And spend Spend the d spend spend play what up? Bro? I can
hear you. Welcome everybody to tonight's live stream. As you guys know,
it is me and David Patrick Harry tonight, and we're gonna have a good
time. We are going to cover We're both diving into this furious issue.
I mean, the Internet has just blown up the last year with the topic
of red Pill, Manosphere, feminism, dark Triad, right game pick up
artists, top g, Rollo, Pearl, you name it. This is
the whole Internet talking about it. And He's covered it, I've covered it,
and I imagine we're both going to be covering it pretty heavily in the
near future because it's so hot of a topic, and hopefully we can arrange
maybe some debates and discussions. I think you're trying to get something going with
Rollo, and I do want to give a shout out to Rollo, because
tonight I'm going to be covering with my buddy David here the paper that he
did a live stream about. It's called signaling virtuous victimhood as indicators of Dark
Triad personality. So if you guys know about the red Pill or the history
of pickup artist, the net that niche. Then you know about the dark
triad. You know about this characteristic which is the three try. The triad
is Macabellianism, narcissism, and psychopathy. So we're not going to spend the
whole night on that and how that relates to what they call virtuous victimhood and
virtue signaling through victims status and why that's an advantage. We're gonna get into
all that in a minute. We're also going to be talking about David's live
streams that he's done on the phenomena of red Pill and the different characters and
the pros and the cons and so where do you want to kick it off
tonight because you've done You've done a stream, I've done a stream, and
I know we're gonna be doing more streams on this's what's on your mind?
First, I guess to get into it is for those who aren't aware kind
of what the man of sphere and the red Pill is, because a lot
of it and I think that's the misnomers. I do want to debate and
get into the sphere and debate people, but we probably agree with a lot
of what they talk about and so a lot of the ills of the world
right now, me and being disenfranchise, what's called the lost boy generation,
looking for role models, trying to find status in a place to to find
themselves. Really in the world we can all agree with. We can agree
that, you know, talks about a ginocentric worldview, basically that the world
is being oriented around women. Don't disagree with that really either. I would
say, our critiques as traditional Christian men is going to come to what why
would somebody become high value? What's the point of being high value? What's
the point of getting these virgin, pure women? What's the point of a
man in society? And I think that's where the red pill in the manosphere
kind of is too myopic, and it kind of deals with really important issues
for men right now. But they you know, you'll hear anybody who's been
really into rollo stuff. They'll say, oh, red pills of praxeology is
not an ideology, and of course they have no philosophical understanding that you know,
red pill is not engineering and mathematics. It's definitely an ideology. It's
built within presuppositions of how men should be or how society should be, and
how the society is so manosphere is really blown up, as even Rolos talked
about the mantosphere that really got going with the game and in the whole late
two thousand's, early two thousand teens. It's very different now in the twenties,
post twenty twenty, it's a whole new thing. And obviously the Tates
Yep, Neil Strauss, I got that book actually too. I got my
Game Bible right here. You got your Bible. I'm gonna be a Bible
fupper. I'm a Bible fupper, but it's the game Bible. And I'm
just joking. Yeah, I've got a lot of those books over here to
just sitting around and I read I read Rollo for many years, and I
read Return of Kings. I read you know, Ruci's site for many many
years. So you know, I know this, uh domain, I know
the thought process, and it's it's I think I totally agree with what you're
kind of laying out at the beginning. Is there's a lot of pieces of
the puzzle that they have. Yeah, and and and when we get really
precise, I'll even go so far as to agree with Rollo's point against like
Jordan Peterson because I was listening to a really long stream that he did,
and he was critique in Jordan Peterson, not on everything, but just on
certain areas. Like when Jordan Peterson continues with that sort of it's really an
annoying trad con position that it's time to man up, buckle, man up.
And it's like, well, now, wait a minute, as a
classical liberal, what's the motivations for me as a young man? Why am
I supposed to man up? Right now? I thought Rolla has a really
good critique of that. Maybe we can talk about that later. That's getting
really precise, but yeah, but yeah, so like tell us more about
like when you encountered manosphere and what what do you what did you think it
was because it used to be first red pill was like conspiracy stuff. Then
redpill became men's issues, and it's sort of just morphed into a lot of
different things. Well, I think, and that's what you know. You
hear redpill back in two thousand and sixteen with Trump, and it had to
do with, you know, almost libertarian understandings of the Fed Reserve and the
new World Order and that there's a larger agenda in twenty twenty being based in
Red Pill were synonymous, and it seems like red Pill because of the explosion
of the manosphere, it's basically been totally oriented around male female relationships at this
point, and so the red Pill then is trying to fix the sexual dynamics
between men and women and the twenty first century. And you know, you
look at somebody like Kevin Samuels, who's now passed away. I don't know
if you're familiar with him. He was an African American man down in Atlanta
who he blew up on the scene he had. I remember I watched a
few videos. This was like early early twenty twenty he had. He was
in the low thousands, maybe twenty thousand subs or something like that, and
then within just a few months he was over a million subs. And he
would start to have women on and he would ask them questions about, oh,
what do you want, what's your dress? Sides? How tall are
you? How much do you weigh? Was your face look like when you
get out of the shower, And then he would just give them a reality
check. He's like, lady, you're five five and you wait too an
pounds, You're not gonna get a man who makes six figures and this blew
up on the Internet because he was given like this dose of reality to women.
I would say Rollo is still probably the pre eminent manosphere redpill promoter.
I would say he's probably the most articulate. He's probably got the best arguments.
But now there's all these quacks and in these young guys on Twitter.
You see them, they're like showing their lambo in the Bugatti or I mean
not the Tates specifically, but other guys, and they're like, oh,
yeah, I got this girl last night. She had a fiance and yeah
I fucked her right in the club man, you know, hive out in
it. And it's like, dude, what like this this is supposed to
be the manosphere. Now it's just like these men that are totally hedonistic and
they're just it's just like now about a numbers notch and getting many many as
women as you can. And it's like, well, what is the role
of masculiney? What's the role of men? Is that? Is that why
people should bragg And I've seen this before, bragging about how many virgins they
sleep with. And it's like, as a religious man, I don't disagree
with their even assessment on what a high value woman is, submissive, feminine,
fit, pretty pure. Don't disagree with all that stuff. But then
why are you also sleeping with girls that are virgins? And then you're criticizing
girls for being only fans and having high body counts. That seems contradictory if
you're not going to marry them, why are you sleeping with virgin girls?
And so it's like the manosphere, at least to some degree. I'm not
saying that Rollo says this, but generally speaking, as a cultural phenomenon,
it's bridged into the whatever podcast Pearly Things, who Are Friend? Rachel Wilson
has been on really talking about feminism, and so it's weird. It's like
this, it's a new space to talk about sexual dynamics, and I think
people haven't been able to express and that's why it's just exploding like wildfire on
social media. Yeah, but even before all that, I remember the first
phase or cycle of this was I mean, there was a phase of dudes
that we're doing the Pua Frank tgmacky stuff into two thousands, but like mystery
and like and Rollo was first kind of blogging back when Mystery got popular,
and then when when Rusche return of Kings and you know his stuff, that
was really kicking off, like twenty eleven, twelve, thirteen fourteen is when
that was starting to get some traction. And forget I forget what year the
game actually came out. But there was an important element to this which also
came about, which was men's rights. So men's rights came about because a
lot of the legal system was seen to be extremely disadvantageous to men and bent
against any of the arguments of the men or the fathers in those situations,
always just well, women are always right, which became like some stupid hashtag
right, which is complete nonsense and I mean just crazy stuff. So there's
the men's rights element of it that was kind of its own thing. And
there was the Spearhead and there was a guy I kind oft remember the name
of the There was a or doctor, doctor somebody, and he ran the
Spearhead website. And I used to listen to all these podcasts, I read
all this stuff, and then red Pill kind of it was like overlapping with
men's rights, and then and the social dynamics stuff and conspiracy stuff because originally
as I know, you know, but for those that don't know in the
audience, the red pill is from the matrix. I mean, yeah,
it goes back to a total recall, but the popularization of it is the
matrix where you know, Neo has a choice between is he gonna wake up
to how the world world really works or is he going to stay in the
system and take the blue pill. So it had to do like you said
back then in the two thousands, with Federal Reserve and the stuff that Alex
was talking about and all that kind of stuff. So it's kind of been
an amorphous, elastic thing that's been able to be pasted on a bunch of
different things. But it is really surprising to me that it kind of made
its way back in the last couple of years. But I did watch an
interesting Rollo video where he makes the argument that actually, this the red pill
thing actually goes in a cycle, and so there was a cycle of it
before you know, twenty sixteen, back in twenty twelve thirteen, when you
know, Russian return of Kings is really popular and there's gonna be another cycle
of all of this. After he says that after the election, you'll notice
a lot of these people who will gain a lot of influence and traction.
He's like, after the election, the next election, they'll die away and
they'll disavow it. And he made a good point to Canvas. Oh and
I didn't even I forgot this. I actually remember this because she she used
to go on Ralph back in the day, and at that time she was
red Pill Black. That was her handle on Twitter. So she was doing
doing red pill issues and then then she transitioned into being basically just a political
commentator, right right. Um, not that I care. I don't care
whether she talks about politics or whatever. I'm not knocking her. I'm just
saying that this is what this was the trick she took, and so a
lot of and Rollo's making a good point much I think it's true, is
that he's saying that if you watch a lot of these red pill people,
they're going to disavow red pill after the election because they're riding a wave to
get popular, and then they'll transition into being political, normy conservative commentators because
the cycles happen in the past. And I think that's really important to notice.
Because I'm not calling anybody specifically out, I don't really care what other
people. I don't know people's motives, and I'm not an interested in judging
people's motives. But what I do know is that this is a recurring pattern
that a lot of these red pill people right now will transition into just being
normy political commentators after the next election. And so you can tell there is
going to be a there's there's a grift phase that goes on. As what
I'm trying to say, That's what I was gonna say, a lot of
grifters in this sphere, and and that's why I partly I want to get
into and you too. I'm sure it's just to kind of debate some of
these guys because it's kind of built on saying their houses. Now. Again,
a handful of people like Rollo have been there from the beginning and have
gone through all these different various phases. Like you said, it was conspiratorial
moved into men's issues, and the manosphere as a title was actually a derogatory
term created by feminists to describe all these men talking about, as you said,
men's rights and men's issues, and this has just blossomed and grown,
and especially in the last three to four years, where it's I mean,
as we were talking about in Nashville. I mean, this is like the
hottest topic on YouTube now. You can't scroll YouTube without your YouTube shorts or
YouTube clips from what all these different podcasts would be Pearly Things or Fresh and
Fit or Rollo or the whatever podcast. It's in your face, it's everywhere.
So this is clearly one of the hottest topics and something that people want
to talk about. It's because people can't have good relationships right now and we
can get into it. And I think that's going to be partly tied to
secularism and the way that culture is. And I would argue, and if
I was to debate somebody, I would make this debate because I was supposed
to. I was supposed to debate Spencer Cornelia tomorrow night on The Crucible.
He's got a big YouTube channel that exposes like fakes and frauds and stuff on
marriage. He says men shouldn't get married. And I was basically going to
grant him all his premises and say, yeah, if you're secular, probably
not a good idea, because how are you going to go about finding a
woman that you can actually trust? You know? And what's the point of
the relationship. That's the other thing is like for us as Orthodox Christians,
you know, you get married to have a family. You get married to
commit not just a legal but a spiritual union with somebody, a vow that
you're gonna be with him for eternity. That's a little bit that's totally on
a different level than the manosphere in the Red pills talking about relationships. So
I was gonna he backed out of it, but we were gonna supposed to
do a debate tomorrow night that I don't know if I'll be doing with anybody
or not, but I grant them that, you know, like you said,
the court systems, divorce courts, child custody, all this stuff,
it's all oriented against men. The bigger question then is why. And this
is where I would have a beef with Rollo, somebody pointed out because he
had that viral tweet to say it, you know, don't get married,
don't have children, and get a vasectomy the quickest way to become a high
value man. And that implies even though Destiny and Sneeko try to push him
on, well, what is a high value man, he was kind of
reluctant to define and said, well, everything's contextual meaning relative that I would
say, no, there are objective things that we can qualify what a high
value man is, and we can get into those here in a few but
quick question. So the guy that you I'm not familiar with, the person
that you're talking about that you were going to have to debate with, now,
is he migtowel Because migtowl kind of is its own thing, right,
which is like so out of the men's the pot of the men's sphere,
there's sort of eventually became these schisms and divisions to where there's the sort of
the the men's well, there's men's rights, there's the guys who are you
know, pickup artists, social dynamics, here's how to make you into a
high value mail guys. And then there was the division of what would become
migtowel slash in all guys who have decided that no, I want sex bots,
I want you know, literally right like because some of those some of
those popular channels from a few years ago, I don't know if they still
exist, like poop Flinging Monkey and Barbara Rosa or whatever, like they became
full on like never get It's actually bad to get Mary period. Having any
sex relations is actually bad. We should have sex bots literally, So that's
the course that some of those you know people took in terms of end cells.
