We're Tom of Lorenzo and this is the Pop Style Opinion Fest Tell Quits.
Welcome back to another edition of the PSL. I am the team. You're
t Low Tom Fitzgerald, and I'm here with thellow and your tea lot.
Lorenzo, my love the husband. How are you a lovely husband? Fantastic,
fantastic. The heat Dome is not as bad as it was. We
might even open some windows today. It is the end of June. We're
heading into the week of July fourth, which is always fun for us because
we live in Philadelphia, literally only a couple of blocks from like the Betsy
Ross House and the Liberty Bells, so people are always asking us what do
you do for what are you doing for the July fourth? And the thing
is like there's literally fireworks outside our bedroom window. Like we don't have to
do anything. We just walk a couple of blocks and there's like parties going
on everywhere, just low down and yeah, there's there's stuff everywhere. I
used to be pissy about yes, tourists, but actually I'm not anymore.
No, I'm not. I'm proud to live where I live and no,
I actually took pictures of them and send them to My Mama said, this
is my neighborhood every day because I walked to the gym and sometimes I see
them coming, like fifty one hundred people coming my way through boy Scout,
you know, I know, so I have to cross the street. I'm
very good at that to like spotty them like miles away, so I can,
you know, cross the street or whatever. I don't mind. I
don't mind the mind. I think it's cy that they come and it's history,
you know, we all should learn a little uh, And it's great.
I think it's great. It's good for the neighborhood. No, I
don't I don't mind at all. I don't mind either. As for our
podcasts, as we it is a hundred percent TV talk podcast. And part
of the reason this is dropping on a Friday, we actually were going to
get this out earlier in the week because we didn't have a particularly busy week
on the red carpet front. But the bear was dropping and we know people
were going to plow through it very quickly, so we thought, you know
what, we're going to wait for that to drop. We're going to watch
the whole season, which we did, which was relatively easy to do because
most of the episodes are under forty minutes long, some of them are under
thirty. So we binge watched the entire season three and we're going to have
a mostly spoiler free discussion about it. There will be some discussion about what
the episodes were about. We're deliberately kind of staying away from the finale,
but it's not like it was a plot heavy season anyway. But we'll get
into that. But we're going to wait until the end of the you know,
the second half of the podcast to get into that one, because that's
like a whole season long thing. But we are very late because we waited
for the Bear to come out. We are very late talking about this past
week's House of the Dragon. We're like five days late on it. So
we apologize for that. I think this was right nearer the Cruel is the
It was the the second episode of season two, and this is the sort
of the fallout from Damon sending assassins to kill aim and then wind up killing
Prince Jaharis. So it's all the fallout from that and all the political positioning
from that. I have to reiterate my point, and I just I don't
want to sound like I'm smug about this or that I'm being superior about this,
But I do have to laugh a little bit when people people take size
on this and that they treat they act like the person they're like, you
know, right, is our girl, and you know all the and she's
awful. They're all awful. Everybody in the show is terrible. It actually
frees you up as a viewer to just embrace the actual story and not have
to worry about whether or not or even concern yourself with whether or not the
people that you are identifying with or rooting for or whatever are good people,
because nobody in the story is good. First. That's what I like about
the show. It is they're all horrible people, and they all have you
know, there are they have their moments when you feel sorry for them that
you kind of root for them and then you hate them the next episode.
I just love that because there are people, they like people. That's just
it. It's a much more human take on a fantasy story, clearly.
I mean, that's the thing that separates George R. R. Martin from
someone like Tolkien is that he was far more interested in the human emotions than
he was in things like magic rings or rag or even dragons. You know,
dragons are basically nuclear weapons in this world. That's all they are.
They're just allegories for nuclear weapons. But I agree, I like that you
know, no one on there is nobody, no good people around this in
this story. Literally nowhere in this story is they're a good person. But
they're humans. So you know, mothers more than their children, and and
you know, people watch their life plans fall apart or whatever, and you
feel for them, and that is, as you said, that's humanity.
They don't have to be morally perfect people for you to either root for them
or identify with them or feel something for them. But the idea of taking
sides on this story like nobody, I mean, I guess nominally Rhinira is
the one that you're supposed to be taking sides with. Maybe that's because I
think Emma Darcy's performance is just so friggin strong. And also I do think
Allison comes off pretty badly. I do think she does. She is horrible.
I think she comes well, they're all horrible, don't get me wrong,
but ah, I feel like she makes bad choices. Yeah, she's
a hypocrite. I think that's the big she's a big time hypocrite, and
I guess, say, what's a little about right near her? But she's
not a hypocrite, and I think that's part of what gets, you know,
people so caught up. It's sort of like Sir Kristen Cole. People
loathe that guy, loathe him, and I agree, they do such a
great job, and I want to get into why they do in it a
little bit. But they loathe that guy, and I'm like, yeah,
he's horrible, But you know, is Damon any better? Is Agone any
better? Are any of these people better than he is? Not? Really?
No, I do love that they're all shitty people and they blame someone
else for their fuck ops. Yeah, it's just just like ordinary people.
Just like ordinary people. They also have great conversations, which I think that
we don't see much of that, you know, on shows anymore, that
they have these long conversations, you know, the cameras on them, and
they have these great discussions or conversations about anything. I actually read a very
good interview with jessc laying my Goddess talking about that. I like, like
she went back and watched her movies and whatever, and she feels like today,
everything cut, cut, cut, you know, they cut to the
vaccine, cut and move. Directors don't stay, you know, and spend
a good two or I don't know, three minutes on people just talking and
having conversations. So and you get that on the show. I think I
agree. Going back to Sir Kristen call, one of the things I think
is very smart about that character is the casting. Oh yeah, my god,
because it's not new to cast a traditionally conventionally good looking person in a
villainous role. It's not even new for this franchise. You know, there
were plenty of very good looking terrible people in Game of Thrones, and there
are plenty of good looking terrible people in House of the Dragon. But what
I think is interesting about Fabian Frankel is that, unlike someone like Matt Damon,
who you know, I don't know if you would consider him movie idle
good looks or but well, let's just let's just agree stipulate that Matt Smith
has his you know, charms or whatever. Or a better one is to
go back to Game of Thrones and Jeoffrey. Remember Jeoffrey. Everyone hated that
kid so much they cast that actor. I can't remember the guy's name.
