WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.480 --> 00:00:05.960 Welcome to Wine Soundtrack USA. Listen to the passion with which producers narrate their 2 00:00:06.000 --> 00:00:11.279 winery and their world, and thirty answers discover their stories, personalities, and 3 00:00:11.359 --> 00:00:15.679 passions. Hello, friends and listeners of Wine Soundtrack. This is also Levine, 4 00:00:15.720 --> 00:00:19.239 and today I am in the Unquah Valley in Oregon, and I'm sitting 5 00:00:19.239 --> 00:00:24.079 with Dyson Deamara of Hillcrest Vineyard. Dyson, welcome to Wine Soundtrack and tell 6 00:00:24.160 --> 00:00:28.399 us where we are right Well, you're in the beautiful Unqua Valley, which 7 00:00:28.480 --> 00:00:33.640 is in the southern third of the state of Oregon, a little bit below 8 00:00:33.679 --> 00:00:40.799 Eugene. For those of you familiar with the geography of Oregon, we're about 9 00:00:40.840 --> 00:00:43.880 maybe an hour and a half two hours drive north of the California Oregon border, 10 00:00:43.960 --> 00:00:48.159 so north of Medford and that and just a little bit south of Eugene. 11 00:00:48.560 --> 00:00:52.439 So easy to get here from Eugene, yep, for sure. Actually, 12 00:00:52.479 --> 00:00:55.679 one of the nice things about our area is that we have literally millions 13 00:00:55.679 --> 00:00:59.840 of people drive by every year on Highway five. Highway five bisects our appellation, 14 00:01:00.039 --> 00:01:04.519 the Ample Valley appalation. So tell me a little bit about Hillcrest Vineyard. 15 00:01:06.079 --> 00:01:08.959 So Hillcrest vineyard is actually I think it's the greatest wine story no one's 16 00:01:08.959 --> 00:01:12.280 ever heard of in the New World. Well they will now, they will 17 00:01:12.359 --> 00:01:19.439 now thanks to soundtrack. No. It's Hillcrest is the oldest wine grape winery 18 00:01:19.439 --> 00:01:23.560 in the state of Oregon, started by the real father of the Oregon wine 19 00:01:23.560 --> 00:01:26.799 industry, which was a gentleman by the name of Richard Summers who graduated Davis 20 00:01:26.840 --> 00:01:30.200 in the fifties and was told that he needed to go into the coastal valleys 21 00:01:30.200 --> 00:01:34.840 of California to cool things down to make wines of elegance and fine wine, 22 00:01:34.840 --> 00:01:37.799 as it was known, and he decided he was going to come north here 23 00:01:37.799 --> 00:01:41.480 to Oregon, and the professors at that point, many of the famous Amerine 24 00:01:41.560 --> 00:01:45.400 Winkler in this were of the mind that Oregon was really too cold and too 25 00:01:45.480 --> 00:01:49.319 wet, and it was somewhat unexplored. There was some venifera planet here by 26 00:01:49.359 --> 00:01:53.719 Germans, of course, west of Portland in the eighteen hundreds, as well 27 00:01:53.719 --> 00:01:56.159 as in the southern part of the state. And then here in the eighteen 28 00:01:56.200 --> 00:01:59.359 eighties we had two German families that came out of an apple valley that had 29 00:01:59.400 --> 00:02:01.959 worked for Barren. They came up here and planted Vanifita, but Oregon pre 30 00:02:02.000 --> 00:02:08.719 prohibition made mostly fruit wines, some Vnifita wine. And then Richard Summers came 31 00:02:08.800 --> 00:02:14.199 up here in fifty nine and brought cuttings from old man Louis Martini at Stanley 32 00:02:14.280 --> 00:02:16.960 Ranch down in Napa, thirty five varieties, including the first pin and Wan 33 00:02:16.960 --> 00:02:21.120 and reasoning ever planted in Oregon. He rooted those out in fifty nine, 34 00:02:21.159 --> 00:02:23.639 and then the Hillcrest estate where we are today was planted in nineteen sixty one, 35 00:02:23.719 --> 00:02:28.759 and from there he did many first the first nanal steel tanks in Oregon 36 00:02:28.879 --> 00:02:30.280 and some of the first nanles steel tanks in the world. We know that 37 00:02:30.400 --> 00:02:38.240 the first documented use was sixty three for Stainless Steel and Oregon Wine Growers' Association. 38 00:02:38.400 --> 00:02:40.879 He was a co founder of that first pin and Wi. Do you 39 00:02:40.919 --> 00:02:45.599 give you any example of how far out he was He was actually producing commercially 40 00:02:45.639 --> 00:02:49.560 molbeck here in the Umpqua Valley in nineteen sixty four. Wow, So I 41 00:02:49.560 --> 00:02:53.599 mean you think of the Lammett when you think Oregon, and here Unqua Valley 42 00:02:53.719 --> 00:02:57.240 is the home of the first wines exactly, the pioneers, and they're all 43 00:02:57.280 --> 00:03:01.400 very important, but the pioneers of of the Willammette Valley both tasted pin and 44 00:03:01.400 --> 00:03:07.199 Wa here at Hillcrest prior to moving to Oregon, while they were still students 45 00:03:07.199 --> 00:03:10.120 at you see Davis, So that would be David Letting Charles Curry and so 46 00:03:10.879 --> 00:03:14.759 there are many different ways of measuring it. But Richard I mentioned he brought 47 00:03:14.759 --> 00:03:16.439 the cuttings and then fifty nine of pen and Wan, and he came here 48 00:03:16.439 --> 00:03:20.840 primarily to do pin and one reasoning because those were two of course, very 49 00:03:20.840 --> 00:03:23.360 famous variety. Especially Reasling in its day was the most expensive wine in the 50 00:03:23.360 --> 00:03:27.639 world at that point. Great Mosel and Raengo, the good old early days 51 00:03:27.680 --> 00:03:30.039 when reasling was planted everywhere, Yes, exactly, and it'll come back. 52 00:03:30.280 --> 00:03:34.199 The great great ones are classics because they stood the test at the time. 53 00:03:34.639 --> 00:03:37.919 Well tell me, so we're here in this historical property. How many acres 54 00:03:37.960 --> 00:03:44.879 of land do you have? What's planted here? And where are your wines 55 00:03:44.919 --> 00:03:47.759 available? Yeah, so I'll start with the last question. We only sell 56 00:03:47.800 --> 00:03:51.400 out of the winery. Mind us a couple of friends that have restaurants here 57 00:03:51.439 --> 00:03:57.199 in town. So everything is sold on premise here cellar door, Yeah exactly, 58 00:03:57.240 --> 00:04:00.719 and that's very intentional. We're veterans, my wife and I the business. 59 00:04:00.919 --> 00:04:03.199 I've been in it almost forty years, starting mostly in California, but 60 00:04:03.280 --> 00:04:09.039 other places in the world as well. We have many different varieties. We 61 00:04:09.120 --> 00:04:12.199 have kind of almost two wineries under one roof. We only do about twenty 62 00:04:12.199 --> 00:04:15.680 five hundred cases that we bottle. I qrushed about five thousand cases and I 63 00:04:15.759 --> 00:04:18.160 use the human element as selection to kind of whittle down to that twenty five 64 00:04:18.199 --> 00:04:23.920 hundred cases. We do classics that were done here by Richard pinanoa Chardonay, 65 00:04:24.800 --> 00:04:28.360 Cabernet, franc Molbeck, which are truly spectacular here in the Emqua Valley. 66 00:04:28.680 --> 00:04:31.000 But we also one of the things that brought us into this area was doing 67 00:04:31.040 --> 00:04:35.120 research climate research on Noah, looking at Piamonte in what areas of the world 68 00:04:35.160 --> 00:04:39.199 came closest to it. In Emquia Valley was one of those. So we 69 00:04:39.279 --> 00:04:43.519 have a project called Pasokalina, which is a play on hillcrest, which means 70 00:04:43.560 --> 00:04:47.879 crazy hill. We have Sangavesi Barbera which has been grown here also since sixty 71 00:04:47.920 --> 00:04:54.360 one. We Toroldego, we have We've just planted ski at Patina. We've 72 00:04:54.360 --> 00:04:58.920 got Frasier in that and so there's it's really yeah, yeah exactly. I 73 00:04:58.920 --> 00:05:01.319 mean the grape well known, but the grape that really built the reputation of 74 00:05:01.360 --> 00:05:04.920 Piamonte. I mean the great burrows were initially Frasia and you begin to see 75 00:05:04.920 --> 00:05:11.279 great producers. My daughter worked for a producer in Bussia, Finocchio, and 76 00:05:11.720 --> 00:05:14.519 they've gone back to producing very high quality of Frasier. And you see some 77 00:05:14.560 --> 00:05:17.199 of the other traditional Borgonio and that they're beginning to produce like very very high 78 00:05:17.279 --> 00:05:20.519 in Frasier, that it's not just a simple kind of sparkling red wine. 79 00:05:20.839 --> 00:05:24.319 Right. And how many acres do you have planted? Yeah? We have. 80 00:05:24.600 --> 00:05:27.759 We farm about forty acres on three different properties. This is the coolest 81 00:05:27.759 --> 00:05:30.199 site that we have. It's a higher elevation site, which at this latitude 82 00:05:30.319 --> 00:05:33.319 we are at about eight hundred and fifty feet and the thousand foot would be 83 00:05:33.360 --> 00:05:38.360 the cutoff where you can grow grapes from a frost standpoint. We have pin 84 00:05:38.399 --> 00:05:43.079 Andoa. This estate's mostly pin Andoi. I've got Cabernet, franc Mulbeck, 85 00:05:44.439 --> 00:05:47.040 a little bit of Sarah and then I've got on all three properties that we 86 00:05:47.079 --> 00:05:50.240 have, I have a library of unusual varieties of anything from n I should 87 00:05:50.240 --> 00:05:55.439 say unusual, but I've got things like from Malvazia to the ski a Patina 88 00:05:55.439 --> 00:05:58.519 we got we grew out that that plant material for own crafting and that, 89 00:05:58.600 --> 00:06:00.959 so we have a lot of other things. The other properties tend to have 90 00:06:00.000 --> 00:06:02.680 they're a little bit warmer, so we tend to have more kind of big 91 00:06:02.720 --> 00:06:05.879 bodied reds in that. But this is an area really of exploration. So 92 00:06:05.879 --> 00:06:10.399 the beautiful thing is this area. It's all seventy five percent hillside. It's 93 00:06:10.439 --> 00:06:14.160 got a wide range of climate, very moderate rainfall, similar to the north 94 00:06:14.199 --> 00:06:16.720 coast of California, and there's much like the Russian River. There's many different 95 00:06:16.759 --> 00:06:20.040 pockets. You can do everything from very cool varieties. You know, we 96 00:06:20.079 --> 00:06:23.879 look at the west side of the Russian River versus you know, you get 97 00:06:23.920 --> 00:06:26.959 into areas where the old vine zen is in Dry Creek Valley and that this 98 00:06:27.079 --> 00:06:30.240 area is like that. The challenge is nobody's really planted many of these places. 99 00:06:30.279 --> 00:06:32.399 You've got to go explore for yourself. And just really quickly you had 100 00:06:32.439 --> 00:06:36.639 told me there are how many different soil types here? Yeah, So to 101 00:06:36.639 --> 00:06:41.240 put it in and or to frame it, NAPA has thirty two, which 102 00:06:41.279 --> 00:06:43.399 is very unusually. When I worked from Adabi, we went around the world 103 00:06:43.439 --> 00:06:46.519 and talked about that there's over one hundred and fifty different soil types in the 104 00:06:46.560 --> 00:06:50.680 Umpqua Valley and so it's as far as we know, it's more soil types 105 00:06:50.720 --> 00:06:56.000 than any wine region of the world. But playing alongside that is the topography. 106 00:06:56.079 --> 00:06:58.759 So it's known as the Indians called it, the hundred Valleys. And 107 00:06:58.800 --> 00:07:00.519 so the thing is you have these rules hills, there's almost nothing flat, 108 00:07:00.560 --> 00:07:04.360 so much like Piamonte. So that gives you this almost like facets on a 109 00:07:04.399 --> 00:07:09.439 diamond. The different exposures, your different lenses of soils mixed different ways, 110 00:07:09.439 --> 00:07:13.279 and so that's part of the complexity and it's part of the beauty. But 111 00:07:13.360 --> 00:07:15.879 it's also one of the reasons we're probably not as well known because you don't 112 00:07:15.879 --> 00:07:19.240 have a lot of the larger wine reason that are good at marketing and building 113 00:07:19.240 --> 00:07:25.120 brand coming here because it is very fragmented. Yeah, so tell me something. 