1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:03,200 And it hits me, Oh my gosh, this is a triangle. You 2 00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:06,960 know, there's explanation for everything that occurred in the randallsham Pars incident. It 3 00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:11,960 doesn't involve aliens at all. It was completely silent. It comes right over 4 00:00:12,039 --> 00:00:17,719 our heads. Classic. He's also really standing into clearing. He turned over 5 00:00:17,800 --> 00:00:20,160 to my father and held his hand, and he looked in his eyes and 6 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:28,160 said, we're not alone. Welcome to Podcast UFO for our live show. 7 00:00:28,839 --> 00:00:32,719 During the show, feel free to participate live in our chat room, and 8 00:00:32,799 --> 00:00:37,520 don't forget to like us on our very active Facebook page. Hello, and 9 00:00:37,719 --> 00:00:41,439 welcome to the show. I'm Martin Willish, your host, and we have 10 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:45,479 a great show for you this evening. We have Paul Karr as a guest. 11 00:00:46,399 --> 00:00:50,880 He is involved in the space field. He's a healthy skeptic, and 12 00:00:51,079 --> 00:00:59,000 he's also he's involved in the Aerial Phenomenon Investigations Team API. We're gonna be 13 00:00:59,039 --> 00:01:03,520 talking all about that later. Alejandro Rojas is coming up in just a minute 14 00:01:03,520 --> 00:01:07,239 with UFO updates. Just a couple of things. I want to thank everyone 15 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:10,239 that supports the show. Without your support, we could not do it. 16 00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:15,560 I really do appreciate that every week we have a new blog by Charles Lear 17 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:19,840 who blogs for US and this week the blog is titled Sympathy for the Air 18 00:01:19,879 --> 00:01:23,920 Force regarding UFOs. Maybe a lot of people don't have sympathy for the Air 19 00:01:23,959 --> 00:01:30,280 Force because we know they've actually have not always been truthful. But in this 20 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:36,799 blog Charles covers the Air Force's means of deflecting the press and the citizenry who 21 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:42,079 hounded them for information right in the midst of the nineteen fifties, UFO Mania, 22 00:01:42,159 --> 00:01:47,680 O flap, whatever that was happening, I would say mania is more 23 00:01:47,879 --> 00:01:51,760 to it. Also, I just wanted to let people know that we do 24 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:57,200 have a UFO Sighting posting page. Anyone can post there anonymously. Recently the 25 00:01:57,359 --> 00:02:06,400 last posting the gentlemen decided not to remain anonymous. And he is a pilot. 26 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:12,400 His name is Mark Muscat and he's a commercial pilot with over five thousand 27 00:02:12,439 --> 00:02:17,400 hours and he writes about his encounter while night flying back in nineteen ninety eight 28 00:02:17,719 --> 00:02:23,080 with a formation of lights, six very unusual lights. So check that out. 29 00:02:23,120 --> 00:02:28,159 That's over at podcast UFO dot com under UFO Sightings. And that's it 30 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:30,639 for me for right now. We're going to bring on the one and only 31 00:02:30,719 --> 00:02:35,840 Alejandro Rojas. How are you, Alejandro? Hello? Hello, I am 32 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:40,520 doing well. Thank you good. Welcome to the show. And we're going 33 00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:46,520 to have a Lou Alesando on this week's Is he coming up? Yeah, 34 00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:49,280 well this will be the update. So I didn't have him this week, 35 00:02:49,319 --> 00:02:52,960 which was kind of cool in a way because I thought, I really want 36 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:54,759 to catch my audience up. I mean, I've been doing a lot of 37 00:02:54,759 --> 00:03:00,840 research in the background over the background of eight hip and how it got together. 38 00:03:00,879 --> 00:03:04,080 Who are all these major players, and it can be really confusing, 39 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:07,439 and so I decided it would be good to have a show where I just 40 00:03:07,560 --> 00:03:10,960 covered that, and so that's what I did that way people because people were 41 00:03:10,960 --> 00:03:16,919 asking a lot of questions for Lou that obviously they didn't understand a lot of 42 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:21,800 that background. So I did that because he had to push again. And 43 00:03:21,919 --> 00:03:24,759 essentially what happened was he made the commitment that he would do an interview with 44 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:30,120 me before he kind of knew what the schedule was for the History Channel, 45 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:35,039 and plus he didn't realize he had to get permission from the History Channel to 46 00:03:35,159 --> 00:03:38,080 do the interview. So we've been working with them and that's been kind of 47 00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:42,319 weird. So what's funny and I'll tell people about that in just a minute. 48 00:03:42,360 --> 00:03:45,479 Is we've been in contact, so I've been able to get some answers 49 00:03:45,560 --> 00:03:49,719 from him on various things that have happened, but I've shared some with you. 50 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:53,560 So I'm still getting these kind of many interviews in the background, but 51 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:57,919 our actual interview now cannot happen until the show airs. So as soon as 52 00:03:57,919 --> 00:04:02,800 the show airs May thirty first that weekend will do the interview. And so 53 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:10,360 the essentially show right after the first show of the History Channels unidentified will be 54 00:04:10,439 --> 00:04:14,400 the lou Elisondo interview. So you know, I can understand why they're doing 55 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:17,680 that. I mean, yeah, may not want any little tibbets thrown out 56 00:04:17,680 --> 00:04:21,639 there that they're you know, that would be important to the show itself. 57 00:04:21,680 --> 00:04:25,680 So I kind of get why they're why they're doing that. Yeah, And 58 00:04:25,720 --> 00:04:29,040 it's kind of funny because I've written a couple of stories we haven't posted on 59 00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:32,040 Deni Geek yet and this podcast, you know, covers a lot of the 60 00:04:32,079 --> 00:04:35,399 background. Well, I was able to get a view of the first episode. 61 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:39,519 I'm not sure if I even told you this yet, and it is 62 00:04:39,759 --> 00:04:42,720 really good. I think people are going to be floored. Karen, my 63 00:04:42,759 --> 00:04:46,240 girlfriend, the owner of the UFO Congress, She says it was her favorite 64 00:04:46,279 --> 00:04:49,879 UFO show ever. I mean, it's amazing that it's a UFO show where 65 00:04:49,920 --> 00:04:55,199 it's very accurate. I saw, you know, I'm well known, I 66 00:04:55,319 --> 00:04:59,319 know the background to everything they covered, and it was very accurate. But 67 00:04:59,439 --> 00:05:02,600 it goes over you know, Chris Mellon plays a big role, Steve Jessics 68 00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:06,120 plays a big role, Alesando's kind of the main guy, and it goes 69 00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:12,959 over their backgrounds and just to have the high level of credibility that these people 70 00:05:13,079 --> 00:05:18,399 have to be doing a show on UFOs and being and talking about it seriously 71 00:05:18,399 --> 00:05:25,360 and conducting serious investigations. I think this show is incredibly important and I think 72 00:05:25,399 --> 00:05:30,560 that all of our UFO buddies are gonna love it. Now are The UFO 73 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:34,959 crowd always surprises me. They often beg are you know? There's more negativity 74 00:05:34,959 --> 00:05:40,839 than I could have ever imagined. That happens sometimes, but we'll see what 75 00:05:40,879 --> 00:05:43,600 people nitpick. I don't think there's a lot to nickpick. I think more 76 00:05:43,639 --> 00:05:46,279 there's a lot to be excited about with the show. Well that's great and 77 00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:49,959 yeah, so you got to see I think that I forget what the screener 78 00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:53,360 is, what they call them. You get to see the screener. Are 79 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:57,240 they gonna show you other episodes or just that number one that's it. I'm 80 00:05:57,279 --> 00:06:01,000 not sure. We've actually asked, and they have said that they're not sure. 81 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:04,360 It'll probably just be this first episode before the show airs, So it 82 00:06:04,439 --> 00:06:09,439 might be this might be it. I'm hoping that I'll get early looks for 83 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:14,519 all of the shows to prepare reviews early. That doesn't always happen with Blue 84 00:06:14,519 --> 00:06:16,079 Book. They gave us a few episodes, but not all of them, 85 00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:21,560 so we'll see. That's yet to be seen. But this first one is 86 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:25,800 really good. A couple other people I've gotten in I know Ryan Sprague and 87 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:30,680 m J Banias, and I know they both really really liked it. MJ 88 00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:33,800 is of course more critical of things, but he even really liked it. 89 00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:38,879 I haven't listened to his full review yet, but he does have great reviews. 