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Hello, and welcome to the show. I'm Martin willishur host, and I'm

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still out on the West coast in
California. I'm in my old unbelievable,

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I hit the wrong button. I'm
in my old stomping grounds where actually where

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I used to live for oh,
I don't know, somewhere around eight or

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nine years. And I'm in Tibron, California, which is in the San

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Francisco Bay area, a beautiful place, exploring old places I used to go

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and having a one full time and
meeting up with some old friends. Tomorrow,

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meeting with my good friend Dean Aliotto, who eventually he'll be on the

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show talking about great docuseriies that he
has coming out. I've seen enough of

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it to tell you it's going to
be fantastic. So meeting with Dean tomorrow,

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heading back east, and then in
November fifth heading out to Phoenix,

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Arizona to go to the move On
boot Camp Investigator boot Camp, and I'm

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going to be filming. We're going
to be doing a show from there as

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well. So podcast UFO on the
Road, that's what I am doing.

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So the blog this week is called
a UFO Photographed in the Italian alp Alps,

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and that is back in nineteen fifty
two, and I do believe the

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bottom line it's a very interesting hoaxed
image. Check out that blog by Charles

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Lee. Are a great great material. As always, my guests this evening,

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Alfred key Ros and I think I
have talked about this a number of

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times, but if you're new or
just started listening to this show. I

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had an insurance broker many years ago, I want to say it was about

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mid nineteen nineties, and we were
discussing. We were done doing our business

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for an insurance policy, and he
was walking around the house. We were

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just discussing different things and he said
I had an interesting I forget what he

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said, an interesting position in the
military during the Vietnam War. And so

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I said, well, well,
what did you do exactly? And he

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said, I was on part of
a team on the Air Force investigating UFOs

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during the war. And at that
time, of course, I didn't have

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the show, and I knew a
little bit about maybe one or two to

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UFO sightings, but I didn't really
know too much about UFOs in general,

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not that I know anything now,
but anyway, so I asked him more

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and more about it, and it
was a real It was a fascinating conversation.

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And I had the question that everyone
seems to have, and that is

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what are they doing? What are
they doing here if you think they're really

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here? The question I did ask
him is what does a government think they

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are? And his answer was we
are a Patrie dish And I thought that

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was a fascinating answer, and I
thought about it for a long time,

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you know, years later, and
when I started doing the show, I

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tried to look him up. I
remember his name was Tom Bowden and he

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was in New Hampshire, I believe, and I've tried to find him because

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I'd love to have him back on
the show, and I've never been able

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to find out anything on the internet
whatever happened to him. But our guest

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this evening is going to be talking
about encounters during the Vietnam War, and

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I'm really excited to talk to him
about It's the first time that he is

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in a public venue speaking about this, and thanks to kind of the ridicule

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factor kind of dissipating in the UFO
topic, he was willing to speak about

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it. And he's the professor emeritus
of Art and here he is, Alfred,

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welcome to the show. Thank you
so much, glad to be on

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your Martin. Thank you. Yes, And you know, I want to

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say thank you to the person that
connected us and right now it's escaping my

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mind. Who was it, Robert
Fresconi. He was the field investigator who

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was investigating a photograph I had taken
in April of this year. Oh well,

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we're definitely going to be talking about
that too. So thank you Robert

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so much for connecting us together.
And so let's let's hear now. When

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we were talking off air, you
mentioned that it was you didn't even like

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to admit that you were involved in
the Vietnam War because of the stigma.

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You know, you all came back
from Vietnam, and you know you were

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in the s s where I am
right now, basically in the San Francisco

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Bay area, and you had to
keep it very quiet. Yeah. Well,

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it was a period of time where
there was a large anti war protest

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going on enduring War. I got
out of the service in nineteen sixty seven

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and went right into art school and
San Francisco Institute to study painting. And

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you didn't bring it up if you
wanted to date young ladies. You did

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not mention the fact that you were
a veteran. So for for a while

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there I used to have a lie
and just tell people. The people would

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ask, because I was a little
bit older than the universt of the freshman

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and they would ask me, what
do you Where were you? What do

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you What did you do before school? So I would tell them that I

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was studying at the University of Southern
Nevada US, and then they were from

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the West coast, and then you
university. Then I would say I was

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in Southern Nebraska, I was studying. That was the joke. Yeah,

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So I No, I didn't mention
it very very often that I was a

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better I probably about nineteen eighty five
I finally came out and asserted the fact

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that I was. If he had
not better, yeah, yeah. And

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so I don't know if you want
to jump right into the well, I

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guess before we jump right into the
topic, I mean into your encounters.

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Um, I want to ask you, did you ever pay attention to the

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UFL topic prior to the first encounter. Well, the only thing I remember

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seeing it was in the movie theater. We saw a movie about the UFO.

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The p fifty one pilot that crashed
chasing the UFO, And it was

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just one of those news thing,
newsreel things that we saw in the movies.

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That was about it. That's all
I knew about you and that in

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that sense it was And that was
like I was about maybe in the fifth

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sixth grade, so I didn't pay
too much attention to it, you know,

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And that was I was. That
was a period of time when there

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was all these uh flying saucer movies, creatures from outer space and all that

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stuff goes going on. So we
all thought it was all part of the

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Hollywood thing, you know. Yeah, um so do you want to now

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you had? Was it two?
We're gonna be talking about your encounter that

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you had. Incident happened that I
was, that I part choke in.

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That's the first incident happened. We
were in route. We had just left

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Midway Island when we were in route
to Guam uh and I was on watch.

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This is probably around the middle of
January January. I figured it was

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probably around the twenty fourth of January
nineteen sixty six. I was a Quartermaster

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third class QM three UH and the
quartermaster on a ship Steers the ship into

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the harbor out of the harbor alongside
other ships, etc. And we do.

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We're also the assistant navigator, so
we navigate the ship and that's our

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job when we're on watch, is
to make sure that the ship is on

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course, and also we keep the
ship's log and we're also the ship's weathermen.

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So on this night, I'm on
the midwatch midnight to four on the

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bridge. Crew consists of two lookouts, a radio man, the Officer of

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the deck, which is a senior
officer, the junior Officer of the deck,

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which is a junior officer, the
bosses made of the watch, the

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messenger of the watch, the steersman
or the hellsman, and the annunciator guy,

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the guy that runs the engines forward
and back. And then myself the

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quartermaster of the watching. My job
is to maintain the ship stays on course,

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and I'm taking fixes about every or
every four to five minutes. Every

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every hour, we have to have
a fix and we go from there.

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So I had taken a break,
and usually at this point in time,

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the sky was incredibly clear. You
get what it's called a dome effect in

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the middle of the ocean. In
other words, you have horizon to horizon

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stars. So I would get my
seven by fifty binoculars and I always had

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around my neck and I was just
aim them straight up ninety agree straight up

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and just look and just like realize
how infinitely small we were. And we

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got through the space that we were
looking at. And as I was looking

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at but my bvernoculars, I was
looking at the stars, and all of

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a sudden, I noticed there was
a v formation five little white dots moving

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very slowly, so almost like a
satellite. So I immediately chewed out the

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lookouts. They were above me sitting, they're standing on top of the bridge.

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So I chewed them out because you
know, it's a quartermaster's third class

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corporal in the army, and I
chewed them out. I said, you

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know, why didn't you report those
lights? And they go one lights and

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those up there, those end up
there. Oh my god, yeah,

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yeah, I said, you're supposed
to report those right away. So I

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informed the officer that we got a
flight of aircraft, probably aircraft heading from

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Guam, same way we are,
because we were in a northwestern League direction

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at the time, so we just
you know, went through regular Ringamo role

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where in other words center operating procedure. We call a CIC Combat Information Center

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and say, hey, what do
you guys got our radar? And he

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said, you don't have nothing our
radar. I said, well, said,

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we're looking at five objects and there
seemed to be moving along pretty high

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up. They're all they're in a
V formation heading the same direction we are,

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so well, that's why we assumed
there was maybe a flight of B

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fifty twos. And then we were
running why they had the landing lights on

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or something, but any rate.
So at that point, the radio the

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radar right the radar man say,
well, why don't you contact Guam.

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We'll contact Guam see what they got
coming in. So they contacted Guam Air

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Force Base and Guam report it back
right away, said we don't have anybody

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coming in. We don't know what
you're looking at. So they suggested at

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that point suggests that they can't weak
contact Tushikawa Air Force Base in Japan.

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So the radar men contact count A
car for Space and they say, well,

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okay, we got these five things
moving along and nobody seems to know

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what they are, and touch Car
Air for Space responded with a negative,

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saying we had nothing in the air
we had, we don't know what you

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guys are looking at. So they
recommended the third radar site, which is

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in Hong Kong, and they said
the British radar. British have the smongest

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radar in this area. Why don't
you contact them, see what they've got

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coming in? Okay, So we
contact the British. Nothing. We said,

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we don't know what you guys said, look at the same We're getting

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the same response all the time.
So when this time we're all looking at

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these guys, we're all there were
the brenoculars. Now, we kept thinking

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that the only they kept going straight
and just kept going, we would have

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just forgotten about it and locked his
five aircraft. And that was ben In.

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But these were moving the law and
then all of a sudden they made

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a ninety degree turn I mean literally
where I'm bam an l and then and

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then just took off, I mean
just just they just vanished. I mean,

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and we were I was yelling dead
reckoning, dead breckoning. So I

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was looking towards the direction they went, and they were gone. So at

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that point we all kind of lowered
our binocuters slowly and just kind of looked

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at each other, and I just
looked at the the operations officer who was

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the officer of the old d the
officer of the dead senior officer who was

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a full lieutenant, and I said
to him and said, um, how

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do I log that in? What
was that? MOP? Twenty thirty?

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What speed was that? That was
a ninety degree turn with no hesitation?

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They just boop boop did an l? I mean there was no arching of

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a turn aircraft for the arc.
These guys ninety degrees, just a shift

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changing direction and then just took off. They just like vaporiz, just like

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vaporized. They were gone. So
I just looked at the officer of the

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deck and I said, how do
I lock that in? I said,

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And he said, gentlemen, I
believe you call those UFOs. So at

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that point I said, do I
have permission to log it as such?

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And he said, log it in
as you saw it, Quartermaster, And

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I said, I will log it
into. I saw it. Thanks these

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for five objects making a ninety return
and then going at a fantastically high speed.

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And the only thing. The other
thing the officer said at that point

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was gentlemen, let us hope they
are whoever they are, they are on

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our side. So that was it. So we logged. I logged it.

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In the funny part about this situation
is I was the guy that when

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a ship's log was filled. I
was a guy that had a key to

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the ship's log blocker, which was
located in the so of the destroyer that

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I was on, and we would
always put the logs in there and mark

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them the date when they spilled out
and not everything else. So I went

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into after I put the log away, after the log was filled and put

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them away, I went back into
the ship's log because I wanted to take

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that page out. In other words, I wanted a souvenir because I knew

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whatever we had witnessed was something very
spectacular and something very very unusual, and

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it's something that it was starting to
alter my consciousness about what I was doing

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and what we were doing and things
like that. So when I went to

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go pilfer the page of that log, the log was gone. Someone beaten

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to so, and I wasn't about
to go asking questions. You know,

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hey, who took that log?
So I figure and had to be an

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officer or someone else that had the
key. I was the only enlisted man

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had a key to that locker,
and I believe the executive officer and another

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and the navigator, which was an
officer, had the key to that to

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that locker. So somebody the whole
the whole log journal was gone, the

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whole book, the whole book.
Wow. And when something like that happens,

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isn't that really like something major?
I mean, well, we uh,

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we kept quiet about it. And
the reason we kept quiet we were

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afraid of riddigo and and we didn't
want to have any anybody riddy kalinus and

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you know the term did you see
any little green man too? That kind

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of would would come up. I
believe I told one other navigator, one

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other assistant navigator about it, and
he just laughed. So I figured,

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okay, we gotta zip it.
But I mean, there was let's see,

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there are two lookouts, the boats
made of the watch, the two

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officers, the messenger of the watch
and myself and a radio man or the

206
00:16:02.360 --> 00:16:10.080
witnesses to this. Yeah, and
so when this thing you're you're you're kind

207
00:16:10.120 --> 00:16:15.000
of unsure how far it is an
elevation, how high it is an elevation.

208
00:16:15.720 --> 00:16:19.840
We figured these were at satellite height. We figured, and we knew

209
00:16:19.840 --> 00:16:26.120
about satellites because we were aware of
the Echo satellite. Because are you okay,

210
00:16:26.480 --> 00:16:33.039
go ahead? Well my question is
echo satellite as a ruse for officers

211
00:16:33.080 --> 00:16:37.919
that were learning how to use sextic. Now there satellite was going to be

212
00:16:38.000 --> 00:16:44.080
over our head. But let me
ask you this. Would you would a

213
00:16:44.360 --> 00:16:49.320
radar go to that height, to
that leveled elevation that I don't know.

214
00:16:49.720 --> 00:16:53.240
I did have to ask a radar. We had a three hundred range,

215
00:16:53.399 --> 00:17:00.320
three hundred mile range, long range
rare. I would believe them swingerland mind,

216
00:17:00.600 --> 00:17:04.759
Wow, that tells anything. Here's
a question that came in a chat.

217
00:17:04.880 --> 00:17:08.839
When the lights shot off, was
the point of the V pointed in

218
00:17:08.880 --> 00:17:12.960
the direction of the movement? And
that's a very good question. I was

219
00:17:14.160 --> 00:17:17.720
pointed in the direction of the what
of the V? The forward V like

220
00:17:17.839 --> 00:17:22.759
an aerial aero dynamically point of the
V. I mean they literally just went

221
00:17:22.880 --> 00:17:29.000
boom and the V always stayed.
The V to the front shifted just literally

222
00:17:29.119 --> 00:17:33.000
shifting like that. Yeah, yeah, they just I mean, God,

223
00:17:33.440 --> 00:17:36.759
I have to tell you a funny
thing that did happen in nineteen seventy seven.

224
00:17:37.400 --> 00:17:38.960
I went to go see the movie
Star Wars. I was living in

225
00:17:40.039 --> 00:17:42.359
Providence, Rhode Island. We went
to see the movie Star Wars for the

226
00:17:42.440 --> 00:17:48.279
first time when it came out,
and there's a scene where Hans Solo puts

227
00:17:48.359 --> 00:17:55.599
his faceship into hyperdrive or yeah.
Well when he did that, I reacted

228
00:17:56.200 --> 00:18:02.680
and I out loud, and people
in the audience really did shut out because

229
00:18:02.799 --> 00:18:06.319
I I freaked. I just like, oh my god, that's what these

230
00:18:06.440 --> 00:18:10.519
UFOs did in nineteen sixty six.
They're getting them too hyperspace and they were

231
00:18:10.599 --> 00:18:17.160
body gonna shit down. And I
was just so excited because that was what

232
00:18:17.359 --> 00:18:21.160
it looked like to me, Like
these UFOs, So they made the ninety

233
00:18:21.240 --> 00:18:23.759
returned. They just they just they
didn't. They didn't. They just didn't

234
00:18:23.799 --> 00:18:26.839
turn and God keep going. They
were they turned and took and gone and

235
00:18:26.880 --> 00:18:32.559
they were gone, I mean boot
banished. Yeah. I just would freaked

236
00:18:32.599 --> 00:18:33.839
us all out because we just,
like I said, we all just kind

237
00:18:33.839 --> 00:18:37.880
of throwed our binoculars really slowly.
Engines looked at each other like, Okay,

238
00:18:37.960 --> 00:18:41.519
did you just see what I just
saw? That kind of thing,

239
00:18:41.640 --> 00:18:48.559
you know, yeah, and so
um, your other encounter was at close

240
00:18:48.720 --> 00:18:52.559
range and might do I have that
right? Yes? Correct? Uh?

241
00:18:52.680 --> 00:18:56.920
And that was a little bit different
encounter. We by this time we were

242
00:18:56.000 --> 00:19:00.559
off the coast of Vietnam. We
we were maybe two three miles four miles

243
00:19:00.640 --> 00:19:04.920
five miles off the coast of Vietnam. We were conducting shore bombarment off of

244
00:19:06.079 --> 00:19:10.279
the Quang Tree I believe it is
the area we were operating in. Were

245
00:19:10.359 --> 00:19:15.519
just below the The DMZ line was
seventeen parallel, so we were moving back

246
00:19:15.559 --> 00:19:22.079
and forth awaiting a warders from an
aircraft. There was a spotterplane flying over

247
00:19:22.160 --> 00:19:26.279
the area, the ground area over
the South Vietnam area, Qualm Tree area.

248
00:19:27.000 --> 00:19:33.839
We were waiting for shore bombarment targets. And as we were cruising along,

249
00:19:33.960 --> 00:19:37.160
I was on the bridge. I
don't know why. I don't remember

250
00:19:37.200 --> 00:19:41.279
if I wasn't on wash so I
was probably conducting my normal duties on the

251
00:19:41.359 --> 00:19:47.119
bridge going around, and we weren't
We were maybe in a condition three battle

252
00:19:47.200 --> 00:19:51.519
stations, so I wasn't at a
battle station now there was. We weren't

253
00:19:51.519 --> 00:19:55.599
at full battle stations when one of
the all of a sudden, bright day,

254
00:19:55.880 --> 00:20:00.319
it was sunny, hot, humid. It is like about April nineteen

255
00:20:00.400 --> 00:20:03.160
sixty six, when all of a
sudden, the lookouts started yelling, there's

256
00:20:03.200 --> 00:20:07.000
a ball in the water, and
there's something in the water of a ball

257
00:20:07.079 --> 00:20:11.079
in the water, silver ball in
the water. And this is about a

258
00:20:11.400 --> 00:20:15.240
oh, maybe one hundred seventy five
one hundred feet safe, I mean a

259
00:20:15.319 --> 00:20:21.839
hundred yards seventy five yards in front
of us. So so the ship slows

260
00:20:21.920 --> 00:20:25.759
down. We slowed the ship slowed
down, and the captain has brought is

261
00:20:25.839 --> 00:20:29.079
called to the bridge. So the
captain comes to the bridge and he says,

262
00:20:29.119 --> 00:20:32.079
what's going on. He says,
there there's the lookouts report there's a

263
00:20:32.200 --> 00:20:36.559
silver ball in the water ahead of
us. So the captain said, owners

264
00:20:36.599 --> 00:20:41.480
immediately turned the ship off. So
everything, all the systems go off,

265
00:20:41.519 --> 00:20:44.400
and the ship's engines sturned off.
Everything turned off. Pretty soon. It

266
00:20:44.480 --> 00:20:48.400
gets really eerie because it's really silent. And then the captain tells these two

267
00:20:48.440 --> 00:20:53.119
officers get into the safe, and
the safe was under the chart desk.

