WEBVTT 1 00:00:31.440 --> 00:00:36.840 Welcome back to I'll Evotement Part two here on Blood and Dust podcast, Wild 2 00:00:36.880 --> 00:00:41.799 West True Crime. Julie Cammy, how are you ladies doing today? Doing 3 00:00:41.799 --> 00:00:45.560 pretty good? Pretty good? Yeah? Yeah, a little wild night last 4 00:00:45.679 --> 00:00:49.359 night, Cammy feeling all right? I did. I had a I had 5 00:00:49.399 --> 00:00:51.719 a new hair, so I went out with the girls and we had a 6 00:00:51.719 --> 00:00:58.600 great time and played in a little mini tourney which was fund Cammy through on 7 00:00:58.640 --> 00:01:02.679 the razzle dazzle. So that makes it a girl's night, right, Yeah, 8 00:01:03.879 --> 00:01:10.159 maybe I need to start doing that. When you go play many tournaments, 9 00:01:10.200 --> 00:01:12.000 you have to go throw your hair in a ponytail anyway, don't you. 10 00:01:12.000 --> 00:01:17.280 No, no, you use it as a blocker, don't you your 11 00:01:17.319 --> 00:01:21.040 hair to where you get tunnel vision from the table and can't see anything around 12 00:01:21.120 --> 00:01:25.840 you. Cammy is a fellow pool player. Kill out some of that commentary 13 00:01:26.200 --> 00:01:29.439 that the boys like to give when there's a female shooter. Oh of course, 14 00:01:29.519 --> 00:01:33.760 yeah, it happens for dude sometimes too, not as often, not 15 00:01:33.879 --> 00:01:38.239 as often, but I'm usually I don't like to shark, but every now 16 00:01:38.280 --> 00:01:42.480 and then I'll be making off hand compliments or off hand comments, you know 17 00:01:42.519 --> 00:01:47.079 when somebody else, Oh that's a good shot. I don't know, kind 18 00:01:47.079 --> 00:01:49.719 of lucky, but never. There's this guy last night and they called him 19 00:01:49.719 --> 00:01:59.159 Cranky Sanna and he was basically narrating all the games. We have an old 20 00:01:59.239 --> 00:02:01.719 dude like that or that I used to play with. I was like that 21 00:02:01.799 --> 00:02:07.239 too, and it's just like, bro, shut up, just go outside. 22 00:02:07.680 --> 00:02:10.520 And he does it on purpose. He knows what he's doing. Yeah, 23 00:02:10.520 --> 00:02:15.960 that's why we just played with earbuds in. Are you ladies ready to 24 00:02:16.039 --> 00:02:21.599 go? Who wants to go first? Awkward silence. I'll go first, 25 00:02:21.639 --> 00:02:27.319 all right. So right round eighteen fifty, the group parted ways near Santa 26 00:02:27.360 --> 00:02:32.039 Fe in New Mexico Territory, and Brewster took a northern route and the Oatman 27 00:02:32.199 --> 00:02:38.039 family, along with several other families, went south to SoCoRo and Tucson. 28 00:02:38.439 --> 00:02:45.000 It was in Tucson that Olive's father, Roy Oatman, took command of the 29 00:02:45.400 --> 00:02:51.680 party that was traveling south. So from then we get into early eighteen fifty 30 00:02:51.800 --> 00:02:57.840 one. The wagon train reaches New Mexico Territory and they are met there with 31 00:02:58.280 --> 00:03:05.520 harsh environment gas resources. The group abandoned their goal of reaching the mouth of 32 00:03:05.560 --> 00:03:12.159 the Colorado River, and their journey ended in Maricopa wells. And isn't this 33 00:03:12.240 --> 00:03:16.439 part of the area of the United States where at night it gets freezing cold 34 00:03:16.520 --> 00:03:20.680 and during the day it's just severely hot depending on the months too, So 35 00:03:20.719 --> 00:03:24.000 I'm guessing it was miserable. Yes, yes, I used to live down 36 00:03:24.159 --> 00:03:30.520 in the around the Phoenix area and in Saint David as well, and that's 37 00:03:30.639 --> 00:03:34.719 usually how it is, depending on the elevation. I will say that elevation 38 00:03:34.759 --> 00:03:39.159 definitely plays a factor because I frequent the Utah area. The Colorado River runs 39 00:03:39.199 --> 00:03:44.719 through it, and it gets dry heat during the day, cold at night. 40 00:03:44.800 --> 00:03:46.960 But you know, if you're in a wagon with your entire family, 41 00:03:47.039 --> 00:03:51.759 and his wife was pregnant, like, I can't imagine this being comfortable. 42 00:03:51.840 --> 00:03:55.599 Oh no, it's just a land of extremes. So it's either really hot 43 00:03:55.680 --> 00:04:00.039 or like he said, really cold. Yeah, right, very little game, 44 00:04:00.319 --> 00:04:04.719 very little water. Oh absolutely. And I remember living in Phoenix, 45 00:04:04.719 --> 00:04:09.240 and I mean it'd be ninety degrees at night, you know, three am. 46 00:04:10.199 --> 00:04:15.000 It's one of those weird terrains depending on the elevation. But yeah, 47 00:04:14.120 --> 00:04:20.160 it's pretty harsh out there. But the Oapmen family were the only ones that 48 00:04:20.240 --> 00:04:28.680 continued to push west after all this, and the townspeople actually warned the wagon 49 00:04:28.720 --> 00:04:34.519 train of barren trails and the hostile natives as well. So for six days 50 00:04:34.519 --> 00:04:42.120 the family traveled southwest, and on the seventh day they again ran into Doctor 51 00:04:42.199 --> 00:04:46.839 Lookout and his guide, who were both on their way back to fort Yuma. 52 00:04:46.680 --> 00:04:51.759 The family pleaded with him to deliver a message to fort Yuma requesting supplies 53 00:04:51.800 --> 00:04:57.680 and assistance, to which he agreed to. So the next morning, when 54 00:04:57.680 --> 00:05:00.000 the doctor and his guide were due to set out out, a group of 55 00:05:00.120 --> 00:05:05.319 natives appeared from behind a bluff and entered their camp in what would be a 56 00:05:05.439 --> 00:05:11.800 successful attempt to distract the doctor and his guide while their animals were being stolen. 