Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence, and is not intended for all
audiences. Listener discretion is advised. The problem is I fell asleep. I
fell asleep. When did you do CPR this morning? When I found it
for you? Paul? Yes, all right, guys. Here it is
season ten, episode two hundred and thirty eight of Sword and Scale, a
show that reveals that the worst monsters are real. Listen, guys. I
know it's weird for you. I know the electronic music. I know it's
not the spooky Halloween tunes you're used to. I know you clicked on the
face of a creepy doll and expected death metal to start blasting out of your
iPod nano. But that's just the basic bitch in you talking. Simmer it
down, Simmer it down. It's going to be okay. If something mindlessly
clichede doesn't appear in front of you every three seconds, you will survive.
Well, you may, who knows how fragile you are. Regardless, I'm
still here doing the same thing after ten years. But hey, maybe,
just maybe your naggy little DM will finally get me to see the error of
my ways and start opening up the show. With a little Lizzie Got a
makeup tutorial. Have you ever had an interaction with someone that just left you
absolutely dumbfounded? I know I have. Maybe they have you questioning reality itself
or even your own memory. Some people have this keen ability to manipulate,
and they make you feel like you're just going crazy, not even understanding what's
real anymore. Nothing makes sense. It's quite a feat, really, to
attempt to make a sound minded adult believe that the sky is green, even
when they're looking right up at it and see that it's blue. It takes
a particular set of skills to be able to pull that off. Yet it
seems like we keep seeing examples of that in pop culture and Twitter specifically.
I hate to bring up the Amber Heard case yet again, but watching her
testimony may have evoked some of the same feelings you've had with people like this
in your life. The gas lighting, the incessant gas lighting. So much
of our interrogation audio features perpetrators who've been caught red handed, yet still somehow
try to explain away all of the irrefutable evidence against them, to the point
where you just start going, are you crazy? Or am I? Many
of these suspects go to laughably ridiculous lengths to try to prove their innocence.
And again, these manipulation tactics sit in the tool belts more than just the
murderers on this show. You might have had an X or two that fits
the bill. Sure, the ability to twist and manipulate emerges at its full
force when someone is faced with the possibility of life in prison or even the
death penalty. But for most of the people in this scenario, the interrogation
room wasn't the first time they've had to employ these tactics. It becomes even
more of a habit. It's their way of life. It's a treasured part
of their personality that they arrogantly think will help them get out of just about
any situation in life. But went up against the clear eyes and sober mind
of the justice system. However, these petty, amateur techniques tend to make
suspects not look innocent but dumb. What is the location of your emergency for
seven four eight France Courts Apartment three four seven four eight, What's a streight
name France f r A NTV and the apartment number three As just a putty
sum medico my boyfriend is dead. You can send the line for the fun
apartment. Do not hang up. Well, that's abrupt. This call came
into the Orange County Sheriff's Department around lunch time on February twenty fourth, twenty
twenty. The caller lived in an apartment complex in Winter Park, Florida,
and as you just heard, she was calling because her boyfriend was apparently dead.
All right, risk Murphy's not really help me? Or seven for eight
France Lane, Apartment three France Court, France Court. Yes, okay,
just near McKenzie Drive. I don't know where that is. It kills her
departments, okay, four seven four eight friends correct? Correct, correct,
correct. I'm not kidding exactly what happened there. My birthfriend Harny, were
playing last night and I put him in a case when we were playing and
like kind of high to seek kind of thing. So I fell asleep and
I woke up and he was dead in the suit case. So I don't
know what happened. In case you didn't catch it, she said, I
woke up and he was dead in the suitcase, So I don't know what
happened. I don't know what happened. Okay, what's your partment number three?
M three? Yes, like he has like blood coming out of his
mouth, and I don't know if like he had a right okay, all
right, okay, listen, we're getting have a pot to you all right,
okay, okay, guys now, okay fo yeah, man, it's
we're on our way out there. Year yet fold seven seven one six eight
four. Okay, he hanging from somewhere? What man? No, I
put him out of the suitcase. I giving him CPR. Okay, so
he was in a suitcase. Yes, then I fell asleep. Okay.
How old is how old is working man? Forty two year old man?
All right? Okay, we're working here. We're standing to het u out
of your shares. I've set away out there, yes I are yeah,
okay, all right, listen to me. Okay that you see that you
need to confirm this one right and I understand you seed to confirm this easy
an easier away? Could allay? Conscious? Goll no purple? Do you
he breathing? No? All right? I need you to get a need
to get him on the floor flanders back for you. Okay, I did,
I did. I tried giving him CPR. All right, I tried
giving him. Yeah, okay, we happen. Okay, listen to me.
You did a different litive. I need you to get it for me.
Okay, what do you have an eaty available? No? All right?
Do you write by him now? I'm sorry you? Are you right
by him now? Yes? Okay? Okay, Lamela, okay, ma'am
listen, so listen. Eady cold and stiff, yes, okay, not
necessarily cold, but he's stiff. Okay, right, all right, look
to me, I listen. Listen to me. I want you to live.
Him flatters back from me on the floor. Okay, we're moving the
pillows. Okay, yes, I did, all right, okay and purple
all right, okay listen. Okay, man, that's fine. We're still
going to be too compressions of them. Okay, all right. You see
el of your hand on his breastbone right, a cent of the chest,
rabbige in the nipples? Yes? Would you have a at a top of
that hand, teddy, I'm telling you just look at any to tell okay,
great, Okay, your girdles okay, okay, let listen to me.
All right. I want to play. I want you to place the
heel of your hand Okay, rebbeteen the rabbeteen his chest or rebuteen his breast
bones. Put you at the top of that hand. We want we want
to pump his chest on me hard at fast go it is twice per second.
I'm doing it again. Okay, no, no, just keep on
pumping. That's all you need to do for me. Keep on pumping his
chest for minutes that. I don't need you to stop and talk on anything.
I just want you to conno and load for me. Okay. One
two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine,
ten eleven, Well thirty fourteen fifteen. Notice how the dispatch operator had
to basically four this caller to perform CPR while on the phone so you could
hear it happening. This is this is n Okay, man, just keep
on pumping his ships. That's all you need to do for me. Okay,
yes, please hurry up. Okay man, man, they're driving as
tacks as they can. Okay, don't stop the saying hurry up. Just
keep on pumping and counting. Okay, I'm still doing you sorry, just
keep you continue pump is connor. I they can come with you. One
two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight nine eleven.
