Big food and be on with Cliff and Bobo. These guys are your favorites,
so like Shay, subscribe and read it. Timesta Meda watching always keep
it squidgy. And now your hosts Cliff Berkman and James Bobo Fay Cliff Bobo
RD. How are you doing? Just joined the day? Nice? Well,
that's good, that's good. I'm scrambling to get ready for this trip
I'm taking on Sunday. I'll tell you about that a minute. And um
and I got home late last night. It was how big footing last night.
I got home and got to bed around one or one thirty or something
like that. But uh, yeah, it's been a lot of time walking
for very very little no noises or anything like that. Found two maybe prints,
but if they are, if they are indeed prints, they were very
very old and kind of indistinct, but might have been the real deal.
I know other people have been casting footprints in one of these areas kind of
a lot lately, kind of a lot. I'm aware of one, two,
three, four, five at least five footprints cast in this area in
June. So um and I think I think there's a couple. But now,
mind you that's two fines because a lot of times, you know,
like like I've cast I think nine footprints or nine prints in twenty twenty three,
and oh, that's so much. Kind of, it's only three things,
it's only three circumstances, and I've cast multiple prints out of each one,
as any I think good researcher would do. Right. Um, So
the numbers kind of you know, misrepresent the luck of the find but um
of the princes in June, you know, it's there were two some footprints
in one spot. There is a handprint and some finger scrapes, and another
footprint in another spot, and that I believe, I believe, if I
have my story right, that one actually resulted in a sighting. At the
same time, this guy was actually casting one of these I think it was
that one casting a print, and he looked up and he was being watched
by one of these things about sixty seventy yards away. So at a lot
of activity basically in this one spot. It's a new area. We haven't
been there before, in this one spot in June. So we went up
there last night to go walk around. And it's good to get some miles
under my feet anyway, I've been a little lethargic lately, getting over the
COVID thing a few weeks ago and all that sort of stuff. Yeah,
just got that last week and a half. Yeah, man, there rust
it's another resurgence I guess going on because I think two of my friends said
that each one of them knew two people individually that had also caught it.
I got it, and of course if I have it, my wife has
it. And then one of my vendors was telling me he got it too,
like a week after I didn't, and he didn't get it from me.
Of course I wasn't in the shop or anything. But yeah, I
think I guess it's going around again. Oh and you know what, I
think the biggest tragedy of them all. I'm pretty sure Sochi got it.
Really. Oh yeah, they get it. Yeah, dogs can get this.
Apparently it's it's it's easily transferable to dogs, but not cats. But
yeah, so and I was thinking, what's going on with Sochi? She
seemed she's an old dog. Now, you know, I love old dogs.
They're just cool and mellow and stuff. But she seemed particularly old,
and I say, O, wait, man, she's only ten or eleven
she seemed a little bit more lethargic than normal, and then she was doing
this thing she was going, and at first like, oh, that's adorable.
Whatever that is, that's adorable. But then I looked it up and
they said, oh, it means your dog might be in pain or is
sick, and then suddenly became much less adorable. You know, no one
wants us to get a dog in pain, especially one that you love,
right, or any dog, of course, but but you know, so
she's pretty much my everything except for Melissa, right. And then you know,
dogs don't cough real well, right, but they do make that weird
sort of coughing noise they have it sound like the heavy smokers's. Yeah.
Yeah, And you know, and I'm pretty sure Sochi's stopped smoking like last
year, you know, unless she's going out back like hitting a cigarette or
something. I'm pretty sure she's stopped at Habits cartoons. Oh I love them.
Yeah, when nobody's watching. Um. Yeah. So anywayeah, so
anyway, I think she's better now. I mean, Melissa and I were
looking at her today and she's acting much more normal the last couple of days.
But yeah, I think I think my poor dog got it too kind
of sucks. Yeah, of course, then you know, the COVID takes
a toll on the end. Like I still have a little persistent cough,
and I get tired pretty easily in the middle of the day, even though
it's been like a week and a half or something like that, since I
pretty much got over the time period you're supposed to isolate and then wear masks
and all that other junk. But um, I get tired all the time.
But I'm a little worried about it because on Sunday, I'm backpacking Tape
Canyon. Oh that's right, yeah, yeah, Mark, Marcel and I
are going to go spend the night at the cabin site for the ninety ninth
anniversary, which is this coming Monday, July tenth. Yeah, he invited
me to go, but I was just like, dude, unless you bring
a stretcher, Well, the stretcher is not going to help you because I'm
not dragging your ass up and down that you can lay there in the stretcher
until we get back down the hill. Roll down the hill. Oh yeah,
well you can't roll up, so I do the stretcher. Yeah.
So so Monday headed up to the cabin site, gonna spend the night at
the cabin site. Um, I don't think anyone's done that since, you
know, for ninety nine years, you know, and that last time that
somebody tried it ninety nine years ago didn't go that well, they got chased
out of the area. So I'm kind of excited about that. Well.
Mark talks about hearing the vocalizations up there when you cant that one night,
like just booming back and forth, like multiple ridge top locations. Just he
said it was the gnarliest. I think it had impacted it more than seeing
those ones he saw, and I believe more than one occasion, because Mark's
been up there a handful of times over the last ten years. They have
found footprints up in that general area. Yeah, yeah, footprints and vocalizations.
And it's no wonder because you're there, you know, you're you're right
underneath the caldera. You can see up you're it's a spectacular view of the
mountain because you're right there, right there. But the entire rock face is
dotted in little white specks, and when you look closely, those white specks
are actually mountain goats. So the whole place is thick with mountain goats,
no wonder sasquatches are cruising around up there. They're just picking them off and
eating those. Yeah and yeah. And then it turns out in the whole
area there's no water, which is one of the sketchy things about being up
there is there's no waters. You're you're dragging water in essentially, you know.
