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listeners, I am Dan fa Valley coming at you as we continue our decade
ranking series with Adam frommel He is an editor for Bleacher Report as well as
the founder and editor in chief of NBA Math. Follow him on Twitter.
At zero nine, we are up to the top ten players for the Los
Angeles Lakers of this past decade. Spoiler alert, This franchise was maddening to
rank in this context. You will find out soon enough, and we start
things off with a two way tie in ninth place. There's no tenth place.
That's how you get the Lakers started off. That's that's just the best
way to do it. It was that confusing of a process. Before we
get into this, though, just to remind to continue rating, reviewing,
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We will come up last, but certainly not least. Just want to
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them in just a moment. Adam, how are you doing. I'm good
and confused because, as you mentioned, this was a Madden franchise to try
to figure out the top ten four from twenty ten to eleven through the present.
We saw forty different players received votes in the fan ballot, ranging from
all sorts of role players to the hopeful inclusion I assume of Jimmy Butler,
who has, to the best of my knowledge, never played for the Lakers.
I'm pretty sure that's correct. Nothing made sense here. It was.
It was weird from start to finish, which I think is kind of the
testament to how the Lakers have fared over the last decade, which was coming
out of those Kobe Powkasol title years into the strange first Dwight Howard era into
some of the worst teams in franchise history, and now they're starting to surge
back toward the top again. In Lebron James's second year with the franchise,
none of it made sense once more, And I guess that's as good a
time as ever to segue into the actual top ten, which was determined by
the fan vote, by my top ten, and by Dan's top ten.
We actually had four players appear in top tens who didn't make the composite top
ten, and those were Andrew Bynum, who was sixth place in the fan
vote and did not appear for either myself or Dan. Then we had Dwight
Howard and Jordan Clarkson tied just below him. Dan had Jordan Clarkson at eighth,
no one else had him. I had Dwight at eighth, no one
else had him. And then we had Lonzo Ball, who was tenth place
for Dan but did not make either of the other rankings. So as you
can probably tell from those names, like, it's already getting weird. Because
Andrew Bynum, in particular, I think we can single out as a guy
who from a pure talent standpoint, and from a pure production standpoint, probably
belongs in the top ten. But his tenure with the Lakers wasn't always successful.
It had one of the more infamously bad moments when he closedlined JJ brea
and frustration to close out a playoff series, and I totally get why we
don't have him, even though the fans do, and I think like he
alone kind of un score is just how weird this edition is going to be.
So for me, it was if I wasn't going to put Anthony Davis
in on my list, which Boiler Alert I did not. This is his
first season there. I won't say it made me. It made the unilateral
decision to leave off a Bynum and an Odem because of their sample size,
but it made me feel a little bit more empowered to do so, just
because Bynum had one really good year of the two years he spent there.
Lamar Odom's year with the Lakers was spectacular, but there's you know, waiting
theirness, which is why I was surprised that Clarkson ultimately didn't make a list.
Third in minutes, I think it is for the Lakers over this decade,
So that was a little bit surprising to me, But I think if
you were going on the flip side, which would make sense from the fans
perspective, if you were going to include Anthony Davis, I think then you
do need to include buying him and odom if that makes any sense. It
does. But at the same time, like Clarkson is third in minutes played
but only seven six hundred and eighty one over the last decade. I mean,
Kobe is still the runaway first place and minutes played even though he retired
after the twenty fifteen sixteen season. Like this, there hasn't been any sort
of continuity with this organization throughout the last decade. You know, De'angelo Russell
thirteenth and minutes played despite only playing two seasons there, brandon Ingram only three
seasons and he's up in eighth. So for me, it was like,
as as much attention as we've paid to the bareness factor for other organizations,
it was harder for me to use that as a starting point for this one,
just because there's been so much turmoil. Yeah, I think that's a
fair way to approach it. Look, I had Lonzo Ball making my cut
and he's twenty first in minutes. I think that he was underrated defensively while
he was with the Lakers, and people focus so much on his three point
percentage, but just one of the best passers in the game, And had
he been healthier and cracked a hundred games during his time there, I might
have felt a little bit more motivated to even move him up the list,
perhaps above Who's might I think he's one of those guys that's just super valuable
even if your team is bad. His value just really isn't always properly reflected
or necessarily contextualized. But this was look, this was top There was only
the top three. Seemed like they were going to be consensus, and that's
how it shook out. And speaking of Lonzo Ball, another important side note
is that his father LaVar Ball, and I can tell from Dan's look that
he has no idea where I'm going with this. But LaVar Ball did get
a vote, which was interesting, and I deleted that vote because he's not
a player. Steve Balmer also got a vote, which was interesting since he
is not affiliated with the Lakers franchise. So once more, this was a
weird one. Yeah, And also, why would you rank Steve Bamber if
anything, he took Kawhi Leonard from the Lakers. I don't know if that
makes him a top ten Laker. Yeah, I don't know. We could
have an entire separate recording session about Jimmy Butler, Steve Balmer, and LaVar
ball and why they showed up in the top ten for the Lakers. But
the people who actually did we have a two way tie to kick things off.