268
00:20:53.319 --> 00:20:57.000
So I had a chart desk where
I in the pilothouse where I, you

269
00:20:57.039 --> 00:21:02.759
know, work on the chart where
we get our fix us and so we

270
00:21:02.880 --> 00:21:07.240
had the chart in our in our
chart desk. So they opened the safe

271
00:21:07.680 --> 00:21:11.119
and they bring out this huge book, this huge notebook. I mean,

272
00:21:11.240 --> 00:21:17.079
and it says warsaw warsaw pack weapons
and then it says top secret across it.

273
00:21:17.160 --> 00:21:19.359
And they said Kiros that we all
went by our last name. So

274
00:21:19.599 --> 00:21:22.440
they said, get us look away. You only have a secret clearance.

275
00:21:22.839 --> 00:21:26.279
This is a top secret thing.
So I had to turn my head away

276
00:21:26.559 --> 00:21:27.799
and not look at the book,
but you know, I could look at

277
00:21:27.839 --> 00:21:32.880
it, and they were. They
were looking through minds the mind mine area,

278
00:21:33.000 --> 00:21:34.880
so they're looking see what kind of
mind it is, because we thought

279
00:21:36.119 --> 00:21:40.720
at that point we thought it was
a mind because bobbing below the surface and

280
00:21:40.759 --> 00:21:44.519
we're just Bobby. So at that
point, the captain says, we're not

281
00:21:44.599 --> 00:21:47.920
going to get near. Back the
ship up slightly, so we backed the

282
00:21:47.960 --> 00:21:51.000
ship up. By this time,
you know the residual. You know,

283
00:21:51.079 --> 00:21:52.799
when we turn the ship up,
we're still moving. So by this time

284
00:21:53.200 --> 00:21:56.240
captain says, you know, we
got it back to the ship up because

285
00:21:56.240 --> 00:22:00.559
we were getting closer to this object. So the captain and we don't want

286
00:22:00.599 --> 00:22:02.839
to deal with this nonsense. We
don't want to deal with this thing.

287
00:22:02.880 --> 00:22:07.880
We don't know what it is,
so we call the helicopter. We had

288
00:22:07.880 --> 00:22:11.359
an aircraft carrier in the area.
I forget which aircraft. We're operating with

289
00:22:11.519 --> 00:22:15.480
maybe three aircraft carriers at the time. I one of the main ones we're

290
00:22:15.519 --> 00:22:19.240
operating with was the Enterprise. Well, speaking of names, here's a question

291
00:22:19.319 --> 00:22:22.319
here. What was the name of
that ship again, the one you were

292
00:22:22.359 --> 00:22:30.680
on. I was on the USS
Winterburn DD six eighty four Widerberg Wedderburn Winterburg.

293
00:22:30.960 --> 00:22:36.680
Okay, here's thank you. Oh
there it is right there at Wedderberg.

294
00:22:36.880 --> 00:22:42.519
I got it burn. Yeah,
it's a Fletcher Class one hundred Fletcher

295
00:22:42.559 --> 00:22:47.160
Class Destorer. We still had our
five gun mounts. Nice, you had

296
00:22:47.240 --> 00:22:49.400
that book handy like that. Wow. Yeah, that's the yearbook I worked

297
00:22:49.440 --> 00:22:56.279
on for the cruise. It's a
cruise book. So consequently we all the

298
00:22:56.359 --> 00:23:00.319
helicopter comes in. By this time, we got the helicopter pilot on our

299
00:23:00.440 --> 00:23:04.200
radio, so he's trucking. We
can hear him. So I started filming.

300
00:23:04.279 --> 00:23:07.759
I got by. I had an
eight millimeter camera, a regular eight

301
00:23:07.799 --> 00:23:11.119
millimeter camera. So I started filming
a little bit, getting it going,

302
00:23:11.599 --> 00:23:15.359
and the captain turns and sees me
where the cavity says, put that thing

303
00:23:15.400 --> 00:23:18.519
away here I go, yes,
sir, I put the camelboys. So

304
00:23:18.599 --> 00:23:23.319
I got no footage of anything,
because I just barely started when it's Tony

305
00:23:23.359 --> 00:23:30.200
saw me. And so the helicopter
comes, goes in front of us and

306
00:23:30.599 --> 00:23:37.279
lowers a cable or some kind of
a device down a long cable, and

307
00:23:37.400 --> 00:23:42.559
it's some kind of sonar device,
and he's describing it to us. He's,

308
00:23:42.640 --> 00:23:45.559
you know, over the over the
radio. We're listening on the bridge.

309
00:23:45.599 --> 00:23:48.480
We're listening to the broadcast on the
bridge, and he's saying it's a

310
00:23:49.000 --> 00:23:53.440
smooth ball, silver six feet diameter, no scenes, no markings, no

311
00:23:53.720 --> 00:23:57.680
rivets. It is totally smooth.
So he says it doesn't seem to be

312
00:23:57.799 --> 00:24:02.480
doing anything. So I said,
so I'm looking at this point, I'm

313
00:24:02.519 --> 00:24:04.480
looking at the chart trying to figure
you know, and we had we were

314
00:24:04.519 --> 00:24:10.799
off the coast, so there's a
lot of shoals and weird. The ground

315
00:24:10.960 --> 00:24:12.599
is kind of strange. In fact, we had to use some old French

316
00:24:12.720 --> 00:24:19.599
charts that showed sandy showls and things
like that. So we're concerned about not

317
00:24:19.759 --> 00:24:25.839
running the ground a little bit.
So at this point, the helicopter is

318
00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:29.119
lowering this thing and he see not
getting anything out of the cable in doors,

319
00:24:29.319 --> 00:24:33.400
he raises the cable up and he
said we're gonna try something, so

320
00:24:33.680 --> 00:24:38.559
we're like, what's it gonna do. Also, we realized he uh kind

321
00:24:38.599 --> 00:24:42.359
of puts the helicopter to one side
a little bit and the side gunner opens

322
00:24:42.440 --> 00:24:47.960
fire. So by this time we're
seeing tracers flying off of this thing.

323
00:24:48.400 --> 00:24:51.720
So we're ducking down on the bulwark
from the ship of the bridge. We're

324
00:24:51.799 --> 00:24:55.599
like, whoa, this guy's shooting. This guy doesn't realize. These tracers

325
00:24:55.599 --> 00:24:57.359
are flying all over the place,
and then all of a sudden, the

326
00:24:57.440 --> 00:25:02.000
helicopter piler sells you, yelling it
took off, it took off, it

327
00:25:02.119 --> 00:25:07.920
took off, and he's the helicopter
goes into a spin and flies kind of

328
00:25:07.400 --> 00:25:11.240
like in its direction over where it
took off. So the captain and immedity

329
00:25:11.400 --> 00:25:17.480
orders turned the ship back on sound
general quarters. This is not a drill.

330
00:25:17.559 --> 00:25:21.839
We're going to general quarters. Set
the ASW anti Submarine Warfare team in

331
00:25:21.960 --> 00:25:25.480
action. So there's the bong bong
bong. We're going to general quarters.

332
00:25:25.640 --> 00:25:30.960
We start chasing this thing. We
don't even know what it is, so

333
00:25:30.119 --> 00:25:33.400
we think it's maybe some kind of
transport. At this point, they're discussing

334
00:25:33.519 --> 00:25:40.759
some kind of transponder device from a
submarine. So we got our sonar going.

335
00:25:40.799 --> 00:25:45.519
We're looking for a submarine of some
kind. We searched for seventy two

336
00:25:45.599 --> 00:25:51.519
hours, which a standard operating procedure. Nothing zero, nothing, No submarines,

337
00:25:52.079 --> 00:25:56.640
no nothing. There was nothing in
the area. It was clear water.

338
00:25:56.119 --> 00:25:59.880
So we don't know what the heck
it was and what it was doing

339
00:26:00.079 --> 00:26:06.799
there and how it took off and
who pulled it, because it sounded like

340
00:26:06.920 --> 00:26:08.920
somebody had pulled it, pulled it
under water. So that's why we thought.

341
00:26:08.960 --> 00:26:14.359
We thought it was a silver ringe
because it went down when it so

342
00:26:15.240 --> 00:26:18.200
and we never I never saw it, we never, we never really saw

343
00:26:18.279 --> 00:26:21.519
it because it was you know,
under just under the surface of the water.

344
00:26:21.880 --> 00:26:26.680
The lookouts just saw the shimmer of
this this thing. Now we knew

345
00:26:26.960 --> 00:26:30.200
what minds looked like because we had
encountered in World War two mine and had

346
00:26:30.279 --> 00:26:36.960
one of our sharpshooters exploded. Now, when this thing took off, was

347
00:26:37.160 --> 00:26:41.799
their sonar in use or anything like
that. Yeah, we turned everything on

348
00:26:42.119 --> 00:26:47.200
at that point when that thing took
off, our sonar, was our sonar

349
00:26:47.240 --> 00:26:51.519
operators or everything was on back on. I mean it was like instantaneously everything

350
00:26:51.599 --> 00:26:56.000
went back on the ship. We
started the ship off everything, yeah,

351
00:26:56.200 --> 00:27:00.880
if we went. And the only
question I had was the fact that the

352
00:27:02.000 --> 00:27:06.759
water we were in a kind of
a shallow area. And I inventured to

353
00:27:06.880 --> 00:27:08.880
one of the officers, I don't
know if a submarine can operate in this

354
00:27:10.039 --> 00:27:12.559
water, this kind of shallow area. We're off the coast, We're not

355
00:27:12.759 --> 00:27:18.680
We're not only in deep deep water. So that was the only question I

356
00:27:18.799 --> 00:27:21.839
had. And for this to this
day, I have no idea what it

357
00:27:22.079 --> 00:27:26.119
was and it was, it didn't
and I almost kind of forgot about it

358
00:27:26.240 --> 00:27:30.119
a little bit, and I even
brought it up with a former ship made

359
00:27:30.160 --> 00:27:32.759
of mine and asked him do you
remember the zilver wall, isn't it?

360
00:27:33.160 --> 00:27:36.119
And he said noah, no,
it says yeah, because it was something

361
00:27:36.200 --> 00:27:40.440
that you know, we didn't see
anything, so we figured it's a sight

362
00:27:40.559 --> 00:27:45.200
unseen. Wow, well, that
that's something else. I wish there could

363
00:27:45.240 --> 00:27:48.480
have been some data showing, you
know, with the speed that this thing

364
00:27:49.279 --> 00:28:00.160
had um um hang on just when
sure, Yeah, I just I wish

365
00:28:00.200 --> 00:28:04.039
there were some data where they could
have seen the speed of this thing traveling

366
00:28:04.519 --> 00:28:08.200
underwater. You know, we don't
know. The helicopter piled was the one

367
00:28:08.200 --> 00:28:15.720
that saw it. Took off safe
ahead of us. So were you we

368
00:28:15.799 --> 00:28:18.839
were actually watching at the time,
Yes, it was. And did you

369
00:28:18.960 --> 00:28:23.160
see any wake in the water,
any movement in the water. And the

370
00:28:23.240 --> 00:28:26.559
reason I'm bringing that up, and
I think it's your your answer is interesting

371
00:28:27.119 --> 00:28:34.960
because other accounts of what they call
USOS unidentified submergible, submerged object or submergible

372
00:28:36.599 --> 00:28:44.920
whatever it is, is that there's
trans medium movement without causing disturbance, which

373
00:28:45.039 --> 00:28:48.680
is very very strange. Like,
for instance, when these things are seen

374
00:28:48.759 --> 00:28:52.279
to go in or out of the
water, there's no splash, and they're

375
00:28:52.319 --> 00:28:56.599
also seen and I'm not saying this
is what you saw. I don't know

376
00:28:56.680 --> 00:29:02.880
what you saw, but we don't
know either. When they travel underwater at

377
00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:07.480
high speeds. It almost doesn't even
make any sense how they can do that

378
00:29:07.680 --> 00:29:11.279
in in, out of in and
out of the different mediums. Um you

379
00:29:11.400 --> 00:29:15.920
know, it's just like the I
never got the words of the helicopter product

380
00:29:15.000 --> 00:29:18.640
because you know, it just he
sounded scared. I mean, he sounded

381
00:29:18.680 --> 00:29:22.319
like he was, you know,
yelling, it took off. It took

382
00:29:22.400 --> 00:29:25.960
off, and it was like whoa, and he was turning his helicopter was

383
00:29:26.039 --> 00:29:29.079
you know, going into us like
a spin and we're like, well,

384
00:29:29.160 --> 00:29:32.680
what what what does he mean?
It took off? We didn't see anything

385
00:29:32.720 --> 00:29:37.519
take off, so yeah, so
it it almost sounded like something like somebody

386
00:29:37.559 --> 00:29:40.759
had pulled it on from underwater or
it went on its own. And we

387
00:29:40.799 --> 00:29:45.519
don't know we I honestly have to
say, I really don't know whether it

388
00:29:45.640 --> 00:29:48.920
was pulled or went or it went
on its own. But whatever it was,

389
00:29:48.079 --> 00:29:53.599
it went underwater and it took off. Can you can you explain again

390
00:29:53.720 --> 00:29:57.480
what exactly? Who? Who fired
on this thing? Someone fired on it.

391
00:29:59.559 --> 00:30:03.119
It's like kind of fired on it. Yeah, And we couldn't believe

392
00:30:03.160 --> 00:30:07.039
it. We just you know,
oh, sudden, you just opened up

393
00:30:07.400 --> 00:30:11.079
the doorgunner just all of a sudden
just started shooting. And like I said,

394
00:30:11.119 --> 00:30:15.359
there was tracers are flying off in
the air, and it was like

395
00:30:15.519 --> 00:30:17.440
and all of a sudden, we
like freaked out a little bit. But

396
00:30:17.839 --> 00:30:21.079
I remember ducking down behind the ballwork, like what is this guy doing?

397
00:30:22.319 --> 00:30:25.359
Well, it's a wonder it's a
wondering that they would do that. You're

398
00:30:25.400 --> 00:30:29.119
only seventy five yards or so away. And if this thing blew up,

399
00:30:29.440 --> 00:30:32.279
I mean, it seems like it
could have caused some damage to the helicopter

400
00:30:32.400 --> 00:30:36.440
as well. I mean, it's
kind of a strange reaction, and I

401
00:30:36.559 --> 00:30:41.279
wonder, you know, this was
uh we were off the coast of Vietnam,

402
00:30:41.519 --> 00:30:45.319
so you know, yeah, I
guess, I guess you had to

403
00:30:45.400 --> 00:30:49.480
take all the precautions. And so
it's basically it sounds like he was if

404
00:30:49.559 --> 00:30:52.559
he thought it was a mind,
he was trying to blow it up.

405
00:30:52.079 --> 00:30:57.240
Yeah, you know. So you
know the other thing is when they were

406
00:30:57.319 --> 00:31:04.240
looking through the Warsaw Pack book,
there was nothing of that description in the

407
00:31:04.279 --> 00:31:08.039
book. And they let you know
that. They let you know that.

408
00:31:08.480 --> 00:31:12.279
Officers explain to explain to the captain, there's nothing in the book. There's

409
00:31:12.319 --> 00:31:17.960
no no smooth silver ball in the
book. Yeah. Well, the Warsaw

410
00:31:18.039 --> 00:31:22.160
Pact nations do not have a silver
ball, smooth silver ball with those seams

411
00:31:22.240 --> 00:31:25.839
or those spikes or anything, just
a smooth silver bawl six foot diamever.

412
00:31:26.400 --> 00:31:29.079
There was no such thing. Unless
there was a new secret weapon. We

413
00:31:29.119 --> 00:31:33.680
don't know. We you know,
we're speculating now, Yeah, yeah,

414
00:31:33.240 --> 00:31:40.359
well there's there's there's so much speculation
when it comes to this um and you

415
00:31:40.440 --> 00:31:42.599
know, it wouldn't be surprising if
you told me the thing rose up out

416
00:31:42.640 --> 00:31:45.799
of the water either, you know, I mean that that would have been

417
00:31:45.039 --> 00:31:51.559
quite spectacular. And and so you
search for seventy two hours in the direction

418
00:31:51.720 --> 00:31:56.319
lettered operating procedures. Seventy two our
search. So for three days we chased

419
00:31:56.839 --> 00:32:05.240
nothing, and radar had nothing,
and we kept going in circles literally zig

420
00:32:05.319 --> 00:32:08.759
zagging and doing all kinds of maneuvers
thinking where this thing might have gone.

421
00:32:09.240 --> 00:32:15.400
And nothing. We turned up nothing. And what was this? What was

422
00:32:15.519 --> 00:32:25.640
this speculation? Submarine transponder device and
with something submarine belonged to a submarine.

423
00:32:27.319 --> 00:32:30.519
Oh, I seen it pulled it
back down. Yeah, that's what they

424
00:32:30.559 --> 00:32:32.799
thought. I mean, because no
nobody was in this, you know,

425
00:32:34.079 --> 00:32:37.240
that was the I mean, we
we're talking, you know, normal military

426
00:32:37.039 --> 00:32:40.079
kind of thinking. You know,
Okay, you got a ball that's holding

427
00:32:40.079 --> 00:32:44.079
in the water. Who's ball?
While it has to be long to somebody,

428
00:32:44.559 --> 00:32:49.279
it must belong to another another ship
for something. Yeah, we just

429
00:32:49.400 --> 00:32:53.279
didn't know wortship. Yeah. Yeah, So it was one of those mysteries.