Um, but there is a spring. And from the place you camp,
where you stage before you go down to the cabin side, and there's
no water to the cabin site either, but where you stage, um,
it's about a half mile three quarter mile walk to the only water side in
the area, the only spring in the entire area. And so I think
the last night, the night after the cabin night, we're gonna probably camp
there off the spring was closer. It was not like a couple hundred yards
or something. It's it's about it's at least half mile. I think,
Oh, I didn't know it is that far. Yeah, it's a kind
of I mean, if I remember right, I haven't been there for nine
years or something or eight years, But if I remember right, it's a
it's a it's a trudge man. Also, Yeah, when talking about going
to the spring, I didn't realize it was such a track. Yeah,
it's not close. It's not close. So I'm bringing you know, I'm
bringing a couple of extranal genes and stuff, and any chance of film filling
up on the way up, I will certainly do it because dehydration is one
of my biggest fears now since I since that battle with kidney stones last year.
It's like, oh, well never, I'll never be dehydrated again if
I can help it. That's what I got for you, man. Yeah,
so big week, that's exciting. Yeah, And I don't know when
this is coming out, of course, but I know that there's a I'm
going to be doing an appearance in a couple of weeks of East Tennessee,
and two weeks after that, I'm going to be down in Hawking Hills for
that that festival in Logan, Man. So there's a lot going on this
summer. Yeah. It should be fun going to uh the Tennessee gig.
Yeah. Yeah, that's always a good, good time and they run a
great event. And you know we're gonna miss you Renee and Mattelby there.
I'll be there in I'll be there in the morning online doing a virtual appearance
for the Bobo lookalike contest. Really, I hope you win. Yeah,
it's gonna be it's early. It's like a noon. H well that is
early. That'll be like, you know, because there's a time change there,
bobs are you're gonna be gonna get up that early and do a nine
am appearance for us. It's gonna be rough because you've done that job.
It's it's crazy. There's a lot of people there and then that's inside the
building and like after the event, you go outside and it's Gatlinburg. Gatlinburg's
insane. Man, It's like Universal Walk and Disneyland and everywhere else. I
don't want to be all wrapped into one, dude. It's it's brutal.
Like we got caught. I think it was a prove it when we got
and it was like an hour and a half, two hours ago, like
a mile oh in a car, yeah, oh yeah, I drove.
I rented a car last time I was there, and I drove out of
that area. It took forever to get out and it wasn't even I mean
compared to the night before. It wasn't even jam packed on the street.
But it's up forever to get out. It was insane, dude, Sundays
even Gatlinburg on Siday heading back towards Knoxville. Oh my god, what that's
like, LA. You may as well live in LA or Seattle or something.
It's nuts, man, It's nuts. But I'm looking forward to it
because once every three or four years, I can handle it. But so
kill I mean, I love the smoke. He's it's such a bitch a
place and the people that are around, and it's a it's a good it's
a good vantage. I was the first headliner that had the first year they
had that, but it was during the peak of COVID. It was not
a very good turnout. Oh really really Yeah, that's unfortunate. Yeah,
but it is a beautiful place and I do like Tennessee an awful lot.
So I'm looking forward to the job. And you know, even though I'm
in a lot of ways, I'm a My introversion presents a lot of challenges
for me. I think we've talked about that on the air here. But
but once every few years doing something like that, yeah, I can handle
it, and then I'll be done and then um, you know, in
a couple more years, I'll go back and do it again after I recoup
you know, yeah, well cool, we should get to the squatchy part.
Yeah yeah, this is a course ore. This isn't a Q and
A. This is our semi occasional topical episodes. Ye a nice topical thing
you want to rub all over your arms and shoulders. Or we take on
topics and things that we find interesting. So because what we how we do
this is, you know, like Bobo and I were avid readers, were
check out the news all the time, and whatever something crosses our desk that
we think is interesting and at least slightly pertinent to our our favorite subject in
the world sasquatch, we send it to Matt Prue at our producer, the
levely and talented Matt Prue, of course, who has a new book out
everybody should good buy. And then he puts all these things together and we
just kind of pick and choose. Hey, here's a news article that we
enjoyed and we think is interesting, and we discuss it for a while.
So it's our topical episode. Welcome to our topical episode. So, Bobo,
do you want to start as our particular news I and they caught your
attention or do you want me to go first? Um, well, I
think I brought it up. Four. I think I brought it up,
but I didn't have The article in front of me was polar bear throwing rocks
and chunks of ice to hunt walruses and seals. And I remember hearing that
and I was like, oh, that had to be a sasquash and they
just mistook it for a squat for a bear, polar bear or whatever.
And then I do also remember my guys telling me both of these were around
here up in Humble area. Guy one guy telling me a bear, a
black bear threw a stump at him, like a chunk of a stump at
him, like picked up to his legs and front reared up on his back
legs and picked up his front legs and like checked it out him like and
he said it went like twelve to fifteen feet in the air, like not
like just you know laterally like it didn't almost hit him or nothing. And
then I knew another guy that said, um, a bear picked up a
big rock and like throw it in his direction. Yeah, yeah, And
you know, um, well, you just straight to the source here.
It's from Smithsonian magazine and the title the articles polar bears take down walruses by
hurling rocks and ice. New research corroborates Inuit knowledge of the animals cleverly using
new tools, and certainly, if polar bears are doing this, other species
of bears are very very very likely doing this as well. And some of
the interesting takeaways for me, at least from this article is that, first
of all, the native people in the area knew they did it. Du
yeah, duh. Exactly. If you want to know what's going on in
the woods, ask a native person. They have tens of thousands of years
of history in that particular area. I spent three months there with my grad
student, you know, like I'll tell you what's up exactly exactly three months
versus ten twenty thirty thousand years. Come on, yeah, yeah, of
course. And of course the woods documented. It was documented in eighteen sixty
five. Some dude, Charles Francis Hall was his name, an Arctic explore
he published an Inuit account. So he published a native account of a polar
bear attacking walruses, and he wrote about it, and he published it and
talking about how he hurled the polar bear hurled a large rock down upon the
wal wrists and basically crushing his skull. So and of course Native people knew
about this, they had seen these things before. So I think there's a
couple of lessons here. Number one, Yeah, native knowledge. Listen,
listen, listen to it. It's important. Um, they generally know what's
up, you know. Um. And on top of that, I've heard
so many big footers, and I believe I've even said it too, that
sasquashes are the only thing out there throwing rocks. And clearly I'm wrong,
and everybody else who said that are also wrong. Well, it depends on
they define well, I mean not define, but it depends. I mean,
they're not throwing them forty yards or forty feet. I mean they're throwing
them kind of down, you know, kind of they need the vertical height
to get, you know, any distance. It seems like, I mean,
when squashes are throwing rocks, I mean they're like a lot of times
they're whizzing by stuff like that. Bears not doing those kind of rock throws,
but like those bigger rock that they can kind of come rolling down it,
like you know, you hear them crashing down a hill. If they
got that could definitely be a bear. Yeah, it seems like most of
the throwing going on with these bears is kind of downwards, like toppling things
off the side of cliffs or whatever and then crushing their prey down below.
