And it hits me, Oh my gosh, this is that triangle. You
know, there's explanation for everything that occurred in the Randal Champars incident that doesn't
involve aliens at all. It was completely silent. It comes right over our
heads. It's so classic. Clie Sorcier really standing in the cleary. He
turned over to my father and held his hand, and he looked in his
eyes and said, we're not alone. Welcome to podcast UFO for our live
show. We're live every Wednesday at eight pm Eastern Standard Time on podcastufo dot
com. During the show, feel free to participate live in our chat room
and don't forget to like us on our very active Facebook page. Hello,
and welcome to the show. On Martin willis your host. We have Alejandro
Rojas coming up in just a minute with UFO updates, and after that we
have Kevin Randall, doctor Kevin Randall coming on the show. I always enjoy
speaking with him, a man of reason. I want to thank all the
supporters that help us out here. To support the show for two dollars or
more a month and you get to hear the whole show, not just the
first hour, for free and to do that. The information is right on
our website. We also have a one year you know, yearly payments and
it's a one time sign up and you could just put the link in your
media player and go from there. Oh, before I forget, I want
to announce that I have reopened the forum. The sign up trick question is
what is Stan's last name? A repeat guest on the show, Stan Friedman,
of course, So it's an easy sign up to join the forum,
and on the forum there will be questions posed for the guests. Already.
I have a couple of entries this week for Kevin Randall, so in the
forum. I want to get that active again and I hope you will join
the forum. So that is it again. Kevin Randall's coming up. And
right now we have the Esteemed Aalojondo Rojas. How are you hello? I
am good. That was my Esteemed device. Yeah, I like that.
Yeah, it's cool you're having Kevin Randall on. He's great. What's great
about Kevin Randall too, is that he's a straight shooter. He's very grounded,
and you know he's he's got great integrity. He's willing to stick to
the truth and call it like it is despite uh what effect that may have
on relationships with others, which is a true researcher. So I greatly respect
him for that. He's he's a good guy, yes, and just wanted
to say that. I'm glad you did also because we're going to be talking
also about his blog spot, because I so many times I'm trying to figure
something out and talk about the Voice of Reason, it's like, uh,
you know it's yeah, you'll find it on his blog and you know there's
the answer, are right there? So anyway, I really always enjoy speaking
to him, and he's been a repeat guest and hopefully he'll be on many
times. But what's going on for the UFO news this week? What's going
on? First, I'm gonna plug something hopefully that's okay. Well, you
really liked it the last Open Mind UFO magazine video that we did, and
we did just post a new one on Friday that I think is even better.
I mean, the first one's good. I think it covers the Washington
DC in nineteen fifty two event more thoroughly than perhaps you can see out there
anywhere else. But this one goes beyond that too hard and fast. Just
dispel this fallacy that the Air Force tries to push forward, which is that
they have no longer investigated UFOs after nineteen sixty nine. You know, it
used to be very consistorial to say something like that, and people will know.
I'm not really necessarily a conspiracy guy, but you don't much like Kevin
Randall. But we have government documents that not only show us what and when
and how they've been investigating, but that just proved that. And these are
files that are on the DIA site. These are we offer links where you
can go see these things. These are files that are out there and show
that they've been investigating and what they've been investigating and how and why. I
think it's terribly interesting. We get into that in this video, and we'll
get into that more thoroughly in future videos. But I think people should really
like this one. We've got a great response, and I think this one
includes information that is not so readily available or known, so I think people
will see stuff here that they haven't seen before. So I hope people like
it. Yeah, it's exciting. I was so excited to get it out
and I would love for your listeners to go check it out. It's free.
And it's on our YouTube. It's on your YouTube and you can access
that through openminds dot tv as well as I will put that on my sidebar
and on it'll show on all my web pages. SAT. Thanks buddy.
Yeah, well you have to do is just click on it and click the
I don't know what you call expand button and I'll just take over your computer.
That's all works. So I have three stories here I want to get
through, if that's okay. The first one, it's just kind of interesting.
This is a guy in New Zealand who had a siding on September one.
He drew some pictures of it and which is kind of funny and I'll
tell you why in a minute, but essentially, this was about nine pm
on September first, and he said he saw this big, bright, blowing
ball. It was huge, and he ran and he grabbed his camcorder and
he filmed it, he says, for about seventeen minutes. And he said
there were six smaller craft, maybe even seven, and there was also a
red or beneath beneath this craft, and that these crafts kind of attached to
each other and this whole thing was going on. So we watched it for
a while and he filmed it. He says he got like five or six
really good minutes of video and he tried to send that to his friends and
family, but it didn't work and said, in fact, he said some
bastard had hacked it. And that's a direct quote. So yeah, and
that's what he gets into is that, you know, attacked and he couldn't
share the video. So if a move on person wants to see the video,
they're going to have to come to his house because it won't work when
he tries to email it to people. Of course, some people have said,
well, you know, he's suspicious at somebody's keeping it from getting out,
but or of course said it was hacked. But it's just kind of
a funny interesting story there. It's probably just too big of a file to
go through. Email from a Kiwi kid. You're right, did you know
they call New Zealanders kiwis No, I didn't know that. We have some
listening to the show. Yeah, yeah I have, and it's not a
bad thing. They like it. Oh okay, good, yeah, all
right, because you the way you said it was like, oh, you're
a friend in my New Zealanders. No, they like it. It's he's
cute, okay, So I'll do a shout out to the Kiwi kids out
there. Mm hmm. So it was another old the right, yeah,
Kiwi's Actually I added the kid part myself. I think this person it was
a Kiwi kid. Uh huh. So a Hawaiian UFO story. This is
a photograph that was taken in Hawaii on October twenty third, so just about
a week ago or so. And they took some pictures and in one of
their pictures is kind of a golden dish shaped object. So they thought that
was weird and they turned that in and you know, typically if this object
was gray or a bird color, I would say it's a birder or a
bug. But it is a weird color, so and it still could be
a burder bug. You could see, you know, the person zoomed in
to be able to see this object a beautiful landscape in Hawaii. Funny thing
is it was by can Canoa Bay. I'm probably saying it wrong, but
funny thing is this story has been picked up. Our stories keep getting picked
up by the British tabloids and they don't credit us at all. At Open
Minds Unfortunately, I must say there's this inquisitor that picks them up also,
but at least they credit us. And I don't mind people picking up our
stories and writing about them. It's just nice to say, you know,
you got it from open minds. But of course the British tabloids being what
they are, they have to add to it. So if you see some
stories out there about Hawaiian UFO base, that's where that stems from. Is
this story. So they picked it up and they've jumped because well, and
you can't blame just them, although putting that in the headlines is kind of
silly. This was also suggested by a UFO person that they spoke with,
and unfortunately they like to talk to people who come up with these wild theories
every time they show them a picture and then they go with that. But
yeah, so they've gone so far as to say, just because of this
picture of a possible cloud or bug, maybe something more interesting, but off
of this fuzzy picture, they have determined there is a UFO base. It
must be underground, yeah, Hawaiian dulci or something. Yeah. Wow.
A more interesting picture on the third story is actually of some lights, a
light phenomena that is from Italy and they believe them to be earthquake lights.
But the picture is actually not what the story is about. The story is
about a research group that is creating a peer reviewed journal. So they like
to use the term unidentified aerial phenomena. That is a term used well,
it's credited for being coined by essentially NARCAP, which is the National Aviation Reporting
Center on Anomalist Phenomena. One of their founders, Ted Rowe, is actually
working with some other researchers and I know one of them is Erica Luke's and
they are putting together they're going to try to start a peer reviewed journal.
So they're going to try to get some scientists together and create this journal because
you know, essentially, if you're trying to investigate UFOs, there's no peer
review journal where you can get you know, experts and scientists to look at
it to figure out if this is truly an anomalous phenomena. So they are
looking to do that, and so we kind of have an exclusive press release
written by Ted Row himself and we posted that on the website to show you
what they're up to and how they're going to create this group, so it's
really cool. So these Italian potential earthquake lights pictures is one of them that,
you know, the type of thing they want to look at. They
also want to look at, you know, things like the hes Dylan lights,
the Marfa lights, places where people see these lights often but we don't
know what's going on with them. So that's pretty cool. And I should
mention that Ted Row and Eric Alukes will both be speaking at the UFO Congress
coming up here in February. Go to Ufocongress dot com to find out more
about that, or Open Minds doat TV to find out more about all of
these stories and about the conference as well. Excellent, Well, thanks so
much. I'm gonna have to ask Erica Luke has been on a number of
times, but I'm gonna have to get a hold of this Ted Row.
Yeah, that sounds really interesting. Maybe I'll get him on the show coming
up. You should. Yeah, he's a great researcher, I mean,
NARCAP I think is credited as being one of the most serious and important I
think organizations researching this stuff. They write papers and they'll put papers on their
website, but they are not they don't seek you attention from the press or
otherwise, because really they're working with organizations across the world, like the French
UFO organization. They work with aviation organizations and pilots, so they're very careful
about their research and how they frame it to make sure that they come across
as scientific and professional. And doctor Haynes, who works with Ted Row,
worked for NASA for many years. That's where his career was as a scientist.
So yeah, they're a great organization and Ted will be talking more about
their research. Great, excellent, Alejandro. So we will be talking to
you next week. All right, talk to you next week, buddy,
Thanks very much. All right, everyone, hang in there. We'll be
right back after this quick music break with doctor Kevin Randall. Hello, Kevin,
Hello, how are you. I had to turn my mic back on
glad to have you back on the show. I was looking and it was
let's see October twenty eight, two thousand fifteen, so just over a year
and it seems way too long, I think, so too. Yeah,
So you have a book that came out this year I do called Roswell in
the twenty first Century. What I had done, well, actually, what
I had thought about for a long time of doing a Ultimate Roswell book.
Look at all the evidence, look at all the information that I've gathered,
look at all the information that's been published and said about the case. And
Tom Carey accosted me in Roswell. He said, want to go out to
Church's Fried Chicken for lunch? And I said, of course, because I
would not turn down churches Fried Chicken. And he proposed that we do the
Ultimate Roswell book. And the project kind of grew out of there. I
had been thinking about it and actually had talked to a publisher about doing it,
and he decided that what they wanted to do was books that had lots
of different cases in it, just a single case. But anyhow, the
whole plan with Tom Carey fell apart, and so I decided to continue on
myself. But I looked at everything that I could possibly find it determine what
is fact what is fiction? Where we stand today in the case, And
as I say to practically anybody who will listen, it'll probably annoy everybody because
it doesn't leap to the conclusion that what fell at Roswell was extraterrestrial. But
it also he kicks the stool out from underneath the skeptics who believe it was
Project Mogul. So there's a little bit for everybody in there. There's a
little bit in there to annoy everybody. Well, you've been at that particular
research project for thirty is it thirty years we started? I think Don Schmidt
approached me in nineteen eighty eight and I went to the Center for You off
of Studies and we all talked about what was going on, and we made
our first research trip to New Mexico in February of nineteen eighty nine. I
had arranged a meeting with Bill Brasel, which turned out that I did it
right. I mean, people would call him and want to meet with him,
and he didn't want to do it. And I just sent him a
letter and said, you know, if he'd like to talk to us,
give me a call, give me a collect call, and we'll chat.
