WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.640 --> 00:00:03.960 This is doctor Wendy Walsh and you're listening to kf I Am six forty, 2 00:00:04.080 --> 00:00:08.439 the Doctor Wendy Walsh Show on demand on the iHeartRadio app. Kay, bye, 3 00:00:08.519 --> 00:00:11.480 Am six forty. You have doctor Wendy Walsh for you. This is 4 00:00:11.519 --> 00:00:15.599 the Doctor Wendy Walls Show. I'm taking your calls at least one more call 5 00:00:15.679 --> 00:00:19.519 and then I want to get into some things that you should always say to 6 00:00:19.719 --> 00:00:23.039 keep love alive. But first we have a caller named Mike on the line. 7 00:00:23.079 --> 00:00:27.160 Hi, Mike, it's doctor Wendy. Doctor Wendy. What's your question? 8 00:00:27.399 --> 00:00:29.480 You're doing? Oh, thank you? What's your question? Love? 9 00:00:30.600 --> 00:00:37.000 Yeah? Question is what you're feeling about the no contact rule? So a 10 00:00:37.079 --> 00:00:41.280 breakup? Yeah. So there's research on this, and I can only quote 11 00:00:41.320 --> 00:00:46.679 the research. The problem with social media, the problem with hanging out with 12 00:00:46.719 --> 00:00:50.119 the same people who are hanging out with that person, the problem with checking 13 00:00:50.159 --> 00:00:55.200 in to see if they're still okay, is it extends the grieving time. 14 00:00:56.000 --> 00:01:00.439 And so by going no contact, it's not like you're mad at the person 15 00:01:00.479 --> 00:01:03.680 and you can't ever you know, eventually be friends. But there has to 16 00:01:03.719 --> 00:01:08.680 be a period where you're not continually triggered that means you've got an unfollow defriend 17 00:01:08.760 --> 00:01:12.159 on social If there are friends that you have in common, you say, 18 00:01:12.239 --> 00:01:15.400 hey, you know it, just don't invite me to things where they're going 19 00:01:15.480 --> 00:01:19.079 to be. And you know, if you have to switch gyms and dry 20 00:01:19.120 --> 00:01:22.760 cleaners so you won't run into them, that's just part of the healing process. 21 00:01:22.799 --> 00:01:26.280 It's a gift to yourself. So I'm a big proponent only because the 22 00:01:26.319 --> 00:01:30.280 research supports it of going no contact for a period of time until you're feeling 23 00:01:30.280 --> 00:01:34.400 bad, until you get your mojo back. That's what I think, and 24 00:01:34.519 --> 00:01:38.400 then how long you think that ought to be. It's different for everybody, 25 00:01:38.439 --> 00:01:44.560 isn't it. I you know there are relationships, Yeah, there are relationships 26 00:01:44.640 --> 00:01:48.200 I've had in my life or twenty years ago. I would never talk to 27 00:01:48.239 --> 00:01:51.439 that person again. Okay, it would trigger me too much, right, 28 00:01:51.519 --> 00:01:53.519 But there are other people that I might have dated for a short period of 29 00:01:53.560 --> 00:01:57.799 time and then after a year or so they become sort of a business contact 30 00:01:57.840 --> 00:02:01.000 friend whatever, because it wasn't that. It depends how much passion there was, 31 00:02:01.319 --> 00:02:06.840 how much emotion there was. But anyway, thanks for calling my going 32 00:02:06.959 --> 00:02:12.719 on contact toll. You get feeling better, alrighty? I've been talking earlier 33 00:02:12.719 --> 00:02:15.319 about phrases that you should never say in a relationship, especially during the heat 34 00:02:15.360 --> 00:02:20.719 of the moment, because they cause more injury. But there are some things 35 00:02:20.759 --> 00:02:25.039 that research shows that if you say on the regular, on a regular basis, 36 00:02:25.680 --> 00:02:30.199 actually can keep love alive. It can help continue to grow love in 37 00:02:30.199 --> 00:02:37.199 your relationships. So let's go through some of my favorite phrases. How about 38 00:02:37.319 --> 00:02:43.039 starting with daily compliments, things like you look great, or you look fabulous, 39 00:02:43.120 --> 00:02:45.159 or I love when you do that. Oh, I love your smile. 40 00:02:45.319 --> 00:02:47.479 I always tell my boyfriend, I love your smile. That's what I 41 00:02:47.560 --> 00:02:52.280 say, just a little comment here there. It really does make you feel 42 00:02:52.319 --> 00:02:53.520 better. Granted, I'm single as the day is long, but i was 43 00:02:53.560 --> 00:03:00.039 having a really bad day the other day and I'm all crying and feel I 44 00:03:00.039 --> 00:03:02.560 saw you got a great hug. But the guy I would talking to was 45 00:03:02.560 --> 00:03:05.199 like, you know, I know you're going through it, but you look 46 00:03:05.240 --> 00:03:09.120 so beautiful while you're crying, and I'm like, yeah, it helps. 47 00:03:09.400 --> 00:03:15.120 It does help, just a little compliment. There's also tons of research to 48 00:03:15.159 --> 00:03:23.080 support those simple words of thank you, but not just thank you. If 49 00:03:23.319 --> 00:03:29.120 it's especially important that you thank your partner every day, for the little things, 50 00:03:29.439 --> 00:03:31.719 for the tiny little things. I got to thank my boyfriend today for 51 00:03:31.719 --> 00:03:34.719 the big things. I forgot to tell you, Kaylo, you know what 52 00:03:34.759 --> 00:03:38.360 he got me for Mother's Day? Why I'm not even his mother. So 53 00:03:38.919 --> 00:03:40.759 I have a new stove that's an induction Bernard, you know what that is. 54 00:03:40.759 --> 00:03:43.879 It's done with like magnets or something. I don't know, and only 55 00:03:43.919 --> 00:03:46.599 certain kinds of pots and pans can work on it. So I had done 56 00:03:46.599 --> 00:03:50.479 some googling, and I said, cast iron does work. So you bought 57 00:03:50.520 --> 00:03:53.680 me a whole set of cast iron pans that are bright blue blueberry color. 58 00:03:53.759 --> 00:03:58.240 They're just gorgeous. They're like works of art. He is white. Just 59 00:03:58.360 --> 00:04:00.039 you just stumbled upon gold with that one. It is so sweet, I 60 00:04:00.080 --> 00:04:02.919 did. I'm really lucky, really lucky. But we work at it, 61 00:04:02.960 --> 00:04:05.240 we do the stuff. But anyway, I thank him not only for the 62 00:04:05.280 --> 00:04:10.680 big things, but the little things, like you know, small things, 63 00:04:10.759 --> 00:04:14.159 giving me a glass of water at night, doing the sweetest little things. 