not a
movie. They're looking for these things because they hope to God. It's like,
look, if we find a weird wand that we incinerate a battlefield,
Oh yeah, we're using it. We don't care. Wait even if there's
blowback, you know, it kills half of our guys, we're still doing
it. So they're down there and they're setting up shop and then you know
Operation High Jump right after the want the second they sign the papers over in
Tokyo Bay for the surrender of Japan a meat, it's like, oh yeah,
Richard byrd okay getting on a carrier group. We're saying, a full
blown carrier group with infantry down to Antarctica. Why oh, science reasons,
no reasons, let's go, right, And he knew why I was going
down there, and whatever was done, it was, it was over with
by the time you got on television for the Long Jean's Chronoscope Show in nineteen
fifty four. Yeah, that sounds about right. And uh yeah, so
there you go. That's amazing because that was actually my follow up question.
I think history very much is in line with what you were talking about,
David Weiss and the news. I think it's at best our history and and
the news is a little bit of truth covered with a lot of lies.
And you're you're a truther, and I'm sure you've gone down the World War
two rabbit hole as well. And yeah, you know, Stalin is a
great guy, right, But it's amazing here, you know, they were
on the version of World War Two, and he's got folk in Poland and
over here, and they've got a fleet called, you know, down in
Arctica, a New Swabia. But you know, they don't teach that in
high school. Nothing to see here, there's nothing. Antarctica is this little
continent on the bottom of the earth. I mean, when you stop and
think about these things, it's like, how how are you not processing the
next step? You know, there's a Germany, this small country, has
a submarine fleet down there working you know, furiously in Antarctica. And oh,
by the way, in South America at the bottom of the continent they
set up and to this day you can look. They have German cities in
Argentina and they still have the same structure and the people down there. There's
a lot of weird things going on there. Mark, oh Germany. People
don't get And I think in alternate timelines, you guys, want to watch
a fun series if you never watched it, watch The Man in the High
Castle. I'm really surprised they actually made that series because there but that's based
on books, which was why did Germany lose? And I think in a
whole bunch of other timelines. I think we're living one of those rare timelines,
you know, like the Doctor Strange one where where we actually won because
the that war was over. Just so you know, before Paul Harbor this
thing, it was done. I mean, Russia was burning, Europe was
conquered. They were just toying with England, and you know, Germany was
just mopping up. They knew before wha they're gonna do they were gonna eventually
take Moscow of it wasn't gonna be that winner. It was gonna be the
next one that would be that. Then they'd have the Russian resources, they'd
obliterate Germany. And the whole point was they weren't going to fire a shot
on America, not a single shot. They was supposed because there were so
many German citizens over here, and my family being one of them. They
were oh yeah, Minnesota and in Wisconsin, huge German communities, and I
mean they were all over the place, and so they were gonna run dual
flags and that was it. They were America. Why would you ever burn
them down? Right? And they were the they were the crown jewel.
They that's where they were going to take the only thing that could get in
a way was of America turned against them, and then all of a sudden,
Pearl Harbor miraculously. You know the problem that the conspiracy was too big
for most people back then, which was Pearl Harbor gets bombed on a Sunday,
you know. And and Japan then you know they're because Japan's allied with
Germany. You know, in a in another timeline in Germany probably shouldn't been
allied with Japan. I mean kind of it was silly anyway, they were
gonna take over Japan anyway. But anyway, Man in the High Castle an
interesting series. But yeah, well every war that we have fought has been
again numb. Everyone knows the history is written by the winners quote, but
I think Napoleon's quote is actually more devious, which is he said history is
just lies that are agreed upon, and you know where it's like, okay,
we've won. What's the story we're gonna put out there? Right?
Because we don't want to And it's mostly I don't want to. I don't
want to pick on women, but it's mostly for the women, because women
do not like sending their sons to fight for things. However, the old
tricks of the best tricks, and people human means will fight for revenge from
now until doomsday. The old one of the oldest tricks in the book,
which is you walk up to somebody. You've done it yourself. I'm sure
you walked up somebody, Yeah, hit him in the back of the head,
and when they spin around, you point to your best friends. Right,
he did. It's one of the oldest tricks ever and it works almost
every single time. All you have to do is keep a straight face,
right or sell it. It's like, oh, dude, don't will be
hit you And it's like, ah, you know, people fight for revenge.
And again, you know, nine to eleven every American war we've ever
fought, I mean seriously, the Civil Wars, Smash American War, the
the Revolutionary War, which was basically the French people. Again, the fact
that most Americans don't even know. It's like, no, we had to
buy the country back from France. Ye, go ahead, they won the
war for us. It wasn't us. We were yeah, we were there,
but it's come on. The Louisiana purchase was massive, and I probably
would have been even bigger except they hadn't explored any further it's like, hey,
by by the country off of us, you know, back from us,
you always, and then we'll split Canada between England and France, which
makes no sense. Still try to figure that one out. It's like,
how England get that part of Canada and France got the other one? Seriously
Quebec really it's anyway? Sorry, go ahead now you're good, by the
way. Philip Dick wrote the book The Man in the High Castle and if
you want to another, all the Men from Electric Dreams. Uh no,
The Man in the Philip Philip K. Dick, Yes, yes, yes.
He also wrote some the I think the miniseries Electric Dreams, The Electric
Dreams and Scanner Darkly. Oh wow, yeah, wow, he's gonna mind
on him. Yeah. I again, I am really surprised The Man in
a Hot High Castle as I was watching it and it got made. Yeah
me too. I'm like, it's like, it's like, okay, so
you're not gonna let Iron Sky get distributed in the United States, right,
even though I don't really. Can you imagine again, I'm not picking,
but you imagined the Jewish community watching the trailers for Iron Sky and calling each
other's like, so we're not gonna let this actually play in America, right,
because this is horrifying. But you know, one of the little things
that he did, which absolutely was I think dead on, was in Man
in the High Castle. Again, the general public doesn't know this. How
they had concords. Concords were the basic form of travel, and it's like,
yeah, we can make passenger planes to crack the sound barrier. However,
for aesthetic reasons, we don't because we don't want sonic booms everywhere.
