This podcast episode is brought to you by Coors Light. These days, everything is go, go go. It's NonStop hustle all the time. Work, friends, family, expect you to be on twenty four seven. Well, sometimes you just need to reach for a Coors Light because it's made to chill. Coors Light is cold loggered, cold filtered, and cold package. It's as crisp and refreshing as the Colorado Rockies. He's literally made to chill. Coors Light is the one I choose when I need to unwind. So when you want to hit reset, reach for the beer that's made to chill. Get Coors Light and the new look delivered straight to your door with drizzling or INSTATCRT Celebrate Responsibly. Coors Brewing Company, Golden Colorado. I'm Cheneio Bloomackay, I'm Lisa Leslie, and we're very excited to tell you about our new podcast with Blue Wire Front and Center. Lisa and I are breaking down what's going on in our lives and the world and keeping it one hundred. We're also learning from amazing guests as well, like Emmanuel Acho. People it show love to me, I Forever Got their back. Devoicate a Fox. If the foundation is right, then the rest of it's gonna go wrong from there any more. Subscribe to Front and Center today. What is kracklacing hardware knocks listeners? I am Dan for Valley, coming at you with my co host for the first half of this podcast. Anyway, Adam FROMO. We have a loaded episode to get to today. The second half of this podcast is going to be the Clippers look Ahead, and we're bringing on Espionation. Sabrina Merchant does a great job covering the league and all the LA teams over there spit specifically, so I'm excited to talk to her that again. We'll be at the back end of this podcast. If that's why you're here, feel free to skip forward to it. Am and I though lots to talk about. Darryl Morey in Philadelphia. The Rockets hire Steven Silas, what does that mean for their future? LaMelo's ball LaMelo Ball's draft stock is plummeting. Not lame those balls. I don't know about the stock of LaMelo's balls, but LaMelo Balls draft stock might be dropping. We will get to that. The Jazz we're also sold. We may talk about that if we have time. First and foremost, though, shout out to our sponsors this week, Indeed and bet Online dot AG. Without them, this podcast would not be possible. And I just want to add this note. Please, please, pretty please continue rating, reviewing, and subscribing to us on wherever you're getting your podcasts. Download every episode, make sure you're subscribed. If you are not using iTunes, we still ask that you head over search Hardwood Knocks, throw us that five star rating, write a review. We are reading them. It can include constructive criticism. We appreciate it all. That's the best way to help us out. And look, if you're enjoying these loaded episodes where we're trying to do deep dives into every single team, which will do the best we can with that. The league schedule right now, which we already talked about starting on December twenty two, might infringe upon some of that. I will try to bring as many teams on as possible before free agency starts and a little bit after it's over. If you like these episodes, if you like it, we're putting out, you know, between four to six hours worth of content every single week. We really do ask that you subscribe Downlold every episode and go to iTunes and rate and review us. It's very very very very much appreciated. Can't say that enough with that one hundred and twenty second intro. Out of the way, Adam, how you be. I'm doing good. It's snowed in Colorado and helped with the fires that had been raged in just west of the Front Range, so that was good. And it's starting to clear out now, which means that we can go back inside and go back outside and play with our toddler and some fields and stuff, which has been much better than being cooped up. How about you one, It doesn't it from the pictures you have sent to me previously, you and our good friend Jacob, the air quality over there did not look like ideal, at least like in certain parts some of those pictures were incredibly scary. And all's well over here. Look, I'm not complaining because the temperature has been relatively high though the impact of global warming like that obviously worries made. But it's been the temperature has been fine. I have not seen sunlight, I feel like in two or three weeks. It's just been raining constantly here, So hoping for some sunlight if I get lucky enough. But no real complaints otherwise. I'm actually, look, we have to start here, Daryl Moorey ending up with the Sixers after leaving Houston because he wanted to spend a year with his family, his kids in college. We're going to take a gap year. Apparently it ended up being a two week like gap two week whatever you call. That's like a full year. So that's also true that that might be two full years by that point. I'll say my reaction first is that very few things absolutely for me right now, like even though we don't know about them in advance, this was something that legitimately floored me to see, not necessarily the team, but the swiftness with which it happened. And I'm just curious as to your overall impressions of Daryl Moorey ending up with the Sixers as team president also, you know, now elevating him over Elton Brand who was the GM in place. And I think he deserves a lot of criticisms for what's happened there. But it also seemed like this was going to be the first year in which he kind of had carte blanc, where there weren't that many voices in the room or at least ones that needed to be weighed more so or just as equally as his, and now clearly that's just not happening anymore. I'm impressed by the move because I'm impressed by Daryl Morey. I think that if the last decade or so has taught us anything about him, it's that he really is just a brilliant basketball mind who's wishing, who's willing to push the envelope to make controversial decisions and moves all with the idea of bettering his team. I stand by the idea that I wish Houston had had a chance to run it back, because the experiment with micro ball never got a full chance to really pan out. You know, they were trying to fit the pieces that were already on the roster around them, even with the moves to bring in a guy like Robert Covington, giving them a full off season to actually figure things out. With a healthy Russell Brook who had started to really play a lot better and smarter basketball prior to the NBA shutting down amid the coronavirus pandemic, like giving giving that all a chance to be fully realized could have produced some better results instead of ending on sort of a sour note. So yeah, I just I'm a Morey fan in general. I do think that it's interesting how because of the Moury Philadelphia reputations, I think that people are assuming that this is going to be more of like a tumultuous or groundbreaking tenure than it probably will be. I don't I don't see Morey wanting to make a big swing for a new star because he already has two. I don't see Houston wanting to make a James Harden for Ben Simmons swap or anything like that, if any, if anything, because they'd be afraid to trade with Morey given how well he's done on that front in the past. I don't think we're going to see anything like the Sam hinkyp tear down in Philadelphia, even though he was originally a Morey disciple, just because this team already has so much in place, So I feel like we're instead going to see smarter moves made around the periphery to support the pieces that are already in place in Philadelphia, which isn't as exciting as people might expect from that Morey Philadelphia combination, but the starting point is already a pretty lofty one. Yeah, there's definitely I think people are simultaneously over selling the likelihood that he does something seismic with Ben Simmons and Joel Embiid, but also under selling it a little bit. I agree with you that he's going to try and tinker with the surrounding pieces first and foremost. But if we people talked about his patients, this dude has made seventy seven trades over the last however many years. I think it was his tenure in Houston, which was the most in the league. If it's mid season and it's not working out, I don't think he'll hesitate to pull off something that's major and more wholesale, where maybe you're looking at moving one of Joel embe Ben Simmons and so I at once think that they are absolutely going to begin the season there. I think there's actually less of a guarantee that one of them finishes the season there. Maybe you could say there's more of a guarantee because you trust more to sort of figure it out and put the right pieces around them. But the way he likes to play, I don't think it needs to be as drastic as it was in Houston. He doesn't need to take a zillion threes every single game. He prefers threes over mid rangers, and that might be the bigger thing, is that he wants shots at the rim, layups, free throws, and three is just over mid rangers. Cutting out those mid range jumpers are going to be easy from Philly's diet. Ben Simmons is great at getting to the rim. Where you start running into problems is you know, forget about Ben Simmons is shooting because you at least have Joel Embiid who will spot up from the three point line. And then they just went through this with Russell Westbrook, like he showed that he's willing to adjust. Can you get Ben Simmons to have any sort of three point volume? But also the foul shooting with Ben Simmons is not a strength of his and so that might create some issues. And so there's definitely a level of concern earned there. But like this team is still going to be at least until the trade deadline, in my mind, built around Ben Simmons and Joel Embid and the question is going to be about how you can optimize the talent around them. Leads what's leads into the larger discussion or the other discussion of what happens with Al Horford, the Bias Harris, even Josh Richardson on an expiring contract. As you mentioned, you say that more he's not gonna be looking to bring in another star. I would put it, he's not going to be looking to bring in an alternative star right off the bat. He wants stars, and so what I think is actually more likely. I don't think they have the asset sway to pull off a Bradley Beale type trade if you're not including Ben Simmons or Joel Embiid. But he's not. To me, this is just speculation. Won't hesitate to trade distant first rounders, like remember the report where he was going to give up four for Jimmy Butler. And you have to weigh the value of those because if you're getting a star, you're you're theoretically going to be really good, and those first aren't worth as much. But I think it's far more likely now that he includes the sweeteners necessary the number of them to get off of a Tobias Harris or Al Horford. That was the next point I was going to make, specifically with Horford. I have a trouble. I have a tough time seeing him moving Tobias Harris or Josh Richardson because they do fit better around the existing pieces in a theoretical sense. Like you know, Tobias Harris's initial tenure with Philadelphia has been a little bit rocky, but there have been moments where it seemed like he really can fit there, and I would expect more to try to make that work. But the other thing I think we need to dispel a little bit is the idea that he was just a layups and threes general manager, president of basketball operations, whatever the front office role may be. I've always I always got the sense that that was more about him maximizing the central star of his system. You know that that's what worked best for James Harden and as much as he does appreciate those shots over the alternatives which are less efficient, but he is not just like always going to cater to that analytical strategy so much as build the right strategy around his pieces. So that's why, like I think, you know, not to call anyone out too explicitly, but like when Kirk Goldsberry initially reacted to this news by tweeting out a link to Ben Simmons's shot chart and questioning the fit essentially like, yeah, Simmons doesn't shoot threes, he's also really good at generating three pointers for other players. So between his ability to get to the rim and create for others, like, that's what I would expect Morey to try to maximize rather than trying to shoehorn his roster into his idealistic system. Now, it's it's always the mark of a good general manager or a good coach when you're able to blend together your own desires with the personnel at your disposal, rather than force fitting the personnel into a desired scheme. I think Rick Carlisle and Greg Popovitch are probably the two absolute maths at doing that, and that's why we see them consistently get the most out of these fringe roster players and cast offs from other teams. And in a sense, like, that's what I expect more to be able to do as a general manager with resources at his disposal, is to use those same kind of principles we saw established in Houston, but also fit them to the roster at his disposal. And what's sort of interesting too, is I think the question has come up that who is more likely to be traded Al horferor Tobias Harris, And the reflective answer has been Al Horfer just because his contract is shorter. He has three years an eighty one million left, only sixty nine million of which is guaranteed, so you can look at it as a two year, sixty nine million dollar commitment. And then Tobias Harris has four years in one hundred and forty seven point three, which is just I'm glad he got his