114 00:07:25.360 --> 00:07:29.360 What is one of your first memories relevant to wine. I mean, 115 00:07:29.399 --> 00:07:31.240 oh, I understand you you were raised as a Mormon, so I'm sure 116 00:07:31.240 --> 00:07:34.680 wine was not introduced too early. Yeah, you don't want to really know. 117 00:07:34.759 --> 00:07:42.360 The first one that was in high school with two Portuguese brothers. Yeah, 118 00:07:42.040 --> 00:07:46.399 my first memory of wine really, So it would be so I'm a 119 00:07:46.439 --> 00:07:49.360 great lover of Mozle reasoning as I think a lot of people that are familiar 120 00:07:49.360 --> 00:07:53.279 with fine wine around the world in that, and it's one of my go 121 00:07:53.319 --> 00:07:57.000 to wines. But when I was eighteen years old, I came back from 122 00:07:57.319 --> 00:08:00.399 I think it was one or two months being in college in southern californi Ornia, 123 00:08:00.680 --> 00:08:03.560 and went up to Lake Tahoe and went to a friend's house and his 124 00:08:03.680 --> 00:08:09.079 parents had this beautiful reasling and I began drinking beer in that in high school 125 00:08:09.120 --> 00:08:11.800 in that, but it really wasn't exposed to wine, especially fine wine. 126 00:08:11.839 --> 00:08:15.600 And I remember sitting out in it was a north shore, sitting out on 127 00:08:15.639 --> 00:08:18.759 their deck overlooking Lake Tahoe and tasting that wine. And I wasn't sure if 128 00:08:18.800 --> 00:08:22.759 it was the view of everything else was so perfect, or was that wine. 129 00:08:22.959 --> 00:08:24.680 Now I look back and I realized it was the whole picture. It 130 00:08:24.720 --> 00:08:28.920 was so beautiful. And to this day I make can almost smell like the 131 00:08:28.920 --> 00:08:31.840 greatest wine experiences I've had in my life. And I've got, you know, 132 00:08:33.480 --> 00:08:35.039 several, but the benchmarks I can tell you who was sitting there. 133 00:08:35.200 --> 00:08:39.200 What we ate? You know what you're wearing kind of thing, and I 134 00:08:39.200 --> 00:08:41.840 mean I have there's one, the one that made me want to grow peanut 135 00:08:41.840 --> 00:08:46.440 and win. And that's how we ended up eventually here at Namco Valley's We 136 00:08:46.519 --> 00:08:50.679 had a small vineyard winery at the end of Soda Canyon Road in Napa Valley. 137 00:08:50.879 --> 00:08:52.440 And I was a great collector of Bordeaux and had a lot of eighty 138 00:08:52.480 --> 00:08:54.519 two s eighty five to eighty six is and that, and a good friend 139 00:08:54.519 --> 00:08:58.120 of mine that I worked with at Madavi came up and helped us. I 140 00:08:58.200 --> 00:09:00.399 picked a little bit of wine on the side. I sold most of my 141 00:09:00.440 --> 00:09:03.840 fruit at that point. And one day it was we came in from harvest 142 00:09:03.919 --> 00:09:07.200 and it was another cool harvest day, nap about it was like one hundred 143 00:09:07.200 --> 00:09:13.320 and twelve degrees and my wife we made a wild mushroom risotto and I had 144 00:09:13.440 --> 00:09:16.360 a bunch of old Bordeaux and that we were drinking, and my friend bought 145 00:09:16.360 --> 00:09:22.200 the seventy nine fevallet Mazie Chambertin and you know a big house slash negosha on 146 00:09:22.320 --> 00:09:28.360 firm wines that are are are very beautiful but not known as top and in 147 00:09:28.399 --> 00:09:31.960 their class, i'd say sometimes. But anyway, I had the seventy nine 148 00:09:31.000 --> 00:09:33.879 and I tasted that wine. That wine changed my life, and I knew 149 00:09:33.879 --> 00:09:37.639 at that point was the aha moment. That was the aha, that was 150 00:09:37.639 --> 00:09:41.039 the aha. I've got to do pen and Wall And so we spent four 151 00:09:41.120 --> 00:09:43.440 years looking around the world. We entered into a contract to cellar property in 152 00:09:43.519 --> 00:09:46.799 Napa Valley, looked at Annapolis over by sea ranch on the coast, and 153 00:09:46.840 --> 00:09:50.559 that we're an escrown a piece of property, and that fell apart. And 154 00:09:50.600 --> 00:09:54.000 from there we went to you know, Mendoza, Argentina. We were in 155 00:09:54.080 --> 00:09:58.799 the our valley of Germany. Came very close to kind of settling in there. 156 00:09:58.279 --> 00:10:01.120 We went up down the west coast looking for places. I never stopped 157 00:10:01.120 --> 00:10:05.759 here. I drove through the Umquia Valley, but I never stopped here until 158 00:10:05.799 --> 00:10:07.279 the very end of that trek. And we were in Lemieux, France, 159 00:10:07.360 --> 00:10:11.360 and all kinds of places and that, and I stopped in here and literally 160 00:10:11.360 --> 00:10:15.240 the first day, you know, the old saying is when you see it, 161 00:10:15.320 --> 00:10:18.120 you know it. It's hard to define. The first day was here. 162 00:10:18.200 --> 00:10:20.679 I looked at the topography of where we were and it was being like 163 00:10:20.720 --> 00:10:22.799 once again, west side Russian River. I looked at the soils. I'm 164 00:10:22.879 --> 00:10:26.039 very much a dirt person, and so that gold Bridge sandy loam, and 165 00:10:26.080 --> 00:10:30.120 the soils like you get on the west side of Napa Valley where it can 166 00:10:30.240 --> 00:10:33.440 rain for three weeks straight and it's dry for an afternoon and there's dust, 167 00:10:33.679 --> 00:10:37.000 and you know, those are really deep, warm, very dry soils the 168 00:10:37.120 --> 00:10:39.440 drive wine quality and finesse. And so I saw that up on this bench 169 00:10:39.440 --> 00:10:43.360 here at Hillcrest, and three years later that happened. Wow. So you've 170 00:10:43.399 --> 00:10:46.799 traveled the world, and I know you do. And on top of that, 171 00:10:46.960 --> 00:10:50.759 you don't just travel around the world and drink great wine. You make 172 00:10:50.799 --> 00:10:54.159 wine in other places. Just really briefly, where else are you making wine? 173 00:10:54.200 --> 00:10:56.559 Yeah, So I'm a dirt guy, said, So that's a perfect 174 00:10:56.600 --> 00:11:01.240 segue into that. Now we're gonna go from dirt a big dirt, which 175 00:11:01.279 --> 00:11:03.720 is rocks. So I'm a slate guy. I love slate. That blove 176 00:11:03.720 --> 00:11:09.799 affair began with the Mosel Valley again, the great you know, blue gray 177 00:11:09.080 --> 00:11:13.679 red slate of the Mosel Valley, and that we do wines in Russion, 178 00:11:13.960 --> 00:11:16.320 both in France, in the Saint Paul defen Away we do a carryon based 179 00:11:16.320 --> 00:11:20.159 wine, and then in the little village of Polboleda in pray or Walk, 180 00:11:20.200 --> 00:11:24.840 we do two different wines. The primary wine is carrying one hundred year old 181 00:11:24.840 --> 00:11:26.919 carrying on fine with a little bit of garnacha splashing, and then I do 182 00:11:28.320 --> 00:11:31.840 a garnacha kind of reverse with a little bit of carryon. We also do 183 00:11:31.879 --> 00:11:35.360 some wine occasionally on and off in Italy out of Acte, down in Victoria, 184 00:11:35.440 --> 00:11:41.559 down in Sicily, we do a little bit of one on and off. 185 00:11:41.559 --> 00:11:43.559 In Austria. That's the one area that we're kind of in and out 186 00:11:43.600 --> 00:11:46.799 of, and that's the one area that actually it's it's stone, but it's 187 00:11:46.840 --> 00:11:50.799 not slate. We do Blo Francish and spy guilt on and off with a 188 00:11:50.799 --> 00:11:54.679 friend a lot of these people. For example, in Polo Leeda, it's 189 00:11:54.720 --> 00:11:56.919 a friend of mine that I met like thirty five years ago in Napa Valley 190 00:11:58.039 --> 00:12:00.919 and there are people that we were both young people working. They'd come over 191 00:12:01.000 --> 00:12:03.720 to work. Same thing. In Austria, it's that same connection. My 192 00:12:03.799 --> 00:12:11.200 connection in Brucion is a guy that I met in Zurich. There's an import 193 00:12:11.200 --> 00:12:13.600 of very famous import in Zurich had a bunch of night clubs, and he 194 00:12:13.639 --> 00:12:16.759 and I kind of hit it off. I was much younger, and so 195 00:12:16.320 --> 00:12:18.519 we went out one night for dinner before we went out to the clubs. 196 00:12:18.519 --> 00:12:22.080 Then he brought some of his friends and there was this little kind of shy 197 00:12:22.200 --> 00:12:26.200 Swiss guy and kid, and so we talked and kind of hit it off. 198 00:12:26.200 --> 00:12:28.679 And ten years later I walk into a cellar in this little village of 199 00:12:28.679 --> 00:12:31.279 Saint Paul de fen Away and here he is a Swiss kid. I mean, 200 00:12:31.320 --> 00:12:35.360 there's nobody at that point. Now there's some Americans in that area, 201 00:12:35.480 --> 00:12:39.559 Mari. But I walk in and it's it's Maurice, and I, oh 202 00:12:39.600 --> 00:12:41.759 my god, what are you doing here? And he just dropped everything in 203 00:12:41.799 --> 00:12:45.360 life and kind of the same thing that you know. I always say that 204 00:12:45.480 --> 00:12:50.360 sometimes you don't choose it, It chooses you, and it manifests itself through 205 00:12:50.360 --> 00:12:52.159 you. And I feel so blessed. Especially being raised Mormon, I was 206 00:12:52.200 --> 00:12:54.799 never exposed to this, and it just happened to be the first couple of 207 00:12:54.840 --> 00:12:58.639 times that you know, wine crossed my path. I kind of looked at 208 00:12:58.679 --> 00:13:01.080 it and followed it down the street. And it's been such a beautiful thing, 209 00:13:01.399 --> 00:13:05.039 because the legacy of one. I've got young kids that are involved in 210 00:13:05.080 --> 00:13:07.919 the wine business in that and that's you know, we work for the Frescobaldi's 211 00:13:07.960 --> 00:13:13.879 for a while on the Luce Lucente projects in that and when in the family's 212 00:13:13.919 --> 00:13:16.279 private dining room there were frescoes of family members that were popes, and you 213 00:13:16.320 --> 00:13:20.200 know, you have family that's been in the business thirty generations. You start 214 00:13:20.200 --> 00:13:22.440 thinking of the legacy of your family being part of that. That's a very 215 00:13:22.519 --> 00:13:26.679 magical thing that in the New World we just begin to taste that a little 216 00:13:26.679 --> 00:13:30.240 bit with a few few wineries that are like third generation. But you know, 217 00:13:30.279 --> 00:13:31.720 that's one of the exciting things about Hillcrest is that, you know, 218 00:13:33.200 --> 00:13:35.559 I believe this will be here in four hundred years and maybe my family's involved 219 00:13:35.559 --> 00:13:39.840 for two generations or five, or hopefully more than that, but still the 220 00:13:39.919 --> 00:13:43.399 legacy of being part of something like that is such an incredible thing. Yeah, 221 00:13:43.399 --> 00:13:46.399 well, you know you'll be two generations because the second generation is already 222 00:13:46.399 --> 00:13:50.360 involved in amen. So you're mentioning that you have you make wine around the 223 00:13:50.399 --> 00:13:54.039 world, and you have all these friends around the world. So if we 224 00:13:54.039 --> 00:13:56.679 were to come into your home or we're here in your office where you got 225 00:13:56.679 --> 00:14:01.840 a lot of bottles. What kind of wines do would we find in your 226 00:14:01.840 --> 00:14:05.080 cellar? What do you collect? What do you drink on a regular basis? 227 00:14:05.919 --> 00:14:07.200 I do collect a little bit. I don't collect. When I think 228 00:14:07.240 --> 00:14:09.759 I moved here, I had probably one hundred and fifty cases, a lot 229 00:14:09.759 --> 00:14:13.080 of you know, Burgundy, Bordeaux, aroone, that kind of thing. 230 00:14:13.720 --> 00:14:18.840 Today I drink a lot of wines that are high acid, very delicate. 