Well, thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, sixteen, seventeen, eighteen,
nineteen twenty ring one, thank you, twenty very, twenty four, twye
five thy fix thwenty seven, thway twenty nine thirty are you one? Threk
you two? Please hurry. Okay, man, there's getting her fast as
they can. Okay, he stares as her phone. Okay, keep pumping
for me, ma'am. I'm still doing it. Okay, I'm still doing
it all right. Okay, that's fine to be even a good job.
Just keep on doing it for me, all right. They're getting her fast.
They can long with the sheriff's off. It's also okay. If you
were on the other end of this call, you'd probably be thinking this is
going to go one of two ways. Either this woman is really distraught and
has a lack of patience because of what she's just been through, or she's
a real piece of work and deputies are about to have an interesting day.
Keep on pumping, man, three four one two three four one two three
four. Keep on pumping for me. Man, I'm doing okay, we're
bringing all right, I understand, all right. Just keep on company for
me, okay, okay, hurried right, Okay, horrible. Is this
mor happened? What happened? A you? What happened? Okay? Man,
just keep on pumping his chest for my Opay, they're they're in they're
they're in the parking lot. They should be called they're shortly Okay, I'm
still doing it. Okay, all right, okay? Good? Are you
following him in a suit case? He said, yes, we're playing you
see last night? I thought, A sweet I think that's right. Just
keep on pupping the chests until they pop over. I am okay, Hi
am okay, I am okay, hip let them think of one for you.
Okay. At this point, paramedics and Orange County Deputies were arriving on
scene. Police were greeted by a frantic forty two year old Sarah Boone.
She was a small mouseie woman with a short bob and bad posture. She
had her hands clasped together, pulling on her zip up hoodie like a child
as she waited for the officers to approach. Hello, then we lived here,
Yes, okay, How hope you guys get the property manager? I
tell him really quick or want that? Oh, don't worry about that.
We'll take there. That for you, okay, so right off the bat,
Sarah was concerned with making the property manager aware of the situation. Also,
she didn't seem to be even a little bit sad about the death of
her boyfriend. It seemed like her primary emotion was confusion. How could this
have happened? We were just playing hide and seek? I really need something
to drink. Okay, Well I got my doctor park roma counter. Okay,
okay, kay? What what who is he to you? Boyfriend?
This? Because like three and a half years what happened? And we ranked
us putting a puzzle together? And we can do some art right there there,
and well, you are putting a puzzle together. Yes, we have
a puzzle that we started in there. Okay. We've been doing our time
taking stuff off the wall to make new art put up there, like having
a good time with one another. But we're thinking. We had a bottle
of wine last night. So then it's like we set to play, right
okay, Okay, how he looking with you? But no, I called
him over here, okay, Okay. I didn't know what to do.
Okay, I didn't know what to do. Okay. So there was a
lot of information in those short interactions. First, she seemed to be concerned
with getting something to drink. That cotton mouth is really annoying. Sarah will
mention this several more times to the officers while they're on the scene. Then
she explained to one of the deputies that she and her fiance had been drinking
a bottle of wine the night before. Sarah also told the deputy that she
and her boyfriend, George Torres, had been doing a puzzle and some arts
and crafts out in the main area of the apartment when they decided to play
hide and seek, you know, like adults do. I guess everyone has
their weird what would you call it? Quirks? I mean, let's also
keep in mind that these are two people in their early forties playing hide and
seek. Anyway, Sarah went on to tell the deputy that George decided to
get into a suitcase, as you would. They thought it would be funny.
It does sound like we're talking about a couple of ten year olds left
on their own, but I digress. At the end here, Sarah shared
with the deputy that the man approaching them was her ex husband. Sarah called
him first because she didn't know what to do. How bizarre is this whole
situation right now, by the way. Yeah, let's talk all you guys.
The problem is I fell asleep. I fell asleep. When did you
do CPR this morning? When I found it for you called yes one o'clock
right now. I tried. I was awake, but I actually got out
of the bed of like twelve thirty whatever. So I came downstairs and I
was like, oh, he's in the sky still when I found him and
I took him out and then I called him and then I called you guys.
He get hit before the fire of fiem. I got here. Who
your husbands at something? Okay? What hear? It? All right down
the street? Okay? So you were playing and he didn't come up there?
I did, But did I fell a sweet Okay? Okay, I
don't I want to here. I'm just trying to figure out what happened so
sweep, So I don't know if these keys I had an inn reason,
our heart attack or what medical condition. And then then I know him.
No. No, all we had was a bottle of wine, literally,
just a bottle of wine, okay, doing puzzle artwork. Then we decided
to wait. Hadn't see just a bottle of wine doing puzzles artwork. Then
we decided to play hide and seek. Not even chet GPT could make this
stuff up. Guys, that's all that happened. Okay, So I don't
know. I don't want it there. So what happened? So? How
long were you doing CPR on him prior to you falling that one? One?
You try that all more? Yes? Okay, but I called him
while I wasn't start probably fall apart here. Let me feel this defintian Okay,
please man, my doctor Pepper, I am also caught. Now,
just give us anything. I don't let you passing up. This is probably
a lot for you to do, right, water, water, I can
get you some water, okay, Just I want you that on your seat.
I don't want passing out on your I need okay, I'll get some
show. Yeah, just so you can visualize this properly. Sarah's facial expressions
throughout these interactions are very startling. She's wide eyed, a little bit scary
looking, kind of in your face, with a leaning forward posture that kind
of makes you want to slowly back away, especially given that its point of
view bodycam footage. If you go watch it, it looks like she's coming
for you go check it out links in the show notes. Anyway, it
was apparent to everyone on the crime scene that something was not quite right up
in Sarah's head. She eventually got tired of waiting for a drink from someone,
so Sarah went over to the outdoor faucet meant for hoses, turned it
on, and crouched down to drink from it. Meanwhile, the same officer
that had been interviewing Sarah had moved over to interview Brian Boone, Sarah's ex
husband. He seemed to be much more clear headed. So kind of tell
me how you came here to day? Well, I've been um calling your
life, yes, yes, about a year and a half, eleven thirties
when I started calling it out. It is supposed to be her day,
okay, don't really have very good about always doing it. Okay, So
Sarah is someone who tends to drink and forgets to pick up her own child
for visitation. But Brian Boone had a lot more to share. I started
calling like eleven thirty, hold every half hour hour or so, and then
finally got a hold of her twelve forty nine, told me what was going
on in my come over here? And why came over got over here cold
her. You can call nine one one, get some the over here and
then basically she said she needed to go outside of a drinking a cigarette.
