1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:03,200 And it hits me, Oh my gosh, this is a triangle. You 2 00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:06,719 know, there's explanation for everything that occurred in the randallsham Pars incident. It 3 00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:11,960 doesn't involve aliens at all. It was completely silent. It comes right over 4 00:00:12,039 --> 00:00:17,519 our heads. Classic fly. He's also really standing into clearly. He turned 5 00:00:17,559 --> 00:00:20,079 over to my father and held his hand, and he looked in his eyes 6 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:28,160 and said, we're not alone. Welcome to Podcast UFO for our live show. 7 00:00:28,839 --> 00:00:32,479 During the show, feel free to participate live in our chat room, 8 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:37,759 and don't forget to like us on our very active Facebook page. Hello, 9 00:00:38,039 --> 00:00:41,520 and welcome to the show. I'm Martin willsher host, and we have a 10 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:45,560 fun show for you this evening. We have our guests is Nick Redfern repeat 11 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:50,240 guests. Always really love having him on the show. He's got a new 12 00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:54,560 book. I think he's written fifty books so far on all kinds of interesting 13 00:00:54,600 --> 00:01:00,320 topics, and this one is particularly interesting. We're gonna be talking about top 14 00:01:00,399 --> 00:01:06,000 secret abduction files, what the government may or may not know. He always 15 00:01:06,040 --> 00:01:10,359 dives deep into these subjects and should be really fun to talk to him. 16 00:01:10,359 --> 00:01:15,480 Before that, I have Alejandro with a special guest visiting him. He's going 17 00:01:15,519 --> 00:01:19,159 to be on the show in just a second. And we are live on 18 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:23,359 KGr A Radio and I want to say hi everyone over there and getting some 19 00:01:23,439 --> 00:01:27,879 email from people over there, so that's that's always nice. And I'm getting 20 00:01:27,879 --> 00:01:33,200 a lot of email from Australia. They're one of the big listeners of the 21 00:01:33,200 --> 00:01:37,159 show, and I want to just say a little shout out to people over 22 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:41,599 there. Stacey, I think is one person's name. We also have Chris 23 00:01:42,079 --> 00:01:48,599 from Tasmania who has written another blog and this one is the Valentech UFO incident 24 00:01:48,599 --> 00:01:52,799 in Australia. He wrote about that. So check out podcast ufo dot com 25 00:01:52,799 --> 00:01:57,040 and you'll see the blog is right there. And I want to thank everyone 26 00:01:57,079 --> 00:02:00,439 that helps out with the show. We absolutely could not do it without you. 27 00:02:00,799 --> 00:02:05,280 It's about a break even now and I really appreciate people helping out. 28 00:02:05,879 --> 00:02:09,039 And all right, we're ready to get going. Ala Handro. How are 29 00:02:09,080 --> 00:02:13,639 you, yes, sir, I'm doing well. How are you good? 30 00:02:13,759 --> 00:02:16,319 You're kind of an awkward angle. I don't see now. I'm the guy 31 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:20,639 with the I have the stars behind me. I don't know if you can 32 00:02:20,719 --> 00:02:23,520 see that. I have a new background, not as fancy as yours, 33 00:02:23,599 --> 00:02:29,759 but my stars have fold marks in them, so copycat. Yeah. Yeah, 34 00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:32,080 I can't see him. I can't see you at all, but I 35 00:02:32,159 --> 00:02:37,240 assume you're there. I can hear you, and U must it's somebody that 36 00:02:37,400 --> 00:02:42,240 is doing a very good impression of you, which I think would be difficult 37 00:02:42,439 --> 00:02:46,039 because you have a unique voice. Oh wow, I think that's a boy. 38 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:50,159 You should be able to see me. It must be your skype or 39 00:02:50,199 --> 00:02:53,919 something, because you're in your iPad or something like that. Anyway, Yeah, 40 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:57,960 I'm onp You have a sidekick? Does a sidekick want to wave high 41 00:02:58,199 --> 00:03:05,400 to us? It's Mark D'Antonio. Hey, how are you Mark? Good 42 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:08,800 to see you, and I very nice to hear you. I wish I 43 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:12,800 could see you. But you know, we'll just blame it on ALAHNDO, 44 00:03:12,879 --> 00:03:15,599 right, supposed to do. That's what we're always supposed to do, whatever 45 00:03:15,680 --> 00:03:17,439 happens. Yeah, well, he always blames things on me, so that's 46 00:03:17,479 --> 00:03:22,000 sort of paying it forward. I guess, right. Right, So you're 47 00:03:22,080 --> 00:03:27,560 visiting Arizona and uh, actually, are you both going to the event coming 48 00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:31,120 up in Baltimore. I am not going, but I believe he is. 49 00:03:31,919 --> 00:03:37,520 Oh yeah, that's the alien con I believe don in Baltimore. I'll be 50 00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:39,800 there. Yeah, all right, well I'll be there and I'll be doing 51 00:03:39,879 --> 00:03:44,520 three different talks and participating in a panel. So they're going to keep me 52 00:03:44,560 --> 00:03:50,319 busy. And we're gonna have a UFO Congress booth there where we're gonna be 53 00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:53,840 selling super cool stuff, all right, and that's coming right up this weekend, 54 00:03:53,919 --> 00:04:00,639 right that is the ninth through the eleventh. So what we adopt that? 55 00:04:00,159 --> 00:04:04,199 Yeah? Yeah, yeah, following week Oh excellent. Okay, so 56 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:09,280 what is going on? Okay, so you want to get to a cup 57 00:04:09,680 --> 00:04:13,120 before you start, Just before we start here, you start to tell me 58 00:04:13,199 --> 00:04:15,519 that you are going to make something after the show. I don't want you 59 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:20,439 to forget to talk about that. Just remember that. And because I want 60 00:04:20,560 --> 00:04:25,439 once we start talking UFOs I get excited about UFOs, you're gonna have to 61 00:04:25,439 --> 00:04:28,639 remind me you're the set your job. I'll try. Yeah, all