And he said when we got down and talked to him, he said he
really appreciated being contacted by a letter, not phoned for an interview. And
he said that he had told his wife surely that if he liked us,
he would help us out, and if he didn't, well he just blow
us off and Apparently he liked this because he provided us with great deal of
information. But that whole research trip into New Mexico just blew up. We
were supposed to meet with Frank Joyce and he got sick, and I'm thinking,
yeah, right. We were set to meet with an Albuquerque UFO group
and they turned out to be wackos. We went down to Roswell. We
talked to Cliff Stone, but he really didn't have any insights into the thing,
and I'm thinking this is really not going anywhere. Then we met Bill
Brasel. I said, oh, have you there's something to this after all.
So, yeah, we've been doing all of this since nineteen eighty nine.
I don't know how many trips I've made to New Mexico and to talk
to witnesses, to look at the sites, to do all of that sort
of thing, looking in archives and libraries and everything that we could possibly think
of that might provide us with a little bit of insight to what went on
in Roswell. So we have a great deal of or I have a great
deal of information about it and have been doing it for quite a long time.
Yes, well, you sort of just I think I would call it.
You sort of just dropped bombshell, and I can't let it go without
asking. Did you say that has nothing to do with extraterrestrial No? I
did not. Okay, I said it doesn't lead us directly to the extra
trest It's something actually, I've said for a long time that if you eliminate
all the explanations, Mogul being the latest one thrown up, you really have
nothing left that doesn't take you directly to the extraterrestrial, but it is suggestive
of it. And I think that where we stand today, you look at
the evidence, the evidence which is basically testimony. We have very little documentation,
especially official documentation. We have a lot of newspaper clippings that don't take
us anywhere. We've had an awful lot of witnesses who came forward who lied
about it, and we can point our fingers any number of them when we
get when all of a sudden done is all we have is the testimony,
and now a lot of it collected from family members, not even the person
who was involved. So the amount of testimony we have doesn't really take us
anywhere. I mean, you've got people who talked about seeing the bodies,
and there's a couple that seemed to be fairly credible. But you have people
who talked about the debris and how it was nothing like they'd ever seen before.
So that suggests it, but we don't have the thing that you would
want to prove it. The Roswell slides last year suggested we may be getting
to the point where we have the smoking gun, and as everybody knows,
that blew up, so that we're stuck with that sort of thing. Linda
Corley did a book about Jesse marcel sor she lived in home of Louisiana where
Jesse Marcel lived. And I don't know why anybody who'd ever left Louisiana would
come back to it, but I'm sorry, I shouldn't say that Louisiana is
a nice place. But she had sat down with him and apparently recorded four
or five hours of interviews with him and his wife and about what went on.
And you read her book, which is cleverly called I Think for the
Sake of My Country, and it's Linda Corley and it's about her interviews with
Jesse Marcel, and you read that thing, and Jesse Marcel is saying things
that are very disturbing that suggests maybe he tended to embellish things a bit,
and so you begin to worry about things like that. And I mean,
if you're looking at this objectively and you read what Jesse Marcel said to Linda
Corley, and she's basically provided a transcript of those interviews, you find some
disturbing things in them. And you look at the interview that he did with
Bob Pratt. We have the transcript for that, the Pride interview from nineteen
seventy eight, nineteen seventy nine, eight pages, and it's it's it's somewhat
confusing an interview. And there's one point where if you put a comment in,
you change a whole meaning of the sentence. And that's the point where
Jesse Marcel is talking about how he was forced to be all out of an
aircraft that was shot down, and Pratt says, everybody survive, and he
says all but one crashed into a mountain. Well, that sounds like he's
saying everybody died except one guy, you know, uh uh, other than
one survivor, you know, one survivor everybody else crashing the mountain. But
you put a comment there and it says one and and and then you you
changed the meaning of the sentence that everybody survived except for the one guy who
crashed into the mountain. So it's it becomes very confusing and very very disturbing.
But you look at that sort of thing. You look at what Walter
HoTT said for virtually his entire life when we were discussing this with him,
and what he said repeatedly. In one of one of the cases, it's
from from a film that was made, they're asking him if he ever saw
the object and he said, well, no, he'd ask Colonel Blanchard if
he could, and Blanchard said no. And then we get the AffA David
that he signed within a couple of years of his death, and it alters
everything that he'd been saying for years and years and years, and that has
to be disturbing. You can say if you want, well, he was
protecting the secret as he was required to do by saying that, and then
upon his death he let the secret out. But I mean that only goes
so far and kind of excusing these sorts of things. So there's a lot
of disturbing things that when you sit down and you look at all the evidence
and the testimony we have, it just doesn't seem as robust as it once
did. Is it cloudy too? You know? I mean, is there
too much in the mix to decipher? I think the problem is we have
to eliminate the liars and the charlatans and the embellishers from the case. And
if we can do that, we end up with a core of information.
Is very interesting. For example, I guess the best way to say it
is, you know, they released the rosv Armi airfield released of the press
release that says, yeah, we have a flying saucer, and you interpret
that in many ways, and then you have three hours later everybody say,
no, nah, it's just a weather balloon, which is which is a
cockamami explanation. So you know, you go off in those directions and it
becomes is something clearly fell, something clearly extraordinary happened. Clearly there was some
sort of cover up, But that does not lead us to the extraterrestrial.
It is suggestive of something unusual. It is it can be suggested that that
does. It takes us toward the extraterrestrial, but it doesn't get us there.
What we need is physical evidence, We need documentation, We need all
of those sorts of things, and we simply don't have it right now.
Yes, how about let's talk about the Raimie memo. If technology keeps advancing
as far as the blurring and you know, documents, do you think that
someday that document will be able to be completely deciphered. The problem is it's
on film, and there's only so much you can do before you get into
the grain of the film that becomes confusing. We had thought, and I
say we, David Rudiak being one and a couple of experts in photography and
photo analysis and that sort of thing. I mean experts in the field that
work with police departments and all of that sort of thing. I mean,
highly skilled, highly intelligent, highly qualified to do this. We thought if
we could get a scan of the original negative, we might be able to
do that, and just prior to the Roswell Slides presentation in Mexico City,
they were able to do that with the help of the University of Texas at
Arlington. I was supposed to be there. I got sick and couldn't go.
But with the help of the University of Texas at Arlington and the people
there who were very cooperative, we got the best quality scans possible in various
I got various arrays, various ways the from with filters and non filtered and
using microscopes and everything that you could think of trying to do that. And
one of the experts says, you know, if if the photography then just
you know, like twelve inches closer, we could we could probably do it.
And I'm thinking that we may. We may have taken it as far
as we can. David. David's got a anale of it that he's pretty
convinced is correct. I think, you know, it's based on a little
bit of supposition on his part, but he's done the best analysis of anybody,
and he thinks that he can He can read it pretty well. What
we need is to be able to say this is the way we got here.
If you follow these steps, you will get there too. And right
now we can't do that. We cannot clarify it to the point where you
can say this is what it says to a great deal of certainty. And
so I don't think that the technology is ever going to get us to a
place where we can do that. Yeah, when you talk about it goes
down to the grain of the film. It seems like that is made.
That may be where it loses the whole you know, prospect of being able
to be read. And I know, you know they probably probably will be
software that will make conclusions, but it could never be you know, uh,
if we could, if we could get a consensus, really high consensus,
that would be something and and you know it and it may it may
turn out to be nothing that was created by the military. I mean,
the document he sold, he may not have been created by the military,
because there's a possibility that Javon Johnson, the photographer, the man that took
the pictures, actually brought the teletype message from the Fort Worth Star Telegram to
Ramy's office and handed it to him. There is the possibility that's where the
document came from. And Johnson said at one point that's what happened. He
he'd he'd come in and he wanted he wanted Ramy to have something in his
hands, so he handed him the the teletype message and then he of course
repudiated that when he realized that that meant it wasn't as important a document as
it would have been if it was something off Ramy's desk that might purport to
tell us that it was an alien spacecraft. So these are the things that
I examined in the book at great, great depth, you know, these
sorts of things looking at the raymy memo, with the latest information that was
available, including the analysis of the of the experts who went to Fort Worth
and spent their time down there, looking at all of this sort of thing.
So you look at all of that stuff at great depth and try to
bring it out in kind of a neutral voice where I'm not suggesting yes,
this is the truth or be this is false. It's here is the evidence
as neutrally and unbiased as I can present it. And I know the skeptics
will say, well, your extraterrestrial bias shows through here, and there's others
say well, you've just become a complete and total skeptics. And all I've
tried to do is present the information as accurately and neutrally as possible. And
I do definitely appreciate that you do. That's your approach. Now in the
forum, there's a question you you kind of just touched on what you know
when you first started on Roswell, and before I asked that question, though
I wanted to ask you how many firsthand witnesses would you say that you actually
spoke with. Oh, good lord, And there's there's a question that's kind
of difficult to answer, simply because I think some of the people who came
forward with what they were talking about really weren't discussing the events in Roswell.
They have confused it with something else. There's a guy named Newly, I
think his name was, who claimed that he had seen something in the bombay
of a B twenty nine, and they talk about how it might have been
the escape pod from the crash, and I think it was probably an NK
m K three atomic bomb mock up that he saw in there, because if
you read his description and what the atomic bombs looked like back in nineteen forty
seven, he's basically described that. And the real key is that the silver
plate be twenty nine and silver plate was modified to carry the atomic weapons.
But there was there's a great number of people from the people who were at
the base at the time who Corporal Piles, for example, saw something in
the sky that he talked about that he'd seen. Well, here's the first
hand witness seeing something traveling across the sky in the right time frame. He
may be a first hand witness. William Woody talks about how they thought they
saw this meteor coming down and crashing north of town and went out to look
for it. I mean, here's the first hand witness to something in the
sky, but it may not have actually been the craft itself, so you
know, it's kind of hard to say there are It was Thomas Gonzalez who
was transferred off the base shortly after this event took place, and he would
carve little alien like creatures rather than tell people about they looked like he would
sort of carve creatures of it. And so here here's a first hand witness
who who said he saw the bodies. So you know, there's probably forty
five fifty different firsthand witnesses. We talked to the members of Blanchard's staff.