Okay, so that's pretty much the way you have. We're gonna make a
few funk hawk and then we'll go from there. You know he has a
medical issues or okay, but you've met him before, I've met him before.
Year They've got a whole fun history. So these two had a long,
exciting history. The Sheriff's office was already very familiar with this couple,
but Georgia's suitcase demise wasn't a cut and dry death, not by any means.
Despite Sarah's odd mannerisms and statements, investigators never could have imagined the strange
path this case would take them down. On February twenty fourth, twenty Orange
County deputies arrived at an apartment complex in Winter Park, Florida, and discovered
a dead body in a suitcase. That body belonged to forty two year old
George Torres Junior. Apparently, while he and his fiance were playing hide and
seek the night before, George decided to get into the suit case and allowed
his girlfriend, Sarah Boone to zip him up. If you're a guy listening
to this, never do that. There, I just saved the life.
Sarah frantically claimed that she fell asleep and forgot about George in the suit case.
When she woke up the next afternoon, She told police she went downstairs
and realized he was still zipped up inside. When she opened the suit case,
it was clear to her that George was dead. Sarah's ex husband,
Brian Boone, called her during this debacle earlier in the day, and he
was actually the one who convinced her to call nine one one. Once Orange
County deputies completed quick outside interviews with both Sarah and Brian, they packed up
Sarah in the police cruiser and got an other statement and the front seat is
can you see an email? Sarah, ben I am going to read you
your rights, but it's just because that's how we do things. Okay,
So last night you said that you and your boyfriend George were here at your
residence, and UM, tell me what what you guys were doing next?
Like, what what was happening? We had a bottle of wine, we
painted, we drew, we did puzzles. Do you remember what wine.
You guys are drinking, um, what is what good? Chardonnay? Okay,
the bottles are in the trash Okay. Notice how she was adamant about
the fact that she had a bottle of wine, but then went on to
tell this investigator that the bottles plural could be found in the trash can.
It's also a bit odd that Sarah seemed to continually try to inject the puzzles,
arts and crafts into the story, as if those details held any importance
whatsoever. And you guys were doing puzzles and art okay, listening to music,
enjoying each other's company, and all downstairs upstairs where did you stare?
Stone stairs? Okay? We usually sit on the back porch because we smoked,
you know, a lot of smoke inside, so okay. And who
was here last night? Was it just the two of you? Yep?
Okay. No one ever came over at any point, no, no,
okay, we called us daughters on FaceTime. Okay. We're just literally just
enjoying one other's company. Okay. And you guys share the phone that you
have, correct, so telling you what happens next? You're painting. Your
guys are doing this puzzle together. You obviously finished the bottle of bottle of
wine. Yes, did you have one or two bottles of wine? Well,
we had one previously that was maybe not even half full, okay,
but then so you finished that one, and then you had the full one.
Yes, And from there just waiting, we were puzzled out, we
were painted out. So being silly, let's play hide and seek, which
we have played before, Like I don't know if you've opened the door on
the top of the stairwell like he and I have hidden in there before,
like just having fun and enjoying each other's company. Okay, So I mean
that's literally all it was. And then the suitcase is downstairs because I was
telling you we were getting ready to donations, and because it's not a very
good suitcase. The what was the question, I'm sorry, you were just
explaining to me the night. Oh, he decided to hide in there,
so being silly, he and I were sitting there laughing at it, like
with him in there. And then so I didn't zip it up all the
way, but I mean enough to where his little fingers were out there and
whatever, but still having a good time and whatever. Then I guess I
decided to go upstairs, and I don't know, I fell asleep. So
I woke up this morning and again thought he was downstairs on the laptop looking
for a job, as he usually is, and then thought where is he?
Is he on the back porch to see in the bathroom, like where
is he? And then I came to about the suitcase, so I opened
suitcase. I took him out, stretched him out for reference, Sarah is
about five three, one hundred thirty pounds, while George was five to four
and one hundred and forty pounds. I mean, the guy fit into a
piece of luggage. These height and weight details come from police records and prior
domestic violence incidents. But in each of George's mug shots over the years,
he starts to look more gaunt. He was a skinny guy to begin with,
and in his final mug shot he looks sickly. Started to do CPR
where air was coming out and then like whatever, gurgle? I mean,
so I'm trying to do CPR on him. I'm shaking him, trying to
get him to come too. But I could tell if by looking at him
something was wrong. He's been losing his teeth lately and has been complaining about
his chest hurts, which is why I keep trying to get him to go
to the doctor. But because he nor I have a job or insurance,
has been putting it off so again, so I didn't know what to do,
so I called Brian, my ex husband. I called him. He
came over, just walked in and then walked out. I grabbed my phone
and I called you guys. After hearing Brian Boone's account of the situation and
the nine one one call, I'm sure you're realizing the discrepancies in Sarah's recollection
of events. That's not quite how it all went down, not to mention
the lack of logic and so many of the decisions Sarah made. Why on
earth would she leave him zipped up in a suitcase before going to bed?
How could she have forgotten? Why did she wake up so late almost twelve
hours later and still not remember George until she saw the suitcase downstairs? But
also love to know what she trumped about the first time you woke up this
morning, did you look at your phone just see what time it was?
No? Most of the time, like I'll wake up, but because he
or I have a job. I'll usually just lay in the bed for a
little bit longer because the house is clean. There's nothing else that we can
do. Me thinking he's on the laptop looking for jobs. I can't use
the laptop, so most of the time I'll just stay in the bed and
collect my thoughts and get ready for the day. So do you have any
idea what time you woke up that first time? What time it may have
been. I don't know if you guys haven't when I say eleven something,
eleven something? Okay? Maybe is that when you finally got up or is
it the first time you woke up? No, that's the time that I
decided to get because I figured he was downstairs on the laptop. So and
look for jobs on the laptop, and then it usually all clean. He'll
look for jo or vice versa, where I'll look for jobs and he'll clean.
So you think you got out about after eleven at some point, yes,
okay, but we can't recall which time. Do you think you were
up for, like hours before that or not acting? Your thoughts ran because
I was supposed to have my son today. When I'm up from school,
Brian usually calls to make sure, Hey, Are you sure you're getting Lucas
today? Because I've had job interviews? Are you going to pick up Lucas?
