What is Krack Lakin Barbar Knox listeners, I am Dan FAVALLEI coming at you
without my fantabulous co host Adam frommel I am however, super pleased and excited
as always to be joined by Salmon al Lee, who covers the Houston Rockets
and the NBA at March for the Clutch Points app. We get in and
he's also the co host of the Red Nation Hoops podcast. Follow him on
Twitter at Salmon A Lee NBA. That's at SA L M A n A
l I NBA. Great follow on Twitter. We're going to be ranking the
futures of the NBA's rebuilding teams and we narrowed it down to eight rebuilding teams,
trying to not include squads that are inadvertently bad or aren't really rebuilding even
though they're not having the best season. And we get into the criteria.
It was a fun episode before we dive in, though. Just want to
remind BEG Pleading forty one to continue rating, reviewing, and subscribing to us
wherever you get your podcasts. That's a great way to help out the show.
It also helps us out a ton when you recommend us to people that
you know who like hoops or don't know who like hoops, as well as
actually putting in ratings and reviews on iTunes to help us on those charts.
Join our discord channel. It is in the podcast description. We have a
lot of fun in there, including live game campfires. I haven't done one
of those this week, but I'll schedule another one shortly. Follow us on
YouTube, YouTube dot com s or Chartwknox. We will come up. That
link is also in the description. Follow us on Twitter at Hardwood Knox.
That is enough out of me, though, Let's dive into ranking the futures
of the NBA's eight rebuilding teams with Salmon. Ali Salomon, Welcome back to
the Hardwoo Knox podcast. Thank you for hopping on, specifically this time on
short notice, because the Houston Rockets and Jay and Green specifically beating up on
the downtrodden, out of hope, lifeless listless Lakers inspired me to want to
have a certain podcast idea. You were kind enough to hop on and do
it with me, so I'm excited. But first and foremost, how are
you doing? I'm doing all right, man, I got a positive COVID
test. Five minutes to go, I'm pretty confident, and I gave it
to my brother too. I think people are digging up old articles for me
and with you know, posting screenshots of headlines on Twitter without context. So
life's good right now. I'm doing great. I'm doing great. How about
you? Look you didn't. I gave you an opportunity to tell me what
was happening before we started recording, and so you're throwing this on me.
Now, are you sure you're okay to proceed? Yeah? Yeah, I'm
good. I'm good. Do I sound okay? My throats, my throat's
a little bothersome, but I feel good. You sound you sound fine?
But I just I sort of feel like despotic having someone who just returned to
positive COVID test come on and talk about what is It's a fucking game,
So I appreciate you powering through it, but I would like our listener show.
I did not demand it, So no, no, you didn't.
You didn't even know until I told you just now that I wanted to spring
it on you just to see how you'd react. On the bright on the
bright side, it does sort of give you some teflon shielding against any bad
takes you might deliver now because if people disagree, He's like, look,
I had COVID. I didn't know what was going on. So when you
call the Rockets or identify them as having the best future in the NBA among
rebuilding teams, that's what you can use if as to inoculate yourself should people
disagree with you. Oh wow, is that what I'm gonna do today?
Yeah, it's it's gonna be interesting. Let's see, let's see how this
goes. I think you know what's interesting about COVID is like every you know
you have it right, Like you know you have it, but you have
to go confirm it. And that's the miserable part, Like you have to
tell you have to have someone tell you what you already know inside, and
that sucks because I can I can already tell my food was already starting to
lose its taste, my throat was messed up, I had a fever,
and like I still had to go to the stupid PCR drive through to confirm
what I already knew. Yeah, that's tough. I do think they're probably
sentences where you don't know you have it, which is the bigger problem.
And there's also just the fear of you might have something else, but the
symptoms are so intertwined with COVID that you're concerned that you have it. For
me, when I had it, the dead giveaway was a body aches like
I've never had before. Those were those were the hardest part of me sliding
through that. So we wish you a speedy recovery here, and like I
said, I appreciate you continuing to power through. And you know what's interesting,
those body aches actually felt familiar, which is kind of why I knew
I had it. They felt familiar to after I got my second dose,
Like like after I got my second dose, I felt similar body aches and
I was like, Okay, yeah, this is COVID, Like this just
feels very similar to how I felt dead. My god, I still can't
believe you're on the podcast doing this, but I'm excited. I think you
did my show with COVID before. I feel like it's happened. Maybe I
was sick. I don't know. I was doing appearance as the way I
had COVID. I can't even remember. But what is time anymore? Though?
Though I did bring you on to rank basically the futures of the leagus
rebuilding teams, and you and I had an interesting back and forth about which
teams should qualify as that, and so we ultimately landed on the Pacers,
Pistons, Magic, the and then in the West the Blazers, Spurs,
Thunder Rockets. And this was the point of contention the Sacramento Kings, who
are more of an inadvertently hopeless sort of like the Knicks or like stuck in
the Middle Wizards. But I we're gonna include them, and this this eight
team listic goal, because I do think you're right. They they're rebuilding and
just might not know it or be acting like it. Right And and the
reason I asked you to include them many ways because I looked at the list
and I was like, Okay, if if San Antonio and Portland are going
to be on here, then Sacramento definitely belongs on here, right Like that,
those teams are much older, they have more veterans. And so even
if I, you know, may not may not agree with the concept,
you you kept it not enough to where like, Okay, all these teams
fit under the umbrella that you're talking about. I mean, the Kings could
easily fit under any umbrella, just because they might they have a little bit
of the Pelicans in them where they are trying to make the play in It's
just that the Pelicans have the talent to do so and the Kings do not
at the moment. And you know, for anyone, this is not I
want to clarify, like, we're not looking specifically at the worst teams here,
which is why the Knicks aren't on here, which is why the Lakers
aren't on here. Anyone that's like inadvertently bad this season or wasn't intending upon
rebuilding. The Kings were just the iffious inclusion though, because the Blazers in
the Spurs at least made moves at the trade deadline that signaled the direction which
they were headed. The Kings went the opposite way with the Domasa Bonus trade,
and it just confounds everything even further of what was already sort of this
hazy, obfuscated, disaligned direction. Yeah, yeah, definitely complicated things.
But I do have updated opinions on that trade, so I guess we can.
I mean, like, where are we going with this? Are we
going bottom to top? Were we going top to bottom? Let's go bottom
to top, Let's keep let's keep your listeners so who do you have it
at number eight Portland? For Portland, it's like, what are you selling
me on? Right? Like, this team doesn't really know whether they're rebuilding
or whether they're reshuffling, right, And I kind of kind of I kind
of feel like they think they're reshuffling, but you look at you look at
what they've been this entire season, and it's like, yeah, they should
probably just go full bore, rip the band aid off, trade Dame and
and eventually trade Narcic because I don't see a team. I don't see a
pathway for this team getting back to contendership if they were ever there. I
don't think they were ever there at any point since LaMarcus Aldridge left anyways,
Like I think this team just should probably tear it down and that, and
like I look at their roster, their prospects, it's like, so,
again, what do you selling me on Anthony Simons this year? Little?
Like I actually like Trendon Watford, but it's like he's not like it's not
like he's gonna get an opportunity once nur Gets returns, right, Like he's
gonna go back to the bench and they're gonna go back to We're gonna go
back to pretending like the Blazers are this sneaky playoff team again, right,
Like would you that every year the Blazers are gonna sneak up on everybody and
they never do. I don't disagree with where you put them. I think
they have just opted for flexibility. They're going to have, you know,
twenty plus million dollars in cap space this summer. They have that huge trade
exception everyone's linked to Jeremy grant to it. I'm with you in the sense
though that their their asset well is sort of underwhelming. You trade CJ.
McCollum and Norman Powell and don't really recoup a ton of first round draft pick
equity. And I think you could argue that the CJ. McCollum trade was
a win win for all parties involved. Actually, but the Norman Powell trades
to me, remains inexplicable. You didn't need to make it to dump to
duck the tax. Excuse me, especially knowing that you were going to make
the CJ. McCollum deal, which we all knew, or we know that
they knew they were going to make anyway, and you didn't turn it into
like any high end youngsters, I do think there are more intriguing players on
their roster. It's definitely opened up more of an opportunity for Anthony Simons,
who before his I think he's a hip injury right now. He was absolutely
bawling. But it's definitely fair to question where is this team headed because you
still have Damian Lillard, and I know people think that they're just going to
trade him. I'm of the mind that unless he asks her out, they're
not going to move him, and so that puts them in the That puts
them in this weird it's too hard. Yeah, it puts them in this
weird situation where, Okay, you're probably gonna keep this year's pick because you're
gonna successfully tank enough. But where do we go from here? What you
have this let's call it a top like five or seven lottery pick five.