Everyone we could talk to, with a single exception, said it was an
alien spacecraft. Edwin Easley, for example, he was a provost marshal.
He was He's a very good example, was very cautious in what he said
and was directly involved in this and apparently saw a great deal, but he
was very careful in what he said said about it, you know, so
there's a first hand witness as well, so there's a there's a large number
of them, but most of them just have a little peace. They don't
have the entire story, and that that kind of trips you up as well.
Yeah, if only if only this was investigated, you know, right
after the cover up or whatever happened when they said it was a weather balloon,
if only was investigated at that time when it was fresh, or even
even even a couple of years afterwards, would have been great. You know,
we start thirty five forty years after the fact and then memories do change.
That's true, Yep. Absolutely. The question, one of the questions
just in the forum is do you think that extraterrestrial bodies were recovered at Roswell?
Why or why not? There is testimony to suggest that and from from
a number of people. Edwin Easley again suggested that Walter HoTT said so in
his later years, but denied knowing anything about them in his earlier years.
Frankie Rowe, a very nice lady, talks about what her father saw and
then we get about you know, it's his secondhand testimony, her father being
a firefighter that went out there, and we're trying to figure that out,
and we talked to a firefighter who was there, a guy named Smith I
think it was, who said that the fire fire department didn't make a run
out there, but Dan Dwyer and Frankie's father did his personal car because some
colonel came back by from the base and said they don't need to go out
there, that the base was handling it. You know, I always kind
of laugh, it's always a colonel. It's never a captain, never madeor
it's always a colonel came out and talked to him. But I mean,
there's more firsthand testimony that kind of leads to the idea that there were bodies.
So there's evidence of that, but the evidence that we have today is
not as robust as it was or what we thought we had fifteen twenty years
ago. And that's because we've learned so much more about the case and we've
been able to identify some of the people who claim to have seen these things,
and you know, it reduces the numbers. At one point I talked
to like eight people who claim to have seen the bodies, and it turns
out not one of them was telling the truth. So you know, you
get into that sort of thing. Now, what about the group that was
the archaeology college class or something? Is that what you're talking about? Is
that something else? No, that's something else. The archaeologists were over on
the plains of Santa Augustine, and I think that if there was event on
the plains of Santa Agustine, did not take place in nineteen forty seven.
I think the evidence again is suggestive that a couple a couple of assumptions were
made that weren't valid. And by looking through that stuff, and in the
book, I go through the entire Plains of Santa Augustine story about that which
devolved from Barnie Barnett's tale, and it just again the tale is not as
robust as it once was. The archaeologist's story came through Barnie Barnett, and
it just just doesn't seem to work. We can't find the archaeologists. There
was a fellow named Anderson Anderson Gerald Anderson who claimed to have seen the archaeologist
and claimed to be out on seeing the plant plains of Santa Augustine with his
family. He was like five years old, and he identified the archaeologist.
Guy named Buskirk. Turns out Buskirk, who was in fact an anthropologist archaeologist,
was in Arizona at the time and can prove where he was. He
wasn't there, So you know, the Anderson Anderson connection blows up. The
Anderson story isn't any good. It's it's clearly fabricated. Anderson claimed to be
a Navy seal, and the Navy Seals used to have a website with a
wall of shame on it and Gerald Anderson's name was on it for claiming to
be a seal when he was not. I think they've since taken it down
because I think lawsuits have been threatened, and you know, you lie about
being a Navy seal and they call you on it and then they threaten to
sue you, the type thing I thinks. Don Shipley does a thing on
the web about people claiming to be naked Navy seals and he says, for
every every thousand people who claim to be a Navy seal, one of them
is telling the truth. So it's it's it's really just horrendous in that respect.
So you move away from the Plains of Santa Augustine and the Barney Barnett
tale, and you move away from some of the other stories, and we've
got some interesting secondhand testimony the family of Brown, Sergeant Melvin Brown, I've
had some communication with him in the last couple of months as a matter of
fact, But it's secondhand testimony what we don't have, and it's kind of
stunning given the era. We don't have letters that mention anything about this that
family members would have kept. We have no diaries, we have no journals,
We have nothing like that that you'd expect if this event had happened.
The only diary we have and kind of proves the point is Ruth Barnett kept
a diary for nineteen forty seven. It's apparently the only year she did it.
Somebody given of her a daily reminder book and each year, each day
she wrote what had happened. And you get into the daily reminder book and
you're looking in July of nineteen forty seven, there's no indication Barnie Barnett was
on the plains us and Augustine seeing a crash flying saucer. In fact,
he counter Dix Gerald Anderson's story of being there on the fifth of July because
the diary say Barney was in Secoro buying glass for their windows for the new
house they were building. So you get all of this kind of stuff,
and it becomes very, very kind of discouraging when you've got this story Bonnie
Barnett seemed to be a great story, and now you find a document from
nineteen forty seven and there's just no indications in it at all about this event.
And I know Stan has said, well, you know, if it
happened and they were scared, and he didn't tell anybody about it. But
you go back and you read the testimony of Bonnie Barnett's relatives. Supposedly a
Thanksgiving in nineteen forty seven, he told the story to people, but there's
nothing in the diary from that time either. Well, Barney told us this
amazing story of Thanksgiving dinner today about seeing us alien spacecraft. Nothing in the
diary to suggest that at all. Wow. Wow. Now what about the
deathbed confession that the in Florida of the woman who claimed to see the bodies?
Well, actually, these aren't technically deathbed confessions because that's a legal term
and it usually refers to to admitting to a crime of some kind. All
right, so you know what I mean. Though, yes, we have
people who are in very poor health and they know their time isn't long.
I think you're talking about Marianne Gardner, but her caretaker is the one who
talked about it that. I'm not sure where we're going with this one.
There's so many of these things that are from Florida that it just confuses me.
But most of the time it's, you know, secondhand testimony at best,
and given the way things have gone, I'm just becoming a real pessimist
about death death bed testimonies and uh, secondhand testimonies, because there's just so
many ways that testimony can go bad or in error. Totally understand that.
Now on the message board, someone's asked asking if you know anything about Chuck
Lytel, saying to General Blanchard that Chester Lytel that comes from a book,
that Robert Robert, Robert Robert. Why is his name gone? And he's
a good friend. I had that happen the other day, so it was
asking me and I couldn't remember a friend's name. Well, it's Robert,
Robert Hastings. Robert Hastings, Oh sure, yeah, No, Robert Hastings.
Don't call him Bob, Well, Robert, I'm calling him Bob now
I'll tell you what later, Okay. He he tells that story in in
his book on News. The Chester Litel. It was going to being flown
from Alaska to Illinois because his wife was about to have a baby and he
was out there working with the Air Force on something. And Blanchard, who
was now a general and it's the nineteen fifties, arranged for him to get
a flight back to Illinois so he could be there when his wife gave birth.
And on this flight they talked about this event and he and Blanchard admitted
to Litel that, you know, there were four bodies recovered. Second hand
testimony again, but given the reputation of Chester Litel, that's much more persuasive
than some of those secondhand testimonies. So what strikes me as odd, though,
is Don Schmid and I spent a lot of time with Chester Litel in
Albuquerque, went out to dinner with him, lots of times, went to
his office and he and Don would get these these discussions that just were a
crashing boar and I'm I got to keep awake, got to keep awake,
you know, they were just having a great time, and I've just lost
it completely. But I'm surprised that he never never mentioned a thing like that
to us and even in passing, but you know, that's just the way
it was. Maybe he just became more comfortable with Robert because Robert lived in
Albert Creek at the time as well. So it's a very interesting story.
You have to remember it secondhand, but it comes from a very credible individual,
so he wouldn't be making it up. And there's other testimony Art mcquittie,
who had been the editor of the Roswell Morning Dispatch, and that this
is the thing that just kills me. Back in those days, there were
two daily newspapers in Roswell, New Mexican. For God's sake, there's like
seven people living in town and they got two daily newspapers. But he was
the editor of the Morning Dispatch. And he said that he was at some
kind of testimonial dinner that Blanchard attended and they were seated next to one another,
and they they got back onto the Roswell case and Blanchard kind of admitted
to him that there was there were bodies involved. You know, another another
secondhand testimony. But but you know, you're getting into the the idea that
Blanchard did kind of spread that story around a little bit. So you wonder
why, hey, why Blanchard would say anything about it if it wasn't true.
And be that why either one of these people would say that, especially
Cheester lied little if if it wasn't true. So now makes you wonder,
you know, you're you're talking, we're talking so many years after. I
wonder what things are going to be viewed at that is, if we never
find out the truth in one hundred years from now, what's going to be
left of Roswell? Of what Roswell would be? Just like a fantasy story
or something that you know, it makes you really wonder, doesn't it.
Well, you know, a myth from from the Old West type of thing.
And you know this, this is the problem that I've had with the
with the case. You know, at one time it seems so robust and
seeing there was so much going on, and we've just seen so much of
that collapse. You know, we had the alien autopsy nonsense. It didn't
help. We had the Air Force reinvestigating. Actually the Air Force didn't reinvestigate
the Roswell case. What they actually did was survey different government agencies to see
if they had any documentation about Roswell, which really isn't quite the same thing
as reinvestigating the case, and came up with this project Mogul nonsense. So
we've got all of that, and we may be at the point where we
may find out what it really was, if it wasn't extra Trust, Well,
we may find out what caused the reaction in Roswell in nineteen forty seven.
That got what sort of thing happened at that time that created this story
and that as we got into it, and I say we as UFO investigators,
starting with the original researchers got into it, how we kind of morphed
it into a spacecraft type thing, even though that suggestion was out there.
I think Frank Edwards did something in his book A Flying Saucers Serious Business in
nineteen sixty five. You know, he mentioned a Roswell case and a crash.
He got nearly every fact wrong except it was Roswell, and there's a
discussion of a UFO crash. But it sort of morphed into this big story.
And we were lucky that we had a list of literally fifteen hundred people
who were at Roswell in nineteen forty seven, that we could go to and
see what they might have heard or might might have to say about it.
