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Hello, and welcome to open My
UFO Radio. I am your host,

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Alessandro Rojas, and I am joined
by the Man, the myth, the

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legend, the person we've met missed
so much the last couple of weeks,

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Martin and no show. Willis no
show. I think I've been called that

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before. Real, So you're talking
about bigfooted first, but yeah, no,

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that's me as you. Yeah,
yeah, as anybody compared to you

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to Bigfoot before kind of maybe a
baby sasquatch not yet, No, I

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guess it would depend on you know. This is main right, I know,

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so it's a very witty area.
Yes, but I like to tell

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people this is something new I'm doing, Martin. I'm telling people making sure

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they understand about the show. So
this show is Open minds UFO Radio,

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where we cover credible UFO news and
information. We take a journalistic standpoint since

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I'm a journalist, I'm a writer, and we cover substantiated, credible information

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for you all to kind of make
up your minds. We do, of

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course, give commentary and give our
opinions, but and we do when we

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speculate, we call it speculation.
But I think that's what something unique that

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Martin and I do is that we're
giving you credible, substantiated information instead of

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just kind of spitballing and making guesswork
out of things. We also do review

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the news the beginning of the show. We'll be doing that momentarily, so

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if you want to just skip to
the interview, you can't do that.

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That's at about the twenty five to
twenty six minute mark. But we'll talk

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about news and stuff in just a
second. But first I want to talk

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about Patreon. What I'm doing on
Patreon is I'm alerding to people to what

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my next guests, to who my
next guest will be, and then you

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can go on there and ask questions, but only if you're a patron.

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And I asked people about that last
week, about how I'm going to be

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putting some more exclusive information on my
Patreon that only patrons can see. However,

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it only costs a dollar a month
to get on there and see that

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at the very lowest, and you
know, it'll keep me doing UFO stuff,

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which of course I would like to
continue to do. It just takes

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a lot of time researching all of
this info and quickly here you guys responded

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greatly. I had a ton of
you come and join Patreon. Here are

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some of them, Mitchell, Mitch, Jean Pierre or Larry, Rob,

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Matt Jode, Alex Rory, Jeff
Kevin, Ray, Dennis Nicole, Richard

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Duncan, Steve Christopher, Shawn,
Marcel, Craig Rubin, my good buddy,

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Ruben, yr Arte, Steve,
Dave, and let's say Clinton,

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and we have Darth reichas so this
is a Sith Lord. I guess is

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on here, Dars, so that's
kind of scary actually, and Iran.

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So yeah, a ton of people
are joining. Thank you so much,

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and hopefully we can keep that roll
in. But check out my Patreon this

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week. I have up a picture
I hung out with my buddy Dave Childress

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not too long ago, from Ancient
Aliens. And he shared a picture from

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the Ancient Aliens television show that's upcoming
from him in Peruin some caves. It's

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a really cool picture, so you
can see that if you're a patron.

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I've also got a cool bit of
audio bonus that I'm gonna have this week,

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and I'll tell you about that in
just a seconds. I tell you

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about my guests anyway. Our guest
for today is Bryce Sable Bryce has worked

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in the Hollywood industry for a long
time. Some of you know him because

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I've had him on the show quite
a few times. He was a speaker

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at the last Congress. But he's
worked on the show Dark Skies, which

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was a UFO conspiracy series kind of
about the mythology of MJ twelve and stuff

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he talked about. He did the
TV show The Crow, Mantis, Lois

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and Clark, The Fifth Corner.
On all of these typically he was a

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producer and a writer. He's worked
on the Mortal Kombat movies, on the

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Atlantis movie, all kinds of cool
stuff. Currently, he's got a movie

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that's being filmed called The Last Battle, about the last battle in World War

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Two, which is really interesting.
So that's going on. So he does

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cool stuff. And he used to
be in charge of the Academy. In

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fact, when nine to eleven happened, he was the guy who had to

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say, oh, we're not going
to hold the Academy Awards because you know,

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we've got this tragedy. So really
interesting character. He's worked for CNN

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and so I love talking to him. He's been online trying to start up

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discussions about disclosure and some other UFO
topics recently, So that's why I decided

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it'd be great to have him on
to see what he found and see what

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he's thinking about this stuff, and
especially right now, this topic is really

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important. So that's our guest.
But before we get into that, brilliant

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He is a brilliant guy. He's
a great dude. I really like love

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talking to him. Right. Isn't
it amazing how he got started? I

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mean basically his wife told him,
you know, you could do that probably

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better as far as like writing a
screen. Really, yeah, it's amazing.

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Not aware of that. And yeah, he's just a brilliant guy,

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great guy. He had lunch with
David O'Leary, the writer of uh,

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you know, Project Bluebook, and
it it appears that it was kind of

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some funny thing and we didn't even
talk about this. We're both trying to

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take credit for hooking it up with
David O'Leary. It was me. I've

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got there the emails to prove it. I have the emails to prove it.

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Oh my gosh, what if we
emailed them at the same time.

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He got two emails. You got
to have lunch with Dave? Well he

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did. Dave said to me,
you're not the first person that told me.

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I see there's that it was me, but he said, but it

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definitely wasn't. Yeah, yeah,
No, it's funny we had the same

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idea. Well, they're both Hollywood
guys, are both there in town,

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and I know Bryce always loves to
meet people in the industry. I've hooked

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them up with others and have lunch. That's kind of what they do in

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Hollywood. They have lunch, talk
about ideas. So, yeah, they

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really liked each other. In fact, I think we talk about that a

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little bit in this interview. Yeah
that's great, But before that, let's

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get into the news. Martin.
You got a new story to start us

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off with. Well, I you
know, as you know, I was

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absent the last couple of weeks during
your show, but I know that you

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talked about the Manutwauk incident and which
if any of the listeners watched that video,

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it's quite amazing and there was a
lot of effort put into it,

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you know, the video itself and
then the interviews and where was this video

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and update us on where and when? Okay that was that was back?

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Do you say I only have the
down read Unfortunately, up in front of

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me. But that was just a
few few weeks ago that this happened,

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and essentially a UFO signing and somebody
did a video in a witness and stuff.

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Yeah, and the video itself is
pretty amazing. I mean the lights

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first, it starts out with a
very bright light and then you can see

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sort of a formation and then you
know, lights going in and out,

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and basically it was a you know
uf you know UFO to this guy who

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was a marine, former marine,
it seemed, you know, many aircraft.

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He understands what they are and all
that. But my hat's off to

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John Kelly and News Inside and Out
who first reported this. And by the

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way, it's not just them,
a lot of people picked up the story

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and it's on also. The video
has gone quite well, semi viral on

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YouTube. A great video if you
watch it. And but anyway, it's

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been downgraded because John took the time
to get some people involved in doing research

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on this, and they've done an
overlay of the lights with the daylight scene

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and it basically silhouetted one on top
of the other. Basically the camera was

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pointing down and these appear to be
street lights and cars. Ah so yeah,

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I would, you know, even
though it was a fantastic filming,

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I so much like this better when
you know, when someone does the work

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and finds out it's something prosaic and
nothing. Yeah, And sometimes people do

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that and then they do they try
to downplay it or be like, oh

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no, that can't be the answer. It's nice when someone just owns it

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and they're like, oh, yep, I guess we figured this out.

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Yeah. So it is that that
story is up on the same place that

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broke that news inside and out,
John Kelly, over on the West Coast.

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So there's another story here that I
want to talk to you about.

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I think it's really important and it's
getting kind of forgotten and not getting enough

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attention, I think. And this
is that. On April eleventh, the

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Senate Armed Services Committee had a hearing
about the Space Force, and Senator Richard

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Blumenthal had some scary statements. He
said, the American people have no idea,

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really no idea about the immensity of
the threat in space. And I've

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got a link to the c SPAN
video so you could watch the video.

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And I've also in the c SPAN
video they have the transcript of what he's

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saying. But he's very I mean, he's very adamant about this, that

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this is a big deal, and
so it's kind of freaky. He essentially

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is saying that we're sitting here talking
about the Space Force, but the most

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important things regarding this topic we can't
even talk about because they're classified, and

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the American people don't have the facts. And he said, if we did

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have the facts, we'd be pretty
alarmed. Says, I think we have

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a real obligation to explain to the
American people why space is a domain that

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matters. He also says we need
to know why the threats there are real

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and urgent and why they are growing
in importance. He says, you know,

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before if people start thinking it's aliens
he's talking about, because many UFO

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people are posting this and thinking it's
aliens, I don't think so. And

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the reason why is he does say
that, you know, we know what

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our adversaries are up to in space. They know we know what they're up

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to, and we talk about this
behind closed doors, but the American people

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don't know, so they have no
context for this conversation we're having right now

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about the Space Force. So he's
kind of like we're wasting time, you

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know, just kind of blabbing about
this crap that we can't even really talk

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about the beef of the situation.
So that no wonder the American people are

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confused by the Space Force thing.
But these the immensity of the threatened space.

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What a incredible statements. Yes,
and you know, we did sign

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a space treaty all the way back
in nineteen sixty seven basically, and there

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was I think there's one hundred and
eight countries on the treaty. But treaties

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are broken all the time. Yeah, I think that, you know,

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it's always good to be safe.
And you know, if our communications system

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was wiped out, I mean we're
very vulnerable when it comes to our satellite

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system right in so many ways.
You know, it could it could really

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destroy our country and cause chaos very
rapidly if something happens. So I think

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that's probably the classified stuff. Yeah, And I mean how this relates to

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UFO, it's also is that,
of course, if we've got technology up

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there, especially satellites that can move
or change direction, which some people are

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speculating is what he's referring to,
that the Chinese and Russian to have such

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technology that those would easily get mistaken
for UFOs. In fact, that's essentially

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one of my sightings was what looked
like a satellite that turned around and went

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the wrong the other direction, And
of course satellites shouldn't be able to do

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that, but I could have been
looking at something that was, you know,

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an advanced secret project satellites that can
do that. So I don't know.

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So that's how it relates. You
know. It's just there's a lot

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of stuff in space we don't know, and some of it as our so

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in fact, maybe all of it
is we don't know, but of course

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there are some big mysteries up there. So I think this is an interesting

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statement. And to kind of coupled
with this, there's a writer who works

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in this field that you and I
have interviewed, Tyler Rogueaway, and he

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writes on defence projects and the aerospace
classified projects and that sort of thing.

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He's got an interesting story out here
about Vandenberg Air Force Base and essentially the

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Space Shuttle processing facility. So the
Air Force was going to have its own

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secret space shuttle where it's going to
do secret projects. And some of you

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maybe saying, well they do they
have a mini one, which is true.

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They have this little mini space shuttle
they fly up that does these top

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secret projects. We don't know what
it's doing up there. But what Tyler

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says is, even though that's the
case, we know where they fly that

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thing out of and if I were
to call up the Air Force, they

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would tell me, oh, yeah, we fly that out of here and

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there, but what it does is
secret and I can't tell you. But

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what's weird is there's only one facility
where he's ever had the experience where he

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calls up and says, hey,
what are they doing at this facility?

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And they say, we can't tell
you. And that's what's a mystery here.

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So they after this project to create
an Air Force space shuttle that got

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canned, they didn't even fly it. They built it but didn't fly it.

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But this base they then started flying
Delta four rockets out of it.

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After that, just a few years
ago it went secret. Somebody bought it

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and they're doing some work there and
they've obviously upgraded it and there's a lot

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of activity, but what they're doing
we don't know. So he speculates on

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some of the technology that might be
being developed there and flown out on the

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ocean right outside of there. And
it turns out I didn't even know this,

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but he reviews this that out in
the ocean in that area in southern

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California is the largest kind of testing
range for the military. It's out over

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the ocean. It's this restricted airspace
where they do lots of maneuvers and flying.

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He also mentions the Nimets UFO experience
or you know, encounter from two

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thousand and four, and he notes
that this is the area where that happened.

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You know, The point is,
it's not too big of a surprise

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that it was in, you know, a military zone where they do military

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exercises. And also back in two
thousand and four is when they were doing

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the Delta rockets, so it's not
like they were flying whatever they saw Nimets

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in the nimet's encounter there. But
that's just kind of the relation, but

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another story of some of a facility
that's doing some advanced technology that we're not

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aware of. So there's a lot
going on that way now as far as

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as far as protected airspace. It
just seems like one hand would know what

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the other is doing and this wouldn't
happen in other words, they wouldn't be

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seeing, you know, something unusual
flying that was you know, that was

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being tested. It seems like there
would be some type of communication going on

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there as far as like the tic
TAC and all that. Yeah, you

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know, if that was something,
that's exactly a great point that you know,

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they do notify each other when they're
flying stuff like that, you know,

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because they don't want people to get
hurt or you know, people have

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speculated that the two thousand and four
and immitt ins and it was just a

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test of a rocket, and there
were testings of rockets going on at the

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time, different types. But of
course what was described and what was witnessed

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by several witnesses is an object for
a period of time then matched the maneuvers

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of one of the eighteens uh and
then darted off at a very fast speed,

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all of which just not you know, a missile wouldn't do that sort

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of thing. So that's why that
has been ruled out. But yeah,

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just interesting stuff. Another story is
a news on the bob Lasar front.

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So we've been seeing a lot about
this raid that happened while Jeremy Corbell was

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filming this movie about Bablazar, the
guy who was the witness in the you

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know, kind of alleged witness blower, whistleblower at Area fifty one, who

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says he was working back engineering alien
aircraft. Of course we only had to

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have his word that that has been
happening. Well, while Jeremy was filming

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about Bob and interviewing him, the
FBI came and raided Bob Lasar's house.