That's what you end up with plus Dame plus resigning Anthony Simons. It is
tough to identify the core thereafter. Even if you're intrigued by some of their
youngsters, and like Windlow has played well, Keian Johnson's had some moments for
them. Nasire Little was interesting before he was dealing with yet another injury.
But it is hard to spot and Josh Hart, you know that's salad.
It's just hard to spot core pieces and there's no guarantee the flexibility they have
turns into anything. I admire Joe Cronin for sort of choosing a direction for
this team. Where I think the cardinal sin for the Blazers was when nil
o'shay constantly aimed for these singles and doubles on the trade market rather than making
that swing for a triple or a homer. And so you look at all
a lot of his past moves, Larry Ant's junior, Robert coming to Norman
Powell. Those are all trades that individually, in their vacuum were quality deals.
But you either missed the point to capitalize on CJ. McCollum's trade value,
or you just never went all in around CJ. McCollum and Damian Lillard
not really at least not authentically enough to enter that level of sustainable contention.
There were probably a couple of seasons where I mean, they did make the
Western Conferences, but there are probably couple of seasons where they were in that
click, but it was never really this, you know, persisting status,
So I am with you there. I think I have them at number eight
as well, just because I'm I'm so confused as to what they're doing.
I did initially have them though, at number seven, because I have the
Kings at number eight. So I think there's a case to have I have
to have Portland lower. It's just they still do have Damian Lillard and whatever
let's say they do eventually move him, whatever he recous, plus Anthony assignments,
plus this year's draft pick. They did get an extra first rounder in
the season mccollin trade as well. It's it's at least more of a basis,
and I think I appreciate the clarity at least with which they're operating where
they've decided, No, we don't know what the selexibility is going to get
us, but we're either rebuilding around Dame or we're just rebuilding period. Right,
they can hedge, they can hedge their backs if they do choose to
go into a rebuild. If Dame does demand a trade, what I'll say
is like to put an asterisk next to all these teams and this this entire
list. Uh, this could change depending on what happens. First of all,
there's a major trade, Like if game gets traded and they get a
major haul for this, I have the right to change this, right if
if they win to the Blazers win the lottery, Right if any of these
teams have great lottery luck, or if a player at the top of the
draft falls to them, right and they get lucky at the draft, we
have the right to change our list around because we just can't predict those things
right now. Where this is a list based on March tenth, right,
and a month, which is also why this was a good timing immediately after
the trade deadline, and so I approached it like you did. Whereas if
we were just betting and ranking on the betting on these futures, ranking these
teams futures today, That's just how it is, I think the more than
anything. Yes, we don't know what's gonna happen over the offseason, but
this is probably something that could be relitigated immediately after the draft lottery perhaps,
Yeah, yeah, for sure, I mean, because I mean, these
flattened lottery just opened up so much like we have team is jumping from like
ten to the top of the draft, and that's just how it is.
That's that's how the NBA wants it to be. You know, we could
talk about the Flatten Lottery and stuff like that, whether or not it was
that it was actually a good idea, or whether they're not actually hurts these
small markets while they're trying to rebuild. But that's a different conversation. Well,
today, March tenth, I have the Blazers at at eighth on this
list because I just don't believe in that core of Dame and Nurkics and I'm
not confident, Like I've seen the Blazers with caps plays before I got I
know what they do right, Like, obviously this is a different general manager,
but I'm not confident based off the fact that they promoted from within that
they're gonna do anything different. I have the King's last because they have not
provided clarity of direction. And that's a problem when you went all in at
the trade deadline. If you were going to and this is maybe the most
basic way of looking at it, if you're going to trade someone in the
second year of his rookie scale contract, it has to be with the assent
of immediate urgency and improving your immediate position. They didn't do that. With
Domas Sabonis. This season, they're not going to make the play in They're
probably gonna finish twelfth or thirteenth in the West, like just like we all
predicted. And the biggest victory, or the best way to frame this is,
I think that the Bonus is a good player was still the best player
in this deal. He just said to the athletic he wants to stay in
Sacramento. But you have shrunk your timeline. You also ostensibly made this decision
of what we need to choose between the Iron Fox or Tyres Haliburton, when
that was never a decision you needed to make. And so I recognize they
didn't give up any draft equity for Sabonus, and they're gonna have another really
good draft pick this summer, or at least they at least they should.
And they have the Aaron Fox who's been playing, By the way, anyone
who hasn't watched the Arn foxy the defense still comes and goes, mostly doesn't
exist, but he's just been annihilating people on offense. I still believe in
him. You have Sabonus, You have those two. I think you could
reasonably say two guys that in any given season, can be one of the
two twenty five to thirty best players in the league, But like, what
do you have beyond that? Harrison Barnes is fantastic, there's weird overlap long
term with Rashaun Holmes. There you don't have a ton of wings. I
think davy On Mitchell's an interesting prospect and someone who you know, you look
over his past couple of weeks. He's can be a force around the basket,
and we know what he does on defense, but just like, what
is his best case outcome for this team? And then there's also just not
a lot else thereafter. And I don't know, again on March tenth,
how you trust this team to make the right decisions moving forward When even the
nicest compliment you can give the Domas move you still have to relay it within
the context of this remains super questionable. And I just don't trust them to
ever prioritize the big picture properly enough. This was a situation where I think
that people wanted the Kings to do something anything that suggested they weren't okay,
absolutely in the bottom of the middle, bottom whatever you want to call it,
and they did do something anything but it was somehow just not clarifying to
me at least in any sense. So they are a team I think that
can improve their position a great deal between now and the start of next season,
but just after the trade deadline. What we've seen from them since the
offense hasn't even been that efficient since the trade deadline. Domas Tabronis is not
shooting well on jumpers. They're just still too many question marks with this roster,
and I think you sort of have to take in the reputation of an
organization that perpetually cannot get out of its own way. Yeah, I have
them a little higher. I guess we'll talk about it when I get when
we get a little high area. Oh yeah, a little high. Well,
did you want to just move up to my next team or what I
had at seven? Yeah? So I think the best way to frame it
now is let's go through yours and then I'll just talk about if, like
there's any major differences with mine, so we don't spoil anything too ridiculous.
So who did you have at number seven? At number seven, I had
the Spurs. Okay, So so here here's my thing. I like de
John Ta Murray. I don't love de jon Ta Murray. I'm not confident
in the jump shot. I think he's probably one of the best players on
this list of teams, right, Like, if you're if you're just ranking
the players that are on these teams, he's probably one of the better ones.
I just I'm looking at the rest of their core, and yes,
I'm I'm happy that they finally chose a direction and that they're finally going to
lean into a rebuild. But there's their players are still kind of too old.
Like you're like, we're talking they're their best. Their cornerstone talents right
are Yaka Purdle and Dejante Murray. Those guys are twenty five and twenty six,
respectively. Like it's it's just I don't know, Like I think when
we're talking about futures, I feel like they're gonna flat line at some point,
unless they plan on tradeing Yacca Purdle, and in which case we can
come back to this and talk about whatever return they got for him, or
of a return they get through John Day Murray. I just think I'm looking
at them right now, and you know at takeupton dot Com they have the
seventh best lottery odds. That's not good enough for me to get excited about
what they have going on right now, especially consider you're gonna be taking in
a nineteen year old to add to these mid twenty guys. Right I think
there's still more of a tear down that needs to be had. I like
Kildon Johnson, you know, I think he can fit into whatever core they
build. He's young enough. I think he's you know, he's shown enough
promise to where like, Okay, yeah, you can probably keep him around.
I think they're still in the tear down phase. I think they started
some of that obviously at the trade deadline, but they still't need to advance
past this for me to move them up my list. That's all fair.
You didn't say enough nice things about Devin Vassell in my opinion, but they're
actually don't have them that much. It's not an egregious miss I have him
at fifth on this list, and maybe that just says how I feel about
John Day Murray. I also think you can trust their player development more than
a lot of these other teams, and I think the fact that they're committed
to rebuilding at this point is a big deal. And the Derek White trade
was more of a harbinger of that than anything they've done, even dating back
to the Collive trade when they still prioritize kind of hanging around in the middle.
They've opened up just you know, Kelton Johnson's used has been a little
bit different since the trade. They've thrown more ball screens for Devin Vassell.
We've seen Trey Jones and Josh Primo a little bit more. I do agree
with you that Dejan Say Murray is the closest they come to having sort of
that blue chip cornerstone. I don't know that we know enough about the other
guys to say definitively they don't have another option there. You're probably looking at
Basel or Primos your most likely answer, and that's a little underwhelming. So
I have trouble, excuse me, putting them in the top half, mostly
because of everything you said. They are flexible moving forward. They've done a
great job of mining talent, quality talent. But to look at this roster
and envision there being this tent pole player or two in prospect form, it
is tough to get there. Maybe that changes that this year's draft, But
they also just have the look and feel of a team that's gonna still be
in part because they have Murray, but also because they've done a good job
grooming a lot. I don't think people understand how good Devin Vassel is unless
they're watching or excuse me, like in San Antonio watching the Spurs consistently enough.
