WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.040 --> 00:00:02.080 Today, I want to tell you about a journey that I've been on for 2 00:00:02.200 --> 00:00:05.040 most of my life. Ever since I was a kid, I've heard tales 3 00:00:05.080 --> 00:00:09.160 of bigfoot and wild men while spending time with my friends and family. As 4 00:00:09.199 --> 00:00:12.960 I grew older and read more about the paranormal, my interest encryptids and other 5 00:00:13.000 --> 00:00:17.120 things strange only deepened. That's why I'm so excited to share with you what 6 00:00:17.199 --> 00:00:23.039 I've personally become involved with the Untold Radio Network. The Untold Radio Network is 7 00:00:23.039 --> 00:00:28.000 a live streaming podcast network that airs a new show every day across all podcast 8 00:00:28.079 --> 00:00:32.119 platforms, YouTube, and more. They have eight different shows on all sorts 9 00:00:32.119 --> 00:00:36.359 of exciting topics such as bigfoot, cryptids, UFOs, aliens, and much 10 00:00:36.399 --> 00:00:39.920 more. I even have my own show called Weird Encounters, where I talk 11 00:00:39.960 --> 00:00:44.119 about all things strange. This is more than just a podcast network. It's 12 00:00:44.119 --> 00:00:48.119 a community that allows me to meet so many amazing people who share their stories 13 00:00:48.119 --> 00:00:52.240 and experiences with the strange. If you're interested in hearing more of these stories 14 00:00:52.240 --> 00:00:55.840 and learning more about the paranormal and encryptids, make sure you check out the 15 00:00:55.880 --> 00:01:00.600 Untold Radio Network for all kinds of exciting shows. It's free to subscribe. 16 00:01:00.640 --> 00:01:06.120 So what are you waiting for visit www dot Untold Radio neetwork dot com. 17 00:01:06.159 --> 00:01:08.640 Today. Hey everybody, this is Less Striding. Yes, yes, I 18 00:01:08.719 --> 00:01:36.359 know aka Surviving Man, and you're listening to Brian on Sasquatch Odys. He 19 00:01:36.480 --> 00:01:40.400 guys, and welcome back to Sasquatch Odyssey. Thank you so much for clicking 20 00:01:40.400 --> 00:01:42.640 play. It is Friday. I hope you guys are having every week. 21 00:01:42.000 --> 00:01:45.680 We have an amazing guest lined up for you. But as always, I 22 00:01:45.760 --> 00:01:49.159 want to start the show by inviting me. If you've had an encounter and 23 00:01:49.159 --> 00:01:51.760 you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email and get me 24 00:01:51.760 --> 00:01:53.879 at Brian at Panormal World Productions dot com. You can head up to the 25 00:01:53.879 --> 00:01:57.000 website check it out, become a memory there and help support the show. 26 00:01:59.200 --> 00:02:00.079 As I said, we've got a great guests lined up. I got to 27 00:02:00.079 --> 00:02:05.200 sit down recently with Bob Strain and if you guys remember a couple of years 28 00:02:05.200 --> 00:02:07.120 ago, I had his wife, Kathy Strain on and she shared some of 29 00:02:07.120 --> 00:02:12.960 her amazing experiences out of Area X with the NAWAC, and Bob is here 30 00:02:13.000 --> 00:02:15.199 to not only talk about his experiences there at Area X, but some of 31 00:02:15.240 --> 00:02:19.560 those that he had prior to going out to Area X with his father while 32 00:02:19.560 --> 00:02:22.800 out on a hunting trip, and we get into all things sasquatch. Bob 33 00:02:22.879 --> 00:02:24.599 is a really cool guy, so I know you guys are going to enjoy 34 00:02:24.680 --> 00:02:28.319 this as much as I did. If you would take a couple of seconds 35 00:02:28.319 --> 00:02:30.000 to rate and review the show. If you're listening to us on Apple podcast 36 00:02:30.120 --> 00:02:34.199 or Spotify, and we would love to have you join us on Instagram at 37 00:02:34.199 --> 00:02:37.680 Sasquatch Odyssey. You can check us out and follow us on TikTok at Sasquatch 38 00:02:37.680 --> 00:02:40.919 Odyssey podcast, and join us on Facebook and the Sasquatch Odyssey Fans group over 39 00:02:40.960 --> 00:02:46.199 there. I will be speaking at Squatch Con in Idaho on August to twenty 40 00:02:46.240 --> 00:02:49.319 six. Make sure you keep an eye on your podcast feed wherever you're listening 41 00:02:49.360 --> 00:02:52.919 to the show, because I'm going to drop a special episode tomorrow with Brandon 42 00:02:52.960 --> 00:02:55.759 Holfins. He's been on here from Squatch Nut. You'll probably remember his episode 43 00:02:55.759 --> 00:02:59.719 where he came on and shared his personal experiences. But Brandon's going to stop 44 00:02:59.759 --> 00:03:04.000 by because we have a huge announcement about SQUATCHCN and it's something that I definitely 45 00:03:04.039 --> 00:03:07.120 think you don't want to miss, So make sure you tune in on Saturday 46 00:03:07.159 --> 00:03:09.439 for that special episode when we make this special announcement, and we'll have some 47 00:03:09.560 --> 00:03:14.759 details that you're definitely gonna want to hear about SQUATCHCN and how you can attend 48 00:03:14.960 --> 00:03:16.360 that and make sure you're a part of that. I think it's going to 49 00:03:16.400 --> 00:03:19.599 be a story. But enough of that. I know you guys are here 50 00:03:19.639 --> 00:03:22.120 to hear Bob Strain, so I'm gonna let the music play. You gotta 51 00:03:22.159 --> 00:03:43.360 sit back, relax and enjoy the show. Hey, folks, don't want 52 00:03:43.360 --> 00:03:46.120 to my guest to the show. It is none other than Bob Strain. 53 00:03:46.240 --> 00:03:50.080 Welcome to the show, Bob Brian, Thank you very much, pleasure to 54 00:03:50.120 --> 00:03:53.280 be here. I am so glad to have you. So let's get right 55 00:03:53.319 --> 00:03:55.840 into it. Let's talk about the Sasquats thing everybody always wants to know, 56 00:03:57.039 --> 00:03:59.919 or at least I want to know. What is the thing that got you 57 00:04:00.199 --> 00:04:03.599 interested in? The subject should begin with, well, it was a probably 58 00:04:03.639 --> 00:04:09.000 inexperience that happened to me. You are graduated in high school in nineteen seventy 59 00:04:09.039 --> 00:04:12.800 five. My dad and I had a bunch of other guys but hunting, 60 00:04:12.919 --> 00:04:17.279 big game hunting and Idaho up near the Montana border and were on the edge 61 00:04:17.279 --> 00:04:23.240 of the wilderness area and I had a sighting one morning that I thought it 62 00:04:23.360 --> 00:04:28.399 was a bear and the wat should walk across the hillside at an unobstructed view. 63 00:04:28.800 --> 00:04:31.480 Was on all fours, but it kept looking behind itself like it was 64 00:04:31.560 --> 00:04:34.600 waiting for something to come out of the trees. Did come out of the 65 00:04:34.680 --> 00:04:38.759 open, and I was, you know, thinking maybe it was a mama 66 00:04:38.800 --> 00:04:42.560 bear. We were waiting on its cubs or something like that, and then 67 00:04:42.600 --> 00:04:46.279 it were behind some rocks. It stayed there like ten minutes and then started 68 00:04:46.319 --> 00:04:51.000 moving again. And decided it was a mama bear because there was nothing behind 69 00:04:51.000 --> 00:04:55.439 it, although it kept looking behind it, and it's still on all fours, 70 00:04:55.480 --> 00:04:59.639 and then it turned and went straight uphill to the ridge, which was 71 00:05:00.000 --> 00:05:03.680 probably a good hundred yards distance it had to traverse in the open. It 72 00:05:03.839 --> 00:05:06.720 was on all fours, and I thought, Okay, that's gonna be a 73 00:05:06.759 --> 00:05:11.279 bear, and I was actually going to shoot it. We had fair tags 74 00:05:11.360 --> 00:05:15.000 and just about the time I got my crosshairs on it and figure out, 75 00:05:15.399 --> 00:05:17.959 you know, my range and the whole thing. It stood up on two 76 00:05:18.079 --> 00:05:23.120 legs and once it got to the top of the ridge and it was flat 77 00:05:23.240 --> 00:05:26.879 up there. It stood up on two legs, and it was huge, 78 00:05:27.199 --> 00:05:30.879 and it was solid black, and there was I mean, I could see 79 00:05:30.240 --> 00:05:33.360 its hands. I couldn't see his face, but I could see his hands 80 00:05:33.839 --> 00:05:42.439 and solid color head to toe. And then it walked off and it resembled 81 00:05:42.519 --> 00:05:46.879 Now I think I knew anything about Bigfoot at that time. I may have 82 00:05:46.000 --> 00:05:50.959 seen something, but you know, I never really paid it much attention or 83 00:05:50.959 --> 00:05:57.120 give him my stock. But it had the cross country skier kind of motion, 84 00:05:57.560 --> 00:06:00.439 leaning forward and swinging its arms. Whoever that is over there is going 85 00:06:00.519 --> 00:06:03.680 to get shot, because I almost shot him. I had my finger on 86 00:06:03.720 --> 00:06:08.600 the trigger. I was I was about to squeeze, and it stood up 87 00:06:08.600 --> 00:06:12.519 on two legs and now did no exactly what the thing? I thought, 88 00:06:12.600 --> 00:06:14.920 You know, it was kind of mad, and I thought, well, 