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And so far they've been telling us
that, you know, this was about

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the FBI looking for receipts, that
there was someone who bought something from Bob

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Blazaar that was potentially illegal, and
so they wanted receipts from this purchase from

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many years ago. And that's what
we've been told. But of course they

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could have just called to get these
receipts. They didn't have to raid to

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get the receipts, so they know
is overkill. Well, we just found

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out because this retired police officer,
Tim McMillan went and was able to get

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a local police report that no,
that isn't a story that actually this person

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who purchased this material he purchased well
we don't know what he purchased, but

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Bob Blazar sells this stuff called thallium, I think that's how you say it,

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and he sells a legal version of
it. But thallium can also be

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a poison in another form, and
this person was killed with thallium poison years

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ago. They suspected that Bob Blazar
sells this poison, and that's what the

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police report says. They suspect he
sells it. So they raided not just

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looking for the reas, they were
also looking for this poison, apparently suspecting

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that Bob Blizzar sold it. And
according to the pre support, they were

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convinced he did sell this stuff.
Bob Blazar wasn't arrested during that raid,

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so apparently they didn't find anything.
But that's why there was hasmat there and

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why this raid was a big deal. Not you know, it would seem

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out of proportion if they were just
looking for receipts, but they were looking

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for more than that. Wow,
it just goes to show how things can

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be taken out of proportion and everything
else about the speculation. It was element

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one fifteen. And I know that's
why you've got to ask. That's why

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the journalistic process is so important,
because you have to seek the root of

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the information. It may Sometimes things
may in appearance seem very mysterious and leave

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you to want to jump to conclusions. This rate is a perfect example.

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You think, Wow, they're obviously
harassing this guy because that was They didn't

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need to have all these people there
and has Matt and everything, unless maybe

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they were looking for element one fifteen, this mysterious element that supposedly Bob Blazar

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saw. Well, here you go. When you look at the roots,

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you find a prosaic answer. That's
happened with a tip. Recently, people

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were wondering, oh, there's all
this mystery about how you know a tip

258
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was called one thing and now it's
called something else, and what's going on

259
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here? Well, I interviewed lou
and it turns out, you know,

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the the details are actually much more
prosaic and makes sense. So you know,

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you don't know what you don't know
until you interview and ask. You

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know, Uh, you got to
be careful not to jump to assumptions.

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Mm, which happens a little bit
in this It does a little bit.

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Another story, Psychology Today wrote a
story UFO's Close Encounters and the Cry for

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Meaning. They reference Carl Jung,
who said, man cannot stand a meaningless

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life. Now, I haven't read
this story, to be honest, but

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Carl Jung I have read his book. He has a book on UFOs.

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Now Here's what's important to understand is
that Carl Jung did believe that, you

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know, UFOs and stories about aliens
replaces the old tales about seeing ghosts or

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saints or fairies or Jesus, and
that all makes sense. That we're all

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looking for a meaning, we're looking
towards the supernatural. That's what religions are

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based off of, is kind of
our relation with the supernatural, even by

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definition if you look up religion.
So but however, even though Carl Jung

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said that's a lot of what this
phenomena represents for us, he was adamant

275
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that he felt there was a true
mystery, and he actually had written letters

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that he felt that the Air Force
was even covering up information about UFOs.

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So Carl Jung was very much into
that this was a genuine phenomena but also

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a symbolic phenomena that was important to
human beings. Yeah, there's so many

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facets to it when you really think
about it. Yeah, oh exactly.

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I mean there's so much to look
at and what it represents for all of

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us. Another article that came out
in the Metro is actually about something that's

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been batting around the internet. Is
this patent by the US Navy. It

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was submitted by a Navy scientist.
The patent is about essentially a triangular shaped

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anti gravity device. Now the patent, just because you submit a pattern doesn't

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mean you can actually build the device. It means that this is a theory

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for how something might work, and
I want the rights to it, you

287
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know, if I'm able to build
it. And so that's what a pattern

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represents. So it doesn't mean that
they've built something like this. But what's

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interesting is the file was put in. The patent was filed in twenty sixteen,

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and that one of the authors of
the articles that is referenced in you

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know, essentially that they were able
to build this theory off of or is

292
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how put Offs. So How put
Off is one of the physicists who worked

293
00:22:03.039 --> 00:22:07.799
with Big Low and the Pentagon program, UFO program. He's worked on remote

294
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viewing and stuff like that. So
that's what makes this patent interesting is that

295
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how is involved, and you know, and to the stars right now is

296
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trying to develop you know, they
say that one of the things they want

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to do is develop anti gravity devices
based off of technology they observed and help

298
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put off as part of their groups. So people are speculating that perhaps this

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is a technology they hope to develop. I've never really understood that part of

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it about observing something and trying to
replicate from observation. It just seems that

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seems like trying to replicate a magic
trick that you see in front of your

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eyes, you know, without knowing
the magic behind it. It's true,

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but in your analogy, that does
happen where magicians see their magicians do something

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and then they try to back engineer
the magic trick. And I love that

305
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analogies back engineering the magic. Ooh, that's a good term. So,

306
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I mean it's possible. What they
say is that things like the auroras,

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the color of the auroras, other
types of things that can be determined,

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can help give clues to the technology, and they believe that they've gotten enough

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clues to do something with it.
I don't know that interesting discovery magazine.

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I'll just go through these quickly.
Remember you could see all of these links

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in the front page of Openminds dot
TV but there is an article where they're

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discussing the Drake equation a little further
on Discover magazine. This is the equation

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that tries to determine how many extraterrestrial
civilizations are out there, and it essentially

314
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determines that there's a lot. This
is a really important one. UFO.

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00:23:55.799 --> 00:24:00.000
Joe, who I just had on
recently on the show, Joe Murghy posted

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that article. He was talking about
that with Senator Harry Reid. In one

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of the quotes he highlights, heres, people are afraid to step out for

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00:24:10.240 --> 00:24:15.920
fear of people criticizing them for talking
about extraterrestrial things. So essentially he's saying

319
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that there are a lot more people, important people interested in this topic.

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Then we know that he's talked to
and they just don't want to talk about

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it publicly because they don't want to
be ridiculed. Well hopefully that'll change,

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yeah, a little, hopefully.
And then the Newsweek had a article that

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most people felt was really boring and
kind of lame. And yeah, it's

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not the best article, I would
say, but it's about the top UFO

325
00:24:41.160 --> 00:24:45.720
cases out there. Did you look
at that one? I just glanced at

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it, and it's funny when these
things happened. You know, I always

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feel like arguing with them what they
you know, it's just because you know,

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who's to say really, you know, I hear you. I know,

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yeah, you're right, I mean
exactly, And it's very arbitrary.

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And I guess what's tough is taking
the top cases from Newsweek. They don't

331
00:25:10.920 --> 00:25:14.599
have a clue. Come on,
I mean, it's rare that they would

332
00:25:14.839 --> 00:25:18.160
look too into it to really find
something out. Unfortunately, the mass media

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00:25:18.160 --> 00:25:22.960
doesn't use its due diligence and researching
very hard when it comes to UFOs.

334
00:25:23.400 --> 00:25:29.440
It would give this article more credibility
if they would have referenced perhaps someone in

335
00:25:29.480 --> 00:25:32.359
the note, like if they would
have said, according to Nick Pope,

336
00:25:32.839 --> 00:25:36.240
you know, and Nick Pope obviously
is very aware of many of the great

337
00:25:36.319 --> 00:25:41.599
cases, so that would have been
a more interesting list. Hmm yeah.

338
00:25:41.079 --> 00:25:45.599
Yeah. But Carlou Alisonda, I
recognize these, I recognized the sightings.

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00:25:45.680 --> 00:25:48.440
Is just I don't know if i'd
call them the top, you know,

340
00:25:49.000 --> 00:25:52.200
in the very top. Yeah,
they do have some good ones, but

341
00:25:52.279 --> 00:25:56.960
you know some of them, you
know, are there are controversial? Yeah?

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00:25:56.000 --> 00:26:00.680
There too. Yeah. I guess
the biggest complaint, which is agreed,

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00:26:00.799 --> 00:26:03.799
is how can you even review or
talk about what a great case it

344
00:26:03.880 --> 00:26:06.880
is in one paragraph, which is
about all they give gave to each of

345
00:26:06.880 --> 00:26:10.799
these cases, right, exactly,
Yeah, it is. Every one of

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00:26:10.839 --> 00:26:15.559
these is one paragraph. But they
are great cases. It's one thing I

347
00:26:15.599 --> 00:26:18.720
would argue, and that you know, if you're disappointed with the coverage that

348
00:26:18.799 --> 00:26:23.559
news what gave for these cases,
google them and you'll find out, especially

349
00:26:23.640 --> 00:26:27.640
go to open minds dot tv and
do a search there for these cases and

350
00:26:27.680 --> 00:26:33.400
you'll find out a lot of credible, great information. Right, you can

351
00:26:33.440 --> 00:26:37.200
do your own exploration. Yes,
all right, we're out of time,

352
00:26:37.240 --> 00:26:41.680
buddy, I saw that. Wow. Well, thank you so much for

353
00:26:41.799 --> 00:26:45.880
joining us again this week. Remember
you guys can hear Martinott podcast UFO.

354
00:26:48.279 --> 00:26:52.720
Yeah, thank you, thank you, my friend. Let's go ahead and

355
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talk to our guest Bryce Zabel.
He'll be right on after this short musical

356
00:26:56.319 --> 00:27:00.400
interlude, unless you're listening on a
radio stage and then you'll hear a short

357
00:27:00.559 --> 00:27:06.279
break. Otherwise we'll be back with
Bryce Zabel on Open Mind UFO Radio.

358
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I am terribly happy to have back
on the show, Bryce is Zabel,

359
00:27:47.400 --> 00:27:49.119
So I always love to have you
on the show. How are you doing.

360
00:27:51.079 --> 00:27:53.119
I'm doing great, Alejandro, and
thanks for having me back on It's

361
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very interesting. Over my career,
I guess I've gotten more comfortable talking about

362
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UFOs at night, but I always
say to talk to you about UFOs during

363
00:28:02.400 --> 00:28:04.160
the daylight, which is is a
little more positive. I like that.

364
00:28:04.279 --> 00:28:07.400
I like that too, because my
whole thing is, you know, we

365
00:28:07.519 --> 00:28:11.839
got to be bold, we got
to get out there, and that's why

366
00:28:11.880 --> 00:28:15.480
I try to be I mean,
I think I even try to overdo it.

367
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I'm very careful about, you know, citing sources and being journalistic because

368
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we have to not be afraid of, you know, getting out there and

369
00:28:22.839 --> 00:28:23.839
talking about this. We don't need
to do it in the middle of the

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night. We can do it during
the day, especially for sharing credible information.

371
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Well, it's it's interesting. I
would. I hope that is the

372
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case. I mean, I absolutely
hope that is the case. And I

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hope that none of us who are
talking openly about it or painting big old

374
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targets on our backs for somebody,
oh we are, you know, I

375
00:28:42.559 --> 00:28:45.960
hope that's not happening. I hope, I hope whoever is in charge of

376
00:28:47.400 --> 00:28:52.839
managing this secret and this information over
the years has a you know, has

377
00:28:52.880 --> 00:28:57.559
a positive, evolving sense of how
to go about it, and it doesn't

378
00:28:57.599 --> 00:29:03.559
involve silencing guys like us. So
far, so good. Although guys like

379
00:29:03.880 --> 00:29:07.559
us because we are in the media, there is that aspect, and I

380
00:29:07.559 --> 00:29:11.920
think that it's important that you know
we're cognizant of this, is that media

381
00:29:11.000 --> 00:29:18.079
always gets used as useful idiots,
essentially given information to share that serves a

382
00:29:18.119 --> 00:29:22.119
purpose that we don't know, but
we still have an obligation to report it.

383
00:29:22.400 --> 00:29:30.200
And well and frankly, people like
you are are far beyond useful idiots

384
00:29:30.519 --> 00:29:34.079
at this point because you're taking information
not from from a lot of different sources,

385
00:29:34.119 --> 00:29:44.079
you're applying journalistic ethics and thoughts to
it, you're applying scientific discussion to

386
00:29:44.160 --> 00:29:48.319
it, and you're you're looking at
information from multiple sources in different ways.

387
00:29:48.519 --> 00:29:52.480
So you're not being spoon fed anymore. And I think that's the that's the

388
00:29:52.480 --> 00:29:56.000
good thing about where we are right
now in twenty nineteen. Well, and

389
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that's what I try to do,
is that you know, first of all,

390
00:29:59.200 --> 00:30:02.599
it's important to be there and if
we are being used, but at

391
00:30:02.599 --> 00:30:06.359
the second on the second half,
it's also we can take the other information

392
00:30:06.440 --> 00:30:10.559
that's credible out there and match it
up and see what we get to hopefully

393
00:30:10.599 --> 00:30:15.960
identify any discrepancies. And you know, that kind of brings us to today.

394
00:30:15.319 --> 00:30:19.359
We've got a tip and you know, I've admitted I'm kind of friendly

395
00:30:19.400 --> 00:30:22.039
with Louie Alizondo. I'm gonna have
him on the show. Here. People

396
00:30:22.079 --> 00:30:26.720
are like, you know, they've
got to be bs and and feeding disinformation.