64 00:04:14.439 --> 00:04:17.000 But the other thing the research says is not only thank them regularly for the 65 00:04:17.040 --> 00:04:21.600 little things, but tell them how it improves your life, tell them why 66 00:04:23.000 --> 00:04:26.360 it means a lot to you, And then you know, when I say, 67 00:04:26.959 --> 00:04:30.000 your relationship is a garden, water what you want to grow. Don't 68 00:04:30.000 --> 00:04:34.079 water the weeds by criticizing them. Just literally say thank you for all the 69 00:04:34.120 --> 00:04:40.319 little stuff. Here's a good one. Apparently, when we're in relationships, 70 00:04:40.360 --> 00:04:45.560 we're in relationships with human beings, and apparently human beings make mistakes. And 71 00:04:45.639 --> 00:04:48.360 when they make mistakes, instead of jumping on it going I can't believe you 72 00:04:48.399 --> 00:04:51.399 did that. Oh my god, why did you do that? How about 73 00:04:51.519 --> 00:04:56.759 simply saying it's all right, baby, I love you anyway, I love 74 00:04:56.800 --> 00:05:00.480 you anyway. You see, we all know when we've messed up. But 75 00:05:00.639 --> 00:05:04.839 having somebody there go is okay. You know, I'm gonna give you a 76 00:05:04.879 --> 00:05:10.399 pass on that one. I love you anyway. Another big one, and 77 00:05:10.519 --> 00:05:15.560 this happened recently. I was in a stressful situation about something and I called 78 00:05:15.600 --> 00:05:19.600 my guy and he unfortunately was like, you know how, guys, it's 79 00:05:19.639 --> 00:05:24.319 not their fault. They're really great. This way they try to solve the 80 00:05:24.439 --> 00:05:28.240 problem instead of giving emotional support, well you should do this, you should 81 00:05:28.240 --> 00:05:30.680 call that person, and you should write that letter, you should do whatever. 82 00:05:30.360 --> 00:05:35.279 And instead I said, I just need to know that you got my 83 00:05:35.319 --> 00:05:40.839 back, and then he said those magic words, We're going to get through 84 00:05:40.879 --> 00:05:45.000 this, baby, We're gonna get through this, beautiful. And then the 85 00:05:45.079 --> 00:05:48.600 best phrase, I tell you you're not alone. Right, We're gonna get 86 00:05:48.639 --> 00:05:54.959 we were the royal we Yeah, we're gonna get through this, right because 87 00:05:55.000 --> 00:06:00.639 this too will pass um or on the same line, understand you know you 88 00:06:00.720 --> 00:06:03.879 say something and instead of them saying why do you feel that way? Why 89 00:06:03.920 --> 00:06:08.639 did you do that? Why did you say that? I understand you feel 90 00:06:08.680 --> 00:06:13.040 gotten. You feel heard much better than make you feel crazy and unheard. 91 00:06:13.199 --> 00:06:17.480 Yeah, here's another good one. What can I do for you? Or, 92 00:06:17.839 --> 00:06:23.800 as I like it worded, how can I help you? I say 93 00:06:23.800 --> 00:06:26.480 that all the time to my guy. I say that to my kids, 94 00:06:26.519 --> 00:06:30.079 how can I help? You can when they they're going on about how can 95 00:06:30.279 --> 00:06:32.879 I help? We all need to say that more often to everybody in our 96 00:06:32.920 --> 00:06:40.040 lives, co workers, bosses, our kids, our lovers. How can 97 00:06:40.240 --> 00:06:43.279 I help? That's all we want to know, how we can help? 98 00:06:43.920 --> 00:06:46.240 All Right? Here's another phrase. I love write this down. You need 99 00:06:46.279 --> 00:06:51.199 to say this when you get home tonight. I believe in you. When 100 00:06:51.680 --> 00:06:57.720 you know we have these moments where we're feeling down and our partner is a 101 00:06:57.720 --> 00:07:01.680 little bit our cheerleader, and you need to know that they believe in you. 102 00:07:01.959 --> 00:07:06.160 And as I've said before, the research is very clear, long term 103 00:07:06.199 --> 00:07:12.160 happy couples actually really value their partner. And even when they're fighting, they 104 00:07:12.160 --> 00:07:14.920 don't forget who they fell in love with. They still value their partner. 105 00:07:15.120 --> 00:07:18.160 They think they got a good deal. And so when you say I believe 106 00:07:18.240 --> 00:07:23.959 in you, do you know who you're reminding not just them, You're reminding 107 00:07:23.959 --> 00:07:30.079 your own brain of why you're there in the first place. How about this 108 00:07:30.120 --> 00:07:34.319 one, I trust you. I have said that to my Julio. I've 109 00:07:34.319 --> 00:07:38.639 said I've trust I've trust you to make a good decision. I've trust you. 110 00:07:38.800 --> 00:07:43.120 I trust you to make a good decision. Actually here's another one, 111 00:07:43.240 --> 00:07:46.279 but this was really important. He said it to me because he realized. 112 00:07:46.319 --> 00:07:50.519 So he sometimes hasn't done it in a while, Thank Goodness, goes home 113 00:07:50.600 --> 00:07:54.480 to visit, you know, friends, family, whatever, on the East 114 00:07:54.480 --> 00:07:58.279 Coast, and he will say when he's there, every time, he'll say, 115 00:07:58.800 --> 00:08:03.959 you know, back here, I realize I'm a New Yorker. I 116 00:08:03.040 --> 00:08:07.120 just love New York. I love And he'll go on and on the whole 117 00:08:07.120 --> 00:08:09.639 time, I'm talking about how much he loves New York. This terrifies me 118 00:08:11.079 --> 00:08:13.800 because, first of all, I'm not a New Yorker. And secondly, 119 00:08:15.199 --> 00:08:16.480 I feel like all the time I've spend in New York, I was living 120 00:08:16.519 --> 00:08:18.959 in a filing cabinet. Sorry, Kayla, I know you're from New York. 121 00:08:20.079 --> 00:08:24.399 I'm from New Jersey, but it really felt like I was living in 122 00:08:24.439 --> 00:08:26.759 a filing cabinet. Agree about New York. So anyway, he can tell 123 00:08:26.920 --> 00:08:31.360 that. I get a little bit insecure whenever he goes on one of those 124 00:08:31.360 --> 00:08:33.679 bands. Luckily it hasn't been for a while, but anyway, and so 125 00:08:33.840 --> 00:08:39.000 what he does is he comes back and he says to me, I'd rather 126 00:08:39.080 --> 00:08:41.480 be with you than New York. That's what he says. I'd rather be 127 00:08:41.600 --> 00:08:46.000 