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Chrysler Dodge jeep Ram. It's bilified the Bill Moran Podcast. Well, hello
and welcome. Thanks for getting your pawn on, Thanks for telling a friend.
That's how we spread the word today. A special one, Patrick Bernuncio,
Pat Bernuncio, he's the president of Watermark Specialty Foods, but you probably
know him better for this. What's the best thing about Leo's Everything? The
president of Leo's Bakery and Delhi. So I guess Patrick, My question for
you to begin with would be how does it all begin for you? Well,
forback, you want to go, well far back, like what did
your parents do? So, my father owned a bakery. Okay, my
grandfather owned a bakery, and here in Rochester. Here in Rochester, okay.
My grandfather's bakery was called ran Dc Bakery was on SiO Street downtown.
Yea, my father's bakery was called rand Cora Bakery was on Central Park then
in Webster. So did your grandfather owned the bakery? He was in?
He did, he did, and he but your dad went and started his
dueling bakery. Not exactly, it was my dad. It wasn't his dad
though, was my mom's Okay, I got you. Okay. My dad
was in the business then with with his father in law and then my two
uncles who were by Grandpa's brothers, and my father decided to open a bigger
bakery because Grandpa's bakery was small, right, so they opened the bigger ones.
So then Grandpa came along with him he did, okay, yeah,
yeah, and so did he sell his He? I don't all yeah,
probably, or maybe just closed it and moved in. So growing up around
that, yeah, did you learn early on all about I mean, I
look at all the things that are inside Leo's. I did, and it's
very unique, right, I mean from Connoli's to the Half Moon Cookies to
everything that's and a lot. Although when I grew up in that whole bakery
business, my father's, my grandfather's, it was bread and rolls, was
never sweets, and it was never sweets very little. Oh So then after
a bunch of years went by, I got out and I worked for Tops,
okay, and I was bakery specialist for them. I was in charge
of all their bakeries. I learned a lot of it there was did the
family still have the bakery at that point when you were working for Tops?
Or did that? So you want to hear the whole nasty story. My
father and my two uncles got in an argument. It's going way back.
So they got along great for many years and they had a really successful business.
But years went by and they just kind of had a falling out,
and so my father left the business. So then I left the business.
Was got worked there without him. So once he did, I did.
I went to work for Tops. So what happens if I'm getting too personal,
but what happens in within the family structure. I would assume that everybody
worked together. You're in everybody's daily lives. Yes, you know, if
you ever leave a job, you really missed the people you worked with,
if you you know, because they become more like family than a coworker,
and it was family for you. So the cousins and it was a little
difficult. Was it really a while? Yes? It was actually people get
together or no no, no, no, not for a while. But
you know, as years went by, I think things got fixed up.
And the whole business was closed though by then, okay, it was all
done. Yeah, once my father left, kind of it all fell apart
pretty much really, so he was sort of the lynchpan that kept it all
together in my opinion, and you too, but probably you as well.
I was pretty young. I was just in my early mid twenties. Yeah.
Yeah, that's difficult when family doesn't talk. I remember my parents having
a twenty fifth or thirty fifth wedding anniversary for one of the one of my
grandparents, and there were two uncles that hadn't talked probably in twenty years,
and they began talking and they couldn't remember why or what, you know,
what I'm saying, like, what happens with that? And then there was
a period of time I mean going uh, you know, a little personal.
But again, I was seven and my parents decided that they wanted to
get more out of church, and they felt like they weren't getting enough out
of the Catholic Church. Now I come from a very Irish Catholic family,
so they switched to Protestantism, and my grandfather would not talk to my mom
wow for a year. So that's her dad, her dad. Because it
was Northern Ireland, Southern Ireland, and then my grandmother, like I would
still go down to visit stuff and they never shut us out, but he
just wouldn't speak. And my grandmother used to corner me and asked me what
I was learning in church and wasn't properly. But it's one of those things
with family dynamics, it can be tough. And I got I think even
working together is pretty tough. Tough. Yeah, yeah, sure, but
they did it successfully for a number of years. You go to tops yep,
and I was there about four years, okay, and I decided to
open my own business. Yeah, yeah, what gave you that crazy idea?
Because because that's how I am. Well as you'll hear. But you
saw your family. I did, Yeah, I did. So I found
a bakery. It was for rent. Actually I had no money, it
was yeah, it was for rent. It was pretty cheap. I was
back in nineteen eighty or whatever. Okay, so I rented it. It
was it was actually either rent or sale. I think fifteen thousand to buy
it or five thousand to rent it. Okay. Said to the guy,
Well how long does the rent last? So as long as you want,
I said, worry, Well, then I'll pay five thousand. Idin't have
any money anyway. So I rented it for several years and I so the
five thousand was the rent for for as long as not every year. What
No, but there was still rent per month, you know. I got
to rent the rent space. I rented basically the equipment. The equipment I
got you. Yeah, so I was in there for quite a while.