So after he called like maybe three, four times, maybe five,
I finally answered, and that's like, do you think you were sleeping and
missed those calls? No? I ignored them. You ignored them because he's
notorious for blowing out my phone. But I understand why, because he's making
sure that Lucas gets home. Right. Yeah, this woman has a history
of drinking and forgetting to pick up her son from school, yet she chose
to ignore or her ex husband's reminder calls that morning. There was nothing on
Sarah's mind, laying there, unemployed in bed at eleven am. Nothing was
important to her that morning, least of all her boyfriend downstairs suffocating in a
suitcase. This is also something Sarah seems confused about. She doesn't understand what
happened to George, like a toddler who squeezed a hamster too tight and doesn't
understand why it's no longer moving. At some point, someone would have to
explain to this lady that she killed George Torres. No matter how you slice
it, like I couldn't, I still to the I don't I don't know
what happened, like I don't know what happened, but the whole teeth losing
thing, and I don't know what happened, like, I don't know what
happened, I don't know what. He and I were having an amazing time
yesterday like we normally do, no arguments, no nothing. And the thing
with him though, is, which is why we've been doing puzzles and artwork
lately, is that he's been stressing about a job, of course, which
we've talked about. So what I did was start having him do puzzles and
artwork to keep his mind off of it. His ex wife is all over
him about sending money, which he can't do because he doesn't have a job,
so he was stressing about that. He's been stressing about the job.
But that's why I started to buy puzzles and paint to get his mind off
of them, which is what we I don't know if you noticed on the
wall in there, it's all of our artwork and stuff, so I don't
know. I mean music, art and playing with the dogs, dancing around
the room with the dogs, and then decided to play hide and seek because
we're always trying to outdo each other on where we could find we can hide
the best. Even though these sound like made up excuses, something tells me
these people might actually have been the type to play hide and seek. How
often you guys play hide and seek? Gosh, that was maybe what the
third time? Maybe? Okay, is it a more recent game you've gotten
into or three times in total in your relationship you're talking about lately? Lately?
Because again, like we were puzzled out, we're paying it already,
so why not. All Sarah remembered is that she and George called and talked
about his two daughters, then called Sarah's son Lucas, before playing hide and
seek. By this time, it was dark outside. Okay, so you
know it's dark out, but you're not really sure what time it is you
play hide and seek? How when you guys playing, I didn't seek before
he decides to get into the suitcase. Wasn't approximant, It wasn't really I
hit upstairs in the shower and then came downstairs because I was tired of hanging
out in the shower. Okay, so that's when he was playing around in
the suitcase. So because we both thought it was funny that, Oh yeah,
well I'm gonna zip you up. Uh huh, you didn't come look
for me. So again, it's a broken suitcase. But what do you
mean more broken? It's only got one of these. But because I didn't
zip it up all the way, he was doing the You mean it doesn't
have like the poll part correct? Okay, but no, it's gotta I
think it's gotta what do you call it? A piper clip? Okay,
so the sipper to it is missing, like the actual zipper that attaches to
it to help you open and close is missing. But you think a paper
clip was on it instead, there is a paper I believe there's a paper
clip on it because I know that the last time you used to like help
us assume well, or you can just stick your fingers in there and right,
yeah, yeah, you zile yourself, which is why I did not
zip it up all the way. So how much did you zip it up?
I mean I don't really know. He said his finger, he was
his fingers were able to stick out, Yeah, two fingers, okay,
Yeah, so I'm figuring he he'll go get it, he'll get it.
But then I wanted to go upstairs and waited for him, and eventually I
guess I fell asleep. I had the dogs in the bed with me,
was warm, and then fell asleep. Doesn't she know that during hide and
Seek, you can't all be hiding as someone playing the rules of this game.
To this woman, someone has to be actually seeking. That's the point.
That's why it's in the name of the thing. I can't get over
how strange this explanation is. To get a better understanding of Sarah and George's
dynamic, police spoke with the property manager of the apartment complex. Sarah and
George had lived in their unit for a couple of years by this point,
and the property manager had quite a bit to say Sarah when shortly after she
moved in um with George, she came into the office to talk to me.
We noticed bruises and stuff are and she asked me if she could talk
to me priorly and asked how I could how she would be able to get
George of the lease. Is there anywhere you need a where? She prompted
deeper conversation. She was as let me know, and was showing me a
lot of buses. A marse Prince strates at one point had to go to
the hospital or multiple conversations that we had had it sadly progressed. You know,
she had a very large gash at one point in her shin. She
had to go to the hospital and get that taken care of. But you
know, she came to me at one point asking, you know, what
do I do by health? And I didn't get rid of him. You
know, I don't dealt with this type of situation. Um. I just
canceled her as she continued to come to me and explained her that you know,
she had to make a decision if she was going to stay with him
or not be with him, because she was going to try to work things
out out. There be something. Um. It wasn't too long after that
last conversation that I found out the police again and Georgie was arrested. Less
than a year prior to the suitcase incident, George was arrested for battery or
dating violence. As Florida calls it, here's Sarah's ex husband again. They've
got a whole fun history. Really really okay, I'm not there, I
haven't been here personally. He's current because of it with her. Yes,
Okay, he got him were trials something or other. He had to go
to a arm semestic violence class. I don't know he was doing it a
role officer, stuff like that, but I mean, like today she was
trying to get about. Sarah told police that George had hit her, that
she had been beaten in the face, head, legs, and arms.
She told them she begged George to stop, and that Georgia allegedly replied,
you are going to die. Sarah said, He then punched her in the
head and threw her off the bed. This incident was apparently triggered by Sarah
talking to another guy. The officer who responded to this call noted that Sarah
did have injuries to her face and hairline and scratches on her neck. He
also noted that George had scratches on his neck as well, though he couldn't
remember how they happened, we know they drank from Would you heard combining a
lot? Would you hear? Sarah's odd behavior makes a lot more sense when
you factor severe alcoholism into the equation. She wasn't just a wine mom.
She was that crazy, falling down drunk neighbor person. The complaints throughout their
whole term, roughly about twenty to thirty moys complaints, fighting, arguing,
banging on doors, about music is just always something pertaining to their lifestyle.