with you. D rather be with you. You are more important. No 128 00:08:46.039 --> 00:08:48.279 matter where you are in the world, is where I want to be. 129 00:08:48.879 --> 00:08:54.440 I know. Isn't that great? You know we should all be saying this 130 00:08:54.559 --> 00:09:01.600 to our partner on a regular basis. I'm glad we're together, Appreciate your 131 00:09:01.639 --> 00:09:05.559 relationship, Appreciate that you've got a person, You've got a buddy to go 132 00:09:05.639 --> 00:09:09.519 through life with. And say it regularly. You know, I say it 133 00:09:09.559 --> 00:09:13.799 over and over, and I'm going to say it again. Water what you 134 00:09:13.840 --> 00:09:18.200 want to grow, don't water the weeds. Because here's what's happening. When 135 00:09:18.240 --> 00:09:22.240 you say nice things to your partner, your brain is listening and you are 136 00:09:22.919 --> 00:09:28.080 reminding your own brain of why you're there. I'm glad we're together. You 137 00:09:28.120 --> 00:09:31.200 know this one I used to say to my kids when they were little. 138 00:09:33.200 --> 00:09:37.240 I used to say to them, both of them at different times. Privately, 139 00:09:37.440 --> 00:09:39.960 they never knew I said it to both of them. I said, 140 00:09:39.679 --> 00:09:46.639 you're the daughter I always wished for. You can say that to your partner. 141 00:09:46.120 --> 00:09:50.200 You're the person I always wished for. You're my dream person. Such 142 00:09:50.240 --> 00:09:54.600 a reminder that that person's not taken, taken for brained exactly, that you're 143 00:09:54.639 --> 00:10:00.519 so special that I went my whole life and I wish for you, and 144 00:10:00.720 --> 00:10:07.879 you came. And finally, let's not forget these words have so much value. 145 00:10:07.360 --> 00:10:11.639 I really feel safe with you, or you make me feel safe, 146 00:10:11.679 --> 00:10:18.679 right, If it's true, you definitely want to do listen. I know 147 00:10:18.720 --> 00:10:22.879 it's Mother's Day. I know most of you had your Mother's Day brunch and 148 00:10:22.960 --> 00:10:26.320 you think it's over. But I do want to talk about something that I 149 00:10:26.399 --> 00:10:33.519 haven't addressed. So much yet, which is those people out there who may 150 00:10:33.559 --> 00:10:39.440 have really complicated feelings about motherhood I or Mother's Day, either because they've lost 151 00:10:39.480 --> 00:10:46.159 their mother, either because they've had a negative relationship with their mother. Maybe 152 00:10:46.159 --> 00:10:48.559 they've been trying to become a mother and there's just a lot of feeling of 153 00:10:48.720 --> 00:10:54.320 loss around there. Let's talk about it when we come back. As well 154 00:10:54.360 --> 00:10:58.000 as I want to pull you off the guilt train, moms, there are 155 00:10:58.039 --> 00:11:01.240 ways to be a good mom in a hostile world that don't take as much 156 00:11:01.279 --> 00:11:05.399 time as you think. You are listening to the Doctor Wendy Walls Show on 157 00:11:05.559 --> 00:11:11.799 kf I AM six forty. We're live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app. You're 158 00:11:11.840 --> 00:11:18.840 listening to Doctor Wendy Walsh on demand from kf I AM six forty Am six 159 00:11:18.960 --> 00:11:22.480 forty. You have doctor Wendy Walsh with you. This is the Doctor Wendy 160 00:11:22.519 --> 00:11:30.480 Walsh showing. Mother's Day is a wonderful celebration of women who devoted their lives 161 00:11:30.600 --> 00:11:35.240 to raising their children, but for some people it can be a day they 162 00:11:35.279 --> 00:11:39.480 can be very triggering. Some people have had a mother who let them down, 163 00:11:41.080 --> 00:11:45.480 or a mother who wasn't even there, a mother who gave them up 164 00:11:45.519 --> 00:11:50.240 for adoption, a mother who passed away early, a mother who was cruel, 165 00:11:52.320 --> 00:11:58.879 a mother who was hurtful. Maybe you're a woman who's been trying hard 166 00:11:58.919 --> 00:12:07.159 to become a mother and IVF isn't working. Maybe you're a mother whose relationship 167 00:12:07.200 --> 00:12:15.679 with your adult children is challenged. This can be a very complicated day. 168 00:12:15.840 --> 00:12:20.320 There's a reason why when you go to therapy often one of the first questions 169 00:12:20.320 --> 00:12:26.960 a therapist might ask is, so tell me about your mother. I know 170 00:12:26.240 --> 00:12:33.360 fathers are super important, and certainly people can have daddy issues, and dads 171 00:12:33.399 --> 00:12:39.559 can be hurtful and traumatizing and wonderful and supportive. But it is our mother 172 00:12:39.320 --> 00:12:46.000 who grows us literally inside her body and nurtures us with our body, with 173 00:12:46.120 --> 00:12:54.960 her body. It is the most primal relationship, mother and child. I 174 00:12:56.000 --> 00:12:58.360 want you to know if today was a complicated day for you, you're not 175 00:12:58.399 --> 00:13:05.320 alone. One research hole done by you GOV revealed that about a thirty percent 176 00:13:05.399 --> 00:13:09.879 of both men and women don't celebrate Mother's Day at all. They just ignore 177 00:13:09.919 --> 00:13:15.200 it, just let it past. I want to you know. I lost 178 00:13:15.240 --> 00:13:18.879 my mother to breast cancer when I was thirty, and so for me, 179 00:13:20.440 --> 00:13:24.039 I take time to sort of honor her memories. And there are some things 180 00:13:24.039 --> 00:13:31.200 you can do if you've lost your mother, You can reflect on her and 181 00:13:31.279 --> 00:13:35.919 her memories. You know, when I became a mother myself, my mother 182 00:13:35.000 --> 00:13:39.679 somehow came back from the dead because she came right out my lips when I 183 00:13:39.720 --> 00:13:43.279 was under stress all of a sudden. You know, I had two brown 184 00:13:43.320 --> 00:13:46.399 eyed kids, and I would say, they say, Mom, where's my? 185 00:13:46.600 --> 00:13:48.879 Where's my? And I go there, right under your two blue eyes. 186 00:13:52.240 --> 00:13:56.159 I have blue eyes. I heard that over and over again. Just 187 00:13:56.399 --> 00:14:03.480 look. So anyway, maybe you could even take some time to light a 188 00:14:03.519 --> 00:14:07.360 candle for your lost mother, to write a letter