right, 62 00:04:29,480 --> 00:04:32,160 write a note. Yeah, so what's going on? Okay? I 63 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:34,879 want to get to a couple of things. I'll touch it on this one 64 00:04:35,040 --> 00:04:39,600 real quickly, just because it's a case that you brought this up on my 65 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:44,360 podcast actually, and it's an interesting case. I had not heard of but 66 00:04:44,399 --> 00:04:47,720 it's in the Baltimore Sun. It's a case that happened sixty years ago in 67 00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:55,120 that area Lock raven Uh Reservoir, where these two guys were driving in the 68 00:04:55,160 --> 00:05:00,519 area in the fifties and they came across a large saucer in the sky. 69 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:04,560 It actually made their car stop. They got out. It had beamed a 70 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:12,079 light on them and before leaving, and then their car worked. What's great 71 00:05:12,079 --> 00:05:15,160 about this case also that it was a Bluebook case, so it was something 72 00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:20,040 that was investigated by the Air Force. Now they say that this case influenced 73 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:25,319 a lot of UFO research and a lot of UFO research in the area, 74 00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:29,240 but I'm not aware. I had not heard of this case before. That's 75 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:31,319 why I think it's pretty cool. But I also think that it's cool that 76 00:05:31,360 --> 00:05:35,879 it's in the Baltimore Sun. Of course I'll be heading there pretty soon, 77 00:05:36,319 --> 00:05:41,000 just like you talked about. But yeah, that's one to check out that 78 00:05:41,040 --> 00:05:45,480 people will find out Open Minds dot TV. You know. Another thing to 79 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:51,160 mention is you mentioned Valente, which who was this kid who was a pilot 80 00:05:51,199 --> 00:05:56,240 and that case was something like forty years ago. I can't remember the exact 81 00:05:56,319 --> 00:05:58,439 date, but since you mentioned it, I just wanted to talk about it 82 00:05:58,480 --> 00:06:02,800 because there is a store in the media about that one as well, where 83 00:06:02,920 --> 00:06:09,240 his girlfriend from the time was mentioned. But just to view that. Oh, 84 00:06:09,319 --> 00:06:12,639 go over that one real quick. It's really interesting. This kid had 85 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:16,639 just essentially gotten his pilot's license, he was going to do his first solo 86 00:06:16,759 --> 00:06:23,319 flight over water. Well, during this flight, he said he was being 87 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:29,360 followed by a large cylindrical glowing object that was flying around his plane, and 88 00:06:29,399 --> 00:06:31,839 then he was never heard from again, and he nor the plane was ever 89 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:38,920 found. His girlfriend said in this recent article that he was actually worried about 90 00:06:38,959 --> 00:06:44,120 his first solo flight over water, so she felt he kind of prophesized what 91 00:06:44,279 --> 00:06:50,199 had happened, that something unfortunately negative did happen. Wow, But ahead I 92 00:06:50,240 --> 00:06:55,759 wanted to get into another case just because Mark is here something else that's going 93 00:06:55,800 --> 00:07:00,160 on. And I love this because it's always fun to educate the public on 94 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:05,879 great cases, but also to warn them of material that is not credible or 95 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:12,920 is not what it appears to be. So nineteen fifty two UFOs flew over 96 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:16,279 Washington, DC and actually there was a wave, so there's a period of 97 00:07:16,319 --> 00:07:20,560 time. It's one of the best cases out there. In fact, because 98 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:27,439 it had happened and they had flown over National Airport or Airport National Airport there 99 00:07:27,439 --> 00:07:32,800 in Washington, DC. Blue Book was investigating it and Captain Rupelt, whose 100 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:36,680 book you can read on this incident, he goes into it in detail, 101 00:07:38,399 --> 00:07:42,639 was out there investigating it. He had to go home, but the weekend 102 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:46,680 after he went home, these things came back, and Blue Book personnel who 103 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:53,279 were there in Washington, DC actually went to the control tower and witnessed all 104 00:07:53,319 --> 00:07:57,680 of this going down. It sounds much like you know stories that you hear 105 00:07:57,759 --> 00:08:01,600 through history, including very similar to two and four in San Diego, what 106 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:07,000 happened to the Nimics Carrier Strike group like we hear about, but essentially seeing 107 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:11,480 these white lights, jets are scrambled when the jets get in the area, 108 00:08:11,879 --> 00:08:16,040 these things dart off at very quick speeds, and in this case, it 109 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:20,199 was reported that once the jets left, they came back. So a great 110 00:08:20,279 --> 00:08:24,120 case. However, why I'm bringing this up is that you will see this 111 00:08:24,199 --> 00:08:28,439 in the UFO news because what had happened recently is that Tom DeLong and lu 112 00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:35,759 Alesando Boast to the Stars Academy went and spoke in Rome recently and Louise Alesando, 113 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:43,960 you know, as a formerly random Pentagon UFO project, and in they 114 00:08:43,039 --> 00:08:46,720 talked about this case because it's a great case, but they did show a 115 00:08:46,799 --> 00:08:54,720 photo and it was this photo. And people see this out there often it's 116 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:58,399 crop where you just see you don't see these lines, but you see the 117 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:01,120 capital in these lights. Well, if you see the full photo here, 118 00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:07,039 and this is a photo from nightcap, they draw lines from the lights down 119 00:09:07,080 --> 00:09:11,279 on the street level up to the lights in the sky. Why because when 120 00:09:11,279 --> 00:09:18,240 you take a picture of something in the dark where there are lights that are 121 00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:22,799 overexposed like this, you'll often see kind of this in camera kind of flare 122 00:09:22,840 --> 00:09:28,399 type of thing, and that this is not these aren't you votes, These 123 00:09:28,399 --> 00:09:33,440 are flares. And I actually have a moof on photo expert here to talk 124 00:09:33,559 --> 00:09:41,480 more about this reflection phenomena. Yeah, it's true, you know. And 125 00:09:41,519 --> 00:09:45,720 the thing about lens flares is that they're symmetric across the center of the field. 