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Hello, and welcome to Open Mind
Guofo Radio. I am your host,

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Alejandro Rojas, and I am here
with my good buddy Martin. Funny dude,

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Willis, Oh god, you know, I think we've said this before,

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but I funny dude, I absolutely
have no idea what you're going to

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say. Yeah, before we say
it in verse advice. I don't think

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you know either, a lot of
times I don't. So you can hear

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a pause at the beginning often because
my brain is formulating something and uh so

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those gears are you know, the
mucked up gears in my brain aren't kind

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of spitting something out, and that's
what comes out, you know, just

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like those old computers where the paper
comes up, meet me, met meat.

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It's a little paper comes out,
and that's what it is. Funny

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guy, because you are making me
laugh before the show here. Yeah,

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well, thank you with the awkward. And we're geeks. We're UFO geeks

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and like I always talked about,
geeks invented awkward, and awkward is cool.

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We and geeks own it. You
know. Yeah, it was going

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to come around eventually, and you
know, by Gaully, I'm glad it

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has. And you know how I'm
an official authority on geek them. You

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know why. You know why,
I know why, but I'll tell the

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audience because I am now officially a
writer for Den of Geek and people are

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like, well, I've never heard
of Geek and maybe you haven't, but

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probably a lot of you into sci
fi have because it's a very very popular

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geek site that mostly covers entertainment and
of course sci fi and all of that

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cool type of stuff, but they
also want to cover more UFOs and more

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space science. And as some of
you may know, I've been writing space

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science stuff for the last few years
and I've been able to go to you

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know, NASA facilities and interview astronauts
and stuff. In fact, tomorrow I

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head to Minnesota to speak to Scott
Kelly. Actually three AM is inviting me

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and some other press people to show
us kind of some of the science they're

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doing. And the keynote an art. Yeah, the astronaut who spent a

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year in space, and I'm going
to get some one on one time with

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him. He's he's like the second
I don't know how many people have spent

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extended periods at the moment, but
he's well, it wasn't there a woman

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that spent like six hundred days or
something. She's combined cumulative six hundred days.

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So his was in a stretch the
longest. Yeah, yep. And

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it was essentially to study the effects
on his body. So it's very interesting

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step. So I'm super excited,
and you know what I'm gonna Shit,

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don't tell anybody, I'm going to
try to slip in a question about aliens

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and UFOs. Yeah, wow,
I'm gonna do it. So I hope

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you do. And my guest I
told my guest for the show today this

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that I was gonna do this,
and he gave me some great suggestions on

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kind of if he seems kind of
sketchy, you know, he might not

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want to go there, how to
ease him into it, which is a

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great idea. So this is I'm
going to make it happen. So assuming

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they don't cancel and he can't do
his one on ones with us, but

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they've already got it scheduled, so
it should be good. So I'm super

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excited about that. My story on
Denna Geek, the very first one,

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should be posted at any moment now. It is about the rekindling of the

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space race. And if you're like, well, what do you mean,

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how do you know that? It's
because Harrison Schmidt told me show so.

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And Harrison Schmidt was one of the
last men to walk on the moon.

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He was part of Apollo seventeen.
And I asked him. I asked him

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about this question and he told me. But I also have a lot of

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other information that demonstrates, you know, how and why we've gotten here to

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this brand new space race to the
Moon. Great. Wow, I can't

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wait. And also I can't wait
for your interview. I hope he doesn't,

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you know, dodge the question.
If you actually get to ask him

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here, he may, but we'll
see. And I don't want to put

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him in an awkward position, and
I don't want him to say anything he

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doesn't want to say, because I
know sometimes they're a little skeptical or they

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don't they were a little worried to
go there. But I've asked other people

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about it, and I've written about
that other astronaut, so a lot of

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times they have fun with the topic. They like to talk about it,

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and it's and it's a different world
after December and the New York Times story,

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and that's a lot of the subject
of my interview. So, oh,

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I should get to my guest.
My guest is the wonderful Bryce Sable,

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all right. So, and I've
had him on before, in fact,

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not long ago, but that was
before the conference, and I had

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him now because he was actually on
coast to coast for just a few minutes.

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I thought he was going to be
on all night, but I guess

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it was just a few minutes.
And that's not necessarily why I had him

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on. Although we do talk about
this, because you and I talked about

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this last week, how he created
and wrote the series called Dark Skies for

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NBC and Art Bell played a cameo, So we discussed that, which was

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a lot of fun how that came
about and all that sort of thing.

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But I also talked to Bryce about
the New York Times article, essentially because

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Bryce wrote a book with Richard Dolan
called ad After Disclosure. So I wanted

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to talk to him. You know, are we in a kind of a

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little bit of an after disclosure world? And you know, given the thought

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he put towards he and Richard put
towards the book, his insights regarding this,

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and it's a fun conversation, very
interesting conversation. He was wonderful.

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He was a great guest as always, so very excited for the show today.

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Right, one of my favorites,
Prices, so highly intelligent and yet

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a super nice guy. He is. He's a big time Hollywood right if

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you if you go to Facebook,
he's hanging out with stars and everything all

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the time. Right, amazing,
amazing and down to earth. As I

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say, very down to earth.
You're exactly right about that, as you

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are about many things, my friend. Thank you, sir. But getting

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to the news, so UFO news, that's what you're here for, buddy,

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is to talk about some ufone news. And before the show you talked

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about well, really there isn't any
UFHOE news this week, and there's not

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a lot, but did you find
something? Well, I thought I would

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talk about. It's more, you
know, like the possibility of searching for

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extraterrestrial life. So not really about
UFOs but anyway, it's about hypersaline lakes

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that could help for the search of
extraterrestrial life. And it's a group of

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international researchers have discovered what they believe
to be the first isolated hyper saline subglacial

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lake in the world. And this
was a news study published in the Journal

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of Science Advances Reports, and the
team came upon these strange formations which sit

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between eighteen hundred and twenty five hundred
feet beneath the Devon Ice Cap in Canada

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after looking at airborne radar. It's
great with this new technology that was acquired

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by NASA and the University of Texas
Institute of Geophysics to analyze the bedrock conditions

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below the cap. Pardon me,
they weren't actually looking for subglacial lakes,

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but there they were. And this
is really something because they're down below the

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ice and they are actually lakes where
you would think that it would be,

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you know, still frozen. There's
they find a you know, liquid water

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and this is saline water. So
the newly discovered lakes are important because they

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act as a habitat for microbial life
and it could help scientists understand how life

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could exist in outer space and that
could definitely apply for some of the moons

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that we have in our you know, in our galaxy, I mean our

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Solar system. Actually we have some
ice covered moons. So although you know,

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it's nothing that was actually discovered as
far as microbial life there, they're

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just saying there could actually be a
possibility that there are, and I don't

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know how they'd ever find out,
but I thought it was kind of interesting

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anyway. And you know, what
does a microbe do that far down for

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all these years? Because they would
have existed for one hundred and twenty thousand

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years. H sounds pretty boring.
And how do you get down there is

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a question, because I did see
that story, and I wonder, you

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know, how do you get down
to get a sample without contaminating and exposing

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then that link to our atmosphere into
you know, all of the little critters

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that could go down that drill hole. I wonder how they plan to do

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that, Yeah, because you can
actually certainly can drill that far down without

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any trouble. But you're right about
that because as they're going down, how

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can they keep the drill bit from
carrying you know, contaminants down And maybe

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we don't want to know what's down
there? Maybe not? Yeah, I

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never know if it's come up booky
through the drill hole. Yeah, I

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mean it could be some kind of
little critters like I haven't seen this show

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life, but I kind of get
the gist of like this little kind of

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thing that comes up and kills people. It could happen. That would be

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awful. If NASA drilled down there
and some kind of critter came up and

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killed people, I'd be very upset
with them. Yeah, I mean,

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what do you do? In fact, put a plug on, that's what

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you know. There was news last
year about hiring this planetary protection agent,

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and they did hire someone, and
a lot of people were like, is

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this going to be a man in
black? You know? There were a

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lot of jokes and speculation and a
lot of stories were generated from this,

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and they thought it would be like
the Men in Black, you know,

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But of course that's not what the
job was. What the job was is

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for this to make sure that we
do not contaminate other planets and vice versa.

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Because I guess that's far. We've
done a very bad job of that.

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In fact, we've done such a
bad job that if we were to

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find a microbe on the Moon,
there would probably be some scientists and technically

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they would they would have some ground
to stand on who would say, that's

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probably not life from the Moon.
It looks so much like life from the

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Earth. It's probably in contamination from
the Earth, and it'd be difficult for

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us to say otherwise unless it was
very different than what we find on Earth.

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Yeah, good point. So we
could have like a monumental moment turn

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into you know, still not actual
proof really yeah, and we've had that.

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So for instance, that meteorite that
was discovered when Clinton Mars came out,

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Yeah, the one from Mars,
and Clinton came out and said we've

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discovered life elsewhere, and then it
got debunked. There are still scientists who

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argue, no, that still could
be a microbe from elsewhere. But many

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scientists were saying, well, we
don't know that that meteorite wasn't contaminated once

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it got to Earth, that could
be Earth life. And some also argue

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it doesn't even look like a biological
evidence anyways, that it could be some

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sort of mineral or something like that. But there are some scientists who say,

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nope, that to them, they're
convinced it is evidence of life from

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elsewhere. Yeah, I'm sure it
will be debated. M hmm. That's

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what we do. We debate,
people debate all day along. So got

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any other news. Well I did
poke around and I saw, you know,

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a couple of other things, but
just not in the sightings in the

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way of sightings, except you know, I think things that we may have

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discussed before about the sighting in New
Jersey, which is just lights in the

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sky. Yeah, I didn't see
anything really out there. Yeah yeah,

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not a whole lot of stuff on
sightings. But I have something that is

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exciting, at least to me.
So I unfortunately have not been able to

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have a whole lot of conversation with
lou Alizondo recently. I know he's very

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busy. I've had a little bit
of back and forth, and we're supposed

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to talk some more soon. But
the last time we did email back and

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forth, he said, check this
out. We're making some good headway.

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And it's along the lines of what
I have spoken about before, which is

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people are like, you know,
why aren't these guys, what are they

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doing? Why aren't they talking to
you? Followed just why aren't they doing

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this? Why aren't they doing that? It's because their main goal is,

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like Louelsander said, he left the
DoD because they weren't taking the UFO question

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serious enough. But luck since his
news has come out in the New York

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Times and elsewhere, there has been
some more serious thought to this and some

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exciting kind of progress. So my
next UFO story that'll be coming out soon

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is going to be about what he
showed me, which is this political story.