430
00:32:53.640 --> 00:32:57.640
You know, you're left scratching your
head and you go like, okay,

431
00:32:58.519 --> 00:33:05.319
what's next. Yeah, that's about
it. And uh and to this

432
00:33:05.480 --> 00:33:08.240
day, we don't know what we
saw and then now again now with what's

433
00:33:08.240 --> 00:33:14.039
happening today with these little these uh
spirit spheres that are going into the water,

434
00:33:14.160 --> 00:33:17.880
I'm sorry to wonder was that one
of those things or well, what

435
00:33:19.200 --> 00:33:23.839
I don't know right right? Um, there, I had a friend,

436
00:33:24.799 --> 00:33:29.519
um he's been on the show many
times, Mark d' antonio, and he

437
00:33:29.759 --> 00:33:37.839
was on an excursion on a submarine
um as a guest because of some work

438
00:33:37.920 --> 00:33:42.920
that he did that was related to
it. And they had they had something

439
00:33:43.079 --> 00:33:46.440
moving that they called a fast mover
that was they already had a term for

440
00:33:46.599 --> 00:33:52.200
it. It was going over two
hundred knots and underwater and you figured this

441
00:33:52.400 --> 00:33:55.920
is I think it was he said
it was in the nineties or maybe early

442
00:33:55.960 --> 00:34:00.400
two thousands. You know, we
didn't have any technology that would do that

443
00:34:00.480 --> 00:34:06.880
speed. Yeh. You know you
think the fastest ship at that time in

444
00:34:07.039 --> 00:34:13.880
nineteen sixty six with the USS Enterprise, yeah carrier, yeah whatever. They

445
00:34:13.920 --> 00:34:16.480
would launch their planes and there was
areas in the in the tunk and golf

446
00:34:16.639 --> 00:34:21.199
where there was no win, so
the aircraft carrier had to create win.

447
00:34:22.800 --> 00:34:27.679
At one time, we chased that
carrier. He singled back to us,

448
00:34:28.360 --> 00:34:34.480
Mike speed sixty plus knots. We're
going twenty five almost thirty knots, and

449
00:34:34.599 --> 00:34:38.480
we were popping rivets. Literally,
I was on a World War two destroyer.

450
00:34:38.880 --> 00:34:45.119
We're moving through the water in thirty
knots. Our ship was taking was

451
00:34:45.239 --> 00:34:47.840
rumbling, we were in a rumble. And by the time we caught off

452
00:34:47.880 --> 00:34:52.679
to the aircraft carrier, they were
already launched, their aircraft were coming back.

453
00:34:53.719 --> 00:35:00.800
I mean we were. They were
going plus sixty knots on the water.

454
00:35:00.199 --> 00:35:07.280
So it takes some I remember reading
an article one time about um boating,

455
00:35:07.559 --> 00:35:12.400
you know, like power boating.
So for every knot, it takes

456
00:35:12.639 --> 00:35:15.840
so much more power. And the
higher you go out, like if you

457
00:35:15.920 --> 00:35:21.840
want your your your motor boat to
go eighty knots, it takes an enormous

458
00:35:21.880 --> 00:35:27.119
amount of power once you get over
like forty knots to make it go higher.

459
00:35:27.239 --> 00:35:32.000
So if you can picture something that
has submerged traveling at two over two

460
00:35:32.079 --> 00:35:36.599
hundred knots, I mean, it
just seems like it would take uh,

461
00:35:37.000 --> 00:35:42.480
you know, and it takes an
enormous amount of pressure around, you know,

462
00:35:43.119 --> 00:35:45.880
uh to make something like that happen. A question that Richard has here

463
00:35:46.320 --> 00:35:51.559
the tracer bullets were actually ricocheting off
the object. Is that what you that's

464
00:35:51.840 --> 00:35:55.920
so they were shot with tracer bullets. Well every everyone other I think,

465
00:35:57.039 --> 00:36:01.239
I forget what the what they Paul
is loaded. I didn't know how there

466
00:36:01.320 --> 00:36:05.360
was loaded. I mean we saw
tracers and there. I mean, there

467
00:36:05.440 --> 00:36:07.760
wasn't like a steady stream of tracer. This was like maybe every five or

468
00:36:07.880 --> 00:36:12.280
six rounds or something. In other
words, every once in a while you

469
00:36:12.440 --> 00:36:17.159
see a tracer shoot off. That's
what's scared us. So we're starting to

470
00:36:17.159 --> 00:36:21.840
see the tracers because you know,
normally, if you know, maybe I

471
00:36:22.159 --> 00:36:27.000
know, we carried fifty color machine
guns at our ship, and I think

472
00:36:27.119 --> 00:36:29.920
there was maybe every six round as
a tracer or something like that. I

473
00:36:30.079 --> 00:36:36.119
forget the military tournament because I never
had to fire the machine guns. That

474
00:36:36.320 --> 00:36:43.960
wasn't my job. Yeah yeah,
well, so these things happened to you,

475
00:36:44.199 --> 00:36:47.519
And what was it like, um, you know behind the scenes,

476
00:36:47.639 --> 00:36:53.760
like did for instance, let's go
back to the first encounter and was like

477
00:36:53.920 --> 00:36:58.800
in the mess hall or whatever was
her talk, you know, like,

478
00:36:58.960 --> 00:37:00.480
hey, what do you think bring
it up? We can bring it up.

479
00:37:01.199 --> 00:37:06.719
Nobody was on the watch brought it
up because I think we were afraid

480
00:37:06.800 --> 00:37:10.679
of ridicule. Yeah, one of
the things that you had to be aware

481
00:37:10.719 --> 00:37:15.159
of what you're on a small,
well small ship, but you got a

482
00:37:15.199 --> 00:37:19.480
crew of two hundred and fifty men
or just destroyer, and like I said,

483
00:37:19.480 --> 00:37:25.159
it's a Flesher class or twenty one
hundred class destroyer. And there was

484
00:37:25.199 --> 00:37:28.800
a lot of harassment all the time. I mean, if somebody got a

485
00:37:28.880 --> 00:37:31.639
Dear John letter, everybody in the
ship knew it, and you and that

486
00:37:31.800 --> 00:37:37.559
poor guy had for them for about
a month until somebody else. You can

487
00:37:37.639 --> 00:37:40.360
harass somebody else. I mean,
there was always that kind It was almost

488
00:37:40.480 --> 00:37:47.239
a rite of passage kind of thing
that you say, so yeah, I

489
00:37:47.360 --> 00:37:52.039
mean I for example, for myself, I wrote a letter to my girlfriend

490
00:37:52.039 --> 00:37:54.360
and then I threw it away and
to put it in the garbage scan.

491
00:37:54.519 --> 00:37:59.280
My mistake was throwed it in the
garbage scan, because then it was pulled

492
00:37:59.280 --> 00:38:01.800
out by the other and they was
they all had a section of the letter.

493
00:38:01.840 --> 00:38:09.559
It was later loud in front of
all the proven. Oh that's the

494
00:38:09.639 --> 00:38:14.360
kind of thing I'm talking about.
That's the kind of talking about that's so

495
00:38:14.599 --> 00:38:17.599
terrible, you know. So my
reaction to when they were reading my letter,

496
00:38:17.800 --> 00:38:22.440
I responded by saying where'd you find
the letter in the garbage? Yeah,

497
00:38:22.480 --> 00:38:28.199
that's where you guys were in the
garbage learn how to throw it back

498
00:38:28.519 --> 00:38:31.679
or else? Yeah? Yeah,
what's the biggs in your bath? Yeah?

499
00:38:32.280 --> 00:38:37.000
Yeah, that was just form for
the rest of this this uh,

500
00:38:38.000 --> 00:38:42.159
this question is I don't know if
you even know it. These M fourteen

501
00:38:42.239 --> 00:38:46.880
tracer of fifty caliber. I have
no idea what the Yeah, well,

502
00:38:47.360 --> 00:38:51.519
um, all right, gone back
to the first it was a fifty caliber.

503
00:38:51.599 --> 00:38:55.119
I do not think it was fifty
caliber, okay, because the machine

504
00:38:55.159 --> 00:39:00.039
gun is a pretty heavy machine gun. It's about eighty five pounds. And

505
00:39:00.119 --> 00:39:01.880
the reason I know that is that
I one of my jobs when we went

506
00:39:01.920 --> 00:39:07.639
to general quarters. We had a
fifty color machine gun that was strapped to

507
00:39:07.800 --> 00:39:10.280
the side of our chart house.
In other words, are where we worked

508
00:39:10.320 --> 00:39:15.400
on charts, our chart room,
and my job when we went to general

509
00:39:15.480 --> 00:39:17.639
quarters was to take that fifty color
machine gun that was strapped to the wall,

510
00:39:19.159 --> 00:39:22.400
throw it over my shoulder, go
up the ladder to the bridge,

511
00:39:22.800 --> 00:39:24.800
had to the gunners mates who were
on top of the bridge, and they

512
00:39:24.840 --> 00:39:31.400
had a machine gun mount on top
of the bridge. Wow that sounds those

513
00:39:31.480 --> 00:39:39.639
things that are probably pretty heavy too, eighty five pounds amazing poles. Yeah.

514
00:39:40.079 --> 00:39:44.039
Yeah, so when you're looking at
this, let's talk about the first

515
00:39:44.840 --> 00:39:49.360
encounter. Um, yeah, it's
amazing that you just happened to be looking

516
00:39:49.480 --> 00:39:53.519
up. And it was the thing
I it was the way I relaxed,

517
00:39:53.679 --> 00:39:59.079
you know, once I did a
fix and and and showed the officer of

518
00:39:59.119 --> 00:40:01.000
the deck where we were in the
position of the ship, how we were

519
00:40:01.039 --> 00:40:05.159
doing. Did we need to change
course? Paul? Was our drift and

520
00:40:05.239 --> 00:40:07.960
you know, all these kind of
things that you're doing when you're navigating.

521
00:40:07.599 --> 00:40:09.960
What kind of drift do you have? Do we have a following sea?

522
00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:14.239
Do we only going against the sea? Are we doing good time? Or

523
00:40:14.239 --> 00:40:15.920
are we going to arrive when we're
supposed to ride? Because we were our

524
00:40:16.039 --> 00:40:21.840
job was to rendezvous with some other
destroyers before we pulled into into buns and

525
00:40:21.920 --> 00:40:28.920
we could pull in as a in
a column, so that was what we

526
00:40:29.000 --> 00:40:31.960
were kind of operating by ourselves.
So in points of relaxing, you know,

527
00:40:32.639 --> 00:40:36.840
you would I would just get my
predocatives and look straight up and just

528
00:40:37.360 --> 00:40:40.000
I really enjoyed that. It was
a lot of fun just looking up and

529
00:40:40.159 --> 00:40:45.840
seeing all the stars, just a
just an incredible view. And if anybody's

530
00:40:45.880 --> 00:40:50.320
ever seen that, you understand what
I'm talking about when you get the what

531
00:40:50.440 --> 00:40:54.639
it's called the dome effect. Yeah, being under a dome. Yeah yeah,

532
00:40:55.000 --> 00:41:00.880
so moving boy, you spotted Yeah, I did a I was doing

533
00:41:00.039 --> 00:41:07.719
other other shows and I actually had
the pleasure of meeting and doing an interview

534
00:41:07.840 --> 00:41:12.559
with a gentleman that was at the
time I think someone else has beat the

535
00:41:12.599 --> 00:41:15.639
record. It's not a record you
want to beat, and that is to

536
00:41:15.800 --> 00:41:21.440
be how long he was by himself
in a life raft, you know,

537
00:41:21.559 --> 00:41:24.480
trying to survive until he was found. And I forget how many days it

538
00:41:24.599 --> 00:41:30.199
was. It was all many,
many, many days. And so after

539
00:41:30.280 --> 00:41:32.880
I did the interview, of course, I had nothing to do with UFOs.

540
00:41:32.960 --> 00:41:37.280
It was completely about his survival,
which was an amazing story all on

541
00:41:37.360 --> 00:41:42.320
its own. There was a book
written about it, Adrift it was called.

542
00:41:42.559 --> 00:41:46.320
But anyway, So I said,
hey, by the way, you

543
00:41:46.400 --> 00:41:51.039
know, I do a show in
UFOs too, And I said, you

544
00:41:51.119 --> 00:41:53.559
were out at sea in the dark
every night, and you know you could

545
00:41:53.599 --> 00:41:57.960
see all the stars and everything.
Did you ever see anything weird? And

546
00:41:58.079 --> 00:42:04.400
he goes yes, And so I
go like, can you talk about you

547
00:42:04.440 --> 00:42:07.000
know, I try to get more
information. He's, well, you know,

548
00:42:07.159 --> 00:42:08.440
maybe another time I'll talk about it, you know, that type of

549
00:42:08.519 --> 00:42:12.039
thing. But so, yeah,
you're out there, you have the vast

550
00:42:12.320 --> 00:42:15.719
sky, and you know if something
is going to happen. It's kind of

551
00:42:15.800 --> 00:42:20.519
like you think about commercial pilots,
you know, they have when they're up

552
00:42:20.559 --> 00:42:22.119
in the sky, they have if
it's clear, you know, you can

553
00:42:22.159 --> 00:42:28.639
see a big range hundreds of miles
in all directions, you know. So

554
00:42:29.119 --> 00:42:32.480
yeah, there's no way to tell
exactly how the high this thing is.

555
00:42:34.280 --> 00:42:38.000
Um. The radar thing is a
little um murky to me because I'm not

556
00:42:38.159 --> 00:42:43.960
sure. Did you say that they
can see within three hundred miles? Is

557
00:42:44.000 --> 00:42:50.239
that what you say? It's a
surface radar, surface radar? Yeah,

558
00:42:50.719 --> 00:42:53.480
okay. Radars on the ship are
are four? Well, they had one,

559
00:42:54.039 --> 00:42:57.760
they had a small they have to. We have two radar devices on

560
00:42:57.880 --> 00:43:00.679
the vans, a small one on
the very tall and then a large search

561
00:43:00.840 --> 00:43:05.960
radar right below that one. And
I don't know what they're full function.

562
00:43:06.079 --> 00:43:08.199
I know that the bottom one had
a range of three hundred but it was

563
00:43:08.239 --> 00:43:14.800
a surface radar that other words,
they couldn't aim it up now the other

564
00:43:15.519 --> 00:43:19.880
This is why it was suggested to
to contact WOM Air Force based to see

565
00:43:19.920 --> 00:43:22.639
who they had coming in. Yeah, we thought it was a flight of

566
00:43:22.800 --> 00:43:25.679
B fifty twos, you know.
Yeah, I mean that was that issue

567
00:43:25.719 --> 00:43:30.280
reaction. And I mean we were
all casual about it. It's five five

568
00:43:30.320 --> 00:43:34.599
aircraft up there, you know,
and must be and we were, you

569
00:43:34.679 --> 00:43:37.360
were casual, very quiet, you
know, it must be a flight fifty

570
00:43:37.400 --> 00:43:39.360
two. Well, and then and
then you know, they see, I

571
00:43:39.440 --> 00:43:44.360
see what you got, you know, and then a then it change,

572
00:43:44.400 --> 00:43:45.679
you know, the all of a
sudden, the focus started changing. It

573
00:43:45.719 --> 00:43:51.920
also when when WOM sent to check
with Tachikawo Air Force basis, something's going

574
00:43:52.000 --> 00:43:55.000
on here. And uh, like
I said, we went through three radar

575
00:43:55.239 --> 00:44:00.679
sites or three radar stations, and
they said, we about what you're looking

576
00:44:00.719 --> 00:44:05.679
at. So the three I'm just
hang in here just a little bit on

577
00:44:05.719 --> 00:44:09.719
the radar. So the different radar
stations. What I'm trying to get at

578
00:44:09.840 --> 00:44:15.519
is if there was an object up
at possibly satellite height because satellites can go

579
00:44:15.639 --> 00:44:22.719
way way high, but um but
possibly at say lower satellite height in elevation,

580
00:44:23.559 --> 00:44:28.000
are there radars that could capture something
like that. That's what I was

581
00:44:28.079 --> 00:44:30.719
trying to get at you know,
you're asking the wrong guy. And I

582
00:44:31.199 --> 00:44:37.239
don't know. We were just following
procedure. This is the standard operating procedure.

583
00:44:37.320 --> 00:44:40.000
You call one person, they say, no, check this person.

584
00:44:40.039 --> 00:44:44.079
Okay, we'll check with that person. Yeah, okay, persons check out

585
00:44:44.119 --> 00:44:45.239
that person. Okay, we'll check
out that person. That's what we were

586
00:44:45.280 --> 00:44:50.320
doing. We were just checking off
what we were going through, the procedures

587
00:44:50.440 --> 00:44:54.840
and uh and it's you know,
and we're thinking like a US military ship.

588
00:44:54.920 --> 00:44:59.320
We're we're not thinking at very cast. We were at first, we

589
00:44:59.360 --> 00:45:02.400
were taking a casually because it just
looked like an aircraft, aircraft flying along.

590
00:45:04.159 --> 00:45:09.119
But when the last radar said,
we don't know what you're looking at,

591
00:45:09.320 --> 00:45:13.519
that's when we all were looking at
him. That's when we all had

592
00:45:13.559 --> 00:45:19.760
our monoculars looking at them. And
that's when and the sensation, I don't

593
00:45:19.800 --> 00:45:22.800
know, maybe I maybe it's just
my own feeling, but the sensation was

594
00:45:23.760 --> 00:45:28.159
it picked up that we were looking
at him or something, and they decided

595
00:45:28.199 --> 00:45:32.679
to change course all of a sudden. Yeah. I mean, I've never

596
00:45:32.760 --> 00:45:37.760
seen anything maneuver like that in my
life right this day. I've never seen

597
00:45:37.800 --> 00:45:42.199
anybody that can be moving along and
then make a ninety return without hesitation and

598
00:45:42.400 --> 00:45:47.639
just oh gone. And I mean
they were gone like that. Would you

599
00:45:47.719 --> 00:45:52.400
say that they were gone like in
a streak or were they gone like vanish

600
00:45:54.000 --> 00:46:01.559
both streak advantage. Yeah, they
just like zoomed out. I mean the

601
00:46:01.639 --> 00:46:05.599
minute they made that turn, they
were they took off. I mean they

602
00:46:05.679 --> 00:46:09.920
just like zep. And that's what
I started yelling, dead breaking dead,

603
00:46:10.360 --> 00:46:15.519
assuming that they would appear at a
certain direction. Dead wreckting means you're you're

604
00:46:15.559 --> 00:46:22.239
following, You're trying to follow their
direction. So I was yelling deadrectoring,

605
00:46:22.320 --> 00:46:25.159
deadrecting, and we all kind of
aimed our predoctors where we thought they might

606
00:46:25.239 --> 00:46:30.239
be next. But they were gone. They were totally totally gone. Yeah,

607
00:46:30.719 --> 00:46:35.519
so did this thing? Did this
thing fly in the same structure of

608
00:46:35.599 --> 00:46:38.400
V? Like? You never saw
that change? Like what I'm trying to

609
00:46:38.519 --> 00:46:45.519
ask you. It looked like possibly
like a triangular shape or possibly a V

610
00:46:45.719 --> 00:46:49.760
shape. It was a V.
They were they were a vat like this.

