WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.720 --> 00:00:06.559 This week, we continue with our theme of remote viewing, or in other 2 00:00:06.599 --> 00:00:13.720 words, psychic archaeology with doctor Stephen Schwartz, a parapsychology who has actually used 3 00:00:14.199 --> 00:00:19.719 psychics in an academic setting to find important ancient sites. This is a look 4 00:00:19.719 --> 00:00:27.559 at a protocol that includes university scientists, scanning technology, and psychics in the 5 00:00:27.640 --> 00:00:36.640 search for lost ruins, tombs, and individuals. All this and gendeo today 6 00:00:36.960 --> 00:01:15.760 on Earth Ancients for Saturday, August twenty six, twenty twenty three. This 7 00:01:17.040 --> 00:01:29.439 is is Earth Ancients. I'm your host, Cliff Dunning. I've got an 8 00:01:29.439 --> 00:01:37.920 interesting program today and the theme is psychic archaeology. And I was and obviously 9 00:01:37.920 --> 00:01:42.439 the interviews done and you're listening to the recorded version of it. But I 10 00:01:42.519 --> 00:01:49.599 was taken aback by the amount of accuracy but also the number of places that 11 00:01:49.920 --> 00:02:00.000 have been viewed through what can only be considered remote viewing. And I had 12 00:02:00.040 --> 00:02:05.519 to get Jen Deo on and Jen's with me here to ask her what her 13 00:02:05.560 --> 00:02:10.560 feelings were. And I wouldn't ask this of most archaeologists simply because a lot 14 00:02:10.599 --> 00:02:15.159 of them are, you know, feeling like, hey, I did my 15 00:02:15.240 --> 00:02:19.080 time, I did my four years, I did my six years, I 16 00:02:19.159 --> 00:02:24.599 have my PhD. I know what's going on, but that's not true necessarily. 17 00:02:25.039 --> 00:02:30.000 And I look at this remote viewing otherwise known as psychic archeology, as 18 00:02:30.039 --> 00:02:37.639 another tool to help find individuals, ruined cities, so forth, and so 19 00:02:37.759 --> 00:02:42.879 on that have been a question down through the ages and so so, Jen, 20 00:02:44.599 --> 00:02:46.879 what do you think of psychic archeology. I mean, this wasn't a 21 00:02:46.919 --> 00:02:53.439 course that would be offered to your college. Yeah, probably not. You 22 00:02:53.520 --> 00:02:59.919 know, I'm gonna own that I didn't know a ton about this before we 23 00:03:00.159 --> 00:03:04.879 talked, excluding you know, some of maybe like the little offshoots of it, 24 00:03:05.000 --> 00:03:10.199 like say dowsing, which is like seeking electromagnetic fields, which is really 25 00:03:10.240 --> 00:03:15.080 really common, and people do it to find, you know, water, 26 00:03:15.599 --> 00:03:17.960 So it would make sense that you know, you would be able to find 27 00:03:19.000 --> 00:03:22.680 it if you know there was something else going on there. Then there's channeling 28 00:03:23.120 --> 00:03:27.319 Edgar Casey and the Akashic Records, which we all kind of know about that 29 00:03:27.520 --> 00:03:32.080 or have heard about that his work with channeling Atlantis. And then there's the 30 00:03:32.159 --> 00:03:38.400 remote viewing, and that's kind of what your guests talked about today. And 31 00:03:38.439 --> 00:03:42.400 then there's psychometry, which kind of blew my mind. You know, when 32 00:03:42.479 --> 00:03:47.159 someone holds an object and they can tell you about the object somebody who's sensitive 33 00:03:47.479 --> 00:03:51.520 and they can kind of give a date, time and maybe a period or 34 00:03:51.560 --> 00:03:55.159 something. Yep, yeah, exactly, So good about that. Yeah, 35 00:03:55.199 --> 00:03:59.919 And so I think that it has a number of components that are kind of 36 00:04:00.520 --> 00:04:03.360 really interesting, you know, in and of themselves, but then when you 37 00:04:03.400 --> 00:04:09.439 put them all under the umbrella of psychic archeology, it's definitely something that's been 38 00:04:09.479 --> 00:04:14.759 discounted and kind of left the wayside and considered fringe, even though it's had 39 00:04:14.840 --> 00:04:19.759 some really successful results. I e. Your guests who did the Alexandria Project. 40 00:04:19.879 --> 00:04:23.399 Yeah, I want to mention to our listeners that you had a chance 41 00:04:23.439 --> 00:04:29.439 to see a presentation that I suggested that you look at called the Alexandria Project, 42 00:04:29.959 --> 00:04:32.279 which was gone in the late nineteen seventies. It's been so long. 43 00:04:32.360 --> 00:04:38.199 Everybody looks so young in that in that serious but yeah, talk about that. 44 00:04:38.360 --> 00:04:45.240 What your feelings were. So, the Alexandria Project was written by Stephen 45 00:04:45.360 --> 00:04:49.079 Schwartz, who is a parapsychologist. That's interesting in and of itself that he's 46 00:04:49.120 --> 00:04:55.000 a parapsychologist. Yeah. He took eleven psychics and gave them a map of 47 00:04:55.079 --> 00:05:00.439 Alexandria, and the outcome was what he wanted to see if they was any 48 00:05:00.480 --> 00:05:04.319 commonality and what they chose and kind of some of the things that he had 49 00:05:04.399 --> 00:05:10.839 in his mind that he was interested in finding were the tomb of Alexander the 50 00:05:10.879 --> 00:05:16.879 Great, the Library of Alexandria, and the palace of Cleopatra and Mark Antony 51 00:05:17.040 --> 00:05:24.040 kind of their their last ground where they were. So what he does is 52 00:05:24.279 --> 00:05:28.199 so he has those eleven psychics go in and look at the map and see 53 00:05:28.199 --> 00:05:33.040 if they find some similar things. And then he identifies two psychics female and 54 00:05:33.079 --> 00:05:40.600 a male, and basically he uses them to get their impressions. And what 55 00:05:40.680 --> 00:05:47.800 he ends up finding is they think that they identify a location where Alexander's tomb 56 00:05:47.879 --> 00:05:50.759 may well have been. And what they end up finding is, you know, 57 00:05:50.800 --> 00:05:59.000 there's this mosque and underneath the mosque is something that had been named after 58 00:05:59.120 --> 00:06:06.279 Alexander prior to that moss being built. So there was definitely there was some 59 00:06:06.399 --> 00:06:11.319 sort of something going on there. They didn't really they weren't really able to 60 00:06:11.360 --> 00:06:15.680 put a finger on it other that there was a connection there, which I 61 00:06:15.720 --> 00:06:19.839 think is, you know, that's interesting that these two people came up with 62 00:06:19.879 --> 00:06:26.199 it up with something very similar. They came up with something where they both 63 00:06:26.240 --> 00:06:32.279 saw very similar images and what they identified was corroborated by an actual archaeologist. 64 00:06:32.920 --> 00:06:40.160 So they tried to meet somewhere in between where they were using this psychic archaeology 65 00:06:40.240 --> 00:06:46.639 but also incorporating an archaeologists to corroborate their fines. So the big thing that 66 00:06:46.720 --> 00:06:51.480 they found, which I did think was really interesting, they went out into 67 00:06:51.720 --> 00:07:00.160 the Egyptian desert and both of these psychics identified some very very similar imaging and 68 00:07:00.240 --> 00:07:08.040 they ended up finding a Byzantine city it wasn't Roman, and they identified shapes 69 00:07:08.560 --> 00:07:12.319 where exactly it would be, and again they brought in an archaeologist and the 70 00:07:12.439 --> 00:07:15.959 archaeologists started digging, and they ended up digging there for I think like two 71 00:07:15.000 --> 00:07:20.439 months and uncovered an entire city in this small Egyptian town. Yeah. I 72 00:07:20.439 --> 00:07:26.560 mean, I was a kid in the late seventies and so I have no 73 00:07:26.639 --> 00:07:30.800 idea what the technology was. But obviously light ar wasn't around. Some of 74 00:07:30.839 --> 00:07:34.600 the early ground penetrating radar was around, and I don't know what other technologies, 75 00:07:34.639 --> 00:07:40.920 but I was surprised, and we'll hear it today in our interview that 76 00:07:41.639 --> 00:07:46.079 this information, and this technique, the protocol that Schwartz developed where you use 77 00:07:47.040 --> 00:07:56.040 established archaeologist and you use these psychics to pinpoint, hasn't come forward, hasn't 78 00:07:56.040 --> 00:08:03.519 been brought and used in any other place. And I was just curious what 79 00:08:03.600 --> 00:08:07.600 your feelings were. Why not? I mean, because these people were able 80 00:08:07.639 --> 00:08:13.600 to actually show the building in the desert. I can't think of the name 81 00:08:13.639 --> 00:08:18.120 of it. I think it was Maria or something, yeah, yeah, 82 00:08:18.160 --> 00:08:22.480 And they actually found the walls, the rooms. I think the woman psychic 83 00:08:22.959 --> 00:08:30.399 Hella, found an oven of some kind. And it's like, this is 84 00:08:31.040 --> 00:08:35.840 extremely accurate, but we don't hear about it anymore. Well, I mean 85 00:08:35.879 --> 00:08:39.840 you could say the same thing about you know, police detectives who bring in 86 00:08:39.960 --> 00:08:43.919 psychics to work with the police to find missing children or you know, murder 87 00:08:45.039 --> 00:08:52.879 victims. I think that it probably just kind of went the wayside because you 88 00:08:52.879 --> 00:08:58.600 know, they couldn't I guess they couldn't legitimize it essentially, you know, 89 00:08:58.600 --> 00:09:05.159 because you can't measure it. It's not quantifiable, it's not qualifiable. So 90 00:09:05.440 --> 00:09:11.639 I think, even though we even know today that human beings do have psychic 91 00:09:11.720 --> 00:09:15.799 elements to our existence and how we work within our consciousness, I mean that 92 00:09:15.840 --> 00:09:18.799 has been proven. That's why I think that, like, for instance, 93 00:09:18.840 --> 00:09:24.200 you know dousing falling under the psychic archaeology, Well, we know that energy 94 00:09:24.279 --> 00:09:30.639 exists in various different capacities. So to be able to use copper rods to 95 00:09:31.000 --> 00:09:35.919 identify electromagnetic fields doesn't feel out of the realm of reality to me. That 96 00:09:35.960 --> 00:09:41.519 feels actually like, yeah, that feels like that's something real. I feel 97 00:09:41.519 --> 00:09:43.600 like I could take a physicist out with me and they could explain why it 98 00:09:43.679 --> 00:09:50.039 did that or something to that effect. But I think archaeologists are less likely 99 00:09:50.200 --> 00:09:54.360 to bring in a psychic because it would somehow demean them or make it seem 100 00:09:54.360 --> 00:09:58.519 like, you know, they weren't paying attention to the geology or you know, 101 00:09:58.559 --> 00:10:03.960 the lay forms and the topography to identify their sites. You made a 102 00:10:03.039 --> 00:10:11.759 very good point when you started defining what archaeologists use today. Psychic archaeology doesn't 103 00:10:11.919 --> 00:10:18.840 use the scientific method, and there's no way to quantify or tests. It's 104 00:10:18.919 --> 00:10:24.360 like if you find a man or a woman who's highly sensitive, highly psychic, 105 00:10:24.279 --> 00:10:28.200 and and we'll learn more about it today, it's just too much woo 106 00:10:28.200 --> 00:10:35.840 woo. I think for the established university archaeological community to consider and even though 107 00:10:35.879 --> 00:10:43.039 it could be dead on or even in the high nineties, it's just too 108 00:10:43.120 --> 00:10:46.799 much. I guess, yeah, well, I mean it also, let's 109 00:10:46.799 --> 00:10:50.559 agree about this too, how do you find a psychic to do this work? 110 00:10:50.080 --> 00:10:54.440 Like, it's not like you can ask for, you know, a 111 00:10:54.559 --> 00:10:58.279 CV or a resume. And how many you know sites have you found remotely 112 00:10:58.519 --> 00:11:03.919 up into you know what point in time? So I think that that might 113 00:11:05.000 --> 00:11:07.519 have a little bit to do with it, because you know, psychics don't 114 00:11:07.559 --> 00:11:13.080 have a lot of credibility. They're seen as Charlatans and people who you know 115 00:11:13.240 --> 00:11:16.519 want to take your money. And still, you know, that's a good 116 00:11:16.519 --> 00:11:20.799 point. It isn't necessarily that credible, and you don't go to a university 117 00:11:20.840 --> 00:11:24.440 to become a psychic. It's something you're born with. Although and in this 118 00:11:24.480 --> 00:11:31.720 interview today we do learn that there is a select type of psychic that he 119 00:11:31.440 --> 00:11:39.080 Stephen Schwartz uses in finding Alexander's tomb and Cleopatrick's rooms and so forth, and 120 00:11:41.200 --> 00:11:48.519 so we'll learn about it. I guess I would think whatever tools you can 121 00:11:48.559 --> 00:11:56.159 get that help you find a location and narrow down the dig site is not 122 00:11:56.200 --> 00:12:01.399 only money and time saving, you know, it's just gets to the point 123 00:12:01.919 --> 00:12:09.080 much quicker, and you know, to not have it as a learning tool. 124 00:12:09.159 --> 00:12:13.320 Now, maybe what you're saying is true. Maybe it was vogue in 125 00:12:13.360 --> 00:12:18.000 the late seventies to work with these people. Because he doesn't excuse me. 126 00:12:18.320 --> 00:12:26.919 In our interview last week with Russ Targ one of the founders of the SRI 127 00:12:28.200 --> 00:12:33.600 Remote Viewing Group, they did work with the Patricia Hurst kid nap and they 128 00:12:33.639 --> 00:12:39.440 actually found where she was located. So that was unique psychic that that did 129 00:12:39.480 --> 00:12:45.519 that. So there's a lot of elements in this whole question, and because 130 00:12:45.759 --> 00:12:50.519 yeah, the psychics don't necessarily see the same things either. Even in this 131 00:12:50.639 --> 00:12:56.519 video that Alexandria project, how the impressions that the woman experienced versus what the 132 00:12:56.600 --> 00:13:01.320 man experienced were so mean, they weren't, you know, so far apart. 133 00:13:01.480 --> 00:13:07.559 But something that I found interesting the woman Hella, she was saying, 134 00:13:07.600 --> 00:13:11.799 you know, she felt when she was identifying areas or regions, she felt 135 00:13:11.840 --> 00:13:16.799 like they were heavy, the heavy areas. Whereas the other psychic, the 136 00:13:18.000 --> 00:13:22.399 gentleman, he would he was very descriptive and had shapes and you know, 137 00:13:24.399 --> 00:13:26.879 like at one point he describes half a floor and then when they find the 138 00:13:26.919 --> 00:13:31.720 floor. They say, you know, there was debris on it, it 139 00:13:31.799 --> 00:13:35.120 had deteriorated, but you could still see part of the mosaic that existed, 140 00:13:35.159 --> 00:13:41.440 so it really was a floor on top of a floor. So yeah, 141 00:13:41.480 --> 00:13:46.960 I mean, it's just such this wide swath of information and how you interpret 142 00:13:46.000 --> 00:13:50.799 it is such a you know, it's almost like you could take a crash 143 00:13:50.879 --> 00:13:56.000 course on how you interpret psychic information and what you you know, what it 144 00:13:56.039 --> 00:14:01.799 could mean to whomever the archaeologist is excavate, because that was the other takeaway. 145 00:14:01.799 --> 00:14:05.799 The archaeologists that they were working with was like, oh, hell no, 146 00:14:05.039 --> 00:14:07.120 there's nothing here, and then all of a sudden, you know, 147 00:14:07.159 --> 00:14:13.080 they find these walls and rooms and mosaic tile floors, which he was like, 148 00:14:13.120 --> 00:14:15.840 there's nothing here, and then all of a sudden, there's really something 149 00:14:15.879 --> 00:14:20.840 there. Yeah, I know. And this comes up on our interview today 150 00:14:20.879 --> 00:14:24.799 with him with Stephen Schwartz, is the fact that the archaeologists who were on 151 00:14:26.159 --> 00:14:30.360 the team who are looking for these various objects were like poop pooling the whole 152 00:14:30.360 --> 00:14:35.279 thing going. You don't know what you're talking about because in some cases they'd 153 00:14:35.320 --> 00:14:41.759 actually been looking for specific sights and didn't find them. I just think when 154 00:14:41.759 --> 00:14:48.639 we have, as an example, we have these sixty thousand Mayan ruins in 155 00:14:48.679 --> 00:14:56.080 the Guatemala jungle. We've had doctor Richard Hanson on, We've had Ed Barnhart, 156 00:14:56.240 --> 00:15:00.879 and we've had others talk about them, people who are Mayanists. Wouldn't 157 00:15:00.879 --> 00:15:05.000 it be interesting? Because you know, the funny thing is Jen is that 158 00:15:05.399 --> 00:15:11.639 Hansen he's actually admitted that they're looking for the tomb of a king. Yeah, 159 00:15:11.759 --> 00:15:13.480 they're looking for I mean, I'm going dude, this thing is huge. 160 00:15:15.399 --> 00:15:18.679 And I'm not going to get into how I feel about his definition of 161 00:15:18.759 --> 00:15:24.320 pyramids, because he believes that they are big, big monuments to the gods. 162 00:15:26.679 --> 00:15:35.559 But if he had other tools, like a psychic archaeologist or psyche working 163 00:15:35.559 --> 00:15:41.759 with him, psychic archaeologists, I'm putting it into a division. You've created 164 00:15:41.799 --> 00:15:43.480 a whole new job. Oh my god, if you're listening, let's do 165 00:15:43.559 --> 00:15:48.519 it. No. I think it would help him if he was able to 166 00:15:48.559 --> 00:15:56.759 bring somebody in to target a location that Hansen goold dig to find something, 167 00:15:56.919 --> 00:16:00.480 because he's not going to be around much longer. He's in his you know, 168 00:16:02.320 --> 00:16:08.559 seventies now, and El Minador is a monstrosity. I mean, he's 169 00:16:08.559 --> 00:16:12.559 done some great work. But wouldn't you think that if he was able to 170 00:16:12.799 --> 00:16:18.759 use somebody to pinpoint a site that supports lighter, that that would be the 171 00:16:18.799 --> 00:16:26.679 next step. Can't hurt, right, it can't hurt I look at it. 172 00:16:26.720 --> 00:16:30.399 I mean, I'm always of the philosophy do no harm, but I 173 00:16:30.480 --> 00:16:33.480 don't see the harm that it would do. You know, bring in a 174 00:16:33.519 --> 00:16:40.200 local brujar or something like that and see what they have to say. I 175 00:16:40.200 --> 00:16:45.720 mean, why not. I'm a proponent of magic and you know, whatever 176 00:16:45.919 --> 00:16:52.879 abilities that other people have, and you know it's it's it's not it's not 177 00:16:52.759 --> 00:17:00.000 something that you know, demeans the group or the you know, the project 178 00:17:00.240 --> 00:17:03.000 that they're working on. Really it's a collection of information, and the more 179 00:17:03.039 --> 00:17:07.640 information you collect, the better off you are. Yeah, I mean, 180 00:17:07.720 --> 00:17:11.440 you've been out on excavation size and you've excavated all over the place. Wouldn't 181 00:17:11.440 --> 00:17:18.599 it be nice to know specific a specific area that got a hit by a 182 00:17:18.599 --> 00:17:23.279 local sensitive. Wouldn't that help other than just going through a whole mountain side 183 00:17:23.279 --> 00:17:30.319 and trying to find pot sharts. I'll be honest with you. They might 184 00:17:30.359 --> 00:17:36.079 not call them, you know, psychics, but archaeologists do bring in you 185 00:17:36.079 --> 00:17:41.200 know folks who are local. They do bring in people who, you know, 186 00:17:41.240 --> 00:17:45.880 the local shaman, the healer, whomever it might be. I've worked 187 00:17:45.920 --> 00:17:52.160 on a couple of excavations where that's the case. So in the United States, 188 00:17:52.200 --> 00:17:57.240 I mean, I worked on an excavation in Nevada where we had some 189 00:17:57.279 --> 00:18:02.880 tribal elders come in and one of them did a blessing and then walked over 190 00:18:02.920 --> 00:18:04.200 to a cave and said, you need to dig in here, and so 191 00:18:04.240 --> 00:18:08.079 we did, and guess what we found? Some we found a beautiful site 192 00:18:08.119 --> 00:18:14.400 with cordage and matting. Really. Yeah, So I do think that we 193 00:18:14.559 --> 00:18:18.400 use it. How we label it might be very different than how you perceive 194 00:18:18.440 --> 00:18:23.319 it. But for the language, yeah, language has to change. Here's 195 00:18:23.319 --> 00:18:29.079 one for you. And be honest. Now, if you were required to 196 00:18:29.119 --> 00:18:36.039 take will not require, but if you were had an elective course on developing 197 00:18:36.240 --> 00:18:40.839 psychic awareness of archaeological sites, would you be interested in something like that? 198 00:18:41.720 --> 00:18:48.039 I mean I would personally, I should. I should ask you because you're 199 00:18:48.079 --> 00:18:52.440 like you're you're transparent, very open minded person. That's why you're my friend. 