57 00:05:12.560 --> 00:05:15.560 Both a doctor and his guide return to town and leave a note posted 58 00:05:15.600 --> 00:05:21.240 to a tree in hopes of warning the Oatman family of the dangerous natives and 59 00:05:21.360 --> 00:05:29.040 a promise to return with reinforcements and supplies. Yeah, we noticed or mentioned 60 00:05:29.079 --> 00:05:33.199 this in part one, and I think Justin was retelling it. Where they 61 00:05:33.279 --> 00:05:36.399 ran into where they were supposed to read the note on the tree, and 62 00:05:36.480 --> 00:05:40.639 it was just like fate kind of intervened and they didn't see the note, 63 00:05:40.680 --> 00:05:45.120 and perhaps if they would have seen it, the entire family would still you 64 00:05:45.160 --> 00:05:48.759 know, have survived. Absolutely, just kind of sad. It is really 65 00:05:48.800 --> 00:05:56.319 sad. In the memoir, Lorenzo actually expounds upon that, and there's like 66 00:05:56.360 --> 00:06:00.639 two or three pages where he's talking about the fates and this letter. So 67 00:06:00.839 --> 00:06:04.519 that's a very good point. This whole story is just like kind of makes 68 00:06:04.519 --> 00:06:09.240 you sick. But unfortunately there's a whole new world, you know, on 69 00:06:09.439 --> 00:06:12.959 our time frame compared to theirs. It's just kind of sad, oh, 70 00:06:13.079 --> 00:06:18.120 definitely, And unfortunately this is what leads us to the Oatman massacre in March 71 00:06:18.600 --> 00:06:24.120 eighteen fifty one. This is the party now passes what is Gilli Bend, 72 00:06:24.959 --> 00:06:28.680 what they now call Oatman Flat. They made a camp there about their fourth 73 00:06:28.759 --> 00:06:32.079 day when they were out of Maricopa Wells. This would have been approximately eighty 74 00:06:32.160 --> 00:06:38.839 to ninety miles outside of Yuma. The terrain was rough and visibility was low. 75 00:06:39.120 --> 00:06:44.079 Making camp on a small island sandbar, the group struggled against strong winds 76 00:06:44.120 --> 00:06:46.800 and surges of water that at times would come up and try to put out 77 00:06:46.839 --> 00:06:51.839 their fires. So this was just a terrible sound like a rough night. 78 00:06:53.240 --> 00:06:57.920 Yes. The next day they traveled to the opposite bank, and after difficulty 79 00:06:58.000 --> 00:07:02.040 with pushing the wagon livestock and supplies all the way up that steep embankment. 80 00:07:02.439 --> 00:07:05.759 They were left to break camp early and planned to make up for it by 81 00:07:05.800 --> 00:07:12.240 traveling the next night by moonlight. Lorenzo, which is olives younger brother. 82 00:07:12.360 --> 00:07:15.920 I thought he was older, Yeah, the one older than her. He 83 00:07:15.959 --> 00:07:20.360 was actually quoted in that memoir as saying, for one hour the night before, 84 00:07:20.399 --> 00:07:26.399 my father had wept bitterly while in the wagon, thinking himself concealed from 85 00:07:26.439 --> 00:07:30.439 his family, but of which I was ignorant until it was told me by 86 00:07:30.480 --> 00:07:33.279 my eldest sister. During the day, my mother was calm, cool and 87 00:07:33.319 --> 00:07:39.120 collected, patient to endure, and diligent to do that she might administer the 88 00:07:39.199 --> 00:07:45.120 comfort of the rest of us. So it just really kind of illustrates how 89 00:07:45.160 --> 00:07:48.160 stressful this was. You see the effect on his father and his mother's really 90 00:07:48.199 --> 00:07:54.000 just there trying to hold things together for the family. Man. Man, 91 00:07:54.040 --> 00:07:59.439 I couldn't even imagine. Yeah, So this is where they actually met up 92 00:07:59.439 --> 00:08:03.879 with the Indian where the actual massacre starts to occur. It was there on 93 00:08:03.920 --> 00:08:09.079 the embankment that the family was approached by party of natives, And this is 94 00:08:09.079 --> 00:08:13.720 a direct quote from their memoirs. It is Captivity of the Oatman Girls. 95 00:08:13.720 --> 00:08:18.079 And this is directly from it was written by I believe what was his name 96 00:08:18.079 --> 00:08:24.519 again, kiami Ah Stratton, Yeah, Stratton. So he wrote it in 97 00:08:24.560 --> 00:08:31.800 a way obviously to gain but most of it should be roughly what happened or 98 00:08:31.879 --> 00:08:35.759 had occurred. To keep that in your back pocket when you're hearing this quote, 99 00:08:35.759 --> 00:08:39.320 our hasty mail had been served. My father sat and, seemingly spellbound 100 00:08:39.320 --> 00:08:41.639 with his own struggling emotions, was a little on one side, as if 101 00:08:41.679 --> 00:08:46.480 oblivious evolve immediately about him, and was about in the act of lifting some 102 00:08:46.559 --> 00:08:52.440 of the baggage to the wagon that had as yet remained unloaded since the ascent 103 00:08:52.600 --> 00:08:56.360 of the hill. When casting my eyes downhill by the way we had come, 104 00:08:56.440 --> 00:09:01.159 I saw several Indians slowly and leisurely approaching us on the road. I 105 00:09:01.200 --> 00:09:05.720 was greatly alarmed, and for a moment dared not to speak. At the 106 00:09:05.799 --> 00:09:09.759 time my father's back was turned, I spoke to him, and, pointing 107 00:09:09.759 --> 00:09:13.919 to the Indians, what I saw in my father's countenance excited me and a 108 00:09:13.960 --> 00:09:16.279 great fear, and it took a deeper hold upon my feelings of the danger 109 00:09:16.320 --> 00:09:20.440 we were in. Then at the sight of the Indians they were now approaching 110 00:09:20.440 --> 00:09:24.840 near us. The blood rushed to my father's face. For a moment, 111 00:09:24.919 --> 00:09:28.039 his face would burn and flash as it was crimson with the tide from within, 112 00:09:28.720 --> 00:09:33.399 and then a deathlike paleness would spread over his countenance, as if a 113 00:09:33.440 --> 00:09:37.200 whole frame was suddenly stiffened with horror. I sat too plainly the effort that 114 00:09:37.240 --> 00:09:41.879 it cost him to attempt a concealment of his emotions. He succeeded, however, 115 00:09:41.919 --> 00:09:46.519 in controlling the jerking of his muscles and his mental agitations, so to 116 00:09:46.559 --> 00:09:52.600 tell us in a mild composed accents not to fear the Indians would not harm 117 00:09:52.679 --> 00:09:56.039 us. He had always been led to believe that the Indians could be so 118 00:09:56.159 --> 00:10:00.559 treated as to avoid difficulty with them. He had been among them much in 119 00:10:00.600 --> 00:10:05.120 the Western States, and so often tried his theory of leniency with success that 120 00:10:05.200 --> 00:10:09.480 he often censured the whites for their severity towards them, and was disposed to 121 00:10:09.600 --> 00:10:13.759 tribute injury received from them to the unwise and cruel treatment of them by the 122 00:10:13.799 --> 00:10:16.320 Whites end quote. So I really liked this from the book because I really 123 00:10:16.360 --> 00:10:24.519 like how it explained that Roy Oatman actually tried to be friendly with the natives 124 00:10:24.519 --> 00:10:30.559 and wasn't quick to cause conflict. Yeah, he wasn't quick to rush to 125 00:10:30.639 --> 00:10:35.639 alarm. He wasn't quick to judging, just kind of treated them with compassion, 126 00:10:35.679 --> 00:10:39.720 I suppose from reading that. So after the Indians approached, he became 127 00:10:39.799 --> 00:10:45.159 collected and kindly motioned them to sit down, spoke to them in Spanish, 128 00:10:45.200 --> 00:10:50.360 to which they replied. They immediately sat down upon the stones about us, 129 00:10:50.480 --> 00:10:56.320 and still conversing with father in Spanish, made the most vehement professions of friendship. 