WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.280 --> 00:00:09.759
You're listening to KFI on demand.
Freedom is a wonderful thing. Freedom can

2
00:00:09.800 --> 00:00:15.720
be abused just like anything, and
for the believer, it must be controlled.

3
00:00:19.079 --> 00:00:24.359
So it just because you can do
something doesn't mean you should do something.

4
00:00:25.719 --> 00:00:31.399
And that's the age old dilemma with
everybody, really with any system of

5
00:00:31.440 --> 00:00:34.960
freedom. This happens in the United
States as well, but it will happen

6
00:00:35.039 --> 00:00:39.759
on a day to day basis with
you as a believer. You'll be around

7
00:00:39.880 --> 00:00:44.079
all kinds of people, whether they
are non believers or that maybe they're young

8
00:00:44.159 --> 00:00:50.520
believers just new trying to learn get
their footing, and people will be watching

9
00:00:50.560 --> 00:00:55.679
you, watching you and what you
do, how you interact, the things

10
00:00:55.679 --> 00:01:02.240
you say, and your desire is
to have that freedom and explore that freedom.

11
00:01:03.039 --> 00:01:07.799
Thank God for that freedom, but
also not to misuse it or to

12
00:01:08.200 --> 00:01:18.640
put it in a light that causes
confusion and a stumbling block for those around

13
00:01:18.640 --> 00:01:23.840
you. You will let people down, and there will be times where you'll

14
00:01:23.840 --> 00:01:30.000
do things that are completely okay under
the blood on the cross, but will

15
00:01:30.680 --> 00:01:37.519
somehow make someone else stumble. And
for instance, is there's nothing wrong with

16
00:01:37.599 --> 00:01:42.680
drinking wine. However, if you're
in the presence of an alcoholic it's not

17
00:01:42.760 --> 00:01:45.480
the best thing to do. As
a matter of fact, that you can

18
00:01:45.640 --> 00:01:49.840
very much be a stumbling block depending
on where the person is in their recovery,

19
00:01:52.200 --> 00:02:00.120
and that by knowing that you should
be compassionate towards that and forego the

20
00:02:00.200 --> 00:02:06.920
drinking on your own. And that's
just a simple analogy or a simple example

21
00:02:07.040 --> 00:02:15.120
rather of how it can come up
in your life. And New Testament times

22
00:02:15.159 --> 00:02:20.280
it had a lot to do not
only with drinking, but with food and

23
00:02:20.400 --> 00:02:27.400
the concept of food, paganized food
or food that was sacrificed to idols.

24
00:02:27.439 --> 00:02:32.199
Sometimes you know, sometimes you didn't. That's quite why most people pray today.

25
00:02:32.280 --> 00:02:37.039
When you're praying over a meal,
oftentimes you're not sure where it came

26
00:02:37.120 --> 00:02:43.360
from, and so you're giving God
the glory for the food just in case

27
00:02:43.400 --> 00:02:47.800
it was sacrificed by someone else for
some other reason, and sort of cleansing

28
00:02:47.840 --> 00:02:54.120
it while giving praise to God.
Well, those things happened two thousand years

29
00:02:54.120 --> 00:03:00.560
ago as well. The battle when
going to eat something thing isn't going to

30
00:03:00.599 --> 00:03:07.000
make someone stumble. Plus, there
were things that the Christian believers would eat

31
00:03:07.240 --> 00:03:14.240
or consume that they're Jewish brothers and
sisters would not, and these things can

32
00:03:14.319 --> 00:03:21.520
sometimes cause confusion. In First Corinthians
eight thirteen, it says, therefore,

33
00:03:21.560 --> 00:03:24.120
if what I eat causes my brother
to fall into sin, I will never

34
00:03:24.159 --> 00:03:28.639
eat meat again, so that I
will not cause him to fall. And

35
00:03:28.800 --> 00:03:34.400
essentially it was better to just cut
that food out of your life than it

36
00:03:34.560 --> 00:03:38.439
was to make someone stumble. Best
case scenario, you kind of cover all

37
00:03:38.560 --> 00:03:42.319
edges. And I'm not saying you
have to be that dramatic about it,

38
00:03:45.159 --> 00:03:53.039
but really it's about having that instant
come into play. Protect yourself and others

39
00:03:53.159 --> 00:03:58.400
by knowing if someone has a weakness
or a concern or a sin, that

40
00:03:58.520 --> 00:04:02.639
you don't want to lead them down, especially young believers. You know,

41
00:04:02.800 --> 00:04:08.879
being with a young believer and an
old believer should be inspiring and often is,

42
00:04:09.039 --> 00:04:15.080
but sometimes can be a little confusing. The older believer has kind of

43
00:04:15.080 --> 00:04:19.199
whittled through a lot of the garbage, maybe things that people have placed in

44
00:04:19.240 --> 00:04:23.639
the way, or certain traditions that
are really more about tradition than they are

45
00:04:23.639 --> 00:04:28.600
about anything else, and all of
this and that can be confusing sometimes.