So is that is this a guy who's which camp? Is the guy
you're talking about? No? I think no. He has a prominent YouTube
channels, like four hundred thousand or something, and he basically exposes like fakes
and frauds, tac cheeps, hustlers on the internet, people selling fake courses,
stuff like that. That's how he grew his channel. But more recently
he's kind of developed the friendship with a handful of people in the mantosphere.
So he's been on like Fresh and Fit and like Access Vegas with Rollo and
people. So he's kind of dipping his toes in there. But again I
don't know his personal story. I believe I haven't watched all the stuff that
he has gone through a divorce, and so he's like he looks like he's
in maybe his mid thirties or maybe later thirties. I'm not so he's you
know, still got a lot of life ahead of him. But I would
probably grant him any of his premises. So I don't think he's migtawel per
se. And that is, like you said, there's like the red pill,
the blue pill, which is a derogatory term, the red pill,
which means you know, you're awake to the matrix, and then you have
the black pill, and that's becoming more and more popular with the neihilism,
the far right wing. This usually gets into almost racial stuff, the black
pill, because there's nothing for him to hang on to anymore. And then
you have the men going their own way, the Migtowel. I don't think
Spencer was part of one of those groups. However, he echoes a sentiment
that we find, you know, common throughout the manosphere, whether it be
coach Greg Adams or various people telling men, oh, don't get married,
don't get married, don't get married, you know, have a girlfriend or
spin plates have multiple girlfriends. And again, the point I would ask is,
well, what's the point of sexual relationships, what's the point of getting
married in the first place, And it's going to get to family creation and
then it's gonna get to what's best for children and all these other things that
I think that they just don't focus on, per se, because that's not
you know, it's more about male female sexual dynamics and why it's all falling
apart. And it's a fact it has fallen apart. I mean, you
luckily haven't been single recently, but glory to God, I have my fiance
and we'll be getting married soon. But dude, it's terrible out there with
the only fans. And this is where again I grant them mannosphere in the
red Pill. Look at these girls. Look at the young girls at ore,
dating age from from eighteen to thirty five or forty. It's terrible narcissism,
self absorption, social media, and people overlooked that a lot of the
girls too are on pills and SSRIs, which isn't a big issue too in
birth control, which totally all the pharmaceutical cocktailer. Yeah, yeah, and
and there's multiple studies that shown that birth control makes women basically choose more feminine
men. And then you know, there's I think even Canda's owns did a
whole thing on this about how she's against birth control and talking about all these
rates of divorce where women they'll be on birth control, they'll get married to
this guy, then they have to get all birth control to have a baby.
They have a baby, and then they look at this guy and they're
like, oh my gosh, I'm like not attracted to you. You're not
going to be the provider or the protector of me and the child. And
then they feel totally unhappy with the relationship and they get a divorce. And
it's true, seventy five of all racial demographics women initiate divorce. So again
granting the manosphere in the red pill, like, what's the upside of getting
married? Well, it depends on where you're coming from and what is the
point of these relationships and yeah, so we can begin to define. I
have a handful of things, just defining again the presetup level, like what
is the red pill? And the red pill is well, hold on before
you get in that, I have a question for you. I have a
question for you about some of the previous discussions that you've made that I think
is actually really relevant for what we're talking about tonight, because I didn't even
realize it until like a day or two ago that the stream that we planned
on doing before got postponed. I was feeling like crap. I had like
a bug, and it ended up being that we're doing it tonight on Father's
Day in America, which is hilarious because I mean this is right the patriarchy
day. So you know, the feminism succeeded through a lot of things,
through a lot of money and a lot of support from very wealthy families,
oligarchs, foundations, think tanks, and so forth, and just the sort
of inherent virus nature of leftism and all that that it was able to sort
of worm its way into all of our institutions. And one of the ideas
behind it, which we'll get into, i'm sure in a little bit,
is not just the idea of a society organizer around so called fairness and egalitarianism.
Also this idea that there are no boundaries and the patriarchy is bad because
somehow follow logocentrism is it creates boundaries, and that's bad because boundaries limit you.
Man, you'd be whatever you want. I can identify as an attack
helicopter if I want to man it right, So literally, I could be
anything one day identify as something else the next day. And that's the root
of this idea that there are no limits or boundaries to reality. There's no
metaphysical essences of things things will have natures. We can determine whatever they are
from our own postmodern magical thinking perspective. So tell us why boundaries are actually
good and why they're absolutely necessary to function at all, and how that's connected
to patriarchy to men. Right, So again, what if you get into,
like what is the role of masculinity? And as you pointed out,
Jacques Derrida and his famous book Grammatology says, well, it's this thing that's
the central pillar of Christianity. It's he called foul logo centrism, privileging the
foulest masculine principle, logo centrism, looking at a logos worldview oriented worldview and
focusing on the center, the middle. And he said, what we got
to do to undermine this is focused on marginalization, and we have to take
the marginal and make that the center, take the center and move that to
the fringes. And anybody's watched commercials nowadays would probably see that's exactly what's going
on. And this is how he believed it would undermine the patriarchy because he
thought, again, the patriarchy upholded boundaries and moral structures, and we needed
to erode those and so when we look at our society, the boundary between
men and women dissolved, the boundary of nation states dissolved, the boundary between
man and machine dissolved, the boundary between man and animal dissolved. That we
see what I would argue is a henosis. Is a neo platonic term for
really a different understanding what we would consider theosis. It's like this dissolution of
all boundaries, so everything becomes unified, and this is supposed to be the
endpoint of mystical of the mystical process. And I would say, no,
this is like a Satanic Everything is one, Dude, is one. Dude.
I just did biggest hit ever. I saw everything as one, which,
oh wow, you came to the realization of what every ancient pagan religion
ever said, everything's one. Yeah right, it's really deep, dude.
But yeah, this actually has consequences, like you're saying right that the working
out of this leads to social destruction, and a lot of people don't realize
that this stuff can be weaponized and can be used to break down societies.
Of course, we talked with our friend Rachel. You know, in her
books she talks about the occult roots of feminism and witchcraft. How a lot
of women's liberation comes out of witchcraft. And you know, you couldn't have
the crazy, insane postmodern denial of all essences and boundaries that we have today
without prior without having feminism first. So feminism prepares the way for the destroying
of all boundaries by first destroying that notion of the boundary between legitimate roles for
men and women. Right which rightfully so that both Rachel and Andrew Wilson point
out is that it has to do with men. Feminism only existed because men
granted the rights. So this process, and that's where I point that it's
the whole it has to do with men allowing the boundary to dissolve. You
can still point to the Islamic world, and this is not an apologetics for
Islam, but it still maintains its patriarchy, and the men are still then
in control of our society. So the Western man has slowly given away the
boundaries. And something I've spoke with even Father Peter Here's is that I equate
this with the fall Adam simping for Eve, Adam turning his back on God,
the true patriarchy, that true maintaining of the boundaries, whether it be
King Ahab and Jezebel, men simping and choosing, like sexual pleasure and the
sexuality of women, over its relationship with God, over these higher callings,
these transcendental values. This is what allows us to begin to dissolve these boundaries
at a societal level. How did everybody choose this? And so the boundaries
are essential, and so men always maintain boundaries. That's what war is about,
That's what defending your home is about. That's what value structure is about.
And so shout out to all the fathers out there for Father's Day.
And that was one of the things that I would level at the manosphere and
the red pill people is like, what patriarchy are you a part of?
You see, we're Orthodox Christian. We're part of basically the last patriarchy in
Christendom, the true patriarchy going You could argue all the way back to Abraham.
What patriarchy are you a part of? Because they want to criticize feminism
or some of the moral indecency of contemporary women. But it's like, bro,
I'm part of an institution that goes back ages that is this is our
This is our worldview. You're doing this as an isolated, atomized person like,
it's totally less effective and you're not part of any actual patriarchal tradition.
One of the elite texts that I was just reading, I'm charmer which one
it was, It was actually discussing that present day Islam has not yet completely
capitulated to the Western geopolitical strategy of pushing feminism. I'm trying to remember which
text it was. Now, that's not a concession to Oh, therefore,
Islam is Baysed and trad bro because actually the documents it just said that we
haven't gotten to them fully yet, will eventually get to them, and the
Irania is that, of course, went a lot of Islamic people who end
up in the US or in the West, they actually, just like all
the other immigrants, in a generation or two, turn into totally Americanized individuals
as well. So the document wasn't conceding that Islam is trad and Baysed.
It's just saying that we haven't gotten them fully on board with what we are
pushing for the whole world yet, but we will, right and they believe
that they will, and the Islam and that's one of the things that I
would argue that it's probably and this I mentioned this Montanica to Bishop Maxim that
I said, you know, really the greatest threats to Orthodoxy, it's not
atheists. Anybody's still thinking that atheists are gonna like convert and apostis highs the
Orthodox like you're you're out of touch. The biggest threat to people in Orthodoxy
is people that believe in the occult. And I think Islam's gonna grow because
Islam is going to be this place, especially for these mano sphere type young
men. Well, well, you know, I'm just enfranchised in the West.
I have no social status. But you know, uh, you know,
if I've become a Muslim like Sneako and uh you know, I'll get
my virgin bright exactly. Yeah, they'll get their virgin bright. They don't
have to do anything. They just have to submit to Islam. And it's
like, bro, that like that's not masculine either, that's just another form
of consumerism. That's just a kumer. It's like, Bro, The point
is, and I agree with the Mantis where you gotta work on yourself,
but this is where theology and actually taking philosophies here. I think this is
part of masculinity as well in regards to spiritually leading somebody. So again we
can get into anywhere you want to go at this point. But well,
one last point on Islam there, which is that so at a lot of
the recent manosphere individuals, obviously the largely because of the Tape acceptance of and
I know it's I don't know exactly if Tristan has fully accepted Islam, but
I felt recently with the did you see the Patrick bet David I've not Christian,
still says he's Orthodox Christian, so he has a fully excepted and Andrew
as a Muslim has actually pulled back on some of his stuff. So it's
no longer get the ferrari to escape the matrix. He's saying, Okay,
you gotta do he slowly in that interview again I was listening to he's kind
of changed his tone on a little bit of issues that I would argue are
a little bit more closer to our side of things as a traditional religious person.
So again I don't know the sincerity of his hard I'm not here to
talk about their faith Orthodox or Islam, but just about what they say and
how that ripple effects and culture. Well, one thing that somebody had a
good critique of it might have been you, and I can't remember who was
critiquing the reasoning of some of the tape interviews where he was talking about why
excepted Islam. It was essentially the same psycho theology of Jordan Peterson, where
God is a concept that really is the exemplification of my self help strategy.
Right, It's like, well, dude, that's not what God is.
And so it seems like he was sort of saying, oh, Islam will
function as this for me, as a way for me to put God into
a system that allows me to say, well, I'm this because that allows
me to you know, do better in life and to get bugattis or whatever
I mean. And I know Jordan Peterson doesn't say that the purpose of the
the God archetype or whatever is to get you bugattis, but he basically has
a similar idea that God is this sort of archetypal thing that helps you in
the psychological process of working out your issues, not an actual personal God.
That's the key thing, right, Yeah, it's a ttilitarian approach to religion
exactly so. And so whether it be, and and I could see multiple
factors for Andrew. Again, I don't know as hard so I'm not here
to claim what his intentions were, but just as an outsider, I could
see that if you were him and you were being investigated by the Romanian government,
um, and you had all this money, and you had all these
dealings with the Middle East, and they have their own banking system and the
West are trying to de bank you, it makes sense why it would be
very pragmatic to become Muslim, because now you have access to an entire economy
and social system that isn't trying to you know, put you in jail and
deebank you, but actually allows you some type of maintain your status, and
you become an idol for the entirety of the Muslim world. And by the
way, yes, so people in the chat, you're right, Uh it
was it was. That was Jim Bob's stream critiquing uh JBP and Tay,
that's right, that was his that was his argument. And that's a really
good point because if if God is just a conceptual thing that we can make
it into whatever we want to, you know, make us into self help
bros, then that has nothing that's not that's is basically nothing right, that's
that's not a god, that's just a that's just another self help path.