130 00:10:56.879 --> 00:11:00.919 They asked for tobacco and a pipe that they might smoke in token of 131 00:11:00.960 --> 00:11:07.000 their sincerity and of their friendly feelings towards us. This my father immediately prepared, 132 00:11:07.399 --> 00:11:11.000 took a whiff himself, then passed it around even to the last. 133 00:11:11.679 --> 00:11:16.200 After smoking, these Indians asked for something to eat. Father told him of 134 00:11:16.200 --> 00:11:20.240 our destitute condition, and that he could not feed them without robbing his family. 135 00:11:20.759 --> 00:11:24.159 That unless we could soon reach a place of new supplies, we must 136 00:11:24.240 --> 00:11:28.480 suffer. To all this, they seemed to yield only a reluctant hearing. 137 00:11:28.559 --> 00:11:33.039 They became ernest and rather imperative, and every plea that we made to them 138 00:11:33.080 --> 00:11:39.840 of our distress, but increased their wild and furious clamors. Father reluctantly took 139 00:11:39.879 --> 00:11:41.759 some bread from the wagon and gave it to them, saying that it was 140 00:11:41.919 --> 00:11:46.919 robbery and perhaps starvation to his family. As soon as this was devoured, 141 00:11:46.960 --> 00:11:52.600 they asked for more. Meanwhile surveying us narrowly and prying and looking into every 142 00:11:52.639 --> 00:11:56.639 part of the wagon. They were told that we could spare them no more. 143 00:11:58.240 --> 00:12:03.080 They immediately packed themselves into a secret council little on one side, which 144 00:12:03.120 --> 00:12:09.679 they conducted in the Apache language, which was wholly unintelligible to us. We 145 00:12:09.679 --> 00:12:15.000 were totally in the dark as to their designs, save that their appearance and 146 00:12:15.120 --> 00:12:18.679 actions were the threatening of some hellish deed. We were now about ready to 147 00:12:18.720 --> 00:12:24.440 start. Father had again returned to complete the reloading of the remainder of articles. 148 00:12:24.759 --> 00:12:28.759 Mother was in the wagon arranging them o'live with. My older sister was 149 00:12:28.799 --> 00:12:33.440 standing upon the opposite side of the wagon. Mary Anne, a little girl 150 00:12:33.519 --> 00:12:37.679 about seven years old, sat upon a stone holding a rope attached to the 151 00:12:37.679 --> 00:12:43.000 horns of the foremost team. The rest of the children were on the opposite 152 00:12:43.000 --> 00:12:46.639 side of the wagon from the Indians, so the whole family at this point 153 00:12:46.759 --> 00:12:50.639 is just kind of hanging around hoping to avoid any more trouble. Yeah, 154 00:12:50.679 --> 00:12:54.240 and to get the heck out of Dodge. Well, it seemed like they 155 00:12:54.240 --> 00:12:58.279 were playing nice at first when they were getting what they wanted, and then 156 00:12:58.600 --> 00:13:01.360 when they were told, Hey, if I give you any more, I'm 157 00:13:01.399 --> 00:13:03.879 going to be starving my own family. We got nothing else to give you, 158 00:13:05.399 --> 00:13:09.279 right, And obviously they were not there to make friends, as indicated 159 00:13:09.399 --> 00:13:15.240 as we'll soon find out. Yeah, So the way it's told is that 160 00:13:15.320 --> 00:13:18.120 all of a sudden, while you know, the family's over here and the 161 00:13:18.480 --> 00:13:22.080 natives are over there, all of a sudden, the natives it roughed into 162 00:13:22.399 --> 00:13:28.360 hoping war cries and they start attacking the family. They are attacked with clubs, 163 00:13:28.600 --> 00:13:31.720 and I believe it was Lorenzo. He was struck on the top of 164 00:13:31.759 --> 00:13:37.320 the back of his head. He actually was struck so hard that he fell 165 00:13:37.440 --> 00:13:43.120 to his knees and was struck unconscious. And then all of continues to say 166 00:13:43.200 --> 00:13:46.759 that as soon as they had taken her on to one side one of the 167 00:13:46.799 --> 00:13:52.159 Indians, she actually saw what happened with Lorenzo, and almost at the same 168 00:13:52.200 --> 00:13:58.159 instance, her father was also beaten. She's just completely in shock with what 169 00:13:58.200 --> 00:14:01.799 she's seeing happen around her. And she turns around and she sees her father 170 00:14:01.960 --> 00:14:05.600 struggling and bleeding, you know, in the dirt, and the top of 171 00:14:05.600 --> 00:14:11.360 his head is basically busted open, and she's just looking around. She sees 172 00:14:11.360 --> 00:14:16.240 her mother and her mother also has the youngest sibling in her arms, and 173 00:14:16.360 --> 00:14:22.799 her mother and the sibling are attacked and unfortunately they're all murdered. I believe 174 00:14:22.879 --> 00:14:26.600 they're all beaten to death in the head with the war club. Yeah, 175 00:14:26.679 --> 00:14:31.480 that's horrible. Yeah. So after being knocked in the head with the war 176 00:14:31.559 --> 00:14:35.559 club, Lorenzo, the older brother, is actually thrown over the side of 177 00:14:35.559 --> 00:14:39.320 a cliff and left for dad after his body was rated for valuables. I 178 00:14:39.320 --> 00:14:43.600 think they ended up taking a hat. And this is something to keep in 179 00:14:43.639 --> 00:14:48.519 mind because Lorenzo actually goes on and never stops looking for his sisters. And 180 00:14:48.720 --> 00:14:54.320 after he was