46
00:04:31.399 --> 00:04:36.720
Even First Timothy four twelve says,
don't let anyone look down on you because

47
00:04:36.759 --> 00:04:42.560
you were young, but you're accountable
too, goes on to say, but

48
00:04:42.720 --> 00:04:46.639
set an example for the believers in
speech, in conduct, in love,

49
00:04:47.240 --> 00:04:56.040
in faith, and impurity, regardless
of your age in Christ. And what

50
00:04:56.079 --> 00:05:00.199
I'm calling you to here is to
be be aware of your surroundings and the

51
00:05:00.279 --> 00:05:03.319
things you do and the things you
say, and the things you know,

52
00:05:03.360 --> 00:05:11.519
and how you interact and all these
things because others see them. And it's

53
00:05:11.560 --> 00:05:17.519
not just the world. It's those
that claim to be Christians as well that

54
00:05:17.560 --> 00:05:20.639
are going through their own struggles.
Now, some may care, some may

55
00:05:20.680 --> 00:05:29.839
not care. There are some believers
that just don't focus on those things,

56
00:05:29.879 --> 00:05:38.000
and there's some that people refer to
as legalistic and get very very specific about

57
00:05:38.040 --> 00:05:45.279
every little thing. But the truth
be told. Scripture says that you're to

58
00:05:45.879 --> 00:05:51.959
make no one stumble, and it's
not. It's not about judging everyone are

59
00:05:53.079 --> 00:05:59.120
going back and judging each other.
It's about understanding that what you can do

60
00:05:59.480 --> 00:06:05.240
affects and as much as you're trying
to you know, sometimes you may do

61
00:06:05.319 --> 00:06:09.879
something and if a nonbeliever sees you, say, oh, well, they're

62
00:06:09.920 --> 00:06:12.639
not a believer. They don't really
get the whole thing anyways. And it's

63
00:06:12.720 --> 00:06:17.160
under the blood of the cross and
I'm fine, and they don't get it.

64
00:06:17.240 --> 00:06:27.439
But it's not just about that.
It affects Christians alike Romans fourteen thirteen.

65
00:06:27.519 --> 00:06:32.160
Therefore, let us stop passing judgment
on one another. Instead, make

66
00:06:32.279 --> 00:06:36.680
up your mind not to put any
stumbling block or obstacle in the way of

67
00:06:36.680 --> 00:06:41.800
a brother or sister. So think
about the things that you do, sometimes

68
00:06:41.879 --> 00:06:47.480
maybe in spite or out of frustration, that you may do that would cause

69
00:06:47.560 --> 00:06:54.800
stumbling from another believer, the way
you act, the things you do.

70
00:06:56.720 --> 00:06:59.800
I know, I have this conversation
with my producer Neil all the time,

71
00:07:00.040 --> 00:07:11.879
a little too free spirited wrestles with
being an individual in his faith versus being

72
00:07:11.879 --> 00:07:15.439
an actual stumbling block. And that's
going to be a concern of yours as

73
00:07:15.480 --> 00:07:20.800
well that you're going to You don't
want to be a cookie cut You don't

74
00:07:20.800 --> 00:07:25.240
want to just do everything that everybody
else does or anything that you have to

75
00:07:25.279 --> 00:07:30.279
hold on to your individuality most certainly, but do it in a way that

76
00:07:30.360 --> 00:07:38.600
it isn't causing others to fall or
to sin, to stumble, because in

77
00:07:38.680 --> 00:07:43.879
doing that, you remove God from
the equation. Now you're you're making it

78
00:07:43.959 --> 00:07:48.240
about the sin, or you're making
it about the mistakes in people's lives that

79
00:07:48.399 --> 00:07:53.040
you're kind of giving them excuse to
do them more, and people struggle as

80
00:07:53.040 --> 00:08:00.519
it is. You know, a
research came out recently, and this is

81
00:08:00.519 --> 00:08:03.920
one of those things that they've been
going back and forth on them been studying

82
00:08:03.920 --> 00:08:09.560
for a long time, is how
people react to visual stimulation or other types

83
00:08:09.560 --> 00:08:16.120
of stimulation that remind them of something. For instance, they've made note that

84
00:08:16.199 --> 00:08:24.120
if an athlete is watching a sports
game, they had different responses than your

85
00:08:24.160 --> 00:08:31.600
average Jane or Joe, and they're
a little more intense. However, everyone

86
00:08:31.720 --> 00:08:35.960
watching kind of puts themselves in a
game. You ever wonder why, wow,

87
00:08:35.080 --> 00:08:39.320
how can so many people sit around
watching a football game or a basketball