to her, to tell 189 00:14:07.440 --> 00:14:13.039 her how good you're doing on your own. Maybe you want to donate to 190 00:14:13.120 --> 00:14:20.159 a charity that she supported, volunteer for a cause that was really important to 191 00:14:20.200 --> 00:14:26.960 her, plant a tree in her memory. My mom's favorite flower is a 192 00:14:26.039 --> 00:14:31.759 yellow rose. I actually have a little tattoo, a memory to memorial tattoo 193 00:14:31.799 --> 00:14:33.799 of a yellow rose. You don't know where, Kayla. Even if I 194 00:14:33.799 --> 00:14:35.799 had a bikini on, you wouldn't see it. I didn't know you were 195 00:14:35.799 --> 00:14:41.519 a tattooed art. It was a memorial tattoo. But here's the problem that 196 00:14:41.519 --> 00:14:43.679 they don't tell you. The tattooed to artist does not tell you this. 197 00:14:43.720 --> 00:14:46.639 When you're thirty and your mother has just died and you go to Sunset Boulevard 198 00:14:46.840 --> 00:14:52.279 and there's that guy leaning over you that when you get pregnant, it stretches 199 00:14:52.320 --> 00:14:56.720 out big and then it shrinks again. And then you get pregnant and it 200 00:14:56.799 --> 00:15:01.159 stretches out big and then it shrinks again. Now it's just a blur that 201 00:15:01.240 --> 00:15:05.480 happens. Yes, whoa, this is a blob and a blur. It 202 00:15:05.480 --> 00:15:09.159 had her name, Frankie, and it had her yellow rose, and that's 203 00:15:09.159 --> 00:15:11.879 just a blur. I'm so scared for the future of my tattoos. That's 204 00:15:11.960 --> 00:15:16.320 right. Oh all you young people, wait till you're walking around the pool 205 00:15:16.320 --> 00:15:22.000 when you're eighty. It will be a site anyway. So, since my 206 00:15:22.080 --> 00:15:26.919 mother's flower was a yellow rose, wherever I own or rent, anywhere I 207 00:15:28.039 --> 00:15:31.559 plant a yellow rose, I always have a yellow rose in my garden. 208 00:15:31.679 --> 00:15:35.159 That was beautiful. That's a beautiful dedication and that rose bush. You know, 209 00:15:35.200 --> 00:15:37.399 I have to tell you something really bad. Can you believe one time 210 00:15:37.960 --> 00:15:41.879 the guy who I want you, who wanted to get back at me, 211 00:15:41.960 --> 00:15:46.759 one time he came in the night and he dug up my mother's yellow rose 212 00:15:46.240 --> 00:15:50.639 and tore it down. Yeah, I had a man still her ring that 213 00:15:50.679 --> 00:15:56.559 I had hit her obituaries and her pictures like six stuff. Oh my gosh, 214 00:15:56.559 --> 00:16:00.120 oh my god. I will say this, if you've lost your embrace 215 00:16:00.200 --> 00:16:04.879 your friends, that means you've got a mom whole that you need to fill 216 00:16:06.320 --> 00:16:08.840 and you have to actively do that. You know. Sometimes, you know, 217 00:16:08.879 --> 00:16:12.240 I always recommend people go to a therapists because I'm you know, a 218 00:16:12.279 --> 00:16:22.759 proponent, a beneficiary of good therapy. But I often will say that therapy 219 00:16:22.840 --> 00:16:29.240 is like reparenting. It's like your therapist becomes your internal mother in some way. 220 00:16:29.840 --> 00:16:32.840 I do want to say that if you are somebody who has been trying 221 00:16:32.879 --> 00:16:36.879 to become a mother, this can be a very tender day if you've been 222 00:16:36.960 --> 00:16:42.679 having challenges, and I just want you to know that your emotional responses are 223 00:16:42.799 --> 00:16:48.720 valid. You deserve to feel exactly the rainbow of crazy emotions you may be 224 00:16:48.840 --> 00:16:55.879 feeling on this day. And I also encourage you to do things, find 225 00:16:55.919 --> 00:17:00.519 things that are comforting and nurturing for you, and talk to your friends about 226 00:17:00.559 --> 00:17:07.079 what you're feeling. You're supportive friends for all of us who may have complicated 227 00:17:07.119 --> 00:17:15.000 relationships with our mothers, It's important that we focus on positive relationships in our 228 00:17:15.039 --> 00:17:19.480 lives. You know, at the end of the day, we are given 229 00:17:19.519 --> 00:17:26.240 this life. Our childhood may be filled with trauma or big bumps or small 230 00:17:26.279 --> 00:17:32.519 bumps, but how our life ends is up to us. Whether it is 231 00:17:32.640 --> 00:17:37.559 attending to all those dings and dings that happened in early childhood, whether it 232 00:17:37.720 --> 00:17:42.720 is doing things differently as a parent yourself. One of the things that I 233 00:17:42.759 --> 00:17:48.440 often say is when I became a mother, is that all I hope to 234 00:17:48.519 --> 00:17:55.200 do is make different mistakes than my parent. And that's evolution, that's growth. 235 00:17:55.480 --> 00:17:59.319 Right, you realize that didn't work. What else can I do? 236 00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:04.000 But they often say that friends are the family we choose, and it is 237 00:18:04.039 --> 00:18:10.960 incumbent on us to reach out and find that social support. Find those friends, 238 00:18:11.079 --> 00:18:14.160 make those friends. And how do you make friends? You be a 239 00:18:14.200 --> 00:18:18.359 good friend, You care for others. You'll be curious about their lives, 240 00:18:18.359 --> 00:18:22.359 You ask them questions about themselves. You find ways to slowly become closer and 241 00:18:22.440 --> 00:18:26.359 more intimate. And I think you know I've talked it last it last week. 242 00:18:26.440 --> 00:18:29.680 The week before I was talking about the loneliness epidemic. I think it 243 00:18:29.720 --> 00:18:33.559 was just last week that it's really up to all of us to reach out 244 00:18:33.599 --> 00:18:38.880 and fill that void that we may have when we come back. I want 245 00:18:38.920 --> 00:18:45.039 to talk about my experience as a mother and a few of the things that 246 00:18:45.119 --> 00:18:48.960 I learned. First of all, I think our culture pathologizes mother motherhood way 247 00:18:49.000 --> 00:18:52.400 too much. I want to pull you off the guilt train and give you, 248 00:18:52.599 --> 00:18:56.440 especially if you're a mom of small children, or maybe a grandmother and 249 00:18:56.559 --> 00:19:00.680 you've got some small grandkids, come in to visit. I want to give 250 00:19:00.680 --> 00:19:04.319 you a little bit of advice from my life of what I feel worked, 251 00:19:04.720 --> 00:19:08.400 and a lot of it came from textbooks that I put into practice so that 252 00:19:08.480 --> 00:19:15.599 we can all be a good enough mother when we come back. You're listening 253 00:19:15.599 --> 00:19:18.839 to the Doctor Wendy Walsh Show on kf I AM six forty. We're live 254 00:19:18.920 --> 00:19:25.000 everywhere on the iHeartRadio app. You're listening to doctor Wendy Walsh on demand from 255 00:19:25.119 --> 00:19:30.279 kf I AM sixty KIM six forty. You have Doctor Wendy Walsh with you. 256 00:19:30.039 --> 00:19:36.759 Motherhood's hard, It's a burden. Our culture doesn't make it any easier. 