pushed off that cliff, Olive and her younger sister, Mary 181 00:14:54.320 --> 00:14:58.480 Anne, who was I believe seven at the time, they were taken away 182 00:14:58.519 --> 00:15:03.000 from the murder scene. So three days after the attack, Lorenzo woke up 183 00:15:03.000 --> 00:15:07.399 from his injuries on the cliff or you know, around that cliff area, 184 00:15:07.440 --> 00:15:11.320 and went in search and help in finding his family. While searching, he 185 00:15:11.399 --> 00:15:15.720 was found by Pimole natives and who took pity on him when they recognized him 186 00:15:15.759 --> 00:15:18.919 as one of the children from the family that had set out on the trail 187 00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:22.559 not too long ago. The natives took him from his horse to providing him 188 00:15:22.720 --> 00:15:26.600 with blankets, water, and food. They bade him stay while they went 189 00:15:26.600 --> 00:15:31.200 in search of the massacre site, leaving him with supplies and the promise of 190 00:15:31.240 --> 00:15:35.360 an escort to Pimole. So Lorenzo understandably was nervous in their company and continued 191 00:15:35.399 --> 00:15:41.039 on his way. Soon after they left, he was found by Robert Wilder 192 00:15:41.440 --> 00:15:45.679 and was rejoined in an immigrant and wagon train three days later. Returning to 193 00:15:45.720 --> 00:15:48.879 the Oatman flat and buried what remained of his family, he is quoted as 194 00:15:48.919 --> 00:15:54.039 saying, we buried the bodies of father, mother and babe in one common 195 00:15:54.080 --> 00:15:58.320 grave. This would have been due to the rocky desert landscape, and a 196 00:15:58.440 --> 00:16:02.279 karen was used. They were not able to dig with any real depth. 197 00:16:02.679 --> 00:16:07.480 Lorenzo returned to the settlement and continued his hope in finding and reuniting with his 198 00:16:07.559 --> 00:16:12.919 sisters. Man. Could you imagine that though like living through that beating and 199 00:16:12.960 --> 00:16:15.840 being left or dead, and they threw him down, like down at twenty 200 00:16:15.840 --> 00:16:21.960 foot embankment. Dude ended up living and then he wakes up and he's like, 201 00:16:22.679 --> 00:16:26.559 Okay, my sisters are still alive, two of them are. I 202 00:16:26.679 --> 00:16:30.559 need to find him, and then just getting that help is gosh's just so 203 00:16:30.600 --> 00:16:34.600 hard to do. What I remember, he crawled up the cliff, if 204 00:16:34.639 --> 00:16:40.600 I remember correctly, and then he was making sure like finding every part of 205 00:16:40.600 --> 00:16:44.480 his family to see like who was alive, who was dead? Can you 206 00:16:44.519 --> 00:16:48.080 imagine finding your mother and father, let alone all of your siblings, let 207 00:16:48.120 --> 00:16:53.600 alone too just dead. Oh my gosh. Can you imagine what he's thinking 208 00:16:53.720 --> 00:17:00.759 is happening to his two sisters right, or how his stomach felt to the 209 00:17:00.799 --> 00:17:04.400 Tinne Indians came and took him under their wing. He's probably thinking, I 210 00:17:04.400 --> 00:17:07.359 don't know what to do with myself at this point. Oh yeah, yeah, 211 00:17:07.400 --> 00:17:11.119 that would have been terrifying. Yeah. So after the attack, the 212 00:17:11.240 --> 00:17:17.920 natives pillaged all the family's goods, and they even stripped the deceased bodies of 213 00:17:18.160 --> 00:17:23.000 any of their valuables, and they took both fourteen year old Olive and seven 214 00:17:23.079 --> 00:17:27.400 year old Mary Anne as captives, and once all the goods were packed up, 215 00:17:27.920 --> 00:17:32.359 the girls were forced to walk a mile and a half to a former 216 00:17:32.440 --> 00:17:37.519 native camp, which Olive was quoted as saying, they boiled some of the 217 00:17:37.559 --> 00:17:42.119 beans just from our wagon, mixed some flour with water, and baked it 218 00:17:42.240 --> 00:17:48.000 in the ashes. They offered us some food, but in the most insulting 219 00:17:48.160 --> 00:17:55.200 and taunting manner, continually making merry over every indication of grief in us, 220 00:17:56.559 --> 00:17:59.759 and with which our hearts were ready to break. We could not eat. 221 00:18:00.279 --> 00:18:03.440 After the meal and about an hour's rest, they began to repack and make 222 00:18:03.480 --> 00:18:08.799 preparations to proceed. The party then walked another mile or so and broke camp 223 00:18:08.839 --> 00:18:12.960 for the night, where Olive and her sister were again offered food, and 224 00:18:14.160 --> 00:18:21.519 understandably so declined because they were mourning and they were terrified. When Olive recounted, 225 00:18:21.519 --> 00:18:25.359 she said, this food was offered to me, but how could I 226 00:18:25.440 --> 00:18:30.319 eat to prolong a life I now loathed? The reader can perhaps imagine the 227 00:18:30.440 --> 00:18:33.839 nature of my thoughts while standing at the camp fire, with my sister clinging 228 00:18:33.880 --> 00:18:40.680 to me in convulsive sobs and groans from fear of the Indians, whose frowns 229 00:18:40.680 --> 00:18:45.680 and threats mingled with hellish jests were constantly glaring upon us. She struggled to 230 00:18:45.720 --> 00:18:51.640 repress and prevent any outburst of the grief that seemed to tear her little heart, 231 00:18:52.279 --> 00:18:56.400 and when her feelings became uncontrollable, she would hide her head in my 232 00:18:56.559 --> 00:19:03.079 arms and most piteously sob aloud. But she was immediately hushed by the brandishing 233 00:19:03.319 --> 00:19:07.720 of a war club over her head. Man, God, that really got 234 00:19:07.759 --> 00:19:11.039 me. I think the part where they said, why would I want to 235 00:19:11.079 --> 00:19:15.039 eat to prolong a life that I no longer wanted? I mean, can 236 00:19:15.079 --> 00:19:21.200 you imagine not wanting to live? You're one kidnapped by these people who just 237 00:19:21.400 --> 00:19:26.920 murdered your dam your siblings, and you're sitting out here scared to death. 