He's grown up now, he's in his thirties, and I don't want to
cast dispersions on his looks. He was a good looking kid and he's a
good looking adult. But he has that sort of sneering, villainous face.
You know, there's a certain type of face that you love to hate.
I think Matt Smith has that kind of face, that kind of sneering.
He's hot, but he's also villainous, that sort of It's just that,
you know, shows like this tend to cast a certain look to get get
and Fabian Frankle just has that sort of soft boy pin up look to him,
and it's actually an unusual look. The only other person who was like
that were sort of like Rob Stark or John Snow, that sort of soft
boy pin up look, and they were both, you know, hero heroic
characters. But he looks like a pin up. He's he's very good looking,
like like and I don't mean like he's like movie stargled look. He's
like he's got that softness. It's not just that he's like rugged and square
Jawn. He's got like a pin up idol look to you expect him to
do good things, and you expect a guy, and you don't expect a
guy like that to be a raging misogyny with women issues. He's clearly got
women, and he's a liar and he's a you know whatever, he's a
coward on top of it. The other cute people of the show, or
the two twins that died this eric, they look they're adorable, They looked
incredible there the costume. You would think one of them would have cut their
hair so that they wouldn't have had a well issue, like we'll get to
that. But there was a huge conversation online complaining about that that during the
fight they couldn't tell who Well, that was the point, you, Yeah,
but I think that's brilliant. That's exactly the point, because because at
first I was like, are we getting to the fight already? Okay,
so yeah, it's not a strict right right, So when when they were
fighting, I was like, all right, one is gonna win, but
how do we know he's the good guy or the bed I thought that's what
It was incredible, Yeah, and then the one who won killed himself And
I think that was such a great yes sort of metaphor for the entire story.
It's family fighting family. I mean, remember, it's hard to remember
this sometimes, but like Queen Helena who lost just lost her child, is
right near his sister, right, It's kind of hard to remember that,
but that's you know, so it is family fighting family. And the two
twins were like this perfect visual representation of how fucked up this whole story is
because here they both wound up dead and when they were fighting, I was
like, God, you're both fighting over nothing. It has you're gaining nothing,
it has nothing to do with you, which is that is the history
of warfare. It's you know, people dying for and other people who aren't
actually fighting. And also the history of the royal in kingdom whatever, you
know, like the loyalty right, you were loyal to your king or to
your queen right, and you've you know, you fought and died for them.
I thought that was very I wish we as someone mentioned, several people
mentioned, I wish we had no more about the twins they but I agree
we we think some of the more interesting people are already dead in this story.
That's the problem with it. But my god, they look majestic.
They look so gorgeous. At two of them, the costume, the hair,
the face. I was like, ah, and yeah it was.
It was tragic vision, beautiful visual. They died for no they really died
for no reason. What else there are? Yeah, there's the two guys
that were introduced that are I think pretty clearly Corless's children or bastard sons whatever.
Yeah, And this is what happens when you diversify your casting, is
that you introduce these two black characters and there's only one other prominent black character,
and they're in the scene together. So I don't know what's going on
there. I have read the story outlined for this, so I have a
general idea of where I know how everybody dies, I which is actually very
very satisfying when you're yeah, because you know to find out how. I'm
not going to spoil anything, but I know how every character meets there.
There's no stress, no stress. I'm just waiting for some of these buckers
to get there. According to what I read online, he's the son,
you know, something like that, which would make them potential Dragon writer,
which is why there was that scene where the guy was just pointing that out.
It's just an interesting thing to note that I believe their Lenia is just
supposed to be something of a mystery. But it's you know, when you
when you have one prominent black family in the story than any black characters that
come in, you're just going to assume that they're. Back to what you
said about the actors in general. The acting in general, I have to
say, and we said that many times and I'll say it again, excellent.
The actors are so good. They are so so even the young kids.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, the one who plays young Helena, the
Queen cannot take the funeral. First off, the costumes, those crowns with
the veils, the boats she and Allison were, I was like, oh
my god, that's beautiful. That looks like something out of a Roman fresco.
The way they were costume, the slow motion, the cinematography, everything
about that funeral was just absolutely perfect and grueling, grueling, and it was
clearly based on Princess Diana's funeral. They even admitted that, yeah, yeah,
they did, And I just loved the whole thing. And then when
the wagon wheel got stuck, yeah, I was going to go down the
street, the head is going to fall off. I can't believe they're doing
this, but they didn't think that. They didn't take it that far.
But that's what I love about this show is that they really show how raw
and brute or everything was at the time, you know, you were the
king. I always say that at the time there was no time. There
was a time, not history. Well, but even let's say real history.
You know, people were filthy and dirty, and the streets were dirty,
people smelled. I love how you can get that. You know,
it's not just beautiful people in a castle. No, I totally agree with
that. I mean, I do love Tolkien, and I'm really, really
truly looking forward to the Rings of Power, especially since they're bringing the Barrel
Whites in. Very excited about that. That was just released this week.
Anyway, But Tolkien is a different thing. And you you get into Tolkien
and because of the glory of it, the majesty of it, and that's
I mean, George R. Martin is opposed to glorifying any of this stuff.