200 00:18:53.359 --> 00:19:00.240 I mean, I don't. I think I think all education matter in 201 00:19:00.279 --> 00:19:03.880 that way, and so I think that this is part of the history of 202 00:19:03.000 --> 00:19:08.960 archaeology, and I think that an archaeologist could determine if they wanted to go 203 00:19:10.039 --> 00:19:12.640 in a direction. You know, it's not unheard of. You know, 204 00:19:12.680 --> 00:19:17.240 I'm going to go back to dousing because that really resonates with me. I'm 205 00:19:17.319 --> 00:19:22.319 very interested in that. I think that that is a perfectly reasonable thing to 206 00:19:22.519 --> 00:19:26.160 use, whether you're trying to identify water on your site that you want to 207 00:19:26.200 --> 00:19:32.839 avoid, or if you want to, you know, identify the electro magnetic 208 00:19:32.880 --> 00:19:36.559 current of wherever it is that you're working. So yeah, you know, 209 00:19:37.000 --> 00:19:41.839 I don't It's so funny because people make things so black and white and when 210 00:19:41.880 --> 00:19:44.759 it comes to these things, just like I said to you on the front 211 00:19:44.839 --> 00:19:47.880 end of this, I don't really know about this cliff, but it is 212 00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:55.680 fascinating because there are little fingers and tendrils that work into the status quo and 213 00:19:55.720 --> 00:19:57.960 how we do things and whether or not we want to call it by you 214 00:19:59.000 --> 00:20:03.519 know, these psychic archaeology, or say that we brought in an elder and 215 00:20:03.559 --> 00:20:06.519 they told us this, and then we did what they said and they were 216 00:20:06.599 --> 00:20:11.480 right. It's kind of the same thing. It's just called something different. 217 00:20:11.079 --> 00:20:17.680 Thank you for that story about bringing in the local elders and perhaps shaman, 218 00:20:17.920 --> 00:20:25.839 because in many ways native or indigenous people are tuned in to the local awareness 219 00:20:25.920 --> 00:20:30.640 and the land and so forth, and so in many ways that kind of 220 00:20:30.640 --> 00:20:36.759 like psychic archeology. So fantastic, Jen Dale as always a pleasure having you 221 00:20:37.759 --> 00:20:44.799 with us, and we'll see you again. It's always fun to have gen 222 00:20:44.880 --> 00:20:51.160 on the program. She gives us a orthodox view of archaeology, but of 223 00:20:51.200 --> 00:21:00.359 course she has tinted glasses and sees things a little differently than the books, 224 00:21:00.359 --> 00:21:04.359 which the academic books would lead us to believe. No, it's fun to 225 00:21:04.440 --> 00:21:11.319 have that perspective because I don't know why they're not using these people more regularly, 226 00:21:11.920 --> 00:21:19.599 especially when there is an area or an individual, tomb or an artifact 227 00:21:19.640 --> 00:21:25.680 that is of great interest like a codis, like a Mayan book that they 228 00:21:25.680 --> 00:21:32.799 can target and then bring some of these sensitives in to find the location, 229 00:21:33.359 --> 00:21:38.359 the gray site, the tomb where this item lies. So I just don't 230 00:21:38.359 --> 00:21:44.039 know why we're not using more of this type of technology, human technology. 231 00:21:44.279 --> 00:21:49.039 So all right, So today's program is psychic Archeology, and my guest is 232 00:21:49.119 --> 00:21:56.079 doctor Stephen Schwartz. And by the way, This is an extended interview going 233 00:21:56.160 --> 00:22:52.599 for about ninety minutes, so enjoy. H We're continuing our theme of remote 234 00:22:52.680 --> 00:22:59.680 viewing with a new guest today. Last week we had rust Tar speaking on 235 00:22:59.799 --> 00:23:04.599 him his work, his involvement in remote viewing with the CIA and with SRI 236 00:23:06.839 --> 00:23:14.680 and detailing some interesting projects. But this week we really get to the core 237 00:23:14.720 --> 00:23:19.359 of it, and I'm really really happy and feeling fantastic that we have a 238 00:23:19.480 --> 00:23:25.079 new guest. His name is Stefan Schwartz. This is what Earth Ancients is 239 00:23:25.079 --> 00:23:32.799 all about, using psychic archeology, using the latest technology, penpointing information, 240 00:23:33.319 --> 00:23:37.920 and actually going after it. My guest today I mentioned Stefan Schwartz. He 241 00:23:37.000 --> 00:23:41.720 is a scientist, a futurist, award winning author of both fiction and nonfiction, 242 00:23:42.160 --> 00:23:48.799 Distinguished Associated Scholar of the California Institute of Human Science. He has written 243 00:23:48.839 --> 00:23:55.319 and continues to write a great deal. His books include Opening to the Infinite 244 00:23:56.039 --> 00:24:00.559 Awakening, The Eight Laws of Change, The Sacred Valid Excuse Me, The 245 00:24:00.559 --> 00:24:04.400 Sacred Vaults of Time, which I urge everyone to get. It's actually three 246 00:24:04.480 --> 00:24:08.400 books in one. And then he wrote another book that we'll talk about today 247 00:24:08.480 --> 00:24:14.920 called The Alexandria Project. This is what we're all about. And I'm really 248 00:24:15.079 --> 00:24:18.759 really quite pleased and happy to have Stephen on the program. Welcome to Earth, 249 00:24:18.839 --> 00:24:22.039 Ancient Stephen. Great to see you, a pleasure to be here. 250 00:24:22.079 --> 00:24:26.839 Cliff, all right, I mentioned a few people that you know well. 251 00:24:26.960 --> 00:24:33.559 One is Russ targ and the work he did at SRI. How did you 252 00:24:33.599 --> 00:24:38.839 get I mean, you're you're a parapsychologist. Remote viewing somewhat makes sense, 253 00:24:38.880 --> 00:24:44.000 but how did you get involved on a personal level? What would inspire you 254 00:24:44.759 --> 00:24:51.240 to dedicate so much of your life to this fascinating topic. Well, I 255 00:24:51.279 --> 00:24:56.160 woke up when I was up twenty three years old. I was I was 256 00:24:56.200 --> 00:25:00.880 in New York. I was working. I had and i've been working for 257 00:25:00.960 --> 00:25:04.640 National Geographic. I got drafted. This is during the Vietnam Era. I 258 00:25:04.680 --> 00:25:11.319 went into the Army, I came out. I wrote a movie for Colonial 259 00:25:11.400 --> 00:25:18.160 Williamsburg in Virginia, and I sent a copy of the script up to a 260 00:25:18.200 --> 00:25:23.960 guy I had met in the Army who was in New York and he was 261 00:25:25.000 --> 00:25:30.920 working for screen Gems and they asked me to come up to New York and 262 00:25:32.000 --> 00:25:37.359 offered me a job. And I've started writing an adaptation of a Bud Schulberg 263 00:25:37.440 --> 00:25:41.440 play anyway, And so I was in New York. I was twenty three, 264 00:25:41.640 --> 00:25:47.759 I was being successful and all that sort of thing, and I met 265 00:25:47.799 --> 00:25:52.240 all kinds of people, and I went to a party that Truman Capote gave 266 00:25:53.680 --> 00:25:57.119 and I went down the hall to go to the bathroom. And when I 267 00:25:57.279 --> 00:26:03.359 came back, I looked there was this gold antique mirror on the wall. 268 00:26:04.359 --> 00:26:10.279 And I looked at this mirror and I just said, spontaneously, without really 269 00:26:10.319 --> 00:26:14.640 even thinking about it, I said, you are becoming an unattractive person. 270 00:26:14.759 --> 00:26:18.599 Your values are all screwed up. And I sort of, oh, what, 271 00:26:19.079 --> 00:26:22.799 you know, why did I say that? Anyway, I looked down 272 00:26:22.839 --> 00:26:26.880 the hall and there were all these famous people that were in the room, 273 00:26:26.920 --> 00:26:34.400 and and I left the party. I went back to Manhattan, got in 274 00:26:34.440 --> 00:26:44.039 my car, drove back down to my family's property in Virginia in Gloucester, 275 00:26:44.240 --> 00:26:48.160 and I was depressed. It's the only time in my life I have really 276 00:26:48.200 --> 00:26:52.640 been depressed, because I knew something was wrong, but I couldn't figure out 277 00:26:52.720 --> 00:26:57.880 what it was. And one day I was sitting on the porch looking out 278 00:26:57.960 --> 00:27:06.240 over the bay, and I mean, this was a property land grant to 279 00:27:06.319 --> 00:27:11.440 my mother's family and built in the sixteen fifty three, so it had been 280 00:27:11.480 --> 00:27:15.359 around a long time. I had beautiful grounds, and I looked over and 281 00:27:15.599 --> 00:27:22.960 on part of the garden there was this couple walking, middle aged couple, 282 00:27:22.079 --> 00:27:27.519 and and I didn't know who they were. And they were dressed like people 283 00:27:27.559 --> 00:27:32.880 in Manhattan, not in Virginia, you know. He had on a gray 284 00:27:32.960 --> 00:27:37.240 suit and she had on this very smart dress, and and I thought, 285 00:27:37.960 --> 00:27:41.680 who are these people? I looked over where the cars would park. We 286 00:27:41.680 --> 00:27:45.920 were at the end of a ten mile unpaved school brush road and our lane 287 00:27:47.039 --> 00:27:52.880 was a mile long. So I thought, there's no car. I mean, 288 00:27:52.119 --> 00:27:56.880 I looked down at the dock, the boat house, and there was 289 00:27:56.920 --> 00:28:00.119 no boat. I thought, you know, who are these people? How 290 00:28:00.119 --> 00:28:03.799 did they get here? And they saw me looking at them, and they 291 00:28:03.880 --> 00:28:08.240 came over and I opened the screen door and they came in, and this 292 00:28:08.279 --> 00:28:12.599 woman looked at me and instead of introducing herself, she said to me, 293 00:28:12.680 --> 00:28:19.359 do you believe in reincarnation? Oh my god? And I said, I 294 00:28:19.400 --> 00:28:26.279 said, I don't know anything about it, but yeah, I guess if 295 00:28:26.279 --> 00:28:32.000 I think about it, I probably do. It seems very symmetrical. And 296 00:28:32.039 --> 00:28:33.680 then I said, but We'll wait. You know, who are you? 297 00:28:33.759 --> 00:28:41.160 Why are you here? And they introduced themselves as Edin Paula Fitzgerald. And 298 00:28:41.240 --> 00:28:42.880 I looked at this guy. I mean, I just thought they were nuts. 299 00:28:45.240 --> 00:28:48.319 But I looked at this guy and he seemed vaguely familiar. And I 300 00:28:48.400 --> 00:28:52.119 said to him, are you the Ed Fitzgerald who was the production designer for 301 00:28:52.200 --> 00:28:57.880 Magnificent Seven, which was a very popular movie at the time. And he 302 00:28:59.000 --> 00:29:03.559 said yes, And I realized I had met him just to shake hands at 303 00:29:03.599 --> 00:29:07.880 a film conference in New York, so they just see that made him seem 304 00:29:07.880 --> 00:29:10.960 a little less crazy. And I said to her again, you know, 305 00:29:11.680 --> 00:29:14.640 why are you here? She said, well, I had a dream that 306 00:29:14.759 --> 00:29:19.279 told me that I was supposed to drive up here with with my husband and 307 00:29:19.400 --> 00:29:27.519 to invite you down to the Edgar Cacy material to show you the edgre Cacy 308 00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:33.039 material. Do you know who Edgar Casey is? Oh? Wow, okay? 309 00:29:33.279 --> 00:29:36.799 And I said no, I don't have any ideas. She said, 310 00:29:37.160 --> 00:29:40.720 well, do you know what a psyche is? And I said, well, 311 00:29:40.759 --> 00:29:44.880 you know, I mean I yeah, it was sort of And I 312 00:29:45.279 --> 00:29:49.079 how you know, why were you doing this? How did you know to 313 00:29:49.160 --> 00:29:52.000 get here? I mean, you know, We're at the end of a 314 00:29:52.039 --> 00:29:56.559 ten mile school bus road that's not paved, in a mile long lane that 315 00:29:56.680 --> 00:30:00.519 goes to our fields. And how we did you possibly ever even get here? 316 00:30:00.799 --> 00:30:03.319 She said, well, in the dream I saw where to turn, 317 00:30:03.759 --> 00:30:07.799 and when I woke up, I just wrote it down. I thought, 318 00:30:07.920 --> 00:30:15.160 okay, it's pretty strange. She said, would you like to meet Thomas 319 00:30:15.240 --> 00:30:22.759 Jefferson? And I said I'd gone to the University of Virginia, where I 320 00:30:22.759 --> 00:30:26.200 had been an ECHL scholar. And I said, well, yeah, is 321 00:30:26.200 --> 00:30:29.960 he backed? And she said yes he is. I said, well, 322 00:30:30.000 --> 00:30:32.920 how do you know that? And she said, well, Edgar Casey said 323 00:30:32.960 --> 00:30:38.720 it. And I said how does Edgar Casey know it? And she said, 324 00:30:38.759 --> 00:30:42.559 well, you need to come down and look at this material. And 325 00:30:42.640 --> 00:30:47.920 just then a car came down the lane and this young couple was driving it, 326 00:30:48.000 --> 00:30:52.599 and she said, give me your telephone number, and I handed her 327 00:30:52.640 --> 00:30:59.039 my card and they said thank you very much and got left and got in 328 00:30:59.039 --> 00:31:02.839 the car and drove away. And I thought, what the hell just happened? 329 00:31:03.400 --> 00:31:06.799 Exactly That's what I'd be thinking, Yeah, I said, so. 330 00:31:07.160 --> 00:31:10.880 About a week later, I got a telephone call from a guy who said, 331 00:31:10.880 --> 00:31:15.680 this is t J. Davis Thomas Jefferson Davis, and I'd like to 332 00:31:15.720 --> 00:31:22.200 invite you down to Virginia Beach for the weekend. And as I told you, 333 00:31:22.279 --> 00:31:26.599 I was at this point as depressed as I have ever been in my 334 00:31:26.640 --> 00:31:30.880 life. And I said okay, because I just didn't know what to do, 335 00:31:32.759 --> 00:31:34.039 I said, okay, give me an address. I'll come down. 336 00:31:36.400 --> 00:31:40.400 So at the appointed to day and everything, I drove down to Virginia Beach, 337 00:31:40.440 --> 00:31:48.640 about two hours south of where my family's property was. And I got 338 00:31:48.680 --> 00:31:52.160 to this address and there was a young man up on a ladder putting up 339 00:31:52.200 --> 00:31:59.559 a sign for a leather shop and and a sort of hippie store. And 340 00:31:59.839 --> 00:32:04.519 I said, I'm looking for T. J. Davis and he said he's 341 00:32:04.559 --> 00:32:10.480 not here, but Joan is. And around the corner came this quite lovely 342 00:32:10.519 --> 00:32:15.960 woman, had beautiful lavender eyes, and she said, I'm supposed to take 343 00:32:15.960 --> 00:32:20.759 you up to the AAR. I said, what's the AAR and she said, 344 00:32:20.759 --> 00:32:24.279 well, that's where they studied the edgre Cacy material. And so we 345 00:32:24.400 --> 00:32:30.880 got in my car and drove up to up Atlantic Avenue and we got to 346 00:32:32.039 --> 00:32:37.400 where she told me to go, and she took me into this building and 347 00:32:37.880 --> 00:32:39.680 We're going to go in the library, she said. And we went into 348 00:32:39.680 --> 00:32:45.240 this library and along one of the walls where these green loose leaf notebooks, 349 00:32:47.279 --> 00:32:52.440 and she said, these are the readings. And she told me her idea 350 00:32:52.480 --> 00:32:57.680 of what a reading was. And I walked down the wall and just at 351 00:32:57.759 --> 00:33:00.799 random, I pulled one of these green loose leaf notebooks, you know, 352 00:33:00.839 --> 00:33:05.839 the kind of ovens school, the three ring binders. I pulled one of 353 00:33:05.839 --> 00:33:10.519 these notebooks down and I opened it up, just at random, and I 354 00:33:10.640 --> 00:33:15.559 started to read this what was on the page. And I'm telling you, 355 00:33:15.599 --> 00:33:21.319 Cliff, it is possible that your hair can stand on end, because I 356 00:33:21.400 --> 00:33:27.839 had, at random pulled down a reading given in nineteen thirty six for a 357 00:33:27.920 --> 00:33:32.759 woman and it was and in the reading he said you were a member of 358 00:33:32.799 --> 00:33:38.799 the Essecene community at he described the area which I recognized as Kurbet Cumron, 359 00:33:40.480 --> 00:33:46.880 and you were a teacher of astrology. And in nineteen thirty six, there 360 00:33:46.960 --> 00:33:52.599 was not a single human being on earth who knew that. In fact, 361 00:33:52.880 --> 00:33:55.839 nobody knew that Kurbet Cumran was in a scene community. They thought it was 362 00:33:57.240 --> 00:34:02.359 outpost to the Emperor of Aspasian's troops. What part of the world is that 363 00:34:02.480 --> 00:34:07.079 located. It's in the Middle East. That's why I thought, okay. 364 00:34:07.719 --> 00:34:16.159 And anyway, eleven years after he gave that reading, a young Bedouin tribes 365 00:34:16.239 --> 00:34:22.559 boy was chucking rocks into a cave just as he was taking his sheep along, 366 00:34:23.199 --> 00:34:27.880 and he heard something go clunk, and he went down and he found 367 00:34:27.920 --> 00:34:34.000 these urns which contained the Dead Sea scrolls. And then archaeologists came in and 368 00:34:34.079 --> 00:34:38.440 they did excavations, and they found that there were female skeletons, and not 369 00:34:38.559 --> 00:34:45.559 a single person knew at that time that there were women who were part of 370 00:34:45.599 --> 00:34:51.840 the Essene community. Josephus says it was a schismatic order of Jewish monks, 371 00:34:52.199 --> 00:34:58.440 so nobody knew that there were women involved. Nobody knew that they there was 372 00:34:59.039 --> 00:35:02.760 Jewish a scene community at courbet Comeran, and no one knew that they were 373 00:35:02.760 --> 00:35:07.840 interested in astrology. He said, this woman had been a teacher of astrology. 