It was between Lamar Odom, who was fifth for the fans and did
not appear for either me or Dan, and we had Kyle Kuzma, who
actually did appear on all three ballots, which is kind of a rarity here.
He was eighth for the Fans, he was tenth for me, and
he was ninth for you. Odom was tough because he only played the one
season and he was good. But we've had so many players play like the
short abbreviated stints and be good to some extent for the Lakers, and I
did feel like Kuzma needed to be on there, if for no other reason
the loyalty that the Lakers seemed to want to show to him, like the
fact that he was deemed like pseudo untouchable in the Anthony Davis talks and is
still there despite not really developing as some might have expected after his encouraging first
season. I think that those are important factors, yeah, for sure.
And look, he's probably I won't say he's underrated by this point, because
it does seem like he's still overrated by the Lakers fan base itself. There.
I think they've gotten better at recognizing his flaws and probably understand he's not
the third star. That's also a bar he's being measured against in certain places,
not this space, just to be clear, and that's kind of warped
like what he can actually be. And it's you know, he's not the
worst defender on that team. He can survive at some of the wing positions,
and he's someone who can who can score. You know, you would
like him to shoot a higher percentage off the catch. But there's also value
in knowing that you have someone who, again, maybe not the most efficient
player, but he can generate these square one looks. And so I don't
know that he's the perfect fit for the current iteration of the Lakers, but
they clearly, like you said, saw something in him. I don't know
if it was more so, well, we know we're gonna have to give
up Lonzo Ball and Brandon Ingram, and so we're just going to deem one
of Josh Hart or Kyle Kuzma untouchable. I don't know if that's what it
came down to, but there's a clear value there. And look, it
seems like he's just handled sort of the lack of continuity in Los Angeles pretty
well where it wasn't you know, you saw kind of Ingram and Lonzo Ball
struggle to adapt around Lebron James. They've since kind of talked about that since
leaving the Lakers, and Kuzma has had those struggles as well, But you
don't really it's not something that he really just look towards or leans on.
So I respect his ability to try and fit in. And when you look
at the way that that he plays, is that, yeah, you know
a lot of the shots that he's taking are the ways that he's being used
on offense, like he's trying to be this seamless fit for the team.
And so I do still think he can be a very valuable scorer and that
there's always going to be I call this the the Andrew Wiggins paradox, is
that I don't think that Andrew Wiggins is a good basketball player, but there's
almost more value, or it's he's more useful knowing that he's comfortable operating with
the ball in his hands over shooting off the catch. With the Warriors,
that's a problem. But I'm just saying in a vacuum, and so that's
kind of the type of player that Kuzma reminds me of, not Wiggins specifically,
but I'm looking at his offense where it's he's someone who's going to be
comfortable controlling everything, which in theory, is a lot more difficult than hitting
those shots off the catch. And that's kind of where I land on him.
And I think there's some value too in being able to fill a high
volume scoring role off the bench, even with substandard efficiency, because if you
can still go out and keep the offensivefloat against second units, maybe you're not
going to thrive against starters, or maybe you're not going to be making undeniably
positive impacts, but just the ability to kind of minimize the drop off that
happens when you go to the second unit on the offensive end, like,
there's value to that, and the fact that he's capably filled that role at
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experts. So moving on to eighth, though, we have met a world
piece run our test Panda's friend whatever he's going by today, I think he
actually like did officially change his name to something else, And I'm just totally
blanking on what it is now. But he was eighth, He was tenth
on the fan vote. He was up to sixth for me, he was
seventh for you. For me. This was a player where the birness did
matter, just because he did spend so much time like as as a quality
player. Towards the end of his career. In this decade he was a
fourth and Minute's played just barely behind Jordan Clarkson. And the stints with the
Lake in this decade were separated into two. He had the coming off the
twenty ten title. He spent three more years there than he played for the
Knicks. He went and played in China in Italy, and then he came
back and played another sixty games over two seasons for the Lakers at a much
lower level. So that kind of takes away from the barness. But the
first stint alone, I think was enough, especially on the defensive end,
to get him into the top ten. Yeah, I have really nothing to
add to that. I think what really put him over the top, if
he were on the fence about including him, is that, well, he
just came back in the middle of the decade and played another sixty games for
the Lakers, just really drive up his airness. Actor And look, this
is like gonna read like a tweet. Prime Metal world Piece was a cap
stock problem smoke face emoji. He doesn't fall the Prime Metal world Piece doesn't
really fall into this category. But you know, the first three seasons with
the Lakers, particularly those first two just really a work work hard, try
hard on the defensive end. And we might be inflating his standing because one
this was so confusing and too maybe were like sort of nostalgic for the way
that he was playing defense. He didn't his last All defensive team was in
two thousand and nine. But I think when you spend as much time as
as he ended up doing there for the Lakers, particularly in this conversation,
I know he said you don't wait there in his factor too much. But
to play that many separate seasons five where you don't have the most games or
the most minutes, but you spent five separate seasons in Los Angeles over this
decade. Look, you need to make the cut. Yeah, I agree,
And it's funny like Metalworld piece. For me, he feels like one
of those guys where it almost seems like he had a fifty year career because
it seems like he spent a decade in LA and it seems like he spent
a decade with Indiana and there were still four other teams that he played for
and like they're marginally memorable stints like Sacramento in Chicago especially, But obviously that's
not the case, and I'm not sure that's really how he's going to end
up being remembered a decade from now. But hey, at least he gets
to be in the top ten on this weird franchise. Yeah, and look,
if you're looking for what his current name is, it's Meta santaford our
Test. That is his current legal name. Oh well, I learned something
today. Throw that out there as a nice little fun fact. There was
your trivia. But we'll just we'll have to make sure that when this is
published that it's accurate because if he changes it again between recording and publication,
which is a possibility, he did change at May twenty twenty, so that's
actually fairly recent. Yep. Alright, so moving on from the fascinating human
being that is Metal World Piece, we have a two way tie for sixth
place between Brandon Ingram and Anthony Davis. Davis was up at fourth place for
the fans. I had him at seventh. You did not have him.