And so it's like, like David said, it's it's just utilitarian. So
now, uh, you said you had a list of five things that were
ready, yeah, to find like what the red pill worldview is, because
you know, we do philosophy and theology, so I always like to see
what the paradigm is. And and so the red pill is built upon evolutionary
psychology, evolutionary biology, and evolutionary understandings of sociology. And so it's already
rooted in a in a structure that really doesn't give you moral objectivity. It
gives you, Okay, this is the way it happens, and this is
how we evolved, and this is why women like this and uh me,
as an orthox Risian, I don't believe in mac revolution. I think it's
actually a nonsensible worldview. I can get on on board with the idea that
people evolve based on niches, but mac revolution the leap between species, there's
no evidence, I mean, no series academic even maintains that because the probability
does even a match up well one thing I would say on this point is
that I agree with you there about the transmutation of species. I don't think
that's a very sensible or coherent theory at all about the origin of life and
whatnot. However, we as I think, I don't know of anything in
orthodox theology or in our system that would contradict the notion of adaptation. And
so what I think a lot of what evolutionary psychology is studying in particular is
precisely adaptive strategies of different societies and cultures. And I think all of that
information is one percent totally relevant. If you look at the interviews that doctor
Edward Dutton does, who he basically he doesn't come at this from the red
pill perspective, comes at it from the academic perspective. He's done a lot
of interviews where he basically just makes all of these same points with nothing to
do with like the red pill manisphere. He's just making the points from the
data and from the papers that you know, there's these there's certain tendencies in
you know, women to do this. There's certain tendencies and certain cultures for
like, for example, he had a really good discussion on witchcraft as a
survival mechanism for really basically ugly nasty hose. Okay, so when they when
they weren't part of society and they and they couldn't get a made I already
agree with you. They when they couldn't get a mate, they would turn
to these practices that and somehow they thought empowered them or maybe gave them contact
with another group of a coven. Right, so they found community when they
were sort of no longer part of the mainline community. And a lot of
those individuals would be you know, unattractive women who couldn't find a mate and
whatnot. So this is why we get the archetype of the ugly hag,
right, because she's the witch that and she's always childless and she's uncry.
Yeah exactly. And so we see I did a whole stream on the archetype
of the old hag, and we see that is almost the modern woman.
They just haven't aged that far yet. Um. It's it's somebody who's usually
you know, not at the point where they're the old hag with the big
nose and the witch hat, but usually sexually promiscuous, unmarried, no children,
pursuing their own will. That's what magic is anyways, So it's like,
well, geez, it looks like that is agreeing with the mantosphere in
the Red Pill. That is the contemporary landscape for most women. Um.
I'll recommend for those that have not heard it, go listen to doctor Dutton's
analysis of witchcraft and feminism. It's a fascinating evolutionary psychology approach to this.
And I would also say too that there's a lot of information in what they
call just evolutionary biology. Again, evolution can mean different things, guys.
So if if we're referring to the study of how the species evolves to adapt
to different circumstances, there's nothing unorthodox about that. That's different than a theory
of origins that everybody came from a single celled organism and that all of the
species somehow mutated out of this single cell origin and it's all atheism. And
that's two different things. Now for a lot of people that are connected but
there's no necessity, but they're not. It's important distinction. Speciation is not
mac revolution. Those are two separate processes of which we have. We have
evidence for speciation, and that doesn't go against the creationist worldview. It actually
makes total sense, but mac revolution I would reject that outright. So the
red pill worldview is built on evolutionary psychology, biology, and sociology. They
often referred to It wasn't familiar with the doctor you mentioned, but doctor David
Buss and doctor Godsid they refer to him a lot. Then it gets into
the ginals centric order. And this has to do with the idea that we
live in a world in which there's a war on masculinity and that everything is
sort of rigged against men and in favor of women, which I don't totally
disagree with. Where I would push the mantospheres, I would say, well
why is that why? It's because I would argue, it's ultimately getting out
of spiritual reality to move us towards a one world inverted order towards the end
times, which has to feminize men and get us to become less virtuous and
give away these boundaries. And so the gnocentrism is part of it. Evolutionary
psychology hypergamy is a big part of what the red pill is. This idea
that women are always trying to get their best option, which again I don't
disagree with. And again if I have a daughter, I want her to
get with the best man she can. So this is where I would almost
push back on, you know, some of the red pill guys that and
I'm not saying Rollo is one of these, but you could see the people
who watches content, Oh women are hypergamist women hyper Yeah, Well, I
hope my daughter gets the best man she can. What's wrong with that from
a female perspective? I don't see anything wrong with them trying to get the
best man that is available as a suitor for them. So hypergamy is a
big part of it dating up. And so Rollo breaks this down into what
he calls beta bucks and alpha as you can imagine, or beta needs and
alpha seeds. And it has to do with beta's For a woman in hypergamy,
she is look, she's always analyzing two assessments. One he calls the
beta needs, which is protection, parental investment, and provisions what they can
provide. Then women are, he would argue, balancing this with their hypergamous
nature with the alpha seed, which is men that are physically fit, attractive,
and have the best genetics. And so women then are trying to put
their he argues, they're trying to choose the best suitor based on the beta
needs what they can provide, and then the alpha seed who they actually are,
and trying to get the best man somewhere in between the middle there.
I read a book one time, just interject on that, and I want
you to keep going with this list. But I read a book that was
really good on the the biological components of this, which was talking about the
different sorts of signals that male and female members of very species do. So
basically, this is for for all mammals. Right, There's certain traits and
certain patterns that you'll notice that they biologically give off to attract or to h
you know, get a mate. There's some obvious ones. You know.
We think about peacocking, right, this is the term that the red pill
master uses for trying to show out, to show off. Right, Peacocks
do this. Spiders do this. There's spiders that will like build a they'll
do a little dance. Have you seen that little spider and he's doing this
attractive mate? And so there's nothing inherently wrong with this because we're all I
think all of us sort of biologically wired obviously to want the best possible mate
in all of the criteria, and that's true for men and women. There's
nothing inherently weird or bad or wrong with that. It's it's a biological hardwiring
that we have, right, And there's a sort of a misnoe worth the
peacocking because the book the game, as you pointed out, mystery the pickup
artist, you know, he's like, where the most outrageous hat or the
most outrageous shirt you can wear, or you know, don't wear shoes to
the bar, do something to like drastically stand out too, For he would
consider peacocking to make yourself noticeable to women. But peacocking or making yourself noticeable,
it doesn't have to be that extreme. I mean again, just by
being well dressed, fit, look people in the eyes. These are ways
that you can stand out in the twenty first century. So yeah, again,
I like you said, these are nuances where most of the time we
don't even disagree with them. It's just like bringing it back into a sort
of a middle path. Well, one point I would make before you do
the next one is that so a lot of the people that we're talking about
and the information that they put out, they're not interested in actually giving a
philosophy of life or a totality meaning or any kind of ethical grounding, and
not everybody has to do that. But the problem is that if you're going
to predicate a lot of your critiques of modern society and feminism and the you
know, gynocentrism on ethics and morals, we need to know a grounding and
a basis for ethics and morals exactly. And most of these people don't believe
in any grounding and ethics and morals. They end up being relativistic. And
the problem is that if if that's the case, then there's no reason why,
really you have feminism is bowed or wrong. It's just as valid as
your relatives. So they basically fall back into a power relations dynamic, which
is the leftist position, which is that there is no truth or falsehood.
It's all power relations and oppressed or oppressed dynamics. Oh, you nailed it.
And that would be exactly if I was debating a mantosphere guy and they're
making these arguments, I would say, Bro, you're the only fans chick
of masculinity, Like, you're the one that has no objective standards, You're
the one has no moral standards. And I think that perspective kind of open
that floodgate when Leela Rose, a Catholic conservative content creator, sort of criticized
Justin Waller, who's a big friend of the of the Tates, really handsome
guy tall has his own construction business. Millionaire, so he's got all the
things that the people are looking for. And he was talking about, Yeah,
I want to get married, I'm gonna have a wife, and she
said, well, you say you want to get married and have a wife
and have children, but you're also going to have girlfriends. Don't you think
that's contradictory. I mean, you talk about all this discipline and working,
but then you don't want to have discipline regards to like a faithful marriage.
He's like, well, I'm not. I'm not. I'm not wired that
way. I try to have I try to be monoga if I'm not wired
that way. And it's like, bro, that's a cop out. Like,
if you're gonna have children, then you can make you could make an
argument for what's the best way children can grow up and it's not by seeing
their dad have a bunch of girlfriends, because that's only going to cause more
conflict with maybe amossi between children and father or father with wife. So you
know, like they don't have an objective standard to make their arguments and they
are giving prescription. One of the guys was upset, this is a praxeology,
not an ideology, No, bro, Like, shut up, you
don't even know what you're talking about. Even if it is like okay,
but at some point we're gonna need some explanation or basis for grounding the morals
and ethics. Right, So yeah, it's fine if you want to give
just a praxeology, but if you're going to start making these totalizing universal claims
about this being bad, this being horrible, this being manipulative, deceptive,
Okay, why is it wrong to be a moral manipulative and deceptive? Right?
Deceptive? Right, So we gotta we gotta have some kind of grounding
for the ethical claims or else nothing now of this is going to get off
the ground. And we can't avoid metaphysics either, as I'm sure a lot
of these people would like to do. Again, we're just gonna I'm sorry,
but we're gonna be in the domain of philosophy when we start talking about
good versus bad. The good is on the one hand, both ethical and
metaphysical. Right. In classical philosophy, the good relates to being, it
relates to what is versus what is not, versus negation. Those are all
just heavy, heavy, you know, philosophy terms. So we're gonna need
more than just saying what's the data, what are the papers the data?
And uh, you know, just get what feels good for you, Bro.
I mean, it's got to be more than that, exactly because I
would say that's feminine, that that that's very feminine. That's exactly right.
It's consumeristic. It's like, bro, the man produces more than he consumes.
And the boundaries which we establish in our own lives help define us.
That's the point is and where this is where I would agree again with part
of the mantospheres that men have to make themselves. Women are born with a
sense of innate value because they can give birth to children. Men, you
know, we're disposable. That's why we die at war. We we're the
disposable sex. But that means you have to make yourself, and you define
yourself and make yourself through the discipline that you put on yourself to develop.
Whether it's like you and your philosophy and all your knowledge on theology. That
took a lot of time, discipline, and effort, but that's what defines
it. May no matter what. You could be a mechanic, you could
be a plumb it doesn't matter. But that's what it means to be a
man. And so this this hedonism that they put forth because they have no
objective morality, I would say, it makes them like the women they criticize.
Well they often they'll point out too that, oh, you know,
the society that's uh gynocentric is necessarily egalitarian and collectivists, which it is right
because it is. However, on what basis then am I supposed to prefer
the atomized individual classical liberal society. Now maybe the classical liberal individual society is
better, but you're not going to be able to tell me how it's better
on your systems. All you can ever say is because it's gonna give you
more feely points and more pleasure points. So why is that better? Says
who? Why it's this arbitrary? And that's where, like you pointed out,
it gets back to power again. Anybody who's studied philosophy knows this is
the state of twentieth century philosophy. With FUCOT, it comes down the power.
There's no longer objective truth and that's why you listen to some of these
guys. And I'm not talking about just the main figures, just the rhetoric
within the live chats. It's the women are the enemy. And it's like,
Bro, you've fallen into the same paradigm of the women that you're trying
to criticize because they think the men are the enemy. Oh, the radical
feminists, Well then, and I'm I'm not trying to say they're misogynists or
anything that gets thrown out way too much, just generally on the internet,
but now they've totally have this contempt for women, and it's like, Bro,
you're not gonna get a wife that's gonna submit to you when like you
just you know, make fun and mock every woman that you see because you
are deep down hurt because you've been rejected so many times because you haven't put
in the work to become a man worthy enough for a woman to submit to
you. Yeah, well, this is just the male version of the feminist
slash fat acceptance flash. You know, gross creature who is rather than I
mean, it's means a lot of vice is involved in this. One of
those is sloth. Right. Rather than self improving, rather than doing the
work that I need to do to make myself better, I'm going to instead
blame society for not accepting me and for my own you know, failures and
lack of success. I know it's everybody else's fault. And so now I'm
going to just constantly sort of try to feel better about myself by spending all
my time on the internet just dissing you know, only fans, chicks or
something like that. Like right, that that all that is is a concession
too. Also the feminine society that you're criticizing, that's a feminine approach to
things, right, It's a it's an approach that says, it's a passive
aggressive I'm gonna hide by the keyboard and just diss everybody all day long when
they're in reality, it's because you are you failed, and also you're lazy.
Right, And I would even tie that mentality with um like social justice
worries, virtue signaling, and even in the orthosphere, piety signaling. These
are ways in which people can like try to achieve competency or status without actually
engaging in those things by by signaling them. So okay, I'm not very
masculine. Well then I'm gonna I'm gonna brate women and talk about how only
fans and how all these girls are horrors and stuff like this. It's a
way now I can establish my masculineing behind my little handle online. And you
know, I think this is a real problem. It's the scapegoating, whether
it's whatever it is. If you're if you're scapegoating though, they ultimate masculine
thing to do. It's just as Jocko. Willing said, take more responsibility,
radical responsibility. Everything's your fault in your life, so now deal with
it. And that's going to get you to put your life in order.
Even if everything in your life is not your fault one. At a certain
point you have to come to the realization that nothing out there is going to
ultimately I'm not talking about in the religious selvific sense. I'm just talking about
in your own personal improvement. Right nothing out there is going to get you
the thing that you're after, or that you want or that you need.
Right, well, I want to I want a better job, I want
this, I want that is if you bitching complaint, is it going to
come to you. No, it's going to take you changing your situation.