Even Trey Jones is just someone that I think he's gonna be a rock
solid, if not better NBA player, has like the pull up MIDI work
in form, has shown that he can throw some different types of passes and
knows how to work the pockets there. So I'm I'm higher on them immediately
than a lot of these teams. But I tried to forecast more into the
future, and I'm with you there that there's there's the potential for this to
flatline, even if it's by design. They might recognize our ceiling in the
West with this core where let's say, you know, even regardless of who
they draft or signed this summer, let's say they look at this and say,
we're gonna get to a point where Deshanta Murray, Devin Vassell, and
Kelton Johnson are three best players. They just might decide that that tops out
as a five seed in the Western Conference and sort of have to to start
over. And I will say, what gives them just some a little bit
more cache for me if they wanted to go out and make a trade,
just having the twenty twenty eight swap with Boston and the Derek White deal and
they do have some of these extra first round picks now, they could accelerate
their position fairly, reasonably and more significantly than a team like the Kings did.
To me. Yeah, And to be clear, like I don't hate
what they have going on, right, I just I like the direction.
If you were asking, like do you like what direction this organization is going
in? Yeah, they were. They had one of my favorite trade deadlines
out of everybody on fifth February to the tenth right, Like they killed it.
I thought they killed it, And that swap is part of the reason
they killed it, Like they just seeing the Spurs like behave that way.
The way that they did at the deadline was so weird. It was like
it was like I was in an alternate universe watching them trade for first round
picks left and right. But that's what you gotta do. Like you're not
good enough to make the play in tournament, you're long term, you're not
gonna You're probably not gonna make the playoffs, so it's it's better to just
air down now before you know it gets out of hand and your players don't
have value. So I like what. I like where they're going. I
don't hate where they're at. I like the other teams on this list more.
That's more where I'm at. I think what you sort of spoke to
there. If we were to do this in tears. There are maybe two
teams on this eight team list where I don't like their directions. They're gonna
be teams that are better than these squads right now. You know, visv
The Lakers, the Knicks, the Wizards rum lower on their overall directions.
I think the Kings and the Blazers, and that's more born from a combination
of distrust or just uncertainty. Are the only two teams on this list are
on like either don't necessarily understand what they're doing, don't trust what they're doing,
don't have faith and what they're doing. Everyone else, I would say,
has at least position positioned themselves fairly well. And so that's like when
you're putting the Spurs at you had them at seven, that's not really an
insult because it sounds like, especially if you're higher on the Kings than I,
and it sounds like the Lasers are the only team on this list whose
direction you don't necessarily appreciate or understand. Yeah, I just I don't.
I don't, well, I understand it. I don't agree with what the
players are doing. I guess that's that's how I would phrase it. I
get that they're trying to be flexible. I just kind of think that the
directions obvious. They just don't want to go there yet. And you know,
like I think that you understand what they're doing, because it also means
that you understand what the Kings are doing, and that's the team on this
ride just don't have a hold on what the hope here is. Well,
we'll get we'll get there. We'll get there. Uh, it might be
a little bit bit of time before we get there. We'll get there.
No, Like, like I think, I think the Spurs aren't a good
spot. You know, they should just keep it up. I have no
problem with how they've operated the past twelve months. What do you have at
number six? Orlando? So I really like Jen Jalen sucks. I realize
this rookie year has not been is he's not been one of the best rookies.
It's it's pretty clear. I still think he has the potential to be
a star caliber guard in the NBA. I love his mental makeup, I
love his intangibles. I love what he could become as a defender. I
love that he clearly has team leadership qualities about him that I think will translate
well into the basketball court. He seems like a big game guy. I
realize I'm talking about everything but what he's actually done this year on the court.
But I think I think that will come. I think that will come.
It takes a long time for point guards to develop. Franz Wagner obviously
one of the biggest surprises of this year's draft. He's probably, by the
way third I think on my Rookie of the Year ballot right now, I
don't. I think a lot of people want him ahead of Scottie Barnes.
I can't get there at the moment. I think it's gonna be tough figuring
out Scotty Barnes versus Wagner versus Kay Cunningham. But that's neither here nor there.
Please continue, I apologize for interrupting. No, no, no,
no, I get it. Like, here's the thing, he's been that
good, Like he's warranted a top five Rookie of the Year spot. Like
he's been amazing, and it's it's kind of amazing. It's kind of crazy
that he failed to the Orlando where he did. And I think, you
know, I like, I like their big I just think they have one
too many. I think they're both playing the same position, right, Wendell
Carter and Mo Bamba, Like that's superple with pick one, right, pick
one trade the other one, get some value, and and that's a decent
kind of out. I don't want, I don't I don't want to say
they have a core going, but they have the makings of a core going.
And I like their young talent better than everybody below them on this list.
You know, I actually thought about putting them ahead of the Spurs.
I have them at number six as well, so we match up here.
I considered putting them at five based off a lot of what you said.
Friends. Wagner has had the better season than Jail and Suggs. I think
Suggs still clearly has the higher ceiling. They've they've sort of he's dealt with
some injuries too, and he's been one of the most inefficient shooters in the
league, but they've saddled him with a lot like this is someone that this
is a team, excuse me, that still doesn't have a clear floor general
hierarchy, and a lot of that has fallen on Joe and Suggs this year.
I've still liked what I've seen when you look at a lot of his
decision making going downhill, the physicality with which he can play there. I
do think he projects as a good defender eventually. Like you said, there,
there's just and look, friends, Wagner, the dude is just does
a lot of things well. I don't know if he'll ever be dominant,
but there's a finesse to his game. There's also a fuck you to his
game. When you look at him putting the ball on the floor, you
see guys bounce off of him. He's shooting like almost fifty percent on his
floaters. I think you would probably make the case, or should make the
case, that he's been the single most impactful or let's say consistent rookie,
let's say consistent rookie on the offensive end this year. So he is a
pick that I didn't appreciate in real time for them, and I think gives
them just a lot of different optionality moving forward. What I struggled to see
here is what the top end of this roster will eventually look like. It
just feels like there's a please go ahead, we're talking about all right,
we don't even talk about co Anthony. I like Co Anthony. Anthony's cool.
I think I think you think you'll be a good rotation caliber NBA guard
on a playoff team. I think he's good. I agree with you.
I look. I also still really like RJ. Hampton despite the season that
he has had, and but that more speaks to my point of it just
feels like a hodgepodge still here. And maybe I'll feel better once we get
a bigger sample from Mark el Folts under his belt. They still have not
had Jonathan Isaac hasn't played basketball basically two years at this point, right,
And maybe I'm waiting those question marks a little bit too much. I just
have a question of how it's all eventually going to come together for them on
offense, even though the fact that they play in the Eastern Conference might be
worth a little bit of a bump here because Isaac is essentially a defensive system
unto himself, and we've seen just a lot of good things at both ends
of the floor from Wendell Carter Junior this year. And so if you're working
off a front court of Carter, Isaac and Wagner, plus you have Sugs
and Anthony in the backward, like, that's an interesting lineup. I still
just I don't necessarily know the mode of operation there offensively. So while there's
a lot of names to like here, I still look at Jail and Suggs
is kind of the only potential blue chip cornerstone option. And it's not meant
to insult Franz Wagner, And I'm not trying to necessarily criticize Jonathan Isaac.
I just I haven't seen it from him on offense yet. He's just and
again it's been years at this point, but he is an incredibly limited offensive
player. They look they are a team that maybe could consolidate themselves into a
better position, not to mention the draft pick that they'll have this year,
like even Chumo Kiki, like those are all just interesting guys they have on
this Russer So if they wanted to they can go out and make a consolidation
trade. I just don't know if that's what they're thinking, and so I
do have them at six, but I considered putting them fifth with san Antonio
by virtue of being in the East and also just maybe having a lot more
flyers than san Antonio. It's just I like, once you get off of
if you want to go Murray versus Suggs long term, I think a lot
of people are probably just going to prefer Suggs because he's more of an unknown.
After that, though, once you sort of get to like the number
two and three and four guys on the team, I feel like I like
a lot of what san Antonio's dudes in that instance, Ken or might bring
to the table than I do when you look at Orlando. Yeah, we
should also mention that they have the worst record in basketball right now, and
if that continues, they're locking themselves into one of buoncro Ivy, home Grin
Smith or aj Griffin right like like that, that's a pretty good player to
lock yourself into, and I'm kind of projecting that as well into this ranking.