397
00:30:27.279 --> 00:30:30.640
I think over the last couple of
years we've seen that everything that loose

398
00:30:30.680 --> 00:30:34.319
tell us has kind of come to
fruition and we've found it from other outlets,

399
00:30:34.319 --> 00:30:37.960
and of course George nappis sharing a
lot of information. He's a great

400
00:30:38.039 --> 00:30:44.359
journalist. They're in Las Vegas.
So I think that we are being smarter

401
00:30:44.440 --> 00:30:48.039
and by now I think we're seeing, especially with witnesses coming out, that

402
00:30:48.119 --> 00:30:52.480
this is some pretty good information we're
getting. Yeah, it's good information,

403
00:30:52.799 --> 00:30:59.319
and it's becoming more complete. The
puzzle picture is filling in a little bit.

404
00:30:59.799 --> 00:31:03.559
It's interesting you've just named somebody who
you know, they always play that

405
00:31:03.559 --> 00:31:06.799
game, who would you like to
have dinner with? And if could be

406
00:31:06.839 --> 00:31:08.920
living or dead. If it was
living, I think Loue Alisando is somebody

407
00:31:08.920 --> 00:31:14.200
I want to have dinner with I've
met a lot of people in this UFO

408
00:31:14.279 --> 00:31:17.559
business, but I have not met
him, and he seems to me like

409
00:31:17.839 --> 00:31:21.519
a very important man at this time
in history. And I guess the other

410
00:31:21.559 --> 00:31:23.279
guy I'd like to meet right now
would be Tom DeLong to figure out,

411
00:31:25.279 --> 00:31:27.119
you know where he's Have you met
Tom? Do you know Tom? I've

412
00:31:27.200 --> 00:31:33.279
spoken to him on the phone.
He actually came to the Congress and you

413
00:31:33.359 --> 00:31:36.319
might have been there, but I
was so busy I didn't even know he

414
00:31:36.440 --> 00:31:38.319
was at dinner. He was at
the dinner the whole time, and I

415
00:31:38.440 --> 00:31:41.640
didn't get to meet him, and
I really regret that. So I've been

416
00:31:41.680 --> 00:31:45.000
invited to come down to their store. They're just in Encinitas and they're not

417
00:31:45.119 --> 00:31:51.000
far from you, and they have
meetings there. I think, you know

418
00:31:51.039 --> 00:31:53.559
what. I hesitate to say this, but I think we're talking road trip.

419
00:31:55.079 --> 00:31:57.440
I think you and me in a
road trip. It sounds good to

420
00:31:57.480 --> 00:32:02.039
me. An excused to be that
at the beach and I love Inntonitas.

421
00:32:02.039 --> 00:32:06.440
Oh, it's it's fantastic, and
you know, you know, all kidding

422
00:32:06.480 --> 00:32:12.480
aside, These are two people that
are doing the good work right now,

423
00:32:12.640 --> 00:32:16.000
and as are you and a number
of other people right now, and this

424
00:32:16.079 --> 00:32:23.680
is the time to continue to network, to get the people who are the

425
00:32:24.119 --> 00:32:30.000
leadership of this to start to mend
themselves together so that we can we can

426
00:32:30.039 --> 00:32:37.880
present kind of a unified front in
the cause of disclosure, which is what

427
00:32:37.920 --> 00:32:40.759
we're talking about. One of the
topics we're going to talk about is disclosure

428
00:32:40.799 --> 00:32:45.480
and this does matter and segue into
it because we'll be talking about what is

429
00:32:45.480 --> 00:32:51.000
the definition of disclosure and are we
seeing disclosure here? And speaking of Tom

430
00:32:51.039 --> 00:32:55.559
DeLong before the show comes out later
next month, I've already written this story.

431
00:32:55.880 --> 00:33:00.359
I've written a story why the heck
is this rock star, you know,

432
00:33:00.400 --> 00:33:05.960
investigating UFOs with these former intelligence officials
on this History Channel show, And

433
00:33:06.000 --> 00:33:09.240
that's the gist of the article.
But what the article explains is none of

434
00:33:09.240 --> 00:33:13.559
this would have happened without Tom DeLong. So you can make fun of him

435
00:33:13.640 --> 00:33:16.400
all you want, playing his guitar
and his underwear, you know, running

436
00:33:16.440 --> 00:33:22.319
around with the girls and whatever the
goofy stuff he used to do, but

437
00:33:22.400 --> 00:33:25.160
we would not be here if it
wasn't for Tom DeLong. He is the

438
00:33:25.200 --> 00:33:30.400
definition of a catalyst. He is
someone who you know, through the force

439
00:33:30.440 --> 00:33:36.279
of his own will has willed certain
events into happening, and I have to

440
00:33:36.359 --> 00:33:38.880
say that's terrific. And you mentioned
George Knapp, who I happen to think

441
00:33:39.000 --> 00:33:45.839
is probably probably the best journalist reporting
on this today in my view, and

442
00:33:45.880 --> 00:33:50.880
he's you know, I know,
Tom has been a controversial character, but

443
00:33:51.799 --> 00:33:54.559
I sat down for lunch with George
and he said, Tom's the real deal.

444
00:33:54.680 --> 00:33:59.400
So I believe George is the real
deal. So I believe Tom is

445
00:33:59.440 --> 00:34:02.440
the real deal. Yeah, George
is all right. Well, George and

446
00:34:02.480 --> 00:34:07.599
Tom, I'm just very impressed with
what they've gotten done. So that brings

447
00:34:07.679 --> 00:34:14.079
us to our topic of disclosure.
So you have been inspired lately to get

448
00:34:14.119 --> 00:34:16.800
on Twitter and to kind of start
some conversations, and one of the conversations

449
00:34:16.840 --> 00:34:22.599
you started was, hey, we
really need to define disclosure. And it

450
00:34:22.639 --> 00:34:28.519
looks you feel you ran into some
issues there. So what inspired you to

451
00:34:28.599 --> 00:34:30.960
kind of get out there and decide, you know what, right now we

452
00:34:30.039 --> 00:34:35.400
really need to read a fine this
And what did you find out? Well,

453
00:34:35.440 --> 00:34:37.320
first of all, I wrote a
book about it with Richard Dolan ad

454
00:34:37.519 --> 00:34:42.599
After Disclosure, and so I've been
thinking about disclosure for a long time.

455
00:34:43.440 --> 00:34:46.000
But because in the years since that
book, came out. I've had a

456
00:34:46.000 --> 00:34:52.119
lot of conversations with people like you
and many many others, and I realized

457
00:34:52.400 --> 00:34:58.639
that disclosure means different things to different
people. There's small D disclosure, there's

458
00:34:58.880 --> 00:35:06.800
capital D disclosure, And even in
a meeting of people who are in the

459
00:35:06.840 --> 00:35:10.320
know, researchers, et cetera,
people use the word differently. And I'm

460
00:35:10.400 --> 00:35:16.719
not saying that I have any insight
into what should actually be the title of

461
00:35:16.760 --> 00:35:21.480
it or the definition of it,
but I think it doesn't hurt us to

462
00:35:21.519 --> 00:35:29.760
start asking about it. Disclosure to
me is particularly because the book that Richard

463
00:35:29.800 --> 00:35:32.880
Dolan and I wrote was called AD
After Disclosure. We were trying to go

464
00:35:32.960 --> 00:35:39.360
for the calendar metaphor that the BC
world is before confirmation and the AD world

465
00:35:39.440 --> 00:35:45.559
is the after disclosure, which would
mean tends to suggest that there's an event,

466
00:35:45.920 --> 00:35:50.360
there's a disclosure event that takes you
from where we are now in that

467
00:35:50.480 --> 00:35:57.599
sort of before confirmation to the after
disclosure moment, and that implies that something

468
00:35:57.719 --> 00:36:01.159
happens that literally changes the game.
Now what could that be? I mean,

469
00:36:01.920 --> 00:36:09.599
I've seen our mutual friend Steve Bassett
say it's when extraterrestrial presence is acknowledged.

470
00:36:09.679 --> 00:36:15.079
By basically the political class. I
think, you know, I don't

471
00:36:15.079 --> 00:36:19.920
have his definition in front of me, but I think we need to look

472
00:36:19.960 --> 00:36:23.960
at it a little broader because I
don't think we know that it's extraterrestrial alone,

473
00:36:24.199 --> 00:36:29.719
or maybe even at all. And
I don't know that disclosure, which

474
00:36:29.800 --> 00:36:34.920
is kind of a process, is
something that can necessarily be done by just,

475
00:36:35.519 --> 00:36:38.440
you know, one person making some
proclamation. It's a group event.

476
00:36:38.800 --> 00:36:44.800
And then my thinking started to evolve
a little bit further, which is the

477
00:36:44.880 --> 00:36:51.119
disclosure that we've been talking about is
really an official confirmation of UFO reality.

478
00:36:51.840 --> 00:36:54.000
And by official, I guess it
could be the Pope, it could be

479
00:36:54.039 --> 00:36:59.360
the president, it could be the
Chinese premiere, somebody gets the ball rolling,

480
00:36:59.599 --> 00:37:06.440
okay, But I think disclosure needs
a broader definition because we're now entering

481
00:37:06.480 --> 00:37:12.280
into the political world where our political
representatives are going to have to know what

482
00:37:12.639 --> 00:37:17.679
we expect of them when disclosure begins, and so I would say it has

483
00:37:17.760 --> 00:37:22.800
to go a little bit beyond just
confirming, Yeah, some of those things

484
00:37:22.800 --> 00:37:27.920
that are out there aren't ours.
I mean, that's disclosure, But are

485
00:37:27.920 --> 00:37:30.840
we all going to be happy when
they say that? I don't think so.

486
00:37:30.840 --> 00:37:34.880
So I'm trying to. I'm trying
to look at a broader definition,

487
00:37:35.199 --> 00:37:40.920
which would be disclosure requires the official
confirmation of UFO reality, the transparent release

488
00:37:40.960 --> 00:37:47.199
of evidence, and independent investigations.
To me, that's when disclosures full on

489
00:37:47.440 --> 00:37:52.920
happening. We've got to go beyond
just standing up, you know. I

490
00:37:52.920 --> 00:37:57.440
mean if Donald Trump stood up tomorrow
and said, yeah, I think UFOs

491
00:37:57.440 --> 00:38:00.079
are real, I mean, I
don't think that would be the end all

492
00:38:00.280 --> 00:38:02.800
be all. I think that would
just be a starting gun. And maybe

493
00:38:02.800 --> 00:38:06.679
not even that, because half the
people that heard him say it would say,

494
00:38:06.719 --> 00:38:09.079
I don't believe anything the man says. Anyway. You know, I

495
00:38:09.079 --> 00:38:14.159
think you raised a lot of great
points. Now, Antonio and I at

496
00:38:14.199 --> 00:38:17.400
Open Minds used to talk about this
a lot because we would right about it,

497
00:38:17.440 --> 00:38:21.960
and you know, back when we're
doing the magazine and everything, and

498
00:38:22.000 --> 00:38:24.960
we had our whole crew there at
Open Minds. That's when Bassett and a

499
00:38:24.960 --> 00:38:29.719
lot of the other disclosure people were
out and they were debating themselves what the

500
00:38:29.760 --> 00:38:34.920
definition was, and Antonio always stuck
to and I think he's right that the

501
00:38:35.480 --> 00:38:37.760
disclosure, at least the way that
we've been defining it, is a political

502
00:38:37.840 --> 00:38:43.599
process. When politics gets involved and
starts to release this information. And we

503
00:38:43.679 --> 00:38:45.280
hear this a lot speaking of Trump. You know, we always hear impeachment

504
00:38:45.320 --> 00:38:50.719
as a political process, that disclosure
is the same. It's attached to by

505
00:38:50.800 --> 00:38:57.679
definition politics, and that's how we
always went forward thinking about it. But

506
00:38:57.800 --> 00:39:00.480
you know what, there's also what
Big talks about. I love this.

507
00:39:00.559 --> 00:39:05.400
I don't know if you've heard him
talk about this. He talks about confirmation.

508
00:39:05.519 --> 00:39:07.360
He says I could give it damn
about he loves that I can give

509
00:39:07.400 --> 00:39:09.679
it damn. He kind of looks
like Rex Butler, I guess in a

510
00:39:09.679 --> 00:39:14.320
little bit of a way. But
maybe that's why he likes that term.

511
00:39:14.800 --> 00:39:19.599
But he's like, I think what's
more important. He says, he thinks

512
00:39:19.639 --> 00:39:22.760
disclosures happen. He thinks the government
has, you know, essentially admitted there's

513
00:39:23.039 --> 00:39:30.239
a phenomena going on that we don't
understand. He likes to use the word

514
00:39:30.320 --> 00:39:35.000
confirmation, that he's looking for confirmation
when all of the public realize that this

515
00:39:35.119 --> 00:39:38.000
is a thing. Well, you
know, first of all, it's a

516
00:39:38.000 --> 00:39:43.119
good discussion to have because it's good
to get people talking about it, and

517
00:39:43.239 --> 00:39:46.559
confirmation is certainly a part of it. You can't really have disclosure. If

518
00:39:46.559 --> 00:39:52.239
you don't confirm something, I try
to. Here's my long version of what

519
00:39:52.320 --> 00:39:57.000
I want from disclosure. It's like
I may not be defining it, but

520
00:39:57.039 --> 00:40:00.360
I am trying to define what I
want from it. Okay, my first

521
00:40:00.440 --> 00:40:07.599
take on it was disclosure requires global
confirmation of non conventional uap UFO reality made

522
00:40:07.599 --> 00:40:14.719
public by multiple official sources in a
way that allows citizens to investigate and engage

523
00:40:14.760 --> 00:40:19.639
the phenomenon openly and without ridicule.
Okay, that's my long version. But

524
00:40:19.760 --> 00:40:24.239
what I mean by it is that
somebody official can't just say yeah, yeah,

525
00:40:24.599 --> 00:40:29.400
some of that's real and then dodge
forever. They've got to say it

526
00:40:29.440 --> 00:40:32.159
in a way that this stigma that's
been put on people who want to talk

527
00:40:32.199 --> 00:40:37.000
about this topic is removed, that
it's not We're not going to be denied

528
00:40:37.039 --> 00:40:45.360
and ridiculed anymore. That whoever is
disclosing anything, the political system needs to

529
00:40:45.400 --> 00:40:52.199
move in in a way that allows
us as citizens to do our own investigations

530
00:40:52.239 --> 00:40:59.280
and to use our governments to aid
and help in those investigations, because you

531
00:40:59.320 --> 00:41:01.920
know, we have a lot of
missing time of you know, missing political

532
00:41:01.960 --> 00:41:07.800
time to make up for. Once
we toss this into the body politic.