257 00:19:37.640 --> 00:19:41.279 When I became a mother, I also became a feminist, and I'll 258 00:19:41.319 --> 00:19:45.279 tell you why. You know what, women can be men until a mother 259 00:19:45.359 --> 00:19:49.440 walks in the room. All of a sudden, you realized how disadvantaged and 260 00:19:49.559 --> 00:19:52.319 disabled you are. I mean, I used to complain. I was a 261 00:19:52.359 --> 00:19:56.559 news reporter, right, and we used to go out to cover news stories, 262 00:19:56.000 --> 00:20:00.160 and the information officer from the LAPD would step out and you wouldn't know 263 00:20:00.200 --> 00:20:04.599 which door he was coming, and you'd watch your male colleagues take off in 264 00:20:04.680 --> 00:20:08.440 their suit and flat shoes, and I'd be in my high heels and pantyhose 265 00:20:08.480 --> 00:20:11.039 and pencil skirt, trying to chase after him, trying to keep my hair 266 00:20:11.119 --> 00:20:14.279 look good while I was trying to get the same sound bite. And I 267 00:20:14.359 --> 00:20:18.200 was already mad about that, okay, But then I became a mother and 268 00:20:18.440 --> 00:20:26.480 realized that every time I step outside my door, I have to pay someone 269 00:20:26.880 --> 00:20:30.640 fifteen dollars an hour to replace me. If I want to go to the 270 00:20:30.720 --> 00:20:33.720 gym, if I want to go grocery shopping, if I want to just 271 00:20:33.799 --> 00:20:37.039 take a walk and take a breath. So when people say, oh, 272 00:20:37.119 --> 00:20:41.160 well, women make like eighty percent or seventy seven cents on a man's dollar, 273 00:20:41.200 --> 00:20:45.480 I go, not mothers. They have to take that seventy seven cents 274 00:20:45.480 --> 00:20:48.680 and split it in half and share it with another woman in the form of 275 00:20:48.759 --> 00:20:55.160 childcare. I literally, my heart goes out to women who stand at a 276 00:20:55.200 --> 00:20:59.880 bus stop at six in the morning feeding their kid Thailand all so they can 277 00:21:00.039 --> 00:21:03.039 drop it at a daycare on time and not be fined, So they can 278 00:21:03.079 --> 00:21:06.039 get to work on time and punch their cart in on time and not be 279 00:21:06.160 --> 00:21:08.000 reprimmanded, not lose money so they can pay for more formula for their baby. 280 00:21:08.000 --> 00:21:14.440 Blah blah blah. It's a cycle. It's so so hard. More 281 00:21:14.519 --> 00:21:18.519 than twenty five percent of children in America are raised by single mothers. I 282 00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:23.519 was a single mother for eighteen years. I'm going to tell you a story 283 00:21:25.119 --> 00:21:32.599 where I first learned the term pathologize motherhood, making motherhood pathological. Let me 284 00:21:32.680 --> 00:21:36.759 explain. So we lived at the beach. My three year old loved to 285 00:21:36.880 --> 00:21:38.839 run in the waves. I would chase after her and pull her a little 286 00:21:38.880 --> 00:21:42.160 curly head out of the foaming waves, and she would come up sputtering and 287 00:21:42.279 --> 00:21:45.920 coughing, and I thought, well, this is no way to learn how 288 00:21:45.960 --> 00:21:48.480 to swim, and you are going to drown. But she needs to learn 289 00:21:48.559 --> 00:21:51.680 how to swim. So I asked around the mom world and they sent me 290 00:21:51.759 --> 00:21:55.920 to a woman who in her backyard swimming pool teaches toddlers how to swim. 291 00:21:56.599 --> 00:22:00.759 So we go and my daughter has her first little swimming and it went very 292 00:22:00.839 --> 00:22:04.279 well. And then the woman got out of the pool, got the kid 293 00:22:04.319 --> 00:22:07.759 out of the pool. I had my back turned and I was getting a 294 00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:11.440 towel. And what do you think my three year old did. No, 295 00:22:11.839 --> 00:22:15.359 did a running leap and jumped right back in the pool. No. So 296 00:22:15.480 --> 00:22:19.279 of course the woman actually was closer, so she jumped in and grabbed her 297 00:22:19.319 --> 00:22:22.759 and pulled her up and got her to the stairs. And like, the 298 00:22:22.839 --> 00:22:25.640 woman could not get my kid. I don't know, if you know. 299 00:22:25.680 --> 00:22:30.079 I have a really strong willed daughter and she's twenty five now and save in 300 00:22:30.119 --> 00:22:33.920 the world. She's fine. But and so the woman couldn't get her out 301 00:22:33.960 --> 00:22:37.559 of the pool. So I was using a technique that I had been taught 302 00:22:37.680 --> 00:22:41.119 at preschool, because I'm learning motherhood from everybody around me. At the preschool, 303 00:22:41.160 --> 00:22:44.079 they said, give kids some autonomy, give them a choice. So 304 00:22:44.279 --> 00:22:47.319 I say, Carrington, would you like the blue towel the red towel? 