126 00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:48,480 So if you have a flare or an object that's up here right and 127 00:09:48,639 --> 00:09:52,759 you have another bright object on the ground and you think maybe that's the source, 128 00:09:52,120 --> 00:09:56,360 draw a line between it. Okay, Then if you have another one, 129 00:09:56,440 --> 00:10:00,720 draw line between that in its potential source. If all the lines crossed 130 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:03,960 right in the very in one place, then you're actually crossing at the center 131 00:10:03,039 --> 00:10:07,240 that that image frame. And that's typically what happens with flares. They danced 132 00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:13,799 around symmetrically opposite the actual source object. So that's what I think we see 133 00:10:13,799 --> 00:10:18,519 in that Washington one and in many, many hundreds and hundreds of others that 134 00:10:18,559 --> 00:10:22,399 I've seen over the years. But you know, it doesn't mean that's all 135 00:10:22,399 --> 00:10:24,919 we have. You know, there's certainly more to it. But that's in 136 00:10:24,919 --> 00:10:31,720 that case. He's exactly right. While you're on the smart pinnacle of expertise 137 00:10:31,759 --> 00:10:35,320 here, Mark, while you're talking about this, there was a great case 138 00:10:35,799 --> 00:10:41,679 that the Mexican Air Force got involved and it was over oil oil um what 139 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:48,960 do they call them? Oil rigs? Oil rigs offshore and the same thing, 140 00:10:48,159 --> 00:10:52,519 but they actually had radar, they had radar contact, they were they 141 00:10:52,600 --> 00:10:58,039 had their camera out and they were filming, but they also had these same 142 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:03,440 refractions or something coming up from the from the oil. Derek's out there. 143 00:11:05,440 --> 00:11:07,639 Do you know about that particular case. Is that a similar type situation? 144 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:13,840 I don't know about that. But see the thing here, well, the 145 00:11:13,840 --> 00:11:16,320 thing with that case is I don't know that data. I haven't seen radar 146 00:11:16,399 --> 00:11:22,799 data from that case personally, but radar data is always a good thing to 147 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:26,879 bring in. However, the problem is that sometimes photos that get taken are 148 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:31,320 conflated with the actual event and may have nothing to do with the event. 149 00:11:31,399 --> 00:11:35,759 Like that photo that Hondro showed your moments ago with lights over the Capitol. 150 00:11:35,799 --> 00:11:41,000 Those really are just lens flares, right, They really are an I'm using 151 00:11:41,039 --> 00:11:46,120 almost one hundred percent certain that's what those are. But for Campechia, I 152 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:48,519 haven't heard of that case, but it could be more information on compet chain. 153 00:11:50,080 --> 00:11:52,320 Oh there we go, and of course we have a story on this 154 00:11:52,399 --> 00:11:56,559 and Open Mindset TV. But you aren't exactly right. And a similar process 155 00:11:56,720 --> 00:12:01,200 was used to determine that those were the oil rigs. Because I was a 156 00:12:01,240 --> 00:12:03,399 skeptic too, I did not think those were the oil rigs. How can 157 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:11,080 these Mexican Air Force guys who are used to working these machines mistake these flames 158 00:12:11,159 --> 00:12:15,440 coming up from oil rigs as UFOs? I thought, there's no way, 159 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:20,000 But you know what, it turns out the work of Ben McGee had proven 160 00:12:20,039 --> 00:12:24,159 this to me. He actually did a process that's similar to what Mark described, 161 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:26,759 and I'll talk about it. And then I turned out there was actually 162 00:12:26,759 --> 00:12:31,679 a Mexican UFO researcher who had done this at the time that those videos came 163 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:35,559 out, so he had done the same thing prior. But essentially what they 164 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:41,000 did was take the path of the plane, draw that on a map, 165 00:12:41,360 --> 00:12:48,480 and then draw lines from those that position to where these oil rigs are. 166 00:12:48,919 --> 00:12:50,799 And as Ben McGee puts it, and he does it, we've got a 167 00:12:50,840 --> 00:12:56,120 story on Open Minds, and we've got Ben McGee's talk on this. I 168 00:12:56,200 --> 00:13:01,480 was there he did this in Las Vegas, and he clearly demonstrates this well. 169 00:13:01,519 --> 00:13:05,720 That way you can predict the lights. So when you draw these lines, 170 00:13:05,759 --> 00:13:11,159 you know exactly when the plane will see what lights and they line up 171 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:20,200 perfectly right, So he was able to undeniably demonstrate that those were indeed the 172 00:13:20,279 --> 00:13:24,320 lights. And for me, when I saw Ben go through this process, 173 00:13:24,360 --> 00:13:28,720 it was like a real aha moment. It was like, Oh my gosh, 174 00:13:28,799 --> 00:13:31,519 he just proved to me what I never thought could be true. I 175 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:35,360 never thought it could be those oil rigs. But yeah, when you draw 176 00:13:35,399 --> 00:13:41,559 those lines, you can show they line up precisely. Yeah. Yeah, 177 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:43,840 But again, it's not like you got to throw the baby out with the 178 00:13:43,879 --> 00:13:48,519 bathwater, right, you know, there's really something was, really something going 179 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:52,440 on at that time. I don't know if Campeche was. I don't think 180 00:13:52,480 --> 00:13:56,799 anything was really going on in competion. I don't think there was a UFO 181 00:13:56,840 --> 00:13:58,879 incident there. Okay, so we'll throw the baby out with the bathwater. 