533
00:41:08.000 --> 00:41:10.960
You know, that's a starter's gun, but we're not going to finish that

534
00:41:12.079 --> 00:41:16.400
race for quite some time. And
this is the other hard part of all

535
00:41:16.440 --> 00:41:21.039
of this is, you know,
I think, first of all, everything's

536
00:41:21.320 --> 00:41:23.960
very compartmentalized. People have to realize
that a lot of people have been talking.

537
00:41:24.000 --> 00:41:27.360
Well, Louie Alisondo, if he
worked on a UFO program, how

538
00:41:27.360 --> 00:41:29.920
can he not know about this?
How can he not know about that?

539
00:41:30.000 --> 00:41:35.480
Well, if those other things are
going on, then he might not know

540
00:41:35.559 --> 00:41:38.320
about those things. Then the other
question was, you know, at least

541
00:41:38.360 --> 00:41:40.880
in my mind, I'm thinking,
well, maybe there isn't anything else going

542
00:41:40.880 --> 00:41:45.400
on and he's got the only game
in town. But lately we've heard Harry

543
00:41:45.440 --> 00:41:50.719
Reid, we've heard him, we've
heard others say there are other programs and

544
00:41:50.840 --> 00:41:54.519
other departments that they're aware of,
and even going so far, I think

545
00:41:54.599 --> 00:41:59.440
read even said that he thinks they
might be coming out in the light here

546
00:41:59.519 --> 00:42:05.719
soon. So I mean, Harry
Reid is if we gave a disclosure Person

547
00:42:05.800 --> 00:42:10.400
of the Year award, I you
know, while well Elizondo probably got it

548
00:42:10.440 --> 00:42:15.400
for twenty eighteen or twenty seventeen,
I give it to Harry Reid for twenty

549
00:42:15.480 --> 00:42:20.840
nineteen, So right, I mean, I just think this is the man

550
00:42:20.880 --> 00:42:27.239
who, Yeah, I watched on
the news as the head of the Senate

551
00:42:27.519 --> 00:42:30.920
for years, and I always thought, well, he's a button down kind

552
00:42:30.920 --> 00:42:35.679
of guy. And you know,
beneath that the button down was beating a

553
00:42:35.719 --> 00:42:39.639
heart that knew that UFOs are real. And how great it is that he's

554
00:42:39.719 --> 00:42:44.199
willing to step up front. He's
and I like what he's you know,

555
00:42:44.280 --> 00:42:47.639
what he is saying is disclosure of
its own kind. He's saying, there's

556
00:42:47.760 --> 00:42:52.079
facts out there that prove these things
are real. Okay, that's let's just

557
00:42:52.159 --> 00:42:57.519
call that level one disclosure. I
mean, but it can't just be one

558
00:42:57.559 --> 00:43:01.280
guy. It can't just be Harry
Reid confirming just that there's something to study

559
00:43:02.440 --> 00:43:07.039
we need to get. If it's
just going to be a confirmation that some

560
00:43:07.079 --> 00:43:09.519
of this is real, then we
need it even higher than Harry Reid.

561
00:43:09.519 --> 00:43:14.320
It needs to go to the President
and the Congress and so forth. And

562
00:43:14.360 --> 00:43:17.880
then there's the level two of disclosure, which is give us some details.

563
00:43:19.400 --> 00:43:23.480
Because I cannot believe that a government
and a world that has been studying this

564
00:43:23.599 --> 00:43:29.639
since the end of World War two
and that is pretty much confirmed. I

565
00:43:29.679 --> 00:43:32.039
can't believe they don't have some conclusions
by now, and I want to see

566
00:43:32.039 --> 00:43:37.719
those conclusions and want I want to
be able to talk about the interpretation of

567
00:43:37.760 --> 00:43:44.559
those conclusions without being ridiculed for doing
so. And this is the transition that

568
00:43:44.599 --> 00:43:47.280
we're all trying to go for.
And by the way, we just danced

569
00:43:47.320 --> 00:43:51.159
around it. But I'm just going
to lay this out there right now.

570
00:43:51.599 --> 00:43:55.480
It is distinctly possible, and I
hope you're all sitting down. It is

571
00:43:55.639 --> 00:44:02.519
distinctly possible that Donald Trump will be
our disclosure president well. And I wanted

572
00:44:02.519 --> 00:44:07.280
to bring that up because that perplexes
me the whole that with this administration.

573
00:44:07.559 --> 00:44:12.239
But we'll get into that in just
a minute. I do want to address

574
00:44:12.320 --> 00:44:15.280
one other thing, because there could
be for people having hang ups there and

575
00:44:15.320 --> 00:44:17.519
saying no, Harry. First of
all, there's people having heart attacks all

576
00:44:17.559 --> 00:44:21.880
over your radio audience at that pot. But go ahead, please, Oh

577
00:44:22.039 --> 00:44:25.039
I know, but there are people
like you know, I think, thinking,

578
00:44:25.079 --> 00:44:28.480
well, the only reason Harry reads
in this because he was trying to

579
00:44:28.480 --> 00:44:31.079
get money to his buddy Robert Bigelow. But I want to put that in

580
00:44:31.159 --> 00:44:37.639
perspective Robert Bigelow. This is according
to Bloomberg by twenty thirteen, he had

581
00:44:37.760 --> 00:44:45.599
spent a quarter of a billion dollars
on his inflatable space habitats and all out

582
00:44:45.599 --> 00:44:50.480
of his own pocket, a quarter
of a billion dollars. He did not

583
00:44:50.800 --> 00:44:54.480
need the twenty two million dollars they
got for this program to put in his

584
00:44:54.639 --> 00:45:00.000
pockets. And actually the facts are
he that twenty two women million wasn't enough

585
00:45:00.480 --> 00:45:04.559
to complete the work that they wanted
to do, so he spent money out

586
00:45:04.599 --> 00:45:08.039
of his pocket beyond that twenty two
million dollars. And if you think about

587
00:45:08.320 --> 00:45:12.960
first of all, yes, stand
up for Robert Bigelow, because really this

588
00:45:13.000 --> 00:45:17.000
guy is a hero too, and
he should be acknowledged for being out front

589
00:45:17.039 --> 00:45:23.000
and being clear. And let's also
acknowledge that twenty two million dollars, twenty

590
00:45:23.039 --> 00:45:27.079
two million dollars is a lot.
It changed my life a lot, and

591
00:45:27.119 --> 00:45:30.920
it probably changed yours and everyone who's
listening. But in terms of money,

592
00:45:30.960 --> 00:45:36.480
you throw it a problem such as
UFOs are. In terms of acknowledging what

593
00:45:36.559 --> 00:45:40.400
they are and understanding them, well, first of all, it's pretty clear

594
00:45:40.440 --> 00:45:45.559
that our black budgets have thrown billions
of dollars into their study over the years,

595
00:45:45.880 --> 00:45:51.880
and so this twenty two million dollars, is you know that's chump change

596
00:45:51.920 --> 00:45:55.480
for investigating a phenomenon that's this large, and just think about it. There

597
00:45:55.480 --> 00:46:00.559
are some reports out there that if
we could get those DECLASSI, that would

598
00:46:00.559 --> 00:46:02.840
curl your hair, and I'd like
to get my hair curled at this point,

599
00:46:04.079 --> 00:46:07.639
right. And I'm excited to see
the History Channel show because according to

600
00:46:07.719 --> 00:46:09.719
Lou, this History Channel show that's
going to be focusing on to the Stars,

601
00:46:09.760 --> 00:46:14.639
and it sounds like it's really centered
around Lou because he would work for

602
00:46:14.679 --> 00:46:20.239
the government investigating UFOs and now how
he's investigating UFOs in the private sector with

603
00:46:21.519 --> 00:46:27.079
Tom DeLong and to the Stars Supposedly
there will be some more revelations about cases

604
00:46:27.880 --> 00:46:32.719
that they had looked at in the
government program a tip and that some of

605
00:46:32.719 --> 00:46:37.280
these aren't better than the Knimets case. And I think you would agree the

606
00:46:37.360 --> 00:46:40.639
Nimet's case is pretty extraordinary. Oh
you know those are It's a great case.

607
00:46:40.920 --> 00:46:45.280
And I think the interesting thing is
because we started talking about trying you

608
00:46:45.360 --> 00:46:50.519
to define disclosure, it is a
moving target because what literally is happening under

609
00:46:50.559 --> 00:46:55.800
our feet and will accelerate and become
a thing after this unidentified program is more

610
00:46:55.840 --> 00:47:00.440
and more of us will say,
yeah, there's pretty good evidence that something's

611
00:47:00.440 --> 00:47:06.079
going on. Well, that's progress
because we've not had that before, and

612
00:47:06.079 --> 00:47:09.119
and that will be an incremental step. It may blow your mind, this

613
00:47:09.280 --> 00:47:13.760
Nimtz case, but it's you know, I most of my friends have never

614
00:47:13.800 --> 00:47:16.280
heard of it, and maybe more
of them will, and maybe more of

615
00:47:16.320 --> 00:47:21.000
them will be knowledge about to start
talking about it. And then once we

616
00:47:21.199 --> 00:47:30.639
establish that beachhead that there's literally government
video and technology put to you know,

617
00:47:30.559 --> 00:47:35.639
seeing some of these for what they
are. Once you get more people accepting

618
00:47:35.679 --> 00:47:39.800
that, then the question is going
to become, well, okay, what's

619
00:47:39.840 --> 00:47:45.000
the official response to what they are? It's you've shown me they exist,

620
00:47:45.599 --> 00:47:50.559
but what are they? And at
that point, I think you start to

621
00:47:50.599 --> 00:47:57.880
get a more radicalized electorate and population
that say, it's not acceptable to me

622
00:47:58.400 --> 00:48:01.519
that our government found out what these
things, that these things exist. I

623
00:48:01.559 --> 00:48:07.760
would like to know the details.
But what's interesting is I think there's two

624
00:48:07.920 --> 00:48:14.199
major schools of thought I should say
three that have been revealed in looking into

625
00:48:14.239 --> 00:48:20.760
the details of how these government programs
worked. There is the school of thought

626
00:48:20.840 --> 00:48:23.159
that we don't know that there's a
phenomenon, and this would be louell Esando,

627
00:48:23.519 --> 00:48:28.119
who is the closest we have to
an official voice to what's going on.

628
00:48:28.280 --> 00:48:30.199
Essentially, he's like the head of
blue Book. You know, he

629
00:48:30.239 --> 00:48:31.960
was head of a UFO project.
He says, we don't know. We

630
00:48:32.039 --> 00:48:37.039
know that they are technology that are
beyond our own, but we don't know.

631
00:48:37.480 --> 00:48:43.239
However, some of the things that
scientists are looking into in that work

632
00:48:43.320 --> 00:48:47.920
with a tip and outside of it
are more prone and comfortable. Interesting enough,

633
00:48:47.920 --> 00:48:52.360
in my experience talking with these scientists
to go the interdimensional route to say

634
00:48:52.400 --> 00:48:58.599
that, you know, we're learning
so much about interdimensions. Maybe dimensions can

635
00:48:58.679 --> 00:49:02.360
interact with each other and somehow that's
what we're seeing. I think that's really

636
00:49:02.400 --> 00:49:08.119
interesting that scientists are largely kind of
moving in that direction. It's very interesting

637
00:49:08.480 --> 00:49:16.639
because because that's sort of they're adapting
the John Keel and the Jacques Vlet kind

638
00:49:16.679 --> 00:49:22.239
of take on this. That's it's
probably more than nuts and bolts from another

639
00:49:22.320 --> 00:49:25.920
planet, right exactly. Which I
love that perspective because it's the scientific one.

640
00:49:25.960 --> 00:49:29.559
You know, that's where valet and
we've got to follow the data,

641
00:49:29.599 --> 00:49:34.679
and the data just hasn't given us
anything definitive yet. The second one would

642
00:49:34.679 --> 00:49:37.599
be that there's nothing to it,
that it's all silly. But there is

643
00:49:37.639 --> 00:49:45.800
a major third opinion that has had
a tremendous effect, and that is that

644
00:49:45.920 --> 00:49:52.760
it's demonic. That there is a
large contingency of Christians inside of Christian officials

645
00:49:52.840 --> 00:49:58.760
inside the government who have not wanted
to even investigate any of this because it's

646
00:49:58.800 --> 00:50:01.639
a demonic and we ca can't mess
with it. And we heard this years

647
00:50:01.639 --> 00:50:07.679
ago from how put Up when they
were doing their remote viewing. They're essentially

648
00:50:07.719 --> 00:50:13.840
kind of esp research and you know, running a successful program for like decades

649
00:50:14.599 --> 00:50:16.119
doing this, but the religious faction
said, no, this is demonic,

650
00:50:16.159 --> 00:50:20.760
we can't do it anymore. And
sure enough we hear from lou at least

651
00:50:20.760 --> 00:50:27.119
the first iteration of this organization also
got squashed for that same reason. Well,

652
00:50:27.159 --> 00:50:31.239
there's no question that there are people
that take that point of view.

