1 00:00:01,080 --> 00:00:07,200 You're listening to the Mind Over Murder podcast. My name is Bill Thomas. 2 00:00:07,759 --> 00:00:12,039 I'm a writer, consulting, producer, and now podcaster. I am now 3 00:00:12,080 --> 00:00:16,000 trying to use my experience as the brother of a murder victim to help other 4 00:00:16,079 --> 00:00:20,239 victims of violent crime. I'm working on a book on the unsolved Colonial Parkway 5 00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:24,719 murders and I'm the co administrator of the Colonial Parkway Murders Facebook group together with 6 00:00:24,800 --> 00:00:29,039 Kristin Dilley. My name is Kristin Dilley. I'm a writer, a researcher, 7 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:32,799 a teacher, and a victim's advocate, as well as the social media 8 00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:37,840 manager and co administrator for the Colonial Parkway Murders Facebook page with my partner in 9 00:00:37,920 --> 00:00:47,759 crime, Bill Thomas. Welcome to mind Over Murder. I'm Kristin Dilley and 10 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:52,119 I'm Bill Thomas. And it's the long awaited episode that everyone has been asking 11 00:00:52,159 --> 00:00:56,159 for. We are finally digging into the Go Go Beach or the Long Island 12 00:00:56,240 --> 00:01:00,280 serial killing case. It's a discussion even whether we should call it gil Go 13 00:01:00,439 --> 00:01:06,200 Beach or Lisk exactly. I've been calling it Lisk, but I know that 14 00:01:06,239 --> 00:01:10,200 the news media has been calling it gil Go Beach. We're talking about the 15 00:01:10,239 --> 00:01:11,879 same thing. We all know that, and we do want to thank everybody 16 00:01:11,920 --> 00:01:15,200 who reached out and was like, are you guys doing an episode? Are 17 00:01:15,239 --> 00:01:18,840 you? We are, of course, and we wanted to make sure that 18 00:01:18,959 --> 00:01:23,200 we had all of our reporting in order because this is such a very complex 19 00:01:23,239 --> 00:01:27,439 and complicated case. Even though we're not as immediately jump onto it as a 20 00:01:27,439 --> 00:01:30,400 lot of other podcasts were, it's because we wanted to take the time and 21 00:01:30,439 --> 00:01:34,680 make sure that we were doing all of our reporting exactly right. So we 22 00:01:34,719 --> 00:01:38,000 hope that you enjoyed this episode. Thank you for your patience. So what's 23 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:44,760 going on with the Gilgo Beach Killer? Gosh, it's been actually a pretty 24 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:48,159 crazy ripper and ride here, and it feels like he can't turn on the 25 00:01:48,159 --> 00:01:51,760 news anywhere without hearing a little something about it. When we're recording this. 26 00:01:51,879 --> 00:01:56,000 It is July the twenty ninth, and he was arrested on the thirteenth, 27 00:01:56,040 --> 00:02:00,000 I believe, is that right. He's arrested on a Thursday evening in Manhattan, 28 00:02:00,200 --> 00:02:05,319 and then they made the announcement of the arrest the following day, which 29 00:02:05,359 --> 00:02:07,919 would have been Friday, July fourteen, So this is about two weeks ago 30 00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:13,599 now, only that recently. Huh, it feels like we've been this case 31 00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:16,159 has been dominating the news cycle for many days now. It felt a little 32 00:02:16,159 --> 00:02:19,919 bit longer than that. What we wanted to do today is we wanted to 33 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:23,039 get a little bit into the background on the case for anybody who is not 34 00:02:23,199 --> 00:02:25,599 aware of it. And then we wanted to get into the probable cause affidavit, 35 00:02:27,000 --> 00:02:30,080 which I think is very interesting and it's some really good police work on 36 00:02:30,120 --> 00:02:35,840 the part of all of the different investigative bodies who were working here. Bill, 37 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:38,199 I know that this case is a particular interest to you, and it 38 00:02:38,319 --> 00:02:42,960 was long before there was an arrest here. So for anybody who is not 39 00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:47,319 aware, can you give us some background information on the Long Island serial killer 40 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:53,159 lisc aka the go Go Beach Killer. The case stretches back to at least 41 00:02:53,400 --> 00:03:00,639 twenty ten with the retrieval of four bodies alongside the Ocean Parkway near Gilgo Beach. 42 00:03:00,759 --> 00:03:04,639 This is on Long Island. When you look at a map, you 43 00:03:04,680 --> 00:03:07,280 have to study the fact that Long Island, which is very large, is 44 00:03:07,319 --> 00:03:14,000 also a barrier island, and there are stretches of road like this area near 45 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:20,520 Gilgo Beach that are part of the Barrier Island and are pretty stretched out and 46 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:25,680 not necessarily places where people would go. You're mostly driving along this very pretty 47 00:03:25,719 --> 00:03:30,560 stretch of road with the ocean on one side and the bay on the other 48 00:03:30,599 --> 00:03:36,719 side. Lots of very low scrubby brush, so there aren't any homes there 49 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:42,960 described as desolate. I don't necessarily think that's one hundred percent accurate. It's 50 00:03:43,039 --> 00:03:46,000 pretty quiet and maybe even a little spooky in the middle of the night. 51 00:03:46,439 --> 00:03:51,599 During the day and especially on weekends, there's a fair amount of traffic back 52 00:03:51,639 --> 00:03:55,479 and forth long this pretty stretch of road next to the ocean. Most people 53 00:03:55,520 --> 00:04:00,719 are going to and from places like Jones Beach, Oak Beach. There's lots 54 00:04:00,759 --> 00:04:06,039 of popular beaches, big concert venue, country clubs. There's a lot of 55 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:13,240 affluent homes. A little further along this particular stretch is if it's actually state 56 00:04:13,400 --> 00:04:17,519 property or not, but it's undeveloped, and at night in particular, it's 57 00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:21,480 really very quiet. It reminds me a lot of the Outer Banks, which 58 00:04:21,519 --> 00:04:25,759 are also Barrier Islands, and so on the one side you put the Atlantic 59 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:29,079 Ocean and on the other you have the album are all sound and so what 60 00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:32,639 you're describing is very much bringing to mind the same sort of community that you 61 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:36,439 have in the outer banks of North Carolina. So yeah, this is very 62 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:42,920 interesting. The case. It begins in two ten with the retrieval of four 63 00:04:43,199 --> 00:04:48,920 bodies on this stretch of the Ocean Parkway near Gilgo Beach. Over time and 64 00:04:48,959 --> 00:04:55,279 with additional searching by law enforcement, a total of eleven bodies have been found 65 00:04:55,439 --> 00:05:00,040 that include nine women, a man who was dressed in women's clothing at the 66 00:05:00,079 --> 00:05:03,879 time of his death, and a child who was then later linked to one 67 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:08,600 of the women that was killed. So this would have been like a toddler 68 00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:13,079 two to three years old. Although twenty ten is mentioned as the day that 69 00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:17,240 the case began, that's when the first body is discovered, and then bodies 70 00:05:17,279 --> 00:05:23,560 are discovered in fairly short order using cadaver dogs along that stretch of road, 71 00:05:23,959 --> 00:05:28,240 but they think that the murder stretched back, probably into the nineteen nineties. 