But we may find out what really happened. If it wasn't alien, we
might find out what caused it. And you know, say, well it
was covered by they felt they had to do this for whatever reason. I
can't think of what it would be. You know, here we're moving into
nearly seventy years after the event. What possibly could have happened, What possible
secret could it be? What possible terrestrial explanation we could have that we couldn't
be told today. It's not like anybody who was involved and is still alive
to be punished or anything like that. You know, if there's a legitimate
explanation, we should have it by now. And so you know, you
know, I say in the book, you know you look at that,
and Segan says extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and I look at the other
side where Sherlock Holmes said, when you've eliminated the impossible, whatever whatever is
left, no matter how improbable, must be the solution. Well, at
this point we've eliminated all the other answers. There is no other answer.
Can we prove it was extraterrestrial. Absolutely not. Doesn't mean it wasn't.
Just means we can't prove it. But there is nothing else that explains it
as far as I know right now this minute. There may be something coming
down the pike that would explain it. And then in the far future they'll
look back and say, yeah, these guys thought it was a flying saucer
from outer space and it turned out to be blah blah blah. Or they
may look back and say, yeah, it was the first contact and you
guys blew it. Oh, by the way, I have to correct you
on something. And that was Marcelo Truseau that actually came up with that,
saying that Carl Sagan stole it. Yes, yes, yes, you're right.
Yes, Marcello Ucie that said that, Yes, you're absolutely right.
Let's see, there was a question, Oh yes, how about the June
crane story. Oh, that's just she wasn't there in nineteen forty seven.
Oh, she had her work history. Her work history is really sporadic in
the parachute, what she did in at Right Patterson Air Force Base, it's
really really sporadic. But in July of nineteen forty seven, she wasn't there.
I had thought at one time, given her work history, she might
have been talking about the King of in Arizona crash and but but I think
now that story is a hoax. So I she was a nice lady.
I talked to her. I have letters from her. She sent me pictures
of her garden, among other things, and and documentation I have, like
the original documents. Other people have them up on their websites. They have
copies of the documents. I actually have the originals she sent me. But
unfortunately, I just don't think her her story doesn't relate to Roswell. That's
That's the kindest thing I can say. It doesn't relate to Roswell. Might
relate to something else. She might have misunderstood what was going on. But
she's a She was a very nice lady, tried to be as helpful as
she possibly could. But I don't I just don't think it relates to Roswell.
Okay, now I'm going to ask you about Chase Brandon. Why,
because I've never asked you before another cocka Mamie store. Yeah, I'm wandering
around the CIA and look in this vault and there's a box name marked Roswell.
Why in the hell would it be to Mark Roswell for good, it
would be numbered only if if any well, yeah, or it might say
Corona, or it might say Flying Saucer crash. But the Roswell Roswell's kind
of a misnomer for this thing that came out of I guess Bill Bill Morris
typewriter calling it the Roswell incident, because well, the the very field that
Brazel talked about was up up closer to Corona, New Mexico, and there
there apparently is a site or two closer to Roswell where the bodies were located,
but it's still quite a ways away. So sixteen uh something like that.
The road's back. Even the roads when we were driving them back in
the early nineteen nineties were really some of them are really crappy. You know.
You you go down this road from Corona to or the turn off to
get to the Brasl Ranch, and you would come to this big sign it
says road becomes impassable in clement weather. I could this is the nineteen nineties,
for God's sakes. You can't keep your roads. But anyway, so
there's all that sort of thing going on. But this Brandon Chase guy.
I don't know what the hell his problem was. I just that story just
struck me as cockamami when I heard it. Yeah, I have heard a
couple of people that really thought it was something, but I just don't know.
You know, I've never really looked into it that much. But I
thought the first thing that hit me was why would anything be marked you know,
Roswell? I mean, that just doesn't make sense to me, But
that's exactly what I thought, Why would it be marked Roswell? And then
and the other thing is he may have had access to the top secrets,
but you know, top secrets are guarded a little bit differently than the other
classification levels. You know, you just can't wander into a vault and start
looking around. You have to have a reason for going in there, and
you're not going and you're not going to be pawing through this stuff. And
you know that's the thing that they that always stuns me about these sorts of
things, right, Yeah, I mean it doesn't really make that much sense.
A question that came up on the message board a while back. You
mentioned Clifford Stone earlier in your books. He is now a controversial figure in
upology. What is your current view on him and his stories? Cliff is
a very nice guy. I visited him at his house first time I ever
met him. We were He didn't want to meet us at his house.
He met us at the Burger King North Main Street in Roswell. I say
that for the Burger King to get some publicity. I don't know why.
But so he shows up in uniform, in his sergeant's uniform. He was
retired, No, he wasn't retired yet, but it was a Saturday afternoon.
He should have been in civilian clothes. I don't know why he showed
up in his uniform and he takes it. Then he takes us to his
house. I'm thinking, well, this is really stupid because his name is
in the phone book, so I mean, anybody wants to find him looking
up in a phone book. So he takes us to his house. When
we go inside and we're sitting there, and says, oh, I gotta
go, I'll be right back. I got to get something out of the
car. And he goes outside the car and he comes back in and he's
carrying this folder. This is his top secret on it, and he goes
in his bedroom and I'm thinking, yeah, if that's really top secret material,
you're going to jail there, Cliff, because hey, you're not protecting
it properly. I'm not sure if you've got a vault in your bedroom,
but I'm betting you don't. And I'm not talking about a save. I'm
talking about a vault. Top secret material requires a vault. You know,
when I was an intelligence officer, I although cleared for top secret, we
didn't have any top secret materials that I had to store. I had a
safe that weighed like a ton, but it's not a vault. The across
the airfield from me was the refueling wing and they had they had access to
top secret material, and they had a vault. So, I mean,
the first time I see him, he's trying to pull this stunt and press
this because he's carrying around top a secret material, which is I have a
science fiction novel. It's got secret stamped on a lot of pages. And
it's because I was at when I was when the Air Force reserved, and
one day I was born in the office and had that novel with me,
so I stamped a bunch of pages or secret just for fun. I think
it's the Moon is a Harsh Missness by H. Robert Hinlin. Anyhow,
I U Cliff spends a lot of stories h he talked about and then the
one that really got me and I think Don Eckers both. He published a
story in UFO magazine about him sneaking through the wire when he served in Vietnam
to go out hunting, hunting the viet Cong or the North Enemes. And
I'm thinking, if I saw anybody in the wire, I'm opening five.
And where I was stationed at kou Chie, they had to have an officer
on the bunker line on our section of the bunker line, and so it
rotated among the officers. So I had an opportunity to be on the bunker
line a couple of times. So I know how that thing was. And
you see anything in the wire, you opened fire. And I remember one
night I didn't do it, but one of the other guys did. They
opened up on this thing that they saw in the wire because they'd never seen
it before. The next day they found out they just shot up a South
Vietnamese grave that had been been erected some five hundred meters away from the from
the base camp. You know, it was something new and they thought that
was something they needed to engage. So, I mean, he tells those
stories and that just ruins his credibility. Remember when the Alien Autopsy came out,
he said yeah, he'd seen the film. That turned out to me,
wow, yeah that was a big deal. Yeah I saw that film.
I didn't see it. I saw it when I was doing this and
this and the other thing. I did a thing on my blog, which
is a good place to plug Kevin Randold do blogspot dot com where I looked
at a number of these people who made claims in cliff Stone, and I
looked at the stories he had told, the how they'd evolved over the years.
So I don't find cliff credible what he says. But he's a nice
guy and I enjoy talking to him. Yeah, he seems like an He
seems like one of those people that are just playing nice. Yeah, he's
a nice, nice fellow. I'm not sure how he could spend twenty two
years in the army and never get above a tech sergeant. But that's just
me, you know. Yeah, I mean he moved into these senior NC
grades, but he never made master sergeant. He never made command sergeant.
Major or sergeant major, command sergeant major. So you know, of course,
people can ploined me, said, well, you spent twenty two years
in the army or the military and all you got was to lieutenant colonel.
Why didn't you get fired? I can explain that I spent a lot of
time as a warrant officer people, but I mean, you look at those
sort of He's a nice enough fellow, but he just tends to embellish his
stories and put himself in positions where he couldn't possibly have been. Okay,
now I'm going to ask you a question, and this might be hard to
answer for you, but what is your gut feeling about what happened at Roswell?
Going back to that, I'll tell you what I'd like. I would
like it to be alien. I'd like it to be extraterrestrial. I fear
it's going to turn out not to be. The evidence. Like I said,
the evidence is not nearly as robust as it once was. I think
I think I've talked about this on my radio show too a little bit.
Oh, just let the listener know about your radio show too. Ah.
Yes, I have a radio show on the X Zone broadcast network. Called
A Different Perspective cleverly titled after my blog. It airs on Saturday nights the
first time at nine pm Eastern time. It's on the on the network and
there's a satellite feed. Usually I end up with a link and so it's
up on YouTube, and that I should have the link for the Today Show,
which was interesting we did. I talked to a guy who actually had
been an officer in Blue Book at the end of Blue Book, so that
was kind of interesting. Wow. And the links usually show up. The
links usually show up like Thursday or Friday, so you can listen to it
through YouTube. Just a Different Perspective by Kevin Randall. And and for your
listeners, if you go to the x Zone, it's x ZBN dot net.
If you go to their website, there's voting for your favorite radio host.
So vote for me. Rob McConnell is you know, he's he's leading.
He's got like five thousand votes and the rest of us have like two
hundred. So vote for me if you get a chance. But and we
we went off on a tangent there, I know, and I entered up
to you. Sorry, yes, And I'm not sure where we were going
at the Time Radio show. Well, we had had been talked about we
we We've talked about the Roswell case. I had Don Schmid on talking about
the slides and other things that he has done as well. But we kind
of talk about where the case stands today and where we all kind of fall
in the perspective. I believe Tom Carey believes absolutely it was extraterrestrial. I
think Stan Friedman believes absolutely it was extraterrestrial. Don I think is not absolute.
He pretty sure, like ninety percent sure, but there's always the possibility.
And I think I fall a little bit further down the continuum, down
towards seventy five percent or something like that. Yeah, I think it's extraterrestrial.
We just don't have the evidence to prove it. Now. Another question
on the forum is do you think that we are being visited by extraterrestrials and
what makes you come to your conclusion? Yes, I do, And the
reason I do is things like level Land, the sightings where we had the
UFO interacting with the environment, stalling the car engines. You had witnesses at
thirteen separate locations as near as I can tell, independently reporting the same thing.
Of their car engines being stalled. That's a very very robust case.