374 00:35:07.239 --> 00:35:13.679 But all of that was true. And I knew all this because the 375 00:35:13.800 --> 00:35:17.920 last thing I had done for the National Geographic before I had been drafted, 376 00:35:19.719 --> 00:35:23.400 was research on the Dead Sea scrolls for to do an article in the National 377 00:35:23.400 --> 00:35:30.039 Geographic magazine. And I knew that in nineteen thirty six. When he gave 378 00:35:30.079 --> 00:35:34.400 this reading, none of the things that he was saying were known to be 379 00:35:34.760 --> 00:35:40.719 were known period. And I said to this young woman, let me take 380 00:35:40.760 --> 00:35:45.639 you to dinner. I have a bunch of questions. And so we went 381 00:35:45.679 --> 00:35:52.199 off to dinner, and and I've talked to her and mean to her understanding 382 00:35:52.199 --> 00:35:57.159 of what was going on with Casey. And and I thought, wait, 383 00:35:57.280 --> 00:36:00.360 whoa, whoa. Though this is a whole other world, what's going on 384 00:36:00.440 --> 00:36:05.960 here? And so I called back to the farm and said it's gonna take 385 00:36:05.960 --> 00:36:09.599 a little longer than a weekend. And it ended up taking five years. 386 00:36:10.920 --> 00:36:17.360 And I went up to the AAR the next day and I met Hughlyn Casey, 387 00:36:17.400 --> 00:36:23.519 and I met Gladys Davis Turner, who was Casey's lifelong secretary and archivist. 388 00:36:24.000 --> 00:36:30.679 And I said to her, I don't understand this, and I want 389 00:36:30.719 --> 00:36:32.719 to understand it. I'm going to I would like to read the readings, 390 00:36:32.960 --> 00:36:36.920 and I would like to start at the first one and read all the way 391 00:36:36.920 --> 00:36:40.960 through sequentially. Now, and I want to stop right there, because there 392 00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:49.119 are something like fourteen thousand of his readings. Yeah, you are about the 393 00:36:49.159 --> 00:36:52.159 only person. And I'm sure there's others, but there are very few of 394 00:36:52.159 --> 00:36:59.400 you who have read one through fourteen thousand. Now there's nobody else, only 395 00:36:59.440 --> 00:37:04.320 Gladys. According to Gladys, she and I are the only two people to 396 00:37:04.400 --> 00:37:09.840 read all the readings, and they granted you permission to go through those obviously. 397 00:37:12.079 --> 00:37:15.880 Yeah, okay, I mean that's all I started reading. I started, 398 00:37:15.199 --> 00:37:20.199 you know, as I said, I said, it take a little 399 00:37:20.239 --> 00:37:24.360 longer than a weekend. So I moved on to Virginia Beach and I started 400 00:37:24.360 --> 00:37:31.119 reading. And after I'd been at it for two or three years, I 401 00:37:32.280 --> 00:37:38.000 had read by that time unknown thousands of them. I thought, well, 402 00:37:38.039 --> 00:37:45.320 I better start reading what does science think about this? And so I decided 403 00:37:45.360 --> 00:37:52.239 I would start reading all the parapsychological literature. So I started with the very 404 00:37:52.320 --> 00:38:01.800 first journal in parapsychology. I was going to William and Mary College and Commonwealth 405 00:38:01.880 --> 00:38:10.480 University and Wesleyan University, and in their libraries were all these things about these 406 00:38:10.920 --> 00:38:17.239 these journals, these parapsychology journals. And then I started reading books. So 407 00:38:17.320 --> 00:38:22.519 I read all the journals, and then I started reading books Blavotsky, Uspenski, 408 00:38:22.719 --> 00:38:29.440 Gerjief, all the sort of metaphysical people from the late nineteenth early twentieth 409 00:38:29.440 --> 00:38:35.599 century. That's what I did. And then in nineteen sixty eight, I 410 00:38:35.760 --> 00:38:40.760 had enough money saved up from working as a screenwriter in New York. I 411 00:38:40.760 --> 00:38:47.239 didn't have to take a job, so I was just living on that and 412 00:38:47.400 --> 00:38:54.079 doing this research. And then sixty eight I decided that I wanted to be 413 00:38:54.159 --> 00:39:02.159 an experimentalist to test these ideas, and and Casey kept saying other people could 414 00:39:02.159 --> 00:39:10.559 do this, So I created what I called distant viewing, which we later 415 00:39:10.679 --> 00:39:15.800 renamed remote viewing. That's an Ingo Swan word that he gave it. It's 416 00:39:15.960 --> 00:39:21.079 terrible term in both cases because it has nothing to do with remote, has 417 00:39:21.079 --> 00:39:27.480 nothing to do with viewing, has nothing to do with distance anyway. So 418 00:39:27.599 --> 00:39:31.840 I built a grid in my back yard, the back garden of this house 419 00:39:31.920 --> 00:39:39.039 that I had, and I started out with twelve foot square grid. I 420 00:39:39.280 --> 00:39:45.880 went down to a ship Chaanzor and got a lot of yellow line and I 421 00:39:45.960 --> 00:39:51.000 staked out and I made this grid of twelve squares, and eventually it made 422 00:39:51.000 --> 00:39:53.519 it one hundred and forty four squares because I had a friend who was a 423 00:39:53.559 --> 00:39:58.440 statistician, and he said, it'll be much more impressive if it's one hundred 424 00:39:58.440 --> 00:40:05.000 and forty four squares. Actually it didn't really make any difference. And I 425 00:40:05.039 --> 00:40:12.440 would bury things in mason jars or in thirty five millimeter film canisters because I 426 00:40:12.480 --> 00:40:19.559 wanted to see how refined people's perception could get. So a little bit thirty 427 00:40:19.599 --> 00:40:24.280 five millimeter film canister or a mason jar, and I would bury things in 428 00:40:24.320 --> 00:40:29.920 them in a grid, and I made a mimiograph. That's how long ago 429 00:40:30.000 --> 00:40:34.679 this is. I made a mimiograph of the grid, and I would send 430 00:40:34.679 --> 00:40:38.320 it out to people all over the world that I knew, and I would 431 00:40:38.360 --> 00:40:45.199 ask them if they could locate which of the grid I had buried something, 432 00:40:45.679 --> 00:40:51.519 and if they the first to locate it and make a mark on the grid 433 00:40:51.960 --> 00:40:55.119 the piece of paper I sent them, and then to tell me what it 434 00:40:55.320 --> 00:41:00.280 was. And to give you an example, there are many of these. 435 00:41:04.400 --> 00:41:10.639 I got. My wife had a perfume bottle that had one of those little 436 00:41:10.719 --> 00:41:19.280 rubber squeezy balls that atomized the perfume, and I buried that in a mason 437 00:41:19.400 --> 00:41:24.119 jar and in the grid. And the person said, well, there's a 438 00:41:24.239 --> 00:41:31.480 very strong smell of flowers, and there's a bottle and there's something around and 439 00:41:31.679 --> 00:41:37.679 it's you can squeeze it and that was exactly correct. I mean, that's 440 00:41:37.719 --> 00:41:44.360 just a example. Anyway, I did dozens of these things, and it 441 00:41:44.519 --> 00:41:49.480 turned out people could do it, and not always, not every time, 442 00:41:50.159 --> 00:41:55.320 but statistically significantly. And how many people would you say were involved in this 443 00:41:55.800 --> 00:42:01.800 early test that you were developed. Oh, I don't know, maybe fifty 444 00:42:02.280 --> 00:42:08.719 okay, okay, number of people? Yeah, And then I and then 445 00:42:08.800 --> 00:42:22.360 I got interested. I got interested in why religion is so focused on water 446 00:42:22.480 --> 00:42:29.280 and wine, and I began doing a series of experiments where I had would 447 00:42:29.320 --> 00:42:36.480 have meditators focus on bottles of wine, and then I would compare that wine 448 00:42:36.880 --> 00:42:43.679 to exactly the same wine I would I would buy a bottle of wine and 449 00:42:43.880 --> 00:42:47.280 split it into a seven hundred and fifty MILLI leader, and I would split 450 00:42:47.320 --> 00:42:52.880 it into three seventy five MILLI leader bottles, and I would randomly assign one 451 00:42:52.960 --> 00:42:57.679 of them to be control, one of them to be treated, and I'd 452 00:42:57.719 --> 00:43:00.199 take the treated bottle, I'd put it on a chair in the middle of 453 00:43:00.280 --> 00:43:05.800 a study group that was meditating, and I would ask them to focus their 454 00:43:05.840 --> 00:43:12.519 meditation on this bottle, and then I would take the two bottles, the 455 00:43:12.599 --> 00:43:16.480 control and the treated to a friend of mine, and I would tell them 456 00:43:16.639 --> 00:43:20.920 I'm about to make a big wine buy, and I'm down to two kinds 457 00:43:20.920 --> 00:43:24.199 of wine, and it's a lot of money. And so could you have 458 00:43:24.320 --> 00:43:30.239 people, could you have a little wine tasting. Invite seven people to come 459 00:43:30.280 --> 00:43:36.760 in and taste these two wines and tell me which one they think is the 460 00:43:36.800 --> 00:43:45.360 better wine. And I did it twelve times, and in eleven times they 461 00:43:45.480 --> 00:43:51.599 picked the bottle that was treated. And I later did another experiment on how 462 00:43:52.519 --> 00:44:00.639 focused intension changes the materials the molecular structure of water anyway. But so from 463 00:44:00.639 --> 00:44:08.719 sixty four sixty five, sixty five, I guess to sixty nine sixty almost 464 00:44:08.800 --> 00:44:14.679 seventy, all I did was study the Edgre Casey readings and start to do 465 00:44:14.719 --> 00:44:20.719 these experiments, and study also the parapsychological literature. And by the time I 466 00:44:21.000 --> 00:44:27.000 got into this, I realized most people start doing these kinds of experiments because 467 00:44:27.000 --> 00:44:30.559 they want to prove doesn't exist. Okay, But by the time I got 468 00:44:30.599 --> 00:44:36.480 there, having looked at the Casey material, which has got just it's the 469 00:44:36.599 --> 00:44:42.960 largest body of remote viewing data that exists. And I mean he did all 470 00:44:43.039 --> 00:44:51.119 kinds of things that just you you couldn't do if if consciousness was only physiologically 471 00:44:51.159 --> 00:44:54.400 based, so I didn't have any doubt that it was real. What I 472 00:44:54.519 --> 00:45:00.159 wanted to know, and what I've always wanted to know, is how does 473 00:45:00.199 --> 00:45:05.360 it work? What can you do to make it work better? What can 474 00:45:05.400 --> 00:45:10.480 you do with practical utility with it? What is it telling us about who 475 00:45:10.480 --> 00:45:15.960 we are as human beings? And what is it telling us about our place 476 00:45:15.000 --> 00:45:17.840 and the matrix of life? Yeah, I'd like to know. I'd like 477 00:45:17.880 --> 00:45:25.400 to get your definition a step in what remote viewing is, and also if 478 00:45:25.400 --> 00:45:30.840 you could give us a little flavor of psychic archaeology and touch on maybe one 479 00:45:30.880 --> 00:45:37.480 of the noted cases that Edgar Casey presents. But up to you go ahead. 480 00:45:38.000 --> 00:45:43.239 Well, I mean, first of all, as I said, remote 481 00:45:43.320 --> 00:45:50.119 viewing is a very bad term. What we're really dealing with here is non 482 00:45:50.199 --> 00:45:58.360 local awareness and the fact that there is an aspect of consciousness that exists before 483 00:45:58.480 --> 00:46:05.119 you were born, and we'll continue after you are physically dead, and that 484 00:46:05.320 --> 00:46:13.760 what's going on is that what I would call the eternal self, what religion 485 00:46:13.800 --> 00:46:22.159 would call the soul, episodically manifests a personality and incarnates it. You choose 486 00:46:22.199 --> 00:46:29.559 your parents, you choose your socio economic background, you choose your race, 487 00:46:30.840 --> 00:46:37.840 you choose your abilities, and this all comes in and what comes across is 488 00:46:37.000 --> 00:46:45.719 information. And if you look at the reincarnational research of Ian Stevenson or Jim 489 00:46:45.800 --> 00:46:55.400 Tucker at the University of Virginia, or Erlander Harrelson, there's an enormous amount 490 00:46:55.400 --> 00:47:02.360 of data that has been accumulated, very vigorously researched by those three people, 491 00:47:04.360 --> 00:47:08.000 particularly Ian and Jim Tucker. It makes it very clear that there is a 492 00:47:08.119 --> 00:47:17.639 continuity of consciousness and that what comes across between incarnations is information which literally affects 493 00:47:17.639 --> 00:47:23.360 you at the genetic level people. For instance, I'll just give you one 494 00:47:23.400 --> 00:47:31.920 example. Years later, I was making a television program about reincarnation and we 495 00:47:32.079 --> 00:47:43.360 studied a case in which a young boy said that he previously had been a 496 00:47:43.440 --> 00:47:49.039 money lender. This is an India, that he'd been a money lender, 497 00:47:49.119 --> 00:47:52.800 and that he had been killed by a woodcutter who had killed him with his 498 00:47:52.920 --> 00:48:00.400 acts. And this kid was born and had on his back a long scar 499 00:48:01.079 --> 00:48:07.599 just exactly like you'd expect if you were hit with an axe anyway, So 500 00:48:07.679 --> 00:48:13.559 we arranged to take this kid, not with the village where he was but 501 00:48:13.719 --> 00:48:17.599 to another village where nobody from his village had ever been or even knew existed. 502 00:48:19.679 --> 00:48:24.039 And they we took him up to the village, and as soon as 503 00:48:24.079 --> 00:48:29.840 he got to the edge of the village, he immediately went up to a 504 00:48:29.880 --> 00:48:37.119 particular house. Is too big a word, cottage, I don't know. 505 00:48:37.199 --> 00:48:43.840 Anyway, he went up to this little building and he knocked on the door, 506 00:48:45.719 --> 00:48:50.119 and a woman, an elderly woman, answered the door, and he 507 00:48:50.239 --> 00:48:57.239 called her by a pet name, and she immediately responded because she then said 508 00:48:57.280 --> 00:49:01.400 that that the only person had ever called her by that name was a lover 509 00:49:01.559 --> 00:49:07.360 that she had had, but that she was married to a woodcutter, and 510 00:49:07.440 --> 00:49:10.800 he had come back one day and caught them, and as he was trying 511 00:49:10.800 --> 00:49:15.400 to climb out the window to get away, the woodcutter, who was holding 512 00:49:15.440 --> 00:49:21.519 his axe, had killed him with this axe. So everything this kid said 513 00:49:21.760 --> 00:49:25.880 turned out to be true anyway, So, and if you look at the 514 00:49:27.559 --> 00:49:31.320 work of Ian Stevenson and Jim Tucker, you'll see there's there's literally several thousand 515 00:49:31.400 --> 00:49:40.320 of these kinds of stories. Anyway, I began this research, and I 516 00:49:40.360 --> 00:49:45.920 decided that what I was going to do was to spend my life studying consciousness. 517 00:49:46.760 --> 00:49:51.360 Right, And that's basically what I have done ever since. I mean 518 00:49:51.400 --> 00:49:54.079 I have done other things, you know, As you know, I was 519 00:49:54.199 --> 00:50:02.119 the Special Assistant to the Chief of Naval Operations, to the MIT Secretary of 520 00:50:02.119 --> 00:50:08.239 Defense, Discussion Group on Innovation Technology in the Future, consultant to the Oceanographer 521 00:50:08.239 --> 00:50:16.239 of the Navy. Right, I wrote the speech that John Mourner gave at 522 00:50:16.559 --> 00:50:23.480 bi Centennial when he was by Centennial Commissioner. Yeah, I'm curious because around 523 00:50:23.559 --> 00:50:30.000 that time, i'd say, the late seventies, you launched the Morbius Society, 524 00:50:30.119 --> 00:50:34.719 And I'm curious what were the goals when you when you launched that. 525 00:50:35.360 --> 00:50:37.719 And then we're gonna talk We're gonna get into the Alexandria project here in a 526 00:50:37.760 --> 00:50:45.840 second, but talk about the goals and the wonderful protocol that you developed using 527 00:50:46.039 --> 00:50:55.960 academia and intuition and psychic awareness. Well, when I was special assistant, 528 00:51:00.639 --> 00:51:06.880 there was a project that began that the Navy was interested in, how do 529 00:51:06.960 --> 00:51:15.360 you communicate with a deep ocean ballistic missile submarine without bringing it to the surface 530 00:51:16.599 --> 00:51:22.119 because if it got close to the surface, Soviet satellites could pick up the 531 00:51:22.320 --> 00:51:28.360 heat bloom from the reactor, so they didn't want them to come up to 532 00:51:28.440 --> 00:51:32.159 the surface. They wanted them stay submerged. So they started a project to 533 00:51:32.280 --> 00:51:43.800 see how deeply electromagnetic radiation could penetrate into the ocean. It was called Project 534 00:51:43.840 --> 00:51:47.360 SENDWIN and then Project ELF, or maybe it's the other way around, ELF 535 00:51:47.440 --> 00:51:52.440 and then SENDWIN. But in any case, the Navy spent about one hundred 536 00:51:52.480 --> 00:51:59.639 and twenty five million dollars figuring out very precisely two things, how deep radio 537 00:52:00.920 --> 00:52:07.760 radiation could penetrate into seawater and what the bit rate of transmission was. That 538 00:52:07.920 --> 00:52:12.400 is, how much information you could get across. If you saw, for 539 00:52:12.440 --> 00:52:16.000 instance, to the movie to Search for Red October. You know there's a 540 00:52:16.039 --> 00:52:20.679 scene in there where they get a message and they have to go to a 541 00:52:20.719 --> 00:52:24.679 book and open it up. And because the bit rate of transmission for ELF 542 00:52:24.760 --> 00:52:32.880 extreme low frequency three to three hundred hurts is extremely limited, and so all 543 00:52:32.880 --> 00:52:37.840 you get across is a few numbers, and so the submarines have a board. 