money. I am pro players getting paid as much as they can. That's a tough contract to move. But also because it's so tough to move, it's just like, can you trade to buy Harris as part of a net positive deal? Where the way I'm thinking about is one of the deals that I thought is like, you know what if Orlando just really wanted a scoring wing, even if you're you're not including sweeteners to get let's say a package built around Evan Fournier and Terrence Ross or Terrence Ross and Aaron Gordon, because at that point, where you're really doing instead of maybe upgrading the talent or the fit around you, is your just shaving dollars off your long term salary build, and that's not something fan should celebrate. Number one and two, it's not going to result in cap space for this team they could use in pre agency because they have such lofty contracts elsewhere. And you already touched on this the bias. Harris is a good fit in Philly. It's just the player that they need. He's not Jimmy Butler. He's not gonna put a ton much pressure on the rim. He's more of like a you know, that third creator if you like a spot ball handler more so than an actual creator. And maybe a Philly's willing to run more pick and rolls in the Darryl Mori error like that might help his value. But the fit is just cleaner than it is for Al Horford. And if you combine that with the financial commitment, and it's easier to just envision them turning Al Horford plus picks, whether it's thybo like Al Horford plus a, Zach always been saying stuff into someone who demonstrably helps their roster because Al Horford is such an awkward fit there. My biggest concern with this move is potential clashing between Doc Rivers and Darryl Moray, just because Maury is one of the most pronounced proponents of analytics in the NBA today, and Doc Rivers has more questions about those. To put it nicely, I just they have a relationships. As Adrian wil Tarowski reported, they have history together, but I wonder if there are going to be any head clashing incidents there just because they do have such different philosophies. We have seen reports about how Doc Rivers was let go from the Clippers because he would ignore the analytics staff. He didn't enjoy the trends towards the relying on the numbers, and that's definitely more of a Moriy principle. So that relationship is definitely going to be something to monitor for sure. And I think anytime you bring in a top basketball executive who didn't hire the current head coach, it's something that's worth looking at. I guess, aside from Loach saying they have that working relationship from Boston, what probably helps is that the Rockets were looking at Doc Rivers as head coach before Daryl Morey left. Now, I don't know how much it matters that Daryl Morey was telling candidates he might not be there, and so you could just look at that as like, well, that doesn't really matter, but maybe that helps, just the fact that they had spoken already, I would assume about the job with the Rockets, and look, I don't think it seems like the Sixers. You know, team governors are going to be willing to spend because they went out there and got more. And look, the willingness to spend is probably the biggest market inefficiency right now because other teams won't be on the heels of this coronavirus pandemic. And then the impact on the league revenue, which for this season only dropped by ten percent. I thought that was shockingly low overall, but they're definitely gonna be more concerned about next season, where I think you have to deal with the prospect where most of the markets, if not many, may not have fans all year. Like that seems like it's a legitimate possibility. So if you're willing to spend, I wouldn't put it past this team too. If it doesn't work out after year, Doc Rivers is gone and they're sinking up with a new coach who's Darryl Moore's choice, that's something I think you absolutely have to wait. Knowing he didn't pick the coach that's in place. And also you would think that they talk to him about that and said like, is this would you keep that like his doc a fit for you long term? Because maybe he's taking the mindset of well, I'll just come in and I'll figure it out later. But he knew Doc Rivers was there before he took this job, and so that just coupled with the fact that the Rockets were looking at Doc Rivers probably helps out a little bit. But as you were talking about what the reports were, Doc wasn't necessarily taking into account what the analytics team for the Clippers was saying. That certainly couldn't matter, but it's also like that's clearly not going to fly in Philadelphia like that with more at the helm because just that's just not going to work. Yeah, So before we wrap up this segment, I want to ask you if you can have one word or phrase to sum up the Morey hiring, because it is so complicated and there are so many different ways to react to it. What would it be, And to buy you a little time, I'll tell you that mine would be optimism inducing. I think you said one word, that's two. It's hyphenated it's one word. No, that doesn't can't come up with another one. I also said word or phrase I would say, I would say aggressive might be the word that I'm that I'm coming out just because you look at what they had just done, because it's a little confusing. It's it's like it's everything. It's bold, it's confusing, it's no doubt expensive. It is certainly optimism inducing, like if you're a six or strand, you have to be more hopeful that whatever happens Daryl Morey is going to prioritize fit a little bit better than what was at least happening in Philly. Because I can't stress this enough, like shooting in ball handling is what you need. Around Ben Simmons and Al Horford, they went the completely opposite direction. It wasn't like this slight detour, slight pivot. It was the antithesis of how they needed to build this team. And I wasn't among the people that killed they Al Horford signing, and I'm not even saying that I was in support of it. It was more of this morbid curiosity where it's like, well, you could see it working, but it seemed like their main concern was navigating the minutes without Joel and Bed in which case they're paying close to nine figures for a second string center. Is what it felt like, even though he was starting. So there was a morbid curiosity where I thought it might work and the fact that it didn't though, like you could with Jimmy Butler leaving jj Reddick leaving, Like those are the two players you needed most, So they're in this weird spot. Even though sports had a break, your business didn't. You have to keep moving and that makes hiring more important than ever. Indeed is here to help. 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Go right now to indeed dot com slash blue wire. Terms and conditions apply. Offer valid through December thirty. First, I know you said you wanted to wrap this up, but I actually have a couple of trades I'd like to throw out with you to see, like the level of sweeteners that it would take to pull something like this off. Nothing about that is in any way surprising. Why why you think that I love fake trades or something like that. I don't know where I would have got another impression, So I'll start with the most popular one. I'm more so going to ask you, like what sweeteners do you think it takes to get these things done? And it's the buddy heeled to Philadelphia for Al Horford. What needs to be attached to make that work? So you can look at Horford's deal, Let's just say it's three years eighty one million, knowing that it could be two years sixty nine. I think the one thing that would help the Sixers in this case is that Buddy Heald's contract like isn't great itself. Like, I don't know that you get Buddy Healed on his I think he's four years and guaranteed ninety four million dollars as the potential to go up to one twelve or something around there in one oh six. That's not a great contract, But I still think you probably need to include a first round pick and Thible or another first round pick to get that done. See, I think it might be even less than that, just because of where Healed stands with the Sacramento organization right now. We had the reports earlier this offseason that he wasn't even talking to head coach Luke Walton, which is troubling. We know how disgruntled he was after he was moved to the bench and the team experienced success after that. Knowing that they're going to have to pay Dear and Fox a mega extension and that they are aggressively pursuing a resigning of Bogdon Bogdanovitch, the money is going to be tight for Sacramento. But given their their need for a big man who they can rely on to some extent at least, like, I feel like that's more feasible than we originally thought, especially with more in place now where he might be willing to make the offer of Horford and one first round pick and see if they bite on that, and they might. I don't know that you need to get too aggressive beyond that, just given where Healed stands with the organization, I actually think it would take more because I'm just unless money McNair is going to do his guy down more a favor here, But it's just so unknowable. I have another one for you, though now I'm actually surprised this one hasn't been floated out more since the Bulls hired Billy Donovan, who coached Al Horford Florida Otto porter, who's making he has a twenty eight point five million dollar player option. He's going to pick that up for Al Horford with the siebal and number seventeen. Now here's my thinking, because the Horford contract can theoretically go three years, Like maybe that seems too long, but you have Wendel Carter Junior, who was billed as Minnie al Horford, And maybe the concern is can you start Wendell Carter Junior over Al Horford. I don't think that you could play them together, at least for long stretches, but who better to mentor Minnie al Horford than actual Al Horford. Well, and the good news is that Wendell Carter Junior will only be available for half of the season anyway, so you don't have that problem for much of the year. But I mean, I feel like that does seem pretty fair right off the bat to me. And less Chicago is still really high on Auto Porter Junior, which is a possibility because they entered this past season harboring in their minds legitimate playoff aspirations, and then when everyone got hurt, Porter included, that wasn't able to even become close to reality. But if they if they look at him and still see the do everything kind of fringe star that they expected when they originally acquired him, then it could take significantly more. And it's just it's tough to know where his value lies with that organization, especially given the front office changes that they've also made, because, as you mentioned, with the front offices and hiring and coaches that were hired by the previous regime. Like, that's this situation in a nutshell as well, just with a player instead of a coach. So without having any insight into what Chicago still thinks of him, it's tough, but it seems like a fair initial proposal. Also, I don't know why I keeps saying number seventeen. They have number twenty one. I think because I was writing about the Timberwolves earlier that number seventeen is sort of ingrained into my head, so it would be uber, it would be number twenty one. Okay. So this what I think is probably the ideal trade partner for the Sixers is a team that might be looking to rebuild but wants to straddle two lines. And I could think of no better team than the San Antonio Spurs for this. If you went Al Horford, let's say the twenty twenty second from the twenty twenty one second from New York, the twenty twenty second from New York, number twenty one, and tieble for Patty Mills and Rudy Guet. I'm sorry, I just I need a minute here to wrap my head around the idea of DAMARDA. Rosen LaMarcus Aldridge and Al Horford sharing a court in twenty twenty and twenty twenty one, because that's just I view Damarda Rosen for the Spurs is like a sunk cost at this point, and even not a sun cost like Kean aldrederon expiring deals, I just don't view them as part of the long term. And I think you can get away with playing Horford and Aldridge together because they both shoot threes, and I don't think it's gonna be any better than the Ebide Horford pairing. But if you're the Spurs and you really want to grind down the pace, I think there's a pathway to doing it. I wouldn't suggest for long periods of time, but look, yaka Peardle's up for a new deal. Maybe you don't want to pay him, you know, twelve to fifteen million dollars a year if that's what his market ends up being, and you kind of want to rebuild, But like you said, you have to Marta Rosen and la Marcus Aldridge, and I think those contracts are so massive they're both Aldridge is twenty four million, Demarta Rosen's making about the same as horfor twenty seven point seven million, Like those are just hard expirings to move, and so maybe you could give Demarta Rosen to Philly. They just won't care about the theoretical fit with Ben Simmons there, but you're I don't think you're the sweeteners you're gonna get will be as profuse in that scenario. So it's two seconds both from the Knicks, so they're one of them is already a higher end second that comes at it's number thirty eight in this year's draft, next year's Nick second the number twenty one pick, or you could even go maybe with Philly's pick next year if you get that out of them plus the eyeball and then Al Horford for