It's one on top of two wherever you go, So put down the hod,
clean off the trough and grab a brew. Because is he the brickies
on site from Fix Radio. We're dropping knowledge, hints, tips and big
name guests from the trade, just hopefully not the bricks. This is the
Bricklaying Show from Fix Radio. Welcome to the brick lay and Podcast. I'm
your host. Is he the brickey? On this episode Albert talking some bricklayers
about how we win good work, find decent leads, as well as how
we market our business and how to approach quoting jobs. Enjoy the show.
This is the Bricklaying Show from Fix Radio. Join me now once again is
Ash Francis from the Bricklayers Social Club. Hi, Ash, are you doing
today? Hello you good, Bud? Yeah? All good, thank you.
So what we're talking about today is winning jobs, winning quotes and making
sure you build up a good reputation as a bricklayer so then you have a
constant float off work. So when having a brick layer come into your house
for the first time to quote work, what are some of the good practices
to have or what you have in place that make you more likely to win
the job. I think, for a start, it's how you present yourself.
So everyone's going to take you on face value when you get to that
door and they answered the door, Yeah, it's going to be like,
okay, So if you turn up in a pair of tracks with holes in
it and you look a bit rough, and it's going to be don't really
if I want to let you in my house, you might still be Yeah,
I'll say, you know, you don't want to judge your book by
its cover, but you're always exactly So I think firstly, your presentation of
yourself. Yeah, like a pair of dreams of Polo with your company name
on it, so you look the part for a start. Yeah, And
obviously so I've got to that stage. Is like a website and a good
online presence obviously help with a good portfolio of work to show what you've done
as long as you have been robbing pictures and it's all your own work that
you can kind of talk about brilliant, And then I think it's just I
think it's kind of remaining you know, when you're having that conversation is yeah,
you need to just be quite quite clear and transparent. If they're offering
you additional bits of work you can't do we're not confident in doing. It's
just kind of being quite clear on that table when you're having a conversation with
clients, say yeah, I can't do this, I can do this.
Look, here's an example of what I've done in the past, is that
here's an idea here, and kind of bounce back and forth with your clients.
Yeah, no, definitely, because it's very army. I've done this
before in the past and I've regretted it. You go to a client's house
and you're there to win the job. So when they say, oh,
when we've got this, and we've got this, and we've got that,
and it's things you're not quite confident in, and you go, yeah,
i'll see what I can do. As soon as you say I can see
what I can do, that's basically a green light to them saying this bloke
is going to end up doing that. So, like you just said,
being quite clear and concise saying listen, I'm here to do this, this,
this, and this. If you do want something else doing, perhaps
we can speak about that in the future, but the moment, I'm here
to do this job right here, for you, yeah, because I mean
it can get messy. And the problem is if you go there and you're
talking about we use a garden wall as an example, We're here to price
up this big six meter garden wall, but mister Jones has got a broken
wall in his back garden that you want through building as well. It's like,
well, I'm here to price up this garden wall here, let's price
up this garden wall, and then let's talk about the wall with rather back
after, so you kind of keep it clear because on what I find with
customers is sometimes they'll think that you're going to end up price in the two
together. Yeah, and then they're going to get a bit confused. But
it's like, well, no, that's a that's an additional bit of work.
Yeah, no, definitely, And that's only as an example. I
mean, variations are are normally a lot more complicated than the sake of a
garden well. Yeah, for to make it easier that it's just to be
very clear if your customers win quoting and pricing, yeah, definitely. And
as well, while speaking about quotes and things like that, people are often
like a hard quote, Now what do you do? Do you quote or
do you give a estimate, like and not a guestimate, a rough Do
you give them a rough figure saying I think this is what it's going to
cost, or do you give them a full on quote, this is what
it's going to cost down to the last penny. So verbally, because when
you've got when you've done this for a while and you've got experience, you
can kind of throw out ballpark figures. Yeah, and that's what I would
typically do in the presence of the customer, have the conversation, because normal
it will come up and come so, so it's going to cost and you
go, well, I don't something similar to mean, you can baby showing
the picture of what you've done in the past, but this costs seven and
a half thousand pounds and then plus materials. But yeah, yours is slightly
different in this way, and we're going to be doing that that that's to
give you an idea of where we're going to be with me. Then when
it comes to the quote, I like to give give as much information as
I feel comfortable to give them, so I would kind of want to price
it up. I would tell them X amount of bricks that I'll be using,
but I wouldn't. Specially if I knew what the brick was going to
be, I wouldn't necessarily say what the brick is, because that then gives
them the opportunity to then pass that information onto another brick layer. Now,
I think a nice little golden ticket that you've got if you know what brick
is, if you've gone through the effort of finding out what the brick is,
what the mortar is, all them kind of things, that's sure from
the risk. So when quote and I would try and retain that information if
I could, right, Yeah, I just have that like little secret so
they can't go to other people or the brick layers and say, listen,
I have three five hundred bricks of these heathers today. What's your price?