And there's some livestyle concerns and crap like that. But with Journey, they're
like, yes, screw that, we just want to get to the point
A to point be as fast as possible. Therefore everybody's flying freaking concords.
I actually agree with the logic. It's like, why would you want to
fly anything else? And you're you're perfecting it while you're doing it. It's
like, why are you flying stub sonic if you don't have to? But
whatever, again, fascinating, fascinating, serious. It got a little weird
towards the end, but whatever actually would kind of got by the time it
got to the end, it was kind of delving into the truth, which
was, Okay, what timeline are we living in, because again they their
timeline, they won. At our timeline, we won, but they didn't
really go and like Japan was going to share it with them. Oh no,
no, no, no, zero chance of that happening. No,
they were going to get to Japan eventually. Why because if you didn't get
not to be brutal, but if you didn't look like German people, you
weren't going to be part of the empire. Yeah, let's just how you
were. So I have a question from a listener's name is Joe. When
he asks kind of video game simulation of glow Birth helped prove flat Earth or
vice versa, he'd, you know, obviously had heard that you've been in
the video game community for a while. Is that something that has crossed your
mind putting together a video game to kind of drop breadcrumbs for flat Earth?
I don't. I don't have to, and it is that's a that's a
great question, by the way, Thank you too, Joe. Which is
you know, yeah, because I came from the video game world, and
a lot of people don't know this, which is most of the video games
ninety nine percent of the video games are made on a tabletop flat scenario,
meaning oh yeah, there might be some valleys and mountains and stuff like that,
but the edges lineup. And I don't care what you're playing, whether
it be Warcraft or FORTNIGHTE or GTA or whatever. I mean, Minecraft being
the most blatant example. I hate that game. It's so terrible, and
I hate I hate the fact that Lego didn't go to that guy immediately and
just buy it out right. It's like, dude, this is a Lego
game. You could own this right now, and they lost so much money
by the time they figure it out. But but the games are made tabletop
flat. And what's interesting is also the sky is also it's it's fact that
the the graphics models that they use to create the sky are called a skybox.
So yeah, when you're looking at the sky, you might see planets,
you might see the moon. Everything seems like it's curved and maybe even
dome like, right, But engineering wise, computers don't like curves. In
fact, they can't technically even draw curves. They can only draw right angles.
Okay, so which is why pixels are squares, right. You know,
it's an engineering A engineer will tell you this. It's always square Scar
Scar scar square. Right, it's legos don't have really, you know,
you don't have let curve pieces, so you can you can make spheares,
but when you zoom in and zoom in, it still comes down to you
remember that as things get pixelated the old term. So when it comes to
the skies and the video games, they're all Skybox systems. Everything's angled off,
everything's squared off. So if this place was a simulation, by the
way, then the dome, the snow globe that every culture has been drawing
since the dawn of civilization is an illusion. And then outside of this,
let's say it is you know that what in fact, what you've got the
Orlando Ferguson behind you, which I love, you know, And by the
way, I was a huge fan of that because I like the I just
liked the whole feel of it. I liked it was made in the eighteen
hundreds. I even liked the the whole roulette table feel, you know,
because it really kind of looks like a roulette table. Indeed, but people
immediately called me up and they said, yeah, you can't use roulette table
anymore when you're defining it. Even though again I love them. I've even
seen the the being blown up original I think it's in South Dakota. It
takes up like half of a room, which is really awesome, which is
why that every picture you see if it's so high rest. But they said
you can't use the roulette table like and why not they go because all the
numbers a roulette table add up to six hundred and sixty six. That's what.
That's not true. It is true, It's absolutely true. Wow,
Okay, that's not ominous at all. So yeah, video games, there's
only one or two that actually use spherical modeling, and I don't even remember
which ones they are. And the reason why they do it is one,
it's easier to code. Why would your code in a sphere it's tougher to
do. Why would you ever try to work in the spere calculations because that
affects freaking everything. And the other is the average gamer won't notice it.
I mean, I played Warcraft for sixteen years and I looked out at the
horizons over the ocean right and everything, and you're looking over it and yeah,
there should be a curvature there, but you're never going to notice it.
But you tell place, well, oh, you know, if you
ask them back in the day, oh, is there a curvature to the
warcraft Horizon, most people would say, I don't know. You know,
they go whatever way you were trying to lean them towards. But there isn't.
It's absolutely a tabletop flat, you know, especially over water. And
so yeah, it is so trying to make a game. Now there we
are making a game, but it's it's kind of delving into it's still a
flat game, but it's not doesn't have the it's more of an informational trying
to get people to go to different websites and stuff like that just came out.
I don't even know the name of it. I just found out about
a couple of days ago. Cool. Thanks for that explanation, and thank
you, Joe. Can I play one of our two audio messages for you?
Sure? All right, here we go, and this is from our
friend in Transylvania. Hello. Question for Mark, what do you think about
the Virgin galactic tourists space flights? Keep doing what you're doing, saying searching,
we will find the truth eventually. There you go. I love his
accent, right, he sounds like a cross between a vampire and grow rob
Oh my god, Oh it's so great. I almost expect him saying blah
blah blah, I want to suck your blood. Okay, when it comes
to you, I won't just do. I'm not picking on him. That's
a great accent. Absolutely, I don't. Uh, why stop it,
Virginal, he said, Virgin Galactic, right, yes, last week or
two? Yeah? Please, No, every every private space agency has huge
holes in the plot, some better than others. Virgin clac there's just a
token on the side of this whole thing. It's like, Oh, we're
gonna go straight up sixty miles. Uh huh. Okay. First off,
you've been telling people they are going up sixty miles, means you're probably not
going up sixty miles. And he's saying, oh, we're going to space.
They're not even saying the edge of space anymore. They're staying space.
What a little crap. Then you have what blue Horizon. I think that's
Amazons. They haven't done anyone and anything, anybody any favors, but anyways,
but Virgin Galactic, oh, no, Blue Horizon. They're the one
that goes straight up and straight down. Virgin Galactic. I don't even know
what the hell. Oh they're doing that plane that rocket and then the plane
falls off of the rocket. Yeah, yeah, yeah, the rocket power
plane. Yeah again. People want to show out money to go up at
a certain altitude. That's fine, but you're not you're what are you doing?
