What is up, fellow thermonuclear affors. I end Dant Valley, coming at you with my certified fantabulus co host, mister Grant Hughes. We have loads to get to today. We're gonna talk NBA Finals between the MAVs and the Boston Celtics. It's here, it's coming on Thursday. You're probably listening to this on a Tuesday. We're gonna get to the Timberwolves post mortem basically about their future. And then I say, we have lots to get to, but that's pretty much it, and then we'll go into some fun stat padding stuff. But Grant first and foremost before we get off to the races, how the heck are you doing? I'm doing very well. Thanks for asking how are you doing? I'm all right, all right looking at you asking how I'm doing. I'm a big tacul I'm caffeinating at the moment at ten thirty pm Eastern time, but I already made the thumbnail for this podcast. But like, that's how on top of my ship. I am right. I want to go to bed before four in the morning. Uh so I have the thumbnail locked and loaded. I just hope that we talk about everyone who's in the thumbnail. I think we will, well, we will have to just readdress that like halfway through and make sure we don't need to mention you guys image Luka Johnsons once fuck Uh, I rest assured looking at my notes, I'm gonna we may mention him. Uh. We should start there though, with the NBA Finals, right, I feel like that's a pretty big deal. No, yeah, can I ask can I start it by asking you a question? No, We're gonna try it. That was a question. So I guess we're done. So just this is this is the way to me, This is the way into the series. However long or short we want to go on this ideally pretty short because you know, well this will all be stale after game one. This is the most time we've had to record before a series of I know, I know, it feels bizarre that it's like, hey, this might actually hold up for thirty six hours before it's useless. Uh. Who is this series about? Like? What to you? You know, exclude Like, if you're in Boston, it's about one thing, if you're in Dallas it's in it's about another. But if you are just an NBA fan or or impartial in any way like who or what? You could say, it's a what is the series about? Man? I don't know if I've given that enough thought. I normally gravitate towards which, like which team not has more at stake? But what does the series, regardless of outcome, become more about. I think we end up talking more about the Mavericks, just because if the Celtics lose, it'll be def Con one, because it's championship or bus which I don't love painting it in those terms. In general for them, them not making it out of the East would have been a disaster. They did it, they lost twice. That's like any anyone who wants them to do something nuclear because they if they lose in the finals, would be mistaken up to put it kindly, and I think with the Mavericks, what's interesting is so either you lose and you were still ahead of schedule relative to your roster, and that includes what you did at the deadline. Know what everyone could and they have. They've called you and I out for what we wrote and said about them. We've welcomed it. We were wrong. If you want to continue to do that, I want you to show me where you said with actual reason that the Mavericks were going to go to the NBA Finals after the trade deadline. So even if they lose their ahead of schedule, but if they win, it's kind of just like, don't you think that there'll be more ramifications or ripple effects throughout the entire league. You start talking about where Luka Dancic's ranks among kind of all time greats, he'll enter that, he'll get that bump where it's, oh, he did this. We already know he was a postseason killer, but he did this, so he just might be right at the top of the MVP discussion next year by default. Then sort of the other thing is you look at the way they built their roster and the type of talent they have in the front court. Do we see teams try to mirror image that? And then the bigger thing to me would be, this is a team that overturned a good or turned over a good amount of its road. Like we're talking about they acquired what would you say, two of their top six players at the trade deadline, at least two of their top seven, and drafted one of the other ones just you know a year ago, right, do we see teams want to take more chances in the draft and actually play these guys when they're supposed to be good, or even more importantly, do we see teams kind of have this renewed utility in the trade deadline? Because where I think it's been for a few years and it makes sense, is that these massive moves, for the most part, they will happen early in this season because there's a trade demand or a team like the Raptors finally gets clarity and it's like, okay, we'll trade Pascal siakam well and oh Jianna will be fairly well before the trade deadline, or it's all about like sort of futzing and fiddling and finishing touches and odds and ends at the trade deadline, like that's what the actual good teams seem to be looking for. Like the Sizic moves tend to happen over the offseason and the Maps did something in between, and so does that kind of reinforce the importance or the again, the utility of making moves the trade deadline. So I feel like this series winds up being more about the Mavericks in some what was your were you thinking something you know you well, it's it's I kind of it's easy to look at the Celtics first, and the championship or bustness of it all is definitely like what you'll hear a lot of talk about, especially say they lose Game one or something, and then it's just like you start having to think about the referendums on Tatum and on the team itself, and like, well if it's not good enough now, like it's already getting crazy expense all this stuff, like that's all there for sure, and well that's part of it. And if you're in Boston, that's why I tried to, like, you know, create the impartial perspective, like if you're in Boston, that's all your you know, that's all you're thinking about. You don't care about what I think and what you've mentioned. This series is really about. It's just narratively like this is the Luka Doncic moment, like or the first opportunity we've had. He's had to really do all the things you mentioned, And in my notes I have the exact things like this, if they win this title against this Boston team, which like spare me the easy road stuff, they won sixty four games. They were plus double digits net rating during the year, like and not only you know, yeah they didn't. They got lucky in terms of the injuries of the teams they face, but like they killed those two you know they they they ran rough shot into the finals. It was easy. I don't care. This is still like a great team just based on the numbers. So if Luca beats this team will immediately start talking about like it's Yo is it yokich or Luca? Like those are it will those will be the arguments we have of like who's the best player alive And a lot of people are gonna say Luca because a recency bias and because of like he's just kind of different. It's there's a I don't know, there's something about him that maybe it's because he's not a big and he like kind of scratches the itch that we're all much more comfortable with of like a wing or a guard being the most dominant player center is weird to us. So no, I think it's Luca and just sort of like, you know, I know this isn't what we tend to traffick in, but like the legacy defining like legacy starting moment, it's it's whatever Jordan's first title, you know, you know what, whatever you want to how nuts you want to go, Like that's this kind of stuff we'll have to talk about. And then within that, like I think narratively it's about Luca, but also tactically this whole series is about Luca, like from both sides of just like what's Boston that's kind of we won't go too deep, but like that's what I'm most interested to talk about, is like what's Boston do? Like what what are what should it try? What has it? You know? I have some numbers that I think are pretty interesting, but like everything circles back to Luca for me. And you know, maybe that's just like the well we focus on stars and that's how it works. But I just I think that really is where the meat of the series is. You know, I don't know, tell me if I'm wrong, but I think you're I agree with you. I actually like to get into that to like kind of start talking about the actual BASKETBALLTI. But I want to ask you really quickly, and this is not something we normally traffic in, but because we're on the subject matter of it, traffic in it what who does an NBA Finals victory do more for Luca or Tatum? Okay, that's a great question, and this is why I preface it with like, well, well what about Boston. I think it does more for Tatum than it does for Luca, because I think people will assume Luca will just be back. Tatum has already been here once and been in late series several times. I think for him, well, interestingly, if Tatum, unless Tatum just crushes it, but even then we won't start next year thinking like, is Tatum the best player in the world or is Nicola jokicch Like that's not gonna happen. I do think it just like it ticks a box for him that a lot has bothered a lot of people, that it's been unticked to this point, which is ridiculous because as you know, he's nineteen. But for Luca, I think it's like, no one's gonna view this as like people will view this as the first of many opportunities. I don't know if Tatum gets that same grace, just because he's won so much already. You're acting like you think it's Luca that it does more for, right, and it's just well, I mean Tatum is we make the joke about him being nineteen, but are we So we're just gonna assume that Luca is gonna be back while playing in the more difficult conference and basically being the same age iven Tatum's now twenty six, And I just think I have less faith. I think that So this is where we diverge the most, is I have less faith in people ticking those boxes that you say are unticked right now. If Tatum wins, I think they're gonna look at it and say, Boston built one of the most dominant cores one through six that we've seen in I mean, like this is the level of town is different at the top, Like one's the last team that looked this good one through six? I guess you could say it was last year's Denver now kits if you want, Like that's okay, great. And so also the thing with that it does more for Luca is it cements his status in a conversation that you to which you already said, Jason Tatum does not belong right. And so to elevate yourself to all of a sudden go from you know, maybe we'll talk about Tatum. I doubt it'll be this, but is he the best? Words? Kind of like, oh, you're not good enough to be the best player in the NBA, but are you the best two way player? You don't get like that at a boy type thing. With Luca you already mentioned it, it's oh, it becomes Luca versus Yo kitchen. Not a discussion that I want to have at this moment. You could get into who's I honestly think it's a discussion as to who's more valuable on offense when you're looking at the way teams game plan around. But with all that said, I think you also look at it. And the bigger thing for me is I keep putting back to Boston. Was supposed to be here, not just because people were saying championship or bust, but because of the things I just mentioned of how just good they are one through six, And then with the Mavericks, when is who would be not that the Mavericks were bad, Like who is the last team that you can say won a title and was so unexpected to win a title? Was it? The I know it changed as the season went on, and with Dallas it's kind of different because, like I don't think anyone was picking them leading them into the season, and I think even fewer people would have picked them around the trade deadline, Like is it the twenty fifteen Warriors. I mean, well, they're so different than Dallas though, because they were just crushing everybody from the jump, you know. But it's like coming into this and no one was like this team is going to become x. I guess you could say the twenty nineteen Raptors. That's the first one that came back to mind, right. I think that's just because of the Mids, like the Gasol shows up and and like who else I forget just the the before the season. Yeah, yeah, right, that's a good Yeah. The Irving trade was all the time. He's not the same as the Kauhi one, but it's like kind of new guy, you know, let's see how it goes. That. I think that's pretty close. But but even then, I mean, but it's it's even that this is I think that's a great point, Like if the MAVs, this MAPS team is really unusual for a lot of reasons because it's not like if if Luca is in the Kawhi role, like Kawhi already had a Finals MVP, like he it's not you know, he right, right, he's not. It's not like he was proving. I think people viewed Kawhi differently after that title, because then then he really had the clamps on, like the two best, two way guy thing and like the you know, who's actually the best player? Like he was real, he was that guy for a minute, but he was a little more established in terms of like big stage winning. But yeah, I think it's I think it's probably that there's