I look at the SoCoRo case, and you know, I vacillate on that
one simply because you can say, well, it's single witness, it's just
Lannie Zamora. But he's very credible. But there's hint, there's hints that
maybe others saw things too. But we get into the into the second hand
testimony. Robert Robert Holder, Richard Holder was a range officer at White Sands
at the time, and he kind of investigated. He was one of the
first guys on the scene, Captain Captain Holder, and he wrote a report
and he said that the three people had called the police about the same time
Lonnie Zamora was seeing the object in the sky, and they reported seeing the
thing too, but the police didn't bother writing anything down. You don't have
the names. They didn't write it down in their logs. But apparently the
dispatcher told Holder of this within hours of the event happening. So there's some
interesting testimony that suggests others saw it in the sky, But we don't know
who the hell they were. We don't know anything about what they saw.
They just called the police. And the police didn't bother to write anything down,
which is kind of annoying. But there's a very very good, solid
case. There's some cases like that. As they said, level Land is
very good because of everything that went on there and around that area at the
time. I think within twelve hours the object was seen at White Sands,
and there's some very interesting testimony out of White Sands. I talked to one
of the guys, one of the MP's who was there at the time and
gave me some insight into what was going on. So you know, there's
this there's some solid cases like that, So I I I think visitation is
taking place. I don't think it's nearly as frequent as it's been suggested in
the UFO community, but I think it's taken place. Now, speaking of
White Sands, there is a video that shows this object object crashing that's like
glowing bright. Are you familiar with that? Yeah, it used to be
on my website till YouTube changed all their rules and it won't They won't let
you play it anymore. It's a missile, yeah, but it's a missile
to win astray. But how could it be glowing like that? You're seeing
that you're seeing the back end of it. You're seeing the fire and the
flame of it. It's a missile that went astray. I think it's well
documented it And in fact, I talked to the people at White Fans about
that when when the video first hit a number of years ago, and uh,
you know this is this is really kind of neat and I talked to
him and they had pretty much the documentation showing that it was a missile that
that misfired in some fashion. Uh. Yeah, that's so disappointing. I
know, I know, I hear you. Uh, here's a message.
By the way, I'm I would like to take calls. So if anyone
wants to call in, this is how I'm going to work it is.
I will accept your call. In other words, you'll be on hold.
You just can't talk until I introduce you. In other words, you call
in to the number six O three nine sixty seven four oh three. Oh.
I'm not going to interrupt our guests, but when he gets done speaking,
then I will introduce the caller. So if anyone wants to call in,
that is six O three nine sixty seven four oh three oh. Or
you can skype in and that's Marty Willis m A R T Y W I
L L I S either way. Another message on the four Let Penny interrupt
you, Let me interrupt you. One thing. Does anybody care that the
score in the World Series is tied one one? I'm glad this isn't a
show during the election, that's for sure. I don't plan to watch the
election coverage because it's going to be annoying. Yeah, I saw. I
said I'd never bring up politics, but I did see a great bumper sticker
today and it said Giant Media twenty sixteen. Let's get it over with.
Well, I've got my plans to go to Canada. I don't care who
wins. I'm just going to Canada. Yeah, they need to build a
wall. A lot of Americans were escaping so they won't go out, never
mind people coming in. Okay, it doesn't matter who wins. I'm gone.
Yeah, I know I'm staying in the United States. It's pretty sad.
Yeah. I wish they had a thing none of the above, but
they don't. In Vata on some of the ballots they actually have that.
Oh really wow. Yeah, so I was thinking the same thing, and
I was thinking, you know, I'm not voting for anybody in this election,
I'm voting against somebody. Yeah, you know, I'd like to support
somebody. I just can't. Yeah. Yeah, it's tough, tough,
Okay. The question on the forum is, and by the way, I
mentioned this earlier, if anyone wants to jourin the forum, it's a really
easy sign up. I'm trying to get that restarted. With the incredible amount
of surveillance aimed at opposing countries with radar detection and spy satellites, do you
think that UFO craft are also being monitored, recorded, cataloged somehow if they
enter our airspace? I would think so. But you know, we used
to argue and quite a few years ago, that you know, the flying
saucers aren't seen on radar. Of course that turned out not to be true.
There are cases, good radar cases, but I would think our stealth
technology render that argument pretty well moved that the uh oh, yes, you
know, if we can do that, what can they do with their composites?
There are hints that the satellite surveillance has picked up stuff. There was
a program, and I forget the name of it, a number of years
ago where they were monitoring the sky with cameras just to detect meteors and that
sort of thing. So the cameras were going all the time, you know,
on a preset cycle, and they would gather the film and then they
would look through the film to see if they could find any meteors or any
anomalous phenomenon going on and the UFO community, and it may have been the
center for UFO studies, or it may have been fun for UFO research or
a combination. That both of them had convinced them when when they were done
with the film to give it to them so they could look for flying saucers
for UFOs, and Phil class raised a big stink about that, and so
they never got the film. But there there is that monitoring going on,
and you wonder about that, and anything they see probably would be class highly
classified and be very difficult to for any of us to get get to see
it to determine whether or not there's something going on. The thing that worries
me that's sort of tangential there is that everybody's got a camera with them all
the time. Now, I just my stupid cell phone's got a thirteen megapixel
camera, and I guess and I understand that's now pretty crappy. You know,
thirteen megapixels, for God's sake. You know, it used to be
the big deals. You had a megapixel, you know. Well, I
when I went to a RAQ, I had a camera with a one point
six megapixel was about the best you could do. My stupid phone's got a
thirteen megapixel camera in it. Oh, I got But I've got another.
I got a new camera and it's got a twenty six megapixel in it.
But anyway, the point simply is, everybody's got a camera with them.
Why don't we have any really nice UFO photographs at this point, taken from
multiple locations at the same time, so we could triangulate and get the size
of the thing and the height above the ground and all of that. We
just don't. You would think we'd have some of the documentation like that,
and we simply don't. And it may be because everybody's walking around looking at
their stupid phone and not in the sky, so they wouldn't see it if
they was hovering right above their heads. But I mean, the point simply
is we don't have that kind of robust testimony, and it kind of worries
me. There was a meteor that fell. It really didn't fall. I
should take that back. There's a picture of it over the Grand Teton Mountains
taking it in like the nineteen sixties, and from what I understand is the
thing hit the atmosphere and glowed for a while and skipped off and back into
space. But I mean a huge daylight media over the Grand Tetons. I
know that there's at least four pictures of this thing that was taken at the
time in a movie footage, and I'm thinking, why don't we have any
UFO photographs like that? Well, of course, the thing was like fifty
sixty miles in the sky, so it was seen over a much wilder,
wild wilder area than if things at like twenty thousand feet or fifteen thousand feet.
But we just don't have anything like that, and that kind of worries
me immensely. You know, I got to tell you, I don't I've
heard people say this, and I understand it totally because I had a sighting
and that is I never even thought of taking a picture. And I think
that you're mesmerized and it's like a lat I mean, some people are always
ready to take a picture. Ray Stanford you had on your show. He
never leaves home without a camera or a video camera with him and has been
doing that for years and years, and now we all do it because we've
kiked our cell phones with us. Yeah, but I don't I would think
of it now, but I don't know. You know, I can understand
why people don't think of taking a picture because you're just saying, what the
heck is that? You know? I mean it's you're kind of blown away
when you have, or at least I was, And I can understand that
from a certain point of view. But there's got to become a part point
where you have that sort of a case with multiple witnesses and multiple locations with
photographic evidence, and we just don't have that level land you know. You
look at that and you say, well, we've got the craft interacting with
the environment. There's possibility, there's possibility that there was a landing trace as
a matter of fact, but that wasn't discovered until like fifty years later.
Where I mean, they didn't discover the landing trace, but people started talking
about it that had kept it secret all this time. But I mean,
here's a case where probably none of those people had a camera with them.
So even even though they well, that's a good here's a good question.
Would the if it's if it's stalling your carriage and your radio, could you
have taken a picture with your cell phone because your cell phone is operating in
electricity as opposed to being mechanical like a camera would have been back in those
days. But I mean a lot of people didn't have cameras, they didn't
carry them around with them and special location. But in today's environment, you
would think think we would have something like that, and it just hasn't shown
up yet, and that that is disturbing. And you know, that's kind
of the thing that we were talking about the Roswell case, with the diaries
and the journals and the letters and stuff. You know, you would think
somebody would have written something down right, and we would we we'd have that,
and we don't. And that's very disturbing when you look at it from
that point of view. Does it mean that Roswell was an alien? No?
Does it mean something didn't fall? Absolutely doesn't mean that we know something
feul It was in the newspapers for crying to allow they went out and picked
it up. We just don't know what for certain, what they picked up.
You know a lot of people believe, like we said, it was
extra trust. You know, I don't know. I worry about that,
but we just don't have the kind of robust cases you would expect in today's
environment. And it may, it may happen. I do wonder too,
why there's not And as soon as you see a really good video, the
first thing you think of is CGI or you know it's yes, some type
of fake. Now. I mentioned this story a number two but on this
show probably two or three times at least. But I had someone visiting here.
I have a Russian connection. I was over in Russia this year and
last year. But I had someone visiting here from Russia, and they when
they found out I did a show on UFOs, he told this, and
he has nothing to do with UFOs or anything like that. He told this
story about being in a pass in the mountains in Russia in his car where
everybody's car stalled in the pass. They all got out, people were lifting
their hoods and standing out there, and all of a sudden, this big,
huge cigar thing went right through the mountain pass right over their head with
portholes they said it had port he said it had portholes, and it just
floated right through the mountain. And then someone thought to get back in the
car and tried the car and their engine started up and they all took off.
Nobody said anything back in their car and took off. This is about
thirty years ago. Well, you know, the same thing happened right after
the leveland case in Oral Grande, New Mexico, and it's just south of
Hullum And Air Force Base, and a guy named Stokes was heading toward El
Passel from Alamagordo and the car stalled. You know, he pulled over and
there's a whole bunch of people standing outside looking at this thing. Stokes got
burned by it going by, and then the thing disappeared and they all got
in the cars and drove off. And he gave the names of two people
he fought, and they could never find those two people as additional witnesses.
But it's the same sort of thing. All these people standing around watching this
thing. Stokes actually manifested a reaction like a sunburn to the object passing overhead.
And once the thing was gone, they all just jumped in the cars
and drove off. Nobody said, hey, hey, let's collect our information
here so that we can verify one another's stories. Yeah. Absolutely. Someone
wanted to know if you think that NASA is cutting video feed when a UFO
wanders into the range. I don't know. I really don't know. I
watched The Martian, and I know that they tried to be transparent in the
movie, showing everything we have, you know, twenty four hours to release
his release his photographs. But I don't know if they're doing it. I
don't know if they see anything. I just I just don't have a good
feeling about that at all. I don't know whether they're cutting the feeds or
or not. I just I simply do not know. Yeah, let's see.