544 00:52:38.000 --> 00:52:45.280 The submarines are books which say, you know, one to three means 545 00:52:45.360 --> 00:52:50.719 target this city, and then four means to fire or whatever. So it's 546 00:52:51.199 --> 00:52:58.199 very little little bits of information, far less than remote viewing can provide anyway. 547 00:52:58.639 --> 00:53:01.719 So they had done all of this, and at that time the big 548 00:53:01.800 --> 00:53:13.039 question in parapsychology was is what we call psychic electromagnetic in nature? And so 549 00:53:13.280 --> 00:53:19.800 I was reading all of this stuff and and then John Warner of Sectarian Navy 550 00:53:19.800 --> 00:53:23.000 at that point asked me to go up to Groton, Connecticut with him to 551 00:53:24.039 --> 00:53:30.880 launch a nuclear submarine. And on the plane was him and Rick Over, 552 00:53:31.000 --> 00:53:37.079 the father of the nuclear Navy, created all the nuclear navy in and I 553 00:53:37.199 --> 00:53:45.440 had this experiment in mind, and I had in preparing for a speech that 554 00:53:47.360 --> 00:53:57.599 I had written for Admiral Zumwalt Elmo Zumwalt, I had come across research a 555 00:53:57.760 --> 00:54:06.280 book which said Admiral Lord Nelson in the Battle of Abu Kirbey the Battle of 556 00:54:06.320 --> 00:54:16.519 the Nile, in which he fought the French Admiral Bruyer, he because of 557 00:54:16.559 --> 00:54:22.559 the nature of the cannons aboard the ships at that time in the seventeen hundreds, 558 00:54:22.719 --> 00:54:29.280 the black powder caused so much smoke that it was hard for the ships 559 00:54:29.320 --> 00:54:35.239 to see what was going on or to get to get commands from their commander. 560 00:54:35.800 --> 00:54:40.599 So Nelson created this system which I'm brilliant in which he had the frigates 561 00:54:40.679 --> 00:54:45.960 smaller ships sort of like destroyers today. They would sail up and down. 562 00:54:46.000 --> 00:54:51.880 And he had created a code book and there was a picture. When I 563 00:54:51.920 --> 00:54:55.320 was doing this research for this speech, there was I was looking for some 564 00:54:55.599 --> 00:55:00.559 historic reference. There was a picture in the book of this manual that Nelson 565 00:55:00.639 --> 00:55:06.079 had created. So if there was a red flag with a white stripe that 566 00:55:06.159 --> 00:55:09.880 meant to do something TAC left, and if it was a blue flag with 567 00:55:10.639 --> 00:55:14.920 white dot that meant TAC light. I mean, I just made that up, 568 00:55:14.960 --> 00:55:20.760 but it was. He created what he called an associated command, and 569 00:55:20.920 --> 00:55:25.800 I thought, well, that would be very interesting to do. It would 570 00:55:25.840 --> 00:55:31.719 be an associated what we now call what I created the protocol associated remote viewing. 571 00:55:34.880 --> 00:55:42.000 And so I also was reading all of this literature and this big argument 572 00:55:42.039 --> 00:55:46.880 that was going on in parapsychology about is all of this electromagnetic nature? I 573 00:55:46.920 --> 00:55:52.960 mean, the idea of telepathy, a word that was coined back in the 574 00:55:52.159 --> 00:56:00.519 nineteenth century. The concept of it was that you were sending a signal to 575 00:56:00.800 --> 00:56:07.440 another person, that your brain was sending a signal to their brain. That's 576 00:56:07.480 --> 00:56:12.760 the way people conceived of telepathy. And I did not think that was correct, 577 00:56:13.280 --> 00:56:16.039 But the only way to test it would be to put a person in 578 00:56:16.079 --> 00:56:24.000 a condition where he was completely shielded or they were completely shielded from electromagnetic radiation, 579 00:56:27.079 --> 00:56:30.599 because then if that was true, then it couldn't be electromagnetic. So 580 00:56:30.480 --> 00:56:37.000 also at this same time we're talking here in the early seventies, a friend 581 00:56:37.000 --> 00:56:39.239 of mine was the head of the CIA, and he began to send me 582 00:56:40.079 --> 00:56:47.719 because everybody knew of my interest in a parapsychology consciousness research. I don't like 583 00:56:47.800 --> 00:56:52.920 the word parapsychology either, because it means standing next to psychology, which is 584 00:56:52.960 --> 00:57:07.840 not the right conceptual word anyway. So I began getting these translations of what 585 00:57:08.000 --> 00:57:15.199 had been classified documents. A man named Leonid Vassiliev who was a scientist working 586 00:57:15.360 --> 00:57:22.719 in then Leningrad now St. Petersburg, and he was putting people down into 587 00:57:22.800 --> 00:57:29.719 caves and into mine shafts, into Faraday cages. We would shield from electromagnetic 588 00:57:29.800 --> 00:57:35.719 radiation down in the caves or down in the mines, and he would ask 589 00:57:35.800 --> 00:57:38.679 them to do non local perception, which is the correct term, by the 590 00:57:38.679 --> 00:57:46.880 way. He would ask them to do tasks in which they would acquire information 591 00:57:47.719 --> 00:57:53.880 from the non local domain that they couldn't know intellectually and they were able to 592 00:57:53.920 --> 00:57:59.480 do it, and so he was. He was I was getting these papers 593 00:57:59.599 --> 00:58:05.840 from from this friend of mine, from Vassiliev, and Vassiliev finally said, 594 00:58:05.840 --> 00:58:10.119 well, the only way that this could be working is if it was ELF 595 00:58:10.280 --> 00:58:16.039 extreme low frequency electromagnetic three to three hundred herds. And at about that same 596 00:58:16.079 --> 00:58:22.679 time a researcher in Canada, Michael Persinger, who was advocating that this was 597 00:58:22.760 --> 00:58:32.639 in fact the explanatory, the explanation for non local perception. He also argued 598 00:58:32.760 --> 00:58:37.519 in his paper that it must be ELF. So I thought, oh, 599 00:58:37.519 --> 00:58:44.920 okay, well I will see if I could get somebody to put me aboard 600 00:58:44.920 --> 00:58:50.239 a submarine that was at depth, because I knew exactly how deep it had 601 00:58:50.280 --> 00:58:55.559 to be because of this sixth project that the Navy had done. And as 602 00:58:55.599 --> 00:59:01.519 I said, I was on this flight up to Groton, Connecticut that Warner 603 00:59:01.599 --> 00:59:05.840 had asked me to go along with him, and Rickover, the father of 604 00:59:05.880 --> 00:59:08.119 the nuclear Navy, was a board, and I asked him if he would 605 00:59:08.239 --> 00:59:14.519 let me do this experiment. I explained what it was, and he said, 606 00:59:14.519 --> 00:59:16.679 well, let me think about it. And about a week later, 607 00:59:20.079 --> 00:59:24.880 I've got a call, and he called me up and he said, I've 608 00:59:24.920 --> 00:59:29.320 been thinking about that experiment you asked me about, and no, I'm not 609 00:59:29.360 --> 00:59:35.360 going to do it, because even though we make it secret, it will 610 00:59:35.400 --> 00:59:38.840 inevitably somebody will leak the data. Too many people will find out about it, 611 00:59:39.480 --> 00:59:43.639 and the media will get hold of it, and they'll start talking about 612 00:59:43.679 --> 00:59:50.000 the deep ocean nuclear submarines with ballistic missiles, and we'd prefer that not happen. 613 00:59:51.639 --> 00:59:54.119 We really, I mean, most Americans have no idea that there are 614 00:59:54.320 --> 01:00:00.239 nuclear submarines going around with ballistic missiles. It's part of what's called the the 615 01:00:00.360 --> 01:00:05.760 Triad defense strategy. Anyway, So I'm sorry. It's an interesting experiment, 616 01:00:05.800 --> 01:00:07.239 but we're not going to do it. So I thought, well, it 617 01:00:07.280 --> 01:00:15.960 will never happen. We're going to take a short commercial break to allow our 618 01:00:16.280 --> 01:00:22.480 sponsors to identify themselves, and we will return shortly with my guest today, 619 01:00:22.119 --> 01:01:05.920 Stephen Schwartz. Be right back. My guest today is Stephen Schwartz, the 620 01:01:06.000 --> 01:01:10.840 author of the Secret Vaults of Time, who has done extensive work using remote 621 01:01:10.920 --> 01:01:23.119 viewing in archaeological digs. Anyway, I left government because of Watergate. I 622 01:01:23.199 --> 01:01:27.880 just I couldn't tell the good guys from the bad guys, and I thought, 623 01:01:27.920 --> 01:01:30.920 I can't work like this. So I literally walked away from a career 624 01:01:32.119 --> 01:01:38.079 and I decided to go out and explore using what again I called at that 625 01:01:38.199 --> 01:01:44.800 point distant viewing in archaeology. And the reason I did that was I wanted 626 01:01:44.800 --> 01:01:51.599 to create an experiment, a protocol that was so rigorous that it would be 627 01:01:51.679 --> 01:01:58.519 impervious to criticism, because I don't like to be embarrassed, and so I 628 01:01:59.039 --> 01:02:05.480 at that At the same time in archaeology, the big discussion that was going 629 01:02:05.559 --> 01:02:10.280 on was where to look, because at that point, most archaeological finds were 630 01:02:10.320 --> 01:02:15.280 made because we're serendipitous. You know, a farmer would be plowing in his 631 01:02:15.480 --> 01:02:21.159 field and find a tomb, or a road crew would be building a road 632 01:02:21.239 --> 01:02:25.400 and find a temple, or you know, something like that, and so 633 01:02:25.480 --> 01:02:30.079 the big discussion amongst archaeologists is where to look? And I thought, well, 634 01:02:30.119 --> 01:02:36.800 here's a perfect example. This is perfect triple blind conditions. That is, 635 01:02:36.920 --> 01:02:40.440 nobody will know the answer at the time that I get the information, 636 01:02:42.119 --> 01:02:45.480 so it's pure triple blind. There is no way you could get this answer 637 01:02:45.719 --> 01:02:53.639 any other way because in parapsychology, at that point, criticism of the remote 638 01:02:53.679 --> 01:03:00.000 doing to exist yet in parapsychology. But I mean was the only person doing 639 01:03:00.039 --> 01:03:07.320 it. The big argument and criticism was, oh, you know you, 640 01:03:07.880 --> 01:03:12.960 it was the way your facial expression and you cued them as to what to 641 01:03:13.079 --> 01:03:16.559 say, or yeah, I mean, all kinds of nonsense. So there 642 01:03:16.639 --> 01:03:23.360 was one one denier who claimed that they had the people doing the response, 643 01:03:24.119 --> 01:03:30.000 had someone up on the up above them and the floor above them who drilled 644 01:03:30.039 --> 01:03:34.239 a hole through the floor. This is where they would say, I'm holding 645 01:03:34.280 --> 01:03:37.239 a card, you know, can you tell me what card was? Zenner 646 01:03:37.360 --> 01:03:40.960 cards, that kind of thing. Yeah, anyway, so I thought, 647 01:03:40.960 --> 01:03:52.039 well, this is perfect. I'll combine the electric issue with location issue, 648 01:03:52.800 --> 01:03:59.280 and I went to I left government. I went to to Tucson to write 649 01:03:59.320 --> 01:04:01.760 a book called The Secret Vaults of Time, because I wanted to write a 650 01:04:01.760 --> 01:04:08.599 book about all of the use of remote viewing in archaeology. Prior to my 651 01:04:08.800 --> 01:04:12.840 getting involved, remote viewing, you know, I mean, did not begin 652 01:04:12.960 --> 01:04:16.320 with me, or with Russell targor how put off. People have been doing 653 01:04:16.400 --> 01:04:24.039 remote viewing for thousands of years. The oldest remote viewing that we have that 654 01:04:24.159 --> 01:04:28.000 he can call remote viewing. Obviously, the oldest remote viewing that we have 655 01:04:29.079 --> 01:04:34.280 is in the forty sixth chapter of Herodotus. Herodotus is considered the father of 656 01:04:34.400 --> 01:04:40.960 history, and he's describing an experiment that took place in the fifth century BC. 657 01:04:42.840 --> 01:04:47.280 And this was an experiment. Today we would call this an outbound protocol. 658 01:04:47.920 --> 01:04:54.480 But basically King Cresus, king of the Olidians, which is now part 659 01:04:54.519 --> 01:05:00.639 of Turkey, learned that he was going to be attacked by the Persians and 660 01:05:00.719 --> 01:05:06.559 he was obviously very concerned. They were much larger than his army, his 661 01:05:06.679 --> 01:05:14.960 kingdom, and so he was very concerned about this and thought, we know 662 01:05:15.000 --> 01:05:20.119 what can I do? And he finally decided, well, he would go 663 01:05:20.159 --> 01:05:26.320 and consult the oracles. In Greece at that time, there were seven oracles. 664 01:05:27.280 --> 01:05:32.360 These were temples where they would train young people, young women in the 665 01:05:33.000 --> 01:05:40.360 or young men, mostly women. They would train them in a meditation technique 666 01:05:41.320 --> 01:05:45.960 that would allow them to open to non local consciousness to give non local perception 667 01:05:47.199 --> 01:05:53.360 information to people who came to the oracles. So he assembled seven teams of 668 01:05:53.480 --> 01:06:00.079 people, sort of seven diplomatic units, and he told them all, I 669 01:06:00.119 --> 01:06:02.519 want you to go out to the oracles. I want you to wait for 670 01:06:02.559 --> 01:06:08.480 the hundredth day. And on the hundredth day, I want you to go 671 01:06:08.519 --> 01:06:13.480 into the oracle, and I want you to ask the oracle what is Creesus, 672 01:06:13.639 --> 01:06:20.039 son of ali Etes, King Olydian's doing today. And so these seven 673 01:06:20.079 --> 01:06:26.320 teams of people went out to the seven oracles, and the only one we 674 01:06:26.400 --> 01:06:32.360 know because Herodotus wrote it down in the forty sixth chapter when they all came 675 01:06:32.440 --> 01:06:40.639 back after the hundredth day. And it took a long time because they had 676 01:06:40.679 --> 01:06:44.760 to travel. These were long sea voyages to get to the where the oracles 677 01:06:44.800 --> 01:06:48.760 were located. So the only one we know about is the oracle from Delphi. 678 01:06:50.079 --> 01:06:55.960 And on the hundredth day they went in to where the oracle was, 679 01:06:56.119 --> 01:07:00.320 and this was a young woman who was sitting in a kind of tripod, 680 01:07:01.559 --> 01:07:09.599 hanging in the seat over a cleft in the earth from which hydrocarbons, which 681 01:07:09.639 --> 01:07:15.480 produced psychedelic effects, bubbled up. And before they even asked their questions, 682 01:07:15.519 --> 01:07:19.480 she said, I can count the sands of time, the hundred days, 683 01:07:20.480 --> 01:07:26.400 and the great ocean, the trip that they had just taken, and I 684 01:07:26.519 --> 01:07:30.960 see a great urn, a bronze urn hanging from a tripod with a bronze 685 01:07:30.960 --> 01:07:41.039 lid, and a sheep and a tortoise being cut up and thrown into the 686 01:07:41.039 --> 01:07:44.519 boiling water of the thing. And of course it didn't make any sense to 687 01:07:44.599 --> 01:07:46.960 him at all. They didn't have any idea what she was talking about. 688 01:07:47.440 --> 01:07:50.880 But they wrote it all down as they had been instructed to do, and 689 01:07:50.920 --> 01:07:57.840 they went back and when they got back to Creasus in Lydia. And by 690 01:07:57.880 --> 01:08:01.199 the way, the reason we know Creasus is as rich as Cresus because he 691 01:08:01.239 --> 01:08:06.559 was the first person in the Greek world to coin money. Anyway, when 692 01:08:06.599 --> 01:08:13.719 they got back and each of the teams reported, when the Delphi team reported 693 01:08:13.760 --> 01:08:19.239 what they had heard been told, he bowed down and gave obesience because Cresus 694 01:08:19.279 --> 01:08:24.960 on that day had decided, what can I do that nobody could possibly guess 695 01:08:25.000 --> 01:08:28.680 I would do, because if they'd said, well, he's sitting on his 696 01:08:28.720 --> 01:08:32.279 throne issuing edicts, well that's what kings do. So he had a great 697 01:08:32.319 --> 01:08:38.640 bronze urn brought into his courtyard of his palace and hung from a tripod and 698 01:08:38.760 --> 01:08:42.000 with a big bronze lid, and he filled up with water, and he 699 01:08:42.119 --> 01:08:46.560 personally cut up a lamb and a tortoise and threw it into the water just 700 01:08:46.680 --> 01:08:55.600 exactly as she had described, and so he decided that he would listen to 701 01:08:55.640 --> 01:08:59.600 the Delphic Oracle. But in any case, that is the first remote viewing 702 01:08:59.600 --> 01:09:08.000 we had have. There are many others. What we created in the seventies 703 01:09:08.039 --> 01:09:15.159 are in the late sixties I started in sixty eight was very rigorous protocols in 704 01:09:15.239 --> 01:09:21.760 which you could not claim that you had gotten the information in any way other 705 01:09:21.800 --> 01:09:28.920 than non local perception. And this is the more bious societies. This the 706 01:09:29.039 --> 01:09:34.640 company that you and so I left government. I went out to let me 707 01:09:34.760 --> 01:09:39.560 go on. Then I went out to Tucson to write this book and to 708 01:09:39.640 --> 01:09:47.000 do an remote viewing archaeological project up in the Little Elden Mountains up above Flagstaff, 709 01:09:47.039 --> 01:09:55.960 Arizona, and I wrote this book. I along with a guy named 710 01:09:56.000 --> 01:10:02.359 Joe Long at the American Anthropological Association, I started what became the Association for 711 01:10:02.399 --> 01:10:13.960 the Anthropology of Consciousness, and I, out of the blue, I got 712 01:10:14.000 --> 01:10:23.880 a invitation. Peter Tompkins and I had been talking about writing a biography of 713 01:10:23.920 --> 01:10:30.000 a man named Manly Hall. Peter Tompkins wrote Secret Life of Plants and co 714 01:10:30.119 --> 01:10:33.239 wrote it with Chris Bird and Secrets of the Great Pyramid Secrets of the Mexican 715 01:10:33.279 --> 01:10:40.920 Pyramid, and so he had contacted them, and Henry Drake, who was 716 01:10:40.960 --> 01:10:45.520 the vice president there, had called me in and invited me out. So 717 01:10:45.600 --> 01:10:51.039 I went out to Los Angeles, and while I was there, I stayed 718 01:10:51.119 --> 01:10:56.079 with a friend of mine, Don Keach, who had been the deputy director 719 01:10:56.119 --> 01:11:00.439 of Navy Labs, and he and his best friend, guy named Don Walsh, 720 01:11:00.520 --> 01:11:05.119 who had made the deepest dive in history, had taken over the Institute 721 01:11:05.119 --> 01:11:12.600 of Marine and Coastal Studies at the University of California excuse me, Southern California. 