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Hello, and welcome to the Rojas
Report, our special interviewers, exclusive content

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just for our subscribers, and hopefully
we'll have We've got a couple of people

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joining live, but hopefully we'll have
a few. I did put this together

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kind of last minute, but we've
got a great show here. We've got

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Anthony Lepey and am I saying that
correctly? You nailed it. I think

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I asked you that last time too. But you are the showrunner and executive

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producer for Unidentified and congratulations on launching
the second season. Thank you, thank

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you. It was not easy getting
that on the air in the time of

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COVID, I'll tell you that.
Oh right, And from what I understand,

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you had to even make the season
a little shorter. Yeah, unfortunately

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we had. We were planning on
two more episodes, but it just we

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had all a bunch of shoots set
up for March that we had to shut

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down, and we decided not to
try to, you know, stretch material

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or you know, kind of make
something out of nothing. So we fortunately

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the network was was okay with us
just delivering the eight mm hmm. Well

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I want to get into to begin
with. I was able to interview Chris

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Mellen, which was great. I
saw that. That was really interesting.

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Yeah, thank you. I was
really excited to be able to do that.

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I over all these years, I
haven't been able to talk to him

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personally. Oh oh, Brittain interview. So that was my first one,

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and I kind of froze up a
bit because I finished my questions and I

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was like, uh, and I
had I could have asked so much more,

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but oh well, I was able
to get though a good story out

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of it. For Den of Geek
regarding how much Unidentified the television show was

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able to help with getting the Senate
Intelligence Committee to ask for these UFO reports

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from military agencies, and he said
quite a bit. I mean, is

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that surprising to you? No,
but it's it's not surprising because you know,

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I've been I've been on the inside
of it for the last two years.

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I've never been involved in something like
this though, where I'm both following

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a group of people who are investigating
something and then actually the product of you

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know, what I captured also had
an effect on the stories. You know

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what I mean. It's kind of
a circular, kind of meta, weird

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thing that you know, I've never
done a show like that that's had such

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a tangible effect on both public opinion
and you know, actual things on Capitol

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Hill and in Pentagon. It's so
it's it's surreal, honestly actually to tell

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you the truth, because I saw
it happening. You know, Chris had

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been working on this, you know, behind this scene stuff for years,

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going back to the first season.
You see a little bit of that happening

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in the first season. You know, there's a whole process by which we

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interviewed Lieutenant Ryan Graves. Right,
We took a video of that. We

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did about a ten minute piece of
that interview, and Alizondo showed that to

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Melon in Washington, DC. And
then he actually took a tablet with that

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video on it and met with members
of Congress and showed that And so that's

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all. People might not remember that. It's a short scene in season one,

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but so yeah, our invest our
show has been has been part of

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this whole ongoing story in a very
interesting way. Right, I mean,

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as an investigative journalist, which is
your background, you've covered a lot of

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Typically, you know, as investigative
journalists, you cover topics that you feel

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need some more attention. And what
has happened here is kind of the ultimate

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goal, which is to really make
some change. And it's it's kind of

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odd that, you know, UFOs
is the thing that you're you're exactly you

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would have told me five years ago
this was going to be the show that

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sort of had the most kind of
effect on both public opinion and actual lawmakers.

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I would have I said, you
were crazy. But but that's what's

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been so exciting about it. It's
just such a it's such an amazingly fascinating,

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endless mystery, and it just keeps
getting more interesting. Honestly by the

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week. It blows my mind everything
that's that happens every almost every week now

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on this ongoing story. It's really
a live story. Right. So yesterday,

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I think Marco Rubio made some comments
or the day before about and he

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didn't back down. He was like, yeah, this is a big deal,

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you know, yeah, and it's
been going on for years, you

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know, basically confirming exactly what you
know Alessander and Mellen Ben saying, I

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mean, it's the other really fascinating
part about this story, right as an

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investigative journalist is you know, I
have these characters who you know, they

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really do have one foot in the
government, right, they have clearances,

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They are actively meeting with these people
who are making these decisions. So and

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they are still very serious about their
non disclosure agreements and they're in maintaining their

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clearances. So you know, they
can't say everything they know, right,

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and they can't even allude to the
things that they've actually seen in a lot

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of ways. So it's a very
interesting story because they are not you know,

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I always say to people, you
have to remember, these guys are

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not whistleblowers. They consider themselves sort
of still performing the duties that they were

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when they were in the government.
They just, you know, couldn't they

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hit a wall inside while they were
in government and now are kind of you

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know, coming out from the outside. But they are still very much and

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you can read that you know,
both ways, right you can. I

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think it still is a very legitimate
question to ask, and I don't I

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take no offense. And we explore
this question as well as we did in

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the first season, asking the hard
question of well, can what they say

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be trusted? Are they still acting
as intelligence officers? That is a completely

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valid question to ask, and you'll
see in season two we asked that question,

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just in the same way we asked
in season one, because I think

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it's it's irresponsible, not that,
uh, to ask that question journalistic.

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I have my own opinions, but
I don't I don't those are you know,

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they don't count really, you know. I we try, we're trying

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to, you know, be as
transparent and journalistically sound as you can.

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But I do think those are legitimate. But I don't think I don't think

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it's disingenuous to ask those questions.
But I think you can. You can

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look at what these guys have said
and how they act, and people can

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judge for themselves. And and this, I think, the whole cycle of

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Pentagon statements and revisions and it's just
fascinating. I still don't really understand what's

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going on there. But remember in
season one, this is what's interesting,

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and people there's like parts of season
one that I feel like people don't remember.

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Uh maybe they have. They're in
the in you know, in the

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last episode, but and they are
short scenes. But remember in season one,

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Elizondo says there's an ongoing effort that's
and he meets with two guys and

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a third guy. If you remember
in a hotel that we got from a

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distance and we hid their identities.
But you know, he called it and

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said that there was an ongoing effort, didn't and I you know, we

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we were able to check that out
and it appeared to be legitimate. That's

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why we reported it. You know, I know some of the names of

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those individuals. I was able to
see some correspondence and things that proved to

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me that that seemed appeared to be
true, and that's why we included in

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the show. So actually that you
know, that's actually not new. We

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we somewhat broke that story in season
one. So the fact that now with

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the Senate Intelligence Committee calling for this
multi agency task force and and you know,

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revealing that there is an ongoing effort, it's something that actually, you

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know, we taught Alessandro has been
consistently saying, you know, so that's

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just it's fascinating. But I'm not
saying I'm not trying to say take credit,

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but it isn't there. These are
elements that these guys have basically been

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working on ever since we were left, you know, in twenty seventeen.

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I think you can take credit because
I mean, you're doing investigative journalism with

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the show and what's interesting and I'm
interested to hear what this experience was like.

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During the first season, I things
such as Alessando's saying, this is

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an ongoing project, you know,
the a hip and its affiliation or what

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it was purpose to do and his
affiliation with it, all of these were

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in question. I mean, everything's
pretty much been resolved and it's come out

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that your show was accurate. Alessando
was accurate. It's only even recent,

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you know, just before the second
season aired that the d admitted, essentially

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right before the Senate request was revealed, that this was an ongoing effort with

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a task force and multiple agencies involved, just like you reflected in the show,

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Like you said, was were you
nervous about kind of these what was

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coming out with the D O D
and everybody kind of Oh definitely, I

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mean you might want to step into
your mic a little bit more. On

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one hundred people are noting that.
Yeah, you're a little low for me

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too. Thank you Stacy for pointing
that out. Yeah. No, I

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mean that was, like, you
know, from as a producer and a

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journalist, when that what's her name, Susan grow statement came out, that

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was like I was like, what, Yeah, that was pretty that was

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a shock to the system, and
uh, you know, it's still confusing

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exactly what's going on there. I
mean, Lous explained, I mean I

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don't think he really fully understands what
what the you know, what was actually

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going on behind the scenes there.
That is some you know, byzantine deep

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state stuff that you know. Obviously
I'm not privy too, and I'm not

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even sure he understands at this point
what the game that was being played there

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or whether it was a game,
whether it was just you know, people

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not being in the need to know, you know, so, but it

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was, yeah, it was definitely
you know, we were just gearing up

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to start the new season and it
was just like, what that's a twist.