Right They're gonna get a really solid blue shift prospect and you know,
adding the adding that kind of player to this core, it's intriguing. It
makes them intriguing. And you know, I do agree that, or I
should say I can see the case for you saying that Dejant Murray is a
better prospect than anyone on this roster currently. It's just the age difference,
right, it's just the age that that kind of I'm I don't project much
more future growth onto Murray as I do for like Stugs, or as I
do for like Wagner, Right, and that's kind of why I can't get
there with as much with san Antonio as you. Yeah, and just so
over clear, I think Suggs is the better prospect because Murray is no longer
a prospect, and so Suggs is best case outcome I think is the chance
to I don't want to say nuke, but definitely exceed that of Murray's I
guess the best company being. I don't want to. I know, Magic
fans are passionate about how good Franz Wagner has been this season. If you're
asking me whether I prefer Devin Vassel or Franz Wagner long term, or Kelton
Johnson or Franz Wagner long term, once you start getting into those conversations,
I do feel more inclined to pick san Antonio there. And I'm not trying
to diminish what Frands Wagner has done this season. Like I said, he
has been probably one of the no worse than the fourth best rookie in my
personal opinion, and he's definitely been the most consistent rookie on the offensive end.
I just don't, you know, do you view him as a legitimate
building block. He's only twenty, so maybe I'm sort of limiting him too
much, and maybe I'm also dismissing, you know, after you know,
Okay, we have Suggs, we have Wagner, we have Isaac am I
dismissing the rest of this roster too much. I think Coland he's like this
really valuable, entertaining, useful microwave score. I think he's been miscast as
a primary ball handler a lot of the time in Orlando. I just I
like him, but it's just sort of where does he fit into the context
of a really good, too great team, And it feels like maybe he
might be better suited coming off the bench there. So just the weirdo pecking
order in their backcourt where they have all these options without a like a floor
general, not even saying a pass first point card, but just a floor
general segs probably still gives them the best chance of having that the absence of
that. I also think, you know, yeah, I like Wendel Carter
Junior. I like Jonathan Isaac. What are they top out at? Though?
If you're looking at just biggs and you know, whether you want to
call we know Wendel Carter Junior should be a five. Isaac could probably play
him five, but he's mostly a four. Just what is the ceiling on
that? Maybe I would feel differently if I had seen Jonathan Isaac play with
any semblance of recency. Yeah, there's a lot of defensive potential there right
in that front court that you're describing as well. When you when you throw
into sugs, uh you know, as your point guard defender that that's a
hell of a you know, potential defensive corps there. Uh yeah, I
agree with you on Coy Anthony. Coy Anthony is a guy. I you
know, I was careful not to describe him as a as a starter on
a championship team or a playoff team, because I don't think he's going to
become that. Like I think it's very KPJSK and that he probably has a
role that he's not qualified for right now. But you look at the rest
of the roster, who else you're throwing in there? Right I DI have
no problem with them doing what they're doing right now on the court. Long
term, they should probably think about, you know, how they handle the
ball handling responsibilities of Sugs versus Coy, Anthony versus Wagner. I like Sugs
more as a floor general type, so I'd like to see the ball in
his hands a little bit more, and he's gotten it this year. But
yeah, I have no problem what you just said there. The other thing
too, is they have two extra firsts in their chamber in twenty twenty three
from Chicago that is top was a top four protection and then the twenty twenty
five pick from Denver, and so that I think more than I would expect
those picks to be sort of black. I mean, the Chicago one's kind
of interesting, to be honest, but it gives them between that and just
sort of these guys you can talk yourself into on the roster away from the
top. You know, you don't have to move jail and Sugs or Franz
Wagner, but just the other dudes on this roster. That plus their pick
equity, plus the inbound like you said, they're gonna lock themselves into one
of the four best prospects probably this year. That does give them maybe some
more juice. And so I'm I'm almost considering vaulting them ahead of san Antonio.
I have to. That's a tough decision between six and five for me.
But who do you have at number five? Okay, number five?
I have Detroit? Like, wait, where did you have? I guess
we can do that later. Yeah, I like I like. I love
Kate cunning aam man. I love Kate Cunningham. I think he's I think
he has a potential to be a hugiocentric ball handler on a very good playoff
team. Like I really do believe that, Like I thought, I thought
that when he was drafted, that I had him in a tier of his
own during the draft. I still, you know, you know, maybe
Mobly has surpassed him, but like as a long term projection, but I
still really really like him. He's not shooting the ball particularly well, I
think he's like forty eight percent true shooting last time I checked. But he
is. He is pretty much the main reason I have Detroit here. I
like Sadik Bay. You know, Sadiq Bay is a good player. I
like Jeremy Grant. I think is obviously someone that probably isn't going to fit
into their long term timeline, but they have some wiggle room there. They
could probably keep him around, and you know, because he's not a major
player on their team right like long term, I think Cunningham is clearly a
bigger player on their team than Grant. Bagley's Obviously, if you're thinking of
Bagley as the prospect he was drafted for, you're going to be disappointed.
If you're looking at him for what he is at right now as a basketball
player at age twenty two. He's a good player. He's a good basketball
player. Isaiah Stewart's intriguing. I like, I like your core, but
it's more Kaid Cunningham more than anything else. And they're extremely young across the
board, which is really attractive to me because some of these prospects may hit
on a level that none of us are expecting. Because just the sheer volume
of young players they have, yeah, for sure. And Detroit with Detroit
has working against it is there's a big mystery box, and that might be
a kind way of putting it in Killy and Hayes. Maybe I'm reading too
much and I won't, you know, reveal where I have them just yet.
Maybe I'm placing too much stock and just you know, you've seen flashes
from my livers over the past few games. Marvin Badley has a lot good
there, but he is of course going to be a free agent this summer.
Sadique Bay that guy who can be sort of out of control at points,
but there's more ball skills there to him on offense, and you can
throw them on a lot of tough assignments defensively, I think for them.
And the final thing I'll say before we move on, just because I have
him in a different spot, Kay Cunningham is just the single most transcendent prospect
in this exercise right now, when you're looking at every single other team,
I think he is a lot better if you look at his best case outcome
than a jail and Green in Houston or even a Shake guil Just Alexander in
Oklahoma City and SGA is maybe more of an A step is not. Maybe
he's definitely more of an established quantity at this point, but Kay Cunningham is
going to control, even if sometimes subtly, every single aspect of the game
and do so at an incredibly high level. Even now there are you know,
some of the shooting percentages aren't great. He shot the ball a little
bit better as the year goes on, but you can all of a sudden
look up and this dude is twenty and five and it's you felt it,
but he just didn't realize how quickly it came because he's so effective at it,
and I don't know if it works against him optically, because it feels
like certain guys dominate the game more of an a smack your face style.
If it's a if it's an Evan Mobley or even even a Scottie Barnes who
has like these you know, has the ten of ten night in the first
half the other game. Kaid Cunningham feels like he could wind up flying under
the radar, in part because he plays in Detroit and I think there are
a lot of people that will just tune out of other pistons, but also
just because his game it feels like it's built too. I guess the best
way I can say it is he's built to dominate through his well roundedness rather
than necessarily just annihilate whatever is in front of him. No, I agree.
I agree he's not. The athleticism holds him back a little bit obviously,
but just the skill level all across the board, I'm confident that the
shooting will improve. I'm a believer in that jump shot and that guy is
gonna be a very good shooter in the NBA, just based off what I
saw from him as a prospect, uh, and the volume he was taking
as a prospect. I think that guy's gonna be a really good shooter.
And they also have the third best lot of yards as of right now,
so that's obviously a factor into this. Uh. You know, they're you
know, obviously they could drop. That's not secure, but that's that's a
good spot to where like you can guarantee like a top Tennish pick coming in
for them, and like it's it's you know, adding in a top Tennish
pick onto this current young core. I like it. I like what they're
doing. Uh. I think I think that front office is pretty capable.
They you've done some weird things with pick protections on draft picks, but like,
I think that's largely an inherited from Sam Presty and like some of the
creative stuff that they were doing Oklahoma City. So like, I like what
they're doing. I like what they're doing. They've been frisky, by the
way since like the middle of February six and three over their last nine they
have a below average offense and defense during that stretch, including a negative net
rating, but they've had just some nice victories, and like I said,
you can look into stain like seeing Isaiah Livers show flashes in certain moments.
Also, just Marvin Bagley's been fantastic there. I think you hit it on
the head though, and I appreciate sort of the creativity with which the front
office has worked the fact that they still don't have any future first coming their
way right now. That's a little bit weird, but I think, look,
the toughest part of any rebuild is to find the directional star who is
going to guide you or dictate where you go next. They've already done that,
and so to have the hardest part to me of any rebuild done,
I think that makes what they're going to do moving forward exponentially easier, And
we didn't even talk about and I guess you don't like they're eventually going to
get some sort of first round pick and prospect equity for for Jeremy Grant.