653
00:50:31.840 --> 00:50:37.239
In fact, when I was working
on a show called Mantis, my fellow

654
00:50:37.360 --> 00:50:43.079
executive producer knew more about UFOs than
me, but he was sure that they

655
00:50:43.119 --> 00:50:49.639
were all angels and demons, and
yet he was very well versed on it.

656
00:50:49.719 --> 00:50:52.320
And I think there's a lot of
people like that. On the other

657
00:50:52.360 --> 00:50:57.159
hand, I've done some polls on
my own like this Twitter site, and

658
00:50:57.639 --> 00:51:00.639
angels and demons came in dead last
out of four options. You know,

659
00:51:00.920 --> 00:51:05.880
so well, it may be that
there are embedded people in our government who

660
00:51:05.960 --> 00:51:10.159
are feeling that, and maybe that's
why they've gone they've slow walked any disclosure.

661
00:51:10.880 --> 00:51:15.440
I don't think that the majority of
the public in any way thinks that's

662
00:51:15.519 --> 00:51:19.760
the case. But in a way, it almost doesn't matter, does it,

663
00:51:19.800 --> 00:51:23.440
Alexandro, Because the truth of the
matter is, there's probably a phenomenon

664
00:51:23.760 --> 00:51:28.840
that we are interpreting differently, but
the phenomenon is probably what it is.

665
00:51:28.880 --> 00:51:31.719
In other words, somebody may look
at this phenomenon and say, oh,

666
00:51:32.840 --> 00:51:37.679
those are fairies and folklore, and
somebody else may say, no, it's

667
00:51:37.719 --> 00:51:40.880
angels and demons, and somebody else
may say it's extraterrestrial, and somebody else

668
00:51:42.079 --> 00:51:45.119
may say it's interdimensional. They're probably
looking at roughly the same thing, or

669
00:51:45.159 --> 00:51:51.360
at least a collection of things that
are related. So this is why I

670
00:51:51.480 --> 00:51:57.760
want the people and we've got to
take a break. So hold that that.

671
00:51:57.880 --> 00:52:00.039
We've got to take a break right
now, pick up the rest of

672
00:52:00.079 --> 00:52:02.960
this and get into something else that
you brought up just some minute ago.

673
00:52:04.400 --> 00:52:07.440
After this break. For those of
you listening to the podcast, you'll hear

674
00:52:07.480 --> 00:52:12.000
a short musical interlude. For the
rest of you, you'll hear some commercials.

675
00:52:12.039 --> 00:52:15.039
But we'll be right back with Bryce
Zabel. So stay tuned to Open

676
00:52:15.079 --> 00:52:35.239
Mind UFO Radio. Welcome back to
Open Mind UFO Radio. This is your

677
00:52:35.239 --> 00:52:37.960
host, Alejandro Rojas, and we
are here with Bryce zab And we were

678
00:52:38.000 --> 00:52:43.079
just talking about kind of that third
faction to religious faction, and you were

679
00:52:43.119 --> 00:52:47.320
finishing up your point there. Oh, I think I was. Uh.

680
00:52:49.760 --> 00:52:55.400
I think what I'm saying is I
don't think that the even if that is

681
00:52:55.559 --> 00:53:00.320
an explanation for why there are people
in our government who have resisted telling the

682
00:53:00.400 --> 00:53:04.920
truth. I don't think that's the
reason why they haven't told it. I

683
00:53:04.960 --> 00:53:09.519
think I think that's a relatively recent
phenomenon, if it even exists, you

684
00:53:09.559 --> 00:53:15.559
know that that people in the government
have resisted telling us because of this this

685
00:53:15.679 --> 00:53:22.920
demon kind of thing. I just
think whatever this phenomenon is is obviously very

686
00:53:22.480 --> 00:53:27.920
distressing in some respects, and that
it's bigger than our ability to comprehend it.

687
00:53:28.119 --> 00:53:31.079
And as time has gone on,
much has been studied. So I

688
00:53:32.000 --> 00:53:37.599
think that there's a lot of information
that the government and others possibly out of

689
00:53:37.679 --> 00:53:43.280
government have and it just hasn't been
shared for reasons that don't have anything to

690
00:53:43.320 --> 00:53:46.320
do with demonology. Mm hm.
Although you know, but again we could

691
00:53:46.360 --> 00:53:50.679
be wrong. Who knows, I
mean, we don't know. I think

692
00:53:50.000 --> 00:53:53.480
that the scary part is, you
know, it could be hampering a stance.

693
00:53:53.599 --> 00:53:58.800
And I think what happens with these
groups is that they there's these big

694
00:53:58.840 --> 00:54:00.760
echo chambers, you know, essentially, and I think there's a lot of

695
00:54:00.760 --> 00:54:07.559
that going on. We have these
segments of the population that we don't see

696
00:54:07.639 --> 00:54:12.320
because they're outside of our realm,
but they exist there where people are going

697
00:54:12.360 --> 00:54:15.519
to these meanings, like you know, going to these meetings and having these

698
00:54:15.800 --> 00:54:22.000
so for instance, Roswell has its
own kind of religious based event every year

699
00:54:22.719 --> 00:54:24.719
and there are a lot of people
there. It's just those people don't interact

700
00:54:24.760 --> 00:54:28.480
with us because they're like, well, you know, I already learned from

701
00:54:28.480 --> 00:54:30.320
my church about this their demons.
Why do I need to listen to Bryce.

702
00:54:31.320 --> 00:54:35.920
Well, that may be true,
although I'm getting a little I'm not

703
00:54:36.519 --> 00:54:40.559
down with trying to dismiss ufology as
some kind of modern religion. I know

704
00:54:40.639 --> 00:54:49.920
that was popular in this latest book
that came out from Diana Pasolka. I

705
00:54:50.119 --> 00:54:57.159
just don't buy it. I don't
want Rosweld to be dismissed. Because people

706
00:54:57.239 --> 00:55:00.679
go there and have fun at a
festival doesn't change the underlying reality of it.

707
00:55:00.840 --> 00:55:06.119
The underlying reality is that event probably
happened, and there probably were bodies

708
00:55:06.159 --> 00:55:13.320
and crafts and that happened. And
the fact that people make funny alien blow

709
00:55:13.400 --> 00:55:19.159
up models in Roswell seventy years later, I don't think is a knock against

710
00:55:19.239 --> 00:55:23.159
the original thing. So, you
know, I don't know, there's enough.

711
00:55:23.239 --> 00:55:27.199
There's so much going on right now. We live in a really interesting

712
00:55:27.320 --> 00:55:30.719
time. But you know, just
to follow the Roswell thing, there's this

713
00:55:30.880 --> 00:55:36.000
article out in Newsweek right now about
the best cases, and they come up

714
00:55:36.039 --> 00:55:39.679
with their little plan to rate the
best cases in UFOs and I was frankly

715
00:55:39.760 --> 00:55:44.960
really intrigued. I mean, it's
great to have some kind of mainstream media

716
00:55:45.000 --> 00:55:49.159
look at this. But what's the
first thing they do They dismiss They start

717
00:55:49.239 --> 00:55:53.159
their list of cases with the worst
possible one. They call Roswell, all

718
00:55:53.239 --> 00:55:59.639
right, And why does Newsweek call
Roswell the worst possible case? Because the

719
00:55:59.679 --> 00:56:04.440
government in nineteen ninety seven said it
wasn't It never happened, And because the

720
00:56:04.440 --> 00:56:09.719
government said that there were dummies that
were the reason why people thought they saw

721
00:56:09.800 --> 00:56:15.079
bodies, and because of that,
in less than one paragraph, they dismissed

722
00:56:15.079 --> 00:56:17.679
the whole thing. Is the worst
case. So I got to tell you,

723
00:56:17.760 --> 00:56:22.039
we are getting more people talking about
it, but we still got to

724
00:56:22.079 --> 00:56:27.440
bring the game up of some of
the media who just they want to talk

725
00:56:27.480 --> 00:56:31.239
about it now, but they aren't
assigning anybody to actually dig deep into this

726
00:56:31.280 --> 00:56:36.679
and try to understand it. They're
just tilling the same old nonsense and it's

727
00:56:36.719 --> 00:56:39.719
time for us to go up a
level. That's my take. I agree,

728
00:56:39.719 --> 00:56:43.960
And it's been one of the difficult
parts with the media, and we've

729
00:56:43.960 --> 00:56:47.519
talked about this before, is that
you know a lot of people in mainstream

730
00:56:47.559 --> 00:56:52.800
media do not feel they have to
put their normal due diligence to work when

731
00:56:52.840 --> 00:56:58.039
they're writing about UFOs, and they
would writing for anything else. And it

732
00:56:58.119 --> 00:57:00.960
is unfortunate because that's why I've been
trying to really push and you know,

733
00:57:00.960 --> 00:57:06.920
I got to be involved with this
CW show and I wrote this article about

734
00:57:07.480 --> 00:57:08.920
how you know, at the very
least there is a cover up. We

735
00:57:09.000 --> 00:57:15.320
know for a fact you know that
those pictures, that debris is not what

736
00:57:15.320 --> 00:57:20.840
what was found, and that is
if you're a journalist, you have to

737
00:57:20.880 --> 00:57:25.440
cover that aspect because there's your reason
that there's a conspiracy because we have a

738
00:57:25.480 --> 00:57:30.079
cover up, and so what's going
on here, and by glassing that over

739
00:57:30.960 --> 00:57:35.199
or not even covering it shows they're
not doing their their homework at all.

740
00:57:35.599 --> 00:57:38.719
It just cracks you up. I
mean, here is a Newsweek reporter assigned

741
00:57:38.719 --> 00:57:45.119
by the magazine to write this article
who says, the extent of my investigation

742
00:57:45.280 --> 00:57:50.559
of this topic is that I'm going
to dismiss Roswell as the worst case ever

743
00:57:50.800 --> 00:57:57.000
because the government denies it happen.
Right. Wow, that's hilarious. That's

744
00:57:57.039 --> 00:58:01.639
like lazy, lazy piece of journalism, that is Yeah, I mean unfortunately,

745
00:58:01.719 --> 00:58:07.199
yeah it didn't happen. Oh well, case closed, everybody go home.

746
00:58:07.239 --> 00:58:10.039
Nothing to see here, Yeah,
exactly, which is hilarious. But

747
00:58:10.480 --> 00:58:15.679
you know, it's probably good.
We had also that religious conversation getting into

748
00:58:15.679 --> 00:58:17.599
this next topic you brought up.
You know, maybe Trump will be the

749
00:58:17.639 --> 00:58:22.480
disclosure president. I'd love to hear
why your thoughts are on that. But

750
00:58:22.800 --> 00:58:29.199
this has been curious to me.
Why this administration has been completely silent on

751
00:58:29.239 --> 00:58:35.800
the UFO topic because Clinton Hillary brought
it up during the campaign at the beas

752
00:58:35.920 --> 00:58:39.519
kind of pressured by John Podesta being
kind of pushed along on that. And

753
00:58:39.719 --> 00:58:44.320
you know, I thought for sure
that the Republicans would jump on that to

754
00:58:44.360 --> 00:58:46.440
make fun of the campaign, but
they didn't. Really the media did,

755
00:58:46.519 --> 00:58:52.119
but the Republicans didn't, right,
And he has not touched the topic at

756
00:58:52.159 --> 00:58:58.360
all. And now I think maybe
it's because he is kind of the evangelical

757
00:58:58.400 --> 00:59:00.840
president. I mean, certainly that's
a big part of his base, and

758
00:59:00.920 --> 00:59:04.920
maybe he doesn't want to go there
because of the demonic reason. I don't

759
00:59:04.960 --> 00:59:08.039
know, I don't I think he
hasn't touched the topic because he doesn't really

760
00:59:08.519 --> 00:59:14.760
hasn't really thought about it, and
he probably I'm not saying he's going to

761
00:59:14.760 --> 00:59:19.639
be the disclosure president because he chooses
to be. I'm just saying if he

762
00:59:19.679 --> 00:59:23.079
gets re elected in particular, then
you've got a horizon of the next six

763
00:59:23.159 --> 00:59:29.159
years out there, okay. And
I happen to think that the transition to

764
00:59:29.280 --> 00:59:32.400
where we feel like we are in
a disclosure world, the post disclosure world,

765
00:59:32.440 --> 00:59:37.000
that after disclosure world, I think
that's going to happen in the next

766
00:59:37.000 --> 00:59:39.599
six years, and so as a
consequence, if he gets reelected, then

767
00:59:39.639 --> 00:59:43.599
he'll be the guy standing when it
happened. That is what will make him

768
00:59:43.599 --> 00:59:45.920
the disclosure president. There's a reason, though, There's a couple of reasons

769
00:59:45.920 --> 00:59:50.880
why he may have avoided it.
One is if Hillary was talking about it,

770
00:59:50.880 --> 00:59:54.239
then he doesn't want to be Johnny
come lately to a Hillary issue.