probably someone screaming at us right now that we're missing an obvious one. No. Twenty nineteen was pretty recent, Like it's not, Yeah, would you say the Warriors winning in twenty twenty two, It's like, no, come on, Like that's a little different. But but I mean that was pretty unexpected. I mean they expected it, I think, but like I don't think anybody else really did until it was like, until it was almost done, it was like, this is really gonna happen. You know, that was a hard one to foresee. I think, Yeah, I guess what I mean about saying it changes more for Tatum. It has more to do with like I think now I'm more convinced that Luca it just is the guy, and like it's almost like, well, if it doesn't prove something about him now, he just feels like one of this could be prisoner of the moment stuff. Definitely subject to that see the our Nuggets and Wolves evaluations throughout the postseason. But like, I just think he's gonna get He's gonna get there, you know at some point, like Luca's gonna end up, you know, regarded as whatever, you know, the best of this generation or something close to it. And like whether he wins this title or not, because I think he'll get another one or the numbers will be so undeniable, but Tatum, it's kind of like getting a title at least like that. Even so when you're saying, yeah, I mean, you know he's he's not a top five guy like or whatever, but but then you have to go, but he was final with MVP for one of the best teams we've ever seen. Like that, you know, it'll it'll give you a butt for Tatum. There's also even though the Mavericks are here, there is an element of combustibility to this because I'm just don't have fait that because it's the West, this doesn't really as much do with the Mavericks is the fact that the West is just fucking wild. I don't think they can guarantee they'll be back here. No, no, no. If you lose, you get into when you're talking about Luca's next contract. I'm not framing this as Luca's gonna leave. I think that the Maps have bought plenty of goodwill, and even if things don't go according to plan next season, should they lose here, I think they've built up enough goodwill with him. It seems the vibes are so good right now. I just less is guaranteed to me in the West, and I don't see I know the Celtics they have the second Apron stuff, but I just feel like Boston long term is less combustible, regardless of what the end result here is than Dallas was being. That's why I would say I think it does more for Luca and the Mavericks organization at large, too, just I think it buys them a level of stability. I'm not just talking for the next two years or maybe like the next five to seven that they're not gonna get if they lose. Yeah, all right, let's do you want to talk just like loosely about you know what we're looking for. What are the points of interestar like in terms of on the floor for this series. Yeah, so I think we have to start with Luca. As you said, how do you think they're gonna defend? So just looking at something everybody should go read. John Schumann on NBA dot Com has a bunch of numbers that just breakdowns that really I think clarify kind of the crux of like what what may decide? Uh this this title here and it's just got it is. It is all about Luca. It is all about how this really good Celtics defense guards him. And it's it's amazing that so like the Celtics want to switch like that is their default setting and they have plenty of guys to do that. They're probably better equipped to do that than anybody. And some of the numbers that were really striking to me, Uh, I'm gonna have to dig them all out of here? Is that so it So let's break it down this way. When Luca gets switched against in the playoffs, he's getting you one point two to three points per possession, which is like that'll work in the half court. That's just good enough. Right, Yeah, if you blitz him. That numbers one point oh one, which is like, oh, that's a win if you do like a soft double, or like bring the center up to the level. Like how basically, how the Nuggets use Jokic a lot of times in pick and roll defense one point two to one, So the numbers say blitz. Basically Boston does not do that, like that they that's not what they want to do. And I think one of the most interesting points I saw was from Tim Cato. It was on a podcast with Vince Goodwill was talking about how like, and Tim Cato knows the MAVs better than you know, you me or most people rights for the athletic for anyone for some reason who doesn't know that was saying that, like, it'll be fascinating to see if Boston wants to force Luca to isolate, so switching all the time throughout the series on the in the hopes that he will fatigue, which is like, that is a way to beat Luca, or it has been in the past, Like if you just force him to have an absurd usage, don't let him get off the ball, don't force him off the ball, he might get tired by like Game four or five. The thing is you might be down three to one, but you do that and then and Tim Cato's point was like, but then you have to stick with this strategy that you're probably getting killed from all corners for continuing to go with Like it's a real like you know, three steps ahead kind of thinking. But like the Celtics do just have to decide, like do we let Luca isolate? Do we help off of shooters in the corners, which Boston does not do Boston likes to play the pick and roll with two guys. This is all from John Schumann, Like I don't profess to be an expert. Uh, it's so like the Celtics are gonna either gonna have to go with the thing they like to do and give up one point two to three points perd points per possession in the half court, which is gonna get you beat, or they have to change a lot and hope that that doesn't like because the only thing worse than getting beat like with your preferred style is getting beat with one that you switch to too soon and then you lose like not on your terms. So I think I think that whole interplay is really uh, the most interesting aspect of it. To me, that's a lot to go on. But like I just I'm fascinated by what do you do with Luca? Is? What is this great defense with you know, a bunch of guys you can throw at him? Do like do they do the things they want to, the things they have to, the things they don't want to. It's just that there's a lot to kind of unpack. Yeah, what do you think they're gonna end up doing? Because I feel I actually don't think that they need to be I mean, I think there'll be points and if they're gonna leave someone, I think they're gonna help off of Derek Jones Junior. I think that that's the guy that he's shooting with thirty nine percent forty from three in the playoffs. But it's on like three attempts a game. They'll live if that's the type of volume and he's gonna shoot like, they'll live with it. But I'm what I'm sort of the interplay is it's not even just the way they're defending him, but okay, well the who's the primary defender on him? So if you are going to switch Because I've tried to give this a lot of thought and I know there's there's two different schools of thought. It's we'll just put the best guy that you think is like, for like, to go against Luca on Luca. And I think if in a vacuum, the best person they have to defend Lucas probably Drew Holliday. I'm not I think that's the guy that you would prefer, and so be just throw Drew Holliday on Luca. Like he's handled assignments that are that big before. He's strong, he can do it. He's the guy you've thrown. They've thrown it Kevin Durant before, like whoever you've needed Drew Holliday to guard, he goes and gets that guy. But there's the other school of thought where it's, well, you know what you put and we saw the Timberwolves do this at one point, was no, you put that guy on Kyrie and it's just like, deal with limiting Kyrie because Luke's gonna figure out a way to get his or figure out a way to get shots for everybody else regardless. The other thing that you could do, and I think Boston did a little bit of that this year during the regular and you could throw I don't I mean, I want to make this clear. They could have played each other ten times during the regular season, and I just won't assign much value to it. Only one of their games came after the trade deadline, and I think they were both relatively at full strength. What you could do, and what I actually liked the idea of doing, is there's the end you use the word in your play of You could put you Holiday on Kyrie and maybe use Derek White to come off of Derek Jones Junior if you want to do something like that, or maybe even Tatum just because of the size, but like, why not throw jam On Brown as your primary defender on Luca. That's the guy that has his size a little bit more than he's not necessarily as strong as Drew Holiday. But then if you want to, you know, if if you want Luca to mismatch Hunt or you want someone to screen, it's, well, why don't we have Drew Holliday guarding Daniel Gafford. Essentially, it's like, if you're gonna like, if we're gonna switch with then we'll just get the matchup that everyone would want us to have anyway, or maybe it's Derek White in that case, if you want to throw Drew on Kyrie and say, here, go do that. So I'm very interested to see how Boston goes back because I really do expect them, especially with him coming back from and that's another element of the series, as Christops porzingis is. By the way, this was from the Lockdown Mass podcast. Shout out Nick Angins, Dad. Not something I realized, but you definitely know it without thinking about it. He's never been to a conference finals, never played in a conference finals, but he's about to play in the NBA finals, which is just shyster. He was interest kipping steps out here, right, So like they're they're not gonna have him like do a lot of the stuff on defense we've seen with other bigs do. Like, I don't think he's the guy that's gonna they're gonna use to blitz Luca, especially coming off this Soulius injury. I think it's right the right calf. So if you're gonna be dead set on him kind of just even if it's not like being tethered to around the basket like in that general area, then you are, like you're like Derek Jones Junior is probably maybe PJ. Washington depending on the night or something like whatever guy you think is gonna do that. So I think that's gonna be their base that they're not gonna move away from at all, and then maybe they'll kind of fuz and fiddle from there. I just I'm curious what you think is the best approacher? What do you think they end up one very quickly. I think we're gonna see them try a ton of different shit. I think that there's stuff that Joe Mizzoula will just bust out of the bag that maybe we don't see coming, or he'll vary it up to try and keep Luca off kilter. A lot of people are like, just go with the one thing you think is gonna work or the one thing that's working, and the thing that might work is diversity there. But what do you think is the best approacher? They're most likely approached. So I agree that the regular season is not especially between teams that played twice, only one of which had a whole lot of value. What I would expect them to do is what the numbers said they did most of during the year, which is Jalen Brown is the primary defender and then Jason Tatum spends most of his time on the center, so like, which is in fact what happened this year? I guess he Jason Tatum's primary assignment was Derek Lively more frequently than anyone else when they played the MAVs. So when Lively is upsetting the screen, it's just Brown and Tatum switch like that's that's it now. Of course, like if Porzingis is in the game, he's gonna be in a drop like that's just that is the defense you play with Porzingis on the floor, that's it. You can't bring him up to the level that will you'll get picked apart, so he has to drop. So then it becomes like how much pre switching can Boston do to keep Porzingis or Horford for example, because they'll go at Horford too being the guy guarding the screen like they're gonna try to pull they being Dallas and Luke are gonna try to pull the bigs up into the screen as often as possible, just because then it's like, at least if you're switching, that's a pretty significant mismatch. And if it's Porzingis, it's like you know, green light for Luca, right, because there's no rim protection anymore, and he's got a big on them, so I think it'll be I would guess it'll be Brown. I would guess it'll be Tatum like finagling his way into guarding the screen setter as much as Boston can get away with that. But then, like, especially when Porzingis is in a drop, I think you're right, like, well, then surely it's just Derek Jones and PJ. Washington getting corner threes, like, and I think, don't you feel like Boston would be like okay, with the theory of if the MAVs are gonna beat us and win the title, it'll be because Derek Jones and PJ. Washington like shot us to death from the corners, I feel like you could be. But by the way, Boston is allowed one and a half three point makes from the corners per game in the playoffs, one and a half, so like that's by far the fewest, so they they don't leave those guys. But I think, think against Luca, this is what I'm talking