90 00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:42,839 Yeah. I like watching his reviews. He's fun. Yeah. So 91 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:46,199 what else is going on? So a couple of big pieces of news that 92 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:48,040 I want to cover first. I do want to mention I'm wearing my UFO 93 00:06:48,079 --> 00:06:55,040 Congress hat. Used to save forty save forty and your listeners can get forty 94 00:06:55,079 --> 00:06:59,560 dollars off ticket packages, So save forty at UFO congress dot com. But 95 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:03,519 a couple of pieces of news. First of all, the guy who's giving 96 00:07:03,600 --> 00:07:08,519 us all of the best news and keeping us up to date on what's going 97 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:11,959 on is George Knapp, and he has a new story at KLAS with his 98 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:15,680 buddy Matt Adams, who he does these stories with. But they essentially got 99 00:07:15,720 --> 00:07:19,160 a hold of this forum that's called a d D nineteen ten. I think 100 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:23,879 I might we might have talked about it before, but what this form does 101 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:30,199 is shows that the DoD did release these three videos, these three clear navy 102 00:07:30,319 --> 00:07:34,759 videos. Now we have to remember, and Leslie Kane has piped up recently 103 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:40,839 actually to clarify with people, and I've kind of spoken to this. There 104 00:07:40,879 --> 00:07:45,240 has been no doubt in the mainstream as to the veracity of those videos. 105 00:07:45,279 --> 00:07:47,720 A lot of UFO nerds, like us, I'm certainly a UFO nerd, 106 00:07:47,800 --> 00:07:53,240 we care about the details, but most don't because right off the bat, 107 00:07:53,240 --> 00:07:57,240 the New York Times said they got the videos from the DoD, they were 108 00:07:57,279 --> 00:08:00,800 able to vet them and make sure they were real, and they were from 109 00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:03,160 the Navy, so boom for most people, that is good enough. Nick 110 00:08:03,199 --> 00:08:07,680 Pope even came in and backed up Leslie Kane and said, you know, 111 00:08:07,759 --> 00:08:09,240 because she was like, I don't know why this is even in question, 112 00:08:09,319 --> 00:08:13,000 But of course we verified all of this stuff, and Nick Pope says, 113 00:08:13,079 --> 00:08:18,279 yes, The New York Times has a highest standards for checking the veracity of 114 00:08:18,319 --> 00:08:22,199 the details. They make sure that everything is double check, triple check to 115 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:28,639 make sure it's all real and accurate. But this form is from the DoD. 116 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:33,879 Now it was leaked, and so when George napt posted the story showing 117 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:37,919 displaying this form, some people, you know, all of us, were 118 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:39,720 going to the DoD, Hey verify this, tell us if this is real 119 00:08:39,840 --> 00:08:45,159 or not. Because in the past the cod has told John Greenwald, we 120 00:08:45,240 --> 00:08:48,799 had nothing to do with those videos, and that was essentially what they said, 121 00:08:48,879 --> 00:08:52,200 we have nothing to do with those videos. They got back to John 122 00:08:52,240 --> 00:08:56,600 Greenwald first, and it's kind of funny that they all and I knew it. 123 00:08:56,919 --> 00:09:01,600 They always get to John Greenwald first, and John is, of course 124 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:05,960 you've had them on the show more skeptical about things, and so he posted 125 00:09:05,039 --> 00:09:11,360 that this form did not really show that the DoD had released the videos, 126 00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:18,480 and to be honest, I'm not even completely sure some people. I will 127 00:09:18,519 --> 00:09:20,200 put it this way, I wrote a story to kind of clarify, to 128 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:26,000 go over every point and every little aspect of that document so we can talk 129 00:09:26,039 --> 00:09:31,840 about the different parts of it and why the DoD had said what they said. 130 00:09:31,879 --> 00:09:35,399 They said the form is real, which verifies these are real DoD videos, 131 00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:39,399 and which also counters what they had said before that they have nothing to 132 00:09:39,440 --> 00:09:43,759 do with it. They certainly did have nothing to do with it or something 133 00:09:43,759 --> 00:09:46,519 to do with it. They released them. At the end of their comment 134 00:09:46,600 --> 00:09:50,480 to John Greenwald, though they did comment that these were not approved for general 135 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:56,879 public release, and that's actually completely inaccurate. This form is a form for 136 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:01,320 public release. It was approved by the Navy. The name of the person 137 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:05,519 in the Navy is withheld. It's redacted, but you know, there is 138 00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:09,799 a section it shows it is someone from the Navy who was asked and boom, 139 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:13,399 there's a stamp of approval. It was approved for public release. Now 140 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:18,960 in the comments, the person who requested that the videos be released, and 141 00:10:18,000 --> 00:10:24,080 we don't know who this person is as of yet. Apparently Alisando does know, 142 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:28,519 but he can't share that information yet. But the person said that they 143 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:35,559 were going to share this with USG governmental agencies and also with industry partners for 144 00:10:35,639 --> 00:10:39,600 their databases, so we can all kind of figure out what this is, 145 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:43,840 almost like a crowdfunding sort of thing. Nowhere on there did it say that 146 00:10:43,879 --> 00:10:48,600 these databases could not be public basing, and you know, the way it 147 00:10:48,639 --> 00:10:50,879 was written to me sounds like they wanted to kind of crowdsource, get this 148 00:10:50,919 --> 00:10:56,159 out to people and see what people think. So certainly to the Stars would 149 00:10:56,159 --> 00:10:58,519 be an industry partner, and nothing is barring them from sharing it to the 150 00:10:58,519 --> 00:11:03,440 public with this was for a public release, so it does not bar anybody 151 00:11:03,519 --> 00:11:07,200 from general public release. Now, it does have a sentence in there that 152 00:11:07,279 --> 00:11:11,679 said, this is not for publication. We are not intending to publicize or 153 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:18,759 to for a publication to publish these videos. A publication would be a journal, 154 00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:24,320 a book, a New York Times story. So this Dodd form did 155 00:11:24,360 --> 00:11:28,919 not approve their videos for release in that fashion, but that's not what the 156 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:33,039 writer was seeking in the first place. Now, the New York Times did 157 00:11:33,120 --> 00:11:37,720 publish them, but the New York Times is saying is not telling us you 158 00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:41,240 know where they got the videos. They're just saying they got them from the 159 00:11:41,320 --> 00:11:43,799 DoD, they were vetted, they were able to publish them. So what 160 00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:50,039 their process was to get those videos published we don't know, but at least 161 00:11:50,360 --> 00:11:54,279 this form does confirm and the DoD does confirm these videos are theirs. So 162 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:58,919 there's a lot of confusion around that piece. But the big story, which 163 00:12:00,159 --> 00:12:03,039 a lot of people are like, why are why are we even debating any 164 00:12:03,039 --> 00:12:05,519 of this other stuff, The big story is the d D is confirming they 165 00:12:05,639 --> 00:12:11,240 did release these videos. These videos are real. They are from the Navy. 166 00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:15,960 They are from Navy at eighteen jets, something that really the mainstream is 167 00:12:16,000 --> 00:12:18,320 not even questioned since the New York Times told us all of that, But 168 00:12:18,399 --> 00:12:24,320 at least it verifies that all in the background. So I do have on 169 00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:28,320 Open Minds dot tv a link to George Knapp's story it's the first one, 170 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:31,399 and then a link to my story with some clarifications, and I do link 171 00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:35,679 to John Greenwald, so if you want to go look at John Greenwald and 172 00:12:35,720 --> 00:12:39,559 see what he has to say and his interpretation, I've got links to all 173 00:12:39,559 --> 00:12:41,960 of that in there as well, so you can go see what you think 174 00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:50,000 yourself. Now, why do you suppose that the person and the Pentagon would 175 00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:54,799 say not for a public release in an email. That's a bizarre isn't it 176 00:12:54,879 --> 00:12:58,360 Not? Really, I don't think. I think that it's been obvious to 177 00:12:58,399 --> 00:13:05,120 me. Now this is me speculating, but it's also me having This is 178 00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:11,240 educated speculation. We've seen this before. The DoD are all of these military 179 00:13:11,399 --> 00:13:18,960 public you know, public relations departments. They obviously their first thought is how 180 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:24,200 do we make us look good? The second part is can I even get 181 00:13:24,279 --> 00:13:28,000 access to this information? A lot of times they don't. They're not able 182 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:31,240 to get access. In fact, Leslie Kine made a comment, the reason 183 00:13:31,279 --> 00:13:35,039 the DoD is probably wrong so much on this is that it they don't have 184 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:39,480 access. It's such a small program that is, you know, tucked away 185 00:13:39,639 --> 00:13:43,960 in the Pentagon here, that they probably have a hard time finding any information. 