611
00:46:50.679 --> 00:46:54.159
So it's one, two, three, four, five lights again one

612
00:46:54.199 --> 00:46:59.440
point and two of the side.
Yeah. Now here's here's something someone called

613
00:46:59.480 --> 00:47:01.920
in one time. I'm imposed a
very good question, and that why would

614
00:47:01.960 --> 00:47:06.480
they have lights? You know,
I mean, I'm I'm not I'm not

615
00:47:06.599 --> 00:47:09.559
asking that question, but I'm just
saying that is a very good question.

616
00:47:09.679 --> 00:47:15.000
If if whatever it is traveled whatever
it is to get here, and it's

617
00:47:15.079 --> 00:47:19.360
like way up there, why would
they bother to have lights? They don't

618
00:47:19.400 --> 00:47:23.519
need lights. But but obviously these
things seem to have lights most of the

619
00:47:23.599 --> 00:47:30.039
time there were like five dots.
They don't. Yeah, it's almost like

620
00:47:30.400 --> 00:47:34.159
whatever it is is not afraid that
someone is seeing it, and it's almost

621
00:47:34.239 --> 00:47:43.320
like here I am, you can
see and I you know, I think

622
00:47:43.400 --> 00:47:47.559
one of the this is what like
that? Yeah, well I can tell

623
00:47:47.599 --> 00:47:52.119
you're an artist if you can yep. I can tell you are an artist

624
00:47:52.159 --> 00:47:57.639
if you can draw that quickly and
that evenly. Well, it's it was

625
00:47:57.719 --> 00:48:04.480
embedded in my mind. I mean
really it after that incident, I was

626
00:48:04.559 --> 00:48:07.679
I have to admit to you,
I was very pro pro navy, pro

627
00:48:07.880 --> 00:48:10.280
government, pro everything. And when
I was in the Navy, I mean

628
00:48:10.440 --> 00:48:14.920
we were, you know, we
were on our way to our This was

629
00:48:14.960 --> 00:48:17.920
why I was on my second tour. We were on our second cruise to

630
00:48:19.480 --> 00:48:23.280
the Vietnam area, Vietnmese area,
So we were very Uh, should I

631
00:48:23.360 --> 00:48:28.400
say positive about what we were doing. I mean we felt very positive.

632
00:48:28.440 --> 00:48:32.440
There was no we did have a
one conscious objector on the ship and he

633
00:48:32.800 --> 00:48:38.960
jumped off the ship. In a
serious situation. He jumped off the ship.

634
00:48:39.719 --> 00:48:43.880
Yeah, like he was gone forever. No, no, no,

635
00:48:43.960 --> 00:48:49.400
we could come up. We had
Oh god, well, I'll tell you

636
00:48:49.519 --> 00:48:57.440
the situation. We were assisting Vietnamese
marines landing. Vietnamese Marines were conducting a

637
00:48:57.599 --> 00:49:00.599
landing on this beach area and we
were to provide gunfire support for them,

638
00:49:01.239 --> 00:49:07.679
and so we're waiting for I'm on
the bridge at the time, but it

639
00:49:07.800 --> 00:49:10.039
was in my battle station. At
that point. We switched our battle station.

640
00:49:10.079 --> 00:49:13.920
The navigators were always switching their battle
station. Sometimes would be on the

641
00:49:13.960 --> 00:49:17.440
bridge, would be after steering and
being the secondary Cohn. We were always

642
00:49:17.480 --> 00:49:21.719
moving around and just to give ussel
was a little bit of variety. So

643
00:49:21.840 --> 00:49:25.760
this time I was on the bridge
and we were conducting this uh these yetting,

644
00:49:25.760 --> 00:49:30.760
these marines landed boats and stuff,
and we were going to go gunfire

645
00:49:30.800 --> 00:49:36.800
support. While we're waiting for the
orders for to open fire, we keep

646
00:49:36.880 --> 00:49:39.519
hearing somebody yelling, I am a
conscience as objector, I am against the

647
00:49:39.559 --> 00:49:44.599
war Diet. Now we're looking around. Hell is that who the hell's yelling?

648
00:49:44.840 --> 00:49:46.559
Finally somebody said, look up on
the mask. We looked up at

649
00:49:46.599 --> 00:49:50.960
the mask and there's this guy at
the very top of the mask. And

650
00:49:51.199 --> 00:49:55.039
we're going slow because we're on gunfire
support. So the ship is yawing back

651
00:49:55.079 --> 00:49:59.480
and forth, so the mask is
going like this. So I'm thinking,

652
00:49:59.719 --> 00:50:04.079
or that guy jumps the wrong time, he's gonna hit the deck. But

653
00:50:04.480 --> 00:50:07.440
you know, he's gonna have to
wait till the ship's yaws over the ocean.

654
00:50:07.559 --> 00:50:09.840
Then he's gonna have to do his
jump. And that's the jump too.

655
00:50:10.199 --> 00:50:15.000
That's a very high I thought this. You know, I hope he

656
00:50:15.239 --> 00:50:19.880
jumps in deep water, hits deep
water because there's a lot of shoals.

657
00:50:20.239 --> 00:50:24.599
We were in an area and these
shows are marked with bamboo sticks sticking out.

658
00:50:24.639 --> 00:50:28.840
The fisherman. The Vietnamese fisherman had
the sticks STI get out of the

659
00:50:28.880 --> 00:50:32.880
water, so we have to maneuver
away from him. And so he jumped

660
00:50:34.400 --> 00:50:38.599
and we had to call off what
we were doing to rescue him because now

661
00:50:38.639 --> 00:50:43.480
we had a mad overboard, right, So we rescued him, brought him

662
00:50:43.519 --> 00:50:50.679
aboard the ship. People were really
angry with him, some intended violence s

663
00:50:50.719 --> 00:50:53.920
towards him because we were in a
combat situation and here's this guy jumping off

664
00:50:54.480 --> 00:50:58.960
And we've been waiting for this combat
situation for so long and finally here we

665
00:50:59.039 --> 00:51:01.920
are getting into action and this guy
disrupts it by jumping off the ship.

666
00:51:02.639 --> 00:51:06.960
So the captain brought they brought him
up to the bridge. He's soaking.

667
00:51:07.000 --> 00:51:08.960
What the captain looks at him,
He says, you're lucky that the Congress

668
00:51:09.000 --> 00:51:15.840
has not declared war because if anything
we would have this was desertion under fire,

669
00:51:15.920 --> 00:51:20.639
we would have just shot him.
Jeez, wow under fire. Wow.

670
00:51:21.000 --> 00:51:25.920
Going back to here's the question,
has your guest had a sighting sense?

671
00:51:27.039 --> 00:51:29.800
We will talk about that later after
the break. We're going into the

672
00:51:29.840 --> 00:51:32.199
break here in just a couple of
minutes, and it's a five minute break.

673
00:51:32.840 --> 00:51:37.679
Um. But uh, now,
you did I hear you say that

674
00:51:37.840 --> 00:51:43.599
there was you knew someone else that
also had an encounter during the war.

675
00:51:44.239 --> 00:51:47.599
Yeah. One of the one of
the navigators, told me that he actually

676
00:51:47.639 --> 00:51:52.079
came down and woke me up.
He was on watch, and he said

677
00:51:52.119 --> 00:51:57.280
they were looking at the ground because
you know, we'd watched the action at

678
00:51:57.400 --> 00:51:59.880
night we were we could watch the
action at night. You know, tray

679
00:52:00.119 --> 00:52:05.920
is going back and forth, you
know who runs the board. And he

680
00:52:06.119 --> 00:52:10.199
said that there was an amber light
that flich went back and forth, was

681
00:52:10.280 --> 00:52:14.800
going back and forth an amber light, and then that the amber light shot

682
00:52:14.920 --> 00:52:20.880
straight up and took off disappeared.
So I said amber light. So I

683
00:52:21.440 --> 00:52:24.079
said, well, there's only according
to the US Navy, there's only two

684
00:52:24.280 --> 00:52:30.880
kinds of things, two kinds of
vehicles that would have amber lights. One

685
00:52:30.079 --> 00:52:35.719
is a submarine and the other one
is a hovercraft. Hovercraft don't shoot straight

686
00:52:35.840 --> 00:52:40.320
up. Yeah, so he and
he said it was the weirdest thing,

687
00:52:40.440 --> 00:52:43.800
man. It was. We keep
going back and forth, back and forth

688
00:52:43.920 --> 00:52:46.599
really fast, and then it only
it just went chow straight up. And

689
00:52:46.719 --> 00:52:53.360
I looked me up for that,
so was up. Oh so this happened

690
00:52:53.400 --> 00:52:55.920
on the same ship or another ship
that you were on the same ship,

691
00:52:57.360 --> 00:53:00.480
same the same the same time.
Yeah, just start to like question,

692
00:53:00.639 --> 00:53:05.239
like what the heck is going on
here? I mean we did. And

693
00:53:05.440 --> 00:53:10.559
you know, I had a roommate
who was first air cav and he told

694
00:53:10.599 --> 00:53:16.360
me about a time they were out
in the field. Because I told the

695
00:53:16.400 --> 00:53:22.119
story about the UFL thing and then
he said, you know, and the

696
00:53:22.880 --> 00:53:28.320
funny thing is, we had provided
a gunfire support for this, for this

697
00:53:28.760 --> 00:53:31.440
uh, this first air calve.
In fact, we had provided a shotgun

698
00:53:31.519 --> 00:53:36.360
support. In other words, they
were driving along what is highway wanted Vietnam,

699
00:53:36.840 --> 00:53:42.079
and we were going along the water
providing gunfire support protecting him. And

700
00:53:42.280 --> 00:53:45.920
he remembered the number on my ship
and wrote to me. It says,

701
00:53:45.920 --> 00:53:47.320
it's your ship number six eighty four, and I wrote back to him,

702
00:53:47.360 --> 00:53:51.800
Yeah, that's my ships. You
guys were providing gun fires, providing a

703
00:53:52.599 --> 00:53:55.079
shotgun for us. You were writing
shotgun for us, And I'm like,

704
00:53:55.159 --> 00:53:59.840
wow, incident into the incident.
So here he was talking, we were

705
00:54:00.039 --> 00:54:04.239
talking. This is after we got
other servants. He was my roommate when

706
00:54:04.239 --> 00:54:07.880
I was going to our school and
we were talking and he said, you

707
00:54:07.960 --> 00:54:09.760
know what a weird thing happened to
us? And I said, where was

708
00:54:09.800 --> 00:54:13.400
that? He said, we were
out of the field and was at night,

709
00:54:13.840 --> 00:54:19.039
and all of a sudden, this
big black thing went over us,

710
00:54:19.280 --> 00:54:23.119
real slow, and he said,
and the pressure, he said, all

711
00:54:23.119 --> 00:54:27.840
of a sudden all of us just
followed us just lay down, Oh my

712
00:54:27.960 --> 00:54:30.199
god, and it just like went
over us and then it just passed.

713
00:54:30.960 --> 00:54:35.280
It was I can't believe you're saying
this because it was a black it was

714
00:54:35.360 --> 00:54:38.400
a dark black thing. It went
over us, he said. He said,

715
00:54:38.480 --> 00:54:43.719
we literally had to lead down.
Yes, this is this is really

716
00:54:43.760 --> 00:54:47.719
fascinating because I have a guest from
Australia that is going to be talking,

717
00:54:49.079 --> 00:54:54.320
you know, briefly on my show
about something very similar. She told me

718
00:54:54.440 --> 00:55:00.079
this story about God. She told
me the story about nine years ago that

719
00:55:00.400 --> 00:55:06.800
her and her grandmother were in their
garden in this black triangle floated very slowly

720
00:55:06.880 --> 00:55:08.760
over them and made the pressure like
they had to go lay down on the

721
00:55:08.840 --> 00:55:16.199
ground. Wo yeah. Yeah,
you have to realize this is all the

722
00:55:16.320 --> 00:55:21.679
same year sixty six. Wow.
Well, we have to go. It's

723
00:55:21.719 --> 00:55:24.760
time for us to go into commercial
break. And it's a treat for those

724
00:55:24.840 --> 00:55:31.599
of you on YouTube and also on
Facebook watching, because we have a five

725
00:55:31.679 --> 00:55:39.039
minute clip about a UFO sighting that
happened outside of Detroit and it's pretty interesting.

726
00:55:39.400 --> 00:55:44.320
So for those of you over at
KGr A Radio, we'll be right

727
00:55:44.360 --> 00:55:54.440
back right after this five minute break. All right, So I'm with Mark

728
00:55:54.639 --> 00:55:59.840
Richard and he had a sighting outside
of the building you're in right now you're

729
00:56:00.039 --> 00:56:05.199
working right now. Yes, I'm
actually I live and work in the building.

730
00:56:05.280 --> 00:56:08.760
I'm the head of maintenance for the
apartment building. So my sighting actually

731
00:56:08.880 --> 00:56:13.559
happened back in two thousand and eight. I don't have the exact date,

732
00:56:13.880 --> 00:56:17.079
but I think it was somewhere late
October early November of two thousand and eight.

733
00:56:19.239 --> 00:56:22.719
And can you explain exactly something caught
your eye out the window. Yes,

734
00:56:23.480 --> 00:56:27.440
I was working at the time.
I think it was maybe around two

735
00:56:27.519 --> 00:56:30.920
pm or so, and it was
a bright sunny day, not a cloud

736
00:56:30.960 --> 00:56:34.840
in the sky. Something kept reflecting
light into my eye. Every time I

737
00:56:34.880 --> 00:56:37.880
would look up from my work,
something out the windows reflecting this light into

738
00:56:37.920 --> 00:56:40.719
my eye. After about the third
or fourth time of this happening, I'm

739
00:56:40.760 --> 00:56:45.159
getting a little annoyed, and I
walked over to the window. This is

740
00:56:45.159 --> 00:56:49.760
the old historic building. We have
huge windows. Walked over to the window,

741
00:56:49.840 --> 00:56:52.000
and I'm looking at this thing.
I can see it. I'm in

742
00:56:52.119 --> 00:56:54.519
downtown Detroit. I've been here for
several years, so I'm used to seeing

743
00:56:54.599 --> 00:56:58.159
traffic copts. I thought it was
a traffic coptor. It looked like it

744
00:56:58.239 --> 00:57:00.880
was over the expressway out there,
maybe like a mile and a half two

745
00:57:00.920 --> 00:57:06.239
miles out. It was out there
little ways. So I lay eyes on

746
00:57:06.360 --> 00:57:08.719
this thing, and pretty much as
soon as I do, it starts moving

747
00:57:08.880 --> 00:57:13.840
towards kind of my general direction.
And I'm still thinking at the time this

748
00:57:13.920 --> 00:57:20.119
is a helicopter. It's annoying with
the clip that this thing moved towards me.

749
00:57:20.360 --> 00:57:22.360
I'm starting to second guess now is
this a helicopter or not, because

750
00:57:22.400 --> 00:57:28.519
this thing was covering this mile and
a half two miles very quickly. Within

751
00:57:28.760 --> 00:57:36.280
seconds it was. It was outside
of my building and slowly coming towards me

752
00:57:37.519 --> 00:57:40.480
to the point where this craft I've
got I'm now in full view of a

753
00:57:40.639 --> 00:57:46.159
craft that is hovering outside of my
I'm the thirteenth story of an eighteen story

754
00:57:46.199 --> 00:57:51.719
building. This thing's hovering outside of
my window. It starts to rotate up

755
00:57:52.719 --> 00:57:57.199
so that it's now sort of ninety
degrees to me where I'm looking directly at

756
00:57:57.239 --> 00:58:01.480
the bottom of this craft. It's
got three large white lights on the bottom

757
00:58:01.559 --> 00:58:07.000
and a smaller red light in the
center that's kind of pulsing, And this

758
00:58:07.159 --> 00:58:14.039
thing starts to rotate clockwise and the
three white lights start flashing a pattern,

759
00:58:14.880 --> 00:58:17.199
and it's rotating, and the pattern's
going a little bit faster and a little

760
00:58:17.239 --> 00:58:23.639
bit faster, and then the outside
edges of these white lights start to flash

761
00:58:23.719 --> 00:58:28.639
in colors, so now I'm getting
every color of the rainbow. It reminded

762
00:58:28.639 --> 00:58:30.559
me one of those Simon games from
back in the eighties where you try to

763
00:58:30.639 --> 00:58:36.760
hit hit the colors. It was
something like that. As it's rotating and

764
00:58:37.440 --> 00:58:40.800
it's speeding up to by the time
this thing was at full board, it

765
00:58:42.000 --> 00:58:46.599
was just a blur of light,
like the most vivid, bright, colorful

766
00:58:46.719 --> 00:58:52.719
light. And at that point I
kind of felt like I was being sort

767
00:58:52.760 --> 00:58:58.280
of mesmerized or being kind of drawn
in mentally by this thing, and it

768
00:58:58.400 --> 00:59:00.639
made me pause, and it made
me sort to put almost a mental block

769
00:59:01.119 --> 00:59:05.320
right there where I said, hold
on, what's what's going on here?

770
00:59:05.360 --> 00:59:09.199
This is obviously very strange. I've
never seen anything like this before. And

771
00:59:10.639 --> 00:59:14.079
when I did that, when I
kind of put a mental stop to it

772
00:59:14.199 --> 00:59:17.239
and kind of put the brakes on
things mentally, the flashing lights stopped.