231 00:14:20.559 --> 00:14:24.639 I drink kind of non classic varieties from a New world standpoint, they're not 232 00:14:24.679 --> 00:14:26.600 the varieties, you know. I mean, I enjoy Burgundy, Bordeaux, 233 00:14:26.600 --> 00:14:31.159 this kind of thing, but you know, pieti rosso is something we've been 234 00:14:31.240 --> 00:14:33.519 drinking a lot of lately. So it's kind of new flavors. Kind of 235 00:14:33.519 --> 00:14:35.799 like with food that when you're young, you have your favorite dish and if 236 00:14:35.799 --> 00:14:37.159 I could, I'd always eat that, And by the time most people are 237 00:14:37.159 --> 00:14:39.200 fifty years old, it's like, oh, yesterday we had sushi, and 238 00:14:39.240 --> 00:14:45.519 today I want barbecue. And so it's the beauty of exploring different places of 239 00:14:45.559 --> 00:14:46.840 the world. And there's so many, you know, they say there's between 240 00:14:46.840 --> 00:14:50.120 four thousand and eight thousand great varieties in the world, and Italy has twenty 241 00:14:50.120 --> 00:14:52.879 eight hundred. Italy is a place just to go in and mine and just 242 00:14:52.919 --> 00:14:56.919 see. There's so many beautiful, distinctive, unique things. And so we 243 00:14:56.000 --> 00:15:01.080 drink a lot of Italian and this is also heavily once is what we produce. 244 00:15:01.480 --> 00:15:03.639 You know, I always say you are what you drink. And it's 245 00:15:03.639 --> 00:15:07.200 important to taste the great stuff because you have to know what's possible and what 246 00:15:07.399 --> 00:15:09.679 is held on a pedestal. But once you've done enough of that, you 247 00:15:09.720 --> 00:15:13.720 can see there's so many beautiful, beautiful wines in the world that really get 248 00:15:13.759 --> 00:15:16.879 no traction in the marketplace. And so first requirement of great wines it tastes 249 00:15:16.919 --> 00:15:20.559 good. And so there's there. There are many things to be learned in 250 00:15:20.600 --> 00:15:24.080 different places and meeting people, and I think you know, it's the human 251 00:15:24.120 --> 00:15:28.519 aspect of that that's the most important to us. Is there anything you opened 252 00:15:28.559 --> 00:15:33.600 up recently last night for dinner or this week that stood out? Oh? 253 00:15:33.639 --> 00:15:39.159 Boy? Yeah, So I drink a lot of game. I've got this 254 00:15:39.240 --> 00:15:43.200 theory that winemakers, you know, you see this in Piamonte, you see 255 00:15:43.200 --> 00:15:46.519 it in Burgundy where they drink their daily wines tend to be variety, these 256 00:15:46.600 --> 00:15:50.159 red wines that are real high and malic acid, you know, Barbara Gammey 257 00:15:50.440 --> 00:15:54.879 this kind of thing. And so we had a beautiful twenty twenty Gammet we 258 00:15:54.960 --> 00:15:58.240 had this. I bought a case or two of it and drank most of 259 00:15:58.279 --> 00:16:00.240 it and had, you know, with that one bottle kind of in the 260 00:16:00.279 --> 00:16:06.840 back of a crewe Boujelai. That from Griffi and that's in Estates, a 261 00:16:06.840 --> 00:16:11.279 family that was in the southern part of Boujelai and their son who's a little 262 00:16:11.320 --> 00:16:15.200 bit older and is unmarried. They settled him to the north and they bought 263 00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:18.919 a great estate from a small, small, old producer that was the end 264 00:16:18.960 --> 00:16:22.639 of the line. And they produce some really stunning, stunning wines. And 265 00:16:22.919 --> 00:16:26.559 we had a flury from them that it's not the it's not the village. 266 00:16:26.559 --> 00:16:29.919 They do more gold flury in the and mulvall and the whole package. But 267 00:16:30.440 --> 00:16:34.279 that wine was so delicate and transparent, and the way people go from drinking 268 00:16:34.320 --> 00:16:37.679 white to red and sweet to dry, I think people go from power to 269 00:16:37.720 --> 00:16:41.600 elegance and to taste those wines, and I think sometimes they're so elegant they're 270 00:16:41.679 --> 00:16:44.559 kind of over they're missed and their overlooked. But those are the wines that 271 00:16:44.960 --> 00:16:48.120 you know, you think about when you bring this up in that and so 272 00:16:48.159 --> 00:16:51.200 we drink a lot of very very unusual wines. We also import some of 273 00:16:51.240 --> 00:16:52.600 the wines. We bring in our own wines through own import company. But 274 00:16:52.639 --> 00:16:56.080 I also import friends like mosles. By import more mosle than anything else. 275 00:16:56.159 --> 00:17:00.200 And I've got all kinds of beautiful, beautiful flavors from Moses. Yes, 276 00:17:00.279 --> 00:17:03.359 I'm drinking a lovely mocle reasoning right now that you make right y, yeah, 277 00:17:03.119 --> 00:17:06.519 yeah, this this is food. Or you know, we're very traditional. 278 00:17:06.799 --> 00:17:10.119 You've seen in the cellar. We use body. You know, several 279 00:17:10.200 --> 00:17:14.160 years ago you couldn't buy body here, and so I imported my own body. 280 00:17:14.200 --> 00:17:19.039 I put together a couple of containers of uh what are we were uh 281 00:17:19.160 --> 00:17:22.680 in leaders and I'll give you gallons like four hundred and forty gallons and thirteen 282 00:17:22.720 --> 00:17:27.559 hundred and twenty gallon five thousand liter cask in that. And so the same 283 00:17:27.640 --> 00:17:30.440 thing we do in Europe, and that is like looking making krinon. That's 284 00:17:30.519 --> 00:17:34.119 kind of the old variety as it was known of like prayer rot. And 285 00:17:34.240 --> 00:17:37.839 so you know, grenache was the hot thing. The Parker hundred point wines 286 00:17:37.839 --> 00:17:41.599 are all grenache based. Now you see those top consultants in that area. 287 00:17:41.599 --> 00:17:45.599 Everybody's doing carnon and most that unfortunately has been pulled out. Same thing with 288 00:17:45.839 --> 00:17:48.839 the reasoning we have as fooder and a fooder. The Romans shipped wine. 289 00:17:48.839 --> 00:17:52.880 It traded wine the way we trade oil today. So like the Mayflower was 290 00:17:52.880 --> 00:17:56.119 a wine trading vessel, even modified for human passage to the New World. 291 00:17:56.160 --> 00:17:59.559 So that was something that you know around the world. Wine was traded when 292 00:17:59.559 --> 00:18:03.240 you weren't the English and the French navies those ships were all built to handle 293 00:18:03.279 --> 00:18:07.960 wine as well. Well. The Romans transferred wine in one thousand liter barrels. 294 00:18:07.000 --> 00:18:10.680 What they call the ton to know is the French version of it. 295 00:18:11.039 --> 00:18:12.640 If you look at the Germans, German call it a food. And so 296 00:18:12.759 --> 00:18:18.119 we make every year at a Trittenheim Apoteca in the Middle Mosle with blue slate. 297 00:18:19.240 --> 00:18:23.519 This beautiful, beautiful wine gets fermented in two foods, thousand liter barrels 298 00:18:23.559 --> 00:18:27.160 built in nineteen thirty three and nineteen forty five. Well, as I said 299 00:18:27.160 --> 00:18:30.839 this, I'm going to ask you a question. Do you think there's a 300 00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:37.200 such thing as a perfect variety. Uh no, thank god. Yeah, 301 00:18:37.279 --> 00:18:41.480 I say the greatest wines in the world are perfectly flawed, and it's the 302 00:18:41.480 --> 00:18:44.559 flaws that make them interesting. So it's much like diamonds. You know, 303 00:18:44.720 --> 00:18:48.200 a perfect diamond is cubic zirconia. It's something that's nearly perfect, is so 304 00:18:48.279 --> 00:18:52.640 expensive and beautiful and distinctive and unique. And I think you know what separates 305 00:18:52.839 --> 00:18:56.799 you know, Lake Combe, Pollii Montchet from Le Montchet. That's beautiful and 306 00:18:57.000 --> 00:19:00.920 those things. It's a fingerprint and it's that finger and I think that's that's 307 00:19:02.000 --> 00:19:04.720 part of our you know. Rigai, the great Burgundian wine maker said, 308 00:19:04.759 --> 00:19:08.880 the trick is there no tricks? And so this concept of finding if you 309 00:19:08.920 --> 00:19:12.799 make wines that are driven by sight, of really kind of standing back and 310 00:19:12.799 --> 00:19:18.000 not using technique, which could be so beautiful and build such consistency into wine, 311 00:19:18.079 --> 00:19:21.079 but it can also take away those flaws that make something very interesting. 312 00:19:21.880 --> 00:19:26.000 Well, So if you appreciate the flaws, and you've worked for a large 313 00:19:26.000 --> 00:19:30.400 company, work from Mundabi for years, you're here making wine that you sell 314 00:19:30.440 --> 00:19:33.640 out of your cellar door, so people have to seek you out a little 315 00:19:33.640 --> 00:19:37.039 more. So I'm curious with all that experience. What's your opinion on wine 316 00:19:37.039 --> 00:19:41.519 critics and scores. I think it's a gateway. I think it's it's important 317 00:19:41.559 --> 00:19:44.680 people enter wine from all different especially in a culture like ours. It's not 318 00:19:44.720 --> 00:19:48.759 really a wine culture historically, But I think that it's also important to empower 319 00:19:48.839 --> 00:19:52.319 people to drink what they like. You know, I can think back to 320 00:19:52.480 --> 00:19:56.240 reading the old old Wine Spectator when it was like a newspaper form, and 321 00:19:56.279 --> 00:19:59.799 there was a wine that I came across that my tasteed not really liked. 322 00:19:59.839 --> 00:20:03.319 It was a winery out of Alexander Valley, their eighty two Cabernet sauvignon, 323 00:20:03.559 --> 00:20:07.160 and that wine was seller selection, and this is the one I think about 324 00:20:07.200 --> 00:20:10.359 like ninety six points, and this wine's supposed to age incredibly well in that 325 00:20:10.480 --> 00:20:15.039 so I took my little meager college, you know, pocketbook, and I 326 00:20:15.079 --> 00:20:21.000 bought six bottles that I never liked that wine, and and I'm I'm very 327 00:20:21.079 --> 00:20:22.839 lucky for this. But at that point it hit me as is kind of 328 00:20:23.240 --> 00:20:26.200 you know, what I like is not necessarily what somebody else likes. There's 329 00:20:27.079 --> 00:20:32.359 Matt Kramer says that the definition of a connoisseur or somebody knows the difference between 330 00:20:32.440 --> 00:20:34.160 what they like and what's good. And I think that's so so important, 331 00:20:34.160 --> 00:20:38.160 and I think a lot of us as wine producers suffer from the wine expert 332 00:20:38.279 --> 00:20:41.759 that what I like is what's good instead of being a critic, you know. 333 00:20:41.759 --> 00:20:44.359 I think about the old like Clive Coats in England, where I'd go 334 00:20:44.400 --> 00:20:47.559 to a state for three days and spend one day with the viticulturalists, one 335 00:20:47.599 --> 00:20:49.480 day with the analogist, one day with the owner, and you'd write a 336 00:20:49.559 --> 00:20:53.279 little article saying this is where the property is, these are their vineyards, 337 00:20:53.359 --> 00:20:56.000 this is where what they've done, they want to evolved, this direction, 338 00:20:56.079 --> 00:21:00.119 they're looking at these techniques. To me, that was so beautiful. And 339 00:21:00.400 --> 00:21:03.000 I understand, you know, a culture that you know, wants to know 340 00:21:03.119 --> 00:21:07.480 the ten best ten best in that. But I think the beauty is and 341 00:21:07.559 --> 00:21:08.960 this is where you know, Europe comes a little bit our direction. But 342 00:21:10.079 --> 00:21:11.640 this whole concept of eat and drink what you like, you don't have to 343 00:21:11.759 --> 00:21:15.880 know that much about it. I was always amazed at how little most European 344 00:21:15.920 --> 00:21:18.960 wine connoisseurs knew about wine and America. We're so technically, we know, 345 00:21:18.200 --> 00:21:21.359 okay, in this part of the room they do this is the base. 346 00:21:21.440 --> 00:21:23.359 And these three varieties are typically the ones that are blended in and going to 347 00:21:23.440 --> 00:21:26.079 people sellers that they have incredible sellers. What would you like to taste? 