about, Like you're almost gonna have to and just say, please beat us. That's what I would expect to see. But I agree, like I think if you show Luca the same thing for a quarter, like you need to pivot after that, or like, you know, just because if you don't show him different looks, I just don't see a way where he fails to figure it out. So yeah, I don't know, did you want to respond to that, because I have another like kind of rhetorical question I think that about. I think it's I don't know how to say it's a mystery, but I think it's Boston's well equipped to try all these different things. I'm just curious to see what ends up working the best. Because there's also some of the concessions you might make. Is so you mentioned that Boston's only allowing one and a half makes from the corners. Dallas thirteen percent of its entire shot attempts through the playoffs are coming from the corners, which we have a playoffs. They make the most corner threes among playoff teams, So you've got the least allowed and the most made clashing now. And it's just like when you look at teams that made it deep into the playoffs for the most part, like it's not even close on the corner three stuff. And so if you if Boston takes that away like they're supposed to are you just then conceding that, well, Luca might be able to cook us from inside the arc and if he shoots fifty five sixty sixty five percent from twos, we're okay with that. And like does your I guess your approach will change depending on the big you have on the floor because Al Horford's interesting. The big thing about porzinc is coming back, by the way too, is now when Al Horford is your backup rather than like, all right, this is Al Horford and Luke Cornette show, and maybe somebody David Tillman sprinkled in the issue. The I'll say persisting issue because it's not a new one, is well, how many minutes is Porzink is going to play? Like what does he look like? How many minutes can he handle this series? Because even look, if he gives you fifteen, it's just it's better because then you can it's less of your third and fourth string big that you're gonna see, which is you you maybe don't have to see Cornette at all. If he can give you those fifteen minutes, Yeah, then you're playing Al Horford thirty three. Well, I mean Cornett Cornette isn't This is not the serious for Cornett, I don't know well. But what's interesting with al Horford though, is that I don't I still don't know if we fully appreciate how mobile this dude still is at age eighty. Amazing, but he's what's the issue. Like, so if Luca or Kyrie is looking to get downhill and he finds himself in those situations, that becomes an asset. But like if they're not going downhill, he's weirdly, it's not weird, it's just he feels like this is anecdotally. I don't have numbers to back this up, but it feels like he struggles more against the guys who are gonna be able to hit those step back threes, like almost going south rather than north, Like he can you go east west, He's fine, you go, you try and go drive downhill, go south, still fine, but like you go north whatever that direction would be considered, like you stu this, like those are the stuff that he's not gonna be able to shoot those gaps on close out as quickly because he's still trying to leave some space to make sure that he doesn't get blown by or can keep pace with or can test shots that are gonna be right in front of him. I think that's the matchup that they will probably look to attack the I mean they're gonna go after Perzingis too, just one that's I guess their offense is bretd Butter, but you have this guy coming back from an injury. I'm just really interested to see, like which big they fare better against or how they go about trying to either involve these bigs in the action or like just go about attacking them. And I don't We've seen them do it time and again. I just don't have a great answer for what they're gonna do. And this leads me to, unless you have any other thoughts on Boston's defense, back to Dallas's defense, because they have not faced like in full I know Karl Anthony Towns within the last series, but like when you go from the thing that I don't think people will talk about enough with Karl Anthony Towns is you functionally change the advantage he gives you on offense when you move him from the five to the four. There he is still very good offensive player, but the stuff that makes him unique is most unique and valuable at the five on offense. So Dallas has not faced a. I would say a true high volume team that has a stretch five which bought in the playoffs yet which Boston like that is just their default, unless, oddly enough, unless's Lou Cornette that's playing it or just doesn't take threes anymore apparently. So I'm very curious, how do you think that they're you know, if it's Derek Lively, I think they're mostly they'll be okay, but that's still something that Boston could look to attack. I don't trust Daniel Gafford in those situations, and we kind of did see it against Minnesota in the game that Lively missed, where it's if you bring him out too far, like you might be a little fucked. Yeah, he loses his power so the farther he gets from the restricted area basically, So my rhetorical question was gonna be like, isn't it weird that Boston had the best offense in the league this year and all we and we still are like it, just well, let's make or miss for them, like it just it depends on if the threes fall, right, Like, isn't that I know that's that's not we're not saying that, but that feels like the reductive way that people think about the Celtics of like, well, they're gonna shoot more threes than you, and chances are they'll make more. But if they don't, they just don't score on the paint, even though they're super efficient there, they just don't get baskets other ways, and then we get then we like slide down the hill into the like mud pit of like what's wrong with Boston's offense when it bogs down? And like why can't you know that we've talked about a million times. I just think I think offensively, for Boston there is an element of like are the threes falling? That is is a is a bigger part of their success or failure than I'm comfortable with, Like if it gives me a little bit of pause, Like if you imagine a scenario where Dallas wins this series, I guarantee it features like multiple fourth quarters where Boston just doesn't score and it's just and it's missing jumpers. But like, to your point, Dallas has not seen a group like this because like the thing about the Celtics offense is they will just be five out basically all the time, and almost everybody on the floor can can run, can like run the offense. And now running the offense might mean swing, swing five dribbles someone shoots a three, but like you can initiate it from anywhere, which means you can attack. You can target whoever you want to target. So if it's Kyrie you want to go at, like, I guess that's true, Holiday, Okay, you can start the offense like then that's fine. If it's if it's you know, Gafford that you want to pull out, like easy enough, he's gonna have to guard someone a center that's gonna shoot threes anyway. So like, I think Boston has more like spots to pick at, I think than than Dallas does when you're looking for like how are they going to score? But at the same time, Boston is the type of team where it's just like I don't know, like what is what is picking at a weakness means because of the types of shots that Boston's offense tends to favor, So that I it's just interesting to me that that, like the Celtics had the best offense in the league and have all these advantages, and yet like it does feel like it comes down to are the make or miss a little bit more with more so for them than with Dallas. I think, yeah, I would agree, especially because like they're not a team. I think when you look at them on paper, you could see a pathway like okay, well why this volume isn't higher. They're eighteenth during the postseason in transition frequency, and so when you're that reliant on the half, like even Dallas is gonna get out in transition, yeah, more than that quarterback. Now did you hear he throws outlet pass? This he won? So I just and I'm wondering if that that makes them I would think functionally easier to defend if you're Dallas, because I guess I mean the key for Dallas is like, okay, you need to do I think they're eleventh in defensive rebounding rate during the playoffs, which just like you want to be better just because that's gonna you know, one end possession so that you can get into your to your offense. But I'm wondering if a key for them is like, well, let's continue to limit like this volume that Boston is spending in transition, because you're talking about this make or miss stuff. When they get into half court, they just go through these stretches where it feels like they bogged down and sometimes look, that's gonna end up working out for them. But the percentage of their shots that are coming very late in the shot clock are are above average for the playoffs. And like there when you get into the fourth quarter specifically, like you see that number kind of skyrocket and you're seeing the percentages skyrocket, like Boston shooting twenty four percent from three in the fourth quarter in the final four seconds of the shot clock, and like, no, you're not gonna defend them for a full twenty seconds on every single possession, but like when you're watching them, it feels like there's and I'm wondering if that does help Dallas because of the way they're defending. Are they gonna be intimidated and not intimidated but impacted enough by the lively and the gafferd minutes to where they're just possession where feel like they don't get below the free throw line until if they even try to get inside the three point line. And are they gonna be even like more reserved and more reliant on and they're taking like I think forty four percent of their shots are coming from three in the playoffs, So there are they gonna be even more reliant on that because of the way that Dallas defends, or are they gonna bend Dallas's defense to the point of breaking because Dallas can't defend in theory conceptually the way that it's been defending for most of this postseason. That's like a very sort of interesting subplot here. And if you're Dallas then and you can't defend the way that you want to do, you like this is will come a Maxi kleabless series. We're like, well, now we want to play five out and that gets you away from a lot of what's been most effective. But I am curious, is well, that's not you know, if if they're kind of if what you're able to do defensively or what you're what you've done so successfully defensively to this point, is it working? Do you try and pull that out of a hat, because then you're you know, we'll maxic cle will maxic cleve with shoot enough threes or make enough threes for it to matter, maybe not in a vacuum, but just the idea that you have to guard him. That's gonna open things up then for Luca or Kyrie who in theory, even if Boston is not blitzing them, like, it's just gonna be harder to get by this Celtics defense because of when you look at all four of their perimeter defenders or above average defenders, like there's just there's not Their weak link on defense is like Kristaps Porzingis or the center, which is such a wild thing to like consider a weak link because it's not actually a weak link. That's how you win sixty four games? Is you, like, really don't have one? Basically, do you want to make a pick? I have? I have two stats here though that I for apologies to wherever these came from. I can't remember, just I was because I was agonizing over who to pick. I have made a pick. But before we reveal them, here's a couple of stats about like who tends to win championships. So teams with eight more wins than the opposition in the finals, which is definitely the case this year. It's fifty to sixty four, So Boston has fourteen more wins are thirty and five against it. So it's like when the win gap is that big, it's it's decisive. The other one that I was blown away by was every champion except for one in the last forty four years, was a top three seed, and one fifty two games. Dallas is neither of those things. Now, we talked about how this is a different team after the trades, but it's like, if Dallas wins this, it is going to be a historic win for a lot of reasons and just highly highly improbable based on past precedent. So who are you picking? Oh well, I'll tell you the odds just to see if you're shocked by them at all. Boston's a minus two twenty favorite to Dallas being a plus one point eighty four. That is that is that like seem kind of square with where you're at with the impression of it, because it's weird where I think Boston is going to win. They're my pick, But I very much struggled to figure out, Okay, how many games is gonna last. I was really struggling between Dallas in six and Boston in seven, and I ultimately went Boston in seven just just because like, well, I don't know the fact that I was gonna pick I really could I could have picked either team. I don't know. That tells you how like close. I think potentially this is I just in picking Boston, I think