I mean, he really wants you down in the mud and the ship
with his character and you get that, Yeah, you get that. Nobody
takes a shit in Tolkien, but everybody does in Western Oh my god,
Yeah, nobody bleeds in Tolkien, not really, and then wester Ros is
just like a wash in blood anyway, so many great things scenes, do
you The one that I just absolutely loved this is the auto auto high tower
scene with the king. That was just brilliant. Yeah, what's his name,
Reeves Ephans. He is absolutely fantastic. He deserves a nomination. That
performance was like one of the best. I mean you just like you just
enjoy every second of it, every line, every move, the way he
looked at the king, Yeah, just perfect, perfect, perfect. If
anybody I can't root for that guy. I don't think he has a moral
I mean he actually does have a moral code, because he was offended that
innocent that the king had all the ratcatchers killed, right, and he was
offended by that, although I think he was more upset that it wasn't going
to aid them politically. But I do think there was a moral response there
where he was like, you you killed innocent man. I think I think
he cares about tradition of things going a certain Well, he's a hand.
They all did. Yeah, that's his job. So it's not that he's
a good guy, but he's not. He at least I don't know he's
better than he has. He has some sort of moral center to him.
I mean not really. I really don't want to overstate it. Like I
said, everybody in this story is horrible speaking of horrible people. Damon,
my god, he is just well that scene was actually really funny. I
mean, Ran is like, who could have done this? Were you really
the lady? I said that everybody turns and looks at him. I said
that out loud, and I was like, come on, you can't be
that stupid. Come on. I guess they needed to have this moment where
right near her realizes that her husband doesn't love her, never loved her,
and and he still blames his brother for giving her the throne. You know.
So there's that that. But but it was a fantastic scene because he
was his anger and then marriage fight right away, but Royal fied too.
I mean it was just all there. Yeah, it was just like all
that anger and it was just great when she talks about him being a kid
and you know what a ship had he was and she been trying to fight
that her whole life. I think that the show does, I don't say
a great job, but does a good job showing how women, you know,
are always you know, sacrifice or how women are not treated the way
you know they should be treated, especially back then. So I think the
show does a good job. And and she you know that everyone is a
game. These two women, nobody cares about what they have to say.
So I thought it was interesting that Missaria and Raniera met. Missuria is the
white worm, the one that and I didn't even realize until it came up
in the dialogue that they had met when when Raniera was a child, because
damon he was going to marry her. I don't know if they wrote her
out or not. She was leaving Dragonstack was beautiful when she saw the one
twin coming through, and clearly she warned somebody about it, But I don't
know if she it'd be interesting if she and Raniera had some sort of I
don't know, you know, partnership or whatever. I think. I think
Missuria is probably one of the few people that Ryania could probably put her trust
in if she if she wanted to. So we'll see. I don't know,
Like I said, I know the general I know where how everybody dies,
but I don't know every twist and turn of the story, So I
don't know where Mazaria is going well, whether she even has a role in
the story going forward, But well, I it's not very clear if she
came back and said something I know so, but let's say she did,
then well the Queen is gonna love yeah, exactly. So I'm hoping it's
that, But I don't know. I don't know. I mean, why
would she come back? But we'll see. I don't know. Is there
anything else you wants? I also love the that they're bringing common folks,
you know, the public opinion and people matter, and show you more of
esther rows, because I don't want it just to be people, you know,
having conversations in you know, in the cast rooms. Yeah, yeah,
I mean it's nice to see a little more of the outside and and
I don't know, it feels more real to me. I do like that.
It was just a great episode. It is great episode. The story
is small. It's not about saving the world from a great evil. It's
about terrible people, you know, jocking. It's succession with dragons. It's
terrible people jocking for power, and none of whom are likable. But yeah,
and it's really really well acted and beautiful to look at it. And
I appreciate that they're all horrible people. Horrible, horrible people. Yes,
that makes me easier to watch because I don't have to root for anybody.
I just hate. Are we wrapping up our concast? So that was very
good and I keep I hope they keep having, you know, great moments
like the second episode. Agreed, we'll take a second here and we are
back. I just wanted to briefly talk about and get my nerd on and
talk about Uh I didn't see that. I'm sorry, that's right. What
was I saying? You were going to talk about your show? Yes,
I wanted to briefly talk get my nerd on and talk about Star Wars the
acolyte. Sorry about that brief interruption. Uh So the nerd, the the
angry in cell nerds have been, you know, review bombing this show because
there are no white men in the story. And I don't want to over
praise the show, but I will say it's probably the second best Star Wars
show. Well, let me put it this way, and or of all
the Star Wars television shows, live action Disney Plus television shows that they've done
since Disney Plus launched, I would say Indoor season one is far and away
the best of all of them. Mandalorian Season one is only slightly behind that,
But then everything after that sucked. I'm sorry, Obi Wan sucked,
Ahsoka sucked, Bobba Fett all sucked, completely sucked, and then the Mandalorian
went down the tubes too. So I don't want to overstate how good this
show is because I don't think it's perfect, but I do think it's actually
very good. The story is interesting to me because it is not rehashing.
It exists within a framework of what we know about the history of the you
know, the High Republic and all that, and the Jedi Order, but
it's not a wash in lore and continuity and stuff that you need to know.
There are no Skywalkers in this, thank god, and they really haven't
tied it to any of the films, like they literally had one character from
the film in one scene, and a minor character. If I said his
name, most of you wouldn't even know Key out of Monday. I mean,
you'd have to be a really big Star Wars fan to even know that
he was in there. So it stands on its own in a lot of
ways, but it plays on what we know about the Jedi about the Force,
about the Sith, and this episode was, honestly, that was one
of the best lightsaber battles I have ever ever seen on film. It was
really really well done, just a great, great fight scene and with the
reveal that spoiler. Okay, so there is going to be a spoiler here
giving you a second all right boiler. Many Jacinto really is the bad guy.