348 00:21:26.079 --> 00:21:29.559 So let's try this, do you know the blend? And they look at 349 00:21:29.599 --> 00:21:32.440 you looking from another planet. It's like they get their dad bought wine from 350 00:21:32.440 --> 00:21:34.279 that winery. They love that wine and they buy it. And so I 351 00:21:34.319 --> 00:21:37.119 think it's something we'll move towards that. And it's not a right or wrong, 352 00:21:37.200 --> 00:21:41.039 but I think that you know, always most important is the place and 353 00:21:41.119 --> 00:21:45.200 the producer and the intigenal that falls behind. Well, you said that the 354 00:21:45.400 --> 00:21:49.319 difference is knowing what a great wine is and knowing what a good wine is 355 00:21:49.359 --> 00:21:53.160 what you like. So I'm curious. This is a simple one word answer. 356 00:21:55.200 --> 00:22:02.119 As a consumer. Redwetter rose, white white for sure. Yeah, 357 00:22:02.200 --> 00:22:03.799 yeah, I drink a lot more. I mean i'd probably drink seventy percent 358 00:22:03.880 --> 00:22:07.839 wife white. My wife is about ninety nine percent red. I used to 359 00:22:07.920 --> 00:22:11.960 drink a lot more red, and I've found that is I have gotten older 360 00:22:11.000 --> 00:22:15.079 in that just white wine. I love to drink wine, and so the 361 00:22:15.160 --> 00:22:17.640 thing is to drink it and not feel it the next day, you know, 362 00:22:17.720 --> 00:22:21.960 to have two three glasses or whatever, and even within white like certain 363 00:22:22.039 --> 00:22:23.519 varieties that I you know, I love acid. I think most of us, 364 00:22:23.720 --> 00:22:27.319 the more we drink wine, the more we love acidity. And so 365 00:22:27.759 --> 00:22:32.680 you know, those those real high acid crisp whites from cooler areas are so 366 00:22:32.839 --> 00:22:37.960 spectacular that still are sparkling still yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm 367 00:22:38.000 --> 00:22:41.880 married to one of the sparklers, though. I mean, like I remember 368 00:22:41.920 --> 00:22:47.640 being at Melissa me Bio and we've been like one week tasting at wineries on 369 00:22:47.720 --> 00:22:51.119 the front end of this big wine show in Montpellier, and I think there 370 00:22:51.160 --> 00:22:53.160 were five hundred vendors there and we spent three days walking table to table and 371 00:22:53.200 --> 00:22:56.160 everybody's porn. You say, can I taste maybe two or three year wines? 372 00:22:56.160 --> 00:22:59.359 And the boy You're like, they're twelve. And so we did that, 373 00:22:59.480 --> 00:23:00.920 did that. At the very end, my palate actually hurt from all 374 00:23:00.960 --> 00:23:04.920 the acid, Like my palate was like it hurt to put a little taste 375 00:23:04.960 --> 00:23:07.799 to one in your mouth. I'm sure a lot of us have experienced that, 376 00:23:07.960 --> 00:23:10.079 Like you go to Tuscany for long enough and you see that kind of 377 00:23:10.119 --> 00:23:15.000 thing. Yeah, And and so my wife continues, like we've had somebody 378 00:23:15.000 --> 00:23:18.200 who walked by a table with sparkling wader champagne producer. I think it was, 379 00:23:18.559 --> 00:23:19.960 and they would you taste them? Like, I can't do it? 380 00:23:21.000 --> 00:23:22.039 And that My wife's oh yeah, yeah, it tastes simil, and I'm 381 00:23:22.079 --> 00:23:25.480 just like, wow, it should taste sparkling. It doesn't matter what the 382 00:23:26.279 --> 00:23:30.279 challenge is, you know. Yeah, so you you you were talking about, 383 00:23:30.440 --> 00:23:33.920 you know, going into a cellar in Europe where people just open up 384 00:23:33.920 --> 00:23:36.960 lines. They don't think about the grapes. They're not thinking about all the 385 00:23:37.039 --> 00:23:41.240 things that we tend to think about as a consumer here. So I'm wondering 386 00:23:41.319 --> 00:23:45.079 how you look at pairing wine and food. Do you look for rules? 387 00:23:45.240 --> 00:23:48.640 Are you a come what may are there rules to follow or their guidance you 388 00:23:48.720 --> 00:23:52.119 can share? What do you do when you're cooking? Yeah, yeah, 389 00:23:52.279 --> 00:23:55.440 I've like all of this. I've spent a lot of time thinking about this. 390 00:23:55.440 --> 00:23:57.319 I think there are many theories and most of them are great ninety percent 391 00:23:57.359 --> 00:24:02.200 of the time, and then they suck ten percent. You know, when 392 00:24:02.240 --> 00:24:03.720 you get this is a great theory, you know, the amami thing, 393 00:24:03.799 --> 00:24:07.200 but you know, wine doesn't go with cheese kind of thing. Okay, 394 00:24:07.240 --> 00:24:12.000 that's a problem. But I think that you know, once you've eaten and 395 00:24:12.160 --> 00:24:17.200 drank enough and paid attention to it, it's it's it's literally you don't think 396 00:24:17.200 --> 00:24:19.720 about it. It's a reflective action. It's much like on a warm day, 397 00:24:19.799 --> 00:24:22.119 maybe you say, oh, I have a cobb salad and a nice 398 00:24:22.160 --> 00:24:25.279 tea. You don't think about, oh, this as both white delicate, 399 00:24:25.400 --> 00:24:27.359 or you're having Maybe somebody says, so I just made some fresh chocolate chip 400 00:24:27.400 --> 00:24:30.440 cookies. You don't think, oh, I want creamy milk to kind of 401 00:24:30.480 --> 00:24:33.759 balance it out kind of those textures and that. So, but I think 402 00:24:33.759 --> 00:24:34.960 if I was to come up with the rule, it would be a first 403 00:24:36.000 --> 00:24:37.440 rule for to drink, which you like. When I used to travel a 404 00:24:37.480 --> 00:24:41.079 lot, i'd go out with the dinner with people, and that the people 405 00:24:41.119 --> 00:24:44.920 that I always kind of came closest to are related to the most. Where 406 00:24:44.920 --> 00:24:47.640 the people that picked up the wineless, they ordered the wine and then they 407 00:24:47.720 --> 00:24:51.519 looked at the venue. That's my kind of priority right there. Yeah, 408 00:24:51.599 --> 00:24:53.720 so you pick your wine and then you pick your food that's gonna fit with 409 00:24:53.799 --> 00:24:56.960 the wine. Yeah yeah, yeah, And I don't even think about it 410 00:24:56.000 --> 00:25:00.400 because once again, it's it's reflective. It's like and so if I was 411 00:25:00.480 --> 00:25:03.240 going to create use a rule though, I would use texture that I think 412 00:25:03.319 --> 00:25:06.920 that the safest thing is that if you have, you know, like a 413 00:25:06.960 --> 00:25:11.680 piece of chicken and you had it with like a lemon sauce or something something 414 00:25:11.799 --> 00:25:14.480 light, you know, Sovino blanc could be so beautiful. Or if you 415 00:25:14.599 --> 00:25:17.359 had that same piece of chicken grilled with like a little bit of a cream 416 00:25:17.400 --> 00:25:19.319 sauce, like a nice Chardina shabilee, that kind of thing could be nice. 417 00:25:19.480 --> 00:25:22.039 But I think that we get to the point that that's reflexive that I 418 00:25:22.240 --> 00:25:25.559 like, I really don't think about that at all. Like we'll know what 419 00:25:25.599 --> 00:25:27.960 we're cooking the first. The first conversation we have every day my wife and 420 00:25:29.000 --> 00:25:30.559 I is what's for dinner? And then it's Levia, what are you doing 421 00:25:30.599 --> 00:25:33.799 today? Kind of thing, and so we'll know that all day. And 422 00:25:33.920 --> 00:25:36.799 so at that point I just kind of open up, you know. We 423 00:25:36.880 --> 00:25:38.359 have a little enotech that's kind of chilled in that, and then we have 424 00:25:38.440 --> 00:25:41.640 some boxes in a room and stuff, and I go through and kind of 425 00:25:41.720 --> 00:25:42.359 like, oh, that sounds good, that sounds good. I don't think 426 00:25:42.359 --> 00:25:45.039 about, oh, we're having that for dinner. I just think like, 427 00:25:45.079 --> 00:25:48.559 oh, that sounds really good to drink. Yeah, it must be fun 428 00:25:48.599 --> 00:25:52.279 to be in your house. So for somebody who hasn't had the pleasure to 429 00:25:52.440 --> 00:25:56.640 try Hillcrest Vineyard wines yet, what do you think they're missing out on? 430 00:25:56.720 --> 00:26:03.559 I think you're missing out on. What we do is what most people tried 431 00:26:03.599 --> 00:26:06.119 to do for fine wine on the West Coast, like in the fifties and 432 00:26:06.200 --> 00:26:11.160 sixties. I don't use any adjuncts wasn't used one hundred years ago. I 433 00:26:11.240 --> 00:26:14.240 don't use it. So I don't use enzymes, tannins. I don't use 434 00:26:14.279 --> 00:26:17.880 oak powder at the you know, crusher kind of thing. And so I 435 00:26:18.000 --> 00:26:19.759 try to make wines. I say, good wines taste like a grape, 436 00:26:19.799 --> 00:26:22.839 and great wines taste like a place, and so I want my wines to 437 00:26:22.920 --> 00:26:26.000 all taste nice. But the primary driver is I want to wine to smell 438 00:26:26.079 --> 00:26:29.920 and taste like a place. Maybe with the like I was the framer, 439 00:26:30.119 --> 00:26:32.839 I look at the painting and then I stuck the frame on it a little 440 00:26:32.839 --> 00:26:34.599 bit, But I want that to be where you look at that picture for 441 00:26:34.759 --> 00:26:37.720 you know, an hour, turn your head, you don't remember what the 442 00:26:37.759 --> 00:26:41.119 frame looked like. I wanted to add something without really being able to separate 443 00:26:41.160 --> 00:26:42.599 it, and that's a very hard thing to do. We do one hundred 444 00:26:42.599 --> 00:26:47.119 percent dry farm to one hundred percent hillside. So I think it's it's I 445 00:26:47.240 --> 00:26:49.240 think in the modern world of you know, the frenchly good wine has made, 446 00:26:49.279 --> 00:26:52.319 great wine is born, and I very much believe in that wines that 447 00:26:52.400 --> 00:26:56.680 are very very low yielding drive farm. Like I said, hillside vineyards. 448 00:26:56.799 --> 00:26:59.720 I bring that in. I ferment in concrete tanks. That gives me very 449 00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:03.279 mental powerful extraction. If you look at shadow Patruz has always been fermented in 450 00:27:03.359 --> 00:27:07.720 concrete. Shovel Blanc used concrete and then in February of eighty six poled all 451 00:27:07.799 --> 00:27:10.799 that out put stainless in, and ten years later all the stainless went back 452 00:27:10.839 --> 00:27:14.039 to concrete. And it's much like it gives you a very gentle, but 453 00:27:14.240 --> 00:27:18.200 very rich, intense masduration period. So we'll do like thirty to sixty days 454 00:27:18.240 --> 00:27:21.680 on skins kind of thing, and then aging of like two, three, 455 00:27:21.759 --> 00:27:23.839 four or five years. So I make something I think that that would have 456 00:27:23.880 --> 00:27:27.119 been typical of what you'd see in old the real old world of Europe, 457 00:27:27.160 --> 00:27:30.039 you know Europe. Right now there's this great battle between of course the tradition 458 00:27:30.160 --> 00:27:33.160 was the modernists. In some areas that's kind of resolved and settled. In 459 00:27:33.240 --> 00:27:37.359 other areas that's just kind of kicking up. And the question is how how 460 00:27:37.559 --> 00:27:41.000 important should wine making be in fine wine? And I don't think there's a 461 00:27:41.079 --> 00:27:44.799 right or wrong answer, but I think that there's a There are very different 462 00:27:44.839 --> 00:27:47.759 pathways in terms of how you grow grapes, how you make wine to end 463 00:27:47.839 --> 00:27:51.279 up at that point. And that's something with the next generation with my children. 