186 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:48,960 She's like, you know, I've got experience with BOYA and she's ran 187 00:13:48,080 --> 00:13:52,240 into the same issues where they just don't know where to look, so they 188 00:13:52,279 --> 00:13:56,360 can't find the information. And that's probably related to what's going on. And 189 00:13:56,480 --> 00:14:03,039 this happens all the time. Nearly every major UFO case, the military tells 190 00:14:03,159 --> 00:14:07,000 us something and then they correct themselves later. I mean, this was done 191 00:14:07,240 --> 00:14:15,879 in Stephenville, this was done with the O'Hara incident. It's done practically every 192 00:14:15,879 --> 00:14:18,720 time. So is it a surprise at here Again we have a big UFO 193 00:14:18,799 --> 00:14:22,799 case where they gave us wrong information at first and then corrected it later on. 194 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:26,879 It's not that surprising. What is a little bit of surprising is they're 195 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:33,240 kind of blatantly spinning. In my opinion, they either are embarrassed or kind 196 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:37,679 of frustrated by this whole situation, and you can't blame them. Lou did 197 00:14:37,759 --> 00:14:41,679 not Alisander did not say, hey guys, I'm going to retire and then 198 00:14:41,720 --> 00:14:46,120 I'm gonna tell everybody about this UFO project that I'm working on. He did 199 00:14:46,159 --> 00:14:50,639 not clear this with the press department. So they're probably very frustrated with Lou 200 00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:54,840 that he would go out there and do this, which puts them in an 201 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:58,799 odd position because now they have to answer all these questions about UFO stuff, 202 00:14:58,799 --> 00:15:03,519 which they haven't been They I haven't been really talking to anybody but John Greenwald. 203 00:15:03,039 --> 00:15:05,639 He's the only one they're talking to on a regular basis. The rest 204 00:15:05,639 --> 00:15:09,440 of us they're ignoring, or they say they're going to come back with a 205 00:15:09,519 --> 00:15:13,840 response, and they don't, So I think that's what it is. They're 206 00:15:13,879 --> 00:15:18,639 embarrassed that they're proving themselves wrong, and so they're just trying to save face 207 00:15:18,879 --> 00:15:22,200 and at the same time they're they're not doing a very good job of it. 208 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:26,360 They're making themselves look bad, and we just you know, these are 209 00:15:26,440 --> 00:15:31,759 not often professional PR people. These are often people who take PR duty, 210 00:15:31,039 --> 00:15:37,519 you know seriously. I mean, they're they're not professionals who are looking to 211 00:15:37,519 --> 00:15:41,320 get into the media to do this as a profession. So they're just tasked 212 00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:45,559 with having to do this, and if anybody's called them, you kind of 213 00:15:45,559 --> 00:15:50,879 get that sense. They there's a vast difference between a talking to publicists and 214 00:15:50,919 --> 00:15:54,720 talking to the PR guys for the military. So I think all of this 215 00:15:54,799 --> 00:15:58,679 has to be all in play here, and it's we've experienced this over and 216 00:15:58,720 --> 00:16:03,720 over again in the past dealing with their them. I mean, they are 217 00:16:03,759 --> 00:16:07,240 not the best source of the most accurate information. That's why you need the 218 00:16:07,279 --> 00:16:11,799 documents, and that's what's great that people are pursuing to get these documents. 219 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:15,960 It's great that John verified that this document that George Knapp got was real. 220 00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:19,039 In fact, they verified it with Greenwald before they did with NAP for some 221 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:23,519 reason, even though Nap is an award winning investigative journalist. I mean, 222 00:16:23,559 --> 00:16:27,720 that's more evidence that they're kind of playing games over there and who they're talking 223 00:16:27,759 --> 00:16:32,840 to and what information that they're giving people. Yeah, maybe that because John 224 00:16:32,879 --> 00:16:37,600 has like two million for your document documents that he's gone. Yeah, but 225 00:16:37,720 --> 00:16:40,039 anyway, you know, we're out of time. Did you have anything else 226 00:16:40,039 --> 00:16:41,639 you wanted to say real quickly. Yeah. The only other thing that I 227 00:16:41,679 --> 00:16:45,679 wanted to say out there is that the other big story is that the Navy 228 00:16:45,679 --> 00:16:48,799 had said they're not going to share any UFO information they receive. Well, 229 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:53,320 here's another thing where I've gotten some information from Luelasondo. In George Knapp's story 230 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:57,480 that I referred to earlier, he interviews Chris Mellen, and Chris Mellen actually 231 00:16:57,519 --> 00:17:02,799 gives him a statement on how to the Stars was integral and getting the Navy 232 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:07,480 to create these UFO guidelines, and lou is saying when I asked him that, 233 00:17:07,559 --> 00:17:11,359 Hey, the Navy said that they're not going to release the data, 234 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:14,480 but that's not the full story. We've been working behind the scenes. We 235 00:17:14,559 --> 00:17:18,799 know the Navy's not going to release their raw data to the public, but 236 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:22,880 that information will be given to Congress, it will be given to their leadership, 237 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:26,599 and then that information will be taken and summarized for the public. So 238 00:17:26,680 --> 00:17:33,000 we will see information about what the Navy is collecting on UFOs. The example 239 00:17:33,079 --> 00:17:37,440 he gave us North Korea and their nukes. We don't know details about where 240 00:17:37,480 --> 00:17:41,519 their nukes are, what they're you know, everything that's been retrieved that way 241 00:17:41,519 --> 00:17:45,200 with the data. But we do get public information about summaries of their nuclear 242 00:17:45,319 --> 00:17:49,200 program, and that's the sort of thing we will get information. So that's 243 00:17:49,240 --> 00:17:52,359 not completely accurate all these headlines that the Navy is going to keep it all 244 00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:56,880 secret. Excellent, all right, all Andre, thanks so much. Yep, 245 00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:59,400 my pleasure. I'll talk to you next week. Thank you, talk 246 00:17:59,400 --> 00:18:02,039 to you later. All right, all right, everyone, So our guest. 247 00:18:02,839 --> 00:18:08,480 Our guest as Paul Carr, and he's had a lifelong fascination with the 248 00:18:08,559 --> 00:18:15,519 exploration of outer space and all things unexplained. And let's see, he has 249 00:18:15,599 --> 00:18:21,559 been a spacecraft systems engineer, a career that now spends about thirty eight years. 250 00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:26,680 And he while working at the Applied Physics Lab in Maryland, he earned 251 00:18:26,680 --> 00:18:33,200 his MS and applied physics from John Hopkins, and in two eleven he was 252 00:18:33,279 --> 00:18:37,839 recruited to join the Aerial Phenomena Investigations Team API. We'll be talking about that, 253 00:18:38,359 --> 00:18:45,200 and back in twenty seventeen he took over as director of that and this 254 00:18:45,279 --> 00:18:52,599 is an independent organization that investigates UFOs worldwide. So welcome to the show. 255 00:18:52,559 --> 00:18:56,279 Well, thanks Mart for having me on. Thank you, And you know 256 00:18:56,319 --> 00:19:00,359 I was looking he was back four years ago. A lot's changed in the 257 00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:03,920 four years that that's when you were on last time. Yes, it has. 258 00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:07,359 Yeah, and back then we were doing the one hour shows. Now 259 00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:12,000 we got two hours, and we're we're on a great radio station and all 260 00:19:12,079 --> 00:19:15,799 kinds of good stuff here. But anyway, thank you, and we do. 261 00:19:15,839 --> 00:19:19,599 I want to say that we do have a lot of new listeners to 262 00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:25,119 the show. There's new listeners every week I get email. That's really amazing. 263 00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:27,839 How I would say, within the last year, how many people are 264 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:33,119 listening now to the show? Can you give them for the person that didn't 265 00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:37,079 listen four years ago? Please give your background if you would, and what 266 00:19:37,279 --> 00:19:41,400 got you interested in the UFOs. Well, as you mentioned, I've been 267 00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:49,160 involved in the space field for since I got out of college. And and 268 00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:55,519 I was a spot nick baby born in nineteen fifty eight, right a few 269 00:19:55,519 --> 00:19:59,200 months after. So there was this big panic on about, oh my gosh, 270 00:19:59,359 --> 00:20:03,519 we have to catch up on science and engineering and so uh there was 271 00:20:03,559 --> 00:20:07,759 that big push to get all us little kids into space and into and you 272 00:20:07,839 --> 00:20:14,440 know I was. I was totally right there with that, that whole program. 