It's just like the people. It's like fat acceptance is the best example of
this, because it's like, you can't change society to say, oh no,
this way of living is actually healthy. No, no, it's objectively
not healthy. And so to engage in a political crusade to try to get
society to change its standards so that you can be unhealthy and then delude yourself
that you're still healthy, that's actually a form of victims status, which actually
suggests here's the crazy part, which is paper blew me away. I mean,
I think we kind of sensed this, but when I want you to
finish your list there, but when we get to this paper. What's amazing
about the paper that we're talking about tonight. The signally virtuous victimhood as indicators
of dark Triad personality is that most of the time people think, oh,
the dark Triad, that's the manosphere player pickup artists who are using their dark
dark Triad skills to get women in to manipulate. Actually, now that can't
happen. But actually, the typical manifestation of the dark Triad is consistently seeing
the paper argues in people who do not just virtue signaling, but virtuous victimhood
virtue signal, that's a whole other layer to where, yeah, to where
the individuals who are not just virtue but actually virtus sigling their victim status,
they most often exemplify and consistently exemplify the dark triad traits of machiavellianism, narcissism,
and psychopathy, the very opposite of what is actually the case, right,
because they're always saying, oh, you know, I'm I'm a good
person, I'm the victim. I'm oppressed. Think about the video that we've
talked about a few a few times in the past few days, which is
where the Pearl was arguing with the women on the Vice clip. Brittany Sellner
did a video on that clip as well, and at a certain point when
Pearl says something, the portly feminist woman says, I don't have to Basically,
I don't have to listen to you because you're pretty privileged. I didn't.
I didn't get pretty as a privilege growing up, and so that makes
me a victim status and my opinions are now better. I'm a more moral
person than you because you're privilege, so immediately flipping it into oppressed or oppressed
dynamic, I guarantee you the persons saying that has Machiavellian narcissistic, psycho psychopathic
traits, like we see with most of these feminists and these activists right the
leftist activists right there, they're they're the ones that have the actual Marchiavelian narcissistic
psychopathy traits. And the more they are narcissistic, Machiavelian and psychopathic, the
more they signal their virtuous victims status. Right. In related to that,
you know, orderliness and cleanliness are associated with godliness, virtue, and as
boundaries dissolve, men become more feminine, society becomes more chaotic. And if
you listen to these people say, they're like, oh, well, men,
men know they want to erect boundaries because it has to do with their
ego, their ego, their ego. And it's like, well, you
start looking at society and maybe the fact we're dissolving boundaries and men are less
ego focused to some degree. Now, it can obviously go off the deep
end for sure, but it's caused more mental instability. You look at women
and men and their mental health is all over the place. And I would
say if society was more ordered and less chaotic, we had more structure and
more patriarchy, mental health would go down because people don't know how to deal
with the chaos that they're seeing everywhere. And you know, so when you're
talking about the dark triad, to me, that is going to continue to
rise as masculinity continues to be you know, demonized. Yeah you have the
dread pill. Yeah, I get through all five and then I'll do some
more of this paper. Go ahead, okay. Um. Another thing that
they really talk about is again the uh, the dual mating hypothesis, which
gets into the hypergamy, so short term physical fitness, sexual attractions, long
term and the investment of resources. One of the things that you'll hear if
you listen to like the Fresh and Fit podcast, which really is just Myron
the head guy there on Fresh and Fit. All he does is regurgitate Rollo
Tamassi. That's all he does. He brings in basically sex workers and sugar
babies in Miami. They come on his podcast and they just say the same
thing every night. They just get women that are totally and you know,
obsessed with themselves and you know, usually horrors that are engaged in some type
of sex work. And then they're like, show J you're not going to
get the high value man because look at your body count, how many people
you slept with and X y Z. And they always say men love idealistically
and women love opportunistically, meaning men have this idea that they're gonna lock down
a woman and she's gonna be true to them for their life and they don't
have to worry about it and they can just focus on their stuff, where
women are constantly gaining hypergamus look for the best opportunity to be with the best
mate and and so that's another part of this rhetoric again just defining the worldview
of the red pill. And then it gets to the sexual marketplace value.
What is sexual marketplace value? And so this gets into how what is a
high value man? And so for Kevin Samuels as a man that had a
career that made six figures, that was somewhat in good shape. Other people
won't put such strict categories, like Rollo won't define it as any particular thing,
but usually the red pill is always describing a high value man in regards
to what you'll hear some people say, oh, it has to do with
money, muscles, and game. So your money, your fitness, and
then basically your charisma, your ability to socialize, your ability to lure people
into your sort of social web. And so the sexual marketplace value then is
a man as he gets older. The idea is that a man has very
low sexual marketplace value in his early twenties because he hasn't defined himself again through
the discipline in the boundary erection, so he has to then work, work,
work, and then basically they'll say a man in his thirties to forties
is the prime of a man's life. And he then if he does,
if he works well and works to the best visibility, he'll be successful somewhere
around let's say thirty three to thirty five, and then he can look back
and he can get a high sexual market value woman, which is going to
be younger between eight, you know, somewhere between eighteen and twenty four.
There they'll talk about low body counts, pretty feminine, submissive, and willing
to fit into your frame, which we can get into frame. And I
actually really support the conversation on frame because that's one of the problems even with
our Orthodox brothers, is really having your life together that a woman can come
and help you do what you do. If you don't know what you're doing,
how can you have an eve? Eve is there to help you.
But you have to then have a frame, as I like to use the
metaphor, you have to have a boat. That is, you have to
be you have to set sail, you have to be on your way to
a destination that then she can come and help you. So um, they
talk a lot about frame, sexual marketplace value. I want to let me
interject something at this point, which is that when you're talking about, you
know, the guys in our sphere, this paper is so instructive. Everybody
needs to read this paper because as I was reading it and thinking about,
you know, the leftists and the people in the media that constantly signal their
victims status as a way to increase social status. The more I thought about
it, the more I realized, Hey, actually, this is a big
part of what is a problem in the religious sphere as well. It's not
just a matter of people that are politically signaling their leftism victims status to acquire
social status. So many people in the religious sphere are prone to doing the
exact same thing where they want to signify their spiritual one upping yep on and
nitpicking, and the irony is that the critique would apply to them. That
in most cases, I would venture that the people who are actually doing this
constantly signaling their victim status and their virtue status. They're doing this, as
the paper says, as a form of resource extraction. And by resource the
paper doesn't just mean money. It might mean money, it's saying time attention.
Uh, you know, all of these things can be a form of
resource extraction through not just being a virtue signaler but a victim status. Just
think of, for example, the way every time Michael Lofton makes a video,
it's always that he's a victim. For example, a time somebody criticizes
him, it's slander. You've attacked him and you need to repent. And
then he talks about how virtuous and how great he is. That's the that's
one percent. You'll notice. And this if you if you follow this paper
and you pay attention to the way so many of the piety signalers which drive
me nuts in the Orthodox sphere because as well as evangelical sphere, Romancalic sphere,
it doesn't matter. All that is a is a manifestation of macavellian as
a narcissism and psychopathy to get you to manipulate. It's a manipulation tactic as
the paper shows, to acquire social status and resource transfer. Exactly Amen.
And again we see it in all sphere. That's why I said that matter.
If you're a virtue signaler, you're a social justice warrior, you're a
piety signer in the orthosphere, or you're a feminist victim of the world or
your manosphere guy, and your whole angle is being a victim of the world
and how people need to you know, really, you know, relate to
you and care for you because you're so disenfranchised by the ginal centric order all
this stuff. This is not a masculine approach at all, exactly no.
And that's where as you as well, I know, even within the religious
sphere, men use piety to as you said, acquire social status as opposed
to using skill. Well, it's not even real piety. It's feigned Internet
pie. Yeah, it's not even real. And it's always public piety,
which is the worst form of piety, which is what Jesus says, don't
do right, go into your prayer room and pray in your corner. Jesus
says, don't pray on the streets like the Pharisees, showing everybody how pious
you or that's the worst. And he said, God doesn't listen to that,
so it's a waste of time. As performative, you have your reward,
he says. And if you read this paper, you'll notice that.
As the paper says, the thesis is, I'll read this real briefly,
it says, we investigate in this paper the consequences and predictors of emitting signals
and victims status and virtue. In our first three studies, we show that
virtuous victims signal can facilitate non reciprocal resource transfer from others to the signal or
in other words, the motivation is, if I can demonstrate not just that
I'm a victim, but that I'm a virtuous victim, I'm able to extract
much more out of you, whether that's time, attention, social media attention
and empathy, empathy or money. It might be all of those. The
paper goes on to say, we develop and validate victims signaling scale, and
we combine that with an established measure of virtue signaling to operationalize the virtuous victim
construct. We show the individuals that have dark triad traits of macabellianism, narcissism,
and psychopathy more frequently will signal their virtuous victimhood status. And we control
for both demographic and socio economic variables in the paper. So the last point
here, it says, throughout the site, we show that this is common
in Western societies because the West, through its democratic structure, it argues later
in the paper, has actually elevated victims status to be its own culture,
the culture of victimhood, and so perceptive and machiavellian people understand that being a
victim is actually a way to accrue social status. In the West, that's
crucial and that's part of that gynocentric society. Ye, everybody can accrue social
status. Oh, I'm a victim of a victim. I'm appressed. I'm
appressed. Here's what it says at the end, it says the rest of
these studies point out that our thesis is correct that the frequency of emitting virtuous
victim signals predicts a person's willingness to engage in and endorse ethically questionable behaviors such
as trying to earn a bonus or the intention of purchasing counterfeit products. These
are some of the papers that are some of the tests that they run.
Later on the paper, they give people these different scenarios to see how they
would work, and it says that the result then is that in most cases,
those who were willing to constantly signal signal their victims status were also the
ones that were the most unethical. Is the point? Yeah, I definitely
believe that. I definitely believe that. In regards to again just wrapping up
here the red pill, you know, one of the things that I would
definitely agree with them is that men and women went different things. And so
part of the stuff that Kevin Samuel's exposed before he passed away was you talk
to these women, maybe she's okay, she's halfway attractive, she hop fall
and he would do zoom things and he would just allow these women to come
in and he would and that's why people would it was so popular people watch
because he would just blow them out and almost humiliate them. And so he's
like, okay, so how old are you? Oh, I'm thirty three.
Okay, what are you looking for? Oh, I would need a
I ain't need a man who makes six figures. He's six foot. He
needs to be fit with the six pack and have a nice job. Okay.
How tall are you? Oh, I'm five foot. How much do
you weigh? One fifty one sixty? Okay, well you're a little big.
How big your address size? Oh, I'm a I'm a ten or
something. And he's like, man, you don't even qualify for that.
And she's like, well, I make I make eighty thousand dollars. I
have a job. In the point is, men don't give a damn how
much a woman makes because that's not our money. And so if I'm getting
in a relationship with a woman, it doesn't matter how much money she makes,
how driven she is with her career, all these attributes that we would
consider masculine, that is not what would consider a high value man would be
looking for in regards to a woman. And so he really put these women
on blast, which became really popular online. So women and men are looking
for two totally different things, and unfortunately, modern women think that men are
looking for the same things that they're looking for exactly. So then when they
market themselves on the sexual marketplace, they're like talking about the car they drive
and how much money they have and how successful they are, and they're like
interconnection there, the circles they're connected to inside. I don't I don't care
about you being a CEO. I'm not interested in. That doesn't impress me
at one bit exactly. And so what a man would be whose high value
be looking for is a woman who's pure, a woman who's honest, a
woman who's young and pretty, a woman who won to be a mother,
a woman who's submissive to his frame. So a frame is again my life,
my worldview, what I'm doing, and that a woman needs to accommodate
herself to you. And that's where even my orthodox brothers, guys, do
not scent for a woman. Do not be moving or changing your opinion or
changing things about yourself because you want the attention of a woman that is you
fitting to her frame. And I would say even this gnocentrism, in these
dark triad traits, these are men actually fitting into a female gynocentric frame.
Well, I wanted to make a point of that. Yeah, So the
paper actually notes that the only way that this could have become a way to
increase your social status in the West, is if the West had already adopted
a radical presupposition of egalitarianism, that everybody is equal, everybody's the same,
everybody deserves and has some claim on everything coming equally right, which is essentially
just kind of fundamental weird kind of mar Xism of some kinds, some kind
of weird kind of socialism, which is just simply says, who I mean,
nature itself doesn't fit everyone equally. Biology doesn't fit everyone equally. Why
would we think that therefore everything should come in some sort of equalitarian doling out
of everything being fair. That's again a much more of a a feminine approach
to things right right, based deals with the kids that are upset. Yeah,
not based on not not the masculine approach to what's the objective reality and
the facts of the matter, right, which are that no nature fits certain
people better than others for certain tasks. And by the way, that we
can still have an equality in some sense in another sense and be unequal in
other senses. So that there's another presupposition that goes on with this, which
is that, oh all everything must be one type of thing. So if
we're equal, you must be always equal in every single sense. Well,
we might be equal in the sense of all posit us in human nature,
but how we exist and have that nature doesn't necessarily have to be the same
or equal either. I can men can have different roles from women and still
have the same nature, right, And that's where religious worldview is that we
complement each other. So the idea that a woman's better with children, the
woman is more like you know, she should stay home, be a stay
at home mother, take care of the house. That's you know, that's
because we're we have different natures. Men are hunters, gatherers. We we
go out and we're more factual. We're world oriented. We're trying to do
something, build something, find something, and so you know, this is
just basic human nature that again, the world we live in now has totally
inverted everything. And so the women literally market themselves sexually as men, and
then the men, you know, they're becoming more like women. Well that's
part of that equalitarian push. And the paper even notes that. And this
is not it's not trying to take a stance, it's trying to look at
the data. But the paper even notes that this whole culture has given rise
to the idea of the oppression Olympics. So now whoever can be and demonstrate
the most victim of status is actually at the top of the goblin totem pole.
