WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.240 --> 00:00:04.960 In a disturbing incident from Saint Catharine, Jamaica, a thirty nine year old 2 00:00:05.120 --> 00:00:12.279 Kenyan Roman Catholic priests faces serious charges of sexual offenses involving a twelve year old 3 00:00:12.400 --> 00:00:17.960 girl. The accusations include abduction, aren't rip within the church premises. The 4 00:00:18.399 --> 00:00:25.879 charges encompassed sexual intercourse with minor sexual touching, grieve via sexual assault, and 5 00:00:26.079 --> 00:00:32.679 child abduction. These incidents allegedly occur in Mark, but were reported in June 6 00:00:32.719 --> 00:00:39.520 twenty twenty three. The priest's accused of befriending the girl, a school student, 7 00:00:39.759 --> 00:00:44.679 and learned her to his church home for the assault. The charges were 8 00:00:44.759 --> 00:00:50.359 filed based on the girl's identification of the priests in an official lineup and questioning 9 00:00:50.479 --> 00:00:57.240 by his attorney. The case underscores the importance of skepticism even towards figures of 10 00:00:57.359 --> 00:01:03.840 trust. Authorities emphasize their commitment to justice for the victim and urge anyone if 11 00:01:03.840 --> 00:01:10.319 relevant information to step forward. This article was carried on July eleventh on The 12 00:01:10.439 --> 00:01:15.480 Jamaican Observer, ABC News and AP News, and on July twaintered on Loop 13 00:01:15.640 --> 00:01:22.239 News. Yes, Cynthia, over to you, what what do you have 14 00:01:22.400 --> 00:01:26.480 for us? In relation to this article. This is such a tragedy. 15 00:01:26.879 --> 00:01:32.000 When I first read it, I was really just trying to find out more 16 00:01:32.079 --> 00:01:38.000 information because the ABC and the AP news articles are pretty short. The Jamaica 17 00:01:38.359 --> 00:01:41.439 Observer gave us a little bit more details, but I did have to do 18 00:01:41.480 --> 00:01:46.519 a little bit more digging in order for me to find out more concerning this 19 00:01:46.560 --> 00:01:49.719 whole tragic event. But before I really go into that, I'm very curious 20 00:01:49.719 --> 00:01:53.959 to hear what the panel has to say. So, Jonathan, would you 21 00:01:53.000 --> 00:01:59.359 please give us your thoughts. Yeah, this one is unfortunately all too common. 22 00:02:00.120 --> 00:02:05.879 We've covered on this show many times when a Catholic priest or other minister 23 00:02:06.159 --> 00:02:09.479 or church official has committed these sorts of crimes. A lot of times they 24 00:02:09.520 --> 00:02:16.199 get away with it because either the parents or the guardians of the kid don't 25 00:02:16.319 --> 00:02:20.680 know about it, or when they do find out about it, are reluctant 26 00:02:20.840 --> 00:02:25.039 to press charges against the man of the cloth. And you know, I 27 00:02:25.080 --> 00:02:30.479 did find that the Jamaica Gleaner first carried this story on July tenth, so, 28 00:02:30.680 --> 00:02:35.479 and then then it was picked up by the Jamaica Observer on the eleventh 29 00:02:35.520 --> 00:02:39.479 and the API on the eleventh, and that's Associated Press International. But there 30 00:02:39.560 --> 00:02:43.800 was no author so it's kind of hard to do any further further digging on 31 00:02:43.840 --> 00:02:46.120 it. But she's twelve years old. Come on, people, you know 32 00:02:46.479 --> 00:02:51.719 this guy should pretty much go away for life. I could think of some 33 00:02:51.840 --> 00:02:57.800 other suitable punishments, but they're mostly illegal according to the Geneva conventions. So 34 00:02:58.639 --> 00:03:02.800 the Kingston dis he's saying they're cooperating with police, you know, are they 35 00:03:02.840 --> 00:03:09.120 really The archbishop immediately removed the priests from all active pastoral minister in the diocese, 36 00:03:09.199 --> 00:03:14.719 but only the probably because he was in jail. The only reason why 37 00:03:14.840 --> 00:03:19.520 they express concern for those effective, of course, is because they got caught. 