771
00:59:54.519 --> 00:59:59.519
And then the other thing is I
mean, and I say this to you

772
00:59:59.519 --> 01:00:02.039
know, I have friends that are
Trump supporters and friends that aren't. And

773
01:00:02.079 --> 01:00:07.719
so I say this not in a
way to be pejorative one way or the

774
01:00:07.760 --> 01:00:10.880
other, other than to say,
we know that Trump is the center of

775
01:00:10.880 --> 01:00:15.079
his own universe. That's just the
way his brain is wired. And I'm

776
01:00:15.119 --> 01:00:21.760
not sure that a revelation that the
world and the universe is a lot bigger

777
01:00:21.800 --> 01:00:27.800
and stranger and grander than we ever
imagined is something that his brain wants to

778
01:00:27.800 --> 01:00:32.920
get behind. So I think if
he becomes the disclosure president, it will

779
01:00:32.960 --> 01:00:37.760
become one of the greatest ironies in
history because he'll simply be the guy on

780
01:00:37.960 --> 01:00:43.920
the watch when it happens. But
once he decides to talk about it,

781
01:00:44.280 --> 01:00:46.800
whoa watch out the floodgates will be
open, and I wouldn't be surprised,

782
01:00:46.840 --> 01:00:53.159
to be honest with you, if
it comes out in the twenty twenty campaign

783
01:00:53.280 --> 01:00:59.239
as an issue that he comments on. I think, if anything right now,

784
01:00:59.760 --> 01:01:07.719
this twenty twenty presidential election has the
potential of really making progress toward disclosure,

785
01:01:07.760 --> 01:01:13.000
because there's every single person who's listening
right now could if they wanted to

786
01:01:13.320 --> 01:01:15.760
go to a town hall for a
presidential candidate. There's plenty of them out

787
01:01:15.800 --> 01:01:19.760
there, and they could go to
that town hall and they could put their

788
01:01:19.840 --> 01:01:24.079
name in to ask a question,
and they could ask in a respectful and

789
01:01:24.480 --> 01:01:30.880
knowledgeable way what the candidate thinks about
the issue of investigation of UFOs and a

790
01:01:31.000 --> 01:01:36.039
tip and things like that. And
so I think we're entering a period where

791
01:01:36.039 --> 01:01:39.199
this might leak into it. I
was surprised it didn't leak in more strongly

792
01:01:39.440 --> 01:01:43.440
to twenty sixteen, but I think
we're teed up for it to happen in

793
01:01:43.440 --> 01:01:49.079
twenty twenty. Now here's a question
for you. The way it's happening now

794
01:01:49.639 --> 01:01:53.840
is that you know Elisander's come out, he has colleagues, and of course

795
01:01:53.880 --> 01:01:58.719
we have the whole big Low faction, and that's what I call the majority

796
01:01:58.719 --> 01:02:01.400
of the people into the stars.
And that's another thing people have to realize.

797
01:02:01.400 --> 01:02:05.360
They're like, oh, these people
are part of some insider disclosure.

798
01:02:05.400 --> 01:02:08.360
Well you've got to look at the
history. Someone like how put Off has

799
01:02:08.400 --> 01:02:15.880
been working at looking into and legitimizing
paranormal topics for decades since before I was

800
01:02:15.920 --> 01:02:20.559
born. Literally, he's been working
on this sort of thing. That's the

801
01:02:20.800 --> 01:02:22.320
you know, this physicist who worked
with Bigelow, and he worked with a

802
01:02:22.400 --> 01:02:25.880
Tip and he's worked with all kinds
of different things on this front. Same

803
01:02:25.920 --> 01:02:30.960
goes with John Alexander, who I've
had on the show. Same goes for

804
01:02:30.760 --> 01:02:34.760
many times. But same goes for
Bigelow and all of these others. They've

805
01:02:34.760 --> 01:02:38.199
been in, you know, kind
of fighting this fight in at a higher

806
01:02:38.280 --> 01:02:42.719
level and in the scientific realm,
so they have a lot of access.

807
01:02:42.760 --> 01:02:45.079
And now we have people like Steve
Justice, who was a you know,

808
01:02:45.159 --> 01:02:50.960
work for Lackheed Martin. And we
have Chris Mellon who is part of the

809
01:02:51.000 --> 01:02:57.639
Melon Empire, you know, and
no doubt he was a deputy Intelligence secretary.

810
01:02:57.800 --> 01:03:01.559
I mean, So we have access
to these people who can get information

811
01:03:01.679 --> 01:03:06.599
to the highest levels and are doing
that. So we've got this momentum going,

812
01:03:07.119 --> 01:03:13.280
and we're getting I think, better
information via these routes than a politician

813
01:03:13.599 --> 01:03:16.039
who's just going to try to spin
it in a way that makes them look

814
01:03:16.119 --> 01:03:22.119
good and they're going to cherry pick
information. Yeah, but the distinction is

815
01:03:24.320 --> 01:03:30.960
the people you're referring to, the
Justice and Melon and everyone who's approaching this

816
01:03:31.079 --> 01:03:37.039
in this new investigative, scientific way. They have to be there doing their

817
01:03:37.079 --> 01:03:45.719
work, but what pushes it over
the finish line is literally their work becoming

818
01:03:45.760 --> 01:03:52.079
the basis that allows our political system
to change itself. And one of the

819
01:03:52.079 --> 01:03:57.119
ways we have to do that is
by forcing our politicians to start talking about

820
01:03:57.119 --> 01:04:00.960
it. You know. And whatever
people think about Hillary Clinton, at least

821
01:04:00.960 --> 01:04:05.320
she did talk about it, and
that was that was a radical new thing.

822
01:04:05.559 --> 01:04:10.199
And we're going to need more of
that, particularly just the cycle back

823
01:04:10.239 --> 01:04:15.920
to where we started. If indeed
disclosure is when somebody official, uh says

824
01:04:15.000 --> 01:04:19.519
this is really going on, then
that is a political issue. And and

825
01:04:19.519 --> 01:04:24.679
and I can't expect people to start
talking about it out of nowhere. They

826
01:04:24.719 --> 01:04:28.719
have to. We have to start
that discussion now. People have to start

827
01:04:29.000 --> 01:04:32.480
asking their senators, their congressmen.
You know, it's a legitimate question.

828
01:04:32.960 --> 01:04:40.400
Uh. And it's easy to ask
you simply say, uh. Senator Harry

829
01:04:40.440 --> 01:04:46.119
Reid has called for investigations into UFOs
and there's this project called a TIP and

830
01:04:46.639 --> 01:04:51.920
there's increasing good cases that we that
the government showing us. What do you

831
01:04:53.039 --> 01:04:59.159
what's your opinion on this? Are
you going to support congressional hearings. It's

832
01:04:59.159 --> 01:05:01.800
a pretty simple question. I'd like
to know what most I think every candidate

833
01:05:01.880 --> 01:05:06.280
ought to be on the record about
that. Yeah, that makes sense,

834
01:05:06.639 --> 01:05:13.000
I think one of the other Uh. Here's here's kind of my thinking on

835
01:05:13.119 --> 01:05:16.719
this has been and this is why
I love the scientific community for uh UAP

836
01:05:16.920 --> 01:05:21.480
research. They changed their name and
and and this is why, you know,

837
01:05:23.559 --> 01:05:28.039
I've always felt that we need a
SETI of ufology because politicians will often

838
01:05:28.519 --> 01:05:34.159
rely on you know, they need
their credible UH backup that they can rely

839
01:05:34.280 --> 01:05:39.159
on. So they need the Michio
Kaku's or the someone to come out that

840
01:05:39.159 --> 01:05:42.079
they can say, well, look, this is what MITCHILLOCACU says. It's

841
01:05:42.079 --> 01:05:47.000
going to back up whatever they're saying. UH. And SETI used to be

842
01:05:47.079 --> 01:05:53.400
seen as fringe, and now they're
not because they tackled the most skeptical by

843
01:05:53.519 --> 01:05:58.119
Nature group of all the scientists,
and uh, they were successful that way.

844
01:05:58.559 --> 01:06:02.079
I think that's going to be important
that we at least create a community,

845
01:06:02.320 --> 01:06:09.800
even if it's small community of scientists
who are willing to publicly state their

846
01:06:09.840 --> 01:06:14.039
opinions, because we like the SCU, like the SCU, and the majority

847
01:06:14.480 --> 01:06:17.760
of the scientists, even with SCU, a lot of them still want to

848
01:06:17.800 --> 01:06:24.000
remain anonymous. They're still worried and
they don't want to publicly share their thoughts.

849
01:06:25.880 --> 01:06:30.159
It's it's it's true, and we
we need you. Although two of

850
01:06:30.159 --> 01:06:34.320
the groups that you mentioned, SETI
and then mitchio Kaku. I just listened

851
01:06:34.360 --> 01:06:39.559
to mitchill Okaku's latest book, and
you know, I just want to grab

852
01:06:39.639 --> 01:06:44.280
him and shake him and go stop
this, you know, stop talking about

853
01:06:44.320 --> 01:06:48.079
how the universe is probably teeming with
life and about space travel and how we're

854
01:06:48.119 --> 01:06:51.920
going to do it and refusing to
acknowledge that somebody else may have done it

855
01:06:53.039 --> 01:06:56.000
and beaten us to it. And
they're here, and I want to say

856
01:06:56.039 --> 01:06:59.679
to Cess Shastak and all the guys
that SETI, look, I'm glad that

857
01:06:59.719 --> 01:07:03.079
you're running SETI, but don't be
so close minded. You know, you've

858
01:07:03.079 --> 01:07:06.880
got to open yourself up. Look
at all the evidence, and there is

859
01:07:08.079 --> 01:07:10.880
evidence. I mean, look at
this a tip stuff, look at the

860
01:07:11.440 --> 01:07:15.320
look at that those videos. There
is evidence that something is going on that

861
01:07:16.719 --> 01:07:24.199
will blow SETI out of the water. SETI is looking for signals from way

862
01:07:24.239 --> 01:07:28.840
out there because we want to prove
that there's other life in the universe,

863
01:07:29.000 --> 01:07:33.280
when the evidence seems to exist currently
that that life not only exists, but

864
01:07:33.360 --> 01:07:39.320
it's come and made contact here.
Mm hmm. You know what's interesting frustrating,

865
01:07:39.440 --> 01:07:45.159
yeah, is there was that scientist
Silvano Columbano who kind of made this

866
01:07:45.320 --> 01:07:49.440
argument that hey, guys, we
you know, we're the primary primary people

867
01:07:49.519 --> 01:07:54.880
out there telling everyone that aliens are
here, are out there somewhere. We

868
01:07:54.920 --> 01:08:00.639
need to take it more seriously when
there's potential evidence near earth, there on

869
01:08:00.760 --> 01:08:04.480
Earth that there could have been a
visitation and you know at some point and

870
01:08:04.519 --> 01:08:09.159
we have to look at those you
know. Unfortunately, that story got a

871
01:08:09.159 --> 01:08:13.280
little spun and actually I know personally
he got embarrassed by it, and he's

872
01:08:13.320 --> 01:08:18.720
not talking about it much because unfortunately
his message got taken it the wrong way,

873
01:08:18.800 --> 01:08:24.680
especially by the UK tabloids. But
Shostak chimed in and this is the

874
01:08:24.760 --> 01:08:27.960
first time he's ever been open to
it. He agreed, he said,

875
01:08:28.000 --> 01:08:30.359
you know what, I think he's
right that we do need to take get

876
01:08:30.359 --> 01:08:32.800
this evidence. Good for Seth,
all right, that I'm happy about.

877
01:08:32.960 --> 01:08:38.520
And by the way, uh,
what makes this even more complex is if

878
01:08:38.520 --> 01:08:42.920
it was just like, hey,
are we being visited by UFOs from another

879
01:08:42.960 --> 01:08:46.000
planet or not? That's that's a
pretty binary choice yes or no. But

880
01:08:46.119 --> 01:08:54.680
in reality, the universe is as
a quote I always love to throw out

881
01:08:54.720 --> 01:08:59.199
from J. D. Saldana physicist, was the universe is not only stranger

882
01:08:59.239 --> 01:09:02.159
than we imagine, it is stranger
than we can imagine. And I think

883
01:09:02.199 --> 01:09:10.239
that we're starting to wake up to
the knowledge that this is slightly This phenomenon

884
01:09:11.439 --> 01:09:16.279
does have a UFO component to it
that can be captured as the videos like

885
01:09:16.319 --> 01:09:20.000
the Nimetz video and so forth,
But there's a whole other element of just

886
01:09:20.439 --> 01:09:27.479
paranormal weirdness surrounding it that guys like
Keel and Valet and others have highlighted over

887
01:09:27.520 --> 01:09:32.880
the years. And by the way, I have never seen a UFO,

888
01:09:33.079 --> 01:09:36.920
but I have been, as we've
talked about on other shows, been approached

889
01:09:36.920 --> 01:09:43.119
by people that certainly acted like they
were real and they seemed real. But

890
01:09:43.159 --> 01:09:47.880
I've also had some of those weird
paranormal things. Can I just tell you

891
01:09:47.920 --> 01:09:53.159
one of them, because it's so
strange. When I was writing After Disclosure

892
01:09:53.199 --> 01:09:56.560
with Richard Dolan, he and I
don't live in the same town, so

893
01:09:56.600 --> 01:09:58.800
we did a lot of work on
the phone, and we were talking on

894
01:09:58.840 --> 01:10:03.399
the phone and I had a I
was working on a document and that was

895
01:10:03.439 --> 01:10:06.880
sort of the table of contents thing, and we talked and we were talking

896
01:10:06.880 --> 01:10:12.039
about how the number three was an
important number. You know, we were

897
01:10:12.039 --> 01:10:16.239
just playing around whether you know you
see the triangular spacecraft and just other things

898
01:10:16.279 --> 01:10:20.960
about that. No big deal.
But so we hung up and I went

899
01:10:21.000 --> 01:10:27.119
to bed, and the next day
I open up that file and in the

900
01:10:27.159 --> 01:10:32.800
middle of that file are three lines
of the of threes that are just keystrokes,

901
01:10:32.840 --> 01:10:36.840
as if you'd held your finger down
on the three and there it was,

902
01:10:36.880 --> 01:10:42.319
and it wasn't there the night before, And you know, it's such

903
01:10:42.319 --> 01:10:45.239
a small thing, but you go, how did that happen? Yeah?