88
00:08:39.360 --> 00:08:43.399
game and they tend to say things
like oh we won or things like that

89
00:08:43.000 --> 00:08:46.960
when they weren't playing at all.
Well, the body, even though it's

90
00:08:48.000 --> 00:08:54.200
not playing, sees the action and
almost puts itself in the action. That's

91
00:08:54.200 --> 00:08:58.639
why adrenaline can raise while watching a
game. I'm sure if they had a

92
00:08:58.679 --> 00:09:01.919
bet to or had money on the
game, that kind of helps the cause

93
00:09:01.960 --> 00:09:09.240
as well. But physiologically, there's
other stuff going on and new studies coming

94
00:09:09.240 --> 00:09:15.200
out that when when a smoker or
an ex smoker. See somebody smoke on

95
00:09:15.440 --> 00:09:20.960
camera, they're watching a film,
they feel the urge and the desire smoke

96
00:09:20.039 --> 00:09:26.480
as well. Now, as a
believer, when you're doing certain things,

97
00:09:26.559 --> 00:09:30.600
you may be doing something that motivates
someone else in a way that could be

98
00:09:30.639 --> 00:09:35.279
destructive in their life, causing them
to stubble. And this puts extra weight

99
00:09:35.360 --> 00:09:39.679
on you understanding who you are,
what you do, and how you are

100
00:09:39.720 --> 00:09:48.080
around others. Being an example or
living as an example is always going to

101
00:09:48.080 --> 00:09:54.879
be difficult, And as believers,
there's this extra balance because you're to be

102
00:09:56.000 --> 00:09:58.559
living in a way that compels the
world to ask about the hope that lies

103
00:09:58.600 --> 00:10:03.039
within you. As it says in
First Pew three fifteen, you're called to

104
00:10:03.120 --> 00:10:07.000
that living in a way and dealing
with problems and circumstances in such a way

105
00:10:07.039 --> 00:10:15.720
that others will notice. But also
you're called to defend younger Christians and younger

106
00:10:15.759 --> 00:10:22.080
believers and others in your own flock
by the things you do in liberty.

107
00:10:22.200 --> 00:10:26.879
So this wonderful thing, liberty that
gives you that freedom to do all kinds

108
00:10:26.919 --> 00:10:33.559
of things, also gives you the
most intense responsibility. There's a lot of

109
00:10:33.559 --> 00:10:37.159
bondage and freedom. And I know
it sounds strange, but quite frankly,

110
00:10:37.360 --> 00:10:41.320
in that comes the responsibility of what
to do and what not to do,

111
00:10:41.519 --> 00:10:48.120
even though you're allowed. It really
focuses not on what you can do,

112
00:10:50.639 --> 00:10:56.720
but focuses on what you should do. First Corinthians ten twenty three says,

113
00:10:58.000 --> 00:11:05.120
I have the right to do anything
you say, but not everything is beneficial.

114
00:11:05.399 --> 00:11:09.039
I have the right to do anything, but not everything is constructive.

115
00:11:11.120 --> 00:11:16.240
And this is where discernment comes in
and where you play the part of learning

116
00:11:16.519 --> 00:11:20.679
what's going to be beneficial what not
just what you can do, but what

117
00:11:20.840 --> 00:11:26.399
you ought to do, what you
should do. And there are going to

118
00:11:26.399 --> 00:11:31.399
be things that would be legal technically
under the blood of Christ, and that

119
00:11:31.480 --> 00:11:35.519
you have freedom, but honing that
freedom and maximizing it and doing good things

120
00:11:35.679 --> 00:11:39.919
is really the path that God calls
you justever you want for whatever reason.

121
00:11:41.559 --> 00:11:46.039
Yes, when you have the blood
of God on your side, it allows

122
00:11:46.039 --> 00:11:52.000
you a lot of freedoms, much
more than even much of the church gives.

123
00:11:52.039 --> 00:11:56.080
There are churches that seem to spend
their time looking to take away your

124
00:11:56.120 --> 00:12:01.279
freedoms. However, that's not that's
not what I call you to call you

125
00:12:01.360 --> 00:12:07.559
to have the freedoms but simultaneously have
the discernment and the ability to weed them

126
00:12:07.559 --> 00:12:11.840
from your life if they cause division
or if they cause people to stumble.

127
00:12:13.720 --> 00:12:24.440
And it really should motivate open discussion
between believers, healthy, healthy discussion amongst

128
00:12:24.480 --> 00:12:28.960
believers. It's kind of a family
in house discussion because there are going to

129
00:12:28.000 --> 00:12:31.240
be those that say, well,
this makes me stumble, so you should

130
00:12:31.240 --> 00:12:35.320
stop doing it. It says that
if you ate meat and it made someone

131
00:12:35.360 --> 00:12:39.799
stuble, that you would stop,
so you should stop. And that's not

132
00:12:39.840 --> 00:12:43.000
the case either. It can't be
just used to as leverage to get people

133
00:12:43.000 --> 00:12:46.039
to do what you want them to
do because you think it's right or wrong.