238 00:19:26.920 --> 00:19:30.079 Oh my god, Well then you're trying to be strong for a seven year 239 00:19:30.119 --> 00:19:33.920 old sister when you're only fourteen. That's what kept her going, and I 240 00:19:33.920 --> 00:19:37.839 think that is yeah, yeah, so sad. Yeah. She makes reference 241 00:19:37.839 --> 00:19:42.599 to that quite a bit in the memoir, including how much she really did 242 00:19:42.759 --> 00:19:48.000 struggle with wanting to continue in the beginning. You know, she had to. 243 00:19:48.640 --> 00:19:49.680 It was one of those things, It's like, if I'm gone, 244 00:19:49.720 --> 00:19:55.279 what's going to happen to my little sister here exactly so. Under the threat 245 00:19:55.359 --> 00:19:59.680 of the war club and untold violence, the girls were forced to march at 246 00:19:59.680 --> 00:20:03.880 a foot rendering pace that almost led to Marianne being left behind, until a 247 00:20:03.960 --> 00:20:07.920 native took her upon his back for the remainder of the day. The following 248 00:20:08.000 --> 00:20:11.680 day, around noon, they broke camp to harvest the plundered livestock, and 249 00:20:11.759 --> 00:20:15.839 the girls were offered food, of which this time they actually ate. I 250 00:20:15.839 --> 00:20:22.960 would imagine at this time they were very trail very, especially with the walking. 251 00:20:22.319 --> 00:20:27.200 Can you imagine in a hot, asolutely and survival mode right, The 252 00:20:27.200 --> 00:20:30.480 next few days would prove to be a preview of the horrors that the girls 253 00:20:30.640 --> 00:20:37.160 could expect for the next year of captivity. Olive spoke of the next day. 254 00:20:37.079 --> 00:20:41.599 They endeavored now to compel Marianne again to go on foot, but this 255 00:20:41.759 --> 00:20:45.079 she could not do, And after beating her again, all of which she 256 00:20:45.200 --> 00:20:48.000 took without a murmur, one of them again took her upon his shoulder and 257 00:20:48.119 --> 00:20:52.759 we started. I had not gone far before I found it impossible to proceed 258 00:20:52.799 --> 00:20:57.039 on account of the soreness of my feet. They then gave me something very 259 00:20:57.119 --> 00:21:00.799 much of the substance of soul leather, which they tied upon the bottom of 260 00:21:00.880 --> 00:21:06.240 my feet. This was a relief, and although suffering much from thirst and 261 00:21:06.279 --> 00:21:10.039 the pain of over exertion, I was enabled to keep up with the heavy 262 00:21:10.119 --> 00:21:15.039 laden Indians. During the last six hours they whipped Marianne into walking. So 263 00:21:15.079 --> 00:21:21.440 this is pretty harsh. Unfortunately, when you do read the memoir, it's 264 00:21:21.559 --> 00:21:26.480 very clear that Marianne that poor little I have to remember, she's seven years 265 00:21:26.480 --> 00:21:33.279 old. It's the worst of it, and it's just really sad. So 266 00:21:33.319 --> 00:21:37.160 Olive really kind of goes into that mother nurturing role and really starts to try 267 00:21:37.200 --> 00:21:40.000 and take care of her and look after her. Oh, I can't even 268 00:21:40.000 --> 00:21:44.079 imagine. So the fourth day after the attack, the Oatman girls arrived to 269 00:21:44.079 --> 00:21:47.240 the native camp that was to be their home for the next year. The 270 00:21:47.319 --> 00:21:52.240 tribe had approximately three hundred members and subsisted of deer, quail, rabbit, 271 00:21:52.279 --> 00:21:56.680 and root vegetables. In the memoir, Olive expounds upon the fact that they 272 00:21:56.680 --> 00:22:00.680 were barely giving enough to survive, and even went so far as to say 273 00:22:00.720 --> 00:22:04.559 the village believed that the young female should be allowed meat only when necessary to 274 00:22:04.559 --> 00:22:11.000 prevent starvation, and that their own female children frequently died and those alive old 275 00:22:11.000 --> 00:22:15.000 and young, were sickly and doorfish generally. So this is where I think 276 00:22:15.039 --> 00:22:18.279 it's really important, along with all of the memoir to really take into account 277 00:22:18.400 --> 00:22:25.799 the perspective that it's coming from, because while this could very well be completely 278 00:22:25.839 --> 00:22:30.000 accurate, you also or I also wonder. You know, they're in the 279 00:22:30.079 --> 00:22:33.359 desert, it's very scarce, nobody's getting a lot of meat, and she's 280 00:22:33.400 --> 00:22:38.519 also interacting or having such negative interactions with this tribe. I doubt she's going 281 00:22:38.559 --> 00:22:42.559 to see them in any kind of positive light. Yeah, definitely, I 282 00:22:42.599 --> 00:22:47.559 would agree even if Olive recounted this, you know, because this is the 283 00:22:47.559 --> 00:22:51.720 first part with the first tribe, even when she gets to the second tribe 284 00:22:51.720 --> 00:22:56.039 and she becomes warm and friendly and even loving. At some point, Stratton 285 00:22:56.119 --> 00:23:00.519 wrote this memoir and he phrased it in a way so he could gain more 286 00:23:00.720 --> 00:23:04.680 fame and more money because the public's view of Indians were not good. Yes, 287 00:23:04.799 --> 00:23:11.359 absolutely, and that was the it's hard to I'm grateful for the listeners 288 00:23:11.400 --> 00:23:19.799 that we have because we've never gotten any snide comments about when we factually talk 289 00:23:19.880 --> 00:23:25.640 about the past. Because if you're gonna sit here and look at the past 290 00:23:25.839 --> 00:23:30.640 through a twenty twenty two lens. You're just not gonna get it. You're 291 00:23:30.640 --> 00:23:33.319 just not going to get it. You can't do that. And not to 292 00:23:33.359 --> 00:23:38.279 step on my soapbox, but that's from a twenty twenty two perspective or even 293 00:23:38.359 --> 00:23:42.000 recently in the last couple of years. You cannot change history and you cannot 294 00:23:42.000 --> 00:23:45.599 erase history, no matter who you are. I don't care exactly. Yeah, 295 00:23:45.640 --> 00:23:49.240 it's like, that's why it's history. We can either learn from it 296 00:23:49.680 --> 00:23:53.400 or we can pretend like it didn't happen or try to change it, which 297 00:23:53.759 --> 00:23:57.880 in the long run does us no good. You know, it's kind of 298 00:23:57.880 --> 00:24:03.160 counterproductive. So I will give a shout out to our listeners who have always 299 00:24:03.160 --> 00:24:08.359 been very understanding of how we approach our topics, because topics like this are 300 00:24:08.559 --> 00:24:14.200 harder because that's a real thing. Though, Like when they were writing articles 301 00:24:14.839 --> 00:24:19.319 or writing you know, long essays or books at this time period, they 302 00:24:19.440 --> 00:24:23.359 had a different mindset than what we have now. They had a different understanding. 