That was in East Rochester where of course we ended up again. Now,
but in the old part of town. What were you baking? Was it
just? It wasn't just rolls and bread? No, that was because I
took over what they had already. They had a bakery and a meat market.
So these guys were meat guys, and they had a baker and he
got sick, and they said, hey, instead of closing the baker,
why don't we see if somebody'll just take it over. Who knows how to
bake? So that was me, okay, And I stepped in there and
I did a lot of their recipes that they already had and some that I
had, and got it going pretty good. Yeah, we actually took over
the note. There was an empty store next to that, so we doubled
the size of it within a few years. And then I got antsy and
my dad was getting a little sicker, and he, by this time had
a very small little pastry shop, so I took that over. So then
I had two bakeries. Wow. Then and about two years later I thought
I'd like to have my own building. So I said, would you guys
sell me this building? And they said, no, we don't want to
sell it. So I bought a building in Webster and opened a third bakery.
So you had three bakries. You continued to end. You took over
your dad's pastry shop, but your dad had just been making brett. Where
did the training come from? Now? I grew up downstate near the Culinary
Institute the CIA. We used to go in there with a teacher and sometimes
we would sit in the back. He knew some of the other one of
the professors there, so we would sit in the back and sometimes desserts would
come back and they were barely touched. So we realized, and they're so
good. So where does the training come? Because pastry is quite the Yeah,
I mean, that's quite the undertaking. Because like I had a neighbor
who was a French chef. His name was Charles Vurione. Charles ran one
of the ten best restaurants in the United States at one point and then had
a cookbook and he was the private chef to Orson Wells. When he moved
in, we all thought he was kind of full of garbage. And my
mother brought over Irish soda bread and he called her up and said, I'd
love to work on the recipe with you, and then sent over his cookbook,
which just showed you like, there's a lot of you know, a
lot that goes into pastries. There is, I don't know, it just
kind of comes in. You learn things, you get recipes, you follow
them, you do what you think is right, and before you know it,
you have a whole line of pastries and baked goods and customers. Yeah
it's all good. So you're doing three different locations at that point, I
am. Yeah. My wife's helping me. Um. My kids were pretty
young at the time, so they helped a little, but not really to
count on a baker's day start at what time? For me? I always
had a donutmaker, Okay, a donutmaker would come in usually at three am,
three am, although there was a time in my life that I was
the donutmaker. When you can't find someone you own the business, you got
to do it. But right. So I would come in at six,
six o'clock in the morning, and then when when what a baker's day end?
A baker or an owner of an owner of baker. You know,
for a lot of years I worked a lot of hours sometimes, you know,
if you come in at six, you go home at six. Yeah.
Um. When I bought Leo's, I worked for an entire year straight
without a day off, many many, many hours trying to get it right.
So over the years I've worked a lot. Ye you love it?
Ah, Yeah, I do. Yeah, I do. I mean,
I'm guy, can see it. You look very vibrant. Thank you,
like like you know what I'm saying, Like you've got energy. And because
that's a lot. With the three plus you have kids at the time you're
married, that's a that's a lot. Yes, So I decided that's a
lot and I sold them, okay, all three of them. Well I
did, and I said, I'm I'm not going to be in the bakery
business anymore. I'm try something different. So the company that sold the businesses
for me said, so what are you going to do now? And I'm
like I'm not sure. They go, why don't you come work for us?
You could sell businesses. I'm like, well, I don't have it.
I don't have any training in that, and you don't need any training.
Okay, what do you do? We'll train you. So I sold
businesses for about about a year. It was fun, yeah, and showing
what kind of businesses, anything that came our way. You know. He
would run ads that we would. I think there once was a hobby shop.
Yeah, there was a couple of gas stations. So someone's looking to
sell their business, yep. Instead of them having to go find the leads,
you guys would do it. It would be almost like a real estentially,
yeah, like real estate, except not and there was if there was
real estate involved, there was a realtor that would be right. So this
was just strictly the business, right Yeah. Yeah, And I've said the
story before, but I was doing pretty good. I was like salesman of
the month a couple of times for getting listings, and but I never made
any money. I told the owner like yeah, he said, yeah,
but you're a salesman of the month. I said, yeah, but I
mean, you don't get any money for being forgetting to be the salesman of
the month. You sold something, and we sold very few things. But
anyway, a bakery came along, so I had to buy it. So
I bought it. It was a small little cookie shop, okay. And
I think at the time my son was in his twenties or nineteen or twenty,
and I thought maybe he would like to get in it with me,
and that didn't really happen. So my wife and I ran a little cookie
shop for okay, a couple of years until I got frustrated with it.