Brandon Ingram was ninth for both me and the fans. You had him up
at number four. This is my this is my brandon Ingram victory lap very
against victory laps because we're all so wrong about so many things that I don't
believe we get to celebrate when we're right yourself there, Well I am.
I'm gonna put on my hypocrisy hat right now, just because I was very
bullish on brandon Ingram with the Lakers when people were talking about, oh,
could Julius Randall be better as Lonzo Ball? The better prospect Brandon can confirm.
I got like a text today about Brandon Ingram, if probably more than
that, but I feel vindicated obviously this is what he's done in New Orleans.
But if you look at his clothes to the latter two seasons he spent
with the Los Angeles Lakers, yeah, you know, they weren't those full
year samples, but he was playing at an all star level, particularly in
twenty eighteen twenty nineteen before he you know, I say it's the end of
the season, but it was the end of his towards the talent of his
season because he had those blood cloud issues. He just watching him always felt
like someone who was going to succeed in the NBA, even when he wasn't
making his shots. He was getting to his spots. There felt like a
fluidity to his game. Yes, you want him to take more threes,
doesn't seem like he was. He wasn't that guy and it doesn't seem like
he's going to be that guy to hit off the dribble threes. That's ofinitely
fine for me, just because of how much versatility he provides as as a
playmaker. And yes, he's going to take some difficult shots, but he's
comfortable with making them. He looks. Towards the end of his tenure with
the Lakercy it looked he at least looked a little bit more comfortable finishing around
the rim, though not nearly as comfortable as he does look now in New
Orleans. And then the other thing that I think we kind of overlook and
maybe that's getting lost in this season because he has struggled defensively with the Pelicans.
I think that's one due part in part to how they play their offense,
but also just two with Los Angeles, he was just such a disruptor
and you're I still think even now that you can get you know, defense
at the two, three, four spots from him, and to be kind
of someone who I don't think you're ever going to anchor a very good defense.
But despite being more lanky than you are strong, I think he matched
up well with bigger wings and even certain let's say pure fours for that matter,
and so someone who was just as active and really knows how to use
his length on the defensive end. I always felt that, even relative to
how he was underachieving, that he was still underrated during his time with Los
Angeles. It feels like Ingram has bounced between being overrated and underrated throughout his
entire career, Like maybe more so than any other player in the league,
it felt like there was he entered the league with so much hype as the
number two pick of the twenty sixteen draft, and he's really disappointing as a
rookie. He only averaged nine point four points, He shot twenty nine point
four percent on threes forty point two percent from the field, and it seemed
like, okay, like maybe he's going to be a bust, like maybe
the Lakers squandered their first really high draft pick in decades. And then his
sophomore season came around and like, hey, maybe he's underrated. Like this
the end to his sophomore season seemed full of promise, but then you know,
twenty eighteen nineteen rolls around and all of a sudden, he's over rated
because he's really struggling at the beginning of the year, and then we accept
that that's as new normal, and then he breaks out big time before the
blood clot issues popped up, and all of a sudden, now he seems
to be continuing on that trajectory with New Orleans. But he's just he's been
a fascinating player because it seems like the consensus opinion on him has been wrong
at every single turn. And look, I think the absence of continuity really
ends up hurting him when you look at how many different versions of the Lakers
he played for. I specifically believe that the end of twenty seventeen two eighteen
probably spills over into twenty eighteen twenty nineteen if you don't have Lebron James there,
and that's an adjustment that everyone had to make. Look, it's Lebron
James, so you make it. I'm not criticizing them for that, but
he was just a part of so many different iterations of the Lakers within those
three seasons that it's not really surprising that he struggled and never really found like
this happy, sustainable medium, right. And I think the adjustment, if
I may segue to Davis here, is that was kind of the reason that
I had Davis higher and why I kind of understand why the fans had him
all the way up at fourth. I think you can make an argument that
he's been the second best player that has played for them this decade. And
that's not meant as disrespect to Kobe Bryant or to Pau Gasol, but they
were at the back ends of their careers when the time frame that we're talking
about started. Davis has been phenomenal this year, albeit only for fifty five
games. But his ability to adjust to playing with a ball dominant superstar in
Lebron James, and to continue operating at such a ridiculously high level in a
small sample size in a season that isn't yet complete, that's really impressive.