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How do we incorporate that? So
we just kind of took a wait

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and see and let let it play
out. And you know, we try,

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as you see in the show,
we try not we don't go too

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much because in some ways this is
a popular show, right, it's a

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show for a mass audience, So
it's not about the Louelsondo story and his

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trials and tribulations. So we just
we kind of work took it as a

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wait and see situation and then saw
you know, as the succeeding statements came

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out, it kind of you know, resolved itself, at least to somebody.

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I mean, there's still lots of
mystery and murkiness. I mean,

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if you're an investigative reporter, you
know, people like Greenwald and McMillan and

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m J. Bannis in particular,
those guys have been doing some great reporting

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all around this that has definitely informed
us, but that that wasn't the focus,

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like what a tip. You know, our show is not about a

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tip and what a tip was and
what Bass was and what Bigelow did and

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those are all fascinating stories, but
that's the network, you know, fundamentally

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want to focus on, you know, what happened in the past. They

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wanted to focus you know, being
a popular show for a mass audience,

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they really wanted to focus on stories, on engaging evidence and stories. And

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that's what we did and that's what
we do. Know kind of segue to

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talk about this season, you know, I think that's the exciting part about

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this season is there's just as you
saw in episode one, there are four

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news stories. Every episode has three
to four, sometimes five. Never before

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heard stories. So it's just I
think it's the entertainment value of this season.

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We were able to really up the
production value, which I'm very proud

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of from the producer's point of view. But it's just fascinating. You're just

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gonna we spent a lot of time
vetting those stories. You know, these

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most of these stories came from people
emailing us. You know, we had

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to call it action at the end
of the episodes last year. Some of

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them came through connections to Alesondo and
other people contacting TPSA and some of our

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other sources, but that majority of
the cases came through this email system that

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I spent most of last summer reading
through these emails and then vet and then

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sort of wittle the people down and
then vetting them and talking to them,

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and you know, sometimes people didn't
want to talk and we got them to

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talk. Sometimes you'll see some people
wanted to remain anonymous. So but it's

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fascinating. I mean, the trove
of stories that came in were absolutely amazing,

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and we really try to focus on
a diverse range of kinds of stories,

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of locations of different branches. We
have people who have intelligence, we

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have an army we have Navy,
Air Force, you know, we have

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everyone involved. And but anyway,
that's that's the most exciting thing that I

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hope viewers appreciate and are entertained by, because you know, this is a

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TV show. We're trying to make
something entertaining. What I think was exciting

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too, hopefully and let me know
if people can hopefully hear me better if

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there's still an audio level. But
another thing exciting part of this that Chris

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Mellan had talked about along the lines
of just what you were saying, is

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that these cases that you're now presenting
are actually part of this strategy to get

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information out of the government in that
some of these cases that you're covering demonstrate

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there were investigations done by these different
agencies that should be coming out in these

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reports that the Senate has asked about. In particular, he talked about a

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nor AD case that will be coming
up. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah,

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no. Some of them were yeah, very high level, you know

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NORRAD command and stories of you know, i'd never heard the light of day.

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Some of them are like if you
saw in the first episode where you

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have instances after action reports being you
know, issued or film being confiscated and

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classified and you know, we've tried
in vain to do floyas on some of

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those. And yeah, I mean
most of these cases included some sort of

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action after action report, in particular
the the you know, the ones involving

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pilots. There's a very interesting case
coming up that launched a larger Dad investigation

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that will be in a later episode
that we you know, we haven't been

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able to find out much about as
well. There's a lot of things that

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we've a lot of stories that we've
you know, just kind of this show

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in some ways is like the tip
of the iceberg. We're getting the first

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hand accounts and like like a lot
of these UFO stories, right, it

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just takes years, right for the
multi layered pieces of information to kind of

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leak out and other people to come
forward, Right, So this is almost

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like a new wave of witnesses that
hopefully will spur further investigations. Mm hmm.

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Now you talked about the second season
being kind of I think you called

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it more professional, which I I
think it's I agree. I love that

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the first episode, I think it
feels kind of like you've got your own

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thing. Now, you've got your
own professional, credible way in which to

209
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demonstrate, to show this information and
interview these guys and have your own space

210
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to present it. That's unique,
it's edgy, it's professional. So it's

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really exciting going forward. And I've
heard a lot of great feedback as the

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feedbacks been pretty good on your end. Thanks, Yeah, I mean I

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think, I mean, I think
the first season was professional. Is just

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the production value and that we you
know, really tried to bring these sightings

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alive with you know, as you
see the dramatic recreations where we were using

216
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a lot of real military hardware to
shoot with, which was really fun just

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as a director. And then we
have a lot more visual effects where we're

218
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taking their accounts and we were really
working with these guys to like tell us,

219
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you know, how big, where
was it? What did it look

220
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like? So we worked very hard
to try to really illustrate, uh,

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visually what they were talking about,
you know, and terms both everything down

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to the size, the shape,
the way the lights moved in some cases,

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you know, the way they described
the noises it made. The I'll

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give you a hint actually about tonight's
episode is really cool. It's one of

225
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my favorite. It's really that it's
and it's very app that you You've got

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to talk to Chris Mellan this week
because, uh, tonight's episode is really

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his mission. M hm. He
is on a mission to investigate the great,

228
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you know, giant Triangle mystery,
which is something that is it's like

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kind of his personal I don't know
if a lot of people know, but

230
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he's personally fascinated by trying. I
didn't know that that's interesting. Yes,

231
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so we and we have two never
before heard stories from incredibly incredible witnesses from

232
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the Gulf War era, in the
Gulf War feeding and that. You know,

233
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what's so interesting about the triangle mystery
is it's clearly connected. You know,

234
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some people are clearly seeing some sort
of military craft, right, there's

235
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definitely enough evidence, you know,
in terms of where they're seeing things and

236
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what the craft we're doing. But
then there's just so many other accounts that

237
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don't add up to anyway. It's
fascinating. I think people are really there's

238
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a lot of story. We have
a lot. We have a new witness.

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He goes to Utah and meets with
a former intelligence officer who just had

240
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a very recent incident. Even have
some photos of it, But it's what's

241
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exciting about tonight's episode. And I
think the other thing that I'm excited about

242
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this season is even though this show
is not about Melon and Alessandro, right,

243
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it's not a biography of them,
we really try to focus on the

244
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witness stories and and you know what
they're seeing and try to examine that you

245
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do. As you watch this season, you will get to know these guys

246
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a lot better, and you'll start
to hear them speaking in ways that they

247
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didn't speak in the first season.
So tonight is a great example. I'm

248
00:20:42.599 --> 00:20:47.480
not going to give too much away, but tonight is a very good example

249
00:20:48.160 --> 00:20:52.599
of you're going to hear Chris Mellan
speak in ways that I don't think anyone

250
00:20:52.680 --> 00:20:57.799
got held him speak. Wow,
that's interesting. I'm want to interview David

251
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Marler next week. Is a good
friend of mine, one of my favorite

252
00:21:00.680 --> 00:21:04.640
researchers. I don't help you in
the episode, Yes, he figures prominently.

253
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Melon goes and meets with him and
they have a fascinating conversation. He's

254
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just He's got one of the most
incredible tropes of research I think I've ever

255
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seen on any topic. Fascinating guy, really smart, guy and was incredibly

256
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generous with his time and his research, and it's a great meeting of the

257
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mind. You'll see they had a
really so it's a really interesting it's really

258
00:21:30.559 --> 00:21:37.240
exciting to hear also that you have
a new triangle cases because of course Dave

259
00:21:37.759 --> 00:21:40.960
David follows him closely, and anybody
who follows him, you know, knows

260
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a lot about the big cases.
So and that's one other thing that's great

261
00:21:44.960 --> 00:21:51.119
about the show is that you're presenting
new cases that are credible military cases that

262
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no one's ever heard before. Yeah. Yeah, this one is technically a

263
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civilian, but he's he's former military
intelligence. So even even in our civilian

264
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cases. We have another instance like
that in another hot spot, uh where

265
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we go to North Carolina, you
know, where there's been a lot of

266
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sightings, and we have a former
marine, a very high level well not

267
00:22:18.079 --> 00:22:26.319
high level, but a real badass
marine commando ricon guy who had a siding

268
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off the Carolina coast that just you
know, he just cannot explain and I

269
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didn't terrify him. He was pretty
freaked out. Yeah, And you know,

270
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and this is a guy who was
a marine reconnaissance you know, going

271
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behind front lines. You know,
up in the mountains Afghanistan. Kind of

272
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a dude, so not easily scared
guy. The other thing that I'm really

273
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excited about is the we have a
whole episode with Never for Her. Civilian

274
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UH airline pilots include active, active
pilots and some recently retired guys, very

275
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very experienced flying. You know,
I think we don't mention the airlines,

276
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but for to say, major legacy
airlines in the United States and they have

277
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that is just incredibly captivating because it
really brings home these guys were super freaked

278
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out. You know, there is
they have two hundred souls right that they're

279
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responsible for, and there's these things
that they're seeing and in one case what

280
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I think one of the most dramatic
accounts that we have something that comes very

281
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close to an air So I'm excited
for the response to that episode as well.