Patty Mills and Rudy Gay. I guess the concern there for Philly is that seems more like those players fit, but that seems more like a rental because how many years are you going to give? Does Rudy Gay and Patty Mill? So like throw the seconds out of there are you doing? Or throw one of the first Like is that enough of a two seconds and bible or first plus Horford for those two players. Yeah, I think it's fair value. But you know, like you know when a star player is clearly hanging on too long, and it's just like it's a little sad to watch because they're such a diminished version of themselves, and you like you wish that they had hung it up a little bit earlier so that this wasn't the lasting image in your mind. I just I don't want the Spurs to be the franchise equivalent of that, where they're so desperate to hang on the periphery of the playoff chase and stick on that mediocrity treadmill that we end up seeing Al Horford, LaMarcus Aldridge, and Dmardrozen playing together, because that does not sound like an enjoyable experience for anyone involved. I'm kind of with you a team that I would watch for Al Horford, and I'm saying, if Janna signs his Supermax and that takes twenty one for agency off the table, I could see Toronto being opportunistic and thinking we won't always play in with Pascal Siakam, But if they're going to give us enough assets to take off his money, that ends up being more of a straight salary dump though, unless you're giving up Lowry. In the conversation and then that's where things get really interesting. What would the Sixers be willing to pay to get off Al Horford's money and exchange for Lowry's expiring deal. I'm also wondering love that move. I would love it. I mean, we just saw what they could do with Marc Gasol and a diminished role and maximizing his talents. And I think Al Horford has more left in the tank than Cassault did when he went to Toronto, and I would love to see what Nick Nurse could do with him. Yeah, so that would be sort of like striling tones. I don't if you're not giving up Kyle Lowry in that deal, I don't know necessarily what Toronto has, because then it's just a cap relief deal where it's like I guess Norman Powell and stuff is cool. Toronto might have cap space at that point if Van Fleet and a Bacca leave, those are things to consider as well. The last thing I'll ask you on this front is I came up with a trade that landed Ben Simmons and Minnesota Bradley Beal in Philadelphia, and then just a whole bunch of other stuff in Washington, and I think it was actually a fair deal that doesn't feel like it's going to happen like imminently, where one the Wizards might not want to move Beal, but I don't think they're at the point they want to move. Ben Simmons, I'm wondering, can you what would it take if you dangled Horford and how much stuff to get the Wizards to think about moving Bradley Beal for that package? Is it like Horford and Bible and four first round picks, like something ridiculous like that? If not more okay? So, because if if the Wizards are doing that, they're essentially admitting and they have quin tension of competing until the Horford and John Wall contracts are off their books. And it feels impossible to ask any NBA franchise, especially in a weird revenue cycle right now, to absolutely, unquestionably tank their prospects of being even remotely competitive for three plus years. I tend to agree with you actually want to throw because that's something that Morey will do, is he will unload every single clip. Oh, absolutely, But I don't. I ultimately don't think even if it was Tobias Harris, who's younger, I'll run this three team or buy you and our listeners to see what you thought of it. Minnesota gets Ben Simmons, Philadelphia gets Bradley Beal at number seventeen. This is where number seventeen was actually coming from. Washington gets Jared Culver, James Johnson's expiring deal, Josh Akogi, Jared Vanderbilt love him by the way, the number one pick, and Minnesota's twenty twenty three first round pick up unprotected conditional upon their twenty twenty one obligation of Golden State, which is a pick that's top three protected. If not, you have to wait till twenty twenty four for that pick to convey. It's a lot to wrap my head around, so I'm glad that you've shown this one to me before. I think I think there's two questions, but it relies on two teams being willing to trade stars that I don't think they're willing to trade yet. Well, I actually think the bigger question is for the Sixers, is Bradley Beal number seventeen enough for Ben Simmons because you have him under contract for five years at this point. And then the other question would be, let's assume that the Wizards are open to move deal, which I think they could be swayed too at this point is Culver Akogi, Josha Cogi, Jared Vanderbilt number one, and then that unprotected pick enough, I don't I honestly don't know. I think it's at least a conversation. If they love one of the prospects in this draft, maybe let's move on from this. Though those are our thoughts there. Unless you have any Tobias Harris trade destinations. The only one I could really come up with was like, maybe Atlanta because they want to win so badly, but I feel like if they were to overpay someone like that, they prefer someone who's just really good at defense. That's where my head went first. Where Atlanta does seem like a good landing spot. I wouldn't be surprised if Atlanta went all in on pursuing like a Davis Burton's or even Adnilo Gallinari this offseason, So like trying to fill that spot with someone like Harris would make sense, But I just I still want to see what he can do in a Mori run organization, just because it does seem like such a great fit. And the other thing is is I mentioned this before that becomes a salary dump where it's let's just say you're trading to buy Haires into their cap space and Dwayne Dedman they're sending back as well, Like that's not helping your team. The weight is finally over. Football is back. You might not be at a game this year, but you can still be in on the action at bet online. Bet online is going the extra mile to make sure you can get it on every possible chance to win this season. From game spreads and totals to team player and coaching props, bet online gives you more options to wager on than anywhere else. You can get in on their season opening bonuses today and start off wagering on wins, division odds and championship futures all day every day. Head to bet online today and take advantage of all the great sign up houses. Don't forget to use promo code blue wire all one word at bet online dot ag. That's blue wire all one word bet online. You're online sports book experts. Before we get to the meloball wanted your thoughts on the Steven silas Hire, who very everywhere He's been just glowing reviews throughout the league. Was in Charlotte for a long time, was the internm head coach there for a litt bit when Steve Clifford needed time away from the team with Dallas the past two seasons, and he was among the architects of their offense. We know that Rick Carlisle is, you know, the final say voice there, the primary voice there. But to be a part of an offense that was so efficient this season, one of the best by the numbers of all time, that's certainly encouraging. I'm just wondering, like, what does it say. I don't you've never heard anything that James Harden and Russell Westbrook are difficult to coach, But like, is it you're throwing in this first time head coach. Does that make this situation anymore combustible? Does it say anything about Houston's willingness to spend in general, because you have to imagine that Silas was cheaper than Van Gundi or is that just a terrible fit with Van Gundi and Russell Westbrook and James Harden. But if it does say something that they wanted a cheaper coach, that makes it so much less likely to me that they end up using their mid level exception this year, in which case the team is not going to be able to get appreciably better. I think we don't know anything about Steven Silas as a head coach long term. Like I think he's an intriguing option. And if they really did this as an off the beaten path higher that they think is going to be ingenius, more power to them. But if this ended up being like they went with the more I'll say, the cheaper name, I'm just curious what that infers about their immediate future and then how long before it becomes a situation where James Harden starts thinking do I still want to be here? Whenever Tilman Fritida is involved. My immediate inclination is to think that cost does matter and that they are chasing the cheaper options at the expense of the better ones. But in this particular case, I don't really want to say that because I think that's a discredit to Steven Silas and his resume, which is really impressive. I mean, he has nothing but good reviews from the people that he's worked with. He has experienced coaching Luca don Chich, Kemba Walker, Stephen Curry, which should work nicely in a Houston offense that completely revolves around James Harden and Russell Westbrook, who as as we might as we might know, are both guards. So just the fact that he is viewed it as this offensive mastermind, and it's not just based on reputation, it's based on actual results. The Dallas Mavericks offense that you mentioned that literally has the best offensive rating in the history of the NBA, and that all of these elite offenses are revolving around ball dominant guards, that bodes well. I don't know much about him beyond that, so it would be irresponsible speculation from my part. But I do always like, and I've said this multiple times on this on this podcast, not this specific one, but in other episodes, I'm always a fan of giving non retreads opportunities, whether it's former players or whether it's assistant coaches who haven't been able to sit in that lead chair, rather than going with someone like Jeff Van Gundy or Mark Jackson or any of the other names who have been around the block a few times. Like, good on them for making this kind of higher, especially when the franchise does feel like it's at a crossroads. I think, if anything, that speaks to the confidence that they have than him. I don't want to sound like I was discrediting Silas anyway, And the three candidates that came down to John Lucas, jeff A Gunny and Silas. He would have been my pick unless you really value like the pre existing relationship that John Lucas has with James Harden and Russell Westbrook. But I think you make this higher with Silas. I think it's the bigger swing, which is why I would prefer him over Lucas. But then also I don't think you make this I guess the expectation would be can you pay Lucas enough to stick around anyway, because he's so important to that dynamic. And so I'm with you on everything you said there. I will say that the James Harden stuff becomes interesting if they underachieve this season, and it's you know, maybe if they're you know, make it deeper in the playoffs, or they put up a real fight in the second round, everything's fine. But like if, and as we mentioned, there's the level of unknownness because Russell Westbrook was playing out of his mind, then the pandemic hit, then he got coronavirus, and you have to believe that was at least responsible in part for his play inside the Disney bubble. So there's still a lot we don't know about this team, and they should still be really good because James Harden is ridiculously good. However, if we're talking about it another first round exit, if there's evidence that they won't spend to bring even they're just mid level in free agency, because again, one of the biggest advantages you have this off season to be is a willingness to spend your mid level exception. Since I think so teams are going to be hesitant to do it. If it gets into that scenario, I think we start hearing James Harden either he's disgruntled, because I do think it would ultimately be him that dissolves this relationship by next offseason, if not by the trade deadline, and I would say that trade deadline is probably a little bit less likely. Look, if there's just evidence that they're under achieving that, it would not surprise me if that's when we start to hear the rumblings. The only real trepidation that I have on the Silos front is the history of the father son coaching duos is not great. And credit to ESPN and Adrian Wodrowski for putting this together. But he is the fifth son of an NBA head coach to get a head coaching job. The previous four JB. Bickerstaff, Bernie Bickerstaff's son had a losing record with the Memphis Grizzlies in and the Cleveland Cavaliers. Eric Musselman, the son of Bill Musselman, coached the Golden State Warriors and the Sacramento Kings for one year. He has a losing record. Ryan Saunders, the son of Flip Saunders, losing record with the Minnesota Timberwolves. And the one exception is Mike Malone, the son of Brendan Malone, who has done very well with the Denver Nuggets. So obviously a very small sample here, but you know, if if napotism is more in play than competency, you know, then there's a potential issue. But we have no indications to believe that that's going to be the case here. And Ryan saw more interesting than anything else. And Ryan Saunders specifically so early into his tenure with the Timberwolves that he did not inherit a great situation. No, he did not, all right, So let's talk about this LaMelo Ball stuff. This came from you sent it to me so that you Rick Bonal, the Charlotte Observer, was on