These uh you know, twenty thirty fifty mile an hour fastballs coming in,
going through the tree tops and hitting stuff above you. I'm still inclined to
think that those are sasquatches. Oh yeah, undoubtedly. Yeah. So anyway,
ye have two big takeaways. M yeah. Bears they turn out they
throw rocks. Go figure, and by the way, with accuracy. I
thought that was another interesting thing. Here. Let's see, I want I'm
kind of scrolling through the article here. Let me find where it where it
says this. It says the bear mounts the cliff and throws down upon the
animal's head a large rock, cackling the distance and the curve with astonishing accuracy,
and thus crushing the thick, bulletproof skull. All describes and astonishing accuracy.
I love it, And of course, you know, but I don't
know, Maybe I just have different um well, I certainly have different opinions,
and a lot of people or whatever. But the scientists, they said
the most significant part of this is that a bear is able to look at
a situation, think of it in a three dimensional space, and then figure
out what it might have to do to be successful. Really, is that
the most like, I don't know, I think they're underestimating bears. Oh
dude, underestimated everything. Yeah, stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with
Cliff and Bogo will be right back after these messages. Yeah, I mean
scientists and a lot of people in general underestimating animals. Is that chimpanzees can
bind calls to communicate new meaning. I mean that doesn't surprise me at all.
It's like, yeah, I mean, of course they do, Yeah,
of course, of course. And of course this was published on phizz
dot org like pizzas in short for physics dot org. It's a great science
blog and they routinely published a lot of arts that I know that I'm interested
in. And so yeah, again, scientists are underestimating these animals. And
I see this all and such a scientist. By the way. It's just
people underestimating these animals all the time. And that's why I get so perturbed.
My feathers get all a fluff when people say, colo, if you
think these sasquatches are just big dumb apes. Well they're big, and I
think they're apes, but they're not dumb. And it kind of shows how
little people understand, how fantastic and what a high level of cognition these other
are our brethren, these other ape species have. Yeah, they communicate,
Yeah, they're they're basically talking to each other to some degree. And you
know, birds talk to one another, but an entire song will will express
a meaning, you know, and and humans we have things that express meaning
and we can rearrange them. So are our language abilities a little bit different
than theirs because it's a little bit more advanced. But to think that chimpanzees
were not capable of that, I think that's kind of ridiculous, you know.
I mean, chimpanzees are extraordinarily intelligent animals. They're not the smartest of
the apes generally speaking, for problem solving skills. That's that that trophy goes
to the orangutan from an I understand from my reading. But chimpanzees are very
very intelligent, so of course they wouldn't just express a mood or express a
thought. They would probably rearrange it to express higher level, more complex thinking
that they are clearly capable of. Right. Yeah, it's like, well,
as you're talking about not the most intelligent species, what was it?
If you give a gorilla a screwdriver, he'll I forget what it was.
But if you give it chimpanzee a screwdriver, he'll he'll figure out how to
stab you with it. If you give it to an orangutan, he'll figure
out how to escape with it. Oh yeah, Yeah, they don't even
need a screwdrivers. I mean, their hands are so strong they can actually
undo the bolts and whatever in their in their enclosures. They people, or
zookeepers in general, have a very difficult time keeping orangutans in the cage.
Yeah. Yeah, I've seen videos of that. God, I wish I
could remember that saying. Our guests told us that one about the screw drivers.
Yeah, yeah, and gorillas they just kind of like give up on
it. They said, well, who cares man? So I kind of
like that kind of like the gorilla attitude, it's like who cares man?
Yeah? Yeah. But you know, as far as getting back to the
article here about the combination of calls with chimpanzees, how many times, Bobo
have you heard a combination of noises being omitted by a purported sasquatch. Yeah,
several. Well, we'll describe. Tell us, tell them, tell
us what what what you heard? Please? I can't describe the sounds,
but I mean it was like it was definitely put together a different I don't
even know how to explain it. Yeah, because I've only really heard them
do one or two like a rise at whoa, like that kind of stuff,
and with the end going who like that like kind of that warbly thing
that is very often associated with the vocalizations. But I can't think of any
time I've heard them do something like well, I've knocks and whoops. I've
heard those things together, whistles and whoops. Um no, no, I'm
sorry, whistles and knocks. I've heard that as well. But I can't
think of like them going whoa, who whoo or anything like that, like
changing the actual vocalization being exhibited. Um well, I guess uh. One
thing I noticed is at the end of the Ohio house, like the drop
off that weird warbly part at the end. I've noticed that's gonna be different
for sure. I wonder how length of the call, like when they just
go like when they do those like twelve second versus like a five second or
a four second one. Right, Yeah, I've heard a variety of that
sort of thing, but never never a combination of different sounds. Never in
that sort of way, you know, So it makes you wonder well,
Sami chatter, I mean that when I've heard that, that's like a bunch
of different sounds. I mean, yes, I've never heard that, though
I've only heard the recordings and um, and so far that's a sample set
of one. I want to I'd like to hear it from myself or hear
a slew of other recordings, so I can, you know, learn a
little bit more about what might be going on there. Right, It's gonna
be interesting to see AI is in these quantum computers and stuff that put to
this stuff, like what they're going to figure out like with all the analyzation
of all the calls and there should be some good breakthroughs. Well. Yeah,
so this idea of combining meaningful vocalizations, you know, if we do
it, we clearly do it, and chimpanzees do it, and our our
last common ancestors about six million years ago, give or take a little,
give or take a few months, so they did it too, So everything
passed the everywhere in between here and there, they probably did it as well.