182 00:14:00,759 --> 00:14:05,200 Not necessarily, it's just when you throw when all there is his bathwater, 183 00:14:05,320 --> 00:14:07,279 that's all you got. Now we've got a baby in Washington, DC. 184 00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:11,720 Because in Washington, DC, we do have radar data. We have also 185 00:14:11,799 --> 00:14:18,440 a ton of witnesses, including Blue Book personnel themselves, so there's a lot 186 00:14:18,519 --> 00:14:22,000 more data. And we had jets scrambled to chase these scenes, so we 187 00:14:22,039 --> 00:14:26,399 have a lot more data and witness testimony when it comes to Washington, d 188 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:31,919 C. In nineteen fifty two as compared to the Campag case. I see, 189 00:14:31,039 --> 00:14:35,039 Hey, going back to the case, we were talking about the very 190 00:14:35,039 --> 00:14:39,639 first one at that lock in Baltimore, I believe it was. Yeah, 191 00:14:39,679 --> 00:14:45,000 so that one you and I were talking on your show about the professor of 192 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:48,840 history that looks into UFOs and by the way he did it, he is 193 00:14:48,879 --> 00:14:52,440 going to be on the show. By the way, I think he's been 194 00:14:52,440 --> 00:14:54,399 on any shows. I haven't seen him. I looked all through everywhere. 195 00:14:54,399 --> 00:15:00,399 I couldn't find him on anything. So it's taken a chance. But Professor 196 00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:03,759 of History ought to be very interesting when it comes to beat me to another 197 00:15:03,799 --> 00:15:07,639 one. Yeah, you know, that's the sort of thing where I feel 198 00:15:07,679 --> 00:15:11,320 that you can't lose that someone like that is going to say something interesting. 199 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:16,440 I noticed he wrote some stories for the Smithsonian, and he does seem to 200 00:15:16,559 --> 00:15:24,960 draw a correlation between people claiming to have alien experiences and the movies, especially 201 00:15:26,039 --> 00:15:30,559 Close Encounters, coming out with alien type characters. So it sounds like he's 202 00:15:30,559 --> 00:15:35,720 a bit skeptical in that arena. However, he's definitely into the topic and 203 00:15:35,759 --> 00:15:39,879 I think what he'll have to share is going to be fascinating. So that's 204 00:15:39,919 --> 00:15:41,519 a good job, good job on getting him. Yeah, well it's just 205 00:15:41,559 --> 00:15:46,559 an email. Hey Alajandro, Hey you and Mark, but you still had 206 00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:48,639 the Oh wait, you still have to tell me what you guys are going 207 00:15:48,679 --> 00:15:52,159 to do after the show. So Mark and I don't know he can explain 208 00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:58,399 to you how but let me have him explain. Oh sure, Well, 209 00:15:58,399 --> 00:16:03,080 you know what, um, when you're when you do things like we do, 210 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:06,840 we talk, we investigate UFOs, sometimes you have to have an outlet. 211 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:10,200 And one of my outlets that I like that I really think is amazing 212 00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:15,559 is primal music. That is, uh, the aboriginal music from Australia. 213 00:16:15,639 --> 00:16:18,679 And you think about what kind of instruments they use. They use these things 214 00:16:18,679 --> 00:16:22,519 that were basically termite hollowed logs and they would create this, you know, 215 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:27,519 a world sound, and that sound is generated by standing wave inside the tube. 216 00:16:27,519 --> 00:16:30,279 It's called but don't worry about that. It's it's actually called it did 217 00:16:30,279 --> 00:16:34,080 you redo? And that did you redou can and has been used for a 218 00:16:34,159 --> 00:16:38,600 long time, centuries actually to create and uh stories and in the dream time, 219 00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:44,120 uh, in Aboriginal culture. So uh, tonight we're actually gonna make 220 00:16:44,759 --> 00:16:47,799 did you redus. We're gonna take a little modern approach. We're gonna actually 221 00:16:47,879 --> 00:16:52,320 use PBC pipe, which can great bell be used as well. Special right, 222 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:56,279 yeah, yeah. You have to do circular breathing, which is basically 223 00:16:56,320 --> 00:17:00,440 like you constantly are breathing out of your mouth while taking breath breath in through 224 00:17:00,480 --> 00:17:03,879 your nose. So if your listeners want to try that, let them try 225 00:17:03,879 --> 00:17:06,079 it. But you know, make sure you hold on to something because you 226 00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:08,440 might pass out if you're trying to do that too much. That's pretty cool. 227 00:17:08,720 --> 00:17:11,599 Well that's what we're gonna do. We're gonna build did you adues? 228 00:17:11,599 --> 00:17:12,920 And we've got a group of people that are getting together tonight to do it. 229 00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:18,480 Wow. Yeah, that sounds really like New Age type of stuff to 230 00:17:18,559 --> 00:17:22,359 me. But no, it sounds like sounds new Agy maybe, but the 231 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:26,880 Aborigines have been doing it for centuries. No, No, I'm interested. 232 00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:29,720 I'm just giving you hard time. All right, you two guys, thanks, 233 00:17:30,079 --> 00:17:32,839 thanks so much for checking in and have fun with you. Did you 234 00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:36,920 aduce? We will? All right? Well did you redo? Just for 235 00:17:37,039 --> 00:17:40,000 you? All right? I can't wait. All right, talk to you 236 00:17:40,039 --> 00:17:45,240 next week, all right, see yeah, all right everyone. So, 237 00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:49,839 our guest is Nick Redfern. He's always always a pleasure to have on the 238 00:17:49,839 --> 00:17:57,039 show, and this this week we are going to be talking about his fiftieth 239 00:17:57,039 --> 00:18:02,400 book. You heard it right, fiftieth book. He really puts out a 240 00:18:02,519 --> 00:18:07,279 lot of work and this one is called top secret Alien Abduction Abduction Files. 