773
00:59:17.840 --> 00:59:24.239
The craft slowly rotated back down to
an upright position, and it just kind

774
00:59:24.280 --> 00:59:30.199
of floated off to my right hand
side and kind of floated around the building

775
00:59:30.280 --> 00:59:34.960
to where I couldn't see it anymore. I was expecting to see this thing

776
00:59:35.000 --> 00:59:37.360
shoot off into space or something,
and never did it. It just kind

777
00:59:37.400 --> 00:59:40.280
of floated off slowly. I tried
to keep my eye on it for as

778
00:59:40.320 --> 00:59:44.199
long as I could, and once
I lost sight of it, I actually

779
00:59:44.360 --> 00:59:50.159
ran down to the street level to
try to get outside and get my eyes

780
00:59:50.199 --> 00:59:52.280
back on it. But I had
lost it at that point and it was

781
00:59:52.320 --> 00:59:58.159
gone, Wow, well we're already
up to four minutes, so that's okay,

782
00:59:58.440 --> 01:00:00.039
and that's all right. We'll be
r a little bit longer of a

783
01:00:00.119 --> 01:00:05.000
commercial that day. We'll run at
four minutes and thirty seconds. Bill always

784
01:00:05.039 --> 01:00:07.519
likes it over at KGr A when
I can run longer. But we're out

785
01:00:07.559 --> 01:00:10.239
of time now, Mark, thank
you so much. That's a really interesting

786
01:00:10.320 --> 01:00:37.800
sighting. Very all right, welcome
back. Bill probably really liked that when

787
01:00:37.840 --> 01:00:44.760
I said that they liked the long
breaks over at KGr A Radio for the

788
01:00:44.840 --> 01:00:50.559
commercials. But anyway, back with
my guest Alfred, thank you Alfred again

789
01:00:50.639 --> 01:00:55.079
for talking about this. It's always
I always enjoy people that have never talked

790
01:00:55.079 --> 01:01:00.039
about this before, and it's something
new and fresh, some thing very interesting.

791
01:01:00.320 --> 01:01:04.760
Actually, the last encounter you told
me about this black thing and then

792
01:01:04.800 --> 01:01:07.760
the pressure and those people like push
them to the ground. I think that's

793
01:01:07.800 --> 01:01:15.199
so fascinating because you're going back to
nineteen sixty six and the woman that will

794
01:01:15.239 --> 01:01:17.559
be on the show, I think
we're going back to the late nineteen seventies

795
01:01:17.599 --> 01:01:22.119
when she was young, and so
these things. You know, people can

796
01:01:22.199 --> 01:01:27.280
say all they want about you know, secret military craft, black projects,

797
01:01:27.360 --> 01:01:34.119
things like that. But did could
they possibly possibly have had that technology starting

798
01:01:34.159 --> 01:01:38.360
in nineteen sixty six that would never
be used by us in any type of

799
01:01:38.440 --> 01:01:43.960
situation? You know, what are
your thoughts on that? Well? I

800
01:01:44.079 --> 01:01:47.000
don't know. It just makes me
wonder. I mean I have read quite

801
01:01:47.039 --> 01:01:51.800
a bit about the German technology at
World War Two and what they were working

802
01:01:51.840 --> 01:01:53.599
on, and of course, you
know there's a speculations of the Germans that

803
01:01:53.719 --> 01:02:00.079
were developing the UFO, and they
read some accounts where they actually flew a

804
01:02:00.159 --> 01:02:06.079
craft and I believe it was in
Prague, Czechoslovaka, and they flew a

805
01:02:06.159 --> 01:02:08.679
craft and it went up to two
thousand miles per hour. But in all

806
01:02:08.760 --> 01:02:14.559
speculation, we really don't go if
that really happened, because they destroyed all

807
01:02:14.880 --> 01:02:17.679
the records of that of that craft, because they didn't want the Russians to

808
01:02:17.719 --> 01:02:21.199
get a hold of it or something
like that. And then there are some

809
01:02:21.360 --> 01:02:24.960
people that believe the UFOs that were
signed in nineteen forty six, the first

810
01:02:25.159 --> 01:02:30.199
UFOs and where the term flying saucer
was used by that photographer, by that

811
01:02:30.360 --> 01:02:37.079
pilot in Washington. I believe,
yeah, yeah, and they that there's

812
01:02:37.159 --> 01:02:43.800
some connection with British intelligence that was
working in that area of British Columbia.

813
01:02:44.159 --> 01:02:46.679
I don't know. There's a lot
of things I've read, and I've always

814
01:02:46.760 --> 01:02:50.679
read these things with a grain of
salt, you know. I'm kind of

815
01:02:50.719 --> 01:02:53.760
like, Okay, you have to
and even when I look at a photograph,

816
01:02:53.800 --> 01:02:59.880
I wonder about it. I have
to show you what started this same

817
01:03:00.039 --> 01:03:07.719
with ruff On And I was back
in April this year. I'm an artist,

818
01:03:07.920 --> 01:03:14.239
and I saw a cloud that had
this incredible yellowish tinge to it and

819
01:03:14.320 --> 01:03:16.599
I said, wow, that is
a really wild yellow and it's so pale.

820
01:03:16.920 --> 01:03:20.559
I wonder if I can catch it
with a camera. So I went

821
01:03:20.639 --> 01:03:24.159
and grabbed my camera and I shot
a picture of it. Can I show

822
01:03:24.199 --> 01:03:28.559
you the picture? Oh? Yes, a matter of fact, you can

823
01:03:28.679 --> 01:03:31.679
send the picture to me and I
will put it in the show notes permanently.

824
01:03:34.119 --> 01:03:37.239
Go ahead and hold that up right. Now, here's the picture I

825
01:03:37.360 --> 01:03:44.639
took of the cloud. Yeah,
I didn't notice anything until I downloaded the

826
01:03:44.800 --> 01:03:49.960
camera and saw this little black speck. I don't know if you can see

827
01:03:50.000 --> 01:03:52.519
it. I can see it.
Yep, you got to hold it up

828
01:03:52.559 --> 01:03:55.400
more. But yeah, and I
saw that little black speck, and I

829
01:03:55.559 --> 01:03:59.880
go to, what the heck is
that? I said that was? I

830
01:04:00.039 --> 01:04:02.519
didn't see that. I didn't see
it when I took the photograph, I

831
01:04:02.559 --> 01:04:06.440
didn't see it. The photograph was
shot at five six of a second,

832
01:04:06.639 --> 01:04:12.840
I mean five six vocal uh.
Opening was five to six of them,

833
01:04:13.000 --> 01:04:17.239
and the speed was one five hundred
of a second. I took two photographs,

834
01:04:18.039 --> 01:04:20.920
this one and then a shot.
I zoomed back and took another shot.

835
01:04:21.239 --> 01:04:27.679
By the second shot, the object
is gone. So here's a close

836
01:04:27.800 --> 01:04:31.480
up of it. I can't see
it. It's gotta come up, gotta

837
01:04:31.519 --> 01:04:40.480
come up. Here you go.
So um, I so when you weren't

838
01:04:40.679 --> 01:04:45.360
When the investigator came um, the
person that connected us two together, did

839
01:04:45.880 --> 01:04:50.480
did he rule out I know this
sounds really bizarre, but did he rule

840
01:04:50.559 --> 01:04:57.039
out either an insect or bird?
No? In fact, they called it.

841
01:04:57.400 --> 01:05:03.440
They called it a blur foe b
l u r f blurbful. I

842
01:05:03.559 --> 01:05:06.920
said, I have never heard of
that term blur foe. And they sent

843
01:05:08.039 --> 01:05:12.039
me a long explanation of what a
blurfoe was. It could be a bird,

844
01:05:12.599 --> 01:05:16.719
an insect, uh. And I
looked at the photograph and I said,

845
01:05:17.280 --> 01:05:21.519
that's got to be a really large
insect. Because that thing was further

846
01:05:21.639 --> 01:05:27.800
away than the cloud. It almost
seemed to be in the same distance as

847
01:05:27.840 --> 01:05:32.760
the cloud. And both Robert Frestoni
and I both noticed that there was a

848
01:05:32.880 --> 01:05:40.199
kind of a little trail, a
very very very slight trail behind this object.

849
01:05:40.559 --> 01:05:43.320
And I said, I don't know
what what I photographed. I didn't

850
01:05:43.320 --> 01:05:46.880
see it. I never saw the
object. This thing was between second so,

851
01:05:47.239 --> 01:05:54.599
you know, beyond my ice feed. So and that's what started this

852
01:05:54.679 --> 01:05:58.679
whole thing. And so once we
started, I met with mister I met

853
01:05:58.719 --> 01:06:02.280
over the phone mister prest Go.
We started talking about it, and then

854
01:06:02.320 --> 01:06:05.920
he asked me if I had any
other any experience, other experiences, and

855
01:06:06.000 --> 01:06:11.159
I told him about my Davy experiences
and then he told you and that's how

856
01:06:11.199 --> 01:06:15.599
we got that's where we are now. Yeah, I think, um,

857
01:06:15.079 --> 01:06:20.119
I think one of the most interesting
aspects of your first encounter is that the

858
01:06:20.199 --> 01:06:28.039
ship's log was missing after that.
Yeah, I thought that very very strange

859
01:06:28.159 --> 01:06:30.760
that somebody would take the ship's log. Yeah, I mean, had that

860
01:06:30.840 --> 01:06:38.840
ever happened prior or had you ever
noticed that happening at any other time ever?

861
01:06:39.119 --> 01:06:43.079
Ever? Yeah? Yeah, you
know, and we would, you

862
01:06:43.199 --> 01:06:45.880
know. And the ship's logs were
big, and they're like about eight and

863
01:06:45.880 --> 01:06:49.280
a half or fourteen, you know, yeah, paper bound and all that

864
01:06:49.320 --> 01:06:53.519
stuff, and on the front you
have a start date when you start the

865
01:06:53.599 --> 01:06:56.880
log, and et cetera, et
cetera, and you record everything in the

866
01:06:56.880 --> 01:07:00.599
ship's log. You know, Joe
Blow cut his figure, I'm apply to

867
01:07:00.679 --> 01:07:02.599
band aid, He's okay, you
went back to work. That kind of

868
01:07:02.679 --> 01:07:05.960
thing goes in the ship's log.
So every little thing that goes on in

869
01:07:06.039 --> 01:07:11.320
the ship is recorded. So yeah, of course, and that's diary in

870
01:07:11.400 --> 01:07:15.800
other words, it's been that way
for centuries, you know, and you

871
01:07:15.920 --> 01:07:20.760
know, so it is really odd
how that that whole thing disappeared and you

872
01:07:20.880 --> 01:07:24.519
never saw it. Now, let
me ask you this, So what do

873
01:07:24.599 --> 01:07:27.519
you do? Get a new log
and you start again? You know,

874
01:07:27.719 --> 01:07:30.880
Yeah, what you finish the log? You put the end date on it,

875
01:07:30.000 --> 01:07:32.719
for the last date on it,
you signed it, You sign it,

876
01:07:33.000 --> 01:07:36.400
you say, okay, this has
been signed by whoever finished the last

877
01:07:36.440 --> 01:07:39.519
slog. And then you put the
date and they say, okay, give

878
01:07:39.519 --> 01:07:45.920
it to give it to get all
to put it in the log locker.

879
01:07:45.960 --> 01:07:49.239
So then we start a new log
and start a new log first date.

880
01:07:49.880 --> 01:07:55.880
Yea, so we have, you
know, new logs ready go. So

881
01:07:56.039 --> 01:08:01.039
we never we never run out right? And what about the documentation of the

882
01:08:01.199 --> 01:08:06.199
second encounter that was probably put in
the ship's log. Also, I was

883
01:08:06.280 --> 01:08:10.159
not in charge of the ship's log
at that time. Somebody else was in

884
01:08:10.320 --> 01:08:15.480
charge of writing that up. Yeah, so whoever was the quartermaster at that

885
01:08:15.639 --> 01:08:19.279
time? And I could there was
well, there was like four of us

886
01:08:19.880 --> 01:08:24.600
that was a first class petty officer, of second class petty ouncer, two

887
01:08:24.760 --> 01:08:30.760
seamen, and myself a third class
petty officer. And so it was either

888
01:08:30.880 --> 01:08:33.960
it had to be one of the
petty officers that was writing the log.

889
01:08:34.680 --> 01:08:39.960
So it was either the second class
petty officer, the first class petty officer,

890
01:08:40.159 --> 01:08:43.319
or myself. And I was at
that time, I was not writing

891
01:08:43.319 --> 01:08:48.319
the ship's log. Hmm. When
okay, so let's Now I'm just gonna

892
01:08:48.479 --> 01:08:53.119
just change the conversation a little bit. So when you so, when you

893
01:08:53.319 --> 01:08:57.960
saw this, I'm asking about your
personal experience. You saw this object,

894
01:08:58.840 --> 01:09:01.039
It seemed to appear to be at
a very high elevation, but then all

895
01:09:01.039 --> 01:09:05.199
of a sudden it did things you
can't explain and every and you were among

896
01:09:05.680 --> 01:09:11.039
many witnesses that that saw this,
all saw it happened at the same time.

897
01:09:11.720 --> 01:09:17.800
Um, what was your your aftermath
thoughts about what you saw? Like,

898
01:09:18.039 --> 01:09:20.720
did you think, wow, you
know, maybe we are being visited,

899
01:09:20.960 --> 01:09:27.000
or you know, did you think
about it? I did. I

900
01:09:27.079 --> 01:09:29.640
thought a lot about it, and
really, like I said, it altered

901
01:09:29.720 --> 01:09:34.079
my consciousness and maybe start to think. I started to think of who who

902
01:09:34.159 --> 01:09:38.960
are they and what are they doing? And why are they doing that?

903
01:09:39.520 --> 01:09:43.680
And were they showing off? I
mean that was the reverse reaction. These

904
01:09:43.720 --> 01:09:47.920
guys showed off. Look what we
can do? I don't know, because

905
01:09:48.359 --> 01:09:51.920
you know, I kept thinking if
they had kept going straight, only they

906
01:09:51.920 --> 01:09:55.680
had kept going straight, we would
have forgotten all about it. We were

907
01:09:55.880 --> 01:09:59.840
asked somebody's aircraft. They just kept
going you know, unusual atograft or whatever

908
01:10:00.319 --> 01:10:05.640
whatever, and we would have forgotten
about But that maneuver that ninety degree turn

909
01:10:05.800 --> 01:10:12.039
and then just taking off like that
the way they did, that's what was

910
01:10:12.119 --> 01:10:15.479
indelible environ mind and that kind of
like, what the hell was that?

911
01:10:16.720 --> 01:10:19.680
Because we all, like I said, we all just looked at each other

912
01:10:19.840 --> 01:10:24.199
like, did you just see what
I just saw in my dreaming? You

913
01:10:24.279 --> 01:10:28.159
know, it was kind of like
holy metal, that's that's that was starting.

914
01:10:28.159 --> 01:10:30.239
It was startling, let's put it
that way. Yeah, it's very

915
01:10:30.680 --> 01:10:34.039
unusual. I mean we were used
to seeing jets, We're used to seeing

916
01:10:34.199 --> 01:10:42.039
other ships. Yeah, so you
know something that out does us kind of

917
01:10:42.079 --> 01:10:47.560
made you feel like, yeah,
not at all. Whoever that is I

918
01:10:47.920 --> 01:10:53.479
like the like the this was the
operations officer. Okay, this is a

919
01:10:53.560 --> 01:10:56.079
full lieutenant. In other words,
in the army, you would be a

920
01:10:56.159 --> 01:11:00.640
captain. And this was a straight, kind of arrow kind of guy.

921
01:11:00.760 --> 01:11:03.239
This is the kind of guy most
officers on the ship. You saluted him

922
01:11:03.279 --> 01:11:05.920
in the morning and that was it. You were done saluting for the rest

923
01:11:05.960 --> 01:11:11.039
of the day. This officer,
you had a salute returning song. He

924
01:11:11.159 --> 01:11:15.760
was an I believe he was an
Annapolis guy. Yeah you're serious, Yeah,

925
01:11:16.319 --> 01:11:21.920
very sick. His demeanor changed after
that. He was not as serious

926
01:11:23.000 --> 01:11:28.199
anymore. He started to smile a
little more. I can tell you his

927
01:11:28.359 --> 01:11:30.760
name. I could even show you
a picture of the officer, but I

928
01:11:30.800 --> 01:11:35.359
don't think I should because I don't
have permission from that gentleman to be showing

929
01:11:35.439 --> 01:11:41.479
the war craft. Right right,
Um, So this question, this is

930
01:11:41.800 --> 01:11:45.439
another speculation. Could the vcraft have
been one solid craft? Most most most

931
01:11:45.520 --> 01:11:50.239
likely if it turned it in an
instant right, and the ninety degree angle

932
01:11:50.239 --> 01:11:56.199
and then the V formation never changed
right right, never. Yeah, it

933
01:11:56.399 --> 01:12:01.079
was like this and they weren't like
that, right, and I mean not

934
01:12:01.479 --> 01:12:09.279
that small. They were whoooo they
were they were gone, I mean were

935
01:12:09.359 --> 01:12:15.920
you Also it was almost like an
elongation slightly like when they took off,

936
01:12:15.479 --> 01:12:19.840
like a like a streak, like
a blur, Yeah, like a blur,

937
01:12:21.039 --> 01:12:24.840
and they were gone and they were
all the lights are gone. Yeah,

938
01:12:25.880 --> 01:12:28.880
yeah, yeah, that that's really
that's really a good one. Haw

939
01:12:28.920 --> 01:12:32.319
far offshore? Were you at that
point? We were. We were in

940
01:12:32.399 --> 01:12:36.479
the middle of the ocean. We
were traveling from Midway Island to Guam.

941
01:12:38.119 --> 01:12:41.479
We were in a part of the
ocean for the charts or white because there's

942
01:12:41.520 --> 01:12:45.760
no land, so we in fact, we were marking rocks. We were

943
01:12:45.800 --> 01:12:54.359
working with sonar at that time marking
rocks. Now there was we were navigating

944
01:12:54.439 --> 01:12:59.279
and were actually creating things for the
charts. UM. You know things that

945
01:12:59.359 --> 01:13:01.680
are there. You know there's a
rock was sighted here in nineteen fifty three

946
01:13:01.800 --> 01:13:04.800
and you know things like that would
be on the chart. And so we

947
01:13:04.880 --> 01:13:11.079
were documenting new things through so we
can send it to the Notice Tomarritors.