You're not you don't even have you have a very limited I mean,
if you want to do a parable the cheaper option would be to do the
hollowed airplane for the parabolic flight, the Moomit comet where you get up to
a certain height and then just nose down and really, then it's not anti
gravity. You're just falling without wind. That's all you're doing. It's not
anti gravity at all. It's it's an illusion. It's it's stagecraft, really,
which is thing is gravity, so it can't be anti gravity. Oh
yeah yeah. And then SpaceX. Of course, I don't even know where
to start with SpaceX. I mean, they are a United States military puppet
arm of arm in the military. They they shouldn't be doing what they're doing.
That The people say it's a private space for Everment's like, what are
you talking about? It is run by NASA, It runs off NASA facilities.
You know the fact that NASA even allows them to use Cape Carnaveral and
Kennedy right as their pads, Like that's direct competition to what they're doing.
And and yet again that the general public believes that you know, they've turned
they've tried to turn Elon Musk, who I I don't say I hate a
lot of people. And again I don't hate him as a person. I
hate the idea that they chose him. That's what that was their option.
Yeah, that's what they came up with. Again the line from Armageddon that
where Brustlis is yelling at It's like, and this is the best idea you
could come up with. You're not asked to forgot, It's like, this
is it right? This is what you got. So when I mean,
they try to turn Elon into Tony Stark and he's he's used for all sorts
of everything. And again because the general public has such short term memory,
they don't understand that he hasn't done anything right. He didn't create PayPal.
My uncle came to me and you know, looked at me, and I
shocked him with it, and it's like, I go, you realize he
didn't found Tesla, right, and he just bought it right, And at
the same time he's he I guarantee you within two years he's going to ask
the kid on the street, Oh yeah he found it X. No he
didn't. He bought Twitter. And he only bought Twitter because he had to
buy Twitter because his lawyers said, no, they're going to sue you because
you said the taught stock price was perfect time to buy and it's gonna be
cheaper for you to just buy it then destroy it rather than fight the legal
fees and get nothing. That's right. Still, Oh and sorry, one
one more, let me throw one more. Since we're doing private space companies,
let's throw in the one that happened this morning, which was India.
Oh my gosh, so India, you know so yeah, so Russia supposedly
tanked on the moon right slowly crashed. It's like, okay, no proof
of this at all. You just said, oh, yeah, we launched,
Okay, fine, you launched a rocket, and then some days later
you say you tanked it on the moon. Wow, sounds totally legit.
India was right behind them, supposedly. The graphics are I'm looking at them
right now, and you've seen over you saw any of the headlines from today.
The graphics are I don't know, pre nineteen ninety eight, a little
better than they're horrible, a little better than pong, yeah, a little
a little better. I mean they're they're Atari graphics. And they even added
stars to the graphics. And then the single shot that the years was was
terrible. But here's not here's the part that they got. The part that
GOTMI was the insulting part. Not only did you say that you landed on
the moon India right, when I think high tech, I'm not picking on
India. Look, they do a lot of tech support. I don't think
India right, It's Japan, It's it's German engineering, it's the United States,
it's every once in a while, you know, Italy. India is
not think about for a space program right now. And not only that,
but they said they did for seventy five million dollars. I'm going, what
one day? Right, Yeah, that's one day's worth of NASSA. I
go, not only I go, I go, I go. Super yachts.
You can't even get a super yacht for seventy five million dollars minimum for
a super yacht, even just one hundred foot or it's two hundred million dollars.
Right one, You notice for the military, F sixteen cost sixty three
million dollars and that's not even fully loaded. That's not even fully rocketed up
right. You want to throw on some sidewinders and it's not. Yeah,
then then then you're upwards of seventy eighty million dollars. But these guys supposedly
went to the moon seventy five million dollars. They landed. It took one
snapshot. So wow, we did it. And of course we were there
the entire time. NASA was the consultants on all of this. We ran
the trajectory, we ran the computer. It's horrible computer animations. So yeah,
but again all of India bought it. They're like clapping little little flags.
It wasn't funny. They're premiere whatever sitting there with a flag like just
kind of ball. That drove me in the laughing. I hope that's the
image you want to use. Even you wouldn't even put Biden with a little
as No. I mean that was that was a carnival puppet holding that flag.
I mean I looked at his eyes and going there's nothing there, no
lights on, but nobody's home. He's like just wave the flag man.
In fact, it may not have you even been live. It may have
prerecorded that for sure. Why why you know the guy holding the flat why?
Why the hell? And on? Just run that, run that video
for sure, it's gonna keep it on a loop. It's gonna be it.
That will be a gift before it's over. Oh yeah, that'll be
a gift. And we'll make it a TikTok video as well. But sometimes
three Stooges music with it or something. Since we're talking about these things.
Who who was it? Okay, here it is flat Earth. Tom from
Kansas asks how high do you think the firmament is at its apex? You
know, at the center above the north star? Uh? Eight miles?
No, No, nobody knows to be sure. All I know is it's
way lower than most people think, do I. The only reason we draw
it as a snow globe infect if you go into Google and type in ancient
cosmologies and hit images, you'll see what everybody drew. It's really weird that
they all drew about pretty much the same thing, which looks like a snow
globe. But it doesn't have to be that high, so it's probably more
like a shallow sports stadium. And I say that because human tech are Human
technology doesn't go that high. So the average I mean mostly like most of
our civilization lives between sea level and one mile up. That's ninety seven percent
of the population. Then commercial aircraft cap at about fifty thousand feet or ten
miles roughly. Spy planes, if you believe what they'd tell you, cap
out of roughly twice that twenty miles. So even if it was a thousand
miles up, that'd be way more than we need to do what we need
to do, especially when it comes to rockets, because you remember all the
rockets. You want to look at telemetry, look at time laps. Any
rocket, you know, it goes up and then it just goes horizontal so
fast, I know, no one even questions it. It's like where's it
going. Well, it's gonna go down there and then it's gonna go up
this stunt. It's like, why I didn't go up? Now? No
one wants to talk about it. So it could it be three thousand miles
up? Maybe? Could it be less than a thousand miles up? Maybe?
Don't know for sure. The rockets that we've we've fired up there.