Was your wife a baker as well. She is incredible. She she can
do anything. She still works with me today. Okay. Now she does
all the accounting, but she decorates wedding cakes, any cakes. It's quite
the open now, just gonna jump in ahead. When we walked through.
That is quite the operation you have there. You have some really talented people
that we today you do so much talent, it's incredible. But in the
beginning it's just you and your wife, right wow, right, And I
think we hired a guy that makes the domnuts and stuff like that, so
she never got sick. Of each other you can get We did, Yeah,
of course we did. What do you think for normal people? My
wife always says that when you work together, it's like dog years. So
that's actually been married fifty three years. That's very funny, so time seven.
That's a good sense of humor your wife has. She doesn't know.
She says that, but not in a nice way. Well not only,
but I kind of think like it must have. There had to be days
like when one of you wasn't there you sort of felt wall because you're together
so much. Or no, no, we were together a lot. Yeah,
yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, I think that's kind of
nice. And it's nice. Yeah, Like I said, we still do
it today, and it's a lot easier. We don't you know, world
people now we don't kill ourselves. We Okay, it works part time.
I guess I work full time, but I also take some winters off.
I go down to Florida and stuff. So it's not as hard as it
used to be. But when you're running this little little one the cookie shop,
yeah yeah, that's all you and so you are you getting up at
three o'clock in the morning or no, it wasn't like that because it wasn't
don't. Yeah, cookies, Yeah, exactly right, because don't let's have
like a ten hour shelf like or whatever. Cookies last maybe a week,
so you could make them during the day and deliver them the next day.
So okay, So we did that just for a few years. We sold
it, and I had a midlife crisis. Does what does that mean?
Yeah? Yeah, I mean we all have an idea that pops in our
head when we hear those words. But is there what kind of sports car
came into No, it wasn't a sports car. It was boat, honey,
Nope. My daughter was still living home. She was I think a
senior. I think we're gonna move to Hawaii. Wow? Wait, and
we did? You did? You did? Wow? Three years? Holy
cow? I know the craziest thing in the world. Okay, so you
can I kind of interlude here a little bit. I hope you don't mind.
I'm very curious as to how that conversation goes, because I'm assuming your
wife is probably a Rochastarian. She is with her family here. We know
you. We heard your story, right, your grandfather and father at bakery,
So you've got roots here. You're gonna get up and go, I
mean really to the other side of the world, six thousand miles had you
gone to Hawaii prior. So this conversation didn't just happen instantly, as you
might guess, So it evolved over about a two year period of time.
Maybe someday we'll move to Hawaii. And I had an employee actually that worked
for me, and he found a bakery for sale in Hawaii. Because I
used to tell him all the time, it's so nice that I go on
a vacation during the during the winter and go to the Caribbean or whatever and
say, man, Joe, it's it's great to to be and what if
we had a bakery somewhere like that, you get out of work and you
go to the beach instead of you or you're freezing and stuff. So after
I had sold my business, he found a bakery for sale in Hawaii.
This is kind of what got me all like fired up for it. So
he called the guy. Because I wasn't really going to do this, but
he called the guy and he's a you know, he's in his twenties,
so he could do whatever he wanted. And the guy said, yeah,
yeah, I have I have my baker's for sale and this and that,
and but if you want to come here and work until I sell it,
you're welcome to come here and work. So he did. He went and
worked there, and then he started, yes, he did, and he
started calling me like once a month. This is before cell phones, and
and he'd say, Pat's great here the weather or the thing, that you
should come here. The bakery still for sale. Bakery still for sale.
So one day we went and visited. And so you we have talked about
moving to Hawaii, yes, but had never stepped foot in the state of
Hawaii. Never. Okay, I know, no, I like this.
It's like me with the Maldives. I want to go. I wouldn't live
there, but I want to go. Yeah, okay, yeah. So
anyway, so I think it was maybe a year after that that we decided,
yes, we're going to do this. What's some encouragement for my daughter,
who was, like I said, nineteen, she thought it'd be awesome
to live in Hawaii. Let's do it that And so she was coming,
my wife was coming, and we moved to Hawaii. My son was already
off to college, so he wasn't a part of it. When you moved
to Hawaii. Are you buying all new when you get there? Yeah?
Okay, yeah, but you take you got to take family heirlooms and things.
Yeah, we did. Actually, I mean there's gotta be some like
pictures now that you say it. We took, we got, we were
waiting. We actually brought our car, okay, then on a boat brought
it over. We brought some furnishings, we brought dishes, photos, stuff
like that. Yeah. Yeah, and we rented a place for a little
while. Then we found and bought a house where what island Maui, Mauie.