273 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:18,880 Uh and uh. I was eleven years old when Armstrong said his foot 274 00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:23,039 in the moon, and I was really jealous of the Armstrong. I wanted 275 00:20:23,319 --> 00:20:30,599 I wanted to be him, and um, I even fantasized about stowing away 276 00:20:30,079 --> 00:20:37,759 on the capsule. That wouldn't I don't, Yeah, every I couldn't think 277 00:20:37,759 --> 00:20:42,680 of a good plan anyway. The uh and when I was at that, 278 00:20:42,839 --> 00:20:47,240 of course, also in the sixties, what was going on was a lot 279 00:20:47,319 --> 00:20:52,000 of uh ufo stuff around. A lot of books uh that were available at 280 00:20:52,039 --> 00:20:57,880 any public library or uh. It wasn't all stuck away in the New New 281 00:20:57,880 --> 00:21:04,119 Age section of the bookstore. Uh. And so I had a lot of 282 00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:07,880 exposure to that. I did, I didn't think a great deal of it 283 00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:11,920 until I was a little older. I started reading some books. I actually 284 00:21:12,599 --> 00:21:18,119 Uh. To join Nightcap, you had to have five dollars for the membership 285 00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:21,160 fee, and I started saving, which, by the way, five dollars 286 00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:23,519 for a ten year old kid in night nineteen sixty eight was a lot of 287 00:21:23,519 --> 00:21:29,519 money, it was, I remember, Yeah. And so I started putting 288 00:21:29,519 --> 00:21:32,279 my pennies and stuff in a box and I was going to join Nightcap. 289 00:21:33,079 --> 00:21:37,680 Uh. And I can't remember what happened that plan. But um, I 290 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,799 never I don't remember ever getting one of the newsletters. I think they folded 291 00:21:40,839 --> 00:21:47,079 around around that time. But um, because I was really interesting and what 292 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:48,119 I was reading now, a lot of that was just sort of the pulp 293 00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:56,039 press, uh, you know, and uh, just books I could find 294 00:21:56,079 --> 00:22:00,200 them in the library. And but when I was a teenager, my dad 295 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:07,240 and I were out walking one night, probably about I think nineteen seventy one, 296 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:14,359 something like that. Uh, and uh we had I had my first 297 00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:18,200 sighting. Uh these were lights, but there were a lot of lights, 298 00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:22,039 and they were brightly colored lights and were dancing around each other and moving very 299 00:22:22,039 --> 00:22:26,640 fast. And my dad saw it too, although we didn't speak of it 300 00:22:27,359 --> 00:22:32,200 after that really, which I think is pretty common in a lot of families. 301 00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:33,200 And do hear that, Hey, Dad, I remember the time we 302 00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:40,319 saw the UFOs. Yeah no, uh, because you know that that was 303 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:42,839 kind of upsetting to his worldview, and I been to mine as well. 304 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:49,240 I was already an aspiring scientist and engineer, and now I didn't see another 305 00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:53,799 UFO again for many many years. But I wasn't interested. I went off 306 00:22:53,839 --> 00:22:57,799 and got my degree in science, and I was thinking, well, you 307 00:22:57,799 --> 00:23:03,960 know, maybe, uh this self can all be explained, and I don't 308 00:23:03,079 --> 00:23:07,599 really have time to deal with it. And it wasn't until much later, 309 00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:15,839 h in the in the nineties that my interest revived again. And H I 310 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:23,440 did have rather unusual experience again with nocturnal lights that were that I still can't 311 00:23:23,519 --> 00:23:27,519 fully explain. I suppose it could have been a hoax, but it would 312 00:23:27,519 --> 00:23:33,960 have been a very elaborate one. And uh so I was puzzled by that. 313 00:23:33,039 --> 00:23:38,240 I still am puzzled by that experience. Uh, And I uh started 314 00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:45,519 thinking about it quite a lot and started researching online. I was involved in 315 00:23:45,599 --> 00:23:48,319 some of the bulletin board stuff in the early days, you know, the 316 00:23:48,319 --> 00:23:55,039 the uh A copy serve. Uh yeah, problem many relationships probably aren't holding 317 00:23:55,119 --> 00:24:00,480 up for member copy serve. But ut yeah the ultivis ye yeah, yeah, 318 00:24:00,319 --> 00:24:04,839 I had but I had I got into that. I was a little 319 00:24:04,839 --> 00:24:11,880 bit disappointed in the culture and UH, and I was witnessed to a lot 320 00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:18,359 of the disinformation that was flying around back then. Most people weren't the way, 321 00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:23,440 most people weren't suckered in't buy it, but UH them And then UH. 322 00:24:23,839 --> 00:24:27,319 This went on for a very long time. And as you mentioned earlier, 323 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:33,200 and UH and my interest with Wax and Wayne, with other things going 324 00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:36,039 on. I had a family, I had other things to deal with. 325 00:24:36,759 --> 00:24:41,400 And UH, in twenty eleven, just as my kids stopped being so little, 326 00:24:41,599 --> 00:24:48,000 you know, the I was contacted to join API and I thought, 327 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:48,359 well, you know, this is what I want to do. I want 328 00:24:48,359 --> 00:24:52,039 to get out there and talk to people who've seen UFOs. I don't want 329 00:24:52,519 --> 00:24:56,920 to read about it online anymore so much. H. I want to actually 330 00:24:56,960 --> 00:25:02,440 go talk to these people and are the crazy? Are they? Are they 331 00:25:03,079 --> 00:25:07,799 rednecks? Ignorant? What are what kind of people are they? And really 332 00:25:07,839 --> 00:25:11,359 you know, trying to understand their experiences, understand my experiences inn for theirs. 333 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:19,160 And and in the meantime, I'd had another couple of experiences again, 334 00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:26,200 one one which one was I would consider a close encounter and the h which 335 00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:33,279 puzzles me to this day what that was. But that and I was very 336 00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:37,880 disappointed in myself that did a poor job of documenting that siding. And so 337 00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:40,279 I said, well, let's get into this figure how to document siding, 338 00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:44,720 how to how to get it right. And m our director at the time, 339 00:25:44,799 --> 00:25:48,759 Antonio Paris, had a lot of background in investigation. He'd been an 340 00:25:48,759 --> 00:25:56,920 investigator for the federal government and he had after he left the army and had 341 00:25:57,319 --> 00:26:02,880 so he understood investigated procedure and so on. So that's I did. I 342 00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:06,440 said, well, this guy can teach me how to do investigations. And 343 00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:11,319 that's what happened. And we did a lot of investigations, and we had 344 00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:15,319 some really good cases. We had lots of bad cases. And I got 345 00:26:15,359 --> 00:26:18,559 out there and talk to those people, and what I learned was, uh 346 00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:22,759 no, they're by and large not crazy, not stupid, not ignorant, 347 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:30,720 and perfectly functional, normal adults. Many of them are actually rather bright, 348 00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:36,880 and uh I know it was surprising, Yeah, and as not the stereotype 349 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:45,160 right of the ignorant hick h m who sees the light in this guy and 350 00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:49,319 thinks it's somebody from Mars. Right. That's the majority of The people we 351 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:53,319 talked to do not have a theory. They do not say, ah, 352 00:26:53,319 --> 00:26:56,920 that was the great men from his eight in Particuli. They said, I 353 00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:02,000 saw something I don't understand it. Can you help me understand it? And 354 00:27:02,039 --> 00:27:06,359 that was what we did. In many cases we were able to explain what 355 00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:10,240 they saw, and we still that's still the case. Most of the cases 356 00:27:10,279 --> 00:27:17,519 we get in, we have we're able to do enough investigation is to make 357 00:27:17,559 --> 00:27:22,480 a positive identification of some known phenomenon, right that which happens, like you 358 00:27:22,559 --> 00:27:25,680 say, most of the time. We're right at break right now, So 359 00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:30,240 we're going to head into break and hang in there with me. We'll still 360 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:34,839 be talking on YouTube. So my guest tonight is Paul Carr, and when 361 00:27:34,839 --> 00:27:37,759 we come back, I'm going to be asking about his close encounter. We 362 00:27:37,799 --> 00:27:44,240 need more information on that, and we'll continue talking about investigations that he's currently 363 00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:48,039 doing. And so hang in there, everyone, we'll be right back right 364 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:55,559 after these messages. We're clear, Martin, Sorry I didn't see your message 365 00:27:55,599 --> 00:27:59,279 there. I didn't have a chat window. That's s right. How many 366 00:27:59,279 --> 00:28:02,880 minutes we have here? Uh? One, two, three, four minutes 367 00:28:02,920 --> 00:28:06,359 and fifteen seconds? Got it? Okay? All right, so we are 368 00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:10,839 still live. Um, we are live on YouTube and uh so Paul, 369 00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:14,160 we'll continue that conversation. We will come back right now. I'm going to 370 00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:17,240 look to see if we have any questions that anyone can post a question up 371 00:28:17,279 --> 00:28:21,920 on the in the chat room and when you were here before, Paul. 372 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:26,680 If if I don't see any questions right now, UM, I'm going to 373 00:28:26,759 --> 00:28:30,200 ask you because I remember you said something that was pretty good. You said 374 00:28:30,759 --> 00:28:36,359 something along the lines is we've got to drain the swamp, the UFO swamp. 