89 00:06:15.040 --> 00:06:16.879 you know what, we're out here in middle of nowhere. I could crank 90 00:06:16.920 --> 00:06:19.600 off a couple of rounds over its head, you know, say hey, 91 00:06:19.680 --> 00:06:25.680 but to walk around in a first suit in elk season, and I know 92 00:06:26.519 --> 00:06:29.680 then a couple of days later, and that bothered me for a long time, 93 00:06:30.160 --> 00:06:32.839 not really knowing what it was. Two days later, it snowed heavy 94 00:06:32.839 --> 00:06:36.480 the next date, and then the next the following morning, we were in 95 00:06:36.560 --> 00:06:42.680 a couple of four World Drive vehicles headed up this old logging road and in 96 00:06:42.800 --> 00:06:46.600 about you know, six eight inches of new snow, and it was before 97 00:06:46.680 --> 00:06:50.360 daylight, and we saw something on the side of the road. They looked 98 00:06:50.360 --> 00:06:55.319 like a burned out tree stump. And we're going real slow because of the 99 00:06:55.879 --> 00:07:01.120 conditions, and this tree stump got shorter and wider as we were getting close 100 00:07:01.160 --> 00:07:04.279 to it, and we're all leaning out of the window like, yeah, 101 00:07:04.439 --> 00:07:10.399 what is going on? And then I described it as an oil slick moved 102 00:07:10.480 --> 00:07:14.079 across the white road. It was a two track road, and it was 103 00:07:14.160 --> 00:07:19.240 black, and it slowly, slowly inched across the road and until at one 104 00:07:19.319 --> 00:07:25.759 point it took up the entire width of the roadway all right, and then 105 00:07:25.759 --> 00:07:30.120 it went. It was an embankment over to the way it went, and 106 00:07:30.240 --> 00:07:35.120 it knocked off some snow out some tree limbs that were like, you know, 107 00:07:35.319 --> 00:07:39.399 heavy laden with snow, and then knocked that down. And so we 108 00:07:39.439 --> 00:07:43.199 saw the snow come down, and so we set a guy over the edge, 109 00:07:43.360 --> 00:07:46.240 and you know, he didn't want to do it at first, but 110 00:07:46.319 --> 00:07:47.800 you know, when you're sitting in the right hand seat in a four wheel 111 00:07:47.879 --> 00:07:53.920 drive truck called shotgun for a reason, and that means you know you're the 112 00:07:53.959 --> 00:07:57.000 one that's guy that it was anything you need a gun for it, you're 113 00:07:57.079 --> 00:08:00.839 it, you know. So it's like opening the gate Texas. You sit 114 00:08:00.879 --> 00:08:03.160 on that side, you're opened the nevergate here encountered. So he goes, 115 00:08:03.199 --> 00:08:07.639 well, I don't have my good my rifles in the back all locked up, 116 00:08:07.720 --> 00:08:11.160 and the driver goes goes out of forty five in a flashlight as Tim 117 00:08:11.199 --> 00:08:15.120 goes, here's your chance to be a man, got him out of the 118 00:08:15.199 --> 00:08:18.800 truck, went over the side, came back in a big hurry, and 119 00:08:18.839 --> 00:08:22.800 I didn't want to talk about it, said let's go, let's go. 120 00:08:22.319 --> 00:08:26.120 There was something down there. It was Harry was trying to hide, and 121 00:08:26.399 --> 00:08:31.320 I didn't want to mess with it and move, let's go. So parked 122 00:08:31.399 --> 00:08:35.000 up in the top of the ridge and all day didn't see anything. Came 123 00:08:35.039 --> 00:08:39.679 back to the truck and there was like big giant footprints all the way around 124 00:08:39.679 --> 00:08:45.000 the truck in the snow, and I see that we're the first one's back 125 00:08:45.039 --> 00:08:46.679 and I go, Dad, my god, look at the size of that. 126 00:08:48.080 --> 00:08:50.919 What is that a bear? And his look and his nun Yeah, 127 00:08:50.919 --> 00:08:54.879 it's a bear. It's a big one too. And I thought they had 128 00:08:54.879 --> 00:08:56.360 four legs. He goes, Oh, sometimes a bear, you know, 129 00:08:56.440 --> 00:09:01.440 they'll step down in the know the front speed, you know, their back 130 00:09:01.519 --> 00:09:03.720 feet stuff or their front feet r and made some look bigger. And I'm 131 00:09:03.840 --> 00:09:09.200 looking and that she looks like a human footprint to me. Barefoot, you 132 00:09:09.240 --> 00:09:13.080 know, walked all the way around one trip around the regul we could sit 133 00:09:13.639 --> 00:09:18.039 so uh, you know that that always kind of bothered me. All those 134 00:09:18.080 --> 00:09:22.240 events. We had a couple of other things that had happened to me as 135 00:09:22.320 --> 00:09:24.879 well. A couple of years later, up here in the Sierra is not 136 00:09:26.000 --> 00:09:28.120 far from where I live right now. As a matter of fact, my 137 00:09:28.279 --> 00:09:31.799 dad and I we're scouting for a place to hunt deer and on all the 138 00:09:31.960 --> 00:09:37.559 morning. And so we had gone up about a month before season opened, 139 00:09:37.600 --> 00:09:41.279 and we were gonna find a place to hunt and build some brush ups, 140 00:09:41.279 --> 00:09:46.240 some deer blinds, you know, just find some concealment spots and brush it 141 00:09:46.360 --> 00:09:50.960 up so that the wildlife will get used to the change in the environment. 142 00:09:50.600 --> 00:09:54.159 And so it was just the two of us up there at the end of 143 00:09:54.200 --> 00:09:56.519 a get end road, and as a matter of fact, the wilderness. 144 00:09:56.559 --> 00:10:01.679 That was a trail hit for the wilderness area, which is the same wilderness 145 00:10:01.679 --> 00:10:07.519 area where the cur selves were recorded, So we were probably within eight or 146 00:10:07.559 --> 00:10:11.159 ten miles as a pro flies, you know, from the recording site, 147 00:10:11.159 --> 00:10:15.600 which we're not really sure exactly where it is, but it's something, you 148 00:10:15.639 --> 00:10:18.399 know, somewhere in the wilderness area up there. Anyway, we're sitting around 149 00:10:18.440 --> 00:10:24.240 the campfire and my dad's looking off into the darkness and he's gone, son, 150 00:10:24.320 --> 00:10:26.919 come over here, and what do you see over there? And I 151 00:10:28.039 --> 00:10:31.320 see a set of red eyes big and bicycle would fluck their eyes out there, 152 00:10:31.360 --> 00:10:35.720 just to pitch black Dad. There's a couple of big, giant red 153 00:10:35.759 --> 00:10:39.480 eyes looking at us. Because what do you suppose that is, unless I 154 00:10:39.519 --> 00:10:43.559 don't know, raccoon up in the tree maybe because it's really high, and 155 00:10:43.679 --> 00:10:48.159 he goes, m one problem with that is there that's a meadow. There 156 00:10:48.159 --> 00:10:54.039 ain't no trees out there. Oh yo, you're right, And uh so 157 00:10:54.080 --> 00:10:58.799 I had a little flashlight that shot my flashlight and then the eyes you can 158 00:10:58.840 --> 00:11:01.240 see that kind of would turn and you could see him getting narrow and turned 159 00:11:01.840 --> 00:11:05.080 and man, I don't see anything that you know, And then a couple 160 00:11:05.080 --> 00:11:11.000 of minutes later, they'd reappear. Over half hour period. Eventually there were 161 00:11:11.039 --> 00:11:15.200 three sets of red eyes watching us from out in that area. One real 162 00:11:15.320 --> 00:11:18.360 tall, one a little shorter, No, one way off to the side, 163 00:11:18.440 --> 00:11:20.240 like real close to the ground. Man. We couldn't figure it out. 164 00:11:20.279 --> 00:11:24.559 So Dad goes, well, I'm hungry, Let's get in the camper. 165 00:11:24.720 --> 00:11:28.320 They had a camper that sits on the bed of a truck. Grew 166 00:11:28.399 --> 00:11:33.159 up in there and he's making some sandwiches, and out of nowhere, we're 167 00:11:33.159 --> 00:11:37.639 just sitting there talking. Bom something smacks the side of that camper and just 168 00:11:37.960 --> 00:11:43.200 reverberates the mirror on the truck. Well, those old Ford trucks had those 169 00:11:43.240 --> 00:11:50.759 big giant mirrors. The mirror just went, oh stuff and came down out 170 00:11:50.759 --> 00:11:56.080 of off the shelves and we're like, what the heck was that? You 171 00:11:56.120 --> 00:11:58.720 know? So we jumped out. They had flashlights and pistols and we went 172 00:11:58.799 --> 00:12:03.440 all we were on the truck. We found nothing. We found nothing, 173 00:12:03.559 --> 00:12:07.720 no clue. Was dead silent darkness out there. And about the time we're 174 00:12:07.759 --> 00:12:13.480 getting back into the truck, there's a skyd awful, blood curdling scream happened 175 00:12:13.799 --> 00:12:18.200 in the darkness, probably not more than fifty yards in front of the truck. 176 00:12:18.480 --> 00:12:22.679 They've went downhill. It was down in a gully over there, just 177 00:12:22.080 --> 00:12:28.320 blood curdling woman getting murdered scream, and then similar, almost identical scream answered 178 00:12:28.360 --> 00:12:33.799 it from back where the red eyes were, which was in the opposite direction. 