72 00:05:28,639 --> 00:05:34,959 There's lots of strange and gristly connections to these ultimately eleven victims who were found 73 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:41,720 in that body parts are found scattered all over the area, some places as 74 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:46,120 far as forty miles away, and so at different times and in separate years, 75 00:05:46,560 --> 00:05:50,639 remains are found and then only later linked through DNA testing. Does law 76 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:57,439 enforcement realize that this body part that we found here is related to something that 77 00:05:57,439 --> 00:06:01,399 we've found in some cases years later in a completely separate location. The man 78 00:06:01,519 --> 00:06:06,480 that's been charged, Rex Humorman, seems to be the way we're saying. 79 00:06:06,519 --> 00:06:13,199 It's a fifty nine year old architectural consultant. He's never been on law enforcement's 80 00:06:13,319 --> 00:06:16,839 radar. Although, interestingly, and we'll get into more detail as we discuss, 81 00:06:17,079 --> 00:06:20,879 profilers, including our friend Jim Clementi, who worked on this case, 82 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:27,920 had a pretty accurate description of the kind of person they should be looking for. 83 00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:31,480 And I have to say that Rex Human checks a lot of boxes in 84 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:35,759 terms of the kind of suspect they thought might be involved in the Long Island 85 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:43,120 serial killings slash gil Go Beach killings. It's interesting that when I was looking 86 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:48,160 at some of the coverage on Facebook from a multitude of our friends, there 87 00:06:48,160 --> 00:06:51,639 were a couple of people who said, this guy looks like a serial killer. 88 00:06:53,199 --> 00:06:56,879 They're like, what does this And there were people people who were like 89 00:06:56,959 --> 00:06:58,920 I were like, I don't want a stage up. They're like, but 90 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:02,560 he looks gary, he looks like as a serial killer. People were remarking 91 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:05,959 on his eyes, they feel like they're his eyes looked dead and a little 92 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:11,480 mean. The mug shot is not doing him any favorites either. But there 93 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:14,759 are definitely people who I heard just saying, oh, he looks like a 94 00:07:14,839 --> 00:07:18,399 serial killer. And of course there's no one physical type of serial killer. 95 00:07:18,439 --> 00:07:21,199 Of course there isn't. I can see. He wouldn't want this guy coming 96 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:25,720 up behind you in a dark alleyway, agreed? And what is he six 97 00:07:25,879 --> 00:07:30,480 for? Nearly three hundred pounds? Every Yeah, every picture I've seen of 98 00:07:30,600 --> 00:07:34,920 him next to police police officers, he dwarfs them. Yeah, it looked 99 00:07:34,959 --> 00:07:42,199 like there were photographs that came out actually in video clips of the actual arrest, 100 00:07:42,560 --> 00:07:46,000 not shot by law enforcement, but by security cameras in Manhattan. He 101 00:07:46,120 --> 00:07:50,879 was arrested near his office as he walked down the street on that Thursday evening, 102 00:07:50,879 --> 00:07:55,800 a beautiful summer evening. When I first saw the clip, I watched 103 00:07:55,839 --> 00:08:01,000 it several times. There's no sound, it's from cam from stores in the 104 00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:05,920 area. Human is walking down the street. He's approached by multiple New York 105 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:09,439 City Police officers and Suffolk County PD as well, and they're all wearing dark 106 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:13,920 suits and ties. But they all look to be like a full head shorter. 107 00:08:15,319 --> 00:08:18,040 And it's not like law enforcement goes out to try to find the shortest 108 00:08:18,079 --> 00:08:22,920 cups they can. It's just that this guy is gigantic. Yeah, people 109 00:08:22,959 --> 00:08:26,920 were describing him as ogreish. I'm not trying to be uncharitable here, but 110 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:33,000 I can see where that description might apply, just in terms of size and 111 00:08:33,159 --> 00:08:37,639 bulk alone. Like, he is a scary looking guy. I'm just speaking 112 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:39,919 as a woman. I find him to be kind of scary looking, intimidating 113 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:43,120 looking. So I hope that doesn't sound like I'm being cavalier or cruel, 114 00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:46,960 but he's a scary looking guy. The four victims in this case, and 115 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:52,679 we're talking about now the Gilgo Beach part of this case, are all women 116 00:08:52,720 --> 00:08:56,440 who were sex workers. They're all in their twenties. They're young, they're 117 00:08:56,559 --> 00:09:03,399 petite, multi have fair skin, blue or green eyes, hazel eyes, 118 00:09:03,639 --> 00:09:09,720 and they all seem to be very diminutive and that may be a type that 119 00:09:09,879 --> 00:09:13,679 he's interested in. Some people have said that's also sadly, a person of 120 00:09:13,759 --> 00:09:18,679 that size is more easily disposed of. All of these women were working as 121 00:09:18,919 --> 00:09:26,360 escorts. They were all connected, likely through classified ads like on Craigslist, 122 00:09:26,600 --> 00:09:33,559 and they ultimately were able to track the movements of these four women and their 123 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:39,600 killer through electronic means. Once they were able to narrow down the field. 124 00:09:39,759 --> 00:09:43,960 Now, there's been a lot of problems in this case, and we'll talk 125 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:50,559 about that in an upcoming episode with former NYPD detective Joe jack Alone, who 126 00:09:50,639 --> 00:09:54,000 has studied this case very closely for a number of years and has a lot 127 00:09:54,039 --> 00:09:58,000 of interesting observations for us, and that's in an upcoming episode of Mind Over 128 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:05,399 Murder. Over the last two weeks now, there's been intensive searching at human's 129 00:10:05,519 --> 00:10:11,240 home as well as related locations, including his office in Manhattan, storage units 130 00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:16,799 that he rented in several locations, and homes in even in other states, 131 00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:22,519 moving a small complex in South Carolina that he owned with his brother, a 132 00:10:22,559 --> 00:10:28,200 timeshare condo that he owned in Las Vegas, and other potential locations. Most 133 00:10:28,279 --> 00:10:33,639 of the searching has been concentrated, however, at his home in Massapequa Park, 134 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:39,519 Long Island. Watching the news reporting on this with my family members in 135 00:10:39,559 --> 00:10:43,919 particular, is always very interesting because and I don't know if this happens to 136 00:10:43,960 --> 00:10:48,919 you, Bill, but it happens to me. Whenever something vaguely true crime 137 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:52,799 related or directly true crime related. I we found a serial killer on Long 138 00:10:52,840 --> 00:10:58,240 Island occurs and I'm sitting watching the news with my family. They all look 139 00:10:58,279 --> 00:11:01,399 at me like, do you have some to say on this? This is 140 00:11:01,440 --> 00:11:03,879 interesting? Can