464 00:27:51.359 --> 00:27:55.119 Have got two kids that have joined us that I'm trying to show them 465 00:27:55.160 --> 00:27:56.599 that because that's very unique in the world. When I got in the business 466 00:27:56.680 --> 00:28:00.400 in the early eighties, I got to see both sides of it. And 467 00:28:00.519 --> 00:28:03.240 today, like the schools that I know of and what you know is taught, 468 00:28:03.359 --> 00:28:08.119 it's a lot of manufacturing of wine, and that's fine and that's great, 469 00:28:08.160 --> 00:28:12.160 But the concept of those old world rules and that wisdom you just don't 470 00:28:12.319 --> 00:28:15.000 see that you don't read it in books, you don't hear it from professors 471 00:28:15.039 --> 00:28:18.440 and that and that whole thing of being able to read a plant and like 472 00:28:18.519 --> 00:28:21.400 what direction of the leaves like in a warm spell at harvest, and that 473 00:28:21.480 --> 00:28:25.880 of the leaves facing away from the sun or towards the sun, and these 474 00:28:26.000 --> 00:28:29.839 little things that I've been so blessed. It's when I travel it recharges my 475 00:28:29.880 --> 00:28:33.119 batteries. But to meet people that have magic not even know they have magic, 476 00:28:33.400 --> 00:28:34.799 that's just the way they've done it. And maybe they haven't looked over 477 00:28:34.799 --> 00:28:37.799 the fence enough to go, oh, that's very unique. Well, for 478 00:28:38.039 --> 00:28:41.759 if space aliens were to land it on your property right now, which of 479 00:28:41.839 --> 00:28:45.440 your wines would you want to say, Welcome to Hillcrest Vinyard? Yeah, 480 00:28:48.599 --> 00:28:51.920 which candis that you like best? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, none of 481 00:28:52.000 --> 00:28:57.400 them, No, that's the truth. I love them all. But I 482 00:28:57.480 --> 00:29:03.559 would say probably, I would say Malbeck and so Richard Summers, So he 483 00:29:03.640 --> 00:29:07.920 planted these thirty five varieties. He was very successful with pin and Onan and 484 00:29:07.960 --> 00:29:11.119 Reasling, but he never made a lot of Malbeck. And I asked him 485 00:29:11.160 --> 00:29:15.559 when we took over, so he'd had decades of experience with those varieties, 486 00:29:15.839 --> 00:29:18.880 And I said, Richard, and I asked this a few times. Besides 487 00:29:18.960 --> 00:29:21.960 Reasling and pin and Wan, which we know is successful, if those other 488 00:29:22.039 --> 00:29:23.799 thirty three varieties you were to plant them again, what would you plant? 489 00:29:23.880 --> 00:29:29.079 Which three? And I asked him this multiple times every time he said Maulbeck, 490 00:29:29.680 --> 00:29:33.119 Malbeck and Malbeck, Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think that 491 00:29:33.160 --> 00:29:34.799 we're beginning to see that. We've seen a lot of press in Malbeck out 492 00:29:34.839 --> 00:29:40.319 of this area, and it's something that it's very distinctive. It's very different 493 00:29:40.400 --> 00:29:44.359 from Cohor, it's very different from Argentina, but it's super classic, age 494 00:29:44.440 --> 00:29:47.519 worthy, and I think that there's a long road to run with Maulbeck. 495 00:29:48.599 --> 00:29:52.279 So you've been here a long time, You've worked in the wine industry for 496 00:29:52.359 --> 00:29:56.079 a very long time. We know that every vintage tells a story. You 497 00:29:56.200 --> 00:30:00.519 make wines very pure that will express place and time. How much variation do 498 00:30:00.680 --> 00:30:04.599 you see from year to year. Is this a region that gives you a 499 00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:11.680 pretty steady or is the variation pretty extreme? I think it's all relative where 500 00:30:11.720 --> 00:30:14.519 you stand. Like if you came from Europe, i'd say we're not extreme, 501 00:30:14.839 --> 00:30:17.799 we're kind of moderate. If you're at you know, as you move 502 00:30:17.920 --> 00:30:21.119 closer to the equator, and we'll say this case California, it's much more 503 00:30:21.200 --> 00:30:25.279 consistent in that. But I think that and I've talked to many other wine 504 00:30:25.279 --> 00:30:29.240 producers about this. They say the greatest fruit of its type comes from the 505 00:30:29.319 --> 00:30:33.319 coolest environment in which a small crop will ripen. And so people talk about 506 00:30:33.319 --> 00:30:36.640 the greatest apples in the world coming from England, Southern England are coming from 507 00:30:36.720 --> 00:30:38.839 Normandy and that and the same thing is true of wine grapes. The challenges 508 00:30:38.880 --> 00:30:44.000 as you march away from the area that it's very comfortable ripening a nice crop 509 00:30:44.160 --> 00:30:47.880 in a healthy, healthy way. You have the potential of making higher quality 510 00:30:48.000 --> 00:30:49.640 wines, but not as consistent. And so if you look at like, 511 00:30:49.720 --> 00:30:52.359 it's really interesting. I think in the modern wine business to look at like, 512 00:30:52.440 --> 00:30:56.119 the big wine companies have moved, especially into areas closer and closer to 513 00:30:56.200 --> 00:31:00.039 the equator, and that gives you much more consistent sun. And you know, 514 00:31:00.039 --> 00:31:03.039 if you look at the areas of the Northwest and that the big big 515 00:31:03.119 --> 00:31:07.519 wine companies are in areas where land as plentiful, sun as plentiful, water 516 00:31:07.640 --> 00:31:11.759 is plentiful, and that gives you you know, it's good business. You 517 00:31:11.839 --> 00:31:15.640 know, I always joke that you I use my hand and I put my 518 00:31:15.680 --> 00:31:18.640 hand at a forty five degree angled say you want to drink that on a 519 00:31:18.720 --> 00:31:21.880 vineyard, You want to drink that steep hillside, you know, co rot 520 00:31:22.160 --> 00:31:25.319 Mosle valley kind of thing. But you want to own from a business standpoint, 521 00:31:25.400 --> 00:31:29.279 that flat land and my hand is horizontal now and the same thing is 522 00:31:29.279 --> 00:31:30.640 true. And so the question is what are you after? And it's I 523 00:31:30.720 --> 00:31:33.160 mean, there's great wines made in flats, but I mean, I know 524 00:31:33.160 --> 00:31:37.079 whe those flats are those flats where the old river beds were. It's not 525 00:31:37.240 --> 00:31:40.799 usually next to the river, and it's up against the hillside roll that rocks 526 00:31:40.839 --> 00:31:42.880 come off the hill and that then, But there's always that balance of the 527 00:31:42.960 --> 00:31:47.079 economics, you know, also the style you want to make. I mean, 528 00:31:47.160 --> 00:31:48.759 if you want to make a very pleasing, luscious style of wine, 529 00:31:48.759 --> 00:31:52.359 I mean a lot of that is wine making that maybe it's not so important 530 00:31:52.599 --> 00:31:56.960 in higher yield is good business and it doesn't show so much. If you're 531 00:31:56.960 --> 00:31:59.279 making wines that are very hands off, you've got to do that. I 532 00:31:59.400 --> 00:32:01.240 use the analogy like sashimi. If you're putting sashimi on the plate, you 533 00:32:01.279 --> 00:32:04.319 don't get to fix it, you don't get to put heat and sauce to 534 00:32:04.440 --> 00:32:07.319 it. Versus you can take like fish, it's not very interesting, and 535 00:32:07.359 --> 00:32:09.440 you can make something so beautiful, but it doesn't taste like the fish. 536 00:32:09.480 --> 00:32:12.759 I'm in the business of trying to make wines. It tastes like the fish. 537 00:32:14.839 --> 00:32:19.880 So I'm curious because you are such a good communicator and you're you're very 538 00:32:21.200 --> 00:32:24.480 good at verbally expressing everything you've been sharing with us. So when you're walking 539 00:32:24.559 --> 00:32:28.200 through your vineyards, I'm curious, do you talk to your vines or do 540 00:32:28.319 --> 00:32:30.720 they talk to yah? Yeah? Yeah, is that what that voice is? 541 00:32:31.000 --> 00:32:35.920 I'm not sure. Yeah. No, Actually that's a beautiful thing to 542 00:32:35.960 --> 00:32:38.279 say. But thank you. Richard Summers. When we took over, you 543 00:32:38.359 --> 00:32:40.720 know, he was in his late seventies, he was never married, never 544 00:32:40.799 --> 00:32:43.799 had any kids, and he knew that we were going to put our own 545 00:32:44.480 --> 00:32:46.880 kind of a fingerprint on this place. And he talked about his children, 546 00:32:47.039 --> 00:32:51.680 the vines and the wine. So that's kind of like the advanced advanced stage. 547 00:32:51.720 --> 00:32:55.960 I'm not quite at yet, but I look at you know, I 548 00:32:57.319 --> 00:33:00.880 do look at things in a very different way. Part of that is just 549 00:33:00.039 --> 00:33:05.759 age and life and experience and that. But you know, it's I was 550 00:33:05.799 --> 00:33:07.920 thinking about this the other day that you know, I used to know that 551 00:33:08.079 --> 00:33:10.680 like the age of every vineyard, like ooh, that vineyard that's six years 552 00:33:10.720 --> 00:33:14.359 ago we planted that, and that's thirteen And now I don't even really care, 553 00:33:14.720 --> 00:33:15.680 you know, I just know that that's not ready to go, and 554 00:33:15.799 --> 00:33:20.480 that is ready to go. Are there any like kind of science or predictors 555 00:33:20.519 --> 00:33:22.920 that you look like look for at any vintage that's gonna say it's ready to 556 00:33:23.000 --> 00:33:24.880 go? Yeah, yeah, yeah, and and and once again, that's 557 00:33:24.920 --> 00:33:30.720 that's that's that's kind of and that's the wisdom of time in the business if 558 00:33:30.759 --> 00:33:34.160 you've paid attention, and in our case, we've been lucky enough to go 559 00:33:34.279 --> 00:33:37.960 and leverage that with other people's wisdom and that and so yeah, there are 560 00:33:37.000 --> 00:33:39.519 things and you know, and some of those are things that you you have 561 00:33:39.640 --> 00:33:44.279 the theories you know on what creates what and what's related to what, and 562 00:33:44.319 --> 00:33:45.839 sometimes that theory is good for three four years and then all of a sudden 563 00:33:45.920 --> 00:33:50.839 it's not. But that's that's that is that's part of the magic. You 564 00:33:50.880 --> 00:33:52.559 know. It's so interesting in the modern white business. We see so many 565 00:33:52.599 --> 00:33:57.599 people that have like you know, they work in technology or the science is 566 00:33:57.640 --> 00:34:00.640 and that, and then they're mesmerized by wine the way are four Fathers were 567 00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:04.200 like a Jefferson in that And it's because it's not an equation, it's it's 568 00:34:04.240 --> 00:34:07.239 something that you know, there's there's right and wrong within the big, big, 569 00:34:07.639 --> 00:34:12.440 larger context, but it's it's really an individual thing and the beauty of 570 00:34:12.519 --> 00:34:15.840 and I think that's where you know, for like wine writers and people that 571 00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:21.639 evaluate wines, it's it's it's such a different thing interacting with that plant and 572 00:34:21.719 --> 00:34:24.760 having a relationship with that plant and having a relationship with that wine that if 573 00:34:24.800 --> 00:34:30.280 you only critique wines, it's hard to see, you know, and and 574 00:34:30.800 --> 00:34:35.719 that that that that passion and that interaction, and you know, it's it's 575 00:34:35.840 --> 00:34:37.440 kind of like having, you know, your kids, like they might have 576 00:34:37.599 --> 00:34:40.920 quirks and unusual things, and sometimes you come to think those are beautiful, 577 00:34:40.920 --> 00:34:44.719 beautiful things. The same thing with vineyards. You know, it's it's what 578 00:34:44.920 --> 00:34:46.239 is perfect? Don't I don't want perfect? You know, perfect is like 579 00:34:46.320 --> 00:34:52.559 a German engineered factory. Imperfect is like a Ferrari, you know, and 580 00:34:52.760 --> 00:34:53.960 Ferrari is exciting. But the thing is, you know, every five hundred 581 00:34:53.960 --> 00:34:57.800 miles you're given it a tune up kind of thing. And so so it's 582 00:34:57.880 --> 00:35:00.119 it's it's it's it's that that you know, they say, the journey and 583 00:35:00.199 --> 00:35:04.079 evolution and so the ability to be able to do that and that's one of 584 00:35:04.119 --> 00:35:06.760 the reasons we came north out of Napa Valleys. I wanted my kids to 585 00:35:06.880 --> 00:35:09.440 experience that, amongst other things, to be able to kind of to do 586 00:35:09.559 --> 00:35:12.960 it hands on our kids. You know, we dug every hole that we 587 00:35:13.079 --> 00:35:15.119 planted the vines ourselves. Our kids were involved in that, all the bottling, 588 00:35:15.280 --> 00:35:21.000 labeling, harvest in that after school, and so that's part of that. 589 00:35:21.159 --> 00:35:22.840 That's the beauty to me. And I know wine is different things to 590 00:35:22.920 --> 00:35:28.559 different people, but that interaction and especially the magic of nature and a place 591 00:35:28.639 --> 00:35:31.320 that the nature is so powerful. I really feel like I'm in a wool 592 00:35:31.400 --> 00:35:36.320 class area that's totally unexplored and undeveloped. And so to be able to be 593 00:35:36.360 --> 00:35:38.719 a pioneer here is an amazing thing. And follow in the footsteps of the 594 00:35:38.800 --> 00:35:44.199 Dorner family from the eighteen hundreds and Richard Sommers. And do you and your 595 00:35:44.239 --> 00:35:46.480 family have any good luck rituals that you do at the start of harvest? 