They probably did as well, which of course means austral epithescenes and all
of our course i'd be other hominins and all that sort of stuff. But
it makes me kind of wonders since I've never heard sasquatches do it, it
means doesn't mean they don't do it. Of course, some people think that
that these are pretty much silent species, which I think is kind of a
ridiculous statement, knowing what we know about vocalizations at this point. But that's
signorant. Yeah, I would think, Yeah, it seems to be ignoring
a lot of the data, that's for sure. But um, but I
don't know. I'd like to hear a vocalization of multiple sounds multiple Um what
what's the word I'm looking for? Like compositions, I guess, But I'm
not aware of any vocalization recordings of that. But then again, maybe they're
just not trying to express anything with that, or maybe I'm overthinking it,
and that's exactly what the whoops and knocks or the whistles and knocks are I
still I can't wait till we figure out how many knocks means what or if
that's even consistent, right, I mean, the affors doesn't mean anything at
all. It's just like one guy banks three times, a guy banks once
or four times or whatever. It's just being because he's more hyper, he's
got more testosterone, or she's more talkative or you know, quote unquote talkative.
But yeah, it's it's uh, I can't I just can't wait till
we start learning this stuff, you know, instead of just speculating all the
time. Well hopefully we're learning a little bit now, but with you know,
good record taking and all that sort of stuff. So but speaking,
and we've got another another article about underestimating that's the Home of the Lady,
about how they're intelligence. They had a brain one, they're the size of
the of a human like us. But it turns out there are more complex
thinkers than we gave them credit for, like the whole burials and the hashtags
and the symbols. Yeah, of course. And this is from the Rising
Star Cave in South Africa, and this is on ABC News is ABC news
dot co dot com. Article um published in early June about Homo ledi,
of course, which is another human name and not maybe not ancestor, but
human relative. It's a hominin for sure. And these things were kind of
small, and they're very archaic in a lot of ways. They showed a
lot of characteristics of early hominins, but also some things with later hominins.
So there, and of course, um there's a lot of interesting things about
Homo and aldi. First of all, all of the fossils from this one's
species have been found in one place, in one place only. Um,
I think that the Rising Star Cave in South Africa. So and this one
find, of all these different hominin fossils, I believe more than doubled all
of the hominin fossils in the world. So now this one, this one
particular find, gave us more hominin fossils in one find than we had collected
in the previous one hundred and fifty years. Well what really, what's really
amazing about it to me is the scarcity of fossils. Yeah, yeah,
because it turns out there aren't that many fossils. People. I think that
we hear about them so much and we get this idea that we have all
these different fossils and all these different examples of all these different hominins, and
it's just simply is not true. It just simply is not true. We
have barely any you know, of the billions of these different animals that existed,
we have barely any. I was talking about this in the shop the
other day. Is people alcome, there's not more fossils, and you know,
yeah, that whole thing that we get all the time. And I
brought up the idea of Trynosaurus rex um. You know, everybody knows about
t rexes, you know, Jurassic Park and all that jazz. And a
recent study suggested that there were a couple billion of these over time. And
to my knowledge, and I believe I'm correct on this, and if I'm
not, please let me know. I don't mind. I don't mind being
wrong. From what I understand, we have yet to find one complete skeleton.
So all, all of the rearticulated fossil skeletons of Tyrannosaurus rex are composites
of different animals put together. But even though there are billions of these things
over time, we have yet to find one complete fossilized skeleton. And a
lot of that is true of hominins as well. Oh yeah, there's always
bones missing, always bones missing. But back to the Homone Alady things.
There seemed to be deliberate scratch marks on the wall inside this cave system,
and there's triangles, there's hashtag signs. We don't know what the We have
no idea what these carvings with these scratch marks mean, but it seems to
be that these were used by homone Alide for something. So there's some sort
of symbolic thought going on here, some some sort of symbolism, which is
one of the defining characteristics of what humans are about really for the most part,
although that again that that line is very much blurred every time we learned
something new about another one of these animals where they're talking about ravens or other
covids or dolphins or something else that like, oh, yeah they do that
too. Yeah, Yeah, maybe humans aren't this site aren't as special as
we thought. Yeah, they're the first social media presence hashtag in those graves.
Yeah, I guess so, I guess so hashtag and aldia they line
up that, yeah, because those they scratched into the rock surface and they
line up right over the right each one lines up over a grave. Well,
I'm going to read a paragraph out of this real fast. And what
I like about is this. The finding was striking and shocking and erases the
idea of human exceptionalism that humans are different than animals and special due to their
big brains. Home and Aldi had brains about the size of a chimpanzee and
yet practice ritual burials, a behavior previously assumed was only done by humans.
Lee Burger says. Lee Burger is the name of the paleo anthropologist who's in
charge of this entire dig. But again, I don't know. I'm not
sure I totally one percent agree with everything he just said there, because I
think that, yeah, are they actually is this actually examples of ritual burials?
Because they're scratching on a wall. I don't know what we don't know
that. I think it's very possible. I'm not saying it's not, but
I think that perhaps at this point, maybe it's a little early. I
don't know, what do you feel about that, Bobo, A little maybe
a tadbit earlier. Yeah, I mean, I think it's very possible and
a super intriguing idea, But again, it's to say it is that this
is ritual burial as I don't know. Maybe maybe it's like, oh,
dude, there's a dead thing there, let's scratch the wall there because it
stinks. Who knows? So, yeah, exactly, you don't want to
step in that. Man, How often are we going to find another thing
like that to corroborate? You know, like, no, I would love
How about how fantastic would it be to find another cave system or another example,
any other example of homology. Yeah, just if we have something compared
to other case would be we'd get some answers then, And you know,
there's a lot of speculation. He goes on to say they've made they might
have been placing artifacts and graves with the bodies, but no examples have been
found to that. But you know what that does show is that, I
mean, I think it's a pretty safe bet at this point to say that
sasquatch brains proportional to their bodies are are barely larger than chimpanzees. Okay,
they're big animals, and therefore they have big brains, but you know,
whales have real big brains too, and of course whales are real, real
smart. But the larger the animal the larger the brain is going to be.