282
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I think people are going to be
surprised because we've been so focused on

283
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military kind of we switch it up
and we've got these just really great guys

284
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too. These you know, pilots
are just you know, you got to

285
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there's something about the bearing of a
pilot. They're all you know, I

286
00:24:02.759 --> 00:24:07.200
think they were all ex military,
if not most of the guys, uh,

287
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you know, and these guys take
their jobs. These guys, you

288
00:24:08.599 --> 00:24:11.279
know, every time they go to
work, right, they have two hundred

289
00:24:11.279 --> 00:24:15.559
people's lives in their moments, right, think about that responsibility. Right.

290
00:24:17.039 --> 00:24:22.759
So this these were like serious life, life altering experiences for them that you

291
00:24:22.799 --> 00:24:25.279
know, like the same way these
military pilots that you know, they can't

292
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shake. That's what it you you
find in this season, you know,

293
00:24:30.079 --> 00:24:37.759
Ah, there's a lot more there's
a lot more emotional things that happened where

294
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people are you know, really are
like really kind of had had life changing

295
00:24:44.480 --> 00:24:48.000
moments, whereas I think you know
when you uh, you know, Commander

296
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Favor and even Graves, those guys
are fascinated, you know, and I

297
00:24:52.519 --> 00:24:56.839
think it definitely kind of has changed
their worldview a little bit. But they're

298
00:24:56.880 --> 00:25:00.240
they're very you know, they're you
know, there's they're cool cats, right,

299
00:25:00.480 --> 00:25:03.200
Like Fraver it's just like I want
to fly that thing, right,

300
00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:07.119
I remember to me And Graves is
just he's like a real intellectual. Actually

301
00:25:07.960 --> 00:25:14.680
he's just kind of perplexed. But
there's other people that you'll meet, you

302
00:25:14.720 --> 00:25:19.079
know who you who, they really
changes their world view and in an emotional

303
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way. So I'm excited about that
part of the storytelling. Ye just want

304
00:25:23.759 --> 00:25:29.880
to He'll make those point of view. I'm really just the story. Yeah,

305
00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:36.519
that's really interesting. Are there other
I guess I was gonna say surprises,

306
00:25:36.599 --> 00:25:41.640
but I guess revelations that you're really
excited about this season? You know,

307
00:25:41.680 --> 00:25:44.480
I don't want to give too much
away, and I had off off

308
00:25:44.559 --> 00:25:49.039
the you know, yeah, I
think I think I'd rather just let it,

309
00:25:49.160 --> 00:25:52.599
let it play out. I mean, there's a lot of things just

310
00:25:52.599 --> 00:25:55.079
there's a lot of things that happened. You know, we go down to

311
00:25:55.119 --> 00:26:00.680
South America, lots of interesting things
happen down there with Blue and we meet

312
00:26:00.839 --> 00:26:07.400
some very interesting people, and uh, you know, there's just yeah,

313
00:26:07.440 --> 00:26:11.640
there's just a lot of stories.
I don't and I think it's it's really

314
00:26:11.680 --> 00:26:18.519
about building this big pattern, you
know that when you watch it all together,

315
00:26:18.640 --> 00:26:26.400
it's just like there's just the patterns
that emerge are fascinating. That's Yeah.

316
00:26:26.400 --> 00:26:34.200
One of the the most negative comment
that I heard I have heard from

317
00:26:34.240 --> 00:26:41.960
people is a repetition of the Knimics
material. Yeah. I didn't really have

318
00:26:41.000 --> 00:26:44.119
a problem with it, because I
know you have to remind the audience,

319
00:26:44.160 --> 00:26:47.359
and not all the audiences live with
the UFO stuff or pay attention to it

320
00:26:47.400 --> 00:26:52.920
as much as those like myself and
those I've heard feedback from. It was

321
00:26:52.920 --> 00:26:56.880
that something that people just saw in
the first episode and won't see as much

322
00:26:56.920 --> 00:27:00.640
going forward. Well, you know, here's the tricky thing. You know,

323
00:27:00.799 --> 00:27:07.079
your audience is just a real subset, right, Yeah, you know

324
00:27:07.200 --> 00:27:11.799
the nimics incident inside and out.
Probably every single person listening right, like

325
00:27:11.960 --> 00:27:17.559
me, knows that incident inside and
out, But for the vast majority of

326
00:27:18.759 --> 00:27:22.839
viewers, it's it's new information or
its information they have only seen a headline

327
00:27:22.839 --> 00:27:26.880
about. So yeah, I mean
it was something that the network, you

328
00:27:26.880 --> 00:27:32.720
know, we tried to I tried
to streamline the storytelling more this season,

329
00:27:33.279 --> 00:27:40.480
to to have a little less you
know, there's definitely a style on the

330
00:27:40.519 --> 00:27:44.960
History Channel that that tries to hold
your hand a lot as you move through,

331
00:27:45.640 --> 00:27:48.960
right. You know, I'm definitely
come from more of a filmmaking you

332
00:27:48.000 --> 00:27:55.240
know, just kind of let people, you know, put the two and

333
00:27:55.240 --> 00:28:00.920
two together themselves. But there is
something effective to it because it does it.

334
00:28:00.559 --> 00:28:07.720
There is you know, some satisfying
neuro connections that are made and you

335
00:28:07.799 --> 00:28:11.119
help you know, you have to
not everyone knows this stuff, you know,

336
00:28:11.279 --> 00:28:15.039
and it can be confusing. So
you can't just say like in two

337
00:28:15.079 --> 00:28:18.720
thousand and four, right, right, have to say like in two thousand

338
00:28:18.720 --> 00:28:22.200
and four in the US or pilots
from the USS mimic, so I'll pick

339
00:28:22.279 --> 00:28:26.759
back and it did this and this
and this. You just unfortunately you have

340
00:28:26.799 --> 00:28:30.160
to kind of yeah, there has
to be a minimum amount of context when

341
00:28:30.160 --> 00:28:33.000
you're trying to put it into the
whole thing. So it's definitely something that

342
00:28:33.039 --> 00:28:37.599
we really tinkered with, and it's
tricky, you know. It's it's how

343
00:28:37.640 --> 00:28:44.200
do you draw connections and create and
talk about patterns without being repebited. That's

344
00:28:44.240 --> 00:28:48.119
definitely it was a major kind of
editorial conversation that we've got to put that

345
00:28:49.480 --> 00:28:52.799
So, but I hope you know. What I think is cool about this

346
00:28:52.839 --> 00:28:57.319
season is because there's so many new
stories. We're constantly moving forward, you

347
00:28:57.359 --> 00:29:02.759
know, and there's just new new
information and new information and new information.

348
00:29:02.960 --> 00:29:07.319
So you know, like that's what
that's why it's that's in particular why the

349
00:29:07.359 --> 00:29:11.079
network wanted to air tonight's episode as
a second episode, because it's it's you

350
00:29:11.079 --> 00:29:14.519
know, it's nothing to do with
for the minutes. It's all about this

351
00:29:14.720 --> 00:29:22.680
whole other as you know, universe
of trying the sightings and theories and counter

352
00:29:22.759 --> 00:29:26.839
theories, right, so that's its
whole. It's like it's whole you know,

353
00:29:26.039 --> 00:29:30.079
cottage industry. Mh. So yeah, but it's a good point.