134
00:12:46.440 --> 00:12:50.159
It has to be about harmony and
learning that what you do does affect

135
00:12:50.200 --> 00:12:56.840
others. And just because it's legal
and under the blood and there's freedom doesn't

136
00:12:56.840 --> 00:13:01.360
mean it's good or healthier constructive.
Hi, Kathy, welcome to the Jesus

137
00:13:01.440 --> 00:13:03.679
Christ Show. Hi. I love
your show. Well, thank you.

138
00:13:05.440 --> 00:13:09.519
I will preface my question with this. A position friend of mine recommended the

139
00:13:09.559 --> 00:13:13.879
book The Language of God by Francis
Collins. Collins right, and he said

140
00:13:13.879 --> 00:13:16.720
to me, I'm a scientist and
a believer, and this book is a

141
00:13:16.840 --> 00:13:22.519
must read, and so I recommend
it. It's my book club and we

142
00:13:22.600 --> 00:13:26.039
are all, like twenty five of
us are just really into this book.

143
00:13:26.039 --> 00:13:31.960
And really it's so it's not anything
new, as you know, but it's

144
00:13:33.000 --> 00:13:39.360
so interesting to hear Francis Collins as
a scientist and as a Christian and explain

145
00:13:39.840 --> 00:13:45.279
the biological part or the scientific part
of the Bible, the DNA project and

146
00:13:45.320 --> 00:13:48.240
all this in such a way that
for the first time, I feel like

147
00:13:48.320 --> 00:13:54.840
I really do understand sort of where
God was coming from. And I asked

148
00:13:54.840 --> 00:13:58.120
a friend of mine about this book
if she had read it, and she's

149
00:13:58.159 --> 00:14:03.279
a very fundamental Christian, and she
believes that the Earth and that the universe

150
00:14:03.360 --> 00:14:07.080
is six thousand years old, and
she, oh, gee, I don't

151
00:14:07.080 --> 00:14:11.919
know. I'll have to run that
by somebody at my church. Anyway.

152
00:14:11.320 --> 00:14:16.120
I just want your opinion on what
do you think about the suppose Well,

153
00:14:16.320 --> 00:14:20.200
we don't. My producer, Neil
is the one that puts his thumbs up

154
00:14:20.240 --> 00:14:24.639
or thumbs down on books. I
don't endorse books on the program myself,

155
00:14:24.720 --> 00:14:26.320
but but I will tell you this. We will look at a couple of

156
00:14:26.320 --> 00:14:31.720
things. One Collins is the head
of the Human Genome Project. He's a

157
00:14:31.759 --> 00:14:41.759
former atheist and an incredibly brilliant mind. He is a Christian and he is

158
00:14:41.360 --> 00:14:46.440
a huge fan of C. S. Lewis as well, who gets quite

159
00:14:46.480 --> 00:14:52.200
a quoted rather quite a bit in
the book. So there is there is

160
00:14:52.600 --> 00:15:00.200
debate that goes on because of this
particular the case he makes for a kind

161
00:15:00.200 --> 00:15:05.279
of God directed evolution, and there
are Christians that will land in different areas.

162
00:15:05.279 --> 00:15:09.200
Now there's there's kind of a breakoff
of different belief Now you've got an

163
00:15:09.200 --> 00:15:15.080
intelligent design, you've got a basic
creationism, you've got the atheistic type of

164
00:15:15.080 --> 00:15:18.639
evolution, and then you've got what
people call theistic evolution, and now you've

165
00:15:18.639 --> 00:15:22.919
got this kind of God directed evolution, which is a little different as well.

166
00:15:22.679 --> 00:15:26.840
So I would say as a whole, I think it's wonderful that you're

167
00:15:26.840 --> 00:15:33.519
reading it. The concept of the
universe or the concept of people being six

168
00:15:33.559 --> 00:15:39.639
thousand years old is truly based on
a misreading of scripture. So it's using

169
00:15:39.720 --> 00:15:43.879
scripture in a way that it wasn't
meant to be used. They're taking the

170
00:15:43.960 --> 00:15:48.279
chronology of man and saying that this
is a true chronology, and this is

171
00:15:48.399 --> 00:15:50.320
every single generation. So all you
got to do is add up the averages

172
00:15:50.360 --> 00:15:54.799
of generations and you'll come up with
a rough estimation, and then you tie

173
00:15:54.879 --> 00:15:58.440
in the Jewish calendar to that.
You think, okay, well, this

174
00:15:58.519 --> 00:16:03.639
is roughly about what it is.
And it's really not a fair look or

175
00:16:03.679 --> 00:16:08.519
an honest look at how old man
is or how old the earth is,

176
00:16:08.720 --> 00:16:12.919
or any of those things. So, but there is a discussion that goes

177
00:16:12.960 --> 00:16:18.480
on. We talk about reason reasons
dot org. The folks that reasons to

178
00:16:18.519 --> 00:16:26.000
believe that are old Universe creationists.
There are those that believe that the earth

179
00:16:26.080 --> 00:16:32.120
is much older than six thousand years, much older, and and some people

180
00:16:32.159 --> 00:16:33.399
look at them and say, oh, they're not Christian because of this.