375 00:28:37,039 --> 00:28:41,039 Yeah. Yeah, well that that Uh, somebody else stole that since 376 00:28:41,079 --> 00:28:48,680 then, but some people are saying that the swamp the no, the swamp 377 00:28:48,759 --> 00:28:52,599 is not drained, but the drain is swamped. Um or more more gaiters 378 00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:56,359 got into the swamp. But yeah, I got to stay away from that 379 00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:59,720 topic. You should see the mail I get. Yeah. Well anyway, 380 00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:03,720 yeah, well, as you know, and I'm sure many of your readers 381 00:29:03,119 --> 00:29:11,519 listeners know, Uh, there's a lot of of stuff in the UFO field 382 00:29:12,079 --> 00:29:21,599 that is highly inaccurate and highly speculative. And also people just a lot of 383 00:29:21,599 --> 00:29:23,279 people just like to fight, you know, they like they want to they're 384 00:29:23,319 --> 00:29:27,440 looking they're looking for a fight, and uh, we don't want anything to 385 00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:33,000 do with any of that. Um we didn't. So you know, some 386 00:29:33,079 --> 00:29:37,839 people might call it woo woo, you know, saying and uh so what 387 00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:45,079 we have are trying to do is actually bring in a scientific approach. Now 388 00:29:45,079 --> 00:29:49,440 I'm not saying science. Science is something we're not. We haven't arrived at 389 00:29:49,519 --> 00:29:56,000 yet. Science is a big deal, but we are, uh, we 390 00:29:56,039 --> 00:30:02,640 want to take a genuinely scientific approach, a dogma free. We don't. 391 00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:07,079 We don't think we don't. Everybody at API has their own idea what UFOs 392 00:30:07,079 --> 00:30:15,799 probably are. I have my ideas too, uh. And but what we're 393 00:30:15,839 --> 00:30:18,279 really trying to go get it is get at the facts. Create a database 394 00:30:18,359 --> 00:30:26,359 of well investigated cases where we determine all the facts that we can and try 395 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:33,000 to figure out how to if it's even possible to do science within this field. 396 00:30:33,279 --> 00:30:36,599 We don't even know that it's possible. Yeah, I mean, there's 397 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:44,000 a fleeting the fleeting element for one transient element, there's as far as you 398 00:30:44,039 --> 00:30:48,000 can't replicate. It's really tricky. Um well you know that. You know 399 00:30:48,079 --> 00:30:55,839 that, But science has dealt with that problem before successfully. Scientists study very 400 00:30:55,880 --> 00:31:00,839 well tornadoes, earthquakes, demo, ray bursts, supernovas, things that only 401 00:31:02,039 --> 00:31:06,359 good point yeah, where the event is unique, but there are more events 402 00:31:06,519 --> 00:31:08,440 like it, and so what they can what they do is they look for 403 00:31:08,519 --> 00:31:14,359 patterns in the in the multiple events and they found well, we can classify 404 00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:18,880 this and and study that, and eventually models get built up and they start 405 00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:25,720 to understand it better and better over the years. And you know, some 406 00:31:25,839 --> 00:31:29,359 of them are just really really difficult problems to solve, like how do you 407 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:33,240 forecast a tornado more than to play five minutes in advance? Very difficult. 408 00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:34,920 Yeah, just so let you know, we got about thirty thirty seconds I 409 00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:41,319 think before we go back, um on KGr a, wow, Um, 410 00:31:41,319 --> 00:31:47,200 you're right about that. And uh, you know I always mentioned you know, 411 00:31:47,279 --> 00:31:52,319 dark matter and um you know, I mean that is that's non observable, 412 00:31:52,759 --> 00:32:00,359 but it might yeah, uh we'll find out someday, I think, 413 00:32:00,839 --> 00:32:02,759 Yeah, what it is? Yeah, hey, Race, just interrupt when 414 00:32:02,759 --> 00:32:08,000 you have to. You got it. Yeah. Um, so we're going 415 00:32:08,039 --> 00:32:15,880 back in like ten ten fifteen seconds, right, so when we go when 416 00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:21,240 we go back, um, I'm going to you can continue where you were, 417 00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:24,079 but I really want to know about your encounter. Okay, Yeah, 418 00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:30,200 I'm happy to tell talk about that. Yeah, it was. It bugs 419 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:32,119 me every day. Yeah, oh wow. Okay, are we back. 420 00:32:32,119 --> 00:32:38,920 We're going back race. I just got the bumper Rowland. We're ready to 421 00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:45,119 go. Okay, we're ready on the side in five four three two. 422 00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:50,240 All right, welcome back. Um, this is Martin Willis. My guest 423 00:32:50,279 --> 00:32:53,880 tonight is Paul Carr. And right before the break, um, he was 424 00:32:54,240 --> 00:33:00,759 discussing his investigations for API, and but I do want to ask him. 425 00:33:01,519 --> 00:33:04,920 I want to ask you, Paul, about your encounter. Can you get 426 00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:07,200 into the details. And you just mentioned while we're on break here that it 427 00:33:07,279 --> 00:33:12,440 bothers you every day, and that's that's interesting to me. Well, part 428 00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:14,839 of it. Part of the bothers me is that I did a such a 429 00:33:14,839 --> 00:33:19,960 poor job of documenting it at the time, which a lot of the things 430 00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:23,599 that I that I tell witnesses to do now that are good, I didn't 431 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:30,079 do, Like make a sketch. I always tell witnesses please, first thing, 432 00:33:30,279 --> 00:33:32,039 go grab a piece of paper and make a sketch of what you saw. 433 00:33:32,359 --> 00:33:37,319 There's science that says that that helps you then remember it better and h 434 00:33:37,759 --> 00:33:44,599 and also it helps us investigate better. So make the sketch and probably before 435 00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:46,799 even run anything down in words, just make a sketch. We've had some 436 00:33:46,839 --> 00:33:50,720 witnesses that have done beautifully at that, by the way, without being asked. 437 00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:55,799 Uh so they're smarter than I am. But uh, the the thing, 438 00:33:55,880 --> 00:34:00,440 this was a nice warm summer day. Uh you know, I don't 439 00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:07,880 even know the date, but it was around two thousand and seven, and 440 00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:13,800 I was out in the front yard and my kids and some neighbor kids and 441 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:19,639 some neighbor adults were there out there, and they were they were all standing 442 00:34:19,679 --> 00:34:24,559 on the driveway, and I was, for some reason, standing ways away 443 00:34:24,559 --> 00:34:29,079 from them, towards almost on the street and not on the driveway, on 444 00:34:29,159 --> 00:34:34,159 the lawn. And they were My wife and some other the neighbor lady were 445 00:34:34,199 --> 00:34:43,039 in deep conversation. The kids were running around playing, and I just this 446 00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:49,599 broad daylight and I looked up and I saw something that at first my brain 447 00:34:49,639 --> 00:34:53,119 did not register because it was just didn't make any sense. There was this 448 00:34:53,719 --> 00:35:01,679 black slab gliding through the tree in my neighbor, my next door neighbor's yard. 449 00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:07,159 And now I have to explain that between our yards there was a line 450 00:35:07,199 --> 00:35:10,280 of trees, including a great, big white pine and some other oak trees 451 00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:15,920 and so forth. This part of Maryland is blessed with nice, beautiful trees 452 00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:22,719 all everywhere, and we have and I just it was gliding in this It 453 00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:25,760 looked like a straight path, but it was avoiding lots of things. It 454 00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:35,079 was avoiding my neighbor's house and several trees and eventually power lines, and it 455 00:35:35,239 --> 00:35:39,639 just glided. And it at the closest approach, it was probably fifty feet 456 00:35:39,679 --> 00:35:46,639 from me, and wow, that's very kept. It was about the size 457 00:35:46,679 --> 00:35:52,000 of a car, roughly, but the flat side was facing me, and 458 00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:59,800 the chexture looked very rough and uneven. But I couldn't see it great through 459 00:35:59,840 --> 00:36:02,400 the trees. I just I could just sort of see the big shape of 460 00:36:02,519 --> 00:36:07,760 it. And I looked at every other people and d I would say, 461 00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:13,480 what is that? And nobody turned to luck. It was the strangest thing. 