And so that's what I was saying the other night. It was Okay,
so now the lesbian Islamic Jeffrey Dahmer is at the top of the totem
pole because he's the most fringe character. But I mean, so you see
what I'm saying, Like, the logic of that is that I'm the most
oppressed because I'm the most fringe. There's the fewest of me. I'm serious,
right, yeah, no, I know. So the inversion totem pole,
then that allows the worst moral people to then say I am at the
top of the totem pole of social status because I'm the most oppressed because society
doesn't accept that I want to eat people and I'm a you know, a
lesbian Islamic cannibal Jeffrey Dahmer person. Right, well, bro, I just
saw that. What was it was the ACLU, I retweeted on Twitter.
They just posted a thing like yesterday defending because a man is in prison who
is trying to transition to a woman in the prison, wasn't letting him transition
and recognize his pronouns. His crime was that he is a pedophile, necrophiliac
who viciously stabbed a fourteen year old girl years ago then raped her dead body.
I watch out, don't get my stream taken down. Um but um
anyways, uh, he he engaged in all this stuff and it was totally
put to the side, and this particular organization put out a public notification,
uh, talking about how he was oppressed. He was oppressed by The paper
goes on to say that there are there's a section of the population that is
cunning enough to realize that you can excuse any of your actions if you can
figure out a way to fit into a victim status niche of society. And
it actually points out that for a lot of the people engaged in the virtue
victims victimhood virtue signaling that they reasoned that it was that their actions were excused
when they were being deceptive and when they were engaging in the dark triad traits
because they were victims. You see. So because I'm a victim, I'm
not subject to the normal ethical constraints and I'm complaining about other people, but
I'm a victim, so it excuse, which is that narcissism of the triad
right where I'm not bound by the rules that I'm applying to everyone else and
I'm my evil is excused because I'm a victim, you see. And it
goes on to say that that section of the population that is cunning enough to
figure that out. By the way, this also applies to think about how
FEDS work. Right, feds that infiltrate right they will do, they will
do and operate the exact same way like cointelpro and this kind of stuff.
It notes that dark personalities can flourish as social parasites who intentionally attempt to extract
the resources of their environments without providing any benefit. Similarly, Jones, one
of the researchers, theorized that predatory social parasites can use a variety of mimicry
and deception strategies to integrate themselves into different communities so that they can extract the
resources of those communities, all at once or over time. The great example
of this is, says, are con men who infiltrate themselves into societies to
do so so basically saying that the victim signalers are basically like con men,
right, that makes total sense to me. Just to wrap up the red
pill here, just trying to finish up by talking about the sexual marketplace values.
So therefore, high value men are men that work on themselves, that
attain some type of social status, success, monetary wealth, and physical fitness
in their thirties, and they're going to have the most leverage to then look
at the highest value women on the sexual marketplace value, which are going to
be young, low body counts, pretty feminine, submissive, and all these
sorts of things. And so the women they hit what Rollo Tamasi calls the
epiphany phase, which is usually around twenty eight twenty nine, moving into their
thirties, where they look, oh, man, I've had hot girls summers
since I was eighteen and got out of high school. And I'm looking around
and now all my friends have babies, they're all married. I want to
get married too. And so the epiphany phase he talks about is where these
girls become religious or they become self conscious and they start presenting themselves in different
ways, which we've seen with only fans girls that are already born again Christians
and all this type of stuff. So the sexual marketplace. I'm only highlighting
that because part of the red Pill is understanding this dynamic how men attain social
value, how women attain social value, how women are born with it,
how men have to achieve it, have to attain it, and then how
these women then who lose their value because they go through their twenties and maybe
they're very promiscuous, they're doing the clubs every night, they're doing you know,
multiple relationships. Now they come to a state where they've become self conscious
of that fact. They're realizing, man, I need to lock down a
man, and those high value men don't want those women. So that creates
this whole problem which now we're seeing in society right now, which we're seeing
like the late twenty thirty year old woman who can't get married one because the
average man. This is another thing tied to this is that you look at
the sexual like hierarchy, the average man is totally disenfranchised. Well, the
average woman that he would be with, say two hundred years ago, they'd
be married and have a family. She's probably a feminist. She probably has
purple hair like you're talking about, like the ugly witches, right, Well,
weren't they supposed to marry Like the guys that are on that level too,
Historically they would have been together, but they're not gonna get married,
they're not going to have children. So then these guys who maybe they still
want to get married, but now they can't. And that's part of this
whole migtow black black pill section of men is that they're in a place where
they really can't see themselves getting out of it, and so men then have
no incentive to marry. This is my my wrapping up the red pill is
that men have no incentive to marry because of the divorce, because the ginnocentrism,
because of YadA, YadA, YadA, And so the best thing to
do is spend plates or have maybe more of a domestic relationship with a girl,
or if you really want to, or they'll even give the caveat if
you're religious, then you can go get married. So that's generally speaking,
a good outline of the world view what the red pill is and what they're
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there. So getting back to the red pill issues, one last thing I
would say about this paper to sum up, was just that the individuals who
were engaged in a lot of virtuous victimhood signaling were also very quick to make
use of any crises, and so the paper actually notes that they were often
never let a good crisis go to waste because this allowed them, as it
says at the end of the paper, to utilize a tactic. And so
it is specifically a known tactic amongst these people. Whether they have this consciously
in their mind is a tactic, or whether just sort of innately doing this
as a sort of innate scam that they know about without thinking about it second
nature. I don't know, but he says that basically it's the paper says
it's a resource extraction scam for social influencing and to gain social status. That's
the key crux of all of this. And how relevant is that to social
media? So if it's a tool for social influence that is victimhood status,
you better believe it's going to be used on social media. And we see
it everywhere. And once you read this paper and once you're aware of this
tactic, this scam, you're gonna notice it all in all everywhere. You're
gonna notice that the people that are claiming victimhoods status, that are engaged in
Marcavillian techniques and strategies, psychopathy, narcissism, that triad is usually amongst usually
what characterizes the people that are mostly signifying their virtuous victimhood status. Yeah,
yeah, I totally agree with that. And Ze, Yeah, it's all
over the place at this point our society, no matter what sphere you're in,
Really do you want to get into? Where do you want to go
next? Criticisms, general criticisms. I know you've had a sort of a
plan for it. I would say, let's begin with, like, for
those listening, what is masculinity? How would we as traditional Christians define what
masculinity is? And maybe we can then go riff off like what exactly the
mantosphere is talking about? Yeah, I mean this is kind of what I
was thinking earlier about a philosophy of these things. Right, So it's not
like there's some self evident idea of what it is to be high value,
to what it is to be high status, I mean in relation to what
says who? I mean, what is that? Right? And so the
same thing goes with what it is to be feminine and what it is to
be masculine. They cannot be social constructs. They have to be actually existing
qualities or metaphysical realities. And I think that if we're going to need a
worldviewer system that actually posits that, And so I would say, first and
foremost, that's where we got to start. Yeah, we gotta have something
that grounds the notion of masculinity beyond just traits. So being buff okay,
yeah, that's a masculine trait, but is that the essence of ualinity?
Attaining wealth? Okay? Yeah, that's a thing that a man can do,
and it can be a positive thing. It's not inherently bad to have
money or to have wealth. If you're going to be in the world and
have a family, you got to do that. I mean, even even
monks ask for money and they gain wealth. Okay, So it's not like
there's some realm where oh well, we don't do that because we're good virus
Lukell virtuous. So I am as a Christian, I don't believe in money.
Yeah, right, Like Paul says, the labor is worthy, is
right. Even the apostles ask for money. This is ridiculous. So God
is not So God is the author of money? Right? Do people not
realize that? We realize there's a lot of principles in the Bible to deal
with money, to deal with fair weights and balances and proverbs. That's fair
transaction and value. Okay, that's not inherently anti religious or inherently worldly.
Now, love of money is an idol and is evil, but money itself
is not bad, is not evil. So if it was, then there
wouldn't be the tithes. This is so obvious. Right, So look,
money and attaining a wealth cannot be the essence of masculinity. So these are
traits that would accompany or are part of masculinity. But there's got to be
something more than any of these traits that can also be to a degree had
amongst females. Right. For example, females can be good in battle.
I'm not saying that's what they should do, but they could be. There
are really buff women on Instagram, which I find to be really gross and
weird. But they can be strong. So is that what character? So
are they there for men because they're strong? Now, there's got to be
more than certain traits that we find that accompany men. Right, There's something
more spiritual, something more philosophical, It's more theological ultimately, and I think
ultimately goes back to these ideas being grounded in the doctrine of creation. Man
being created as Adam and Eve. Right, Yeah, I couldn't agree more.
Being made in the image of God. First of all, it's what
gives us unique ontology as mankind. And so this evolutionary worldview doesn't really privilege
they of men and women. So and I always say, I use a
metaphor that men are the go ahead. Yeah. One point on that,
which is that a lot of the red pill people, for example, the
manistry of people. They will say women attained a cunning nature because they were
the weaker sex to survive, and which, okay, I don't have a
problem saying that that's true. Okay, So so when women were you know,
in ancient medieval times or whatever maybe or the think of the Middle Eastern
world, when women were like property and they a conquering tribe might take over
another tribe. And now if you're a woman to survive, you're gonna have
to rely on your cunning and not your physical strength and prowess. Right,
Okay, maybe that's that's true. But if that's an evolutionary survival trait and
the feminists are engaging in using cunning and dark triad traits, as the paper
notes, then why do you have a problem with it? Why is it
bad? Yeah, it seems like that's what nature is as execued from them.
Yeah, they they will, they have no answer for it. And
that's where ultimately, and we'll get back to it. Is like I would
love to ask somebody, after going through and highlighting like all the ills and
all the misfortunes against men, this guyo centric worldviews, say well, why
do you think that is. Do you think this is just so happens because
they'll get into like Rollo's talked about twenty first century thinking verse twentieth century thinking.
And so with somebody when he tweeted that vasectomy tweet, they said,
well, that's a great way for your for your lineage to stop. And
he said, oh, focused on lineage, that's so twentieth century thinking.
And I'm thinking, no, bro, That's like what a man thinks about
is I want to have sons. I'm the last male of my family line
and that goes generations just so have I'm the last one and from my dad's
line, and so I want to have sons. I would like to have
multiple sons so that my name and my genes continue on. That's that's like
a set, actual innate drive for men. Men want their lineage to go
on. But anyways, what I was gonna say is I always use this
metaphor on my stream that men are the castle walls and women or children are
the jewels. And so men being strong in their values become erected boundary makers
and they prevent things from taking and you know, and let's say pillaging the
jewels the women and the children. We look at our society because we're so
weak, who are the ones that are most most affected by this boundary dissolution
process in our society? And I would say it's the women and the children,
because you look at who's taken over female sports, who's taken over female
locker rooms? Who is you know, focused on, you know, a
variant forms of sexuality that are involving miners, even when they call themselves maps,
you know, as I'm sure you're talking about. I want to avoid
any any hot words here, but what a man is, what mask ulinity
is, I would say, are actually tied to things that are non physical.
So the way that the manus who are often describes what a man is
masculine is going to tie to material things. You can touch his body,
how much money he has, his size of his house, how beautiful his
wife is, and it's like, really, as a Christian man, what
I would think about what defines a man is really masculin is like his courage,
his honor, his skills, his self sacrifice, which again we can
see from Christ the Old A man takes responsibility for things and he puts things
on his back and he deals with them and so a man or high value
man like I would love to ask him, okay, high value man,
well what are the high values? Because yeah, well, I mean,
how are you gonna how are you gonna have values without value judgments and without
virtues? Right? Virtue ethics really is the only way out of this whole
dilemma, and the only worldview that gives an account for virtue. Ethics,
I would argue, is the one that we have. Hence why part of
the reason why we have right. So, as somebody in the chat noted
correctly, yeah, I mean the reason that a lot of the manospheres ethics
are do what thou will, just because that's why they tend towards that libertarian
ethos. And I'm not saying everything in libertarianism is wrong, but I'm saying
that if the ultimate highest principle libertarianism is this my own self interest in the
sense of my own pleasures, then there's no then that leads to a power.