38 00:03:19.560 --> 00:03:23.360 That priests got caught, and so the church has had a bad record 39 00:03:23.560 --> 00:03:28.439 of not just moving priests around when they get caught, but also not doing 40 00:03:28.479 --> 00:03:32.280 anything about it to the priest other than say, four hail marries a you 41 00:03:32.319 --> 00:03:36.960 know and our father or something. You know. It's like they always believe 42 00:03:37.039 --> 00:03:40.439 that you can pray it away, and that's a disgusting part. This little 43 00:03:40.479 --> 00:03:46.039 girl is going to be scarred for life. She's going to have trauma that 44 00:03:46.240 --> 00:03:50.680 she's going to need a lot of help with dealing with. And is the 45 00:03:50.759 --> 00:03:53.960 church going to pay for their therapy or assistance or are they just going to 46 00:03:53.039 --> 00:03:57.000 say I'll pray with you and that's what I want to know. Really. 47 00:03:57.039 --> 00:03:59.520 Of course, we don't know yet what's going to happen with her, and 48 00:03:59.560 --> 00:04:02.919 probably ever will because it won't make the news. But anyway, as I 49 00:04:03.000 --> 00:04:08.240 was saying, this is just something that is all too common, what do 50 00:04:08.240 --> 00:04:10.759 you have to say on that? Well, you know, John, this 51 00:04:11.199 --> 00:04:15.000 girl needed help with the Catholic Church added a predator. You know, this 52 00:04:15.120 --> 00:04:19.079 would be laughable if there wasn't a very real nightmare that this child is living. 53 00:04:19.199 --> 00:04:21.759 But you know, as you alluded to this, this tragedy is going 54 00:04:21.800 --> 00:04:27.079 to soon be replaced by another church atrocity in the news psychle but not for 55 00:04:27.160 --> 00:04:30.439 her. Her need for help was more harm. And now this family and 56 00:04:31.480 --> 00:04:36.199 most likely were risk being opstracized and maybe even in danger for just speaking out 57 00:04:36.279 --> 00:04:39.519 because you know, there are going to be people that are going to come 58 00:04:39.560 --> 00:04:43.399 to this priest defense. I am curious to whether this priest was you know, 59 00:04:43.879 --> 00:04:46.160 was he under previous suspicion before he was moved? You know, whether 60 00:04:46.480 --> 00:04:50.720 other investigations are they investigating now where he was? And of course you know 61 00:04:50.800 --> 00:04:55.839 that any investigation they do is ultimately going to serve their own self interests. 62 00:04:56.279 --> 00:05:01.160 You know they're blind followers, frivously accused their enemies of being groomers. They 63 00:05:01.199 --> 00:05:04.879 should spend some time looking in the mirrors and see what they are their own. 64 00:05:04.920 --> 00:05:11.399 Catholic Bishop report estimated over four percent of priests in the Catholic Church are 65 00:05:11.439 --> 00:05:15.439 a quote plausibly accused of abuse. That's over one hundred times higher than the 66 00:05:15.480 --> 00:05:20.959 general population. Conviction right now, religion orders obedience and that breeds secrets. 67 00:05:21.240 --> 00:05:25.600 But the problem does extend far beyond just to Catholic. I have in laws 68 00:05:25.600 --> 00:05:30.480 sitting under a pastor right now facing charges for sexual assault of two underage victims. 69 00:05:30.519 --> 00:05:33.480 Now understand, if you're a Catholic, you're supporting a crime syndicate. 