179 00:12:33.480 --> 00:12:37.919 So all night long, you know, I got here crunch crunch, 180 00:12:37.000 --> 00:12:41.840 crunch, crunch, crunch all around the caprinum, and my face up to 181 00:12:41.960 --> 00:12:45.879 that I didn't see anything. But you know, those were all within a 182 00:12:45.879 --> 00:12:50.159 few year time period, and I never really thought about it together after that 183 00:12:50.320 --> 00:12:54.360 until the Internet came along and I just happened to find, you know, 184 00:12:54.399 --> 00:13:00.679 the Bigfoot Farms in two thousand and three, surfd there from another site, 185 00:13:00.840 --> 00:13:05.440 you know, reading something on who knows what, and just surfing my way 186 00:13:05.480 --> 00:13:09.720 over there and started reading some of that stuff and started putting two and two 187 00:13:09.720 --> 00:13:13.679 together. I thinking, you know, there's probably a sasquatch that you know, 188 00:13:13.879 --> 00:13:18.320 was the cause of all that, And it's been something that had been 189 00:13:18.360 --> 00:13:20.799 just sitting at the back of my brain for years, one of those things 190 00:13:20.840 --> 00:13:26.200 you can quite figure out, and you know, and so I kind of 191 00:13:26.399 --> 00:13:31.440 took an interest in it, and I, you know, started investigating reports, 192 00:13:31.440 --> 00:13:35.720 and you know, I went to two thousand and three International Bickboot Symposium 193 00:13:37.120 --> 00:13:39.159 in Well Creek, which is where I'm at. Kathy. We hit it 194 00:13:39.200 --> 00:13:43.679 off for a well and started, you know, our dating. We were 195 00:13:43.720 --> 00:13:48.039 going out. You know, I'm looking for sasquatch, our huntingmoon, you 196 00:13:48.080 --> 00:13:52.480 know, the garden Capital of America. We went Arkansas, where Legend of 197 00:13:52.519 --> 00:13:54.879 Baggy Creek was filmed, so you know, we got I got that going 198 00:13:54.919 --> 00:13:58.440 for me, So you know, the rest is just you know, natural 199 00:13:58.480 --> 00:14:05.120 progression of the things. The deeper you dig into something, and this has 200 00:14:05.240 --> 00:14:09.440 legitimate See I talk to people sometimes I tell them, you know, people 201 00:14:09.600 --> 00:14:15.039 like really interested in it, but don't have an experience to back it up. 202 00:14:15.120 --> 00:14:18.480 It's like very compelling to them, but they're not. I mean, 203 00:14:18.519 --> 00:14:22.480 they want to believe. They believe they you know, skeptics make fun of, 204 00:14:22.559 --> 00:14:26.759 oh, you're a knower, who was like, you're like a you 205 00:14:26.759 --> 00:14:31.240 know, a boomer whatever, you're just jealous. But I kind of have 206 00:14:31.759 --> 00:14:37.879 a lot of people at a disadvantage because I knew something was up. I 207 00:14:37.879 --> 00:14:41.559 mean I knew it. I didn't know what it was, and I'm pretty 208 00:14:41.600 --> 00:14:46.600 skeptical on the retired firefighter paramedic, and you know, I try to be, 209 00:14:46.159 --> 00:14:50.120 you know, pretty skeptical about things. I mean, like, you 210 00:14:50.200 --> 00:14:56.440 know, work the nine one one ambulance in the downtown Sacramento for years and 211 00:14:56.000 --> 00:15:01.759 transported and through Wholesome Fire Department out of Wholesome prison. If there's a b 212 00:15:01.919 --> 00:15:05.080 a story that they had, I've heard it. You know, it's like, 213 00:15:05.159 --> 00:15:09.559 you know, how did how did that get there? You know, 214 00:15:09.600 --> 00:15:13.799 it's like, oh, well, you see, just I have, you 215 00:15:13.799 --> 00:15:18.840 know, a disadvantage over people that want to have an answer, And my 216 00:15:18.960 --> 00:15:24.840 answers came before the question. You know. But just because I know that 217 00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:30.159 something exists doesn't mean that every story that I hear it's something, there's something 218 00:15:30.240 --> 00:15:35.519 real. You know. I think it gives me an advantage there as well. 219 00:15:35.080 --> 00:15:39.320 I won't call it an addiction, because an addiction you could break. 220 00:15:39.519 --> 00:15:43.559 I'm not sure you could break this. It can break you, however, 221 00:15:43.399 --> 00:15:46.960 you know, so if you know there are people I was talking to the 222 00:15:48.000 --> 00:15:52.480 guy from the Pacific Northwest Real nice research, and I said, well why 223 00:15:52.480 --> 00:15:54.240 do you why do you research? He goes, well, because the one 224 00:15:54.279 --> 00:15:58.559 I have answers and said, well, what's gonna be an answer for you. 225 00:16:00.000 --> 00:16:02.759 They said, well, when I have an experience, I said, 226 00:16:02.759 --> 00:16:06.240 in an encounter, when you see one, you see one up close? 227 00:16:06.399 --> 00:16:10.879 Well yeah, and I said, are you ready for that? Because if 228 00:16:10.879 --> 00:16:14.360 you realize what's going on at the time, you know, it can be 229 00:16:15.399 --> 00:16:18.039 can be a frightening and experience, you know. So that's that's kind of 230 00:16:18.039 --> 00:16:22.919 what got me interested in And then I've met a great group of friends that 231 00:16:23.120 --> 00:16:27.360 you know that we have now that are interested in it as well, so 232 00:16:29.000 --> 00:16:33.320 you know, we're we're compelled to finish this out, to find a resolution, 233 00:16:33.759 --> 00:16:37.279 you know, to this question. I think it's very important to talk 234 00:16:37.320 --> 00:16:41.000 a little bit about what you just mentioned. Is I've started asking that question 235 00:16:41.279 --> 00:16:45.559 over and over with the people that I've talked to recently about what the motivation 236 00:16:45.720 --> 00:16:48.960 is for people who are into this subject, because you know, for some 237 00:16:49.039 --> 00:16:52.799 people, it is they want to have that experience, they want to have 238 00:16:52.840 --> 00:16:56.480 that encounter, they want to experience whatever it is they want to experience, 239 00:16:56.519 --> 00:17:00.360 and that's really what they're looking for. For some people, they say, 240 00:17:00.360 --> 00:17:02.879 I want to prove the subject. I want to prove that these things are 241 00:17:02.879 --> 00:17:07.119 real. I think the motivation is different in a lot of cases. For 242 00:17:07.160 --> 00:17:10.799 a lot of people. But I think that's a really important question that everybody 243 00:17:10.880 --> 00:17:15.319 needs to ask themselves, is why am I doing this? I certainly asked 244 00:17:15.359 --> 00:17:19.240 myself that every single day, and I am very skeptical. I've had experiences 245 00:17:19.240 --> 00:17:22.799 that I certainly can't explain, but I've never seen one of these things. 246 00:17:23.000 --> 00:17:27.519 For me, it's trying to document as many encounter stories as possible through the 247 00:17:27.559 --> 00:17:32.559 show. Obviously it's entertaining to people. People like those kind of stories, 248 00:17:32.599 --> 00:17:37.200 but for me, it's about collecting data because I think every experience that people 249 00:17:37.279 --> 00:17:41.240 have is important, even if it's just a vocalization. You know, people, 250 00:17:41.839 --> 00:17:44.240 I don't want to share my story because I didn't really see anything. 251 00:17:44.240 --> 00:17:45.920 Well, I had an experience when I was twelve and I didn't see anything, 252 00:17:47.000 --> 00:17:49.200 but I'm pretty sure it was with a sasquatch. So I think those 253 00:17:49.240 --> 00:17:53.799 things are certainly important. And I think it's amazing that you went to a 254 00:17:53.799 --> 00:17:59.000 symposium and ended up meeting Kathy and you guys have been together all this time 255 00:17:59.039 --> 00:18:02.160 being able to share that, because I think that's a really important part of 256 00:18:02.160 --> 00:18:04.440 this as well. There's a lot of people that are into this their husband 257 00:18:04.519 --> 00:18:08.079 or wives aren't supportive of what they either their own experiences. Some of them 258 00:18:08.079 --> 00:18:11.799 don't even believe their experiences, right, you know. I've talked to people 259 00:18:11.839 --> 00:18:15.920 that have told and shared it with their husbands and wives and they just look 260 00:18:15.960 --> 00:18:18.359 at them like they're crazy and say, sure, honeyuts, that's what you 261 00:18:18.400 --> 00:18:22.079 saw, you know, kind of pat them on the head and say, 262 00:18:22.079 --> 00:18:25.519 bless your hard and move on. But I think it's so powerful when you 263 00:18:25.680 --> 00:18:30.119 have that in your life and that support system because you both have had experiences 264 00:18:30.160 --> 00:18:33.680 that you can share with each other, and that you get to go out 265 00:18:33.680 --> 00:18:37.039 and do this research together, I think is just brilliant. I love it. 266 00:18:37.279 --> 00:18:41.119 Let's talk about how you guys got involved in the North