241 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:11,480 What the government doesn't want you to know. Nick, Welcome to the show. 242 00:18:11,519 --> 00:18:15,960 How are you, hey, Martin? I'm doing good. Thanks those 243 00:18:15,039 --> 00:18:21,720 things very good. Good as always. Um, And I've always, I've 244 00:18:21,720 --> 00:18:25,400 always talked to you about You're the only one I know that is so discipline 245 00:18:26,000 --> 00:18:32,799 to write. How does it feel to get to your fiftieth book? I 246 00:18:32,839 --> 00:18:34,880 don't know, really. I mean, if you ask me when I did 247 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:38,759 the first book in ninety seven that twenty years later i'd have done fifty, 248 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:45,400 I'd have probably said, there's no way. But but you know, I 249 00:18:45,440 --> 00:18:48,359 mean, it's it's what I enjoy doing, you know. And it's sort 250 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:55,559 of these situations where I sort of I'm sort of pretty driven in the way 251 00:18:55,599 --> 00:18:59,559 that I am the right I write the books. For example, I like 252 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:03,119 to saw to stick to what I call working out as I saw. I 253 00:19:03,200 --> 00:19:07,079 used to get off about seven and have some breakfast and had three emails, 254 00:19:07,279 --> 00:19:11,759 mess around on Facebook. And I do writing for the books and the magazines 255 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:17,680 from nine to five Monday to Friday. But evenings and weekends I can literally 256 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:22,000 completely switch off. I don't do any work on evenings and don't work any 257 00:19:22,039 --> 00:19:26,599 weekends. That's for me, evenings and weekends for having a good time. 258 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:30,200 And but I you know, I do put in like an eight hour day 259 00:19:30,319 --> 00:19:34,680 Monday to Friday, like just like a regular job. But I wouldn't want 260 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:38,200 people to think that I consider it just a job. You know, for 261 00:19:38,279 --> 00:19:44,079 me, it's a passion that I've turned into a career as well. And 262 00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:48,880 for me, as long as I have that passion that excitements that sort of 263 00:19:49,279 --> 00:19:52,319 sense of wow, you know, this is really interesting, I've got to 264 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:57,480 investigate this. As long as all that, I'll keep doing it, you 265 00:19:57,480 --> 00:20:02,599 know what I mean, because it's what I enjoy doing, whether it's investigating 266 00:20:02,680 --> 00:20:07,559 big foot up a cabra ufo encounters. So yes, you know, as 267 00:20:07,599 --> 00:20:11,599 long as I'm happy doing it and I can keep coming up with new material, 268 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:15,480 which is an important thing. You don't want to just keep going overall 269 00:20:15,559 --> 00:20:18,039 ground. That was my next question. I was going to ask you how 270 00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:22,559 do you come up with the topics that you come up within and when you're 271 00:20:22,559 --> 00:20:26,880 talking about this discipline work that you do, the nine to five so to 272 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:30,599 speak, how do you do that when it comes to the research, I 273 00:20:30,599 --> 00:20:33,960 mean, you know, boots on the ground, like you may have to 274 00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:37,680 go somewhere and look at files or something like that. Do you kind of 275 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:42,000 keep it the same way or is that in a whole different way? Yeah, 276 00:20:41,839 --> 00:20:47,160 that's that actually is pretty much a lot different. I mean, for 277 00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:49,599 the most part, you know, I am sort of working from home during 278 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:52,960 the day. But yeah, if I'm sort of going out somewhere, you 279 00:20:53,039 --> 00:20:56,480 know, someone, Let's say hypothetically, I mean, I live just outside 280 00:20:56,519 --> 00:21:00,759 Dallas, and if somebody phones me up and say, you know, I've 281 00:21:00,759 --> 00:21:04,480 got a really interesting story, pictures, etc. And they're down in Houston, 282 00:21:04,519 --> 00:21:08,640 which is like a five hour drive from me, then yeah, that'll 283 00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:11,480 be totally different. You know, I'll go down there and just grab a 284 00:21:11,599 --> 00:21:15,599 room for overnight, you know, and and chat with the witness and so 285 00:21:15,640 --> 00:21:21,079 that that's sort of totally difference. Yeah, But in terms of actually doing 286 00:21:21,079 --> 00:21:25,839 the research, you know, and coming up with new ideas, I mean, 287 00:21:26,079 --> 00:21:30,079 I guess I take sort of like a journalistic approach of just digging out 288 00:21:30,119 --> 00:21:34,359 stories, you know, and particularly somebody shares a story and they're okay about 289 00:21:34,519 --> 00:21:40,680 using it, and then I'll sort of look further into the story and further 290 00:21:40,799 --> 00:21:47,759 and further and get further leads and additional sources and contacts, and the story 291 00:21:47,799 --> 00:21:51,519 then starts to kind of build itself, you know, it sort of has 292 00:21:51,519 --> 00:21:57,440 its own momentum almost. I see now about topics though, how does that 293 00:21:59,079 --> 00:22:03,319 do you like her? Do you test that by talking to people? Or 294 00:22:03,319 --> 00:22:06,640 how do you how do you figure out how to you know, how to 295 00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:11,160 come up with a topic that's your next Yeah, that's a good question. 