You know, the highest amateur one that I think everyone went up was less
than seventy miles. Uh, you know, a getting it if commercial trapp
if if the average if of the population doesn't even go up to ten miles,
then how high you know, how high do you have to make it
to make it to pull it off? If only the military knows how high
it really is, then you can you can keep it a secret for a
pretty long time. That the reason why our population has not figured this out,
The biggest reason is because we don't have flying cars. And by the
way, on the side note, we're never gonna get flying cars. I'm
not talking about the unified field cars. I'm talking about those pieces of crap
giant drones that they're talking about, which is basically just a helicopter right with
a whole bunch of little wings. It's like, no, dude, again,
fail army. You want you want to see why we're never gonna have
flying cars, type in car fail into YouTube and watch an hour worth of
what happens, and then you're gonna tell me you're gonna give that same population
three d flying No. No, I mean, come on, we can't.
We can't stop people from drinking and driving. No, you would have
these things fallen in your backyard people backyard. Oh yeah, it would be
the crashes, and plus you're guaranteeing fatalities. Yeah, I mean, and
the collateral damage would be horrible. So yeah, anyway, if we had
flying cars, if we had unified field cars like UFOs, then yeah,
we figured it out. And I also, by the way, think I
don't know if you're a biblical guy necessarily, but the Tower of Babble story
one of the shortest stories in the history of stories. But I you know,
I expanded on it in The Clues, which was I think the one
that the very very early version of us was too good in that that,
Okay, we made a completely unified people that had a single goal and hide
intelligence, high degree of engineering, and they figured out what this world was
immediately, And what do you think that they did. It's like, oh,
yeah, so we need to go up there. Forget about the flying
cars. We're gonna build a freaking bridge to have it, you know,
to get out of here. And again, I love the story because it
rings so true because whoever was overseeing the world, let's say it was God
or one of God's subcontractors. It's looking down going crap, it's not gonna
work. They're gonna make it. Yeah, we've already done the math.
It's not gonna take very long. So okay, scattered scatter, scatter,
languages, languages, get rid of that. Toower. We gotta we gotta
redo this because it was so But but yeah, if we had flying cars,
I think every I think every civilization has their chance, and ours was
one of the slower ones. Because if you remove the unified field engine out
of the equation, which is the UFO engine, right, which doesn't need
aerodynamics, right, it just goes, you know, like an etch a
sketch. You can go any any direction it wants at just about any speed,
and it doesn't matter if it's underwater. It would replace all vehicles,
see with ours. The reason why it's so slow is we have to have
a vehicle for just about everything we do. Right. We have cars,
we have airplanes, of submarines, we have big trucks, we have tankers,
we have all. With the UFO, just one engine, make it
any size you want, you can do anything you can want. Plus you
can weaponize it on top of it. So if we had one of those
yeah, we'd figure out this place really really quick, but we didn't.
And five thousand years later, I think we're just about there. Yeah.
And by the way, you know why, I think that the biggest,
the biggest thing that did it for us. The reason why it got so
easy to detect, why you couldn't detect it thirty years ago, which came
now, which is why most people got into flat earth, was HD technology.
That was that was the big thing, which was you could see HD
cameras. Who would have thought cameras that you could see further than you should
be able to And people understood that. It took him a little while,
and so you know, looking at it's like, hey, you see that
boat. Yeah, you shouldn't be able to really, And and then I
mean I didn't tell aid and the clues. You know, I'm not going
to take credit for it. Nowhere any point in the clues that I tell
people to run to the beach and start shooting long distance photography. And that's
what so many people did. And they would call me, and then again
why they told me. It's like, oh, yeah, that Lauren a
Lando ferguson map, you can't use it? And I go why because it's
tabletop flat like a really and they go, yeah, I go, how
do you know? It's because we were shooting over water and I go,
and water it's flat. It's like I had to learn all these things from
from observers. They were right out and doing this on their own. I
didn't even know where the inspiration came from, but it spread really really fast.
Indeed, indeed it did. Where was my next question here? Actually,
let's do another. And by the way, thanks for that question,
brother. He's gonna be on the on the podcast and I look forward to
that. Next one is a good friend of the podcast, Jim. Hey,
George, I got I got something from Mark Sergeant. I'm a fan.
You know, I don't remember who I started listening to first for Flat
Earth, but I know, I know, I know Mark Sergeant was in
there. And uh, you know, I just want to say, because
he's a humble guy, and I know he don't like to take credit for
anything. Half the time. It's see, it seems like when people try
to give him some credit, he you know, he's just a humble guy.
And I love him for it, and I'm proud of him for it.
I think it's I think his attitude is awesome. I just want to
say that I appreciate his humor and the way he handles conversations. You know,
humor in a flat earth conversation is awesome to me. I laugh about
it all the time. It just, I don't know, keeps it keeps
you from being crazy about it. It's just a look at the humor side
of it. And I know what I got a minute, So I just
want to say, appreciate you, Mark, and I like the way you
throw in humor on different things, and and we appreciate you. I'm out
there. You go, brother, Well that's awfully nice. First, I
wonder if he has a like a lifetime members ship to NASCAR. The second,
let's see the humbled part. It's like bow jown, lowly dog.
How dare you say I'm humble? Yeah. I give credit where credit is
due and I try not to take a credit when and Flatters has really changed
that for me. Flatters has changed my attitude toward love things. Well,
one would be I'm never gonna do anything malicious to him, but he ever
again, mostly because now that I know that we're living in some sort of
structure, the high degree that we're being watched you know, it's like,
you know, someone's got an eye on you, maybe not necessarily hovering over
you, but definitely apparent on the sofa looking over the top of the newspaper
type of thing. It's like, what are they doing right? And what
was ther thing? He said, Oh, adding humor to it. Yeah,
if I'm not laughing, I'm crying. So there's there's a lot of
bad things in the world, but I think there's a lot of very humorous
things in the world. And I try to find the silver lining whenever possible,
and if that comes off is humor, then that's what it is.