305 00:22:47.319 --> 00:22:48.920 We're getting out now. Which towel would you like? Because we're getting out 306 00:22:48.920 --> 00:22:55.039 of the pool now, right, And this woman lost her whatever and started 307 00:22:55.039 --> 00:22:57.599 saying to me, you need to just grab your child and get her out 308 00:22:57.640 --> 00:23:03.599 of that pool. And then she called me later that night and just read 309 00:23:03.680 --> 00:23:07.480 me the Riot Act, told me I was a terrible mother, told me 310 00:23:07.599 --> 00:23:11.920 that she'd asked around and there was another public school or public pool where I 311 00:23:11.079 --> 00:23:15.759 also didn't keep an eye on my daughter, which really like, now she's 312 00:23:15.799 --> 00:23:22.440 like shaming me in the village the pool instructor girls. So I obviously she 313 00:23:22.599 --> 00:23:25.119 was triggered from something that happened to her in her life and I had nothing 314 00:23:25.119 --> 00:23:26.680 to do with me. So I go to therapy with tears down in my 315 00:23:26.799 --> 00:23:29.839 chin, saying, oh my god, I'm a bad mother, and I 316 00:23:29.880 --> 00:23:33.720 can't believe she said I'm bad mother. And my therapist said, don't let 317 00:23:33.839 --> 00:23:40.079 this woman pathologize motherhood. Mothers are not at fault for everything that happens to 318 00:23:40.200 --> 00:23:45.480 a child. It used to be an entire village that helped raise a child, 319 00:23:45.960 --> 00:23:51.000 and now we put everything on the mother, so much pressure. You 320 00:23:51.119 --> 00:23:55.279 know, back in the nineteen I'm gonna say forties fifties fifties, I think 321 00:23:55.920 --> 00:24:02.440 a psychotherapist named Donald Winnicott came up with this eerie of parenthood called the good 322 00:24:02.599 --> 00:24:07.880 enough mother. And Donald Winnicott believed that the best kind of mother was the 323 00:24:08.000 --> 00:24:14.880 mother who wasn't too doting and solved kids problems for them and was so overprotective 324 00:24:15.119 --> 00:24:19.000 that the kid became disabled. Right. And it also wasn't the neglectful parent 325 00:24:19.440 --> 00:24:23.359 who let the kids stumble and fall and hurt themselves too much. It was 326 00:24:23.440 --> 00:24:29.400 the good enough mother that allowed, because she was a human being, our 327 00:24:29.480 --> 00:24:33.440 children to grow in our gaps, to grow in those moments when we couldn't 328 00:24:33.480 --> 00:24:37.480 be there from them. One of the things I learned from the director of 329 00:24:37.720 --> 00:24:41.839 our preschool, Mary Hartzel, who's still who's passed away now, but gave 330 00:24:41.880 --> 00:24:45.680 me so much wisdom. She said, all kids need our twenty minutes a 331 00:24:45.799 --> 00:24:52.240 day of undivided attention from a parent. That means no other kids, no 332 00:24:52.599 --> 00:24:56.240 technology. Literally, she said, call it you know, mommy, and 333 00:24:56.160 --> 00:25:00.880 the kid's name, my case was Carrington or Jones moumming care in special time. 334 00:25:00.240 --> 00:25:03.599 Have them make a little sign on their door that says do not come 335 00:25:03.680 --> 00:25:07.359 in mommy and Carrington special time, and you do anything the child wants to 336 00:25:07.440 --> 00:25:10.000 do in that twenty minutes. You don't have deep conversations, just what do 337 00:25:10.039 --> 00:25:12.160 you want to do? Can't involve technology though, you can't sit and watch 338 00:25:12.160 --> 00:25:18.440 a video together. Do something that is child led for twenty minutes a day. 339 00:25:19.079 --> 00:25:23.119 If you have three kids, that's in an hour, right? Is 340 00:25:23.160 --> 00:25:29.200 that right? Three times twenty sixty's right? I do? Okay, And 341 00:25:29.440 --> 00:25:33.400 so that's all you have to do to be the good enough mother is listen 342 00:25:33.480 --> 00:25:37.119 to your child. Also, I do want to say this from experience, 343 00:25:37.759 --> 00:25:41.680 allow as much father as possible, whether you're married or whether you're single. 344 00:25:41.720 --> 00:25:45.000 Do not push that father away. I don't care if you don't like the 345 00:25:45.039 --> 00:25:49.400 way he parents. You know what, they're that child and that man are 346 00:25:49.440 --> 00:25:52.359 going to form their own relationship in their own way, and it's not up 347 00:25:52.400 --> 00:25:59.279 to you to get involved in that. Okay, So let fatherhood happen. 348 00:26:00.079 --> 00:26:04.359 Don't be such a perfectionist mother that you criticize his parenting and then he gives 349 00:26:04.440 --> 00:26:07.240 up, throws up his hands in the air and go okay, you do 350 00:26:07.359 --> 00:26:12.079 it right. Also, and this is vital. Build a village. You 351 00:26:12.160 --> 00:26:15.839 know. One of the things I would do is I would use my house 352 00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:18.759 as the play date house, and I would as many kids over as possible, 353 00:26:19.079 --> 00:26:22.400 because in my mind, I was banking childcare. I was banking free 354 00:26:22.480 --> 00:26:26.960 childcare because I knew who I could reach out to when I needed them. 355 00:26:26.480 --> 00:26:30.119 We actually, when the kids were little, did a unique thing. We 356 00:26:30.279 --> 00:26:34.519 did a playgroup with toddlers where one mother always got to leave, so it 357 00:26:34.720 --> 00:26:37.240 was free time for a mother to go to the gym or shopping or do 358 00:26:37.359 --> 00:26:41.680 whatever. And then every week it would rotate a different mother would leave, 359 00:26:41.720 --> 00:26:45.680 but say there were four or five little toddlers there. I also want to 360 00:26:45.720 --> 00:26:51.720 say this, give your kids your time, not the stuff. I remember 361 00:26:51.759 --> 00:26:53.759 going to therapy when my kids were little and crying because my kids didn't have 362 00:26:53.799 --> 00:26:57.000 a yard. They're being raised in apartments, and I felt this was a 363 00:26:57.079 --> 00:27:00.759 travesty that they needed some help, playground equipment, a jungle gym in the 364 00:27:00.839 --> 00:27:04.440 backyard, and they needed a yard to play in. And she said, 365 00:27:04.599 --> 00:27:11.119 a baby's home is his mother's body, and if you have to leave to 366 00:27:11.240 --> 00:27:14.119 go make money so they can have a jungle gym, they're not going to 367 00:27:14.160 --> 00:27:22.240 care about that jingle gym. A child's home is its parent's body, hold 368 00:27:22.279 --> 00:27:27.680 them close and help them leave when they hit middle school or older. Teacher 369 00:27:27.759 --> 00:27:33.079 eighth graders how to rise city buses. Pack them with summer programs that enrich 370 00:27:33.200 --> 00:27:36.839 them. Help them build a resume for college. Help them in high school 371 00:27:36.839 --> 00:27:40.920 get part time jobs, get a driver's license, help them launch. The 372 00:27:41.079 --> 00:27:44.640 favorite bit of wisdom that I ever got from the director of our preschool is, 373 00:27:45.359 --> 00:27:48.799 if you do your job well, you work yourself out of a job. 374 00:27:48.920 --> 00:27:52.440 And that's what parento it is. When we come back, a special 375 00:27:52.519 --> 00:28:00.680 guest, a researcher who studies why some mothers and adult children are no longer 376 00:28:00.799 --> 00:28:04.440 talking. You're listening to the Doctor Wendy Walsh Show and KFI AM six forty. 