296 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:15,920 I mean, sometimes it's purely and simply because there's something that I really want 297 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:19,960 to write about, um, and so that's what I do. But then 298 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:25,519 there are other occasions where a story falls in my lap, which is like, 299 00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:29,799 well, that's that's a really cool story, and I look into it 300 00:22:29,839 --> 00:22:33,880 further and find a lot of other cool aspects to the story, and so 301 00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:38,039 you know, then I then I pursue it further. Sometimes, you know, 302 00:22:38,079 --> 00:22:41,839 you just stumble on something by mistake or you know, whether you're not 303 00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:47,839 even trying, and the more you look into it, the more you think, 304 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:51,960 wow, you know, there's X number of people who know something about 305 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:56,119 this, but they've never really shared their their story and again if they find 306 00:22:56,400 --> 00:23:00,400 with the stories being told, et cetera. But a lot of it, 307 00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:07,480 I guess sort of comes from me having particularly interests in certain areas and just 308 00:23:07,079 --> 00:23:11,200 you know, just digging around for things that fall into those categories, like 309 00:23:11,279 --> 00:23:15,920 big foots or like monsters, Jubber Cabra men in Black. I just you 310 00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:22,720 know, sort of pursue leads really and then expand them to like a book. 311 00:23:22,759 --> 00:23:29,000 Lymp I guess, So how did this particular book, Alien Abduction Files? 312 00:23:29,079 --> 00:23:33,359 How did that? How did that begin? Well? Yeah, I 313 00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:36,279 mean with this book like it like with any book. You know, I'm 314 00:23:36,319 --> 00:23:40,599 not just somebody who writes books. I always also read books, you know. 315 00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:45,200 And and of course if you're going to read a book and write a 316 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:48,960 book, you want the audience to think, well, you know, this 317 00:23:49,079 --> 00:23:52,359 is you know, this is a good book. Not only is a good 318 00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:56,599 book, but it's a new material or a new slant or a new angle 319 00:23:56,119 --> 00:24:00,640 on the subject. And I think that's important. You know, if you're 320 00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:06,240 writing books, you have a responsibility to your readership to give them something new, 321 00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:11,599 you know, with each book. So with this particular book, Top 322 00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:17,759 Secret Alien Abduction Files. Now, over the years and decades, dozens and 323 00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:21,759 dozens of books have been written on alien abductions. You know, You've got 324 00:24:21,799 --> 00:24:26,240 like John Fuller's The Interrupted Journey back in the sixties on the Betting Barney Hill 325 00:24:26,319 --> 00:24:33,880 case, Bod Hopkins Missing Time, which was like one of the definitive books 326 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:38,599 on the subjects around seventy nine, eighty eighty one, and of course Whitley 327 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:45,079 Strieber's communion, the late John Mack his books and so on, and the 328 00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:53,160 subject of abductions interests me anyway. But the one angle that i'd heard snippets 329 00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:56,279 of, and I think a lot of people have heard snippets of but had 330 00:24:56,359 --> 00:25:03,000 not been really fleshed out to any significant degree, was what government agencies may 331 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:10,240 know about abductions, about abductees, about the agenda that's involved. And so 332 00:25:10,519 --> 00:25:14,039 I did what I always do. I sort of take a journalistic approach, 333 00:25:14,559 --> 00:25:18,759 tried to track down as many people who had made comments on this or had 334 00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:22,920 experiences, you know, with people from the government asking them about their abductions, 335 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:27,440 and again just sort of you know, developed a situation where more and 336 00:25:27,519 --> 00:25:33,039 more data came forward, and to the point where I was able to make 337 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:40,640 a full manuscript that presented a new well that's much a new angle, but 338 00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:47,920 new data demonstrating this connection between government agencies and what they know about abductions. 339 00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:52,359 But to demonstrate that this is you know, an importance and intriguing aspect of 340 00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:57,960 the phenomena, namely not just the nature of the abductions and the abductees, 341 00:25:59,519 --> 00:26:04,200 but looking at how and why government agencies are concerned by this as well. 342 00:26:04,279 --> 00:26:08,039 Right, Okay, well, hey Nick, we're at our first break, 343 00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:12,960 so we're going to go to break and so we'll hold that thought and we'll 344 00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:18,279 come back to it, all right, all right, So this is Martin. 