it's the right pick. But like there's such an obvious scenario where Luca is just unsolvable and it's clear in like Game two that Boston has nothing for him and and that this is like a five or six game series and Dallas wins it, like that's one hundred percent on the table. I just I think I just trust in the full body of work, the like lack of weaknesses and you know, the depth. It's just I think Boston should be the pick. But man, that's like, that's so scary because Luca just is looks like he's gonna he's that guy. And especially he's at all his time off for whatever injuries he's got the knee to ankle to maybe be you know a little bit better, because that's the other thing, is like nobody could shut up about how banged up he was while he's just running running over you know, the best defense in the league all year. Yeah, and his efficiency improved in that series, Like he was not shooting well in his off the dribble jumpers, and all of a sudden we start going in more consistently in that series, I'm gonna go. I think I'll go Boston in seven. Like you, it would be Boston in six for me if it wasn't, but I did. I feel like I fell into that trap last series with the Timberwolves, or I'm not accounting for the Luca effect and how much of your defense he's able to manipulate and that it doesn't and it doesn't matter, but all right, awesome, you have five good defenders on the court at all times. Yeah, but he can put you in a state to where that matters nowhere near as much as it should. If if you knew Porzingis was gonna be like basically a non factor like either not healthy enough or re injures himself or whatever, would you would you pick Dallas? Like how much of your pick depends on Porzingis actually not only mattering but like being a real weapon. Honestly, I think here's why I'm gonna say that it doesn't matter as much to me. I think there's a chance, well there's not a chance. They're more versatile, versatile with Al Horford at center, and they're probably better with Porzingis because of just like that base rim protection and of course that that size does this feel like a series where it's like, oh, Jason Tatum or the day fact there's no big on the court type deal from Boston to where if Porzingis isn't working or you don't want to have to put one of the third or fourth Xavier Killman or Luke Cornette in the game, like we like who is the big that you would fear stat I mean, like you're in saying Jason Tatum's gonna be on the big anyway, So at that point, like why not just cut out the middleman here? And I guess you're worried about the rim protection in that case, but you just have Derrek Wilder just coming for that highlight block off help. Yeah, I think. I mean it's hard for me to say this because I picked Boston in seven, which means I think the margin is about as slim as it can be. But I think if Porzingis is not a factor, Boston can still absolutely win it. I would feel really nervous only because I feel like to beat a team that's playing as well as Dallas is you kind of need all your shit and like Porzingis can give you. You know, we've talked all year about like that's He's like the way out of Boston's offensive problems a lot of times because you dump it to him on a small guy like and that's just the only change up they ever really throw if you don't have that, And like Kyrie is someone they could definitely use that against. If Josh Green's on the floor, if Jaden Hardy plays, There's a lot of guys on Dallas's roster that you could attack that way. But I mean, like I would say too, if porzingis looks really good, then you might be talking about Boston in five or six hypothetically, But I think I think Boston has enough either way. It's just like it's a scar. That's another scary element of it is is you know, in addition to Luca just being who he is, like Porzing has mattered a lot all year, and just to say that they could do it without him feels a little iffy to me. I just I don't know, does it feel like And they've had some like turnover struggles at points, Dallas does, and Boston has the more efficient offense for the playoffs, but because of Luca, it feels like they have the steadier equilibrium or the higher floor on offense than Boston will and that that might be to make or miss here, but it's really more about okay, the net sum of their playmaking, their actual shot making and shot creation. Like the types of shotster, it's not just make or miss. It's really it's decision making for Boston, and I think that's what we talked about. We were talking about Jason Tatum in the previous podcast, was just like he can be infuriating, and this offense can be infuriating because it feels like it has the tools to bust up pretty much any defense. And when they do things wrong, not just if they miss, they miss, if they're missing wide open threes, jumpers, missing at the rim, they miss, but when they're taking shots that frustrate you, it feels more like an active choice. I would say percent of the time that it's holy fuck, we'll go with the defense. Just did the Boston's offense well that paired with or contrasted against Luca getting whatever shot is the best shot based on the circumstances in front of him consistently, Like that's such a different that's what you're talking about, Like the baseline is just higher because he'll if it's the lobb, it's the lob. If it's the skip to the corner, it's the skip to the corner. If it's the pull up from twelve feet with the guy on his back, he'll do like he'll just get you whatever. Whatever shot. The defense like is telling you you need to get he like, got it processed, no problem initiate like fine pass, fine bucket, whereas Boston is just like that processing isn't there. It feels like so, I mean, the way the Celtics could turn this into like a make or miss thing for both sides is blitzing Luca. And because then that's when you get into like someone else is making the decisions. Someone else is shooting those three like someone's shooting corner threes. Probably, so like, if you really want to get nuts, like you and your Boston, you could introduce variants that way and like at least make it so Dallas isn't just like a good shot creating machine because you're letting Lucas see the floor. The other thing, though, is like, does this just become the type because of how good Luca isn't like the Boston can do things to prevent Dallas from being able to attack one person. But if like if they're able to get porzingis involved in the actions or Horford or if it's a pa like can this even be a Peyton Pritchard series if Dallas is able to go? Because I think a lot of it comes down to it. It's like, well you can put Crayton Pritchard on Derek Jones Junior, do you really want him to set in screens? And it's like, I guess if it gives you the opportunity to maybe go that Peyton Pitchers, then yeah, you absolutely would. And so it almost feels like couldn't Dallas take a few of Boston's clubs out of its belt. I'm not saying that Peyton Pritcher' is a swing piece in this series, but Dallas, I feel like he's gonna make Boston's rotation, like make Joe Mizzoola think more about his rotations. Yeah, I think. I think Cornett is an example of like, I just don't know if you can play him because he can only play drop, but he has to play a deep drop and Lucas just gonna feast on that. So yeah, I think that's right. Yeah, I don't know. Celtics and seven don't feel good about it, really excited to see it. But I hope he gets seven, and I hope it's like a close seven game set and very quickly. What's more likely like a drawing match or just a kerfuffle between christophs Porzingis and Luka Dancic or Kyrie Irving and a Boston fan. Ooh, So I don't, by the way, I don't think in some of the roster has been turned over, it doesn't really seem like anyone who's on the Celtics, like a Jaylen Brown or Jason Tatum, has any animosity towards No, I don't think so either. I'm gonna say I like Luca Porzingis jawing. I think I think I like that. I like the odds for that. I think it never seemed to really. It was kind of just like the biting your lip thing where they never seem to like each other, but it wasn't super duper like public about it. I think I think that's right. Should we talk wolves now? So should we talk about a team that isn't playing anymore? Yeah? Where do the Wolves go from here? Mister? I think you trade everybody because it's too expensive, and you just got to get did you know that they're gonna be a second apron team? Did you know? I hadn't heard. I hadn't heard. Yeah, no, like what So it's always funny to see how people are trying to like break it down to like emphasize how expensive this team has become. Where it's like the numbers like one hundred and thirty five million between Cat and Aunt and Gobert, and then if you add McDaniels, you're over the You're over the cap right there with guys and commonly gets you up to the first day of the tax or it's just like, Okay, the one that I is compelling to me is you're at about one hundred and ninety six million with all the guys that you expect to have back. That doesn't include Kyli Anderson or Monte Morris, so like your second aproning no matter what, And it doesn't include their first round pick, which they have for now. I don't know if if that's gonna stay that way, but like it's it is what it is like. And then we've talked a lot about how it's urgent, but it's not like capital you urgent because they can get under the second Apron by the end of next year, right, Like that's so I don't know. I don't think we need to unless you want to go into like who should they trade and why and what are the fallback because like you just don't have to do it yet, no, you don't. And then the other thing is, you just made it to the conference finals, yeah, by beating the reigning champ, and you this is the time where you make the moves on the margins. And two here's here's also the issue where if you want to get out of this, it's not even the way. And what's really true. First of all, we have even talking about this, who the fuck is controlling this team? Well, that's the big question. I don't. I know, Glenn Taylor did a good job of paying himself as the hero at one point. I just don't trust either of these two sides to commit to paying the second Aprin long term, but for next season specifically, if you make a move before this, before the season starts, like you haven't gone into the trade deadline and you see you're underachieving, it's we're gonna cut costs that person, whoever is if it's a Rod and Mark Waurie if it's it's fucking Glen Taylor, I don't I don't care, Uh, fire them into the sun, because then you shouldn't be in a position of old an NBA team if you're not gonna stomach it for even a season or half season just to see me, right for this team specifically, like yeah, you don't pay the like I get it, if I don't know, Utah doesn't want to pay the tax or whatever, just like because of where they are, like the box being self aware that well, but they lie to you and say they will pay the tax and then they don't. But it's like not good enough. They're competitive, but they're not good enough to work. No, we don't really want to start the tax clock, thank you very much. Yeah, no, right, And it's different now, but not only it would be different if this weren't the Wolves and it was just a team that beat the defending champs and made the conference finals and like, yeah, kind of got it handed to them a little bit. But like, you know, all you can do when you're building a team is make it good enough to get that far, and then it's just kind of a little bit of luck and a little bit like you know, if you if you if we always talk about like, oh, you're trying to win a championship, it's like you're really trying to make the conference finals, because if you can get that far, you're really really good and you had a puncher's chance, and that's the best thing you could possibly hope for. Like you don't like the sixty four win Celtics are the outlier. You can't just like that can't be the goal, right, So like if it were just that, you really can't make a cost cutting move, But because it's Minnesota who never gets here, you really can't make the cost cutting move. You like that it's even more more egregious if you use cheapness to like break this team up, then it would be for almost any other franchise. Yes, because the bar for success was lower, and they blew past that bar and into a bar that would have been if the Nuggets reached the conference finals, you would be sitting here and saying like their season, like, yeah, they didn't win, and we picked them to win, like their season was a success, Like you beat you met the bar that should have been there for the Nuggets, And even the Nuggets internally probably had a lower bar, but my The other thing here though, too, is I think we also need to be open to the idea. But I'm about to shut it down and tell you that we shouldn't be. But in theory we should. We open the idea that well, you can make a move to get better where if you're changing out Karl Anthony Towns for two players who give you and that's what this team needs. Is I'm sure there'll be people in the comments that tell us we're wrong. We've been saying it all year, was the shooting