That will eventually happen. Yeah, it's possible. And also, like I
think, I think when you look at like what Kaide, so when you
when you project Kide cutting him on a playoff team, like, do you
see him more as like a complimentary star? Do you think he can be
like the ignition for an elade offense? Like where do you specifically see him?
I know it's a little off topic, but I'm curious. I see
him as the ignition of an offense, but someone who can also sort of
scale to that secondary role, if not because he's playing alongside a better player,
but maybe a more specific player who doesn't work off other people as well,
if you need him to work alongside someone who's super ball dominant. I
envisioned him being able to just plug and play into that role almost seamlessly.
And that I think when you're talking about someone who I view as if we're
I don't know how many players can be the best player on a championship team
like ten is probably the fair number to go right. And of those taps,
how many of them can just seamlessly work seamlessly work off of others.
I don't know that you're even going to get to you know a lot of
the yeah, a lot of the heliocentric guys and Luca Nantis and James Harden
or even a trade young it just feels like their teams are unwilling to move
him off the ball or can't and cunning him. To me, I'm not
saying he's going to be better than any or all of those guys, but
he you don't look at him and say that, And I think that's really
important and valuable. There's a flexibility there that may not exist with those other
top stars that you're talking about. I agree. I did have the Spurs
at five. We already talked about them. Who did you have at number
four? The Thunder? So I have the Thunder here at number four.
A lot of this is banking on Sam Presty as a general manager, to
be honest, like I yes, they do have some intriguing, intriguing young
talent, including Shay Gilgest, Alexander and Josh Kiddy. But I trust that
guy more than anybody on this list as a general manager. I think that
guy, uh, he can can rebuild. I think that guy knows what
the hell he's doing. I think he's a very good talent evaluator. And
obviously they have a top pick coming into them. I think I think Josh
Giddy has gotten to the point where he's slightly overrated now. I think he's
he was. The reason people were so high him at the beginning of the
season was because he was surprising, right It was surprising that okay, see,
he took him more they took him, and it was surprising that he
was as good to start the season as he was. But I don't see
him, you know, as a complimentary star ish kind of guy, and
I see him more as a complimentary star starter, Like I think he can
be a very good starter in the NBA. I think Jay Giljis has insane
upside. I mean, he's only twenty two, twenty three years old.
He's efficient right now, He's like forty Phil is a fifty five per century
shooting. The three point shooting is a little bit of a concern. But
I think you know, when you look at how he plays and and just
the ferocity at with which he attacks. I have no trouble buying him as
an efficient scorer in the NBA, and I think he's gonna I think he
has a potential to be like a complimentary star type of player. So they
already have a pillar there, and you look at the rest of obviously the
amount of picks that they have coming in, we can talk about that all
day, but in reality, it's because Presty is managed the ship that I
have him just high. They may not have higher they may not have a
higher talent pool and a team like Detroit, but I trust I trust them
more than a team like Detroit to rebuild. Yeah, there there's a lot
of misconceptions about Okase's rebuild, including that they're just the most egregious tankers in
the league. And I guess there are a lineups that go out there where
that sort of proves their point. But they've put together like a scrappy defense
and they're not bereft of just NBA prospects or yeah, forget about ptegular jobs
ader like. I'm kind of with you on Josh Giddy. There seems to
be a lot he's a lot of progress to make as a as a scorer,
and though I think he's probably been a little bit more aggressive than I
thought he would be, and positionally he's been fine on defense. He can
get you rebounds, and we know what he does as a passer. I
might be with you though, that's sort of if people think that he's been
like the third best rookie this year, I would I would push back pretty
firmly against that. They're just so I have him higher than this. So
my my fourth team and I juggled with this one. I will can we
stick with the under really quick? Yeah? But they're ability to find talent
off the scrap heap is incredible, Like lou Dort, Like his development story
is ridiculous, Like like he is legitimately someone that could be a starter on
a playoff team one day, right and they found him like out of nowhere.
Like I think that that kind of stuff always happens with this organization.
Uh, I'm not as high on tree Man as other people, but like
it's not really a big deal. Like their direction just it's very clear,
like and you're right, they're not trying to take they're just like Mark Dang
knows not out there. I like him. I think I think he's a
He's got a very Taylor Jenkins vibe to him, and that he may may
may not look like he's a good coach right now, but once they start
adding talent, I feel like he's going to be a pretty scrappy team.
Like he's gonna be able to put together really scrappy offense. Is that achieve
ahead of where they should be and that like that. You talk about player
development with the Spurs, I mean this organization has a history of awesome player
development, So yeah, I should want to close out there with the Thunder.
That's yeah. I have, like I said, I having a little
bit higher, so I'll get into them deeply, more deeply in a second.
My fourth place team though was the Rockets, and they have equity moving
forward when you look at all these inbound first they also have a couple of
risky seasons where they're first are going to be controlled by Okhoma City. I
think Jalen Green is that guy. I don't think he's the guy that you
where. I view Kay Gunningham as someone and maybe even Jalen Sungs is someone
who can initiate the entire offense of a good to great team. I don't
see that from Green. It comes the caveat that he's only a rookie,
and I do think he's gotten a little bit better at it as his game
has gotten more efficient, and then the level of difficulty just assigned to some
of his shots is absolutely mind melting to me. I look at the rest
of the roster, though, and Alperren Shangun has been a revelation as a
rookie. Josh Christopher is super pesky. And I'll appreciate any specific thoughts you
have on individual players from the Rockets, since you'd cover them so intimately obviously,
but like, where is the where is the high end talent? Aside
from Jalen Green, And I think you could probably make the same case about
the Pistons. It's just that I think Kate Cunningham is going to be just
a much higher end player there. And it's wife for spoilers, like the
Pistons are number three for me, so like they're right there with Houston and
so if you wanted to interchange those, I don't know that I would provide
a ton of pushback. It's just as many players as you can, like
on this team, whether it's a Josh Christopher Are you a Kevin Porter junior
believer? I think it helps that they have guys like Eric Gordon and Christian
Would. It's just one of those players do for you long term. You
probably should have moved both of them already. And then when you're looking at
just some of the quality, whether they're prospects or flyers on your team.
Yes, kJ Martin is interesting. Garrison Matthews was a nice fine. What
do those players ultimately do for you and how much do they nudge your needle
relative to your hierarchy within the rest of the league. Look, if my
guy who's Mon Garuba suddenly gets the play next year and is a superstar,
and then Houston does have their own pick this season, maybe I'm underwaiting that
a little bit. I just think there are more pitfalls for a team that
when you look at after Jalen Green doesn't have a ton of directional talent,
And if you don't have a lot of that type of prospect equity after Jalen
Green, your top end prospect better probably be even better than Jalen Green.
Yeah, I have them third, So I don't disagree with you too much.
Okay, I think like they're they're obviously really good at fighting talent off
the scrap peep as well. And Jay Shawn Tate, Uh kJ Martin of
somebody a lot of people even have going in the draft. Uh. They
got him at fifty second, So you know, I like like what they're
doing from a talent evaluation standpoint. KPJ they got for nothing. Uh.
And even if you're not the biggest KPJ guy, he certainly has more value
than a pick that didn't end up conveying. Right. And here's here's where
I stand with them right now. They absolutely killed it at the last traft,
right, they killed it, like we we all felt that way in
the moment, and as we watched them right now, it certainly feels like,
you know, we were right. They absolutely destroyed And I think you
look at Jalen Green, I agree with you. I view more as a
complimentary star, sort of a Zach Lavine, Devin Booker, you know,
Bradleybeo type, rather than you know, like he's just heliocentric ballhammer. He's
never been that at any level. And for any you know, Rockets fan
that believes, you know, he he deserves more touches or he's being slided
opportunity wise. Go watch his full full length ge Leaue tapes. It's online,
you can find him on YouTube. He wasn't this guy that was running
a heavy amount of pick and roll and just constantly ball handling for them.
He was very much a guy who thrives in transition, isolation, catch and
shoot, cutting all that stuff, and that makes you a very multiple piece
of clay as a complimentary star. Right. I don't think he's the guy
who can initiate elite off MT. I think he can become a secondary playmaker.
He's done more playmaking than I thought he was capable of this season,
and I think that bowled well for him becoming like a six assistant game guy.
Right. If he can get there at that, I think you hit
it out of the park in terms of your development curve for Houston. And
I think, you know, you look at Josh Christopher, that's a guy
I didn't I did not see him going in the first round. I had
him as a second round talent and he looks every bit the first round talent
that he's played like this year. I mean, he's you know, rafel
Stone on draft night, compared to to Drew Holiday, and a lot of
people, including myself, that that was ridiculous, Right, that's that's that's
an unbelievably eyebar. I still think it's a high bar. But I see
what he was talking about in terms of how he is as a defensive player,
right, and just his ability to score. Like, he has a
confidence and swagger about him that I think translates very well to winning teams.