one or two point five FM w f NZ in Charlotte. This transcription comes from Lonzo. Lonzo wires Jacob Rude and here's what Bonneal had to say about LaMelo Ball. Here's what I'm hearing from the league at large. LaMelo Ball is not performing very well at job interviews. I've heard that from multiple sources. He's not improving his perception via job interview. There are people drafting later in the top ten who are not preparing for the possibility of Ball still being around. And I'm not saying that he will be a top three pick. I'm saying that I know for a fact that there are teams later in the top ten who are doing more research on him because they no longer think it's a given he will. Two things stand out for me from this. I don't know what job Sorry, sorry, I don't know a job interview means here? Is it like conversations or are you looking at more film? Is it? Are even workouts taking place right now? I think they're allowed to. I can't remember so many things have happened. And then I will say this is coming from Rick Bondle, who's a reputable reporter, but he covers the Hornets who have the number three pick in a draft where there's a consensus top three prospects. In essence, they are going to be left without a move with whoever Golden State and Minnesota do not take. And so if you have interest in LaMelo Ball at number three, what better then to throw something like this out there. I do think though there could be some validity to it, because he is considered this boom er Bus prospect. There are friend of the pot. An NBA draft Grew Adams Spanella writes over at the Celtics Blog has him number fifteen on his big board, which is incredibly low relative to the field for LaMelo Ball. We obviously don't know whether he's going to be good or not, but this seems to be in line with at least the devisive nature of him as a prospect. You could also say that about every single other prospect in this draft. And so I just want to note the person who's relaying this is covering a team in a situation where if they want Lamela Ball, and can't or unwilling to move up. It would be a good idea. So maybe throw out some reports or some leaks that he is going to drop in the draft or isn't worth a top three pick. Look, this feels like one of the smoke screeniest smoke screens that ever smoke screens for the reasons that you mentioned, and also just like, what job interviews are we talking about here? There isn't an on court portion, And I'd like to read from ESPN's Jonathan Giveney. So this is about the meeting that LaMelo Ball had with the Minnesota Timberwolves on Tuesday of this week. The meeting, conducted in southern California, consisted of an interview and did not feature any basketball activity. It was attended by blah blah blah, blah blah. This was the first meeting Ball had conducted. He is tentatively scheduled to interview with the Golden State Warriors early next week. They have the number two pick in the NBA Draft. The expectation is that Ball also will interview with the Charlotte Hornets and Chicago Bulls, who picked third and fourth. So what job interviews is this that he's not performing particularly well in like we know, we know who he is, Like he's been so profiled so many times by so many different writers because he's been this phenomenon for years, playing abroad at such a young age, leaving high school to go play professionally, Like, I don't know how much new stuff we're going to be learning at this stage, especially with no on court work. So like this to me just absolutely screens smoke screen. I'm with you there. So again like that, as you mentioned, Rick, Rick is a fantastic reporter and it is in no way discrediting the report. This is just like yeah, but yeah, so it's look if he drops outside the top three, then look more powder, Rick Bottle, who was on top of this from the start really quickly. The last thing we want to mention is the Jazz were sold. The Miller family sold them to Ryan Smith, the founder of Qualitrix, who which he believe he sold it for eight billion dollars. When he did sell that they were he purchased the Jazz for one point six plus billion, which is I think that's I think that's what Forbes have them evaluated around and to get that money. As the Miller family amid the pandemic when the league is so concerned with revenue, I think it does bode well for the future of the league. I'm just curious if you have any thoughts on this, and I'll say my one straight thought is this was mentioned on the Hoop Collective podcast at ESPN, is like, these new younger owners, so timen for Tita, but they come in they don't want to be coming in with a whimper, like they're here to spend, and so now of a sudden, I'm wondering if, like, is there a path to the Jazz even for one season paying the tax because they have an opportunity to resign Jordan Clarkson and use their full non taxpayers mid level, which would take them into the tax probably. But if you're adding on top of the team you already have, you're throwing a healthy boing on mcdonovitch what Donovan Mitchell did during the playoffs. You're all of a sudden, kind of like a lion in the West where now you've been this darling. Everyone finds you interesting. You're you know, basketball nerds like their names. You as a fringe contender or a dark horse, but you become like a legitimate Lion. If you're willing to spend that because of the caliber of player, I imagine you'll be able to get for the non taxpayers mid level exception. Yeah, I would. I would absolutely agree with you wholeheartedly. Where I do think that you know, the younger owners want to come in and immediately make a splash, and we should see Utah trying to do something to solidify its place among the Western Conference elites, rather than speculating about whether the Rudy Gobert Donovan Mitchell relationship is going to work and if one of those pieces has to be moved. I was also really glad to see that this is not a Clay Bennett situation where somebody is buying a franchise with the intent of moving it to a different location. That this sale was predicated on the belief and promise that the Jazz were going to remain in Utah. Now, I would just like to see them abandon the Utah Jazz nickname because it's dumbinant doesn't make any sense, and they should give it back to the New Orleans Pelicans so they can become the New Orleans Jazz and we can just move from there. That's certainly a take the thing that I'm actually more interested to see. I agree with you. The Miller family is credited with keeping the jazz in Utah, and so to sell it to a Utah and native like that absolutely matters. He's a Byu Alum and so he's clearly vested in in that community. I want to see what happens with the Rudy Gobert extension. I would assume that Ryan Smith is going to pony up where it's necessary. I'm just curious where that number of lands, whether it's less likely that they sign him to an extension because maybe they want to take a bigger swing in twenty one. I don't think it's less likely that that Ryan Smith doesn't want like the new regime. I think they'll be willing to pay for talent, is my guests. I'm just curious to see what this means for Rudy Gobert's contract situation, because I have zero feel for it, is my point. I don't know if this makes it more likely less likely that he gets one this summer. I don't know if it makes it more likely that he gets more than we thought less than we thought. I honestly have zero idea and so I'm wondering if there will be any impact there. But with that as Adam's just nodding his head to me, so I think he agrees. He doesn't know what's going to happen, but something will happen that does it for us. On this portion of the podcast, please stay tuned, we're gonna be talking to Sabrina Merchant from SB Nation about the Clippers. Go really deep on there, and remember to follow her on Twitter at Sabrina JM. That's at sab r e n a j M. Stay tuned. Sabrina, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. It's nice to speak with you virtually as opposed to just in your DMS. You helped me out. I asked you about a piece that I was doing on franchise Moments like earlier in the year, and you were kind of help me out with that. But it's good to actually talk to you. I guess it's called face to face because we're skype, so that's as close to face to face as anyone's getting this time anyway. Yeah, it's it's all uncomfortable, and he'll tell you that I'm totally there with you. I did. We are going to talk estensively about the Clippers, but I wanted you're the first guest that we've actually had on since the NBA shifted its start date to December twenty second, And aside for myself my coach, I'm just curious to see, like how you feel about a start date that soon, whether you think it's realistic, knowing that the players are also already pushing back against that. Was this just like a employed by the owners where it's like, Okay, if we throw out December twenty second, bell counter with MLK Day and that's fine, as opposed to like this leaking into February or March or something. Yeah, I mean that that's a really good question. I love Christmas basketball. It's my favorite thing. So having the NBA play December twenty fifth is I'm all for it all the time, no matter what the situations are that leads to it. And I mean, I'm kind of the belief that the NBA just needs to get back on its normal calendar, So you just kind of suck it up for one year and let the guys play in the Olympics in twenty twenty one, and then we're back to normal, you know, for the twenty one twenty two season. But the fight back from the players, you know, like Rishell Roberts obviously had a lot of comments put out in the public the last couple of days. It makes me think that they're trying to get some other concessions, not so much start date, but like maybe less money in escrow something like that as a you know, negotiating tactics so that they can still start in December, but the players get some sweetener out of that. Yeah, there's all that stuff that goes into it. Like I was surprised that the NBA only, like the revenue was down ten percent for this past season. I thought it would have been shockingly good, right right, And I think now it's like, how do you justify keeping thirty to forty percent of the player's salary and escrow next season when you're only down ten percent like they. I would say, let's say, like twenty five percent of the season was screwed this year, and like you only like ended up being down ten That was profit too. I want to stress that, like that was revenue. They were down ten percent year over I think they were down five percent year over year and ten percent from like the projections or whatever it was. So I'm I think that might be a more contentious issue than the actual start date. But I'm with you. I'm torn between. I love Christmas basketball, but then I'm also like you know, for the players, for the players and teams that weren't in the bubble of they'll probably want to get going. But like Lebron is definitely taking like a month off, like maybe he comes back and plays Christmas and then we don't see him again until February or something done with that, which is fine, but I think we would see a lot more load management like throughout the year with maybe players were not used to seeing it, like maybe even a James Harden is not trying to play in all seventy two games or whatever it ends up being. Yeah, I totally agree with that. I am to receive if that's the actual start date. I think it will be because Christmas is so important, But I think the teams and rightfully so, we're gonna have to make other concessions elsewhere, Like as you would mention at the top with the escrow, I'd assume the players were looking for something along those lines. But I did bring you on to pester you about the Clippers, and so they are when I do these look aheads, I really like to get into like the nitty gritty basketball stuff. But there are the teams where you have to talk about the low hanging fruit, and the Clippers are are one of those teams where it's like all these issues like don't necessarily seem like nitty gritty basketball. They're all like there's the basic questions about free agency, like what would they do with the roster? But I'm just curious how you feel, Like, let's start with the tylou Hire Like, how did you feel about that or the fact that this team being the most talented team on paper, I would say in the league, even though they underachieved. How did you feel where you shocked at all that they made the coaching change at all, like just pivoting away from Doc Rivers after year one. Yeah, so docer versus been in LA for some time now. I think that was his seventh season with the Clippers. Yeah, seventeens with mid the playoffs six times, three Western Conference semifinals appearances, and obviously no trips to Western Conference finals because Clippers have never yet been to the conference finals, which again we all thought was going to end this year, we're gonna get that Grand Lakers Clippers, you know, into Hallway Series, which obviously would have had to happen in Orlando. But whatever. The minute the season ended, I thought, Okay, this is not a good time to beat Doc Rivers, like I was when I said this on my own past my own podcast back when during the Dallas series, when people's names were being floated for all the open head coaching jobs, and I kept thinking, like, maybe the reason why lose name is and being floated around is because he's waiting for this job. And like, mind you, the Clippers were