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So last week there was a space
conference and it was in Colorado Springs,

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and I do mention this in my
Dent of Geek story that's coming out

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today, which it just so happens
that that's where Space Command is and US

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Air Force. Actually Space Command does
exist if people don't know, actually Stargate

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took place in Colorado Springs under Cheyenne
Mountain, the not the conspiracy Stargate stuff,

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but the television show with mc iver. But and that's why because you

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know, Nora AD's there and Space
Command actually is headquartered just outside the gates

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there at Peterson their for space.
But it was there was a lot to

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talk about space warfare and everything.
However, in Politico talked to a someone

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who advisesn't the National Space Council,
and the National Space Council is actually an

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old concept that was revived by Trump
to advise you know, him on space.

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And one of the advisors was asked, you know, should we be

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talking about UFOs maybe or or no? Just as are you guys going to

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talk about UFOs at this conference,
and she said no, but maybe we

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should. She said, essentially,
if there are things buzzing around in the

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skies that we don't understand, then
we should take a look at it.

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They also asked a couple other representatives
who were there, some congressmen, and

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they said, yeah, we should
be looking into this, maybe we should

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have some hearings, and maybe we
should be funding some sort of In fact,

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this one representative, Amy Barrow from
who's a Democrat, said, look,

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I think it's fascinating. We don't
know what these phenomena are. Obviously

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it's important enough to allocate some funds, and we ought to talk about what

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we can talk about. So it's
just amazing there's this kind of real openness

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to this whole idea of UFOs.
And of course it's trying to figure out

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what these unidentifying craft are, not
necessarily with the assumption that they are extraterrestrial,

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but that they might be foreign however, you know, human developed foreign

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technology. However, it seems that
these guys are open to the idea that

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it could be something else, you
know, something possibly otherworldly. But what's

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interesting is typically, you know,
there's some sort of tongue in cheek joke

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about this topic. But these are
very serious people at the most serious kind

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of event regarding space that goes on, and they are talking about, Yeah,

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maybe we need to talk about it, maybe we do need to allocate

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some money. And that's extraordinary to
me, it is. That's really amazing.

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M that's great. Hey, you
know, when I was poking around

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for UFO story today, I came
across one of these news websites that had

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a survey and they basically said do
you think UFOs are a sign of alien

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life? And the top one was
yes, and then maybe and then no.

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So I'm looking at it and I'm
thinking instead of just doing my first

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initial click on maybe that's what I
wanted to do, I thought, well,

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I'm sure the this is a really
really low so I clicked on yes.

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Ends up there was like eighty eighty
nine percent said yes or something like

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that, and it was like only
ten percent said maybe. I was shocked.

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What is this site? I don't
even know where the site was,

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Like, I visited a whole bunch
of sites and it was just a regular

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news website and they had a UFO
story. So that was on the site.

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So's some regular, kind of conventional
mainstream Newsay. Yeah, and then

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the no's were really low. So
but it was like seventeen percent for no

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or something like that, and the
maybes were I mean, I was just

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shocked. I thought most people would
say, maybe, see that is fascinating.

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And that's the topic of what we're
going to be talking about for the

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rest of the show, is that
I feel things have changed. You know,

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there's a different people seem to be
okay talking about it now, right,

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and who knows where that's going to
lead, you know, I mean

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it. I think what will happen
too, is we're going to start hearing

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about old UFO incidences that people have, you know, encountered, that have

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kept it quiet. I think there
may be some people that may feel like

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it's now time to talk about certain
things. Mm hmmm. And I know

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possibly some people I agree with you, and I know some people will get

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frustrated by this, But I think
it's really the case in that some people

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are like, oh, no,
we need to check their work. We

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need to know everything they know.
We need the files, we need to

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know how the videos got released from
the Department of Defense. We need the

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files as to what you know,
their investigation included. We need to know

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this and that and this and that
because we need to verify what they did.

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But I think that that, well, that's great, and I agree

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that that's important, and I hope
that we have access to this information at

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some point. I think for a
lot of people, they feel like,

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who is a bigger authority than the
Department of Defense. They are a big

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deal. And if they say they
did a thorough investigation and this is what

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their conclusions are, then that's good
enough for me. And I think that's

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the difference that a lot of people
feel that way. There was a lot

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more talk earlier about wanting information,
wanting details on this, this or the

250
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other, but that's kind of faded
away. But what hasn't faded away is

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this idea is that it's a legitimate
phenomena, a legitimate mystery that is worth

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credible discussion and credible observation or at
least thought. And that's a very very

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important takeaway, right you know.
I think some of it can harken back

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to the Chilean you know, cepha
Ha when they had their UFO sighting and

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they announced it unfortunately ended up being
you know, the jet heat signal from

256
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fifty miles away or whatever it was. So I think there's people that are

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out there that are going to say, hey, that happened. Let's let's

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be real careful and see what this
is. I think that's what why we're

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getting that type of blowback. Probably. I think you're right, and that

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makes sense because Cepha Odd, at
least in that one case, and I

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think in a couple of cases honestly
got it wrong. They didn't. They

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didn't do you know they did.
They got it wrong essentially, and that's

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unfortunate. But I believe personally the
Competcha case in Mexico, if you're familiar

264
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with that, the air Force released
some stuff to him Mussan saying, hey,

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we got these weird lights. I
think that they got it wrong.

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I think very quickly there was a
researcher. I know there's a video out

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there I've written about, and you
can go to Open Minds and you can

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put in Campeche and you can see
Ben McGhee explaining the case and kind of

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the debunking of the case very thoroughly
that unfortunately it was these these flames from

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these oil fields. Oh, that
one. Yes, I mean he thoroughly.

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He demonstrates that to no doubt.
And even I was skeptical, just

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like I get with Mark D'Antonio,
you know my like, yeah, right,

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you figure it out, Sure you
did, there's no way. And

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then he shows me what he did
and how you know the facts, and

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puts it all together, and they're
like, ah, okay, maybe he

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did figure it out. And that
was the case here. I even was

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like, yeah, right, Ben, we'll see it. I'll see it

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when I believe it. And I
was able to be there in person when

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he did this talk that in Vegas
that you can see online on our story,

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and sure enough he breaks it down
and he tells it he got it.

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Then I found out a Mexican researcher
had already done that, but well,

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I know we're almost out of time, but I thought there was actually

283
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some radar evidence on that. No
no, okay, no, no radar

284
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all video, So yeah, you'll
have to watch that video. Really good

285
00:24:19.759 --> 00:24:25.720
stuff. But yeah, unfortunately Cepha
got it wrong. And I think you're

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right. That's why people want to
triple check this stuff, and hopefully they

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will be able to because you certainly
I don't think, you know, our

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military is above getting at possibly getting
it wrong and or possible disinformation. You

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00:24:37.640 --> 00:24:40.960
never know, I mean, on
something like this, you want to triple

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check everything. So right there you
go, and we're out of time.

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We're out of time. Thank you
so much for joining us, Martin,

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00:24:48.799 --> 00:24:52.680
very welcome. All right, Bays, thank you very much. After this

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break, you will we'll be back
with Bryce Davels. So stay tuned.

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Welcome back to Open Mind UFO Radio. I'm your host, Alejandro Rojas,

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and I am happy to welcome back
to the show. Bryce Zabel. It's

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my pleasure to come back. It's
always fun doing this show. Thank you.

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So we actually did a couple of
minutes of the show. They were

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really good mates and now I feel
like they're undiscovered. They were amazing minutes.

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But I forgot to push a record, but which I just want to

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just put this out here. I'm
just thinking that in the future, you

301
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should always do that before you start. Yeah, yeah, I think I

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should write that down in the future, push recurse records. Yeah. But

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it's wonderful to have you back.
Thank you. You reminded me and you

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know, of course, before the
conference with such confusion and so busy that

305
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you were just done. Right before
the conference, I was, but there

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was a lot to talk about in
terms of setup. I was very excited

307
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at the time about the topic I
was going to be talking about. I

308
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ended up, as you know,
calling it fear and Loathing on the Trail

309
00:26:03.839 --> 00:26:07.599
of the Saucers, because I wanted
to sort of bring a new tone to

310
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the whole endeavor. We talked a
little bit about that, but then also

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the conference was a terrific one.
As usual, I always learn a lot

312
00:26:15.960 --> 00:26:21.400
and I always enjoy meeting people and
talking, so I really had a great

313
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time. But there's never an end
to what we can talk about. This

314
00:26:26.240 --> 00:26:30.279
is the biggest topic in the world. It's the biggest story in history,

315
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and we would be remiss if we
thought we had talked it out, because

316
00:26:34.720 --> 00:26:38.000
we haven't well, and I don't
think there's a time where we've gotten together

317
00:26:38.160 --> 00:26:45.240
to just discuss uf and three hours. No, although as we get older,

318
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maybe we're just repeating ourselves. I
don't know, but I enjoy it,

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and I think that this is such
a nuanced and interesting topic that the

320
00:26:56.000 --> 00:27:00.799
chance to discuss it with similar like
minded people is good because because you don't

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00:27:00.839 --> 00:27:04.599
really say the same thing. You're
in an active process of investigation of your

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00:27:04.640 --> 00:27:08.559
own thoughts, which is something that
I've enjoyed very much about it. I've

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00:27:08.559 --> 00:27:12.400
spent so much time, as most
of your listeners have, thinking about this

324
00:27:12.519 --> 00:27:17.279
topic. What does it mean,
what's really happening, what's going on in

325
00:27:17.319 --> 00:27:25.119
this world that would explain this phenomenon
in a coherent and reasonable way. And

326
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every time I think I have my
hands around that topic, the bar moves

327
00:27:30.960 --> 00:27:34.160
a little bit higher and I realize
I'm not quite there yet. And I

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think the listeners feel the same.
So I think they're really going to understand

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what you're saying, especially my listeners. My listeners are extraordinary, they're just

330
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but they're thinkers and you and I
think it's the same thing that you're always

331
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kind of rethinking the information. And
I think it's important that you know your

332
00:27:52.359 --> 00:27:56.960
mind is not set because we're learning
new things all the time. It's the

333
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thing that's always bothered me, which
is how do we reconcile all these disparate

334
00:28:02.599 --> 00:28:07.039
things, whether they be alien abductions
or crop circles or animal mutilations, or

335
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you know, go on and on
and on, all the aspects of the

336
00:28:11.559 --> 00:28:14.640
phenomenon that are out there. You
say, well, they can't all be

337
00:28:14.720 --> 00:28:18.440
true, or if they are true, how are they all related. That's

338
00:28:18.480 --> 00:28:22.279
been something I've grappled with for a
long time. We tried to do it

339
00:28:22.319 --> 00:28:26.599
in the NBC series Dark Skies that
I co created with Brent Friedman. Our

340
00:28:26.640 --> 00:28:30.759
idea was to try to come up
with the unified field theory of ufology,

341
00:28:32.640 --> 00:28:37.599
and so we tried to apply some
kind of coherent philosophy to all these things.