There was another question I wanted to ask you that kind of has to
do with things that are going on right now. This is on the forum.
Do you have any opinions about recently leaked John Podesta emails related to UFOs,
such as the mentioning a meeting with Podesta, Tom law and retired General
Neil mccleo. Mcclass has been Podesta has been involved in that sort of thing
since he was with Bill Clinton and they talked about these sorts of things,
and uh, you know, it's interesting that they're in the emails. Uh.
You know, Podesta was supposedly going to look for the evidence for Bill
Clinton, and if you remember, Clinton says, well, you know,
if if Roswell was alien, they have they haven't told me, And I'm
thinking, yeah, probably not, but I just uh uh, it's it's
interesting stuff. It suggests that discussion goes on at high levels, but I
don't know if it's anything more than personal curiosity, just attempting to learn a
little bit more, you know, it's it's It's all I can say is
it's interesting that they're they're discussing at the highest levels. But remember Bill Clinton
was going to release the information when he when he was elected. Nothing ever
came out. And I think Jimmy Carter was going to do that too,
and there was nothing came out. So it means one of two things that
the you know, people say, well does the president know? And my
answer to that now is I don't think so. I don't think they they
don't tell the president less the ass specifically, and I think that I think
that you know, you look at the environment we live in the world.
Environment the president has a lot of stuff to worry about right by the tail.
Yeah, he's got an awful lot of stuff to worry about. And
this thing with flying saucers. I mean, if we go back to the
actual beginning of the modern era, which I think with the Foo fighters during
World War Two as opposed to the Arnold signing, we're looking, you know,
at this thing going on for seventy five eighty years and there has not
been a hostile attack. We haven't been attacked by and they haven't invade yet,
so they're pretty benign for the most part. So the o the thing
you have to look at is that, you know, the president has so
much on his plate. Unless something triggers it, like in an independence day
where they've got the photographs and the ships are now gathering around the earth to
attack, you don't bother telling him unless he says, you know what,
what can you tell me about the flying saucers. So it's not something that
I don't I don't think it's something they brief him on unless he asks,
because he's got so much other stuff to worry about, or maybe in the
next few months, she's got so much to worry about. I always with
that and I think I've even said something similar on this show about that it's
just like way down the list, yeah unless something, unless something triggers it.
And in case you're interduceted to three ones cubs in the World series.
Okay for the updates as we go here, so I anybody cares. I
had the pleasure of having h the first to record with Chris Mellon, and
Chris Mellon was he was on the Department of Defense and he was an insider
basically, and I asked him the question came up about would the president know?
And his answer to that the president would know if the president asked.
Yeah, I think I think that's probably true. If the president asked,
he would know. And then the next question is is there something about it
well relates to national security or something about it that is so terrifying that is
better that they keep the secret. You know, I think I've always said
the president can get the answer if he wants it, And you know,
I'm thinking, okay, I'm I'm president, and I get my leader of
the NSA, and I said, what can you tell me about flying saucers?
And he says, well, I'm miss President. I'm sorry, but
that's highly classified and you can't know. And my next next my next sentence
to him is you're fired. You get your deputy in it. Here,
he's got the power to learn it. You know, you don't give me
the answer I want. You're fired or an ant you tell me this.
You can't know because it's classified. Crap, You're gone your history. But
so the president can find out if he wants to, And I think part
of the problem is not necessarily he doesn't want to. It's just he doesn't
have a need to find out because he has so much else to deal with.
And I mean, you look at the world today with everything going on.
President Obama's got so much to deal with. The last thing on his
mind is going to be are there really flying saucers? M right. Someone
wanted to know if you looked into and I don't know if I can pronounce
this right, the Cape Girardio Cape Girardo. Yeah, have you looked into
that? First of all, you have to know that Cape Girardo is the
hometown of Rush Limbaugh, so that that may inhibit it. Yeah, I've
looked into that. It's basically second hand. Oh, it's a second hand
story. Yes, yes, from Rush No, no, from actually from
Lynn Springfield, Okay. And the woman's name is Charlene, Charlene Mann.
I think it is to send a letter. Oh. Yes, wasn't that
her father, that he was the preacher? He was, Yes, I
know that one. They came came out to, uh give last rights to
the alien creatures had been killed in the crash. But it's all second hand.
There is some additional testimony, but it is all second hand, and
so it's it's not a really really good solid case. The thing that always
bothered me about that if it had happened, then I think the response at
Roswell would have been completely different. The military high command would not have been
caught flat footed as they seem to have been, Well, my god,
what do we do? You know, what do we do? They would
have had something in place, which I guess it's really not a which isn't
really a good argument because I think about it in back in the nineteen thirties,
late nineteen thirties, as they were wargaming, you know which they do,
You'll play war games, and a lot of the war games started with
a Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, and so you know, we're caught flat
footed by that, but so, but you would think they would have been
a little bit sharper in dealing with this thing, had had Cape Girardo been
a real had been an event I I you know, I when I did
my book Crash when UFOs Fall from the Sky, I communicated with Charlene Mann
got permission to use some of the stuff that she had said in the book
so that we wouldn't get sued again. We're dealing with people who are sincere.
They believe what they're telling you. It just might have been screwed up
in the translationship. We also talked about a photograph they had and which really
just annoys me, is somehow those photographs always disappear. And they had a
picture of one of the alien creatures and some environment, and I think Lens
sent her a couple of photographs that had been taken allegedly had taken of alien
creatures and now that these aren't the ones that I'm talking about, and they
loaned it to a friend, which seems incredibly stupid to have done, but
they did that and it disappeared. So we don't have the photograph, which
would be interesting to have. So you know, it's an interesting case,
but you have to look at it from the point of view. It's basically
all secondhand and it could be the absolute gospel truth, but there's nothing we
can do to prove it right. Right again, we're taking calls if anyone
that's listening live would like to call in nine sixty seven. I'm sorry six
oh three, nine sixty seven, four three to zero. Another question here
in the forum. Do you think there actually have been crash retrievals from any
locations, or that any reverse engineering of recovered technology has ever taken place?
Well, what I've always said is we certainly don't have the number of crashes
that people are reporting. I mean we've if you look at it, I
think some of the lists are three hundred crashes. There's no way to keep
that kind of information secret. It would be out. We would know.
I think the number of crashes is very limited. And you know, you
look at something like Shag Harbor where the thing went into the basically the harbor,
nothing was recovered. If you look at Roswell and you say it's recovered,
then you have to you have to start thinking, well, why hasn't
the technology shown up in our society. Why hasn't something been developed from that?
And I always say maybe because it is so far advanced, we haven't
figured it out yet. If you take a VCR and for the millennials,
that would be the videotapes things VCR, a TV and a powerpack. Back
to Merlin the Magician, and you're showing this black ribbon, and if you
know the secret, you can get colored pictures and sound out of it,
motion pictures of it, but you have to understand two things that are invisible
to decode it. You have to understand electricity and magnetism. He just simply
did not have the cultural elements to decode this black ribbon. And I suspect
if it wasn't so badly damaged that if we recovered something at Roswell, we
do not have the cultural elements to decode it. We haven't figured it out,
I've said, and that pure speculation on my part. That it seems
to me that some of the composits we've come up with may have been indirectly
inspired by that, because we're thinking of metals and all of this stuff that
you have to have, and we now know that you know, you don't
need to make an airplane out of metal to fly, you can make it
out of these wonderful composites. So you know, that might be something think
that indirectly was inspired by this, but I do not know. I think
that if you look at our the the evolution of our cultural elements, of
our technology, I think you can find the the precursors of everything prior to
the Roswell crash. You can see that it was not directly stimulated by by
Roswell. So, uh, you know, that's kind of where we are.
I I don't think we've figured it out yet. I've heard the speculation
of fiber optics as something. No, I I think I think uh Bill
Bill Brazil actually talked about fiber optics. I remember him sitting there and he
says, you know that this material like monofilament fishing line. You know,
you shine a light in one end and comes out the owner. So,
oh, you mean fiber optics, But I think there was there was.
Uh. If you if you look at the evolution of fiber optics, it
precedes Roswell. So there's really yeah, but I mean in very rudimentary form,
but it that it seems that the research was being being done prior to
the Roswell case. And and you know the same thing with some of the
night vision technology that we have, you know, we can see the evolution
of these things. And so there's really nothing that that seemed to be a
quantum leap in our understanding that you'd expect if if you've been handed this,
this gift, gift from the gods, if you will. I was just
both stuck in my mind. Remember the old movie uh oh with the with
the bushmen from Africa and the coke bottle drops there's no words in it,
Yeah, yeah, and and all the trouble. He finally throws it away
because it's caused so much trouble y. But you know that that kind of
thing a gift from the gods. I don't think we figured it out.
I think the other thing that's happened if something was picked up at Roswell that
they might have had in the beginning a huge group of people working on it,
but as time passed, that group shrank so that it was fewer and
fewer people so that they could plug any leagues possible leagues. I think our
society today, we're just too fond of telling secrets that the number of people
would have access to this ultimate secret would be very very few and very little
documentation about it. But I think they apply our technology as it develops to
see if we can suddenly make that quantum leap. So that's kind of where
I am on that the gods. The Gods are crazy. That's the name
of the movie. Yeah, something like that. It's actually really fun.
Yes, yeah, great movie. So what about this is totally off a
subject, but have you looked into the Tabby Star and the possibility of the
dice in sphere or something going on there? This is a question on the
message board. This really annoys me because I claim that planet and that star
long before they called it the Tabby Spirit. I said we should call it
Randall's World, but nobody picked up on that, so I lost out there.
You know. That's interesting. It's very interesting, and we really don't
have any information that suggested might be an alien construct, but that's one of
the theories they're working on. I also saw something not too long ago that
they received signals from like two hundred and thirty four stars that could be intelligent.
And the reason I remember two hundred and thirty four is because the battalion
I was with in Iraq, was that two hundred and thirty fourth So the
number stuck in my mind. But the so we've got that, and there's
the wow signal, and they say, well, it's not necessarily alien because
it wasn't repeated. Well, I remember back in the olden days when you
had antennas on your TV and everything wasn't hooked up to the cable. The
periodically, if the ionosphere was right, you'd get these incredible skips, And
I remember watching about thirty minutes of television I'm living. I'm living in Iowa,
and I'm watching a TV station in Florida just because of the atmosphere.