345 00:26:18,559 --> 00:26:23,519 I'm with podcast UFO and my guest is Nick Redfern, and we'll be 346 00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:27,440 right back. Nick. I mentioned to you that we're going to we'll chat 347 00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:32,400 about off topics. We'll get back to the topic we were on UM. 348 00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:34,839 So I was just trying to think of something different to talk to you about 349 00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:40,039 while we're on break and UM. And if this is too personal, just 350 00:26:40,119 --> 00:26:45,079 please let me know. But I'm I wondered how you came about coming to 351 00:26:44,279 --> 00:26:48,640 UM to live in the United States and end up near Dallas. Oh yeah, 352 00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:52,440 that's no problem. That's on the problem at all. Okay, So 353 00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:56,799 so how did that all? How did that all fallen? Sorry, believe 354 00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:59,279 that you wanted to keep that for the show. Oh no, no, 355 00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:03,480 that's this is break break stuff. Oh I see. Okay, Well, 356 00:27:03,519 --> 00:27:07,519 yeah, this was two thousand and two thousand and one. I've been over 357 00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:14,880 to the United States as far back as ninety eight for like lectures and conferences. 358 00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:18,200 But one of the people I met during the course of sort of doing 359 00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:25,039 the whole conference scene and so on was a guy named Ryan Wood. And 360 00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:30,039 Ryan was someone who used to investigate all the Majestic twelve documents with his dad, 361 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:33,319 doctor Gobwood, and they did a huge amount of work on this. 362 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:37,079 And one occasion it was like just over a couple of beers at the bar, 363 00:27:37,799 --> 00:27:41,880 Ryan said, you know, I'm looking for someone who can work for 364 00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:48,200 me full time doing research and investigations and looking into these documents and tracking down 365 00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:52,920 people who might know anything about it. And you know, I was in 366 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:56,359 the UK then, and you know, I didn't have any ties or anything 367 00:27:56,440 --> 00:28:00,359 like that at all. And so he basically said to me, you know, 368 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:03,160 he said, would you be interested in And I said, well, 369 00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:06,599 yeah, sure. And you know, as I said, you know, 370 00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:10,039 I enjoy it sort of just traveling around here and there. I've never been 371 00:28:10,119 --> 00:28:14,119 one to worry about, you know, not putting roots down. I'm fine 372 00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:18,799 with, you know, just wherever the things take you. And so I 373 00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:26,559 basically went through the whole immigration process and you know, which took about eighteen 374 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:32,920 months. But in during that period, you know that I think about four 375 00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:37,079 months after I first applied with the immigration people, you know, I was 376 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:41,160 given a social Security number and then permission to work, et cetera. So 377 00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:45,680 that then obviously Ryan had to wait until you know, I was legally able 378 00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:51,119 to do all this, and then I became fully illegal, like about eighteen 379 00:28:51,119 --> 00:28:55,039 months after that, And that's how it all began. Really, it was 380 00:28:55,119 --> 00:29:00,880 just pure coincidence or fate ever you want to term it, that I happen 381 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:04,200 to be at the conference at the same time Ryan was looking someone to work 382 00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:08,559 for him full time, and I was someone who didn't have and didn't have 383 00:29:08,599 --> 00:29:15,039 any particular ties that would you know, prevent me from doing it and prevent 384 00:29:15,039 --> 00:29:18,799 me from sort of traveling around the country and doing research for instance. Wow. 385 00:29:18,839 --> 00:29:22,079 Perfect, all right, everyone, Welcome back. My guests tonight is 386 00:29:22,160 --> 00:29:26,839 Nick Redfern on YouTube. The show does play on the Dark Matter Digital Network 387 00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:30,160 on Thursdays as well. Hello to everyone over there. There's a lot a 388 00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:34,119 lot of people listen. O listen over there. Nick. Before we went 389 00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:37,200 to break, you were talking about, you know, the interests that certain 390 00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:44,839 government agencies. Are you talking about government agencies in which countries or all countries 391 00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:48,880 that are other several countries. I mean, well, the ones I focus 392 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:56,279 on in the book of the United States and the UK. And that's primarily 393 00:29:56,319 --> 00:30:00,039 because you know, being familiar and coming from the UK and living in the 394 00:30:00,119 --> 00:30:03,880 US, um, you know, I'm more familiar with the events in those 395 00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:08,960 nations. So in that sense, you know, I've focused on some cases 396 00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:15,359 which are overseas in other countries, but predominantly, you know, I do 397 00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:19,680 sort of focus in on the US primarily and then the UK. Uh huh. 398 00:30:21,119 --> 00:30:25,920 And so can you go into a little bit about now the title of 399 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:30,880 your book, of course, is abduction Files, and that kind of insinuates, 400 00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:36,079 at least to me, that you're talking about some possible documents that came 401 00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:40,519 out of our Freedom of Information Act or something like that, or that have 402 00:30:40,599 --> 00:30:45,440 been unclassified now or something. Yeah, that's that's exactly what it's about. 