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And while I think succeeded on the
level of a television series, a

343
00:28:41.279 --> 00:28:45.279
dramatic television series, I don't think
I ever succeeded on the level of in

344
00:28:45.319 --> 00:28:51.640
my own mind being able to say, now, I understand now it all

345
00:28:51.640 --> 00:28:56.079
makes sense, because I don't think
we're there yet, and I doubt if

346
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the people who do know more about
it than I do, who have seen

347
00:28:59.400 --> 00:29:03.319
the better pick and the better videos
and all this, I'm not so sure

348
00:29:03.400 --> 00:29:06.640
they have it all figured out either. But that's something we'll talk about today.

349
00:29:06.839 --> 00:29:08.640
Yeah, I agree with you,
And just so your listeners know,

350
00:29:10.440 --> 00:29:14.680
just because I forgot that that Bryce
was just recently on doesn't mean we're just

351
00:29:14.680 --> 00:29:18.400
going to ramble because I don't have
anything to talk about I do yes,

352
00:29:18.480 --> 00:29:25.319
because after disclosure disclosures essentially what I
want to talk about, although I do

353
00:29:25.400 --> 00:29:29.799
have a question before we get to
that, but let me do that real

354
00:29:29.920 --> 00:29:33.240
quick. Art Bell, because you
brought up Dark Skies and that's something that

355
00:29:33.480 --> 00:29:37.759
is really cool. Of course,
Art Bell unfortunately passed away recently. But

356
00:29:37.920 --> 00:29:41.759
one of the really cool things that
happened, and you were on Coast to

357
00:29:41.799 --> 00:29:47.279
Coast for this recently, is that
you were able to get him to play

358
00:29:47.319 --> 00:29:52.240
a role on Dark Skys and you
shared that hopefully everybody can can go take

359
00:29:52.240 --> 00:29:53.920
a look at that and you can
tell him where they can watch it.

360
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But he was great, He was
a really his acting was really good,

361
00:29:59.039 --> 00:30:03.640
and that it's very It's kind of
an amusing story. I first met art

362
00:30:03.759 --> 00:30:08.759
virtually by being on his show back
in nineteen ninety six during the promotion of

363
00:30:10.160 --> 00:30:14.480
NBC's Dark Skies, and I had
never been on Coast to Coast before,

364
00:30:14.480 --> 00:30:17.759
and it was interesting that I got
invited back to Coast to Coast because they

365
00:30:17.799 --> 00:30:21.079
were for the Art Bell tribute.
Because they were saying, wow, I

366
00:30:21.119 --> 00:30:23.559
mean you go back to the original
early days, And I thought, has

367
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it been that long? But I
guess it has but Art and I did

368
00:30:26.799 --> 00:30:30.079
three hours. The one thing I
learned about a radio show there is doing

369
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three hours is a long time,
and it requires a lot of mental agility

370
00:30:34.759 --> 00:30:38.759
to be doing it at two in
the morning. But I got to know

371
00:30:38.880 --> 00:30:41.880
him well enough that I thought,
you know, he's got such a large

372
00:30:42.000 --> 00:30:45.599
radio audience. This is the promoter
part of me, the producer part.

373
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I thought maybe we should cast Art
on the show because he's bound to talk

374
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about it, And this is before
Facebook and Twitter would allow me to talk

375
00:30:56.160 --> 00:30:59.079
about it. I thought maybe Art, with his audience, could talk about

376
00:30:59.119 --> 00:31:03.119
it. So Brent and I cast
him in a scene that we had and

377
00:31:03.160 --> 00:31:07.119
I believe it was our eighth or
tenth episode. It was called We Shall

378
00:31:07.160 --> 00:31:11.480
Overcome, which was about the civil
rights movement, and we cast Art in

379
00:31:11.519 --> 00:31:14.839
a scene that took place at Majestic
twelve, which, as your listeners know,

380
00:31:15.039 --> 00:31:19.319
is possibly the UFO cover up organization. So we thought the most delicious

381
00:31:19.400 --> 00:31:23.559
and subversive irony that we could possibly
put out there would be to cast Art

382
00:31:23.559 --> 00:31:29.119
Bell as a member of Majestic twelve
in charge of keeping the UFO cover up

383
00:31:29.160 --> 00:31:32.039
intact. Then we thought, well, then, who is he going to

384
00:31:32.039 --> 00:31:34.720
play? And so we thought,
let's go all the way and for a

385
00:31:34.759 --> 00:31:38.000
penny in for a pound, let's
be really subversive, so we cast him

386
00:31:38.000 --> 00:31:44.079
to play the CBS founder and president
william S. Paley. So Art is

387
00:31:44.200 --> 00:31:48.240
in this scene in Dark Skies playing
william S Paley talking about the UFO cover

388
00:31:48.359 --> 00:31:51.279
up. And if you want to
see it, there are two places you

389
00:31:51.319 --> 00:31:56.559
could see it. It's still on
the website at Coast to Coast, I

390
00:31:56.599 --> 00:32:00.400
believe, under the Art Bell tribute. And if you can't find it there,

391
00:32:00.480 --> 00:32:02.279
or if you just want to see
more Dark Sky's clips, you can

392
00:32:02.319 --> 00:32:07.799
come to my own site on YouTube, which I guess you just go to

393
00:32:07.839 --> 00:32:12.359
YouTube and google my name Bryce Abel
and you'll see it. And we have

394
00:32:12.400 --> 00:32:15.440
a whole playlist of Dark Sky's clips, but among them is the one where

395
00:32:15.519 --> 00:32:19.759
Art Bell is on and it's probably, I think it is our most popular

396
00:32:19.839 --> 00:32:22.759
Dark Sky's clip, because why wouldn't
it be. Art Bell was a great

397
00:32:22.799 --> 00:32:27.119
guy. And here's a quick little
thing about Art's appearance. He showed up

398
00:32:27.160 --> 00:32:29.960
that day and you know, look, this is a guy who, like

399
00:32:30.039 --> 00:32:34.319
you, Alejandro was pretty comfortable in
front of a microphone, and yet he

400
00:32:34.359 --> 00:32:37.000
had two lines in this majestic twelve
thing, and he was a little bit

401
00:32:37.119 --> 00:32:42.039
nervous about him. And not only
was he nervous, but I had asked

402
00:32:42.079 --> 00:32:45.319
him to shave his mustache off,
because William S. Paley did not have

403
00:32:45.359 --> 00:32:50.599
a mustache in nineteen sixty four when
the scene took place, and so Art

404
00:32:50.599 --> 00:32:52.480
had shaved his mustache off. And
it's sort of like, I think he

405
00:32:52.519 --> 00:32:55.680
felt like his power had been taken
from him, right in which a man

406
00:32:55.799 --> 00:33:00.119
usually feels when you take your facial
hair off and you see this other guy

407
00:33:00.160 --> 00:33:04.039
staring mac at you, and you
get a little shaken. So I was

408
00:33:04.039 --> 00:33:06.279
a little concerned, and so is
Brent. We're like, is this guy

409
00:33:06.319 --> 00:33:08.599
going to be up for the challenge? Is going to even remember his two

410
00:33:08.680 --> 00:33:15.559
lines? Art, like all of
those of us who are in this business,

411
00:33:15.799 --> 00:33:19.359
knows how to stand and deliver.
So we start rolling the cameras Art

412
00:33:19.440 --> 00:33:22.160
is there with both his lines.
He's fantastic. I think your listeners will

413
00:33:22.160 --> 00:33:24.599
agree if they take a look at
him. He did a great job.

414
00:33:24.680 --> 00:33:29.599
So just all I can say is
rest in peace to Art Bell. He

415
00:33:29.759 --> 00:33:36.519
started something that we're all standing together
and appreciating even today, and much of

416
00:33:36.559 --> 00:33:40.359
what's going on in the world of
ufology owes a lot to Art bell for

417
00:33:40.480 --> 00:33:46.279
giving shining a little light on it. So I hope he's learned what the

418
00:33:47.039 --> 00:33:52.640
next passage is all about, and
if he's able to, I hope he

419
00:33:52.680 --> 00:33:54.680
sends us a message and tells us
so that we can know. You know,

420
00:33:55.359 --> 00:33:59.799
I agree he did a great job. In fact, after watching that,

421
00:34:00.400 --> 00:34:02.079
I wanted more and I thought,
man, it's too bad he didn't

422
00:34:02.119 --> 00:34:06.759
do more acting. I thought he
did a great job. He did a

423
00:34:06.759 --> 00:34:09.000
great job, and in fact,
we brought Williams Paley back in a later

424
00:34:09.079 --> 00:34:14.239
episode, and I think he was
literally unavailable to do it. He was

425
00:34:14.320 --> 00:34:20.679
just too busy to come in from
perumpt to play william S Paley, which

426
00:34:20.760 --> 00:34:23.119
is too bad because it's always good
to have. Anyway, I think you're

427
00:34:23.199 --> 00:34:27.679
right. He had appeared on various
things. I think though the Dark Sky

428
00:34:27.760 --> 00:34:30.400
thing was his first big network acting
gig. We didn't pay him at hardly

429
00:34:30.400 --> 00:34:35.760
anything, of course, but we
still appreciate. Of course, you know,

430
00:34:35.800 --> 00:34:37.840
it's funny too, now that I'm
thinking about it, Karen. Of

431
00:34:37.840 --> 00:34:44.360
course, what your listeners noted,
My girlfriend is off right now watching George

432
00:34:44.440 --> 00:34:46.920
Nori, who's in town, who
was of course Art Bells successor so.

433
00:34:47.440 --> 00:34:51.000
And the reason I bring that up
and what made me think about it is

434
00:34:51.039 --> 00:34:53.280
I thought, you know how grueling
it is to have to be responsible to

435
00:34:53.280 --> 00:34:59.400
do a show every night. It's
especially a long show like that. It's

436
00:34:59.440 --> 00:35:05.440
something and I think for the Art
Bells and the George and areas of the

437
00:35:05.480 --> 00:35:09.599
world, they've adjusted their bio rhythms
over time to accommodate that. When you're

438
00:35:09.639 --> 00:35:15.199
a guest on his show and you're
basically waiting up all night long, so

439
00:35:15.360 --> 00:35:20.320
you're either overcaffeinated for late at night
or you're undercaffeinated for later at night,

440
00:35:20.519 --> 00:35:22.760
you're not quite one hundred percent on
your game. Here's what I found.

