Hey, thanks for being a part of the conversation. We recently spoke with
Daniel jose Older. The first part of our talk is a little distorted,
and hang with me because it'll clear up. But it is such an important
conversation for creative minds as well as his book. So thank you for being
so forgiving right in the very beginning. It was something that we couldn't miss
and we couldn't edit out. And I think you'll understand why. Hello,
and good morning. How are you doing today? Good morning, I'm doing
great. How are you just sitting here listening to that voice of your See
now, I wanted to know what your voice sounded like because you speak so
highly of music and I can hear it in your tones. For you to
be that writer that knows how to connect readers to the storyline, what is
that like and what what did it require in your journey to get to this
moment? Thank you so much. First of all, journey, I was
a paramedic for ten years in New York City on the ambulance, and then
at some time I'm really focused on online as where I wanted to throw all
of my artistic concentration. That was that was it for me. So I
really went into that, uh, to surrounding myself with stories, you know,
whether those books, movies, video games, shows people on the corner,
and you know, there's the longest full of stories. And I really
wanted to take them apart and put them back together to see what makes them
tick. And that was one of my process when I sat down to write
my first book. So when when you say that you to put things together
and stuff, because I mean this right here, this is this is the
final walk with this saga. Will will you step back into it and find
newer layers so you can continue that journey with with those that you've already captured
as the listeners and readers. You know, I think I might. I
don't know the answer yet. I know this particular story in this moment was
really a two book story, right and and this is so this is the
Outwall Sience series. It's about sixteen year old plan Partigy Matello motifs just attack
under his newfound healing powers on this ancient eagle ris in this community and it
comes from the shadowy history of their magical lost island and he sees the girl
that he has a crush on murder something right in front of his face.
That story, like that little seed of a story. I knew that was
a two book situation. So we're finishing that story with last canto, The
Dead Tomorrow. M But it's a huge world, and as you can hear
from the concept, there's a ton of history there and I could absolutely see
going all the way back in time and figuring out how it all came together.
Let's see. That's the reason. That's the reason why I asked that
question, because I mean, it seems like you're just barely scratching the surface.
Yeah, it's an in depth story. It's an in depth, you
know, journey for all of your readers. But it's it's like, oh
no, no, no, Daniel, this cannot be the last one,
and as a reader, I'm going to refuse to accept it as a last
one. Well, I appreciate that. That's the best kind of a reader.
So when when you do step into the world of folklore, I mean,
that's that's continuity that you You've got to be a well disciplined researcher to
make sure that you stay true to what's going on. That's right, that's
right, And this book in particular the culture of the island that they all
come from, which is a fantastical, imaginary island called son Maddgao in the
Caribbean. That is a place that it was full of pirates of Stephardic Jews,
u of Santetos from Cuba. Right, So there's all these cultures mixed
in with each other, and they in turn created new gods and spirits and
demons and everything else. And yes, it was a lot, but I
had so much fun putting all these ideas together and bringing in all these different
monsters and spirits and everything else that it was just like it. It felt
very natural in my head. It came to life, and so it felt
very natural to just keep going with it. And that was the process.
It's fun, and I totally believe that even today these spirits and monsters continue.
We just can't see them, but if you, if you listen carefully
through meditation, they're there. They're knocking on our hearts. Absolutely. That's
it. That's the whole concept of the book right there. To go into
that realm, do you feel it? I mean, do you do you
call to it? How how do you get into that moment where you really
bring out the character of what's going on. Yeah, it's such a good
question because I think that's something we all struggle with as writers. Right.
One thing that I always tell my students, and I know helped me a
lot. I always tell people to take one acting class if you want to
be a writer. Yea, And it seems backwards. I mean, you
should obviously study writing too, but when you act, when you perform,
you take on that persona of that character, and you make decisions as that
character, not in an intellectual way where sometimes as writers we get caught up
in our head, right and we're like, oh, what would this character
do? The quest? That's the wrong question, Like, really, what
we have to be asking us those I am this character? What would I
do? What am I about to do based on this r That's a totally
different question in the way that when you bring these characters to life, that
you you have the power and the energy to carry them beyond the page.
Because I mean, that's one of the hardest things for me to do as
a writer, is that I can't set a book down when I'm finished with
it and just walk away. I have to mourn their loss. M that's
so beautiful. It's true you know, I think that comes from really giving
them full flashdown lives, so it's not just about the decisions and making in
the moment, like what we were just talking about. That's that's the book,
right, that's the story of the book. But for them to really
come alive and walk off the page, they have to have histories. They
have to have memories. They have to have relationships, communities and relationships to
their own histories. And if we think about each of us has that and
they come out in different ways, they manifest in different ways, and maybe
not all those things will certainly not all those things they're gonna make it to
the page, like just like with research. You know, they say,
like you research a hundred different books and one of them makes it on the
page. You know, that's how it works. But knowing that will affect
how you write them and who they are, and that's what brings them to
life for readers. Part of the fun of writing to me is the editing
word. I'm such a stream thinker that it's like get it out now,
go back and piece it all together. Do you do the same, you
know, it's a different process. I love that you're writing. This is
so great to talk about with another writer. It's for me. Every process,
every book has a different process, Every project really requires me to like
approach it differently. So I lost as a perfect example, book One Ballot
and Dagger right, which came out last year. I outlined I outlined the
outlines of that book. I mean I had multiple drafts of the outline,
like I went all the way and then there was like the process of writing.
It was kind of filling in those outlines for last conso of the Dead,
for whatever reason, I just had to sit down and let it ripe.
I did not know chapter by chapter of what was going to happen.
They call it gardening, right, And I just planted the seeds and I
helped them grow and cultivated them as best I could. And here we are
today. So it really depends on the book. You're so right about that
about about planting the seeds. I talk about that all the time. Plant
the seed, take care of the soil, let it grow, and then
and then share the harvest. That's it. That's it, and it's magic,
right, It feels like magic. Like I don't know if you've had
that experience. I'm sure you haven't. Where you you put something in the
beginning of the book and you're like, I don't know why this is here.
I don't know what it's going to mean. And then you're like three
quarters of the way through and you're like, oh man, I need that
guy, and there he is, like ready to go jump into action.
It's the best feeling. You know. Well, I'm I'm a true believer
that we're chosen to write. We're not the actual writers. We just happen
to know how to put the ink on the page. Listen. We have
to step up. And the thing I love about books is that they to
write them. It means you have to step up and become the writer who's
able to finish them. So every book you write grows you, like it
makes you a better person than a better writer, because you have to figure
out that puzzle of what the book is and that's a journey into itself,
Like that's the writer's journey. Wow, Daniel, you got to come back
to this show anytime in the future. The door is always going to be
open for you. Thank you, sir. I would love to. This
has been great. You be brilliant today, Okay, sir, thank you
and you too.