Try to the tension in movies. I love tension breakers. I love it
when the movie's super supertense and then somebody comes in and figures out a way
to break the ice, you know, And usually that's just a little perspective
thing, you know, some some little name, some small comment that out
of nowhere that people are like, okay, okay, now we can now
we can kind of move forward without you know, dreading the worst. Granted
the powers that be, and you know, people talk about, you know,
in the last three years we've we've been through and the great reset that
people talk to talk about all the time. Don't forget that there's still I
still believe in the plan, you know. I still believe in the design
and everything for a reason. So whatever's happening to us now, Yeah,
it doesn't seem like a lot of fun, but there's got to be a
reason for it. I don't believe in randomness. I believe in the the
Einstein quote from years ago, which is, and I won't go into it
too much necessarily, which is that God doesn't play dice. And I get
that. I get that more than anyone, and it took me a long
time to figure that out. But the short version is is that there's a
plan here. So we thank you. I appreciate, I appreciate the compliments
and thank you for that. And I'm not I'm not going to take credit
for much pay I can only tell you that I was there in the beginning
with two other guys, Eric to Bay and Matt Boylan, and the three
of us we did not see eye to eye at all because they're completely different
personalities. Matt was basically insane and Eric was and is. He doesn't like
sharing anything with anybody, so if you're not with him, you're against him,
and I know how that goes. And I'm saying, all right,
then we're gonna be at odds and he's gonna spoil things by saying that I'm
a government agent for the last eight years and he is never backed down from
that, and for eight years. You know, I keep saying, a
fine, prove it, prove it. You're saying this. You live in
freaking Thailand. How do you know that I'm a government agent? What proof
do you have? What video? What audio? What email? And the
only reason he said, I was there when we came up with I've got
the email from Matt Boyland. They said, look, you're with us or
we are going to discredit you. I still got the email from twenty fifteen,
and you know, and real quick, which there was a little thing
that happened in the the Netflix documentary which most people missed, which was there
was one hundred and something seats in the back of that that first conference that
were empty and it's nonrefundable conference, right people paid, it was sold out.
And what happened was Eric Debay convinced odd you know odd reality channel.
He convinced, He's like, tell your guys, whoever we think they're gonna
go to the conference to not go because it's just government agents. It's all
anyone on stage and its government agents. And I'll be damned if those people
burned those hundreds at all, you know, each one of them, and
they did not go wow, And it was just this little thing. And
it's like, but it's the power of the power of media and the power
of persuasion. It's like, all right, so Eric, I don't know,
I don't know how he does it. But Eric's channel, I mean,
he's been burned down several times. It keeps coming back. Get I've
I've I've never for me. I don't have a personal beef with the guy.
I just don't like, you know, I told him, And come
on, every producer has told me. It's like, you can't make a
whole bunch of flatter videos and the make a video called Adolf Hitler's the greatest
guy in the world. You can't do that. You can't mix the two.
There's it's never gonna go well. And then you act surprised. It's
like, oh, why was my channel destroyed by YouTube? A gonna start
up another one do the same thing, and he like today he's got like
one hundred and ninety thousands ups like, al right, wow, you want
to keep doing the same thing, That's fine, I'm just warning you the
producers. He well, sorry, last thing. I'm on that point.
He was supposed to be I'm sure he's been told this. He was supposed
to be in behind the curve. Absolutely was supposed to be in it,
and not not because of me, because of the producers. Okay. And
and once they I go, and I was the one that showed it to
him, I'm going, well, and they they said, does anybody have
skeletons in their closet? I go, well, you might as well know,
you know. And I threw him the you know in all Hitler video
and they and they said, is there any chance we can get him to
pull that down on? Nope, not for this project. He's not.
And he didn't. And every producer since then, in fact, one of
them said, look, you may want to call him and tell him and
say, no, producer, you know when you go up the chain of
producers, no, no, no project's going to work with you because of
what you're doing with that. And I said, it's not going to do
me any good. Tell him. He already knows. So anyway, there
you go appreciate that I do have two more questions left. One is something
that I was I get a lot of these emails that say my life was
wayward, I had turned from God. I was doing this, doing that,
and it's incredible to see that people come across, whether it's the podcast
or your channel. I get so many messages where Flat Earth completely changes people's
lives to where they're brought back to God and there they're living their lives different.
And that is the most powerful, humbling. When I open up those
emails, I get teared up to think that I'm just some guy in Delaware
raises chickens, you know, put this podcast together. And and for me,
that's why I had to do this podcast separately. I told you in
the beginning. It was divisive on that, but it was such a passion
to me that I had to do a separate podcast, and obviously that was
God's plan for me. And now I'm doing this and we get emails all
the time, and I can only imagine how many messages you get about how
you've changed people's lives. Yeah, over the years, and it's not again,
it's not me. I did not change people's lives. I am not
a part time cult leader, even though even though we have all the earmarks
of it, which is really weird. I'm really surprised the media hasn't jumped
on it because but I suppose because we don't have the flags that go with
it, meaning we don't have a compound or a Bible or hobes or chanting.
You know this, you know the conferences, and I'm really surprised more
people haven't said that. However, to your point about religion, very very
true. Over the years, I have had so many people. In fact,
I'll give you a quick story. Before the pandemic, we were doing
Christian flat Earth conferences, right, and I wasn't even invited to speak at
most of those because I didn't quote enough chapter in verse A right. Most
of the conferences we go to. We knew we were doing something right when
after the first conference, half of the people said it was too Christian.