Yeah okay, yeah, that looks it was interesting. So how is
this living there? Because we always see is the touristy stuff, right,
but when it's your everyday life. Yeah. So what we did was we
opened the bakery there. You did. We did because I mean I still
had to work. I was only forty three, I think forty two,
okay. Yeah, So I'm looking to take over a business, and I'm
looking for square footage and property and stuff. And it's like I wanted like
two thousand square feet. I figured small but nice sized, little bakery,
and I started looking at go that's how much it cost for two thousand square
feet, Like, whoa, that's way more than I would have thought.
So I ended up with six hundred square feet. Tiny little thing. But
um, we did get the bakery open and we ran it for three years
and I sold it and came back. Now, when it comes to what
was being made there, because I would assume that there's some differences in terms
of just cultural tastes and things, right, So basically what we did was,
Okay, it's not a blueberry muffin anymore, it's a pineapple macadamia nut
muffin or stuff like that, kind of put a Hawaiian flare on it.
Yeah, And we also put ads out and we said where we were from,
and you would get a lot of people come and go, oh,
you're from Rochester, are you? Oh, I know, who are you?
And a lot of people surprisingly from men and yeah shop there, and
then you know, to come to a little bakery kind of coffee shop,
and a thing was compared to staying at the hotel. Prices were so high
in the hotel and they can come to the little bakery. That's one of
the things I've always heard about WHI how the cost of living is so expensive,
just like milk, for example, is what five dollars a gallon?
I had heard or something. I just heard it was nine back then.
But yeah, yeah, everything's expensive, right, you know, but I
remember I always said, flowers the exact same price, except for it's a
it's a twenty five pound bag instead of a fifty for the same It was
like double, right, but you charge more too, so it didn't it
all balanced out for us being the owners of the business. Yeah, and
what was this time like? Like living there right where it's your every day
is different than visiting. Yeah. Yeah, it was fun. Actually I
liked it a lot. Okay, got a little homesick. I guess it
went home once a year in the winter, okay, summer, yeah,
I guess one summer. So yeah, well you're far away, right and
then I mean you're talking holidays and things away from family where it would just
be you. Yeah, we'd have to be in the ocean on Christmas Day.
Horrible sucks, but we do remember doing that. Well. It was
always weird. I remember being down in the Caribbean around Christmas time, and
it's very strange because it's a little further east some of the islands, so
that it gets darker earlier, but it's warm, and in my mind,
warm means longer days because I grew up in you know, the Northeast,
and so when you're down there, it was very strange. But that had
to be just even. It was just strange to see Christmas lights and m
trees. I just did not jive in my head. But this was your
life for three years. Yeah, and then and then what made you?
What brought you back? To his family? So my son's wife had a
baby. Okay, all right, they lived in New Paul's gotta be close
to the grandkid, especially, my wife said, and I'm like, yeah,
yeah, yeah, we do. So we came back and I think
within three or four months they moved to Seattle. Like, okay, we
could have stayed. We're closer in Seattle, I know, don't that's like
that's just crazy, wow, I know. And they're still there to the
stay has been there I think twenty Seattle, yeah, because Seattle's just a
was it like a three or four hour flight from Hawaiian maybe a little more
maybe five five hours probably like California. Yeah, okay, so it's what
is it twelve hours or nine hours from Chicago to Mayah. That's uh yeah,
that's a little episode. Uh you come back and then when you when
you come back, you obviously sell the business in Hawaii and you come back
here and come back here and thought, now what, I got to buy
another bakery, and I think my fifth or six or something one, yeah,
and I started looking around and found Leos for sale and I did.
I bought it at the end of nineteen ninety six, so okay years,
yeah, a long time ago. And it wasn't what it is today at
all. It was in a rough part of the city basically and very small,
I said earlier when I started. When I bought it, I had
to work every single day trying to get things right. It was just it
was a rack. I mean, the employees didn't care about it. It
was just a lot of work, like a lot of fixing this and that.
And so I did it for a year and got it fixed up and
running fairly smoothly. But then within I guess about eight years, we moved
to where we are now in East rot That's when things now. I told
somebody that you were coming in and they said to me, the best cold
cuts I have ever had or from Leos and I said, well, boar's
head. Now I had worked your son lived in New Palls. I don't
know if you had ever gone to visit, but I worked in a place
called Adams ferrick Or Farms, which was in Poughkeepsie, not far from New
Palls, and they were all boars head. I worked in the Delhi and
that was always the best kind of cold cuts you could get, always the
Long Island, I think, right the company, I believe they are,
Yes, yeah, yeah, so that's all they said to the best tasting
cold cuts ever. They go cut perfectly, it's thin cut. This is
because when we first so I have I have, I have a lot of
really good help right now. I mean I don't do this by myself.