441
00:35:22.800 --> 00:35:28.239
I've done the coast to coast thing
a few times, and hour one usually

442
00:35:28.239 --> 00:35:30.000
goes pretty good because you're on your
toes, you're in your fighting weight.

443
00:35:30.320 --> 00:35:36.679
Hour two you're like totally ready to
rock and roll because you're the adrenaline is

444
00:35:36.719 --> 00:35:42.239
flowing and everything, and somehow in
hour three you just kind of lose your

445
00:35:42.360 --> 00:35:45.880
edge. And fortunately that's when they
do the phone call ins, so that's

446
00:35:45.880 --> 00:35:49.840
good. I don't know why I'm
going to tell you this, but it

447
00:35:49.960 --> 00:35:52.559
just amuses me. In hour three
once with George Knapp, who is the

448
00:35:52.599 --> 00:35:57.880
other George on Coast to Coast.
We're taking a call from a listener and

449
00:35:57.960 --> 00:36:00.840
in the middle of the call we
hear the toilet flow bush and George Napp

450
00:36:00.960 --> 00:36:05.559
said that that was the first time
that had ever happened to him in live

451
00:36:05.719 --> 00:36:08.679
radio, and it was certainly my
first time. Whose end was that on

452
00:36:09.440 --> 00:36:14.280
yours? No, it wasn't no, George Napp me, George Napp did

453
00:36:14.360 --> 00:36:16.760
not flesh the toilet. The caller
fleshed the toilet. Nor did I flesh

454
00:36:16.760 --> 00:36:20.719
the toilet. It was the caller. Oh, that's hilarious. That's a

455
00:36:20.760 --> 00:36:25.280
good one. So moving on to
the next topic then, is after Disclosure.

456
00:36:25.400 --> 00:36:30.000
So you wrote a book and the
reason I bring this up, and

457
00:36:30.039 --> 00:36:35.199
I think, especially my listeners some
will agree and you probably is at work

458
00:36:35.400 --> 00:36:39.599
kind of a little bit in a
kind of minor after disclosure moment. But

459
00:36:40.199 --> 00:36:45.639
you wrote a book called AD after
Disclosure. Some listeners may be aware,

460
00:36:45.719 --> 00:36:50.360
some not. And this was written
with Richard Dolan. You bet what year

461
00:36:50.400 --> 00:36:53.159
did it come out? Okay,
Well, here's the history of AD after

462
00:36:53.239 --> 00:36:59.320
Disclosure. I met Richard Dolan in
the early twenty tens because I had read

463
00:36:59.320 --> 00:37:02.960
his two books, wonderful books,
UFOs and the National Security State, and

464
00:37:04.000 --> 00:37:07.159
I thought he was the best and
most truthful historian on the topic, and

465
00:37:07.199 --> 00:37:12.639
I wanted to meet him, and
we sort of hit it off, and

466
00:37:12.719 --> 00:37:19.119
I think what caught our imagination was
the idea there's probably been five thousand books

467
00:37:19.119 --> 00:37:22.800
and maybe more written about UFOs,
and all five thousand of them seem to

468
00:37:22.840 --> 00:37:25.760
be trying to prove that UFOs are
real. In other words, they're almost

469
00:37:25.800 --> 00:37:30.599
written for the skeptic who's reading them, trying to say, well, here's

470
00:37:30.599 --> 00:37:35.199
the evidence, marshalled to tell you
why you should believe that we're not crazy

471
00:37:35.239 --> 00:37:39.159
and that UFOs are real. And
what caught us was, what if we

472
00:37:39.199 --> 00:37:44.960
write the book that nobody's seen before, which is the one that assumes UFOs

473
00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:49.119
are real, and that the reader
knows they're real, and it's a fact

474
00:37:49.119 --> 00:37:52.079
that they're real. But what's going
to happen when the entire world admits it?

475
00:37:52.440 --> 00:37:57.199
Okay, so the first book,
I mean, the book originally came

476
00:37:57.239 --> 00:38:02.880
out in I believe twenty eleven from
or Richard's Keyhole Publishing. And interestingly enough,

477
00:38:02.920 --> 00:38:07.400
this will tell you something that when
we titled it it was called ad

478
00:38:07.559 --> 00:38:10.880
after Disclosure, The People's Guide to
Life After Contact. It was a hardcover

479
00:38:12.440 --> 00:38:15.800
and then a couple of years later
it got picked up by Career Press and

480
00:38:15.840 --> 00:38:20.599
they put out a paperback version and
they changed the title to ad After Disclosure

481
00:38:20.800 --> 00:38:23.800
when the government finally admits the truth
about alien contact. So they felt we

482
00:38:23.800 --> 00:38:28.400
were a little too obtuse and wanted
to make it a little more clear.

483
00:38:28.599 --> 00:38:34.920
But here's the thing. In order
to talk about disclosure, there's so many

484
00:38:34.960 --> 00:38:37.800
things to think about, and it's
such a nuanced topic, but it starts

485
00:38:37.840 --> 00:38:42.719
from what is disclosure. So one
of the things that I always say when

486
00:38:42.719 --> 00:38:50.000
I'm trying to define what disclosure is
would be this, when somebody in a

487
00:38:50.039 --> 00:38:52.519
position of power, could be a
president, could be a pope, could

488
00:38:52.559 --> 00:38:58.559
be the Premier of Russia, could
be anybody who's in a position of power,

489
00:38:58.840 --> 00:39:04.639
starts that official conversation that these things
are real and admits that at least

490
00:39:04.719 --> 00:39:07.159
some of the things that are flying
around in our skies right now and have

491
00:39:07.320 --> 00:39:12.280
been for a long time, are
from someplace that isn't here, and they're

492
00:39:12.320 --> 00:39:16.480
being flown by somebody that isn't us. In other words, when we admit

493
00:39:16.840 --> 00:39:22.280
publicly that these things aren't ours,
but they belong to that other group whoever

494
00:39:22.400 --> 00:39:27.400
is visiting us. And that's going
to be a radical thing. Now why

495
00:39:27.440 --> 00:39:30.360
do we call it AD? That's
the other part of the equation. We

496
00:39:30.400 --> 00:39:39.599
felt that the acknowledgment of another reality, another a visitation by aliens or ultra

497
00:39:39.599 --> 00:39:44.000
dimensional whatever, whoever the others are, we called them the others. We

498
00:39:44.039 --> 00:39:47.199
felt that when that happened, it
was just as big a moment as the

499
00:39:50.159 --> 00:39:54.239
birth of Jesus. It's a big
moment. So we wanted to say the

500
00:39:54.239 --> 00:39:59.440
calendar almost starts over again at that
point, that we are currently and what

501
00:39:59.480 --> 00:40:02.920
I would call the final days,
the waning days of the BC world BC

502
00:40:04.199 --> 00:40:09.079
meaning in this case before confirmation,
and we are soon to cross over into

503
00:40:09.119 --> 00:40:14.280
the world of AD, which will
be after disclosure, and that people are

504
00:40:14.320 --> 00:40:19.079
going to start to reference time in
a different way after that. So in

505
00:40:19.119 --> 00:40:24.360
our world there's AD plus one day, AD plus one week, AD plus

506
00:40:24.400 --> 00:40:29.760
one month. That there are going
to be changes to our society that are

507
00:40:29.800 --> 00:40:34.440
going to roll out, And the
question is are they predictable? Some are

508
00:40:34.840 --> 00:40:37.239
or are they unpredictable? And some
are that as well, And so Richard

509
00:40:37.280 --> 00:40:43.639
and I fell down that rabbit hole
and spent an entire book trying to dissect

510
00:40:44.039 --> 00:40:45.800
that new world, that brave new
world, and what it would look like,

511
00:40:46.840 --> 00:40:50.440
which is exciting. It's a great
book. If you haven't read it,

512
00:40:50.519 --> 00:40:53.480
definitely get it. It's a lot
of fun because I can tell the

513
00:40:53.559 --> 00:40:57.440
voices since I know you guys,
and for those of you who have read

514
00:40:57.480 --> 00:41:00.800
Dolan, you'll be able to tell
it because it's much more historical, and

515
00:41:00.840 --> 00:41:05.880
then your parts to really exciting and
more you know, thinking like your other

516
00:41:05.920 --> 00:41:09.679
books. Well what if it's interesting
you say that, though, Alejandro,

517
00:41:09.760 --> 00:41:14.679
Because what Richard and I did was
we wrote on top of each other.

518
00:41:14.840 --> 00:41:16.920
Well, one of us would have
a chapter, and then we turn it

519
00:41:16.960 --> 00:41:21.599
over the other guy and he would
write on top and there are sections of

520
00:41:21.639 --> 00:41:23.119
it where I'll read it today and
I'll go, I don't know if I

521
00:41:23.159 --> 00:41:28.599
wrote that or Richard wrote it,
because there's enough of me in that paragraph

522
00:41:28.679 --> 00:41:30.719
and to remind me that it's me, but there's enough of him in it

523
00:41:30.760 --> 00:41:36.519
to remind me it's him. But
it is true. What we wanted to

524
00:41:36.559 --> 00:41:43.320
do was capture the entire future of
humanity, if you will, and that

525
00:41:43.480 --> 00:41:47.079
required two things. It required the
voice, the rational voice of the historian

526
00:41:47.159 --> 00:41:52.000
with the knowledge that Richard Dolan has, But it also required a sense of

527
00:41:52.039 --> 00:42:00.360
being able to just cut loose the
chords that bind us to a common sense

528
00:42:00.440 --> 00:42:06.280
what people know instead start to look
to the future and say, what will

529
00:42:06.360 --> 00:42:09.360
really happen? And that's sort of
because I'm a dramatist, that's where I

530
00:42:09.480 --> 00:42:12.679
come in. And by the way, you mentioned the what if I'm just

531
00:42:12.679 --> 00:42:15.639
going to put this one shameless plug
in what you're talking about is, lately,

532
00:42:15.880 --> 00:42:20.119
I've got a series of books out
that are called the Breakpoint Series,

533
00:42:20.280 --> 00:42:24.239
where I've been looking into fascinating what
ifs from our time. The first was

534
00:42:24.920 --> 00:42:28.920
surrounded by Enemies, what If Kennedy
survived Allison. The one that I have

535
00:42:28.960 --> 00:42:30.920
out right now is called Once There
was a Way, What If the Beatles

536
00:42:31.480 --> 00:42:37.239
Stayed Together, which has nothing to
do with UFOs except that my own publisher

537
00:42:37.320 --> 00:42:42.079
on the what If Books really looked
at Ada as another what if book,

538
00:42:42.559 --> 00:42:45.920
and in that respect, you could
really say it is a what if book.