And I think that he has reinvigorated this franchise with the hope and with the
Lakers exceptionalism that has been part and parcel for the franchise for so long.
And I do understand we're willing to give him sort of the benefit that the
statistics aren't necessarily providing in a way that we aren't for someone like Ingram.
Yeah, I just couldn't bring myself to to put him on there after just
a fifty five game sample size, and which I think is an understandable decision
as well if I was not Also, if I wasn't going to put odom
or buying him on mine, it was just really tough to put Anthony Davis
there. Still, I think you can make the case pretty strongly that he's
the best player of the decade to play for the Lakers in his prime.
Just because you look at you're kind of hitting the tail end of Kobe Bryant,
say they here Lebron James. If you still want to consider Lebron James
as being in his prime, that's absolutely fine with me. I want to
argue with you there. But if you do think that this is the tail
end of Lebron's career in some form, then I think Anthony Davis ends up
taking that title pretty handedly. That's fair. Who's there who comes in at
number five for US Number five did not in the Fans Top ten. He
was actually down at sixteenth place behind Nick Young and Derek Fisher, which is
which is interesting. I had him up at number four, you had him
at number five, and it is Cantavious called well Pope. I'm not really
sure what to say about KCP because he's just sort of been there filling a
three D role without really excelling at either the three or the D part of
that. Hey, this season thirty nine point four percent from three, shooting
fifty four point three percent on his twos. And I've this is my bias
probably creeping in, but I've been I was higher on him when he was
with Detroit. I thought he was definitively better and worth a lot more money
than Tim Hardaway Junior. I clearly missed on KCP to a big extent,
but I still think he's a very helpful player. And what probably drags down
his value over the previous two seasons, including the first one that he spent
with Lebron, is that, yes, one, there's the changing teams thing,
but you're also weren't on great teams to begin with, and now it
seems like he's sort of found a wheelhouse on a good team, and you
can show and you and it's proven that he can really move the needle for
a contender, or at least a really good team. The Lakers are a
contender, But I'm saying you could move him out of this situation. He
would still be good and impactful for a quality squad if you can live with
the heat checks off the dribble in transition from three. The KCP experience,
to me is worth it, and he is never really developed into this.
Detroit tried, and then the Lakers kind of got away from this after year
one once they bring in Lebron. He's not really going to give you a
ton of secondary playmaking, but someone who can work off the dribble with the
ball, who's fine hitting those shots off the catch, and who is going
to work on defense, and whose defensive range sort of just belies his physical
tools because he's six five, and that seems like it might be a generous
listing. He's not super long, and yet you can get away with him.
You'd rather him defend either guard position, which is fine, but you
can get away with certain stints with him defending actual wings. And so this
isn't me arguing that KCP and Ne's have his batter hung up in Staples Center,
have his Jersey retired in Staples Center. But I think that he's been
particularly this season, that he's been really good. And so for someone who
spent the past two seasons on weird versions of the Lakers and now showing that
you can make a high level impact on this good of a team, I
think that really needs to earn serious consideration within this entire conversation. Yeah,
I mean, I had him up at fourth and I think that what we're
seeing from KCP now is the new normal where he's kind of accepted that he
has a smaller role and he's going to excel at it. And I think
it's understandable that it took so much time to get there because of the lack
of continuity, but also because of the player that he was asked to be
in college. So you know, I was at George at the same time
as Caldwell Pope, so I saw I got to see him play a lot
of games at Stegman Coliseum and Athens, Georgia, and he was the guy
there and that team was awful around him. There was no other even fringe
NVA quality player joining him, so he constantly had double teams thrown at him,
and he was still asked to take those tough shots and be the guy.
And it's a tough adjustment from being the guy to being not the guy.
I mean, as basic as that sounds. When you're used to being
the guy taking the hero shots and the bailout possessions on offense at the end
of the shot clock, and all of a sudden you're asked to be a
definitive role player, which he was in Detroit, which he was in la
I think that he's finally getting to the point where he's accepted that role and
has realized that it's in his best interest to thrive in it without necessarily trying
to push those boundaries. And that's what we're seeing this year on a good
team, right And what you're so you kind of I don't want to say
limit him too, but you're gonna have someone who specializes in taking taking threes,
assisted threes and then really getting out in transition and capitalizing on those opportunities.