303 00:24:23.400 --> 00:24:26.200 It was a different time and we can't well, I kind of have 304 00:24:26.319 --> 00:24:30.880 to provide an example. I know, this is like my one example. 305 00:24:30.960 --> 00:24:33.400 I always go too, and I know if you're having a bet placed on 306 00:24:33.440 --> 00:24:37.880 it, you're probably gonna win some money. But when I first kind of 307 00:24:38.200 --> 00:24:42.119 became aware of Justin, I was going through, like, let's research Jesse 308 00:24:42.279 --> 00:24:48.359 James, and then I fell into his stuff and like became just super enamored 309 00:24:48.359 --> 00:24:52.240 with Justin because he told the Jesse James story so well, and he did 310 00:24:52.319 --> 00:24:57.440 reiterate like, hey, the Jesse James that you grew up doing doesn't exist 311 00:24:57.559 --> 00:25:03.039 because the people who wrote a Jesse James painted him as this hero and the 312 00:25:03.279 --> 00:25:08.599 savior, and in fact he wasn't. And it was a real awakening for 313 00:25:08.680 --> 00:25:11.319 me at that point. And I guess that's kind of where history for me 314 00:25:11.759 --> 00:25:15.160 turned on its head, because you have to take in consideration these authors, 315 00:25:15.599 --> 00:25:21.720 these news reporters, everybody who's trying to tell the history. They're doing it 316 00:25:21.759 --> 00:25:25.680 from a point of view to get or gain something. Yes, and especially 317 00:25:25.680 --> 00:25:30.960 in that context providing information to the public, there's always an agenda. Whether 318 00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:36.279 your agenda is this that, or your agenda is to provide the could hard 319 00:25:36.359 --> 00:25:41.839 facts. Our agenda is to provide the factual information. It's not to talk 320 00:25:42.000 --> 00:25:45.319 bad about this or that. I mean, yeah, we both all three 321 00:25:45.359 --> 00:25:51.400 of us have emotions about how this is all happening, and I couldn't even 322 00:25:51.440 --> 00:25:55.480 imagine what these girls went through. I don't want to imagine what these girls 323 00:25:55.519 --> 00:26:00.279 went through because you look back on it and it's like me, as a 324 00:26:00.319 --> 00:26:04.039 guy at fourteen years old, could I have handled that? Like what would 325 00:26:04.079 --> 00:26:08.000 I have done? You know? And that people were built different back then, 326 00:26:08.559 --> 00:26:12.680 right, Yeah? And with Jesse James taking that as an example, 327 00:26:14.079 --> 00:26:18.200 you had the North who painted him as a racist who hated the North, 328 00:26:18.079 --> 00:26:23.000 and the South painted him as a hero who was robbing from the rich to 329 00:26:23.000 --> 00:26:27.599 give back to the poor of the Southern community. And there was a lot 330 00:26:27.680 --> 00:26:30.319 of kind for those of you who have not listened to that series, like, 331 00:26:30.359 --> 00:26:36.640 there's a lot of context and detail going on there to talk about on 332 00:26:36.759 --> 00:26:41.960 this episode. But it's like both our right to a certain extent. Yeah, 333 00:26:42.039 --> 00:26:45.720 yeah, it's it depends not so much on your perspective, but like 334 00:26:47.119 --> 00:26:51.680 if you look at his growth in his youth and what he saw when he 335 00:26:51.759 --> 00:26:56.240 was a teenager and a kid that the North did to his family, like 336 00:26:56.279 --> 00:27:00.200 the Northern militias and stuff like that, you can see why he hated the 337 00:27:00.240 --> 00:27:04.400 North. It didn't have anything to do with slavery, Like he legitimately hated 338 00:27:04.440 --> 00:27:11.960 the North. They tortured, and they tortured and strung up his father while 339 00:27:11.960 --> 00:27:15.519 they burned the bottom of this feat so he could not walk over and help 340 00:27:15.599 --> 00:27:18.079 them. And when they would string up his father, they would choke him 341 00:27:18.519 --> 00:27:22.839 and the tree like from a noose until he was almost dead. Then they 342 00:27:22.839 --> 00:27:26.920 would let him down again so he could start. He actually suffered a brain 343 00:27:26.000 --> 00:27:30.480 damage from that and was like and that's part of the reasons. And then 344 00:27:30.880 --> 00:27:37.119 you have the Pinkerton's who threw who threw explosives and his mother's window, killed 345 00:27:37.119 --> 00:27:41.279 his baby brother, blew off his mom's arm. You know, like there's 346 00:27:41.319 --> 00:27:45.440 a lot of context going on here, and unfortunately history has always written by 347 00:27:45.440 --> 00:27:51.480 the victors. So that's that's why we love doing this podcast, because we 348 00:27:51.559 --> 00:27:56.440 like bringing you the facts. We're not giving you our perspective. We're giving 349 00:27:56.440 --> 00:27:59.799 you the cold, hard facts. And that's why I appreciate and love are 350 00:28:00.039 --> 00:28:03.200 listeners so much, because you guys understand that you get that. Okay, 351 00:28:03.279 --> 00:28:12.079 rant over Olive recounts a year of manual labor servitude under supervision of the native 352 00:28:12.119 --> 00:28:18.039 females, with lashings and beating ever present. Their women were the laborers and 353 00:28:18.119 --> 00:28:22.599 principal burden bearers. And during all of our captivity, it was our lot 354 00:28:22.640 --> 00:28:26.559 to serve under these enslaved women, with the severity more intolerable less than that 355 00:28:26.599 --> 00:28:33.759 to which they were subjected by their merciless lords. They invented modes and seemed 356 00:28:33.799 --> 00:28:37.839 to create necessities of labor that they would gratify themselves by taxing us to the 357 00:28:38.000 --> 00:28:44.359 utmost, and even took unwarranted delight in whipping us beyond our strength. And 358 00:28:44.440 --> 00:28:49.519 that was a direct quote from Olive and her memoir. It just sounds horrible. 