596 00:35:50.000 --> 00:35:55.760 You got any suggestions? Actually, we don't. So we break bread, 597 00:35:55.960 --> 00:35:59.880 you know, virtually every day together and so that's kind of that, that's 598 00:36:00.199 --> 00:36:02.280 our ritual. It's more of a family daily. But yeah, so this 599 00:36:02.599 --> 00:36:05.760 some of this probably goes back to being Mormon, and I mean the family 600 00:36:05.840 --> 00:36:07.320 side of things is such a powerful thing. And to have your children, 601 00:36:07.519 --> 00:36:09.800 you know, we made them work for other people for a number of years 602 00:36:09.800 --> 00:36:13.159 before they could come back, so they knew what like a real boss was. 603 00:36:13.440 --> 00:36:16.719 But to have them come here and see that that magic that find wine 604 00:36:16.800 --> 00:36:22.639 and having a product that is such a beautiful positive that people travel from different 605 00:36:22.679 --> 00:36:25.320 parts of the country maybe the world to come experience and to kind of share 606 00:36:25.559 --> 00:36:28.599 and to be able to touch people in that way of like, you know, 607 00:36:28.719 --> 00:36:30.360 I came in here with my father ten years ago and now I'm here 608 00:36:30.360 --> 00:36:34.480 as an adult able to taste and stuff. That's that's a beautiful, beautiful 609 00:36:34.480 --> 00:36:37.159 thing about wine. And until you've done other things, you don't realize most 610 00:36:37.159 --> 00:36:39.360 of the world's not like that. No, yeah, well when you were 611 00:36:39.480 --> 00:36:43.920 when you were I mean, you obviously were introduced to wine at a younger 612 00:36:43.960 --> 00:36:45.519 age, you know, and turned onto it. And you've worked in the 613 00:36:45.519 --> 00:36:49.599 wine industry for a long time, But did you ever have aspirations to do 614 00:36:49.719 --> 00:36:52.679 something else, like when you were a little boy or once you knew about 615 00:36:52.679 --> 00:36:53.559 wine. This was kind of the focus. This was, you know, 616 00:36:53.599 --> 00:36:55.719 it's so interesting because a lot of things, you know, like sports. 617 00:36:55.760 --> 00:36:59.920 I do it for two years intensively. My wife and I we honeymoon, 618 00:37:00.079 --> 00:37:02.800 We went and played tent We went to a tennis intensive course at a club 619 00:37:02.920 --> 00:37:06.159 med and I remember, like third day you could even pick up the water 620 00:37:06.280 --> 00:37:08.320 picture. Your hand was so sore from like six hours of tennis every day. 621 00:37:08.519 --> 00:37:12.719 But most of those things kind of faded when I said, I think 622 00:37:12.840 --> 00:37:15.599 this certain things choose people. I think this chose me. And after two 623 00:37:15.679 --> 00:37:17.800 or three years, I remember it became a little bit bored, and then 624 00:37:17.840 --> 00:37:21.159 I kind of sat down and I was kind of reflecting, thinking like this 625 00:37:21.320 --> 00:37:24.079 is everything in the world. This is this is agriculture, it's production, 626 00:37:24.400 --> 00:37:29.159 it's marketing, it's incredible history. And that if this I find, if 627 00:37:29.199 --> 00:37:31.719 I find this boring, it's because of me. And so ever since then, 628 00:37:31.840 --> 00:37:36.280 I mean I engage. I read my wife many many years ago, 629 00:37:36.320 --> 00:37:37.480 decades ago. Actually, I remember her walking out and we lived in Napo. 630 00:37:37.559 --> 00:37:40.199 One morning she goes and I'm not a big I like to go to 631 00:37:40.199 --> 00:37:43.639 sporting events, but I don't fall sports and that, and I remember her 632 00:37:43.719 --> 00:37:45.559 coming out and saying, I think it's so great. You don't like watch 633 00:37:45.599 --> 00:37:47.320 football a Sunday night. But she goes, would you read something besides a 634 00:37:47.400 --> 00:37:51.480 wine book? You know, like, wow, that's a problem. Yeah. 635 00:37:51.599 --> 00:37:52.599 And so every morning I get up, I usually read for like two 636 00:37:52.639 --> 00:37:55.639 or three hours every morning, and not only wine, but for many years 637 00:37:55.679 --> 00:38:00.280 it was only wine, and today it's a lot of wine and so other 638 00:38:00.360 --> 00:38:04.119 things. And so I'm just I'm fascinated by life, and so I feel 639 00:38:04.320 --> 00:38:07.559 very blessed to have that kind of tickled and have that awakened within me that 640 00:38:07.639 --> 00:38:10.199 I can kind of you know a lot of the things I'm talking about, 641 00:38:10.280 --> 00:38:13.599 and we all think about the same things, but so much should the time. 642 00:38:13.679 --> 00:38:15.119 We'll think about it and then let it pass. And I've tried to 643 00:38:15.199 --> 00:38:17.880 train myself that when I think about it, I look it up. So 644 00:38:19.000 --> 00:38:21.880 like at our table, there's no cell phones unless we have a question you 645 00:38:21.920 --> 00:38:23.320 can't answer, and then you can google it and we google it and bring 646 00:38:23.360 --> 00:38:25.519 it up to the whole table. I like that. I like that. 647 00:38:27.159 --> 00:38:30.199 So if you're planning a romantic evening for you and your wife, what sort 648 00:38:30.199 --> 00:38:34.320 of wines get open to set the mood? Obviously you're opening wine every night, 649 00:38:34.400 --> 00:38:37.639 you talk about your dinner at breakfast, but is there are there particular 650 00:38:37.679 --> 00:38:40.599 wines that make make an evening a little different than the average evening? Yeah, 651 00:38:40.840 --> 00:38:45.719 for sure, for sure. Actually I have like several cases of wine, 652 00:38:45.719 --> 00:38:51.280 and it's not always famous wine, but oftentimes it's bottles that like maybe 653 00:38:52.119 --> 00:38:54.119 what's the last one? The last one. I have a good friend I've 654 00:38:54.159 --> 00:38:59.199 known for about thirty years in the molesl and we went over as a winey, 655 00:38:59.280 --> 00:39:02.280 probably eight or ten years ago, and they'd done a big tasting the 656 00:39:02.360 --> 00:39:06.000 day before. We walked in like one hundred and fifty different wines that they'd 657 00:39:06.039 --> 00:39:10.239 made over decades and super beautiful wines, and our favorite wine. He gave 658 00:39:10.320 --> 00:39:15.840 us a bottle of that, and it was off of a vineyard called Clusiroth 659 00:39:15.920 --> 00:39:17.880 or Brudershot in the lay and so you have the great lines of log of 660 00:39:17.920 --> 00:39:22.000 ground crew vineyards. Sometimes there's a rock out cropping that you might find like 661 00:39:22.039 --> 00:39:24.880 four or five six hundred vines in that's considered delay. That's the best of 662 00:39:24.960 --> 00:39:28.920 the tenderloin kind of thing. And so there was a bottle of that that 663 00:39:28.960 --> 00:39:30.400 we had in ourselves that he gave us and signed or whatever, and so 664 00:39:30.480 --> 00:39:35.719 that was like a special bottle. Recently we've been drinking. So we traveled 665 00:39:35.719 --> 00:39:37.880 two to three times a year into Europe and our kids we alwa was tipped 666 00:39:37.880 --> 00:39:40.760 one at a time, and finally in twenty twenty, we took the whole 667 00:39:40.840 --> 00:39:44.559 family and we introduced all of our kids to all the people that we have 668 00:39:44.679 --> 00:39:47.840 relationships, business and friendships with that. And so we bought a lot of 669 00:39:49.400 --> 00:39:52.360 wine back that were wines that our kids liked and that, and so when 670 00:39:52.440 --> 00:39:55.360 the kids come back for Christmas or whatever, we opened those up. My 671 00:39:55.440 --> 00:40:02.159 wife and I there was one great beautiful grower champagne that we drink on special 672 00:40:02.199 --> 00:40:06.239 occasions and I've got a couple bottles of that left. But you showed there 673 00:40:06.239 --> 00:40:08.679 are wines that are connected to people that we know in love and experiences we 674 00:40:08.760 --> 00:40:13.239 know in love. I love it so Dyson. You are a wealth of 675 00:40:13.360 --> 00:40:16.079 knowledge. And I'm curious if there's a piece of advice that somebody else gave 676 00:40:16.159 --> 00:40:21.239 you at some point, whether it's life, work, career, that you 677 00:40:21.440 --> 00:40:23.880 carry with you, that's something that you try to work by or live by. 678 00:40:24.519 --> 00:40:29.199 You've shared a few of them. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, 679 00:40:29.360 --> 00:40:31.280 I would say I truly believe the trick is there are no tricks. 680 00:40:31.360 --> 00:40:34.679 We spend most of our life. And I saw this at the you know 681 00:40:34.760 --> 00:40:38.519 wineries I worked at, were you know, one winery really world class, 682 00:40:38.559 --> 00:40:44.639 beautiful Cabernarty Sauvignon off of old vines that were you know, eight foot between 683 00:40:44.719 --> 00:40:49.159 vines, twelve foot rows and that, and you know, that was replanted 684 00:40:49.199 --> 00:40:52.880 and the concept was we want that same quality. And the brightest guy I've 685 00:40:52.880 --> 00:40:55.320 ever met in my life and bit a culture guy named Andy blood Soe, 686 00:40:55.519 --> 00:40:58.280 Hello, Andy, if you're out there. I've not seen him for a 687 00:40:58.320 --> 00:41:00.920 while, but you know, remember him saying, you know, well, 688 00:41:01.000 --> 00:41:04.440 I would go back to that kind of style, maybe tighten the rose up 689 00:41:04.440 --> 00:41:06.639 a little bit. And that was not the answer they wanted to hear. 690 00:41:06.840 --> 00:41:10.320 You know at that point that operations going towards high density, and that high 691 00:41:10.400 --> 00:41:15.159 density with something people like it was very different and you could like it or 692 00:41:15.199 --> 00:41:19.960 not like it. But I really think that that it's really not that hard 693 00:41:20.400 --> 00:41:23.079 to make fine wine. You have to give yourself experience. It takes time. 694 00:41:23.159 --> 00:41:24.719 I think that's one of the things. We always want to get from 695 00:41:24.719 --> 00:41:28.519 here to there as quickly as possible, to take the shortcuts. But if 696 00:41:28.559 --> 00:41:30.400 you look at it as this is kind of a lifetime venture if you spend 697 00:41:30.559 --> 00:41:34.159 I always tell my kids, you want to find, like, if you 698 00:41:34.199 --> 00:41:36.239 think you're in just in something, you want to find somebody doesn't better than 699 00:41:36.280 --> 00:41:37.960 anybody else. Work for them, even if it's for free kind of thing. 