was shaky, and like they need a secondary playmaker to make the decisions. That it's not even just that. And I defended Anthy Edwards like he made some pretty bad decisions and he's clearly not like the best passer yet, but maybe you call them like he's a minus at everything or B plus it at passing that needs to be good enough based off everything else that he does. And so if you can't assemble like a consistently good offense around him with him being the player he is right now, yes he will get better, but the player he is right now, you should be able to get to a level where your offense doesn't have these peaks and valleys or oh, after another bad pass, our season's over. Like you can't be he can't be your all everything everywhere whereas what he needs to be our best on ball defender or second best mind Jane McDaniels and I know that's the bar for success for him. So you need kind of that playmaker type to organize things aside from a Mike Conley. And you need just I would say shooting. And here's the problem. You need more offensive dynamism. That's what you need. The problem by trading Karl Anthony Towns is twofold one. He is, for better or worse, your second most dynamic offensive player. Yep. So like now you need to get your second most dynamic offensive player back in that deal, but you also need to make sure that player is an upgrade or that the other player coming back is your third most dynamic player. And then who wants Karl Anthony Towns when that super max extension is about to kick in? And I think there were teams I still I won't go as far as underrated because the playoff stuff, the fouling the peaks and valleys on offense is weird. But I mentioned this before. We weren't talking about the Wolves. So I don't even know why I said it, but I said it in this podcast, people did not discount enough how much different materially materially different his value is on offense. When you shift him from the five to the four, he gives you the ability to do that. That doesn't mean he's still as valuable at the four. And so I do think a team would give up value for him, But where's the move, Like what are the player I thought about, like if you were able to get and it would take a third team, But it's like if you could sub out Karl Anthony Towns and get like Bo Doug Bogdanovic and de Jontey Murray, team would be you have all sorts of rotation, like is Mike Conley coming off the bench, then what are we doing here? Like why are the Wolves doing that when they have Clint Capella and do Yaka Congou and now Karl Anthony Town's on there and then Karl Anthony Towns and Trey Yung would be a defensive disaster if you're also looking to cut costs though as part of that. So let's just I know you want to say something, I'll wrap it up here in a vacuum, we should be open to the idea that you can trade Karl Anthony Towns just because his money's so big. And I think that aside from aunt he, I know people will be appealing, like Jane McDaniels will appeal to people. But I still think that Karl Anthony Towns to me is the second most intriguing player on this roster. But if you're trying to also cut costs as part of that, you're now dealing with teams that are only going to be sending you draft equity in return, and so now you're getting worse and cheaper. And that's what needs to be inexcusable. So I want to lay the option of if they find a deal and maybe it's oh, they're going to trade their draft pick with Karl Anthony Towns and get somebody, in all likelihood, it should be they should be aiming smaller rather than thinking about busting this up. I just don't if you're looking to save money, you're invariably just gonna get much worse, I think, And that's the that's the big issue. I think that's right. I think you know, I would agree just with the general idea of like you know, not any not any and every Karl Anthony Town's trade would would like draw the eyre that we're talking about of like that you did this to get cheaper. This is ridiculous, like because you have nas Reid and everybody likes to talk about like you know, you kind of slot nas read in there you get a lot of Carl Anthony Towns that like a fraction of the price is not that different, so you backfill that and then you do go get another guard in another wing or whatever, and like maybe you're better bottom line, Like it's really that is a plausible outcome, I do think, And we haven't really talked about this like the counter two because we I think we're in lockstep on the idea of like you don't have to do this now, like this is it's crazy, don't please, don't make a kneed ra But like, because his salary is so big, I think the fact that there are some teams that like could take him into cap space and you know, send you back someone much cheaper, like that option might go away, well probably would go away because of the salary floor rules, Like if you wait till the trade deadline, like you might just have fewer options because then you really are having to deal with like more even money, and you can't you know, you can't take back anymore, not that you would, it's a cost cutting, but like the existence of a few teams, like none of these are fits obviously, other than maybe the thunder who I've kind of talked to myself to like I don't hate cat in the Josh Getty spot, but like they have cap space. Orlando has cap space, like you know, Detroit has cap space. There's all these teams that like trades are just easier with big salaries. When you have teams like that that can just yeah, we got fine, you want anybody back, you want like a ten million dollar player back, we can do that like that. The options are there. With that, that's the only thing that should be like encouraging haste with this decision, and every other factor is just like we've got to chill out and just hope Anthony Edwards gets five percent better and maybe you win a title. Like That's that's where we are with this team. By the way, the other thing you mentioned about, like nos Rey's gonna be a free agent at for next season. He's a player option, so it's like you're gonna not he's never gonna make as much of Conthony towns, but like he's not gonna be super cheap forever, Like how much money are you still saving twenty million dollars a year? Maybe so when you're looking at like what they could actually do, though, because everything's focused on okay, they should run it back. I do think you have to aim for improvements. They're only gonna have minimums to offer if they keep their salary sheet the way it is. I would love to see them, and I don't know if this would be like you would probably if I guarantee him being your sixth man. And I don't know why it d Philly, but like Kyle Lowry here, it would make a lot of sense. That's like my ambitious target for them. In terms of more realistic guys, I think someone like a Cameron Payne you could look at, Uh could you also? Like, I don't what is Spencer Dinwood's market gonna be. I'm just going he'll get more than the minimum. But again, if he's promised X amount of playing time. Uh So, like those are like that's kind of your pet like and those are even aiming high it would be great. By the way, if the Warriors wave Chris Paul and Chris pauls like, yeah, I'll go to Minnesota. Yeah, starting him, that'd be interesting. But I was gonna ask, do you think Kyle Anderson or Morris will be back? I mean, there's just going deeper into the tax but they can't. They could, They could bring them both back well. And also then you have a salary slot to trade in the middle of the year. I would my guess would be that Kyle Anderson still has more value, so he'd be the one to bring back in the Moni Morris stuff just didn't work out for them. That's also you could bring him back. I mean the worry is, like, you know, the guys you mentioned are probably better. Even Lowry is like brings more to the table than Morris. But like that's the type of guy you're that they're gonna be shopping for. You're like, who's like Montey Morris? But isn't Montey mor you know, like it's you're not gonna start, we can't pay you much. You have to be steady. We're not gonna get anything great. Like that's just who that guy is or was I don't know if what he is anymore potentially, but like it is, is there a scenario where Morris is just like, actually is the best they can do? You know? I think that's on the table too. Yeah, well, I mean because look at let's just say and let's be realistic and say, okay, I did who doesn't really help your shooting but gives you just some additional scoring and playmaking, and Kyle Lowry are sort of off the table. It's his Delawn Right better for you than Monte Morris maybe defensively, sure, but that's not the issue. Yeah, you don't need you don't need that. Yeah, I probably not actually, because Right is just like so low usage. He just gets on the ball and gets off it and doesn't like do a whole lot with it. More worse might be better. And then it's like when you're getting into I mean, and also you would prefer them to shoot or you're gonna have to go out and get a separate shooter typdeal. I don't know, Like I think if they do anything, it feels like it's going to have to happen via trade. And now you're in a situation where it needs to be a dollar for dollar match. You can't aggregate salaries, and so your best or rather I would say your player who's going to be most expensive, that you're likely because you're not gonna trade Gobert. Let's assume that you're not just gonna trade Cat calmly. I don't know why you would trade Anthony Edwards is not going to be traded. So then it's okay, Well, nas Reed is making fourteen million, Like what would it take for you to actually think about parting with nas Reed? And if the answers like it just doesn't make we want to have that button a push if we do decide to move Kat in the middle of the season. But by the way, that's gonna be tough because when teams don't have cap space in the middle of the season, how do you square those deals just become tougher to square away. And then it's oh, it's Nikhil Alexander Walker whose salary is actually declining from this season the next at four point three million. You're not going to trade Jane McDaniels at twenty two point six at least, I don't think. And so even someone like a Javon Carter would make a lot of sense. For this team. You can't get him unless you're gonna give up nas Reed basically just because of the way the salary matching is working there. So they're in a really weird spot. I think it'll be easier for them. This is my roundabout way of saying to add shooting to the rotation, where it's like, could we get someone i'd like for them? And he was playing in Atlanta and look pretty good, and he's looked good when he was playing in Washington, Garrison Matthews and someone just coming. He'll chuck threes and sometimes get going downhill if you wanted to go super nuclear. It's just like if you put a first round pick on the table to Thunder to give you Isaiah Joe. I mean you, that'd be phenomenal if they would if you're Minnesota, probably not, because you're helping out. They already did this. They helped out Dallas. It's like, you're really gonna do this again. So but like I kind of I guess My point is, I think even talking about the names like a if it's I mean, Isaiah Joe is really good, so like a Garrison mad like, I think you could add someone maybe slightly better than Garrison Matthews or Garrison Matthews himself, just as an example, and like your team is like like stocked enough to be better next year. And like the other thing too that we can't discount is now you've had this entire season of going through all of this, and it's like you're gonna get improvement from Anthony Edwards. Jay mc daniels should be better. He was better on offense for most of the playoffs. He should be better during the regular season. I know Gobaar and Conley are another year older, but I just would caution it. I know fans are not thinking this way, but any media members who think that they need to sort of blow it up or trade, like make a big trade, or even if the Wolves are thinking along these lines, it's the absolute early. It is not even considered it as at the twenty twenty five trade deadline. And that's only because or if they're like just missing expectations by again, right, they're healthy and they're like seventh in the West. For some reason, it's like Okay, well, now weren't there seventh in the West, but like still twenty games, Well, yeah, I would say it almost would have more to do if like, well, it's so like if kat is having a shit season and it's been healthy and it's just playing terrible, But then like, how are you trading that guy? That makes it even harder if you wait till the deadline, and that's the that's the situation you're in. Yeah, we're team team what should we call our team for? Like team patients? That's not catchy enough? Team don't do anything stupid until the trade deadline. And again it's just like how I would feel at least five percent better about their type about their offense next season if they added Cameron Payne, and honestly, I probably feel like twenty percent better about their offense if they added Garrison. Matthew's not gonna lie. Uh So, like the fact that I'm saying that might be hyper