But that doesn't necessarily equate with higher level thinking or symbolic thought, or
intelligence or problem solving or any of those things, because there's a certain certain
amount of mass in the brain that is required to run a larger body.
It's just a fact. And by looking at the Patterson Giblin film subject and
comparing it to like other skulls, like there's doctor Melton is a great presentation
where he lines up the skull of paranthropist Boiseye and shows that it is exactly
exactly proportional to the Patterson gibling film subject face, like the mouth, the
chin, the nose, the zygomatic arches, everything about it, the orbital's
eye sockets, everything lines up exactly. And I find that to be pretty
pretty and interesting. Um. And also, but you can in that wonderful
composite photograph where the sasquatch in the in the PG film is turning its head,
you can see huge psygomatic arches, a very very flat face, very
very congruent to Um the paranthropist, which I really liked that idea about it.
Um, Clearly the thing doesn't have a huge brain in there. It
does not have a huge brank because most of the head seems to be taken
up by chewing structures. That's what zygomatic arches are, that's what sagittal crests
are. They are anchoring points for muscles. So that that gives us a
little insight into what sasquatches are doing out there. They're chewing on big,
heavy things. They're they're they're eating things that are pretty tough to chew.
In other words, probably bark and the and the Cambian layer trees and you
know, all sorts of things that are just kind of hard to get your
teeth into. You can see that in the PG film. And so there's
not a lot of room left in the cranium for the brain. And also
the way that the face is, as I mentioned, very very flat,
and then the forehead retreats really I think Grover Krantz noted that it retreats at
almost ninety degree angle above the brow ridges. There's not a lot of room
in there for the frontal part of the brain that makes us so human in
so many ways. But that doesn't necessarily mean that they don't have symbolic thought,
or that they aren't strategic thinkers or that they don't see their environment in
a three dimensional actually four dimensional way like planning ahead for example, like these
other animals like chimpanzees and stuff too. I think that it gives us some
indication, but it isn't an end all be all to the thinking capabilities of
sasquatches. Yeah, we don't know. I mean, it's just like an
engine department, dude, you get look at a seabre the way they put
their engine in, or a Porsche or a Chevy. I mean, it's
given you powers. It's getting the job done of the layouts different the physical
lay out, So that's they got something like that, you know. Yeah,
yeah, And I think that's the big takeaway from this particular article about
home on a Lady, is that small brained. Yeah, it's an indicator,
but it's not the end all bell. It doesn't tell us everything we
need to know about him. And again, I think, as you mentioned,
it kind of goes towards underestimating what the other critters are doing than critters,
I mean, any other primate, you know, and it underestimates what
might be going on inside their brain and perhaps maybe maybe a little less underestimating
them and perhaps overestimating ourselves. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff
and Bobo. Will be right back after these messages. But you know,
one final comment on this home and ality thing. Lee Burger, of course
is the anthropologist, a paleo anthropologist in charge of this whole dig, and
hats off to him, hard hats off to him really because he's a spelunker.
Now. He had to lose a lot of way to get into this
cage. Yeah, how's that, man? I mean, that's that for
dedication. I mean you've done that, you know how that's not not easy
to do. Bobs and he's still and he's still, I mean he still
got hurt trying. He forced himself through so so determined tours, wrote in
her cuff and dislocated his shoulder. I couldn't even imagine doing that, dude,
I know, how stressful would that be? Just like I get a
little claustrophobic nowadays, you know, Yeah, as I grow older, certain
fears pop up in me that I didn't exist before. You know, claustrophobia
is one of them. You know, I look back at finding Bigfoot,
climbing all these trees and stuff that you guys had me do. I don't
think I could do that now. Man, this fear of heights things is
kind of taken over too. Dang, I'm a little more cautious. Yeah.
Yeah, Well I've said it before, is I don't know if I
can ever forgive Melissa for giving me a reason to live. Yeah, before
I didn't give a damn you, and I was like, yeah, I'll
do that whatever. It's a cool way to die if I have to go.
You know, it's better than you know, dining hospital with tubes up
there all my orifices if that's the word. I'm not sure what plural of
orifice is, but anyway, Um, but but nowadays, like gosh,
darn it, there's a reason for me to go home. Yeah, I
mean that's a good reason. And sochi, yeah, and sochi and sochi.
But you know, I'm honestly Melissa has taken the number one slot there.
So getting married though, you know, it's one of the I mean
I'm already married. Of course, hobbies doesn't say you are. Yeah,
I gotta do it again, can't can't get married too much? Yeah,
yeah, no, but um, Melissa and I are married, but yeah,
that reminds me, um bobo didn't you almost get married once to some
Tahitian woman? Oh yeah, yeah, we're done Tahiti. Yeah so you
got you did almostly. I've heard stories of this, but I'd like to
hear it straight from your mouth, and I think this is a good opportunity
for a bobo story time. Well, yeah, around it, bobo story
dude, He's see some things, classic everything. He's going a kid yell
for one skin. It's bulbo story. Any description of felonious or criminal activity.
It's being told here strictly for entertainment purposes, and is in no way
admission of guilt or even true for that matter. Yeah, I almost did
get married inadvertently down Tahiti. We were down there in eighty six for the
World Championships. Out your canoes like Polynesian canoes like Hawaii five. Oh and
uh they're like six man candee and six man canoes and we had one man's
and twelve mans like double hold canoes. So we were down there racing.
It was it was rad and uh we were staying there. We had to
staying in a village. We were just staying in empty school because it's so
expensive down there. We just like We're just laying on like little paths and
just you know, just had a sheet because it's so warm, and it
just it was it was chilling. But we lived with the villagers. We
weren't near to the church areas, and uh, every day we'd go down
like we were like celebrities there, our candoes into heat. He's like,
it's like football, basketball, and baseball bicks together here. It's like ninety
plus percent of the population is active, the participating member of a commune club
like the old people like, you know, help it's a big deal.