I have some tremendous people. But Sam Deperna, one of our one of
my GM basically knew the Delhi business and stuff. So that's how I kind
of got started with it. And I said, I, you know,
we talked about different cold cuts to carry, and we decided, you know,
let's try the boar's head. And I had this guy tell me,
Pat, you're never going to sell boar's head. It's so expensive. People
don't want to pay for it, and I said, well, we're going
to try it. If not, we can't sell it, does it really
matter because we're gonna put it on the subs and stuff like that. And
he's like, you're gonna put boards had on the subs. I go,
yeah, goes, that's a waste of money. Nobody's gonna even know.
Time you put mayonnaise and mustard whatever, nobody's gonna even know. Man,
oh man, we do a lot of boards. Well I think you can
tell, well, you can tell yeah, I mean I I always thought
that myself. But but the guy that told me that was a deli owner
and subsher. Don't waste your money on it. It worked that way.
He's talking out of it. So when you start Leos and you moved to
the East Rochester location, this is nineteen ninety six. Now Leos is you've
got the whole Delhi will sit down cafe, the prepared foods, what's the
gradual growth and as we said at the beginning, the watermark specialty foods.
When does that come in? Yeah? Good, because you get yeah,
here's the one I'm picking up. You don't sit idle long, No,
I don't. And you know my wife but you don't see him like a
guy who's like, you know, I mean, you just seem like this
is your every day, this is we're gonna do it. There's no there's
no can't in you, right right, I mean, I mean, I'm
as I'm I'm hearing you. You sold by We're going to Hawaii. Yeah,
there's no can't. Who goes to Hawaii? Who says we're just moving?
Do you know what I'm saying? Like, that's amazing, that's a
I think it's a wonderful quality. It's a successful one. And you and
happy, positive, always looking at the positive. I'll make this work,
I'll you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, So you ask about watermarks.
So what happened when I bought Leo's took. I worked that year straight
trying to get it right. And then the building had the bakery on one
side, and the other side of the building was a whole bunch of stuff,
like junk like stuff that they left like, oh there's an old motor,
there's an old showcase, just push it back there. Oh there's some
old tires from the truck. Oh push it back there. And this half
of the building was just full of junk. And I said now that the
bakery was settled, I said, in the afternoon, after I get my
work done, I'm gonna gold and start cleaning it up. So, little
by little by little I did. I went over there and cleaned it all
up and the dumpster and threw all the junk out and swept it out.
And I looked at it and I said, this looks really good. I
could put a business in here. It's empty space. What would I do
at the space? So I started looking for a business to put in my
empty space, and I found Watermark Foods for sale and I bought it and
brought it in there. So you know there's business schools, right, there's
people. Yeah, Well, I mean you know Saint John Fisher has a
business department. I went to Fisher for communications, and I'm not convinced that
that is needed necessarily. I guess if you're going to be a CEO of
some big company, they prefer to have somebody that maybe has some say.
But isn't it the best teacher experience in my opinion? Yes, for sure.
I mean I went to a year and a half at McCay, no
good education. I did go to McQuaid, which was probably good for me.
Yes, cut me on the street. McQuaid. I sent one of
my boys there. I was overly impressed, very impressed, and I thought
it was wonderful and I think the connections that you make there are wonderful.
It's a real I mean, I think there's some people may think, oh,
my quaite, but I think it's a real asset to the area.
Myself. I do too, just totally. But I find that really interesting
that you just I'll put a business in here. Yes, well it was
empty space, no, no, but a business is you know, it
could get a little scary. There's license this and one of the profit of
loss and how do I you know, yeah, I don't think of all
those. Well, no, that's one. I think that's great because sometimes
if you do whatever your expectation is or worries, that's what comes. I'm
a big believer in you know, your brain's a magnet. Yeah, we're
thinking it's going to bring it and so far you're proving it. Yes.
Yeah, And I thought, you know, it was a food distribution company.
Basically they bought and sold food. And I still watchee I could they're
buying and selling food, They're going to these restaurants they could I could throw
my pies on there or whatever. So I'll just it'll kind of work together.
And it actually worked together even better than I expected, because I didn't
realize that now I can buy my ingredients as a distributor instead of yeah,
sure, actually buying, and I can buy and sell sugar and flour and
shortening to other bakeries and we do today. Okay, so but I could
get it at a discount to use for myself. So it worked out really
better than I thought. Yeah, and that's growing a ton too. That's
where does the inspiration come from for some of these things. Let's say you
walk in, and maybe that sounds like a silly question, but you walk
in, you clean out your garage, there's tires, there's motors. You
clean it out, and then say, I could put a business in here.