He has a leadership quality about him, Like if you look at where they
were at the beginning of the season, there was a lot of games where
Houston was out of it. They had they were down like double digits,
you know, fifteen twenty points sometimes, and Josh Christopher would come in during
garbage time and bring them back to within two or three points. That happened
all the time, right, And he did that as the primary ball handler.
So I think he can be a really, really sold I like him.
This is kind of I'm glad I'm saying this on your podcast and not
mine, So I actually like him long term. Next, Jalen Green better
than Kevin Porter Junior, just because I think the fit is more, is
cleaner. I think I like I think gonna need to surround Green with high
level defenders. Christopher can become that. So I like what they're doing.
I think I agree they don't have that foundational foundational talent. Like they have
a foundational talent, they don't have the guy, but they have a pretty
good baseline here and they've only been rebuilding pretty much for one year, right
they had they had one year at the top of the draft, and I
think they did a good job in that in that first draft. I'm still
high on Garuba. I think he has some work to He has some work
to do on the offensive end, and I think both of us didn't anticipate
he's a little bit behind that area. But when you look at what they're
what they're doing, and the direction they're going in, I think obviously you
can nip pick. I don't like how they didn't move aircording to that trade
deadline. I don't like how Christian Wood is still on this roster. I
think they could have maximized his value by trading him last trade deadline, perhaps
not this trade DeLine. I think offers were I think the market was cool
on him this this this season, but I think last season, when he
had three years remaining, and you know he was in that first you know
year with the Rockets obviously one of the biggest surprises of the offseason. Right
back then, you could have gotten more value for him, right you know,
maybe you could have gotten to two first round picks last year. This
year, I think it's pretty clear like they were pretty much offered like for
one first round pick and like maybe a you know, an intriguing young prospect.
So the market was a little bit cool, and it was all excuse
them not moving Christian? Would the Gordon thing? Listen, we'll see man
Like, if if they can't get if if if we get to a point
where they can't move him for a first round pick, that's on them because
we we know for sure now that there were offers on the table where they
could have gotten a first round pick and they turned them down. Like we
know that, Like that's been reported by two people already that they were first
round picks on the table for Eric Gordon and they chose not to take them.
So we'll see if they can act, you know, maximize his return.
I we'll see if they can get in on the on whatever the Lakers
are trying to do the summer if there's a way for them to seek in
and trade multiple role players for like Westbrook and buy out Westbrook or something like
that, that I think is an intriguing pathway. Right that, then you
can kind of defend them holding onto air Gordon, right if there's a pathway
for them to trade air Gordon for that twenty twenty six Lakers pick. This
is projecting in a way that we haven't done with any other team on this
on this rod, on this list. So I'm not I'm not going to
go there. I'm not going to go there, But what I'm saying is
there are pathways for them to eat to add more draft equity. And I
mean, when you look at how long they've been rebuilding for, I don't
know how you can be disappointed. You know, I think you know where
we have them on the list. You know I have them at three.
You haven't met for it. It's fair. You might have convinced me to
move them to three. But to be in the top half of this I
think is an achievement. Like you said, given how brief the rebuild has
been so far, I am with you on Josh Christopher. I think I've
been overstimulated by Josh Christopher in recent weeks, just because you've mentioned the Drew
Holiday things to me before. And he had this play against Miami where the
Rockets are already down big, but he's just like off the dribble, spinning
and spiraling around the rim with this incredibly nifty finish. I'm so high on
him to where I thought, is he more valuable to Houston long term than
Alpern? Shane Goun, Oh, we didn't talk about Shan Goun, my
guy. I love Shanon. So this is this is where while while you
were talking before, I kind of disagreed with you. I think this guy
has All Star potential potential. I'm not saying he's gonna become an All star.
I saw him when he got drafted as a player that's for sure going
to be a starter on a good on a good playoff team. And right
now, I mean, you look at how he plays in limited minutes.
He shows flashes of being someone special, right especially the passing ability, like
he has eyes on the back of his head. In the back of his
head, he makes ridiculous passes every single game. His touch around the basket,
and his size, He's not that big like his talent level for his
size is insane and defensively obviously a work in progress, but I don't think
he's but he's overachieved to where a lot of people thought he was going to
be. I think a lot of people do a lot better on that end
of the floor than I thought that he would ever move, if that's any
If that means anything, right, Yeah, So I actually think there's a
there's a possibility where we come back to this list in a couple of years
and it's like, yeah, Kenon was clearly a cornerstone talent that we overlooked,
right, I think, Uh, I'm I'm obviously bias. I've always
been high on this guy. So I'm gonna I'm gonna try and defend my
take from the traff where Adam seven. So, like, I think I
think their direction the rebuild is uh is fine. They've They've had some They've
missed some some opportunities, right. They should have probably taken care of LeVert
instead of Victoria Deepo in the James Harden trade. They should have they should
have traded Eric Gordon at this trade deadline. We'll see if they if they
can actually capitalize on his value. Despite that, but these are nitpicks,
right, Like, I have no problem with what they're doing. I guess
are you? Are you not his high and joining No, I'm higher than
I was to begin with. I'm just and it's I don't know what he's
actually going to project as defensively and if he's eventually your loan big who is
not I'm not talking about she's playing as the loan big, but like he
is your your centerpiece in the middle, I don't, I don't know.
I feel like there'll be too many obstacles you have to clear to assemble a
really good defense. I do like what he brings on offense, Like he
is a visionary when it comes to being a passer. Like he's shown that
he has his floor game there. We know that eventually he's going to shoot.
I don't even know what he's at up to this season from three point
range, but he's going to shoot better than twenty five percent on threes eventually.
I think he's he has the potential to be an offensive stud. I
just don't know what he trans what he translates into, or what your team
translates into. If you call him your second or third best player, yeah,
we'll see I guess, I guess I want the big The big test
here is like when they eventually move on from Christian would right, because I
think that's a when not question. When that happens and Shangoon has given the
opportunity to play more minutes, can you still you know, produce on this
permanent level like he's doing right now, right, It's different when you're a
starter. It just is. So if when when he gets that role,
when he gets that opportunity, how he produces is going to change how we
view him, I think, and positively negatively whatever I do. Wonder if
I would feel a little bit more rosier on Houston's future, if it didn't
feel like they were sort of straddling like two different directions so much even since
the trade deadline, Like you look at their players who are most used Jalen
Green, Garrison, Matthews, Kenyan Martin Junior, Christian Wood, Jay Shawntate,
Shanegun, Kevin Porter Junior, Eric Gordon, and Josh Christopher. So
you're going ten names down the list there, I think I just went and
how many of those guys do you think are members of the next iteration of
the Rockets? And it's I might say three like Shanegoon, Josh Christopher and
Jalen Green. So yeah, that's maybe something that I'm maybe I'm waiting that
too heavily. And then it's like, okay, well who else do you
want them to play? But I'm also just looking at it like, you
know, I guess it helps the Garrison Matthews is the second most used in
total minutes since the trade deadline, Like there's there's clearly a vision there,
but I could be just harping too much on the Okay, Christian Wood and
Eric Gordon, where does all of this fit into they You have a bunch
of future picks in comanies we already mentioned they basically just control the nets the
future, which no longer looks as certain I think we can say. I
mean, we don't know how Ben Simmons is going to fit in. The
Other thing that's not talked about enough is Kyrie is a free agent after the
season. We don't know what happens with that. And so thinking about the
amount of the breath of nets equity that Houston owns, I'm wondering if I
need to move them up to number three by default. But I wanted to
recap before we got into our final two teams. Who do you have?
Eight through eight through three? And then I'll name how my list panned out
so far. Oh, by the way, the Nets are a game and
a half away from being in the lottery. Why did right now? So
yeah, yeah, I agree like the Brooklyn picks obviously way into it.
It's something you after factor and obviously I guess like I talk about it so
much that I almost forget to mention that they have all these picks in coming,
and they also have the second best lottery odds as of right now,
and I haven't checked where they're projected to finish, but I think they're projected
to finish bottom two as well. Let's recap. So at eight, I
have the Kings, seven, I have the Blazers, six, I have
the Magic five, I have the Spurs four, I had the Rockets,
and I have the Pistons. At three, which was basically my rationale here
is I'm so high on Kake Cunningham at the idea of adding a top four
prospect to him this summer sort of just bends my brain. And so that's
how my eight through three has shaken out. Yeah, and to recap.
I have Portland at eight, stan Antonio at seven, Orlando at six,
Detroit at five, Oklahoma City at four, Houston at three, Indiana at
two, and I guess we can we can talk about I don't know.