354
00:29:30.079 --> 00:29:34.119
It's a fair point, definitely.
Well I get it though, because I

355
00:29:34.160 --> 00:29:38.920
when I write articles or when I
do my podcast or interviews, every time

356
00:29:40.039 --> 00:29:44.839
a case comes up, I do
my best to encapsulate the gist of that

357
00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:48.319
case. So it's something I try
to do and I know viewers and listeners

358
00:29:48.359 --> 00:29:52.640
appreciate because, like you said,
not everybody's up to speed, and a

359
00:29:52.680 --> 00:29:56.400
lot of times we've got someone brand
new, right, and so they need

360
00:29:56.400 --> 00:30:00.799
that background. Another important point about
this season, which is different from last

361
00:30:00.799 --> 00:30:06.079
season, which made it a little
trickier as a filmmaker, is they wanted

362
00:30:06.119 --> 00:30:14.039
these episodes. Technically, this season
is not a serialized so each episode needs

363
00:30:14.079 --> 00:30:18.960
to they the direction we thought was
each episode needs to stand on its own,

364
00:30:18.400 --> 00:30:22.480
So they're just watching this on a
replay later, you know, in

365
00:30:22.519 --> 00:30:26.519
two thousand and one or something that
you wouldn't have to have seen the second

366
00:30:26.519 --> 00:30:32.160
episode the first episode for the second
episode to make sense. So they're they're

367
00:30:32.200 --> 00:30:37.839
more they're more self enclosed in that
way. So, uh, that made

368
00:30:37.880 --> 00:30:45.240
it a little different, that makes
sense. Speaking of triangles, one of

369
00:30:45.279 --> 00:30:48.359
the things that really strikes me about
those, and I'm wondering if you have

370
00:30:48.480 --> 00:30:52.960
the same sense when you began investigating
it to prepare for the episode, is

371
00:30:53.000 --> 00:31:00.240
that they're these sightings seem much more
bold like off. In other sightings,

372
00:31:00.279 --> 00:31:04.480
the objects are at a distance or
they zip off very quickly, whereas with

373
00:31:04.559 --> 00:31:08.799
triangle sightings, they're right above the
road, they're right above the witness.

374
00:31:08.880 --> 00:31:14.119
They hang out for a period of
time, sometimes long periods of times before

375
00:31:14.200 --> 00:31:17.960
they float off, sometimes lingerally,
you know, slow, before they take

376
00:31:17.960 --> 00:31:22.680
off very fast. That's what yeah, yeah, I mean, that's one

377
00:31:22.759 --> 00:31:26.799
of the major points. Actually.
The other interesting theme actually actually about this

378
00:31:26.839 --> 00:31:30.720
season is there's there are more voices
from TTSA are going to get involved.

379
00:31:30.240 --> 00:31:34.559
So without getting too much away,
and what they say in tonight's episode,

380
00:31:34.759 --> 00:31:41.680
you're going to hear from some of
the other players in TTSA and they're in

381
00:31:41.720 --> 00:31:48.440
one of them speaks very much to
that exact part of the phenomenon. What

382
00:31:48.519 --> 00:31:52.680
the if this was a military craft, why is it lingering floating really low

383
00:31:53.799 --> 00:31:59.279
over a house a civilian area,
and why is that repeating account? That's

384
00:32:00.160 --> 00:32:07.160
huge part of the story that is
perplexing and fascinating. Speaking of you know,

385
00:32:07.279 --> 00:32:10.079
these discussions, like we had this
kind of analysis and discussion in the

386
00:32:10.160 --> 00:32:15.240
first episode. One of the things
that this show does well, also compared

387
00:32:15.240 --> 00:32:21.160
to other reality television shows, is
that it doesn't feel scripted, even though

388
00:32:21.519 --> 00:32:27.160
obviously you have them positioned in a
location that film's really good. But they're

389
00:32:27.200 --> 00:32:30.920
like other shows, including sister shows
on History Channel that I won't name,

390
00:32:31.359 --> 00:32:36.440
you know, feel very very scripted. You could tell their they may be

391
00:32:36.519 --> 00:32:40.079
even repeating something they already said,
but it just feels scripted. You don't

392
00:32:40.119 --> 00:32:45.079
really get that in Unidentified. How
do you get around that? You know?

393
00:32:45.319 --> 00:32:47.839
Thanks, I really appreciate that,
because, well, first off,

394
00:32:47.880 --> 00:32:51.759
I'm not a reality I've never done
a reality show, so I wouldn't even

395
00:32:51.799 --> 00:32:54.720
really know how to do it.
But I also wanted to make sure it

396
00:32:54.759 --> 00:32:59.920
never felt like we were doing it
even though we weren't doing And sometimes I'll

397
00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:06.400
be honest, it's hard because you
know, Eleisondo in particular, is you

398
00:33:06.440 --> 00:33:08.960
know he also he can be very
formal sometimes in the way he speaks.

399
00:33:10.440 --> 00:33:16.319
So we definitely, you know,
just to you know, try to like

400
00:33:16.359 --> 00:33:21.119
when they're having their discussions, really
tried to just say, hey, guys,

401
00:33:21.200 --> 00:33:24.759
just pretend like we're not here,
like there's a that's actually when tonight's

402
00:33:24.759 --> 00:33:29.400
episode has a really good example of
that, where we get the team,

403
00:33:29.680 --> 00:33:34.440
the larger team together to talk about
the triangle phenomenon, and I think people

404
00:33:34.440 --> 00:33:37.400
are going to be and we really
are just you know, all we're saying

405
00:33:37.559 --> 00:33:43.480
is triangles go. You know,
we're not trying to say, okay,

406
00:33:43.559 --> 00:33:45.240
can you set this up? And
can you Yeah? I mean and also

407
00:33:45.279 --> 00:33:50.559
these you can't tell Chris Melan or
Lou Alesando what to say, right,

408
00:33:51.640 --> 00:33:55.039
that's not something that you know,
you're really able to do. These guys

409
00:33:55.079 --> 00:34:00.759
don't take direction, you know.
So, but thank you. I appreciate

410
00:34:00.799 --> 00:34:05.119
it, because yeah, we really
tried not to. You know, we

411
00:34:05.440 --> 00:34:08.440
tried to make this show really as
organic as as possible. Obviously there is

412
00:34:08.480 --> 00:34:13.239
a you know, an artifice of
of you know, for instance, I

413
00:34:13.239 --> 00:34:17.840
don't think Lou would have been going
to South America if we did not decide

414
00:34:17.880 --> 00:34:24.119
to go there. But in going
there, in organically a bunch of things

415
00:34:24.199 --> 00:34:32.400
happen because of his connections to some
of the military uh personnel them that is

416
00:34:32.440 --> 00:34:37.000
completely organic. You know, that
wasn't tried as we'll see. Uh.

417
00:34:37.400 --> 00:34:42.320
So you know there's you know,
it's still a television show. You know,

418
00:34:42.559 --> 00:34:45.800
he's still going out and just you
know, the resources we have,

419
00:34:46.000 --> 00:34:50.119
they it wasn't you know, I
don't know if they really have the resources

420
00:34:50.119 --> 00:34:52.719
for for for us to be all
the event. You know, we're sort

421
00:34:52.719 --> 00:34:59.639
of you know, our production is
able to go places. Let's say that

422
00:34:59.639 --> 00:35:02.039
that they who wouldn't necessarily be able
to go to it on a daily basis,

423
00:35:02.119 --> 00:35:07.000
right, So that's also that you
know, I think the benefit for

424
00:35:07.079 --> 00:35:13.280
everyone is that we're able to you
know, support this effort in a way

425
00:35:13.519 --> 00:35:15.840
and to get more. I mean, really all what this show is all

426
00:35:15.880 --> 00:35:22.559
about is just getting stories out there
and finding credible stories and vetting them as

427
00:35:22.639 --> 00:35:28.000
much as we can and letting people
decide for themselves. And you know,

428
00:35:28.079 --> 00:35:31.960
the other part of this season,
which some some of your viewers and others

429
00:35:32.000 --> 00:35:39.480
may get annoyed with, is we
we even more so are you offering countervailing

430
00:35:39.679 --> 00:35:49.840
theories and evidence? And I think
last season we didn't have as many voices

431
00:35:49.920 --> 00:35:54.679
that were offering countervailing technical explanations for
things. It was, you know,