you interpret this for us? And so I happen to be 141 00:11:03,919 --> 00:11:09,360 watching the news with my parents when they were talking about what they had found 142 00:11:09,799 --> 00:11:15,360 in rex Huerman's house, and I'm talking about the vault that they found that 143 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:20,399 is soundproof and contained a number of guns. The exact number was two hundred 144 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:24,960 and seventy nine guns. I believe that was very interesting. And one of 145 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:28,320 my family members looked at me and they were like, what does that mean 146 00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:31,440 exactly? And I said, it could mean any number of things. It 147 00:11:31,440 --> 00:11:35,080 could just mean that he likes guns. It could also mean that he was 148 00:11:35,159 --> 00:11:37,759 killing them in his home, and that is something that I know law enforce 149 00:11:37,799 --> 00:11:41,720 someone is looking into. This is a very disturbing case. One thing was 150 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:46,360 evident. In addition to being a gun enthusiasts, shall we say only about 151 00:11:46,600 --> 00:11:54,159 ninety two of those weapons were permitted. Possible that some of the weapons might 152 00:11:54,240 --> 00:12:01,000 include gun parts like silencers and other attachments. But nonetheless, he has an 153 00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:07,639 unusually large number of guns in this walk in vault is the word that law 154 00:12:07,679 --> 00:12:13,240 enforcement is using, so that's extremely unusual. It's also very unusual that this 155 00:12:13,279 --> 00:12:18,679 guy's an architect, is trained, and he has worked as an architect for 156 00:12:18,720 --> 00:12:22,840 thirty plus years, primarily in New York City. Yet the home they live 157 00:12:22,919 --> 00:12:28,440 in Massapequa Park, Long Island, is notable for being incredibly run down and 158 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:33,519 in poor repair. So the house is the crappiest house on the block. 159 00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:39,279 The front porch is held up by two by four's, it needs a paint 160 00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:43,120 job, it looks like it needs renovation. The other homes on the block 161 00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:50,120 are significantly neiter, many of them have been replaced by newer homes. This 162 00:12:50,399 --> 00:12:56,080 property, where he and his wife and two children both grown live is notable 163 00:12:56,320 --> 00:13:01,879 for how run down and sadly looking at is, and this guy's an architect. 164 00:13:01,879 --> 00:13:05,440 It's very strange that. Actually, that was a great comment that was 165 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:09,799 made on our mind over Murder page by Sue Moose, And I want to 166 00:13:09,799 --> 00:13:13,480 make sure that I actually read this comment out loud, because she says something 167 00:13:13,559 --> 00:13:16,639 very similar to what you just said. So Sue says, I'm wondering something 168 00:13:16,759 --> 00:13:20,360 I have heard that he's an architect, but his house was in a shambles 169 00:13:20,360 --> 00:13:26,159 and being held up in some places with boards. Some commentators wonder why when 170 00:13:26,159 --> 00:13:30,440 he was an architect, maybe he didn't want anyone in the house working and 171 00:13:30,639 --> 00:13:35,759 updating it due to being afraid someone would find something. It just makes me 172 00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:39,960 wonder, and I thought that was an excellent point from Sue. It also 173 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:46,519 appears that human is in some financial trouble. He has unpaid taxes in the 174 00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:52,679 hundreds of thousands of dollars. He's clearly spent money in very strange ways, 175 00:13:52,679 --> 00:13:58,679 buying a timeshare condo in Las Vegas near an area that's frequented by sex workers, 176 00:13:58,679 --> 00:14:05,399 buying property in South Carolina where his brother currently lives, and spending money 177 00:14:05,720 --> 00:14:11,679 in odd ways. Two hundred and seventy nine weapons isn't something that you can 178 00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:16,480 just acquire for a dollar ninety five apiece. Yeah, so he's spending money 179 00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:20,399 in very strange ways, but he's sure not putting any money back into this 180 00:14:20,600 --> 00:14:28,000 rundown house, which was spooky and even avoided by children and neighbors who didn't 181 00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:33,120 have very much interaction with him, but had a tendency to avoid him because 182 00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:37,720 he was such a strange, off putting kind of character. What we'd like 183 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:43,679 to do for you all is go into one of the documents that The New 184 00:14:43,759 --> 00:14:46,519 York Times posted, and we made sure that we put the link to this 185 00:14:46,639 --> 00:14:52,679 on our Facebook page right after the arrest occurred. Because we did this with 186 00:14:52,759 --> 00:14:56,759 the rust affidavit, we wanted to do the same thing with this document, 187 00:14:56,879 --> 00:15:00,039 and we wanted to go over it in detail for you. Basically, we 188 00:15:00,399 --> 00:15:03,879 do it so that you don't have to. So the document that we're referencing 189 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:09,840 today is it's basically an argument against bail from mister Huerman. It is a 190 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:15,559 thirty two page document from the New York Times if you want to look for 191 00:15:15,639 --> 00:15:20,879 it by title. The title of the document is the case against Rex Humerman, 192 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:24,679 and then it says read the document and let me go ahead and preface. 193 00:15:24,759 --> 00:15:26,480 This is what the New York Times says about the document, and then 194 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:30,559 we'll launch into it. From the New York Times, Suffolk County, New 195 00:15:30,639 --> 00:15:35,000 York prosecutors argued against bail from mister Hureman, and a thirty two page document 196 00:15:35,159 --> 00:15:41,600 that explicitly details the investigation into the Go Go Beach killings. The New York 197 00:15:41,639 --> 00:15:46,799 Times has redacted phone numbers, email addresses, personal addresses, and the names 198 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:52,919 of private social media accounts. It has also redacted offensive material that was included 199 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:58,720 in mister Huorman's Internet searches. Let me add something here too, Kristen, 200 00:15:58,799 --> 00:16:03,799 which is some people will gotten confused in reading this document and remember a similar 201 00:16:03,840 --> 00:16:11,679 document in the Brian Coburger case in the Idaho four Murders. Understand that law 202 00:16:11,799 --> 00:16:18,240 enforcement investigators are only going to put up what they need to make the point 203 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:23,840 that this person deserves to be incarcerated in this case without bail. This isn't 204 00:16:23,919 --> 00:16:30,120 their entire case. And this is where four months now since the Coburger arrests 205 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:33,639 in the Idaho four Murders, people have been saying they don't mention this, 206 00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:38,200 and they don't mention that the prosecutors are not going to lay out their entire 207 00:16:38,519 --> 00:16:45,120 case for the defense to begin picking apart at this early stage. So in 208 