It's like their whole cultures. How they lived. It was life or death
if you had a canoe or not, you know, to fish and go
island to island and all that. So we're down there and I'd go to
this one, I'd help. I'd help the women pulling the nets. Every
day they'd set up these saying nets. You know, they'd swim out and
then swim around, and we'd all pull them up on the beach. And
they talked to me, and I just laugh and smile, and I don't
know what the hell they were saying, and they didn't know what I was
saying. But we just point and laugh and make you know, hand gestures
or whatever. And they'd always like they'd always like bring this one little chevy
girls. She was like five foot tall and just a little butterball, big
smile, like super friendly. So every day that I was do you know,
for like a couple of weeks, they'd be like, you know,
I'd be talking to and they and they'd bring, you know, always pushed
a little bit in front of like, oh, good morning, how are
you? And I knew how to say that kind of stuff at that point,
and they'd say things to me and ask me questions and I'd go yeah,
yeah, yeah, yeah. Well I didn't find out until later because
we were getting ready we were going to go over to Marea, another island
off Tahiti, and uh, the chief of the village pulled my passport,
wouldn't give it back because apparently I had agreed because when we brought in a
translator. It was actually Marlon Brando's son. Really yeah, he was our
translator, and uh, he came, he came over and he was just
like he just starts laughing and laughing and pointing at me and the points at
the girl and he goes, you're engaged He's like, you've been telling them
all the last couple of weeks you're gonna marry her? Like why I No,
I just been saying good morning and stuff like. He's like, no,
dude, they've been they said, they've gone over the plants multiple times
and you keep it green. I was like, no way. Then the
old ladies talking with mom, and it was the mom and the grandma and
the little girl that's who was there every day. Those three would come up
to me, usually the mom and grandma first one. They'd call the little
girl over and you know, I was just like I wasn't thinking anything like
that. And then I was like what, no, No, I was
just trying to be polite, and he goes, well, you agreed,
like the chiefs holding you to it, you're not leaving. They're not gonna
let you leave. And I was like whoa dude, Like this is not
good. Some of the men came over then her, like grandpa and dad
and novels thinking over and like I was real popular in the in the village,
like they all loved me, but they were all like going, like
you you're not leaving. Then they came up and the grandpa and the dad
and some u thles. They were like, going, well, you like
to surf, you know, because you know they know I served, and
so I was like yeah. So they they said, well, we're gonna
you get five acres because the natives can just go and take empty if there's
some where there's nothing built, they can go and claim five acres and build
a house on it it's there, or build a shack whatever, like a
different homesteading Act sort of thing. Yeah, exactly. And so there's a
spot Hipedia is this left reef break that is like a world class search spots,
one of the famous sport. I mean, everyone knows about Chopu,
but there's another spot on another island that's real popular too. And they're like,
you can have five acres of beach front. And they hid me up
with this half French, half Tahitian guy that had an electric he was an
electrician, he had one of the only electrician businesses into the islands, and
he's all, yeah, he's gonna he agreed to hire you. And I
started thinking like maybe I could get married, you know, un surf.
And I was like, I was it was like having five acres of a
tropical search spot would have been pretty epic. But so then they said,
yeah, well you get to go over to HIPPEDI and you can check it
out. They wanted me to go over there with the family, a couple
of family members, and I was like, man, this is not happening.
So we got done with the racings. The racing season was over,
and so the World Championships was done, and we had we still had like
a I don't know, like a week to go or something. So we're
just like, oh, let's let's go out to Moray, you know,
and take the ferry over there, and and everyone else flew over there.
But then I wasn't allowed to leave. I didn't have my passport. So
I ended up talking to some guys, got a chipped on the on the
freighter that brings supplies because we were dialed in with the locals like dude,
we were like dude, we were like rock stars down there to them.
So we ended up going there that we sneak in a club mad like the
the guys that all the security, local guys like knew who we were,
say this let was sneaking a clubbed and like he didn't need any didn't even
just eat and drink and so we're just partying it up. So we were
just trying to find like single girls that we could look up with it we'd
have a place to stay. And so I ended up eating these girls from
Missouri. Their their family on the biggest bank in private bank in Missouri or
whatever the like the three states around there or whatever. And so they had
tons of money and they had like a big suitets and so being there's two
sisters that me and my buddy crash over there, and then they gave us
like a bunch of their points like drink ticket stuff like whatever, like to
get these shells or beads whatever, these beads, and so we were we
were just like partying down and then they had an arm wrestling and beer drinking
contents like slam beer and then do an arm wrestle and well that has Bobo
written all over it right there. Yeah, we were just uh in there
and uh being another guy Kevin accidentally like injured the guys that we were we
were going against. And uh, this one dude, he was he was
totally buffed and he was like a he was an Asian guy. He was
he was Philippino. I remember his mom was Filippino was Dad was English.
He was real tall, but he had like real thin bone structure like,
and he was so buff. He built up way too much muscless. What
the doctor said later, it was he built up way too much muscle for
his skeletal frame. He was just he was. He was. He was
a paddler with us, and so like they said, go, he went
full bore. And there was two teams racing and his arm, dude,
like it sounded like a gunshot went off. I just froze. It's it's
just it was just crack it saw like a thirty odd six. And he
faced he was dark. He was a real dark skinned like you know,
he was real tan, dark skin. And he literally was the first time
I seen someone turned white like that, like just turned like all of like,
just like a second, his face turned white. He lets out this
horrific scream and all of a sudden, his arm like let go his arm.
It h what had happened was the bone, so the humorous was snapped
in half and well it was snapped cleaned through in two different spots. Then
his muscles just flung his arm up like behind his twisted up behind his back
and his hand slapped him in the back of his the back of his hand
slapped back of his head, and then he just fainted and dropped. But
the other guy that got hurt wasn't with us, like he wasn't one of
us, and his elbow snapped. Where you get Tommy John surgery that uh,
you snapped the elbow tendon ligament. That guy's arm snapped too, And
then so they were like, oh, so they grabbed me and the other
guy that we're arm wrestling, and they brought us into the offices to fill
out pit work for the insurance, like okay, who are you guys?