The other half said it wasn't Christian enough. It's like, okay, so
we we we apparently were right down the middle there. But there was this
take on the world conference. They've done for a number of years before the
pandemic, and I remember they're doing this this roundtable. Towards the end,
and Rick Hummer relayed the story to me. The guy's m seeing the Las
Vegas conference and he goes somebody. I don't know if it was Rob Scheba,
Robbie Davidson or one of the other guys, but they all everyone was
in agreement. They go, we have never seen any device or tool that
has brought more people back to the church than flat earthised. No single thing
has been able to do this. And the reason is is it gives people
that extra persue per single digit percentage points that reinforces their faith that they may
have lost or fallen away from. So if you were ninety percent sure,
you know ninety percent in the camp, it's like, yes, you know,
you know I you know I believe in God or high power or whatever,
you know, whatever denomination. You're looking at this just by the default
structure of it, meaning if we're in some sort of building, then it
was built. It was created. Now you may not know exactly who the
creator is exactly, or or or the reason behinding behind it, but it
gets you one step closer. You know. The joking and the humor I
would throw out at people that I would say, it's like, yeah,
you don't know, you don't know who exactly built it. It could be
one of God, you know, could be God directly, it could be
one of God's sub contractors. But the very least you're one st that you're
one step closer to figuring out God's phone number. Right, You're one degree
closer, And that was enough for most people. They're like beforehand, they're
like, oh, yeah, I'm in now, you know, because it
remember I was telling about the how it shrunked down the universe. Yeah,
if the universe gets shrunk down too, what's essentially a giant garden of Eden,
right, I mean, it's just a big, big garden of Eden
version. Let's face it, the world without people is actually a really nice
place. People screw it up. Take people with the equation works pretty well,
I mean as far as they know. Again not to steal that line
from the matrix, but you know everything natural equilibrium is in there, except
when you throw people in and then it just turns into a nightmare. So
yeah, I got tons of those emails along those lines where people we were
so happy and they weren't thanking me so much as they were I mean they
thanked me for the way I explained it, but that they were so happy
that the concept was put out there, and I would try to remind them.
And I think Rob Skiba did as well in his website, which I
highly recommend to people. If you're a Christian out there and you want to,
you know, go to testing the Globe dot com, which is so
wonderful. And I'm so glad it's still up and his wife is keeping it
there after his untimely passing. Yeah, but he was the first guy to
go through it back in twenty fifteen. He went through the Bible with a
fine tooth comb. It's awesome. Wait, and he came back almost immediately
and said, yeah, it's a flat earth book. The Bible's a flat
earth freaking book with one exception, which was he and he found it so
fascinating. He said, Isaiah forty twenty two, He who sitteth upon the
circle of the earth, he goes. But circle is not ball, it's
not spear, it's not glow, and ancient Hebrew it is not the same
word he goes, but he goes. I have talked to so many pastors
that hang on to Isaiah twenty two by their fingernails, and like it has
veto power over everything else. It's like, really over Genesis. You know,
you're gonna you're gonna use this over Genesis. It's like, yeah,
one shouldn't have more weight than the other, but they do. And but
it's mostly the fear. You know, most most pastors they're they're scared.
You know, they don't want to You don't want to come on, you
don't want to sit up in front of a congregation of I don't know,
two, three hundred and five hundred people, depending on what group you're looking
at, and say, okay, so we're going back to the flat model
because people mainstream has sunk their claws into so many of the people that they
they're afraid of the backlash, kind of like you when you got those emails.
Yeah, so yeah, but I love I love the spirituality aspect of
it again, the fact that that it turned me to where again, I
will not do anything malicious to anybody else. Now that doesn't mean I won't
defend myself, you know, Second Amendment, you know, gun controls using
two hands. But uh, but at the same time, I'm not going
to go out of my way to to I don't troll people. I don't
even donew practical jokes on people. So I hate I hate practical jokes,
don't I don't like. Yeah, and you get those emails. It's and
again it's the flatter It wasn't George that change these people's lives. It was
them finding flat earth and them realizing that. Yeah, and they had to
thank honestly, they had to thank somebody. So it's like they send me
emails or whoever was. And I'm sure lots of other people, you know,
even the people that that don't quote religious stuff. I will say this
though, I was one of the I was the first guy to delve into
the religious side because the Christian community was writing me almost immediately as I was
doing the clues, and they said, you are you are dancing around the
God aspect of it too much. You've got you've got to address it.
And at that point, I said, well, I was already in you
know, on my list anyway, so I'm going to bump it up.
And I made a clue called they are hiding God absolutely, and uh it
was. It got it was received extremely well, and I but I really
I wanted to do it in a different way. So I did something kind
of unique, and I was kind of hoping that that that somebody else would
touch upon it. You know, I stretched the tower of Babbel's story into
the way I would see it if I wrote it as like a screenplay.
Gotcha, And and I thought it. I thought I worked pretty well.
So anyway, I'm glad. I was glad that people enjoyed it. Awesome.
Thank you for that last and thank You've been very generous with your time.
I really appreciate I'm good, appreciate you. The big question, well,
you know why the lie is the big question. But you know we
we've everybody kind of knows that. But who do you believe the hidden hands
or the controllers are the people at the very top of the food chain here
on earth that are pulling all the strings that are responsible for what you've seen
over the last three years and and for heliocentrism and everything that does hide god
Oprah Winfrey correct, that's not true. Uh, good night, everybody,
great show. Uh No, the you know that is that is a question
that I have I have posed for a number of years too. I've thrown
back at people. I go. The great thing about true power if you
know how to wield it is that the rules are very very simple, which
is true. Power stays hidden, you cannot be And that's the line from
Napoleon, which I thought was great, prettyquotable guy, now as quotable as
Einstein, but still pretty quotable. He said that, uh, he goes,
they cannot he goes. Never put yourself in a position where you can
be overthrown, all right, And that was the curse of what he had
to live with. He was a military general, he was a dictator,
and people knew who he was the person you want to be. The curse
of being the puppet master is you can't also be in the limelight, so
you can't run the puppets and also tell people you're running the puppets, because
then you're also people. Again, people know who you are. They can't
get you if they can't see you. So kings and queens and presidents and
people like that. Anybody can be overthrown if you know who they are.
That's the whole point once because they're everyone's at that level of power is worried
about the mob. There was an old quote and or a metaphor where they
said the general population is like this giant, dimwitted, lumbering beast that you
absolutely did not want to get its gaze on you. You know, you
want to give it somewhat contend, but do not. If you're gonna tack
it off, make sure it's not going your way. And the only way
to make sure is that they can't see you if you're invisible. So long
way around to this to answering this question. That being said, people are
all sorts of theories out there. If you ask the average conspiracy person to
ask, you know, it's what's what's your top twenty in order of importance
the groups out there that are controlling the world. You're never gonna get the
same twenty from people, and there's gonna be heated to arguments. It's like,
okay, you know, is it the Rothchilds, the Builderbergs, the
CFR, the tri Laterals, the Masons, the Vatican, the it just
goes on and on and on. Right, there's also you know the skull
and bones. I mean, which you want to do is you want to
find the oldest group. The oldest group is probably one that's running at the
most. I mean, people say, well, is the rothchilds Now the
roth Child's really got their big claim to power twelfth. Yeah, yeah,
well after after Waterloo, absolutely they you know, which was a great scamp.