432
00:35:55.320 --> 00:36:01.000
sometimes it was more like Chris,
I mean, Lou and Steve Justice sort

433
00:36:01.039 --> 00:36:07.440
of devil's advocating, you know,
gaming it out right, whereas now we

434
00:36:07.639 --> 00:36:13.360
have guys like Bill Scott, you
know, who's a former Air Force test

435
00:36:13.400 --> 00:36:17.719
engineer who had a lot of experience
in black projects, who was an aviation

436
00:36:17.880 --> 00:36:23.280
group editor for years, you know, people like that, and other even

437
00:36:23.159 --> 00:36:30.280
and uh, people who are sort
of skeptics, like Clark in the UK

438
00:36:30.519 --> 00:36:35.679
I believe he was in episode one
was so you know all about him,

439
00:36:35.719 --> 00:36:42.079
right, He's definitely a skeptic.
So we're really offering those voices as well

440
00:36:42.119 --> 00:36:46.639
because I think it's important to hear
those those voices, and because and then

441
00:36:46.679 --> 00:36:51.079
also just from a storytelling point of
view, it's you know, I enjoy

442
00:36:51.599 --> 00:36:55.880
hearing these uh, these countervailing points. It makes it just more interesting,

443
00:36:57.360 --> 00:37:01.400
you know. That's what That's what
I think most not to critique other shows,

444
00:37:01.960 --> 00:37:07.239
you know, but that's always kind
of the problem with the UFO shows

445
00:37:07.239 --> 00:37:10.519
in the past is they always are
trying to you just can't really believe what

446
00:37:10.599 --> 00:37:16.039
you're seeing because it's so clearly trying
to push you in a particular direction,

447
00:37:16.320 --> 00:37:22.840
right, Yeah, that's what I
loved about the first episode. And and

448
00:37:22.880 --> 00:37:27.880
it also, you know, you're
putting out all the information, you have

449
00:37:28.000 --> 00:37:31.320
experts who are all looking at that
information, and then some of the things,

450
00:37:31.360 --> 00:37:35.320
like David Clark, honestly, you
know, some of his comments really

451
00:37:35.400 --> 00:37:39.039
seem kind of out there. You
know, they don't fit along the lines

452
00:37:39.079 --> 00:37:44.119
of what some of the experts are
saying. And they're more experts on some

453
00:37:44.159 --> 00:37:47.760
subjects than he is. So I
think it's really fair to really encapsulate the

454
00:37:47.800 --> 00:37:52.840
information. And what's really interesting about
the show too, is that the witnesses

455
00:37:53.199 --> 00:37:59.519
also become experts because they are experts, they're pilots, h yeah, and

456
00:37:59.599 --> 00:38:02.280
so they're input. You usually don't
see that. Usually a witness is a

457
00:38:02.360 --> 00:38:08.239
talking head as opposed to kind of
jumping in and joining in on the analysis.

458
00:38:08.559 --> 00:38:12.719
Yeah, yeah, exactly. I
mean that's what's so. I mean,

459
00:38:13.320 --> 00:38:19.679
who knows more about what is flying
in the air than you know,

460
00:38:20.239 --> 00:38:24.639
these these guys. I mean,
there's a there's guys who uh coming up

461
00:38:24.760 --> 00:38:34.000
really fascinating story from a from the
FAA contractor who has a really interesting uh

462
00:38:34.320 --> 00:38:40.480
visual on craft from a very remote
location. And but like, for instance,

463
00:38:40.559 --> 00:38:44.320
his experience, I don't even know
if we even talked about this in

464
00:38:44.360 --> 00:38:50.960
the show, but like he had
been trained as a anti ballistic missile uh

465
00:38:51.079 --> 00:38:54.880
you know operator, so he was
you know, well, what he's studying

466
00:38:54.960 --> 00:39:00.480
the profiles of craft, right,
like every single known aircraft. He has

467
00:39:00.519 --> 00:39:04.360
to know the profile on the characteristic
side. Right, These these people are

468
00:39:04.400 --> 00:39:08.199
and that's fundamentally the DNA of our
show, Right, we're finding these people

469
00:39:08.280 --> 00:39:13.280
who have been I think we even
when I think about it and I say

470
00:39:13.320 --> 00:39:16.559
it's out loud, we probably underplay
that. We probably should if we have

471
00:39:16.719 --> 00:39:22.920
more time on these shows, really
get into the amount of training and what

472
00:39:22.000 --> 00:39:27.760
it goes into each of these you
know, these people's roles and how much

473
00:39:27.800 --> 00:39:32.039
they really understand aircraft and things like
that, and how train how much training

474
00:39:32.119 --> 00:39:38.760
goes into every one of their their
you know, uh positions. Because I

475
00:39:38.760 --> 00:39:44.039
think that then that's why I think
that's why our show had the impact it

476
00:39:44.239 --> 00:39:49.519
had and is having, because these
people they're not you know, a military

477
00:39:49.559 --> 00:39:54.599
person isn't necessarily a better person,
right or more honest than anyone else's,

478
00:39:54.719 --> 00:40:00.280
but they are trained in what is
flying and what enemy looks like the want

479
00:40:00.280 --> 00:40:05.039
of you know, in physics and
things like that. I mean Ryan Braves,

480
00:40:05.079 --> 00:40:07.360
you know, had a degree in
aeronautical you know, physical aviation,

481
00:40:07.800 --> 00:40:12.280
things like that. So these are
these are really highly trained people. They

482
00:40:12.320 --> 00:40:15.000
are as you said, they're experts, right, And it comes across in

483
00:40:15.039 --> 00:40:19.119
that they speak the same language,
you know, being in the military and

484
00:40:19.159 --> 00:40:24.880
having that experience Chris Elizondo along with
the military witnesses, uh and the engineer,

485
00:40:25.119 --> 00:40:30.119
the aerospace engineer, uh, not
just Steve Justice, but the other

486
00:40:30.159 --> 00:40:34.360
guy who with from Air and Space
magazine. I think he's from Uh.

487
00:40:34.519 --> 00:40:39.039
They speak the same language, and
so they kind of are typically on the

488
00:40:39.079 --> 00:40:45.000
same page about things and explaining it
similarly, which I think then adds to

489
00:40:45.280 --> 00:40:50.239
you know, people backing up what
they're saying as far as their expertise,

490
00:40:50.920 --> 00:40:54.239
especially when they're kind of digesting and
mulling over maybe things that David Clark is

491
00:40:54.239 --> 00:40:59.119
saying. You know, they're putting
their take on it. And so I

492
00:40:59.119 --> 00:41:00.480
think that comes across said these guys, you know, they know what they're

493
00:41:00.519 --> 00:41:07.480
talking about. Yeah. One of
the interesting things that happened last season.

494
00:41:07.559 --> 00:41:10.440
You got a hold of me and
you said, there's something that's going to

495
00:41:10.480 --> 00:41:14.800
happen in this episode that looks scripted, but it wasn't at all. And

496
00:41:14.840 --> 00:41:19.440
I think it was the Guadaloupe Island
Show, and I watched it and I

497
00:41:19.480 --> 00:41:22.960
didn't see anything that felt scripted.
And I don't know that I've asked you,

498
00:41:22.079 --> 00:41:24.880
what was it that you felt might
have come a crod scripted. I

499
00:41:24.920 --> 00:41:29.559
don't think it did. I guess
it was the scripted. He just like

500
00:41:30.400 --> 00:41:34.039
basically to recap it so you know, people know what we're talking about.