What room are you in it? We were like giving fake answers like what
and then they started realizing we weren't from there, and they called it They
had some French guys like security working inside, like they were the Tahitian guys
that there was. There was a few French the French owned clubbed, so
it was like guys from France that spoke French. They were they all speak
French there. But so they were like they put us under arrest and put
us in this room and then they locked it all up and it was like
a really nice room. It was like a plantation was like plantation style,
and it was just this beautiful, like well decorated room, like nice hardwood,
like teak furniture and wow. So even even the jail club med is
nice. It was it was the it was the it was the manager's office
or whoever it was, like the head person of the whole place's office.
They brought us in there because we were filling out they wanted us to.
It was like a midnight or one in the morning, so it was they
locked us in. And part of the locking thing was like they had those
storm shutter windows. You don't, like those hurricane shutters or storm shutters,
yeah, fuller, So like they just had like a little lock on them.
So we just went up and broke it down and jumped out the windows
and so we escaped. We were like wanted, we were like they were
looking for us. So the locals helped us get off the island, just
took the barge back. That took a little little mission, and so then
I had to go back and then I was trying to get my passport to
get out of there. So we went back and then we ended up.
Jack can't remember exactly how I got my pack, I got my passport back.
Oh yeah, I agreed to marry her, but I was gonna go
home and get more money and bring my parents back in flatbacks. I left
like I couldn't go back, but I could go back. Now it's been
like thirty years whatever, but almost forty Jesus thirty seven years. So anyways,
yeah, so I agreed to all this stuff, and they were like
they had a party for me before I left, you know, like cooked
up a pig and all this, and so I was he said, yeah,
I will be back. I can't wait to be part of the family.
My parents are gonna love all of you. And I'm gonna go back
and get go to the bank and get more money and come back. And
so I left, and then I actually had some mail corresponse, like they
had like someone right for him, like translate it. It's like where are
you? You know, you promised us and you know, guilt tripped me.
And then they were like send me that kind of threatening letters and if
I ever come back, they're gonna take care of me in a not a
good way. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo.
We'll be right back. After these messages, you ended up not marrying this
woman. I wonder where she is now. You get tired. Moulton supposed
she kept in touch. Yeah. Then so when I got I finally got
my passport and I barely made it for our flight because we had a chartered
plane. Well, because we didn't drink dude from January first until the Championships
at the end of July, like we weren't. We couldn't have one beer
the whole time. So we we did do the whole Nationals, like the
whole team, the US guys, we none of us drank a beer the
whole time. So when we got done with the racing, we just started
partying like hard. So on the way back, we had a chartered seven
forty seven and I was I was getting pretty met. Another guy went up
and still the well, we we charted the back half of the plane.
The front half was like normal people, like regular people, and like the
first class. I went to first class dude and just grabbed the cart and
just ran back when it rolled it back, running back into the into the
coach section where we were just started. I just started throwing handfuls of mini
bottles to everybody. And throwing out beers and you know, caused a full
scene. And then then I started a dogpile, jumping on this one guy,
like going dogpile, and like I ended up breaking three seats in a
row. Probably couldn't get away with that nowadays, no, dude. Then
they ended up they ended up taking me and they were gonna they were gonna
divert the plane to Hawaiian and Hawaiian have me and like about five or six
other guys arrested. And uh yeah, we were we were housed, man,
We were just three sheets to the wind. And then so they ended
up putting those jump seats at the steartus to sit in looking backwards. They
strapped me into one of those and put on some little cheesy hand like cinch
tie thing, and I had to sit and if I got out of out
of my seat, I was they were going to divert the plane and have
me arrested in Hawaii. So I had to sit there and like everyone's throwing
stuff at me the whole time and heckling me, and he deserved it.
Oh, I totally did remind me to go in front of you in line
if we ever got through customs together. Again. Do you remember coming out
of China, mouney Maker. That was he throws his carry on case up
there and it's just filled like night vision thermal imagers. Oh that was in
Dubai. Man, it was both. It was China and it was China
and Dubai. I just remember like in Dubai where they pulled him over,
so to speak, and we're upset about all the technology he had and and
then you thought it was a good idea to snap a picture and the flash
went off. Yeah, oh man, that was that was kind of scary.
Man, they got they got chapped. The China part was that took
way longer. That was like a thirty five forty five minute They hit mouney
Maker through that one, and he kept going like I had a television star,
an international telenosion started like what He's like, I looked for year in
big but Yeddie. And then they're like because they didn't really speak English,
those guys they're like soldiers or whatever, like and I you're they're trying to
explain, like I'm just watching them trying to explain, like you know it
it's all fresh people thinking the talks like that was just one of the funniest
things. We had trouble getting the batteries out, the lithium batteries for the
cameras, so Adam Vosky almost had to stay in China with those because they're
so expensive, and that that we had our time getting them out, even
though we got them in UM. But that was a complication. And then
of course you and I thought it was a good we were flying first class
and I wasn't used to first class. I still am not, but we've
got to fly first class over there, which is cool. But part of
the deal with first classes at these lounges you can go into and there's free
food, and there's free drinks, and there's places you can shower. I
mean, there's private there's there's it's weird, you know, it's how the
other half lives. But you and I went in the lounge and we're thinking,
oh, or our poor producer friends have to fly code for all the
way back. So we just thought we thought it was a good idea to
put a bunch of free beer in our backpacks UM, and we're going to
distribute them amongst the production so they didn't have to pay for a couple of
beers. On the way back since we got all this this free beer and
then you and I had backpacks just full of beer cans, and of course
they decided to search us on the on the way back in the plane,
and they were just bummed and disappointed. I mean, the I don't know
what the Chinese equivalent of TSA is, but they looked at us in a
very disapproving manner um. And I know in my backpack I had thirteen beers.
Yeah, yeah, so that they weren't very happy with us leaving China.