Yes, okay, some people may say, forgive me, pat,
but it's crazy right that that would be almost crazy, like you've got all
this over here, why would you want to? But people do say that,
well, yeah, but but you've found a way. You just explained
it beautifully. I get you know, my ingredients and wholesale, and I
can take care of things that I can also sell my pies to that.
So to me, yeah, but that's you know, did you talk to
people about this before you did it? No good because they'll try to talk
you out. Yes, I'm so, I'm so much. And I don't
think that people mean to I don't think they're trying to be mean. No.
I think they're trying to give you, from their perspective, what they
believe is the best advice. But a lot of times if you if you
listen to it, I'll always think back in my head, I go when
Jesus healed that guy and he said, go forth and tell nobody, because
once you come in and go, my leprosy is gone, it's coming back.
And then you start to put the doubt in your mind. Yes,
you know, that's how I think. And I man, I find that
fascinating that you did that. I really do. I think that's super super
impressive. Thank you. Yeah, I don't know. I guess I just
sometimes I just try not to think it out that much. Yeah, but
don't think too hard. Well, it's it's funny. I hesitates to say
this, but I have a thirteen year old son. He does not live
with me. He lives with his mom out of state called me today,
wanted to see the smoke in the sky. The he had been seen it
on the news. So when he went out and faced time and showed him
some stuff. And then we're talking and I said to him, his grandmother's
gonna have surgery and I'm gonna go down. And he said to me,
um, what if it doesn't work out the surgery? And I said,
I don't think that way, right, I don't think that way. And
I said and I and I said, but you know what, maybe people
who do are a little better prepared. I just always think of the best
possible outcome. What's the best possible outcome? And when you said that,
now I thought, yeah, I don't really think that way. If I'm
in, I'm gonna if I'm jumping in, I'm jumping in, yes,
right, yes, and then and it's gonna work and that and that's it.
And as you did with when with Leo's when it started, you were
all in. I mean it was hard. Yeah, I'm sure, I'm
sure. And then on top of that, so you're running businesses, but
you're also managing the business with employees, and that's not an easy thing.
Hiring firing, figuring things out, trying to teach some are the ways of
the business, that this is how we do it here. And yeah,
I guess you ever stopped to think about what you do? I think it's
just a passion. Yeah, just clearly. Yeah, if you bake at
home time, does your wife no? Okay, no, she can't have
gluten or dairy or anything anymore, so okay. Yeah, but yeah,
I don't know. I sometimes I think I had helped from up above,
like father or my grandpa. Who knows they're watching me and they're saying,
Pat, you need a little help here. This isn't I don't know,
somebody's guiding me. Who? Yeah, Like who do you owe? Who
taught you the most? I guess would be the question father, your dad?
By far? Yeah, because my grandpa passed away. I told the
story before he passed away at the workbench making bread. I was eleven years
old, and uh, grandpa was working and yeah, I remember my mom
picked me up at um I was at swim lessons and my brother and I
and she picked me up, picked us up and said Grandpa passed away.
And I'm like, wow, I remember forty sad you know, sure,
absolutely so that. But I always say, you know, did he teach
us that this is how hard we work? We work? My father always
worked hard too. Yeah. It was never a day off for him.
He worked every day. I remember when I first got married, my wife
said to me, uh, what day do you get off? And I
said, I don't. I don't think I get a day off. She's
like, shouldn't you have a day off? So I asked my father,
go, Dad, kath he thinks I should have a day off? And
he said day off. I said, yeah, He's just like, well,
well maybe Saturday. Okay, that's what it worked out? It did?
Yeah, yeah, did he gave it? Yeah? But was there
ever did you ever wish you had to? I mean, clearly it's the
Saturday. But did your dad ever feel like he was missing out but not
having a day off or was this sort of what kept him alive and kept
your dad had? Um? He worked, like I said, tons and
tons of tons, and my uncle's as well. And they built a new
building in Webster and put a brand new, state of the art bake.
This is back in the eighties, and they said, once we get this
up and running, because we've been working so hard we're all going to take
a month off. Okay, each of us going to take a month to
whatever we want. So my dad was first, and my my mom and
dad. I was older now, I was in my twenties, so I
was married and gone. But my younger sister and brother and my parents drove
to California, and so about a week or they were going to be gone
for the month, and about a week or so end, my mother calls
up, if you had her dad's Blue Cross card there? Why? Oh,
well, he got hurt. What do you mean he got hurt?
Well, what happened? Well, he heard and he had a heart attack.