So I've got an antenna and I'm watching this TV show. So and of
course it's never repeated, so there obviously no TV stations in Florida. But
the point really is they've got all of this sort of thing going on.
So I think we're very close to identifying some sort of alien civilization, however
far away it might be, And that might be one of the points where
they are able to say, yeah, this obviously is an alien construct.
But right now I think the evidence is not conclusive. Yeah, absolutely,
someone just tried to call in, and for some reason this has happened before,
I was not able to add the call, So I apologize for that.
So I'm going to take back. I'm going to recant calls for now
unless you want to try Skype. And if you want to try Skype,
it's Marty Willis. This is the Skype name for that. Yeah, it's
awful. It's awful. Hard to understand that we are not able to detect
anything, but I think the technology out there is probably way beyond our thinking.
Possibly or both sides. Let's take a step back. You know,
twenty years ago we couldn't detect planets around another star. And so when you
when you started talking about alien civilizations, we're to the point was saying,
we don't know if the solar system is unique. We don't know if it
is rare. We think they're common, but we just don't know. Now
we know that solar systems are pretty common throughout the galaxy, and I think
that that trying to pick up a signal, especially a radio signal that would
be hidden in all the radio noise that has generated naturally, is a very
difficult task. And I know they're now searching in other arenas I think they're
using trying to detect laser flashes and things like that. But I mean,
you've got all this problem of the noise that you've got to filter out before
you can get to a signal. And I think think that might be the
problem that we well, why we haven't detected that. You know, I
think that that there are multiple civilizations out there. I don't know whether they're
older than hours, newer than hours, or where they might fit on the
civilization scale, or what their technology might be. There's always a possibility that
they don't use radio as we know it because of their innate capabilities. You
know, we just we just do not know. Because we have nothing with
which to gauge that sort of a discussion. We can only make guesses based
on our experience, and our experience may be completely dare I say it,
alien to how things work and the rest of the galaxy. Possibly. I
think eventually we may come up with a technology that would be able to detect
you know, atmosphere elements and things like that. We have that take we
have that capability. They are identifying planets that have water in the in the
atmosphere of some of the planets. They've they've they've discovered, So we have
that take technology. What we do not have is the technology to develop of
the technology that allows us to listen into their TV programs. And if you
want a really horrible thought of it, this, you're you're an alien civilization.
You're fifty light years from Earth. You've detected a signal and you decode
it. And it's Laverne and Shirley for the millennials. That's an old TV
show. Yeah, I'm trying to think of something as stupid that the millennials
could relate to. Oh well, that's that's that's kind of clever. Yeah,
that's the only I don't watch TV. I haven't had a TV for
since two thousand and seven or eight. I followed the monkey philosophy. If
you remember the Monkeys, they were talking in Pleasant Valley Sunday, the guy
Selcereni has a TV in every room. I try to follow that philosophy so
I don't have to be too far away from entertainment at any time. And
if I can't get my TV work, and of course I can, I
can access HBO on my phone and my iPad. I've got it. I've
got it locked in here. Okay, someone wanted to know what you're again.
I want to apologize. Someone try to call in. I couldn't add
the call, and I'm not sure why that's happening. But anyway, what's
your opinion on stargates? I liked it. I liked it, especially the
ones that had Magiver in them. You know, I thought I preferred I
preferred from him to uh Kurt Russell in the original movie. Yes, right
right, I'm just oh, that's the other thing in Babylon they had that.
Now it was it the ishtar gate or they have a stargate I forget.
Anyway, the concept is interesting, and you wonder about those sorts of
things which would make interstellar flight easier. Uh. You look at the vast
distances, and if you move toward relativistic speeds, you begin bombarding your state
spacecraft with radiation and you have to be well shielded. You radiate everybody in
the spacecraft. But you know, if you get beyond relativistic speeds, then
then does some of that change or is there a way of warping space so
that you short circuit the distances? In some ways, I've got a blow.
I get the astronomy picture of the day on my iPad, and the
one I'm thinking of I think it was like on October eighteenth, somewhere back
there, they had a picture of a cluster of galaxies, which just freaks
me out by itself. All these galaxies, these little tiny pinpoints, and
you can tell their galaxies as opposed to stars, and there's this red thing
around them or this thing, and it's kind of a galactic lens that is
created by the gravitational pull of these galaxies that are clustered together. So you
wonder if there's some sort of of of something there that allows you to short
circuit the distances so that people could literally travel interstellar instances. I mean,
if we're going to go to Mars, it's going to take what twelve months
to get there or something, and you know, so it's a really complex
problem to defeat to get to just a plant in our Solar system. Of
course, it's not the closest planet. You go to Venus, but then
your spacecraft would melt and would be really screwed. But you know, getting
to Mars is a technological feat. I think we could do it if we
really put our minds to it. But we're you know, our attention gets
diverted into a lot of other things as well. So that's sort of that
sort of where I go on that sort of thing. Wilbert Smith from Canada
was supposedly shown debris in the nineteen fifties and his son said, a UFO,
I mean a US Air Force officer brought a piece to their house.
It looked like it was a piece off of a craft. Did you ever
hear anything about that, not that they not that, not that they took
a piece to the house. I find it very hard to believe that if
we've got a piece of alien spacecraft that it wouldn't be so highly classified that
taking it to Wilbersmith's house would be a violation of the of the law.
I mean, you have to look at these things in that kind of a
context as well, and you go back to you know, Smith was running
around with this stuff in the nineteen fifties or nineteen fifty and the attitudes were
a lot different than you know, the government tells you not to do something,
you're going to not do it. And in today's environment, the government
tells you not to do something, your attitude is, yeah, you want
to see me, So so, you know, back then, you have
to look at these things, and people took those things a lot more seriously,
and we didn't have we didn't have the access to the Internet, and
we didn't have wiki leagues, and we didn't have people making all kinds of
classified materials into all kinds of different arenas from all sorts of different places,
so that, you know, I just find it difficult to believe that the
security would be violated in that fashion at that time. You know, in
today's environment, we'd be sharing photographs on it, We'd be having a video
skype conversation and I'd be showing you the pieces of the debris that I picked
up in Roswell, you know that sort of thing. Yeah, absolutely,
So you know, you've got to put it in the context of the times
as well, and you've got to understand these things absolutely. One other question
on the forum, do you have any opinions? Oh, I'm sorry,
this is a different one. Do you think there are efforts underway by the
government, I guess the US government to do at least some kind of partial
disclosure. If so, what form do you think that disclosure might take.
There's no motivation, there's no motivation there's no motivation form to disclose. Yeah,
I don't think. I don't think we're going to get disclosure until the
things land in New York City and Central Park and say yeah, here we
are or something like that. I mean, there's no motivation for the government
to disclose anything. I have a question for you that I asked this recently
if someone else can't. Maybe it was Stan Freeman last week, But do
you think the government actually knows what's going on? Or do you think there
as much baffled by the whole thing as we are. Well, if you
look at Roswell and you say this is a craft of anything, spacecraft and
all the guys were killed, then all you know is that there's visitation.
You know nothing about their motives, You know nothing about their civilization, you
know nothing about how they travel. You don't know if they're hostile, you
don't know if they're benevolent. You know nothing about them. So the best
thing you can do is keep your mouth shut until you can learn these things.
And I don't think we've learned those things. But I just don't think
that we're going to see anything in the realm of disclosure until the event is
precipitated by something else. We can demand disclosure and all of this thing,
and they're going to point and laugh at us as they do. I think
the closest we may have come was in the mid nineteen nineties, and we've
had a lot of discussion going on in the Roswell case, and I think
that scared somebody, because that's the only reason you'd think that they would say,
well, we've got to respond to these Roswell stuff. And the Air
Force pretends to investigate Roswell, when in fact all they were doing was looking
for documentation in other agencies. But we just don't really have any power to
force disclosure, and I think it's going to take the aliens to force it
by doing something that is so extravagant that there's no way to bury it.
If Roswell was a real UFO crash, they picked probably the best place they
could do it to keep it hidden, given the location, given what the
bas at Roswell did, given the the the scientific work being done throughout New
Mexico at that time, they picked the worst place for that to happen because
there was so many ways to bury the information. If it had happened in
New York City, if it happened in Denver, Colorado, if it happened
anywhere else, they probably couldn't have buried it as well as they did.
Right. Yes, A question up on the message board, what do you
think about possibly they could be called disinformation agents? Jim Oberg especially, I
don't think so. I think the guys truly believe what they're saying. I've
often wondered about the skeptics. They're allegedly skeptics, unless, of course,
you're following their point of view. And I've asked them about this, Why
do you accept Mogul's the answer for Roswell without asking the kind of questions you
ask us who are saying that it might be an alien spacecraft? You know,
don't you see the dichotomy there? And and so I think I don't
think Oberg is a disinformation agent. I think he just believes that he has
the right answer. I'm not sure why they believe they have to protect the
flame of knowledge the way they do. They are keepers of the flame.
But I don't think they're disinformation agents. I think if there was ever a
different disinformation program, it's been closed down long ago because we do it to
ourselves. And all I have to do is look at the alien autopsy.
Again, there's a disinformation program if you want to point at it. But
it was not motivated by the government. It was motivated by money, right,
and and a fame. And we look at all of this stuff,
you know, and my friend Stan Friedman will yell at me for this,
but but MJ twelve was not disinformation. And it was Bill Moore and and
and Richard Dody and Jamie Shandery trying to move themselves to the forefront of UFO
research with the disclosure of these alleged documents. And I think we just do
that to ourselves all the time so they don't have to do it. If
I, if I was on the if I was on the staff of the
people that for disinformation, I take credit for all of this stuff. Yeah.
I fed this, uh, this alien autopsy thing to this race and
telling a guy and uh he just ran with it for me. Uh you
know, it was my idea. I just take credit for it, right.
Uh. Someone wanted to know what your thoughts were about Kecksburg, And
I want to ask, had you ever checked out what I think I'm trying
to remember John Venture and someone else that they were on my show talked about
they thought they had it solved that I say, satellite. No, they're
wrong. It's not a satellite. I know. I actually had uh Stan
Gordon on and debating about it. But I think Stan's wrong too. Stan
Gordon's wrong too. I think it was a meteor. Uh. And there's
evidence for a meteor fall in the area, which I hesitate to say because
Stan Stan Gordon's friend, and I know he's spent decades researching this thing,
and there's some very interesting stuff that comes out of there. But in today's
world, what about the right angle turn that everybody said they saw. I
don't think it made a right angle turn. I think it was the smoke
caught in the upper atmosphere and they perceived a right angle turn when there really
wasn't any. And I've seen that sort of thing from if you watch vapor
trails enough, you'll see some of that where it was at one point straight
across the sky and suddenly it looks like it's been all over the place,
and it's the the atmospheric's upper of the winds aloft to get to it.