539
00:42:45.199 --> 00:42:50.840
What if the world finally owns up
to the fact that the people who

540
00:42:50.960 --> 00:42:54.760
think UFOs are real aren't crazy.
What if that happens? And I think

541
00:42:54.880 --> 00:43:00.480
we're very close to that moment.
Yeah, so given your definition and someone

542
00:43:00.519 --> 00:43:02.519
in power, of course you're talking
about someone at a very high level.

543
00:43:02.599 --> 00:43:08.599
But still what we have is at
least closer to that than we've ever had

544
00:43:08.679 --> 00:43:14.840
in the United States, where we
have someone who worked at the Pentagon for

545
00:43:14.920 --> 00:43:17.679
a period of time, working for
a funded program and then kind of working

546
00:43:19.880 --> 00:43:25.199
gorilla in a way. And I
want to remind people, because especially John

547
00:43:25.239 --> 00:43:30.239
Greenwald from The Black Mountain I have
been debating this quite a bit lately,

548
00:43:30.639 --> 00:43:32.960
is that when you're someone in intelligence, and you can kind of see this

549
00:43:34.000 --> 00:43:37.840
if you watch those shows about the
CIA, guys, they're looking at data

550
00:43:37.880 --> 00:43:43.199
that has already been created. They're
just looking at it from a different perspective

551
00:43:43.559 --> 00:43:47.480
to try to glean from all of
the data out there understand something, in

552
00:43:47.480 --> 00:43:54.960
this case, trying to understand situations
and where aircraft that performed in ways that

553
00:43:55.000 --> 00:44:02.000
we can't understand that are unidentified.
And so Alzando feels that they have found

554
00:44:02.079 --> 00:44:07.400
cases where that has been the case. So that's how you can do it

555
00:44:07.519 --> 00:44:10.000
unfunded. You go look at the
data that's already out there. So we've

556
00:44:10.000 --> 00:44:15.000
got this guy working who worked for
the Pentagon, and he says we essentially

557
00:44:15.039 --> 00:44:20.760
what you said, that we have
a real phenomena, we have real craft.

558
00:44:21.239 --> 00:44:24.079
We don't know whose they are,
but we don't believe there ares because

559
00:44:24.119 --> 00:44:30.199
they outperform ours, and that's kind
of a disclosure. It is disclosure,

560
00:44:30.199 --> 00:44:39.679
And in fact, I think it's
very clear the calendar clickover of disclosure means

561
00:44:40.320 --> 00:44:45.519
it has to be on a level
where the entire world at the same time

562
00:44:45.599 --> 00:44:50.679
comes to disclosure. There's no question
that most of your viewers or listeners rather

563
00:44:50.880 --> 00:44:54.599
have are already in the post disclosure
environment because I already know that this is

564
00:44:54.639 --> 00:44:58.360
real. You know it's real.
I know it's real. We're all living

565
00:44:58.400 --> 00:45:01.719
in the ad. We're living in
the post disclosure world to us personally,

566
00:45:01.960 --> 00:45:07.480
but the world isn't yet acting like
we've disclosed this reality. But based on

567
00:45:07.519 --> 00:45:14.880
what you just said and the revelations
the New York Times, Tom Delong's group

568
00:45:14.960 --> 00:45:17.280
that kind of thing, we are
getting closer and closer. But I'm reminded

569
00:45:19.519 --> 00:45:22.000
that we should have a little bit
of humility about this. I'm sitting in

570
00:45:22.320 --> 00:45:24.599
by the way, for those of
you who are listening, I'm sitting in

571
00:45:24.639 --> 00:45:31.719
Alejandro's podcast Kingdom, and I'm surrounded
by his collection of UFO books, which

572
00:45:31.920 --> 00:45:36.280
rivals my collection of UFO books.
And you have some that go back to

573
00:45:36.320 --> 00:45:40.679
the beginning, right, and those
include Donald Kejo's wonderful books that were written

574
00:45:40.679 --> 00:45:45.599
in the fifties. I have those
myself. But let's remind ourselves that even

575
00:45:45.679 --> 00:45:50.760
in the early fifties, when Donald
Keyho was writing his wonderful books, he

576
00:45:50.880 --> 00:45:54.280
kept talking about the Silence Group,
all right, which we're call it Majestic

577
00:45:54.320 --> 00:45:57.559
twelve, call it the secret Keepers. I don't know what you want to

578
00:45:57.599 --> 00:46:00.840
call it, but he called it
the Silence Group. And in most of

579
00:46:00.880 --> 00:46:05.360
his books, as I remember them, he talks about how disclosure. He

580
00:46:05.360 --> 00:46:08.239
didn't call it disclosure, but he
called it the end of the secret was

581
00:46:08.320 --> 00:46:14.440
imminent. Okay. Well that was
by my count, almost seventy years ago,

582
00:46:15.039 --> 00:46:20.239
and so people have been predicting the
imminent end of the UFO cover up

583
00:46:20.599 --> 00:46:24.159
since then, and we haven't had
it yet. But I do think the

584
00:46:24.239 --> 00:46:30.480
situation seems to have been moved forward
by recent events, and we have the

585
00:46:30.519 --> 00:46:37.360
greatest reason for optimism that this new
world is rushing at us faster than most

586
00:46:37.360 --> 00:46:42.239
of us would ever believe. I
think, you know, it was interesting,

587
00:46:42.280 --> 00:46:47.159
in fact, talking with George Knapp
recently, very recently, he wrote

588
00:46:47.199 --> 00:46:52.159
to me and he said something along
the lines of how shocked he was,

589
00:46:52.280 --> 00:46:58.480
how excited he was about what's happened
so far. He never thought we would

590
00:46:58.480 --> 00:47:02.360
make it this far, that even
this level of disclosure would happen during his

591
00:47:02.440 --> 00:47:07.840
lifetime. I feel the same way. I'm sure you do too. Look,

592
00:47:07.880 --> 00:47:10.400
I'm not as young as I used
to be. I guess that's true

593
00:47:10.400 --> 00:47:15.960
of all of the people who are
listening. I still would like to see

594
00:47:15.960 --> 00:47:20.840
this happen in my lifetime. And
if you'd asked me fifteen years ago,

595
00:47:20.880 --> 00:47:23.920
if that was possible, and I
was a younger man fifteen years ago,

596
00:47:24.000 --> 00:47:27.480
so I had more reason for optimism, I still would have said, I'm

597
00:47:27.480 --> 00:47:31.159
not sure. Now I'm an older
man compared to that person, and yet

598
00:47:31.159 --> 00:47:36.519
I'm more optimistic. The facts on
the ground, if you will, seem

599
00:47:36.599 --> 00:47:40.960
to indicate that there is strong movement
toward owning up to this. And part

600
00:47:42.000 --> 00:47:45.880
of the reason is this vast new
technology that's surrounding us. Look at the

601
00:47:45.920 --> 00:47:50.199
fact that you and I are reaching
so many people, but we're sitting in

602
00:47:50.239 --> 00:47:54.719
your office doing a podcast. Think
of all the technology that can be aimed

603
00:47:54.719 --> 00:48:00.119
at the skies right now, by
regular people, not just by the military,

604
00:48:00.320 --> 00:48:04.079
not just by the government. Think
of the ways of communication, think

605
00:48:04.119 --> 00:48:07.639
of the ways of research that people
are able to do on their own.

606
00:48:07.880 --> 00:48:12.760
They don't need official people who have
better toys to do it. They have

607
00:48:12.840 --> 00:48:20.360
their own great toys. So we
are preparing to disclose this reality to ourselves.

608
00:48:20.599 --> 00:48:23.719
That's part of what's happening in this
podcast. That's part of what's happening

609
00:48:23.760 --> 00:48:30.239
with the New York Times report and
the released videos. It's starting to happen,

610
00:48:30.599 --> 00:48:37.480
and it's as co writer of Ads
Richard Dolan said, we are preparing

611
00:48:37.519 --> 00:48:42.599
to leap into their world. Up
until now, the others have sort of

612
00:48:42.639 --> 00:48:46.079
owned their world, and it was
up to them when we would know they

613
00:48:46.079 --> 00:48:51.000
were here. And now it's kind
of up to us, and I think

614
00:48:51.079 --> 00:48:54.599
that is a big, big game
changer. All right, Well, it

615
00:48:54.679 --> 00:49:00.480
is time for a break for those
of you listening with KGRA going to hear

616
00:49:00.480 --> 00:49:05.440
some commercials, so please listen closely
and patronize these great people who keep all

617
00:49:05.480 --> 00:49:08.039
of us on the air. For
those of you listening to the podcast,

618
00:49:08.119 --> 00:50:07.199
you'll hear a short musical interlude and
we'll be right back with Bryce Abel Welcome

619
00:50:07.280 --> 00:50:10.480
back to Open Mind UFO Radio.
I am your host, Alejandro Rojas,

620
00:50:10.519 --> 00:50:15.639
and we are here with Rece Zabel, one of the authors of A d

621
00:50:15.920 --> 00:50:20.800
After Disclosure, along with Richard Dolan. So I want to ask, then,

622
00:50:22.000 --> 00:50:25.320
in relation to your book, Uh, do you see because you guys

623
00:50:25.320 --> 00:50:34.760
put a lot of thought to what
would happen with what has happened since you

624
00:50:34.800 --> 00:50:38.280
know Alissando has come out and told
his story. I think the changes are

625
00:50:38.360 --> 00:50:44.519
subtle, But do you see changes
and do you see anything maybe that you

626
00:50:44.559 --> 00:50:51.599
even touched upon into in your book
coming to fruition. Absolutely there There are

627
00:50:51.599 --> 00:50:54.320
a couple of ways that disclosure can
come about. I don't think Richard and

628
00:50:54.360 --> 00:51:00.320
I ever meant to set ourselves up
as the grand poobas of disclosure who tell

629
00:51:00.320 --> 00:51:02.519
you exactly how it would happen.
So what we intended to do was ask