722 01:11:13.439 --> 01:11:19.399 University of Southern California. And while I was there Don Keach we were 723 01:11:19.439 --> 01:11:24.680 having lunch and he said to me, you know that crazy submarine experiment you 724 01:11:24.720 --> 01:11:28.279 wanted to do, And I said, yeah, but we were never able 725 01:11:28.319 --> 01:11:30.439 to do it. Where you're going to get a submarine? And he said, 726 01:11:30.439 --> 01:11:33.760 well, as it happens, we have a research submarine that's coming down 727 01:11:33.800 --> 01:11:43.079 to do its sea trials at our facility on Catalina Island. And Don and 728 01:11:43.119 --> 01:11:46.359 I have talked it over and we're prepared to fund three days to let you 729 01:11:46.399 --> 01:11:53.159 do that experiment. I'd like to see how it comes out and I said, 730 01:11:53.359 --> 01:11:58.479 Okay, let's do it. So I came out to Los Angeles and 731 01:11:59.319 --> 01:12:05.319 I moved out there, and this is the summer of seventy seven, and 732 01:12:05.520 --> 01:12:11.279 I designed this experiment which came to be called Deep Quest. And the point 733 01:12:11.279 --> 01:12:18.840 of the experiment was one to determine by getting, first of all, asking 734 01:12:18.880 --> 01:12:27.199 people to locate on a map the location of a previously unknown wreck on the 735 01:12:27.239 --> 01:12:34.760 sea floor between Catalina Island and the mainland of the United States. One that 736 01:12:34.840 --> 01:12:40.960 was the first thing. Second thing, because that would test whether you could 737 01:12:41.000 --> 01:12:45.159 go through the water, whether ELF could explain it. And then the second 738 01:12:45.239 --> 01:12:53.359 part was to put remote viewers aboard the submarine, one at a time and 739 01:12:53.760 --> 01:12:59.760 submerge them to depth and asked them to describe, just like the Creases experiment, 740 01:13:00.439 --> 01:13:03.840 where in this case Russ Targe and how put Off, who I had 741 01:13:03.880 --> 01:13:11.600 just met, where they were hiding. And so I was originally going to 742 01:13:11.760 --> 01:13:18.039 use George McMullen and Alan Vaughan as the viewers, but Alan got the flu 743 01:13:18.359 --> 01:13:25.319 and George McMullen had a co worker at the Dealer car dealership where he worked 744 01:13:25.920 --> 01:13:30.720 whose wife had a child early a premature child, and he couldn't leave because 745 01:13:30.840 --> 01:13:36.119 the other guy was home with his wife and their new baby. So I 746 01:13:36.600 --> 01:13:43.600 had literally just met Ingo Swan and Hellahammed, and I asked them to be 747 01:13:43.680 --> 01:13:49.239 the remote viewers to come with me as to go into the submarine, and 748 01:13:50.000 --> 01:13:56.319 I had previously sent out a seat copy of the sea chart. What you 749 01:13:56.399 --> 01:13:59.800 do is take all the colors off and the names off, and you make 750 01:13:59.840 --> 01:14:04.399 it into a blueprint. So and it's all one color or the blue and 751 01:14:05.079 --> 01:14:11.000 the grayish blue and the white. Because I knew from research I had done 752 01:14:11.039 --> 01:14:15.840 in psychology that people are attracted to specific colors, and so the way to 753 01:14:15.880 --> 01:14:20.960 avoid that is eliminate the colors and get the names off. And so I 754 01:14:21.119 --> 01:14:25.800 sent them just as I had back in the day when I had had the 755 01:14:25.960 --> 01:14:30.920 grid in my yard. I sent them out sea charts had been made into 756 01:14:30.920 --> 01:14:36.279 blueprints and said, please locate a previously unknown wreck on the sea floor and 757 01:14:36.399 --> 01:14:42.479 described for me in detail what I will find when I go there. And 758 01:14:42.560 --> 01:14:49.640 they did, and then I turned it over to the Institute and they're one 759 01:14:49.720 --> 01:14:56.840 of their officers created what for me a master map, because what you're looking 760 01:14:56.880 --> 01:15:03.399 for is that we're consensus where people multiple people described the same location and I 761 01:15:04.279 --> 01:15:12.439 so we this submarine came down called the Taurus from a company called Hiko which 762 01:15:12.479 --> 01:15:18.720 was up in Canada, and we went out in the submarine and I had 763 01:15:18.760 --> 01:15:25.439 a surface ship that's that was the support vessel for the submarine. Go to 764 01:15:25.640 --> 01:15:33.239 the exact location that the consensus zone that they picked and to drop a location 765 01:15:33.279 --> 01:15:38.359 device called the PingER that goes ping, ping, ping, and you just 766 01:15:38.439 --> 01:15:42.920 home in on it. And so they did that, and then we sank 767 01:15:43.000 --> 01:15:51.039 down to the bottom of the ocean and we listened for the ping Ingo Swan 768 01:15:51.239 --> 01:15:57.119 was aboard of any fine tuning. The night before, Hella had come to 769 01:15:57.159 --> 01:16:01.079 me and described I looked in and we looked for consensus on what are called 770 01:16:01.119 --> 01:16:08.199 Lowa priority things you'd never expect to hear. And the night before we did 771 01:16:08.239 --> 01:16:12.199 the dives, Hella had come to me and said, you're going to find 772 01:16:12.840 --> 01:16:18.359 a big stone block about five by six by seven and it's a big granite 773 01:16:18.359 --> 01:16:21.760 block. And I thought, what in the world would that be about. 774 01:16:23.239 --> 01:16:29.319 Let me stop be real quick, stephen is this was this off the California 775 01:16:29.359 --> 01:16:33.199 coast. That these wrecks were a wreck, a single wreck, okay, 776 01:16:33.319 --> 01:16:39.760 yes, And I had the Bureau of Land Management Marine Sites Board, who 777 01:16:39.840 --> 01:16:45.640 know they keep track of every wreck on the West coast of the United States. 778 01:16:45.880 --> 01:16:48.840 I said, do you know of such a wreck? And the head 779 01:16:48.880 --> 01:16:54.000 of the Marine Sits Board said, there is no wreck there that we know 780 01:16:54.119 --> 01:16:59.800 about. So again triple blind. So we went there and they had just 781 01:17:00.039 --> 01:17:02.840 scribed in detail. They said this was a wooden ship, that it had 782 01:17:02.920 --> 01:17:11.359 sunk about nineteen oh six, that it did that because it had a it 783 01:17:11.520 --> 01:17:15.560 had a kind of steam engine on the deck that had blown up and set 784 01:17:15.640 --> 01:17:24.079 fire to the ship, and it had sunk in place, and uh, 785 01:17:24.079 --> 01:17:31.039 and that we would find the remains of the of this steam engine that was 786 01:17:31.119 --> 01:17:38.640 on the ship that ran some kind of uh, some kind of crane I 787 01:17:38.680 --> 01:17:45.560 think, and uh, that we would find that we would find the stern 788 01:17:45.680 --> 01:17:50.000 wheel of the ship and a and the shaft on it, that we would 789 01:17:50.039 --> 01:17:53.960 see that. And then as they say, hell, I came in and 790 01:17:54.600 --> 01:18:01.079 described this granite block we would find and I filmed all of this. You 791 01:18:01.119 --> 01:18:08.119 can go to my personal website www. Stephane Schwartz dot com and you can 792 01:18:08.159 --> 01:18:11.960 see the movie. I got Leonard Nimoy, doctor Spock, to do the 793 01:18:12.079 --> 01:18:18.680 narration for the movie and anyway, So we homed in on the PingER and 794 01:18:18.920 --> 01:18:25.159 there exactly as you'll see in the film. There was the wreck exactly where 795 01:18:25.159 --> 01:18:28.720 they had placed it, and it was exactly as they described it. We 796 01:18:28.800 --> 01:18:34.039 found part of the steam engine for the winch. We found the wheel with 797 01:18:34.119 --> 01:18:41.079 the shaft, and we found Hella's big block. And you were using your 798 01:18:41.279 --> 01:18:46.680 your protocol of the psychics Hella and I don't know if it was pad or 799 01:18:46.680 --> 01:18:51.880 not. No, that wasn't an ingo. Were the ones on site? 800 01:18:53.199 --> 01:18:56.880 Right? So you had them? And what else did you use as your 801 01:18:56.920 --> 01:19:01.680 protocol? Did you have? The like created a protocol called the Mobius consensus 802 01:19:01.720 --> 01:19:08.760 protocol where you get multiple people to do the remote viewing. You break you 803 01:19:09.359 --> 01:19:13.920 break down, you transcribe the tapes. Because they did them. They were 804 01:19:14.279 --> 01:19:18.479 I got I've forgotten now eight eight people to do this. They were scattered 805 01:19:18.479 --> 01:19:24.159 all over the place. Send me the tapes, send me back the maps 806 01:19:24.239 --> 01:19:30.439 that I sent them, and then I take You transcribe the tapes and then 807 01:19:30.479 --> 01:19:35.920 you break them down concept by concept. So if I said, for instance, 808 01:19:35.920 --> 01:19:41.560 the man who's interviewing me in the blue shirt, that would be man 809 01:19:42.680 --> 01:19:51.800 interviewing sitting blue shirt. That's five concepts, So each concept gets evaluated correct, 810 01:19:53.560 --> 01:20:00.680 partially correct, can't be evaluated incorrect. And I know from now sixty 811 01:20:00.760 --> 01:20:05.920 years of doing this that we expect to see about thirty five to forty percent 812 01:20:05.960 --> 01:20:11.239 of the material you can't evaluate. That doesn't mean it's wrong, you just 813 01:20:11.319 --> 01:20:15.319 can't evaluate it. If you know, if somebody told you what somebody was 814 01:20:15.359 --> 01:20:20.560 thinking, unless they left a message or a note or something, there was 815 01:20:20.640 --> 01:20:25.800 no way that you would know. So thirty five to forty percent of material 816 01:20:26.239 --> 01:20:30.199 you can't evaluate because there's no way to do it. Of the remaining percent, 817 01:20:30.720 --> 01:20:36.680 you expect to see somewhere between seventy five and ninety percent of the information 818 01:20:38.239 --> 01:20:44.680 be evaluated is correct or partially correct, but operational. Partially correct would be 819 01:20:45.079 --> 01:20:50.600 if I said the man interviewing me in the black shirt, then I would 820 01:20:50.600 --> 01:20:55.399 be wrong because it's a dark blue shirt, but it would still be operational. 821 01:20:56.680 --> 01:21:01.079 So I went through that process, and so we when we went to 822 01:21:01.159 --> 01:21:06.880 dive in the in the Taurus, I knew we were looking for a ship. 823 01:21:08.640 --> 01:21:13.880 We were looking for a ship that had caught fire and sunk. That 824 01:21:14.039 --> 01:21:18.079 it had a winch aboard, a steam engine winch which had blown up, 825 01:21:18.960 --> 01:21:24.600 and that we would find this shaft with the with the wheel on it, 826 01:21:24.960 --> 01:21:31.720 we would find the remains of the of the winch Uh steam engine, and 827 01:21:31.760 --> 01:21:38.560 we would find this block and it would have happened approximately in nineteen six. 828 01:21:39.439 --> 01:21:43.840 Wow, that's amazing. So it's very specific. Yeah, I mean, 829 01:21:43.880 --> 01:21:48.880 I really want to emphasize. This gets very very specific. Yeah. Well, 830 01:21:48.920 --> 01:21:53.239 so we dived on it and we found the ship. So that was 831 01:21:53.279 --> 01:21:58.239 the foundation for the Morbius Society. Yes, can we go forward a little 832 01:21:58.239 --> 01:22:03.560 bit. I'd like you to talk about the Alexandria project and how you came 833 01:22:03.600 --> 01:22:13.239 about with the different targets. Well, okay, that's nineteen seventy seven. 834 01:22:15.079 --> 01:22:23.199 So I presented this paper about this project project deep quest and oh and also 835 01:22:23.359 --> 01:22:31.359 by the way, Hella and Ingo each successfully accurately described where hal and Russ 836 01:22:31.399 --> 01:22:39.399 were hiding. And the importance there is that in both this and the archaeological 837 01:22:39.479 --> 01:22:47.680 part, the amount of data transmitted was far in excess of what you could 838 01:22:47.720 --> 01:22:55.880 do with ELF and they were it was at great depth, and so that 839 01:22:56.079 --> 01:23:00.560 ended the discussion. There was no way that you could explain remote viewing or 840 01:23:00.640 --> 01:23:08.720 telepathy as electromagnetic in nature. That's not what's happening despite all the people that 841 01:23:08.760 --> 01:23:12.319 had claimed that was what it was. So anyway, so that one individual 842 01:23:12.359 --> 01:23:19.079 who thought that it was a frequency generated detectable energy was wrong when he talked 843 01:23:19.079 --> 01:23:27.239 about remote viewing. Yes, okay, well he didn't call it remote viewing, 844 01:23:27.279 --> 01:23:30.279 but he got people to do what I would call non local perception to 845 01:23:30.520 --> 01:23:34.279 a local perception, right, okay, which is the proper way to think 846 01:23:34.279 --> 01:23:39.800 of it. Anyway, So I did. I presented these papers and they 847 01:23:40.279 --> 01:23:43.520 got a lot of you know, there was a lot of media coverage, 848 01:23:43.560 --> 01:23:48.520 and I made this I cut this film and I put it in a show 849 01:23:48.560 --> 01:23:59.159 called In Search of and I got Leonard Nemoi to do the narration. Anyway, 850 01:24:00.319 --> 01:24:10.600 So in UH seventy eight, I was approached by two women historians who 851 01:24:10.640 --> 01:24:15.840 came to me. I was in Los Angeles and they came to me and 852 01:24:15.880 --> 01:24:21.239 they asked me, could you locate the tomb of Alexander the Great and the 853 01:24:21.279 --> 01:24:31.159 palace of Cleopatra and the Timonium of Mark Anthony. And I said, well, 854 01:24:31.239 --> 01:24:33.600 I don't know. Yeah, you know, I'm willing to try if 855 01:24:33.640 --> 01:24:38.479 you can get the funding. And they said, oh, we've got the 856 01:24:38.520 --> 01:24:44.600 funding, but we just we need somebody to do this. Nobody knows where 857 01:24:44.600 --> 01:24:48.239 these things are located. So you know that from my point of view, 858 01:24:48.239 --> 01:24:54.800 Oh nobody knows. Well, then it's triple blind. So I said, 859 01:24:54.800 --> 01:24:57.159 well, okay, if you've got the funding and well, let's give it 860 01:24:57.199 --> 01:25:01.800 a run. So that became the Alexandria Project. Wow, and I had 861 01:25:01.840 --> 01:25:09.920 eleven people who were remote viewers. Once again, I got charts that maps 862 01:25:09.960 --> 01:25:15.560 of Alexandria, Egypt and the Eastern Harbor, and I sent them out to 863 01:25:15.600 --> 01:25:20.600 these people and I said, please locate the tomb of Alexander, and locate 864 01:25:20.960 --> 01:25:26.199 Cleopatra and Mark Anthony. And oh, while you're at it, why don't 865 01:25:26.199 --> 01:25:30.640 you locate the Lighthouse of Pharaohs one of the seven Wonders of the ancient world? 866 01:25:31.399 --> 01:25:34.640 Why did you pick the lighthouse of the Pharaoh of Pharaohs? Was that 867 01:25:34.760 --> 01:25:41.079 because it was in the general vicinity of Yeah, okay, it was. 868 01:25:41.880 --> 01:25:44.359 It was in the general of a sended and it was one of the seven 869 01:25:44.359 --> 01:25:46.920 wonders of the ancient world. That was a lot of looking for it. 870 01:25:48.680 --> 01:25:54.439 Yeah, okay, I'm really curious to hear this because, uh, these 871 01:25:54.439 --> 01:25:59.680 things were buried in they thought it was underwater, right, No, nobody 872 01:25:59.760 --> 01:26:01.760 knew where they were. No one knew where they were. Okay, all 873 01:26:01.840 --> 01:26:08.319 right, so okay, so people did the locations for me. They located 874 01:26:08.359 --> 01:26:15.119 the tomb of Alexander, which was under a mosque, the mosque of Nevy 875 01:26:15.199 --> 01:26:24.479 Daniel, and the lighthouse, and Cleopatra's palace, and Mark Anthony's palace, 876 01:26:24.520 --> 01:26:30.399 the Timonium and the Pompei pillar. Those were all located out in the harbor, 877 01:26:30.520 --> 01:26:36.039 which nobody knew at the time. Okay, now again, because I 878 01:26:38.000 --> 01:26:46.119 want things to be extremely meticulous, I run a parallel to the remote viewing 879 01:26:46.159 --> 01:26:54.680 part of it. I asked people to do electronic remote survey surveys of the 880 01:26:54.720 --> 01:27:00.439 same area. What was it? What was the technology back? And it 881 01:27:00.560 --> 01:27:06.520 wasn't satellite taking scar? Side scan soonar very good. Yeah, So I 882 01:27:06.520 --> 01:27:12.479 didn't know him at all. I looked up side scan SONAR. I didn't 883 01:27:12.479 --> 01:27:15.359 really know a lot about it, and I discovered it had been invented by 884 01:27:15.399 --> 01:27:19.960 a man named Harold Edgerton who was the chairman of radio physics at M I 885 01:27:20.039 --> 01:27:29.439 T. And I sent him a telegram and said, I'm over here, 886 01:27:29.520 --> 01:27:36.319 I'm doing this. I'm using this non local perception technique and would you come 887 01:27:36.359 --> 01:27:42.520 over and do the side scan sonar of the same area to see if side 888 01:27:42.560 --> 01:27:48.399 scan sonar can locate what the remote viewers are locating. And he, with 889 01:27:48.600 --> 01:27:55.479 being a real scientist, said well, if you can do it between a 890 01:27:55.520 --> 01:28:00.199 certain date in May when I'm available, I'm your man. You fly me 891 01:28:00.279 --> 01:28:02.760 first class and put me up in a good hotel. I said, I 892 01:28:02.800 --> 01:28:09.920 can do that. So I had Harold Edgerton come over and do I mean, 893 01:28:10.039 --> 01:28:14.119 you just couldn't get any better than that, wow, and do the 894 01:28:14.159 --> 01:28:18.560 side scan sonar of the Eastern Harbor, and he reported. We published a 895 01:28:18.600 --> 01:28:26.720 paper together. He reported he couldn't find anything. But the remote viewers had 896 01:28:26.760 --> 01:28:30.600 not only located all of the things that we're talking about, but they had 897 01:28:30.640 --> 01:28:38.479 also said the city once extended much further out into what is now the bay, 898 01:28:38.920 --> 01:28:45.159 and that there was a shift and the so Edgerton, who was a 899 01:28:45.199 --> 01:28:50.960 lovely man, came out with his side scan sonar gear and he did a 900 01:28:51.000 --> 01:28:58.319 survey and he reported, I don't see anything. And I had I put 901 01:28:58.359 --> 01:29:05.119 together teams of people who are experts in various things. I had Mikailowski Rajeyevich, 902 01:29:06.079 --> 01:29:13.520 who was a Polish archeologist who was at that time the leading Alexandrian archaeologist 903 01:29:13.600 --> 01:29:18.039 in the world. He's a Russian. Now he's Polish. I thought he 904 01:29:18.079 --> 01:29:25.159 was okay, bullish, all right. And and I had Peter Fraser, 905 01:29:26.960 --> 01:29:32.800 acknowledged by everybody to be the leading historian of Alexandria egypt history, who was 906 01:29:32.880 --> 01:29:40.960 at All Souls College at Oxford as my consultants. And I had Harold Edgerton, 907 01:29:42.520 --> 01:29:45.560 chief of radio physics lab at m I t as my side scan sonar. 