And he just looks more comfortable doing that. This is the best year
he's had, even when he is putting a ball on the floor. Just
from a handle perspective, his turnover rate has has never been lower, and
so it does sort of feel like he's coming in to his own and like
you said, that journey to kind of it's probably this sounds way too profound
for talking about bestball right now, but that journey for kind of discovering the
player that he needed to be in the NBA or one that he can be
sustainably, because even in Detroit, it felt like there was this rush to
coordinate or to expand his arsenal where it was this could never be the player
that KCP could be in Detroit, like they needed him to be that higher
volume pick and roll guy, probably during his you know, definitely his last
season, maybe also that second last season with the Pistons as well. So
it's I think he's still somewhat of a punchline to people, but he he's
been just this this really net, big net positive for the Lakers this year
and probably has been just by the numbers, their best shooter when you're looking
at from three point that Danny Green is still going to be their most reliable
three point marksman, but he might be their second most dependable one just in
a in a bubble and no Disney World pun intended there. Yeah, and
you need that, especially on a team that's that's led by Lebron. I
get why why the fans didn't have him in the top ten, because he's
not glamorous. He's not been much more than a role player, and he's
ultimately been a little bit disappointing. And he has that no trade clause,
which I think is going to turn people against him a little bit. But
you know, I'm glad that he's he's getting some credit here for the journey
that he's taken. And look, he can't hold the no trade clause against
him anymore. No, definitely past exactly exactly. But let's move on to
number four because I think it's one of my favorite placements in any of the
fourteen of these episodes that we've done so far, and it's Julius Randall,
who is somehow in fourth place despite not appearing in the top four on any
ballot. Like I'm not talking about the fan vote or my vote or Dan's
vote, I'm talking about any fan ballot. He had zero votes in the
top four from anyone and still finished fourth because everyone has all jumbled throughout this
entire process. So he was seventh for the fans, he was fifth for
me, he was sixth for you, and I feel like all those placements
are pretty appropriate, just because his career got off to such a weird start
when he had the season ending injury one game into his rookie season. His
delayed debut, for lack of a better term, went well, but he
was quickly exposed for only being able to go to his left only using his
left hand, like he didn't have very much of an offensive arsenal. He
was kind of a liability on defense at times, but he's been a hard
working player who has put up some big numbers for bad teams. Now,
yeah, there's like the fact that you can't use him. What really hurts
him is that you can't use him at center and have a prayer of fielding
a good defense is probably the biggest thing to hold him back. I am
curious if he never gets injured as a rookie, like never breaks his leg,
is he's probably still around the same player. But do we view him
in more rosy terms, like just because he would have by default been a
bigger part of the Lakers long term plan at that point, I honestly don't
think so, just because, like reputations are established so quickly in the NBA,
and once there's a popular perception, it's really hard to break past that.
I mean, I think we see that especially with like guards on defense,
Like how hard has it been for the consensus opinion to accept that Steph
Curry and James Harden aren't atrocious defenders like they were early in their careers.
I think that's a little bit of what we saw with Randall, where it
was like, okay, Like he played one game in his rookie c in
his second year, he only averaged eleven point three points per game, Like,
maybe he's not this really high the high valued prospect that we thought he
could be coming out of Kentucky. He's also one of those players where you
look at his assist numbers and they're for his position, they're good, and
I just don't trust him to create for anyone Like those passes, right,
the passes feel like last resorts is how I would describe it. Still,
he could be fun to watch because he's like, and this is not a
unique comparison, but he's like a bowling ball when he gets up and down
the court, like at full momentum. And so if you can have a
big guy who could lead fast breaks, that's great. I just you can't
really play to me the four position as effectively in today's MBA without having some
zemblance of a three point shot. And while he never really took them in
Los Angeles, never averaged more than point nine three point attempts per game with
Ali, and so he started taking him with the Pelicans and the Knicks,
just not at a high clip, although he was at thirty four point four
percent while he was in New Orleans. So but with Los Angeles scifically that
final year there, leading into restricted free agency, which became unrestricted free agency
for him. That he had a really good year. He shot fifty seven
point five percent on his twos, and that was with a ton of offensive
responsibility. Wasn't subsisting solely on these gimme opportunities and assisted looks. So he
had that one really good year. And if you want to argue that his
third season was better than replacement level, I think that's fine. And so
having at least two solid to really good seasons in this era for the Lakers,
I think it immediately gives you like top five consideration. I of course
didn't have him there, but the fact that he was able to appear in
semi close spots on all of the ballots. It almost makes sense that he
ends up as high as he did. I kind of want to see this
Lakers Decade team play some of the previous Lakers Decade teams because it would be
hilarious. I mean, we're talking about Julius Randall in fourth place, right,
No disrespect meant to Julius Randall, who has He's again he's put up
big numbers on bad teams. It's not but come on, it's not the
outside of the top three. It's not one that you would expect from what
has remained a flagship franchise. Like the Knicks have just been awful for so
long. When we get to them, it's all right, right, whatever.