Yeah. With the labor side of it, I try not to kind of
break it down to the hour, or I'd kind of just give a round
figure for labor that wouldn't be too specific on labor, because then what could
happen is, say farther which you've got to take a lad off the site
for whatever reason, they could turn around and say, well, he was
only on site for two hours. But we know that when we're pricing up
a job. That is the job, That is the price, whether I
have ten men on the job or I have two men on. If I
say it's going to get done in ten weeks for this price, that's how
it's going to get built, and that's how it's going to get done.
Yeah, No, definitely. So yeah, I think some information you've got
to be clear on and others other stuff you've kind of got to back just
for your own sake from a company point of view. No, No,
you're right. Well, going again back to quoting, Obviously we're brick layers.
We're not businessmen. So how can brick layers make sure that they are
putting in a decent price but also allowing enough profit for themselves after the job,
Because it's all right working for wages, but we're not in it for
that obviously. We all want to make a bit more money. So any
little bits of information you can share with us, that'd be amazing. Yeah.
So, as a brick layer, if you joined a brick layer soce
club a loot plug there, you've got hundreds of brick layers in there and
conversating, just having that conversation in amongst the community that you're part of that
will start to give you an idea of what the going rates are. Then
that's not gospel. You can work what you want with that. Yeah,
but that will help them give you a benchmark of what is been what prices
are going out for for peri spare meet or brickwork or blockwork. So you
know you're not you know you're putting yoursel health in the right ballpark figure.
And then it seems like you if you've gone out and bought a mixer,
a petrol saw, you've got a van, you need to be pricing that
into your quote. You need to be factoring that cost in there a preliminary
cost. If your wife is what your missus at home and she's kind of
doing something, you're adding in work, your phone bill, your internet,
all these little costs need to be put into your quote. That could be
a very small amount. Yeah, So your mixer and your petrol saw and
your phone, you've got to pay for the upkeep of running your business.
So you should look at what your overhead is for a year, per a
week, per day and add that cost, add that cost into your quote,
and then look at adding percentages onto your Yeah, good conversation. Yeah,
no, definitely. Well, I had a good conversation before. I
was just working on day work and things like that, and this lad was
like it was when we had the meetup for the Bricklayer Social Club event summer
just gone. Super trow end up speaking to an older gentleman. It's like,
you need to start costing in what it actually costs you to turn that
van on in the morning and get to sight, because you're not thinking about
all these overheads, your insurances, your fuel, everything. So he said,
when you quote a job, now, he said, exactly what you
said. Find out what it costs each year to run your company, whether
that's fuel and everything like that altogether, divide it by fifty two, which
is fifty two weeks in a year. He says. Every single quote starts
with that amount. So let's say it cost let I don't know, fifty
quid a week to have your company up and run in you know, fuel
insurances. He says, that's how you start your quote. And if you
think the job is going to run let's say for four weeks, that's an
extra two hundred pound you need to add on to that job. So it's
accounting for everything exactly. And then I also well, sorry, I'm just
jumping in here. So what I started doing as well when pricing jobs,
Now I whack on twenty percent on top of everything, and I put decent
prices in any way, Like I don't undercut people. I put a price
in what I think is decent, and then I'll whack twenty percent on because
that's what I've started doing that and it's it's not gone too bad, although
some people do turn their nose up. But it's kind of business, isn't
it. It is business, And I mean one thing I've always done,
I've I've veried a profit on my my labor, for my work, like
the workmanship, with any profit on that. I'm not one threading profit onto
materials on the procurement of materials. Some people do that will be anywhere between
five and ten percent, but that's that's that's down to the individual company on
how they want to do it. Yeah, yeah, I know people who
do that. But I feel like sometimes it can scare clients away. You
know, when you're wacking on extra twenty percent, let's say, on all
your materials on a job, it's a bit too much, I feel.