359 00:28:49.599 --> 00:28:56.359 It's interesting to know that it wasn't just them going through a lot of 360 00:28:56.400 --> 00:29:02.119 this, It was all the women related to the tribe. Oh yeah, 361 00:29:02.279 --> 00:29:06.920 just like a gang of women just torturing them constantly. And you know how 362 00:29:07.039 --> 00:29:11.160 vicious women are today, But can you imagine back then when their means of 363 00:29:11.200 --> 00:29:15.160 every day was just to survive. And so now you're surviving, but you're 364 00:29:15.200 --> 00:29:22.000 also like taking cruel enjoyment out of beating these white children. Yeah. Yeah, 365 00:29:22.440 --> 00:29:26.319 So Olive and mary Anne would dream all the time of just trying to 366 00:29:26.480 --> 00:29:30.680 escape, and they would keep an ear out for any kind of helpful information 367 00:29:30.799 --> 00:29:40.000 regarding their specific location, and that of any English settlements that might be around, 368 00:29:40.039 --> 00:29:44.839 but they did not have any luck. Olive reports that after several months 369 00:29:45.039 --> 00:29:48.240 spent within the community and becoming more familiar with their language and treatment, and 370 00:29:48.359 --> 00:29:55.160 general attitude towards the girls, especially mary Anne, changed, with the natives 371 00:29:55.400 --> 00:30:00.960 being cautiously trusting enough to indulge their curiosities and again questioning the girls about their 372 00:30:02.000 --> 00:30:07.559 family, travel and their culture. Olive and mary Anne's life continued in this 373 00:30:07.640 --> 00:30:11.599 manner for a year when they heard a rumor that they were to be sold 374 00:30:11.640 --> 00:30:17.119 to another tribe. The other tribe was a Mojave, whom irregularly traded with 375 00:30:17.200 --> 00:30:22.599 their current captors. A few weeks after the Mohave returned and the daughter of 376 00:30:22.720 --> 00:30:27.440 Chief espanyol I believe that's how it's pronounced, they traded two horses, a 377 00:30:27.480 --> 00:30:33.960 few vegetables, a few pounds of beads, and three blankets for the sisters. 378 00:30:33.920 --> 00:30:38.519 The Mojave and the Oatman girls then set out for what would be the 379 00:30:38.599 --> 00:30:45.880 sister's new home, a three hundred and fifty mile journey to the Mohave Valley. 380 00:30:45.920 --> 00:30:51.319 And think about that, these two girls got traded for two horses, 381 00:30:51.480 --> 00:30:56.480 a few vegetables, a few pounds of beads and three blankets. That's all 382 00:30:56.519 --> 00:31:00.839 they were worth. And then now they have to go in their three hundred 383 00:31:00.839 --> 00:31:04.000 and fifty miles to the Mohave Valley. Did you guys imagined imagine this too? 384 00:31:04.079 --> 00:31:07.200 They would have no idea that it was three hundred and fifty miles until 385 00:31:07.240 --> 00:31:14.240 I right. So on March first, eighteen fifty two, the Oatman sisters 386 00:31:14.279 --> 00:31:21.000 depart with the Mojave Olive is now fifteen and Marianne's eight. Marianne has even 387 00:31:21.039 --> 00:31:25.880 more difficulty on this journey than she did after the massacre, but luckily, 388 00:31:26.000 --> 00:31:30.599 after a bunch of complaining and threats from the new captors, the girls were 389 00:31:30.640 --> 00:31:34.720 able to rest on the second day and daily travels were limited to thirty five 390 00:31:34.799 --> 00:31:40.839 miles a day. They were also given strips of animal skin for their feet 391 00:31:41.279 --> 00:31:48.480 and a small piece of meat that they would take forged roots, and that 392 00:31:48.680 --> 00:31:52.599 was to last them for the next ten days. So this is when the 393 00:31:52.680 --> 00:31:57.640 party, after eleven days, reaches the Mojave Valley. Also, like I 394 00:31:57.680 --> 00:32:00.680 said in part one, when you reach a good stopping point, you have 395 00:32:00.759 --> 00:32:05.920 to take it, and this is a good stopping point because this is just 396 00:32:06.000 --> 00:32:09.599 another chapter that the girls go through when they get to the Mojave Valley. 397 00:32:10.279 --> 00:32:15.680 So yeah, I guess on that note. Just wow, I had no 398 00:32:15.799 --> 00:32:21.000 idea about anything like this is why I love doing this podcast because I get 399 00:32:21.000 --> 00:32:23.799 to learn so much. Like we had stated in part one, we knew 400 00:32:23.839 --> 00:32:30.559 who the woman was with the tattoos on her chin, we never knew everything 401 00:32:30.039 --> 00:32:34.119 that really followed. We had always kind of, you know, heard this, 402 00:32:34.279 --> 00:32:37.240 that and the other. But this is what I love about this, 403 00:32:37.319 --> 00:32:42.680 Like, I am learning so much going through this research. I don't know, 404 00:32:42.720 --> 00:32:45.079 what do you guys think? It's nice to see the grays. Yeah, 405 00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:51.759 I just think it's amazing. I'm really grateful that even though it might 406 00:32:51.799 --> 00:32:54.839 be written in a certain way to paint the Natives or Indians in a bad 407 00:32:54.920 --> 00:33:00.920 light, you know, I'm grateful that people like Stratton, who probably had 408 00:33:00.960 --> 00:33:06.079 an ill intent to gain famous, notoriety or money, they took the time 409 00:33:06.119 --> 00:33:12.640 to like interview these people of their their historical journey. And now years later 410 00:33:12.680 --> 00:33:16.880 we can read it and it's just it's just amazing to put yourself in their 411 00:33:16.920 --> 00:33:22.039 mind while they're recounting this. It's yeah, it's just fascinating. It's freaking 412 00:33:22.160 --> 00:33:28.160 heavy, it's really heavy. Yeah, yeah, I don't know. What 413 00:33:28.240 --> 00:33:30.640 do you think, Cammy, No, I think it really is heavy. 414 00:33:30.680 --> 00:33:34.319 And I think one of the things to really really keep in mind is how 415 00:33:34.559 --> 00:33:37.559 young these girls are and how much they're going through. And they're young even 416 00:33:37.640 --> 00:33:43.759 for their time. That's not I guess it's exaggerated from my mindset now, 417 00:33:43.839 --> 00:33:47.240 but they were still very young back then. Like that eight year old girl 418 00:33:47.359 --> 00:33:53.279 having to truck three hundred and fifty miles, you know, cross country. 