I have Sacramento on two. Excuse me? Well, I mean you would
you would have figured out it was gonna be Indian anyways. But I have
Sacramento on two. Yeah, book, make your case for Sacramento here for
me, So darn fox since February eighth, twenty eight point two points per
game, six and a half assists per game, four point three rebounds per
game, fifty nine point three per century shooting. Did you want to know?
You want to take a guest with February eighth is? All right?
What do you want to take a guess? What February eighth is? Yeah?
What is it his birthday? I don't I don't know. February eighth
is the Haliburton trade. It's the date that the Halliburton trade happens. So
ever since that we've made two days before the trade deadline. I forgot about
that, right, So he he, he has been an awkward trajectory stince.
Then he's eleventh in the league and scoring above guys like in that stretch,
obviously above guys like KD Trey, James Harden, Chris Middleton, Like
there's a bunch of high quality scores that he's just just he's just pronounced.
In this second half of the season, he's back on that upward trajectory that
we thought he was gonna be on last season, right like he had this
down year and because of that, the King's future looked a little bleak.
But he's back. He looks like a cornerstone talent. I don't know if
he's the cornerstone talent, but you look at whether where the Kings are in
the lottery, they're six, they have the six best odds at getting the
number one pick. If they can get a top three pick, that it
definitely helps where we how we view them, and they definitely have a possibility
to climb there. And Sabonus is really good man. I mean, like,
well we can I guess we can transition into talking about Indiana after this.
I don't know where you have him, but I but I thought that
I thought that trade was questionable in the moment for sure. Like the thing
that always helped me back from going too hard on King's criticism. Is Monty
McNair is the guy who pulled the trigger. I have so much respect for
that guy. Super smart guy from Houston, obviously an analytics guy. Uh.
And I think you know, if you've viewed them as the same old
Kings, right, if I think that was the reaction right when I have
it like Kings right, Like that was the thing you saw that all across
Twitter. It's that moved shocked everybody. So if you're being objective and if
if you're asking yourself the question, did they maximize the value of Tyrese Haliburton
if they had to trade him, I think that I think the answers yeah,
right, Like I'm not sure if you're going to get a better trade
than SA bonus, And I'm not sure if the bonus was going to be
available later on, because if you look at like, what's what the Pacers
were doing at the deadline, like they were, they clearly wanted to tear
it down. They clearly wanted to tear it down, and SA bonus is
going to be part of that no matter what. So I think I think
if you're looking at if I understand the hesitancy to call that question that trade
a home run for the pay for the Kings. I certainly still think it's
questionable. If Haliburton ends up becoming a superstar, which is very much on
the table, right, I think that completely makes his ranking look terrible.
Right If Haliburn ends up being a superstar caliber player, guy who's initiating a
lead offense in the NBA and you know, very much a heliocentric ball handler
type, if he ends up being that guy, well then that trade is
horrible. Right Right now, he looks like a guy who's projected to be
an All Star. And if Sabonis is also projected to be an All Star,
you traded a bad fitting All Star next to Deer and Fox for a
better fitting All Star and Sabonis. And obviously you'd rather trade Deer and Fox
if you could, right, if I were, if I were the Kings,
if most people were the Kings, they would have tried to trade Yard
Fox. But the problem is nobody wanted that contract, and you know,
Hayli Burden was the far more attractive asset. So you look at like what
they have right now, the pillars of a championship championship team. The pillars
of a very good playoff team and Sabonis and Fox, and they also have
the sixth SOD to the top of the top pick in this draft. I
mean, I'm feeling good if I'm a Kings fan like I. Obviously they've
made some mistakes along the way, but well, all this really ends up
all this really ends up hinging on is if Haliburn ends up being a superstar,
if he just ends up being a regular All Star guard right And obviously
I'm not I'm not projecting to be anything right now. I'm just saying if
if he ends up being that, then that trade's terrible. But if he
ends up being just a regular All Star, I have no problem with logic
behind it. I still I think if if it was another if it was
another executive, I might I might have crapped on the trade a lot more.
But I've just I've just given my side to my time, myself time
to think about it. See how Dear and Fox performs in that time,
see House the Bonus performs without uh, someone you know taking up so much
usage next to him in Miles Turner and I have no problem with what they're
doing. They're building blocks right now, I think they have better building blocks
and pretty much everyone below them on this list right now. I guess I
just don't appreciate the range of outcomes for them, and I do not view
it as you needed to trade Halibert or Fox. That did it? You
did it right, Yeah, I did. I agree you didn't have to
do it. But if you were going to do it, did you maximize
the return? Yeah? I think I think they viewed it as they needed
to do it. I disagree with that decision, but considering what they got
and where they stand now, their roster makeup makes sense. Long term.
They have two pros. They have two pillars of a rebuild. They obviously
need one more. They need the guy that's going to be really hard to
get that. That's that's the questions I have for them. But if you
look at what they have in relation to what these other teams have and where
they're going to be in the draft, I have no problem. So for
me at two, I had Oklahoma City and that means that we both have
the same number one. We'll be able to get into that in the first
place. With Okay. See, I think as of right now, Shakos
Hosenter might be the best player, of any player on this list that I
guess you can quibble between five and Simonis or him long term, I think
he probably has the chance to be the second best if we're looking at is
it Kid Cunningham I have as the clear number one if you told me number
two with Shay, if you told me it was Darn Fox long term,
I guess you could tell me it sugs. But he gives you like he
is your future, and they have to me, I would view him as
more of a ten pole cornerstone than a jail and Green than even a Darn
Fox or us a bonus that helps them here, just having the higher end
outcome there. I do think they've discovered like, oh, we have this
crafty guy and Josh Giddy who, even if he's not part of your future,
is gonna wind up being in an attractive trade chip to somebody. And
then I really like what they've been able to do on the margins. I
don't know if I know people who listen to this podcast and hoopsters, they've
been paying attention, like Poku is a real NBA prospect now, like he
looks so much more under control and comfortable can do stuff on the ball,
but it's like just more complimentary at both ends, and that's huge for them.
If he ends up panning out, they have lou Dort Ken, Rich
Williams, Aaron Wiggins has been absolutely fantastic for them. I would encourage anyone
to go back and just watch film of a season. I'm with you.
I don't want to frame it just because their names are the same, but
I tend to be higher on Trey Jones than Trey Man. So you're welcome
Spurs fans for saying Matt they definitely do need to find some more options.
And still I'm still intrigued d by Darius Basley. I think he's shouldered an
incredible defensive workload this season and just combined if you just combined Shake Gilds Alexander
with all sort of the middle tier lower middle tier and then just the what
if type of prospects and flyers on this roster, with all the picks and
cat flexibility they have moving forward this team, even though you have to sort
of account for these intangibles when you're looking at, well, what are they
going to do with those draft picks? We know they're not going to keep
all of them. They have too many, and I know they're not the
team that typically goes all in, but when you have a player as good
as Shake Gilders Alexander, and you've proven that you can mind talent at the
margins, when you have players on I would call them suppressive contracts when they're
giving out these known as the Hanky specials, but they should really be the
press these specials at this point, they're going to be attractive to other teams.
This is a squad that is built to grow organically, but can also
accelerate their position if the right player becomes available. And I think my biggest
concern with them is just how do you sort of play the roster spot game
moving forward. I don't care about the cap space necessarily. People harp on
too much teams hitting the roster floor. I'm not gonna quibble about incumbent players
getting extra money. It's just a matter of you're gonna have to start making
decisions on some of these guys to make room for all these inbound first,
unless you're going to consolidate Beyond that, though, they are just stacked with
the with their future assets, and I guess the biggest concern, well,
I've liked some of the lineups they've rolled out this season, there's like a
certain I don't want to say position list, but sizeless anarchy to them.
I don't think you look at Jeremiah Robinson or all or even Poku or Baisie
like those lineups. I don't view those guys at the fives sort of an
answer for them. So they do need This would have plumbed another like higher
end big guy out of the equation doesn't need to be a traditional one.