Oppressed power might makes right dynamic, so that you would have you have
no reason to say then that if a feminist and the left is engaging in
these manipulative dark triad tactics to beat us, then you have no basis to
say that's wrong. They're just doing what is their power dynamic, right,
Right, So we yeah, we need a basis for virtue advice, and
so you're gonna have to have some kind of ethical frameworker system, right,
And that's where I would argue, a high value man lives up to the
highest of values, and so then then as a Christian, we can then
define what those values are, and then men trying to embody them and live
up to them characterize what a high value man and that may then lead to
material success, wealth, physical fitness, status, all this stuff. I'm
not saying that those can't be byproducts of the virtues that we would then posit
as Christians, but there's a difference which one comes first. We're focusing on
the virtues and living up to an objective standard that pre exists creation. We
would argue, then this idea that a high value man is really just attaining
wealth and social status for the utility and access to more women, well that
seems really gay. That doesn't seem like somebody who's like self sacrificing, because
as you said, this libertarian ethos within the mantosphere. Well, well,
well let's position so Rollo says, critiquing Jordan Peterson, that you shouldn't be
manning up for the sake of a woman, right, That was the whole
critique. So Peterson was saying, where it's the men's fault, time to
man up. Yeah, I got a man up buckle and and his his
his argument was man up for women, right, you've got a man up
and engage in all of these self sacrificial practices for the woman. And Rollo's
critique was, why do I have to man up for the woman in a
classical liberal worldview? Right? If Jordan Peterson's worldview is the case, there's
not. There's no there's nothing that's like impels me to have to man up
for for what? For a situation where I'm going to get screwed over?
That doesn't make any sense. So there's got to be more to it,
right than just manning up for a woman. And ironically, the player sort
of game attitude is like, well, I'm gonna do everything in my self
interest just to have pleasure. But it's like, wait a minute, you're
still oriented towards doing everything that you're doing for women. So it's like I
thought you were trying to escape that, and that's the logic of the migdol
guys who are like, no, you're still served women when you're in that
attitude, so you see, it's time to just be at insult brow and
let's just go play video games. Right. No, you're you're you nailed
it. And I would totally agree with that. And that's why living up
to these higher values and objective values, you shouldn't be becoming a high value
man to get a woman. And that's where in my speech that I did
at Montanica, the theme of the conference was seek first the Kingdom of God,
and my point was that if a man wants to become a man,
he needs to do that, and if he does that sincerely and includes his
physical fitness, it includes the idea of that his job, his career is
tied to his spirituality with God. Will seek that first, Seek the Kingdom
of God first, and then working on every aspect of your life, and
then provident God can bring the woman who's looking for that quality of man.
The problem with the orthosphere, and I apologize I'm step on some guy's toes
here, is they want women and they're not the type of men that those
women would want, and it's like, that's where you have to be a
little bit more self aware. And that's where I would totally agree with at
the Red Pill and the mantelsphere talking about male growth and yeah, let's just
be frank, here's a lot of dorks and they don't know how to talk
to women. They've never talked to women. They're terrified of walking over and
uh, you know, making initiating conversation. I mean, come on,
it sounded to stop being a dork. That's that's the creator and and and
I had dude, I am not kidding. I talked to one guy.
He was like, man, you know, there's really cute girl at my
parish and I was trying to talk to her. And I was like,
well, what are you talking about theology? Bro? Why are you going
up to girls? Like total total ignorance, total ignorance for women. Bro,
this is not women that women are definitely interested in some women. But
I'm saying, if you're going up to a girl at a parish that you
think is cute, don't be talking about the energy essence distinction. What are
you doing? Yeah, this is a total misunderstanding of what a woman is
and how she operates and how she thinks, and what a guy is and
how they operate. Right, It's it's the it's the exact flip of what
you we're saying about the career women who think that what men want is what
they are portraying through their careers. This is the flip version of that where
the nerd guy thinks that, oh, girls are gonna like me when I
show that I've read all the Church Fathers and I can actvocate the access energy
extanction, and I can talk, you know how they don't. You just
come off as a complete dork because women are not wired for that. Right,
So if you want to get a girlfriend, number one, work on
your appearance, work on your gates, the way that you walk. Don't
walk around like a spurt with something stuck up his butt, running around like
this or shuffle. These kinds of things are where you want to focus.
Like learning how to act like a normal human being, right, a person
who can have a mundane conversation. You might be a nerd who doesn't want
to do that, but if you want to be able to get around in
this world, you need to learn how to do that, how to have
normal conversations about normal stuff, right right, right, and so um,
yeah, finding objective virtues and values to aim for. That's what a man
should be aiming for. And we look at history like men were all about
honor, and so is it. That's why so many men were willing to
sign up and die on a battlefield because Okay, I'll get married at a
young age, I'll have children at a young age, and now it's time
for my honor. And so maybe I'm enlisted in the military, I go
do something or I build something, like we just have no honor as men
in the present world. And I would say this would be a critique.
I would aim at the mantle spheres. They don't talk about honor enough,
the idea of getting Yeah, it's all utility, it's all it's all commodification,
it's all consumerism. It's that's because that's because for them, it's all
tied to libertarianism and a pleasure principle and utilitarianism, which the connections are all
there, and it's like maximizing happiness is maximizing the moral calculus pleasure principle,
right, going back to Bentham and all those guys. But that's because their
whole, their whole ethos is imminentized, right, So everything that they're talking
about is eminentized because it's the materialistic idea of what exists and what tels and
orientation is. So if you don't have a transcendent Tels, then everything's gonna
be oriented to the here and the now and just the pleasure principles. So
we need virtue ethics. That's classical ethics in the sense of you can even
go to the Aristotle right, right, And if you look at Ambrose for
example, saying Ambrose, we had doctor Sean Stid when he presented his paper
a couple of years ago at the SOFIA conference. He showed how what Ambrose
does is just take the classical Greek virtues and apply them in a Christian context.
And that's essentially what David Patrick Hary's doing here. He's saying, look,
there's these principles that people like Aristotle talked about, courage and honor and
these kinds of things, and they can be they absolutely are part of our
worldview because we do have a virtue ethic, right, and that's what you
as a man should be focused on. And that's why again I was at
Montanica talking to a group of people, and I knew I was talking to
twenty se year old, thirty year old men who felt like they were again
almost consumers at the Mano's spear. But you ask them, they have no
purpose, they have no skill set. And I'm not I'm not step on
anybody's toes, are mocking anybody who feels that way of their life right now,
because that's a real problem, just based the way that our world is.
And so I would then as a as an advice, would be again,
that's why you need to pray, you need to get in touch with
God. You need to really focus on working on yourself, developing yourself,
self development so that you can figure out, Okay, I'm good at these
things, I'm not good at these things. And work, work, work
on yourself, focus on what's in your control. And then they focus too
much on what's out of their control, like the women. Yeah, you
know, whining and complaining about the things that they complaining about women, things
that you can never change or fixed. Right. This is a classic thing
of all leftists, which shows that these people actually just have a leftist mindset,
which is to whine and complain about the things that can never be altered
or changed. And you know, I'm not a Stoic, but if you've
read Marcus Aurelius's Meditations, which we've done a whole lecture on that, the
Stokes had a great point, which is that, look, why are you
going to focus on the world all the things that you can never affect or
change. You can never change what somebody's doing a million miles away. You're
never going to change everybody's mind about whatever you think about this or that.
Right, It's like it's like Marxists and this sort of idealistic perception that they
have that I can fix the world and change everybody's mind about how they think
about equality and fairness and all the stuff. No, you can't. The
stoic would say, look, fix, you can fix what's in your life
that's within your domain of something that you can fix. So focus on that,
not on problems a million miles away that you don't have any connection to,
and we'll never be able to fix. It's ridiculous, right, Like
the Great reseat, you know, things that we talk about people are so
focused and even in our orthosphere, they're so focused on things that are out
of their control. It's like, bro, look, you're you're thirty pounds
overweight man, and you're you're asking for a virgin girl. Are you serious
right now? Like, have some self awareness and work on yourself. So
that's a huge that's a great point. Yeah, the lack of self awareness
exactly right. And I remember in my twenties when I was a super nerdy
theology guy. I remember having to learn these lessons as well because it was
like, uh, you know, I was probably twenty pounds overweight. I
was drinking beer all the time, constantly drinking. I mean, I was
an alcoholic. But I'm saying, like, you know, drinking every weekend,
and you know, all the conspiracy stuff, all the problems in the
world, and it's like, well, wait a minute, what have I
done to actually change my own situation? Right, I'm whining about all this
stuff about oh the new World Order and all this kind of and that's all
true, But what's that going to just put me in a black pill situation?
Well? What am I gonna do with the black pill stage? Would
it be miserable? Right? You have to take the initiative, And that's
where I would say the real white pill. Then, although it's difficult is
that suffering is tied to being a man, and you have to that's what
we that's what we do as Christians. But you have to realize that the
only way you progress is suffering. The only way you look good in the
gym is by suffering in the gym, by exhausting your most The only way
you read all those books you read, the only way you do overviews of
Carol Quigley, is that you suffer through the discipline of going through it.
Christ is the ultimate representation of what a man is because he did he took
the most suffering. He took the sins of the world that he wasn't even
responsible for. And that's where taking responsibility taken ownership and then realizing that suffering
is not something to be avoided, or you're gonna be in your compod you're
gonna be of these libertarian ethics where again, like you talk about, these
only focus on the immediate moment, immediate pleasure, the avoidance of suffering.
If you're trying to avoid suffering, the devil already has you bro because you're
going you're you're like a You're like cattle that are just being hurted right into
the pen, you're gonna be slaughter. Well, I'm gonna be really preciser
because a lot I can already anticipate what a lot of like Migtow or men's
rights guys are gonna say. Oh, so you're telling me that my job
is to totally be self immolated on the altar of marriage and getting screwed over
in the in the marriage core, and that that's my duty as a mean.
No, No, that's not what we're saying. That's not what I'm
saying. The point is that, look, life is going to bring suffering,
so it's going to be part of life. I'm not saying you need
to try to in some weird satos maskets take on ridiculous, absurd levels of
suffering. That's weird and crazy. But rather the attitude of a lot of
the manosphere and the red pill people is, oh, I'm going to live
for pleasure and thus avoid all suffering and just live for my you know,
my my moral calculus pleasure points. And that's actually a feminine uh, that's
a form of I'm going to have my own little security blanket of my feelies
and all this kind of stuff. That's a that's a that's a gnocentric way
to live right exactly. And I would say even even I would say,
you know, Justin Waller has some good things that to say about men's issues
right now, but him saying that I'm not I'm not wired that way that
I would definitely if I was married and had kids, I'd still have to
have multiple girlfriends. Um, that's feminine. That's a lack of if even
if you have that temptation again as a Christian and he calls himself a Cristian
identifies as a Christian that dying to the world is part of that suffering.
So even if you have those temptations for all those other women, not acting
on them is actually part of your self ific journey. That's that's part of
your again being a man and like defining more boundaries. Uh. So that's
where my again we were looking at criticisms. My first criticism is like,
what exactly is the role of masculinity and men? And for them, men
are just supposed to make money, gain status, and then get with the
best woman you can and then it's just it's just here, it's just headenism.
It's just like, how is that a better choice than any of the
other options of what we were. So there's all of this rucus and unwhining
about the status of things, and then the answer is what just just pleasure?
Point? This is like the bro now the mice that are pushing the
little things that gives them the Yeah, the cocaine. Yeah yeah, that's
exactly what they are. And that's why the grift is so profitable because the
men just want more of the cocaine. They just want more of the pleasure.
Um, So what is the ultimate point of becoming high value for the
manosphere? And this is generally speaking on many the people I've listening to,
it's so that you can have autonomy and choose the woman that you want and
have more access to women. And so the discipline that they talk about is
always fitness, money, career. You focus on all those things and you
get though, you get all those game attributes elevated. Now you can focus
and you can just pick pick the girl you want. And it's like,
well, then the next question is what is the role that men play in
society? Is it just to get with women, I mean, because that
seems pretty futile. I would say it's to build structures, it's to build
society. It's to contribute to something that is beyond on who I am.
My goal right now is to build something, get married, have children that
that last longer than I do. That's the point of a man. And
the lack of any focus on children and marriage, I think is really an
undermining of what men should be doing. And I would then agree with them
that, well, why would I get married if you know, if my
girl she's just gonna get unhappy and she's gonna divorce me and I'm gonna lose
half. I would agree That's why you have to be religious. That's why
the woman that I'm marrying believes in God so much that she will do exactly
what I say. Well, one thing I'll say where I will give one
point to the Tates as opposed to Rollo, is that Rollo will say that
he doesn't believe in conspiracies and that none of this really relates to like a
conspiratorial thing going on, whereas at least I know Tristan and I talked about
it. But um, there is a push on the part of elites to
promote the idea that everything is the equalitarian, that men are bad, and
that we shouldn't have families. And here's the ironic part of that, which
is that a lot of these red pill people actually serve to help destroy the
family. And if they're helping to destroy the family, then that's fitting into
this overall elitist narrative. But I mean, because the women hate the feminist
I should say, hate the nuclear family. So one of the biggest enemies
for the feminist, egalitarian, leftist, communal commune, whatever you want to
frame it as, is to do away with the with the nuclear family.