They're probably happy that we're leaving, but it was a little sketchy man
because they could pull you over and keep you for practically nothing there. Yeah,
it was they, you know, like like Discovery. They laded to
me like five times before, like the week before we left, Like I
got calls from like Keith and Margie and whoever else, like the leg like
us, like legal department going like Bubba, you have to keep it,
like you they are so worried about getting like doing something like get thrown in
jail down there. They just kept warning like we don't have the pull down
it like we do other places. You are on your own. If you
get busted or something we can't get. Yeah, and we got what we
got there. You could you could tell that was the case. That was
the case once we got there. Yeah, we always had those people with
us and stuff. They were clearly like FEDS, you know, like Chinese
federal agents of some sort, keeping an eye on what we're doing and all
that sort of stuff. It's kind of weird such such levels of paranoia for
such a harmless thing like a big Foot TV show. Right, well,
Bob, that's quite a story. I'm a little sad that you didn't get
married. You narrowly escaped that one. But how would your life be different?
Man? You'd be living into some beachfront, probably with a woman you
had fallen in love with over the years, surfing a lot, fifteen kids,
dying of skin cancer. Yeah, dude, I almost died down into
heati on our races. Just one race. One of the races we did
was you start off at Poppy Edit, the big harbor on Tahita, the
main island. Then you cross the channel. It's like I think it was
like seventeen miles or fifteen miles or something. Then you cross the channel to
morea circle. The whole island of Morea and then back across the channel.
Think it was like sixty something miles and we were about halfway into it.
And it's called a nine man raus. It's six minutes through the boat at
once. And then you have escort boats, so they go in front of
you escort boat, and then three guys will jump in the water and they
space themselves up in a road line up straight, and then you pull up
the canoe. As you pull next to him, you drop your paddle in
the canoe and you roll out the other side so they can climb in.
They can climb a board. We had spray skirts like a like a you
know, like a kayaks. They put that like fabric over the openings.
Then it since it's running the ways, there's no water getting in the kayak.
Okay, yeah, we had those in the canoe. So there was
like six six openings with like a draw stream with an elastic chord, and
we were on the we were uh yeah, I think we're at Captain Cook
Bay actually um off Marea, and it's real tricky. We were trying to
kind of inside the course and we ended up hitting the reef and splitting a
big hole in the canoe bottom and we uh started sinking and my coach said,
I said, I felt I felt good. So I wasn't getting out.
I was like, I'm staying in, Like I could pal it for
a long time. I could. I could, you know, do thirty
miles or or whatever. No problem. So I was like, I'm just
gonna tie myself into the get this sat skate spray skirt on tight so there's
not water, because we were having tons of it was rough. There's a
lot of water coming over the boat. So I sitched it up. Really,
I sitched it up tight, and I was strapped into the boat and
I couldn't get out. And then we hit that reef and then we just
started sinking fast and we were people are trying to bail and like within real
fast, I mean like ten seconds, we were underwater and we landed on
the reef and my head was about two feet of the surface, three people
the surface at the most. Like my hand I could tep, my fingertips
could break the water, but I was tied in with these knot like and
I nodded that spray skirt around me. I couldn't get out. I was
tied in and I didn't get that good of a breath before I went under.
As you were sitting locked in the locked in the boat, like just
sitting there and looking down. There's all these black tip resharts all over us,
like all around us, like hundreds of them. But they're they're not
that bad. But um, I just remember like fumbling and fumbling. Couldn't
get it. Couldn't get it because I achieve my figuring nats I didn't have
figured nats were untied the thing as you were like just calmly like going,
I'm gonna die if I'm gonna start swallowing water right now if I don't just
calm down and do this properly. So I did. I slowed down and
just untied it and got to the surface just just as I was starting to
swallow water like breathe water. So it's kind of a kind of sketchy,
as like they they they're trying to get a knife off the escort boat.
The escort boat couldn't get close to us though because of the the reefs.
So it's like like there's nothing anyone can do. It sounds like you shouldn't
go to Tahiti anymore. Having them back, Yeah, I can see why,
man, I'm good back. The place was awesome, so beautiful.
It's like if you go like the best like tropical fish tank you've ever seen.
There's millions of those fish and they're giant. They're like like waving you've
ever seen in captivity, Like they're everywhere. It's so awesome, sounds like
a wonderful place. End up almost dying and getting married and all sorts of
other things. Accidentally getting married. Yeah, nothing wrong with getting married,
of course, but accidentally I don't know, man, agreeing to get married,
not knowing you're agreeing. Well, you know, Bobo, we've already
gone over time. We barely touched any of the topics, unfortunately, but
we do have a members episode we're going to record right now for you know,
just of our just our members. And of course, if if you're
interested in becoming a member of big Foot and Beyond and being part of our
Beyond big Foot and Beyond team, discord the website or clicked the show links
down below and follow the membership sort of things, and it's basically a little
bit of it's a subscription sort of thing, and you get an extra forty
five minutes or an hour of Cliff and Bobo every single week, just in
case you can't get enough of us. I don't know, a lot of
people seem to enjoy it. I get a lot of good feedback. We
really, really, deeper, deeply appreciate everybody who support us like that as
well. By the way, so thank you very much for out there listening
and for our members. Yeah, I guess people really liked my last Bobo
storytime on the Patreon pays the Flying Incident. I guess people love that one.
Well. Yeah, I mean there's certain Bobo story times that are suitable
for the regular episode and certain other Bobo story times that are only suitable for
our members who definitely, definitely, definitely want to be there. And so
yeah, I've gotten all sorts of comments and emails about that particular event clash.
I'm not sure what to call it except for an amazing Bobo story time,
but anyway, Yeah, so if you're interested in checking that out,
just follow the show notes below there's going to be linked down there, or
go to the website Bigfoot Beyond podcast dot com and then follow the links to
the membership section. And that's what Bob and I are gonna go do.
Right now, So Bob's why don't you sign us off and we'll jump onto
the members episode. All right, follow sent for joinas again. Sorry to
get too much Bigfoot related stuff go on this one, but next week,
next week. But until next week, y'all keep it squatchy. Thanks for
listening to this week's episode of Bigfoot and Beyond. If you liked what you
heard, please rate and review us on iTunes, subscribe to Bigfoot and Beyond
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