377 00:28:04.480 --> 00:28:10.000 We're live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app. You're listening to Doctor Wendy Walsh 378 00:28:10.400 --> 00:28:14.759 on demand from KFI AM six forty. Welcome back to the Doctor Wendy Walsh 379 00:28:14.759 --> 00:28:18.119 Show on KFI AM six forty. We're live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app. 380 00:28:18.240 --> 00:28:23.400 Okay, we have been talking about mothers. We have been talking about motherhood, 381 00:28:23.680 --> 00:28:29.519 and I know for many people, as I've said, coping with Mother's 382 00:28:29.640 --> 00:28:34.960 Day is sometimes difficult, especially if you have a difficult relationship with your mother 383 00:28:36.359 --> 00:28:41.480 or a difficult relationship with your adult child. So I was going through the 384 00:28:41.519 --> 00:28:48.200 research today and I found this really interesting study called mother's attributions for estrangement from 385 00:28:48.240 --> 00:28:52.599 their adult children. So that's a bunch of psychobabble to basically mean why mothers 386 00:28:52.680 --> 00:28:59.640 and children aren't talking? And I was able to score the lead researcher on 387 00:28:59.720 --> 00:29:04.359 the show. I'd like to welcome from the Ohio State University doctor Sarah Shoppy 388 00:29:04.599 --> 00:29:08.480 Sullivan. Hi. How are you, doctor Sarah. I'm doing well. 389 00:29:08.640 --> 00:29:14.519 Thanks for inviting me on Happy Mother's Day. Yes, Happy Mother's Day to 390 00:29:14.599 --> 00:29:18.200 all the moms out there. So my first question is what compelled you to 391 00:29:18.480 --> 00:29:23.640 want to study this particular subject matter. Well, most of my research has 392 00:29:23.680 --> 00:29:30.599 actually focused on parent child relationships when children are young. But I partnered in 393 00:29:30.680 --> 00:29:36.720 this study with a clinical psychologist who works with adults who are estranged from their 394 00:29:36.960 --> 00:29:41.759 their children, and I've got really interested in the topic because it really hadn't 395 00:29:41.920 --> 00:29:47.000 much occurred to me. I think we so often think of parent child relationships 396 00:29:47.160 --> 00:29:52.839 is a lasting and permanent and so I got really interested in the idea that 397 00:29:52.480 --> 00:29:57.279 that's not necessarily the case, and that there are some adult children who aren't 398 00:29:57.319 --> 00:30:02.720 on good terms with their parents, and that perhaps some people think this is 399 00:30:02.920 --> 00:30:07.799 perhaps increasing in terms of its prevalence. Well, we're going to get into 400 00:30:07.839 --> 00:30:11.720 the reasons why in a minute, but I want to just tell people the 401 00:30:11.880 --> 00:30:15.160 jaw dropping statistic that I read when I read your study that freaked me out. 402 00:30:15.680 --> 00:30:18.559 What your study found, and it was a study of more than a 403 00:30:18.720 --> 00:30:26.599 thousand mothers that fifty two fifty two percent of the mother's surveyed were estranged from 404 00:30:26.640 --> 00:30:33.000 a daughter, and more than half of those moms revealed that they've gone for 405 00:30:33.160 --> 00:30:37.880 more than a year without aiding contact with their children. WHOA, what is 406 00:30:38.000 --> 00:30:42.079 going on? Yeah? Well, one thing you have to keep in mind 407 00:30:42.279 --> 00:30:45.839 is that this study was of over a thousand moms, but these were moms 408 00:30:47.119 --> 00:30:49.519 who were interested in the topic of estrangement. Okay, so this is likely 409 00:30:49.599 --> 00:30:56.039 going to be a sample of moms that are more likely to report estrangement from 410 00:30:56.079 --> 00:31:00.559 their adult children than other moms. So other study don't suggest the prevalence is 411 00:31:00.680 --> 00:31:07.519 that high, which is good. Yeah, but there are some other there's 412 00:31:07.559 --> 00:31:14.200 some other research coming out of some colleagues labs at O'hao State that suggests that 413 00:31:14.920 --> 00:31:19.839 it's about like between six and ten percent of aum adult children report being estranged 414 00:31:19.920 --> 00:31:23.720 for moms. But actually, what's interesting to me is, and it's Mother's 415 00:31:23.799 --> 00:31:27.319 Day, so we don't necessarily need to focus on this, but about a 416 00:31:27.480 --> 00:31:34.400 quarter of adults report being estranged from fathers. So this is not an insignificant 417 00:31:34.440 --> 00:31:41.079 phenomenon even for mother child relationships. But thankfully it's not quite as high in 418 00:31:41.200 --> 00:31:45.240 the general population as it was in our particular study, So well, that's 419 00:31:45.359 --> 00:31:49.519 a relief. But you ask people basically why and what were the most kind 420 00:31:49.680 --> 00:31:53.720 answers? Why are people as strained from a strange from there? Yeah, 421 00:31:55.920 --> 00:31:57.960 and our study was kind of unique because a lot of the research, which 422 00:31:59.000 --> 00:32:02.000 makes little sense, has focused on the adult child's perspective on estrangement, right, 423 00:32:02.279 --> 00:32:07.920 and we focused on the mother's perspectives on why their kids were, you 424 00:32:07.000 --> 00:32:12.200 know, out of contact or in very infrequent contact with them. And what 425 00:32:12.319 --> 00:32:15.839 the mothers thought really was that a lot of it had to do with somebody 426 00:32:15.880 --> 00:32:20.799 else turning their child against them, for example, an ex spouse or an 427 00:32:20.799 --> 00:32:24.519 adult child's spouse or partner, So that was one reason they gave. They 428 00:32:24.599 --> 00:32:30.400 also talked about their adult child's struggles with mental health problems or with addiction, 429 00:32:31.599 --> 00:32:37.119 and they so those were some of the top reasons that they talked about, 430 00:32:37.519 --> 00:32:40.759 which are so different from other research which has focused on, you know, 431 00:32:40.880 --> 00:32:45.039 the children, the adult children's views on why they're estranged from their parents. 