462 00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:19,719 And uh, the kids just kept playing, and my my wife and 463 00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:23,239 they were deep in conversation and probably not even and they there sometimes I shout 464 00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:27,280 for no reason, and of course I shouting my kids all the time, 465 00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:31,679 so they didn't. Uh, they didn't think anything of it. And I 466 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:36,480 it was just flying by, uh in a direction that takes it roughly. 467 00:36:36,559 --> 00:36:39,559 We're in the Maryland suburbs of DC. It was, it was, and 468 00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:45,480 if anybody wants to, I can give you the more details because we no 469 00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:52,199 longer live at that house. But uh uh, it flew. It's somehow 470 00:36:52,199 --> 00:36:55,559 avoided the power lines and the trees, and I had looked. I didn't 471 00:36:55,559 --> 00:37:00,880 see any broken branches or anything. And I just went and just glided gently, 472 00:37:01,079 --> 00:37:06,880 no sound, no sound at all. Again, about the size of 473 00:37:06,920 --> 00:37:12,320 a car, maybe sixteen feet roughly, give or take. But it was 474 00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:15,480 between I know the things that I know it was behind it. I don't 475 00:37:15,519 --> 00:37:16,599 know what was in front of so I know roughly how far away it was 476 00:37:16,639 --> 00:37:22,800 for me to you know, probably pretty well. So I sort of stared 477 00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:23,320 at it, and I thought I got to run in the house to get 478 00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:27,960 my camera. I looked at the house and I got no, the house 479 00:37:28,039 --> 00:37:30,880 is hundred feet away, and by the time I find the camera I get 480 00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:34,360 back here, it gone. I didn't have it. I didn't have my 481 00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:37,679 cell phone into my camera. I didn't have a binoculars. So I just 482 00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:42,239 ran out to the curb and had already gone past the curb and was flying. 483 00:37:43,119 --> 00:37:50,000 Oh I don't know, maybe thirty miles an hour, just and and 484 00:37:50,159 --> 00:37:53,679 somehow I had turned. It was no longer the flat part was no longer 485 00:37:54,199 --> 00:37:58,920 vertical, now horizontal. So I was looking at kind of like the back 486 00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:06,639 of a slab that was horizontally oriented. And it just at a very steady 487 00:38:06,639 --> 00:38:10,920 eltar just flew off and until it was over behind trees and houses and I 488 00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:15,760 could see anymore again. There were lots of obstacles there, but I just 489 00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:21,119 went right through between them all without varying its course in any perceptible way. 490 00:38:21,599 --> 00:38:29,360 It was headed right towards dc H And uh. This, you know, 491 00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:35,079 my emotional old state was more frustration than anything else because I couldn't I couldn't 492 00:38:35,119 --> 00:38:37,559 record it or anything. But I was also you know, I was also 493 00:38:37,599 --> 00:38:42,199 a little bit weirded out that nobody else noticed it. Yeah, now that 494 00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:45,559 didn't really they were early facing towards it like I was. I might not 495 00:38:45,599 --> 00:38:50,119 have seen it, but uh, and this was I have. So ever 496 00:38:50,159 --> 00:38:54,360 since then, I've been on the lookout for a rectangular shaped black things flying 497 00:38:54,400 --> 00:38:58,599 around, and we actually did get a case like that last year that I 498 00:38:58,639 --> 00:39:04,159 can talk about. But so, and if any of your listeners have seen 499 00:39:04,159 --> 00:39:07,360 a black rectangle I want to know, please go to report at UFO dot 500 00:39:07,559 --> 00:39:14,760 org and and and let me know. But excuse me, but that was 501 00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:20,639 by far my closest encounter or anything. The other things I've seen before were 502 00:39:20,719 --> 00:39:25,159 nocturnal lights, which some of which I think may have been within maybe a 503 00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:30,960 quarter mile of me, But maybe I don't. It's hard to it's impossible 504 00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:35,639 to gage disince. Really in many six monstences just seemed like you were close. 505 00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:40,599 Uh And but others were much more distant. And I've seen a couple 506 00:39:40,599 --> 00:39:51,960 other weird things that might be explainable as unusual aircraft or um weather phenomena. 507 00:39:52,039 --> 00:39:57,400 But that was definitely something that should not have been there. Was flying, 508 00:39:59,079 --> 00:40:02,840 was not an airplane, was not not not a little drone craft. Uh. 509 00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:07,719 It was big, and it was black, and it it was not 510 00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:14,840 aerodynamic looking, and uh and so I bugged me and bugged me. It 511 00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:15,800 still bugged me. I still think about it all the time, you know. 512 00:40:16,079 --> 00:40:19,599 And now I worry that my memory is fading and I'm starting to get 513 00:40:19,599 --> 00:40:22,280 the details wrong. And the story I'm telling you may not be exactly the 514 00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:25,719 same story that I would have told you ten years ago. But uh, 515 00:40:27,079 --> 00:40:30,559 I get that because the one sighting I had that I know was you know, 516 00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:35,320 a sighting. Um, I worry about that too, you know, 517 00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:40,280 like remembering it exactly right? Did you do anything after? Uh? No? 518 00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:47,400 And uh until I was contacted a few years later, and I said, 519 00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:52,840 well, I can make amends for my my very poor documentation of the 520 00:40:53,079 --> 00:41:00,000 sighting by helping figuring out how to documents aided correctly and that helping other people 521 00:41:00,199 --> 00:41:05,920 do it. And that was one of my motivations for joining API. And 522 00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:10,079 uh, I think we are doing a better job at that now of communicating 523 00:41:10,119 --> 00:41:14,000 the public, although we have a lot long way to go. What to 524 00:41:14,039 --> 00:41:22,119 do when you see UFO uh and in order that you're citing will be properly 525 00:41:22,440 --> 00:41:28,320 recorded. And uh and again like I said, the first thing, she 526 00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:30,840 was making a sketch. Second thing to do right down all the details place, 527 00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:37,639 time, uh, locations, colored you know whatever, whatever the details 528 00:41:37,639 --> 00:41:44,280 are important to you. Uh And uh so uh you know that that's one 529 00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:49,639 thing that part one of my missions is to really educate the public about first 530 00:41:49,639 --> 00:41:52,599 of all, about things that flying around that that that are not UFOs, 531 00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:57,880 like the International Space Station or the planet Venus. We get that a lot 532 00:41:58,440 --> 00:42:04,400 uh, balloons all those things. We want the public to know about that, 533 00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:07,360 so they can you know, they can say, oh, I know 534 00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:14,679 what that is, rather than you know, get getting h calling yourself to 535 00:42:14,679 --> 00:42:17,039 say, we are not alone. I saw this light in the sky. 536 00:42:17,599 --> 00:42:21,960 Yeah. Yeah, well somebody says that. I usually they said, now 537 00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:23,039 I know we're not alone. I usually say, okay, yeah, they 538 00:42:23,079 --> 00:42:29,280 probably saw. They probably saw that be two bomber you know, or something 539 00:42:29,559 --> 00:42:32,840 yeah like that. But I think also that, you know, to be 540 00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:36,639 fair, a lot of times people don't know how to react to something like 541 00:42:36,679 --> 00:42:43,599 that and it kind of changes their thoughts in paradigm. Uh. But I 542 00:42:43,679 --> 00:42:47,760 do want to say the the one thing you mentioned about drawing the drawing First, 543 00:42:49,039 --> 00:42:52,639 I had Class Swan from Sweden on this show and he was telling me 544 00:42:52,679 --> 00:42:57,039 about him and his wife having a sighting and he actually said to her, 545 00:42:57,119 --> 00:43:00,360 don't talk and they both went into separate rooms and immediately made a drawing. 