But because it's the Lakers, and because it's because they've like weren't just
bad this entire decade, Like they've had probably three good seasons of the decade,
so maybe we almost forget about that. But the Lakers have never lost
their flagship status, and so you would just expect a better selection. But
I think just between ushering out the Kobe Bryant era and then trying to figure
out what you were gonna do, it looked like they wanted to re build
around the kiddies, but then it was not, We're just gonna pivot to
all free agency everything. I won't say that lack of decisiveness, but certainly
that the number of versions of the Lakers that we've seen this decade under all
these different circumstances, I think that contributes to why this is such a confusing
And I would say outside the top three lackluster list, I agree with you,
and let's move into the top three so that we can stop talking about
mediocre Lakers. Number three is Lebron James. He was second for the fan
vote. He was third for both you and I only two seasons. That's
really the only knock that you can you can have against Lebron's time with the
Lakers right now. I mean, what he's done this season in particular is
phenomenal, leading the league and assists kind of reinventing his game again, extending
his prime into this age thirty five season. Still saying that he has an
argument to be called the best player in the world. I'm not quite sure
that he deserves that actual title right now, but in a playoff series,
he might still be the number one choice to build around, even ahead of
Jana Santa Cumpo and and the other contenders for that role. You know,
he suffered the first pseudo major injury of his career with the groin injury that
kind of led to some time off during his first year in LA. That's
probably the only other knock against him. But what he's done in bringing this
franchise back to prominence, I don't really hate it if you haven't even even
higher than third. Yeah, Look, when you're the best player or in
the conversation for best player in the NBA for more than a season with the
team, I think it's fair to just automatically assume you'll be near the top
of a decade ranking list. And with him, you know, it's a
little bit hypocritical maybe for me to say, well, I can't put owd
him or buying him on here or Anthony Davis, but I put Lebron.
Lebron has more games in a Lakers uniform in this decade than all three of
those guys. And it's sort of like you said, I would say,
I think Janni's attend to Kupo is the best player in the NBA overall.
But if you to pick a player that you want. You need one win
in a playoff series, it's between Lebron or Kawhi right now for me,
if that makes any sense. And the fact that he's still in that conversation,
this is his age thirty five season, is just absolutely remarkable, and
look, he he just decided essentially this isn't I won't say it's necessarily out
of necessity, even though it is because the Lakers lack these secondary playmakers.
But he came in age thirty five season, second year with the Lakers,
another sort of off season of turnover where you gave away a ton of youngsters
to get Anthony Davis, and he was just basically, well, I'm just
going to lead the league in assist That is astounding, and so I think
he definitely belongs to the top three. It's probably tough to put him any
higher for me, just because there are those ties that the next two players
have to the organization that Lebron doesn't yet have and we'll probably never have even
if he wins a title. But if someone just came in and said,
look, I think you need to go with talent here and contributions during this
time that they spent with the Lakers. You probably couldn't make a case to
put him at number one. I do not disagree with that. I do,
however, have a tribute question for you now. I was hoping we
were going to get through a decade ranking podcast of that. Hell no,
absolutely not so. When Lebron first joined the Lakers, I remember I wrote
a piece for Bleacher Report about the best players who had ever worn a Lakers'
jersey. It wasn't about what they had done in a Lakers uniform, which
is why guys like Gary Payton and Carl Mullen were mentioned as well as Lebron,
who had yet to do anything for the Lakers in that jersey. And
I think a lot of people misinterpreted and it got a lot of hate because
of that. But that's neither here nor there. But the point is that
a season and a half later, he's done enough that all of a sudden,
we can talk about him as one of the primary contributors to the Lakers
throughout their storied history, not in any way a pantheon member of the franchise
like a Kareem or a Jerry West, or a Kobe or a Magic Johnson
or even going back to a George Miken. So my question to you is
where after these two seasons, with the second one still kind of in progress,
I guess does he Ran can win shares all time on the Lakers all
time on the Lakers. Well, I know how many wind shares he has
because I was just looking at them before. That would be sixteen point eight,
right, and anyone who's curious that doesn't really feel like an awful lot
all time twenty five. He's actually thirty nine alright, because again the history
of this franchise is remarkable. So he's he's sandwiched between Michael Thompson and Metal
World Peace. The second part of this trivia question is to see how many
of the top ten you can name. Oh, come on, Kobe,
that's number one, Kareem number three, Magic Johnson number four, Worthy number
nine, Jerry West number two. I'm going to forget names that I said
is Aldrew Baylor on there Algin Baylor is sixth, one of them most underrated
players ever, by the way, mister Eldrem Baylor Pagasol. Pagasol is thirteenth.
So I'm not even gonna bother you. Only got four names left in
the top ten. That's basically like half, which is really like I'm trying
to I'm trying to think of the obvious ones that I'm forgetting. I might
just holy crap, shack, there's one. He's number seven? Wow?