419 00:33:53.319 --> 00:33:57.440 I have two eight year olds, a boy and a girl, and I 420 00:33:57.480 --> 00:34:00.960 can tell you they'd be dead within days. Like, I don't understand, 421 00:34:01.039 --> 00:34:05.559 like how these kids would have done it. You know they obviously, Cammi 422 00:34:05.640 --> 00:34:07.320 said it, they were built differently back then, or Justin said it. 423 00:34:07.400 --> 00:34:13.599 But can you imagine your little kid at that age just trying to survive in 424 00:34:13.760 --> 00:34:17.920 the heat thirty five miles a day. No, my two boys are completely 425 00:34:17.960 --> 00:34:23.800 different. My younger son, he would try as hard as he possibly could. 426 00:34:23.880 --> 00:34:28.880 My older boy straight up is like, Dad, you know, if 427 00:34:29.519 --> 00:34:31.960 you know, if we lose power someday, you know, I'm probably not 428 00:34:32.000 --> 00:34:35.760 gonna make it if there's no microwaves. And I'm like, all right, 429 00:34:35.840 --> 00:34:39.079 that's your younger brothers learning how to fish and hunt and everything like like, 430 00:34:39.280 --> 00:34:46.480 if you ask him nicely, he'll probably feed you. But yeah, my 431 00:34:46.559 --> 00:34:52.119 oldest would perish, because God forbid, there's life without an iPad. Yeah, 432 00:34:52.159 --> 00:34:54.960 and you can't step into a formist without screaming about bugs. But my 433 00:34:55.079 --> 00:35:01.119 youngest could probably, he'd probably live, not to be morbid. But man, 434 00:35:01.239 --> 00:35:07.920 this is this is deep, deep, just comparing different lives different times. 435 00:35:07.079 --> 00:35:13.079 I just feel so bad for these little kids. And then another thing, 436 00:35:13.320 --> 00:35:16.400 just another layer to think of when you're thinking about the memoir, is 437 00:35:17.039 --> 00:35:22.679 all of the stuff that isn't in the memoir because with you got to remember 438 00:35:22.679 --> 00:35:25.360 they're putting this out for publication, which is going to affect their reputation, 439 00:35:25.480 --> 00:35:30.119 the reputation of two or one young woman, which back in the day meant 440 00:35:30.119 --> 00:35:36.400 the world. So I can only imagine what's not in the plot that I 441 00:35:36.440 --> 00:35:39.079 did not even think about that. That is a very very good point. 442 00:35:39.480 --> 00:35:44.119 I do have thoughts on that, but we'll save that for part three. 443 00:35:44.599 --> 00:35:47.159 I agree, yes, well, ladies, because then I'll get on another 444 00:35:47.239 --> 00:35:52.119 box and just you know, we'll never know this. That's perfect. I 445 00:35:52.239 --> 00:35:57.320 forgot. I forgot to say this in part one, and I know Justin's 446 00:35:57.320 --> 00:36:00.840 probably gonna kind of well end this up. Really, I wanted to say 447 00:36:00.840 --> 00:36:04.599 thank you for all of our listeners. Justin, Kamie and I are on 448 00:36:04.920 --> 00:36:07.119 Facebook quite frequently, so if you want to get in touch with us, 449 00:36:07.159 --> 00:36:10.000 interact with the group, hit us up on social media. We're also on 450 00:36:09.960 --> 00:36:14.760 an Instagram. We are not on Twitter, but that would be in the 451 00:36:14.800 --> 00:36:16.599 world to us. We live interacting with people who listen to our show. 452 00:36:17.079 --> 00:36:21.079 Yeah, the biggest thing you could do for us is if you could leave 453 00:36:21.159 --> 00:36:22.760 us a review on iTunes or any platform that you are on, that would 454 00:36:22.800 --> 00:36:28.000 be fantastic, or just kind of recommend us to people you think that would 455 00:36:28.000 --> 00:36:30.599 like that. That would be great as well. And we're in a place 456 00:36:30.639 --> 00:36:37.280 now where we feel like and I know we've said this probably a hundred times, 457 00:36:37.159 --> 00:36:42.519 but we're actually getting way more organized. Like we have a said day, 458 00:36:42.760 --> 00:36:46.519 a said time that we record every week, and yeah, as you 459 00:36:46.559 --> 00:36:50.840 can see, we're we're getting better at that. So, Yeah, now 460 00:36:50.880 --> 00:36:54.159 that we have a consistent, you know, tool of people we can kind 461 00:36:54.159 --> 00:37:00.199 of lean on, and it's we got backups on backups. There's yeah, 462 00:37:00.440 --> 00:37:04.440 there is there's a lot of us. Now you never know who you're going 463 00:37:04.480 --> 00:37:07.639 to give from episode to episode. But I will say this, when I 464 00:37:07.679 --> 00:37:12.960 started this podcast, and even with bringing on new co hosts, I am 465 00:37:13.159 --> 00:37:20.639 very very picky about who I even ask. And there's a reason that I 466 00:37:20.679 --> 00:37:24.360 have always asked the people that I have. Just know that it's not just 467 00:37:24.400 --> 00:37:30.360 a bunch of randos anyway. We all have our superos. Yeah we do, 468 00:37:30.239 --> 00:37:34.880 we do. But yeah, I suppose, ladies. It's been real 469 00:37:34.960 --> 00:37:38.840 and fun, but not real fun. No, I'm just joking. I'm 470 00:37:38.880 --> 00:37:46.360 just joking. Yeah, if you listeners only knew the stuff that gets edited 471 00:37:46.360 --> 00:37:52.159 out, Oh, man, like one of these days, well, one 472 00:37:52.159 --> 00:37:53.800 of these days we should plan a Q and A episode. I think that 473 00:37:53.840 --> 00:38:00.320 would be fun. Or actually, like compile all of our bloopers and one 474 00:38:00.400 --> 00:38:05.039 reel for our patreons or something. I tell you what, I've been saving 475 00:38:05.199 --> 00:38:08.000 them on and off for a little while, so I haven't saved mind, 476 00:38:08.159 --> 00:38:14.280 so when I edit, I need to start saving things like twenty minutes of 477 00:38:14.400 --> 00:38:20.000 Matt's last Yeah, that's gigle for twenty minutes. It's always good. All 478 00:38:20.079 --> 00:38:22.920 right, Well, good night, everybody, Thanks for listening. We appreciate 479 00:38:22.960 --> 00:40:16.280 it. I don't remember and the barber and