American Woodape Conservancy 267 00:18:41.200 --> 00:18:45.039 and how that all came to be, and how you got out to Area 268 00:18:45.200 --> 00:18:48.640 X, and let's get into some of the things that you've experienced out of 269 00:18:48.640 --> 00:18:52.079 there here. Sure. Well, like I said, Captain, I'm at 270 00:18:52.119 --> 00:18:53.799 in two thousand and three, and she was a member of the BF by 271 00:18:53.920 --> 00:18:59.160 Row and that had been for several years, and she was a speaker at 272 00:18:59.400 --> 00:19:06.759 some and give her presentation on the Harryman Pictographs near Portaville, California that she 273 00:19:06.880 --> 00:19:11.440 gave a brilliant hyper about so when we started dating, we first got together, 274 00:19:11.839 --> 00:19:15.880 I got involved with the bf bar Row. Now I had read all 275 00:19:15.920 --> 00:19:21.359 of her reports on the bf ROW shoot was the most prolific investigator on the 276 00:19:21.400 --> 00:19:26.160 West Coast, and so all the encounter reports in California, I had read 277 00:19:26.440 --> 00:19:30.960 most of them, you know, were ones that she had followed up on 278 00:19:30.440 --> 00:19:34.319 and read the report on. It's always familiar with that, and so we 279 00:19:34.319 --> 00:19:38.240 were able to have, you know, great discussions about that, and I 280 00:19:38.319 --> 00:19:44.279 got involved with the bf ROW did it as an investigator and later curator and 281 00:19:44.799 --> 00:19:48.680 whatever. Anyway, I investigated a lot of reports during that process. That 282 00:19:48.880 --> 00:19:56.640 time, Cathy was invited to speak in several occasions at the TBRC. And 283 00:19:56.720 --> 00:20:00.759 now you talked to Mike Hays about the evolution of the in a WAC from 284 00:20:00.799 --> 00:20:06.799 the TBRC. Stay tuned for more sasquatch otysee. Moving right back after these 285 00:20:06.880 --> 00:20:15.400 messages, they were given us a conferences and Kathy spoke as several of them, 286 00:20:15.119 --> 00:20:18.880 and so of course I accompanied her a lot of those trips. But 287 00:20:19.519 --> 00:20:22.680 we've got to be good friends. But the people that you know, Darryl 288 00:20:22.759 --> 00:20:27.200 and Alton, they were such with the BFRRO at that time as well. 289 00:20:27.599 --> 00:20:33.519 And so they were They were basically our friends, and even though we were 290 00:20:33.640 --> 00:20:37.640 members of the TBRC, it was they were more based in Texas at that 291 00:20:37.759 --> 00:20:42.799 time. But they had some experiences that I know that Darrell talked about that 292 00:20:42.920 --> 00:20:49.400 they had been in there as a group doing camera trap operations, had spent 293 00:20:49.480 --> 00:20:55.519 some time in there and during the summer before it was well twenty eleven, 294 00:20:56.079 --> 00:21:02.440 it was the Echo incident when they almost collected the specimen and I was able 295 00:21:02.480 --> 00:21:08.480 to retrieve some blood off some rocks, but fortunately weren't able to complete the 296 00:21:10.000 --> 00:21:14.680 collection of the specimen. It was minorly wounded, as it turns out, 297 00:21:14.759 --> 00:21:18.359 probably be as it was seen again later the following year. So they had 298 00:21:18.400 --> 00:21:22.759 a whole lot of activity. They really wrapped up there what was going on, 299 00:21:23.079 --> 00:21:27.559 and it was just happening fast and furious. So they had respect for 300 00:21:27.680 --> 00:21:32.519 us as we did for them. They know we had a lot of experience 301 00:21:32.559 --> 00:21:37.519 and they know firsthand personal experience. So they invited us to come. We 302 00:21:37.519 --> 00:21:41.640 weren't members to come to areas, and we came in two thousand and twelve 303 00:21:41.640 --> 00:21:45.920 and they and I spent a week there and seems like it was it was 304 00:21:45.960 --> 00:21:49.119 only a week, but it seems like a year for everything that happened there 305 00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:55.240 that week. That was probably one of the craziest weeks of our lives certainly, 306 00:21:55.720 --> 00:21:57.799 so it was just natural then, you know, we joined, became 307 00:21:57.880 --> 00:22:04.119 members, and wou'd have been members and big supporters of the NAWASC ever since. 308 00:22:04.960 --> 00:22:08.160 Well, let's talk about some of those experiences that happened over that first 309 00:22:08.200 --> 00:22:11.119 week out there. You referred to Darrell being on the show. I had 310 00:22:11.160 --> 00:22:15.839 Michael May's on the show a couple of days ago, and I've got Brian 311 00:22:15.880 --> 00:22:18.200 Brown scheduled. I think next week I'm going to have Brian on, and 312 00:22:18.279 --> 00:22:21.359 of course Matt Prue. It's a friend of the show. I've had Matt 313 00:22:21.400 --> 00:22:25.559 on before. You know, I'm fascinated with the way that you guys go 314 00:22:25.640 --> 00:22:29.880 about your business there because and people have seen obviously some of the documentaries that 315 00:22:29.920 --> 00:22:33.039 you guys have been involved in. You and Kathy have been intricraling some of 316 00:22:33.079 --> 00:22:36.119 those and shared some of your experiences. But I think one of the things 317 00:22:36.119 --> 00:22:41.559 that always piqued my interest the most about the NAWAC was the way that you 318 00:22:41.559 --> 00:22:45.000 guys went about it. You're looking to for a long time. I know 319 00:22:45.119 --> 00:22:48.400 that Darryl talks a little bit about how that sort of shifted recently. But 320 00:22:48.559 --> 00:22:53.079 specimen collection has always been a part of what you guys are trying to do. 321 00:22:53.680 --> 00:22:57.480 And I think if any group is really serious, in my opinion, 322 00:22:57.599 --> 00:23:02.720 it's just my opinion, if you're serious about going about proving these things as 323 00:23:02.720 --> 00:23:08.079 a species, that has to be part of your mission statement because science requires 324 00:23:08.119 --> 00:23:12.000 what it requires, and I think in order to prove these things, somebody's 325 00:23:12.000 --> 00:23:15.880 going to have to take one down and bring it in and let the scientists 326 00:23:15.880 --> 00:23:18.799 take it apart and look at it and figure out what it is. But 327 00:23:18.960 --> 00:23:22.880 in addition to that, the way that you guys go out and spend the 328 00:23:22.920 --> 00:23:26.440 time that you spend there is the other thing, because there's a lot of 329 00:23:26.559 --> 00:23:30.160 us that like to go out. I love to hike my property. I 330 00:23:30.160 --> 00:23:33.599 found a footprint on my property a week and a half or so ago. 331 00:23:33.000 --> 00:23:37.119 Pretty sure it looks like a sasquatch footprint to me. Yeah, I'm not 332 00:23:37.160 --> 00:23:41.359 an expert, but that's what it looks like, and I just happened upon 333 00:23:41.480 --> 00:23:44.119 it. I don't go out in the woods like you guys too, So 334 00:23:44.759 --> 00:23:48.640 for you guys to go out and spend weeks at a time and in rotation. 335 00:23:48.079 --> 00:23:52.640 I think that's the only way to really do the research. So you 336 00:23:52.680 --> 00:23:56.599 and Kathy get out there and you get your experience an area X. What 337 00:23:56.680 --> 00:23:59.759 was it like when you guys hit the ground there was it almost immediate? 338 00:24:00.119 --> 00:24:03.920 What did you guys experience during that first week you were out there? Well, 339 00:24:03.119 --> 00:24:07.200 I was unprepared for it. Not unprepared for the activity, I was 340 00:24:07.400 --> 00:24:11.319 unprepared for the environment. I mean I was born and raised in Texas. 341 00:24:11.359 --> 00:24:15.160 I mean, you know, grew up in West Texas, and I'd been 342 00:24:15.200 --> 00:24:21.400 to Oklahoma. Being from Texas, you go to Oklahoma only when absolutely necessary. 