Why because it's paternal and it's patriarchal, and it's like, if we're then
promoting masculinity, we should promote men to become the best men that they can
be, to get the best women that they can have, so that those
women will submit and have the biggest and best families they can have. That
would, to me would seem like the general sphere, but it stopped short
of that last part of legacy of children. And I would say it's because
they have no transcendent value, they have no God relationship under yeah, everything
is imminentized. That's why it's always utilitarianism. And so like, I'm getting
married and maybe they'd call me a cuck or whatever for doing it. But
it's like, well, I'm thinking a vow with a woman that we're gonna
be together into eternity, and we're very serious about that, and we both
believe that, and there's no there's no idea of divorce. We're gonna and
so, but that's only because of the the prerequisite values of the religious worldview
that we both adopted. And so if you want to be a man and
you want to get that young girl, it's like you better be religious.
And that's where again I'm not promoting Islam, but I can see then the
rational mind of these young men. Oh well, I'll just become Muslim then,
because the reason why that woman will submit to you is because she's Muslim
and she believes in that worldview. If she was some West Western only fans
girl, like, why would she submit to you? If if women are
hypergamus as they say, and they're only interested in you're you're you know,
how you look, and then your money and your status, and they're always
going to be opportunistic and get the next one, well then why would you
even be with a secular woman? That makes zero sense? And yet they're
still advocating for how to pick you know, pua pick up artists and how
to get secular girls and take them back and sleep with them. It's like,
that doesn't make any sense to me. It's like you guys are creating
the same thing that you're fighting. It doesn't make any sense. Yeah,
it's just the inverse of the feminist. Right. So we're coming up on
two hours and we want to get to the super chat. So if you
want to go ahead, and if you want to finish up your list of
crea Yeah, so I had what are men willing to die for? That?
That's something I asked uber Boyo, one of my buddies comes on.
He's a Nietzschean. We've got into it multiple times. He's a relativist and
I'm like, bro, like what do you talk about masculinity? And like
the uberman and the Superman, but like, what are you willing to die
for? And he thought about it. It's kind of like himself and his
family. Okay, I can give you that, but it's like a man
has to have something to die. That's reason, you know, people would
go to war because they had pride in their family, they had pride in
their nation, they had pride in their in their mother tongues and all this
different stuff. So for me, I have the patriarchy to die for,
I have orthodoxy, I have a family, and then I'm going to create
my own family, and I'm going to put the owners on taking care of
my parents. For example, you know my mother's not in the in the
best health. Well, I'm not letting her go to a nursing home.
I'm going to put that on my shoulders and I'm going to take care of
her until she passes away in my own possession. That's that's a sense of
responsibility. And so ask him in like, what are you willing to die
for? Is a huge thing on if you're living just for yourself or you
have a larger purpose. And then hold on, hold on to the people
that maybe you guys just joined, people like Hanzo that are complaining in the
chat. So we've already given all of the concessions to the areas that we
agree. So yeah, if if red pill is helping nerdy dudes figure out
how to go and I have a conversation with a woman, absolutely agree with
that. Yeah, that's a good thing. I'm We're not just lodging complaints.
So you miss the first half of our talk where yeah, we agreed
with actually probably over half of what the Man of Spirit talks about, Like
I have the agreements here. The world is against men and privileged women.
Modern secular relationships are terrible and falling apart. Women on social media are out
of control and narcissistic. Men need to improve beta sims. Men need to
become more masculine, high value pure women. And then the average women overvalues
themselves. That's another fact is that the average women, due to social media,
because they can get so they can garner so much attention through photos,
the average looking girl thinks she's a dime piece, right, which totally Then
again, if you're the average man, you're you're like, you're totally disenfranchised
and even engaging and getting out a woman that's probably right at your level,
like you guys technically probably should be together. But because of the secular frame
of the social media and everything, these girls totally overvalue themselves. So we
were already talking about this earlier that Neil Strauss's book on How To You Know,
And I think that there was a lot of nerdy dudes at that time.
I'm trying to remember what um when did he write this? This came
out and I think the two thousands, right, and this I mean and
this came out around the time of like, you know, Mystery and when
Mystery had that TV show on e or whatever. I still don't see a
date. So anyway, I think it was a two thousands, right,
So we already went through it. For those in the chat maybe who just
jumped in like it was two thousand and five is when this came five or
six, But we already went through all of the positives of Okay, so
learning social dynamics, right, there's a lot of nerdy dudes who don't know
anything about social dynamics, never walked up and talked to a girl and never
had a conversation. And actually the Internet and everybody being adamized and living on
the Internet has made this even worse to where in person people who don't know
how to have normal conversation. Bro. Even the priest at Montanica, like
my speech at Montanica was on the manosphere and young men, and then I
talked to Bishop Maxim again multiple priests there, and they're like, yeah,
you know, we we get these young guys all the time that are just
you know, and they said, well, what you know, what can
we do? And I said, what would be good is if Orthodoxy and
just priests because we have a patriarchy, if they just became more aware of
the situation that young men are facing, and there's just a conversation. Not
the church has to do anything. They don't need to be an initiative,
they don't need to do it's just that if the priest understood the source of
social context, that when a young kid comes into the church and he is
feeling the brunt of everything we're talking about, the priest says, oh,
yeah, I know what you're talking about. I know exactly what's going on,
and then he can teach him because, like you said, this awkwardness,
the inability to talk to women, you know, being totally backward,
lack of self awareness, the way they addressed they they look it's like a
man has to teach you this. Your mother is going to tell you you're
cute, has to give you a Part of this is a gen generation or
two raised by single moms, so they never had a dad in the household,
like exposing them to the realities of the world and like saying, look,
do you look like a nerd man, came here, serious, why
are you walking like a stick up your butt? You look weird, dude,
that's disgusting. Came here, Let's let's fix you. Right. That's
that's the thing is like the today's society thinks of that as shaming, and
no, no, no, it's shaming for the purpose of you bettering yourself.
You see, right, there's a level to where shaming is necessary exactly.
That's why bowling and hazing. Again, I'm too, not to the
extreme, but it's because we men, if you played sports, if you've
done anything, we naturally sort ourselves out on a hierarchy of competency. And
we know that you go play sports, you know you're gonna know who's the
biggest and baddest dude pretty quickly. And if not, there's gonna be violence
to sort of sort that out and establish it. And so we bring reality
to children. And so these young boys who grow up with single mothers,
who have no male role models, they are so lost. I do one
on ones with them. They're they're really really lost. And that's what I
was telling the priests. I was like, you know, you just have
to understand what these young men are going through the Many of them have no
male role models, and you, as a priest, you don't need to
do anything. You just have to be aware so that you can fill that
role. And they can belong to a patriarch, they can belong to an
institution, they can belong to a community and then begin to find themselves.
Well, one thing I realized as I got older, which I didn't understand
when I was younger, but I understood as I got older, is that
you know, guy's men, dads, they have this added their problem solvers.
Just now. We're problem solvers naturally. So when we see a situation,
you know, we see a nerdy dude over there in the corner standing
way and he won't talk to the girls because he's scared or whatever. Like
we assess that and we see the problem the way and we think, okay,
how are we going to solve this guy's problems? He needs to know,
like you're you're a dork, you need to hear that it may hurt
a little bit, but you're not There's never going to be advancement until there's
getting over that pain that hurt. Like you talked about with lifting weights,
right, same analogy, Right, you're gonna have to go through some of
this pain. And by the way, it's not just physical there's psychological and
emotional weakness too that people need to need to get over. Right. So
a lot of people think, oh, you're mean when you debble, you're
so mean. I'm not mean. I'm actually just telling you how it is
and how it needs to be, because that's how guys are. Guys are
problems solved. It doesn't come from a place of being mean. It's that
so many people are so soy they can't take a joke or they can't take
somebody saying oh you're wrong without they're losing their mind. Their world collapses,
right and that, and then they want to complain about somebody else being in
their feefees. No, bro, you're in your feelings. You're emotional,
Like that's the problem. Like maybe you should have got punched in the face
and gotten a few fights when you're younger, maybe you'd be a little bit
tougher. These young guys have no tough That's what I'm saying. Like I
got my ass beat like at least two or three times right when I was
in high school. Now, one of those was legitimately I lost the fight,
another guy like sucker punched me. So I don't really count that one.
But I did get I still got beat up, right, So I
got multiple times beat up in high school. I won a couple of fights
too, so it wasn't like all losses. But but I wasn't some big
brawler. It's just weird to me that like that experience to me, which
was, you know, a handful of fights in high school not that big
of a deal, Like I don't. I think a lot of dudes have
never been in a fight. I agree with you. I know for a
fact. I talked to him. I was like, Bro, you ever
been in a fight? No, I've never punched anything, never, never
hit it a heavy bag, never. You know. It's like, bro,
like, no wonder, you're lost man, Like you have no toughness
like and so that's something that men give to other men. And that's where
I think the church orthodoxy just being the last vestige of the patriarchy, if
just priests, it just became common knowledge that hey, these young men coming
in, we're gonna have to be more than their spiritual father, a male
role model for them because they have none. That would be huge. Yeah.
Well, Unfortunately, a sizable section of so called Orthodoxy is just as
soy and just as it is pitiful as everything else. But go ahead,
yeah, let's get that. Yeah yeah, the priest at Montanica weren't.
But that kind of wraps it up. Um, you know. My my
ending point is that men need a patriarchy to belong to because that's how we
learn what it means to be a ban and that's why orthodox is really the
last home for a man to be a man, and for a man to
have a religion and for man to have a value. So you want to
you want to blow out feminists, well, bro, Like if you're just
some atomized young guy online and you're like debunking feminist logic and all this different
stuff, but then you don't belong to anything masculine, no patriarchy, no
tradition, no value system. Like, bro, you've already lost. Like
you can you can blow out the feminist or you can you know, critique
modern women and only fans and you can still be a traditional man with values
and religion and with tradition and with the patriarchy and with the community. And
so my last point was that boundaries are the new frontier. This is something
that Father Russell and Montanica was talking about, is that, you know,
men have always looked for the frontier. That's what the battle was, you
know, the battle front exploring America. You know, if you've driven across
America, like it's amazing to think that that ancestors, especially if you're a
Native American or native of America, like they went all the way to the
Pacific Ocean before cars bro Like they went across the rocky mountains, like the
desire for the frontier. And you look at them the men today, it's
like, what the hell you guys couldn't have done any of that. And
so the new frontier, if you really want to find the leading edge of
the masculine battle, it's the boundaries. It's the virtue, it's the honor,
it's the glory, it's all the truth. Defending objective truth is like
a radical thing right now. I mean, it's just finding these boundaries in
defending them, not taking one step back. And that's where the Church gives
you a perimeter. Like you were looking for a fight, the Church gives
you a perimeter that we as men can put our heels on it and face
out against the world and take no step back. We don't compromise our values.
We don't allow feminism, we don't allow degeneracy. None of this stuff
is allowed to enter. And that's on us, and that gives us a
purpose, and that gives us a front line to fight against. And that's
kind of yeah, kind of sums up what I'm reading speaking of that,
there's gonna be a big trag cat barbecue in Atlanta that I'm gonna be going
to hopefully this summer. And I'm not joking about We're all gonna be boxing,
so I applaud the track. I'm probably gonna get my ass beat.
I don't care. I'm gonna go box a bunch of trag cats and I'm
gonna get a few Imagine, I'm gonna get a few licks in even even
if I got my ass beat, I don't care. I'm gonna I'm gonna
get a few licks in on the track cats. It's it's my buddies though,
it's I have friends that are track cats are like, dude, you
gotta come this year. We want you to come box Revenge Gigantic barbecue on
hundred fifty people are coming. I'm yeah, I'm there. I'm gonna box
Alle hundred fifty l track cats. Not really, but I'm box But let's
get to the let's get to the super chats. Um. I'm not joking
about though. I'm really am people film it celebrity ortho versus Catholic boxing match.
Dude, I want to actually, I want to fight somebody in the
Creator clash. I really do like I would love to. I don't even
care if I get beat up. I want to do it, like it
doesn't matter to me. It's to me it just sounds fun. It sounds
like a blast, right, it sounds like a blast. But it's got
to be somebody in my weight category for sure. So somebody was like,
you can fight a bar I don't think it borrows in my waight category.
I don't know. I don't know if it bars in anybody's way category.
But I mean, if we can find somebody, I don't know, if
we can find up dig up butter Bean and see if he's able to fight.
But yeah, if he can fight a barrow. But um, by
the way, I'm not some kind of badass fighter. Dude. Again,
I'm probably gonna get my ass beat but it just sounds fun to me.