00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:49,480 arresting mister Humorman, they're going to provide a healthy piece of the case that 209 00:16:49,519 --> 00:16:55,399 they're building against him. But remember at this point they haven't gone in and 210 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:59,679 searched his home. There are so much more work that needs to be done, 211 00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:03,600 which will be part of a presentation in a court of law, and 212 00:17:03,639 --> 00:17:10,240 of course everyone has a right to be defended aggressively and professionally by defense counsel, 213 00:17:10,839 --> 00:17:15,519 and so there'll be plenty of opportunity through discovery for defense attorneys to attack 214 00:17:15,559 --> 00:17:19,920 if they can, aspects of the presentation of the prosecution. When you read 215 00:17:19,960 --> 00:17:26,279 a document like this, it isn't necessarily the entire case. It's just a 216 00:17:26,319 --> 00:17:30,599 piece of the case enough to make their point that we believe that mister Humorman 217 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:36,319 should not be out with the public. That's an excellent point. Let's go 218 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:40,680 ahead and dig into this, into this bail application here. So I'm going 219 00:17:40,720 --> 00:17:44,160 to go ahead and go through and we'll just take this piece by piece. 220 00:17:44,319 --> 00:17:47,240 I'll stop every once in a while, Bill will do some color commentary. 221 00:17:47,279 --> 00:17:49,920 I'll do some color commentary, and we'll continue from there. So we're going 222 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:52,839 to go ahead and get started. So this reads County Court of Suffolk, 223 00:17:52,839 --> 00:17:56,799 County, State of New York, the people of the State of New York 224 00:17:56,839 --> 00:18:00,880 against Rex A. Cureman. Defendant. Rex Huerman stands before this court, 225 00:18:02,039 --> 00:18:07,640 charged by the grand jury width bullet points murder in the first degree in violation 226 00:18:07,759 --> 00:18:11,279 of New York State Penal Law Section one two five point two seven A Class 227 00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:18,519 A one violent felony for the death of Melissa Barthelomy on or about July ten, 228 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:22,400 two thousand nine. Murder in the first degree a Class A one violent 229 00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:29,039 felony for the death of Megan Waterman on or about June six, twenty ten. 230 00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:33,160 Murder in the first degree a Class A one violent felony for the death 231 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:40,039 of Amber Costello on or about September second, twenty ten. Murder in the 232 00:18:40,119 --> 00:18:45,119 second degree a Class A one violent felony for the death of Melissa Barthelomy Honor 233 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:51,000 about July ten, two thousand nine, Murder in the second degree for the 234 00:18:51,039 --> 00:18:55,559 death of Megan Waterman Honor about June six, twenty ten. And murder in 235 00:18:55,559 --> 00:19:00,400 the second degree in violation of New York State Penal Law Section one two point 236 00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:03,880 two five, Class A one violent felony for the death of Amber Costello Honor 237 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:08,799 about September two, twenty ten. They are only listening three victims here. 238 00:19:10,119 --> 00:19:15,759 They believe they've connected mister human with four victims. However, the electronic links 239 00:19:15,799 --> 00:19:22,400 that I mentioned before the use of the cell phones were stronger in these first 240 00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:27,599 three murders. Mentioned in the fourth murder, the cell phone records were not 241 00:19:27,759 --> 00:19:33,160 retained for as long, so that presented a problem. So they've decided to 242 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:40,079 focus on three of the victims. They ultimately may build a case for the 243 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:45,319 fourth victim, but at this point they're only bringing up the first three of 244 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:48,640 the four Golgo Beach victims. I also want to mention too, that, 245 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:52,799 as we've all noticed at this point, when we're looking at things like bail 246 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:57,319 applications and probably will cause affidavits, there is a lot of repetitious language, 247 00:19:57,400 --> 00:20:03,160 and so there will be times when I'm leaving out portions of things, like, 248 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:07,200 for example, section one two five point two five, just because I 249 00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:12,079 don't want to get repetitious. So I'm not purposefully leaving things out that I 250 00:20:12,119 --> 00:20:17,200 think are worthy of note. I'm just trying to spare us all from repetition, 251 00:20:17,319 --> 00:20:21,599 So please just note that, Okay, next page, as described below, 252 00:20:21,799 --> 00:20:26,279 based on the serious, heinous nature of these serial murders, the planning 253 00:20:26,319 --> 00:20:30,559 and forethought that went into these crimes, the strength of the people's case, 254 00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:36,920 the length of incarceration the defendant faces upon conviction, the extended period of time 255 00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:41,599 that this defendant was able to avoid apprehension, his recent searches for sadistic materials, 256 00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:48,279 child pornography, images of the victims and their relatives, counter surveillance conducted 257 00:20:48,319 --> 00:20:53,160 online as to the criminal investigation, his use of fictitious names, burner email 258 00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:57,720 and cell phone accounts, and his access to and history of possessing firearms. 259 00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:03,759 The only means to ensure defendant rex A. Hureman's return to court is to 260 00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:08,880 remand him without bail. That was a super long runn sentence, but you 261 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,480 get the gist of it. So no bail for all of those reasons. 262 00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,440 So that is the request on the bail application. We don't want him to 263 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:19,839 have bail because of all these things. Next they go ahead and start laying 264 00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:23,839 out the case. And so we have a sub section here called Discovery of 265 00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:30,119 the Victims, and it lays out the entire circumstances of the case. Bill, 266 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:33,279 anything you wanted to add about the first bit there about no bail, 267 00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:36,400 No, I think you've covered it. One thing I do want to add 268 00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:42,319 is I apologies for not mentioning the fourth victim's name. Maureen Brainard. Barnes 269 00:21:44,079 --> 00:21:49,279 is the fourth victim. They're still working on building stronger connections between Hureman and 270 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:56,759 Maureen Brainard Barnes, but she is suspected of being part of the same series, 271 00:21:56,799 --> 00:22:00,720 and of course, all of the bodies of these four victims are placed 272 00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:07,720 in an