I know Stan, I mean, Stan has been very helpful. When I
did crash. From the crash, I asked for his help and for photographs,
and he was kind enough to send them to me. And I said,
at that time, I believe there were five legitimate crashes Roswell, Las
Vegas, shig Harbor, Kecksburg. I forget what the fifth one was,
but those and now I think Las Vegas Las Vegas probably was a meteor based
on things that I've seen. At one point on my blog, I had
a from YouTube a video compilation of meteor falls, and you look at these
meteor falls caught on caught on video, I say, videotape, DVD or
whatever digitally captured digitally, and you see the things as they break up.
It begins to look like you've got a cigar shaped craft with windows on it.
And if you just catch a glimpse of that, that's going to be
what your mind perceives. And looking at that sort of thing, as you
know, kind of altered my thinking. So YouTube has taken that stuff down.
I don't know if they've changed the encryption or the encryption on blog Spot
has been changed so it won't play those things anymore. But it's if you
go to YouTube and you type in meteor compilation as three minutes and nineteen seconds,
and you'll see a whole bunch of these things and it's just just incredible
what they look like when you when you think of it in connection with UFO
so well, I saw a fireball once that went over my head. That
was the most It was more incredible than seeing the UFO. It was absolutely
amazing. This was so many years ago. There's a couple of questions before
we get off Kecksburg. There's so many witnesses that this is what I almost
wish I had you on the show. At the same time. There's so
many witnesses. There's people that saw the military go in the trucks take something
away, or a truck flapbed takes something away, and on and on and
on. How would that what's your what makes you think it was a meteor?
Because the actual media was found in Canada, I know, I know.
There's there's little stories and and one of one of them came from our
pal Cliff Stone. By the way, he saw the tarp truck go into
Was it not Lackabye? No, an Air Force base? Not right Patterson,
but he was supposedly was in the parking lot and watched the tarp truck
go into it. If he was sixteen years old. I don't know how
he got there or anything about it. It's just another one of those cockamami
stories he tells. But I know there was that. I know there was
police involved. I know that there was a radio I would say, documentary
that was done within weeks, if not days, of the of the thing
called the Object in the Wood, and Stan Gordon was kind enough to send
me a copy of that. Uh So you've got police officials talking about and
the police officials are out there and that sort of thing. So there's a
lot of this stuff going on. Uh So, I I just I you
know, I there's there's there's questions about it. I just don't get a
good feeling from it anymore. Like I used to there doctor Eric Walker that
supposedly was there and then went to the White House to do a debriefing on
it. I don't know. I didn't know about that year that just came
up on the message board. I don't know about that. I don't know
about that. I know that there's some some things that have been said about
Walker that turned out not to be true. I haven't really researched that,
so I really don't know about that. There were military people. I know
there was three men that were sent in from Pittsburgh. I think it was.
There's a radar of an Air Force Reserve unit there, and in the
Air Force Reserve there's there's full time active duty people who who on the thing
when the reservist aren't there. I know the three guys were sent from there
to to Kexburg to check on this sort of thing. So you've got that
sort of thing going on in their discussion in the blue Book files about it
as well. So it's you know, it's it's a big case. It's
an important case. I think, even even if it turns out to be
something natural, I think it's an important case. I'm leaning now toward a
natural phenomenon for the for the explanation. I don't think that Ventura that venture,
whatever his name is, has got it right. But I fear that
Stan Gordon hasn't got it right. And I always hesitate to say that because
I know the work he's done on it, and I know he's absolutely sincere
in what he says, and he truly believes that he's got it right.
So I always hesitate to say anything about it because I just feel bad for
him. Okay, update Cubs five, Yes to one Cleveland one. Yeah,
I didn't want to do it again. Yes, well yeah, I
don't know enough about Kecksburg. It just seems to me that there was so
many witnesses that saw something going on in the woods and the trench, and
I can and I can, and I can say if we go back to
Roswell in nineteen ninety five, I can say the same thing. And how
many of the witnesses it turned out not to be credible. Well, I
got to tell you also, when going back to the fireball that I saw,
it was this huge thing. I could even see it rotating as it
was moving, and it went out. This is kind of funny because I
was also in a hot tub that's where I had a UFO sighting. But
this was back in the eighties. So I saw this thing and I thought
for sure it went I was right. I lived right near not too far
from the Atlantic Ocean, and I thought for sure it just went right in
the ocean, right off the coast, and I found out the next day
that it had landed in Haina. So it looked like it was going so
low over where I was, and the thing landed or a a large media
that landed that, you know, like an hour or two hours later,
whatever it was in China. So I'm not saying it's possibly the same one,
but I thought it could be. I saw a beautiful media when I
was a paper boy in Shy and Wyoming delivering the papers and looked up and
saw the thing going over the top, and it seems to be sort of
an awkwad green and it broke into four parts. I saw it break up
and then and then go out and then flame out, and I mean it
was such a stunning site. It stuck with me all these years, and
it allowed me to say Shy and Wyoming as well. Wow, let's see.
I just want to make sure I answered asked all these questions. So
I want to talk now. We only have about six or seven minutes left.
But I wanted to talk about your your blog because many times I have
tried to look up information for myself just to see how credible something was or
and I find you have written a blog on it. I've written how many
blogs have you written? Lots of it? Yes, this thing goes back
to like, you know, a decade. Wow. And the first the
first year there wasn't a whole lot. And last year I did one hundred
and twenty three entries. And I know the entries are longer than they're supposed
to be on a blog, but it's my blog and my rules, so
I do what I want, but I as I as I go through.
We've done a lot recently on Scoro and that you know, that sort of
came up on my radio program when I had Ben Moss and Tony Angeola on
the program talking about Secoro and what was going on there. And so I've
done I've done a number of blog postings on that, and that's what led
to Race Stanford being on the program. And we ended up with Rob Mercer
who ended up with some of these files. Well that's how I ended up
with the Project Blue Book guy on my show today named Carman Moreno, and
he was he was, you know, a picture of him standing behind Quintinia.
Uh, how is the book must be fairly old. Uh he's probably
seventy. Oh okay, I was thinking he'd be in his eighties at least.
Well, it's it's the end, and he was he was a lieutenant
at the time, so he could have he could have been easily in his
early twenties. I mean I when I was, I was in the Army.
H I got back from Vietnam within weeks of the Air Force announcing that
there were they were closing Project blue Book. I've actually been accused of being
a member of Project blue Book, which I think is absolutely hilarious. But
but and I'm not seventy yet, so there you go. But yeah,
we had a nice discussion about what was going on in blue Book at the
time and that sort of thing. But that it led to that and Rob
Mercer finding the the blue Book files when we asked him, I asked him
how that came about and why he had that material, and so I was
you know, it was an interesting discussion about all of that. Now,
getting back to your blog, there's you put a lot of common sense into
your work and a lot of research when you write something. And uh so,
actually, if you just look, if you just google a different perspective
online, you will find Kevin's blog. It's Kevin Randall and blogspot or something
like that. Right, it's a Kevin Randall dot blogspot dot com. But
if if you go to just a different perspective, it'll come up. And
sometimes if you're if you're looking for a specific case or something to find it,
it's the first thing that comes up. So, yeah, a lot
of cases I've looked into and find this scoop on your your blog? Have
you? Uh? And I consider you someone very reasonable in very cautious in
your writing. But have you ever written something and had to recant it like
you found out more information? Yes, yes, yes, love can who
was a witness that that was being promoted as having been involved in the Rollswell
case and all of this stuff, and you know, being promoted as a
brigadier general And I couldn't find him on any lists. You know, there's
all kinds of documentation of who were general officers. And I wrote that I
suspected that he was in something called the you know, State Guard Association,
and which is not really military oriented. Is you know, a bunch of
civilians playing playing soldier type thing. And in some of the State Guards they
actually do some really good work. I really shouldn't detegrate them that way.
I myself was actually a major general in the organization at one time. I
sent him my thirty bucks and me. I convinced him I should be.
But so I wrote about that, and I also said in that in that
blog that he was, that he had claimed to have been with the ASA,
and he was on the communications at the Eisenhower White House. And since
this whole thing about him being a general and kind of broken apart and been
more properly than that actual fact, I suggested that I didn't believe that either.
Well, it turns out he really was and had the documentation to prove
it. So I did a blog. I think I took down that one
and put up a difference says, you know, that's a good thing about
a blog. I can eliminate the bad stuff and here's here's the story as
it really is now. And I was right about this part of it.
I was wrong about that part of it. So I've done stuff that I've
taken down, and I'm not sure if you can get it through the wayback
machine or any of that sort of thing, but I have done that,
and I have updated information when I've put something out that which was the best
information I had at the time, and then learned additional information, and I've
corrected that information as we go through it. The most The most recent example
was I did one on the Sikoro symbol identified or something like that, and
a couple of comments made me rethink that, and so I put a question
mark in the title. I think now I'll probably do another update on that,
simply because I have more information about all of that, and I think
I pretty well know what the symbol is and I think we've pretty well identified
it. Okay, just one quick question because we have to close out right
now, and that is have you had a sighting? I can't remember if
I ever asked you that or if you talked about it. It's really crappy.
When I was growing up. When I was growing up in Denver,
I was met with the Denver UFO Society on Thursday nights no Friday nights,
and they had a big thing near Castle Rock and we were all out there
sitting around the campfire, and it looked like something was a light across the
sky from north to south and it got straight overhead and blinked, went and
then it continued on. And it was a time when we didn't have anything
in a polar orbit. Oh wow, So that so that's the best thing.
I mean today, you go outside, look at the International Space Station.
That pretty well looks like what I saw, but it was at a
time when we didn't have a lot of satellites. If we didn't have anything
for polar orbit or orbit, that's the best I can do. Thanks so
much, Kevin. Amount of time here, Thanks so much. Great talking
to you. I hope to have you back on again. Well you know
where I live, I do, all right, check to you soon,
Okay, all right, thank you everyone for hanging in listening to the show.
And that's it for our guests. And next week we have we just
his name just came up, both Ben Moss and Tony and Giola. They're
going to be on next week here at the same time. Thanks so much.
We have to close out because we ran out of time, and we'll
be back next week, so remember to keep your eyes to the sky.