908 01:29:46.720 --> 01:29:55.439 So I go to the top. Yeah, anyway, So we then 909 01:29:56.479 --> 01:30:01.199 went diving. I got the the egypt I go into the head of the 910 01:30:01.239 --> 01:30:09.399 Egyptian Navy, the Admiral, and I got him to give me his diving. 911 01:30:09.600 --> 01:30:15.039 He had a commando team of divers and they would help me dive, 912 01:30:15.359 --> 01:30:24.560 and as well as myself and one of the women who was an experienced diver, 913 01:30:26.560 --> 01:30:31.239 and we went. The thing about this is this is not about searching. 914 01:30:32.319 --> 01:30:39.039 Using non local perception in archaeology is not about searching. It's about finding. 915 01:30:39.680 --> 01:30:43.920 You just go to the exact place that they tell you it's either there 916 01:30:44.319 --> 01:30:46.439 or it's not there. Well, let me ask you about that real quickly. 917 01:30:46.479 --> 01:30:51.880 When you're not using the site scan sonar data is people are people like 918 01:30:53.079 --> 01:31:01.159 Hella giving you longitude longitude latitude? Are they giving you land points to reference? 919 01:31:01.199 --> 01:31:04.920 How are they picking these locations? They locate them on a map, 920 01:31:06.399 --> 01:31:11.720 little circle. So they had you had a map of the of the bay, 921 01:31:11.760 --> 01:31:18.039 had a map of Alexandria. It was a British military map, Okay, 922 01:31:18.159 --> 01:31:21.600 And I made it into I made it again. I made it into 923 01:31:21.800 --> 01:31:29.359 a blueprint, took all the names off all that. I mean, I 924 01:31:29.359 --> 01:31:31.640 can show you pictures of all this. And in fact, you can watch 925 01:31:31.680 --> 01:31:34.399 this movie too, because I made a movie of this as well. I 926 01:31:34.439 --> 01:31:39.960 actually saw this one Alexandria project. You have a couple of movies. Yeah, 927 01:31:40.000 --> 01:31:43.960 so yeah, yeah, Well in any case, so we went diving 928 01:31:44.039 --> 01:31:48.840 and we found first of all, and from Rajeevitch's point of view, the 929 01:31:48.840 --> 01:31:56.079 most important was we found that the ancient sea wall was about thirty feet further 930 01:31:56.159 --> 01:32:02.920 out than the present day seawall, and and that Cleopatra's palace was underwater, 931 01:32:03.319 --> 01:32:10.640 Mark Anthony's palace was underwater, Pompey's pillar was underwater, and the lighthouse of 932 01:32:10.720 --> 01:32:15.239 Pharos was underwater. Wow, And we we photographed all of that. We 933 01:32:15.560 --> 01:32:20.760 you know, as you saw the film and the remote viewers it was exactly 934 01:32:20.800 --> 01:32:30.159 as they described it, and that was all confirmed by Brjeevic. I got 935 01:32:30.439 --> 01:32:39.159 Mustafa Ellabetti, who was the head of of of Anthropology at the University of 936 01:32:39.239 --> 01:32:46.000 Alexandria, and Dao Abu Daoud, who was the president of the Archaeological Society, 937 01:32:46.520 --> 01:32:50.880 who was also a professor at the university, and another professor called Fausi 938 01:32:50.960 --> 01:32:57.359 Fakarani, and all of these guys were part of the consulting team that I 939 01:32:57.520 --> 01:33:02.680 used to evaluate the accuracy of the dad and to compare what the remote viewers 940 01:33:02.760 --> 01:33:08.600 found versus what you could find electronically. Now, let me stop. You're 941 01:33:08.640 --> 01:33:14.439 just right there, Stephen. This is fabulous, fantastic, mind blowing data. 942 01:33:14.960 --> 01:33:17.720 You actually found each of the places that you were sent out to look 943 01:33:17.760 --> 01:33:27.000 for. This is prime material for the Smithsonian or for the National Geographic Obviously 944 01:33:27.119 --> 01:33:31.159 it's a little too much for them at that time of our history. How 945 01:33:31.319 --> 01:33:38.760 was this reported and did you have any reaction from the orthodoxy? Well, 946 01:33:38.800 --> 01:33:43.760 it was picked up by media all over the world. It was okay, 947 01:33:44.119 --> 01:33:49.960 and I presented I wrote it up as I said. Harold Edgerton and I 948 01:33:50.039 --> 01:33:56.640 wrote a paper together and in which he reported what he found with the side 949 01:33:56.680 --> 01:34:03.000 scan, and I reported what I found with non local perception. I presented 950 01:34:03.000 --> 01:34:12.680 it at several archaeology conferences. Years later. One of the archaeologists was at 951 01:34:12.720 --> 01:34:19.239 that conference came to me and asked me to locate Christopher Columbus's caravel from his 952 01:34:19.359 --> 01:34:23.439 fourth voyage, which we did. Yeah. I want to go into that 953 01:34:23.479 --> 01:34:27.359 in a minute, but I'm just really curious. I think you were too 954 01:34:27.439 --> 01:34:31.560 far ahead of yourself in seventy seven for people to react in the manner that 955 01:34:31.560 --> 01:34:35.760 they might today with all the technology we're using with LDAR and things, Sisko 956 01:34:36.239 --> 01:34:44.520 Star. I'm just curious. Did you feel that your reception was enough? 957 01:34:45.399 --> 01:34:48.079 Because to my mind, it's almost like this should be taught in colleges, 958 01:34:49.600 --> 01:34:57.439 you know, I mean it got a lot of media attention. I wasn't 959 01:34:57.479 --> 01:35:00.800 seeking media attention, you know, I did one doing anything that I never 960 01:35:00.920 --> 01:35:05.399 have sought it. You know, just like our interview here, you came 961 01:35:05.479 --> 01:35:11.760 up, you called me, I don't solicit I don't solicit media attention, 962 01:35:12.199 --> 01:35:15.399 right, I mean, yeah, I got a lot of media attention. 963 01:35:15.479 --> 01:35:20.960 I went on the MERV Griffin show, The Door. They I can't think 964 01:35:21.000 --> 01:35:27.439 of her name. Now, oh o Oprah, I went I did Oprah? 965 01:35:27.520 --> 01:35:31.079 Yeah, no, I would Dinah Shore. Oh boy, we're talking 966 01:35:31.119 --> 01:35:34.039 a long time ago, my friend. Yeah. Yeah, So anyway, 967 01:35:34.079 --> 01:35:41.840 I did you know I did lots of interviews with lots of people Oprah at 968 01:35:41.880 --> 01:35:49.640 that point, at at a radio show in Chicago. Yeah, nobody attacked 969 01:35:49.640 --> 01:35:55.640 it. No, that's not true. One guy attacked it, but he 970 01:35:55.760 --> 01:36:02.840 was so it was so shoddily argued that he made a fool of himself. 971 01:36:03.760 --> 01:36:09.000 I mean, one of the reasons that I do this kind of extremely meticulous 972 01:36:09.439 --> 01:36:13.800 There isn't anybody else that I know who does this kind of thing. Yeah, 973 01:36:14.000 --> 01:36:19.000 this very meticulous work is I don't want to have somebody standing up saying, 974 01:36:19.039 --> 01:36:27.119 oh, if only you've done whatever. Yeah you you wouldn't have been 975 01:36:27.159 --> 01:36:30.039 able to. That's how you found it. You read it up on some 976 01:36:30.319 --> 01:36:34.640 secret book. Yeah. Let me just stop you real quickly. This this 977 01:36:34.720 --> 01:36:38.319 is what I want to I want you to ask this answer this question. 978 01:36:39.000 --> 01:36:45.960 It's extremely expensive for a university to fund a dig in Egypt. It can 979 01:36:45.039 --> 01:36:47.520 be in the millions of dollars. We've had a number of people on this 980 01:36:47.600 --> 01:36:54.880 program, uh talking about that. We've had doctor Richard Hanson, who's in 981 01:36:55.720 --> 01:37:01.319 Guatemala excavating the Big Mind sight El Miodor. Wouldn't it make sense if they 982 01:37:01.359 --> 01:37:08.840 had somebody using your protocol to help them pimp point because they're looking for a 983 01:37:09.000 --> 01:37:14.600 king or a queen, that's their primary goal. Wouldn't it make sense to 984 01:37:14.640 --> 01:37:18.199 pull somebody with your protocol in to help them? You'd think, so, 985 01:37:19.640 --> 01:37:25.800 oh boy, But they don't. I don't know anybody else. I thought 986 01:37:25.840 --> 01:37:30.439 at one point that other archaeologists would pick this up, and I've published in 987 01:37:30.640 --> 01:37:34.840 meticulous detail exactly how I did it. You can get the papers. You 988 01:37:35.000 --> 01:37:41.079 go up to Academia dot du and download the papers, and you you know, 989 01:37:41.119 --> 01:37:45.239 it's all spelled out. I wrote a book called Opening to the Infinite, 990 01:37:45.279 --> 01:37:47.520 which tells you exactly how to do it. No, I don't know. 991 01:37:48.199 --> 01:37:53.640 I think it. I don't actually know why nobody has picked it up. 992 01:37:54.520 --> 01:38:00.880 Yeah, I think it's it's it's it's too much for typical academia. 993 01:38:00.920 --> 01:38:08.079 They're they're too linear. They're they're thinking, is uh, isn't creative enough. 994 01:38:08.720 --> 01:38:12.319 I'm just shocked because I, like I'm saying, saying, I have 995 01:38:12.680 --> 01:38:18.119 I have archaeologists, Egyptologists on this program who are funded and they come back 996 01:38:18.159 --> 01:38:23.960 with bags of sand with a few nibbles here and there, and that's it. 997 01:38:24.119 --> 01:38:26.760 Yeah, of course, you know, and and and these guys. 998 01:38:27.479 --> 01:38:35.239 This seems like something that would be very useful. Yes, I've been doing 999 01:38:35.279 --> 01:38:39.079 it, you know. I mean, you make a list of it. 1000 01:38:39.560 --> 01:38:43.399 We did the did Question experiment. We located the unknown wreck on the sea 1001 01:38:43.479 --> 01:38:47.399 floor. We did the Alexandria Project, which located all kinds of things we 1002 01:38:47.399 --> 01:38:55.600 haven't even gotten into yet. I did the Caravel project to locate Christopher Columbus's 1003 01:38:55.720 --> 01:39:03.640 thing. We did the project to find Queen Elizabeth's force that would stole him. 1004 01:39:04.600 --> 01:39:12.920 We solved several murders. Yeah, that couldn't be solved otherwise. I 1005 01:39:12.960 --> 01:39:16.439 mean I just did it over and over and over again, and I published 1006 01:39:16.439 --> 01:39:21.520 all these papers and spelled it out exactly how to do it. And yes, 1007 01:39:21.680 --> 01:39:27.279 I think it's really the problem is people find it very hard to conceive 1008 01:39:27.359 --> 01:39:30.640 that you actually could do this. I think that's the problem. I think 1009 01:39:30.680 --> 01:39:34.239 there's two things. And I want you to highlight a few more things about 1010 01:39:34.279 --> 01:39:41.039 Alexandria. Before we moved to Columbus. We're going to take a short commercial 1011 01:39:41.079 --> 01:39:46.560 break to allow our sponsors to identify themselves, and we will return shortly with 1012 01:39:46.600 --> 01:39:54.960 my guest today, Devin Schwartz, talking about remote viewing. We'll be right 1013 01:39:55.000 --> 01:40:32.079 back. My guest today is Stephan Schwartz. He is a research investigator, 1014 01:40:32.159 --> 01:40:42.920 a parapsychologist who has actively pursued psychics in the discovery of archaeological ruins, sites, 1015 01:40:42.960 --> 01:40:49.600 and individuals from the ancient past. You in your bio you you're considered 1016 01:40:49.800 --> 01:40:55.000 you consider yourself a futurist, and I think the issue is that you're you're 1017 01:40:55.119 --> 01:41:01.359 using technique, technology and protocols that are too far ahead for current minds. 1018 01:41:02.319 --> 01:41:08.960 That's number one. Yeah. The other thing is that I think it's a 1019 01:41:09.079 --> 01:41:15.920 challenge for teachers, professors of archaeology or anthropology to consider using your protocol, 1020 01:41:16.039 --> 01:41:23.199 even though it could save them millions of dollars, could eliminate time and effort 1021 01:41:24.119 --> 01:41:30.840 to find these questions. And I'm laughing because it's it's it's fascinating, and 1022 01:41:31.399 --> 01:41:39.840 you have shown time after time that you can get excellent results for probably a 1023 01:41:39.960 --> 01:41:45.560 hell of a lot less money than pointing a satellite at a certain location and 1024 01:41:45.640 --> 01:41:50.319 hoping you get results. So I want to move on real quickly, what 1025 01:41:50.399 --> 01:41:58.840 was the most significant I mean, other than finding Alexander's tomb, the Palace 1026 01:41:58.880 --> 01:42:03.079 of Cleopatra, remains of the lighthouse, and so on. Was there something 1027 01:42:03.760 --> 01:42:18.880 within that grouping that you thought was outstanding beyond the obvious archaeological Fine, that's 1028 01:42:18.880 --> 01:42:24.439 a big one, because you did dig up quite a bit well, you 1029 01:42:24.479 --> 01:42:29.680 know, in order to get permission to dive in the Eastern Harbor, which 1030 01:42:29.840 --> 01:42:34.840 at that time seventy nine, you know, Russia had been in control of 1031 01:42:35.640 --> 01:42:44.079 Egypt, and you weren't allowed to dive in the Eastern Harbor. So to 1032 01:42:44.159 --> 01:42:46.520 get I wanted to get I had to get permission. I mean you literally 1033 01:42:46.560 --> 01:42:50.840 just couldn't do it. You had to get permission, right, and the 1034 01:42:51.079 --> 01:42:59.239 archaeologists at the University of Alexandria were opposed to my doing that. So we 1035 01:42:59.359 --> 01:43:04.319 finally ended up in a in a meeting in the office of the Governor of 1036 01:43:04.399 --> 01:43:12.239 Alexandria at that time, the second most powerful man in the country, Mohammed 1037 01:43:12.359 --> 01:43:20.399 Hilm and I had harold Edgerton with me. We went to the meeting together 1038 01:43:24.479 --> 01:43:31.000 and they told me all the reasons they didn't want to do it, and 1039 01:43:31.439 --> 01:43:35.199 they then said the governor Hilmey who has got interested in it. He said, 1040 01:43:35.199 --> 01:43:42.000 well, okay, let's do a test, and you know, can 1041 01:43:42.039 --> 01:43:46.039 you design a test for him me? And they said, oh yes, 1042 01:43:46.159 --> 01:43:54.359 yes, we could do that. We are beginning an excavation about forty kilometers 1043 01:43:56.039 --> 01:44:04.960 further into the desert of a buried city called Maria that was once a kind 1044 01:44:04.960 --> 01:44:15.520 of pleasure city, and we if he could locate a particular building then then 1045 01:44:15.680 --> 01:44:19.319 okay, that would convince us. Well we don't think it's going to happen, 1046 01:44:21.079 --> 01:44:26.279 so he said. Governor Hillmey said to me, would you be willing 1047 01:44:26.319 --> 01:44:30.359 to do that? I said, oh, yeah, sure, and that 1048 01:44:30.600 --> 01:44:35.479 kind of surprised him. So that then we we've set it up and on 1049 01:44:35.520 --> 01:44:42.880 the appointed time and day, I had George McMullen and Hella Hammed who had 1050 01:44:42.920 --> 01:44:48.119 flown over into flown to Egypt and to do the on site because we start 1051 01:44:48.159 --> 01:44:51.760 with the maps and then we do the onset. Only in this case they 1052 01:44:51.760 --> 01:44:57.359 didn't have a map, so I couldn't do the map part. So I 1053 01:44:57.399 --> 01:45:01.439 only had Hella and George. And again you can see this in the movie. 1054 01:45:03.720 --> 01:45:10.880 So Filszi Facarani was the professor was assigned to this who was doing the 1055 01:45:10.960 --> 01:45:15.239 excavation. He knelt down in the sand and he said, look, I 1056 01:45:15.319 --> 01:45:20.159 want you to locate a buried building in the city of Maria, and I 1057 01:45:20.159 --> 01:45:30.399 want you to locate a building that's got mosaics, multiple room building with mosaics, 1058 01:45:30.439 --> 01:45:36.760 something important. And so George McMullen, who was down in the knelt 1059 01:45:36.800 --> 01:45:43.479 kneeling in the sand with him, said okay. So we started out there 1060 01:45:43.520 --> 01:45:46.800 was we were searching an area of about gosh, I don't remember, about 1061 01:45:46.800 --> 01:45:55.880 seventeen hundred square kilometers and it's in the desert right you can see in the 1062 01:45:55.920 --> 01:46:00.560 film. So we walk around for a couple hours. George is getting his 1063 01:46:00.640 --> 01:46:03.680 bearings, and then he says, okay, I know where I want to 1064 01:46:03.680 --> 01:46:09.640 go. And we go back and we say to Facarani, we know where 1065 01:46:09.680 --> 01:46:14.479 we want to go. And we get in our cars. He's got about, 1066 01:46:15.159 --> 01:46:19.079 oh, I don't know, maybe ten graduate students that are with him 1067 01:46:19.159 --> 01:46:25.399 in a couple of cars, and and I'm with Helen and George and Hell's 1068 01:46:25.439 --> 01:46:30.359 in one car, George in another, and and we drive out where George 1069 01:46:30.399 --> 01:46:33.399 tells us go turn left, turn right, and we get to this place. 