Oh god, that was a great Indian, so freaking brilliant. But
again that's that's fairly new money in the grands game, the thame. So
when people talking about oh, Bill Kates and Jeff Beatles, and I'm going
that money is so new, the ink is still drying, you know.
By comparison, I go keep going back even further than that. I mean
the Mason's. Yeah, they've been around. The Mason's story goes actually all
the way back to the Masons and the Vatican have been tied together for a
very very long time. You want to look up stuff, look up the
Signet of Solomon or you know, the Knights Templar, going all the way
back. But don't forget that the Vatican was the one that ordered the Knights
Templar to look for the Ring of Solomon's ring in the first place. By
the way, the Ring of Power in the whole Lord of the Rings thing,
yeah not just a movie. He was based off of something. It's
based off the freaking Solomon's Ring. If you want to look it up.
Look at the signat of Solomon that the magic ring allowed him to control demons,
blue demons on top of it. Brilliant. I mean, some some
wonderful stories there. But going back you could probably again there's probably some rich
and powerful families that are old Grope, but the Vatican has got to be
the oldest because it's the remnants of the Roman Empire. Those guys, right,
the empire that ran for a thousand years, that ran for so long
they forgot who they were. They're like, wait a minute, what was
our initial missage? Right, take over the world? Right? Right?
Are we still doing that? You know they didn't even know? And when
would? They had run it for so long? For God's sex that the
Roman short sword for military people out there, they used that for six hundred
years, never changed it. That's how good they were, and they were
they were. They were humble enough to absorb anything which I loved about them,
which was, you know, if they came upon you know, they're
conquering an army, they came upon a catapult. There was a better design
than theirs. Hey you know what, that's new Roman catapult. That's what
we're using. Every other canapults they're using those they absorbed like the borg.
They just they were they were, they were really good. So if I
had to pick a power structure at the very top, at least in men
humans, I would pick the bad I can, you know, just because
they you know, they probably still have this stuff from the Library of Alexandria,
you know, the good stuff that I think they've probably got most of
the resources, and they probably don't have to worry about money, you know,
you know, when you get up at certain points, the money it's
just a number, you know. It's it's not a question of if you
can buy something, it's if you can topple economies and change the world markets.
Do I think there are other beings out there that have influence, Yes,
But I'm cautious and saying who or why, because I think there's rules
to this place. I want to drag I want to drag this out.
But I'll tell a story really quick about the greatest UFOs sighting of all time.
Was not Roswell, and it wasn't Aurora, Texas or anything like that.
It was fifteen sixty one Nuremberg, Germany. You can look it up
the keep page on it, which was fifteen sixty one, two giant space
arm modas just came into a beautiful April sky and hammered each other over Nuremberg,
Germany for a straight hour. And then a third faction showed up at
a giant, single black angular craft and chased them away and then went off
on its own. And that raised so many questions. I mean, of
course, there was no science fiction back then, so they had no context.
They thought it was a ruling, but and the in fact they drew
it. I mean, yeah, there was no photography in sixty one,
but an hour is plenty of time for any even the worst sketch artist,
to sketch the whole thing while they while they're having toast and schnitzen, Globin
goes this first thing in the mord. The question is, okay, who
are these first two guys, right? Who and why were they fighting?
And who's again? Who's there was a power structure here, you know,
obviously they weren't supposed to be fighting because the third group were they the cops?
The big black craft? Were they the un Who the hell were they?
And what was the response time? It took him an hour. I
could shoot a gun outside this window. There's gonna be people here in under
ten minutes for sure, And yet you've got you've got full blown flying aircraft
carriers just hammer each other for a full hour. So what I'm getting at
is there seems to be rules to this place. Again, Do I think
there are civilizations that are older than ourselves? Of course, I mean you
don't have to watch ancient aliens to figure it out. I mean, but
they did help. But just come on the Bossian Pyramids, the real pyramids,
Puma Punku, Machu Picchu. So I can say he's off Japan,
so I can say he's off of India. We are not the first group
to be here. Our unbroken history only goes back five thousand years. So
I think there's probably a prime directive in place, which is whoever's whoever graduates
from this you leave alone the surface group because they want whoever it is.
The rules is you got act naturally, right, So if you want to
pick off some guys in a rowboat or somebody in a forest or somebody in
a mountain, yeah, it's fine. You don't get to land in the
middle of Indiana, right and you know, come out and start taking selfies.
That's not going to happen because you can't. It's again prime directive.
I know I'm stealing from Star Trek, but it's absolutely true. You don't
want to you don't want to mess with that flow. So I don't think.
Then again, people will say, well, you know, it could
be demons at the top. It's like, yeah, maybe maybe, but
only be one or two and you're never going to figure out who they are.
If they were talking anybody, they're probably talking to somebody in the Vatican
maybe, which is sort of ironic, don't you think, Yeah, since
they have a telescope named Lucifer, right, well yeah, or the fact
that it's the freaking Vatican. You know, if you have a bean,
it could be why the reason why the Vatican came out not too long ago
and said, oh, you know, we wouldn't have any problem with aliens
and the whole alien concept. It's like, wow, it seems like an
odd thing to throw off, right, So do I think? But two
things real quick before we go. Do I think that there will be some
sort of alien agenda, introduction of a new you know, old civilization you're
painted you know, Project Blue Beam or however you want to do it.
Sure that seems like the logical step where we're going there. We're trying to
escalate things. We're in an undeclared war with Russia. We have been for
some time using Ukraine as a proxy. Could Russia is not going for it.
We're trying to kick in a big reset. Russia is playing the reluctant
villain. Kudos to them for not falling for all the tricks that we're doing.
But oh my god, it's getting ridiculous out there. But I also
think that the one of the reasons what might happen. It's like, Okay,
what do you expect? What's the goal here? You know what happens
when so many people figure out about flat Earth. For me, it's not
just the hundredth monkey effect, which I do believe and look it up if
you get a chance. You you know about the hundredth monkey effects. I
don't recall it hundred real quick, which is an automatic update for a species.