181
00:16:33.480 --> 00:16:37.720
It's silliness that goes on. I
think it's incredibly healthy, Kathy, that

182
00:16:37.720 --> 00:16:42.159
you're doing this, and I'm happy
to hear that it's inspiring you and that

183
00:16:42.279 --> 00:16:48.360
the type of discussion in the book
is one that piques your interest. In

184
00:16:48.519 --> 00:16:53.720
any work by man, anything that's
written by man, one needs to have

185
00:16:53.799 --> 00:16:57.360
the sense of an old cow and
eat the hay and leave the sticks.

186
00:16:59.200 --> 00:17:00.639
There's going to be some great stuff
in it, and maybe some not so

187
00:17:00.679 --> 00:17:04.720
great, or maybe some areas of
gray area that aren't so well defined.

188
00:17:06.359 --> 00:17:11.559
Also, it's fine to understand science
by the way of God, and sometimes

189
00:17:11.599 --> 00:17:15.000
it's okay to understand God by way
of science, because after all, you

190
00:17:15.039 --> 00:17:18.240
can learn a lot about an artist
by looking at their art. But what

191
00:17:18.279 --> 00:17:22.440
you don't want to do, ever, is overshadow of scripture because of a

192
00:17:22.440 --> 00:17:27.599
book, or even because of perceived
science. And I say that because science

193
00:17:27.640 --> 00:17:33.440
by definition is observational, and those
observations do change. So having said all

194
00:17:33.480 --> 00:17:38.079
of that, there's nothing about this
author, there's nothing about the topic or

195
00:17:38.079 --> 00:17:41.920
anything like that that I think is
damaging or detrimental. On its face,

196
00:17:42.759 --> 00:17:48.079
I think it's wonderful that you guys
would get together and start reading this and

197
00:17:48.680 --> 00:17:53.160
you know, pass it along to
others, and and if it really speaks

198
00:17:53.160 --> 00:17:56.400
to you, it speaks to you. The biggest problem with the concept of

199
00:17:56.480 --> 00:18:04.279
theistic evolution of any kind is if
there's any crossing of the flesh, meaning

200
00:18:04.319 --> 00:18:10.799
that in Genesis it talks about God
creating and everything was created unto their own

201
00:18:10.880 --> 00:18:15.000
kind. Some people may say that
this is defining a phylum like a group

202
00:18:15.039 --> 00:18:19.920
that branches off, but it's a
phylum. The problem that Christianity has is

203
00:18:19.960 --> 00:18:23.160
not with the concept of evolution,
and a lot of people don't understand that.

204
00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:27.319
They think that all Christians hate evolution, but really, if they're an

205
00:18:27.440 --> 00:18:33.440
educated Christian, you'll understand that the
Bible really opposes the special theory of evolution,

206
00:18:33.759 --> 00:18:38.200
that great change is possible within fixed
kinds. That's not what took place

207
00:18:38.359 --> 00:18:45.480
scripturally. But it's fine with the
general theory of evolution, or it's not

208
00:18:45.599 --> 00:18:51.079
okay with a general theory of evolution, which is amiba to human beings.

209
00:18:51.759 --> 00:18:55.319
That there's nowhere there's there's no argument
in scripture that you'll find that. But

210
00:18:55.359 --> 00:18:59.079
as far as the special theory of
evolution, that there's great change or there's

211
00:18:59.119 --> 00:19:02.720
an adaptation and things like that,
of course. But you know, also,

212
00:19:03.039 --> 00:19:06.359
in addition to reading this book,
I'm reading the autobiography of Charles Darwin

213
00:19:06.400 --> 00:19:08.440
because I sort of thought it sit
in with what I needed to learn.

214
00:19:08.559 --> 00:19:12.119
He's an interesting cat. No,
he is so interesting, and he's not

215
00:19:12.160 --> 00:19:15.920
a bad guy. No. No. That's another thing that gets kind of

216
00:19:15.960 --> 00:19:21.880
sticky is when people demonize thinkers.
Now, there are some there are some

217
00:19:21.920 --> 00:19:25.960
mean people throughout history who've written some
ugly things about the Church and about God,

218
00:19:26.400 --> 00:19:32.680
and that had their own issues,
but most often the scientific community.