546 00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:05,159 And I think that's exactly the right thing. Yeah, exactly, yes, 547 00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:09,960 Uh, you should if if the other witnesses are not people, you know, 548 00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:14,760 get their contact information, but don't talk to them about what you've just 549 00:43:14,800 --> 00:43:19,000 seen. M That's very hard, that must be very hard. Well, 550 00:43:19,039 --> 00:43:21,840 I mean you could say, you could say something like, I can't believe 551 00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:24,920 that what I just saw. Uh, you know, here's my phone number, 552 00:43:25,199 --> 00:43:29,400 here's you know or you know or you know, just everybody. Everybody 553 00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:32,840 gotta get to report a UFO dot org as soon as you can with your 554 00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:37,039 sketch. But don't not talk about it, because yes, your memory, 555 00:43:37,119 --> 00:43:44,800 your memories are affected by what other people's impressions were. Yes, and memorials 556 00:43:44,840 --> 00:43:51,079 about that. Yeah, memories a delicate thing, and uh, human memory 557 00:43:51,199 --> 00:43:57,159 is not uh, you know, a recording device. It's various parts of 558 00:43:57,159 --> 00:44:00,360 our brains registering things that seem to be associated and then we try to put 559 00:44:00,440 --> 00:44:05,360 in. Our brains are extremely good at sort of reintegrating those into memories, 560 00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:10,800 but there's no guarantee that those will be accurate memories. So the best thing 561 00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:15,880 to do is make your sketch, write down all the details. You can 562 00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:22,599 do this in two minutes. It's not a big burden. And anything else 563 00:44:22,920 --> 00:44:27,440 that needs to be researched, we can do that for you, or we 564 00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:30,239 can help you help you do it. You know, we we can find 565 00:44:30,239 --> 00:44:32,719 out what planes were in the area or uh, you know, if the 566 00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:36,679 space station was flying over that sort of thing. So all you need to 567 00:44:36,679 --> 00:44:39,239 do is write down what you your oppressions were. Just let's go over that 568 00:44:39,360 --> 00:44:43,920 right now if we can. Um, so for some ideas. First of 569 00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:47,199 all, the sketch time, date, weather conditions, stuff like that. 570 00:44:47,400 --> 00:44:50,840 Well yea, even the weather conditions that we can you know, we can 571 00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:53,960 reproduce that from time and date official records. Yeah, TI, time and 572 00:44:54,079 --> 00:45:02,000 date and location. If there's may it might just be you might know where 573 00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:05,559 you were. You might not know that well where you were if you were 574 00:45:05,559 --> 00:45:08,440 on the highway. Uh. If you've got a GPS receiver on your phone, 575 00:45:09,239 --> 00:45:15,920 just take a screen snap of your of your location, uh, using 576 00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:20,840 many of the many apps many apps are available uh or yeah, but a 577 00:45:20,840 --> 00:45:23,519 lot of people like me, I for cycling, I use an app that 578 00:45:23,599 --> 00:45:28,159 just tracks where I am. Uh just turn that on, you know. 579 00:45:28,639 --> 00:45:35,000 Uh. And um, the uh the direction you were looking at it's important. 580 00:45:35,559 --> 00:45:39,440 Uh. Someone this is actually get that wrong. Uh. Um. 581 00:45:39,480 --> 00:45:44,559 And of course, if you if you had photos or videos, uh, 582 00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:50,320 don't mess with them, save them off somewhere safe. Uh now then then 583 00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:52,880 you can take a copy and mess with them all you want. But uh, 584 00:45:52,559 --> 00:45:57,840 you know, make sure there's a safe molested copy that hasn't touched any 585 00:45:57,920 --> 00:46:04,039 software. Uh. And also if you are taking a video or something with 586 00:46:04,119 --> 00:46:08,920 your phone, particularly, don't zoom. Oh really do that afterwards? No, 587 00:46:09,159 --> 00:46:12,239 just never zoom. Well I can zoom, yeah, I can, 588 00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:15,519 I can. You know I can digitally zoom. If cell phones, well 589 00:46:15,559 --> 00:46:21,679 this is changing now, but cell phones do not have optical zoom. They 590 00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:23,519 have only digital zoom that you know, you can pin, you can pinch, 591 00:46:23,559 --> 00:46:28,960 and but you're not really zooming, You're just using a smaller part of 592 00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:34,280 the image. Uh so uh and now some phones, cell phones are going 593 00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:37,119 to get optical zoom soon. But even if you have optical zoom, if 594 00:46:37,159 --> 00:46:44,840 you have a really good camera and I carry a mediocre camera with me everywhere, 595 00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:46,400 better than a cell phone and not as good as my best camera, 596 00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:52,679 but uh, the don't zoom too much. And there's two reasons for that. 597 00:46:52,679 --> 00:46:57,360 One is auto focus, which you're probably using auto focus. Very few 598 00:46:57,360 --> 00:47:02,360 people are our manual focus people. Uh, it's going to fail the more 599 00:47:02,360 --> 00:47:06,599 you use them in the West. More likely you're just gonna get a fuzzy 600 00:47:06,599 --> 00:47:10,840 blob. And second, the most important thing is you'll lose all your reference 601 00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:16,440 objects you need, you need to know what the object is behind, what's 602 00:47:16,480 --> 00:47:21,920 in front of, what relative size it is. And it reference object could 603 00:47:21,920 --> 00:47:23,400 be anything. It could be a tree, it could be a water tower. 604 00:47:23,679 --> 00:47:25,800 It could be the moon. Actually the moon, it's the best reference 605 00:47:25,840 --> 00:47:31,440 object ever. Uh, if it happens to be visible in that direction. 606 00:47:31,880 --> 00:47:37,639 Uh, a building, church, deeple, anything, because we can figure 607 00:47:37,639 --> 00:47:43,079 out later on how high the tree was, how probably high the church deepo 608 00:47:43,239 --> 00:47:45,920 was. Uh. We may have been called the church and that's how the 609 00:47:45,079 --> 00:47:50,480 church deeple is. You know, we can there's a uh and we can 610 00:47:51,400 --> 00:47:54,800 we can get an use that information to tell how fast the objects moving, 611 00:47:54,800 --> 00:48:00,480 which is more important than what actually looks like and how you know if it's 612 00:48:00,519 --> 00:48:07,840 moving in some anomalous way of light. And so don't zoom uh and uh 613 00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:12,480 if you zoom to zoom a little too uh, you get some of the 614 00:48:12,639 --> 00:48:15,639 some of the if you have an optical zoom just to get somebody maybe the 615 00:48:15,920 --> 00:48:17,679 light interference out of the frame. If you have a bright light or something, 616 00:48:17,880 --> 00:48:22,760 I see the sun if the sun's over there. Uh, but only 617 00:48:22,800 --> 00:48:25,360 if you have a real camera with a with a lens that can zoom. 618 00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:32,800 Um and uh. That that is so crucial to getting good photo evidence. 619 00:48:34,159 --> 00:48:37,679 And one of the reason we don't have very much good photo it's just is, 620 00:48:37,159 --> 00:48:42,960 Uh, the cameras and cameras and cell phones have approved a lot, 621 00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:45,480 but they're still not very good and there tend to be a very wide angle 622 00:48:45,559 --> 00:48:51,079 lens. They're good for close, like really close pictures of like your friends 623 00:48:51,119 --> 00:48:53,920 or yourself selfies and stuff like that. They're optimized for selfies. Yeah, 624 00:48:53,960 --> 00:48:59,000 but when it comes to actually things at a distance, like for instance, 625 00:48:59,039 --> 00:49:01,960 when I was living on my mountaintop, I try to take these nice pants. 626 00:49:01,960 --> 00:49:05,519 I had these beautiful panoramic views, and I try to take a picture 627 00:49:05,519 --> 00:49:08,320 of it and look flat and look like nothing. Yeah, well I meant 628 00:49:08,559 --> 00:49:12,880 even. And the thing is, if you don't don't go out and buy 629 00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:17,400 an expensive camera because you might see UFO because uh, the reality, well, 630 00:49:17,440 --> 00:49:21,199 there are some good mid range cameras that are really really good that you 631 00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:23,960 might want to consider. Uh, they keep getting better every year. But 632 00:49:24,599 --> 00:49:30,480 the h if you have a really good high end camera, you better spend 633 00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:32,119 some time learning how to use it or you won't get good results. Yes, 634 00:49:32,639 --> 00:49:36,400 and get good lenses, and uh, you know, don't just go 635 00:49:36,440 --> 00:49:37,800 to the camera store and say, what can I get for five thousand dollars. 636 00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:40,880 Uh, because believe me, they will load you up. They will 637 00:49:40,880 --> 00:49:45,480 not hesitate, uh, but you will. What you will get is something 638 00:49:45,519 --> 00:49:50,800 that's complicated, and if you're not willing to spend putting the time learning how 639 00:49:50,840 --> 00:49:55,239 to to use it, you'll get even worse results. So but so if 640 00:49:55,320 --> 00:50:00,840 you, uh, if you have going on an everyday carry camera that that 641 00:50:00,960 --> 00:50:06,119 is better than the cell phone. Get a point and shoot. And there 642 00:50:06,159 --> 00:50:10,800 are some really good ones made by the top manufacturers that are and you can 643 00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:15,519 buy a used one very inexpensively sometimes, you know, I've mentioned this before. 