343 00:24:21.480 --> 00:24:25.920 But I had never been to that part of southeast Oklahoma before, and 344 00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:32.200 I did not realize how of a lush, rugged environment. It actually is 345 00:24:32.720 --> 00:24:37.720 just like being air dropped into Cambodia in the height of the summertime. And 346 00:24:37.759 --> 00:24:41.640 that's basically what it was like. We dropped down that as Darryl calls it, 347 00:24:41.680 --> 00:24:45.480 a mule trail, and I mean he's being kind. I would think 348 00:24:45.559 --> 00:24:51.240 mules would refuse to go down that trail. You'd have to pull him and 349 00:24:51.519 --> 00:24:53.880 they would hate you for it. From that point, for the rest of 350 00:24:53.880 --> 00:25:00.839 the week, it was just total immersion. You can imagine you are operating 351 00:25:00.000 --> 00:25:08.119 in a canopy of dice dits forest, dince forest, and everything is grown 352 00:25:08.200 --> 00:25:14.200 up around the sides. There's poison oak, poison ivy, green briar, 353 00:25:15.000 --> 00:25:21.000 millions of tiny trees, millions of big trees, all competing for sun. 354 00:25:21.160 --> 00:25:25.160 And it's like no sun gets down to the bottom of the ground is damp 355 00:25:25.680 --> 00:25:30.759 and it's humid and it's one hundred degrees one hundred percent humidity, and reptiles 356 00:25:32.039 --> 00:25:36.759 love it, and there's venimous snakes. I mean, this is like they're 357 00:25:36.799 --> 00:25:41.960 in heaven in that place, and there's rats everywhere, and it's like it's 358 00:25:41.319 --> 00:25:47.200 like it's Jurassic It's absolutely Jurassic Area. And I can see why the apes 359 00:25:47.279 --> 00:25:49.960 love it. It's because humans hate it. I mean, I don't love 360 00:25:51.000 --> 00:25:55.200 it. So, I mean the apes are there for a reason. And 361 00:25:55.400 --> 00:25:57.640 you know Daryl was talking about it, it's a core world, yeah, 362 00:25:57.680 --> 00:26:03.359 I mean, because humans won't go there. But when we got there, 363 00:26:03.440 --> 00:26:06.640 it you know, there was a lot of people right at first. So 364 00:26:07.119 --> 00:26:10.279 every time you do, you know, like a shift change as of where 365 00:26:10.559 --> 00:26:12.720 you know, there's a bunch of people and we came in. You know, 366 00:26:12.759 --> 00:26:17.400 there have been a team there. I can't remember exactly how many there 367 00:26:17.440 --> 00:26:19.039 were on that team, but there was a team there and they waited for 368 00:26:19.119 --> 00:26:23.720 us, and so we arrived with the crew and there were five of us 369 00:26:23.759 --> 00:26:27.880 that stayed that we and so you know, the first day is usually I 370 00:26:27.920 --> 00:26:33.119 mean, there's just too much emotion going on. And then Sunday, you 371 00:26:33.160 --> 00:26:37.920 know, it was kind of quiet, and then but by Monday, Monday 372 00:26:37.920 --> 00:26:41.880 it was it was when I know that Kathy told you about that. It's 373 00:26:41.920 --> 00:26:47.480 a bit of of seeing two of them run up the hillside behind the cabin. 374 00:26:47.559 --> 00:26:51.200 And when I say cabins, you know, they're structures. That's that's 375 00:26:51.200 --> 00:26:55.119 true. There's structures. There is no electricity, there is no running water. 376 00:26:55.599 --> 00:27:00.240 That primitive at its best, and that's being kind. They were permitted 377 00:27:00.400 --> 00:27:06.519 fifty years ago and they haven't been improved. But anyway, I think that's 378 00:27:06.559 --> 00:27:11.160 part of the attraction for the apes because it's like it's like an obstacle Courson. 379 00:27:11.559 --> 00:27:15.960 They're all acted. There are four cabins there and they all have tin 380 00:27:15.079 --> 00:27:18.400 roofs, and there are some sheds there and they all have tin roofs, 381 00:27:18.799 --> 00:27:23.000 and man, they're just covered with rocks. We would take the rocks off, 382 00:27:23.160 --> 00:27:27.559 which we made sure to do was sweep all the rocks off the tin 383 00:27:27.720 --> 00:27:30.480 roof. You climb up there with a broom, you sweep it off. 384 00:27:32.160 --> 00:27:36.839 You know, they started out with rocks on the tin roof and having us 385 00:27:36.920 --> 00:27:41.519 run back and forth. And these apes can work in Unison when they want 386 00:27:41.519 --> 00:27:45.240 to. I know, Daryl talked about the woodknocks and four different directions. 387 00:27:47.079 --> 00:27:51.440 That's what they'll do. They'll they'll make a loud noise and it distracts you. 388 00:27:52.200 --> 00:27:56.400 Right if you were going after a loud noise and then there's a loud 389 00:27:56.440 --> 00:28:00.359 noise behind you, then you kind of go that way until you catch on. 390 00:28:00.839 --> 00:28:04.079 And that's what Kathy did because she's murdered and the rest of us sitting 391 00:28:04.200 --> 00:28:07.680 up clearly, and she went, yeah, I'm just gonna stand right here 392 00:28:07.720 --> 00:28:11.960 in the middle because it's not you know, I got banging over there, 393 00:28:11.960 --> 00:28:14.480 and we got banging over there, and let's see what happens right here. 394 00:28:15.200 --> 00:28:19.000 And that's when she saw the tree limb being pulled down and something peaked. 395 00:28:19.319 --> 00:28:22.960 And that's when I went over there. That was on Monday, so it 396 00:28:23.039 --> 00:28:26.119 was Monday or the week, you know, our first week there, and 397 00:28:26.680 --> 00:28:32.079 I looked inside the bushes, and she was certain that she had been peeked 398 00:28:32.079 --> 00:28:34.880 out. And I looked inside the bushes and I didn't see anything, and 399 00:28:34.920 --> 00:28:37.640 she does, we'll take a better look, you know, and I, 400 00:28:37.799 --> 00:28:41.880 you know, put my head in the bushes and I could see through to 401 00:28:41.960 --> 00:28:45.160 the other side, and I can see the hillside going up. Now, 402 00:28:45.279 --> 00:28:48.519 I just see a game trail going off that way, which would have been 403 00:28:48.519 --> 00:28:52.079 obscured from where she was. And I said, if there's something here, 404 00:28:52.119 --> 00:28:56.839 I don't see anything now. There's just a big dead tree that had fallen 405 00:28:56.960 --> 00:29:00.279 and it was sticking out in the trail and had to walk around the butt 406 00:29:00.400 --> 00:29:04.319 end of it. And I'm thinking, well, there's a little ditch. 407 00:29:04.680 --> 00:29:07.960 I'm thinking I could get on this old tree and like you walked across the 408 00:29:08.039 --> 00:29:12.240 ditch, get on the other side. And there's a couple of logs in 409 00:29:12.359 --> 00:29:15.359 the ditch. Maybe I could step on, you know, step here, 410 00:29:15.440 --> 00:29:21.000 step there. Oh no, it's you know, I can see, you 411 00:29:21.039 --> 00:29:26.119 know, there's nothing there. So we came back and we've been sitting down 412 00:29:26.240 --> 00:29:30.640 and Ken was a video documenting all everything you know about all the rock brows 413 00:29:32.240 --> 00:29:36.759 banging and running back and point and as he's sitting there. He just put 414 00:29:36.759 --> 00:29:41.000 his camera down. That's when Cathy saw the two coming at us, said, 415 00:29:41.039 --> 00:29:44.200 well, they were walking right at us. Well, I'll say right 416 00:29:44.240 --> 00:29:47.920 at us. It was they were gonna go to a shed which was off 417 00:29:47.960 --> 00:29:51.279 to our side. It looks like they were trying to steak behind that shed 418 00:29:51.319 --> 00:29:55.519 to get closer. They weren't giant ones. They weren't. They weren't small, 419 00:29:55.559 --> 00:29:59.920 they weren't babies. I'd say probably adolescence, dark black, I mean 420 00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:03.279 head to toe. Of course it was Kathy. She stands up and she 421 00:30:03.319 --> 00:30:06.519 goes, oh my god, there they are, and a full sprint takes 422 00:30:06.519 --> 00:30:08.559 off, running straight out of them, which you know, it was kind 423 00:30:08.599 --> 00:30:15.119 of comical in retrospect because the one of them went up like this, you 424 00:30:15.160 --> 00:30:18.559 could tell us it's kind of like going, O that lady, let's running 425 00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:22.799 that at us, you know. And then one was in front of the 426 00:30:22.799 --> 00:30:26.640 other, and the one that saw Kathy running turn around and went I am 427 00:30:26.799 --> 00:30:30.599 and just ran right in those like two people in a subway just work, 428 00:30:30.799 --> 00:30:33.319 you know, look at where they are going, just slammed right into each 429 00:30:33.319 --> 00:30:37.319 other. And they stood there for a minute like that got their bearings. 