70 00:05:33.480 --> 00:05:40.360 They spend over three hundred million dollars a year protecting child raping priest. You 71 00:05:40.360 --> 00:05:44.560 weren't there when it happened, but your money made it possible. Just stop 72 00:05:44.720 --> 00:05:50.680 now, Phil, what's your take on this is problematic and sick in so 73 00:05:50.759 --> 00:05:55.279 many days. You have, first of all, content issue. Twelve year 74 00:05:55.360 --> 00:06:00.040 old right, very twelve year old count give consent and you have the power 75 00:06:00.120 --> 00:06:05.240 dynamic. This party a thirty nine year old versus twelve year old. As 76 00:06:05.240 --> 00:06:11.160 you said correctly in Fidel, trauma. That's trauma for life for that little 77 00:06:11.199 --> 00:06:15.399 girl. Trust betrayed. Right, the priest is supposed to be this so 78 00:06:15.560 --> 00:06:23.959 called holy person. Varied persons will expect that there will be quote unquote righteous 79 00:06:24.000 --> 00:06:28.839 and of course the priest abuses power, right, he's supposed to be. 80 00:06:29.079 --> 00:06:33.680 This is a couple of society. Society. Another thing mental immaturity of the 81 00:06:34.040 --> 00:06:39.720 and the development of the twelve year old. That is, your prefrontal cortex 82 00:06:40.240 --> 00:06:45.879 is not even just probably just start to develop. That's the critical thinking part 83 00:06:45.920 --> 00:06:50.480 of the brain, right, and children tend to use more their amaligada, 84 00:06:50.720 --> 00:06:57.920 the emotional part of the brain. So you can imagine the emotional trauma this 85 00:06:58.199 --> 00:07:03.519 child undergone and this sick priests do this to the child. And one other 86 00:07:03.560 --> 00:07:10.560 thing biologically, child's womb is not developed and cause damage. We know from 87 00:07:10.639 --> 00:07:15.759 science and the medical science that ben children are that young and have set with 88 00:07:16.079 --> 00:07:21.360 an adult, it can cause serious damage to the child's womb where they cannot 89 00:07:21.480 --> 00:07:28.279 reproduce when they get older. So I mean this is really problematic. And 90 00:07:29.000 --> 00:07:33.920 the thing is is that also what had me a bit confused was why did 91 00:07:33.920 --> 00:07:38.399 it take so long? Why did it take three months to be reported? 92 00:07:38.519 --> 00:07:45.079 You know? And as it was Jonathan who said that they because it is 93 00:07:45.120 --> 00:07:48.839 a priest. Maybe that's why the parents, if they fung out early, 94 00:07:49.720 --> 00:07:54.639 will say okay, this is a man of God and probably tell a child 95 00:07:54.920 --> 00:07:59.879 are you sure? Are you you know? Did this really happened? Please 96 00:08:00.160 --> 00:08:05.040 to allays on the priest, I mean, it is really sad that's such 97 00:08:05.079 --> 00:08:09.279 a thing like this happened a twelve year old and the priest who was supposed 98 00:08:09.319 --> 00:08:13.160 to be trusted did this. And as you y'all said correctly, this has 99 00:08:13.199 --> 00:08:20.079 been an ongoing problem in the Catholic Church and other churches to I think in 100 00:08:20.160 --> 00:08:26.439 Christianity, and I suspect it's because of this celibate the celibate rule that they 101 00:08:26.519 --> 00:08:30.199 have it is creating problems. What do you say about that? Centthia? 