700 00:41:38.000 --> 00:41:40.559 And then when you're working for them, think about how you would change 701 00:41:40.639 --> 00:41:45.639 things if you were to be in the same position. And so that ability 702 00:41:45.719 --> 00:41:49.519 to kind of take and read and the wine business were so gracious around the 703 00:41:49.559 --> 00:41:52.000 world to share ideas and concepts. And there's many areas that can make fine 704 00:41:52.079 --> 00:41:55.239 wine, and there are things like dry farming. I mean, I realized 705 00:41:55.320 --> 00:41:59.039 very early on that that was one of my truths. And I saw that 706 00:41:59.119 --> 00:42:00.920 difference between the old world in the new world and the best of the new 707 00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:06.519 world versus the you know, the newer way for me, and so it's 708 00:42:06.760 --> 00:42:08.480 it's witnessed that stuff and just take your time to do it. Don't ever 709 00:42:08.599 --> 00:42:12.239 do a whole bunch at once, because that's how you make fatal mistakes. 710 00:42:12.280 --> 00:42:14.280 You know. I've learned that from like the old world, is that you 711 00:42:14.639 --> 00:42:16.719 when you know you don't plant a brand new vineyard and build a brand new 712 00:42:16.760 --> 00:42:21.519 winery the same day. You know, you plant blocks of vineyards. So 713 00:42:21.639 --> 00:42:23.159 that maybe over five years you plant a piece of property. I give this 714 00:42:23.199 --> 00:42:25.039 advice to people who the time that come in here. It's just like, 715 00:42:25.079 --> 00:42:28.320 if you have twenty five acres, don't plant it all at once in that 716 00:42:28.440 --> 00:42:30.360 plant because the first year different Between the first year and the second years, 717 00:42:30.360 --> 00:42:31.840 you'll go, oh, that was a mistake. The first year, I'm 718 00:42:31.840 --> 00:42:35.239 going to modify this, and that's the third year you're like, yeah, 719 00:42:35.239 --> 00:42:37.960 I would change the road direction here and do that and that way. You 720 00:42:37.000 --> 00:42:39.880 always kind of are evolving and working down the path, and then once you 721 00:42:39.960 --> 00:42:43.280 have your fruit and you figure out how to grow it, then you begin 722 00:42:43.400 --> 00:42:47.199 producing wine. George Hendry, somebody that taught me this in Napa Valley was 723 00:42:47.239 --> 00:42:51.360 the first place I saw this. Somebody that took like a really incredible property 724 00:42:51.760 --> 00:42:54.800 in a brilliant, brilliant man. But instead of him starting day one and 725 00:42:55.079 --> 00:42:58.960 trying to figure everything out, he took top wineries and nap and let them 726 00:42:59.039 --> 00:43:02.119 develop portions property for their own, and then he had them teach him what 727 00:43:02.239 --> 00:43:05.599 they're after, what they're doing in that, and then out of that, 728 00:43:05.920 --> 00:43:07.960 so he went from zero to one hundred, like in thirty years. You 729 00:43:08.000 --> 00:43:10.360 know, most people in one hundreds of years. Don't go to zero to 730 00:43:10.400 --> 00:43:15.519 one hundred, right, but super super bright man that could listen. So 731 00:43:15.719 --> 00:43:20.519 I'd say, follow your passion, listen to everybody, do what's most important 732 00:43:20.559 --> 00:43:22.320 to you, and just dedicate yourself because the most successful people in the world 733 00:43:22.360 --> 00:43:25.920 are the people that don't keep changing direction every five years into the newest, 734 00:43:27.039 --> 00:43:30.599 latest, greatest, and that the classics are classics because they've stood the test 735 00:43:30.639 --> 00:43:34.679 of time. And we talked about reasoning. To start with reasoning. Historically 736 00:43:34.679 --> 00:43:37.760 the most expensive one in the world over the last two hundred years to this 737 00:43:37.880 --> 00:43:39.719 day, still the most expensive wine it was sold in a barrel was nineteen 738 00:43:39.800 --> 00:43:45.199 twenty nine for a food or twenty thousand gold pieces. And yeah, especially 739 00:43:45.239 --> 00:43:47.440 today's world today, I had the goals at all time high. Again. 740 00:43:47.760 --> 00:43:52.519 Yeah, but basically, dedicate yourself to something and if you stick to it, 741 00:43:53.159 --> 00:43:55.639 chances are you'll be much more successful, and if you love it, 742 00:43:55.840 --> 00:44:00.280 you will be successful. When you look back at your career, what would 743 00:44:00.280 --> 00:44:05.280 you say is one of your proudest achievements to date? Huh, Yeah, 744 00:44:07.000 --> 00:44:12.239 I'd say having my family part of the business. So I think the magic. 745 00:44:12.559 --> 00:44:15.239 You know, oftentimes we used to joke intelligence skips a generation. And 746 00:44:15.800 --> 00:44:21.679 I'm not sure which generation I've been, but no, but having two of 747 00:44:21.840 --> 00:44:24.840 my three children see the magic and wine that I see and from slightly different 748 00:44:24.880 --> 00:44:29.360 angles, but to see how special it is and to haven't really registered in 749 00:44:29.400 --> 00:44:32.039 their hearts and not just do it because it's easy. Well, so you 750 00:44:32.199 --> 00:44:35.559 drink a lot of wine. You have wine on your table all the time. 751 00:44:35.639 --> 00:44:37.280 So I want you to complete this sentence for me, A table without 752 00:44:37.360 --> 00:44:46.480 wine is like not eating starvation. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's a 753 00:44:46.599 --> 00:44:50.480 reverse too, you know, but yeah, food with no wine. Yeah, 754 00:44:52.880 --> 00:44:54.760 these are the fun questions now because it's been so much information, We're 755 00:44:54.760 --> 00:44:58.400 almost to the end and I want to get a few fun, little silly 756 00:44:58.480 --> 00:45:01.039 things out. So we're sitting at a big table. We've got your wines 757 00:45:01.079 --> 00:45:05.079 on the table. There's an empty seat next to you. Who from any 758 00:45:05.159 --> 00:45:07.760 walk of life would you want to be sharing a glass of your wine with? 759 00:45:07.239 --> 00:45:13.000 Oh my god, belaving or diseased? Yeah? Famous? Oh yeah, 760 00:45:13.039 --> 00:45:17.280 yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure. Jefferson Thomas Jefferson. 761 00:45:19.440 --> 00:45:22.599 So I'm I'm I think we live in a you know, a beautiful country 762 00:45:22.639 --> 00:45:25.800 and so and the people that laid the plan out for us of initially the 763 00:45:25.840 --> 00:45:30.199 Constitution. It's amazing thing. Somebody that loved wine, saw the magic of 764 00:45:30.320 --> 00:45:34.519 wine, traveled the world, you know, did so many great things. 765 00:45:34.599 --> 00:45:37.920 Have pasta He's a big pasta pusher into the United States. So that you 766 00:45:38.039 --> 00:45:43.840 know that story, I'm sure. Yeah, so you are. You know, 767 00:45:43.960 --> 00:45:49.159 you're dry farming, You're very conscientious of climate. We know climate is 768 00:45:49.280 --> 00:45:53.519 changing. You think people will be making wine in five hundred years, oh 769 00:45:53.679 --> 00:45:59.320 guaranteed? Yeah, yeah, I think. You know, there's a billion 770 00:45:59.400 --> 00:46:01.800 places to it. With the variations that you see, vintage to vintage is 771 00:46:02.119 --> 00:46:06.039 a lot greater even than what they call for that as a climate change over 772 00:46:06.079 --> 00:46:07.239 one hundred years. And then I mean, if you look at our warmest 773 00:46:07.320 --> 00:46:10.880 vintages twenty years ago versus the warmest vintage let's say, over the last twenty 774 00:46:10.920 --> 00:46:14.000 years, the coolest and the warmest, I mean, we're not going to 775 00:46:14.039 --> 00:46:16.679 even approach anything near that warmest at this point, so on average, we're 776 00:46:16.719 --> 00:46:22.039 getting there. You know, I don't know. I do what I do. 777 00:46:22.519 --> 00:46:27.000 One of the reasons I drive farm is plants self regulate when you start 778 00:46:27.079 --> 00:46:30.800 doing things like irrigating and putting things up in vertical shoot positioning versus letting the 779 00:46:30.840 --> 00:46:35.679 shoots fall down. In that you change the physics of the plant. You 780 00:46:35.880 --> 00:46:39.320 change the phonology of a plant. So for example, like in California, 781 00:46:39.320 --> 00:46:43.639 I was used to like pulling leaves when you water, the vine never drops 782 00:46:43.679 --> 00:46:47.320 that basil leave typically, and so the idea of dry farming vines it automatically 783 00:46:47.400 --> 00:46:51.000 defiliate their fruit owned fruit zwneders you get later in the season, and it 784 00:46:51.079 --> 00:46:53.599 takes that old leaf at the base of the shoot that's the least efficient and 785 00:46:53.679 --> 00:46:58.199 scavenges the moisture nutrients, and it drops it and opens the thing up. 786 00:46:58.480 --> 00:47:02.079 So it's I've studied finance quite a bit, and in finance they say you're 787 00:47:02.079 --> 00:47:06.440 either all cash or you're all leverage. To be in the middle is inefficient, 788 00:47:06.480 --> 00:47:08.280 and I agree with it. You either farm hard and you farm grapes 789 00:47:08.320 --> 00:47:12.400 and you get as much as you can at the right sugar or pH whatever 790 00:47:12.440 --> 00:47:15.840 you're after, or it's you know, foot off the accelerator and let nature 791 00:47:15.960 --> 00:47:19.480 do this and nature, you know, one of the magic things we talk 792 00:47:19.480 --> 00:47:21.880 about old lines, old mines are magic. Why are they magic? Well, 793 00:47:21.880 --> 00:47:24.360 one of the reasons they're magic is that old vines typically have these trunks 794 00:47:24.400 --> 00:47:29.559 and massive root systems are like battery packs. So you take a young plant, 795 00:47:29.599 --> 00:47:32.519 it's like having you know, two triple A batteries. If something happens, 796 00:47:32.760 --> 00:47:36.800 let's see, at a frost, that vine would drop its vegetation, 797 00:47:36.920 --> 00:47:40.079 a young line basically fruit would collapse. I've had Burgundian producers and people in 798 00:47:40.159 --> 00:47:44.039 Piamonte telling me, oh, like the really really old vines. Sometimes you 799 00:47:44.119 --> 00:47:46.039 get something that something happens to the canopy, maybe a frost or whatever. 800 00:47:46.320 --> 00:47:51.199 But you'll still see the sugar continue to accumulate because that vine takes that battery 801 00:47:51.280 --> 00:47:53.280 pack as that energy that was storing for next spring, and it liquefies some 802 00:47:53.360 --> 00:47:57.119 of that and it plugs that fruit with another brick or two bricks to kind 803 00:47:57.159 --> 00:48:00.960 of get you over the line. And so you know, once again, 804 00:48:00.199 --> 00:48:05.719 I mean nature has a way of taking care. And there's all different styles 805 00:48:05.800 --> 00:48:07.360 of wine, and so the environment is one of these things. You know, 806 00:48:07.480 --> 00:48:09.920 like in the last several years here, we've not had a warm vintage. 807 00:48:09.960 --> 00:48:13.679 We've had cool vantages. We've had vintages that we kind of prayed for 808 00:48:13.719 --> 00:48:19.480 a little warm. Yeah. I made money for that, yeah, And 809 00:48:19.559 --> 00:48:22.639 so I think it is what it is, and I'll leave it at that. 810 00:48:22.119 --> 00:48:29.039 Well, if if, if, if less than five hundred years, 811 00:48:29.079 --> 00:48:30.400 the world were to end, not to end, but you were said to 812 00:48:30.440 --> 00:48:32.880 a deserted eyeland, what three wines would you want to take with you? 813 00:48:34.800 --> 00:48:38.559 Mos reasoning? I don't know where you got that. Balls like Basil Raisling. 