And if you if you're only small time. There's no really need to do
this there no. And then I also think as well, it comes down
to it depends on the payment terms of that project and how you quote with
it. If it's four weeks, there's got to be a cash flow and
then you can all of these things have to be looked at when you're quoting
up the job. Is the length of time, the overhead, costs,
the resources, the materials, things like your toilets, your site, toilets,
equipment on site. All of these things and the time it takes to
organize that need to be costed for Ash, Thank you so much today for
all your information. I greatly appreciate it myself, and I'm sure our listeners
do as well. Thank you. Chis Fixed Radio Time to crack on.
Joining me this week once again is James Roading. Today we're talking about winning
jobs and quoting jobs as brit layers and as a company. Hi James how
Ai today? Yeah? Thank you? How yeah? Really well? Thank
you so James jumping straight in. How do you find most of your work
nowadays? Yeah? So we've with our social media pages are quite good.
Really, We've got Facebook and Instagram and then we're able to post up previous
jobs and stuff and then get if you get good reviews and stuff and you
get a lot of recommendations and stuff like that. Yeah, no, recommendations
are the best way. I think word of math is a really decent way
to get a lot of work because it's nice having an Instagram page and a
Facebook page and people often look at your work and go, oh, yeah,
he's quite good. We'll get his email address and things like that.
But you know, when you have friends of family or things like that and
they've had work done by you and then they recommend you, that's the best
way because they can actually already see the quality of your work. Yeah,
that's right. They know you as well, don't they, And yeah,
pat on stuff. Yeah, it's always the best way. On So,
when you give a price for a job, do you give a quote or
an estimate? And which one do you prefer? Because I know a lot
of people like giving or I know a lot of clients like receiving a solid
quote, but sometimes it's hard to do. So which one do you go
by? I'd probably prefer doing an actual quote, just because they offer a
fixed price, you know exactly what you're given to the customer. Yeah.
Plus if you can break if you can break down the quotes a little bit.
For example, say you've priced priced two radiators in the new extension,
Yeah, just make sure you list like their standard right radiators. And obviously
a lot of nowadays they go for like vertical rads or something fancy, don't
they. Yeah, yeah, And then you can always just say that's an
added cost and all that. So quotes are probably better you sort of know
where you are. Well, I'll tell you what you know, because I
know that you dig out your own footings and things like that. So it's
easy to put a price in for square meter of brickwork, block work,
insulation, DPC, all that stuff. I find really easy to quote for
because you have an exact figure or a price sheet right in front of you.
But when you go for a dig, you actually never know what you're
going to find. So I standardly price it's a one meter dig by six
hundred mil. And then if there's anything deeper than that, I say to
V decided because you never know what you're going to find. You could have
a conifer tree next to you and you wouldn't didn't realize that you need to
dig down like, let's say two point five meters. Do you do something
similar there when you're digging out footons? Exactly the same, Yeah, exactly
the same, because build and control come along, don't they, And they
can tell you, they really tell you what you need to do. Really
at the end of the day. Yeah, you're right. They can make
you dig two meters two point five meters And if you don't, if you
don't put that on the quote, then you could it could backfire, couldn't
it with the customer? And yeah, one hundred percent. I mean I've
had one not so long ago where us digging a foot in no trees or
anything. I thought it was all you know, virgin ground, end up
digging and came across a massive well which had to be filled with seven Cuba
concrete. Yeah, yeah, not fun, is it? You know?
Swings and roundabout swings and random out. So what top tips would you give
regarding communication with potential customers? Be yourself, you go around there. Don't
try and be your salesman so you can make it into like a footballer's palace
or something like that. Best to just set clear expectations, be approachable,
polite, Maybe take your shoes off you know Bitcurtsey when you go into their
one percent. And then I've also found like quick quick responses work better as
well. So if you if you get the quick the quote over as quick
as possible instead of like a four weeks five weeks people are waiting, you
normally get a good response from that as well. So yeah, yeah,
because obviously it's like when you send someone a message, you want to respond
straight away, don't you. And I think everyone wants that nowadays with how
f thein is and instant gratification on Instagram and TikTok and all that. So
when people ask for a quote, they want something back, let's say within
within at least two days, I'd say yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
definitely, yeah, I'd say so too. So how do you stand
out in your local area? And do you see other firms around you as
competition or do you see them more as just yeah, basically stand out.