I do know that I have seen both of them intoxicated as early as nine
o'clock in the morning, and I mean staggering, falling down intoxicated, both
of them. And there was always some point that I had received about some
fighting. One day that was going on, and Sarah was actually wandering around
the property very girl, barefoot. I'm not properly dressed. I'll say it
like that, sitting on the side of her building. A lether retention far
Sarah and George's next door neighbor also had a few odd interactions with the couple,
like what do you mean interactions? I remember one night she slept on
the back porch of my apartment for some reason. I don't remember much,
but I just remember like looking at those shave see like laid down. Did
you wake her? No? I? Okay? And by sleeping, um,
you guys all have like a cement area, right, like a back
patio, but it's not enclosed. Um, just what she had a chair
on the ground or ground on the ground, Okay, Any other run ins
with her. She witnessed with her, I was coming home from class one
night. I would not be able to give you a time period, sure
when it is. And I was waiting on my roommate to get home because
I had left my keys in the apartment. And I remember I she came
over and was talking to me for a minute, and it was very visible
that like she was talking to me because she didn't want to be to her
apartment. I don't know why, but I didn't ask, but okay,
it's just very evident that she didn't want to be there. Would you already
speak with George by herself? Like didn't you ever find any about their relationship?
The one time where like I was just saying that when I talked to
her, she wanted me. She asked me to go talk to him,
but she's like, please, but with the fear of guy and the fear
guy, I'm a very extern property manager. You know, I don't tell
her him alone, right, And she knew that, and um, she
seemed scary him at the time. So I said, sure, I'd probably
just stay here, I would talk to him. I when I sat down
and talked to George, her I'll turn her about thirty minutes altogether. And
you know, George had explained to me that she was actually the arrestive one,
and the reason she ended up with marks is in my I'll say,
my perception of what he was trying to explain is that she's wearying hands on
in the face, you know, dramatized and talking to him explaining or fustle
letter they might even do him. And I believe that because Jean, my
assistant, doesn't want to deal with her or or like the play, because
she was always here already, she carried hands on. There was one day
my precord was that same day that I talked to George by himself, she
kept grabbing me by the arms, to the point that I told her,
I said, you know, I'm either going to contact the police or whatever
we need to do, but she can't keep grabbing. I had asked for
several times to care touch him. Maybe the property manager was onto something.
Turns out some of what she had to say was backed up by police records.
A year before George was arrested on battery charges, both Sarah and George
were arrested for battery against each other. The first case in twenty eighteen,
was sparked by Sarah asking another man for a cigarette at a bar. This
version is all according to Sarah. By the way, apparently George was angry
about her talking to another man, and the two went back home and continued
arguing. Sarah claimed the conversation became physical when George dragged her upstairs, and
in the process, she told officers George kicked her in the eye with his
heel. She refused medical treatment. George's sequence of events was a bit different,
though. He told police that they were both home that night, drinking
and arguing as they do. George said that he tried to go upstairs to
avoid Sarah, but on his way up the stairs, she grabbed his throat
with both hands and began choking him. Both Sarah and George are relatively small,
skinny people, and George said he couldn't breathe. George told them that
at this point he kind of collapsed and was sitting on the steps kicking at
Sarah trying to get her off of him. He said he really felt like
he was going to suffocate if he didn't stop her, and in the process
of frantically kicking, he admitted that he may have kicked her in the face.
The kicker here is that the injuries more closely matched George's version of events
See what I did there. Officers took photos of the strangulation, marks and
abrasions on his neck and of Sarah's bruised eye. Both of them were arrested.
The second incident in twenty nineteen ignited when George allegedly stormed into Sarah's bedroom
while she slept and began screaming, punching her, and pulling her hair.
During the deputies encounter with Sarah, he noted that she was angry, obviously
very upset, and continued to apologize and state that she was fed up with
being hit. The officer saw that there were marks on the left side of
her neck, under her jaw, and an old bruise on her eye that
he stated was from an incident a few days prior. In this case,
when cops were questioning Sarah, George wasn't around to tell his side of things.
When they did finally track him down, he acted very surprised to see
them. An officer noted that George had some injury near his eye, but
refused medical treatment. The report mentions several times how surprised George was, especially
when they asked George what happened to Sarah. He told them point blank that
he didn't know. When they asked him how she got the marks on her
neck, George alluded to the fact that he himself gets hit all the time.
He asked the officer, what am I supposed to do? They told
George, okay, well, why don't you call the police on her when
this happens. George said he wouldn't do that, So they said, did
you give her those marks in self defense? He said no. Then they
asked did you hit her because she hits you? And George refused to answer.
For the rest of the interview, he was arrested for battery. So
now fast forward almost a year and we're back to February of twenty twenty.
On the twenty third, the day before George's death, he had a short
phone conversation with his brother. His brother's recollection of that call gave detectives a
good idea of how the relationship had been going lately, despite Sarah's report that
they had been getting along swimmingly. We were talking, I was playing dominoes
with my kids and my wife, and at first I wasn't going to pick
it up. Then I picked up because they were always fighting and stuff with
Oh God. So he started talking. He was calm, so I was
like, okay, so I'll put it on speaker, so my kids are
there, like they're joking around on it. He was joking around with them
and we're talking, and then he's talking to me about when we as kids,
and then like a couple of minutes after that, she that's when I
hear in the back start arguing with him, No, I have to call
my brother. I have to talk to him. And he's like, no,
I'm talking to my brother. It was her phone, so and then
she starts arguing and telling them that no, I'll tell them what you've been
doing to me. You choke me, this and that. But he was
calm, and he was like, okay, I gotta let you go on.
And then he said I love you, and I told him my love
basically with it. So she yells in the background, tell telling what you've
been doing to me, You've been choking me. Yeah. Did you ask
him anything about that? No? Because the thing with them, they would
fight and they would hit each other because there was times she came here and
she had hit him with her phone and he had a black guy, so
it was like, did you witness them? I didn't get to see it,
but he told him. Okay, So so you guys know that there's
domestic between the team, and I told them to get out of there,
get out of there. I would tell him leave, And what's crazy is
that he would leave come here, and she would call and tell him to
come back, and she would come and get them. I've been you know,
told about my neighbors. I'm sorry, I don't have it anymore.