948
01:13:11.439 --> 01:13:16.119
The Notice two Mariners is the international
UM document that goes out to all shifts

949
01:13:16.159 --> 01:13:19.760
to see uh saying a booi's been
moved fifty yards this way. Okay,

950
01:13:19.800 --> 01:13:25.199
so they've said ours and so it's
been moved this way or that way.

951
01:13:25.560 --> 01:13:33.479
It's always indicating any kind of change
and UM navigational markers or anything like that.

952
01:13:33.640 --> 01:13:38.039
So that was our job was always
keep our charts up to date.

953
01:13:38.159 --> 01:13:43.159
So we were always looking at Notice
Tmarritors and correcting our charts all the time.

954
01:13:43.319 --> 01:13:45.159
We were correcting charts. That was
our daily job, correcting charts,

955
01:13:46.439 --> 01:13:53.159
making sure we were up to date. Right Bill that the kg R,

956
01:13:53.199 --> 01:13:58.079
a radio producer sent me a question
for you. Wanted to know what you

957
01:13:58.159 --> 01:14:02.119
thought about the military coming for not
just pilots, but people like himself who

958
01:14:02.199 --> 01:14:09.479
observed um things on naval vessels.
Well, it's about time. I think

959
01:14:09.760 --> 01:14:14.560
there's probably a lot more out there. And what I'm poping with this podcast

960
01:14:15.319 --> 01:14:18.399
is that some of the witnesses that
were on the destroyer when I was on

961
01:14:18.479 --> 01:14:24.039
the destroyer, who saw the V
formation, will start to acknowledge. I

962
01:14:24.079 --> 01:14:27.039
mean, you know, there was
quite a few witnesses. You know,

963
01:14:28.399 --> 01:14:35.680
there was two definitely two officers,
a full lieutenant and a ensign, the

964
01:14:35.800 --> 01:14:41.800
junior officer of the deck. So
I know they all saw the same thing

965
01:14:41.880 --> 01:14:45.800
I saw. Yeah, So I
hope maybe one of them will remember it

966
01:14:46.439 --> 01:14:49.760
or remember the ball. I did
ask one of the other navigators that they

967
01:14:49.840 --> 01:14:55.359
remember the balls that he couldn't remember
it. Yeah, And I'm just wondering,

968
01:14:55.399 --> 01:14:59.039
you know how, you know,
if if we if that's like selective

969
01:14:59.119 --> 01:15:01.479
thinking or or you know, I
don't know, I really don't know.

970
01:15:01.560 --> 01:15:05.680
I really thought that, you know, people would remember us turning the ship

971
01:15:05.760 --> 01:15:10.520
off, because that's one of the
eerious feeling to have when you're middle of

972
01:15:10.520 --> 01:15:14.279
the middle of the water and all
of a sudden there's nothing, you have,

973
01:15:14.439 --> 01:15:16.880
no engine you're used to be.
The ship sounds all the time,

974
01:15:17.079 --> 01:15:20.199
the engines are going. We're used
to a certain hum in the ship,

975
01:15:20.479 --> 01:15:24.840
and hum and all you hear is
the water lapping on the side of the

976
01:15:25.000 --> 01:15:28.760
water on the side of the ship. You kind of like really feel eerie.

977
01:15:29.520 --> 01:15:33.800
Yeah, yeahs you're not under power. You know. I've heard of

978
01:15:34.119 --> 01:15:39.520
people that have had you know,
actually UFO encounters and the people that they

979
01:15:39.640 --> 01:15:44.159
witnessed with said they don't remember,
which is pretty bizarre. You know.

980
01:15:44.720 --> 01:15:49.840
Well, it makes me wonder if
they were in shock to the point that

981
01:15:49.960 --> 01:15:53.920
they just push that out of their
mind. They don't want to they don't

982
01:15:53.920 --> 01:15:57.680
want to remember it because it is
kind of a scary thing. I mean,

983
01:15:57.760 --> 01:16:00.079
you know, we were kind of
a little I was a little freaked

984
01:16:00.119 --> 01:16:03.000
down about it. When you say, you know, you just saw something

985
01:16:03.079 --> 01:16:11.239
to make a ninety return disappears.
Yeah, yeah, that's unusual. I

986
01:16:11.520 --> 01:16:15.880
have seen other things like that where
I'll be looking I tell people I'm a

987
01:16:15.960 --> 01:16:18.439
junior in a standom. When I
became a junior astronomer. I have a

988
01:16:18.479 --> 01:16:24.560
couple of telescopes already, h and
my burnoc. I have my standard seven

989
01:16:24.640 --> 01:16:30.479
by fifty barnoculars that I still use
and I have so often we'll be looking

990
01:16:30.479 --> 01:16:32.840
at the sky and I'll see something
like a star and I want to wow,

991
01:16:32.840 --> 01:16:36.119
what star is that? I don't
remember that start being there, and

992
01:16:36.239 --> 01:16:41.079
all of a sudden it'll just go
out. It'll be like a stationary light

993
01:16:41.199 --> 01:16:43.399
and then all of a sudden it
just goes out, and I go,

994
01:16:43.520 --> 01:16:46.039
Okay, that's not a satellite.
I know what satellites looked like. Satellites

995
01:16:46.119 --> 01:16:49.720
keep moving in one direction. They
don't. They don't maneuver. Satellites or

996
01:16:49.720 --> 01:16:55.359
not maneuver. They don't change ruptly. They keep in there. They're an

997
01:16:55.439 --> 01:16:59.479
orbit. Yeah, no, I've
heard. I've had a few people tell

998
01:16:59.560 --> 01:17:02.920
me that they've seen satellites and then
all of a sudden they'll move jag off

999
01:17:03.399 --> 01:17:11.680
um in one direction. So sometimes
there's an atmospheric issues that can make you

1000
01:17:11.760 --> 01:17:15.439
know, the lights change colors and
plank and things like that. Two is

1001
01:17:15.439 --> 01:17:19.560
a satellite, you know, goes
to the other side of the Earth kind

1002
01:17:19.560 --> 01:17:23.600
of thing. They don't go out. Oh yeah, yeah, that's all

1003
01:17:23.680 --> 01:17:27.560
sun reflected. Yeah, the sun, even though that we don't see the

1004
01:17:27.640 --> 01:17:31.720
sun, it's the reflection is still
um from the sun up there. And

1005
01:17:32.760 --> 01:17:36.239
space junk. Two. Now,
I've never seen any space junk, but

1006
01:17:36.279 --> 01:17:43.439
I've heard people talk about it,
and one one friend told me m a

1007
01:17:43.560 --> 01:17:47.399
story about being on the C C
five C five whatever it is has to

1008
01:17:47.479 --> 01:17:55.520
do with uh Stephen Greers famous groups
that he gets together and to see UFOs,

1009
01:17:55.600 --> 01:18:00.199
and they were they the person believe
they're actually seeing space junk. All

1010
01:18:00.199 --> 01:18:05.079
the UFOs were just space junk,
which also supposedly reflects from the sun until

1011
01:18:05.079 --> 01:18:10.640
it gets out of range of the
sunbeam. But what if it's space junk,

1012
01:18:10.720 --> 01:18:13.319
then it do seem will be going
in one direction. It won't be

1013
01:18:13.680 --> 01:18:17.600
unless it's falling. You know,
I'm falling. Yeah, Like I said,

1014
01:18:17.640 --> 01:18:21.920
I never I've seen a lot of
satellites that I've never seen. What's

1015
01:18:21.960 --> 01:18:29.039
that Chace jo does maneuver? Not
that we know, I've not not not,

1016
01:18:29.640 --> 01:18:33.720
it's not supposed to. Let's see. Um, well, someone's asking,

1017
01:18:33.800 --> 01:18:41.000
have you ever had any other types
of experiences? Oops? You there?

1018
01:18:42.640 --> 01:18:45.680
Oh it looks like looks like Alfred
has frozen. I'm not really sure

1019
01:18:45.760 --> 01:18:50.520
what happened. Um, let me
take them out bring him back in,

1020
01:18:51.920 --> 01:18:56.880
all right, So I think we
lost our guest here for a moment.

1021
01:18:57.560 --> 01:19:00.680
Um. I'm gonna try to see
if he'll come back. But I right

1022
01:19:00.720 --> 01:19:04.199
now I have to remove him.
And Bill, I'm wondering if you can

1023
01:19:04.239 --> 01:19:08.439
hear me here, if you can
come on the show for a couple of

1024
01:19:08.479 --> 01:19:15.159
minutes and let me see if I
can let's see. I don't know how

1025
01:19:15.199 --> 01:19:20.680
to do that, so hopefully he'll
be coming back in. Uh, he's

1026
01:19:20.720 --> 01:19:26.119
gone. H Bill, are you
able to talk a little bit? Chat

1027
01:19:26.159 --> 01:19:31.119
a little bit? Okay? All
right? I found him, I find

1028
01:19:31.199 --> 01:19:35.159
him fascinating, and just from my
perspective, I believe him to be a

1029
01:19:35.279 --> 01:19:41.079
hundred US an authentic Martin. Yeah. I don't see why I wouldn't be.

1030
01:19:41.119 --> 01:19:45.279
You're right, I mean you can
body language says a lot about a

1031
01:19:45.319 --> 01:19:48.359
person, not just their voke,
you know, speaking, but you can

1032
01:19:48.439 --> 01:19:53.479
tell. I mean, he's very
passionate about what he's discussing. And then

1033
01:19:53.520 --> 01:19:59.600
when he went back and you you
kind of changed the perspective of the question

1034
01:20:00.039 --> 01:20:06.039
end of he still reiterated the same
thing he said earlier. Yeah. Yeah,

1035
01:20:06.359 --> 01:20:13.199
you know, interesting really interesting cases
he was talking about. And I

1036
01:20:13.439 --> 01:20:17.199
wish that people would come forward.
It's too bad that those people that were

1037
01:20:17.239 --> 01:20:20.840
on the ship with him. I
don't know if they're still alive, you

1038
01:20:20.920 --> 01:20:24.359
know, if they're still in service. Maybe that's the reason why they're not

1039
01:20:24.439 --> 01:20:30.119
coming forward, because they're still active
duty. I don't know they would be

1040
01:20:30.239 --> 01:20:34.119
rather quite up there in age,
but this is the Vietnam War era,

1041
01:20:35.039 --> 01:20:39.840
right, But I think it's important
that people like himself come forward, so

1042
01:20:40.000 --> 01:20:45.479
maybe that would encourage others to come
forward as well. That's right, Bill,

1043
01:20:45.520 --> 01:20:48.680
I'm hearing feedback coming through your speakers
when coming back through your MIC.

1044
01:20:48.720 --> 01:20:51.960
I just had to MUTU when I'm
when I'm talking, So I think your

1045
01:20:53.159 --> 01:20:57.279
your speakers are a little bit loud
there or something. So I'm just gonna

1046
01:20:57.800 --> 01:21:01.560
you're using a headset. I don't
know why I'm hearing feedback anyway, here's

1047
01:21:01.600 --> 01:21:06.199
a we're hoping that Alfred comes back
on. It appeared that his internet did

1048
01:21:06.319 --> 01:21:12.520
go out, and there's a question
here, Martin. Did your sighting changed

1049
01:21:12.600 --> 01:21:17.760
direction? Yes, it did.
What happened the UFO setting I had a

1050
01:21:17.840 --> 01:21:19.479
Bill, I'm going to have to
mute you. I don't know why,

1051
01:21:19.560 --> 01:21:25.640
but the UFO setting that I had
in Carmel Valley just drove through there the

1052
01:21:25.720 --> 01:21:32.680
other day was just a craft that
went over in one direction and stopped and

1053
01:21:32.880 --> 01:21:38.039
just stayed, you know. For
me at this point, trying to remember

1054
01:21:38.079 --> 01:21:44.239
exactly how long it stayed stationary.
I'm going to say five seconds maybe,

1055
01:21:44.720 --> 01:21:49.640
and then it went off on a
very straight angle toward Monterey from from the

1056
01:21:49.720 --> 01:21:53.439
direction I was in. So yeah, I mean it changed directions, but

1057
01:21:53.520 --> 01:21:57.239
it was going very slow the whole
time, and I can't judge the height

1058
01:21:57.319 --> 01:22:03.079
of it, so I can't figure
out exactly how how far it was.

1059
01:22:04.399 --> 01:22:08.359
Now, now, do I still
have that echo because I kind of changed

1060
01:22:08.399 --> 01:22:11.119
some settings on my background. Yeah, no, we're all set now,

1061
01:22:11.239 --> 01:22:15.119
thank you. Okay, now what
I saw over my house, and I

1062
01:22:15.199 --> 01:22:18.199
apologize to folks that are watching.
I've had oral surgery, so it's a

1063
01:22:18.239 --> 01:22:23.079
little tough for me to have a
conversation right now. That's why Martin mentioned

1064
01:22:23.119 --> 01:22:27.199
that before he brought me on.
But um, when I captured that over

1065
01:22:27.319 --> 01:22:31.760
my house, it curved down,
curved back up, curved a little to

1066
01:22:31.840 --> 01:22:42.880
the right, stopped gone. I
think that was swamp gas. But I

1067
01:22:43.000 --> 01:22:50.800
mean, I will never say it's
extraterrestrial or intermensional because it's unclear. It

1068
01:22:50.960 --> 01:22:55.760
was way up there. There's no
way to discern what the object was,

1069
01:22:57.199 --> 01:23:00.199
and it could be a drone because
you mentioned something. Remember he mentioned about

1070
01:23:00.319 --> 01:23:06.479
satellites being stationary, yeah, or
going in an orbit, geosynchronous whatever.

1071
01:23:08.600 --> 01:23:12.359
Right now, we know that under
development by the world powers. Let's just

1072
01:23:12.479 --> 01:23:16.720
say with the control hypersonic missiles that
are going on, where they can actually

1073
01:23:16.840 --> 01:23:26.720
control the trajectory of this projectile or
whatever the platform they're using, I would

1074
01:23:26.760 --> 01:23:31.840
not be surprised there's drones that they're
using in space. Also, satellites can

1075
01:23:32.000 --> 01:23:39.800
move. There are killer satellites out
there Martin that they can actually connect and

1076
01:23:40.000 --> 01:23:44.640
throw off other satellites. You could
look it up. They're called killer satellites.

1077
01:23:45.600 --> 01:23:48.840
They can move toward another satellite to
take it out. So just because

1078
01:23:48.960 --> 01:23:55.279
we think that maybe you know satellite
goes in an orbit there, trust me,

1079
01:23:55.399 --> 01:23:58.520
you know they're doing all kinds of
stuff up there that the public isn't

1080
01:23:58.560 --> 01:24:02.039
aware of. That very welcome.
That's kind of scary, it is.

1081
01:24:02.159 --> 01:24:06.720
But I'm just saying, you have
to think about all the possibilities, and

1082
01:24:08.039 --> 01:24:11.439
I think a lot of people that
are watching right now would say we need

1083
01:24:11.520 --> 01:24:18.119
to deal with all the possible rational
explanations before coming to a conclusion where now

1084
01:24:18.520 --> 01:24:26.359
we've eliminated all those possibilities, Now
what is it we know? And that's

1085
01:24:26.399 --> 01:24:30.800
the things that need to be investigated. But with all the stuff that all

1086
01:24:30.840 --> 01:24:33.920
these countries are testing right now,
I mean, I'm just a person that

1087
01:24:34.000 --> 01:24:40.760
believes a lot of the stuff that
we see is natural phenomenon, man made

1088
01:24:40.840 --> 01:24:53.520
phenomenon, and man made in top
secret experimental level craft. That's just my

1089
01:24:53.640 --> 01:25:00.000
opinion. But I'm sure there's a
small percentage that fits onder that category unexplainable,

1090
01:25:02.359 --> 01:25:05.000
that's right. Um, Well,
while we're at this juncture, I'm

1091
01:25:05.000 --> 01:25:09.239
just going to say too, I'm
not getting an email, email, or

1092
01:25:09.279 --> 01:25:15.199
any correspondence from from our guests.
I'm not sure if he's coming back on.

1093
01:25:15.319 --> 01:25:17.079
If he's just you know, his
internet's gone, who knows. I

1094
01:25:17.239 --> 01:25:23.159
had a situation where someone was on
years ago and um that I think their

1095
01:25:23.640 --> 01:25:27.840
house gets struck by lightning or something, and they were they were gone.

1096
01:25:27.920 --> 01:25:30.920
That was definitely a government plan.
I'm sure, Well he was. I'll

1097
01:25:30.960 --> 01:25:33.720
tell you one thing. He is
a fascinating guest. I agree with Pamela

1098
01:25:33.840 --> 01:25:40.039
and Chat and I told you privately
in Chat I find this discussion fascinating.

1099
01:25:40.520 --> 01:25:45.439
Yeah. Yeah, I've always like
and um and by the way, you

1100
01:25:45.520 --> 01:25:49.279
know, I have some recordings already
of people that had a UFO encounter.

1101
01:25:49.319 --> 01:25:54.600
I like to run these during the
breaks if you'd like to, If you'd

1102
01:25:54.640 --> 01:25:57.600
like to email me and tell me
about your UFO encounter, if I think

1103
01:25:57.640 --> 01:26:00.680
we can do a clip about it, I will do that. And my

1104
01:26:00.800 --> 01:26:05.159
email addresses Martin at podcast ufo dot
com. So also, I got to

1105
01:26:05.199 --> 01:26:11.600
say the guests that I was supposed
to have for this coming next week I

1106
01:26:11.680 --> 01:26:15.920
have not heard back from. So
if you are curious what our guests is

1107
01:26:15.960 --> 01:26:17.319
going to be each week, then
all you have to do is go to

1108
01:26:17.439 --> 01:26:23.439
podcast ufo dot com, go over
to the sidebar, and subscribe to our

1109
01:26:23.520 --> 01:26:28.640
weekly newsletter, and then each week
you'll get a link to the blog and

1110
01:26:29.119 --> 01:26:32.800
a link to the guest information.
So I'm not sure Bill, if our

1111
01:26:33.159 --> 01:26:36.560
guest is coming back or not.
Well, if anybody, I mean,

1112
01:26:36.800 --> 01:26:41.000
if you would like to call in, I can jump off and take your

1113
01:26:41.039 --> 01:26:44.880
college. If you have calls from
Martin, hopefully yeah, we can try.