We'd just like to focus on our reputation, just make sure we do a
good job also, like keeping the neighbors, customers happy, keeping the sight
clean, tidy, being polite, careful with your parking as well because people
like around it. Yeah. Yeah, I've had no end of complaints.
You know, when I bring Sobby's on and then people start complaints say,
oh man, the streets full of vans and things like that. No,
you're quite right there, that's right, And then it would just lead on
like the neighbors would be like, oh, they were really good. Actually
they kept to their bit and they could pass on your number. You don't
know what's going to come around in the future, you know, if you
do three years time or something, Yeah, that's it. I mean handing
out your number, you might not get work, like you just said,
straight away. But in a couple of years ago, there's that dead plight
builder did a really nice, clean job. All the lads weren't swearing on
site. Let's give him a call. CV's about how do you go about
vetting a customer, because I've often worked for clients who have thought initially were
quite nice and things like that and then have turned out to be an absolute
nightmare. So how do you go about trying to quote for a job but
you actually don't really want the job, and you think, I actually don't
really like this client and I don't want to work for them. Yeah,
it's happened. Yeah, normally, what I've found is normally when you're outside,
say you're doing a job, and you're outside of their house and you're
doing you're doing the brick work, and you're not really they're absolutely great,
they're fine, they're no problems. It's sort of when you sort of go
inside and you end up that's going to take walls down and steals, they
just seem to get get a bit funny then, don't they. Yeah,
they really do, because you are knocking about someone's house. I've had it
recently. I've put three what eight meter steals in someone's house and I said,
listen, and we're going to be coming in. I gave him notice.
I gave him about five Now, I gave Hi about three days notice
plus the weekend. So yeah, five days. I said, listen.
On Monday, we're going to be turning up. All the steals are here,
all the equipments here. We're going to start cutting. We're going to
start taking down walls. We'll start knocking through your house, propping up all
your ceilings. Ideally, it'll be lovely if you could empty the cupboards and
sort out your kitchen, just so nothing's like in our way and nothing you
like gets damaged and now I turn up on Monday, the kitchens are absolutely
rammed. Everyone's having breakfast sat around, they're dining table. So yeah,
that's a pain, an't it. Yeah, you just have to be professional.
Really, don't you fight your town? Maybe you don't want to fall
out for the sake of it. Yeah, definitely, And especially like you
said, when he gets towards the end of the job, they're probably a
bit tired of having all the work done, so the messiest and hardest part
is not through. So making sure you're still like courteous and quite respectful all
the way through the job is probably one of the best ways to continue winning
work and things like that. Yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah sad
Well, James, thank you so much for joining me today. I've had
a fantastic chat with you, so I do appreciate you coming on today.
Yeah. Thanks. Thanks. Radio The Brick Laying Show podcast with is He
the Bricky joining me finally is Off the Tools founder and trades business coach Wayne
Vettis Are you all right there? Wayne? Hi? Ah, thanks for
having me again. How I'm doing Yeah, really good? Thank you really
good. So Wayne, what advice would you give to a brick laying business
to stand out from the rest and to win work. Bro. The biggest
thing for me to stand out is is to be different. And being different
can come in different in lots of different forms obviously, but as as a
given you're going to be good at your job, yeah, as you're going
out on your own, So I'm not going to wake time talking about that.
So to stand out amongst a busy crowd, you need to look different,
you need to act differently, So looking at how you communicate with customers.
You know, we all know the cliche builder that turns up at the
job, you know, with the builders barm hanging out and all of that
normal stuff, scruffy looking, you know, try to try to distance yourself
from that sort of more cliche builder. I did, yeah, stereotypical builders.
Yeah, I know exactly what you say. It's nice to be different.
Smart, yeah yeah, yeah, definitely looking smart when you go to
quotes. Obviously, it's a messy train, gosh. You know, you're
not going to be able to big keep clean while you're working, but you
can do little things like have a clean pair of boots in the van,
a clean jumper to put on for when you when you finished your work and
you might be going out to quote for the for the next job. And
more importantly, most customers fear being let down. So if you can reassure
them, if you can build into the conversations you're having at the early stages
that you're reliable. Obviously you've got to meet meet these standards, of course,
but mention it because if you're if you're talking about it, that will
give the customer confidence that do you know what this guy knows what he's on
about, this girl knows what he's on about. So, yeah, you've
got to try to be that bit different and that bit better than than those
around you. And I don't mean in the physical sense of building the brick
wall or building the extension. Is everything around that, yeah, it basically
Yeah, it's basically judging a book by its cover, and you want to
look the best that book can look one hundred percent. So obviously networking is
really important to get a lot of new jobs in and to gain new customers.