essentially the same spot at almost equidistant locations along the parkway. My 273 00:22:07,799 --> 00:22:12,400 apologies for not mentioning her name. You're listening to Mind Over Murder. We'll 274 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:32,640 be right back after this word from our sponsors. We're back here at Mind 275 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:37,880 Over Murder. Discovery of the victims. On December eleventh, twenty ten, 276 00:22:38,039 --> 00:22:45,279 police officer John Malia was conducting a training exercise with his canine partner Blue along 277 00:22:45,319 --> 00:22:48,039 Ocean Parkway in Go Go Beach, Suffolk County, New York. During the 278 00:22:48,039 --> 00:22:52,960 course of the training exercise, Blue located a set of human remains. The 279 00:22:52,039 --> 00:22:56,319 remains were later identified to be those of Melissa Barthelamy. Two days later, 280 00:22:56,400 --> 00:23:02,079 on December thirteen, twenty ten, the SCP continue to search in proximity to 281 00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:06,079 where the remains of Melissa Barthelemy were recovered. On that date, members of 282 00:23:06,079 --> 00:23:11,119 the SCPD found three additional sets of human remains within one quarter mile of the 283 00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:15,160 first discovery, and they reference an image below. These three additional sets of 284 00:23:15,240 --> 00:23:21,279 remains were identified as those of Marine, Brandard Barnes, Megan Waterman, and 285 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:25,440 Amber Costello. The cause of death of all four women was determined to be 286 00:23:25,559 --> 00:23:30,799 homicidal violence. And so on page three you've got a nice full color map 287 00:23:30,839 --> 00:23:33,799 here that shows the locations of all of the different remains of the victims. 288 00:23:34,160 --> 00:23:38,359 And again we have already given a link to this document on our mind Over 289 00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:41,599 Murder page, but we will put the link in our show notes. In 290 00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:49,799 addition, I can't emphasize enough how great these documents are. They're incredibly detailed 291 00:23:51,039 --> 00:23:56,839 with pictures and diagrams. They're easy to follow. I encourage you to take 292 00:23:56,839 --> 00:24:00,400 a few minutes, click on the link and check this out. A lot 293 00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:04,519 of work went into this presentation, and this is the kind of material that 294 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:10,519 ultimately will be presented in court if the case goes to court. They've done 295 00:24:10,559 --> 00:24:15,400 a fantastic job of explaining how this case unfolded. I do want to mention 296 00:24:15,599 --> 00:24:21,680 also that next to the name Maureene Brainard Barnes, there is a footnote down 297 00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:25,519 at the bottom, footnote one, and it does acknowledge exactly the same thing 298 00:24:25,559 --> 00:24:27,640 that you were talking about a couple of minutes ago, Bill, that they 299 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,400 don't have enough of the case, but they're working on it, so let 300 00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:34,599 me read the footnote for this footnote one. Although the defendant is not yet 301 00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:40,079 charged with any crimes as to the disappearance and murder of Miss Brainard Barnes, 302 00:24:40,160 --> 00:24:44,440 as set forth below, Definite rex A. Huerman is the prime suspect in 303 00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:48,240 her death and the investigation which is continuing and is expected to be resolved soon. 304 00:24:48,839 --> 00:24:53,759 Moreover, there is substantial evidence of Definite Hureman's involvement in the disappearance and 305 00:24:53,799 --> 00:24:59,640 death of Miss Brainard Barnes, which evidence closely fits the modus operandi of the 306 00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:03,880 defense in relation to the deaths of the other three women, and which supports 307 00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:08,160 the current charges. As such, this bail application contains descriptions of that evidence, 308 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:15,119 which demonstrates the strength of the people's case as currently charged. Continuing underneath 309 00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:19,200 the map, the investigation into these deaths were linked as, in addition to 310 00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:23,759 the other factors, the victims each appeared to have been placed in close proximity 311 00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:29,440 to one another twenty two to thirty three feet from the edge of the parkway. 312 00:25:30,079 --> 00:25:34,279 All were petite females approximately twenty two to twenty seven years old, believed 313 00:25:34,319 --> 00:25:40,920 to be working as sex workers, all had missing clothing and personal possessions, 314 00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:45,160 all had been killed by homicide, all had contact shortly before their disappearances, 315 00:25:45,559 --> 00:25:51,440 were a person using a burner cell phone i e. Cell Phones without an 316 00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:56,359 associated verified identity, and the cell phones of two of the four victims, 317 00:25:56,640 --> 00:26:00,440 Brainard, Barnes, and Barthelemy were used by the killer after their deaths. 318 00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:06,240 In addition, each of the four victims were found similarly positioned bound in a 319 00:26:06,319 --> 00:26:11,359 similar fashion by either beltzer tape, with three of the victims found wrapped in 320 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:17,480 a burlap type material. And this burlap type material could be incredibly important as 321 00:26:17,519 --> 00:26:22,279 the case moves forward. It appears to be camouflage burlap that is used by 322 00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:27,359 hunters to build duck blinds and things like that to hide behind when you're out 323 00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:33,480 duck hunting and hunting other animals. Apparently, mister human is an avid hunter. 324 00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:41,240 The next section of the bail application state's recent investigation. In January twenty 325 00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:48,279 twenty two, the Seffik County District Attorney's Office assigned an experienced team of investigators, 326 00:26:48,359 --> 00:26:52,160 analysts, and prosecutors to work jointly with law enforcement partners from the Suffolk 327 00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:57,200 County Police Department. New York State Police, Suffoc County Sheriff's Office, and 328 00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:03,599 Federal Bureau of Investigation. A comprehensive review of every item of evidence and information 329 00:27:03,759 --> 00:27:10,599 in this investigation was undertaken by the team on March fourteenth, twenty twenty two, 330 00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:15,359 approximately two months into the renewed joint investigation. This comprehensive review led to 331 00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:22,440 the discovery of a first generation Chevrolet Avalanche that was registered to defendant rex A. 332 00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:26,799 Hureman at the time of these murders. As described below. This was 333 00:27:26,839 --> 00:27:33,200 significant because a witness to the disappearance of Amber Costello identified a first generation Chevrolet 334 00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:37,680 Avalanche as the vehicle believed to have