Am I forgetting anyone else? Obvious? I mean I already mentioned one of
them and you haven't said his name? Oh did you? I definitely wasn't
paying attention. Then that's all right. I'm used to that. Let's just
call it. I named seven. Well, no, let me is odem
on there, odim is not odem is fifteenth. Yeah, I didn't think
he's I didn't have high hopes for that pick. FYI might just have might
just have to call it Byron Scott's tenth. That why wouldn't have gotten him?
I'm gonna let you know. Bern Mickelson is eighth when we've gotten him
either, and George Mike and his fifth. That's one I should have gotten.
That's all right. He did. He did finish his time in Minneapolis
in nineteen fifty six not naming Jacques looked pretty bad. Hey, you got
it eventually. I was hoping that you would you and you did not let
me down. He put on the spot like this, can you take us
through? That's probably enough on le Bron James, Can you take us through
the number two spot? A number two spot belonged to Pawcasol, who was
third for the fans and was second for both of us. I feel like
it would be really hard to make a case that Pawcasol has been the second
best Laker from a single season standpoint or from a peak level standpoint throughout his
time, especially because we're not considering the two title winning years that he was
an integral part of winning. But still, you know, he spent four
years with the Lakers during this decade, one of which resulted in an All
Star appearance, all four of which he was still a high quality offensive player
in particular, so he seems to be pushed ahead through a combination of the
theirness factor and the peak level that he was playing at. Right. I
mean, look the three of the four seasons he spent with Los Angeles here
like he was just an offensive machine. And even looking at the four years
in totality, seventeen point one points, nine point eight rebounds, three point
six assist per game while shooting over fifty percent from two, and he took
he was like he was more of a pick and pop pick could do stuff
in the post, but so he's taking a lot of jumpers to be remained
that efficient through what was his age thirty three season. Never got to the
point where he was taking a ton of threes with the Lakers. That only
ever really happened during his seasons with the Spurs and that one year with the
Bulls. Still just his legacy in general with the Lakers, I wonder if
he's just fully appreciated. I think he is, but he was there were
times in playoff series where he was sort of just dead, even with Kobe
Bryant when looking at how valuable he was to the team winning. And so
maybe you could look, it was impossible for me to put Lebron on overpower
or over Kobe, but maybe you can make an argument for Lebron over power.
But again, there's like those intrinsic ties to the organization, even though
these weren't championship winning years that I think both Gasol and Kobe have quite handily
over Lebron. Would you retire the number sixteen jersey? I think I would.
I think you have to. The Lakers have had so many jerseys retired
already. I'm trying to get the exact number here. I just I don't
know if if you to be the second best player on two championship teams and
he's going to be. I mean this has more to do with just the
NBA obviously, but he's going to be a Hall of Famer. So and
you look at I think I think you do it. Yeah. The Lakers
have retired eleven numbers so far. No one has worn sixteen since since Power
did. Granted there's not been much time for people to have that opportunity,
but yeah, I feel like it would be difficult not to. I wonder
if this is even a discussion, this might sound like a dumb question of
Lakers fans where it might just be reflective. Yes, yeah, I know
I've not really seen anything about this one before, but yeah, let let
us know for sure. Look, if you're gonna I think it's just generally
and mostly because Joe Lake Up said as much, you're going to retire in
Andre Gadala in Golden State, then a PAL becomes a no brainer, even
for a franchise like the Lakers, as storied as they are. No.
No, it looks like there has been some conversation about it just through my
quick my quick Google search here, and he's talked about how it would be
an honor to have his jersey retired, and there have been opinion pieces about
how how people should, But yeah, it doesn't seem like there's any like,
oh, yeah, this is an obvious answer at least I guess because
what he only spends how many seasons in total with the Lakers? A little
bit more than six? Like, is that just not long enough to become
it consensus jersey retiree when two of them result in titles, though also very
fair, And you take us to number one, where we know there was
a major upset that's going to jack everyone. Yeah, it was. It
was Kobe Bryant. Kobe was the only player who appeared on every single fan
ballot. Two people did not have Lebron, three people did not have Powacasol,
seven people did not have Anthony Davis and including including Dan. But yeah,
I mean it feels like Kobe was both the obvious number one and not
necessarily a lock for that number one spot, if that makes any sense,
because he, you know, the first, the first couple of seasons of
this decade period that we're looking at he was still Kobe Bryant, but then
we had the Achilles tear and only a six game season in a thirty five
games season, and he was operating at not a net negative level, I
don't, I don't think, but at a certainly a diminished level. But
then we still have the indelible memories provided by like the sixty point game to
finish his career, and he's still Kobe Bryant, and just how much he
meant to the Lakers franchise. And I felt like it wouldn't necessarily be like
a blasphemous choice to have anybody else or to have two other people, I
guess in that number one spot. But I still like, didn't really hesitate
before putting him in my number one spot. Does that make any sense?
Am I just kind of talking in circles here? No, That's exactly where
I landed, although I think you can you don't need to dip though around
it. He was his final three seasons there, he was only six games
from one of the measure toos Acchilies. He was a net negative. It
was just that was what if it was going to be a difficult decision.