He didn't die, but he had a heart attack, you know,
just probably from going and going and going for I don't know twenty straight years
and then getting time off and just did you ever does that kind of go
in your mind ever yourself? Well? No, no, you just don't
know. I don't think about it. Yeah, well I don't feel like
I have any issues. Help, No, you look great. I mean,
how was Hawaii then? Was that almost like a vacation? Would kind
of midlife crisis I call it? Well, but yeah, okay, but
did you feel like you were sort of a little more laid back there,
or I don't know what the Hawaii I look. I'll go from watching Magnum
Pi as a child and I, you know, maybe the old Hawaii five
oh shows. But the vibe always seemed to be a little a little slower,
a little more relaxed, little slower. Okay, yeah it was.
It was interesting to one thing that happened when I was trying to get the
license to to run the bakery. I was having trouble getting it because I
was a Howley. Have you ever heard the term where I was an outsider
the local. I wasn't a local guy. I wasn't Hawaiian, I wasn't
Asian or whatever a lot of them were. And I'm trying to get my
license and I can't. I can't. Every time I go down to the
town and they're wow, what blah blah. So one day this guy told
me that there's somebody that you can talk to that could help you, and
I said, okay, and what's his name? That called him? He
goes meet me in the parking lot, So I go, all right.
So I met him in the parking lot as I don't can't remember where we
were, and he's in this white truck and pat, yeah you jowned whatever
his name wasn't He said, what are you trying to do? I said
him, trying to rent the space, but they won't give me a permit
to go in. I got the I'm already paying the lease and everything.
He says, give me five hundred bucks, I'll get your permit for you.
I'm like, all right, I'm here in the parking a lot.
Don't know this guy. And five hundred bucks back in nineteen ninety six felt
like at least five thousand, you know, Yeah, sure, I's gonna
give this guy five hundred bucks. But I did, and the next day
I got my license. So it was different being in Hawaii. It wasn't
like here. Yeah. Yeah, So there's little things like that. Well
it sounds like things get done a little faster. Maybe what was taking a
while? So that guy got involved a lot of he was or how he
did it? What was the plan when when you bought leos? Was it
to take it to where it is now? Or does that just happen along
the way and you go, boy, this would be a good idea,
and this would be a good idea, and yes, for sure, yeah
I am not a planner. Has there been anything that you tried that,
oh, yeah, that did not work? Yeah, a lot of things
like espresso we brought in a few different times and not Oh we could sell
fancy coffees and stuff and it never seemed to work. We brought it.
We made gelato for a while and with a dipping cabinet and all that.
It just didn't seem to work. If it doesn't work, we take it
out and try something different. Yeah, but nothing. Ever, what would
be the maybe the failure that taught you the most, if there is such
a thing, because I think I think we always learn from you know,
instead of seeing failure as the word failure. Nobody wants to fail, right,
But yet if you can look at it as okay, but I'm one
step closer to what I really want. I know this didn't work. Yeah,
but maybe this will work. Yeah, I don't know. I don't
have a good answer. Okay, yeah, yeah, I don't. I
don't know. I mean we certainly have failed sometimes. Did it teach me?
Probably a little little lessons, maybe no big lessons, but just away
all these businesses and things and then selling them, and you know that that
alone is a successful is successful and stressful, I would assume, no,
not stressful. No do you you don't seem to have much stress at all.
No, No, What do you do as a hobby or for for
pleasure? I wake that is one thing that I kind of I guess maybe
a minor regret I didn't have. I don't have a lot of hobbies.
I've always worked, and but it's kind of hobby for me. Sure.
I mean today, in this day, the way I work today, I
mean I go in and I always cannot say, well, all right now,
I have a five different manager, store manager, warehouse manager, GM,
bakery manager, and I feel like and it just keeps growing and growing.
It's like a snowball rolling down the hill. And my job is just
to like push it this way and push it that way, just to keep
it round, just to keep everything right. I don't really have a job
function anymore where I have to bake or I don't. I don't have to
do anything when I walk in the door really other than deal with what comes
up. It's kind of nice, it's kind of nice, kind of nice.
Would you also could do any job any Taking back to a few years
ago when there were places like yours that may have had to close their doors
because of COVID. Yeah, and what went on there and you didn't No,
we actually, so we had our issues were Watermark Foods, which is
the food distribution side of it, really went down like eighty five. Okay,
we laid off about thirty five people. We have I think about ninety
working for us. And because nothing was open, we have no one to
sell to the country clubs, the colleges, nothing was open to sell to.
But Leo's was able to stay open because we were essential. I guess.
Yeah, we couldn't have any seating in the cafe, but otherwise if
it was take take it, taken eat it, we could do that.