been driven by her killer. Bill For 335 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:41,519 anybody who doesn't know, can you describe a Chevy Avalanche? Sure? This 336 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:47,279 actually becomes key to the advancement of this investigation. First of all, they've 337 00:27:47,319 --> 00:27:51,839 been looking into the murder of these young women since twenty ten, so that's 338 00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:56,039 twelve years ago, and they've estimated that the killings had taken place even further 339 00:27:56,119 --> 00:28:00,480 back, at least to two thousand and nine, perhaps earlier, so we're 340 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:07,799 talking about thirteen years at this point. It's worth noting that after the Suffolk 341 00:28:07,799 --> 00:28:12,480 County District Attorney's office put together this team of people from Suffolk County, New 342 00:28:12,519 --> 00:28:18,559 York State Police, Suffolk County Sheriff's Office, and importantly the Federal Bureau of 343 00:28:18,559 --> 00:28:25,400 Investigation, who have been blocked from earlier investigations into this case for reasons that 344 00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:32,920 we'll get into in a later episode. It's only two months after this investigation 345 00:28:33,039 --> 00:28:40,039 rolls out. It's actually a matter of weeks the Chevy Avalanche information is discovered. 346 00:28:40,559 --> 00:28:45,160 It's very sad to state that law enforcement had this information for as long 347 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:52,920 as twelve or more years. And a Chevy Avalanche is actually a very distinctive 348 00:28:52,039 --> 00:29:00,000 looking truck fay mix between an suv and a pickup truck and the first generation 349 00:29:00,039 --> 00:29:04,519 and Chevy Avalanche as a very distinctive profile. It has what almost looks like 350 00:29:04,519 --> 00:29:11,079 a roll bar built in behind the cab of the truck that shapes into a 351 00:29:11,119 --> 00:29:15,799 little triangle. The silhouette. If you're a car person, which I am, 352 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:23,400 is incredibly distinctive. This Chevy Avalanche was reported as being driven by a 353 00:29:23,599 --> 00:29:30,720 client of one of the workers, Amber Costello, at her home. It's 354 00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:36,240 very unfortunate that this wasn't followed up on. Apparently this evidence was misfiled. 355 00:29:36,319 --> 00:29:41,680 This tip from a man who was a roommate of Amber Costello. He had 356 00:29:41,759 --> 00:29:48,279 described an incident that had happened at Miss Costello's home where this man and another 357 00:29:48,319 --> 00:29:55,119 man had engaged in a scam where they pretended to be Amber Costello's boyfriend burst 358 00:29:55,200 --> 00:30:00,720 into the room and basically scared mister Human away, and they had apparently run 359 00:30:00,759 --> 00:30:06,279 this scam a number of times. Huerman is a married man, he's also 360 00:30:06,319 --> 00:30:11,279 a john is sitting there with a sex worker. Money has already changed hands, 361 00:30:11,519 --> 00:30:15,400 and then these guys burst into the room and pretend to be to the 362 00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:22,279 jealous boyfriend and Human makes his exit. The description of the client, who 363 00:30:22,279 --> 00:30:27,160 turns out to be Rex Huerman and his vehicle are all there in the police 364 00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:32,920 files. And of course this guy is physically very distinctive, six four three 365 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:37,319 hundred pounds. They are among the first people to use the word ogre. 366 00:30:37,079 --> 00:30:42,640 He's a big, blockheaded guy with a sort of unfashionable dark haircut and these 367 00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:48,200 seventies style glasses, and they described him as ogre like. It may not 368 00:30:48,279 --> 00:30:53,599 be fair, but it's probably pretty accurate. The distinctive silhouette of the truck, 369 00:30:53,799 --> 00:31:00,319 as well as his very distinctive physical appearance actually have been a very powerful 370 00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:03,759 lead that should have been followed up by law enforcement twelve years ago. O 371 00:31:03,839 --> 00:31:10,640 Heay. Continuing this discovery led to a comprehensive investigation of Definite Hureman, which 372 00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:15,519 consisted of over three hundred subpoenas, search warrants, and other legal processes to 373 00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:21,960 obtain evidence. As discussed more fully below, Among the items uncovered were cell 374 00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:27,079 phone billing records for Definite Hureman's corresponding to cell site locations for one the burner 375 00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:30,880 cell phones used to arrange meetings with three of the four victims, two the 376 00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:36,640 taunting calls made to a relative of Miss Barthelomy, three a call made by 377 00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:41,400 a detective to Miss Barthelomy's cell phone while looking into her disappearance, and four 378 00:31:41,599 --> 00:31:47,359 calls checking voicemail on Miss brainerd Barne's cell phone after her disappearance. In addition, 379 00:31:47,559 --> 00:31:51,759 Hureman lived in Massapequa Park, where the victims were believed to have disappeared 380 00:31:51,799 --> 00:31:55,759 from, and he worked in midtown Manhattan, in the vicinity where the taunting 381 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:59,880 calls were made to the sister of Miss Barthelmy. As set forth more full 382 00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:04,440 below, Definit rex a Hureman is believed to be the person who used the 383 00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:08,079 Burner cell phones to communicate with each of the four victims prior to their disappearance, 384 00:32:08,599 --> 00:32:13,640 and who used Miss brainerd Barne's cell phone and Miss Barthelomy's cell phone after 385 00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:19,039 their deaths. Both definit Hureman and these Burner cell phones had significant connections to 386 00:32:19,079 --> 00:32:23,759 both mitten Manhattan and Messapequa Park, New York. It's worth noting here that 387 00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:30,680 the FBI was brought in this time around and allowed to participate, and I 388 00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:35,519 think all of the law enforcement agencies played a key role, but the cell 389 00:32:35,559 --> 00:32:43,519 phone technology cracking performed by the FBI and other agencies is incredibly impressive. Yeah, 390 00:32:43,599 --> 00:32:45,480 this is one of the strengths of the FBI. They have a team 391 00:32:45,559 --> 00:32:53,759 called the Cellular Analysis Survey Team referred to as CAST CIST their mission and this 392 00:32:53,799 --> 00:33:02,400 is very interesting. They performed this so admirable. It's worth highlighting CAST mission 393 00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:07,480 quote is to support the FBI, along with state, local, and tribal 394 00:33:07,519 --> 00:33:15,680 investigations through the analysis of cellular call detail records CDRs and their associated tower information. 