102 00:08:31.120 --> 00:08:35.720 Gosh, you know, this is a story that's right up our fellow nonprofit 103 00:08:35.799 --> 00:08:43.679 tale lur Tales alley. We would have had a whole icon of a de 104 00:08:43.879 --> 00:08:48.000 facto pope with with you know, crazy eyes and like you know, in 105 00:08:48.039 --> 00:08:52.600 the pointy teeth, in the whole nine yards and it's appropriate and Philly, 106 00:08:52.759 --> 00:08:56.200 when you said that, why did it take three months to be and honest 107 00:08:56.279 --> 00:09:03.759 with you, that's like lightning speed considering the Catholic Church of being being put 108 00:09:03.840 --> 00:09:11.559 on blast. Well, this priest specifically being arrested and and and I know 109 00:09:11.600 --> 00:09:16.960 that he's not convicted yet, he's still he just got charged back in June. 110 00:09:16.759 --> 00:09:22.120 But that's pretty quick. I mean, like, how many stories have 111 00:09:22.440 --> 00:09:28.559 we covered on the nonprofits talking about sexual abuse of children at the hands of 112 00:09:28.679 --> 00:09:35.840 priests where some of the children were adults by the time that they got any 113 00:09:35.879 --> 00:09:39.519 as semblance of justice, you know. And I feel for this little girl 114 00:09:39.720 --> 00:09:43.159 who and and she is even though like some people say, oh, well 115 00:09:43.159 --> 00:09:46.720 she's twelve, she's a preteen. She is a child. She is a 116 00:09:46.879 --> 00:09:52.799 child. And children do not have the wherewithal to consent to any type of 117 00:09:52.919 --> 00:09:58.080 sexual acts with an adult, let alone each other. I mean, they 118 00:09:58.120 --> 00:10:03.120 don't. As phil aptly pointed out, your skeptical, critical thinking portion of 119 00:10:03.159 --> 00:10:07.200 your brain, your prefrontal cortex. Now I'm not a scientist, but I 120 00:10:07.200 --> 00:10:13.480 can say that word yay is not developed yet. I believe that I've read 121 00:10:13.559 --> 00:10:18.399 that that particular portion of your brain does not develop all the way until you're 122 00:10:18.440 --> 00:10:22.240 like twenty five, twenty five plus. And this is the reason why we 123 00:10:22.360 --> 00:10:28.480 had crazy college students making very stupid things and stupid acts on video. And 124 00:10:28.519 --> 00:10:33.399 I could even recall a few bad decisions that I made on my own when 125 00:10:33.399 --> 00:10:37.759 I was twenty years old because I did not have a fully developed skeptical core 126 00:10:37.960 --> 00:10:43.960 in my brain. Thank you, Jonathan, you feel me. So this 127 00:10:43.039 --> 00:10:48.960 is so. This was a fully a story that talks about a child being 128 00:10:50.000 --> 00:10:56.320 taken advantage of by an adult, and I'm pretty sure that he used his 129 00:10:56.440 --> 00:11:00.519 position of power in order for him to do it, even though that in 130 00:11:00.600 --> 00:11:05.399 the stories it really does not mention that I One of the articles I found 131 00:11:05.480 --> 00:11:13.840 actually on iri Iirimnyaman FM, which is a radio station in Jamaica, gave 132 00:11:13.879 --> 00:11:18.120 a little bit more exposition on the story. It said that the police now 133 00:11:18.159 --> 00:11:22.919 have charged a Kenyon Roman Catholic Priests who was arrested in relation to an alleged 134 00:11:22.000 --> 00:11:28.320 case of sexual abuse. The charges include sexual intercourse with a person under sixteen 135 00:11:28.399 --> 00:11:33.440 years and sexual touching of a child, grievous sexual assault and abduction of a 136 00:11:33.519 --> 00:11:37.120 child under sixteen years. As Phil talked about at the beginning of the segment. 