1114
01:26:44.960 --> 01:26:47.720
We can drive his guests will come
back, and if his guest comes

1115
01:26:47.760 --> 01:26:51.920
back, you can ask quick Oops, sorry about that, Bill, that's

1116
01:26:51.960 --> 01:26:56.720
all right, just hearing some echoing
again. All right, So what I'm

1117
01:26:56.760 --> 01:27:00.239
gonna do is I'm gonna put up
here's the phone number for anyone I'd like

1118
01:27:00.359 --> 01:27:04.680
to call in. That number is
eight five five four seven two five four

1119
01:27:04.760 --> 01:27:08.600
eight three if you want to call
in now and talk about, oh,

1120
01:27:08.880 --> 01:27:14.880
basically anything the direction that the UFO
topic seems to be headed in. Some

1121
01:27:15.000 --> 01:27:18.039
people want to talk about disclosure.
I have mixed feelings about that. That

1122
01:27:18.239 --> 01:27:23.399
actual word. I'm not really sure. Hey, now that you say that

1123
01:27:24.319 --> 01:27:29.039
wasn't tonight the night that they had
something at the National Press Club, Yes,

1124
01:27:29.239 --> 01:27:32.279
that's correct, um, Bill Bob
Salas who was on the show a

1125
01:27:32.319 --> 01:27:35.079
while back. It is tonight.
I was trying to find out more information

1126
01:27:35.119 --> 01:27:39.680
about that just before we went on
the air, and it's supposed to be

1127
01:27:39.920 --> 01:27:44.640
he's back in is it? Where
where's the National Tam Washington? Yes?

1128
01:27:44.800 --> 01:27:50.319
I actually may have a link to
the live YouTube stream Peter robbin Yeah,

1129
01:27:50.359 --> 01:27:53.479
I'm gonna send it to you this
way, I'll put it in the private

1130
01:27:53.560 --> 01:28:00.840
chat. But um, Peter Robbins
is the only person there that is technically

1131
01:28:00.000 --> 01:28:06.119
in the field of uphology. But
he sent me a link and I'll try

1132
01:28:06.159 --> 01:28:09.880
to pull it up while we're on
the air, and then you could share

1133
01:28:09.920 --> 01:28:15.119
it to that stream, so that
idea. Yeah, and I think a

1134
01:28:15.159 --> 01:28:20.479
lot of people would find that fascinating
not to watch. Yeah, so I'll

1135
01:28:21.199 --> 01:28:26.439
I'll look it up. I think
I may have it here it is,

1136
01:28:27.880 --> 01:28:30.479
So I'm going to click on the
link myself so I can grab it,

1137
01:28:30.520 --> 01:28:34.680
and I'm gonna mute so we don't
hear it on the air. Oh my

1138
01:28:34.760 --> 01:28:40.279
god, someone says they think I'm
on the wacky weed. Isn't that funny?

1139
01:28:40.800 --> 01:28:43.520
Well, you know, maybe that
would help. I might try that

1140
01:28:44.479 --> 01:28:46.359
next time, but thank you for
that, Larry. All right, there

1141
01:28:46.680 --> 01:28:51.800
is the link. All right,
it was this morning actually, Martin.

1142
01:28:53.600 --> 01:28:58.239
Okay, but you can go there
and watch it, folks, all right,

1143
01:28:58.359 --> 01:29:01.479
I will. Um, let's see. How how can I do.

1144
01:29:01.560 --> 01:29:04.079
I'm going to send it to you
on Skype this way you can no,

1145
01:29:04.319 --> 01:29:08.039
No, that's fine. I have
I have an idea what to do.

1146
01:29:08.199 --> 01:29:12.439
But I okay, but it was
from eight thirty to eleven this morning,

1147
01:29:12.479 --> 01:29:15.000
so it's two and a half hours, and we do well, yeah,

1148
01:29:15.119 --> 01:29:18.680
we do have a caller, so
you can take me off. So I

1149
01:29:18.800 --> 01:29:24.159
do have a caller, yes,
so get me off so I can answer

1150
01:29:24.199 --> 01:29:27.479
the phone. I have a great
night, everybody, all right, but

1151
01:29:27.520 --> 01:29:30.159
I gotta bring you back in when
the caller. Yeah, I'll take myself

1152
01:29:30.199 --> 01:29:33.560
off camera. All right, all
right, so Bill is taking a call.

1153
01:29:33.680 --> 01:29:36.840
We have a caller into the show. Thank you for our patients.

1154
01:29:36.840 --> 01:29:45.880
I'm only can only guess that somehow
our guests tonight boss's internet. That's unfortunate.

1155
01:29:45.159 --> 01:29:49.000
Um, it was a great conversation. I'll keep my eyes up open

1156
01:29:49.079 --> 01:29:55.079
to see if he comes back,
and hopefully he will come back. But

1157
01:29:55.319 --> 01:29:59.640
right now we have someone. Bill
is taking screening the call right now,

1158
01:29:59.720 --> 01:30:02.439
and if you'd like to call in
that number again right up on the screen

1159
01:30:02.520 --> 01:30:09.000
eight five five four seven two five
four eighty three. Was it Harry or

1160
01:30:09.199 --> 01:30:12.319
Larry that said he thought I was
on the wacky Weed? But anyway,

1161
01:30:13.560 --> 01:30:18.640
hopefully it was Larry, And we
have Harry from Louisiana. Welcome to the

1162
01:30:18.680 --> 01:30:28.359
show. You're live on that number
again seven two all right, all right,

1163
01:30:29.039 --> 01:30:30.840
this is what's going to have to
happen. Harry, You're gonna have

1164
01:30:30.960 --> 01:30:36.479
to mute your show. You're watching
the show a live obviously, so Harry,

1165
01:30:36.600 --> 01:30:42.000
mute, mute the show. Please
mute the show. And Bill,

1166
01:30:42.119 --> 01:30:45.239
hopefully you can remember to tell people
to do that. We got a couple

1167
01:30:45.239 --> 01:30:50.000
of calls, but right now we
have Harry. You there, I am

1168
01:30:50.199 --> 01:30:54.560
yes, hi, welcome to the
show. You have a question or you

1169
01:30:54.600 --> 01:31:01.399
want to talk about a topic.
I was interested in the triangle UFOs that

1170
01:31:01.640 --> 01:31:06.159
forced the witnesses to the ground.
I hadn't heard that before, and I'm

1171
01:31:06.359 --> 01:31:15.039
interested in knowing more about that.
Yeah, well I would now Katie in

1172
01:31:15.039 --> 01:31:18.640
Australia as a person, I know
now it was a triangle for her.

1173
01:31:18.760 --> 01:31:25.319
I couldn't get the fact that when
he said this black object, this is

1174
01:31:25.439 --> 01:31:28.479
during the Vietnam War back in nineteen
sixty six, when it flew over the

1175
01:31:28.560 --> 01:31:32.000
people on the ground, it forced
them to the ground. And that's something

1176
01:31:32.920 --> 01:31:35.279
he didn't really stay. You know, hopefully we'll come back on, but

1177
01:31:35.359 --> 01:31:40.159
you didn't really say the shape of
that that craft. However, Katie,

1178
01:31:40.479 --> 01:31:43.880
who will be on the show at
some point, is going to go into

1179
01:31:43.960 --> 01:31:47.560
detail about what she saw over them. So yeah, that that is a

1180
01:31:47.600 --> 01:31:54.239
fascinating story. It is interesting.
I just went out online a few minutes

1181
01:31:54.279 --> 01:32:00.000
ago and was just looking at triangle
UFO stories trying to see something anything I

1182
01:32:00.039 --> 01:32:04.319
could find about that. I just
thought that was an interesting kind of phenomenon

1183
01:32:04.960 --> 01:32:10.119
associated with that. Um, I'm
just you know, just it makes you

1184
01:32:10.199 --> 01:32:15.319
speculate about what could be what,
you know, what kind of propulsion system

1185
01:32:15.399 --> 01:32:20.159
or whatever it could be producing that
that effect. But that's really fascinating.

1186
01:32:20.399 --> 01:32:28.840
Um it almost seems like an anti
gravity or something like that. Well,

1187
01:32:28.920 --> 01:32:31.600
yeah, that's kind of what I
thought, But I don't know that effect

1188
01:32:32.119 --> 01:32:35.119
in other reports. I mean,
I'm I may have heard it and just

1189
01:32:35.239 --> 01:32:39.279
forgot, but it doesn't seem to
be too common, and there have been

1190
01:32:39.319 --> 01:32:45.640
a lot of UFO reports over the
many decades. That would be interesting to

1191
01:32:45.079 --> 01:32:51.960
do a search of sightings or close
up encounters that where people were physically affected

1192
01:32:53.000 --> 01:32:58.439
and may be forced even to the
ground by it. That's yeah, yeah,

1193
01:32:59.640 --> 01:33:02.119
yeah, that's only the second time
that I've ever heard that, and

1194
01:33:02.399 --> 01:33:09.800
so yeah, I think that that
is that is fascinating. And so I'm

1195
01:33:09.840 --> 01:33:13.239
just hearing from my guests now,
just to everyone know, I did hear

1196
01:33:13.319 --> 01:33:15.800
back this, doctor Irena Scott.
She's going to be on next week on

1197
01:33:15.960 --> 01:33:21.880
next week's show. So have you
ever, Harry, have you ever looked

1198
01:33:21.920 --> 01:33:30.239
into Dave Marler's great book on triangle
UFOs. I haven't looked into the I

1199
01:33:30.279 --> 01:33:33.560
haven't seen the book. I was
I think aware that there was a book

1200
01:33:33.920 --> 01:33:41.000
in fact, just just now out
online. I noticed some mention of that.

1201
01:33:41.159 --> 01:33:44.079
I think, so, yeah,
maybe I need to check that out

1202
01:33:44.159 --> 01:33:48.439
and see it's it's wonderful research.
Now. I talked to Dave quite often,

1203
01:33:48.520 --> 01:33:54.479
but that's something I've never remembered to
ask him about about the pressure effect

1204
01:33:54.840 --> 01:33:58.319
if any of these triangle UFOs.
I have his book, I mean I

1205
01:33:58.399 --> 01:34:01.600
could, I suppose I could.
I have a lot of books to read

1206
01:34:01.640 --> 01:34:05.359
through, but that's one of them
that you know from the part that I

1207
01:34:05.479 --> 01:34:09.560
did read, I haven't. I've
read part of it. It's so well

1208
01:34:09.600 --> 01:34:15.800
written and documented and great stuff.
You don't hear a lot of triangle UFOs

1209
01:34:15.600 --> 01:34:20.560
early on, but there are some. There are some encounters that go back,

1210
01:34:20.800 --> 01:34:24.479
but just there's just very few of
them. It seems like it's the

1211
01:34:24.600 --> 01:34:27.520
vehicle of choice these days. I
mean, it seems like there's a lot

1212
01:34:27.600 --> 01:34:34.159
more triangles than others. But we're
stacked if we actually have two more people

1213
01:34:34.199 --> 01:34:39.600
waiting in line, anything out,
kerry, Okay, well, just very

1214
01:34:39.680 --> 01:34:43.399
quickly. For a long time,
I've been wanting to see a panel convened

1215
01:34:45.399 --> 01:34:51.199
to discuss whether or not, you
know, the government might have actually acquired

1216
01:34:51.640 --> 01:34:58.960
technology over the decades that would allow
them to have anti gravity craft. U

1217
01:35:00.279 --> 01:35:03.279
you know, all the money that
goes into black projects, they must have

1218
01:35:04.000 --> 01:35:09.000
explored that. And I'd love to
see a panel of like physicists and aerospace

1219
01:35:09.119 --> 01:35:12.760
people just speculate. Uh. I
mean, there's nothing that I know of

1220
01:35:12.880 --> 01:35:20.000
in the private sector that that indicates
that we humanity has has the that ability

1221
01:35:20.159 --> 01:35:24.039
right now, not in the private
sector. I would just wonder if if

1222
01:35:25.159 --> 01:35:29.319
experts could speculate about whether the government
might have focused enough money to have actually

1223
01:35:29.399 --> 01:35:33.560
produced that kind of thing, because
that would be technology that would maybe explain

1224
01:35:33.600 --> 01:35:39.319
a lot of these things away as
as ours and not from somewhere else.

1225
01:35:40.600 --> 01:35:45.039
I can understand though if they are
trying to keep it secret, because I

1226
01:35:45.119 --> 01:35:48.279
mean, it would be such a
you know, it would be such a

1227
01:35:48.439 --> 01:35:53.399
step ahead of everyone else if we
actually had something like that. I mean,

1228
01:35:53.680 --> 01:35:57.359
and also you can think of all
the uses we could have if we

1229
01:35:57.479 --> 01:36:01.479
actually had that type of thing available
to us. The energy that well,

1230
01:36:01.479 --> 01:36:06.439
I don't know what type of energy
it would takes to create the h you

1231
01:36:06.520 --> 01:36:10.560
know, the any gravity. If
it's not a lot of energy, perhaps

1232
01:36:10.640 --> 01:36:15.239
travel could be completely revolutionary, you
know, in the future. So but

1233
01:36:15.399 --> 01:36:18.199
anyway, we've got four people now
online waiting to talk to you. Thank

1234
01:36:18.199 --> 01:36:20.960
you. Enjoy talking to you.
All right, all right, Harry,

1235
01:36:21.039 --> 01:36:28.159
take care, thank you. All
right. Next we have William from Florida.

1236
01:36:28.680 --> 01:36:31.960
William, you're alive on the air. Hi Martin. Good evening,

1237
01:36:32.359 --> 01:36:40.359
good evening, thanks for calling.
Thank you. Um. I had the

1238
01:36:40.439 --> 01:36:47.760
opportunity to install a security system,
you know, cameras and DVR at my

1239
01:36:47.920 --> 01:36:56.640
house. And next I put a
few pails on the roof and hold the

1240
01:36:56.760 --> 01:37:06.239
screed up. Um what I use? Where more than this visible light?

1241
01:37:06.560 --> 01:37:11.600
I could be infrared and ultra violet. Can I just ask you something?

1242
01:37:14.319 --> 01:37:17.760
Are you on speaker phone? No, I'm not. Let me let me

1243
01:37:17.880 --> 01:37:26.159
check. Okay, answer, good
connection. Well I was fading in and

1244
01:37:26.239 --> 01:37:28.520
out, so I wonder if you
just make sure you can speak into the

1245
01:37:28.560 --> 01:37:32.079
mouthpiece and continue on if you would. Okay, let me get a different

1246
01:37:32.079 --> 01:37:39.199
play of the house. Count.
So it's receptionto little Spotty. Yeah,

1247
01:37:39.880 --> 01:37:43.039
okay, please hear me now.
Yeah, but it is fading in and

1248
01:37:43.119 --> 01:37:48.479
out, so go ahead though,
okay. Um. So what I noticed

1249
01:37:50.000 --> 01:37:58.199
was the DVR has a recording log
and it puts a watermark on a twenty

1250
01:37:58.239 --> 01:38:02.600
four hour type of display. See
you can see whatever motion sensed by any

1251
01:38:02.640 --> 01:38:11.520
of the cameras and what I was
noticing. Occasionally this would happen, maybe

1252
01:38:11.560 --> 01:38:15.800
once a week or so, but
every Sunday I'd sit down, sit in

1253
01:38:15.880 --> 01:38:19.920
my coffee and look at look at
what you know, went through the ardor

1254
01:38:19.960 --> 01:38:25.680
went went over the house, and
many times it was helicopters and planes,

1255
01:38:26.760 --> 01:38:31.720
and so I was seeing these balls
of light going across the sky. Occasionally

1256
01:38:33.840 --> 01:38:36.840
some were closer, some were further
up. Some I saw in a v

1257
01:38:36.960 --> 01:38:45.600
pattern like you were talking about earlier
with the guy from the Vietnam and yeah,

1258
01:38:45.760 --> 01:38:47.399
and so very amazing. So what
I ended up doing was I took

1259
01:38:47.439 --> 01:38:53.720
a satellite dish and hacked it out. I put a high game microphone in

1260
01:38:53.800 --> 01:38:59.159
it instead and aimed it straight up
also, and when I headed hooked to

1261
01:38:59.239 --> 01:39:03.279
the stereo, I could really crank
it up. And these balls of light

1262
01:39:03.359 --> 01:39:13.359
would never make any noise, completely
silent. The planes and helicopters, of

1263
01:39:13.439 --> 01:39:16.479
course made noise. I could even
hear the jetliners that look like a speck

1264
01:39:16.560 --> 01:39:21.600
in the sky going over. And
it was it was good security for the

1265
01:39:21.680 --> 01:39:25.479
house because I could hear everything in
the neighborhood as well, because it would

1266
01:39:25.880 --> 01:39:32.399
pick up anything that was reflected around
the neighborhood. Audiolie. But yeah,

1267
01:39:32.600 --> 01:39:38.479
and so on occasions I had some
of these balls of light that were so

1268
01:39:39.640 --> 01:39:45.000
close to the yard that you could
actually see the heat trail coming off of

1269
01:39:45.039 --> 01:39:50.479
them. And the heat is displayed
at night the image, it makes the

1270
01:39:50.600 --> 01:39:59.399
image white on this type of white
spectrum camera, but on these ones that

1271
01:39:59.479 --> 01:40:03.840
were closed, I could actually see
a heat trail behind it, almost looking

1272
01:40:03.960 --> 01:40:09.760
like you know, a mane of
white hair, you know, with the

1273
01:40:09.840 --> 01:40:15.680
wind blowing, and you could see
this ball just slowly moving across over the

1274
01:40:15.760 --> 01:40:23.079
house. And so my camera system, my DVR, was picking the stuff

1275
01:40:23.159 --> 01:40:27.760
up and putting a watermark on my
recorder. So what I'm basically trying to

1276
01:40:27.800 --> 01:40:31.840
tell everybody is anybody can do this. Yeah, there all the time.