But I think, I mean, was it really that hard to figure
out? Come on and the minute they showed that guy's arms under his robs,
I was like, well, we know that's Many Gesinto. God,
he has incredible arms. He really, I mean, that guy's got great
bone structure, but man, I had no idea he had guns like that
in fantastic fight scene. He's also really good as a villain, really really
really good. He got some great lines in and like kind of blew someone
like Kylo Wren out of the water, like Adam Driver's character. I was
like, this is what his character should have been, charismatic and beautiful and
seductim And I guess certain people thought he was, but man, I just
thought Many Jacinto was one of the best evil characters I've ever seen on Star
Wars honestly, not not really up there with the Emperor and Darth Vader.
I wouldn't go that far, but certainly for me, better than Kylo Wren,
better than Darth Maul, better than a lot of the darths. I
thought he was fascinating. I think his helmet's really cool, and people are
gonna people complain that about his helmets. But let's face it, Star Wars
is all about the helmets now, it's not about the faces anymore. Have
you ever noticed that lucasfilm thing that plays in front of every episode. There's
no human faces. It's just all helmets and robots because that stuff is easier
to you know, turn into a toy. That's great because I always thought
he was good. He was good in the Good Place. Yeah he's a
good actor, he's but he never got to play hot on the Good Place,
not really because he was so stupid on that show. And he's insanely
hot in this Like, like all I could think was, it's almost it's
like watching a young Kenna Reeves, if Kannon Reeves was ripped and built,
you know what I mean, Like, because Canon never really was. I
he was kind of built in speed. But yeah, he's just got that
super super hot but also incredibly elegant, high cheekbone look to him, like
it's he needs to be a bigger start. That's what I'm trying. And
I hope he gets a lot out of this. Actually, I hope they
don't kill his character off. I mean, that's a character who probably deserves
a little bit more time, especially since the implication is is that he more
or less is resurrecting the Sith Order. And also there was an implication that
he was somehow utilizing the magic wielding, you know, the force wielding abilities
of the Witches, Like there was some indication that hit. The way he
uses it is closer to how the Witches used it than how the Jedi used
it, which should be interesting. Although you're setting up the Witches in Star
Wars as this anti patriarchal order, which is how I actually had a few
issues about that in previous episodes, but that was the setup. You're going
to have, like lesbian witches as this anti patriarchal order in opposition to the
Jedi. If you turn around and make them the inspiration for them, I
don't know if that's such a great idea, Like you're making lesbians the root
of all evil in Star Wars. I don't know that. Yeah, I
don't think that's I sincerely doubt that that's where that's going. But we'll see
where it's going. I don't know anyway. Episode five really great, really
great fight, seeing a lot of deaths, two character deaths that I won't
spoil in case you haven't seen it, but I was shocked that both of
those characters were killed. And they both had huge potential as Star Wars characters.
So it was really but that's that's refreshing. The two characters that were
killed, you know, whatever, I could say who they were, but
the two characters that were killed, they were perfect setups for their own adventures.
They both had great looks that we didn't know anything about them. They
were young, they you know, and they were charismatic so everything. It's
really kind of refreshing to see Star Wars say, no, we're going to
kill them off. We're not going to do three movies about these, we're
not going to do an entire siere, we're not gonna sell toys and everything.
Here's a couple of really interesting characters. Now we're gonna kill them off
so that you can feel the pain of them dying, because that's not something
Star Wars does well. Franchises don't do death well often because it's not permanent.
So and also because they rarely you know, franchises don't normally kill off
characters with a lot of potential to them. Yeah, there's always a question
mark, well, when maybe we're gonna bring them back exactly. I mean
when you think of something like Avengers, where they killed off Tony Stark,
well, he had appeared in about ten movies at that point, there was
there wasn't a lot of potential. It was that he was an extremely popular
character. That's why the death mattered. But he also so there wasn't a
lot of story left to tell me. He had gotten married, he had
a kid, and you know, he had dealt with all his demons.
And so that's a different sort of thing. When you introduce brand new characters
that you barely know and they're really interesting and then boom they die. That's
a choice to make for a starry show. And I really hope that those
characters aren't getting resurrected in some weird way. I think that's all I'm going
to say about that. The Acolyte. I'm enjoying it. It's not the
greatest show on TV. It's not the greatest season of Star Wars I've ever
seen, like I said, and or season one, Mandalorian season one,
but I would put this somewhere behind probably Mandalorian season two. So it's a
good show. I actually love that there are no there's no white people in
it. There's are some white people, but there's like they're not they're now
no white male character is I don't even I don't even think there is one.
I think that's the beauty of having too many options now, is that
you can do that. You can have a show with, you know,
right, people that you would normally cast, you know, because they're not
white. And you have to remember that Star Wars in nineteen seventy seven,
the original film was just like one white, one hundred percent white. So
this is all sort of a correct two years and years of and they're and
you know, based on what you're telling me, they're talented, you know,
so they deserve the spotlight. Yeah think, yeah, absolutely, That's
all I have to say about that. I know, Lorenzo, let's take
another short break, and then Lorenzo has something he wants to talk about all
right, Lorenzo, Yes, your latest obsession. I know I'm a little
behind here, but I watched recently the movie The Great Lilian Hall with Jessica
Lang, my goddess, I absolutely worship. It's on HBO. It's on
HBO. Uh. It's the story is it's this Broadway star diva who's great,
everyone loves her, and she's rehearsing for her latest play, but she's
battling memory loss in dementia. So it's a very interesting story. Of course,
Jessica Lang is absolutely fantastic, Marvel is wonderful, but also we have
Kathy Baits and we have Lily Rabe as part of the cast, and it's
just a great, great, great movie. You know, I love everything
she does, jesscaling absolutely, but it's just a great movie. It's a
great movie. It's hard to watch for me, dementia. I don't know
why. I mean, I'm always like it's one of the things that really
scared me when I watch on screen. I'm like, oh my god,
please, it's just hard to watch. In fact, I only watched the
movie once because I I can't watch this again. But it's worth watching at
least at least once everyone is great. There's a scene with jesskalalaing, Kathy
Bates and Lily Rabe and it's just my god, I thought my I posted
on Instagram. I thought my hat was gonna explode because all these amazing women
acting together. It was just a beautiful scene. And then later reading an
interview, I found out that they're friends, They're very close friends, and
so that which is perfect for them to act together. It's a it's a
great movie about to mention a very hard thing to deal with, and I
think they did a good job presenting as it is, how hard it is
and how horrible it is. But it's it's a great movie. I highly
recommend it again. It's called The Great Lilian Hole on HBO. Yeah,
and I know it had a strange Originally Meryl Streep was yes, and it
was supposed to be a theatrical release, right right right. And I also
know I can't remember the name of the actress, but this is based on
the theater actress, a real theater actress too. Wait, I do remember
Mary and Selda I think is their name, who suffered dementia late in her
career. So I have nothing to add because I haven't had to watch yet,
but I thought I would add those little bits of factoids in that originally
was supposed to be Meryl Streep, and it is based on a real interesting
Broadway actress I knew about Carl's. Yeah, it's really really good Tory some
of these other seventy years old or to Charame, hello, I'm closed.