403 00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:48,279 You know, people have said to be well, several people have said words 404 00:30:48,279 --> 00:30:51,720 to the effect of or when look, just like you said, when you're 405 00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:57,039 talking about files, you're talking about documentation rather than just witness testimony. And 406 00:30:57,119 --> 00:31:03,960 said, yes, now I start the book with the whole contact tea movement 407 00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:06,759 of the nineteen fifties. You know, we had the contact teas in the 408 00:31:06,839 --> 00:31:11,119 fifties and then the sixties onwards you had the abduction phenomena with the abductees. 409 00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:15,839 Now, the reason why I do this is because, through the Freedom of 410 00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:22,599 Information Act, the FBI, for example, been very good at declassifying their 411 00:31:23,079 --> 00:31:30,960 previously classified files on many of the early contact teas like Georgia Damski, Truman 412 00:31:30,039 --> 00:31:37,880 Beetham, George van Tassel or Feo Angel Lucy, and George Hunt Williamson. 413 00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:41,559 They were some of the early contact teas. And for people who don't know 414 00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:47,119 what the contact teas are, basically, in the early fifties, rather than 415 00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:52,799 having people abducted by these sort of bug eyed little creatures, people talked about 416 00:31:52,960 --> 00:32:02,079 having been invited by what we're called the social Space Brothers. Now, the 417 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:08,400 best way I can sort of describe the Space Brothers is that they were sort 418 00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:15,359 of long haired, very human looking, and in many respects looking just like 419 00:32:15,519 --> 00:32:19,759 us. And one of the important things about this is that the many of 420 00:32:19,759 --> 00:32:24,559 the Space Brothers told the so called contact teas like Adamski that one of their 421 00:32:24,599 --> 00:32:30,240 big turns was the threat of atomic war. And so what you had was 422 00:32:30,279 --> 00:32:37,799 a situation where people were following people like George Damski developed huge followings, and 423 00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:45,079 so what you had was a situation where the FBI got very concerned because people 424 00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:49,599 like George Davski was saying that many of the contacts give me many of the 425 00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:54,279 Space Brothers had a form of government, not unlike communism, and of course 426 00:32:54,279 --> 00:33:00,880 this was the fifties, you know, Artheism and so on. And as 427 00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:07,039 a result, the FBI got very concerned that some of these contact teas were 428 00:33:07,079 --> 00:33:10,160 sort of swaying people around the communism, and that's why many of these files 429 00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:16,279 were opened. But the important thing is the files were opened also because the 430 00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:22,400 contact teas were claiming human alien interaction. So I mentioned all this in the 431 00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:28,839 book because it demonstrates despite some people have said that the guds never investigated people 432 00:33:28,839 --> 00:33:32,759 who claimed to have seen aliens, well that's not the case. I mean, 433 00:33:32,799 --> 00:33:38,880 George Adamski's FBI file is about one hundred and fifty pages long. George 434 00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:44,079 van Tassel's is more than three hundred pages. Than I could go on and 435 00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:49,799 on, and so that that were that sort of demonstrates, if you like, 436 00:33:50,440 --> 00:33:54,599 there was a precedent, if you like, to be adductions, namely 437 00:33:54,599 --> 00:33:58,880 in the form of the contacts, Nick, do you think a lot of 438 00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:04,640 that had to do with the fact that they could gather such a large crowd 439 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:07,000 and had such influence on a large crowd of people. I mean, do 440 00:34:07,039 --> 00:34:10,320 you think that's part of why the I mean, I personally would think that's 441 00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:14,480 part of why the FBI would have a file on them. I'm sure they 442 00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:19,840 do on religious and cult leaders the same thing. Well, Nick's phone went 443 00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:22,559 dead for a little while, so I thought it'd be a good place to 444 00:34:22,679 --> 00:34:24,400 end the show for the free part of the show, and I want to 445 00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:29,280 thank you all for listening. Anyone can help us out, and for two 446 00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,840 dollars or more a month, you can listen to the full two hour shows 447 00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:37,360 plus the archives, and it's all set up for media players of all sorts 448 00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:42,920 as well, and you can make a payment also once a year if you'd 449 00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:46,199 like. All the informations on podcast ufo dot com. And I wouldn't be 450 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:50,920 doing this, believe me, if this show didn't cost some money for a 451 00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:57,480 weekly from my show producer, plus all the other expenses including bandwidth and dedicated 452 00:34:57,519 --> 00:35:00,320 server and all these different things I have to have. So anyway, it's 453 00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:04,679 just barely in the black and that's okay. It's in the black right now, 454 00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:08,079 and so that's good. So anyway, I do thank you for listening. 455 00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:14,880 I do appreciate all listeners of this show. And we'll be back next 456 00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:32,079 week with Alejandro Rojas. So remember to keep your eyes to the sky.