So what's one of the best ways to network in your local area?
And how can you network efficiently? So I see that there has been two
types of networking, So I'm going to talk about the more traditional networking that
some of you may have heard of. There's lots of big groups and local
groups that you can go where you basically sit in the room and you're surrounded
by other business owners in the local area and you'll discuss what you do and
how you can help each other. So that can be very, very lucrative
as long as you put the effort in. You know, as with anything,
nothing comes for free. You've got to be participating. You've got to
be really part of that community if you decide to go down that more traditional
networking route. But what excites me about networking is the more untapped network in
which I don't hear a lot of people talk about. And I believe this
will really help sort of the listeners here is you're most of you guys and
girls are going to be in a building sight or are surrounded by other trades.
Okay, those other trades are doing work customers that probably need your services
too, So I call it internal networking. And what I mean by that
is if you're working somewhere and there's a chippy and he's a good lad or
good girl and you know, does a great job, speak to them,
tell them that you're looking for more work. Now ask them if they can
recommend a couple of clients to you, you'll reciprocate. And if you can
build out a sort of mini network of skilled trades people that are all helping
each other. And if the brick layers at a job and the customer mentions
that they might need a sparky, and you've got a sparky that is part
of that mini community that you're trying to build, you can recommend them and
then vice versa. And it's so powerful if you can get the right sort
of group of people. You don't want too many, but you don't want
too little. And everyone has to sort of participate in it, because you
know, otherwise it becomes one sided. But if you can find sort of
five to six people from different trades and you all sort of commit, and
you're all you're all decent people and want to do decent work and and grow
a business, it costs nothing. Yeah, no, definitely. I mean,
I mean I've been doing that for years, subconsciously doing it. You
know, I know good plumbers. I say, listen, use this plumber,
used them all of my jobs. And then I'll get a phone call
from so and so saying, oh, this plumber's recommended you. I don't.
I just use him because he's a good lad. I didn't even really
think about it for myself. But like you just said, having that group
of people who are recommending you to all their clients because they're going to have
five clients, and then you know so and so and so on. So
it's a good way to network just by having some mates in different trays to
recommend you to other people. Definitely, and yes, one hundred percent agree
it happened subconsciously for a lot of people. But the real power in it
is if you make it conscious. So if you if you bring it to
the front of your mind and you and really think about it and find the
right people that will assist everybody, then that collaboration between all the different trains
is very, very powerful. I've seen it time and time again with the
clients that I work with, where when they start to form these relationships and
sort of not formalized I don't I don't want like you don't want it too
official or anything, but you need to sort of have a gentleman's gentleman,
Yeah, you know we're going to push you. You push up. Yeah,
and then you know, you can always incentivize it. I give my
laves like a little drink, even if it's fifty quid hundred quid, you
know, and then that just gets you know, more and more. So
oil on the machine, I call it. Yeah, that's it. That's
it. So nowadays a lot of things are all online. Note, we
advertise online, We put everything on social media. Do you think it's really
important for brit lay and businesses to have a strong online presence? Yes and
no. So I'm going to contradict myself a little bit here. So one
side of my book brain says, yes, you know, we're in twenty
twenty three. You know, you need to be having all your socials up
to date, you need to be having work did out, their content put
out. But realistically, how many customers are actually watching that compared to how
many other trades people that are watching it? Yeah, no, I'm exactly
saying. Obviously I have YouTube and Instagram and a lot of other trades people
watch my videos. Barely any clients watching videos, I think in all this
time, I mean I've got quite a few jobs from social media, but
a lot of it's from word of math and not from Instagram and YouTube and
actually actually things like that. Yeah, I think it's you should be doing
something and if you enjoy it, then great, jump in and really go
through it. You'll see. Over the last sort of four to five years,
there's been a huge growth in what people call influencers, and these are
just trades people that are showcasing what they do and how they do it.