501
00:41:34.599 --> 00:41:37.360
In episode three, season one,
we go down. You know, we

502
00:41:37.440 --> 00:41:43.639
kind of followed the trail where Kevin
Day, the radar operator and the Princeton

503
00:41:43.679 --> 00:41:46.519
said the craft that we don't know
necessarily if there were tic TACs or not,

504
00:41:46.719 --> 00:41:51.119
but the craft, the multiple craft
that he was tracking on the each

505
00:41:51.199 --> 00:41:55.360
just radar, we're all flying in
a particular direction and then would disappear off

506
00:41:57.119 --> 00:42:02.039
their radar down near Wadalu Bay Island, which is a small island off the

507
00:42:02.079 --> 00:42:09.320
Baja Coast, right outside of the
the Navy's exercise area. So we decided,

508
00:42:09.519 --> 00:42:12.920
just like, heck, let's go
down. There's a really big risk

509
00:42:13.000 --> 00:42:15.079
honestly from a production point of view, because it costs a lot of money

510
00:42:15.159 --> 00:42:20.400
to charter. We chartered a whole
big boat, right, And it's very

511
00:42:20.400 --> 00:42:24.559
complicated to go to Guadalca Island because
it's a nature preserve and you can't land

512
00:42:24.639 --> 00:42:29.639
on the island and there's like a
fishing collective there and it's it's a great

513
00:42:29.639 --> 00:42:36.599
white shark breeding ground. So it
was very complicated in shooting overseas, as

514
00:42:36.639 --> 00:42:39.639
always complicated. Shooting in Mexico's complicated, right, So long story short,

515
00:42:39.679 --> 00:42:46.920
we go down there and we hired
a great local producer and he basically starts

516
00:42:47.079 --> 00:42:53.320
just doing some pre research and starts
talking to all these fishermen from the fishing

517
00:42:53.320 --> 00:43:00.119
collective that basically splits their time you
to have like some kind of small shacks

518
00:43:00.119 --> 00:43:02.559
on Guadalupe and they're the only people
that are allowed to kind of be there

519
00:43:02.599 --> 00:43:09.440
other than the Mexican Navy. So
we go down there and basically like ten

520
00:43:09.639 --> 00:43:15.360
of these guys all start talking about
seeing basically tictacked like craft and then seeing

521
00:43:15.400 --> 00:43:20.400
flying up in and out of the
water, going back like decades. And

522
00:43:21.000 --> 00:43:28.599
then we find a spotter of a
tuna spotter who flies a small plane who

523
00:43:28.920 --> 00:43:35.320
had a sighting of a thing that
sounds moved and it was so eerie the

524
00:43:35.400 --> 00:43:40.599
way he described it zigzagging in the
air, and then when he flashed his

525
00:43:40.760 --> 00:43:44.519
lights at it, you know,
which is like the kind of aviation thing

526
00:43:44.599 --> 00:43:49.199
to say hello, right, it
flew right at him past his nose,

527
00:43:49.239 --> 00:43:53.480
which is exactly what Fraber said the
tic Tac did at the end right of

528
00:43:53.559 --> 00:43:58.880
their little interaction, it kind of
zipped off the kind of, you know,

529
00:43:59.119 --> 00:44:02.199
very kind of freaky way for them
because it came so close and it

530
00:44:02.239 --> 00:44:07.639
went so fast. So and then
you and then we go to the island,

531
00:44:07.159 --> 00:44:09.559
and not only we found more fishermen
there on the island, but we

532
00:44:09.599 --> 00:44:17.679
found this legendary great quite shark researcher
who himself had a psych and that I

533
00:44:17.760 --> 00:44:21.800
just I couldn't when they got back
with that footage, I just was like,

534
00:44:21.920 --> 00:44:27.000
I just couldn't believe it from you
know, from I honestly, I'm

535
00:44:27.039 --> 00:44:30.719
actually surprised more people that showed that
episode, even actually it was our highest

536
00:44:30.719 --> 00:44:35.800
graded episode actually, but it didn't
get a lot of like people don't still

537
00:44:35.800 --> 00:44:37.920
talk about it, you know what
I mean. And I'm surprised that that's

538
00:44:38.000 --> 00:44:42.880
not part of the narrative more.
And I don't know whether people that they're

539
00:44:42.880 --> 00:44:46.079
because they're discounting them because they were
just kind of local fishermen and they weren't

540
00:44:46.119 --> 00:44:52.039
experts. But honestly, people like
local fishermen, like people like farmers and

541
00:44:52.199 --> 00:44:58.239
fishermen who are out in nature and
are like know the skies and conditions and

542
00:44:58.320 --> 00:45:01.280
they know the difference between biolumin f
and not. Right. Those are people

543
00:45:01.320 --> 00:45:07.199
that are experts to in their environment. Right. So when they were telling

544
00:45:07.280 --> 00:45:12.440
these stories, it was that blew
my mind. Honestly, that was one

545
00:45:12.480 --> 00:45:17.280
of the things that really started to
push me in a direction of like,

546
00:45:17.360 --> 00:45:22.719
Wow, this is good something that
was unexplained. That's what I thought it

547
00:45:22.840 --> 00:45:27.920
might be. And when I watched
the show, I think even Stacy who's

548
00:45:27.960 --> 00:45:31.639
in she runs the Arizona moufon or
chapter, and I was watching with her

549
00:45:31.639 --> 00:45:36.679
and other friends who do UFO research, so I think that we were all

550
00:45:36.719 --> 00:45:39.400
like, yeah, that's what happens. But I asked a ram too,

551
00:45:39.679 --> 00:45:45.000
just to kind of get a sense, and just like you said, which

552
00:45:45.039 --> 00:45:47.599
is good, you know, nobody
I didn't. Nobody had said, oh,

553
00:45:47.639 --> 00:45:51.679
how did all those people witness it? Down there? Everybody would kind

554
00:45:51.679 --> 00:45:53.960
of accepted it was like, wow, you know, they're having lots of

555
00:45:53.960 --> 00:45:59.519
sightings down there. Yeah, Yeah, it's fascinating. Yeah, which is

556
00:45:59.559 --> 00:46:02.039
really good, which is interesting.
And of course Kevin Dayan has gotten together

557
00:46:02.119 --> 00:46:06.079
a group and some scientists and they're
going to go down there and do an

558
00:46:06.159 --> 00:46:09.159
expedition. Is that actually happening.
Are they going to get down I don't

559
00:46:09.199 --> 00:46:12.480
know. I know that it's going
to take a lot of money and I'm

560
00:46:12.559 --> 00:46:14.960
not sure if they've raised it all, but they're planning on it, and

561
00:46:15.039 --> 00:46:19.599
at least the last I've heard from
Kevin days very positive about it happening.

562
00:46:20.280 --> 00:46:22.840
That's good, mm hmm. Yeah. It's not easy to do anything these

563
00:46:22.920 --> 00:46:28.159
days. It was definitely difficult to
finish the show. As people will see.

564
00:46:28.199 --> 00:46:30.360
We had to you know, kind
of the last ten percent of the

565
00:46:30.400 --> 00:46:31.760
show. We had to do with
Spike and and do some things like that.

566
00:46:32.079 --> 00:46:37.039
Ah, so ye'll see more of
that. What about your colleagues,

567
00:46:37.079 --> 00:46:44.920
I mean, being an investigative journalist, they probably especially with second season or

568
00:46:45.000 --> 00:46:49.199
first season, where maybe uh,
you know, oh this is interesting,

569
00:46:49.599 --> 00:46:54.480
but I mean they really have to
be shocked that, you know, what

570
00:46:54.519 --> 00:47:00.079
you've done is is literally some of
the cases you've talked about and shared with

571
00:47:00.159 --> 00:47:06.440
the public or have now made it
into you know, the Senate Intelligence Committee

572
00:47:06.559 --> 00:47:10.119
and briefings to the senators. Yeah, I mean definitely. When I began,

573
00:47:10.280 --> 00:47:13.679
before we went the first season went
on the air, a lot of

574
00:47:13.679 --> 00:47:17.199
my friends thought I'd gone crazy.
We're like, what are you doing?

575
00:47:17.320 --> 00:47:20.960
Are you sure do you want to
do that? And I was like,

576
00:47:21.159 --> 00:47:24.719
I don't know, man, I
just I can't not follow this story.

577
00:47:24.800 --> 00:47:29.760
It's so interesting. You know,
if I just got to I got to

578
00:47:29.800 --> 00:47:31.519
stick to my guns. I got
to do it the right way. But

579
00:47:32.400 --> 00:47:37.119
how could you turn away from having
access, you know, a front seat

580
00:47:37.320 --> 00:47:43.599
to this narrative and being able to
roll around with Chris and Lou for the

581
00:47:43.679 --> 00:47:46.920
last two years has been you know, how could you not from a journalistic

582
00:47:46.920 --> 00:47:51.719
point of view, you know,
I would be crazy. So I think

583
00:47:51.719 --> 00:47:53.840
a lot of people, definitely,
a lot of my friends were like,

584
00:47:54.039 --> 00:48:00.199
oh, okay, now I see
why are you so interested in this out

585
00:48:00.239 --> 00:48:05.000
it? Because it seems a lot
bigger than uh, you know that they

586
00:48:05.199 --> 00:48:09.239
thought, mm hmmm. So a
couple of comments real quick from that are

587
00:48:09.239 --> 00:48:14.800
in here Acupunk is saying, and
I'm not sure necessarily what he's asking,

588
00:48:14.880 --> 00:48:21.000
but maybe you'll get super cuts of
foreign surveillance teams chasing Lou and Chris.

