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This is later with Lee Matthews the
Lee Matthews Podcast more what you hear weekday

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afternoons on the Drive. It is
a truly fascinating story, and it's a

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story about about an error that you
don't hear about much anymore. You wouldn't

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you wouldn't think this still kind of
goes on in this modern era. Catherine

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Coldstream converted to Catholicism and then became
a carmelite nun for twelve years. But

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at some point she had to walk
away, and she's told all about it

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in her news book The Guardian,
and it is out now everywhere you get

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books. The Guardian and My Years
as a Nun, Catherine Coldstream. Good

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to have you along today, Hi, highly yes. Just to clarify,

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there was a yeah, there was
a feature in the Guardian newspaper over here.

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The book's title is actually Cloistered Cloistered. I'm sorry, I standing.

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Yeah, Okay, if you were
in your habit, you would have permission

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to slap me on the wrist with
a ruler. I would indeed, No,

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I don't think I would. I
think mother would draw the line at

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that. But yeah, so,
yeah, it tells the story of my

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twelve years in a monastery. So
let's start at the beginning. You got

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into you converted to Catholicism after your
father's death. Am I to gather you

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also maybe became a nun because you
were kind of running away from something.

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Well, good question. I guess
I'll never know for sure, but I

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think I was very deeply affected by
my father's death and other things that had

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happened just before that, which meant
my family was in a state of disintegration

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basically. And I think I,
yeah, I probably was finding regular life

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pretty overwhelming and was looking for meaning. I felt it just not running away

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from, but warning towards something which
I was searching for, which was this

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meaningful life of dedication and of course
God. But you know, it's possible.

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I'm not a psychiatrist or a psychologist, but it's possible I was also

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running away from things. And I
guess you can do both at the same

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time. Catherine Coldstreams, he's the
author of Cloistered my Ears as a nun,

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I too, Catherine, consider myself
a pretty deeply religious person, and

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I can understand there was a time
in my life when I too, thought,

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wouldn't it be wonderful to have this
life where all you were doing is

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serving rather than being served, giving
rather than being given too. But something

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else clicked. It probably was this
demon we know is radio that captured more

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of my heart than my religious life
did. But there's a certain appeal to

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the lifestyle. Yes, it's a
very compelling it's quite a seductive way of

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life because it's so unusual, and
it feels so special when you're very young,

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and that idea of complete dedication appeals
to useful idealism, I guess.

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And in the part of the country
where I grew up, there were a

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lot of Dominicans, Franciscan and Carmelite
nuns. But they were all they were

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not They were not cloistered. They
were all out teaching or nursing or or

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doing something else in the community.
You you're you're uh, you're you're completely

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shut off from the outside world.
Yes, that's so so, I mean,

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there are Dominican nuns who who live
a cloistered life, But there are

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also Dominican nuns who, you know, they're slightly different branches of the same

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order. So there are those who
live a very contemportative life. But then

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there are those who live what's called
an Apostolic life, so they go out

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teach, nurse, serve the community. Yeah, well when when you were

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what what what made you choose one
over the other? Well, it was

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really what I came in contact with. I think, like a lot of

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people who really got into this kind
of spirituality of the cloister I'd read the

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Story of a Soul by Saint Herrere's
of Lizia. That's a story of a

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very strong sense of purpose and vocation
and idealism from a young woman who is

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about my own age, and I
really related to it, so that swung

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me towards the Karmel. She was
a Calmel like nun in northern France.

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And then of course I spent time
just trying out, you know, looking

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at different branches of Catholicism. My
first choice actually that I initially that really

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captivated me was the Missionaries of Charity, the order set up in Calcutta by

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Mother Teresa, and I really was
interested in that, and I, you

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know, I hope for that.
But eventually the kind of silent prayer life

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just took over and I was really
drawn magnetically, really into a cloistered life.

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Catherine Coldstream is with us. Her
book is Cloistered My Years as a

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nan It's a memoir. And then
what made you start to question your choice?

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At some point you decide, I've
got to get away from this.

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Yes, well, a cloitered world
is a hot house. You know,

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you've got twenty one women thrown together, very different personalities under one roof.

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And however, well intentioned people are
in a hot house situation where you're really

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shut off. You know, there's
a shadow side that can really become extremely

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difficult to navigate. And you know, I became aware that there were,

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you know, discrepancies between what was
taught and what was done. That was

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the first thing that kind of worried
me. Now, of course, much

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older and wiser, i'd sort of
been more accepting, but I think I

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was quite shocked by some of that
stuff. And then there were the power

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struggles, which and the cliques.
Power struggles and cliques and things that seemed

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to be very heartful to people.
And in the end, you know,

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there was a lot of inner pain
to deal with in a very solitary way.

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Because you lived a very solitary life
in your cell. You didn't have

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really much sort of emotional support or
you were supposed to manage very much on

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your own in silence that of course, psychologically it's extremely difficult, so you

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know, for better or for worse, I felt I couldn't really carry on

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in the end because I just had
a lot of questions. And she talks

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about those questions in her new book, Cloistered My Life as a Nun.

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It's Catherine Coldstream's memoir and it's available
everywhere. I could talk to you about

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this for a long, a much
longer time, but I'm afraid we must

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move on. And I thank you
for joining us and for not hitting me

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on the wrist with the ruler.
I promise not to do that, Lee,

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and thanks so much for having me
on the show. Ami, thanks

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for listening to Later with Lee Matthews, the Lee Matthews Podcast, and remember

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to listen to The Drive Live weekday
afternoons from five to seven and iHeartMedia presentation.