904
01:10:45.279 --> 01:10:47.399
You know what? What? What
was that? Here's another one for you.

905
01:10:47.439 --> 01:10:51.880
When I was doing Dark Skies,
I told my partner Brent Friedman at

906
01:10:51.920 --> 01:10:56.399
the time that I'd read a book, The Mothman Prophecies, or he had

907
01:10:56.399 --> 01:11:00.199
recommended it actually, and I so
I read it, and I had just

908
01:11:00.239 --> 01:11:03.880
finished it, and I'm walking out
of a theater and the book is sitting

909
01:11:03.920 --> 01:11:06.479
in the backseat of my car.
And I'm walking out of a theater late

910
01:11:06.479 --> 01:11:10.760
at night in the dark with my
son. We're walking to our car and

911
01:11:10.800 --> 01:11:13.840
I see a guy in a long
trench coat walking toward us, and I'm

912
01:11:13.880 --> 01:11:16.119
thinking that's a little weird, and
so I kind of steer us off the

913
01:11:16.159 --> 01:11:20.880
path and as the guy walks past
us, it's this guy I've never seen

914
01:11:20.920 --> 01:11:25.439
before in my life, and he's
carrying a copy of The Mothman Prophecies.

915
01:11:26.439 --> 01:11:30.840
How funny? Now, people have
these things happen, okay? Are they

916
01:11:30.039 --> 01:11:35.399
just synchronicity? Are they related to
a larger phenomenon? Who knows. I

917
01:11:35.560 --> 01:11:41.479
just tend to think that when that
if we don't get started on disclosure,

918
01:11:41.680 --> 01:11:45.199
we're never going to get to the
answers because the answer probably isn't that simple.

919
01:11:45.399 --> 01:11:50.399
And as opposed to angels and demons
being the reason for non disclosure over

920
01:11:50.439 --> 01:11:55.399
these years, I tend to think
it's more like people that are trying to

921
01:11:55.439 --> 01:12:00.600
deal with and study with this thing. Art are wondering how do I even

922
01:12:00.640 --> 01:12:05.680
begin to disclose because we still don't
quite understand what's going on. But you

923
01:12:05.720 --> 01:12:10.479
know, I think that your listeners
and yourself and myself would all say,

924
01:12:10.640 --> 01:12:13.760
well, that may all be true, but we have to get started anyway.

925
01:12:13.920 --> 01:12:17.439
We just have to do it.
That brings me to especially now that

926
01:12:17.479 --> 01:12:21.479
we're running out of time. But
I think you have a unique perspective on

927
01:12:21.680 --> 01:12:28.439
this is the role entertainment media plays, and I think there is a role,

928
01:12:28.479 --> 01:12:31.720
and this is your space, and
so I wonder what you think,

929
01:12:31.840 --> 01:12:38.960
especially given of course Project Blue Book. On the one hand, this Project

930
01:12:38.960 --> 01:12:42.680
blue Book show is sensational and there's
not a lot of facts. On the

931
01:12:42.720 --> 01:12:46.359
other hand, it's based on,
you know, actual cases, and it

932
01:12:46.439 --> 01:12:51.119
does bring to the public a name
that I have always feared for these last

933
01:12:51.199 --> 01:12:57.159
decades people will forget, which is
doctor j Allen Heinich. Now he's kind

934
01:12:57.159 --> 01:13:00.079
of an icon and becoming more of
an icon, So people are realizing this

935
01:13:00.119 --> 01:13:04.279
guy existed and was pro UFO,
which I think is really important and a

936
01:13:04.319 --> 01:13:10.239
positive thing. So can and of
course Tom DeLong is trying to get into

937
01:13:10.279 --> 01:13:15.760
this space. Can that be?
Is that achievable. Is it helpful?

938
01:13:15.880 --> 01:13:20.760
What do you think? I have
really mixed feelings about Project blue Book.

939
01:13:20.840 --> 01:13:30.399
I know the I know it's good
that things. It raises people's consciousness to

940
01:13:30.520 --> 01:13:32.560
even think that there was a blue
Book and even know that there was a

941
01:13:32.600 --> 01:13:40.079
Heinech. But we both know,
like you know, when they did Independence

942
01:13:40.119 --> 01:13:42.600
Day, we didn't say, oh
gee, and that's true. No,

943
01:13:42.640 --> 01:13:45.359
we knew it was a film.
This thing is being promoted as true.

944
01:13:45.560 --> 01:13:49.520
This is the true story of Project
blue Book, this is the true story

945
01:13:49.520 --> 01:13:56.079
of Jay Allen Heineck. But it's
not. And the problem is the vast

946
01:13:56.119 --> 01:14:03.239
majority of people who are watching the
series actually think Allen Heinik was seeing all

947
01:14:03.319 --> 01:14:08.319
the things he sees in that series
in the fifties in nineteen fifty two and

948
01:14:08.399 --> 01:14:12.239
three, and it just didn't happen
that way, and Blue Book didn't happen

949
01:14:12.279 --> 01:14:17.159
the way it did. And I
think it's a mixed blessing for sure.

950
01:14:18.880 --> 01:14:24.199
I don't I'm not surprised. This
is how Hollywood development goes. I'm working

951
01:14:24.239 --> 01:14:27.119
on a project right now, and
every time I go into a meeting,

952
01:14:27.359 --> 01:14:30.119
people that don't know anything about the
topic tell me what I should do with

953
01:14:30.199 --> 01:14:41.279
it, and their answers are always
kind of they're uninformed, and they're destructive

954
01:14:41.359 --> 01:14:45.960
to the very idea that I'm trying
to talk about. But those are the

955
01:14:46.000 --> 01:14:49.720
doors you have to get through in
order to get something on the air.

956
01:14:49.800 --> 01:14:58.039
So I'm way more excited about the
Unidentified program than I am about season two

957
01:14:58.079 --> 01:15:02.239
of Blue Book. So if I
had to pick, but what as how

958
01:15:02.279 --> 01:15:06.800
do you feel about your work?
Then what is the difference between your work

959
01:15:06.800 --> 01:15:11.039
And do you think that because I
think I would imagine and this is I

960
01:15:11.039 --> 01:15:15.119
guess a question. It seems that
your goal is to also entertain and educate.

961
01:15:15.439 --> 01:15:19.039
Absolutely, listen, I don't I'm
the pot calling the kettle black.

962
01:15:19.119 --> 01:15:25.720
I'm not attacking Blue Book. I'm
just saying I'm saying it's very entertaining.

963
01:15:26.960 --> 01:15:30.920
What I'm saying is you can't really
say, I'm not sure that it's advancing

964
01:15:30.960 --> 01:15:35.760
the cause of UFO truth as much
as we might think. And I never

965
01:15:35.800 --> 01:15:42.199
thought my series Dark Skies was doing
that. I mean, all I did

966
01:15:42.239 --> 01:15:45.159
with Dark Skies was say, look, I'm telling an alien invasion story,

967
01:15:45.359 --> 01:15:53.199
so you know, but I'm doing
it within the frameworks of euphological events and

968
01:15:53.239 --> 01:15:57.159
that you know, And I didn't
try to make it, I guess more

969
01:15:57.199 --> 01:16:00.560
than that. Whereas I don't think
the creators of Blue Book are doing this.

970
01:16:00.640 --> 01:16:04.720
I think it's the History Channel that's
pushing the reality of it. Like,

971
01:16:04.880 --> 01:16:10.199
you know, they did a Betty
and Barney Hill episode that wasn't about

972
01:16:10.239 --> 01:16:14.640
Betty and Barney Hill. R sure
promoted it as if it was, and

973
01:16:14.720 --> 01:16:16.039
I thought it was weird. But
I mean, you're you're right. I

974
01:16:16.039 --> 01:16:20.920
mean, I can't be too critical. I guess all I'm really saying is

975
01:16:21.880 --> 01:16:30.680
people shouldn't look at Hollywood entertainment product
as being revelatory. At this point,

976
01:16:30.840 --> 01:16:33.960
I'd go to a good lou Elizondo
lecture if you wanted to, you know,

977
01:16:34.399 --> 01:16:39.439
take it to the next level of
understanding, because what happens there is

978
01:16:39.479 --> 01:16:49.000
an inexorable pressure on Hollywood entertainment projects
to go big, right, to have

979
01:16:49.079 --> 01:16:54.279
some kind of weird thing going on, or to make your character in the

980
01:16:54.319 --> 01:16:57.000
center of it all. And this
is just the way it is. That's

981
01:16:57.079 --> 01:17:02.680
just always the way it is.
But I realize, I'm I'm probably a

982
01:17:02.760 --> 01:17:06.920
hypocrit here. Well, no,
that's that was not my intent. It

983
01:17:08.079 --> 01:17:11.840
was. It was mostly just to
get your insight, which is interesting from

984
01:17:11.880 --> 01:17:15.840
someone who's in that space and essentially
kind of also, So what would your

985
01:17:15.840 --> 01:17:19.159
advice for Tom DeLong, because that's
what he wants to do is try to

986
01:17:19.800 --> 01:17:23.760
you know, get in here.
And we've seen this happen before where people

987
01:17:23.800 --> 01:17:26.760
are like, I think the only
way I can share truth is through fiction,

988
01:17:27.439 --> 01:17:30.640
and they attempt to do that.
Is that a lost cause? Or

989
01:17:30.640 --> 01:17:34.199
what would you tell Tom? I
guess you know it's interesting. Well,

990
01:17:34.239 --> 01:17:38.880
first of all, I'd love to
I'd love to work with Tom DeLong on

991
01:17:38.880 --> 01:17:43.319
one of those things because I think
that he he brings a lot of respect

992
01:17:43.399 --> 01:17:47.199
and intelligence to the work and it
would probably be good. The idea that

993
01:17:47.239 --> 01:17:51.720
you have to tell the truth under
the cover of fiction. Remember I literally

994
01:17:51.760 --> 01:17:56.000
that's how I started Dark Skies.
I had a letter from a so called

995
01:17:56.079 --> 01:18:00.439
Majestic twelve agent telling us that you
have to tell the truth on the cover

996
01:18:00.520 --> 01:18:04.159
of fiction. And that may have
actually been true years ago. Now,

997
01:18:04.199 --> 01:18:09.119
I think you can just tell the
truth. If the truth is your thing,

998
01:18:09.319 --> 01:18:12.279
go tell the truth. If fiction
is your thing, go tell fiction.

999
01:18:13.000 --> 01:18:20.279
I don't think that it's necessary to
convert truth into fiction in order to

1000
01:18:20.560 --> 01:18:25.159
float crazy ideas. I mean,
you don't need to do that. You

1001
01:18:25.159 --> 01:18:29.800
can float them anytime you want.
It's a free country. Look at what

1002
01:18:29.840 --> 01:18:36.399
they put on alien ancient aliens over
the years. So I guess what I

1003
01:18:36.439 --> 01:18:41.720
would actually hope that Tom DeLong is
able to do, and certainly what I'm

1004
01:18:41.760 --> 01:18:45.680
trying to do is to hold on
to some core beliefs going into if you're

1005
01:18:45.720 --> 01:18:50.359
doing a television series or dramatic television
series, hold on to some core beliefs

1006
01:18:50.640 --> 01:18:58.119
if you can, and then you
know, I guess, I guess you

1007
01:18:58.119 --> 01:19:01.079
could argue that what Project Bluebook does
is if you look at their websites,

1008
01:19:01.119 --> 01:19:04.079
they have a lot of information about
the real cases, and that's all to

1009
01:19:04.159 --> 01:19:12.000
the positive. So I don't know. Tom DeLong wrote a book with his

1010
01:19:12.119 --> 01:19:17.239
co writer to start off, and
the only thing I thought was confusing for

1011
01:19:17.359 --> 01:19:24.680
him is, you know, I'm
a television writer producer by trade. He

1012
01:19:24.880 --> 01:19:30.560
was also starting to the Stars Academy
at the same time, so he was

1013
01:19:30.600 --> 01:19:32.800
trying to have it both ways,
and that was a dance that was difficult

1014
01:19:32.840 --> 01:19:36.039
for him, where he's trying to
say, I've got the cutting edge research

1015
01:19:36.079 --> 01:19:40.359
and we're going to get to the
truth. But while we're trying to get

1016
01:19:40.399 --> 01:19:43.960
to the truth, I'm going to
tell a fiction story and you're gonna have

1017
01:19:43.960 --> 01:19:46.479
to guess which parts are true.
That's just a difficult walk, that's all.