Let's get around here. You know, I know it's good. I thought
it was very good. You know. I love Jessica Langston's King Kong.
Believe me. I fell in love with her watching King Kong. So I
love the woman and I do feel minor criticism here that towards the end of
her career now she tends to play the same I don't know, she has
kind of the same mannerisms for every character that's been true of her for a
while. Yeah, I that's my only criticism. But she's still amazing.
She's phenomenal, she's real, and I would also just add to that,
like Jessica lang definitely has her bag of tricks that she tends to go to,
But then again, so does freaking Meryl Streep. I'm sorry, my
god. Yes, yes, if you watch a bunch of Meryl Streep movies
back to back. You just start to see the technique. She has,
that thing that she looks up and roll her eyes and whatever she gets all
flustered with. Yeah, yeah, yeah, doesn't matter who she's playing,
and I'm not I don't mean that to despair. I think any great actor,
yes, once they reach you know, fifty years into their career,
of course, they're going to have a certain bag of tricks, a certain
mannerisms that are going to come up over and over again. That doesn't mean
that they're not good. No, it doesn't mean that they're not good,
although I do think sometimes Jessica Lang goes from zero to sixty in her performance
is a little too like, just a little too often. Were gonna stop
right now? All right, whatever, stop it? Oh okay, let's
move on to The Bear. Yes, the Bear season three, which was
a bear. Yeah, I'm going to start right off the bat and say
I wasn't loving I don't love this season. Let me just get a few
thoughts out, and then yes, I know that The Bear is really a
well beloved show. And I will admit that A couple of times during this
season while I was watching even as I was getting annoyed with the way the
show was playing out, I was like, God, I do actually these
people, and it to make a sort of comparison, but the comparison falls
down, and I'll explain why in a bit, But it's sort of like
mad Men, where you watched a show with very fucked up people working together
in situations that you know, stressful or demoralizing or whatever, but you knew
them all so well, you knew their stories so well that you kind of
loved those people, and you kind of wanted if you wanted to work at
Sterling Cooper, you want to work in the kitchen at The Bear. You
just want to even though it looks horrible. So the show is really good
about that. But to take it back to the mad Men comparison, mad
Men had distinct episodes that were about distinct things distinct thing and they played out
over the course of a forty five minute episode, and then that episode ended
it told it a larger story. But when I think about mad Men,
I think about distinct episodes with beginnings, middles, and ends that had a
point to them, And so much of this season of The Bear, I
was like, is there a point here? Can we get to the point
or better yet, could you please stop making the same point over and over
and over again. I get it, Carmei has a lot of issues,
and actually Carme's issues are the centerpiece of this story, which is why comparing
it to Mad Men is actually somewhat instructive, because it is similar in a
lot of ways. It is a workplace drama with a tortured white man at
the center of it who has a female that he's mentoring. You know,
there's a woman that he's mentoring who looks up to him. So there's a
very you know, because he and what's Aoadebris's character's name, they have a
Sidney. Yeah, Carmei and Sydney have a Don and Peggy thing. People
keep talking about out the two of them as some sort of romantic There's nothing
nothing romantic between the two of them. Anyway. I'll stop there. We're
gonna get into real stuff. We're not gonna spoil the entire season. We're
just gonna talk like, uh, well, there's no major plot turns,
nobody dies or anything like that or no. I won't get into the final
but we'll talk a little bit about it. Yeah, I just I want
to say that season one blew my mind the same it was. I thought
it was fresh, real, something different that we hadn't seen on TV.
My father had a restaurant at some point in our lives, and it was
chaotic as hell. It was just kind of like that, you know,
drama strats. Oh my god, we're gonna be able to make it,
you know, do we have the right ingredients? I mean, now we
what are we missing? You know? All that was real. I hated
it, absolutely hated so that was interesting to watch. Didn't mind so much
in season one all the fighting, fighting, all the yelling and all that,
because I was like, all right, it's part of the thing here,
right, stress, everyone is trying to make it. Season two.
Didn't love it so much, but it was okay. Bork's the episode with
cousin Ritchie last season honestly is one of the best episodes of television I've ever
seen. That is top of the line. I fell in love with him,
that character, the actor, everybody was just amazing. That last season
was the high point. I know everybody talks about seven Fishes, which is
the Oh god, No, I did not love that episode. I didn't.
I think it lacked the subtlety that the show had been trading in up
until that point. Anyway, going back to yeah, so I but so
I didn't read anything because I'm trying to do that and then just watch and
you know, get a real reaction. So I just felt that, you
know, I jokely said to Tom, I was like, well, it
feels like the greatest hits here of season one and two. Well knew the
first episode felt like an MTV video. It was a forty minute montage with
almost no dialogue. And this is what I mean about the season going up
its own ass, getting very self indulgent. Like, Okay, I I
don't look, I don't mind formal experiments on television. If you want to
do an entire montage episode, or you want to do an entire episode without
a dialogue or whatever, that's fine. I don't mind any of that.