So we really spiked up because so many places were closed. So Leo spiked
up a lot, and it didn't not enough to make up for all of
Watermark, but it was enough to keep us going and start bringing some people
back. And you know today were Leo's is busier than ever. Watermarks back
to normal, So it was it didn't hurt us at all. Yeah,
because the hospitality business, I mean certainly more restaurants and things got hurt pretty
badly and some of them did not recover and I think it's amazing. It's
it seems like when you when having walked through your i'll call it the plant
in the back sort of the it's a it's a very um there's a good
vibe. I was going to say, a family vibe. And I don't
know if that that's the right thing, but I like it if you say
that, if you feel that, because I like it that way, and
I think it is that way. I have a lot of people say that
whatever you got going on, that calm, positive demeanor seems to permeate that
business. It does. Like you notice the people who are working and the
young lady about a sub and the pleasant when we're in the back and they're
making the cakes, that people are chatting, and they seem happy, happy
to be there, which is I think a very important thing for I do
too. I think it is probably the most important. Yeah, really,
And of course not everybody's happy there. We have our moments, for sure,
we're human, Yeah, But in general, try to have that that
happy atmosphere, that family atmosphere. Try to you know, people got to
work for eight hours. They want to come and be miserable or they want
to kind of enjoy it right, and I try to make like I'm enjoying
it, which I am anyway, and it just kind of goes trickles down.
One of the things that I know many people love is the two dollar
bread. I know that that's a big deal. You really sort a big
deal. Yes, I do, it's a big deal. What is the
what's the plan is there? I mean you seem like you've always kind of
got some idea. No, no, nothing, no, just keep going
yes, what the plan is? Never a plan? I never It's never
in my head until it happened. So okay, Like even anything that we've
done, people don't believe me. But it's not like I had ever planned
any of this. And and I've been asked over the years, hey,
did you ever think it would get this big or whatever? Maybe six or
eight years ago, maybe ten years agoys, I'd say yes, I did,
okay, but today I'm like, wow, no, I didn't.
It's it's huge. It's beyond anything I ever dreamed up. So I don't
know what would be next to you. If something comes in my head,
I might try it or why. I don't know. I'm an old man.
What do you do when it comes to your to your wife obviously,
somebody who's been truly a partner and all this, which is something like we
hear that term a lot, my partner, my this, but this has
been somebody who's walked in lockstep. You said, let's go to Hawaii.
She said, okay, well whatever, she went right, right. But
I mean all that stuff all the way through to you know, I'm sure
when you first bought Leos and all that to have that is got to be
She's an awesome lady. Yeah, pretty awesome, right, I mean that
that makes it all work. It does. Yeah, it definitely makes a
difference for sure. What is the uh? And then, not to sound
a little more bid, but what legacy would you like to leave? What
would the what would I like to leave? You know, I have a
grandson who's ninetything. Okay, everything, No, but I mean in terms
of like when people think of of Leos and years, I mean, I
think it's a place where that reminds me your cafe where I would go with
my grandfather other for subs when I was a kid, And it's got that
kind of vibe where you you're making memories for people. You may not even
realize it, but there are people who I love my kid. I have
somebody in Webster saying to me, I go out to East Rochester because my
son loves the two dollar bread and whenever we're in there, we always get
a treat. That's what I was told. That's a memory. Yeah right,
I mean I told you about the British cafe where I grew up.
It was the woman was from Britain and they used to have the half Moon
cookies. It's a memory. Yeah, you know those are That's really all
we have in life, the feeling, the memory. I think that's pretty
cool what you got. I think it's a little more than probably you're thinking
about on the day to day basis. But that's how people associate, right,
I mean, when we break bread, what is it it's about.
It's not so much about the food as it is the people and the people
were around and the loved ones. You really kind of bring all that together,
I guess we do. Yeah, that's a that's a good legacy there.
I think I'll take it. Yeah, I like it. That's pretty
good. That's pretty good. But I really thank you. And this is
probably what's the best thing about Leo's everything. I mean, it's just it's
known. It's known so well in town. Like you hear it, you
hear the music, you know it, you know. Yeah, that's pretty
cool of itself. Leo's one on one Despatch Drive, East Rochester, you
can always call two four nine one thousand. That's five eight five two four
nine one thousand. I have been enjoying far too many of the mini almond
crescents and the meatball cookies. You gotta try the meatball cookies. I'm just
saying the meatball cookies, man oh, man oh, and the prepared meals.
By the way, chicken French is. I hadn't really seen it till
I moved here many many, many years ago, and it is one of
my absolute face too. I absolutely love it. Yeah, it's probably one
you grew up with, Yes, Chicken French. Yeah, I don't remember
it so much down south down I say south, but down down the east
part of the state for Pat Bronunzio Leo's Bakery and Delhi, I'm Bill Moran
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