And yes, definitely if you enjoy doing that and you can enjoy putting that
content out, crack on. If you don't enjoying it, then I still
think there's that you should be doing something. Yeah, even if you just
posting pictures off your work. You know, this is a wall we go
you know, so and so exactly. No, definitely, So what about
once you've won the job, once you've won a quote, how can we
make sure that we are keeping you know, clients and customers happy and try
to meet their expectations. So I've been in the construction industry twenty years over
twenty years now, and for me, if I had to sort of boil
it down to one thing that sort of separates the good from the bad and
the good from the average, it's communication. So we we encourage that like
when as soon as that customer enters our ecosystem, So whether they've just phoned
us, whether they've emailed us, whether they've dropped us an inquiry for our
website, we want to communicate with them to the best of our ability,
So we encourage people to if you've booked an appointment, send a reminder.
There's systems out there that automate this, but if you haven't got the funds
available to look at systems quite yet, you can do it simply yourself by
making sure you're organized, having a decent electronic diary. Google Calendar is completely
free, and have this. You can do everything I'm going to talk about
on it on that. So book your appointments in give time frame. Never
give exact times, because you're giving yourself for rooms to fail if you try
and tell someone you're going to be there at five, when you know the
traffic and the school runs and everything are going to be coming out. So
communicate the timeframe so the customer has the expectation that it's not an exact time.
Text when you're on the way when you've been maybe drop them another email
just saying thank you for taking the time out to go through your job.
We'll be in touch in the next couple of days with a quote. So
again you're setting that expectation that the customer isn't just sat there wondering, oh
is this guy getting back to me? Am I going to hear anything.
If you set out the intentions to the customers, not only you be exceeding
what most people do, you're just building good relationships with that level. So
communication at every step of the way. If the weather's bad, get in
touch as soon as possible, and if you're not going to be there,
if you're running late, just send a message to say that I'm going to
be half an hour late. All of these small things are what the customer
remembers. They really do make a difference. Like say, if I say
to a client, oh, I'll be there for four o'clock, but there's
loads of traffics, I'll give them a text to say, listen, mate,
you know so and so, and I'll just be honest, loads of
traffic I'll be there at this time and just keep them up today, because
you don't want people stood around or waiting in for their potential builder turn up.
And it doesn't leave a good first impression. No, it definitely doesn't.
And I always look at myself so like, if I'm sat at home
waiting for a delivery to turn up and there's no tracking link and there's no
idea that it's going to come in the morning, in the afternoon, what
time start, I'm just frustrated. I'm starting to get angry and annoyed with
that company when all it would is a text message to say, right,
your delivery will be out between two and four. All right, brilliant.
I know where I am. I can crack on with my day. I
don't have to think about it. I know that they're coming, and that's
what If I'm like that with something, my customers are no different. We're
all customers to something in our lives, aren't we? So now, one
hundred percent No, you could not be more right there, Wayne, Right
now, just before I let you go, Wayne, can you just tell
us about some of the services you offer with off the tools and do you
want to tell us a little bit about it? Yes? So they basically
I come from a plumbing and heating background. I've been in that industry for
over twenty years, and I decided that I wanted to start helping trades people
grow businesses and get the infrastructure right in their business. So we do a
range of different things, from one off meetings to twelve month programs where where
you invest time, money and effort in becoming better at running a business,
growing a bit business, expanding a business, whatever stage you're at, we
can help. It's me, I say, wee loosely, it's me and
my wife. My wife helps with a bit of admin, but you'll be
working directly with me. Yeah, and the yeah, the purposes is that
most trades people will spend anywhere between two to five years learning how to become
a builder, how to become a bricklayer, how to become a plumber,
whatever it might be. But we never, we never invest any time or
money in how to become a business person. And that's where I step in.
And then obviously there's other coaches as well. You know, I recommend
that if you're if you're looking to grow a business, you should look to
have some support, some sort of coach or mentor that can help you avoid
the obstacles where possible. Sometimes is they're unavoidable and you've got to go through
them. But with a good coach you can learn some of the mistakes and
avoid a lot of hardship. And it's a no brain. You wouldn't become
a sparky without learning how to be a sparky. And unfortunately, in the
business world, people become business people without learning how to be a business person.
So enter off the Tools. If you want to find out more,
head over to the website Off Thetools dot co dot uk. Ah, thank
you so much for joining us today, Yuane. I really appreciate it my
pleasure. Thanks for having me the builders station Biggs Radio. You can find
loads of other great podcasts about the trade and construction at Fix Radio dot co
dot UK. I hope that last couple of episodes have helped you out.
I know I've definitely learned a few bits and bobs, so thank you so
much for listening. I greatly appreciate it and I'll see you later.