814 00:48:38.800 --> 00:48:43.920 Yeah no, yeah, I'm a missionary, I'd say Moses Reasling. 815 00:48:44.159 --> 00:48:47.000 So are we talking like particular wines or like vrietals from certain up to you? 816 00:48:47.119 --> 00:48:58.639 I mean, okay, so Moses Reasling, great red Burgundy and I'm 817 00:48:58.679 --> 00:49:02.159 all back from here? Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, how about 818 00:49:02.159 --> 00:49:06.639 that? I like that. I like that. Well, we're just about 819 00:49:06.679 --> 00:49:08.280 done. I warned you about one thing in advance, that we play a 820 00:49:08.320 --> 00:49:13.400 little game with music. So I want you to, in a in a 821 00:49:14.239 --> 00:49:17.719 quick way of describing your wines, pair them with a genre, a song, 822 00:49:17.840 --> 00:49:22.800 a musician. I'm gonna start with the Mosle Reasling that we started with 823 00:49:22.119 --> 00:49:32.119 sipping today, Okay, Mosling, Okay, let's go strong, yeah yeah, 824 00:49:32.159 --> 00:49:35.880 yeah, yeah, yeah, something shy yeah No, I just love 825 00:49:35.920 --> 00:49:37.920 it. Those wines speak to me in the nerve and the brightness and the 826 00:49:37.960 --> 00:49:40.199 focus. They have a kind of sense of shiver up my spine. I 827 00:49:40.239 --> 00:49:45.880 love it. Your Peino no Ar, your fiftieth anniversary Peano no arm. 828 00:49:47.119 --> 00:49:55.679 Hmm, yeah, what am I thinking? What am I thinking of? 829 00:49:55.760 --> 00:49:59.800 That? I have to say, and I can't. I can't name a 830 00:50:01.760 --> 00:50:06.440 the performer, but I'd say some form of opera, Italian opera, something 831 00:50:06.519 --> 00:50:10.400 kind of deep and rich that demands you listen to it. Okay, you're 832 00:50:10.480 --> 00:50:16.760 mal Beck. Mall Beck. So I love country music. Jamie Johnson who's 833 00:50:16.760 --> 00:50:23.119 a legendary songwriter but also as a performer an artist, and he has a 834 00:50:23.400 --> 00:50:29.960 song plays out on the Ocean and he talks about it's such a beautiful song. 835 00:50:30.039 --> 00:50:31.039 Talks about living a good life, which I think a lot of us 836 00:50:31.119 --> 00:50:35.880 do in the wine business. And mall Beeck can be nice and generous inness, 837 00:50:36.239 --> 00:50:38.440 but he talks about he keeps thinking about his significant other. That's all 838 00:50:38.480 --> 00:50:40.920 I thinks about, even though he's got all these grand things in life and 839 00:50:42.039 --> 00:50:45.039 he's enjoying life. That's what he thinks of. And I think that the 840 00:50:45.119 --> 00:50:47.039 mall Beck is like that. It's kind of like it's so pleasing and easy, 841 00:50:47.079 --> 00:50:50.559 but if you look at it you can see something very serious. I 842 00:50:50.719 --> 00:50:57.559 love it. You're better at this than you thought you would be. Well, 843 00:50:57.760 --> 00:50:59.760 I mean we've been talking a long time, so I won't keep going. 844 00:50:59.800 --> 00:51:04.719 But we are sipping right now. Your tiniolo sangiovese. So what would 845 00:51:04.760 --> 00:51:07.280 you pair with that? This is obviously from Italy? Yeah, well actually 846 00:51:07.400 --> 00:51:10.079 this is so, this is something we produce here. I've got to tell 847 00:51:10.400 --> 00:51:13.440 sorry, it was a problem from Oregon. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 848 00:51:13.480 --> 00:51:15.280 it looks like it's from it. Actually I put Western organ on it, 849 00:51:15.440 --> 00:51:20.199 so which is a new that's a new thing for us. But anywayol Y 850 00:51:20.360 --> 00:51:27.440 synonym for an old synonym for Sangovesi and Tuscany tinolo is it's it's meant to 851 00:51:27.519 --> 00:51:30.599 be very kind of easy approachable. It's Chianti clones, so it's kind of 852 00:51:30.639 --> 00:51:34.519 the softer, easier versus. There's a lot of Brunello clones here. I 853 00:51:34.559 --> 00:51:39.039 would say something like this with Carbonara, classic Carbonar I made. I've been 854 00:51:39.079 --> 00:51:42.840 making carbonar for years. The other day I made my best version, so 855 00:51:43.159 --> 00:51:45.159 it's kind of yeah. With you know, ducades, that's food. But 856 00:51:45.239 --> 00:51:50.159 what about music? Oh yeah, music, music is easy. That's probably 857 00:51:50.280 --> 00:51:54.159 like Fleetwood mac. Oh, now I'm hungry, let's go have some carbon 858 00:51:54.599 --> 00:51:59.800 Yeah yeah, yeah, exactly, Okay, last question. It's a two 859 00:51:59.800 --> 00:52:02.000 part and the first part is you've traveled all over the world. You go 860 00:52:02.079 --> 00:52:06.519 to Europe a couple times of year. Is there anywhere in the world that's 861 00:52:06.559 --> 00:52:08.199 on the top of your bucket list that you want to explore that you have 862 00:52:08.360 --> 00:52:13.840 yet to Oh, for sure, I've had I've been tasting wines out of 863 00:52:13.920 --> 00:52:17.079 Georgia and Armenia for a number of years and they were always semi interesting in 864 00:52:17.159 --> 00:52:22.760 that I've had a couple in the last two years that were really very super 865 00:52:22.760 --> 00:52:27.039 beautiful. Actually, one of the wines that decannor London Wine Fair scored very 866 00:52:27.119 --> 00:52:29.760 highly and I had that one. It was like, what is that wine? 867 00:52:29.800 --> 00:52:31.599 And I started doing research on It's like, oh, that's known. 868 00:52:32.119 --> 00:52:38.400 I didn't know that, but that as well as another area, South Africa 869 00:52:38.440 --> 00:52:40.119 is something I want to say. I've been to South Africa, but not 870 00:52:40.239 --> 00:52:44.960 wine tasting. And many of my friends that I worked with in Germany they 871 00:52:45.000 --> 00:52:46.239 go there on a regular basis. And these are people that I work with 872 00:52:46.360 --> 00:52:51.400 also a nap and they tell me, like the Stellembosch Parl that they say 873 00:52:51.480 --> 00:52:54.000 that that is like Napa Valley nineteen eighty in terms of the landscape, how 874 00:52:54.119 --> 00:52:58.079 wine is approached and the food in that, and they say, oh my 875 00:52:58.159 --> 00:53:00.920 god, it's like stepping back in time, and you know, part of 876 00:53:00.920 --> 00:53:02.239 it's being older once again. But the other side of it is is I 877 00:53:02.360 --> 00:53:06.920 really believe that I've been able to experience wine in a golden age, in 878 00:53:07.039 --> 00:53:12.400 a really beautiful time. And you know when when and I say this very 879 00:53:12.519 --> 00:53:15.320 kind of generically, but when a winemaker was the important person at the winery 880 00:53:15.360 --> 00:53:19.000 instead of you know, finance, sales, marketing and that, and then 881 00:53:19.079 --> 00:53:22.719 winemaker's part of that team or whatnot. And so that beauty of being able 882 00:53:22.800 --> 00:53:25.800 to know the owner winemaker up and down silver on a trail in the eighties, 883 00:53:25.840 --> 00:53:29.320 that was a beautiful thing. And that's a time that's passed and now 884 00:53:29.360 --> 00:53:31.960 it's a nice form of something very different, and so I want to go 885 00:53:32.039 --> 00:53:36.159 there before that changes. I've been able to go to the old world quite 886 00:53:36.159 --> 00:53:38.719 a bit into like I've been into Hungry, I've been into Bulgaria and that 887 00:53:38.920 --> 00:53:42.679 and see that like really old old ways, but to see an area that's 888 00:53:42.800 --> 00:53:45.519 very polished, the way South African wines have had Vergo Legg and some super 889 00:53:45.559 --> 00:53:50.119 beautiful wines, and that to go see that and witness what they're doing there. 890 00:53:50.960 --> 00:53:53.679 Well, the other part of that question is how people can visit you? 891 00:53:54.079 --> 00:53:57.960 And if you come to Qua Valley, what is special is it is 892 00:53:58.039 --> 00:54:00.519 still what you were saying. It is still walking in and you will meet 893 00:54:00.599 --> 00:54:04.760 the owner of the winemaker behind the bar. And if you want to come 894 00:54:04.880 --> 00:54:07.039 here to Unqua Valley, you will meet Dice and most likely or one of 895 00:54:07.079 --> 00:54:12.840 his children behind the bar who will engage you with lots of stories and information. 896 00:54:12.960 --> 00:54:15.599 But can you tell people what they would experience here and how they can 897 00:54:15.679 --> 00:54:21.480 find you? Yeah, So we're Highway five once again, the main artery 898 00:54:21.559 --> 00:54:22.840 on the west coast. Here, we're about fifteen minutes off of that. 899 00:54:22.880 --> 00:54:27.639 So you get off with the main Roseberg exit one twenty five and you just 900 00:54:27.760 --> 00:54:30.519 you head west in the informational signs that will say Hillcrest and that when you 901 00:54:30.599 --> 00:54:35.079 walk into the tasting room, we're very humble winery. The winery that were 902 00:54:35.280 --> 00:54:38.159 used was built in nineteen seventy five by Richard Summers, and the tasting room 903 00:54:38.239 --> 00:54:43.639 is very warm. It's kind of a nineteen seventy nineteen eighty small Napa Valley 904 00:54:43.679 --> 00:54:46.679 boutique winery that we have one part time employee that helps us out a little 905 00:54:46.679 --> 00:54:50.239 bit the taste room. Other than that, it is family. All of 906 00:54:50.320 --> 00:54:52.599 our kids have worked in the business here as well as other places overseas. 907 00:54:53.519 --> 00:54:59.159 But we specialize in a world of tasting rooms that have a lot of cheese 908 00:54:59.199 --> 00:55:01.519 plates, platters and charcuterie plates, and that we don't do that. We 909 00:55:01.639 --> 00:55:06.360 do wine. So we don't sell t shirts. I don't sell cutting boards, 910 00:55:06.599 --> 00:55:08.760 candles, no candles, yeah yeah, cabernets, any candles, yeah 911 00:55:08.840 --> 00:55:14.000 yeah, make your own at home. But we basically sell fine wine, 912 00:55:14.159 --> 00:55:17.880 and we specialize in an educational guided tasting to really talk about not only what 913 00:55:19.000 --> 00:55:22.119 we produce, but what I'm special about. Unqua Valley and the context are 914 00:55:22.159 --> 00:55:24.480 the great wines of the world. So we'd like to give people perspective of 915 00:55:25.280 --> 00:55:29.960 what's special about this place, and you know, in terms that they understand 916 00:55:30.000 --> 00:55:32.920 and can relate to. And people can also taste your German and Spanish and 917 00:55:34.000 --> 00:55:37.000 other wines. Yes, usually we have one or two of those open. 918 00:55:37.079 --> 00:55:39.199 We have an international wine club that most of that goes to, but we 919 00:55:39.280 --> 00:55:44.920 do always have one of those available. Right now, I think we're boring 920 00:55:45.239 --> 00:55:47.280 a grenache, if I'm not wrong, granacha that we do once again out 921 00:55:47.280 --> 00:55:51.599 of Spain, and then I've got a Moses reasoning and dry reasoning. Well, 922 00:55:51.719 --> 00:55:54.639 so it would be pretty special to come here because it's the unexpected and 923 00:55:54.840 --> 00:56:00.639 it's special. So I encourage everyone to head up to the Umqua Valley and 924 00:56:00.199 --> 00:56:05.320 stop by Hillcreso and you're and you will probably meet Dyson and get to engage 925 00:56:05.360 --> 00:56:07.719 with him for even lugger. But Dyson, thank you for joining us. 926 00:56:07.000 --> 00:56:10.920 It's been really fun. And uh, let's go have some carbonara to the 927 00:56:12.000 --> 00:56:15.239 genie in the bottle. And thank you Alison, thank you Jersey. Thanks 928 00:56:15.320 --> 00:56:21.000 for listening to a new episode of Wine Soundtrack USA. For details and updates, 929 00:56:21.199 --> 00:56:22.960 visit our website windsoundtrack dot com.