219
00:19:32.759 --> 00:19:37.319
Really, if you look at it, philosophy birth to science, and and

220
00:19:37.519 --> 00:19:42.599
through that came a greater understanding of
religion, not a lesser understanding. Now

221
00:19:42.640 --> 00:19:48.640
I know that there's a branch of
sciences that, you know, go towards

222
00:19:48.720 --> 00:19:52.680
trying to disprove God, which is
silly because you can't prove a negative.

223
00:19:53.400 --> 00:19:59.519
And in this particular case of Darwin, you've you've you find somebody who is

224
00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:04.079
fascinated by by life. Now it's
a faulty premise that Darwin uses, and

225
00:20:04.119 --> 00:20:08.720
that's why most scientists, if not
all, currently don't adhere to darwin True

226
00:20:08.759 --> 00:20:14.039
Darwinism. Yeah, that type of
evolution doesn't really exist anymore. And Darwin

227
00:20:14.319 --> 00:20:18.079
himself said, hey, you're gonna
find you're you're gonna be digging and there's

228
00:20:18.119 --> 00:20:22.480
gonna be transitional fossils everywhere, and
you know here you are. Well,

229
00:20:22.920 --> 00:20:26.680
I thought, the really interesting thing
about Charles Darwin is that the statement that

230
00:20:26.720 --> 00:20:30.279
he made towards the end of his
life is that he wanted to be seen

231
00:20:30.279 --> 00:20:33.039
as a theist. Well, these
are things that are in debate too.

232
00:20:33.160 --> 00:20:38.119
Those those yes, those statements often
aren't you know, or they're taken out

233
00:20:38.119 --> 00:20:44.000
of context. A lot of people
trying to do that with with Einstein as

234
00:20:44.039 --> 00:20:48.720
well. And you can't help but
look at the complexity of life and say,

235
00:20:48.759 --> 00:20:52.920
hey, listen, you don't come
across a watch and say, oh,

236
00:20:52.960 --> 00:20:56.799
this just happened to, you know, pop up this way because it

237
00:20:56.880 --> 00:20:59.559
was sitting in the sun for a
certain amount of time. It's just when

238
00:20:59.559 --> 00:21:07.200
you see plexity and the argument that
some might use for evolution saying look at

239
00:21:07.200 --> 00:21:11.559
all the similarities and all these animals, you could also say they you know,

240
00:21:11.680 --> 00:21:14.839
that's like saying, look at all
the similarities in a family that came

241
00:21:14.880 --> 00:21:19.480
from the same mother and father that
by by the designer in that sense,

242
00:21:19.559 --> 00:21:26.000
or the creator, they're going to
have similarities in creation. But I don't

243
00:21:26.039 --> 00:21:30.680
see anything. There are some books
that I would say run, don't walk

244
00:21:30.119 --> 00:21:33.319
from This is not one of them. What do you think of C.

245
00:21:33.440 --> 00:21:38.039
F. Lewis? I love C. S. Lewis, and we referenced

246
00:21:38.079 --> 00:21:41.079
C. S. Lewis quite a
bit. And this was a This was

247
00:21:41.319 --> 00:21:48.039
a man who who battled through a
lot of frustrations as well, and through

248
00:21:48.640 --> 00:21:51.799
you know, after his death,
a lot of those writings that were never

249
00:21:51.839 --> 00:21:55.720
meant to be books by the way, a lot of those writings and diaries

250
00:21:55.720 --> 00:22:00.640
and journals and things that he had
written or are now passed along to the

251
00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:07.359
reader, and with very interesting notes
about his battle. And the reason why

252
00:22:07.480 --> 00:22:10.599
I like C. S. Lewis
and we talk about C. S.

253
00:22:10.680 --> 00:22:15.720
Lewis on the air and recommend a
lot of his works through Neil is that

254
00:22:17.440 --> 00:22:22.599
he has an intense honesty and there's
a lot of falsification in the church,

255
00:22:22.680 --> 00:22:26.119
a lot of smile through it type
stuff Jesus Loves You and the batting of

256
00:22:26.119 --> 00:22:33.319
the eyebrows and that business. And
it's it's not just about that kind of

257
00:22:33.400 --> 00:22:38.240
candy eyed thought process. There's a
lot more to it, and there's a

258
00:22:38.240 --> 00:22:44.559
lot of pain in the process of
learning about God and learning about yourself and

259
00:22:44.640 --> 00:22:48.480
growing into a healthy human being.
And I think C. S. Lewis

260
00:22:48.519 --> 00:22:53.359
is incredibly honest about that. And
so it's it's not that C. S.