644 00:50:15,599 --> 00:50:22,599 I was in the Boston Common and walking with my son and a blimp 645 00:50:22,159 --> 00:50:27,760 was going over like over the trees, and you would think, and I 646 00:50:27,960 --> 00:50:30,920 just wanted to take a picture, And you would think that I could reach 647 00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:35,320 in my pocket, get my cell phone out, get the camera out and 648 00:50:35,360 --> 00:50:38,360 take a picture the blimp, as slow as it was moving, I didn't 649 00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:43,360 have time to take the picture. So I can understand why, you know, 650 00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:46,079 because a lot of skeptics will say, hey, you know, there's 651 00:50:46,119 --> 00:50:50,239 so many cameras out there in everyone's pocket right now, why aren't we getting 652 00:50:50,239 --> 00:50:53,360 really good UFO pictures? And I think part of that is, you know, 653 00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:57,719 first of all, you got to think about you you're looking at something 654 00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:00,559 that doesn't make any sense. Next you want to oh, you're gonna grab 655 00:51:00,599 --> 00:51:04,280 your camera, and then you got to open the camerap and by the time 656 00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:07,280 you get it, you know, I mean, a slow moving blimp got 657 00:51:07,320 --> 00:51:10,440 away from me. Uh, I can imagine a UFO unless it's hovering or 658 00:51:10,480 --> 00:51:15,119 doing something unusual, would kind of an escape a camera. Right. Well, 659 00:51:15,159 --> 00:51:17,880 I we have a lot of We always ask a witness, why didn't 660 00:51:17,840 --> 00:51:21,880 you take a picture? And we got a lot of different answers. I 661 00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:25,000 mean, they don't even take the picture when they when they see they don't 662 00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:29,800 even get their camera out in a lot of cases. A lot of times 663 00:51:29,840 --> 00:51:35,320 it's fear. They're so afraid that they can't be calm enough to operate a 664 00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:37,800 camera or operate their cell phone. And the other other times it's just I 665 00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:42,559 never thought to do that. Yeah, I get that totally because I'm with 666 00:51:42,639 --> 00:51:45,800 my sighting. I didn't have a camera handy, but still I would have 667 00:51:45,920 --> 00:51:49,880 I don't I really don't think I would have ever thought of taking a picture. 668 00:51:50,800 --> 00:51:54,480 And my close encounter, I my camera was one hundred feet away and 669 00:51:54,559 --> 00:51:58,360 I was not going to go get it, yeah, because I was to 670 00:51:58,440 --> 00:52:04,079 losing side of it. That's right. Yeah. But now I these days, 671 00:52:04,119 --> 00:52:08,639 I have a point and shoot that I carry with me everywhere. Um 672 00:52:08,679 --> 00:52:15,239 that has four x optical optical zoom, which is good enough and uh it's 673 00:52:15,400 --> 00:52:20,360 uh it's also it's got a GPS receiver built into it. So really, 674 00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:22,599 wow, that's nice. I'll know where I where I was standing when I 675 00:52:22,639 --> 00:52:25,840 took a picture, no matter what, and I found it. You know 676 00:52:27,320 --> 00:52:30,599 today just today on the way home, I saw a helicopter why over and 677 00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:37,239 we get a lot of helicopters in that area. Uh and uh I uh, 678 00:52:37,440 --> 00:52:38,559 I thought what if I get a picture. I grabbed my camera, 679 00:52:39,039 --> 00:52:42,800 turned it on. It turns on almost instantly, turns on like as in 680 00:52:42,840 --> 00:52:50,079 the second and it was gone. Yeah. Yeah, it took me five 681 00:52:50,119 --> 00:52:53,440 seconds maybe to get ready to shoot, and uh the chopper was gone. 682 00:52:53,880 --> 00:53:00,199 And uh so I actually practiced that. I when I see an interesting plane 683 00:53:00,280 --> 00:53:05,639 or something, I will I will try to get a shot, just to 684 00:53:06,679 --> 00:53:10,960 just to prove out and be ready. But of course, you know this 685 00:53:12,000 --> 00:53:14,639 happens to a lot of people. They have a close encounter and they never 686 00:53:14,679 --> 00:53:17,599 see anything ever again. Yeah, but they're ready. They got predocutus, 687 00:53:17,599 --> 00:53:22,360 they got their camera, they got I'm like that too. I'm I'm a 688 00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:25,800 total geek when it comes to that's up. But uh yeah, so, 689 00:53:27,119 --> 00:53:30,719 uh, we try to help people be ready, but reality is you're probably 690 00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:37,360 just gonna have your eyes and your brain. That's a bit. That's probably 691 00:53:37,360 --> 00:53:43,280 the equipment you're gonna have. And I have seen. We did get one 692 00:53:43,440 --> 00:53:49,840 photograph once, which is on our website at report of UFO dot org. 693 00:53:50,360 --> 00:53:53,880 You go to that website and I'll have to send you a link. It's 694 00:53:53,960 --> 00:54:02,960 not looked very impressive it but there are foreground objects. There's clouds in the 695 00:54:02,960 --> 00:54:07,800 background. Uh it's an overcast day. So and we can look up and 696 00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:15,400 see what the ceiling clouds ceiling was in the weather archives and h you have 697 00:54:15,519 --> 00:54:21,880 this thing. And the witness said he saw it just right below the clouds. 698 00:54:21,880 --> 00:54:23,159 It looked like it was right below the clouds. Use and since we 699 00:54:23,199 --> 00:54:25,239 know how high the clouds world, we can figure out how high it was 700 00:54:27,000 --> 00:54:30,519 ur and estimate how far away it was. It turns out it was very 701 00:54:30,519 --> 00:54:37,599 far away. It was miles away. And because we know exactly where he 702 00:54:37,639 --> 00:54:43,679 was standing, and we know where the houses are relative to him, we 703 00:54:43,800 --> 00:54:52,280 can measure quite accurately the angular size of the object, and then by estimating 704 00:54:52,320 --> 00:54:54,760 his distance, we can get a roughly how bigger it was About a hundred 705 00:54:54,760 --> 00:55:00,480 meters. Wow, wow, that is uh yeah, about rander about the 706 00:55:00,480 --> 00:55:05,400 size of a size of a soccer pitch. Yeah yeah, yeah, And 707 00:55:06,320 --> 00:55:12,079 uh the Now that's a rough estimate. It could be a little smaller or 708 00:55:12,199 --> 00:55:15,719 a lot bigger, depending on how far away it really is. But um, 709 00:55:15,760 --> 00:55:19,360 since we know it wasn't above the clouds, we know how high the 710 00:55:19,400 --> 00:55:22,280 maximum height that it was, and if it was actually more below the clouds, 711 00:55:22,320 --> 00:55:29,559 that means it might have been further away. So uh the uh from 712 00:55:29,599 --> 00:55:32,239 that, from that little photograph a little uh with it was shot with the 713 00:55:32,239 --> 00:55:37,440 Samsung Galaxy six, a very ordinary sort of cell phone. Yeah, uh 714 00:55:38,239 --> 00:55:44,079 and uh it was I think with the best CEO pho photographs we've ever seen 715 00:55:44,760 --> 00:55:46,719 about that. I know it wasn't fake, and I know who took it, 716 00:55:46,840 --> 00:55:51,119 and I know I got it straight from him, so the chain of 717 00:55:51,159 --> 00:55:59,000 custody is established. Uh and uh it was. We had a long conversation 718 00:55:59,079 --> 00:56:04,079 with a guy and he saw it. His granddaughter saw it, and so 719 00:56:04,199 --> 00:56:07,960 there was ah, you know that that's the sort of thing where you know, 720 00:56:08,199 --> 00:56:09,880 yeah, you look at it, you go, that's just a little 721 00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:16,239 flack up. It's like thirty pixels wide, but that those thirty pixels are 722 00:56:16,320 --> 00:56:20,920 critical information, have critical information in them. Yeah. Yeah, and I've 723 00:56:20,960 --> 00:56:25,280 got and also there's something like three or four photographs, so there's uh, 724 00:56:25,480 --> 00:56:30,599 this is not a hoax. This is not uh not a lens flaire. 725 00:56:30,639 --> 00:56:32,519 I've had that argument before. Yeah, I know what a lens fair looks. 726 00:56:32,519 --> 00:56:36,800 I've seen a lot of lens flares that says one one uh and um 727 00:56:37,199 --> 00:56:44,679 it's uh and that kind that kind of evidence was fed out. Uh. 728 00:56:45,079 --> 00:56:50,119 You know that part of that part of northern Maryland has had lots of odd 729 00:56:50,159 --> 00:56:53,719 things being seen in the sky. Uh. There's a lot of government activity 730 00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:59,320 up there, but I none of it's really like aerospace development activity. It's 731 00:56:59,599 --> 00:57:02,480 uh you know, yeah, Camp David is an area that sort of thing. 732 00:57:02,599 --> 00:57:05,719 Yeah, let's let's end it there. We got to go to break 733 00:57:05,920 --> 00:57:07,519 and when we come back, I'd actually like to talk to you a little 734 00:57:07,559 --> 00:57:14,519 bit about this study of UFOs and your career. So all right, so 735 00:57:14,559 --> 00:57:16,000 that's it for the free part of the show. Thank you so much for 736 00:57:16,079 --> 00:57:20,519 listening. I'm not sure who our guest is going to be next week. 737 00:57:21,320 --> 00:57:24,440 We may take a week off. I'm not sure, but our guests had 738 00:57:24,440 --> 00:57:29,679 to cancel on us our reschedule, I should say so. Anyway, I 739 00:57:29,719 --> 00:57:32,239 want to thank everyone for listening. If you'd like to support the show and 740 00:57:32,400 --> 00:57:37,480 listen to the full hour in fifty five minutes, all you gotta do is 741 00:57:37,480 --> 00:57:42,360 go over to podcast ufo dot com and support the show for as little as 742 00:57:42,360 --> 00:57:45,599 two dollars a month, and there's also once a year memberships as well, 743 00:57:46,079 --> 00:57:50,480 and you get to listen to all the shows and the archives on about any 744 00:57:50,480 --> 00:57:55,280 media player that is out there. So again, thank you, and remember 745 00:57:55,280 --> 00:58:01,639 to keep your eyes to the sky. S