bop, but it's like if that's what the like the the bar here is, could there even just be We saw it last year with Kelly Hubray Junior just signing for the minimum in Philly, just like something like that where it's like his knees are cooked, the Grizzlies wave him and Lukenard is just available. Oh yeah, And also like I know this is we're never going to get out of this. But like they beat the Nuggets, like this team beat Denver, like per a bunch of our YouTube comments there, they weren't the better team. The Nuggets lost that series the Timbers, and I fucking hate that that logic. Maybe next year the Nuggets proved they were the better team, but the Timberwolves were the better team in that series, you know how I know that they won it one. No, Yeah, so like that, I think hanging over all of it is like this team is really good, like stupid good. Like maybe maybe Dallas is the only team in the West they couldn't have Beaten, like the fact that you could beat Denver, and Denver was everyone's juggernaut. It was our no notes juggernaut, Like they beat them. So if you go into next season knowing that you can do that, you got to feel pretty good just running it back, like or pretty close to it. It is just you didn't. There's there's only one team we're pretty sure that Minnesota can't beat, and like, who knows how that looks next year. I think that that knowledge should really like forestall any major changes for them. Yeah, I would agree with you, very very very quickly. The Pistons. We've already talked about Trajan Lindon now being their lead basketball decision maker. I actually like that higher Troy Weaver is gone. You probably didn't want to stay stay on in this scouting role. Who knew, and Monty Williams' future is being deliberated. That is I still think Monti Williams put that out there. I'm not gonna lie. We already asked this question on last podcast, But do you just see that trickle out? Knowing Troy Reavers already gone? Do you think that Manti Williams is still coaching this team by the end of the by the start of twenty twenty five twenty six season. Oh so, so in this hypothetical, he's coaching it this coming season, but not beyond it. Well, if you say no, not beyond it, I'm gonna ask you does he like to I'd really like to avoid a follow up question. So that's I mean, step one is already complete. You already got rid of the guy that hired him. I'm gonna say he is not coaching the Pistons for twenty five twenty six, so he make it through next year? Does he make it through next year? I think I think probably I would have to say no to that, because it's like, why would he if you like, what would have to happen for him to make it through the entire twenty four to twenty five season and then get fired, Like, wouldn't it be more if it's if it's obvious, why wouldn't you just do it in the season, because more decisive? I guess the fall up to the follow up is, do you think just because Trajan Langdon has been given this is, per multiple reports, the freedom to make whatever decisions he wants, which, by the way, is a good sign, and I also painted the Manti Williams hire is a good sign. But now we found out that like Tom Gors was basically just driving that bus and Troy Reeder didn't actually want him all that much, so that was probably a red flag. Do you think the Pistons are not everyone's looking at them as the team that's gonna be something stupid or a few things that are stupid over the off season with all their cap space, they're less likely to do something stupid now that they've gone this route, right, or do you think that there's still gonna be this mandate to just be I know everyone mentions Tobias Harris, but I don't know why it's Tobias Harris, but it's hey, let's just go give a bunch of let's just go max out Gary Trent Junior or something. It does seem less likely that they would do something like that because that's like you could understand in hindsight why Troy Weaver would have wanted to do that, because he's like thinking, we need to win some games because my job's on the line, and like what do I got to lose by making some win now moves like I might get another year or something out of this. So it does it checks out to me that Langdon might be someone that, like, I mean, maybe maybe this is the way to frame it. It feels more likely now that you might see someone like Jade and Ivy traded or someone like Jalen Duran traded just because it's like, these aren't my guys. This hasn't worked. Let's let's really refresh this. Even Kid Cunningham, like I don't know, like that's probably the last guy you'd want to move, but like if you're really trying to start a clean house, I guess like if you you know, it wouldn't be the first time that a new executive came in and like the old the prizes from the previous regime just start flying out the door. That's pretty pretty common, right. I agree with everything he said there. And the other coaching news was Mike and Norri has apparently interviewed for the Lakers job, and has Perrishna He's Ohio native, to interview with the for the Cavs job, so that'll be something to monitor too. But I'm still penciling getting jj Reddick for for the Lakers. I think I am too, although we haven't heard I haven't seen anything new in the last couple of days. But I just think it's the Finals that like ESPN might have, not that they have the power to threat in the Lakers, but probably like, hey, you guys already took away one of our five broadcasters and like, you can't do this again just weeks before the Finals. Yeah, I think that's that's that's probably maybe Jakan himself did it, like no, I want to broadcast the finals, and well, I can imagine it's just like I got too much to think about. I found myself listening to him on the broadcast, thinking like this guy has not had the time to prepare for this game, like he's doing interview Like not not because it's bad, but it's just like, now that's the lens I'm viewing it through, like this is not his number one priority right now, you know, like that that kind of thing, because he's got to just be I don't know, like if he was calling around looking for assistance right Reportedly he was trying to see who might want to join his staff. Like that's that's a lot to be thinking about when you're trying to analyze another set of games. I do also find it funny that the other is that Darvin ham is. There's been a lot of teams. I think the Warriors are one of them, trying to get them on their assistant staff. And he's apparently so exhausted from spending two years with the Lakers that he's just like nah, I didn't look tired. He always looked really tired. I mean that's that job. That job is like the presidency, It just ages the person like five. I just don't even know why JJ Reddick wants it, like it just it feels like if you win, you're not maybe you would get credit at this point because you're but it's just like it's the credit's gonna go to Lebron and probably as it should, but like it's always gonna go to but if you lose somehow could be your fault. I just I think, like if you're a really competitive person and a really driven person, I think both both of which he is, and you've ever thought about coaching, and then the fucking Lakers job is on the table, Like it's got to be so hard for you to like stay rational about anything because it's like that's like the holy I mean, you know what, other what coaching job is more prestigious than you know than that, So just to have that on the table has got to be like beyond tantalizing for someone like him. That's just like I don't know, just like I said, competitive and like driven and to get that out in front of you, like that's that's got to be like irresistible. But but I agree, it's like it just it seems like not highly Uh, he's not set up to succeed. I don't feel like if he if he takes that job. Oh and the other thing, Mike Brown a point five million a year agreed on the extension. They literally just split the difference. The King's competitive offer was seven. Shout out Greg whis Singer for really just shitting all over the organization when they did, saying why would you how idiotic do you have to be to think that releasing that because it very clearly came from them when you see all these other contracts to coaches being given out that that would be received. Well, so they split the difference where it always would have ended up. Yeah, I just that was too You mentioned it on the last one. You said you felt kangsy, and then I thought you were going to step too far, and I don't think you were. It was just well, they did get him back, so it's like we can just reel in the kangziness like just a little bit. But what you're talking about, what Greg was saying, is like, oh that's I can smell the kangs on that one. That's just like you frame it as like, yeah, you negotiate, that's a good team, like that's just everything. But it's not like this though. That's the point, and it's the way that Greg had also framed it. Was okay, so you either think that he's right for this because he brought you back to the playoffs he wins Coach of the Year, in which case, just pony up the extra couple million dollars. Or if you don't think he's right, why are you offering to fucking extend him in the first place. Yeah, right, it's like the way that they leaked it. But he's the guy or he's not, like so at some point the money, it's certainly that little amount of money should not matter if he's your guy, So splitting the difference seems like that's always And I actually think the way the coaching market is going, like eight point five million for Mike Brown, sign me up. Yep, yep, that's that's totally reasonable. We are on to guess a player, and I believe that we each have some for each other. So maybe let's get through, like we'll see how long they take, but maybe two or three each. Did you want to start us off? All right? I have one here from Rubik scal and this is a Pride Month special, which I don't feel like is a cheat to give to you because it's the it's in the title of the message with this inate all right, tell me the name really quickly. I mean, I feel like I might have to, But here we go. Clue number one. I was named USA Basketball Athlete of the Year while I was still in high school. Gotta try one. I don't know college. I was supposed to know high school. Would you like clue too? Yeah, you're gonna have to pay attention to this clue. By the time I took Seattle by Storm, I had won a FOEBA World Cup while still in college. Is this it? Is this a w NBA player? Is this a Seattle Storm? I feel like I'm obligated to tell you that it is a w NBA player. First ever, first ever w NBA player. Yep, first first ever w NBA player that's been the subject of a guess a player on this podcast. I don't think this person was the first w I don't know a lot, but I'm pretty sure not. Oh man, All right, keep going, all right? Clue three. I added an Olympic title to my NCAA championship. Rings college is not gonna It wouldn't have helped me. If it's the I'll blow through. So here's clue four. Two. I'm a three time Nasmith College Player of the Year and a four time NCAA champ four. I should I feel like I should know that one. No, okay, five, As a first overall pick, I didn't disappoint winning Rookie of the Year as well as second team honors plus All Defense second team while destroying the league for most for the most defensive rebounds in a season. So it's a big I mean, that's just I assume. So nope, all right, Clue six. I missed an entire season to rehabit Torn Achilles. Either side of that lost season, I led my team the championship, winning finals MVP both times. What a boss. Basically every accolade possible so far, I think, oh my god, this is I feel like that you might say the name and it might ring a bell, but I can't even name more than like, I don't even know if I have the knowledge of the Seattle story is it. I don't even know if it's a current player or not. I don't know if I have the knowledge of their their ross. Let's see. I don't want to tell you that unless I have to. Okay, I'll go, I'll go. There's only three more so seven is My sophomore season in the league was my weakest, with only an All star nod to show for my troubles. Every other season, I made first team and featured in one of the all defensive teams. Here you go. Number eight. I became a free agent last year and moved to the East Coast seeking equality and fraternity. That that's a hint on the team that this player ended up on. I think still nothing, all right, Clue nine, happy pride. I'm married to Spanish pro basketball player Marta tzar Gay. That's your last clue? Is that gonna do it for you? No? It is get the pronunciation right, shout out to you. I have no idea if I got the pronounce right. X A R G A y uh. This is Brianna Stewart aka Stewie. I'm pretty sure is the nickname she goes by. All Right, I should have known that one. I don't know why I can't. You know, look, we don't profess to be a w NBA podcast. You know the name that came to me like actually, but then when you said that, they sounded like they were no longer remember the team. And she's also not a big with Skyler Diggens Smith that's the one that I'm But I was just like she wasn't a big so I was like, I'm not gonna get