1070 01:46:33.399 --> 01:46:36.600 He says, okay, stop the car and we get out of the 1071 01:46:36.760 --> 01:46:45.439 car and George gets out and he starts walking up the hill and were everybody 1072 01:46:45.479 --> 01:46:50.960 comes behind and we got the cameras are running and George says, I said, 1073 01:46:50.960 --> 01:46:53.640 you know, you know where are we George? And he said, 1074 01:46:53.640 --> 01:46:57.880 well, I'm walking over a wall. I said, you're walking over a 1075 01:46:57.880 --> 01:47:00.920 wall. He said, yeah, wall. It's about three four feet down. 1076 01:47:01.159 --> 01:47:10.159 There are going to be three rooms and it's a Christian building, which 1077 01:47:12.279 --> 01:47:18.840 very interesting, and it'll be just here, you know, just here, 1078 01:47:18.920 --> 01:47:25.920 and he lays it out and I said to him, okay, George, 1079 01:47:25.960 --> 01:47:30.000 thank you. And he goes away. And Hella, who's been sitting out 1080 01:47:30.039 --> 01:47:33.640 in the sun now for it's about one hundred and fourteen degrees. Oh, 1081 01:47:33.680 --> 01:47:36.840 Hella has been sitting out in the sun now for about three and a half 1082 01:47:36.920 --> 01:47:43.560 hours, and she's really getting sun strokes, she's getting sick. I bring 1083 01:47:43.600 --> 01:47:49.359 her in and I don't ask her to walk around because I'm worried she's really 1084 01:47:49.359 --> 01:47:55.479 going to get seriously ill. So I just take her to where George the 1085 01:47:55.640 --> 01:48:00.520 general area where George had described, and I said, Hella, why don't 1086 01:48:00.520 --> 01:48:03.560 you sit down? And so just find a place you want to sit down 1087 01:48:03.640 --> 01:48:12.119 and so she walks around the top of this hill and she finally walks to 1088 01:48:12.159 --> 01:48:16.880 this same place that Georgia had picked, sits down and she says, well, 1089 01:48:17.119 --> 01:48:26.399 okay, I'm sitting over a building. There are three rooms. In 1090 01:48:26.439 --> 01:48:31.560 the middle of the second room, there is a strange clay column, and 1091 01:48:31.680 --> 01:48:36.560 I associate heat with it. I don't know why. And it's a Christian 1092 01:48:36.600 --> 01:48:44.199 building. And I can hear the archaeologists who are sort of in it, 1093 01:48:44.680 --> 01:48:47.439 not you know, maybe twenty feet away. I can hear them snickering and 1094 01:48:47.560 --> 01:48:54.520 laughing as they listen to all this fakarani, you know, making jokes about 1095 01:48:54.560 --> 01:48:58.119 it. And she says, it's you know, it's here. There's three 1096 01:48:58.199 --> 01:49:04.199 rooms, there's this clay call Christian. Okay. Then she goes away and 1097 01:49:04.359 --> 01:49:10.079 actually goes back to the hotel because by then she's really getting quite sick. 1098 01:49:11.479 --> 01:49:17.199 I'm worried she's going to get sunstroke. And we bring George back and I 1099 01:49:17.319 --> 01:49:21.039 say to George, I don't he doesn't know anything about Hella. Didn't He 1100 01:49:21.119 --> 01:49:25.600 was not there, you know, he was off, he was driven away 1101 01:49:25.640 --> 01:49:29.560 while she was doing her part. I say, George, I want you 1102 01:49:29.680 --> 01:49:33.119 to go to the place that you've described and I have these wooden stakes, 1103 01:49:33.680 --> 01:49:39.159 which you put the stakes in the ground to lay out the building. Now 1104 01:49:39.199 --> 01:49:42.840 you think about that, the corners, He said, okay, I'll do 1105 01:49:42.880 --> 01:49:47.600 that. So he puts the stakes down exactly where he wants. He says, 1106 01:49:47.640 --> 01:49:53.359 the corners are to be found, and he describes this, Uh, 1107 01:49:53.840 --> 01:49:59.239 these little tiles red, black and white, about five six cinks of an 1108 01:49:59.239 --> 01:50:05.319 inch clay on white clay on one side and marble on the other. Yeah, 1109 01:50:05.600 --> 01:50:09.359 he says, but most of them were taken away, but there's still 1110 01:50:09.359 --> 01:50:13.159 a few of them there. And so it's all staked out. And he 1111 01:50:13.239 --> 01:50:23.279 goes away, and Facarani and his team come up and they're just and they 1112 01:50:23.319 --> 01:50:29.039 thought the whole thing was crap. It's just that simple. Why because and 1113 01:50:29.119 --> 01:50:34.119 I didn't know this until afterwards. The University of Guelf had sent a team 1114 01:50:34.159 --> 01:50:41.960 over to work with the Egyptians and they had done proton procession magnetometer survey, 1115 01:50:42.399 --> 01:50:47.960 ground penetrating radar and proton procession magnetometer. They had done a survey of the 1116 01:50:48.000 --> 01:50:54.800 same area that George had picked and there was nothing there. Oh, and 1117 01:50:54.880 --> 01:51:00.720 they had published a paper saying there's nothing there. So they showed me the 1118 01:51:00.720 --> 01:51:04.600 paper. Ha ha, there's nothing there. You know you're not gonna pass 1119 01:51:04.680 --> 01:51:10.800 the test. I said, well, let's dig down and see. So 1120 01:51:10.960 --> 01:51:15.560 we dig down at three feet and a few inches. The first walls up 1121 01:51:15.600 --> 01:51:19.960 here turns out their three rooms. Well, let me stop you, Stephan, 1122 01:51:20.039 --> 01:51:24.800 let me stop you. The ground penetrating radar would have picked something if 1123 01:51:24.800 --> 01:51:28.359 it's good for like ten feet. Yeah, I didn't do it. So 1124 01:51:28.399 --> 01:51:30.680 they missed it. They missed the walls, what you're seeing, they missed 1125 01:51:30.680 --> 01:51:35.680 the whole building. Wow, amazing. I mean, I can you know 1126 01:51:35.960 --> 01:51:42.800 if you look at the paper again, go to Academia dot EEDU look at 1127 01:51:42.800 --> 01:51:46.119 it. It's called the Maria paper, and you can. You can watch 1128 01:51:46.199 --> 01:51:49.319 that. You can see the whole thing. You can want it happen in 1129 01:51:49.359 --> 01:51:55.199 the movie. Anyway, we get down it's exactly. George is twenty eight 1130 01:51:55.239 --> 01:52:01.399 inches off out of fourteen hundred square miles. Wow. And we dig down 1131 01:52:01.479 --> 01:52:04.439 in their three rooms, and then we dig a little deeper and there's Ella's 1132 01:52:04.479 --> 01:52:11.560 column. It turns out it was a Bedouin oven that must have been used 1133 01:52:11.600 --> 01:52:17.279 by the Bedouins after the city had been abandoned, but before it was buried. 1134 01:52:19.119 --> 01:52:24.880 We dig down a little further and there are the little tiles that George 1135 01:52:24.880 --> 01:52:31.159 has described. We dig down a little further and we find the Christian concentration 1136 01:52:31.520 --> 01:52:39.279 consecration marks on the foundations of the building. Fakarani has told me, not 1137 01:52:39.399 --> 01:52:43.279 only is there nothing there, but if there were anything there, it would 1138 01:52:43.319 --> 01:52:48.840 be Roman, it wouldn't be Byzantine, it wouldn't wouldn't be Christian Byzantine. 1139 01:52:50.359 --> 01:52:59.680 It couldn't possibly be laid out the way you described. And there's nothing there 1140 01:52:59.680 --> 01:53:02.199 any way. I mean, they just thought the whole thing was I was 1141 01:53:02.279 --> 01:53:05.920 just going to be a huge embarrassment. I think in the in the movie, 1142 01:53:05.960 --> 01:53:11.359 there's even a piece or two of the tile that they find, yeah, 1143 01:53:11.600 --> 01:53:15.560 that they submit to an authority who verifies it. Yep, yep, 1144 01:53:15.840 --> 01:53:20.079 of course. Yeah. Which, well, everything, everything gets verified, 1145 01:53:20.720 --> 01:53:26.279 everything gets checked. Everything turns out to be exactly the way the remote viewers 1146 01:53:26.319 --> 01:53:31.800 describe it. So we go back to Governor Helmy's office and with the archaeologists, 1147 01:53:32.199 --> 01:53:36.159 and Governor Helmy says to him what happened, and they say, well, 1148 01:53:36.239 --> 01:53:45.239 i'm I'm I'm him him haha. They were correct, And and then 1149 01:53:45.279 --> 01:53:48.239 Governor Helmy says, well, then we're going to get him permission to dive 1150 01:53:48.279 --> 01:53:53.720 in the Eastern Harbor. So that was your test that you passed with flying 1151 01:53:53.760 --> 01:53:59.439 colors, Yes, and that granted you access to the harbor. Yes, 1152 01:53:59.760 --> 01:54:02.920 that kind of a big deal, boy. Yeah. So we dive and 1153 01:54:03.079 --> 01:54:09.760 we find the lighthouse, we find Cleopatra, and it's all authenticated by the 1154 01:54:09.880 --> 01:54:15.439 archaeologists, and we find the ancient sea wall, which from the jo at 1155 01:54:15.560 --> 01:54:17.640 this point of view, is the really big deal because it means that their 1156 01:54:17.760 --> 01:54:25.640 whole understanding of how the city was laid out in the Ptolemaic period was wrong. 1157 01:54:28.199 --> 01:54:32.800 It was all because they thought they didn't realize how much of the city 1158 01:54:32.840 --> 01:54:40.920 had sunk under the sea. Wow. Anyway, so that's Alexandria. Then 1159 01:54:41.000 --> 01:54:46.039 the other thing is they located the tomb of Alexander. And we start digging, 1160 01:54:47.399 --> 01:54:54.640 and this is nineteen seventy nine, and just at that time, the 1161 01:54:54.960 --> 01:55:00.319 students in Iran in Tehran take over the America An embassy, if you remember 1162 01:55:00.359 --> 01:55:09.239 that, and freak everybody out right, and the head of Antiquities comes down 1163 01:55:09.279 --> 01:55:13.760 from Cairo and says to me, you're going to have to stop digging under 1164 01:55:13.800 --> 01:55:20.760 this mosque. This mosque is a Shiite mosque and we're concerned that it may 1165 01:55:20.920 --> 01:55:27.079 stimulate people to do something that we just don't want to have happen. We're 1166 01:55:27.119 --> 01:55:34.119 watching what's going on in Iraq and are in Iran, and we don't want 1167 01:55:34.119 --> 01:55:39.279 that here. It will cause a lot of geopolitical issues. So you're gonna 1168 01:55:39.319 --> 01:55:44.800 have to quit. So Okay, everything has proven so far to be correct, 1169 01:55:45.159 --> 01:55:51.079 but we can't continue. So I'm very depressed about that cast down and 1170 01:55:51.920 --> 01:55:57.159 we're driving away. George is in the car with me, and he says, 1171 01:55:57.439 --> 01:56:01.279 oh, well, don't worry. The bones aren't there anyway. And 1172 01:56:01.399 --> 01:56:06.119 I said, what he said, The bones aren't there anyway. So what 1173 01:56:06.119 --> 01:56:10.319 do you mean there aren't there? He said, well, when the Muslims 1174 01:56:10.319 --> 01:56:18.319 took over Alexandria. That'd be six forty one C. When the Muslims took 1175 01:56:18.359 --> 01:56:26.279 over Caliph Omar took over Alexandria. A group of monks came down from the 1176 01:56:26.319 --> 01:56:30.439 monastery. There's a monastery that's up towards Cairo, that's out in the desert, 1177 01:56:30.600 --> 01:56:36.640 and they masqueraded as merchants and they brought down some donkeys and some leather 1178 01:56:36.760 --> 01:56:44.920 bags, and they went into what was at that time was a church. 1179 01:56:45.359 --> 01:56:49.680 But before that had been the soma, the tomb of Alexander, and they 1180 01:56:49.760 --> 01:56:55.680 gathered up all the bones in the ossiuary and took them away and brought them 1181 01:56:55.760 --> 01:57:00.439 up to the monastery, and that's where the bones are. And I said, 1182 01:57:00.479 --> 01:57:06.000 well, gosh, George, that's fascinating, but this is before DNA. 1183 01:57:06.279 --> 01:57:10.520 That's fascinating. But I mean, you know, a bunch of bones, 1184 01:57:10.560 --> 01:57:14.039 how would I tell which were Alexander's? He said, oh, it'll 1185 01:57:14.079 --> 01:57:17.560 be simple. I said, really, how will it be simple? He 1186 01:57:17.640 --> 01:57:26.439 said, well, when Mark Anthony was with Cleopatra and Alexandria, in order 1187 01:57:26.479 --> 01:57:31.319 to establish a connection with Alexander, to give him status, he went into 1188 01:57:31.399 --> 01:57:39.960 the tomb of Alexander, which had a crystal coffin. Ptolemy Philadelphia said, 1189 01:57:40.039 --> 01:57:47.119 put it Alexander's mummified body in the crystal coffin. He had him opened it 1190 01:57:47.199 --> 01:57:51.600 up, and he took off his red Russia as read Roman war cape, 1191 01:57:53.479 --> 01:57:58.399 and he had him put the war cape around the body of Alexander and put 1192 01:57:58.399 --> 01:58:04.319 it back in the tomb, so that he was associated with Alexander. And 1193 01:58:04.720 --> 01:58:13.800 after the Christians took over, they didn't really care about the tomb, and 1194 01:58:13.840 --> 01:58:18.199 they had built a church. They weren't really maintaining it, and water seeped 1195 01:58:18.239 --> 01:58:26.000 into the coffin and it leached the red dye from Mark Anthony's war Cape into 1196 01:58:26.079 --> 01:58:30.960 the bones of Alexander. So you just look for the red bones. Oh 1197 01:58:30.159 --> 01:58:34.520 boy, I thought, and I said, oh, well, that's very 1198 01:58:34.600 --> 01:58:43.840 interesting, George. Okay. So about two weeks later, a week later, 1199 01:58:43.880 --> 01:58:50.720 I get a call from NBC and they say there's a monastery up near 1200 01:58:50.800 --> 01:58:57.239 Cairo, out in the desert and they think they have found the bones of 1201 01:58:57.359 --> 01:59:03.920 John the Baptist, and you have the only archaeologically trained film crew in the 1202 01:59:03.920 --> 01:59:10.039 country. Would you go up and film for us this place where they found 1203 01:59:10.279 --> 01:59:15.720 found these bones. I said sure. So we made a deal. And 1204 01:59:16.680 --> 01:59:18.880 I says, as long you know, we're doing what we're doing, but 1205 01:59:19.000 --> 01:59:24.880 on a weekend we could go up and do that. And so we made 1206 01:59:24.880 --> 01:59:29.760 a deal and I went up to what turned out to be the Monastery of 1207 01:59:29.800 --> 01:59:34.359 San Macarius at Watti Natroon, which is basically an oasis out in the middle 1208 01:59:34.399 --> 01:59:42.520 of the desert, and there's this huge structure it looks like a looks like 1209 01:59:42.560 --> 01:59:47.520 a fort of some kind, only has one door. And I go up 1210 01:59:47.560 --> 01:59:51.600 and have no phone. I go up and knock on the door, and 1211 01:59:51.840 --> 02:00:00.720 this uh monk opens the door and I tell him why I'm here and about 1212 02:00:00.720 --> 02:00:03.159 the John the Baptist, and he said, well, come in, and 1213 02:00:04.319 --> 02:00:08.000 I said, we don't tell me what's going on. I don't quite get 1214 02:00:08.039 --> 02:00:11.319 it. And he said, well, we have a chapel that we associate 1215 02:00:11.399 --> 02:00:15.720 with John the Baptist, and we don't know why, but we have always 1216 02:00:15.760 --> 02:00:21.199 associated with John the Baptist. And we had a crack in the wall of 1217 02:00:21.279 --> 02:00:26.760 the chapel, and when we were repairing the crack, we discovered this tomb. 1218 02:00:28.920 --> 02:00:30.359 I said, really, and he said yeah, And I said what 1219 02:00:30.479 --> 02:00:33.680 was in the tomb? He said, the bones are about fourteen people. 1220 02:00:35.720 --> 02:00:41.840 Really, I said, I still haven't made the connection. I said, 1221 02:00:41.920 --> 02:00:45.079 that's very interesting. Do you know where the bones came from? He said, 1222 02:00:45.119 --> 02:00:46.359 oh, yes, we know exactly where they came from. And we 1223 02:00:46.399 --> 02:00:50.880 go into the library and he opens up this ancient book and he says, 1224 02:00:50.880 --> 02:00:59.079 you see what happened was when the Muslims took over Alexandria, a group of 1225 02:00:59.119 --> 02:01:05.279 the brothers, the Christian monks, took their donkeys and some leather bags and 1226 02:01:05.359 --> 02:01:11.239 they went down to Alexandria and they went to what is now the Mosque of 1227 02:01:11.319 --> 02:01:15.439 Neby Daniel, and they went to the Ossiuary and they gathered up the bones, 1228 02:01:16.039 --> 02:01:18.520 put them in the rubber and the leather bags, and brought them back 1229 02:01:18.600 --> 02:01:25.920 up here and buried them somewhere. We didn't know where. And now we 1230 02:01:26.079 --> 02:01:29.880 understand that this is what we discovered. And I said, oh, I'll 1231 02:01:30.039 --> 02:01:36.319 zee by. Now I'm really on target. I said, do you is 1232 02:01:36.319 --> 02:01:41.880 there anything about any of the bones that is unusual? And he said, 1233 02:01:42.119 --> 02:01:47.600 m no, not really. Well, a few of them are stained red, 1234 02:01:49.680 --> 02:01:54.079 and I said, oh, really, could I see them? And 1235 02:01:54.119 --> 02:01:58.399 he goes he said, oh yes. Then we go in and he there's 1236 02:01:58.399 --> 02:02:01.960 a big chest which looks I think is the altar of this chapel. And 1237 02:02:02.039 --> 02:02:05.960 he turns out it's a chest and he takes everything off and he opens it 1238 02:02:06.079 --> 02:02:14.439 up and they're in the chest is this bag, big red bag And he 1239 02:02:14.520 --> 02:02:16.880 says, here their bones are here, and he opens it up and I 1240 02:02:16.920 --> 02:02:24.239 can see and and but he won't let the film people fulfillm it because they 1241 02:02:24.359 --> 02:02:27.520 believe that these are the some of the at least they know that's more than 1242 02:02:27.560 --> 02:02:30.920 one person, but that some of them are the bones of John the Baptist, 1243 02:02:30.239 --> 02:02:34.279 and so they're holy relics and they don't want them photographed, so they 1244 02:02:34.319 --> 02:02:41.279 only let me photograph the bag in the chest. Oh boy, but but 1245 02:02:41.520 --> 02:02:45.119 okay, So but they got these red bones, and I said thank you 1246 02:02:45.199 --> 02:02:53.000 very much. And so years go by and DNA begins to develop and is 1247 02:02:53.119 --> 02:02:59.600 used in archaeology, and and I contacted the monks and said, would you 1248 02:02:59.680 --> 02:03:06.600 let me come back to Egypt and get a little fragment from the bones because 1249 02:03:06.720 --> 02:03:15.039 Alexander's father, Philip of Macedonia, his tomb had been found in that during 1250 02:03:15.039 --> 02:03:18.399 that period, and they've done a DNA analysis. So if I can get 1251 02:03:18.439 --> 02:03:25.000 a little fragment of those red stained bones, we can do a DNA of 1252 02:03:25.079 --> 02:03:30.039 it and see if it if it's linked to Phillips, because then we can 1253 02:03:30.079 --> 02:03:36.039 prove that those are the bones of Alexander. And they and the abbot of 1254 02:03:36.079 --> 02:03:41.239 the monastery, who was the monk that opened the door for me, originally 1255 02:03:42.439 --> 02:03:45.239 says no, I'm not going to let you do that. I don't want 1256 02:03:45.279 --> 02:03:49.000 to do that. But the younger monks come to me and say, after 1257 02:03:49.079 --> 02:03:53.359 the abbot's gone, we got a new abbot, we'll let you do it. 1258 02:03:53.479 --> 02:04:00.760 So in the Monastery of San Makarios in watt Watting, I believe are 1259 02:04:00.800 --> 02:04:05.199 the bones of Alexander the Great and they are just waiting for someone to do 1260 02:04:05.239 --> 02:04:12.920 a DNA analysis. Fantastic. That is a fantastic and a way to conclude 1261 02:04:12.920 --> 02:04:16.520 our time together, Stephan. I want to thank you, UH for forgiving 1262 02:04:16.640 --> 02:04:24.119 us such great insight into this UH story, into into your personal journey into 1263 02:04:24.199 --> 02:04:30.680 what we can only consider psychic archaeology. For those of those who are listening 1264 02:04:30.800 --> 02:04:35.600 who want more information, I want to mention that Stephen has a wonderful newsletter 1265 02:04:35.720 --> 02:04:44.159 he publishes every day. It is the Schwartz Report dot com I believe dot 1266 02:04:44.239 --> 02:04:51.159 net dot net you can see god year's worth of writing and published information. 