But at one point, attendant actually sent us a video. But yeah,
there fighting and leading on each other out in my car. I thought she
evermated someone, you know, or it was an emergency. She could reach
out to me and I would do my but I've didn't help her. You
called out for But after a while, she just kept taking him back and
taking him back. I just saw arrest him. You know, he's just
gonna called it, I thought, because you don't wanted to stop. You
know, he's not doing anything to get help and bring to you, and
you just keep dealing with it. I mean, you know, there comes
a point where it's just stupid. The common denominator here is that Sarah's version
of incidents seemed to consistently leave out or twist some details, shifting all of
the blame off of herself and onto someone else. And let me tell you,
it only gets worse from here, folks. On February twenty fifth,
twenty twenty, Orange County deputies recovered the body of George Torres Junior from the
suitcase he died in and performed an autopsy. The next day, they spoke
to Sarah in the interrogation room. So this morning we went for his autopsy
and we were informed of some injuries that he has by the doctor. So
he's got scotch marks to his back. I know that's fun, okay,
And it's called contusion. Do you know what contusion is? So like,
basically you're getting hit and then you know, you get a mark from it.
You'll get bruising, like someone hate you or something like. That's called
a contusion. So he had some injuries to his left shoulder. He he
had to cut me or he's like lip. We could see we could see
his mouth as a hole. I haven't liked the hand on him. Okay,
also too, I he fell off my son's bike, Okay, so
I don't know. And he's notorious for running into the wall or the halting
as a why Okay, I don't know. What about the scratches because there's
also sex, yes, okay, because there's also like a like a scratch
on the back of his neck like kind of like going but it's like going
straight across. I have no idea what that's from. And they're all recent
like if they occurred recently, it wasn't something that occurred post or that occurred
a week ago, two days ago, three days ago. They definitely occurred,
you know, the night leading up so when he was in all honesty,
all honestly, we had not gotten into it. Okay, That's why
I like, the only thing I thought you guys were going to ask me
about, which I was going to ask with you. Anyway, I just
scratched marks on his back. Everything else. I have no idea what it
is. Didn't she just say that the bruises and other injuries were from falling
off a bike and running into walls. Now she's saying she doesn't know about
the bruises. She only has an explanation for these scratch marks. We're just
talking about what occurred Sunday, because, like I said, the injuries are
they occurred within that time period. So you're talking about day before yesterday,
Sunday leading into Monday. You called it yesterday at once. So but the
incident you guys were painting and stuff the night prior, correct, So we're
talking about Sunday. Why I thoroughly confused, because we had a good time
sitting on the back porch having wine and snow, a couple of cigarettes,
and then decided to go inside and literally paint, do puzzles and play and
listen a music. That's why nobody got out of sorts. This is what
mind blowing to me, Like I don't, I have no nobody laid a
hand on any boy. Here's their next door neighbor. Again, he remembers
what he heard that night, and it wasn't all fun in games. My
bedroom shares all with their lower half of their in the lower half. Okay,
do you recall hearing anything coming from Apartment three while you were After you
had gotten home around ten thirty, there was a very loud crashing sound where
I believe I'm not sure, having been in their arming, I remained that
I believe it is the location of the the staircase. Okay, so a
little bit of a very loud music crashing sound. Yeah, like it sounded
like something down the stairs because it started out high and then abandoned. Hmm.
Sounds a lot like he's describing a heavy suitcase being thrown down a flight
of steps. He also had um like on the left side of his forehead.
He had basically bruising and like his head and his skull. I have
no idea as if something hit him. I consider not for such Tarama.
I have not touched him. I have not touched him. How would you
get those? Tell me and we'll both know I have not touched him.
We had a good day. It was a good day. We've had good
days lately, even considering everything that's going on with our jobs and life in
general and ex wives and everything, it's been good. Like I don't even
know where this is coming from. Yeah, I think latched physical was probably
you said, I think what a month ago where you got those injury right?
You said, the us every weeks ever take yeah, a few weeks.
That was the last like physical altercation between the two of you. Um.
Month ago, you was a curtain Rod. Yeah, like Curtin Rod.
That's why I can't leave you. Guys didn't take that either. Like
we've been good. I don't know if like it's since the last time he
got out of jail. Like we've been good and he's been having his classes
men him seeing his pribation officer, who's amazing. So what do you mean
by good? What's your definition? Deformation officer? I know you said you
guys have been good? What's your definite? I've been good. I don't
think you will understand. He comes at me all the time. He comes
at me. Then why are you still with him? Everybody asked me that
when I tell you guys this, I really love who like I do,
and I feel like I can help him, like I feel like I could
help him, which I did, because he's come a really he came a
really long way from where he was in Philadelphia to moving back to hear and
to dealing with everything else that he's been dealing with. I just really helped
him. I failed not a jail, but three times. I've gone to
every single hearing and every single arrayment, everything that I did for him,
going to see all his public defenders, go to the state. I've gone
to the state. I did everything for him to get him, trying to
help him because I had but I hope inness and he was trying. He
was really trying. Just then he starts to think about things and it just
I think he gets overwhelmed, and then it's like the next thing to know,
he's drinking. So it's like, oh, man, I know where
this is going to go. So I'm gonna go upstairs and read a book,
or I'm gonna go for a bike ride, or I'm gonna do something
else where. I don't want to drink. I don't want to drink the
intentional wine whatever. Or if it's a weekend, that's when you have a
good time. You don't have to wake up the next day. I have
to wake up the next day and do things. I have to tend to
Lucas, I have to take him to school. I have all this stuff
to do. He doesn't know how to, I guess maintain himself where I
can do fifty things at once and still know the fifty things more previously prior
that I need to get done. He can't process like that. He didn't
process like that, so he would literally not literally, but had school come
out of his years. So the next thing, you know, he doesn't
want to deal with it. I'm going to go get something to drink.
So the majority of the time I would hang out outside or do something else
because I don't want to drink. The man you're about to hear from is
a maintenance worker at Sarah and George's apartment complex, and he's also a childhood
friend of George's from back in Philadelphia. They were close friends from the time
George was fourteen to his mid twenties. They reconnected fifteen years or so later
when George moved into his unit. Throughout the years that the couple lived in
this apartment building, the maintenance guy had been in and out for repairs.
He was around a lot and he saw a lot. This allowed him to
get to know Sarah pretty well. He often chatted with George separately, rekindling
their friendship and eventually had some deep conversations with George about his relationship or world
of the fact that George had a probation officer, he was in handler management,
and again they had the good times are bad times. Sometimes he would
instigate the situations when Jordan at the times Sarah Boom instigating the situations and she
ended up with buses. But that's more of him, like I push him
off of himself, okay, and that's when he's helped him. Yes,
very hard. Sarah verified idea Okay. Where they did they both drink off?
Yes, yes, okay, excess? What in excess? They didn't
drink to drink. They drank to smar as the sunset all the time.
In between, they just had a very rocking physical delisionship. I don't know.