that. It could have been your one shot kill guess, but uh yeah maybe. I don't know. If Skyler Diggens was the USA Basketball Athlete of the Year in high school, probably Brianna Stewart won for n C double. I feel like I should have known that that's the one that I was like, I will tell you I would not have gotten this either. But the like four NCAA titles, let's you know, you can finagle like a fifth or six year of eligibility in there, but generally speaking, like you're there for four years and you just run the table all four do. I use this segment to say, who talks about women's sports more than hardwood knocks? Or is it still Stephen A. Smith talks about did you see that? Did you see that? Oh? You should go look it up. It's a disaster for Steven A. Smith shout out. I was actually talking to someone the other day too about and it's an excuse, it's a cop out. When I was doing some social media consulting, i'd follow the WNBA more and I really want like I I like it from Afar and I really wish that I could. I don't know how Naicaias and Steve Jones do it, like covering both I get after doing eleven months of this NonStop, I get so basketball, And again, I don't think that that's necessarily a fair excuse. But I'm also like, I think I'm at least not dumb enough to be like when you see Kaitlyn Kate, I always want to say, Kaitlyn Cooper, I've made that slip multiple times. Yeah, but when you see Kaitlyn Clark, like there's the hard foul from Kennedy cart like you're just not Like the discourse on it was terrible, and I think that it's good at the WMAs in the Spotlight more, but we have a long way to go where it's like the discourse is so bad and I feel I genuinely do feel bad, but it's probably also just born from laziness, like I should be trying to be part of to elevate it more. But just in all honesty, were speaking can Lee on the podcast doing this because that's what I get paid to do, and like I'm trying to pay my bills, Like yeah, shallow there, Yeah, it's not you know, I could be in I should talk about it more. I'm not. I'm not here to hide from it. But it's just I've made the choice where it's like the like I'm doing this, it's really a twelve months thing, but like there's eleven months that we go collectively and you have to for what Nikayas and Steve Jones, I'm just using. There's way a bunch of other people do a great job. But just like when you're following it, this intimately basketball for eleven months out of the year, even just as a fan, it gets hard to just like sit down and be like I want to watch this basketball game, and it's it's like it's relaxing me. Yeah, So it's like a weird headspace to be It's I think the way in is like as an actual fan, like first, so like for me, like I look, I haven't watched I haven't sat down and watched an entire WNBA game this season, but I've seen like some and it's because Kaitlyn Clark, like my whole family is from Iowa, Like both my my parents went to Iowa. Like my mom was a good like state level high school basketball player in Iowa. So she watched every IOWA game while Kaitlyn Clark was I almost say Kaylen Cooper again, well, Kaylyn Clark was there, and so like I started getting into it that way, and like, so now I like I have opinions on like Angel Reese saying things like you know, she's not the only reason people are watching the WNBA, like I was in that National Championship game, and like, now I have an opinion that I don't like Angel Reese because she's like petty and jealous of Kaitlyn Clark. So like that's like all fandom, but like I couldn't dissect I couldn't tell you anything about like what this team does well versus another team, or like give you have, let alone talk about like a cap sheet for a WNBA team, Like I don't have the bandwidth for that. Like I just I don't know the bandwidth to do that for like sports, I followed my whole life alone, like trying to add new ones at this point. The discourse on that stuff is pretty bad though, because it's Yes, I do think Caitlyn Clark has definitely helped elevate the WNA profile, but she's not like the genesis of physical competition, where it's like, oh, they have it out for Kaitlyn Clark. It's like if you've ever watched like seconds of a WNBA game, like it can be physical and could there be like like an undercurrent of that with someone somewhere, Sure, but like the leap right to that feels like lazy. I don't know. I think, well, see, this is me being a fan, so I don't have to be rational. That's this is the beauty part of it is. I kind of think there is some and I understand it, Like there are a lot of good women basketball players before Kaitlyn Clark, like and I can imagine being a player thinking like why why now? Like it should everyone should be glad that more people are paying attention like because of her. Frankly, like you can look at all the TV ratings numbers and like, yeah, Kaitlyn Clark was the driver of like an unseen spike and interest in women's that was a bit on the climb for like a while, and like even the like the women's college basketball like that, and Caitlyn Clark obviously a part of that, like Angel Reese was a massive part of that too, and even there was this is not scientific, but It's not something that frankly where I lived that I was used to hearing. I was at the gym around the WNBA draft at one point and there are these Jim bros next to me that were like dissecting the WNBA draft and they were shocked that so and so didn't get drafted higher. And I was like, so the and it wasn't a it wasn't like a Kitlyn Clark thing. Yeah. So, like there's layers to this beyond Caitlyn Clark and I just the clip. You need to look at Steve Nate Smith just putting his foot in his mouth and like he basically said, who talks about the w n b A or women's sports more than first take more than Steven A. Smith? And Monica McNutt rightly said, to be fair, you have the type of platform and power to where you could have been talking about this three years ago, and you need to go look at the face react will I'm always up for that, Okay, shut up. We did w NBA Corner here for like eight nine minutes. That's pretty good. Basically uninformed opinions though, which are probably the huge part of the problem. Entirely uninformed, uh I have uh be rich. Are you ready to get into the mind of a psychopath? I'm in it. Let's go who number one? I was drafted in the NBA lottery in the mid nineties and finished fourth in Rookie of the Year voting. So it's an NBA player, got it? Kah, Let me totally reframe. Okay, mid nineties, fourth and Rookie of the Year. I have to you said lottery, mid lottery. Just I think, Uh, now, you're gonna make me go back. I don't know what mid lottery means. Drafted in the lottery in the lottery in the mid nineties and was fourth and Rookie of the year. Oh, let's go with man. Why is this so hard? I don't know, Ray Allen, if they would have given you it's not Rayale, but if you would have given you a year, I get what like you take this? It gets hard when it's just the mid nineties. I'd gonna try. I had to throwing out there clue two. My sophomore season, I was an All star, averaging twenty two point four points and ten point two rebounds for a team that finished under five hundred twenty two to ten. Mid nineties lottery pick rookie year. So really really just second year was fully had arrived. Let's see Antonio mcdce. No, I like that, guest though, I like that guess too. I thought I might have it. Clue three. I'd played my first seven seasons for an Eastern Conference team I'm most associated with, starting ninety seven percent of games in which I played. During that time. I was a three time All Star, but I only led my team to the playoffs twice. Okay, now we're getting somewhere mid nineties, big guy on an East team that never was all that good? Is it three All Star games too in the first seven years yet? Well, okay, let's think I'm sensing stern to get a wizard's vibe. But I don't know who that would be. Man' I don't have a guess. I don't know. Clue four. I led the NBA in three point attempts in three consecutive seasons in the early two thousands. Some might say I was Steph Curry before Steph Curry if they had experienced a head injury. Despite peaking at eight attempted threes per game midway through my career, I was a career sixty three point three percent free throw shooter. This number actually got me. What the fuck? Okay, hold on, so this guy ten over ten rebounds a game his second year and then became a super high volume three point shooter, like way ahead of when that was a thing. Correct, this should be easy. Who is this well also a poor free throw shooter for his career. That's got to throw you off a little bit too. Yeah, I mean, well, I'm so that's like, oh, on top of everything, and so this is drafted by an East team. I want to say Richard Lewis, but that's that's not right. I think he was the Sonics first man. What guys are getting a bunch of rebounds and shooting threes in like the early two thousands in the East, in the East Toronto. Now I'm just like thinking of teams, like just just just naming teams. I feel like I should have it or but I don't want to just sit here silently running through Eastern Conference teams. Oh Antoine Walker, Oh shit, you got it. Nice shot there the shooting threes, but has no business shooting threes? Did you know about how bad he was as a free throw shooter? I remember that now, but I just I was trying to think of like he really was getting him up like way before and he shouldn't have been. He's like the last guy that should have been shooting that many threes. What a time that he was allowed to do that. The other three clues were late in my career. I was part of a five team trade involving the Heat, Grizzly, Celtics, Hornicks, and Jazz. This trade was pittabule and getting Greg osterteg to facill his destiny and finished his career with Utah. Other notables involved are Eddie Jones, Russell Butler, James Posey, and Quintell Woods. The Celtics traded me to the Miami Heat for two seasons and I had to be Pat Riley's least favorite player of coach ever. In fact, in the two thousand and six two and seven season with the Heat, I was a negative wind share for forty eight player. Second to last Cup grant, you're going to get it on the next clue. The last clue I love headbands and my nicknames was Cyber Twan Cyber That's right. Nick NBA nicknames are totally fucked, you know, there was It was a different time it used to be really good at it. You used to have principles as a society. The nicknames went to ship. All right, I can't. I let's so I have two from be rich here. Uh. I can give you the hard I'm going to give you the what I think is the easier one. Actually know what, No, you deserve the harder one. Just witnessed me go how many ques? Uh Breonna Stewart. I couldn't even get it. I think the harder one is more interesting. I'm still gonna give you the harder one. Deal with it. Your appetite for seeing me fail is a little You're not gonna fail. Uh. Clane number one, I was a wait what I thought? I thought this was someone? Oh no, it is okay. Clue number one. I was a first round pick for a Western Conference team in the early nineties, drafted from an SEC school. Those are schools typically in the in the South Dan colleges. What wait, what is it? What does the SEC stand for Southeast Conference? Oh, that's not something to do with stocks. It's also the Securities and Exchange Commission, which this feel like this. This person might have had a dalliance with the SEC at one point, but this is referring to his college conference. So what was the first clue that just from an SEC school picked by a West team in the first round? Pick Western Conference team in the early nineties. All right, so it's down and down. That just might be fewer than fifteen teams at that point, right, probably like twelve teams in the early ninety would you say mid nineties? Just no, early nineties? Oh that changes everything. I don't even have a step Francis. No, it is not Steve Francis. Uh number two. This is a great clue. Much to Dan Chagrin, I finished second and Most Improved Player voting in my second season, averaging twenty one points, four point nine rebounds, and four point seven assists. I haven't done the research, but I'm most likely one of the only players to finish second and most improved but make first Team All NBA in the same season. What first Team All Where do you go to school? Kentucky? But as not Jamal Mashburn. That's a good Kentucky considered an SEC school. You know what you want? My I think so first team All NBA in his second year in the early nineties. Oh yeah, that's not a This player better be a good player a great player Clue number three. After six seasons in the Western Conference, I was traded to the East, and primarily as a bench contributor, helped my team reach the NBA Finals. I also finished tenth and most improved. So he went making first Team All NBA to four or five years later coming off the bench. So I didn't remember that. I'm gonna take Bill's word for it that he did come off the bench for this team. I definitely remember him being in the finals, but I couldn't. I couldn't remember that he was coming off the bench for this East team and he won a championship. No, it just says