1277
01:40:32.000 --> 01:40:38.199
It's just a matter of looking in
the right spectrums. Usually they're not able

1278
01:40:38.239 --> 01:40:41.640
to be seen with the naked eye, and that's why some people can see

1279
01:40:41.680 --> 01:40:45.239
them at other people can't. Oh, that's interesting. One of the things

1280
01:40:45.279 --> 01:40:48.600
I was going to ask you,
but you kind of answered that. The

1281
01:40:48.760 --> 01:40:54.479
question was that if is there an
airport Nearbying, could these be landing lights?

1282
01:40:54.560 --> 01:40:58.760
But you said you didn't. You
can hear things from the airliners going

1283
01:40:58.880 --> 01:41:02.920
overhead, nothing from these. But
did these things travel on the same the

1284
01:41:03.000 --> 01:41:08.479
same direction every time? No,
no, not at all, all different

1285
01:41:08.520 --> 01:41:13.479
directions. Some I actually saw coming
straight down out of the sky, and

1286
01:41:13.720 --> 01:41:17.399
they appeared to like and large as
they got closer, and then they would

1287
01:41:17.399 --> 01:41:24.760
go back up, really going across
the sky horizontally. There was be vertical.

1288
01:41:26.479 --> 01:41:30.039
So are you saying this is not
it's not in the visible spectrum.

1289
01:41:30.880 --> 01:41:36.680
Many times they're not now and I
have seen a few on occasion with my

1290
01:41:36.800 --> 01:41:43.680
own eyes. But I don't think
that all of these that were going across

1291
01:41:43.760 --> 01:41:48.720
the sky could be seen by the
general public, because I'm certain that I

1292
01:41:48.800 --> 01:41:54.680
would have heard about it from neighbors
and other people. I even had friends

1293
01:41:54.720 --> 01:41:58.000
who would call me occasionally and say, hey, you know, there's something

1294
01:41:58.880 --> 01:42:03.399
coming in your direction, and I
was never able to catch what they saw,

1295
01:42:03.760 --> 01:42:06.560
or if they saw something the night
before, I would go back and

1296
01:42:08.479 --> 01:42:11.840
on the DVR, you know,
and look at it from the night before,

1297
01:42:12.079 --> 01:42:15.720
play playing it back, so I
try to confirm what people saw,

1298
01:42:15.880 --> 01:42:20.680
but never never was able to catch, you know, the same direction.

1299
01:42:21.760 --> 01:42:30.439
So my camras were probably zoomed into
about maybe ten time magnification, so I

1300
01:42:30.640 --> 01:42:35.239
wasn't really heavily zoomed to see something
close up. But yet when when you

1301
01:42:35.319 --> 01:42:40.920
do that, then you lose your
field of view and you don't see as

1302
01:42:41.079 --> 01:42:48.439
much. And so I ended up
with probably two dozen occurrences that I ended

1303
01:42:48.520 --> 01:42:55.039
up saving. And it was always, you know, great entertainment for friends

1304
01:42:55.119 --> 01:42:58.880
that would come over or family.
We would sit there and play this stuff

1305
01:42:58.920 --> 01:43:04.680
back and and everybody was just you
don't found that nobody knew what to really

1306
01:43:04.720 --> 01:43:10.159
say. Well, I'm wondering if
this is if you would be able to

1307
01:43:10.279 --> 01:43:13.680
send me one of those videos,
if you'd be willing to do that.

1308
01:43:15.439 --> 01:43:20.159
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I
do want to do that because there's there's

1309
01:43:20.199 --> 01:43:24.760
people I'm sure that are interests that
are listening to this right now. If

1310
01:43:24.800 --> 01:43:30.720
I would have your permission to just
put it up on YouTube with an unlisted

1311
01:43:30.960 --> 01:43:33.680
and then put the link to it
in the show notes so people that are

1312
01:43:33.720 --> 01:43:39.840
listening to the show only can take
a peek at it, right right,

1313
01:43:40.159 --> 01:43:44.399
right, Well, let's can we
talk later after the call start lighter after

1314
01:43:44.560 --> 01:43:47.520
and what you need to do if
you would, because I have things going

1315
01:43:47.600 --> 01:43:51.399
on this evening's early here in California, where I am, but I need

1316
01:43:51.479 --> 01:43:57.239
you to email me at podcast Martinet
Podcast UFO dot com. But William,

1317
01:43:57.319 --> 01:43:59.880
thank you so much for the call. It's been fascinating. Thank you,

1318
01:44:00.600 --> 01:44:06.600
thank you. And that was Martin
at what podcast UFO dot com got it?

1319
01:44:06.880 --> 01:44:14.000
Thanks man, Okay, William,
thank you. All right. Next,

1320
01:44:14.279 --> 01:44:18.479
we have Stephen calling from Michigan.
Stephen, Welcome to the show.

1321
01:44:21.439 --> 01:44:29.000
Stephen, are you there? Welcome
to the show. All right. So

1322
01:44:29.199 --> 01:44:33.920
let's jump over to Chris from Houston. Chris, are you there? Welcome

1323
01:44:33.960 --> 01:44:39.119
to the show. Hey, Martin, Hey, thanks for having me on.

1324
01:44:39.199 --> 01:44:41.880
I've called him three times now,
I think, and each time it's

1325
01:44:42.199 --> 01:44:45.800
been a pleasure. So thank you
for having me. I had two questions.

1326
01:44:45.920 --> 01:44:51.600
I just finished watching the Skinwalker Ranch
documentary by Jeremy Corbell and with the

1327
01:44:51.680 --> 01:44:58.520
Knids guys out on the ranch,
buck, that's what I thought. I

1328
01:44:58.640 --> 01:45:02.000
was like, I'll roll with it. Thank you. Okay, what's going

1329
01:45:02.039 --> 01:45:11.800
on? All right? Am I
missing something here? I didn't quite catch

1330
01:45:11.880 --> 01:45:17.760
that? Marten? Can you hear
me? I can, yes, Okay,

1331
01:45:17.880 --> 01:45:19.960
I think we got the names mixed
up on the call, but I

1332
01:45:20.000 --> 01:45:25.319
can go ahead with my question.
All right, what's your name? It's

1333
01:45:25.399 --> 01:45:28.560
Steve from Grand Rapids, Michigan.
Yes, I did. I did try

1334
01:45:28.640 --> 01:45:30.840
you, and I guess you weren't
connected at the time. Steve O.

1335
01:45:31.560 --> 01:45:34.960
Welcome to the show. So anyway, move we can move right along.

1336
01:45:35.079 --> 01:45:39.560
Here. Tell me what it is
that happened. Yeah, yeah, So

1337
01:45:40.039 --> 01:45:45.720
I just finished watching these Skinwalker Ranch
documentary by Jeremy Corbell, and it was

1338
01:45:45.840 --> 01:45:49.079
interesting. You know, with the
PhD scientists guys there for over twenty years,

1339
01:45:49.520 --> 01:45:55.119
they kept talking about how the phenomenon
they were trying to capture almost knew

1340
01:45:55.199 --> 01:45:59.119
exactly where like camera positions would be. It would always pop off, just

1341
01:45:59.319 --> 01:46:01.079
like right off of the camera frames, so you can never capture it and

1342
01:46:01.279 --> 01:46:04.199
you can never see it. And
it was interesting. They always said that

1343
01:46:04.439 --> 01:46:08.600
it was it did not want itself
to be revealed. So, you know,

1344
01:46:08.680 --> 01:46:12.960
I watched the New York Times come
out with these these videos from the

1345
01:46:13.479 --> 01:46:15.680
FEDS, and they're I think they're
amazing, but clearly they're not. It's

1346
01:46:15.680 --> 01:46:19.720
not that that golden image that can
convince the world, you know, of

1347
01:46:20.119 --> 01:46:23.840
the reality of the phenomenon, and
we've never had an image like that.

1348
01:46:24.439 --> 01:46:27.960
So I wanted you too, maybe
common and speculate on you know, if

1349
01:46:28.039 --> 01:46:31.159
we ever will get a chance to
see that or if you just I guess

1350
01:46:31.159 --> 01:46:35.720
speculating against or about like when they
appear and when they allow themselves to be

1351
01:46:35.840 --> 01:46:39.680
viewed and if we'll ever see the
full extent. And last quick question,

1352
01:46:39.720 --> 01:46:43.079
Martin, is when I go to
YouTube and you're you're looking for UFO videos,

1353
01:46:43.399 --> 01:46:45.960
I swear the algorithms they don't.
They give you news stories, they

1354
01:46:46.039 --> 01:46:49.319
don't. I know there's more videos
and images out there, and I'm wondering

1355
01:46:49.359 --> 01:46:55.079
if you have any ideas or thoughts
on other platforms or easier ways to access

1356
01:46:55.720 --> 01:46:58.760
the massive amount of the media that
I know is out there. And it

1357
01:46:58.880 --> 01:47:01.199
just feel that it's means surprise.
Thank you, I appreciate it. Uh

1358
01:47:01.279 --> 01:47:05.840
yeah, thank you. You asked
a number of questions there. But get

1359
01:47:06.279 --> 01:47:11.479
as far as the YouTube goes,
I'm not you know, there's some really

1360
01:47:11.520 --> 01:47:15.640
good channels out there. I actually
think that Chris Ledo is doing a very

1361
01:47:15.680 --> 01:47:18.760
good job, but he's doing it
mostly on you know, his experience in

1362
01:47:18.840 --> 01:47:25.680
military experience. John Greenwald has a
great YouTube channel, the Black Vault,

1363
01:47:26.720 --> 01:47:30.600
and there are a number of them. We have a the UFO of the

1364
01:47:30.800 --> 01:47:39.319
Celebrity Review, Lewis yemas um a
fun guy. He is, he's got

1365
01:47:39.359 --> 01:47:41.600
a great show. He's trying to
do some really good work. So,

1366
01:47:41.880 --> 01:47:45.920
yeah, it's hard. It's hard
searching searching a word. You know,

1367
01:47:45.039 --> 01:47:49.600
word search is very difficult because you're
going to come across all kinds of you

1368
01:47:49.680 --> 01:47:54.920
know, bogus things and things like
that. Um, so it's tough.

1369
01:47:55.000 --> 01:47:59.600
You've got to choose your sources carefully
when you're looking into this topic. So

1370
01:48:00.199 --> 01:48:02.039
thank you, thank you for the
call. Sorry couldn't he answer it all

1371
01:48:02.079 --> 01:48:06.560
I'm trying to get some people in
here. And next is actually a friend

1372
01:48:08.159 --> 01:48:12.600
friend of the show as well,
Linda Zimmerman. Linda, welcome to the

1373
01:48:12.680 --> 01:48:16.279
show. Thank you, Martin.
How are you great? I'm so glad

1374
01:48:16.319 --> 01:48:23.720
you called in. How are you
good? You piqued my curiosity when you

1375
01:48:23.760 --> 01:48:29.319
were mentioning the pressure from a UFO. Yeah. I have heard that with

1376
01:48:29.600 --> 01:48:34.520
several witnesses, but the earliest case
I've been able to find was actually Oak

1377
01:48:34.640 --> 01:48:43.000
Park, Illinois in nineteen twenty nine. A fascinating case. A medical student

1378
01:48:43.239 --> 01:48:49.600
was walking home and a forty foot
glowing disc descended to about one hundred foot

1379
01:48:49.680 --> 01:48:56.680
altitude. He felt heat and the
pressure was so strong it literally knocked him

1380
01:48:56.760 --> 01:49:01.159
to his knees, and when it
took off he was able to stand up,

1381
01:49:01.319 --> 01:49:08.039
and he said that distinct odor of
sulfur was in the air, So

1382
01:49:09.520 --> 01:49:14.079
thought you might be interested in this
case. Definitely, there isn't that something

1383
01:49:14.239 --> 01:49:16.520
I never heard of. I don't
know if I've ever heard of any encounter

1384
01:49:16.760 --> 01:49:23.840
ever that there was like a sulfur
smell. That's pretty bizarre, very rare.

1385
01:49:25.720 --> 01:49:28.479
Yeah. Yeah, and the pressure
thing, I mean, we can

1386
01:49:28.560 --> 01:49:34.199
only speculate, but it makes me
wonder what was the effect on other biological

1387
01:49:35.439 --> 01:49:39.800
things in the area, like you
know, I mean, trees, plants,

1388
01:49:41.359 --> 01:49:45.079
dogs, you know, was it
I mean, is there any accounting

1389
01:49:45.159 --> 01:49:48.800
of that? I mean, I'm
sure when you're going all the way back

1390
01:49:48.840 --> 01:49:55.840
to that nineteen twenty nine, I
think that's what you said. Details are

1391
01:49:55.880 --> 01:50:00.199
probably not in there like that,
not that. And plus he was walking

1392
01:50:00.359 --> 01:50:08.600
on Euclid Street in Oak Park,
which probably was more urban I think,

1393
01:50:09.800 --> 01:50:13.800
Um, but yeah, there should
have been trees, but he didn't.

1394
01:50:13.880 --> 01:50:18.119
He didn't say anything about about that. But to me, it sounds that

1395
01:50:18.279 --> 01:50:24.319
there's there's some sort of field this
craft is generating. Perhaps it has to

1396
01:50:24.439 --> 01:50:30.000
do with propulsion or you know,
creating some sort of field in front of

1397
01:50:30.079 --> 01:50:35.760
the craft. To push someone to
the ground, that has to be very

1398
01:50:35.880 --> 01:50:40.880
strong. I would think so.
And it also makes me wonder if there

1399
01:50:41.000 --> 01:50:44.840
was a sound issue, like a
lot of people say that sound you know

1400
01:50:45.039 --> 01:50:54.640
disappears. Um you know initially heard
humming like turbines, he said. Um

1401
01:50:55.159 --> 01:51:00.760
didn't mention any any silence after that, but uh, you know, between

1402
01:51:00.840 --> 01:51:06.000
the pressure, the heat, the
sulfur smell, this this is um.

1403
01:51:06.720 --> 01:51:12.880
This was a remarkable case. Definitely, Linda, thank you so much for

1404
01:51:12.960 --> 01:51:15.800
the call. It's always always great
to talk to you and always nice to

1405
01:51:15.840 --> 01:51:20.119
see you when that happens. So
thank you. Yes, glad to share

1406
01:51:20.239 --> 01:51:26.199
that. So take care, all
right you two bye. Now we have

1407
01:51:26.720 --> 01:51:30.159
just one more call. We only
got a few minutes. Chris waiting patiently

1408
01:51:30.239 --> 01:51:34.960
in Houston, Texas. Chris,
welcome to the show. Hi, Hi

1409
01:51:35.079 --> 01:51:40.079
Martin, Hi Hi Will. Yeah, thank you thanks for being on hold

1410
01:51:40.079 --> 01:51:44.600
all that time. Sorry about that, no problem, No UM, I'm

1411
01:51:44.640 --> 01:51:49.039
not calling with a personal sighting this
time. I'm calling to just mention a

1412
01:51:49.159 --> 01:51:58.560
note about the lights question that keeps
coming up. Why use um UM navigation

1413
01:51:58.680 --> 01:52:03.560
lights on a aircraft? If you
if you're not, there's nothing you don't

1414
01:52:03.560 --> 01:52:09.600
want people to see you. Well, I think one thing that keeps every

1415
01:52:09.640 --> 01:52:14.279
time I hear this, this occurs
to me that if why do we use

1416
01:52:14.600 --> 01:52:17.319
lights on our aircraft? Well,
it's not for aliens to see us,

1417
01:52:17.720 --> 01:52:21.880
it's for other humans to see us. It's for people on the ground to

1418
01:52:21.960 --> 01:52:25.680
see us, and specifically for other
people in the air to see us.

1419
01:52:26.199 --> 01:52:32.359
So doesn't make perfectly good common sense
that if you are a biological organism with

1420
01:52:32.960 --> 01:52:41.119
optical visual systems that operate in what
we share, which is the visible light

1421
01:52:41.199 --> 01:52:45.520
spectrum, that if you have other
craft in the area that you would be

1422
01:52:45.720 --> 01:52:50.880
running lights to for not for anybody
on the ground, not for any of

1423
01:52:50.960 --> 01:52:57.199
the observers or witnesses, but for
your other team members who are also in

1424
01:52:57.279 --> 01:53:00.520
the air with you or on the
ground. I mean a little bit.

1425
01:53:00.640 --> 01:53:02.560
It should be a little bit of
a you know, scary thought. But

1426
01:53:03.199 --> 01:53:09.079
it doesn't make sense, doesn't it
that if if you're if you're if you

1427
01:53:09.159 --> 01:53:14.840
have aircraft that are that are aircraft
based craft, and you operate in a

1428
01:53:15.000 --> 01:53:18.840
visual light spectrum, then it makes
sense to put lights on your aircraft,

1429
01:53:18.960 --> 01:53:21.920
whether you're human non human, wherever
you're from. I mean, yeah,

1430
01:53:23.399 --> 01:53:28.279
and I'm afraid. I'm afraid they
use lights. We're out of a time,

1431
01:53:28.359 --> 01:53:30.640
Chris. I hate to say it, but yeah, that is.

1432
01:53:30.880 --> 01:53:33.560
It's quite hard, you know when
it's also hard not to think in human

1433
01:53:33.680 --> 01:53:39.079
terms. But you did just mentioned
you know, maybe whoever they are needs

1434
01:53:39.119 --> 01:53:42.479
the same thing, and that's a
possibility. I don't really know, but

1435
01:53:42.640 --> 01:53:46.119
I appreciate your your thoughts on that. That was very good. Thanks at

1436
01:53:46.239 --> 01:53:50.199
creatures at the bottom of the ocean
use lights for each other, not for

1437
01:53:50.319 --> 01:53:54.640
us. That's a good point.
All right, take care, Thanks a

1438
01:53:54.680 --> 01:53:57.319
lot, all right, all right, everyone, so thank you so much

1439
01:53:57.399 --> 01:54:00.039
for hanging in with us. That's
too bad we lost our guests. But

1440
01:54:00.479 --> 01:54:02.439
I do want to thank all the
callers that called in and help us go

1441
01:54:02.560 --> 01:54:05.760
through the show. I want to
also thank Bill for helping out. And

1442
01:54:06.039 --> 01:54:10.800
next week we just found out we
have doctor Irena Scott. Should be a

1443
01:54:10.840 --> 01:54:13.960
great show. Thanks so much everyone, and remember to keep your eyes to

1444
01:54:14.039 --> 01:54:14.359
the guy.