That's what made it so difficult, but he had those two exceptional campaigns that
fall under this decade, and look twenty thirteen in particular. Even though that
team was a disaster, Kobe Bryant aged thirty four campaign was just an absolute
monster as a playmaker, as a scorer, and when he got injured,
you just felt that they're you know, would they Yes, they were clawing
and fighting for a playoff spot, and while he was healthy, he felt
like they were going to get it. But once he went down, I
think you appreciated how much he actually meant to that team that was supposed to
be better than him. And I know they were dealing with injuries to Goussoul
and to Steve Nash, but that was just one heck of a year to
have. And of course it was downhill after that, but that's to be
expected. I was with you, though, if you wanted to be a
stickler, could you maybe make the case that this spot belongs to a power
Lebron James. Maybe, but the emotional value that Kobe has to the Lakers,
and something that I was even surprised to see, and you know that
I'm not the biggest Kobe advocate, definitely did sort of a personality one eighty
later on in his career. But I've always had trouble reconciling the you know,
the rape accusations with him and how he kind of handled himself earlier in
his career, but just the connection that fans felt to him and also current
players, current players like a Trey Young who's so young that wasn't even watching
Kobe Bryant in his prime, to feel like, well, they obviously did
know him, but to feel that just sort of camaraderie with him. That's
something that really drives up Kobe's value in this discussion to me, is because
he still is the Lakers organization, Like that's who this franchise has become most
synonymous with, I believe, and to me, that made this an easy
decision. Even though those final three seasons, because of injuries, because of
age, because of pretty bad performances slash pretty bad teams that he was on,
maybe that opened the door for someone else to creep in. But I
never really fully considered it. And let's not forget that. And there's a
chance that Space Jam two could change this, but that Kobe is the only
awesome winner in the last decade for the Lakers. It's so true, and
it's I'm pretty sure Space Jam two at this point is gonna fall outside this
decade, so he has nothing to worry about. That's just true. Any
honorable mentions that you through so many, all right, so we'll end the
podcast there since we have no honorable mentions. So outside of the top ten
of the fan vote, we had Dwight Howard at eleventh, we had Lonzo
Ball and D'Angelo Russell tied at twelfth. Derek Fisher was fourteenth, Nick Young
was fifteenth, Contavious Caldwell Pope was sixteenth, Jordan Clarkson at seventeen, Lou
Williams at eighteen, Rajon Rondo at nineteen, JaVale McGee at twenty, Shannon
Brown at twenty one, a tie between Jeremy Lynn and Robert Sachray at twenty
two. Oh Boy, Vika Zubach and Matt Barnes were tied for twenty fourth.
Tied for twenty six we had Brook Lopez and Sviatoslav Mikhailiuk. Twenty eighth
was a tie between Steve Blake and Alex Caruso, who I'm shocked wasn't higher
in the fan vote. Thirtieth We had a tie between lou All Dang,
Sasha v Chich and Timofey Mozgov. Thirty third was Larry Nance Jr. Thirty
fourth was a tie between Danny Green, Jordan Hill and Trevor Ariza. And
then receiving one tenth place vote apiece, we had Jordan Farmar, Jody Meeks,
Ed Davis, and Jimmy Butler. The only one that's actually just ridiculous
on there is Jimmy Butler because he didn't play for the team. Did you
name KCP within that list though? Yeah, he was sixteenth. How is
that possible? Didn't even skip over him somehow? No, I'm saying,
didn't he make he was six on the composite? How did he end up
being a honorable mention? I'm just talking about from the fan vote composite.
Yeah, just just purely looking at the fan ballots. I should have made
that more clear. Well, that's a lot of that's a lot of names.
It's a lot of names. I'm impressed that. I'm impressed with myself
that I got through all of them. Yeah, look here in pronunciation on
them, we're spot on. I'm a little bit upset that I didn't hear
Carlos Boozer's name. I don't remember hearing Roy Hibbert either, but I'll get
over it. I mean, you can always give him a shout at the
end of the podcast. Well it can't be one of those two now.
But with that, all of that said, we hope you enjoyed this.
It was. It was really a tough one for us to get through it
in a good way because it's a nice thought exercise, but this was a
very tough list to compile. Please remember to rate review and subscribe to us
on iTunes, particularly if you're enjoying these decade ranking series, or subscribe rate
review Us wherever else you are getting your podcasts. Until next time, Adam
and I will be coming at you with the Memphis Grizzlies rankings. But until
then, we leave you with the shout out to the one, the Only,
the Lakers Legend Karl Clark, Sugar Ray Leonard, Roberto Duran, Marvelous,
Marvin Hagler, and Thomas Hearns legends whose four way rivalry define one of
the greatest errors in boxing history, relive their decade of dominance in the new
Showtime Sports documentary The Kings, a four part series premiering Sunday, June sixth,
only on Showtime