he reached the NBA finals. I have no idea, all right. The following season, I became a starter, averaged eighteen point six points per game, My team again made the playoffs, and I earned a five year, sixty two million dollar contract extension. No, okay. A few seasons later, despite being a thirty three percent career outside shooter, I set an NBA record for most three point makes without a miss, dropping thirty eight points on the Clippers in the process. What a year are we even in right now? So my mind is so scrambled, no keep going all right. After missing the playoffs a few seasons in a row, I was traded back to the Western Conference, where I started eighty two regular season games and my team finished with the number one seed. What a career. This guy's just so let me, I'll try to synthesize where we're at. First round pick in the early nineties, is all NBA first team in his second season? Yeah, that's like, how do I not know that? Well? I? And also I told Bill, I think we might have done this guy before. And I but that's when I remember. I don't know if that's that's what I feel like. Telling you that I specifically remember a lot about this player is also like a clue in itself, but that I mean, that could be anything. I definitely had multiple posters of this player when I was like in the mid nineties and maybe early nineties. Uh so these so anyway, this Tanta Clara from the SEC. Uh so he so this guy so and then go all NBA ends up getting traded to an Eastern Conference team where he makes the finals, and then goes back to the Western Conference where he's the starter on the number one seed of a Western Conference team Jason Richardson. No, No, that's a you're too You're too late, but like kind of similar arc. I would say, I think I could give you the clue of when he was on the West team that was a number one seed. I want to say, that's, oh, what year is that? Maybe like it's either one or four. I think you want to last. Yeah, I don't know who was number one in the West. I mean the Lakers were probably one of those years the one seed. Here, here's the last clue. During my last season, ron our Test broke my biggest career record, longest suspension ever handed out by the NBA, longest suspension ever handed out by the end he had the record, it can't be shed because he won a title. So that the fact that the reason for the suspension is not in any of the clues is because the reason for the suspension is like the biggest giveaway for this player that you would get immediately, like what he did to get suspended, It's like it's like the defining thing of his career. I would say, it's not making first team All NBA, No, guess not, because I don't know what the this is. Let's see, I could give I'm trying to think of a clue I could give you that wouldn't just give it away. I could give you the Well, I'll give you the teams. Uh So, the team that he was drafted by is the Warriors, for whom he made All NBA. The next team he goes to that makes the finals. That he's on in the East is the Knicks, and then the number one ninety nine Knicks. This is the last time they made the finals. Yeah, and and then he ends up. I think it's it's he's back on the Timberwolves when they are the number one seed. Is just Spree? Well it is Spree? Well you are correct? Wow? What Yeah, none of those clues make me think of Trell' spree. Well, so, now you're never going to forget that he was All NBA First Team in his second year. I think he came off the bench for the Knicks. I didn't know that either. I think we may have to fact check that that aspect of it. Well, he said it was only for the first season, right, Yeah, Well, who's starting? Is it? Because Allen Hughes since there still is he is, he can't get in there over Allen Houston. So yeah, he came off the bench for them. The first season, he only started four games. He only made thirty seven appearances, but then he started for them thereafter. Oh, I'm a fun little I have a fun that won't blow up his spot. I have a fun little Latrell's pretty well story for you off air. Oh wow, I can't I'm looking forward to it. Yeah, so, like you couldn't put the choking the coach in the clues because you're just like, well, that's Objecinitely you could tell me I'm not going to know, but it's like, oh, yeah, that would have been it. Yeah, that's a I mean, would you agree that is like the first that's in the first paragraph of his like who threw me off? Because I would have tried to think of a player who was way better than la Trell's pretty well about the second team all NBA. I never would have first team a LBA. Excuse me that I never would have been able to get off that. Yeah, No, that's that's like because I'm I want to go look now, I forget what year that it had to have been, because I think he's drafted in the ninety because I think Weber's ninety one and so Spree, well's the year after that, So he makes it in ninety three ninety four, which I think was when Jordan is playing baseball, right, that's one of the years he's gone, And so that's how he gets on first team. That's got to be what how that worked, because otherwise, like Jordan just his first team every year. That's kind of funny. So he makes All Defensive Team his second season, then never makes another Deep for the rest of his career or another All NBA team. Yeah, are you looking at his numbers right now? Yeah? So what did Spree will? I was when I was talking about eleventh in MVP voting as a sophomore, did he uh what? I was thinking, Like, I bet he shot like forty two percent from the field for his career? What what? What is his career field goal percentage and a half percent? I know, I know Spree he was like he would not be highly regarded today. I don't feel like because he was really inefficient and just like didn't I don't know what who I would compare to feel like he had like a pretty looking jump shot though, like if he was super athletic too, and like really could guard when he was younger, and cared. He was an awesome dunker too. He was a good in game dunker because he would always like cock it all the way back with two hands behind the head, like that was his signature. Can you guess how many seasons did he shoot at least fifty percent inside the arc? Inside the arc? I mean on TWESA? I mean probably like what one two year and what was his career three point shooter? He was like thirty three or three point seven. His highest shooting percentage from two was forty eight point eight percent as a rookie with the Warriors, right when he's like on a super restrictive probably shot diet well, No ten two pointers per game? Wow, fifteen point four points is a rookie and that's what that's ninety two ninety three is a rookie year. Yeah, yeah, I don't know, team, I can't remember. Also, I guess he couldn't put the clue about him turning down a forty million dollar contract because of that or ten million dollars year contracts. You need to defeat his family. His family also the data like like spin the spree well spinners, like I mean that the spinning rims that got put on a shoe After a while, that was the thing. Oh yeah, fact, so we have more in the bank. But let's go to a different person. Rubikscal gave us one. We'll do that at another time. Let's go back to big Mic. Okay, who number one? Though my legal first name is Tavares. No one has ever called me that in my thirty years around the NBA. Tavares. Yeah, that rings a weird bell. This would be a one shot kill moment for you. Oh to VARs. God, damn it, I do know this. I just just not coming to my brain. Is it? Tr v A R I s like Tarvars Tava double r e s Jervaris Crittinton's long lost twin brother, Tavares. Now it was corrected. Nice shop. He's He's his actual name's Tavares. He just goes by Javaris. That's just because, No, all right, I don't have one shot kill I thought I did. I don't who number two? As a player, I was drafted by the Knicks twenty fourth overall in nineteen ninety four. I played with the Knicks for two years, being little more than a benchwarmer. I then played for the first ever Spurs team to be coached by Greg Popovich in nineteen ninety six. I was a Spur for three years, having my career year in ninety six ninety seven. Okay, Knicks to Spurs ninety six ninety seven is his best year. So who is good on the Spurs in ninety six ninety seven? Not Tim Duncan, He's not there yet. Those teams, well, I guess, David, they would have been good except for the one year. Who goes from the Knicks to the Spurs. Yeah, that's tough, uh, I don't I don't have a guess. Clu three after a one game pit stop in Denver in ninety eight ninety nine. I played two hundred and twenty five games with the Magic over three seasons, including all eighty two in two thousand and two thousand and one, making the playoffs in two of those seasons. Nick Spurs Magic. So now we're like late nineties on the Magic into the early two thousands. How did you say how many years it was with Orlando? Yeah? Three seasons, including all eighty two games in two thousand and two thousand and one, Nicks Spurs Magic. Should I know this? Like? Would you? It's I know it's hard to just afin me something. Well, I think you'll get it, but I don't know. This isn't someone that is necessarily I can't do that without giving away kind of all right, I don't know. I want to say, like bo Outlaw, but his name is Charles, so that's not who it is. Who. Four. I played my last NBA season in two thousand and two two thousand and three with the Sixers, retiring at the end of the year citing chronic knee issues. Well, everybody that retired at that time was had chronic knee issues. Uh, Sixers, Man, Nicks Spurs, Magic Sixers, I don't know, CLU. Five. In two thousand and five, I got my first NBA coaching job, joining Nate McMillan's staff with the Blazers. So he retires in two thousand and three and is on a coaching staff by two thousand and five. Man, okay, I'm swung up on Tavares like, I don't know if I should be fuck Nickspurs, Magic Sixers just and then as a coach like right away with McMillan. I don't know, don't, I don't know who the I can't name Nate McMillan's assistant coaching staff in two thousand and five. I don't have Yeah. In twenty ten, I got my first head coaching gig with Team X, the team i'm most associated with having coached Jesus twenty twenty ten head coach. Now, I feel like I should have this. I guarantee you'll get it before we're out of clues? Okay, do we have a lot of clues left? Is that what you're saying? There's ten total clues and I just gave you clues six? Four? Uh? I mean there can't be that many coaches that went right from whose career playing careers are really memorable? Who head coach? Uh Tyrone Corbin no oh Man. I felt pretty good about that. Clue seven. I was let go by Team X in twenty fifteen, but signed on to be the top assistant in Oklahoma City, Okay, oh Man, So he coached that team Team X for like five years and then ends up in OKC on that would have been Scott Brooks's staff. I think, oh, this, I should have this. Who's I don't know. I don't have it. I don't have it. I'm not gonna belabor it. Clue eight. I would join Brett Brown's staff in Philadelphia in twenty eighteen, after Lloyd Pierce took the Hawks job. Who is this? Ah, you'll get it on the next clue, all right, give me the next one. I'm annoyed. Clue nine. In May of twenty nineteen, I became head coach of the Phoenix Suns. Uh is this Monny Williams? Yes? I thought. I thought you were like gonna say, I don't know, But I did have a just a brief moment where I'm blanked and I was like, who used to coach the Suns? Because we just talked about them? The final clue was after four seasons in Phoenix, including two Coaches Association Coach of the Year awards, I was like, Oh, I want to spend time with my family, but the Pistons offered me thirteen brings trucks filled with money. Who could possibly say, no, what do you mean? I have to actually coach these kids? Damn it? They just had their more season in history. Now people think I'm a terrible coach. I appreciate Mike throwing in the like here you go, dummy, like final clue where it's just there's no one that's not going to get it. Eat it. So you're not a dummy. Yeah no, I need it, so okay, So now and looking back the Nicks, Yeah, okay, Nick's first, Matt Yeah, all right, all right, that's right, it is it is Monny Williams like I'm like verifying in my own brain. Oh man, would you like to take us out of here? Now that we did our quick podcast in one hundred minutes, yep, we'll be much quicker next time. We always promise and never deliver. Thanks everybody for listening, especially for contributing. All the guest players. Much appreciate it. If you have not already done so, please, wherever you get your podcasts, give you know, give us high ratings, five stars. Subscribe. If you haven't done that, I don't know how you're listening to this. If you just randomly decided to pick this podcast today, thanks subscribe anyway. Tell your friends. Tell your friends you found this. You've randomly decided to listen to a podcast and you subscribed, and they should too. Join our discord. Check out our merch links for both of those things, or YouTube podcast descriptions. I think that will cover it for now. Out shouts Franklin Latina apologies, Jared Allen