395 00:33:16,319 --> 00:33:22,480 The analysis done by the CAST team, together with their other law enforcement 396 00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:27,720 partners, is what helped build the case around Rex Hureman. And as you 397 00:33:27,759 --> 00:33:30,799 get into more detail, not only were they able to figure out where the 398 00:33:31,039 --> 00:33:37,240 cell phones of the four victims were located. Two of those cell phones were 399 00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:44,799 used after the murders by Huerman to make these horrific calls to the survivors of 400 00:33:44,839 --> 00:33:50,000 these two victims. They also were able to figure out where his burner phones 401 00:33:50,039 --> 00:33:53,839 were located and his regular cell phone was located, and so they were able 402 00:33:53,880 --> 00:34:00,480 to triangulate through the use of these cell phone towers where all these cell phones 403 00:34:00,559 --> 00:34:04,599 were moving around. It's fascinating. This is the kind of work that the 404 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:08,280 FBI excels at. We also saw a good work from the cast team and 405 00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:14,840 the Brian Coburger Probabill cause affidavit as well, So they really do an excellent 406 00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:20,039 job with this. Okay, now, the bail application continues by breaking down 407 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:23,840 each of the cases, and that includes Marine Brainard Barnes. So I'm going 408 00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:29,280 to go through each section it will detail what happened to those women. So 409 00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:34,800 we start with first the disappearance and murder of Marine Brainard Barnes. Marine Brainard 410 00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:37,679 Barnes was less seen on July ninth, two thousand and seven, in New 411 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:40,960 York City. At that time, she was believed to be working as a 412 00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:45,719 sex worker. On July sixth, two thousand seven, Miss Brainard Barnes's cell 413 00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:51,679 phone was contacted by a burner cell phone. Between July sixth and July ninth, 414 00:34:52,039 --> 00:34:57,119 there were sixteen interactions between this Burner phone and Brainard Barnes cell phone. 415 00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:01,079 On July nine, the last cell site location for the BRAINERD Barnes cell phone 416 00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:07,559 was at approximately eleven fifty six PM in Midtown Manhattan, near the fifty ninth 417 00:35:07,599 --> 00:35:12,559 Street Bridge. Thereafter, the brainer Barnes's cell phone had no further activity until 418 00:35:12,679 --> 00:35:16,639 July twelve. On July twelve, three days after her disappearance, two outbound 419 00:35:16,679 --> 00:35:22,480 calls were made from Brainard Barne's cell phone checking her voicemail from a cell site 420 00:35:22,519 --> 00:35:27,719 location near the Long Island Expressway in Islandia. Day next, we go to 421 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:32,239 the disappearance and murder of Melissa Barthelamy. Melissa Barthelamy was less seen on July 422 00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:36,599 ten, two thousand nine, in New York City. At that time, 423 00:35:36,679 --> 00:35:39,119 she was believed to be working as a sex worker. On July three, 424 00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:45,119 Miss Barthellamy was contacted by a Burner's cell phone. Thereafter, the Barthelomy cell 425 00:35:45,119 --> 00:35:49,920 phone was contacted by this Burner cell phone on July sixth, July nine, 426 00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:52,639 and July ten, which was the last day she was seen alive. On 427 00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:59,119 July ten, cell site records indicate the Burner cell phone traveled from Massapequa Park 428 00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:04,480 to Midtown Manhattan. Later that evening, the Barthelamy cell phone traveled from Midtown 429 00:36:04,519 --> 00:36:08,760 Manhattan to Massapequa, with the last cell site location being in Massapequa on July 430 00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:15,840 eleventh at approximately one forty three am. On July eleven, Miss Barthelamy's cell 431 00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:20,360 phone was used to make an outbound call checking her voicemail from miss cell site 432 00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:25,039 location in Freeport. On July eleven and July twelve. The Barthelamy phone made 433 00:36:25,079 --> 00:36:31,159 two more outbound calls checking her voicemail from cell site locations in Babylon. On 434 00:36:31,239 --> 00:36:37,360 July seventeen, July twenty third, August five, August nineteen, and August 435 00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:45,679 twenty six. The Barthelamy phone made taunting phone calls to Miss Barthelmy's family members, 436 00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:49,599 some of which resulted in a conversation between the caller, who was a 437 00:36:49,639 --> 00:36:53,000 male, and a relative of Melissa Barthelamy, in which the mail caller admitted 438 00:36:53,119 --> 00:36:59,960 killing and sexually assaulting Miss Barthelamy, as described below. The cell site location 439 00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:06,360 of the Barthelemy phone during these taunting calls were all in Midtown Manhattan. Next, 440 00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:09,599 we come to the disappearance and murder of Megan Waterman. Megan Waterman was 441 00:37:09,679 --> 00:37:13,559 last seen alive at the Holiday Inn in hop Hoog, New York, on 442 00:37:13,639 --> 00:37:17,039 June six, twenty ten, at approximately one thirty am. At that time, 443 00:37:17,119 --> 00:37:21,599 she was believed to be working as a sex worker. On June five, 444 00:37:21,880 --> 00:37:25,000 Miss Waterman's cell phone was contacted by another Burner cell phone, which had 445 00:37:25,039 --> 00:37:30,880 just been activated that day. Thereafter, the Waterman phone communicated with this Burner 446 00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:35,519 cell phone on June six at approximately one thirty one am, which is around 447 00:37:35,519 --> 00:37:40,000 the time Megan Waterman was captured on video surveillance exiting the Holiday Inn in Hopog 448 00:37:40,079 --> 00:37:45,719 for the last time. Following that communication, the Burner cell phone had no 449 00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:51,320 further phone activity. However, cell site records show that the Waterman phone traveled 450 00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:55,840 to Massapequa Park, with the last cellsite location being in Massapequa Park at approximately 451 00:37:55,960 --> 00:38:01,400 three eleven am, in the vicinity of the residence of defendant Huerman and finally, 452 00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:07,039 the last disappearance and this is definitely the longest the disappearance in murder of 453 00:38:07,079 --> 00:38:12,000 Amber Costello. Amber Costello was last seen alive on September two, twenty ten, 454 00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:16,679 leaving her residence at one one one two America Avenue in West Babylon during 455 00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:21,199 the late evening hours. At that time, she was believed to be working 456 00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:24,400 as a sex worker. On September one, twenty ten, the day prior 457 00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:30,360 to the disappearance of Amber Costello, Miss Costello's cell phone was contacted by a 458 00:38:30,400 --> 00:38:35,519 Burner cell phone on September one, This Burner's cell phone had communications with the 459 00:38:35,519 --> 00:38:40,760 Costello phone at approximately eleven thirty three pm and eleven thirty four PM. During 460 00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:45,719 those communications, the Burner cell phone connected to cell site towers in West Amityville 461 00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:51,639 and Massapequa Park. Thereafter, the Burner cell phone traveled to West Babylon in 462 00:38:51,639 --> 00:38:55,000 proximity to the residence of Amber Costello, and had contact with the Castello phone 463 00:38:55,039 --> 00:39:00,199 at approximately twelve or five am on September two. Awe of witness statements. 