589
00:48:21.119 --> 00:48:24.639
Question mark, So I think,
yes, I think I might have given

590
00:48:24.920 --> 00:48:30.639
given a little tip away on another
podcast that I did, But there is

591
00:48:30.679 --> 00:48:38.840
there. We do have a instance
where we're being trailed by some very seems

592
00:48:38.880 --> 00:48:45.760
to be clearly foreign intelligence. Interesting, but of course, when you have

593
00:48:45.840 --> 00:48:51.079
someone of Chris and Lou's stature,
given their backgrounds, they probably get that.

594
00:48:51.960 --> 00:48:55.320
Yeah, exactly, this this was
This was interesting in the context because

595
00:48:55.360 --> 00:49:04.039
I'll give you a hint. Okay, they were appeared to be intelligence officer

596
00:49:04.320 --> 00:49:09.360
or agents of some sort or security
agents. That's some sort of agents of

597
00:49:09.639 --> 00:49:15.840
a foreign government, but not of
the country we were in. Oh wow,

598
00:49:15.960 --> 00:49:19.639
that's very strange. Yes, Oh, I can't wait for that.

599
00:49:19.719 --> 00:49:21.800
How long are we gonna have to
wait for that? Is that late in

600
00:49:21.840 --> 00:49:25.960
the season. I got to look
up one episode, the fourth episode.

601
00:49:27.079 --> 00:49:30.480
Oh cool, so we don't have
to wait too long. Awesome. So

602
00:49:30.559 --> 00:49:36.199
another comment, the Unidentified series has
legitimized the subject where other shows just couldn't

603
00:49:36.239 --> 00:49:39.159
do that. It has made a
huge difference to both seasoned upologists and the

604
00:49:39.239 --> 00:49:44.480
newbies out there. Great job,
and this is from Stacy, my friend

605
00:49:44.480 --> 00:49:51.559
at Phoenix. Thank you and then
nice to finally have reliable sources. And

606
00:49:51.599 --> 00:49:55.800
I think that that is something that
people don't get and when it comes to

607
00:49:57.000 --> 00:50:01.880
journalism is the importance of expertise these
and credible sources. And I think a

608
00:50:01.920 --> 00:50:07.599
lot of people in this community,
the UFO research community don't always get that

609
00:50:07.000 --> 00:50:13.000
either, But it seems to be
something that is definitely should be for every

610
00:50:13.079 --> 00:50:17.440
journalist, but it's something certainly paramount
to you producing the show. Yeah,

611
00:50:17.679 --> 00:50:22.639
yeah, I think so. I
mean, I think and that's why these

612
00:50:22.719 --> 00:50:29.719
military people are so interesting because they
really do even if they're not in the

613
00:50:29.760 --> 00:50:35.559
service anymore, they really have a
lot to lose because of the straight laceness

614
00:50:35.599 --> 00:50:40.960
of the military. So their reputations
and their names are really, you know,

615
00:50:42.360 --> 00:50:46.199
paramount in the legacy of their careers. So for them to come out

616
00:50:46.480 --> 00:50:51.320
and be an outlier and talk about
something that's kind of weird and cooky in

617
00:50:51.440 --> 00:50:55.519
military culture is just you really have
to that has to come into play when

618
00:50:55.559 --> 00:50:59.760
you look at their credibility that they're
willing to come out and say this stuff.

619
00:51:00.000 --> 00:51:02.320
That's the big theme right at this
season as you see all these guys,

620
00:51:02.360 --> 00:51:07.039
you're telling stories that they've held some
of them thirty forty years, some

621
00:51:07.159 --> 00:51:09.880
of them with much more recent but
these are all stories that they haven't told

622
00:51:09.920 --> 00:51:15.400
anyone publicly, and we're a lot
of them were very nervous, you'll see.

623
00:51:15.960 --> 00:51:19.760
That's why we try to show some
of the stuff where you see guys

624
00:51:19.880 --> 00:51:22.800
that are kind of behind the scenes
when they come in and sit down and

625
00:51:22.639 --> 00:51:27.079
you know, this is like some
of them are pretty freaked out about their

626
00:51:27.119 --> 00:51:30.280
ramipications. I'm still in touch with
a lot all they're all emailing me,

627
00:51:30.480 --> 00:51:32.119
you know, like when is it
going to air? I went to wait

628
00:51:32.199 --> 00:51:36.599
till, you know, to know
when I should turn off my phone because

629
00:51:36.599 --> 00:51:40.480
I'm going to get you know,
basic az by my whole you know unit.

630
00:51:42.639 --> 00:51:45.119
So they're they're they're nervous, they're
very Some of these guys are very

631
00:51:45.159 --> 00:51:50.360
nervous about the show, their participation
in the show, and what how they're

632
00:51:50.880 --> 00:51:53.239
colleagues. You know, it's going
to come out of the blue, like

633
00:51:53.280 --> 00:51:59.599
look, there's you know, sergeant
whatever or lieutenant or leaving lieutenant command or

634
00:51:59.599 --> 00:52:05.360
whatever, uh saying something and then
they're going to get blasted. And so

635
00:52:05.599 --> 00:52:07.039
I give them a lot of credit, you know, and yeah, I

636
00:52:07.079 --> 00:52:12.039
appreciate it because it's you know,
that's what that's what made our show possible,

637
00:52:12.159 --> 00:52:15.519
is their bravery really and coming quote
yeah, and I mean a lot

638
00:52:15.519 --> 00:52:20.719
of people feel like, you know, there's a there's a suppression of this

639
00:52:20.840 --> 00:52:23.320
information, like these military guys are
told not to share this information. But

640
00:52:23.360 --> 00:52:28.280
in my experience, it's more along
the lines of what you're talking about.

641
00:52:28.719 --> 00:52:34.000
They're they're just they don't want to
share information and they're kind of self editing

642
00:52:34.039 --> 00:52:37.079
themselves because of the ridicule and that, you know, they don't want to

643
00:52:37.079 --> 00:52:43.599
be a subject of this sort of
attention. Yeah. By by a couple

644
00:52:43.719 --> 00:52:45.840
instances, there were guys who said
they were forced to sign an NBA,

645
00:52:46.480 --> 00:52:52.199
but vast majority of this is just
yeah, just wanting to keep it quiet.

646
00:52:53.000 --> 00:52:58.599
We have a story coming up that's
really interesting, one of the most

647
00:52:58.719 --> 00:53:06.360
dramatic stories where we and then we
have the second witness who also went to

648
00:53:06.400 --> 00:53:12.039
sit from a different dvantage point and
we call him and this is really the

649
00:53:12.119 --> 00:53:16.480
kind of emotional interesting The most psychological
and emotional twists in terms of these were

650
00:53:16.559 --> 00:53:21.400
basically, they both were they were
in a National Guard unit. They both

651
00:53:22.000 --> 00:53:24.800
had the same incident happened to them. They both went out and talked to

652
00:53:24.800 --> 00:53:30.559
tolder unit that day, right,
and they both got totally ridiculed. And

653
00:53:31.079 --> 00:53:36.000
the second guy not our main source, but the second guy kind of turned

654
00:53:36.039 --> 00:53:37.159
on the other guy and was like, oh, yeah, we were just

655
00:53:37.280 --> 00:53:43.360
joking at the time and kind of
hung him out to drop. So when

656
00:53:43.400 --> 00:53:46.800
we called him to corroborate, he
was like, yeah, you know,

657
00:53:46.920 --> 00:53:52.159
I feel bad because all those years
that I kind of left my partner out

658
00:53:52.199 --> 00:53:57.079
to drive because I couldn't handle they
were all and I couldn't handle the ridicule.