beating Dallas at that point, but not looking terribly impressive while they were doing it, and it just sort of seemed like maybe this is the time when they decided to move on from Dock and like I was just waiting for a really good job to open up, and the way they played in that Denver series, I thought it was the right decision to let go Doc because it just showed a complete lack of flexibility inter of the way he handled his rotations and the fact that they were complaining about the players conditioning in the bubble like that guys had to, you know, come out after three or four minutes stints. It's just a really bad look for the staff. But I know that they couldn't get those guys on the same page. So to me, it seemed like a foregotten conclusion that Doc would have to be out. The one thing that sort of gave me a little pause about it was because Doc has been such a good spokesperson for the Clippers. You know, you saw it back during the Donald Sterling fiasco. How Doc you know, took ownership of that ownership per se, But like he was the face of the Clippers in that moment, and he spoke for the players, and he spoke for the organization, and he did a really great job of speaking on behalf of the players during the bubble too, you know when he made those comments about the Jacob Blake shooting and how you know the fear of that black people feel in America, And I thought it was such a powerful moment. I mean, I think even Joe Biden used Doc Rivers's words in a speech that he made in Gettysburg, Like that's not a small thing, right, Like he is he's an incredible face of this franchise and spokesperson for the league and I thought that might be the thing that kept him with the Clippers, but you know, the Clippers are not sentimental. They're just not at all. They traded Blake Griffin after giving him this like whole spiel about his ursy retiring, and I feel like that doesn't get talked about enough, at least that it really does not right They put together a mock retirement ceremony for the guy, and then six months really like all right, you know so I from a basketball perspective, I totally get the firing Jack Rivers are mutual parting, whatever happened. I think Tylou was absolutely the right fit to take this job because you know, he's comfortable with that high pressure situation. He walked into arguably a much tougher situation in Cleveland. He knows how to handle superstar egos. I think one thing that doesn't get talked about with Tie enough is that he's he was just super creative on those Cleveland teams. Like, obviously you have Lebron and that makes things easier to work with, but like Kawai is not that much worse than Lebron, you know, like he's it's a pretty good basketball player too, Like there's a lot. He's all right. Yeah, So you know, I think about that twenty eighteen Cleveland run all the time because like they literally used a different closing lineup and every single one of those Eastern Mormans playoff series. You know, there was just a market amount of flexibility and just adaptability that Tyler displayed. And I think that's what the Clippers need, because I agree with you on paper, they're super talented. They just the pieces didn't fit together quite right, especially the way the doc Rivers use them. So I like Lou I think, you know, having a little bit of you know, institutional continuity where he was on the team last year, so at least he knows, he has a good understanding and what worked and what didn't work. But at the same time, like he's not the same guy, you know, he's not Doc. He's a different guy. He's bringing in a very different staff, and I think Sam Cassell is on his way out. He's joining a DOC in Philadelphia. I haven't heard anything about Rex cleaning. He was a defensive coordinator this year. I assume he's not gonna be coming back because there's like four other assistants who are being hired above him, so it's gonna be a very different look. But like, at least you have the one guy who is there, who, especially if this is a shortened season, you know, can guys on the same page a little bit quicker than you would if it was an entire lead new higher. I'm insure to see if this has ever happened before, but this is like both of Tyler's head coaching gigs have come after he was a highly paid lead assistant and almost immediately after, which is just super awkward because he spoke to David Blatt in Cleveland before he took the job because he didn't like the optics of it, and then I believe he said something along the same lines this time. I don't. I don't think that tylw is like someone waiting in the shadows to take someone else's job. It's just the way the circumstances fell. That's that's just a bizarre note to me. I think he was the right choice too, and the continuity one wasn't even something I considered, like, yeah, he was there this year, that's probably a big deal. You mentioned like the offensive ingenuity from him specifically and with the line of creativity, that's something I'm wondering if we'll see more of, because that's one of the reasons I like him. I think the Clippers were built to play that way more than they actually did. You know, I think ja Michael Green, if Tyler is the head coach, absolutely would have gotten more minutes at the five in the postseason because it works so well against the Warriors last year. So I just found it didn't even really go to that in the regular season. But I also think, and this is where I struggle with Doc Rivers, is that I one don't like it when people box, and this happens a lot with blackhead coaches, that there are these culture guys, So I don't want to pigeonhole either one of them into this. But tylu with one of the first stories of him calling out Lebron in a film session in Cleveland, that feels like that's exactly what this team needs. And now that we've seen Doc oversee the end of the Lob City era where there felt like there was that awkwardness between high profile players there and then we know mid season there was like the old regime of the Clippers, Patrick Beverley, Lou Williams, Tress, the guys that you would vision wanting to go hard eighty three of eighty two games out of the year, like sort of buttons, but definitely the other two. All right, fair enough, Yeah, maybe Lou wants to be at the club eighty three of the eighty two games out of the year. But so you had those guys like kind of butting heads with Paul George and Kawhi Leonard, and so now that's just like maybe I'm finding this out just because now people are talking about, oh, Philly just needs like that discipline that Doc Rivers is going to bring for Ben Simmons and Joel Embiid. But I'm like the circumstances under which the two, I guess Doc didn't leave twice, but like what happened with Chris Paul and Blake Griffin and then now what happened with the Kawai PG versus the guys from the previous seasons. I'm just like, it almost feels like I don't want to say Docs overrated on that front, but maybe they needed that reset where Low's going to come in and he'll actually be like more hands on, Like I don't is that like a thing. I'm just very curious because if this didn't happen again with the Lob City Clippers, I might not be talking about this. But it just feels like there's there's something off there with Doc. Now I could not agree more. I think it's really interesting because you know, Doc got that reputation from being with the Celtics right that you want to head coach. And obviously that worked out very well, swimmingly in year one. You know, they all came together, they want the title. They ended up going to the finals another time. But I struggle with how much blame to apportion to Doc versus how much the players, because you know, Kawai didn't get along with the culture in San Antonio. You know that is ah, you know, an unimpeachable like standard of NBA, you know greatness, and I wanted out. And now I'm not blaming Kwai, like obviously, if he felt uncomfortable with his health, you know, in the hands of those doctors, like by all means, get out. But the fact that he didn't fit in there makes it seem like, Okay, maybe who is a little bit harder to get along with. And you know, we could talk about the Lob City guys like Chris Paul Obviously his had you know, his friends and not friends around the league. It's a tricky player to work with. So yeah, maybe Doc isn't like the gold standard for you know, building a locker room culture. Maybe he's not. He shouldn't be braided that high. But I also think like the situations that he was presenting with the Clippers are like, are not super easy, you know, they're not. The story goes are to the locker room, make everything work when something was off. I do think he takes some of the blame for that, obviously, but I'm more of the belief that theyre just needed to be a change. He'd been here for very long time. There was like a lot of skeletons in the closet. They weren't all related to this team, obviously, because no Clipper has been with the team for more than three years, so they don't carry the baggage from Lobs City. But he carries the baggage, you know, And so I think he just needed a fresh start. I think the Clippers needed a fresh start. And I'm just rooted the hell out of him Philly, because I love Doc. He's such a good guy. Like you said, the stuff where he's like for the face of a team, the face of the league, Like absolutely positively, this feels like it might be a test of how much discipline he could bring because Philly is this is a whole different topic. They've emboldened their young stars. I think you could argue too much like dating back to the early days of the process. So looking at this team, and also you brought up this point about Kawhi leaving San Antonio. We haven't heard Uncle Dennis's name at all throughout all this, and so you think it like Kauai was like not easy to get along with. I'm in LA, maybe he would be involved in some extent, but also even Toronto, it felt like he didn't really forge a connection with anyone on the side from Sergeobaca. And I think Kyle Lowry just because to me objectively, Kyle Lowry is one of the most lovable players in the NBA. So I think you're right. It's like maybe every star has an ego. And even in San Antonio, I think that there was a report once that Kawhi wasn't happy that the Spurs and really like roll out the red carpet once for him and an All Star weekend, like where he saw LaMarcus Aldridge in Portland getting all this stuff and then he didn't get any of it. So who knows how true that is, but that's a that's a good point, and didn't consider looking at his actual roster though. I think there's this is definitely part of the reactionary like times that we live in. But there's like this thing floating around in certain sectors that the Clippers need to do something drastic. That idea is absolutely bombeders right, Like the trade Paul George stuff I think is a farce, Like that's just but I'm even talking like do you need to consolidate your salaries into going after a Chris Paul, Like it doesn't seem like you need to make that level of move. And it would be funny to see Chris Paul come back to the Clippers after Doc left. But I'm just like I can't wrap my head around like after a year one, I know your title window is finite if you're looking at Kawai and Paul George entering free agency in twenty twenty one, But the idea that this team because you look at it on paper and maybe they didn't fit together on the court this season. But it seems like they fit together in general that you need to like sort of bust this up in a semi significant way. I can't wrap my head around it. I'm one hundred percent on the same page with you as that. I this is a really good team. It was the top five, you know an offense and defense this past year. They were up three one on Denver and then they just lost their composure and it was just a wonderful little bubble moment from Japan, Murray and the whole crew in Denver. But yeah, I mean, there are obviously flaws with the Clippers, and we saw these flaws in the summer of twenty nineteen before they even took the court together. Like they don't have a point guard, Patch Provley. It's not a point guard. He's a three D guy who happens to be six feet tall as we plays point guard. Like he doesn't run an offense, and Kauai can do, you know, certain creative things on offense. But like it's a it's a big load for him to be the team's best score the team's best playmaker, the team's best defender. Like that's a lot of things to put on one guy and you saw him sort of just I don't want to say crumble, but like it was a heavy burden to bear in that Denver series and he wore down by the end of it. So they need to point guard. They do need a point guard. I don't think that that means, you know, you have to trade away Paul George to get Chris Paul, or that you have to you know, jumble everything together and make like some Drew Holiday like Godfather offer. But something has to be changed there. I mean, there are these rumors about Rajon Rondo, you know, drawing intrust from the Clippers front office, which is just objectively hilarious to me. But I do think that like there are there are gaps that you could see, you know, that need filling. I think that's really the only one that like would concern me for the Clippers this offseason, Like if you don't add another point guard, like maybe you think we have a fixed sailing, we're not going to win at all, Like not having another big man. I think they can get past if you just play Zoo botch more or you know, you use our kids. You