I don't get That's that's how guys are. Guys. You're like, yeah,
guy, I'll go get beat up. I don't care. But the
fact you see that's like a masculine spirit though, even whether you win or
not, just to go to the fight. You're willing to go to the
fight. Like that's dude, you talk to him. Those of these young
men, they they run away from a fight. And I don't mean just
a physical fight. I mean the state of the world. I mean I
equated this with people like, oh my gosh, look at the look at
the US. I'm fleeing. I'm going to I'm you know, name a
country, like, bro, where are you going? Like, as father
Josia Trenimoy says, we're Orthodox. We don't run if if the devil's here
and he's destroying, and then we stand that's a point. Yeah. I
saw Gonna Tim Gordon and we were talking about boxing. I feel like Tim
Will probably would would beat my ass, but he looks like a pretty he's
a pretty buff dude. He probably would be my ass, but I would
still box him. I don't care. All right, let's go to the
super chests, guys, circle G three dollars. Does anybody remember the og
men's rights channels from twenty twelve? Uh? I remember all those I read
each about channel or you talk about articles. There was a girl who writes
what she was doing with men's rights videos ten years ago, so I'm not
sure what that is, but I did. I did follow and read all
that stuff even back then. Damas seeing thirty dollars Jay, that was a
great five hour to eight stream. Can you share your story about the first
time you went to a liturgy and you felt the theological difference from Rome Catholicism.
Did you experience the English liturgy hitting you differently? Thank you? Yes?
And that was mainly because number one, I'd never been to an Orthodox
liturgy and that was like two thousand and six or seven, and I went
to an Antiochian liturgy. I'm sure everybody's familiar with the famous Antiochian Church in
Franklin, Tennessee. That was my first exposure to it. And it wasn't
English, and it was before they had built that big giant temple that they
have now. It was in a smaller parish back then in two thousand and
six or seven, still really really beautiful but I was coming from years of
the Latin Mass. Okay, so it's just a totally different feel and it
absolutely hit me different. And I basically just said there was a warmth there
that was not there in the ssp X Latin Mass that I went to for
many years. Adam nineteen twelve. If was that the church that we went
to a wedding end? It was, yeah, okay, but see that
the church, that's the new building, which is awesome, But um,
yeah, that the older parish was a lot. It was a lot smaller
back in the day, and the parish was like really intimate than you know,
maybe a hundred people max. Anyway, huge, Yeah, it's huge.
It's grown so much and we have a lot of friends to go to
that parish. It's agree. I'm not I'm not dissing it or anything like
that. We go to the road Court parish. But when we're in Nashville.
But um, anyway, Adam nineteen twelve. By the way, guys,
you would uh, we're gonna do super chats. If you want to
send in your super chats, now is a time to do it for either
myself or David Adam nineteen twelve. Fifty bucks will you do a roope whole
debate. I appreciate you guys. Work, try to let work, try
to the riot. Coba girl, give us a twirl. No, I'm
not gonna be debating RuPaul because I would lose, So I don't. I
would never ever sit step into the ring to debate RuPaul. Noah, chais
three dollars. I apologize this is redundant. But what do priest like father
damic so frequently? Why do they so frequently denounce you? A friend of
mine told me that he attended Katechisis in Virginia and the priest said the same
thing. Is it all because of NGOs or is there legitimate contention? So
I did a video maybe four years ago, five years ago, addressing the
whole reason why he out of nowhere decided to come after me. It's it's
a silly story. It had to do with just uh stuff. He tweeted
about quote in cells and everybody that followed my audience being an in cell.
He had to do a public apology, by the way, for calling a
bunch of young men in cells, which he which is funny to me,
but I had to do with me criticizing ancient faith radio back in the day,
and he took umbradge with that and wanted to defend ancient faith radio which
was promoting all kinds of liberal stuff. He then tried to come out and
do damage control and said, no, it's not actually liberal. I'm gonna
get rid of the liberal stuff. Okay, well then why was I bad
for talking about it? So you know, go watch the video that I
did. It's on my channel. Stills had almost thirty thousand views. Tape
TB eighteen ninety two. Thank you, guys. I'll be baptized in Rocorps
very soon. Thank you for your hard work. Thank you so much.
Appreciate that. Three dollars. I want you to do Esoteric Hollywood three.
The first two are some of my favorite book books. I'm working on Esoteric
Hollywood three. So oh man, dude, you're you're a workaholic. Man.
I totally respect your your work ethic. Thank you. Yeah, we
do work really hard over here. Grew up nondenominational, says glitchy rhythm.
For five dollars, the Orthodox Church makes more sense than what I grew up
with. Yeah, I think it doesn't make a lot more sense than the
domination stuff. Absolutely. How do I get over I get overwhelmed by church
history and how convoluted it can be. Do you have any book recommendations to
highlight the basics? Yeah, I mean Michael Welton's book Two Paths is a
great introduction of church history. Father Meyendorff has a good book called The Orthodox
Church was a good introduction of church history. The Damna scene five dollars.
Do you have a favorite hymn? I mean, the Orthodox Church has a
ton of liturgical chants and I like a lot of those chants. I like
a lot of the chants that we do, for example during Easter. I
don't have a particular favorite hymn, though, do you no not any any
particular one? I like the Charubic hymn that's one, but nothing really,
I don't know. I just enjoy the entirety of the liturgy. Gary one
hundred dollars. I'm a big fan of you both. Thank you for helping
me into Orthodoxy. Thank you so much. Gary. It looks like you've
won. Gary's won the super Chat competition tonight. P b F Live forty
dollars. This is a great stream homies. Thank you so much. PBF
Palatier one dollar. Cotel makes a great point about men having something that they're
willing to die for. What does the average secular man have to die for
without any family in the West, propositional notions of the Constitution and civil rights
in other words, hypothetical. The question is like not being serious, No
wonder everybody's nihilistic. Yeah, exactly, that's what's the point. If everything's
nihilistic, then why does your pleasure even matter? Rachel Wilson five dollars,
Thank you so much for the stream. Happy to see both covering it.
We need smart, strong Christian man influencing this sphere. Yes, I'm sure
that David and I both will be dipping our toes into this sphere as best
we can. Queen ten dollars, Hija and Cotel, No Hyman, no
diamond, Hanzo five dollars. Apologies, j I will watch the first hour.
Yeah, don't have to apologize. It's all good. Does a lot
of people click in at different times, but we did. And I did
a stream a couple of nights ago about a red pill where I talked about
areas where I agree in areas I disagree. Storm the cat three dollars can
you do a Jadier impression. Yes, I've done it the entire stream.
Dave fight the third fifty dollars. What are your thoughts on dating versus courtship?
This is a great question. I would say that if we existed in
a more traditional, healthy society, courtship would be better. And it's definitely
possible for Orthodox circles, and even outside of Orthodox circles. I know Calvinists
and traditional Catholics do set up successful courtship situations, but even those, a
lot of times it's really difficult for those to be successful. Not because the
courtship itself is bad, but it's so much of the modern world is totally
opposite and contrary to that that it's just very difficult to run parallel societies in
this society. It's not impossible, it's just really difficult. So I think
that it's really hard to avoid dating in today's world. Most people are going
to go that route, and it's just kind of going. It's just that's
just the reality where we are. And I've also seen the problem of over
the years, certain really hard core traditional circles, whether Protestant, Roman,
Catholic, and maybe even Orthodox, they'll try to have really strict extreme views
of courtship, and the moment somebody fails to match up to that or they
make a mistake or they fornicate or whatever, always say into the world and
everybody collapses and it's it's just huge. It's this huge scandal, and then
people lose their faith and it's like it's it's really extreme expectations for where society
has gone. So it's really hard, I think too, And I think
root Rollo is actually a good point about this, which is that a lot
of these uh trad egirls that suddenly are trad egirls, right, and they're
on the internet as the trad egirl like this is all just performative, right,
they're not really trad's okay, And so they will promote this idea of
all of this like we're living in the eighteen hundreds. They're over here on
freaking Twitter acting like it's freaking they're going down to the saloon, you know,
And I mean it's not. We don't live in the eighteen hundreds.
You're not gonna be able to make everybody live like as eighteen hundreds. Yeah,
the grift of the e girl trad thing is pretty fierce. Especially on
TikTok in regards to dating and courting, I would recommend I would agree with
it. Would you say, we just don't live in a society where traditional
courting can exist In that context, the way that I went about it trying
to find a traditional, pious Christian girl that is worthy of marriage and is
on the same page that I'm on, is to be one hundred percent straight
up front and straightforward. Is that what I've noticed is it I talked to
some of these guys and they're real reluctant to say what they really want because
they're afraid it'll push her away or do X y Z. And you're gonna
have to get over that if you if you want a traditional girl, on
the first time you guys talk, there should be at least be brought up
of like what your expectator or what you're looking for. And so I would
recommend every man to be very straightforward with what you're looking for and what you
want and be willing to say no. That's what these girls don't hear.
They don't hear men say no. If you're one of the few guys that
you're like, oh, oh, you're into that, Okay, I'm not
really interested. It was nice talking to you. See you, they're gonna
actually be more curious about you, and so be willing to say no,
move on and be one hundred upfront, because we just don't live in a
society where you can, you know, have families vet each other and court
and do all this stuff. It's just we don't live in a world like
that. Hood ra at twenty nine and one dollar. Why do Protestants say
the law has done away with? Why do they direct this towards the church?
The church believable vitical law has done away with or the mosaic ten laws.
Well, how we interpret the law being field is gonna kind of differ
depending upon what tradition you're coming from. So a lot of Protestants will sort
of classify anything like liturgy or vestiments as part of the law being done away
with, and so it's kind of an easy way for them to just sort
of hand wave liturgical worship and this kind of stuff. Orthodox Church has a
totally different paradigm for how they look at what elements carried over into the worship
of the church. So that's a really kind of a long involved question,
And I have a lot of live streams, and my friend Lewis did a
really good documentary on Orthodox worship and its continuity with the Old Testament and it's
in its services. So go watch that documentary that he made over at Orthodox
Shahada valentteer one dollar. How can of Orthodox guys they're serious about their faith
engage in fasting and get gains from weightlifting? Well, did you know that
weightlifting is actually an Orthodox thing? That? I mean, people don't know
this, but so that's a question for you're a much more dedicaate obviously.
Well, multiple priest I've had priests come on that are I have. I
had a priest that who's a bodybuilder, Like literally Father Moses in Texas is
like a huge, gigantic buff bodybuilder guy fa the Russell at the Holy Trinity
Serbian church in there and Butte Montana lifter lifts all the time. What he
does is he tries to use protein powder during the Lenten fast. So it's
all about macros. So when you're in a when you're in a high intense
fast like the Lenten fast, meet your macros. Try to get your proteins
where they need to be in your carbohydrates and do the best you can.
If you're constantly working out, your body's gonna show it. So what I've
noticed is a lot of people want to use things for excuses. You just
gotta go be consistent. Consistency always wins, and just get your macros in.
That's what again, I have priest on That's what they always say.
We'll just do the best you can, and if you are in a place
where you need something, talk to your priest about it. That's the point.
Talk with your priest. Yeah. It's also it's not fastings all just
food. People think. People think fasting is purely and solely something to do
with diet. No, that's only part of it. In fact, fasting
also has to do with alms. Giving Hunter five dollars. I'm excited that
you're coming to LA. Just don't drink the water. I never drink tap
water. And I would remind people too if they do. Want to get
tickets, get tickets to our show. In the show description, July six
will be live in Los Angeles Hollywood area. It's gonna be a lot of
fun. Amanda Huggin kiss one dollar. How would a theoretical situation occur where
the Orthodox monarchy is established anew how is a monarch founder chosen well, just
simply by the coronation of the church, So it doesn't have to be a
like going through genealogy books to find some descendant. It could be that.
I mean, I think there are descendants of the Romanovs in Russia, so
theoretically Russia could have another monarch. But if you look at the Bysantine model,
it was it was not solely on the basis of genetic lineage, so
there's a lot of different ways that that could occur. But the authority comes
from the coronation of the church, so there's different possibilities for how that could
be. But of course Orthodox is we're not mainly concerned with some that's like
a trad cat mindset of like our concern as to how to fix the politics
and get a Bay's trad political leader. That's like secondary to what we're focused
on. Our focus is the theology that we think leads to then down the
road other political solutions like monarchy, and it should be a patro you know,
patriarchy and monarchy go together, I believe, and I don't think that,
you know, a female monarch is ideal by the way, all right,
so that I think is tonight's show. Thank you guys so much,
a lot of great comments and insights. I have David's channel Church Eternal Logos
is linked in the show description and look for more work from him and more
debates. Thanks for having me on b Yeah, absolutely great. It was
a great chatal Palent. We got another we on the super chat. Pallenger
said during Great Lent, isn't the goal minimal Calaic intake? I'm not trolling,
it's a actual question that we are supposed to. So he's arguing,
is the purpose of lent to emaciate yourself? I don't know if that's the
purpose of lent? What? I don't think so I've never heard. All
Right, all right, thank you guys. Everybody have a good good night,
and uh I'll talk to you guys. Letter god bla