630
00:51:02.599 --> 00:51:08.719
questions and to make suggestions about scenarios. There are two basic ways that it

631
00:51:08.760 --> 00:51:15.239
can start. It can start because
there's some incontrovertible event that gains the attention

632
00:51:15.360 --> 00:51:22.119
of the media worldwide. That would
be the equivalent, say of a phoenix

633
00:51:22.199 --> 00:51:29.199
light event, only it happens during
broad daylight and there's not any question about

634
00:51:29.199 --> 00:51:34.880
whether it's flares or anything else.
It's simply seen by twenty or thirty thousand

635
00:51:34.920 --> 00:51:37.559
people at the same time, and
they all take pictures, and the news

636
00:51:37.559 --> 00:51:40.760
media covers it, and it's on
the cover of Time and Newsweek, and

637
00:51:42.280 --> 00:51:45.960
everybody's talking about it. So that
could happen. I mean, that could

638
00:51:45.039 --> 00:51:51.880
happen, and that would basically pop
us into a post disclosure world within seven

639
00:51:51.920 --> 00:51:54.320
to ten days. I would tend
to imagine in such an event. Now

640
00:51:54.320 --> 00:51:58.760
it hasn't happened yet, but there's
the possibility. Then the other way it

641
00:51:58.800 --> 00:52:06.239
happens is what I guess we would
call the avalanche. That there's smaller things

642
00:52:06.719 --> 00:52:10.880
that lead to slightly bigger things that
lead to even bigger things, and it

643
00:52:10.960 --> 00:52:15.519
starts to pick up the momentum of
a snowball rolling down the hill, and

644
00:52:15.559 --> 00:52:22.199
pretty soon that little snowball is now
a giant avalanche of disclosure coming down at

645
00:52:22.280 --> 00:52:25.960
you. And that seems to be
what we're following. Now. It doesn't

646
00:52:25.960 --> 00:52:31.280
mean that some event won't happen,
because we don't control such an event,

647
00:52:31.559 --> 00:52:37.519
but we do see the patterns.
Obviously, somebody on the inside of the

648
00:52:37.519 --> 00:52:43.760
government has said, let's release some
videos. We also have a more open

649
00:52:43.880 --> 00:52:50.000
acknowledgment of it between Luis Elizondo and
of course, you know, even Senator

650
00:52:50.000 --> 00:52:55.360
Harry Reid talking about it. We
had Hillary Clinton and John Podesta talking about

651
00:52:55.400 --> 00:53:00.760
it in the presidential campaign. Had
they won, they would talking about it.

652
00:53:00.840 --> 00:53:05.039
Right now we see Jimmy Kimmel interviewing
former presidents and talking about it.

653
00:53:05.079 --> 00:53:08.840
There's a whole acceptance of the topic
that did not exist a few years ago,

654
00:53:09.239 --> 00:53:15.360
and that is really a harbinger of
change. I think that we have

655
00:53:15.440 --> 00:53:17.679
to think about. So there are
a lot of reasons and a lot of

656
00:53:17.960 --> 00:53:22.880
things that we thought about, and
it does seem like we're moving closer and

657
00:53:22.920 --> 00:53:28.480
closer. The one thing I will
say also, though, is because essentially

658
00:53:28.519 --> 00:53:32.239
disclosure is about the end of secrecy. It's the end of whether it's an

659
00:53:32.239 --> 00:53:38.360
official, nefarious Karen's conspiratorial cover up, or it's something else the jury may

660
00:53:38.400 --> 00:53:45.719
be out on, but it is
when things are publicized one of the things

661
00:53:45.719 --> 00:53:47.039
we can be very clear on that. I don't think there's a lot of

662
00:53:47.039 --> 00:53:51.440
facts that we all agree on about
eufology right now, but I will tell

663
00:53:51.480 --> 00:53:54.400
you that I thought a lot about
it. I think there is one fact,

664
00:53:55.079 --> 00:54:00.960
one fact that we can agree on
right now, and that is that

665
00:54:01.320 --> 00:54:06.559
the people who are involved in it, the others, and the humans agree

666
00:54:06.559 --> 00:54:10.480
on one thing that it should be
a secret, because each side has had

667
00:54:10.519 --> 00:54:15.880
the ability to end this cover up, to end this secrecy from the get

668
00:54:15.880 --> 00:54:21.000
go. If you think about it, we as humans could have the President

669
00:54:21.079 --> 00:54:24.559
walk out tomorrow and say, oh, by the way, that UFO's stuff

670
00:54:24.639 --> 00:54:29.039
is real. And for those of
you in the media, here are hard

671
00:54:29.119 --> 00:54:35.599
drives with three terabytes of video and
photos, and so could we could end

672
00:54:35.639 --> 00:54:39.320
it right now? And the others
could literally land on the White House lawn,

673
00:54:39.440 --> 00:54:43.320
or they could land in Central Park, or they could do a phoenix

674
00:54:43.400 --> 00:54:49.559
lights you know, roundabout. But
they haven't done it right. So we

675
00:54:49.719 --> 00:54:52.760
can state for a fact that both
sides agree it should be a secret.

676
00:54:52.800 --> 00:54:58.199
Now that raises a lot of questions. Why do both sides agree it should

677
00:54:58.199 --> 00:55:00.039
be a secret. Did they agree
together it should be a secret, or

678
00:55:00.079 --> 00:55:05.320
have they agreed independently it should be
a secret. We just know that they

679
00:55:05.400 --> 00:55:08.639
think so far it should be a
secret. But now we're starting to see

680
00:55:09.920 --> 00:55:15.199
more moves on our side that would
say we're willing to talk about it a

681
00:55:15.199 --> 00:55:22.480
little more openly, and we're also
seeing i think, more public events where

682
00:55:22.599 --> 00:55:25.360
whoever these others are if you take
a look at the videos that we're released,

683
00:55:25.679 --> 00:55:31.280
seem to be allowing themselves to be
seen. What's interesting. I think

684
00:55:31.280 --> 00:55:35.840
you're one hundred percent right on that, and I think we always forget that

685
00:55:36.679 --> 00:55:39.440
part because you know, everybody is
why doesn't the government disclosed? Why doesn't

686
00:55:39.480 --> 00:55:43.599
it the government tell with what's going
on when at the same time and there's

687
00:55:43.639 --> 00:55:50.840
another party involved, and they don't
seem, at least according to what Alessander's

688
00:55:50.880 --> 00:55:54.199
discovered, at least shared and what's
in those videos, to have disclosed much

689
00:55:54.280 --> 00:55:58.320
to the government, and that you
know, we've had those cases even in

690
00:55:58.400 --> 00:56:01.559
Bluebook, where they're kind of teasing, they fly around, they show themselves,

691
00:56:01.639 --> 00:56:07.519
We scramble our jets. This happened
then and it's happening now. They

692
00:56:07.679 --> 00:56:10.519
outclass our jets, they fly around, take off our jets. Can't do

693
00:56:10.559 --> 00:56:16.599
anything about it, and that's it. No mass, you know, exposing

694
00:56:16.639 --> 00:56:21.480
themselves to large masses of people during
the day, like you're talking about what

695
00:56:21.639 --> 00:56:24.760
they could do instead. It's it's
very subtle kind of hey look at me,

696
00:56:24.920 --> 00:56:29.639
I'm out of here type of thing. It raises so many questions.

697
00:56:29.840 --> 00:56:32.519
A lot of it is. I
mean, one of the reasons that it

698
00:56:32.599 --> 00:56:37.000
was a semi daring thing to write
ad after disclosure is that it's all speculation.

699
00:56:37.840 --> 00:56:43.639
By definition, it was speculation,
and a lot of people want to

700
00:56:43.639 --> 00:56:46.840
deal in just the facts. But
we also felt it is time to talk

701
00:56:46.840 --> 00:56:52.199
about it. We maybe if you
think about it, let's go back to

702
00:56:52.280 --> 00:56:59.199
some analogs for where we are.
If we came across a new tribe in

703
00:56:59.239 --> 00:57:06.360
the Jungles of Orneo that we wanted
to study and they'd never ever seen advanced

704
00:57:06.800 --> 00:57:10.719
technology of any kind, we wouldn't
just show up right. We would observe

705
00:57:10.760 --> 00:57:15.840
them from a distance, and then
we might observe them a little closer,

706
00:57:15.320 --> 00:57:22.000
maybe even fly a drone over them, might fly a drone exactly and slowly,

707
00:57:22.119 --> 00:57:25.079
we might acclimate them until one day
we might show up, and then

708
00:57:25.119 --> 00:57:29.719
another day a lot of us might
show up and we might have a conversation.

709
00:57:30.079 --> 00:57:32.920
We just don't know. The only
analogs we have are ones that we've

710
00:57:32.920 --> 00:57:37.679
had, Like, for example,
in our human history, every time in

711
00:57:37.760 --> 00:57:45.000
advanced technology civilization rather has met with
a less advanced civilization. The more advanced

712
00:57:45.000 --> 00:57:51.760
one pretty much wins and the less
advanced ones are either absorbed or eradicated.

713
00:57:52.079 --> 00:57:55.480
So let's hope that's not what's happening
with us. We just don't We don't

714
00:57:55.519 --> 00:58:01.840
have the facts, but I think
those of a who favor full on disclosure

715
00:58:01.920 --> 00:58:07.519
of some kind have come to the
conclusion that whatever the facts on the ground

716
00:58:07.599 --> 00:58:13.559
or in the air are, we
would like them. I've always believed that

717
00:58:13.920 --> 00:58:16.480
all of us together are smarter than
any one of us, So it doesn't

718
00:58:16.480 --> 00:58:21.719
seem right that a small and elite
group of humans have been able to study

719
00:58:21.719 --> 00:58:24.320
this phenomenon and then make fun of
the rest of us for daring to know

720
00:58:24.400 --> 00:58:29.119
that it's real. We should all
be part of it, because we can

721
00:58:29.159 --> 00:58:32.280
all collaborate and try to get some
answers. And believe me, I think

722
00:58:32.320 --> 00:58:37.320
we need some answers now along the
lines of what you were talking about,

723
00:58:37.639 --> 00:58:42.559
the scenario where it's kind of a
slow avalanche and these little things like little

724
00:58:42.599 --> 00:58:47.559
boulders start rolling down the hill that
boulder's been rolling. And I haven't had

725
00:58:47.599 --> 00:58:52.559
a lot of contact with Elizondo lately, but in my last one he forwarded

726
00:58:52.599 --> 00:58:57.079
me these quotes, and I did
some research and I found them and I

727
00:58:57.159 --> 00:59:00.960
hadn't seen these, and I don't
know of anybody in this field who had

728
00:59:00.039 --> 00:59:04.360
saw these. And I'm going to
post a story about this, But essentially

729
00:59:04.599 --> 00:59:09.039
this was a story last week.
There was this big space meeting in Colorado

730
00:59:09.119 --> 00:59:15.639
Springs and there were a lot of
defense people and otherwise. And I even

731
00:59:15.719 --> 00:59:19.599
used a quote actually in a story
that I'm going to have in Den of

732
00:59:19.599 --> 00:59:22.519
Geek coming up in the next couple
of days, where they talked about the

733
00:59:22.559 --> 00:59:27.559
major conversation was about space warfare and
this sort of thing. But when you

734
00:59:27.599 --> 00:59:31.119
went down in this long kind of
story on Politico that was about different notes

735
00:59:31.159 --> 00:59:37.800
about this, there was a conversation
from one of the advisors to Trump's new

736
00:59:37.239 --> 00:59:43.000
National Space Council. It's actually something
that existed before that he rebooted, and

737
00:59:43.079 --> 00:59:46.639
she was talking to a couple of
politicians and the reporter I asked, are

738
00:59:46.679 --> 00:59:52.159
you guys going to be talking about
UFOs at this conference given the New York

739
00:59:52.159 --> 00:59:55.280
Times story in December, And she
said, no, but we probably should.