137 00:11:37.000 --> 00:11:43.200 It also alleged offenses were committed on Sunday afternoon on Marsh to nineteenth, 138 00:11:43.559 --> 00:11:48.279 but of course we didn't get reported until June or twenty third. It also 139 00:11:48.600 --> 00:11:54.720 says that reports are that the priests befriended the child and lured her to his 140 00:11:54.799 --> 00:12:00.120 home where he allegedly assaulted her, and the charges were filed after them and 141 00:12:00.320 --> 00:12:07.440 was positively identified by the complainant during an identification parade and question and answer interview 142 00:12:07.440 --> 00:12:11.440 with the story. This is what we know. But I also found out 143 00:12:11.600 --> 00:12:22.440 from nationwide radio JM dot com that this particular priest is named Lawrence Mouvemuvengi and 144 00:12:22.840 --> 00:12:30.440 he is the one who was also granted bail when he appeared in front of 145 00:12:30.440 --> 00:12:35.600 the Saint Katharine Parish court and he was granted a sum get this guy's of 146 00:12:35.799 --> 00:12:43.399 eight hundred thousand dollars And I'm like, where did you get that squirrilla from 147 00:12:43.440 --> 00:12:48.879 sir be able to put a bail after you sexually assaulted a child. And 148 00:12:50.120 --> 00:12:54.840 he has been charged with rape and sexual grooming and having intercourse with the person 149 00:12:54.960 --> 00:13:01.360 under sixteen and he is going to appear in court on September twenty seventh of 150 00:13:01.440 --> 00:13:05.200 this year. So I think that this is a story that is definitely worth 151 00:13:05.360 --> 00:13:11.120 following. But I just have a question for you all, just too, 152 00:13:11.519 --> 00:13:13.639 if you want to go ahead and answer it for me. Do you all 153 00:13:13.679 --> 00:13:20.519 think because the eight hundred thousand dollars was granted for him to get on bail 154 00:13:20.600 --> 00:13:24.399 so he's not in jail now, do you think that this is probably a 155 00:13:24.480 --> 00:13:33.080 part of that whole diocese in a fund that has been set aside for priests 156 00:13:33.080 --> 00:13:39.039 that have been accused of sexually assaulting children in Filadel? What do you think? 157 00:13:39.639 --> 00:13:45.799 Well, I had I had read about that outrageous ability to get out 158 00:13:45.840 --> 00:13:50.879 on bail. I'm not I've had mixed feelings about the bail process because I 159 00:13:50.919 --> 00:13:54.639 think it enables the rich. But moving past that right now, this guy 160 00:13:54.679 --> 00:13:58.000 shouldn't be getting out of jail, and we all know that if it wasn't 161 00:13:58.039 --> 00:14:01.559 directly from the Catholic Church. It's one of those angles, you know, 162 00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:07.320 one of those semi Catholic related charities, not charities, but organizations that are 163 00:14:07.799 --> 00:14:09.679 supporting this. This is, as I said, this is a criminal syndicate, 164 00:14:09.720 --> 00:14:13.279 though you know, we can call it a church, and that's probably 165 00:14:13.279 --> 00:14:16.960 true. At most churches. But at the bottom line is this guy committed 166 00:14:16.000 --> 00:14:20.919 a crime that are most likely committed, a crime that all indications has said 167 00:14:20.960 --> 00:14:24.679 earlier he should never get out, and the mere fact that anyone is interested 168 00:14:24.679 --> 00:14:28.279 in seeing him out I would be more of even if I thought what I 169 00:14:28.320 --> 00:14:31.159 wanted to give him the complete benefit of the doubt. Well, let's let 170 00:14:31.159 --> 00:14:35.240 you sit and think about where you are right now, and then we'll see 171 00:14:35.279 --> 00:14:37.919 what the evidence bears out. But no, like we continue to see, 172 00:14:39.000 --> 00:14:43.480 let's make sure we minimize the responsibility for your actions. Whether you're guilty or 173 00:14:43.519 --> 00:14:46.200 not doesn't matter. Let's go ahead and take care of our own. And 174 00:14:46.240 --> 00:14:48.039 that's what I think we're seeing now, John, or what's your take, 175 00:14:48.279 --> 00:14:54.440 I would agree with what you're saying, if anything is true. I've been 176 00:14:54.480 --> 00:14:58.000 to Jamaica, but that was almost forty years ago now, so I don't 177 00:14:58.000 --> 00:15:03.039 know what Jamaica's lie now, but it was a fairly poor country when I 178 00:15:03.159 --> 00:15:05.000 was, and maybe Phil can fill us in on that a little more. 179 00:15:05.039 --> 00:15:09.960 But I would say that, you know, there's no common person there and 180 00:15:11.039 --> 00:15:13.639 no priest that I know who can come up with almost a million bucks for 181 00:15:13.759 --> 00:15:18.159 bail. So I'm thinking that it had to be the church, even though 182 00:15:18.200 --> 00:15:22.240 it doesn't. I don't I didn't see anything that's said where, But yeah, 183 00:15:22.240 --> 00:15:26.360 you know, it's just really really a tragic event. But he should 184 00:15:26.440 --> 00:15:31.399 stay in jail, and I think I don't remember which one it was, 185 00:15:31.480 --> 00:15:35.720 but I think he was given house arrest. But you know, we know 186 00:15:35.759 --> 00:15:39.480 what that is. He lives in a church house. So you know, 187 00:15:41.519 --> 00:15:48.159 of course the bishops removed him from all pastoral work, but that doesn't necessarily 188 00:15:48.200 --> 00:15:52.759 mean he's put up any blocks to his access to other children. You know, 189 00:15:52.759 --> 00:15:54.960 he said the house last time. Yeah, so I'm kind of wondering 190 00:15:54.960 --> 00:16:00.759 who else he's been grooming, Like you mentioned Infidel that you know, did 191 00:16:00.799 --> 00:16:06.360 he come from that problem before, because it's just like the church to move 192 00:16:06.440 --> 00:16:08.600 him to another country. So, you know, now we have a whole 193 00:16:08.639 --> 00:16:14.600 bunch of whole slew of problems that just don't add up, you know, 194 00:16:14.720 --> 00:16:18.879 as far as anything in the way of being of law abiding or legal precedent. 195 00:16:19.000 --> 00:16:22.519 It just doesn't make sense to me. Phil, What do you got 196 00:16:22.519 --> 00:16:23.840 to say. I know you're in Barbados, but I thought so that you're 197 00:16:23.919 --> 00:16:26.639 in the Caribbean area, you might have a little bit to say. Yeah, 198 00:16:27.279 --> 00:16:33.559 Jamaica is still in terms of because of the large difference. The when 199 00:16:33.600 --> 00:16:36.480 you look at the dollar, I can't remember how much it is one US. 200 00:16:37.320 --> 00:16:41.919 I can't math is one hundred and forty Jamaican. So one my questions 201 00:16:41.039 --> 00:16:45.879 was is it eight hundred US or is it a one hundred thousand Jamaican. 202 00:16:48.759 --> 00:16:55.120 And then the other thing, as you raise Jonathan the point that that's one 203 00:16:55.159 --> 00:16:59.279 of the questions, I had to have he done this before? Yeah, 204 00:16:59.399 --> 00:17:03.759 you know, because this is this, this is something that just don't happen 205 00:17:03.039 --> 00:17:07.680 just so by chance. And on top of that, why that came to 206 00:17:07.759 --> 00:17:12.960 my mind is two weeks later he fondled the girls were after the first assault. 207 00:17:14.079 --> 00:17:18.559 So this is suggesting to me this is not something that just started. 208 00:17:18.720 --> 00:17:23.440 This is something ongoing. And and and then the other question that came to 209 00:17:23.519 --> 00:17:29.559 my mind is Kenyan from a Catholic priest, but they're moving from Kenya to 210 00:17:29.599 --> 00:17:33.799 Jamaica. Why, Holly suspect? Why you know? So it raises a 211 00:17:33.920 --> 00:17:37.839 number of questions and and and and and it is it is clear we know 212 00:17:38.079 --> 00:17:42.759 from the past how the Catholic Church tends to move around problematic priests, especially 213 00:17:42.759 --> 00:17:47.720 when