can't do that. You can't play that's a legal affair. He's not allowed to play in the fourth quarter. He plays a second apst and at the start of the third quarter, and then that just leaves eighteen straight minutes or montros. That's exactly what happens every single game. But yeah, the one thing I think the Clippers do need to address, like they just need some kind of playmaker. And I don't know how you get that because they don't have a ton of cap flexibility. Maybe you like throw Lou Williams into a trade deal. You know, if you get a point guard, you don't really need Lou Williams like to run the second unit. But I do think that's a whole and I think it's just the Clippers would be far more interesting if they managed to address that. It's just it's really hard to see what they could do. I mean, if they cleared out enough of their cap space, they could do like a sign Android for Fredman bleep, but like why would you run do that? They could like just throw their full mid level at Gore and Dragga, but why would he want to leave Miami when they're gonna PAYI a ton more money? So then you're working with like DJ Augustine level guys, which okay, sure he's fine, but like, look at the point on a championship team, right right, Yeah, and even he might be too expensive for I don't know what's this tree energy market is gonna be like, but the point the point guard situation is rough, like that bleak, Yeah, it's bleak, and so like DJ Augustine for the Mini mL E might be like not enough. I honestly have no idea, but that was my next question. So playmaker is the hole that they have to focus on, because what's weird about this team is I think you could say that the most talented on paper you kind of talk to yourself, and then then Needing like another wing but also another big and then there's the playmaker. But the playmaker is the hole that they have to zero in on this offseason. Yes, are there I know you mentioned up, but are there, like actual any free agents that you think are like interesting for them? Like, are there any like lower level moves those doesn't alec Burks move the needle for them? Like is it a matter if you need the actual passer? Is it just someone else who's comfortable shooting shots off the dribble? It seems like you're saying that they need more of a floor general than anything else, which I guess I kind of thought the Rondo report was funny, but I guess if that's the like the quality that you're looking for, you actually kind of makes sense. Then Yeah, so I think it's it's very much the floor general, like someone who can set an offense whose first instinct is to pass and not to shoot. Because the Clippers don't have a single player on their team whose first instant is it passed, just not a one like you look at Kawhi, Leonard, Paul George, Marcus, Morris, Low Williams, Rogie Jackson, who's nominally a point guard. Every single one of them first instinct shoot, shoot, shoot, which is I mean, they're fine players, but like they just need somebody who thinks about passing every once in a while. And yeah, playoff. Rajenrondo certainly makes a lot of sense on like Clippers seventy two games of regular season ra Gen Rondo, that could get a bit tiresome. Like I watch Lakers all season. I get it, I know how this works. It's just a bit of a shock when he shows up, you know, and like starts making smart decisions all of a sudden and like giving effort on the defensive end. That's the you know, that's the rub with Rondo because we've seen this, like it's it's a pattern out like for the course of several regular seasons, he just outperforms his regular season stock in the postseason to just this dramatic level and like cons teams into giving him bigger contracts. But I mean that's also a reason why the Lakers are determined to keep him because we just talked about that point guard market. It is bleak. There is not really a way for the Lakers to replace you know, what he can do. So yeah, I mean I keep hearing like Spencer Dinwoody trades thrown around like a Beverly for Dinwoody deal like kind of interests me because how much do you need Patrick Beverly's perimeter defense when you already have Paul George and Kawhi Leonard, Like wouldn't you rather have a guy who can actually, you know, create some things on offense. So and then like I also like that deal for Brooklyn because like Dinwoody's not gonna have the ball in his hands that much when you have to rank Kyrie Irving and they could use somebody who actually plays some defense, like Beverly, So that's a deal that kind of makes sense to me. I don't think they have the goods to get into the Holiday sweepstakes just because all of their first round picks obviously are in Oklahoma City's hands for the rest of the decade, and they don't really have a ton of young players who move the needle, unless like New Orleans is enamored with Terrence Mann for some reason. But you already have mons of ball, So what are we doing here? Yeah, So that's that's kind of how I feel about the point guard things. It's very tricky, but they just gotta bring in someone who thinks about moving the ball every once in a while. I did not think to Beverly give anyone makes a lot of sense for both sides. I still even with then when he probably hitting for the Injy next year. I guess the Clippers would have to give up something else in that deal. But I actually like that and your look. I did the Nets Look Ahead with Christian wooden Field from the Daily News the other day, and I was trying to figure out who the nets best defender on the roster right now. Would be there's Jared Allen, but non big wise and DeAndre Jordan. Obviously, it might be Kevin Durant, which is a big issue. So that makes a ton of sense for book. And I didn't even think about that. I was looking while you're talking, which is why the ad played behind me. I was scrolling through the point guard market. The names that I'm thinking of, like Trey Burke maybe, but that's not someone like that's more someone who's gonna put pressure on the rim than he's gonna like facilitate your offense. Jeff Teague, I think would probably be fairly interesting for them. Options really start to trail off after that, like you're limited to the mini mL E and it's just I don't know. Shabazz Napier I think could do things for them, but that's another player who's like score first, and so if you're really intrigued by that floor general, that's why the Rondo stuff is like, I did not think I'd come into the podcast thinking that Rondo would just make a ton of sense for the Clippers, And it's like, if he's affordable, it does because that might just be what they need. And look, when you watch their offense, and I'm not sure if you felt the same way, like something just you said they were top five of offense and defense, but it just felt like their offense had no flow, Like it just felt like it was there and it was hey, Kawai and PG and lou Will and then sometimes Marcus Morris just like do stuff and we'll like figure it out. Yeah, I mean, it very much felt like that. It kind of works because Kawhi is such an excellent isolation player, and you know, Paul George can get a shot up over anybody, especially considering he starts at the two, so like who's guarding him? You know, like you put a six six guy in front of him and you just shoots over the top of everyone. So they just have so much individual talent that during the regular season their offense makes sense, like you can't guard everybody at once, But then when you actually put a scheme into place, it's like, Okay, well, no one's gonna like move the ball or move off the ball, so we can just stay in our spots and everything's going to kind of work out. On defense, the other name I had thought was I'm curious what you think about it. I don't know if he can do. He had a good season and he's overpaid. But like if it was a matter of your consolidating, I don't even think they have a bunch of sellers they don't want. But if it's like a Montrez Harrold sign and trade, does a Terror Rasier interest you as someone to handle that position? He's he is overpaid, but with just two years left is the final year non guaranteed, No, it's guaranteed. Nice job quarters, but like he can play off the ball, but it feels like he might be able to run more of the offense than Patrick Beverley for sure. I gotta be honest, I watch maybe two games of Charlotte all season, so the Rosiers, like you know, season with the Hornets is something I'm kind of unfamiliar with. But maybe maybe he just makes so much money and then it's like that, I guess this kind of touches on like what would be the next topic for me? So their own free agents, as I mentioned tres Ja, Michael Green is a player option, which, for the life of me, I canno figure out whether he's going to decline or not. It seems like he could get a little bit more than five million, but who the hell knows at this point. And then Marcus Morris, who would you say is the most critical of those three to return? I think Marcus Morris is the most critical. He I believe is the most talented out of all of them, with all due respect to Trees and Jamichael. He just can do more things with the ball. He's a better score. I don't know if he's a better score than Trees, but he's like a more efficient score than Trees, which is something. And he also plays defense, which Tress is, you know, kind of miss on. And then they just they gave up all of their best assets and that Marcus Morris trade, Like they gave up their twenty twenty first round pick, which is the last one they can trade until twenty twenty seven. I'm gonna say that again, that's the last one they can trade until twenty twenty seven. And then they gave up Jerome Robinson, who, you know, whatever, he's a young player, but like it's a nice little sweet nerd to throw into a deal, especially when you don't have any first round picks left over, like he was the fourteenth pick in the twenty nineteen NBA draft. There is some you know there's gonna be that first round glow on him for a little while where he keeps getting more and more chances. So right, even a lot to get Marcus Morris. I think he fits really well next to Kawai and Peg and I think you can play him as a small ball five like we were talking about with Michael Green. He could do that too. They did that a little bit in the Dallas series and it which was worked like Gangbusters. I think Tyler is going to have a really good way to use Bargus Morris. So he's the guy I think that has to come back ja. Michael Green is really interesting because he was making like twelve million or something when he was traded to the Clippers on that deal that he's tigned with Memphis, and he came back at the room exception like with the understanding that he was going to be used in a larger role that the Clippers would take care of him down the line. He was not used in a larger role. That's one number one. He was not. Like you mentioned at the start of the show, he was so good at the five against Golden State and that playoff series in twenty nineteen, and then the Clippers decided, oh, we're just not going to do that again because obviously, yeah, so I think he expects to get paid by this team. They obviously can't really do that and use their mid level this year. So he didn't really have a good enough season in my opinion, to opt out and expect a bigger offer unless he wants to go to a losing team like Atlanta or Charlotte or you know, New York seems to really like power forwards, so maybe that's a bit. But I think he's gonna stay with Clippers. I do believe that, like one of Tyler's primary acts as head coach right now has to be just sit down, have a hard tart which Michael, and be like, I'm gonna make things happen for you, like you are going to be, you know, regarded like a Channing Fry or something of that level in my system. So I think he stays. I don't think the Clipper should be losing sleep of what happens to Tress. Like if he gets an offer somewhere else, good for him. He deserves the money. He's worked really hard. If he doesn't, then you have all the leverage to lowball him and just keep him around as a regular season employee who should not be seeing very many minutes in playoffs. I'm wondering if with Jamichael Green, if they could just be like, you know, make it like a they have his bird rights, but make it a non bird situation where it's like, hey, we'll give you one hundred and twenty percent like raise on what you were supposed to get, so you're making a little bit more than miniml E. Because I agree with you, I think he would struggle to get paid, But a team like Brooklyn would be smart to be like, hey, here's our miniml it's projected to be worth more than you're gonna make on your player option. And I think that if you lose him, it ends up being like a fairly big deal because you still want someone behind Zubots. And that's my actual question here is how important is Mantras Harald to this team? And I feel like kind of a shitty human being asking this question because you look at his numbers and just the fire that he'll play with like most of the time, like his motor, and he clearly is valuable. But for what Knowing that Zubots fared so well this year and then just kind of knowing what the Clippers need, even if he's not going to get too syllable paid, Like, is he sort of non essential to what they're doing now with the makeup of this roster, particularly following the acquisition of Marcus Morris. I wouldn't say he's not essential. I was probably a little bit too harsh on like saying that you could just