1018
01:19:46.840 --> 01:19:50.439
Yeah, No, I hear you. And that's what's really difficult,

1019
01:19:50.640 --> 01:19:56.039
because because he doesn't have to do
that. By the way, he should

1020
01:19:56.079 --> 01:19:59.560
actually say, this is my truth, and I want to tell a fictionalized

1021
01:19:59.600 --> 01:20:02.800
story. That would be my advice
to him. I think the hard part

1022
01:20:02.920 --> 01:20:05.800
is is that you know, the
rest of the group in TTSA may not

1023
01:20:06.720 --> 01:20:11.960
have the same truth he has.
I guess I'll put it that way precisely,

1024
01:20:12.000 --> 01:20:17.119
and so in a way, I
understand why he wants to do it

1025
01:20:17.159 --> 01:20:21.399
the way he's doing it. I'm
in a similar situation. I might do

1026
01:20:21.439 --> 01:20:27.159
the same thing, but they are. It's a bit of magic to get

1027
01:20:27.199 --> 01:20:30.960
them to work and play together,
because you're right, you have hardcore scientists

1028
01:20:31.000 --> 01:20:35.920
who are really working to get to
the bottom line truth, and then you

1029
01:20:35.960 --> 01:20:40.800
have the entertainment division, right,
and that's a little weird. It's like,

1030
01:20:41.359 --> 01:20:43.920
you know, when I was doing
dark skies, I wasn't Also,

1031
01:20:44.560 --> 01:20:48.079
you know, doing digs at Roswell
looking for wreckage. You know, it's

1032
01:20:48.159 --> 01:20:54.039
just it's just tough, and we've
lived in a time where the people who

1033
01:20:54.079 --> 01:21:00.399
have maintained this secret have, you
know, have used the entertainment product to

1034
01:21:00.479 --> 01:21:05.279
confuse the issue to the extent that
the the entertainment product is so confusing right

1035
01:21:05.319 --> 01:21:10.039
now even looking at Spielberg. If
you look at Spielberg and people go,

1036
01:21:10.159 --> 01:21:13.520
well, I wonder what he knows, he has done every version of aliens

1037
01:21:13.680 --> 01:21:18.119
that exist out there. So there
unless unless there are eight different kinds of

1038
01:21:18.119 --> 01:21:25.359
aliens out there who are interfering with
us, then Spielberg is obviously just making

1039
01:21:25.399 --> 01:21:29.840
some stuff up at the same time, right So exactly, we just live

1040
01:21:29.880 --> 01:21:34.119
in a confusing time right now.
But the overall good news is there are

1041
01:21:34.640 --> 01:21:39.000
lots of people who are pushing it
forward. One of my favorite reads right

1042
01:21:39.000 --> 01:21:44.760
now on Twitter is a guy that
has a is called UFO Jesus. Yeah,

1043
01:21:44.800 --> 01:21:48.479
he's great. He just has a
terrific take on disclosure and I enjoy

1044
01:21:48.520 --> 01:21:53.920
reading him. So there's lots of
ways to tell the truth, I guess,

1045
01:21:54.039 --> 01:21:59.640
is what I'm saying. And I'm
continuing to try to find projects that

1046
01:21:59.720 --> 01:22:05.319
are and truth. And I'll tell
you I have to accommodate buyers and developers

1047
01:22:05.399 --> 01:22:11.000
all the time. And obviously when
you put up if I were to put

1048
01:22:11.039 --> 01:22:12.920
any of my projects out, if
I were, you know, I have

1049
01:22:12.960 --> 01:22:15.479
the rights to the Betty and Barney
book captured. If I get to make

1050
01:22:15.520 --> 01:22:18.720
that movie, people will probably criticize
that movie as much as some people criticize

1051
01:22:18.800 --> 01:22:25.079
Blue Book. And it's just because
that's how Hollywood operates. M You know

1052
01:22:25.119 --> 01:22:28.159
what I love, you know with
this conversation, of course, and it's

1053
01:22:28.199 --> 01:22:30.439
the route that I've taken. Is
I really think that, you know,

1054
01:22:30.720 --> 01:22:34.399
the fiction route is a route.
And of course I love entertainment. I

1055
01:22:34.439 --> 01:22:39.119
mean I love what you do,
and I love all the entertainment stuff a

1056
01:22:39.119 --> 01:22:41.840
lot. In fact, I would
be a dream to actually get involved with

1057
01:22:41.880 --> 01:22:46.520
some of that one day. But
of course I'm bogged down in this and

1058
01:22:46.520 --> 01:22:49.560
it's kind of like I love this
picture that you and Richard take. It

1059
01:22:49.600 --> 01:22:56.560
is this wood Word and Bernstein kind
of mode. And that's where I am.

1060
01:22:56.680 --> 01:22:59.079
Is that, you know, we
just got to look for the information

1061
01:22:59.319 --> 01:23:02.880
and if we we can't, and
it takes a discipline. George Knapp,

1062
01:23:02.960 --> 01:23:08.600
of course, is my role model
for this. You got to look for

1063
01:23:09.079 --> 01:23:13.000
the credible. You got to substantiate
your claims. You need to grab sources

1064
01:23:13.000 --> 01:23:15.760
and sometimes one isn't enough, or
your source isn't good enough, you know,

1065
01:23:15.840 --> 01:23:18.920
so you need another one. It's
just total of Woodward and birds Dan

1066
01:23:19.600 --> 01:23:23.439
to get the information out there,
and it's hard and it takes time,

1067
01:23:23.479 --> 01:23:27.960
and it's worked, but it's very
satisfying, at least to me. It

1068
01:23:28.039 --> 01:23:32.359
is satisfying, particularly now that there's
a little official cooperation on the cases,

1069
01:23:32.680 --> 01:23:38.880
so that you don't have to overcome
initial reticence all the time when you're trying

1070
01:23:38.880 --> 01:23:42.840
to talk to people about something,
Because more and more people are starting to

1071
01:23:42.880 --> 01:23:45.640
go there's something to it. I
don't understand it, or it's not relevant

1072
01:23:45.680 --> 01:23:49.039
to my life right now, but
more and more people are saying, yeah,

1073
01:23:49.079 --> 01:23:53.600
I saw that. That looks pretty
crazy. I mean I show some

1074
01:23:53.640 --> 01:23:59.079
of the videos that came out of
the ATIP disclosure and people are pretty blown

1075
01:23:59.119 --> 01:24:03.680
away by them. Yeah right,
yep, exactly. So we are pretty

1076
01:24:03.720 --> 01:24:09.680
much out of time. But this
has been a fascinating discussion. Thank you

1077
01:24:09.960 --> 01:24:13.800
so much for coming on the show
again. I guess what should people look

1078
01:24:13.840 --> 01:24:16.039
forward to that you're going to be
doing in the future, And is there

1079
01:24:16.039 --> 01:24:20.560
a website you want people to look
at? You know, I've bounced around

1080
01:24:20.800 --> 01:24:25.560
right now, I'm putting a lot
of attention onto the Twitter feed, which

1081
01:24:25.600 --> 01:24:30.000
is at Hollywood UFOs at Hollywood UFOs, and i'd encourage people to come talk

1082
01:24:30.039 --> 01:24:33.680
about that. What I have coming
up right now next is actually not a

1083
01:24:33.800 --> 01:24:38.319
UFO project. I have a big
feature film called The Last Battle about the

1084
01:24:38.399 --> 01:24:42.560
last Battle of World War Two that'll
be shooting later this year and be in

1085
01:24:42.600 --> 01:24:45.640
theaters in a year or so.
And you know, but I'm still working

1086
01:24:45.680 --> 01:24:53.880
on trying to bring more of these
truth based projects to the public because I

1087
01:24:53.960 --> 01:24:58.159
think that's important and I really really
feel like we are in the middle of

1088
01:24:58.199 --> 01:25:02.039
a transition. So all I would
say is fasten your seat belts and buckle

1089
01:25:02.119 --> 01:25:08.319
up, because here we go right
exciting times and you've told me about your

1090
01:25:08.359 --> 01:25:12.720
new movie, The Last Battle,
and it's a fascinating story. So people

1091
01:25:12.800 --> 01:25:15.000
need to really look this up.
In fact, I think in the last

1092
01:25:15.000 --> 01:25:17.039
podcast we went over it. But
definitely look that up, people, and

1093
01:25:17.399 --> 01:25:20.399
we'll have you back to talk about
that too. You know. I'll give

1094
01:25:20.439 --> 01:25:25.640
you one highlight though. My Dark
Sky's partner Brent Friedman, and I are

1095
01:25:25.720 --> 01:25:30.039
developing the book I wrote with Richard
Dolan ad After Disclosure for television, So

1096
01:25:30.119 --> 01:25:34.680
that's cool. That would be fascinating. All right, great, Thank you

1097
01:25:34.720 --> 01:25:39.439
so much, my friends, Thank
you, thank you so much to Bryce

1098
01:25:39.439 --> 01:25:42.359
Abel for being on the show.
Like you said, be sure to check

1099
01:25:42.399 --> 01:25:45.039
him out on Twitter. That's where
he's sharing stuff these days, many of

1100
01:25:45.119 --> 01:25:50.239
us do. He's at Hollywood UFO, so check him out at Hollywood UFOs.

1101
01:25:50.479 --> 01:25:54.439
And you know what, we are
talking a little bit about the bonus

1102
01:25:54.479 --> 01:25:58.800
audio, So be sure to join
my Patreon. You know, you've got

1103
01:25:58.840 --> 01:26:00.359
the link down there in the show
notes, or you could just look up

1104
01:26:00.359 --> 01:26:03.960
for me up on Patreon. Thank
you so much to those of you who

1105
01:26:04.000 --> 01:26:09.239
already have, but you can join
at the lowest level and still get access

1106
01:26:09.279 --> 01:26:14.840
to some of the extra exclusive stuff
I have up there, including this interview

1107
01:26:14.840 --> 01:26:17.960
that I did with Bryce. It
doesn't appear here, but we talked about

1108
01:26:18.439 --> 01:26:26.159
essentially a former Secretary of Energy and
aliens. This is extremely interesting and has

1109
01:26:26.239 --> 01:26:30.159
inspired me to write an article,
but I needed to interview Bryce more about

1110
01:26:30.199 --> 01:26:33.079
it, and that's what you can
get on the Patreon if you are a

1111
01:26:33.159 --> 01:26:38.199
subscriber, so check that out.
Bryce revealed this piece of news at the

1112
01:26:38.279 --> 01:26:43.920
International UFO Congress last year, and
that's another big piece of news. The

1113
01:26:43.960 --> 01:26:48.079
International UFO Congress where there's always breaking
UFO news. And sure enough we've got

1114
01:26:48.119 --> 01:26:53.960
a lot of great speakers this year
and ticketing is now up. The ticketing

1115
01:26:54.039 --> 01:26:59.239
for the UFO Congress is now up, so be sure to go there to

1116
01:26:59.600 --> 01:27:01.720
look at the speakers and then get
your tickets. Get them because there are

1117
01:27:01.800 --> 01:27:08.680
some special tickets for like workshops and
VIP tickets that there's only a limited number

1118
01:27:08.680 --> 01:27:11.800
of, so get them quickly.
Also, I want you to know that

1119
01:27:11.960 --> 01:27:15.960
if you order your tickets now,
there is a discount coach so you could

1120
01:27:15.000 --> 01:27:19.000
get fifty dollars off the packages.
So you got to get the full you

1121
01:27:19.000 --> 01:27:25.000
know, conference packages, and you
can get fifty dollars off from now until

1122
01:27:25.239 --> 01:27:29.640
Thursday. That will be Thursday,
the twenty fifth, but Thursday night it

1123
01:27:29.880 --> 01:27:31.680
ends, so you got to get
your tickets by Thursday night. In fact,

1124
01:27:31.720 --> 01:27:34.479
they're already at a super early bird
discount, so you could get this

1125
01:27:34.560 --> 01:27:41.279
fifty dollars off. On top of
that, use the code save fifty uppercase

1126
01:27:41.680 --> 01:27:45.600
save fifty and get fifty dollars off
your tickets at the International UFO Congress.

1127
01:27:45.680 --> 01:27:49.439
Go to Ufocongress dot com. You
can see the speakers. You can see

1128
01:27:49.479 --> 01:27:54.359
the schedule and then go to the
tickets page and you can buy your tickets.

1129
01:27:54.399 --> 01:27:58.199
You could see all the different packages
for the different ticketing packages you could

1130
01:27:58.279 --> 01:28:00.680
get, but I would recommend the
highest level because then you get to do

1131
01:28:00.760 --> 01:28:05.239
everything and do all the cool stuff
and you get extra you get saved seating

1132
01:28:05.680 --> 01:28:11.920
in the conference room. So ufocongress
dot com save fifty is a code all

1133
01:28:12.000 --> 01:28:16.720
uppercase. Anyway, I want to
thank everybody who's been helped us out to

1134
01:28:16.760 --> 01:28:20.319
do this show. Of course Martin
from podcast UFO at the beginning to joining

1135
01:28:20.399 --> 01:28:24.760
us with the news. Remember Openminds
dot tv and you can find all of

1136
01:28:24.800 --> 01:28:28.319
the UFO news that we talked about. Also, I want to thank Caleb

1137
01:28:28.359 --> 01:28:31.600
Hanks for the opening end, Closed
Music Systematics for the bumper music, and

1138
01:28:31.680 --> 01:28:36.199
of course you all the listeners.
Thank you all for being here and we'll

1139
01:28:36.239 --> 01:29:28.239
talk to you next week. Until
then, audio smooth, chuchos you mus