it comes to this sexual abuse. They do it, and and and 214 00:17:47.720 --> 00:17:49.880 and then the person goes on to do it again. And so when they 215 00:17:49.920 --> 00:17:53.559 do not make them accountable, they do not remove them, they do not 216 00:17:53.720 --> 00:17:59.480 even bring charges against them, you know, And just to say that it's 217 00:17:59.519 --> 00:18:03.680 a priest, so he is excuse. No, he's a human being like 218 00:18:03.759 --> 00:18:07.839 any one of us. And if one of us did it or behinds will 219 00:18:07.880 --> 00:18:11.839 still be in jail. Can't make excuses, right, you can't make excuses 220 00:18:11.880 --> 00:18:18.599 at all, and they should not. And the thing is is that this 221 00:18:18.640 --> 00:18:23.480 seems like a slap on the wrist for that priest one hundred thousand. Maybe 222 00:18:23.519 --> 00:18:29.400 it's Jamaican dollars, a hundred thousand Jamaican dollars, right, it's a slap 223 00:18:29.480 --> 00:18:33.519 on the risk and very likely the church they pay for right. And there 224 00:18:33.880 --> 00:18:41.240 I know there was a assault case here in Barbados where the the pasta right 225 00:18:41.480 --> 00:18:45.880 and he assaulted the same age basically as this young lady, a young girl 226 00:18:47.000 --> 00:18:51.440 too, around the same age, eleven or twelve years old. And the 227 00:18:51.559 --> 00:18:56.640 persons in the congregation used to hold this guy up, put a red carpet 228 00:18:56.680 --> 00:19:00.440 out for him. Then he's got an out the car, and so I 229 00:19:00.480 --> 00:19:04.279 think, what if I remember correctly, they ostracize the girl, the young 230 00:19:04.359 --> 00:19:15.240 girl, and I suspect any church members who love this this priest very lately 231 00:19:15.559 --> 00:19:18.640 will do the same thing for your child. And maybe that's why another reason 232 00:19:18.720 --> 00:19:22.839 why it took so long for them to reapport the incident. Yeah, yes, 233 00:19:23.160 --> 00:19:27.640 right, so Cynthia, Yeah, where is the empathy for the victim? 234 00:19:27.960 --> 00:19:32.359 I just I just want to know. I know that like a lot 235 00:19:32.400 --> 00:19:38.920 of times, I hear some people say very problematic things when a person is 236 00:19:38.960 --> 00:19:45.160 accusing another person of sexual assault. And when me too first came out and 237 00:19:45.240 --> 00:19:48.240 you would hear the words believe me, and then some people will be like, 238 00:19:48.319 --> 00:19:52.519 oh, they're just they're lying, or why would we believe you? 239 00:19:52.680 --> 00:19:56.640 Or did you see what you were wearing or whatever you It still shows that 240 00:19:56.680 --> 00:20:02.039 we have a long way to go in society before we are actually empathy and 241 00:20:02.559 --> 00:20:07.440 empathizing with the victims of these terrible events. And I just want to say 242 00:20:07.440 --> 00:20:11.200 one more thing before we wrap up. This very point was also brought up 243 00:20:11.200 --> 00:20:17.400 on recent episodes, but I gotta say it, I'm so tired of reading 244 00:20:17.559 --> 00:20:23.200 story after story of people accusing members of the LGBTQIA plus community of grooming children. 245 00:20:23.559 --> 00:20:32.200 When we have story after story after story after story of priests and other 246 00:20:32.279 --> 00:20:37.079 ministers and other people that are leaders in the religious community actually grooming children, 247 00:20:37.240 --> 00:20:41.559 we got it backwards and we need to do better. And I hope that 248 00:20:41.839 --> 00:20:45.799 possibly talking about this more we can make a difference. But if you dear 249 00:20:45.880 --> 00:20:49.799 viewer, want to hear us talk more about things, click here.