1267 02:04:51.359 --> 02:04:58.239 Give us the other contact points for you, Stevens, so people can learn 1268 02:04:58.279 --> 02:05:04.159 more. Go to my personal website www. Stephen A. Schwartz dot com, 1269 02:05:04.439 --> 02:05:11.680 ste p h A n A s h W A r t z dot 1270 02:05:11.680 --> 02:05:15.720 com. You can see the movies of all the things I've just described. 1271 02:05:15.680 --> 02:05:20.920 UH. You can go to academia dot edu or go through my web by 1272 02:05:21.000 --> 02:05:25.439 personal website. You can get all my papers. You should also make you 1273 02:05:25.680 --> 02:05:32.520 will go to YouTube and just type in Stephen Schwartz and volumes of video and 1274 02:05:32.720 --> 02:05:39.039 movies material that you've published. So so you've got lots of You can get 1275 02:05:39.079 --> 02:05:42.800 all the books. You go to Amazon, or go to my website, 1276 02:05:42.800 --> 02:05:45.119 my personal website. Again, you can get all my books, you can 1277 02:05:45.159 --> 02:05:50.720 get all my papers. I make everything openly available. I do not. 1278 02:05:50.880 --> 02:05:56.840 There are no secrets, there are no classified material. I would not do 1279 02:05:57.000 --> 02:06:02.119 classified research. I turned down a million six a year because I would not 1280 02:06:02.159 --> 02:06:08.039 do classified research. I think anything we know about consciousness ought to be made 1281 02:06:08.039 --> 02:06:13.960 immediately available to everybody who's interested. So all of my stuff for all of 1282 02:06:14.000 --> 02:06:18.359 these years, the papers, the books, the films, the interviews, 1283 02:06:18.960 --> 02:06:24.680 it's all freely available, and which is wonderful. Now. One of the 1284 02:06:24.720 --> 02:06:27.279 things I want to mention, and for those of you listening, this is 1285 02:06:27.319 --> 02:06:35.079 something very important. Stephen has been working on future psychic review remote viewing and 1286 02:06:35.319 --> 02:06:45.319 has created two research movements or protocols. He calls them the twenty fifty and 1287 02:06:45.399 --> 02:06:50.720 the twenty sixty Research Investigation. We're going to have Stephen back to talk about 1288 02:06:50.760 --> 02:07:00.359 those because they present some very interesting aspects of Homo sapiens on Earth, and 1289 02:07:00.119 --> 02:07:05.399 as I'm happy to report, we don't kill ourselves, but we are radically 1290 02:07:05.439 --> 02:07:13.039 different in twenty fifty and twenty sixty, and Steve has done some great work, 1291 02:07:13.119 --> 02:07:18.359 so we're gonna have to have him back to discuss both those research projects. 1292 02:07:18.359 --> 02:07:24.920 So Stephen, thank you very very much for your time. We'll have 1293 02:07:25.039 --> 02:07:33.960 you back again. That was much longer than I had anticipated, but there's 1294 02:07:34.000 --> 02:07:39.600 a lot of great data in that interview. And I want to remind you 1295 02:07:39.680 --> 02:07:44.239 that I'm going to have Stephen back on the program because he's done extensive work 1296 02:07:44.960 --> 02:07:48.439 on remote viewing the future, and he's got two projects. One is called 1297 02:07:49.000 --> 02:07:54.159 twenty fifty and then he's got a new one he started to think, he 1298 02:07:54.239 --> 02:08:01.359 said about five six years ago, called twenty sixty Future Look, and he's 1299 02:08:01.399 --> 02:08:09.520 already come across with some pretty astounding material, including a new hominin, a 1300 02:08:09.600 --> 02:08:18.479 genetically created human using technology called gene splicing. And we've had people on Destiny 1301 02:08:18.560 --> 02:08:24.039 talking about a technology called Crisper, and Crisper has been out now for a 1302 02:08:24.079 --> 02:08:30.479 few years, but they are able to modify people with certain disease processes, 1303 02:08:31.039 --> 02:08:37.560 certain conditions, and it has what looks like the capability to make a very 1304 02:08:37.680 --> 02:08:45.560 very impressive homo sapien sapien or a whole different type of hominin, a whole 1305 02:08:45.600 --> 02:08:52.880 different type of human being, a genius, physically resistant to various diseases, 1306 02:08:54.600 --> 02:09:01.359 very attractive, you know, a whole breed of superhumans. So that's kind 1307 02:09:01.359 --> 02:09:07.960 of fantastic. But I've spoken to him enough to know that we got to 1308 02:09:07.960 --> 02:09:11.000 get him back to talk about that. So he's probably going to be back 1309 02:09:11.000 --> 02:09:16.239 at the end of the year to talk about remote viewing or psychic viewing of 1310 02:09:16.279 --> 02:09:24.760 the future using his very stringent protocol. So I was very impressive with what 1311 02:09:24.800 --> 02:09:30.920 he had to say about archaeology, and I could speak on in about the 1312 02:09:31.000 --> 02:09:41.439 possibilities of finding important data on partially unveiled data. In other words, I'm 1313 02:09:41.479 --> 02:09:46.359 fascinated by the Mayan pyramids, and they're not just standing stone effigies to the 1314 02:09:46.439 --> 02:09:50.359 guys, they're actually functioning. I'd like to know more about that, and 1315 02:09:50.439 --> 02:09:54.000 I think remote viewing would be a one way to look at it. The 1316 02:09:54.039 --> 02:09:58.279 other way, of course, is if you remember, we had the man 1317 02:09:58.359 --> 02:10:05.039 who says to day was talking about the two Italian scientists who used a new 1318 02:10:05.079 --> 02:10:16.159 type of scanning tech in a satellite is an acoustic wave technology and scan the 1319 02:10:16.520 --> 02:10:26.760 chips Pyramid Giza in Egypt and found new rooms and passages and corridors and shafts 1320 02:10:26.760 --> 02:10:31.960 that go deep, deep, deep under the pyramid, perhaps one hundred feet 1321 02:10:31.000 --> 02:10:37.840 or more, connecting with most likely other shafts, canals, whatever you want 1322 02:10:37.840 --> 02:10:41.720 to call them. And I'd love to have that happen, or I'd love 1323 02:10:41.720 --> 02:10:48.119 to have a scan of a number of the Maya pyramids that are noted to 1324 02:10:48.199 --> 02:10:54.920 be very old. But I've just finished, you know, writing articles in 1325 02:10:54.359 --> 02:11:03.359 a chapter in my book on this Quitzo quad or the serpent plump feathered Serpent 1326 02:11:03.439 --> 02:11:11.520 pyramid at Tiotikon, and I think it's a machine. And I've talked about 1327 02:11:11.560 --> 02:11:15.800 this a great deal and people go, well, no, what do you 1328 02:11:15.800 --> 02:11:18.439 believe that? Well, I'm not an engineer, but I sure wished the 1329 02:11:18.479 --> 02:11:24.319 hell that Gonzalez, the guy who excavated that tunnel and was a very gracious 1330 02:11:24.319 --> 02:11:28.920 host, had brought more technology to bear to find out what's going on there, 1331 02:11:28.960 --> 02:11:35.479 because I don't believe the Tiuanakins had anything to do with the building of 1332 02:11:35.479 --> 02:11:39.079 that pyramid. They came along, probably thousands and thousands of years after the 1333 02:11:39.119 --> 02:11:46.680 thing was around, and resettled it. And this is the real problem with 1334 02:11:46.039 --> 02:11:54.560 naming a civilization or a culture as the initial founders of a site. And 1335 02:11:54.680 --> 02:12:01.319 Tiunako Tiuanakin is a great example of that, simply because it was around before 1336 02:12:01.600 --> 02:12:05.119 this other culture came. Same thing can be said with the Aztecs, same 1337 02:12:05.159 --> 02:12:09.119 thing we can be said with the dynastic Egyptians. We see it in these 1338 02:12:09.159 --> 02:12:11.760 temples. You come over with us and take a look at some of these 1339 02:12:11.800 --> 02:12:18.880 temples. They are true megalithic temples. Their floors are massive blocks of sandstone, 1340 02:12:20.079 --> 02:12:28.920 megalithic walls, ceilings, roofs, columns just out of sight. And 1341 02:12:30.239 --> 02:12:35.600 you know, these egotistical pharaohs put their cartouche on these places and said they're 1342 02:12:35.880 --> 02:12:41.319 mine. I built them, I am laying claim to them, and they 1343 02:12:41.319 --> 02:12:46.159 have no right to do that. In fact, I would love to see 1344 02:12:46.239 --> 02:12:50.720 and Egyptologists begin to really look at some of these temples closer and perhaps do 1345 02:12:50.800 --> 02:12:56.000 a little more digging. Kind of a problem in Egyptology when they don't want 1346 02:12:56.000 --> 02:13:03.439 to use new technology, and we hear people from the Antiquities Department, most 1347 02:13:03.439 --> 02:13:09.720 notably Zahi Hawass, saying that they don't want to use outside resources. They 1348 02:13:09.760 --> 02:13:16.359 want to stay local, stay Egyptian, and just used their people well, 1349 02:13:16.479 --> 02:13:22.119 basically closing the door on anything that's going to happen fairly reason so. Anyhow, 1350 02:13:22.159 --> 02:13:30.199 wonderful they have Stephen Schwartz. I hope you enjoyed that. And again 1351 02:13:30.239 --> 02:13:35.039 we're gonna have him follow up for to look at the future. His research 1352 02:13:35.119 --> 02:13:41.159 is amazing. Please get his free newsletter. It's the Schwartz Report dot org. 1353 02:13:41.840 --> 02:13:50.319 Every single day he posted something and replies to his thousands of Subscribers's free. 1354 02:13:50.159 --> 02:13:54.640 It's completely free. He does ask for a donation after a while, 1355 02:13:54.720 --> 02:13:58.279 but some of the research is just fascinating, and some of the things he's 1356 02:14:00.079 --> 02:14:05.880 pointed his team to look at and reveal are pretty fascinating as well. So 1357 02:14:07.000 --> 02:14:13.000 check that out. Hey, we have a few spots left in our Maya 1358 02:14:13.199 --> 02:14:20.520 tour November tenth through the seventeenth. Remember we're gonna start at Leventa. We 1359 02:14:20.640 --> 02:14:26.720 fly into Mexico. The city is called Villa Hamosa and that's just a few 1360 02:14:26.760 --> 02:14:31.239 miles from Leventa, which is kind of the heart of the Olmec. We're 1361 02:14:31.239 --> 02:14:35.800 gonna see world class Olmec museums. We're gonna see levent in the city. 1362 02:14:35.079 --> 02:14:41.039 We're gonna get a sense of what the Olmes we're all about, and the 1363 02:14:41.079 --> 02:14:46.359 next day we jump on a bus and we head to the crown Jewel of 1364 02:14:46.520 --> 02:14:52.279 Mayan aristocrats, and that is Plank And I've been wanting to go to Polanky 1365 02:14:52.359 --> 02:14:56.600 for as long as I can remember. That's We're gonna be there for two 1366 02:14:56.640 --> 02:15:03.920 days. Our host is doctor Edwin Barnhardt. He will be showing us the 1367 02:15:03.000 --> 02:15:07.880 first day just the general layout, which takes a good day, and then 1368 02:15:07.920 --> 02:15:13.800 the second day he is going to take us to the offbeat pyramids, temples 1369 02:15:13.840 --> 02:15:18.399 and other buildings that are not visible to the general public, and he is 1370 02:15:18.439 --> 02:15:22.159 going to show us some of the most fascinating sites that you could imagine. 1371 02:15:22.399 --> 02:15:26.520 The reason that he knows all this is that as a young graduate student, 1372 02:15:26.640 --> 02:15:35.760 he surveyed the complete city civic area and also excavated quite a bit of it, 1373 02:15:35.920 --> 02:15:39.880 and he knows what's going on there. So you can't get better guide 1374 02:15:39.920 --> 02:15:46.479 than somebody who surveyed for the Mexican government for Ena, the archaeological component of 1375 02:15:46.600 --> 02:15:52.039 Mexico's government. He did that for them, and he knows what's going on, 1376 02:15:52.079 --> 02:15:54.920 So that's going to be a blast. The following day or two will 1377 02:15:54.960 --> 02:16:01.319 go to bottom Pack and some other Mayan cities he has selected just for our 1378 02:16:01.359 --> 02:16:05.359 group. Now, this is a one week tour, so he's going to 1379 02:16:05.439 --> 02:16:11.840 pack a ton of material into that, add a few lectures and it will 1380 02:16:11.880 --> 02:16:16.520 go really quickly. For more information in the full itinerary, go to Earth 1381 02:16:16.560 --> 02:16:22.439 Ancients dot com, forward slash tours t O U R S. Check it 1382 02:16:22.479 --> 02:16:26.760 out. I think we got two or three spots left. I think the 1383 02:16:26.800 --> 02:16:28.720 max we were gonna take was twenty five. I think we're a couple of 1384 02:16:28.720 --> 02:16:33.479 people fell or dropped out. So don't wait if you want to join us 1385 02:16:35.040 --> 02:16:39.600 November tenth through the seventeenth, check that out. Now. We have made 1386 02:16:39.760 --> 02:16:45.840 two announcements since that. Our Grand Egyptian Tour five is happening. That's April 1387 02:16:45.879 --> 02:16:50.440 twenty eighth, May nine, twenty twenty four. That's filling up quickly. 1388 02:16:50.840 --> 02:16:54.440 We just posted our new itinerary. Check out the ninerary for this tour. 1389 02:16:56.000 --> 02:16:58.479 If you've been wanting to go to Egypt, if you've been listening to Earth 1390 02:16:58.520 --> 02:17:01.879 Ancients for years and go, hey, I couldn't do it. I can't 1391 02:17:01.879 --> 02:17:05.520 do it. I just do it. I just can't. Now's your chance. 1392 02:17:05.040 --> 02:17:09.280 Now is your chance. And I gotta tell you people are charging ten 1393 02:17:09.440 --> 02:17:15.040 fifteen grand for this, We charge barely five thousand. It covers everything, 1394 02:17:16.120 --> 02:17:18.799 all your food, all your beverages, all your air flights, all your 1395 02:17:22.079 --> 02:17:28.680 bust tour, private tours the temples. We have more private visits than any 1396 02:17:28.719 --> 02:17:33.719 other tour I've ever seen. That means we get to see the Red, 1397 02:17:33.879 --> 02:17:39.000 the Bent, the Grand Pyramids, all by ourselves without the general public. 1398 02:17:39.280 --> 02:17:46.040 Check out the itinerary Earth Ancients dot com forward slash tours that just got launched 1399 02:17:46.040 --> 02:17:48.559 a few weeks ago. But you don't want to stick around. You don't 1400 02:17:48.559 --> 02:17:54.920 want to wait on that because it's filling quickly. People have been delayed because 1401 02:17:54.959 --> 02:17:58.479 of the pandemic and now are jumping on board, and I'll tell you it's 1402 02:17:58.479 --> 02:18:01.559 filling up fast. The last thing I want to mention is that we're doing 1403 02:18:01.600 --> 02:18:07.079 Turkey in likely August twenty twenty four. I don't have the itinerary, we're 1404 02:18:07.120 --> 02:18:13.159 still playing with it, but I mentioned this and Muhammad mentioned it on our 1405 02:18:13.239 --> 02:18:18.120 last Egypt tour. We're already full, we got like thirty people, but 1406 02:18:18.159 --> 02:18:20.959 we're gonna expand it. We're gonna expand it, So if you want to 1407 02:18:22.079 --> 02:18:28.799 join us for the first Turkey tour, Earth Ancient Turkey tour. Our host 1408 02:18:28.959 --> 02:18:33.120 is Muhammad Imbrium, plus a couple of other academics will give us private visits 1409 02:18:33.200 --> 02:18:41.760 of the Gobeckley Teppi, Carahan Teppi, this news site, the Darren Kuru, 1410 02:18:41.840 --> 02:18:46.799 the Underground City, and many many other amazing sites that you will never 1411 02:18:46.840 --> 02:18:54.760 see on your own. Send me an email to Earth Ancients for you at 1412 02:18:54.840 --> 02:18:58.639 gmail dot com. I'll get you on the list. I'm hoping to make 1413 02:18:58.799 --> 02:19:03.680 an official announcement soon. We're still fine tuning the itinerary because there's a lot 1414 02:19:03.719 --> 02:19:07.000 of really cool things that I wanted to see, and I think I stretched 1415 02:19:07.040 --> 02:19:13.440 the time limit a little bit. Twelve days goes by really really fast when 1416 02:19:13.479 --> 02:19:18.280 you are seeing these amazing, world class sites. So if you want to 1417 02:19:18.360 --> 02:19:20.479 join us, like I said, we're probably going to extend it to forty 1418 02:19:22.319 --> 02:19:30.120 people, maybe more, send me an email Earth Ancients for you at gmail 1419 02:19:30.440 --> 02:19:35.639 dot com and get that on that list. So it's gonna be fun. 1420 02:19:37.040 --> 02:19:41.879 That's gonna be a fun tour. Oh my god, so much going on. 1421 02:19:43.399 --> 02:19:46.920 Hey. As a final note, if you're enjoying Earth Ancients, please 1422 02:19:46.959 --> 02:19:52.559 consider becoming a subscriber for as little as five bucks. What loose change in 1423 02:19:52.559 --> 02:19:56.200 your pocket five bucks a month, you can support the work we do here 1424 02:19:56.319 --> 02:20:03.239 on the program to become a subscriber to Patreon that's PA t R e O 1425 02:20:03.440 --> 02:20:09.280 N dot com, Forward Slash Earth Ancients and subscribe for as little as five, 1426 02:20:09.479 --> 02:20:13.000 ten, fifteen, even twenty bucks a month. If you can afford 1427 02:20:13.000 --> 02:20:15.920 it, you keep the lights on it. And I gotta tell you we 1428 02:20:16.000 --> 02:20:20.479 have a team that requires payment. Yes, you pay people for the work 1429 02:20:20.520 --> 02:20:22.840 they do, and I got a good one. I got a good team 1430 02:20:24.239 --> 02:20:28.159 again. For more information, go to patreon dot com, Forward Slash Earth 1431 02:20:28.239 --> 02:20:35.799 Ancients. And by the way, I place an ebook on the list every 1432 02:20:35.040 --> 02:20:39.399 almost thirty days. We've got a great library for you. It's our gift 1433 02:20:39.559 --> 02:20:43.799 for being a subscriber. Oh my god, all kinds of great books by 1434 02:20:43.879 --> 02:20:48.280 many of the people here on Earth agents some of them are from Destiny. 1435 02:20:48.319 --> 02:20:54.120 And that's our thank you for being a subscriber. So I want to thank 1436 02:20:54.159 --> 02:20:58.319 the following people for subscribing in the month of August. I want to thank 1437 02:21:00.079 --> 02:21:11.520 Christy, John Montgomery, Music, Anthony North, Jason Yashida, Evan Kirkwood, 1438 02:21:11.319 --> 02:21:18.239 Tina Smith and Sammy. You guys, rock, I really appreciate your 1439 02:21:18.239 --> 02:21:24.520 help and your your subscriptions, Patreon, dot com, Forward slash Earth Agents. 1440 02:21:26.200 --> 02:21:28.000 All right, that's it for this program. I want to thank my 1441 02:21:28.040 --> 02:21:35.360 guest today, Stephen Schwartz remember Schwartz Report dot org. As always, the 1442 02:21:35.520 --> 02:21:39.479 team of Ruth Thomas, Mark Foster, and Chris Hazel. You guys rock 1443 02:21:41.159 --> 02:21:43.399 all right, take care of we will and we will talk to you next time.