But they've been inventive with the lineups they've rolled out, and they are a
team that has competed on defense this year. I know people attribute that to
the lack of scouting reports on a lot of these guys. What they're doing
doesn't happen on accident. Like they're tops. I think they're the only team
last time I check to who's top seven in the league in both their frequency
of shots they allow at the rim and then their overall rim protection percentage there
And to do that with this, cast Roger said, they don't necessarily have
a long term five. Depending on how you feel about a JR here or
just position list basketball in general. That's absolutely wild to me. So I
think we have lost sight of because of how egregious their rebuild has been been,
or if you want to call it a tank job, at points,
we've lost sight of the fact that, Okay, they are still actually building
something here. Yeah, I mean, I have no problem and like this
idea. I hate when people talk about roster sponts and draft picks, like
that was the excuse you kept hearing for why Houston didn't trade for a first
right they have. They have all these first round picks, and they're not
gonna have any roster spots. Stop. You can always trade first round picks,
and they always they haven't heard value, like stopping and like, they're
not gonna draft all these picks. They're not. They're they're gonna consolidate some
of these assets for better assets. That's kind of what I expect them to
do. Yeah, can we talk about the Pacers. I'm super excited to
get into them. We both have them at number one, and I think
we're both assuming it's because they're not going to go through the the thorough gradual
rebuild. It's because they have Tyrese Haliburton and this incoming lotto pick. Let's
say it's top five, top four, whatever it ends up being, and
then they're just going to continue to try and compete with Miles Turner, Malcolm
Brogdon, Chris Duarte, Like, oh, shape Risette is there. They
just have a lot of good players to where I don't think they have to
blow it up. The Sabonis trade was kind of a like tear down,
and they moved Leavert as well. But they're like, are they They're the
team on this list by far and away that's most likely to win a playoff
series first, right, Yeah, I agree, And I really love the
job that Kevin Pritchard's done here. Uh So it's kind of my logic and
having the number one, it is kind of similar to what I have to
Why I have the King's number two is because they have two cornerstone talents but
better, right, Like I think Haliburton is better than darn Fox. I
think Turner is better than Sabonus or at least more useful on a playoff team.
Right when he's healthy. That's a big caveat His health is going to
be a factor in their rebuild and how and how they build it around these
two guys. But I mean, listen, like if Sabonus, not Sabonus.
If Aliburn ends up being that heliocentric ball handler that we talked about him
potentially becoming, or if if he's just gonna become like a regular All Star
like that. They got that for someone three years older, right, and
that was less. I didn't want to be there. I think that's become
pretty clear, right, And I was ill fitting on their team. And
it just makes so much sense what they're doing. They have potentially the cornerstone
for their offense and potentially the cornerstone for their defense. Because let's be clear,
Miles her is one of the best defensive players in the NBA. Nobody
talks about him like that, but he is. He's amazing as a defensive
player. If you, if you ever get a chance to watch him when
he's healthy, please do. That guy protects the rim better than almost any
center in the NBA outside of Rudy Gobert. He's he's amazing, but yeah,
he's He's a big reason I have him on this on this spot.
Let's talk about the transactions that they've made from Paul George down to where they
where they at now. So they traded Paul George for the bonus and Victor
Oladipot right at the time a questionable move, but ended up working out for
them because the bonus ended up being a star, right ended up being an
All Star. And they traded Elodipot for Karros Lavert and then they traded Karis
Lavert for rick Ricky Rubio and basically two first round picks. That because that
second round pick that they got was Houston's second round pick, so it's gonna
be an early thirties pick. So they got two first round picks, rick
Karis Lavert, uh and Ricky Rubio's expiring contracts so they have they have flexibility
on their books and they all have. They got Haliburn, so basically they
went from Paul George to Haliburton, Ricky Ruio's expiring salary, and two first
round picks. That's incredibly patient deal making by Kevin Pritchard. I did not
think of him as this kind of executive, but he's The way he dealt,
the way he was moving in the trade deadline was certainly impressive. Yeah,
and I just you know, you talk about the outcome of Haliburt like
he's already one of the most efficient off the drill jump shooters in the league
right now. But the fact that he can play alongside pretty much anyone.
I don't think he even needs to be more than a fringe All Star for
that trade to pan out as a win. Just because Sabonis was look him
and Turner could play together. They did. The minutes were fine, but
there was a cap on that ceiling because there was some geographical overlap. I
think you could say, and now you've removed that from the equation. This
team I mentioned has the potential to be super interesting, like competitive immediately when
you look ahead the next season, Like just imagine they could bring back t
J. Warren as well if he ends up being healthy, and then you
have a top five pick on top of that, they could also This would
be the less appealing route. I'd be curious whether I'd still have them here
if they decided to move Brogged in, move Turner and begin completely anew.
It would definitely depend on the return they get for them. Then you sort
of need to hit your wagon too. Oh, we need Tyrese Haliburton to
be the one A type of star here, so that makes it a little
bit more risky. But you can go that route still and just based off
some of the other players that you have on your roster. Now that's also
okay, Like Isaiah Jackson that showed a bunch for them. O'sheaper set is
one of my favorite players to watch. We know what Chris Daarte can do.
Go goo with Todds has come on recently on the offensive end. They've
gotten like these interesting stretches from other guys too on the roster. They can
do a lot of different things here. It doesn't have to be okay,
we're keeping Brogden Turner, Haliburton Duarte this year's pick and moving forward and trying
to compete immediately. I think that makes the most sense. Just because Turner's
only twenty five. You can extend him and you're already sort of hinted at
it, so Bonus might be the better player. Overall. What Turner does
is more scalable, and I think you, as you alluded to it could
be more valuable in the playoffs just based off his defensive impact alone. And
so you just move forward with that core. You're maybe like one type of
move away where if everything goes right, are we talking about a top four
team in the Eastern Conference. So the immediacy with which they can rise matters
a lot to me here. But I also don't want to undersell their ability
to sort of play the longer game, which again I bet against them doing
because it's just something they haven't done with Kevin Burchard or Herb Simon there.
It's we want to figure out a way to do both. And yes they've
punted on this season, I would be surprised if they lean further in to
the rebuilding. So that's what actually makes their future much more appealing to me.
They have the fifth best lottery odds right now, so I mean,
if they can imagine adding like Jade and Ivy or like you know, Jabari
Smith to this core, right like, that makes this Indiana Corps so much
more attractive. And they have a direction. As you said, I think
we all expected them to move Buddy Healed for another pick and they just they
just didn't end up doing it. So they can still do that too,
right Like, So there's Buddy Hell might be overpaid, but if you're gonna
overpay overpay for functional shooting, I'm not talking about someone who's just standing in
the corner, like overpay for someone who can fly around screens, hit some
pull ups, hit some deeper looks, and like that's what Buddy Healed at
his peak can do. And he's shooting, Yeah, it's only about thirty
seven percent. That's above LEA average in Indiana, I mean, and it
comes on eight point six attempts per game. Like that's real volume. He's
also, by the way, quietly shooting about sixty percent on twos and played
well in Indiana offensively in general. And so I don't want to discount that.
I mean, like even just the reason they're having to make as a
passer since he's been in Indiana. So I don't know, maybe they will
turn him into an asset. But this is a team that can make a
ruckus immediately. Like you were saying, it does have the if you want
to call them, valuable veterans that they could sell off to make their rebuild
that much more intriguing. And they they have an extra first round pick in
this year's draft. Now after that Karis Lavirtue. They are just so many
different things that they can do. Given how poorly this season initially went for
them, I applaud them for being able to pivot into the multifaceted direction that
they did. They've just timed their moves perfectly. They traded Paul George at
the right time, they traded Bonus at the right time, they traded Kris
Lavert at the right time, maximize all their values, got you know,
adequate return for all of them. And that's kind of why, uh,
you know, I'm kind of turning my head at Pritchard, like, Hey,
this guy's pretty damn good at his job, and you wouldn't have thought
that, like literally a couple of months ago. Like there's just so much
more clarity and what he's been doing, Like how long have you been have
we been talking about splitting up some bonus a turner like two years three?
Right? And he timed it perfectly, waited till a player like like Haliburton
was available, traded him. Now has a legitimate corners, don't talent in
his in the fold, and they have so many directions they can go in.
Man, I agree with everything you were saying. I think they're clearly
the best future on this team. Yeah, so I think they're number one
and for me, ahead of Okayse unless you just think that Isaiah Roby is
a future mega star in Oklahoma City. I'll recap mine very quickly. To
wrap us up here, I have the Kings at eight, the Blazers at
seven, the Magic at six, the Spurs at five, the Rockets at
four, the Pistons at three, the Thunder at two, and the Indiana
Pacers at number one. What do you have? Okay to recap? I
have the Pacers at one. Hold on, let me get my list out,
the Pacers at one, Sacramento to Houston at three, Oklahoma City at
four, Detroit at five, Orlando at six, San Antonio at seven,
at Portland eight. It's funny that we differed so much, but we were
just in lockstep with number one. That's great, Salmon. I mean I
think you and I are hiring Haliburton that I think most people. And it's
not just like a basketball Twitter thing like the guy's ridiculous, Like he's just
completely ridiculous. He was the best player on the Kings up until they made
that move the deadline. Legitimately, Salmon, this was great. Thank you
so much for doing it with me. Or you're able to tell our listeners
where they can follow you on Twitter and all of your great work. Yeah
at salmona ley NBA on Twitter. If I'm producing work. It's just gonna
be there. Follow him. He's a great follow. Thank you so much
again for joining me, and I think, as you know by now,
I'll be pestering you again down the line, so I will talk to you
soon. Thank you so much. Looking forward to it here