430 00:30:37.359 --> 00:30:41.799 And then and then flew up the hill, I mean like breeze lightning, 431 00:30:41.960 --> 00:30:45.400 like shot out of the cannon. They completely silent. We heard him walking 432 00:30:45.559 --> 00:30:48.759 up in the leaves, but didn't make any noise at all. As they 433 00:30:48.759 --> 00:30:52.559 shot up that hill side and traversed it like it was, it was ghost 434 00:30:52.640 --> 00:30:56.440 like. I'll tell you, it was absolutely ghost like watching them brow up 435 00:30:56.440 --> 00:31:00.000 that hill. But the first one that went up on up i'm too late 436 00:31:00.000 --> 00:31:03.799 eggs and tucked its arms like this and bent over. And the other woman, 437 00:31:03.839 --> 00:31:08.839 which was a little bit smaller, went a few yards over and went 438 00:31:10.000 --> 00:31:14.240 up a fallen tree that was probably about six inch dime atter, a tree 439 00:31:14.279 --> 00:31:17.920 that had fallen a few years before, was laying straight down the hill. 440 00:31:18.319 --> 00:31:22.400 Use that like a ladder, and we went up the hillside on that on 441 00:31:22.440 --> 00:31:25.680 all fours, and it was used on his hands, you know, like 442 00:31:25.759 --> 00:31:29.279 a you know, the bullets way up at it, and so it went 443 00:31:29.359 --> 00:31:32.839 up on all fours. So that was Monday. Of course, we were 444 00:31:32.880 --> 00:31:37.680 shocked after that. And then that night, I mean it was like they 445 00:31:37.799 --> 00:31:41.559 bombarded us with rocks. Well we kind of harassed them a little dead after 446 00:31:41.599 --> 00:31:47.119 that. We didn't really necessarily mean too. But as they ran up the 447 00:31:47.200 --> 00:31:49.599 hill, we went up to try to find them if you couldn't, you 448 00:31:49.599 --> 00:31:53.559 know, humans going up that hillside covered with the boulders up there of a 449 00:31:53.880 --> 00:32:00.799 square and I'm very unusual terrain, very rocky, so it's hard for humans 450 00:32:00.799 --> 00:32:06.119 to navigate what they just flew up. But we were shining in it was 451 00:32:06.559 --> 00:32:08.559 up before us. So as it got dark, we're looking and we see 452 00:32:08.559 --> 00:32:15.079 eyes shine out there and harassing them, and it sounded like there was like 453 00:32:15.720 --> 00:32:22.200 more than one multiple creatures coming down at us in a beard hurry, and 454 00:32:22.319 --> 00:32:25.920 just as they got dark, so we backed off, you know, like 455 00:32:25.920 --> 00:32:30.119 it was coming from like four different directions, and so we stopped pressing it 456 00:32:30.240 --> 00:32:34.599 and we figured we can't, we can't go up there. Anyway. We 457 00:32:34.720 --> 00:32:39.000 had a couple more visuals that week. I saw another one up the hillside 458 00:32:39.039 --> 00:32:46.240 that was reddish cinnamon and colored like an Irish center walking through an opening in 459 00:32:46.279 --> 00:32:51.200 the trees, and the sun just listened off of it. I can see 460 00:32:51.200 --> 00:32:55.480 it in this waste sound like Chewbacca almost looking, I mean that type of 461 00:32:55.480 --> 00:33:00.880 a look to see if we had a bluff charge that week, And that 462 00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:05.319 was the one that one of the ones that Darryl had referred to had a 463 00:33:05.359 --> 00:33:09.160 couple of creatures that were on either side of a guy that was in a 464 00:33:09.319 --> 00:33:15.799 blind, in a deer blind, and they were like echo locating each other 465 00:33:15.000 --> 00:33:21.519 by clicking like mouthpops. He mouthpoped back at him and one of them bluff 466 00:33:21.599 --> 00:33:27.359 charging, so he wasn't It didn't stopped before I got right to the edge 467 00:33:27.359 --> 00:33:31.079 of the bank of the creek where he was. There was a water pump 468 00:33:31.720 --> 00:33:37.519 that was behind this cabin, and there was like the spring that where the 469 00:33:37.559 --> 00:33:44.119 water would pool up and you could run the water pump and they put into 470 00:33:44.200 --> 00:33:49.920 like this plastic tank very small to collect this and to if you wanted to 471 00:33:50.119 --> 00:33:53.880 have water in the house, like an RV that stink in the cabin, 472 00:33:54.839 --> 00:33:59.279 you'd have to hook up the battery, hook up the water pump and then 473 00:33:59.319 --> 00:34:01.880 pressurized. Of course, the sink just drained right out on the ground. 474 00:34:01.960 --> 00:34:06.559 You know, it's a little sanitary. The landowner said, well, you 475 00:34:06.599 --> 00:34:09.079 know, whenever you start that pump up, you know, sometimes you know, 476 00:34:09.559 --> 00:34:14.000 starts getting happening up there on the hill, and so I would watch 477 00:34:14.039 --> 00:34:16.880 out for them, and I happening what happens on the hill, you know, 478 00:34:17.199 --> 00:34:22.280 and sure enough, well you get rock start at you. So we 479 00:34:22.320 --> 00:34:28.400 had rock start at us. We had the cabin slapped multiple times. I 480 00:34:28.480 --> 00:34:32.400 mean it got so bad that, I mean they they kept us awake all 481 00:34:32.480 --> 00:34:37.079 night, stop the cabin. We get lights, guns right outside, nothing, 482 00:34:37.400 --> 00:34:42.400 silent, dead, silent. This became a game for them. And 483 00:34:42.679 --> 00:34:45.320 finally, you know, I got pissed off, you know, four him 484 00:34:45.519 --> 00:34:50.360 one night and they're just slapping the cabin. They're slapping. It's so hard 485 00:34:50.679 --> 00:34:54.159 the stuff falls off the ceiling. And you know, I just went out 486 00:34:54.159 --> 00:34:58.960 on the front borders and I kind of lose. And I know, listen, 487 00:34:59.480 --> 00:35:02.320 I've had it. Would do you stupid monkeys? You try that again, 488 00:35:02.639 --> 00:35:07.199 I'm gonna beat you. Of course, I'm all taught, you know 489 00:35:07.239 --> 00:35:10.960 what I mean. It's like it on the porch. Yeah, come up 490 00:35:12.000 --> 00:35:15.880 here, but the entire forest went silent, you know, half an hour 491 00:35:16.000 --> 00:35:21.320 later. Bum, It's like all right, all right, Yeah, we 492 00:35:21.519 --> 00:35:24.679 left. There was like being in combat that it's not certainly not combat, 493 00:35:25.239 --> 00:35:29.639 you know, but it's that, you know, closest thing you can get 494 00:35:29.679 --> 00:35:35.400 to it without actually being shot at. It was stressful, it really was. 495 00:35:35.440 --> 00:35:37.599 And we thought we were prepared for We thought, yeah, it's no 496 00:35:37.679 --> 00:35:38.559 big deal, you know, it's like you to go. There's like, 497 00:35:38.840 --> 00:35:42.960 I'm never going back there again, you know, months later is you know, 498 00:35:43.079 --> 00:35:46.679 whenever we going back, and crazy stuff can happen at a moment's notice. 499 00:35:46.920 --> 00:35:52.079 They can be quiet there for somebody will go there for a week and 500 00:35:52.280 --> 00:35:58.440 sit there. It's just like crickets and locusts all night long, trying you 501 00:35:58.559 --> 00:36:01.199 mad, you know, and they come out there, you go all the 502 00:36:01.320 --> 00:36:06.360 what you guys are talking about, and then all the way out, you 503 00:36:06.400 --> 00:36:09.480 know, they'll see an ape and this has happened. They'll see an ape 504 00:36:09.559 --> 00:36:14.800 standing on the side of the road. Loser, get back. You know, 505 00:36:15.199 --> 00:36:16.760 I saw an ape on the side of the road. It's like, 506 00:36:16.840 --> 00:36:22.039 sure about they don't exist. Well, they had a lot of people that 507 00:36:22.079 --> 00:36:27.760 have have had their reality checked pretty quickly. I mean, that's one of 508 00:36:27.760 --> 00:36:34.400 those things. It's thrilling, it's exhilarating, it's madening having conversations with you 509 00:36:34.519 --> 00:36:37.199 Daryl, call your Michael Maze and people who have spent a ton of time 510 00:36:37.280 --> 00:36:44.400 there. It's one of those things that it's always permeates throughout the just the 511 00:36:44.519 --> 00:36:47.280 conversation around Bigfoot in general. Why don't we have a body? Why is 512 00:36:47.320 --> 00:36:51.880 it easier to see one of these things. Why aren't they better pictures? 513 00:36:51.880 --> 00:36:55.960 Why aren't there better videos? You're in a place like Area X, and 514 00:36:57.440 --> 00:37:00.239 you know they're there, people have had a visual sightings. You're getting rocks 515 00:37:00.239 --> 00:37:05.159 thrown at you, these vocalizations, all this stuff is happening. Yet it's 516 00:37:05.199 --> 00:37:07.239 just like Kevin, I had talked to Darrel recently and he's like, we've 517 00:37:07.280 --> 00:37:12.360 been up there fifteen hundred hours or so this year, and there's probably been 518 00:37:12.559 --> 00:37:15.880 three visuals that lasted for a total of three seconds out of fifteen hundred hours 519 00:37:15.880 --> 00:37:21.400 of observation. Right, So that in and of itself for me in that 520 00:37:21.559 --> 00:37:27.840 area and what you guys are doing further proves why it's so difficult to document 521 00:37:28.000 --> 00:37:34.559 these things with photographs, with videos, or with frankly taking one down and 522 00:37:34.679 --> 00:37:38.280 bringing it in as a specimen collection of a specimen. So it sort of 523 00:37:38.320 --> 00:37:43.000 gives me hope in a way, you know, as an armchair researcher who 524 00:37:43.039 --> 00:37:45.320 goes out and hikes, you know, a couple of times a week and 525 00:37:45.800 --> 00:37:49.360 maybe looks for things and tries to find some sign of things around here on 526 00:37:49.400 --> 00:37:53.000 our property. But I think that's one of the things that has really fascinated 527 00:37:53.039 --> 00:37:55.400 me about that area is like you said, you can go up there for 528 00:37:55.440 --> 00:37:59.320 a week and nothing happened, and then you go up there in the first 529 00:37:59.320 --> 00:38:01.800 five minutes it's balls to the wall, and then it's like that for seven 530 00:38:01.840 --> 00:38:07.480 straight days. Are you guys finding any patterns to the behavior. I think 531 00:38:07.679 --> 00:38:09.800 Daryl might