432 00:32:45.640 --> 00:32:49.200 Yeah, you know, we don't want to blame the moms here it is 433 00:32:49.319 --> 00:32:53.440 Mother's Day, but in some sense, I do believe that we reap what 434 00:32:53.559 --> 00:32:59.640 we saw in some cases. And again again the pressure to be we've talked 435 00:32:59.640 --> 00:33:02.359 about is how hard it is to be a good mother in a hostile environment 436 00:33:02.559 --> 00:33:09.759 like modern American capitalism that doesn't necessarily support motherhood and all the pressures on mothers 437 00:33:09.839 --> 00:33:13.559 that are out there. So we want to pull moms off the guilt train 438 00:33:13.599 --> 00:33:16.880 as much as possible. But do you think we're seeing a rising number of 439 00:33:17.759 --> 00:33:23.960 you know, attachment disorders, insecure attachment style bonding issues early in life. 440 00:33:24.000 --> 00:33:30.000 Do you think that could be contributing it to it? I certainly think it's 441 00:33:30.079 --> 00:33:34.200 possible. I think you're absolutely right to point out that our country doesn't do 442 00:33:34.319 --> 00:33:38.160 a good job of supporting mothers or parents in general. And you know, 443 00:33:38.240 --> 00:33:44.119 with the increasing pressure on parents, there are norms of intensive parenting. You 444 00:33:44.200 --> 00:33:46.119 know, that suggests that parents need to do all these things for their kids. 445 00:33:46.240 --> 00:33:51.240 The role of parents has really changed over time, and so has been 446 00:33:51.480 --> 00:33:58.119 children's idea of what parent child relationships should be, and the idea that children, 447 00:33:58.359 --> 00:34:00.880 you know, can grow up and think I didn't get what I needed 448 00:34:00.920 --> 00:34:02.640 for my parents. You know, they're they're my parents, but that doesn't 449 00:34:02.680 --> 00:34:07.719 mean I have to have He doesn't mean I'm obligated to have a relationship with 450 00:34:07.880 --> 00:34:10.920 them if I don't think it's in my best interests. So I think there 451 00:34:12.000 --> 00:34:16.800 have been some changes over time that had contributed to this. And also I 452 00:34:17.159 --> 00:34:21.920 do think that expectations for a parents, no matter the fact that we don't 453 00:34:21.960 --> 00:34:24.719 give them a lot of support, the expectations for a parents seem to keep 454 00:34:24.800 --> 00:34:29.360 going up and up and up, and especially for there's a lot of pressure 455 00:34:29.400 --> 00:34:32.159 on others. And so something else we found in our study that sometimes mothers 456 00:34:32.199 --> 00:34:36.679 would say, you know, I did the best that I could. You 457 00:34:36.760 --> 00:34:38.239 know, I was, you know, divorced mom. Maybe they were single 458 00:34:38.320 --> 00:34:42.320 for a while and I was trying to read my child, and some mothers 459 00:34:42.400 --> 00:34:45.599 would even acknowledge, you know, I don't think I did the best job 460 00:34:45.679 --> 00:34:46.960 I possibly could, but you know, this is what I was dealing with 461 00:34:47.079 --> 00:34:51.800 at the time. So I think that there are these different sort of perspectives 462 00:34:51.840 --> 00:34:54.360 on what you know a mother should be. We have these idealized versions of 463 00:34:54.480 --> 00:34:58.840 what you know a good mother is. But then you know, we make 464 00:34:58.880 --> 00:35:04.000 it very, very difficult for anyone to meet those you know, we used 465 00:35:04.000 --> 00:35:07.360 to have a village and a tribe and neighbors and cousins and aunties and grandmothers, 466 00:35:07.480 --> 00:35:13.360 and now we put it all on very often single mothers. I myself 467 00:35:13.480 --> 00:35:15.039 was a single mother for eighteen years, and let me tell you, it 468 00:35:15.239 --> 00:35:22.239 is no easy walk. So I will say that as far as the general 469 00:35:22.320 --> 00:35:27.480 population before we go, if you had to guestimate it's not fifty percent of 470 00:35:27.639 --> 00:35:30.719 adult children not talking to their mothers, what would you guess it might be. 471 00:35:31.119 --> 00:35:35.400 I think it's more like six to ten percent of the general population. 472 00:35:35.760 --> 00:35:39.440 I feel it. Yeah, it just depends on you know, what sample 473 00:35:39.519 --> 00:35:44.719 you're using. But the best sample is out there of just the general population 474 00:35:44.760 --> 00:35:47.760 of adults suggests that it's a smaller number. It doesn't mean it's any less 475 00:35:47.800 --> 00:35:52.519 significant for the adult children or the moms who are experiencing it, obviously, 476 00:35:52.000 --> 00:35:55.639 but it's not um you know, it's prevalent. It is fifty percent. 477 00:35:55.760 --> 00:36:00.239 Thankfully, yes, well, thank you so much for being with us. 478 00:36:00.280 --> 00:36:05.599 I want to remind everybody that's listening if you have a difficult, challenging relationship 479 00:36:05.679 --> 00:36:09.599 with a parent, there's always room for healing. And also there are other 480 00:36:09.840 --> 00:36:14.639 surrogate people you can choose in your life, and it may even be a 481 00:36:14.719 --> 00:36:19.079 good clinical therapist who can help you get to a point of learning to love 482 00:36:19.360 --> 00:36:23.880 yourself. Doctor Sarah Shappy Sullivan at the Ohio State University, thank you so 483 00:36:24.039 --> 00:36:28.760 much for being with us. Thank you, and thank you for listening to 484 00:36:28.800 --> 00:36:31.280 the Doctor Wendy Walls show here on KFI AM six forty. Reminder, you 485 00:36:31.320 --> 00:36:36.320 can follow me on my social media anywhere. The handle is at doctor Wendy 486 00:36:36.360 --> 00:36:40.519 Walsh. But I'm always here for you on iHeartRadio and KFI every Sunday from 487 00:36:40.599 --> 00:36:45.639 seven to nine pm. We'll see you next week. You've been listening to 488 00:36:45.719 --> 00:36:49.840 doctor Wendy Walsh. You can always hear us live on kf I AM six 489 00:36:49.960 --> 00:36:54.159 forty from seven to nine pm on Sunday and anytime on demand on the iHeartRadio app.