But as you noted, it was all just rehashing stuff that that whole montage.
I was like, okay, there were little bits and pieces in there,
but it was all stuff we already knew, right. I think the
show people were so hungry for more, right that, to me, that
first episode was a major disappointment. I was like, Why am I looking
at all this stuff that I've already watched. I want something new. They
were putting new scenes in it, but they were so irrepetitive and they weren't
telling you anything, right, So I just hated that people thought it was
divine and wonderful, you know, because people do like to I don't know
over what what both people like to do over pray things. I don't know,
but I think two. I mean, the show became such a huge
success, and there's always a that's usually is a problem, I think because
the creators get I don't know, I don't know, they get too big.
Everybody gets too big, and they just forget the essence of what the
show became, why the show became so you know, popular and interesting and
so on. So the first episode was a major disappointment. I was like,
well, why am I watching this? It's like thirty minutes of nothing.
And then the second episode was a thirty minute argument in the kitchen,
and I was like, okay, okay, but again, I understand that's
how these characters act, that's what the show is. I'm not upset that
there was another argument in the kitchen, but it was just right. It
was just people yelling fuck you at each other for thirty minutes. Right,
that's the thing. I don't mind the fuck you because you know, the
F word is actually one of my favorite words, but I choose when to
use it. And I feel like the show is just dropping fuck you everywhere.
I mean, people talk like that, no, but there are certain
moments that I mean it, I don't understand why. Well, that's the
thing. It's to amend my point. People do talk like that, but
you need more than that in dialogue. You need you know, you need
to progress. There needs to be a point if people are just yelling fuck
you at each other. And there was a point where KRMEI and Richie were
just yelling fuck you's back and forth for like several minutes. This is not
entertaining, it's not illuminating, it's not moving the story forward. It's not
funny. So why are we doing this. It's a scene where he's serving
the customers and they're in the kitchen and the whole fuck you back and forth.
I was like, there's no way you'd you'd be allowed to act in
arrest and with your uh you know, with people there, you just can't
can't. They were right by the door. Yeah, I'm screaming, and
I'm just like, how is that accepted for you? I mean, you're
trying to make a business work here, you know, it's just trying to
be successful. I don't. And that's creator's decision that drives me crazy.
Let's make this interesting, let make this you know, I don't know whatever.
Let's just have people yelling at each other the entire time. I and
for someone watching the show as a viewer, it gets to a point where
you can't take it anymore. It's just like I said, it's not doing
anything. It's just noise. At this point. You're not revealing anything about
the characters. You're not moving the story forward. It's not even funny.
It's just repetitive. Beyond repetitive. It's sort of like the Fact Brothers.
Oh my god, I wanted to punch my TV. I mean, they
took these peripheral characters who were funny in small doses and then kept giving them
scene after scene after scene pitty stupidity, and it wasn't fine. No,
it's funny for a second, but if you keep going back to it,
it's not funny. And then they bring in John Cena as their other brother,
and that's when the entire season fell flat on its face. For me,
I was holding on to that point and then when that happened, I
was like, oh, no, you've really lost it. Number one.
I guess the joke is here. You've got these two schlubby, fat guys
and then there's this big muscle guy who's supposed to be his brother. Is
that the joke? Well, it took me right out of the story right
out. Well, first off, that's John Cena, Like there's it was
John Cena in that scene. Like it did not feel like the the third
fact brother showed up. It feels like John's felt like John Cena just walked
into the restaurant. It's just it was I mean, yeah, like the
scene when when the brothers are together and the photography is taking pictures and the
way they're acting, that's the John Cena scene. Yeah, yeah, No,
they had there's another one. Yeah, there was more than anyway.
My point is that there's no way you allow people to behave in front of
someone who came to photograph the plays. Professional walks in to take pictures and
first of all, are you right there in the middle of the shot.
No, no, absolutely not. I mean yeah, I mean, come
on, yeah. I tried to be open about these things. But at
the same time, I'm like, all right, I can't take more of
the yelling here. I can't. I just can't. I am larger.
I mean, I don't want to make it sound like the yelling was what
bothered me this season, because the yelling is the point, like that,
you don't get into the Bear unless you understand that it is about that yelling.
But for me, it never went anywhere. When you think about that
second episode, which was the non Negotiables, when Krmi wrote out that list,
and he's writing out this stuff which sounds completely crazy, right, and
everybody who looked at it says, Okay, this is completely crazy. So
I thought the story of the season was going to be everyone getting Karmi to
understand that his obsession with excellence and all that other stuff is crazy talk and
you should just worry about making good food. But they never actually got to
that point. In fact, his obsession with excellence was still being playing out
in the finale, which I will not get into reasons why, but his
his you know, his wounds and his scars and everything, and I get
it. The point partial point of this season was to show that CARMEI is
perpetuating a lot of bad behavior, like he had a terrible childhood and a
terrible mother apparently I don't know what his father's experience, and then he had
these horrible where he was abused. And that's the point of Olivia Coleman's characters
when she comes in, it's to show you a different way. There is
a way of doing this thing without being an asshole. And I thought that
was going to be the lesson he learned, but that's not where we got
to. I mean, you know, characters don't have to learn lessons,
but there has to be a point to stories, and I just didn't get
what was the point to any of this? Right, Well, season three
and four were shot together, so we're going to get more of all of
this. We'll get more resolution. That's kind of why this season does not
feel like a resolution, you know, it just does last season. The
previous two seasons, when you got to the end of the season, you've
felt like that season had told a full story, right because the end of
season two was you know, the Bear finally opens the new restaurant and everyone
had spent that entire season. Every cast member had stories about how they were
trying to improve themselves. So that was the you know, the story of
last season was about people making something better of their lives, and I guess
we could say the story of this season was about people being stuck in their
own you know, bad behavior, you know that sort of thing, And
there is something to be said about that when you look at a character like
Ritchie Cousin Ritchie, like I said, for it's last season, Oh my
god, that was such an amazing episode of television. However, it would
have been unrealistic if a man who had spent his entire life fucking up and
being a jerky would change, would changed that much. So we did see
and it's the same thing with Krmie, Like, yes, he got his
dream came true at the end of season two, but obviously he's still the
same person. Yeah, all of that's good, feel true. Yeah,
all that's good, All of that feels true. But it was still a
meandering mess of just watching miserable people over and over again. Let's talk about
specific episodes. Go ahead, Yeah, Sugar, Yeah, I'm Sugar and
her mom Jamie Lee Curtis. They did a whole two hander with just them
while Sugar was in labor, and there were some really good moments in that
episode. And I actually think Jamie Lee was better in this one than she
was in the one last year. Well that's crazy. Well that's just it.