have talked a little bit about that, about some of the vocalizations 532 00:38:09.800 --> 00:38:15.480 and things like happening at night. But is there a specific time that you 533 00:38:15.519 --> 00:38:17.920 guys are finding patterns where they're moving in and out of the area, or 534 00:38:17.960 --> 00:38:22.599 just in general when you guys are doing the research as far as correlations with 535 00:38:22.920 --> 00:38:25.599 behavior and times of the year and that kind of thing. Well, I 536 00:38:25.639 --> 00:38:29.719 mean, as far as the time of a year goes. Of course, 537 00:38:30.360 --> 00:38:36.280 the environment is such that it's a forgatma lay a hardwood forest, so it 538 00:38:36.320 --> 00:38:40.039 loses its leaves, it becomes very barren in the winter time. So cover 539 00:38:40.440 --> 00:38:45.760 is you know, evergreen trees or conifers you know, provide and they do 540 00:38:45.840 --> 00:38:51.039 have the dents grows of that in the area as well, and so that 541 00:38:51.280 --> 00:38:55.440 we can you know, kind of estimate or guess that seasonal movements. And 542 00:38:55.559 --> 00:39:00.199 of course I know that Mike talked about the tag set in the paper, 543 00:39:00.559 --> 00:39:07.000 and that we believe we did a tag and a we think that we've eliminated 544 00:39:07.079 --> 00:39:12.639 all the other potential candidates that would do something like that, and not only 545 00:39:13.119 --> 00:39:16.679 at first sight. If anybody who doesn't read the paper, you should you 546 00:39:16.760 --> 00:39:22.360 owe it to yourself, because it's not just simply we put you know, 547 00:39:22.480 --> 00:39:27.239 we were able to attach this bird that had a little radio transmitter that we 548 00:39:27.239 --> 00:39:30.440 could pick up the signal to get a directional fix on it. You know, 549 00:39:30.599 --> 00:39:34.480 the big deal. You know, that could have been anything. No, 550 00:39:34.719 --> 00:39:39.440 it's where we tracked it and the way we tracked it and the way 551 00:39:39.480 --> 00:39:45.719 they tried to initially found it, you know, by using an airplane. 552 00:39:45.760 --> 00:39:50.000 We had lost it. We tagged it, and it was there that night 553 00:39:50.119 --> 00:39:52.800 and it was several hundred yards away, but because it was dark, they 554 00:39:52.800 --> 00:39:55.119 couldn't, you know, they didn't go after it. The next morning it 555 00:39:55.239 --> 00:40:00.519 was nowhere to be found. A signal had disappeared state for more sasquatch otysee, 556 00:40:00.519 --> 00:40:07.599 we'll be right back after these messages. And so it was a month 557 00:40:07.800 --> 00:40:13.599 or two maybe more that we thought it's lost, it's gone. You know, 558 00:40:13.679 --> 00:40:16.320 we'll never do it. And we've been out on foot, driven around 559 00:40:16.519 --> 00:40:21.559 I mean all kinds of stuff, no contact whatsoever. And we had a 560 00:40:21.559 --> 00:40:25.880 couple of private pilots in the group. We have several and the commercial pilots 561 00:40:25.920 --> 00:40:30.320 and this well, you know what, let's just the last hit chap Let's 562 00:40:30.320 --> 00:40:35.320 stick an tinnel on the bottom of plane and just fire out. And they 563 00:40:35.320 --> 00:40:40.960 did a grid I mean a circular pattern and getting further and further away from 564 00:40:42.079 --> 00:40:45.519 where we had any idea where we thought it might be. And they got 565 00:40:45.559 --> 00:40:49.440 it, man, that's how they got it. And it was it was 566 00:40:49.480 --> 00:40:52.760 several miles away, so they were able to get a fix on it. 567 00:40:52.800 --> 00:41:00.159 And we sent teams in over several week period and tracked this thing both the 568 00:41:00.239 --> 00:41:04.639 air and coordinating ground teams, you know, two different ground teams to try 569 00:41:04.639 --> 00:41:08.480 and track it. Had the radio trans locators on you know, in the 570 00:41:08.639 --> 00:41:13.840 air and on the ground, and followed it and chased it and got within 571 00:41:13.920 --> 00:41:16.519 several hundred yards a couple of times. But it was in terrain that was 572 00:41:16.679 --> 00:41:22.719 absolutely impossible for our members and have moved at such a rate it was, 573 00:41:22.800 --> 00:41:27.320 it was incredible, and always stayed about the same distance and get out one 574 00:41:27.400 --> 00:41:30.199 hundred or two hundred yards ahead of the group that was pursuing it and it 575 00:41:30.280 --> 00:41:34.960 would stop. You know, this isn't the dead of winter when the majority 576 00:41:35.000 --> 00:41:38.239 of the bears in the area are denned up. So anyway from that, 577 00:41:38.480 --> 00:41:42.960 you know, we can you know, kind of postulate its range and seize 578 00:41:43.039 --> 00:41:46.559 the movement's because we tracked that for about nine months, you know, as 579 00:41:46.559 --> 00:41:51.280 far as any other routines. I mean, I love Daryl talked about you 580 00:41:51.360 --> 00:41:53.119 know, woodnocks and stuff like that. Well, what we do is, 581 00:41:53.480 --> 00:41:59.800 I mean, I'm speaking for myself, you know, them communicating with each 582 00:41:59.840 --> 00:42:05.039 other there if you will that they have eyes on you, and that's what 583 00:42:05.079 --> 00:42:07.920 it is, if you if you hear or would not by heart or would 584 00:42:08.000 --> 00:42:15.000 not. I personally think I've been spotted that somebody is telling something's telling telling 585 00:42:15.119 --> 00:42:19.199 rest on. Hey, you know I got eyes on the bogey. Not 586 00:42:19.239 --> 00:42:22.519 to say that they don't do it at other times because those Noah has been 587 00:42:22.559 --> 00:42:27.639 recorded, you know, in the middle of the night. But there again, 588 00:42:27.880 --> 00:42:30.800 you know, what's the context. I think that you know, that 589 00:42:30.840 --> 00:42:34.519 type of thing can be used for one thing, but probably you know, 590 00:42:34.599 --> 00:42:38.159 some type of other communication. What it is, you know, what's producing 591 00:42:38.239 --> 00:42:42.039 the knock? You know, I mean I didn't tell you. You know, 592 00:42:42.119 --> 00:42:46.079 I'm sure they have a variety of methods of how they produce that sound, 593 00:42:46.719 --> 00:42:52.440 but at times a day, you know, they're not strictly nocturnal her 594 00:42:52.519 --> 00:42:57.599 they're not. They operate most of the day and at night. But it 595 00:42:57.800 --> 00:43:01.599 seemed to get most active when we our first week there in two thousand and 596 00:43:01.639 --> 00:43:07.880 twelve. It was late afternoon, about four or thirty. You know, 597 00:43:07.159 --> 00:43:10.880 they would be dead all day. I've been until about that time. It 598 00:43:10.920 --> 00:43:14.840 was really hot. So it's I mean, it's hard to say what's their 599 00:43:14.880 --> 00:43:19.440 slip socle like, you know, I mean, well when us, you 600 00:43:19.480 --> 00:43:22.880 know, it's hot in the afternoon and it's real easy just to take it 601 00:43:22.920 --> 00:43:27.159 easy in the shade somewhere, you know. But I think that they're always 602 00:43:27.199 --> 00:43:31.519 on guard and have somebody that's And that's the thing Mike had alluded to this 603 00:43:31.760 --> 00:43:37.559 is that you know, we're working with educated apes, you know, because 604 00:43:37.760 --> 00:43:40.800 we educated them. You know, It's like, are they following there are 605 00:43:40.960 --> 00:43:47.480 normal patterns of behavior when we're there because we're there or you know, or 606 00:43:47.599 --> 00:43:53.480 in spite of how to have we affected their routine. It could us affecting 607 00:43:53.559 --> 00:43:58.480 their routine part to be part of their frustration with us, and I'm sure 608 00:43:58.679 --> 00:44:02.320 probably is. I mean, I think there's a very small segment that there 609 00:44:02.920 --> 00:44:07.480 the wood ape population that is glad to have us there. They're probably the 610 00:44:07.519 --> 00:44:12.559 youngsters, you know, because we're curious, you know, I mean the 611 00:44:12.920 --> 00:44:16.039 side as we've seen those smaller ones because they were checking us out. Yeah, 612 00:44:16.039 --> 00:44:20.440 I definitely think they're curious. So you've had these experiences, Bob, 613 00:44:20.559 --> 00:44:24.679 Kathy's had her experience, as you guys had some really wild close up encounters 614 00:44:24.719 --> 00:44:29.760 with these things. I guess the question is for me before we close out, 615 00:44:29.840 --> 00:44:31.760 is what's next for you guys? What does your journey look like? 616 00:44:31.840 --> 00:44:37.960 Are you still in this to prove the species for everybody else? What is 617 00:44:37.960 --> 00:44:40.719 the research how has it developed over the last few years for you? Are 618 00:44:40.719 --> 00:44:45.119 you still going out trying to have more encounters? What is the research like 619 00:44:45.239 --> 00:44:46.840 for you? And what's the ultimate goal for you as far as the wood 620 00:44:46.880 --> 00:44:52.840 ape is concerned. Well, I mean they ultimate goal for Captain I both, 621 00:44:52.960 --> 00:44:57.239 I think is for the species to be you know, proved to the 622 00:44:57.360 --> 00:45:00.679 science into the world as a real species so that the conservation can begin. 