740
00:59:55.440 --> 00:59:59.880
I think it would be appropriate.
And they asked talk to a couple

741
00:59:59.840 --> 01:00:06.239
of of other politicians and they said, we would be open to hearings at

742
01:00:06.280 --> 01:00:09.880
Congress to hear more about this because
we think if there are something you know,

743
01:00:09.920 --> 01:00:14.119
flying around that we don't know what
it is, we should be talking

744
01:00:14.199 --> 01:00:17.280
about it, maybe we should be
spending some money on it. That to

745
01:00:17.360 --> 01:00:22.840
me was jaw dropping. It's we're
on the verge of great change and you've

746
01:00:22.960 --> 01:00:31.760
sort of highlighted the one major issue. Before often taken the position that somebody

747
01:00:31.880 --> 01:00:36.599
you know, the people who are
in the know, have taken the position

748
01:00:36.920 --> 01:00:39.440
that they're the ones that should be
studying it. I think the change is

749
01:00:40.000 --> 01:00:45.559
we are now starting on a more
open level for people who ordinarily wouldn't be

750
01:00:45.719 --> 01:00:51.159
talking about this matter to start talking
about it and saying, yeah, we

751
01:00:51.199 --> 01:00:54.599
should really get to the bottom of
it. And the biggest open question in

752
01:00:54.639 --> 01:01:00.159
the field right now is are there, in fact people who who know chapter

753
01:01:00.280 --> 01:01:06.280
and verse of what is really going
on? Or are there people who have

754
01:01:06.360 --> 01:01:12.760
been studying this for seventy plus years
and maybe a lot longer who don't really

755
01:01:12.760 --> 01:01:15.559
know what's going on even after all
this study. In other words, where

756
01:01:15.639 --> 01:01:22.320
are we in the behind the scenes
process of studying this and how can we

757
01:01:22.519 --> 01:01:30.599
move our investigation from an inside the
beltway or inside the cover up investigation and

758
01:01:30.719 --> 01:01:34.679
bring it out into the light of
day and let all of us look at

759
01:01:34.760 --> 01:01:40.519
it, and there are likely to
be some really astonishing surprises. It may

760
01:01:40.639 --> 01:01:45.679
very well be there is a darn
good reason why they haven't told us about

761
01:01:45.679 --> 01:01:47.880
it. I don't know what that
is. I don't know that I support

762
01:01:47.960 --> 01:01:55.760
any reason as being good enough to
ridicule people who are aware of this phenomenous

763
01:01:55.920 --> 01:02:02.000
reality. But there probably are some
provocative things we're going to learn, and

764
01:02:02.039 --> 01:02:05.920
some of them may not be good. Oh I just said of something.

765
01:02:06.199 --> 01:02:09.199
What what if this is their test? Their test is you know, a

766
01:02:09.280 --> 01:02:15.599
government is not ready to join or
for us to converse with I'm speaking from

767
01:02:15.599 --> 01:02:21.039
the other's perspective, if they're not
open with their public, with their peace

768
01:02:21.079 --> 01:02:24.800
interesting and by us showing ourselves to
their government and showing, look, we

769
01:02:24.800 --> 01:02:30.360
can outclash you. We're better than
you. We've got technology that you would

770
01:02:30.400 --> 01:02:32.679
love to have. Are they going
to share that with their public? And

771
01:02:32.719 --> 01:02:39.639
thus far they have not. It's
fascinating and the very statement you just made

772
01:02:39.960 --> 01:02:45.239
makes you It raises a question,
which is that's a good way humans may

773
01:02:45.280 --> 01:02:51.719
think of this, But we're dealing
with a potential alien or ultra dimensional or

774
01:02:51.760 --> 01:02:55.840
whatever, another intelligence besides ours is
thinking of us. We don't have any

775
01:02:55.920 --> 01:03:01.079
experience yet as to how another intelligence
think about such matters. We just don't

776
01:03:01.119 --> 01:03:05.559
know, which makes me think of
something else, because what you're talking about

777
01:03:05.719 --> 01:03:10.480
is in order to that they're thinking
is so far out of the box.

778
01:03:10.559 --> 01:03:15.519
It's going to be difficult for us
to make any assumptions about their motivations,

779
01:03:15.639 --> 01:03:20.800
their technology, anything, which I
agree with one hundred percent. What's funny

780
01:03:20.840 --> 01:03:23.960
about that is organizations such as SETI, which are kind of the go to

781
01:03:24.159 --> 01:03:30.679
people, they're thinking is so in
the box. It's completely inside the box.

782
01:03:30.719 --> 01:03:34.000
And there oh, they've got to
be doing technologies that we used to

783
01:03:34.320 --> 01:03:37.119
just go I'm not a SETI.
As a young kid, I used to

784
01:03:37.440 --> 01:03:42.159
think SETI was an exciting concept.
But the more that I've learned, I

785
01:03:42.159 --> 01:03:46.639
think it's just a sham. These
people who are have been looking historically into

786
01:03:46.760 --> 01:03:52.760
SETI and singing its praises and then
pooh pooing UFOs just really irritate me because

787
01:03:53.000 --> 01:03:58.159
they're willing to believe that the universe
is teeming with life, but it couldn't

788
01:03:58.199 --> 01:04:03.639
possibly be here when reality the evidence
suggests that that's wrong, that this other

789
01:04:03.800 --> 01:04:09.639
reality, this other life form other
is here right now and we should be

790
01:04:09.679 --> 01:04:12.840
looking at that. So I'm it's
kind of ironic you bring it up.

791
01:04:12.840 --> 01:04:15.679
But in going back to Dark Skies
for a moment, one of the characters

792
01:04:15.719 --> 01:04:20.079
we made in the series was Carl
Sagan, and we had Carl Sagan basically

793
01:04:21.079 --> 01:04:27.719
being brought into the cover up because
he was willing to trade getting knowledge of

794
01:04:27.760 --> 01:04:30.679
what was really going on in order
to become the public shill for telling people.

795
01:04:31.079 --> 01:04:35.079
Again, as Carl said, there's
billions and billions of planets out there

796
01:04:35.519 --> 01:04:40.400
and life is teaming out there in
the universe, but they couldn't be here,

797
01:04:40.519 --> 01:04:42.519
and I just don't buy it.
I don't think it makes sense.

798
01:04:42.639 --> 01:04:45.639
By the way, can I do
a shameless update on where AD stands right

799
01:04:45.679 --> 01:04:49.440
now? Please do. It's not
shameless, it pertains to the conversation and

800
01:04:49.480 --> 01:04:56.280
it's very exciting, all right.
So one of the as your listeners know,

801
01:04:56.400 --> 01:05:01.400
I'm not so much of you.
I'm a semi semi expert at best.

802
01:05:01.679 --> 01:05:06.480
On UFOs. I know a few
things, but primarily you know quite

803
01:05:06.480 --> 01:05:10.039
a bit. Okay, well,
thank you. But I'm a writer producer

804
01:05:10.079 --> 01:05:15.320
in Hollywood and I do television shows
and films and so One of the reasons

805
01:05:15.360 --> 01:05:20.159
that I've always been excited about ad
After Disclosure is it's the intellectual property,

806
01:05:20.440 --> 01:05:25.039
it's the underlying rights, if you
will, to what could become a very

807
01:05:25.039 --> 01:05:29.920
exciting television series. So I reached
out originally to Richard Dolan because of his

808
01:05:30.119 --> 01:05:34.199
vast expertise, to try to craft
this ip this book, if you will,

809
01:05:34.719 --> 01:05:40.400
And now just recently I've reached out
to my Dark Skies co creator,

810
01:05:40.440 --> 01:05:45.679
Brent Friedman, who is one of
the great minds of storytelling. He's just

811
01:05:45.719 --> 01:05:50.000
a brilliant storyteller, and we have
been working on taking the book that Dolan

812
01:05:50.039 --> 01:05:55.880
and I wrote and developing it into
a new television series. And I'm not

813
01:05:55.920 --> 01:06:00.719
going to tell the details of what
we're doing yet because we're still trying to

814
01:06:00.760 --> 01:06:04.280
figure out exactly how to tell it. But our plan is to get this

815
01:06:04.400 --> 01:06:09.599
out into the market, at least
pitching it in the market in the next

816
01:06:10.000 --> 01:06:13.559
you know, within six months,
and maybe earlier, with an idea to

817
01:06:13.639 --> 01:06:17.679
trying to tell a longer story,
a more dramatic story. And frankly,

818
01:06:18.079 --> 01:06:23.280
the reason we're doing it is that
if we don't get it done quick,

819
01:06:23.679 --> 01:06:28.039
I think real events are going to
overtake it do it. I think that

820
01:06:28.079 --> 01:06:31.800
we are, you know, again, given what I said about Donald Keiho

821
01:06:32.119 --> 01:06:36.159
and people predicting this going back seventy
years or fifty years or sixty years,

822
01:06:38.000 --> 01:06:42.400
I still do believe we are on
the precipice of this happening, and I

823
01:06:42.440 --> 01:06:47.000
would now put the odds at fifty
to fifty over the next five years.