659
00:53:57.599 --> 00:54:00.800
But here's what happened. And he
tells us this is totally independently from

660
00:54:00.800 --> 00:54:07.000
the other guy, tells us his
story from this different vantage point, totally

661
00:54:07.039 --> 00:54:10.480
I mean, slight differences and you
know, kind of subjective experience, but

662
00:54:10.880 --> 00:54:16.440
tells the same story of the same
seeing the same craft, right and and

663
00:54:16.440 --> 00:54:20.079
and says, you know, look, I feel bad. I feel bad

664
00:54:20.960 --> 00:54:22.679
that I let him. I hung
him out to dry. All these years,

665
00:54:22.679 --> 00:54:25.400
I've always felt bad about that because
apparently it was like a big deal.

666
00:54:25.400 --> 00:54:30.639
It really affected them. And you
know, again, that's what's so

667
00:54:30.880 --> 00:54:34.559
people. You know, one I'd
say one of the negative things about the

668
00:54:34.599 --> 00:54:37.599
military if you learn about military culture, and I don't want to speak too

669
00:54:37.639 --> 00:54:42.639
much because someone has never served,
but having been to a rock and other

670
00:54:42.880 --> 00:54:47.320
than have been embedded and know people
that you have obviously, so you know,

671
00:54:47.360 --> 00:54:52.000
there definitely is a culture of hazing, right, Like you know,

672
00:54:52.440 --> 00:54:54.119
I've played a lot of sports.
You know it's similar, right. Yeah.

673
00:54:55.000 --> 00:54:59.239
Uh, there's definitely a macho hazing
and I don't think that's going to

674
00:54:59.280 --> 00:55:05.400
be splash or controversial to say the
culture of hazing that that can be pretty

675
00:55:05.400 --> 00:55:09.360
intense in the more things. So
and there's a there's a culture of conformity,

676
00:55:09.639 --> 00:55:15.599
right so uh yeah, that's what
we get. So hopefully you're going

677
00:55:15.679 --> 00:55:21.039
to learn more about that see it
in the first champ. And I guess

678
00:55:21.119 --> 00:55:25.679
my last question because we're kind of
gone about an hour here is I know

679
00:55:25.719 --> 00:55:30.880
there are a lot of people in
the woodworks who are interested in this topic

680
00:55:30.960 --> 00:55:37.440
but afraid to share their interests,
not just high level officials but also uh,

681
00:55:37.760 --> 00:55:42.119
celebrities. You know, you could
share names if you want or not.

682
00:55:42.440 --> 00:55:46.000
But have you heard, you know, from some high level officials or

683
00:55:46.039 --> 00:55:52.960
celebrities saying, hey, WHOA I
wish not really, I mean we definitely

684
00:55:52.079 --> 00:55:55.000
heard. I mean, for every
story that you see on the show.

685
00:55:55.039 --> 00:56:01.519
There's about ten more right people who
contact them right and some of those stories

686
00:56:01.519 --> 00:56:06.960
are super compelling, but for whatever
reason, like they didn't want to come

687
00:56:07.000 --> 00:56:10.280
on, or sometimes it's like just
a little bit too secondhand of like I

688
00:56:10.320 --> 00:56:15.119
saw a video, like we had
a story. I don't want to say

689
00:56:15.159 --> 00:56:20.760
too much about it, but a
very uh interesting person or with a very

690
00:56:20.880 --> 00:56:28.239
high level position within Air Force and
NASA telescort. But it was, you

691
00:56:28.280 --> 00:56:30.440
know, it was secondhand. It
was like I saw a video or something,

692
00:56:31.039 --> 00:56:34.320
so we didn't you know, I
didn't have the videos. It's like,

693
00:56:34.760 --> 00:56:37.639
can we really make that into a
story. It just seems something something

694
00:56:37.960 --> 00:56:43.239
you know, kind of secondhand.
It just it just wasn't enough there and

695
00:56:43.519 --> 00:56:47.199
in the prout. So but there's
a lot more and we're still asking.

696
00:56:47.320 --> 00:56:52.159
We're going to put up coming up
in the new episodes build the call to

697
00:56:52.239 --> 00:56:57.519
action is going to be up there
at the email that uh you know is

698
00:56:57.599 --> 00:57:01.960
a shoot. I only know that
email address is live. And we were

699
00:57:02.000 --> 00:57:05.960
still you know, people are still
coming in. We've gotten some of the

700
00:57:06.000 --> 00:57:08.159
stories that you see in this episode. I mean, in the season we're

701
00:57:08.239 --> 00:57:13.360
late breaking that just came in you'll
see because they're you know, you can

702
00:57:13.400 --> 00:57:16.760
tell by the ones that are on
Skype, right, those are all post

703
00:57:16.840 --> 00:57:23.360
COVID stories that that guys coming forward
to Lou, And people are coming forward

704
00:57:23.360 --> 00:57:28.960
to Lou all the time. Every
week he's forwarding something from someone coming to

705
00:57:29.039 --> 00:57:32.519
him. So you'll see a couple
of those stories that came in in the

706
00:57:32.559 --> 00:57:36.920
last couple of months that were just
you know, they're too good that we

707
00:57:37.039 --> 00:57:43.519
had awesome. That's so exciting,
So excited to watch the show in just

708
00:57:43.559 --> 00:57:47.119
a few hours now, episode two. But thank you so much for coming

709
00:57:47.119 --> 00:57:52.760
on and sharing this information. These
are some really exciting times and the show

710
00:57:52.880 --> 00:57:57.960
is right in the middle of it, kind of steam rolling all this information

711
00:57:58.079 --> 00:58:00.920
through. Yeah, well, so
are you all? You know, you're

712
00:58:00.960 --> 00:58:04.840
definitely doing a great job with all
you're reporting. Really, I really love

713
00:58:04.880 --> 00:58:08.760
reading your articles, and again I
appreciate all the support and a big shout

714
00:58:08.760 --> 00:58:13.760
out to all your supporters as well. I think you're one of the best

715
00:58:13.800 --> 00:58:19.159
guys. I've said this before on
this topic, and that's great that you

716
00:58:19.239 --> 00:58:22.920
have more supporters and keep out the
great work. Well. Thank you,

717
00:58:22.960 --> 00:58:27.199
thank you very much, and of
course the feelings mutual. You could hear

718
00:58:27.760 --> 00:58:30.039
kicking some butt over there, so
thanks so much for that. All right,

719
00:58:30.079 --> 00:58:32.719
thanks man, and yeah, let's
touch space. Like you know,

720
00:58:32.760 --> 00:58:36.239
I want to hear more, you
know, if you want to do a

721
00:58:36.800 --> 00:58:38.639
kind of into season wrap up or
something, I'd love to chat with you.

722
00:58:38.760 --> 00:58:44.079
Okay, get more feedback from you
and your viewers, definitely great,

723
00:58:44.840 --> 00:58:47.920
then we'll make that happen. Excellent, all right, bye everybody, all

724
00:58:49.039 --> 00:58:52.440
right, Tia, thank you,
and yeah bye to my listeners. I

725
00:58:52.480 --> 00:58:57.280
know I had talked about getting Luelasando
on and I will be able to do

726
00:58:57.320 --> 00:59:00.519
that soon. We're working on it. But lots of more exciting people,

727
00:59:00.519 --> 00:59:05.079
including we'll be talking to Dave Marler, so you'll be watching him hopefully in

728
00:59:05.119 --> 00:59:07.920
a few hours on the show,
and we'll talk to him about the show

729
00:59:07.960 --> 00:59:09.519
next week. We'll do, in
fact, probably a couple of interviews with

730
00:59:09.639 --> 00:59:14.440
him, because he's a good buddy
with a lot of great information that would

731
00:59:14.480 --> 00:59:16.360
be great to hear. I'd love
to I'm going to tune in because i'd

732
00:59:16.360 --> 00:59:20.280
love to hear what Marlar thinks about
the show. Obviously he hasn't seen it,

733
00:59:20.679 --> 00:59:24.559
so i'd love to hear his reactions
to how we He's excited, he's

734
00:59:24.599 --> 00:59:30.079
really excited about it, and he
loved meeting Chris Mellon. Who wouldn't so

735
00:59:30.320 --> 00:59:34.599
yeah, it's going to be good. Excell all right, thanks man,

736
00:59:35.159 --> 00:59:35.960
bye everybody,