But I think it's more interesting for an actor to have to play someone
who is mentally unstable but trying their damn just to hold it together than someone
who's just screaming her head off. And there was that moment where where she
admits to her daughter that she's trying, and the amount of pain in her
face and voice. I was like, all right, Jamie Lee, you're
nail. She is a fantastic she is fantastic, but she needs to dial
that character back and she did. That's that Episodeeah. I love Sugar.
I think she's one of the healthiest people on the show, and subsequently she's
one of the saddest people on the show. I thought that episode was good.
It just could have edited about ten minutes out of it because it was
so repetitive. It was way too long. And I yeah, I mean,
like you said, great moments he in there, but a whole episode
about those two just close up of those two for forty minutes. Now,
that was just a little bit too much because they were saying the same things
over and over again. And Sugar is a great character, Abby Elliott,
she she's doing a great job. So I'm glad they gave her more stuff
too, And that was I love her husband, Pete, Oh my god,
sweetest guy. And it really says something that everybody in that kitchen can't
stand Pete and he's the only one who's emotionally healthy, and that's why they
can't stand it, because they're all so fucked up. Right. The other
thing I want to say is that I'm I was actually happy to see is
that Ao. It's she is a fantastic actress. They did not use her
well, she didn't use her well, but whatever they gave her, she
so she's still great. She's still great. She's still great. Can we
get less fucking close up a Karmie staring off in the distance, like Jesus.
There were so many they really pulled it don Draper this season where they
really felt like, oh, well, the most fascinating character in the show
is the white guy at the center of it. And actually that's not true.
That's not true. Can I just say, speaking of which this might
get into I never notice it until this season. The Bear is known for
its needle drops. It has these great soundtracks, and it uses music very,
very effectively. But when I think of The Bear, when I think
of the cast, when I think of who works in that kitchen, I
think of the diversity of that kitchen. Okay, but the only music the
show ever plays is white guy rock, and it's usually dated white guy rock.
It's not. In other words, it's music that nobody in that kitchen,
with the exception of maybe Richie, nobody else in that kitchen listens to
that music. And it just when I look at Chicago and they have all
these beautiful scenes of Chicago, and they clearly love paying homage to the working
people, to people who prepare food and that sort of thing. Again,
I think of rap music, I think of sales music. I think of
all the different sounds of music, Middle Eastern, you know what I mean.
Like, that's right, that's what a city sounds like. A this
like pearl jam, rolling stone stuff. I'm like, yeah, okay,
but you're showing me a city, and you're showing me a class of people.
And you know what I don't think that class of people are listening to
Pearl Jam as much as you are, mister producer. I know exactly.
That's the thing. It's it's just and maybe that's a minor point, but
it did sort of get into It does sort of get into my point about
how the show was just up its own ass a little too much, because
if it was really trying to paint a picture of these people's lives, what
kind of music do you think Tina's listening to. She's not listening to the
Beastie Boys. She's listening to like salsa most likely. Now let's talk about
Tena's APIs lots of colognes. My god, I fell in love with her
in season one right because, oh my god, what a great character archy.
She was unlikable from the second you met her because she didn't like any
of the changes, and she could be a bitch and then you you just
slowly see her own insecurities and everything, and ah, just a great character
arc, great development. Yeah, and her role. I just love how
well she is in in the She's fantastic. Like when season one, I
have to be honest, I was like, can she even act? I
mean, because they didn't give her enough. She played a bitch, yeah,
but but you know most people can play a bitch. But my point
is that I didn't see much. But but now, oh my god,
I cry just looking at her, like she gets all teered off and everything
when she told that kid fuck you. Behind the reception that. One of
the things I think the show can get kind of silly about is that the
characters will we'll just sit around and have these incredibly deep conversations in the middle
of a kitchen or something, and you know most of us don't do that
during our work day. There was a scene where it was Sugar and I
think it was the fact brothers Oh and Karm talking about their legacy, and
at one point one of the characters said, and what do you want your
legacy to be? And I was people don't talk this way. People don't
have these conversations, right, But every once in a while, those conversations
really those two hander scenes. So the scene with John Burnhall and Liza Colonsais
where they meet for the first Jesus Christ. Sometimes the dialogue got a little
dialogueis, yeah, I got a little precious. But when the two of
them were talking about about people who have plans and to know what they're going
to do with their life, and like, with this complete sense of what
the fuck I got? You know, people who didn't make those plans,
people who are constantly on their back foot trying to figure out their lives and
figure out the world. And I'll just say, without being too precious about
it, I got it in that moment. There were things that they said
during that scene that I was like, oh, yeah, I felt that
way. Yeah, I did feel that way. My favorite moment is when
she talked about these young kids and that's it and they know what they're doing.