623 00:45:01.719 --> 00:45:06.760 Because you know, the conservation is what it's all about. So we are 624 00:45:06.800 --> 00:45:09.039 not in it for the thrill, but yeah, we will. We still 625 00:45:09.079 --> 00:45:15.039 do go out on occasion, you know when we can't, but our emphasis 626 00:45:15.159 --> 00:45:20.079 is different now we don't. I mean we do in the Sierras, would 627 00:45:20.079 --> 00:45:23.639 apes are very vocal and and so it's you know, it's fairly easy if 628 00:45:23.719 --> 00:45:27.400 in the right spot at the right time, to a list of the call 629 00:45:27.559 --> 00:45:31.039 response and that's exciting for use. And it's very low energy. You're just 630 00:45:31.159 --> 00:45:34.760 drive with my truck and get the speakers out of the back of you know, 631 00:45:35.360 --> 00:45:39.280 And we said and listen. But investigating reports, you know, so 632 00:45:39.679 --> 00:45:43.880 you know that we do. We still do. I've been up. Doesn't 633 00:45:43.920 --> 00:45:47.880 matter if I kathy to the Port Service gets reports from local you know, 634 00:45:49.039 --> 00:45:52.480 sightings that happen from campers and were reported to law enforcement, and law enforcement, 635 00:45:52.880 --> 00:45:55.360 you know, tell scatty and we'll go follow up on it, you 636 00:45:55.400 --> 00:45:58.519 know, check it out. And we've seen, you know, felt some 637 00:45:58.639 --> 00:46:04.000 exciting things. But we are about the conservation of the just the animal. 638 00:46:04.119 --> 00:46:07.960 But it's habitat and which is you know, really important. You know, 639 00:46:08.039 --> 00:46:15.360 if what we are doing through the NAWAC isn't you know, immediately successful in 640 00:46:16.079 --> 00:46:22.400 reaching our goal and folktrolling our mission. At least, we're along the way 641 00:46:22.519 --> 00:46:27.679 collecting as much data as possible. I mean, we're taking pictures, you 642 00:46:27.760 --> 00:46:30.239 know, We're not putting them out there and going, hey, you know, 643 00:46:30.360 --> 00:46:32.760 look at this black blur. You know, we don't know, you 644 00:46:32.840 --> 00:46:37.920 know, and we also know that that's not going to prove the species. 645 00:46:37.920 --> 00:46:43.599 But we are collecting data. And along with these any photos that we may 646 00:46:43.679 --> 00:46:49.599 get audio recordings, we have field journals that it all correlates with, so 647 00:46:49.760 --> 00:46:54.360 we can tell what the humans, our investigators on the ground there are doing 648 00:46:54.719 --> 00:47:00.119 at the time that these photos, that these encounters happen, that these recordings 649 00:47:00.119 --> 00:47:05.360 are made, and so you know, we build a big database of our 650 00:47:05.400 --> 00:47:08.559 own and was trying to look at correlations there. So we're trying to learn 651 00:47:08.639 --> 00:47:12.960 more about the animal. What I mean, we're doing a million things at 652 00:47:13.000 --> 00:47:15.840 one time here, trying to you know, to collect the data, educate 653 00:47:15.920 --> 00:47:21.480 the public, and then also you know, prove the species, and then 654 00:47:21.639 --> 00:47:27.760 to prepare for conservation of the animal and it's habitat. And real quick, 655 00:47:27.800 --> 00:47:31.760 I will give a shout out to my good buddy Cliff Broyland who turned me 656 00:47:31.840 --> 00:47:38.559 onto the federal website called the Loss of Open Space g ob or whatever. 657 00:47:39.079 --> 00:47:45.639 And there is, according to the government numbers that we are in the United 658 00:47:45.880 --> 00:47:51.559 in the lower forty eight United States of America losing six thousand acres per day 659 00:47:52.159 --> 00:47:58.320 of open space. And that's not just development, but there's also loss of 660 00:47:58.360 --> 00:48:05.679 habitat and mentation of habitats. So if you have like ten thousand acres and 661 00:48:05.840 --> 00:48:09.679 you know, suddenly you lose you know, a tenth of it, what 662 00:48:09.920 --> 00:48:14.280 was it down here in the corner or is it scattered all over the place, 663 00:48:14.440 --> 00:48:17.039 or is it like bisector right in half. So now you no longer 664 00:48:17.119 --> 00:48:22.639 have the ten thousand acre potential habitat. You have two five thousand acre potential 665 00:48:22.719 --> 00:48:28.360 habitats, you know, separated by urban and so that's the kind of stuff 666 00:48:28.400 --> 00:48:31.239 that happens, you know, and the changing of the forests. You know, 667 00:48:31.760 --> 00:48:37.000 big demand for cardwood boxes right now, you know, so they're growing 668 00:48:37.039 --> 00:48:42.559 trees to supply that demand. You know, Southeast Oklahoma is a big producer 669 00:48:42.639 --> 00:48:46.679 of the paper products, and so in the past what they've done is cut 670 00:48:46.679 --> 00:48:52.679 down nut bearing hardwoods and replaced it with fast growing conifers, you know, 671 00:48:52.800 --> 00:48:58.480 for the paper industry. So you know, there's a race against time. 672 00:48:58.800 --> 00:49:04.800 And if we do anything. We help to encourage other researchers to try to 673 00:49:04.840 --> 00:49:07.679 do the very best. And like you began the program, why are you 674 00:49:07.760 --> 00:49:13.440 doing this And if you're only doing it too for your own hobby, your 675 00:49:13.440 --> 00:49:16.960 own enjoyment, that's cool, that's fine, but don't pretend that you are 676 00:49:17.000 --> 00:49:22.239 a true researcher. You are looking at for an adventure. And if you 677 00:49:22.320 --> 00:49:28.400 are in the camp that you don't want the species to be any harm to 678 00:49:28.400 --> 00:49:31.760 come to them. Nobody wants any harm to come to a w A note. 679 00:49:32.239 --> 00:49:36.039 No, we love them, oop, we didn't want to hurt them. 680 00:49:36.079 --> 00:49:39.480 And I know that sounds like a dicotomy, but it's not our rules, 681 00:49:39.760 --> 00:49:42.960 you know, we're not. We don't make the rules. Takes the 682 00:49:43.039 --> 00:49:47.800 specimen. So if you don't want the species to be proved, then you 683 00:49:47.880 --> 00:49:53.719 need to stop looking for it and you need to stop talking about it because 684 00:49:53.920 --> 00:49:59.079 it's it's not genuine if you want to if you want to protect the species, 685 00:49:59.559 --> 00:50:04.320 then you stop looking for it unless you want to prove it. That's 686 00:50:04.360 --> 00:50:08.360 my own personal opinion. We offer everything up for free, our OPM or 687 00:50:08.360 --> 00:50:15.239 what you do watch your top project monographed and the Time seven paper is they 688 00:50:15.679 --> 00:50:21.239 on our website and there's no chargeboard, and some other group can do what 689 00:50:21.360 --> 00:50:28.239 we're doing and have uneducated apes and they can even if it's just audio our 690 00:50:28.599 --> 00:50:32.400 video do it. You know, let's help prove the species. If you 691 00:50:32.480 --> 00:50:37.239 think that audio alone is going to do it, who knows it might you 692 00:50:37.320 --> 00:50:42.280 know, I don't know. Maybe things will change. But if you don't 693 00:50:42.280 --> 00:50:45.320 go for it now, you know it's time loss. You know, hopefully 694 00:50:45.440 --> 00:50:52.039 we can you know, encourage somebody else to do what we're doing and get 695 00:50:52.159 --> 00:50:55.119 us taken care of so we can protect the habitat. And unless you know, 696 00:50:55.280 --> 00:51:00.079 in the in the species long term, it's going to be necessary. 697 00:51:00.199 --> 00:51:04.400 It really is. I don't like it. That sweet is Everybody, go 698 00:51:04.519 --> 00:51:07.599 check out the North American Wooda Conservancy. I have it linked in the show 699 00:51:07.639 --> 00:51:09.400 notes. You guys, check it out. There's all kinds of interesting stuff 700 00:51:09.400 --> 00:51:14.679 over there. There's tons of audio, the tag seven papers there. Like 701 00:51:14.760 --> 00:51:16.880 Bob said, all the stuff is documented right there. It's free, it's 702 00:51:17.199 --> 00:51:22.519 education. Go get it, dive in and support them anyway you possibly can. 703 00:51:22.599 --> 00:51:24.320 Bob Strain, I really appreciate you coming on man. I've had a 704 00:51:24.400 --> 00:51:28.480 blast talking to you. Well, thank you. It's been my pleasure. 705 00:51:29.840 --> 00:52:08.599 They say, you don't gotta go cast trying to try and try everything, 706 00:52:08.960 --> 00:52:20.000 calling badna my choice for me to stay right you call it right away. 707 00:53:07.239 --> 00:53:30.159 Come back downs us to us, to us, to us, to us,