261
00:22:53.440 --> 00:23:00.480
Lewis hasn't been misquoted in books or
used by people that that I certainly

262
00:23:00.519 --> 00:23:04.079
wouldn't think are healthy Christians. I
do say, though, that it's usually

263
00:23:04.119 --> 00:23:07.720
a pretty good sign when somebody quotes
C. S. Lewis that at least

264
00:23:07.720 --> 00:23:14.279
they're somebody who is honest with not
only their own faith, belief and understanding,

265
00:23:14.400 --> 00:23:19.200
but also a healthy understanding of the
reality of God, not being you

266
00:23:19.240 --> 00:23:22.960
know, the ultimate candy giver.
Oh, I'm going to believe in God

267
00:23:22.000 --> 00:23:26.599
and everything's gonna be great, and
life's gonna be danding. We're gonna skipping

268
00:23:26.599 --> 00:23:29.519
on to church hand in hand and
all of those things. So I'm very

269
00:23:29.519 --> 00:23:32.319
proud of you, Kathy. I
think that's that sounds like a wonderful book

270
00:23:32.359 --> 00:23:36.000
for you to be cracking into.
And the fact that you're so excited about

271
00:23:36.079 --> 00:23:40.200
something and it's engaging you like that, I think is a very wonderful thing.

272
00:23:40.519 --> 00:23:42.559
A lot of these types of books
come out and go by the wayside.

273
00:23:42.599 --> 00:23:47.880
I would recommend to you, Kathy, checking out Reasons dot org and

274
00:23:47.920 --> 00:23:51.720
the folks at Reasons to Believe with
doctor Hugh Ross and the like. You

275
00:23:51.799 --> 00:23:56.960
have chemists and astro physicists and the
like that write and talk about these things

276
00:23:57.000 --> 00:24:00.480
all the time, and I think
that they do it in a very healthy

277
00:24:00.519 --> 00:24:03.319
way as well, and most likely
if you went to their website today,

278
00:24:03.359 --> 00:24:07.359
that they have a critique or a
thought or two about this book The Language

279
00:24:07.359 --> 00:24:12.559
of God as well. But I
think it's wonderful that the scientific community is

280
00:24:12.559 --> 00:24:15.440
starting to break out again, because
if you go back, you see that

281
00:24:15.559 --> 00:24:21.440
the early scientists were people of faith
in one form or another, were people

282
00:24:21.480 --> 00:24:27.319
of faith, and and so that
that is kind of bridging the gap a

283
00:24:27.319 --> 00:24:32.279
little bit. And now it's becoming
a little more okay for scientists to say,

284
00:24:32.319 --> 00:24:37.519
no, I absolutely do not see
it as as contradictory to be a

285
00:24:37.519 --> 00:24:42.319
scientist and to be a person of
faith. Brian, Welcome to the Jesus

286
00:24:42.400 --> 00:24:45.880
Christ Show. That's allows going to
Jesus. Good Brian, what's going on?

287
00:24:47.440 --> 00:24:51.240
Yeah, I just had a question. I was wondering why a lot

288
00:24:51.240 --> 00:24:55.880
of paintings and pictures show angels having
things okay, and I was wondering if

289
00:24:55.880 --> 00:25:00.160
the UFO phenomena had had anything to
do with these angelic beings. Oh,

290
00:25:00.160 --> 00:25:02.680
it's interesting and there's a lot of
theory on both. I don't know that

291
00:25:02.720 --> 00:25:04.319
we'll get to all of it,
but let's go to the scripture first.

292
00:25:06.200 --> 00:25:11.039
That's best place to start that.
You know, you see the cherubic the

293
00:25:11.279 --> 00:25:15.759
little child with the loincloth and the
little wings and their chubby faced you know

294
00:25:15.759 --> 00:25:19.119
how you see those in paintings and
stuff. Well, that's that type of

295
00:25:19.160 --> 00:25:25.079
description is nowhere in scripture, and
what is in scripture is a hierarchy,

296
00:25:25.240 --> 00:25:33.640
almost like a military of created beings, specifically created beings by God that are

297
00:25:33.720 --> 00:25:37.519
messengers, which is what angel means. You will see times in scripture,

298
00:25:37.559 --> 00:25:42.559
like for instance, in Isaiah,
if you go to Isaiah six, verse

299
00:25:42.640 --> 00:25:48.880
two and six, you'll see that
it talks about a seraphim, and the

300
00:25:48.960 --> 00:25:52.880
seraphim in this case said that each
one had six wings, two that covered

301
00:25:52.920 --> 00:25:56.559
the face, to that covered the
feet, and two that he flew with,

302
00:25:57.480 --> 00:26:03.440
and and so a lot of description, you know, and paintings come

303
00:26:03.480 --> 00:26:06.720
from that. If you really saw
the intensity of an angel. Keep in

304
00:26:06.759 --> 00:26:10.400
mind, the angel does not have
a physical body form, only has a

305
00:26:10.400 --> 00:26:15.079
body form at particular times and necessities
to be seen by humans. Yes,

306
00:26:15.160 --> 00:26:18.680
do you think maybe when they when
they all they get, you know,

307
00:26:18.759 --> 00:26:22.759
receive a body. No, it's
not a it's not a necessity. Now,

308
00:26:22.799 --> 00:26:29.079
it doesn't mean that they can't possess
because angels demons and fallen are fallen

309
00:26:29.119 --> 00:26:32.680
angels that yes, they could possess
a body, but they don't receive a

310
00:26:32.720 --> 00:26:37.960
body. A lot of that kind
of twisted theology comes from Hollywood and the

311
00:26:38.000 --> 00:26:41.480
harps and the and that people die
and then they go to heaven become angels.