So the scientist, again, we didn't figure it out scientists. Scientists
did where they were feeding potatoes to monkeys on the beach, and some monkeys
were figuring out that if you wash the potatoes in the sand, you know,
in the water, you can get the sand off at a taste a
little bit. You don't have to eat sand. What happened was about the
hundredth monkey and people in sciences backbelly, so, oh, it's a myth.
It's like you guys were the ones that figured it out. Don't tell
me it's a myth. You just don't want to admit what it is,
which was once again to about the hundredth monkey. All the monkeys knew it,
meaning it's not like they were watching each other to learn it. They
all it was a mass monkey update. In fact, it wasn't just an
update on that island. It was every monkey in the island's plural, all
of them, even monkeys there were there were watering you know, kud and
I absolutely we're disconnected from each other. All the monkeys now instinctively learned.
It's like, oh, beneficial upgrade, totally see that. So is it
possible that humans could run into that same situation where if enough people kind of
figured out where this was, then with something like and I'll just throw out
a term, the Babel, I'll call it the Babel protocol. How's that?
So with the Tower of Babel, right, it was like it kicked
in immediately and afterwards like okay, so we need to put something in the
later civilization or this ever, a threshold has to be put in to where
if enough people figured out and start looking out, it's like, oh yeah,
I see what's going on here. If enough people you know, population
figured out, then God has to step in or you know, God's subcontractors
have to step in, or the caretakers or whoever, and say, okay,
next we gotta well, we gotta rotate over to the next, the
next group. Because I do think that it is kind of like a school
senior class thing where we eventually the this this civilization has to graduate like anybody
else. And as with any graduating class, it's the line you don't have
to go home, but you gotta get the hell out of here, everybody,
because we had another class come. So it's like, Okay, you're
gonna go subterraineing, or you're gonna go off to another continant, you're gonna
go outside the dome or whatever it is. That's that's what I'm that's my
ultimate goal. That's what I'm gunning for, because why not. It's like,
God, We've taken this as far as we're gonna take it. We've
taken to the nth degree. There's nothing new here. So there you go,
well done. Where can people find you? Are you? Are you
doing shows on Tuesday night? Yeah? I just did one last last night.
Yeah, so the reruns around my channel. I'm not going to give
out all the social media stuff because I don't run most of it, so
I don't even know what's out there. Okay, no worries, but but
I no, no, it's it's fine. The two things I want to
encourage. If you want to find my stuff, just go to the Just
type in flat Earth mark into any search engine. You will find me.
You'll eventually find the rabbit holes. They'll get to me. I don't care
how you get there. Eventually you'll get there. The other thing, which
is you've got up on your screen if you haven't done it already, you
know, because we David and his guys worked really really hard on as the
flatterth sun Mon and Zodia clock app. He's done it amazingly well. Because
it's visual, you know, it's people at picture is worth a thousand words
and I have used it myself. It's like people will say, well,
what's it look like you know, I can describe an audio all day long.
It's like it looks like this here, and I regret it. I
did not have it for like the first year at the app out I felt
bad. It's like, yeah, I'll get it, I'll get it,
and then finally I got It's like, oh man, I should have always
had this, so and and and last, last, but not least.
If you guys are looking, you know, there's meetups. We do meetups
in different parts of the country and different countries all the time. But the
big conference this year is gonna be in Las Vegas. So if you're curious,
just type in flat Toberfest twenty twenty three or flatterth Conference Las Vegas,
or I think the official website is what it is, just flatter Festivals dot
com. There you go, Yeah, flatterth Festivals dot com. And so
you can check out. I'm I'm opening. David Whites will be there from
the app I'm sure he's brought that up to you, Jarring from Jarinism,
Dave Murphy and a whole bunch of other people wits. It's going to be
there, maybe making some people cry. It'll be awesome and make sure yeah,
there we go. Well, because he he debates people, and people
people cry when they debate him. Yeah, so what so I was just
gonna tell the folks from mind then we're I just had David on I think
ten days ago, and we're number nine on the referral list. So make
sure you use f you are already number nine in like less than two weeks.
Yeah. Wow, that's pretty good. So guys, fe files for
the Fast. I don't get any referrals from from that because I always is
announce it on my my podcast and I try to work it into interviews.
So yeah, it's great. I have it, my wife has it.
We gift it to people because you can't, like you said, you can't.
Dev it's great, it's it's cool, it's a it's a cool visual
thing and people get it again. All you have to do is show them
a single image. And the reason it's the challenge I'll put that. Let's
end with this, the challenge I put out to trolls. The reason why
we keep growing the way we do and we keep winning by attrition is because
the model that you're looking at on the screen, you know, the like
the app model right there, It's easier to explain exponentially easier to explain than
the solar system model it is, and which I throw that of science.
I go, look on, with science, you need to know trigonometry,
and you know calculus and quantum mechanics and strength theory and all that other crap.
Right, you have to have a solar system and a galaxy around that
in universe around that. It's massive. It's absolutely incomprehensible for most people.
Right with this, that's all you need, just that little thing, that's
just just a little little snow globe. That's all. People can get their
head around it really, really quickly. So I put it the challenge out
to people in science. I go, until you create a version of the
solar system which is easier to explain than ours, people are going to go
with ours. That's right, because that people like easier stuff. They do,
and they just because it's easy. It doesn't mean it's right. I
go, No, it doesn't, but human nature means they're going to be
drawn to it, So try and stop us. There you go, Well
done, Thank you so much for your time. It's been a pleasure chatting
with you and bouncing things off and actually being able to have a one on
one conversation with somebody who has been such a part of this great awakening across
the world. So thanks for everything you do. I really appreciate it.
Thank you for having me. I appreciate it. That's Mark Sargent. Everyone.
Thank you for listening to the flat Earth Files podcast. Want to join
us on the podcast, Email us at the flat earth Files at gmail dot
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as well. Until the next time, my friends, keep your head on
a swivel and until the next time we will see you. You're listening to
the Fact Hunter Radio Network Just the Facts Mount