take him relieve in. But it's so hard to talk about his boot performance because he was just not in the right headspace whatsoever people in basketball after losing his grandmother, and he wasn't in shape. And when a guy who's already undersized doesn't have his like fitness going for him, it's a real challenge to be effective on the court, especially when you're going against so much bigger guys like Yo Kitchen Boon and like even Mason Plumley is super athletic and just negates a lot of what Russ has going for him. So I don't want to put too much stuck into what he was doing in the bubble. But at the same time, like he has built in disadvantages, right, Like Zubatch is a true seven footer, he can guard the best centers on other teams, like that is an important thing when you were going against Anthony Davis or Nikola Yokis or I don't know, Karl Anthony Towns down the line. Whatever, it's it's a good thing to have. And he's you know, a little bit more mobile than the Clippers use him. You know, I thinks you watch can't getut on the perimeter a little bit more. He doesn't. He moves like he has like packs in the bottom of his shoes, Like he's like a lot quicker than you you would think when you're watching him. Yeah, so I don't think that tres is your number one center on a playoff roster. And he doesn't provide the spacing that you would hope when you go small because he doesn't shoot from the distance. He doesn't even shoot midrangers. So when you're talking about like scheming for a seven game series, I just don't see how he's one of your top six or seven guys. And so then how much do you want to pay a guy who's great during the regular season, Because there is supreme value in being ready to play every single game out of eighty two or seventy two or whatever it ends up being the Clippers clearly did not have a lot of those guys on the team this year. Montrez was one of them, like maybe two or three. So during a regular season, great to have treads around. It's just this is a team that doesn't have eyes on the regular season. This is a team that is looking forward to the postseason. And I just don't know how you can justify paying treads like starter money when he's not going to be playing meaningful minutes on the postseason roster. But I guess what has helped on there is like if you look at the cap space teams. I mean, you mentioned New York has an affinity for power forwards, and they they mayview him as a big name, maybe they would pay him, but like Atlanta is off the board after trading for quint Capella. I don't like Charlotte. I guess he makes like some sense there, but they need they already have like those like Miles Bridges and PJ. Washington, neither of whom could play the five. And now you're gonna bring in Harold who is like sort of in the same boat a little bit, and so that should drive go ahead. So Charlotte, but a lot just because he's from North Carolina. It's very close to home, and they just need somebody who can score, you know, like in the worst way. So it's it's pretty well suited in my opinion, to Tries because the other guys on that roster, like Terry Rogier de Monte Graham, like they demanded ball, but none of the big stud none of the wings do. So there's an opportunity there for him to do what he does really well. But again, I don't know if he wants to be in a winning situation, Like it's very different from going from a team that's competing for a championship too, not to Chotte and look, I some people have floated that he's a Toronto type of player. I hate the fit with Fascial siakam so Ill. But if that's like an actual thing, there's your Fred van Fleet sign and trade. I don't know how you get under the like you know, you hardcap yourself in that center. I don't know what you have to do beyond that. But if that's actually true, which I would doubt significantly that it is, and he seems like a terrible fit for what Toronto has. But if they're losing Abacca and Marcus All. I mean maybe, but there's your Fred van Fleet fit is it? So who do you think is actually more important to this team to have on the roster next season, Lou Williams or Mantras Harold because it's like you described how like Harold's like not as valuable in the playoffs, and I think it's now it's like a fact. I know Lou Williams gets like mad when you talk about this, but he's he's not nearly his value pulling the playoffs. Yeah, on that his foul bating thing doesn't really work in the postseason at teams just put bigger players on him, which I don't know why they don't do during the regular season, but they just put a bigger on him, and it's really hard for Lu to get his angles. Like I mean, Denver just put Tory Greig on him. And Tory Craig is a player, you know, he does things, but like he shouldn't be you know, taking your third best offensive player out of a series, and that's what he was doing in that Denver series. So yeah, the thing with lewis just like like we said, you know, they don't really have a playmaker and lou Williams is the closest thing they have to that. So if you address that need in a different way, then yeah, you can get rid of Lou Williams, but the way the roster is presently constructed, you kind of need him. Yeah, that's a good point too, because if you're worried about having a playmaker, he's at least like a fac simile of a point guard if you want it, like, he's gonna be score first, and look, he deserves to be with the way that he can get buckets in the regular season. Sort of the last question on this, do you think that Zubats's performance in the Bubble factors into Tress's future at all, because it's like, you know, he was really good on offense too. I think it last time I checked, or I think he was like one point two points per possession as the rollman. There's I feel like Tress has more of like a post game, but I don't think the Clippers need to run anything through the post exactly, And so like when you're looking at zoobots and thinking that he should be ready for you know, more than the eighteen point four minutes per game he averaged during the regular season. Do you think that maybe factors in at all to how much you're then willing to pay tres or maybe that numbers actually lower, look from the Clippers standpoint than it was at the beginning of this past year. I think that's a really good point for whatever reason. Uh, Doc Rivers you know, artificially capped zoo Botches minutes this season and last season. But he was much you know, in a much different situation, having just come over at the trade deadline, and the Lakers were sport ethically using him. So it is a weird time giving him away. By the way, that's a never remains just a funny little addicto. But I'm sorry, sorry, just zero sense. But it's so funny because like the Clippers went on this like little spin narrative last year because everyone like had so much fun with the zoo Botch field just because it objectively like was in the moment too, Like this isn't even people with the benefit of hindsight. Everyone like zubots wasn't considered the star, but he was actually effective in the time he was playing, and they treated him like he was dead weight. So they created this like spin narrative that was like well, actually, our Memphis trade was really good, you know, like when we got Garrett Temple and too Michael Green, and they started pushing that as much as possible because they wanted to like get some credit for what the front office did instead of just being like the beneficiary of Magic Johnson's honestly. So anyway, that's a story for a different day. But Zoe watched only twenty three years old. He's gonna be twenty four next season. He's firmly, you know, on that growth trajectory right, like he should be able to handle more minutes. He's just really solidly good pick and roll partner. He protects the room just phenomenally. Well. Kali loves him, who I really really likes playing that two man game with Batch. So to me, it just seems like, yeah, you just put more and more of your eggs in the zoo Watch basket. He's on a fantastic contract. It's a three years left about seven million per year. So like that, it's the kind of thing where like you could use it for saler match, but why would you, because you're not gonna get anybody that good. I love Zubatch. I think he absolutely deserves a bigger role, and as he takes a bigger and bigger role, you know you can just those minutes a Truss plays like he said that there don't exist as much, So I mean, I don't really think it's controversial with the visa, Like he's really good, he should be playing more. Presumably Tylu will play him more, and then you don't need as many centers beyond him because he's just you know, taking more of the responsibility, right, And it's like if you have Marcus Morris there too, Like it feels like the need, even when you're playing matchups to ever have Tres's closed games becomes almost non existent because Morris is going to be better when you downsize, Zubots is gonna better if you're going up against the big with like more like brute force or girth to them. And then like, where's treads fit into that? Because I don't know that you if you have Marcus Moore's at the five, it defeats the purpose, or if you have Marcus it doesn't defeat the purpose. But like, if you're trying to downsize, you're favoring spacing, which Harold isn't going to help you with, and then playing Harold and Zubots together for like long stretch at a time, particularly in the end of close games, just seems like a potential disaster. Yeah. I mean, if you're gonna lose Green, I guess, yeah, then you gotta keep Tres. But if you keep Green and Morris, then you can totally get by without Mantras, even if you you know, would still like him for this regular season, just like inning seating. You know this question, I feel like we've almost danced around at talking about like what the Clippers could do with some of their players. But who do you think is the player that's most likely to get traded but before next season on this roster? Good question. I think it's low Will or Patrick Reverley, just because I mean, if you think about the guys who are under contract, it's not a long list, so you gotta, you know, trade somebody who's actually going to be there for a little bit. But I think the Clippers were quietly, very disappointed with Lowell's actions during the restart, the fact that he jeopardized his ability to play by you know, going Magic City getting the wings it Obviously, you know, lou has a long track record of not performing great during the postseason, he was he was pretty good last year against Golden State, but even then, like he would have really good games and then really bad games. So it's not like you can entirely blame his performance on the fact that he wasn't allowed to practice for ten days in a row. But it certainly is not a good look that your team is complaining about conditioning. And then it's like, oh, well, I mean, wasn't there a guy who was stuck in a ten day quarantine because he had to get some chicken wings? Like it's it's not ideal. So I mean, in terms of like re establishing a culture in Los Angeles, I'm not sure that Lou Williams is the guy to set that culture. So that's one of the reasons why I could see him on his way out. And then also, like we talked about, he's just not great in the playoffs, and again, this is what the team is aiming for. And then Beverly, just because he's that salary and he's not really a point guard, so you could kind of kind of approximate what he does just with other pieces, Like you know, that's I mean, you have to like send out something about you when you get something back. So that's where I would see either one of Beckerley or lou Will Amazon our way out. Do you do you think that they, like how married do you think they are to Landry sham it because it seems like they could do, like if they wanted to take real salary back, like I think the most expendable package, Like I think they could go lou Will Rodney McGruder and then sham it as that sweetener and then you're a fifteen point three million in salary. You could take back more than that, But do you think that they would be willing to because he's probably their best, like their best trade asset. I guess you could say left because in the absence of those first round picks, like they can't they did a swap with that. First of all, it's the most pointless swap I've ever seen with the Knicks, Like that was that was just very cute. Like you saw that and you were like, I don't like as New York just trying to like maybe handcuff the clippers are making any other moves, but like that was just funny, Like that's still one of the funniest spops ever. Like, do you think they view him as more of like a long term piece, someone who's really important to this roster because one impact players in theory are on rookie scale deals or like paramount the teams that where their payroll is going to be sky high. Or do you think that they would be willing to maybe when you're talking about if they wanted to load up and go after a Drew holiday, I still don't think they would have the asset firepower to do that. But if they were looking to really substantially upgrade, do you think they'd be willing to include Shammitt in that type of a deal. I mean, I think you you kind of answered your own question. They're right, like if they go for apologize super high powered upgrade, you know, like if you're getting holiday, then Yash shamm It's on the table. But I don't think they're just gonna, you know, include him willing. Nelly is