824
01:06:47.079 --> 01:06:53.360
So I really think we are living
in exciting times. And the thing that

825
01:06:53.400 --> 01:06:57.920
I would frankly urge any listeners to
do is for a long time, we've

826
01:06:57.920 --> 01:07:01.480
all been led to believe that.
As I've often said, I think people

827
01:07:01.519 --> 01:07:06.480
that talk about UFOs publicly are often
treated like the drunk uncle at the wedding

828
01:07:06.519 --> 01:07:10.960
party. And I think it's time
for us to move beyond that. So

829
01:07:11.000 --> 01:07:13.920
for those of us who actually know
that this is a real issue and a

830
01:07:13.920 --> 01:07:18.320
real phenomenon, it's time for us
to take a more public profile and to

831
01:07:18.480 --> 01:07:25.320
speak up in places two people who
we wouldn't ordinarily talk to him. Yeah,

832
01:07:25.440 --> 01:07:29.920
that reminded me of kind of because
I was thinking of, you know,

833
01:07:30.079 --> 01:07:33.760
scenes like that would be in there
and in your show, and I

834
01:07:33.800 --> 01:07:36.239
don't know that these are going to
be scenes in your show, and I

835
01:07:36.280 --> 01:07:41.079
apologize. If they're good, I'm
going to take trust you do it because

836
01:07:41.119 --> 01:07:44.400
it made me think of you know, Nick Pope got really excited. He

837
01:07:44.440 --> 01:07:47.480
even spoke at the UFO Congress about
how he was part of this royal science

838
01:07:48.239 --> 01:07:55.880
conference in space and he was there
and behind the scenes many of the scientists

839
01:07:55.960 --> 01:08:00.760
were willing to share their UFO stories
to talk about UFOs, but they even

840
01:08:00.800 --> 01:08:03.000
said to them, there's no way
I want to talk publicly about this sort

841
01:08:03.000 --> 01:08:08.880
of thing. Here we come,
you know, post December, post this

842
01:08:08.920 --> 01:08:13.440
New York Times story and add a
similar to sort of space conference. Not

843
01:08:13.519 --> 01:08:16.840
only do we have some people talking
about this with a reporter and willing to

844
01:08:16.920 --> 01:08:21.319
talk about it, these are people
who can create some sort of action unit,

845
01:08:21.399 --> 01:08:27.960
right that can you know, something
actionable may happen from what they're doing,

846
01:08:28.199 --> 01:08:32.159
and they're feeling more empowered because of
what's happened. So that to your

847
01:08:32.239 --> 01:08:36.479
point, things are moving and changing
and it's really exciting. I think the

848
01:08:36.560 --> 01:08:43.840
number one way that we accelerate disclosure
and accelerate this brave new world is to

849
01:08:44.039 --> 01:08:49.840
normalize discussion of UFO reality. And
by that I mean for seventy years,

850
01:08:50.680 --> 01:08:57.720
the powers that be have made derision
and ridicule and denial. The way that

851
01:08:57.760 --> 01:09:01.079
we keep this from being talked about
too much. The more we normalize it,

852
01:09:01.119 --> 01:09:08.560
the more we're willing to speak to
friends, neighbors, coworkers in a

853
01:09:08.600 --> 01:09:15.199
normal and yet forthright way about this. It normalizes it so that other people

854
01:09:15.279 --> 01:09:17.399
can talk about it. So if
you've had an experience or a citing,

855
01:09:17.680 --> 01:09:21.000
you should talk about it. If
you just have a belief that it's time

856
01:09:21.039 --> 01:09:25.640
for it to be more more common, talk about it. If you read

857
01:09:25.640 --> 01:09:30.279
the New York Times article, send
it to your friends, Normalize the conversation

858
01:09:30.800 --> 01:09:34.399
about what's going on with UFOs,
and you'll be surprised. How fast did

859
01:09:34.399 --> 01:09:40.960
the Berlin Fall wallfall? Very fast? How fast did we go from Harvey

860
01:09:41.000 --> 01:09:45.359
Weinstein to the Me Too movement?
How fast did we go from the shooting

861
01:09:45.399 --> 01:09:50.399
in Florida to the Never Again movement? And the answer is almost overnight?

862
01:09:50.960 --> 01:09:56.359
All right. So, if the
conditions are right, this thing could break

863
01:09:56.399 --> 01:10:00.560
out in a heartbeat. And your
role, if you're listening right now and

864
01:10:00.600 --> 01:10:02.920
you want to be a part of
that, is don't hide your feelings,

865
01:10:03.319 --> 01:10:09.760
just make them more normal, talk
about them. Don't be crazy, don't

866
01:10:09.800 --> 01:10:15.319
be angry, just be normal and
conversational and speak to people about it,

867
01:10:15.520 --> 01:10:18.800
and that's how the wall of secrecy
is going to fall. This is a

868
01:10:19.000 --> 01:10:23.399
great point to end on. All
right, thank you so much. Work

869
01:10:23.560 --> 01:10:27.520
already out of time to time fly, so now's your time to plug.

870
01:10:27.600 --> 01:10:31.520
Like where can people go to find
out more about your books? And absolutely

871
01:10:31.640 --> 01:10:35.560
listen. I appreciate that I'm still
promoting my Beatles, but because I do

872
01:10:35.640 --> 01:10:40.199
love it, and people can go
to what if beatles dot com to see

873
01:10:40.199 --> 01:10:45.760
that we are working on the after
disclosure thing that will soon be at afterdisclosure

874
01:10:45.800 --> 01:10:47.239
dot com, but it's not there
right now. If people just want to

875
01:10:47.239 --> 01:10:50.159
know what's going on with me,
they can go to pricesable dot com.

876
01:10:50.159 --> 01:10:55.039
That's b R yce z A b
E L. And I hope people do

877
01:10:55.159 --> 01:10:58.880
because I love the conversation. Perfect. Thank you so much, my pleasure.

878
01:10:59.119 --> 01:11:01.760
Thank you so much. Did Bryce
Sabel for joining us once again.

879
01:11:02.119 --> 01:11:05.600
It's always awesome to have him back
on the show. He's so much fun,

880
01:11:05.920 --> 01:11:10.239
His energy is so great. He's
an out of the box thinker.

881
01:11:10.279 --> 01:11:15.079
He's always thinking about how to present
this credible information in a way that is

882
01:11:15.079 --> 01:11:19.199
really going to grasp an audience.
Of course, he's fictionalizing a lot of

883
01:11:19.239 --> 01:11:24.239
this stuff, but it's often,
you know, stuff that is actually pooled

884
01:11:24.279 --> 01:11:27.000
from the research. And as you
can tell, he says, I'm no

885
01:11:27.079 --> 01:11:30.399
eufologist, but you know what,
he knows a lot more. He knows

886
01:11:30.439 --> 01:11:32.880
a lot more than a lot of
the so called uthologists that I do know.

887
01:11:33.039 --> 01:11:38.800
So I certainly would if you had
to say, is Bryce's abele euthologists,

888
01:11:38.800 --> 01:11:41.520
I'd say, yes, he is. So. I mean, even

889
01:11:41.560 --> 01:11:44.720
though he had spoken with us recently, I thought, you know, he

890
01:11:44.920 --> 01:11:47.640
helped write this book AD and he's
such an out of the box kind of

891
01:11:47.680 --> 01:11:51.199
thinker. I think that he's going
to have some really interesting things to say

892
01:11:51.640 --> 01:11:56.880
about what feels like this, this
kind of post ad kind of world.

893
01:11:56.960 --> 01:12:00.760
Things are changing. You can feel
it. And I mean, in conversation

894
01:12:00.119 --> 01:12:03.319
in this story, I'll be writing
that you need to look out for soon.

895
01:12:03.600 --> 01:12:10.359
These politicians talking about actually, you
know, having some sort of program

896
01:12:11.399 --> 01:12:15.199
related to UFO is kind of rebooting
something. I mean, the revelation that

897
01:12:15.199 --> 01:12:19.119
there was a program at all is
just shocking, let alone people actually taking

898
01:12:19.119 --> 01:12:25.880
it seriously at such a high level
in the government about rebooting a program like

899
01:12:25.920 --> 01:12:30.720
that, It's extraordinary. These are
extraordinary times. So thank you so much

900
01:12:30.760 --> 01:12:34.479
for joining me, Bryce that it
was a very incredible discussion. Please do

901
01:12:34.640 --> 01:12:39.640
check out everything he's up to some
very cool stuff from the last show.

902
01:12:39.720 --> 01:12:42.640
You know, he's working on a
Betty and Barney Hill movie. He's working

903
01:12:42.680 --> 01:12:47.039
on a movie that kind of highlights
the work of Stanton Friedman and Don Schmidt

904
01:12:47.079 --> 01:12:50.279
called Magicman or something similar to that. I think that's a working title.

905
01:12:50.560 --> 01:12:55.760
And now we've got this show based
on the book ad which I think would

906
01:12:55.760 --> 01:12:59.800
be so interesting. I didn't know
that either when I invited him back to

907
01:12:59.800 --> 01:13:02.720
the show, So that's a scoop
for the show, and an exciting one

908
01:13:02.920 --> 01:13:08.560
at that. But I also want
to remind you go check out ufocongress dot

909
01:13:08.600 --> 01:13:13.319
com. Lots of cool stuff there. We've got lots of new videos up

910
01:13:13.399 --> 01:13:17.119
at the video site there, and
watch the store. There are new products

911
01:13:17.159 --> 01:13:21.520
like mugs and really cool stuff.
So ufocongress dot com check that out.

912
01:13:21.720 --> 01:13:25.880
And all of the news that Martin
and I talked about you can find at

913
01:13:25.920 --> 01:13:29.880
Openminds dot tv. Of course I'm
posting new stuff there daily. We still

914
01:13:29.880 --> 01:13:31.920
have daily headlines, even though we
don't have as many stories as we used

915
01:13:31.960 --> 01:13:34.760
to. But Before we go,
I want to thank Calem Haiggs for the

916
01:13:34.800 --> 01:13:41.199
opening and Closed Music Systematics for the
bumper music, and of course, as

917
01:13:41.239 --> 01:13:44.960
always, I want to thank the
most important people. Don't I kiss your

918
01:13:44.960 --> 01:13:46.720
butt so much? But I love
to do it because I think my listeners

919
01:13:46.880 --> 01:13:51.239
are awesome and they deserve it.
So thank you so much for joining me

920
01:13:51.319 --> 01:14:50.359
once and again. Until next time, Audio smooth chechos your motion and sound.

921
01:14:50.560 --> 01:14:58.600
The glassy summary of my second thought
res