And I love her for not saying all those idiots does more and she
said I was jealous. I love that that she's real about it and says,
you know, I'm jealous. Jealous? Yeah, because I used to
be like that. Not anymore. I mean, that was that scene.
That scene almost made the entire season for me, but it wasn't enough.
I will say the one thing I whatever, maybe this is my shalon is
coming through, but John Burnhal is probably a little too good looking in Studley
to play such a loser, you know what I mean. It's not that
good looking people can't be losers or whatever. But when he was talking to
her about Carmi and everything and about people who know what they're doing, I'm
like, I don't know, I think I would find this more believable coming
out of Karme's mouth or or or while a fact brother's mouth or whatever.
But that's the beauty of Eliza Cologne's zias is. I mean, she really
makes that character live and breathe. I also liked that they did a little
bit with Marcus and his mother not enough, not enough, yeah, but
some you know, which was great. They went to his mother's unal and
all that. That was great, great to see. I think Marcus and
Sydney should be hooking up at not Sydney and farm farm and I was waiting
for that moment when they were gonna kiss or something. Yeah side and krm,
yeah, I don't know, no, no, but anyway, I
Yeah, a few moments that I really loved, especially Tina. My god,
Tina was just perfect. Yeah. I would love to see Eliza Colinsayes
get a non nomination for this. That episode and Aoadbris directed that episode,
and it was actually very beautifully I was I was watching that and I was
like, oh wow, she directed that I just you know, without going
into it, and you know that there's nothing We've all many of us have
had those moments. But I have been there with a stack of resumes in
my hands. I'm wondering what the fuck I was dealing with my life.
And like when she walks, God walks up to that office building, I
know, and it just looms over her. Yes, yes, just beautifully
done. Everything, the way people treated her rare, everything that say television
gets that level of hopelessness, across that level of despair. She was phenomenal.
She really was. She was phenomenal. It's the greatest moment of the
season three. I think, Yes, now I'm gonna I'm sorry, go
ahead, No, that's it. I mean overall disappointed. I was expecting
more new stuff, not you know, old scenes over and oh every single
Yeah, I want to talk about the thing that I just lost it,
just lost it, and it is in the last episode. But this isn't
really a spoiler. The last episode is forty some minutes long, and at
least twenty five minutes is real life chefs talking about how incredible they are,
and all through the season, in various flashbacks and stuff, they were using
real life chefs to come in so that to show the KARMI was trained by,
like Daniel Blute or whatever. I was okay with those scenes, you
know, the little flashback scenes, and you had these little culinary you know,
superstars in the background or whatever. None of those people can act,
but they weren't. It was fine. Right then they got to the the
guy from what is it laundry or whatever, the restaurant who taught him how
to tie a chicken, to trust a chicken. I forget who his name
is, and I was like, all right, this is going on way
too fucking long, okay, And then we go to the funeral dinner nobody
died, and it's just twenty minutes of all of these and I recognized some
of them. I don't follow the culinary world, although, but it was
very clear that these people were famous because they were not actors. And it
was twenty minutes of them talking about their best dish or their worst dish,
or this or that or the other, and I was like, what the
actual fuck? I am here for the drama. I'm not here for a
documentary about chefs. And it got so when they started talking about the nobility
of their profession. I was like, all right, this and I agree
being a chef is a noble profession, but you are all sounding insanely pretentious
to me right now. Yeah. No, I was just gonna say,
when they're all together talking about, you know, how wonderful they are,
how wonderful they are, their experiences and everything, all I felt was like,
all right, this is like dinner with the Store. It didn't got
sucked. Yeah, he didn't feel like a show. It didn't feel like
a season, you know, it felt it felt like it felt like season
three to me, except for the Fatina's moment. Felt like it they're paying
homage to a show that became very successful. Yeah. It was like a
clip show. Yeah, season long clip show about how great they are when
you buy the DVDs and you get the extra scenes or the you know,
the commentary. I don't know, I don't know. It just felt like,
Okay, this show was amazing, and I'm going to show you how
amazing it is, and you know it's it's got a great cast, and
I will be back for season four, and I believe they have season five
seasons planned, but it is I would not call season three of The Bear
and one of the better shows on television at the moment. I mean,
at the season one and two, it was all prestige, prestige, prestige,
right, And I just don't feel that this is at the level of
a prestige show because the acting is good, but I didn't think the writing
was very good at all, and the directing was so self indulgent that I
there were just too many things wrong with this season. I think they relied
too much on the guest stars, relied too much on the montage and the
montage and the needle drops. See, like I said, pay homage to
a great show. But there, Well, right, but let's move on
with the story. Yeah, I mean I want yeah, it just yeah,
it felt like a season for fans. Yeah, but I mean I
would love it. You know, strip the season, strip the montages,
strip the needle drops out of it, Strip all the guest stars and the
culinary stars out of it, and just tell the Freggin's story. There was
so much crap thrown outto this season that there was no story. We'll see.
Yeah, I do enjoy watching this cast. There were moments that really
really really affected me emotionally. Marcus dealing with his mother's death was one Liza,
I mean Tina. And what's the brother's name? Which one John Burnthal?
Mikey, Yeah, I think so. Yeah, you said his name
earlier, that's all. Oh, Michael, Yes, yeah. I thought
their scenes were great together, but you know, it just didn't pull together.
No, I agree, I agree. Yeah. Reviews in general are
mixed. You know, people will love to show no matter what, and
I think that's the problem here. But you know, it's still a great
show. It's just I don't know, he felt like went down a little
this season. Yeah, right, let us know what you thought of everything
we reviewed today, and we'll be back. Well, we'll be back next
week. Next week is July fourth. We might not be back next week
because no one downloads podcasts on so we'll be back the week after that with
whatever crosses our eyes across the desk. Until then, take care of your
selves, love you mean it. Bye bye bye,