464 00:39:00,519 --> 00:39:06,760 According to witnesses, around the time of these communications between the Burner's cell phone 465 00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:10,000 and the Castello phone. On September one to two, twenty ten, a 466 00:39:10,079 --> 00:39:16,199 prostitution client showed up at miss Castello's residence located in West Babylon, New York. 467 00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:21,599 After the client entered the home, a ruse was executed on the client, 468 00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:25,920 whereby a person pretended to be the outraged boyfriend of amber Costello, and 469 00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:30,760 the client left from the residence, which amber Castello retained the money the client 470 00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:35,360 had brought to pay for her services. So this is what you were referring 471 00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:39,119 to earlier bill. Based upon interviews, the client was described as a large 472 00:39:39,159 --> 00:39:45,880 white male approximately six four to six six in height in his mid forties, 473 00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:52,400 with dark bushy hair and big oval style nineteen seventies type eyeglasses. A witness 474 00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:58,079 described him to police as appearing like an ogre. There is a footnote here 475 00:39:58,159 --> 00:40:02,480 that I want to mention the footnote this mirrors the physical attributes of defendant Rex 476 00:40:02,519 --> 00:40:07,719 A. Hureman, who is a large white male approximately six four in height 477 00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:10,719 in excess of two hundred forty pounds in weight, with dark bushy hair, 478 00:40:12,039 --> 00:40:15,559 who wears large eyeglasses, and who was forty six years old when amber Castello 479 00:40:15,679 --> 00:40:21,639 went missing. Gay back to the document furthermore, a witness noticed a first 480 00:40:21,679 --> 00:40:27,880 generation Chevy Avalanche parked in the driveway of the residents. According to the witness, 481 00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:32,000 following the ruse, this client said he was just her friend, tell 482 00:40:32,079 --> 00:40:37,280 her I'll give her a call, and walked out the front door. Thereafter, 483 00:40:37,519 --> 00:40:42,400 at approximately one eighteen am on September two, after the ruse had been 484 00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:46,679 perpetrated, the Burner cell phone sent a text message to the Castello phone which 485 00:40:46,679 --> 00:40:52,280 stated that was not nice, so do I credit for the next time. 486 00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:59,559 Phone records showed that the Burner phone was located in Massapequa Park within two minutes 487 00:40:59,599 --> 00:41:04,800 of this text message being sent, according to a witness. Later the next 488 00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:08,400 day, on September two, twenty ten, miss Castello was again contacted by 489 00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:13,960 the same client that was in the house the night before the avalanche. Further, 490 00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:16,599 amber told us that he wanted to see her again, but he didn't 491 00:41:16,599 --> 00:41:21,679 want to come back to the house because of her boyfriend. Thereafter, on 492 00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:25,639 September two, at approximately nine thirty two pm, the same Burner cell phone 493 00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:31,960 from the previous evening again communicated with the Castello phone. During this communication, 494 00:41:32,119 --> 00:41:37,920 the Burner cell phone and a cellsite location in Midtown Manhattan. Following this communication, 495 00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:43,880 and based upon the cellsite records, the Burner cell phone traveled to Massapequa 496 00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:49,320 Park and had contacts with the Castello phone at approximately ten thirty nine PM and 497 00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:53,400 eleven o five PM. Cellsite records for the Burner phone indicate that at approximately 498 00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:59,039 eleven seventeen PM, the phone traveled to West Babylon, in proximity to the 499 00:41:59,079 --> 00:42:04,320 residents of Amber Costello. Subsequently, Amber Costello left her own cell phone behind, 500 00:42:04,639 --> 00:42:07,840 walked out the front door of the residence, and was seen alive for 501 00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:12,199 the last time. Shortly after miss Castello left the house, a witness observed 502 00:42:12,280 --> 00:42:16,039 a dark colored truck past the house, specifically coming from the direction Amber had 503 00:42:16,039 --> 00:42:22,320 walked towards. There's so much to unpack here in this final description of what 504 00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:29,920 happened with Amber Costello. This is the place where the scam is run on 505 00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:36,519 human and he demands a credit, and he appears to have talked Amber Costello 506 00:42:36,599 --> 00:42:40,960 into meeting him the next evening for a credit if you will. The fact 507 00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:47,079 that this tip with a good physical description of Hureman as well as a good 508 00:42:47,079 --> 00:42:54,199 description of an extremely distinctive vehicle and not a big seller. I would add 509 00:42:54,480 --> 00:43:00,679 Chevy Avalanches weren't selling like hotcakes. It's a shame this was missed by the 510 00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:07,400 first investigative team back around twenty ten. It was all here waiting to be 511 00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:15,119 discovered with an incredible amount of detail. It's tragic that this investigative team botched 512 00:43:15,159 --> 00:43:22,159 this investigation so badly that it wasn't until the new team came in about sixteen 513 00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:27,760 months ago and began this investigation. A knew that this case moved forward in 514 00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:31,760 the way that it has very interesting information here and a lot to unpack. 515 00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:37,559 So we still have a number of different pages of the bail application to go 516 00:43:37,679 --> 00:43:42,679 over with you all, so we will continue that in our next episode. 517 00:43:43,360 --> 00:43:46,639 Thank you so much for listening to this episode of mind Over Murder. We'll 518 00:43:46,639 --> 00:44:00,239 see you next time. Mind Over Murder is a production and of Absolute Zero 519 00:44:00,639 --> 00:44:07,159 and Another Dog Productions. Our executive producers are Bill Thomas and Kristin Dilley. 520 00:44:07,480 --> 00:44:12,639 Our logo art is by Pamela Arnois. Our theme music is by Kevin McLeod. 521 00:44:13,159 --> 00:44:17,159 Mind Over Murder is distributed in partnership with Coral Space Media. You can 522 00:44:17,199 --> 00:44:22,360 follow us on Facebook, Twitter, or Instagram. You can also follow our 523 00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:25,800 page on the Colonial Parkway Murders on Facebook, and finally, you can follow 524 00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:30,639 Bill Thomas on Twitter at Bill Thomas. Five six. Thank you for listening 525 00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:32,599 to Mind Over Murder.