Did you re see marks of bruises on him? Yes? Okay,
like what scratches on the back kind of he said with him with her attacking,
Kennedy's kind of just trying to stop her bad but because she's such lights
and as soon as he touched it, instant bruses old across the arms and
things of that nature. Right, Even though Sarah kept repeating over and over
to police that she and George had been doing well over the past several weeks,
she told the maintenance man something different. Entirely did they had it until
fight? He grabbed it by the hair and dropper downstairs two days probably about
two days to this situation, so that would be Saturday, over the weekend
took place a little again, satas AIRSI okay. Then she told us that
they were playing out and see he went to the suit shed they she loves.
She passed out, So they just had another blowout argument. A few
days prior to George's death. According to Sarah, she got dragged by her
hair again. Who knows what else ensued, what other details she might be
leaving out. The important part is that Sarah was probably angry after that encounter
and felt like she had the right to hurt George in response. And no,
I'm not just speculating about this. This time, Sarah didn't just scratch
at his neck to try to strangle him in the heat of a scuffle.
It seems like some parts of this crime were planned out. I got the
puddles and the faint to frank get him off of it, so we don't
have a drink, or he didn't have a drink. So when you all
see my phone, you can see all of the damage he has done to
me, and the videos advance smashing my television because he's solligerently drunk. Well,
most of the times, I just don't want to be there and I
try to help him. I try to calm him down, eventually he just
passes out. Well, yesterday, I mean it sound like you guys were
just drinking like a glass or two, like, yeah, you obviously have
the bottle, but you I mean you told me on the yeah, but
you told me on recording like that you were not drunk. He was not
drunk. You guys were at by a good time. I don't get I
can't get drunk. I never why I do not want to get drunk.
I don't like being non complimentious, having my wits about myself. I don't
like feeling out of control. So I'm just saying you're you're making it sound
like like he's a raging alcoholic today and yesterday. I was kind of asking
you those questions, and you're like a little defensive, like, no,
we're not alcoholics. He I'm value or not, you know, but you
guys are both sober on Sunday to your knowledge is when I said you went
and passed out, you were like, no, I didn't pass out,
I just fell asleep. So now it's kind of like, what is it.
Were you guys drinking and it got out of here and it got physical?
No or is it Sunday? It was one of the better days that
we have had in quite some time. Unfortunately, for Sarah, the truth
of her drunkenness would probably have helped her in this case. She must have
been so wasted the night before she totally forgot what was on her phone when
she offered it up to detectives as proof of George's abuse. What they found
instead was proof that Sarah had murdered George. Have you, guys ever played
you said you played Hide, and seems like probably three times in your relationship
when you have played. Have you ever zipped him up in a suitcase prior?
No? Okay, So it was just kind of like that prop was
there, and it was there, and it was in play. Because why
do you say it like that, though I would care review that you would
never up I'm up in a suitcase? Well, I mean, I mean
we were playing. No I did, but I but I'm saying I'm talking
about how I didn't seek, which is a game. So um, okay.
So do you remember making any videos or maybe having any cover anything,
any photos videos that you remember doing on your phone on Sunday? No,
I think I took a picture of a dog okay, okay, um.
So I have something that I want to show you that we found and it
was from your phone. Can you see you? Can you to move it
around? Ahead? No, I don't remember that for everything? Your bat
is it long? Because I don't know how much I hate I don't know
how much I can do it conveniently. Just as detectives were revealing the smoking
gun, Sarah pointed out that the laptop was dying, and then it did.
Here's the video they found on her phone. It showed the downstairs area
of the couple's apartment and a dark colored suitcase faced down on the floor,
except the suitcase was moving and a small voice could be heard coming from inside
of it, pleading for Sarah to let him out. Do I have to
watch this? I can us? We throw up. I don't sleep.
I don't want to see it. If that's okay, Well, it's on
your phone and you can either explain it or we take it for what it
is. We're just trying to give a new opportunity to tell us what's going
on. That's for everything you've send to me, Sah, for everything you've
gend to me. So fuck you, so fuck you, Sala stupid Sarah,
it's my name. Don't wear it to I cannot talk out where you
be Sarasi. Yeah, that's when you do, and he shoke me.
S First of all, Sarah is absolutely wasted in this video. You can
hear it in her voice. Second of all, this man still kept his
calm demeanor and even called Sarah babe as he was dying in the suitcase that
she trapped him in. Needless to say, this audio is horrific. Sarah
Sarah Okara, I can't breathee. That's on you. Sarah, I can't
breathe. That's on you. Sarah. Reel around and I want to give
video for extram, gonna get Sarah Lund Sarah, I can't breathe. Oh
that's what I feel like when you cheat on me, Sarah youth. So
yeah, he should probably shut the fuck up. There's two different videos and
still a picture where yeah, it shows you he's flipping in the different positions
and him saying that he can't breathe. So this is upside down. So
in order for him to have gotten into it, it was flipped up right.
It was flipped up normal, like if you're packing something. So this
is upside down. Guys, this is killing me right now. So this
image is upside down, and then the small video that occurred eleven minutes later,
it's flipped over the other way, closer to your dining room table.
Okay, now he's obviously still in there, so he didn't How did that?
How did it go from the back to the front. I flipped it?
Okay. My plan was not to go upstairs and go to sleep.
Well that's what you did, but not intentionale. No, you told me
you went upstairs because you were at Harry for bed stops here. Okay,
but show me where you can see any fingers coming out, because there is
the end. It's in his head's right here. So going like this rather
than going all the way up it's like this. But why is he saying
I can't breathe? And why is he pushing on it as if he can't
get out? There's no hole, there's no fingers. I don't see his
fingers, there's no holes. I don't know what you want me to tell
you, like, I don't know like what you want me to tell you.
I'm just showing you. I'm just telling you what we see and what
we've heard from the iggin. I understand he's begging to let for you to
let him out. You sound you're laughing in the beginning, and then in
the end it sounds kind of like a no, it's not malicious. Oh
say it's not malicious. What does fuck you mean to you? Well,
like if you're just if artists tell my life? She says, like,
I get told everything but white woman. So I my intention was not to
leave him in there. Please understand that My intention was not to leave him
in there. But you went upstairs thinking that he could get himselt out.
But the video shows at five point when I seen his fingers, he'll be
up here any bed, and then thirty minutes later he didn't show, and
I shareing like that. Do you think you told me he was laughing?
And we were, but were you there's there's no wars got in there.