like a sweetener. It's like you said, they just don't have a lot of flexibility, and shamm It is on what YOU'R three of his rookie deal is relatively clause controlled, not just the year three of his rookie deal, like he was twenty something picked so that contract is tiny, right, and you know, he's just not making any money right now. I will say one of the strangest things about the twenty nineteen twenty season was that Sham. It seems like exactly the kind of player the Doctors loves. You know, he's JJ Reddick White, right, he learned under Reddick in Philadelphia. He came into the Clippers after the trade deadline, was just gun blazing, right, like he's a crucial part of that team that you know, won the eighth seed and then end up taking two games from Golden State. And he obviously hits that shot in Game two to complete the thirty one point comeback, you know in Oracle. It's like, truly, I think it's one of the greatest shots in Clipper history, which says something about the story of the Clippers. But it's you know, Shay throwing the ball to land Ry. It feels like it's your future. And then obviously things did not work out that way. But I just think he's the kind of guy that you need to like juice your half court offense, Like you just need somebody who's gonna run around, move through screens like it I can't see them letting him go unless it's like supremely necessary, you know, like they'll they'll try to like pot prop up terrence and man's value. We're like, you know, hey, Yando, Kevin Gelly was the first round pick last year. Are you interested or a mere coffee? We turned this two way guy into like a really decent wing or I guess that's it. But no, I don't think sham it's really like on the table. I had looked this up actually before we started recording, and I was actually surprised because it didn't feel like guy saw. I probably maybe I just didn't watch enough of the Clippers, but they played over six hundred and fifty possessions where Shamont was like sort of their day factor point guard, and I think not so much in Philly, But when he came over in the trade LA that first half season, it looked like he could run a little bit of pick and roll. Is that something you could see them? I guess maybe that happens in the absence of them not being able to upgrade a playmaker. But do you think they should have maybe leaned on those lineup looks more or no? The thing is I just love Shamon as like a knockdown shooter who's just going to stretch that defense. You know, you can't be that and a playmaker at the same time. So like when he's playing with Paul George, obviously, like you can let Paul George be that guy and then you know, let Shaman do a little more playmaking or vice versa. But it seemed like they just had to do that a lot because you know, they did during the playoffs because Patrick Provley was injured and Reggie Jackson was a defensive train wreck. So they put Shaman in at the one, and that was I think a really successful line up for them in general. Doc used to say this a lot that, like you can tell how well our half court offense is moving by how many shot attempts Shaman gets Okay, Like when he plays well, it's generally a good barometer for how things are looking for the Clippers. So yeah, maybe they could, you know, in second unit situations, potentially rely on Shammon's ball handling a little more. But I just I love him with that starting unit as just this this reddick type right, Like he's so incredibly important to their spacing, even with guys like PG who can shoot and who is a decent shooter, but I wouldn't rely on that in this starting unit just I don't think he has the playmaking juice to really hack it against starting you know, defenses, But like as a second unit option, I think it's something that they could look into. Yeah, I guess if you were playing with a starting unit anyway in that situation, like Shammon's not going to be your ball handler, that's going to be Paul George or Kwai Leonard. So that rendered that question by me totally pointless. I didn't have this on the list that I sent you, but it does feel pertinent. The Clippers are obviously operating under the sense of urgency because Kwai Leonard and Paul George both have player options for next season, but knowing that they or straighted their way to be here, Like I feel if the Clippers get out to a little start or if they're struggling, that we will hear rumor that one of them might be Like, how actually concerned about that? Do the Clippers need to be so? Tylou said after his introductory best furments, Like I expect these guys to be here for a very long time because they chose to be here. Nbsrs are fickle. I don't think that we can say that they just because they wanted to be here, that they're going to be here for the long haul. Obviously, PG and Kawhi have both made it very clear how lovely it is for them to be around their families and to play for a team that they ended up rooting for when they were kids, and it's it's just a good holistic off the court situation for them to be in southern California. I mean, the Lakers could also have cap space next season, but that's different. Sorry, I was getting back to the point. I don't think it's something that they really need to worry about, because the situation with the two of them is better than what they're going to find pretty much anywhere else. I do think that the Clipper should think really hard about extending Paul George this summer that I'm not the summer this offseason, because then you get, you know, one of those stars locked in, and then it's like a much sweeter care for Kawhai to stick around. Potentially alleviates a lot of the pressure on Paul George too, knowing that like he's set, you know, and it's something less to focus on, like, less of a distraction to worry about, because he's you know, he's been in the situation a lot, Like he demanded the trade from Indiana, he's up going for Asian Oklahoma City. Like. I just think it's a lot to play under. I think he plays better when he's in a more stable situation. That's pure speculation. I just think it's something that they should consider, just to get that extension locked up with Paul George so that it's you know, one less thing to worry about. Yeah, I would normally say it makes more sense for him to wait, But I'm wondering if any of the financial tumult of what's to come slash does it help the Equippers that he's kind of coming off a postseason where he became a pandemic p like, does that make it just more likely that he's going to seek an extension to himself where he might have been more inclined to wait and and just see not even surveying the land next summer, would just be able to sign a longer deal at that point. Yep. I think you're you're right on with that. Just the financials kind of makes sense. For an extension, like he can get like forty some in his first year, and like that's that's a lot of money. That's a lot of money. Uh. The last question I have for you, what's one thing I didn't ask you that you would want to talk about this team or just simply the most undercovered or misunderstood thing about these Clippers. Okay, so we talked about the visas who watch a lot, which is great because you know, he's my favorite player on the Clippers and he deserves more time. And I'm glad that he's, you know, getting the love that he deserves after the good, really good playoff that he had. Let's see, we haven't talked much about choir PG. Ironically, I find that funny that I just went through this whole podcast. I only ask you one question for dating to them. That's okay, we don't we don't we have there. I'm just fascinated by this this Clippers coaching staff that they're bringing in, like Chauncey Phillips as a lead assistant coach, the radically who's never coached before. Tie keeps talking about like the cachet that he has players. You know, he's the Finals MVP champion. He walks into a room and he like commands respect. That's cool. I guess, I don't know. I did a little digging. I found out about this like trip to the Dominican Republic that Chauncey and Tye and Larry Drew took one summer. Apparently they're like all besties, which is such a weird like group to think of. I don't even think they really played with each other. But Larry Drew was the same age. I thought he was like sixty two. Yeah, So they took a trip to the Dominican and like this is when U TI found out that Chauncy is like definitely afraid of cats and like Tie is really scared of dogs, or it's opposite. I don't know. The Clippers are going through a lot of like big changes, like they It's it's really interesting this. I mentioned this earlier that the organization has like very little sentimentality, And I get that because like, what are you holding on in the Clippers history? That's so good, you know, like why would you need to like hold in the past when you could just lays forward. But I wonder if we're hitting a point or like players start to feel like assets, you know, and like they just don't really have a culture here. Like I talked about Kawhi, you know, not fitting it in San Antonio, and then he just sort of like was like an ancillary piece in Toronto where they had this very established thing like Kyle Lowry had built. The Clippers don't really have anything here like they it felt like they were building something with Patrick Beverley, Louillyams Montras thing on that scrappy eight seed last year, and then they just completely washed that away by bringing into new guys and letting them have the keys to the kingdom. So I'm interested to see just if it I don't know if it's harmonious. Like I think the Clippers are gonna be really good. I think they're gonna, you know, play better than they did last year. I would expect them to make a conference finals this year barring some dramatic changes to the landscape of free agency. But it just it feels so hard for them, I don't know how else to say it. Like the Lakers had this like happy go lucky moment, you know, just dramatic turnaround from like Lebron James coming in and hating all the young players and then all of a sudden, like everybody's having such a great time, and theoretically the Clippers should be having a really great time, like they have all of the talent in the world, and I don't know, there's just like this connective tissue that's missing, and I don't know how you address that. I wonder if Tyler's they got to fix that. But that's the thing I'm kind of most interested. And it's the hardest thing to like judge, you know, just by watching the teams, especially like when we're watching them remotely, but you could feel it on the Clippers last year that like they were just kind of going through the motions, and I'm interested to see how that works this year with like all of this new blood coming in. Yeah, because it's because the other question that would be ken is a coach even capable of filling that void because there's going to be like that inherent separation between he and the players, and so it does feel like they need that type of a vet And you know, Beverly and Mantraz Harold, they might be outspoken, it might be like the wrong kind of outspoken, where they might be more I want to use the word like combative, but like you need someone to like provide levity too, like they need their Channing Fry. It feels like in the league Jerry Dudley or something Jared. Yeah, maybe Jared Dudley wants to know cross over and keep playing this year. And I do think that puts you in a i'll say a small predicament when your two best players are not that guy. Like because for as much as Lebron might be grading and he has needed strong vets around him, like you at least know that he's someone who's going to be able to rally the troops. And like Paul, George and Quai have just never been those players. That's fine, They're fantastic players in their own right. Kwai is one of the three or five best players in the league. But it does feel you know, you called the connective tissue, and that's I feel like that's a really great point. Even if Tylu is just fantastic at that it feels like they might need that vet, whether he plays or not, who can come in and provide that for them? Yeah, I mean they use their last roster spot on joke him Noah last season. I don't I don't know if he's going to stick around or you know, we just signed one more contract with the Bulls and play with Phillie Donovan again. But and then they like brought in Patrick Patterson because Paul George asked for him to come and then oh I didn't I didn't even know that part of it. Yeah, they were friends in Oklahoma City or something. But yeah, I just want like a little heart, you know, to this team, something more like a personality even right. Yeah, Sabrina, thank you so much for giving me a ton of your time. This conversation was fantastic. If you guys are not following Sabrina on Twitter, remedy that immediately a fantastic follow covers the best covers the NBA and the California based team, specifically at large for SPI Nation at Sabrina JM. That's at SA B R E n A JM. Thank you so much again for coming on and rest assured. I'm sure that I'll be bothering you again for another appearance in the future. Yeah, this is great. Love talking to Clippers Sugar Ray, Leonard, Roberto Iran, Marvelous, Marvin Hagler, and Thomas Hearns. Legends whose four way rivalry, define one of the greatest errors in boxing history. Relive their decade of dominance in the new Showtime Sports documentary The Kings, a four part series premiering Sunday, June sixth, only on Showtime