312
00:26:41.519 --> 00:26:48.359
That's not the way it works in
scripture. Also, there's uh talking

313
00:26:48.440 --> 00:26:52.759
in the Book of Daniel about flight
and the like. So when you read

314
00:26:52.799 --> 00:26:56.759
these things, it's kind of assumed
that they have wings because people think,

315
00:26:56.799 --> 00:27:00.359
well, how does someone fly?
So part of it is anthropomorphic. It's

316
00:27:00.359 --> 00:27:06.799
applying very human or human understanding to
something. Back to Daniel, we're talking

317
00:27:06.799 --> 00:27:08.720
about Daniel, like when they describe
the I guess chariot of fire in the

318
00:27:08.720 --> 00:27:11.960
sky, like, like, wouldn't
chariot be like, you know, if

319
00:27:11.960 --> 00:27:14.920
we were if we were to see
something now, we would call it an

320
00:27:14.920 --> 00:27:18.519
aeroplane. But I guess back then
they you know, obviously they refer to

321
00:27:18.519 --> 00:27:22.440
it as chariot. Well there's yeah, there's instances in Isaiah as well as

322
00:27:22.480 --> 00:27:26.440
well about the wheel in the sky
and things like that. The important thing

323
00:27:26.480 --> 00:27:30.880
is to understand its context, to
see what it's not saying. Because you

324
00:27:30.920 --> 00:27:34.119
can go into gift shops and all
kinds of little shops, and angels were

325
00:27:34.200 --> 00:27:38.599
kind of an end thing for a
while. They're people were collecting little figurines

326
00:27:38.640 --> 00:27:41.400
and books on angels. But a
lot of the New Age movement, a

327
00:27:41.440 --> 00:27:48.200
lot of you know, garbage actually
has seeped into the concept of angels,

328
00:27:48.240 --> 00:27:53.720
because, to make it short,
people do everything they can not to worship

329
00:27:53.759 --> 00:27:57.759
God, and they try and find
anything else to worship or to believe in

330
00:27:59.039 --> 00:28:03.160
or to participate with that isn't actually
being accountable to God. And angels kind

331
00:28:03.160 --> 00:28:07.160
of fall into that category. Yet
angels have always said when someone went to

332
00:28:07.200 --> 00:28:11.039
worship them, don't worship me.
Do not worship me. I am not

333
00:28:11.599 --> 00:28:15.240
here to be worshiped. But there's
a book that Neil put up under his

334
00:28:15.400 --> 00:28:22.960
recommended reading that's called Angels Elect an
Evil by Cefred Dickinson, and he thinks

335
00:28:22.960 --> 00:28:26.200
it's a fantastic book on angels,
And if you really want to know about

336
00:28:26.240 --> 00:28:32.839
angels, there's a good place to
start because it's completely based on Biblical references

337
00:28:32.880 --> 00:28:38.359
about the hierarchy, about the stations
of angels, the names, the appearance

338
00:28:38.400 --> 00:28:42.720
of angels in movies. It's funny
you see angels appear as women most of

339
00:28:42.759 --> 00:28:48.880
the time. Almost every single physical
appearance of an angel is in a masculine

340
00:28:48.920 --> 00:28:55.359
form, with exception of one that
some scholars question whether it's an angel or

341
00:28:55.400 --> 00:29:00.880
not. And there's discrepancies, but
these types of things actually have been modified

342
00:29:00.880 --> 00:29:04.880
by Hollywood. Brian They's Hollywood has
found sexier, more interesting ways, in

343
00:29:04.920 --> 00:29:11.559
their own opinion, to portray angels, and so therefore you start seeing these

344
00:29:11.640 --> 00:29:15.640
different types of angelic beings. But
angels in scripture have been described with wings,

345
00:29:15.839 --> 00:29:21.160
not the single pair, and that
kind of appearance that you're used to,

346
00:29:21.599 --> 00:29:25.720
but usually in more dramatic form.
And some of the you know,

347
00:29:25.759 --> 00:29:29.839
demons and the like are pretty intense, and the appearance of an angel is

348
00:29:29.920 --> 00:29:33.039
pretty intense, more intense than a
very flowery painting that will go in your

349
00:29:33.039 --> 00:29:37.880
mother's bathroom might be KFI amix on
demand