Both of us were How long was he in there for? Like this video
is an eleven twelve when it starts, so it was he in there for
like a long time prior to know or he was no? No, so
it goes from funny to no longer funny. But you're the only one laughing.
But I didn't think that he was like pantykey, like I didn't I
so pushing up on a suitcase, saying Sarah Sarah, Sarah, I can't
breathe, George, she's done that in the past before, to where it's
just like he thinks that he's well with me kind of thing where it's like
you've never been lost in a suitcase, but now are you going to get
out? So please don't. I don't need to sound negative, and I
don't know if I can't say this, but like it's like you guys are
kind of trying to like feed me, Like no, I'm just trying to
show you a video that you no longer want to watch because you probably don't
want to know the outcome of how and what you said. Well, I
know what, you know what's on that video? Now, now you remember
making that video. So why don't you remember making the video? Probably because
we have been drinking, but you weren't drunk. And that's how the whole
rest of this interrogation went. Sarah continually tried to go back and forth on
whether they were drunk or not, and adamantly repeated that she thought George should
have been able to get out of the suitcase over and over again. She
claimed she had no malicious intentions when she went upstairs to bed and just left
him there. So you all think that it's like, oh good, I
got him in there, Now I'm going to go to sleep. Is thout
you guys are trying to assume, are trying to like or just the video
is very portraying of the opposite of what you told us. It is not.
It is not leading up. It is not matching what statement you gave
us in the car. So and that's why we want to know. And
I don't remember you're doing this. The injuries are not consistent with what you've
told us. So we have a lot of inconsistencies. And it's a video
explained itself. It really truly does. There's this so it doesn't matter anything
what it is I say, So, it makes no difference whatsoever. It's
just you keep you're lying and like you're not you're now changing, you're lying
about what you're now now now you're I ever said that I was dropped exactly
what you did here today. That's okay. So everything's everything are valid.
You bring it on alcohol. Alcohol does a lot to people, yes,
but I never said I was dropping. You did so you did, you
did a sober You knowingly left them down there sober. I have already told
both in you also that we were both drinking, right, but you want
to admit that you were drunk? Is that? I am telling you all
those this has changed my life. I will pay this. I don't know.
That's interestingment. Absolutely. Sarah was arrested at the end of her interview
and was charged with second degree murder and the death of George Torres Junior.
This all caught her a bit by surprise. Wait, why isn't the gas
lighting working? This has always worked before. These upcoming clips are lengthy but
well worth it. Okay, Sarah, so you're not pretty though. Okay,
Tom, do you promise everything you told us was the truth? Or
no? Everything we've talked about today? Yes? What do you mean?
I swear? Remember I swore you yesterday on the on the audio recording.
I just forgot so you raised his hand to remind me to tell you.
Okay, do you promise. I'm sure that everything we talked about today has
been true and accurate to the best of your knowledge or what's true, and
I hear it to the best of your knowledge. But that it was,
and I sent home everything you've said today, everything that's come out in your
mouth, has been true and accurate to the best of your knowledge, to
the best of my knowledge. Correct, Yes, Why that's how you for
somebody to assure that everything that we talked about is true and accurate to cove
best to that person, chaledge, it's not a true question, to the
best of my knowledge, to the best of your knowledge, everything that you've
told us to stay is true and accurate to the best of your knowledge.
Yes, but it was not intentional. What coat all right? Give me
if I ever stand up? And did you turn on Fastolf? But chians
behind your back? Do you have anything in your pockets that I should know
about? Okay, life is happening because George's death not intentionally. We understand
who's still did well? I used to call Ryan? Please okay? Or
cannot make a something. You'll be able to make a phone call when we
get you down to the jail. So right, So this was a trick
you're to ask you to explain to your things. You're right, You're right.
Your response to everything was basically, I didn't do it intentionally. Don't
matter? Still my favorite how to seek. Really, guys, really,
so if I didn't show up, why are you trying? Because before y'all
said I could leave that I was done as it is. After that,
we were done. Yes, we were done. So now so that's what
it did. We were done right, not intentional? Okay, So what
am I supposed to do now? Someone needs to call Brian. Lucas is
waiting for mom to come home. This was not my attention. I thought
I was waiting for you all to come and figure out what's what and how
many that's what we're trying to do. And I was going to be able
to go home and see Lucas. Now he's just not going to have me
come home. So there's nothing that I can do. All right, now,
there's nothing that I can do in order to go home and see Lucas
and prepare. You'll be afforded at a time in court. You'll be afforded
an attorney, you'll be afforded a chance to talk to a judge, and
all that stuff will be worked out. But what's the time frame for that?
Though? I have in a way of being able to tell you you
should make first appearance, probably right tomorrow morning. It's not tonight, depending
how things are busy, how quickly you get down there. I had an
work admission that's just going to happen, and I need water, like really
bad. Please. Sarah pleaded not guilty to her charges, and we may
never know if she ever got that drink of water. She has, however,
had six lawyers, so there's that. Numerous attorneys have filed motions to
withdraw from Sarah's case, some of them approved for things like conflicts of interest,
but others for an irreparable relationship between client an attorney. This woman sounds
like a real treat. Sarah sends handwritten letters to the judge on a regular
basis, angry that her case still hasn't been taken to trial. Well,
Sarah's getting her wish. Her trial is scheduled for the beginning of April,
and by the time this episode is released, the case should be either winding
down or have already been wrapped up. I'm sure you'll be seeing lots about
it on social media, so if you can, you know, tell them
about our coverage of it. If you don't mind, none of you tweet
anymore, do you? In any case, it was Sarah's intention at the
time of this recording to pursue the battered spouse syndrome as a defense color me
shocked. But hey, recording to some of you, I just hate women.
Oh well, good luck, Sarah. I'm sure you'll do just fine
gas lighting a whole jury. All right, that's gonna do it. Guys,
thank you for joining us. Remember to apply your foundation before your concealer
and join us at plus Swordenscale dot com slash plus. I might just beyond
from Albuquerque. I have been looking for about a year and a half and
finally subscribes the Plus and I just listened to my first early release AD free
episode and it was absolutely luxurious to just share a whole episode with no ads.
It's never something I thought bothered me until I listened to one without it,
and it was amazing. I've wanted to say that I really appreciate everything
that your team does and then you guys put a ton of work into this,
but I can't even imagine. I cannot even imagine the amount of work
to goose into it. So I just want to say that I really appreciate
what you guys do and to keep a good work. Thank you guys,
so much. Belief